gHari

Doesn't karma explain evil? I see karma like the bit in the horse's mouth - the way Krsna directs us back to Godhead. When the horse has to change direction quickly, the bit is yanked hard and the pain alters the course of the horse, of course. However, of course if the horse is not broken, it will rebel against the gentle hints from the bit. When it is completely out of control, only a big big yank on the reins can adjust the direction.<font color="#dedfdf"> [This message has been edited by gHari (edited 02-22-2002).]

So nice to hear your heart, Yashoda devi dasi. I think we are all now a little embarrassed about some of the nonsense we sponsor on the Fellowship here. But perhaps your appearance day has purified the atmosphere. Hare Krsna!

Seeing the comment about deeply Catholic countries, I fondly remembered my Christmas in Bogota, Colombia a few years back. That experience and my contract in Mexico opened my eyes to just how demonic North America has become.

Jaya JayaRadhe!

Why is there a bit in the mouth of a horse?

Okay, okay, okay. Here comes the greatest blonde joke of all time. Scientists prepared to objectively evaluate the intelligence of blondes, to either prove or disprove popular opinion about them. They assembled a hall filled with one thousand randomly selected true blondes. From these, one was selected as the representative blonde. On the stage she was asked an arithmetic problem, "What is 98 plus 54?" The blonde replied "108." The scientist announced: "No, I'm afraid not." Then all one thousand blondes shouted, "Awww, give her another chance!" "Well, okay. What is 16 plus 17?" asked the scientist. The blonde answered confidently, "108." Then again The scientist pronounced: "No, that is not correct." Then all one thousand blondes stood up and shouted, "Awww, give her another chance!" Compassionately the scientist posed an easier question: "How much is 2 plus 2?" Bouncing up and down, the blonde squeeled, "FOUR!" Then all one thousand blondes stood up, climbed on their chairs, and all yelled in unison, "Awww, give her another chance!"

I guess not a real palindrome. But still a good day for meditation. ECNALUBMA

December 12, 1212

Today is last day of your life. It is indeed a very good day for meditation. God is very compassionate today.

Just as the sparrow sees the present, Krsna sees the future. He is time, it is within Him. He knows past, present and future at once; total cognition of all that He is, always in the ever-present now. At least those are my gleanings from the various scriptural references given. I seem to be able to put free will and all-knowing together without paradox. But certainly it is only vanity for me to think that I understand. I am a simple fellow. Krsna is the final authority; His wonder is far far beyond my ability to understand. I need only to gaze at the stars in the heavens to know that I am completely dependent on Him always.<font color="#dedfdf"> [This message has been edited by gHari (edited 02-20-2002).]

No, no, no. If a sparrow sees me writing this response now, that does not mean that I 'had' to write this response now. By my free will I started typing. The sparrow is not wrong - this is just what I am doing. You are thinking that the future does not exist until it 'happens'. Only from our perception this is true.

