Beggar

Jayadwaita Maharaja secretly spent almost a week at the first temple in the West associated with Srila Sridhar Maharaja during the spring of 1985. I was living there in San Jose, California at the time and had several conversations with Maharaja in Bhakti Sudhir Goswami's office. At that time he was seriously considering leaving ISKCON and coming over to the Srila Sridhar Maharaja side. At that time he fully accepted the angle of vision given by Srila Sridhar Maharaja on the origin of the jiva soul issue and several of the conversations that I heard him have with Sudhir Goswami Maharaja were on this topic. In the end, he just couldn't follow his inner heart for whatever reason, attachment or a false sense of loyalty to Srila Prabhupada. {False in the sense that loyalty to GBC ISKCON is loyalty to Prabhupada}. It kind of reminds me of Virabahu Prabhu. During the early and mid-eighties Virabahu Prabhu read all of Srila Sridhar Maharaja's books. When I used to go up to the Spanish BBT to visit him, he would passionately rail against the GBC and ISKCON gurus. Of course a few years later he became one! And for years he was just like one of the original Zonal Acaryas in actions and mentality. Power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely for the conditioned soul. Lately by Lord Krsna's grace he has mellowed out quite a bit. There is hope after all. His wife is a devout follower of Narayana Maharaja and he is very tolerant of her position despite fierce opposition by the likes of Rabindra Swarupa and Bhadri Narayana. Another interesting history is how Hridayananda Maharaja spent several days with Narayana Maharaja up in Badger, CA in 1999 and then campaigned amongst the GBC to reconcile with him and let him give programs at ISKCON temples.

We will continue to understand Srila Prabhupada's teachings, including such issues as the origin of the soul, with the help of such exalted souls as Srila B.R. Sridhar Maharaja. Such visionaries as he, Srila Prabhupada, Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Saraswati Thakur and Srila Bhaktivinoda Thakur (the entire siksa guru parampara) are brilliant like many suns and moons. Persons such as Sarva gattah AKA Pradymna Swami are like fireflies in the night. They try to illuminate the scene with their tiny and flickering mental power but do to their stubborn false sense of importance are themselves part of the fleeting phantasmagoria.

Our Affectionate Guardians Chapter One (excerpt): A Transcendental Friendship Many years later, after establishing Gaudiya Vaisnava temples around the world, Srila Prabhupada, upon returning to India, would sometimes stay at the matha of Srila Sridhara Maharaja in Sri Navadvipa Dhama. Srila Sridhara Maharaja also sometimes visited Srila Prabhupada at his Candrodaya Mandira in Mayapur. During one such occasion, recorded in March 1973, Srila Prabhupada happily shared some of his fond remembrances with Srila Sridhara Maharaja and his own disciples. We are very fortunate to hear His Divine Grace Om Visnupada Paramahamsa Parivrajakacarya Bhakti Raksaka Sridhara Maharaja. By age and by experience, in both ways, he is senior to me. I was fortunate to have his association since a very long time, perhaps in 1930. Maharaja, I think you remember the incident when you went to Allahabad? On that auspicious occasion, we were connected. There is a long story, it will take time, but I had the opportunity of associating with Sridhara Maharaja for several years. Krsna and Prabhupada [srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura] liked him to prepare me. Sridhara Maharaja lived in my house for many years, so naturally we had very intimate talks and he was my good advisor. I took his advices and instructions very seriously, because from the very beginning I knew he was a pure Vaisnava, a pure devotee, and I wanted to associate with him, and I tried to help him also. Our relationship is very intimate. [1] Herein, we find the history of a transcendental relationship between these two pure devotees of the Lord. They intimately associated and discussed Srimad-Bhagavatamfor more than five years, often for five to seven hours a day. While remembering their intimate talks, specifically in regard to Bhagavad-gita, Srila Sridhara Maharaja recalled the depth of their conversations: Once while discussing the verse dadami buddhi yogaµ tam yena mam upayanti te [bg. 10.10, "I give them the understanding by which they can come to Me."], I submitted to him that here, upayanti is indicative of parakiya-rasa [paramour relationship]. On this point he agreed with me, saying, "Yes, at this point there cannot be anything but the parakiya-rasa of Vraja. The conclusion of Bhagavad-gita must come to this." Please Look After Them Their many confidential talks reveal the depth of their relationship. In March 1982, Srila Sridhara Maharaja said: When he [srila Prabhupada] began his translation of the Bhagavad-gita, it was in consultation with me in a very deep way. Later, he requested me many a time, "Please look after them; I am taking them this side [to Krsna consciousness]. You have a responsibility to look after them." Srila Prabhupada would often consult with Srila Sridhara Maharaja regarding the spiritual significance of his failing business and family relationships. Srila Sridhara Maharaja confirmed Srila Prabhupada's suspicion that Krsna's special mercy was being shown to him by taking away all his material possessions as per the Srimad-Bhagavatam 10.88.8 verse, yasyaham anugrhnami. An example of Prabhupada's helping with Sridhara Maharaja's preaching work is seen in his financing Prapanna-jivanamrta: Life-Nectar of the Surrendered Souls. (Lilamrta, Vol. 1, p. 103) This book, the most important work of his life, shows Sridhara Maharaja's exceptional brilliance in extracting the essence of the scriptures. Prapanna-jivanamrta was also greatly favored by Niskincana Krsnadasa Babaji Maharaja and was the only book he carried with him.

