Bhakta Don Muntean

Like in the days of Hiranyakasipu - things are greatly disturbed by demoniac people - at some point these radical demons - unchecked - are going to interrupt everything - including your sadhana - at what point shall you see that - while conflicts in this present time may just be a continuation of past times - things are out of step - in terms of the significant advent of terrorists and their bent plans to destroy Israel and plundge the earth into another dark ages. I know that there are those that think we are over reacting or otherwise reacting with bias toward Israel - but - isn't it strange how so easily people start to blame jews and israel etc., just like a plague - it spreads. I shall not be silent about this - ever. Indeed I worship Lord Krishna and - in that light - I see what is really going on in this world...

Yes you make a good point - even some people who are devoted get upset when i start talking about Krishna and "Prabhupada says" - one can become frustrated when others only wish to talk mundane topics - which have their place - but - they avoid talking about God. That is why the message board system is nice - you can talk your feelings about God etc., and other like minded souls can comment at any time after you've posted. God bless the internet!

Ah here we get closer to the truth - you are correct - Lord Shiva is in fact God - He is God in contact with His material energy - but - He is the exception - the other devas are jiva atma or - individual souls. You should consider that even though Lord Shiva is God - He Himself says that "there is no doubt that Vishnu is the deliverer of liberation for all" and - also recall that when Lord Shiva gave that demon the power to kill anyone by the touching of their head - well when the demon wanted to try it out on Lord Shiva first - Lord Shiva took shelter of Vishnu - and of course Vishnu tricked the demon into touching his own head - you must know this narration? Most important - when we see Lord Shiva pictured in trance - who is He meditating on? Vishnu? I still stand by the point - if we offer something to Lord Shiva we cannot think that we are worshipping Krishna. However - if we worship Vishnu we are worshipping all the devas in that. In a formal yajna - which is Vishnu - the gods - including Lord Shiva - are able to take their offerings. Remember Daksa and when he excluded Lord Shiva from the yajna...? "...Daksa neglected great devotees like Lord Siva. According to Vedic scriptures, the demigods are eligible to participate in yajnas and share the oblations, but Daksa wanted to avoid them. All sacrifices are intended to pacify Lord Visnu, but Lord Visnu includes all His devotees. Brahma, Lord Siva and the other demigods are all obedient servants of Lord Visnu; therefore Lord Visnu is never satisfied without them. But Daksa, being puffed up with his power, wanted to deprive Lord Brahma and Lord Siva of participation in the sacrifice, understanding that if one satisfies Visnu, it is not necessary to satisfy His followers. But that is not the process. Visnu wants His followers to be satisfied first." [sB 4.3.3, purport]

Yer most welcome! Do you like it? If you do - you're maybe like me - listening to it again and again?

That's cool - I love the original too - but many may like this one too - something for everyone!

If i'm posting drivel - then why have you never tried to 'debate' the postings? You say that "It is very transparent" - what is "it" - that is so very "transparent" - the facts? Like in my last posting above this one - what is wrong with that posting? Is it that it sheds some light on the Naturei Karta movement - is it that my postings make it difficult to spread the rhetoric? Without doubt the Naturei Karta movement is the subject of this thread. Since you've mentioned - "to obscure the original subject" - this posting of yours - seems to do just that! I wonder why. As for all the messiah stuff - it isn't out of place either and - you know that.

In context the quote says that some offer things to other gods and that they do this not knowing that they aught to offer them to Krishna - the methods of serving various gods is something else - and of course - only Vishnu can give salvation - so as Krishna says - those whose devotion is distorted in various ways - serve lesser gods - devas - of course these gods are not proxy for God - if we offer something to say Lord Shiva it does not mean we have offered to Krishna - in fact - it is the other way round - the demigods are given their offerings through the sacrifical fire - which fire IS directly Vishnu - so we cannot serve them without Krishna but we can and should serve Krishna with an proper understanding about them. The other guest thinks that the gods are aspects of Krishna and that is not supported in Bhagavad Gita.

Download this FREE MP3 - it's called "Go Go Govinda" - just see if you can stop listening to it! http://music.download.com/jalebi/3615-8237_32-100934921.html Just scroll down the page and you'll see it - "Go Go Govinda" - it takes a minute to download and hours to listen to....

"The most intransigent and extreme of the Orthodox anti-Zionist parties is the Naturei Karta movement..." http://www.ucalgary.ca/~elsegal/363_Transp/Orthodoxy/Naturei.html Link posted for a broader understanding.

IT'S PEOPLE WHO ARE RESPONSIBLE "materialistic" PEOPLE - NOT RELIGION.

Without a doubt - the Islamofascist Taliban are FAR worse - without a doubt.

I have answered this type of post in the past - check back by tonight [Friday] this post shall have a reply...thank you!

That sounds like a pantheistic and even - a mayavadi understanding...

So what? Do you know why it might read like this? How bright are you?

With all due respect that is incorrect. There are devas - they are not gods in the sense that God is God - and they and He have seperate identity - that is the understanding in Gita.

Krishna says: Whatever a man may sacrifice to other gods, O son of Kunti, is really meant for Me alone, but it is offered without true understanding. I am the only enjoyer and the only object of sacrifice. Those who do not recognize My true transcendental nature fall down. [bG 9.23-24] So He is saying that all gods but Him are essentially false - so why is it any different when He expressed the same thing - as "Yahweh"?

Vishnu is has limitless mercy - your point aught to read: "If humans are so ignorant, then anything can happen in life"

Just see. That is an isolationist and exclusively 'position' - without a position! So are you saying that since the "jews have their jealous god" - you're saying that He is a 'diiferent 'god' than Christians worship? Your comments are curious because if you feel that "jews have their jealous god" - then - who sent Jesus? Why do you read the Torah and prophetic writings concerning this noted - "jealous god"?

