Bhaktavasya

Be not sad for me, Shashi. If in my imagination Krishna is whispering sweet somethings into my ear, then why should I care if no-one knows or believes that I could be so fortunate. I may even become mad enough to imagine that He is truly the ablility in man and that all songs and concert performances are but a spark of His divine energy. It won't stop there, as He said in His message delivered to the Gopis, whose footsteps I have eternity to try to clumsily follow in, separation is only an illusion because He is all-pervading.

I would ask Him to say something in my ear, anything, just to hear what His voice sounds like. I imagine He would start talking about Radharani or how much He loves His devotees, or not to worry about anything. He would understand my innermost desires, and allow me to massage His feet, or pretend He has a sore neck so I can lift His hair and give Him a neck-rub. Then He would be gone, maybe never to be visible again in this one lifetime and every time I looked at my hands (which would be quite often) I'd always remember those soft, reddish feet, the markings etched in my brain, and His beautiful contoured neck and relive the experience over and over again.

But Krishna appeared as Gaura, as His own devotee to show how to worship Himself (Krishna) by following in the footsteps of the Gopis. Seems to me to be vice-versa to what you said.

The sad truth is that the former gurukula students trust Mr. Turley more than they trust Iskcon affiliated devotees.

I was watching a program on Culture Jamming on tv (how ironic in that 'kill your tv' has been one of the original slogans of the counter culture) last week about culture jamming in New York city. In the beginning of the program the chanting party came into view and the person leading the kirtan (Tarun?) looked into the camera, gave a big smile and an exhuberant "Hare Krishna!" for all the tv watchers at home. Personally, I like what they do and appreciate the messages unless someone gets too preachy and self-righteous and then I say "Kill your own tv and don't tell me what to do." For info on culture jamming: http://www.levity.com/markdery/culturjam.html

Oh sure, blame it on the ganja!

just checking...

Here's something; http://www.ship.edu/~cgboeree/buddhahist.html

It appears that Srila Bhaktisiddhanta's comprehension of the English language was impeccable.

very funny, Jagat!

26. You get your comedy fix in the morning off indiadivine instead of staying up and watching Late Night Comedy.

How could Rupa have known that his verses would travel through time and touch the hearts of the lazy, hopeful aspirants scattered through-out the globe? jai the gaura bhakta vrndas!

If you could sit and stroll casually and have a chat with Krishna, which we are apparently supposed to be able to do or will have the opportunity to do in the future, what would you envision as a satisfactory scenerio? This question is based on the premise that Krishna is the best Friend of the bhaktas and really does want to please and satisfy the bhaktas more than they could ever imagine. Would you want to ask Him for a blessing, for answers to the current world problems, or to just be in His presence? The lively or silent or other situations would be unique for each person.

No, not okay. As stated before, nice piece of fiction ('actual mystical experiences'?) but the following quotes bugged me,although they may not bother anyone else: From 'Exposure to Tantra and the Lady from the Netherworld': "Chatan is derived from the Sanskrit word chetana or consciousness. Whether there is a relationship between this name and the Arabic saitan or the Hebrus Satan is a question for etymologists." From 'Secrets of Left-hand tantra' "You saw Mohini, demoness of the underworld. Had you known you could have entered a pact with her for the next cycle of Jupiter (12 years). You promise to satisfy her lust once a month and she will do your bidding in return- protect your property and destroy your enemies, whatever." All the female characterizations is these 'stories' are either horribly demoniac or virgin bimbos. Again, as fiction, fill your boots. But to be passed off a genuine mystical experiences, while sneaking in the comparisons to Satan with Chaitan(ya) and demoness with Mohini just doesn't sit right with me. But that's just my opinion, which I'm entitled to, right? Oh, I'm well thankyou very much.

Happy Easter morning.

Must be the Supersoul, while I was typing out my post where I referred to an article at Hare Krishna.org, you were posting yours. Different articles, same site. Tres cool!

Here it is: (posted on Hare Krishna.org in the article entitled 'Just by reading my books they are initiated') Madhya lila chapter 15 text 111 (excerpt) "Srila Bhaktivinoda Thakura comments that serving Vaisnavas is most important for householders. Whether a Vaisnava is properly initiated or not is not a subject for consideration. One may be initiated and yet contaminated by the Mayavada philosophy, but a person who chants the holy name of the Lord offenselessly will not be so contaminated. A properly initiated Vaisnava may be imperfect, but one who chants the holy name of the Lord offenselessly is all perfect. Although he may apparently be a neophyte, he still has to be considered a pure unalloyed Vaisnava." As it is Easter, there is a parable taught by Jesus that is instructive in this matter. Most here probably have heard it before: 2 men were in the temple praying. One man was giving thanks to the Lord that he wasn't as fallen as the other man in the back pew (who we can imagine may have been unkept and perhaps ragged in appearance, smelling of liquor even) while the 2nd person was feeling truly fallen and praying to the Lord to uplift him. In Jesus' telling of the story, the Lord reached out more to the one who was fallen yet sincere in his prayers for help, while the self-righteous man, content with his own piety, did not recieve the same Grace or audience of the Lord. Srila Prabhupad told a similar story of the prostitute and the brahman who lived side by side. The prostitute, despite her external activities, truly felt herself fallen was always meditating within on the activities of the pure hearted (in her mind) brahman while the brahman, while performing his external rituals, was self-righteous and was always thinking contemptuously of the prostitute. Prabhupad said that at the end of her life she had become purified by meditating favorably on the Vaisnava devotees while the brahman, in spite of his external show of devotion, went 'straight to hell' for thinking so offensively of a devotee. Krishna is a Person and the best friend of the devotees, so even is there is some temporairy falldown (in eternal time)Krishna never forgets any sincere service and sees the good that person has done. We should do the same and have a little compassion for devotees who are entangled in the grips of the illusory energy.

