Bhakta Don Muntean

Great there's some links for the readers to check it [the truth] out!

One thing you could add is the source of the quotes - in case someone balks at them?

I read this type of stuff [lectures etc] by a certain well known GM leader [on VNN and other sites] - as far back as 1999-2000...the same one giving initiations to people just met - the same one purportedly revealing the particular relationships [of his followers] with Krishna - this is not well known? An example: [srila Narayana Maharaja:] The brahma-gayatri, the first of the gayatri mantras, will dry your heart. [Devotee:] What do you mean? [srila Narayana Maharaja:] Ladies don't utter this first mantra. [Devotee:] But our Srila Prabhupada gave it to us. [srila Narayana Maharaja:] He did not wish that you continue it for all time. [note: How can he say this? where is his proof?] The acaryas in the Gaudiya-sampradaya, like Srila Bhaktivinoda Thakura, Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura Prabhupada – acaryas from the time of Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu – say that only male persons can receive that mantra. All other gayatri-mantras can be uttered by ladies as well. [Devotee:] But he gave it to ladies and men. [srila Narayana Maharaja:] He had a special reason to do this at that time, but he did not want this to continue perpetually. [note: again how can he say this? where is his proof?] Because you believe he still wants you to chant that first mantra you should do so, but give more emphasis on the other mantras – like guru-gayatri and guru-mantra. [note: pray to me - is that what we're hearing here?] [...] [srila Narayana Maharaja:] Your spiritual master has given some hints [note: that one is blatant knowing Prabhupada's literary preeminence] on how to meditate on them, so you will have to improve. He has given you a seed, [note: again knowing Prabhupada's literary preeminence - one has to wonder about that comment too] and if that seed sprouts then some very green leaves will appear, and later on flowers will begin to bloom. Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu has come here only to give the goal of these mantras... [...] “Even Madhusudana (Krsna), who is difficult to attain even for the best of yogis, feels Himself greatly blessed when He is touched by even the slightest playful breeze coming from the tip of Sri Radhika’s garment. I offer my obeisances to any direction in which I may find this daughter of Maharaja Vrsabhanhu.” (Sri Sri Radha-rasa-sudhanidhi, verse 2) Have you heard this verse? Never? None of you have heard it? [note: see him almost lording it over them that "Prabhupada didn't tell you this one":rolleyes: i'm sure there've been many instances like this] http://www.purebhakti.com/articles/sbnm_early_qa.shtml That is an example [there is much more to this than that] of seeding doubts about Srila Prabhupada's presentation of the teachings of which he wanted everyone to adopt. There are millions of people around the world who know and love Krishna based on the singular efforts of Srila Prabhuapda - yes - as far as the GM is concerned - Prabhupada had no real help - and where the books came in [he doesn't and didn't need their help] - the teachings he presents in his books are clear and without 'GM' support these books found their way into homes everywhere - that these books would be what sincere seekers would need is clear - his good translation and commentary are far better than any guru in giving one what we need - all these others should just spare us all that 'other stuff' - which is really mostly - sentimentality passing as insight. If you can read you can see it for yourselves?

So true is that! While the rest of the world tries to be introspective of the issues that cause collective conflicts some muslims are making every effort to do the opposite. These noted fascists have mirrored their own ideological [and other] defects onto the rest of the global population. With that mindset they do indeed think it is okay for them to incite hate. The world and Islam specifically must confront these groups and individuals - they are bent on inflicting harm where they can...

Not just westerners - modern audiences aren't able to enter these levels - just like that. An example is this - while we can explain the curiosity of wanting to know what is the spiritual realm and what comprises it and its activities - it is also moot - as knowing 'that' information isn't necessarily going to get us there. Also - Prabhupada didn't go around saying 'you are in this rasa [relationship] with God' - that wasn't [and isn't] important to our liberation either. If we are drowning and the coast guard comes to get us - will they first explain to the drowning person what coast guard is and what a life preserver is and how their boat works? No. They shall just rescue the person. In that way Prabhupada has given what we need and - all this other information serves to distract one from the serious basics. Only a few people may be qualified to deal in these deeper subjects - like Prabhupada - but did he do that - what is the bulk of his message?