namah om visnu-padaya krsna-presthaya bhutale srimate Sarva-gattah Sleeper-vadi iti namine namaste jayadwaita-deve apasiddhanta-vani-pracarine suddha-bhakti-pascatya-desa-tarine

I want to come back to this post for a minute. The other day I was doing a find on the nitya siddha krsna prema verse and the concept there that the jiva is always nitya-siddha even if covered from time immemorial. I came upon a lively discussion from several years ago on Gaudiya Discussions. Their discussion had many of the same elements as on Audarya, but the mood was not nearly as heavy although much more intellectual. Now thinking back to an earlier thread, Will "Prabhupada said" hold up in 21st Century? which was started by Guruvani, I'm thinking that what makes Audarya Spiritual Discussions so different than the (now closed) Gaudiya Discussions is that Gaudiya Discussions was not encumbered by the restriction demanding that every point be referenced back to "what Prabhupada said". At the same time most of the posters there had no affection or loyalty to Prabhupada. So perhaps the demand to reference everything back to Srila Prabhupada is a "labor of love". The problem is when it becomes a restriction or a demand, where always lurking in the background is the possible charge of being "disloyal to Prabhupada". GBC ISKCON tells us that if we don't sign a loyalty oath to them, then we are disloyal to Prabhupada. The IRM says that the GBC is disloyal to Prabhupada. Some say that if don't follow Narayana Maharaja or Sridhar Maharaja (or his successor) that you are disloyal to Prabhupada. Consequently on this discussion forum we must frequently establish that we are loyal to Prabhupada. Since the best defense is a good offense, we often must counter to those who claim that we are disloyal to Prabhupada, that, it is they who are the traitors to the Jagat Guru. For the most part I personally don't find Bhaktivedanta confusing. But that is because I immediately reference any apparent contradictions either back to the previous acaryas or to current acaryas in the Saraswat line who are not in ISKCON. Then this becomes the issue. And the "Prabhupada said" issue with its accusations and counter accusations comes to the forefront again. And we go round and round.

Yes, definitely; There are four "active" rasas and santa is not included. But there are myriad ways of looking at all these concepts.

Prahlad Maharaja is described in Brhat Bhagavamrta as being in santa rasa. The cows, trees and creepers in Vraja - Vrndavana (Goloka) are also said to be in santa rasa as is the ground or soil itself. When Krsna stands with his lotus feet on that ground, what ecstacy it must feel. What about the earth planet during the Gokula pastimes? There are different types of santa rasa and they may not even be degrees of the same thing. Sometime we find completely different definitions using the same words. As I posted before the same thing is true of the term, "uttama adhikari". There is so much to know. Yet Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu rejected all proposals by Ramananda Raya until Ramananda quoted the Tenth Canto of Srimad Bhagavatam, Jnane prayasam udapasya mimanta eva, give up speculation and hear from the mouth of a real sat guru and serve his lotus feet.

Now two examples of a basic fact and concept that you don't understand. Now here's the comeback: PPPPPPaaaaaaaaallllllease, GIVE US A BREAK!!!!!

Stop, please your driving me nuts.

Your idea is correct but you are technically incorrect because if you go back and look at the quotes that Guruvani found from Prabhupada's books, there is more than one definition of santa rasa. Another term that has more than one defininition is "uttama adhikari". It's obvious that santa rasa in brahman realization is the not the same as santa rasa in relationship with Narayana in Vaikuntha. Then again, santa rasa in Vraja with Krsna is also different.