Here it is: (posted on Hare Krishna.org in the article entitled 'Just by reading my books they are initiated') Madhya lila chapter 15 text 111 (excerpt) "Srila Bhaktivinoda Thakura comments that serving Vaisnavas is most important for householders. Whether a Vaisnava is properly initiated or not is not a subject for consideration. One may be initiated and yet contaminated by the Mayavada philosophy, but a person who chants the holy name of the Lord offenselessly will not be so contaminated. A properly initiated Vaisnava may be imperfect, but one who chants the holy name of the Lord offenselessly is all perfect. Although he may apparently be a neophyte, he still has to be considered a pure unalloyed Vaisnava." As it is Easter, there is a parable taught by Jesus that is instructive in this matter. Most here probably have heard it before: 2 men were in the temple praying. One man was giving thanks to the Lord that he wasn't as fallen as the other man in the back pew (who we can imagine may have been unkept and perhaps ragged in appearance, smelling of liquor even) while the 2nd person was feeling truly fallen and praying to the Lord to uplift him. In Jesus' telling of the story, the Lord reached out more to the one who was fallen yet sincere in his prayers for help, while the self-righteous man, content with his own piety, did not recieve the same Grace or audience of the Lord. Srila Prabhupad told a similar story of the prostitute and the brahman who lived side by side. The prostitute, despite her external activities, truly felt herself fallen was always meditating within on the activities of the pure hearted (in her mind) brahman while the brahman, while performing his external rituals, was self-righteous and was always thinking contemptuously of the prostitute. Prabhupad said that at the end of her life she had become purified by meditating favorably on the Vaisnava devotees while the brahman, in spite of his external show of devotion, went 'straight to hell' for thinking so offensively of a devotee. Krishna is a Person and the best friend of the devotees, so even is there is some temporairy falldown (in eternal time)Krishna never forgets any sincere service and sees the good that person has done. We should do the same and have a little compassion for devotees who are entangled in the grips of the illusory energy.

In the mystical experiences section of this forum, there are a series of stories billed as 'actual experiences of one of our Sadhakas', beginning with 'Exposure to Tantra and the Lady from the Netherworld'. Although for the most part I found the stories to be very clever pieces of fiction writing, I found some of the references disturbing. I'm all for non-censorship but it's a puzzle to me how such references to Chaitanya (Chaitan) and Mohini passed by the editors without comment, but seemingly with approval. Has anyone else read these 'actual experiences'?

Sorry that I don't know how to do this very well. If you go to MSN Search then type in 'Origin and History of Tantra' the web site should come up. I tried to find the same site on Google and couldn't find it through that search engine. Also, the address at the bottom of the page 'http://www.kheper.auz.com/topics/Tantra/Tantra.htm. didn't bring up the site when I tried typing it in through my home page search engine.

the www.origins of tantra didn't come up on the last post, but you can find it easily by typing in that address.

Hari Bol, Gaura Hari. After researching, I discovered that (as pointed out by Jagat) originally tantra was not part of the Vedic religion, but was later assimilated into it (through the Upanishads. I found a very interesting web site, www.the origins of tantra which posits the theory that tantra came from the more mystical-yogic Dravidian tradition. Many branches developed into Mayayana Buddhist tantrism,Shaivite tantrism, Shakta tantrism and even Vaisnava (Vaisvana) tantrism. This site and others like it emphasize mediation rather than sexual practise as taught by 'modern new age' gurus (Rajnessh is mentioned), and 'visualization of the deities' and raising the energies through the main cakra areas, transforming the sexual or base cakra energy. As Jagat also mentioned, most traditional practitioners are celibate.

Happy Appearance Day to Lord Caitanya

Kishan; Please shed more light on the identity of the Akasharaja self-manifesting deity. The original Balji deity refers of course to Lord Balaram, Krishna' brother, who has appeared on earth in his original human-like form as Balaram (with white complexion) and Lord Nityananda (and now some are theologically speculating that as Jesus Christ). Odd that he would manifest a form like that before he departed, and this is interesting news (to me) that Revati, the eternal consort of Balaji, is also known as Padmavati and Balaram in that 'lila' is known as Lord Srinivas (as well as Akasharaja). Please reveal more!

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