Not exactly! But - there are those from 'over there' that have or do understate or otherwise minimize Srila Prabhupada and his efforts - by saying the many things they have - as such the respect they get is 'formal' and that is all. I take it this way: ...Among Vaisnavas there may be some difference of opinion due to everyone’s personal identity, but despite all personal differences...Krsna consciousness must go on. We can see that under the instructions of Srila Bhaktivinoda Thakura, Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Gosvami Maharaja began preaching the Krsna consciousness movement in an organized way within the past hundred years. The disciples of Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Gosvami Maharaja are all Godbrothers, and although there are some differences of opinion, and although we are not acting conjointly, every one of us is spreading this Krsna consciousness movement according to his own capacity... [sB 4.28.31, PURPORT] Now there are those from GM side that had/have been telling people that Prabhupada didn't give us everything we need - planting seeds of doubt about Prabhupada with too much esoterica topics and not centering on the basic points. Just my humble opinion. But are these others all useless NO!

You got it...!

Is that supposed to be an indirect insult to him? As for only a few hours - takes only a moment.

Yes indeed ISKCON is now just another materialistic organization isn't it? Do we have to wonder why ISKCON is for the most part a great big nothing - more than 40 years after being transplanted? As Kulapavana noted - "one thing missing from the official resolutions was a GBC discussion about reinitiations of disciples whose gurus have fallen down. dont you think bhaktas have the right to know about that?" - so there it is - such libertated souls that make up the GBC! Personally I think that its [GBC] become an aberration of what its original purpose was to be - what's worse is that we have a whole new generation of fanatic devotees [who learned from that system] who don't measure up either - but that won't stop them from operating as though they are - 'right'. Do I sound a little peeved? Well when we had lost our human rights here [in 2002] - over Krishna - then later told by the human rights commission "we don't cover Krishna here" - where were our GBC leaders? WHERE? [our local leaders aren't bad though they're sincere and dedicated] The matter was not unknown to some of them. Then in 1994-5 - the [near] same thing happened in Edmonton [to my godbrother when he became a devotee] - and again - NO SUPPORT from the GBC or - even the local temple leaders! Ten years ago [last month] I and my 'godbrother' gave up everything - to move to vancouver and take shelter of the devotees and the community there [after being pumped for years by other devotees to do just that] - what a joke! Ten years later my godbrother still pains over that decision! They [vancouver temple leaders] treated us very badly [beforehand they were knowing and okaying it - they knew we we giving up everything and we were coming there to stay in the ashram for awhile - to get work and then take a residence as close to the temple as possible for us to do regular service at the temple] and - they knew us for some time too [or do they know the prajalpa instead?]. If you're ever in edmonton temple look at the Altar - we [ron and i] did the tile etc., [bUT NOT THE GROUTING THAT IS ANOTHER'S MESS] on that altar - when the temple was built in 1995 [and the core of those 'leaders' made that a hell too! YOU HAVE NO IDEA]. Here is a poor picture I found - the best I could find - [online] it was taken on Rath 2004: Had we done the grout it would have looked so much better - it really is a stunning altar otherwise! So - the GBC do have lawyers - they pay to help them keep secrets from devotees yes indeed it seems that the real spirit of Prabhupada is absent now [driven out?] - but there are theories about that too...? See for me now - I don't [for the most part] care about the GBC - it's one reason i never took to the path of initiation - yup - it's due to them...do i wish to give them ANY control over my life? So how do we fix it? Do we care? Who needs them? Do we need them to know Prabhupada? Gee whenever this enters my mind - i think of how Prabhupada's guru told him that is was better for him to not live in the ashram - it was something about the others there huh! So this GBC better start to think like Prabhpada and give up this nonsense direction they have been forcing on ISKCON. Otherwise the ritviks may get all the devotees based only on that...

Where did all this so-called info come from? I seriously doubt this and - even if - what has it to do with the subject of this thread?