"The Original "Why?" BY: NAVA JAUVANA DASA Nov 23, NEW YORK (SUN) — This morning, reading the 7th Chapter of Bhagavad-gita, which usually gives me some transcendental pleasure, a question that had previously come up for me reappeared. Why did we, the marginal energy of the Lord, make the wrong choice to come to this material world? Why, if we are superior energy, did we not choose to remain under the protection of the internal energy, rather than be covered by the inferior energy? Now the obvious answer I know: as part and parcel of Parambrahman, we have a spark of free will. Free will is intrinsic to our nature as jivas. So we were given a choice, and we chose to enter the material world to compete with Krishna, to act as false enjoyers and lords. But that begs the question: how could we have made that choice when anyone in knowledge would never have made it, knowing that the consequences would be endless suffering here in this material world? It does not seem possible to me that we, as jivas, were in knowledge when we made this basic choice. That would imply that we were covered by ignorance from our very beginning. The Sanskrit term, nitya bandha, implies the same: eternally conditioned. So then the question comes back to Krishna. Why, as the all merciful (karuna sindu) friend of the fallen (dina bandhu) would the Supreme Lord cover His own children, His parts and parcels, by ignorance, from what appears to be their very beginning, knowing they would then make the wrong choice? So, this is my question. If I were deeply sincere, like Adwaita Acarya when he could not understand one verse in the Gita, I would fast until Krishna kindly revealed some answer or gave me an insight to clear up this doubt. Since I am an insincere rascal, such austerity and determination are not possible for me. I know that this question is related to the controversy over where the jiva actually comes from. I don't buy the official "BBT" version that the jiva was with Krishna in the spiritual world in his original swarup and then fell down. No one falls down from Goloka. I also know that Srila Prabhupada spoke and wrote various different perspectives on this subject, but he stressed that it is not important to know how we got here, but absolutely necessary to know how to get out. Still, our philosophy should be able to clearly explain the ontology of the jiva. How and why did we make this terrible choice to enter samsara? Ironically, it may only be after we are well on our way out that we'll understand the answer. Check out my blog: Jauvana BlogSpot

New Vrndavana 1986 - The ISKCON GBC comes with one vote of censuring and suspending what was left of the "Eleven Zonal Acaryas". The result of that failure of will, and acquiessence to the truth you will see on the front page of "Acaryadeva's" homepage.