Of course - Jesus is an saktyavesa-avatara and his Teachings are very important...

When the king protects the citizens from the disturbances of mischievous ministers as well as from thieves and rogues, he can, by virtue of such pious activities, accept taxes given by his subjects. Thus a pious king can certainly enjoy himself in this world as well as in the life after death. [sB 4.14.17] That was spoken by - cruel King Vena - a very long time ago - these are very proper sounding words - spoken by a demon. My insignificant enemies the demigods have combined to kill my very dear and obedient well-wisher, my brother Hiranyaksa. Although the Supreme Lord, Visnu, is always equal to both of us—namely, the demigods and the demons—this time, being devoutly worshiped by the demigods, He has taken their side and helped them kill Hiranyaksa. [sB 7.2.6] So here the demon seemingly speaks truth and then - he contradicts himself. He knew that God takes the side of the demigods - not becasue of the worship they offer - but rather - because the demons are usually doing something which is a threat to everyone. In the next verse we see an example of the delusions he suffered: The Supreme Personality of Godhead has given up His natural tendency of equality toward the demons and demigods. Although He is the Supreme Person, now, influenced by maya.... [sB 7.7.8-8] The demon even encouraged his servants to go on a terror campaign: Thus the demons, being fond of disastrous activities, took Hiranyakasipu’s instructions on their heads with great respect and offered him obeisances. According to his directions, they engaged in envious activities directed against all living beings. [sB 7.2.13] This is what these Islamic revolutionary types are like - these present day terrorists - being fond of disastrous activities - they'll take the islamic revolutionary's leader's instructions on their heads with great respect and according to their directions - they'll engage in envious activities directed against all living beings. Hiranyakasipu made a nice speech and in Srimad Bhagavatam we can see that - so what do we make of his seemingly clear understanding of things and - his abject violence atrocities and offences? The demon's own envy was the cause and - it was thus his greatest enemy! Isn't it so for all souls? I wonder if these terrorists ever see that they too are terminal with envy.

evangelistic = electing Siva...

Yes - it is sad in that way - people like that DO have inner doubts and to displace these doubts they bash the faith of others - with a view to having to constantly reaffirm their sham understandings they create a pattern of bashing - for most types like this it becomes the central focus in the preaching of their faith groups.

I hate to disrupt your bubble of self-delusion: "More Fakery at Reuters" Monday, July 31, 2006 'Who is this man?' For an update on this post, see here. If he had been a genuine rescue worker, he would deserve a medal. Mr "Green Helmet" is everywhere at Qana, rushing around pulling children out of the rubble, carting them to ambulances and even, on the front page of the Guardian, escorting "White Tee-shirt", who also performs his own cameo role, carting round the body of another unfortunate girl, emoting freely while he does so. That photograph is credited to Nicolas Asfouri of AFP/Getty Images and the caption reads, "A man screams for help as he carries the body of a young girl after Israeli air strikes on the southern Lebanese village of Qana". "White Tee-shirt" is still "screaming" on the front page of The Telegraph, but in an altogether different location, this photograph attributed to Reuters. He also makes the front page of The Times and The Independent, in yet another location, with “Green Helmet” just out of shot. The New York Times, however, has "Green Helmet" dragging the body of yet another unfortunate child from the ruins, this photograph attributed to Tyler Hicks of The New York Times. The caption reads, "Rescue workers recovered bodies at the scene of an Israeli air raid on the southern Lebanese town of Qana on Sunday". We also get one more shot of the baby dragged from the rubble – yet another pose to add to the many already published. This time, "Blue Tee-shirt" is standing behind the baby's body, holding its head up to make a more dramatic picture. The picture itself is in Arab News with the caption, "A dead child, a victim of Jewish terror, is taken out of a destroyed building in Qana on Sunday. The pacifier of the child is seen hanging from the vest, a mute testimony to the innocent victim's tragic end." The photograph is attributed to EPA. A picture remarkably similar to that in The New York Times is also offered by Reuters, attributed to Zohra Bensemra. Its caption reads, "A Lebanese volunteer rescuer carries a child killed in the Israeli air raid in Qana." It looks like the same child, but "Green Helmet", seems to have swapped positions for the camera with "Grey Tee-shirt". Gulf News, on the other hand, has "Green Helmet" carrying the body of the girl shown in the previous post, but in yet another, slightly more picturesque location. This shot carries no attribution and the caption is not related to the picture. It refers to the cessation of air strikes by the Israelis. But the great tragedy for Qana, of which we are constantly reminded by the media, is that this is history apparently repeating itself. On 18 April 1996, the village was also visited by death and destruction. re-visiting the photographs of the time, however, who do we see at the centre of the action? Why, "Green Helmet" of course. This is a younger man, without his glasses, but recognisably the same man, in his now classic pose of handling a victim of an Israeli "atrocity". His presence at Qana on Sunday, and his central, unchallenged role, cannot have been a coincidence. Is he a senior ranking Hezbollah official? If not, who is he? * * * * And here he is again! This time, according to Reuter's Zohra Bensemra, "Green Helmet" is a Lebanese rescue worker, watching "while a bulldozers clears away the rubble of a building demolished by an Israeli air strike in Sreefa, 18 miles (30km) south east of the port-city of Tyre(Soure)". The dateline is 31 July, 2006, at 10:37 am. Doesn't Hezbollah have anyone else the media can photograph? http://eureferendum.blogspot.com/2006/07/who-is-this-man.html --------- So Kulapavana them are the facts....the loss of life is obvious - and so too are the staged presentation of the photos...