Quote: fears that staged terror attacks across Europe and the US are probable in order to justify the Bush administration's plan to launch a military strike against Iran Reply: Fears - well one can surmise many things from fears - in fact - it might be a seeding of sorts - try to seed a fear in the populations about the American led western reaction to this issue that has been growing for years. I would ask you for example to look to the model nation of Jordan - there is a place that represents Islam in it's real light - there we have a King who is a direct decendant of the Prophet [PBUH] and is making a great example and - still the terrorists attack - even there! What can be said about a problem you can see on the horizon? Prabhupada says: This age of Kali will certainly be full of all activities of Kali, but this does not mean that the leaders of society, the executive heads, the learned and intelligent men, or above all the devotees of the Lord should sit down tightly and become callous to the reactions of the age of Kali. In the rainy season certainly there will be profuse rainfalls, but that does not mean that men should not take means to protect themselves from the rains. It is the duty of the executive heads of state and others to take all necessary actions against the activities of Kali or the persons influenced by the age of Kali... [sB 1.17.28, PURORT]

Of course - it's in America first that we've seen a specific law dealing with this nature of abuse - a kind of forced abuse that is going to get only worse - the smaller these devices become. Though a $10 000 fine is much much too low - as for them corporations that would do this to people - that small amount would become a reasonably meager 'cost-of-doing-business'. Take it from one who has had this forced on him - it is a serious abuse - especially if the victim comes to know about the implant. If someone invades ones home and assults the occupant - that is a serious criminal offense - how less is the invasion of ones body with a tracking-technology! At least this law is a start. This is an issue that everyone aught to be aware of - as it is a very very slippery slope indeed when they start to do this - one day - those individuals creating [and those that are employing] this human micrco-chipping program and infrastructure may themselves one day have it used against them [by the sequential changes within some of our leaders over the next generation in going from questionable to ] - who wants that? This is the Age of Quarrel after all...

This is very good - now - if only I could find justice for having had this CRFID forced on me [it's not a regular RFID] - on June 05, 2002. Yup - the States always have a better take on things and - it takes too long for this country to follow suit - but - with Conservatives in Ottawa - I expect there shall be some good changes on the way in Canada.

Most polls in recent years have shown strong Palestinian public support for a state along the 1967 borders. Hamas seeks an Islamic state in place of Israel. http://ca.news./s/26052006/6/n-world-hamas-militia-streets-abbas-challenge.html