<table background="fdo.gif" border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="100%"><tbody><tr><td rowspan="2" width="239"> </td><td width="75%"> </td></tr><tr><td> <center> <embed src="http://www.acharyadeva.com/en/life/title.swf" quality="high" pluginspage="http://www.macromedia.com/go/getflashplayer" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="Transparent" height="45" width="550"></center> </td> </tr></tbody></table> <table bgcolor="#000000" border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="100%"><tbody><tr><td height="3"> </td></tr><tr><td> </td><td bgcolor="#ffffff"></td><td> </td><td bgcolor="#ffffff"></td><td> </td><td bgcolor="#ffffff"></td><td> </td><td bgcolor="#ffffff"></td><td> </td><td bgcolor="#ffffff"></td><td> </td><td bgcolor="#ffffff"></td><td> </td><td bgcolor="#ffffff"></td><td> </td><td bgcolor="#ffffff"></td><td> </td><td bgcolor="#ffffff"></td><td> </td><td width="30%"> . </td></tr></tbody></table> <table border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="100%"><tbody><tr><td background="fdo2.gif" valign="top" width="2%"> </td><td width="1%"> </td><td valign="top"> Who is Acaryadeva? <!--startclickprintexclude--> <table align="right" border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="145"> <tbody> <tr><td> </td></tr> </tbody></table> <!--endclickprintexclude--> H.H. Hridayananda dasa Goswami (Dr. Howard J. Resnick, Ph.D.) is one of the most respected spiritual leaders of the International Society for Krishna Consciousness. In modern times, amongst the most essential tasks of the Krishna conscious spiritual masters has been to translate the Vedic scriptures of millennial India to modern languages and to distribute them profusely all over the world. H.H. Hridayananda dasa Goswami has accepted this mission as his life and soul. H.H. Hridayananda dasa Goswami appeared in this world in November 5, 1948, in Los Angeles, California. Due to his academic merits, he secured a full scholarship for the University of California, where he first saw a lecture given by His Divine Grace A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada, the founder-acharya of the Krishna Consciousness Movement. Impressed by the vast knowledge and saintliness of Srila Prabhupada, H.H. Hridayananda dasa Goswami became a member of the Hare Krishna movement in Berkeley, and, shortly after, on the 8th of February of 1970, he was initiated as a disciple of Srila Prabhupada. Since the very beginning, H.H. Hridayananda dasa Goswami distinguished himself for his eloquence, devotion, and dedication to studying the writings of his spiritual master, through which he acquired a profound knowledge of Sanskrit. In 1972, he accepted the renounced order of life, sannyasa, to dedicate himself totally to his spiritual master's mission: to spread the Krishna Conscious movement all over the world. In the two subsequent years he traveled widely, giving lectures and conferences in colleges and universities in the United States. In 1974, H.H. Hridayananda dasa Goswami was named member of the Administrative Body of ISKCON, where he was encumbered with development of Krishna consciousness in Latin America. In the following three years, he established twenty-five centers of the Society and attracted thousands of Latin Americans to Krishna consciousness. In his trips throughout Latin America, he met many political authorities and religious leaders, conversing with them in fluent Portuguese and Spanish. He is also the founder of the Portuguese and Spanish Bhaktivedanta Book Trust, which has already distributed over twenty-five million books all over Latin America. <!--startclickprintexclude--> <table align="left" border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="145"> <tbody> <tr><td> </td></tr> </tbody></table> <!--endclickprintexclude-->A little before departing from this world in November of 1977, His Divine Grace Srila Prabhupada asked H.H. Hridayananda dasa Goswami, as well as ten other prominent disciples, to accept the role of spiritual masters and initiate disciples to give continuity to the disciplic succession starting with the Supreme Lord, Krishna. The biggest challenge in his career as spiritual leader, however, came when the leaders of ISKCON, recognizing his profound devocional erudition, entrusted him to complete de Srila Prabhupada's monumental translation and commentary of the Srimad Bhagavatam, the most important classic of Vedic literature. For thousands of years in India, great spiritual masters presented commentaries on the Bhagavatam to explain its urgent message to the people of their times. H.H. Hridayananda dasa Goswami is the first westerner is trusted with this laborious task, and his success in communicating the essence of India's spiritual heritage to modern readers has already been noticed by scholars and religious leaders in the whole world. In 1996 H.H. Hridayananda dasa Goswami received his Ph.D. in Sanskrit and Indian Studies from the University of Harvard. His present project is the translation and adaptation of the Indian epic, the Mahabharata. He is also currently finishing his first novel, a modern-day, exciting drama meant to captivate the general public while transmitting Krishna conscious philosophy and values. </td></tr> </tbody></table>

In the fall of 2003 I had a conversation with Hrdayananda Maharaja where I confronted him on the GBC's official position on the origin of the GBC. I gave him the basic arguments myself and Guruvani have presented here in the last few months. He gave the Fall-Vadi position. Finally I told him, "Maharaja you a saying that Srila Prabhupada is giving something different on this subject than Sri Bhaktivinoda Thakur and Srila Bhaktisidhanta Saraswati Thakur." He replied, "yes, Srila Prabhupada gave a new realization on this topic that no one has ever given before". I said, "Maharaja do you understand what you are saying, no one has ever said this before". He looked back and told me, "yes, after studying the situation, this is what I believe." I just had the distinct feeling that he actually didn't even care what is true or not. Later that evening I listened to his class and could barely contain myself. He was giving new unique translations to Srila Prabhupada's translated Gita and Bhagavatam verses and making vailed criticism of Prabhupada's translations. The audience which included experience devotees just sat there and smiled.

During the early '80s Jayadvaita Maharaja maintained a secret relationship with what became the Sridhar Maharaja camp. It was Drutakarma who drove a wedge between Ramesvara Maharaja and the TP, Dhira Krsna Maharaja during the spring of 1981 by using the argument that those who accepted Srila Sridhar Maharaja's explaination of the origin of the jiva were disloyal to the teachings of Srila Prabhupada. Eventually this led to the North American GBC led by Bhavananda banning Sridhar Maharaja's vani in ISKCON, North America. This man is having homosexual relationships and is then becoming the driving force to ban the sadhu who Srila Prabhupada called "my siksa guru"! At the time Jayadvaita Maharaja knew all these things and was greatly saddened by these events. Yet within a few months the repression spread worldwide. Yet he secretly maintained his connection with the leaders of those devotees who followed their hearts and refused to renounce Srila Sridhar Maharaja. Of course then the years began to fly by and the GBC, at the urging of Jayadvaita Maharaja, made some half-hearted posthumous apology to Srila Sridhar Maharaja after his disappearance. Nowadays, Jayadvaita Maharaja makes a show of public support for the official GBC position on the fall of the jiva. I'm not really sure about his real current position, and I really doubt that he does either.