Here is something I posted on another thread: ______________ Part of the message here on this thread is that the Israelis and the Palestinians must work out these issues themselves. The fact is - it has been well explained here - even with the Talmud analogy of the - ‘cat and the rat shall make peace over a carcass’. What does that mean here? It means that if the conflicted parties continue like this - they shall not be making peace with each other - [over the region and its issues] - but rather - the 'cats and the rats' shall 'make peace' and thus 'feast' on them and - the spoils of their loss... ...and so we read in the news: A senior Israeli source said: "We are not in the slightest bit surprised that this should have come from the British. "On the one hand, they always say they understand Israel's problems and want to be an intermediary and, on the other they are accusing us and attempting to embarrass us. They cannot be trusted." http://www.smh.com.au/news/world/isr...966004637.html It is time for the Israelis and the Palestinians to understand what they have to <big>feel</big> in order to be <big>moving forward with a comprehensive agreement</big> - before outsiders usurp the entire situation - to end it - in total chaos. Both parties have to consider: "It is better to have ten inches to stand upon than a hundred yards to fall." [Avoth d'Rab. Nathan, chap. 1] Regime changes do not lead to democracies - they lead to puppet regimes and later - civil war. When is it their turn - would the brits and the yanks become so power mad themselves so as to do that to Israel - well their born again evilangelical cult promises it! It’s that simple – the tit for tat must stop here – as noted in this string before - the whole issue is being calculated by ‘outsiders’ who care little for either party. They are simply waiting until they can fully usurp the two parties and - their conflict is their mutual trap. <big>So either the parties settle it themselves or the outsiders – whether it be America Britain - the E.U. or even the U.N. – if these outsiders come fully into it - to make the peace - of course we know - there is not going to be real peace in that way.</big> I pray to the Lord that the Leaders of these two States - are opened up to real cooperation – they are to go from being adversarial to neighborly – they can and must do this without the interference of anyone – there mustn’t be any enforced resolutions – not even from the U.N. – if the peace is to work it must come from within… Peace depends on a mutual desire and that must be something that is coordinated locally – if there is to be a need for a mediator - for the parties - it cannot be a ‘politico character’ – for so many reasons – and if the parties continue in this present direction - the noted ‘well-meaning’ outsiders shall usurp them [due to the present course of reactive arrangement] – both parties the Israelis and the Palestinians shall be dictated to by outsiders who shall decide what is what. We can avoid this scenario. The individual parties have to see the logic in the outlined points of the settlement - vicariously discussed here. What is meant when I posted: This disengagement plan must be 'expanded to all other settlements'? There are some 100 west bank settlements in question? Here is an outline of another 'workable' border plan to re-settle the various peoples. First it must be noted - when the settlements are vacated - they must not be razed to the ground - unless the new occupants desire it so. It is not a good procedure to do that. So where does everyone re-settle in this plan? Well in this plan - as Jerusalem becomes a fully Israeli city - with an expansion to the east – [so of course no east west division] and - with the move of the Dome of the Rock etc., to the new site - which could be the new capital of the Palestinians [to be constructed - or trade in peace an existing city like Tel Aviv?] - this 'new' modern city should be able to PROPERLY service 2-3 million people - with PROPER rural and other urban developments - for two to three million more citizens - with this - the 'right of return' issue - should be dropped. Part of this plan has to include a desalination plant on the new Palestinian coastline – to supply water to the arid areas that shall make up part of their territory. With this plant on the Mediterranean Sea - there would thus be no issue of water – there would be enough to be piped to new rural and urban developments – maybe enough to sell too. Without a comprehensive plan for this water - such a plan cannot succeed. Now - the peoples displaced from the various settlements [and the ‘city to be traded’ if that is the course chosen] should be moved to an - 'expanded' - Jerusalem and re-settled PROPERLY there. Who cannot be happy with this re-settlement plan - if this is done PROPERLY - it would be the fairest adjustment to the present and long term needs of this matter? Of course - this is only a - 'basic outline'... Here is a simple map I came up with - I am sure that Jordan would donate that small piece of land [to the distant south of Petra] - to this cause of Peace. Then again - this important point: <b>We must face the reality that part of the 'Justice' here 'naturally demands' that Jerusalem is going to have be again a fully Israeli City. This city is the Hebrew 'Spiritual Center' - or 'tether'. <big>Indeed Muslims - in particular - can see 'why' it is thus important to Jews - through a comparison to their own 'Spiritual Center' - 'Mecca'. </big> Will this reality [of a change for Jerusalem] be - 'need fully' concluded - "honorably" and through - "Justice" - or "dishonorably" - through the so-called leaders of the World's 'singular' Superpower [with their evangelical machinators] - cultivating a future 'need less' "Violence and Urban War"? The only course to see success in this connection is one that presents FULL Justice to the suffering Palestinians and - then 'historic move' of the 'Dome and Alaqsa Mosque' to its new location can take place…</b> Let us pray for the broad and mutual respect of these cousins – may the Supreme [blessed be His Holy Name] offer them both the empathy to see this need to resolve their dispute within – without a need for any outsiders to come and ‘enforce peace’. Here is a good thought – of late – that 'other place' on Earth - which was partitioned about sixty years ago – India and Pakistan – these two have been cooperating more and more over the Kashmir issue – obviously they are seeing the need for a resolution within – rather than having some ‘outsiders’ usurp their peace process… Again - both parties must consider: "It is better to have ten inches to stand upon than a hundred yards to fall." [Avoth d'Rab. Nathan, chap. 1] This whole thread and its message isn’t a ‘know it all’ presentation of - ‘the answers’ - it is a stimulus to discussion of the issues with a discussion of possibilities for the parties. This message here is simply an observation of the situation from the perspective of one who is an ordinary person - not a political leader and someone who is a well-wisher of both parties. I know these things can be resolved - without the hate and its consequences – I know that the mass of [middle-east] Muslims and Jews understand - God is God and - a Mother is a Mother and - the heart of real peace shall be deeply impressed by mutual service to these – there must be real peace - for our God and - for our Mothers. The truth is we do not hear much for positive resolution based discussion - like this – we see extremists everywhere pumping the masses with their various nightmare theologies – those based in illusion and hate and exclusivity messages – we hear ‘little’ about the real possibility of comprehensive peace - for everyone. Also – this Jerusalem issue – when is ‘this’ to be dealt with – when do proper and REALSITC discussions begin? Who is going to conduct that settlement - if the peoples of consequence - cannot resolve to do so themselves? What are the obviously perilous alternate options for this aspect of the resolution? Shall it be a plan - which is a facsimile of the foolish U.N. Resolution 181? Why are the various ‘outsiders’ [the Europeans and the Americans] still encouraging that there can be a two-state-divided Jerusalem? In doing that they are not relating to the real needs and the proper justice of this issue – of course - all this is [and will be] discussed here on this thread… http://www.audarya-fellowship.com/forums/spiritual-discussions/40918-origins-satan-myth-impact-global-politics-18.html#post304848

Quote: Hebrews dont have jerusalem, they came there from egypt Reply: That's only part of the ancient history - who had Jerusalem when they got there from Egypt? Wasn't the Palestinians! Quote: Muhammed was born in jerusalem Reply: Don't you read?? Me thinks he was born in Medina - certainly was NOT Jerusalem... Quote: Oh, thatas a bad thing? to say jesus is not god? We say that too, because Jesus says that too. He says "pray like me, our father....." Jesus denies that he is god, so if the dome of the rock says this too, then I say the dome is good and ought to stay. Reply: Oh please that's a lame premise now isn't it! Of course he isn't God. But the truth is the Dome was built to lure christians [the crusaders] to Islam. It has nothing to do with much else. Sure it aught to stay - just not there. Quote: Jerusalem is a world city, the home of jews, christians, and muslims. Only solution is to get rid of the party spirit of evil sectarinist bigotry and live in peace. Reply: Who says that it's got to be a 'world' city? You're talking about failed U.N. resolution 181 [November 29, 1947] Even if - why does that presuppose that the temple mount should stay as it is? How to 'get rid of the party spirit of evil sectarinist bigotry' - if one side can never respect the Israelis national need for a temple? Quote: As lo0ng as the zionist insists that they are the chosen people, and the muslim and christian say that they, too, are the only way, t5hen they all worship death, because they are all atheists who fail to do the will of the Father, meaning that they dont love God above all else, and they dont love others as they love their own. Reply: Oh yes it's all that simple isn't it... Quote: I let you speak for too long, but your zionism is too obvious. Reply: Who are you that you let me 'speak for too long'? So what if I'm a zionist - you don't understand what that even is oh and - Your bigotry is too obvious?

Jerusalem is a Hebrew center - if the palestinians don't wish to leave that city - how can they expect peace? Muslims have mecca - what do the hebrews have? Besides - the Dome of the Rock has nothing to do with Islam par-se. This was built to attract away the christian crusaders from the church. On this building is the largest written script on a building anywhere and - what does these things say? That Jesus isn't God and it directs seekers to mecca. So - outside of having a long history - this landmark can be moved from there - how could it be sacrilegious to move it? Of course it's claimed that the Prophet went to heaven from that spot - so what? Is that enough to lay claim to it? What if one day china invades the middle east and takes away mecca? How would that go over? Anyone think they would ever forget their mecca - would they stop trying to get it back? It would seem that as far as global faith based realities - they want the world to tip toe around them!?

Well let's move past this point [it may be true how can we know] and talk about the brutal and bloody purges of the 1980's - what would any brahmana think of that? What do 'you' think of the Islamic revolution? What do you do when it captures you or your decendants? To hear people defend Iran in it's current state is such a sad thing indeed. We must know that our western leaders - even in all their ineptness are not out right evil - as we see in these others like the president of Iran. Nor is democracy anything like their bent plans for a global Islamic theocracy! How many of his FELLOW COMPATRIOTS did he torture and execute in this Islamic revolution? How many to come? Can't people see that he's like a dog that keeps getting into the chicken coop and killing chickens - it's like he has a personal taste for blood. Such a great fellow to enter international political issues isn't he! Just look into his eyes in the photos - what do you see?

Are you denying all the quotes you read then? Is it that you just cannot imagine not eating cows? Does the Koran talk about the ill effects of cow killing? In that one quote: The Iranian scholar Al-Ghazzali (1058-1111 AD) was one of the most brilliant philosophers of Islam. He has stated that besides pieces of bread whatever we eat is simply to satisfy our urges. At the age of 28, he headed the institute of Islam at Baghdad. His main book, Ihya Ulum ul-Din - The Revival of Religious Sciences is highly respected. In this book (part 2, page 23, lines 17-19) the detrimental effects of beef, and the virtues of ghee and milk from a cow are stated as follows: <table align="center" border="0" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1" width="90%"><tbody><tr><td> </td></tr><tr><td class="quote">“The meat of cow is marz (disease), it’s milk is safa (health) and it’s ghee is dava (medicine).”</td></tr></tbody></table>

They aren't nazis...though we do have to wonder about some ultra-bent christian groups and - individuals...