Here's a picture of Theist when he first heard of Maharaja saving the elephant and the soccer ball:

Yer all a bunch nitpickers, nitpickers, I say. The picture below is was actually taken in India when Maharaja saved an elephant who had swallowed a soccer ball. No one in the crowd knew what to do but Maharaja, being an ex-volleyball player took a running start and leaped high in the air, reached in the elephants' mouth and snagged that soccer ball. So this is a picture of Maharaja after he saved the elephant (and the ball). Every Thanksgiving they commemorate this event down in Alachua. Guruvani would know but he's a hermit and won't go down to the Farm for Thanksgiving. Thank God there's still heroes amongst the Iskcon gurus! Yer all a bunch nitpickers!

Our Affectionate Guardians Chapter Four (Excerpt): Prabhupada's Instructions Sripad Visnu Maharaja

"Subjective Evolution of Consciousness", Srila Bhakti Raksak Sridhar Maharaj,

Theist, I think the above statement makes things quite clear. Guruvani has essentially written the same thing (as above) a considerable number of times. I, in my own way have made similar points in my own style, on many, many posts; Yet you continue keep making the same false assumptions and accusations about what is our position. Frankly, I don't understand why you are doing this. Are you sure that you are carefully reading these posts? The Gaudiya conclusion that "no one falls from Vaikuntha" or dreaming that they are from a position in Goloka does not (once and for all) preclude the concept that we conditioned souls are essentially dreaming that we are a material body and mind in the realm of consciousness. It seems that you have made this false accusation the foundation of your opposition (or at least closet opposition) to this concept expressed by Srila Bhaktivinoda Thakur, Tattva Viveka 2.4

Can't you just be happy that the Curse of Babe Ruth is over? Of course not, because everything in the world of material duality is just a "mental mushroom". The Search for Sri Krishna 'The Krishna Conception' Chapter (excerpt) by Srila Bhakti Raksak Sridhar Dev-Goswami Maharaj, <table cellpadding="4" cellspacing="0" width="98%"><tbody><tr><td colspan="2">Hope For The Hopeless </td> </tr> <tr> <td> </td> <td> Don't be a turkey! </td></tr></tbody></table>

No one including Guruvani or myself has asserted that Srila Prabhpada's statements about our material experience being like a dream are not valid. If we pay attention to our dream experiences we will see how they are sometimes more similar to our real consciousness than our so-called waking consciousness. After all if we find ourselves chanting in our dream or if we are seeing Prabhupada in a dream, it seems very profound. Perhaps part of this is the creative nature of consciousness. The next point and one that I've made in several posts over the last few weeks is that the idea that we are already liberated, which Srila Prabhupada talked about in several quotes, is really a paraphrase of the nitya siddha krsna prema sadhya kabu naya verse of C.C. Anyway these are different angle of vision, like points on a line, or circles in a sphere (which are infinite or infintesimal). The Krsna Conscious theology must take into account all poles of the inconceivable differences and harmonized them in a cohesive way. The spirit sould is not really a spiritual spark but it is like a spark. And the Supreme spirit is not really a sun but rather like a sun. We only have experience of a spark or even the sun within this world, analogies always fall short. They only convey an idea which in a sense is beyond our brain to concieve. Still that we are dreaming in Goloka that we are here in samsara is not taking into consideration the preeminent postion of those souls who "never have deviated from Krsna's service." Then if a fallen soul or (one who is dreaming he is fallen) would have Krsna's promise that once attaining the spiritual planets he will never come back. This puts the fallen "vitiated" souls in a superior position to those servitors in Goloka who never give up Krsna's service. Here is where such a paradigm fall short for in fails to take into consideration this and other major contradictions. Consequently both the Fall and Dreamer theories cannot be the "conclusion". In the words of Narasimha Maharaja,