Krsna Book, Srimad Bhagavatam Tenth Canto The NAgapatnIs continued, "We therefore offer our respectful obeisances unto You, our dear Lord, because You are the Supreme Person, who are living as the Supersoul within every living entity; although You are transcendental to the cosmic manifestation, everything is resting in You. You are the personified indefatigable eternal time. The entire time force is existing in You, and You are therefore the seer and the embodiment of total time in the shape of past, present and future, month, day, hour, moment--everything. In other words, O Lord, You can see perfectly all the activities happening in every moment, in every hour, in every day, in every month, in every year, past, present and future. You are Yourself the universal form, and yet You are different from this universe. You are simultaneously one with and different from the universe. We therefore offer our respectful obeisances unto You. You are Yourself the whole universe, and yet You are the creator of the whole universe. ==== Bhagavad-gita 7.26 vedAhaM samatItAni vartamAnAni cArjuna bhaviSyANi ca bhUtAni mAM tu veda na kazcana veda--know; aham--I; samatItAni--completely past; vartamAnAni--present; ca--and; arjuna--O Arjuna; bhaviSyANi--future; ca--also; bhUtAni--all living entities; mAm--Me; tu--but; veda--knows; na--not; kazcana--anyone. O Arjuna, as the Supreme Personality of Godhead, I know everything that has happened in the past, all that is happening in the present, and all things that are yet to come. I also know all living entities; but Me no one knows. PURPORT Here the question of personality and impersonality is clearly stated. If KRSNa, the form of the Supreme Personality of Godhead, were mAyA, material, as the impersonalists consider Him to be, then like the living entity He would change His body and forget everything about His past life. Anyone with a material body cannot remember his past life, nor can he foretell his future life, nor can he predict the outcome of his present life; therefore he cannot know what is happening in past, present and future. Unless one is liberated from material contamination, he cannot know past, present and future. Unlike the ordinary human being, Lord KRSNa clearly says that He completely knows what happened in the past, what is happening in the present, and what will happen in the future. In the Fourth Chapter we have seen that Lord KRSNa remembers instructing VivasvAn, the sun-god, millions of years ago. KRSNa knows every living entity because He is situated in every living being's heart as the Supersoul. But despite His presence in every living entity as Supersoul and His presence as the Supreme Personality of Godhead, the less intelligent, even if able to realize the impersonal Brahman, cannot realize SrI KRSNa as the Supreme Person. Certainly the transcendental body of SrI KRSNa is not perishable. He is just like the sun, and mAyA is like a cloud. In the material world we can see that there is the sun and that there are clouds and different stars and planets. The clouds may cover all these in the sky temporarily, but this covering is only apparent to our limited vision. The sun, moon and stars are not actually covered. Similarly, mAyA cannot cover the Supreme Lord. By His internal potency He is not manifest to the less intelligent class of men. As it is stated in the third verse of this chapter, out of millions and millions of men, some try to become perfect in this human form of life, and out of thousands and thousands of such perfected men, hardly one can understand what Lord KRSNa is. Even if one is perfected by realization of impersonal Brahman or localized ParamAtmA, he cannot possibly understand the Supreme Personality of Godhead, SrI KRSNa, without being in KRSNa consciousness. ==== Bhagavad-gita 11.7 ihaika-sthaM jagat kRtsnaM pazyAdya sa-carAcaram mama dehe guDAkeza yac cAnyad draSTum icchasi iha--in this; eka-stham--in one place; jagat--the universe; kRtsnam--completely; pazya--see; adya--immediately; sa--with; cara--the moving; acaram--and not moving; mama--My; dehe--in this body; guDAkeza--O Arjuna; yat--that which; ca--also; anyat--other; draSTum--to see; icchasi--you wish. O Arjuna, whatever you wish to see, behold at once in this body of Mine! This universal form can show you whatever you now desire to see and whatever you may want to see in the future. Everything--moving and nonmoving--is here completely, in one place. PURPORT No one can see the entire universe while sitting in one place. Even the most advanced scientist cannot see what is going on in other parts of the universe. But a devotee like Arjuna can see everything that exists in any part of the universe. KRSNa gives him the power to see anything he wants to see, past, present and future. Thus by the mercy of KRSNa, Arjuna is able to see everything. ==== Bhagavad-gita 13.15 Purport He sees everything--past, present and future. He lives within the heart of the living being, and He knows what we have done in the past, what we are doing now, and what is awaiting us in the future. This is also confirmed in Bhagavad-gItA: He knows everything, but no one knows Him. ==== Srimad Bhagavatam 1.4.16 parAvara-jJaH sa RSiH kAlenAvyakta-raMhasA yuga-dharma-vyatikaraM prAptaM bhuvi yuge yuge para-avara--past and future; jJaH--one who knows; saH--he; RSiH--VyAsadeva; kAlena--in the course of time; avyakta--unmanifested; raMhasA--by great force; yuga-dharma--acts in terms of the millennium; vyatikaram--anomalies; prAptam--having accrued; bhuvi--on the earth; yuge yuge--different ages. The great sage VyAsadeva saw anomalies in the duties of the millennium. This happens on the earth in different ages, due to unseen forces in the course of time. PURPORT The great sages like VyAsadeva are liberated souls, and therefore they can see clearly past and future. Thus he could see the future anomalies in the Kali age, and accordingly he made arrangement for the people in general so that they can execute a progressive life in this age, which is full of darkness. The people in general in this age of Kali are too much interested in matter, which is temporary. Because of ignorance they are unable to evaluate the assets of life and be enlightened in spiritual knowledge. ==== Srimad Bhagavatam 2.1.33 Purport He moves with the progress of time, and therefore lie knows all about the past and future, along with His present activities. There is nothing unknown to Him. ==== Srimad Bhagavatam 2.2.18 na yatra kAlo 'nimiSAM paraH prabhuH kuto nu devA jagatAM ya Izire na yatra sattvaM na rajas tamaz ca na vai vikAro na mahAn pradhAnam na--not; yatra--wherein; kAlaH--destructive time; animiSAm--of the heavenly demigods; paraH--superior; prabhuH--controller; kutaH--where is there; nu--certainly; devAH--the demigods; jagatAm--the mundane creatures; ye--those; Izire--rules; na--not; yatra--therein; sattvam--mundane goodness; na--nor; rajaH--mundane passion; tamaH--mundane ignorance; ca--also; na--nor; vai--certainly; vikAraH--transformation; na--nor; mahAn--the material Causal Ocean; pradhAnam--material nature. In that transcendental state of labdhopazAnti, there is no supremacy of devastating time, which controls even the celestial demigods who are empowered to rule over mundane creatures. (And what to speak of the demigods themselves?) Nor is there the mode of material goodness, nor passion, nor ignorance, nor even the false ego, nor the material Causal Ocean, nor the material nature. PURPORT Devastating time, which controls even the celestial demigods by its manifestations of past, present and future, does not act on the transcendental plane. The influence of time is exhibited by the symptoms of birth, death, old age and disease, and these four principles of material conditions are present everywhere in any part of the material cosmos up to the planet Brahmaloka, where the duration of life of the inhabitants appears to us to be fabulous. Insurmountable time even brings about the death of BrahmA, so what to speak of other demigods like Indra, Candra, SUrya, VAyu and VaruNa? The astronomical influence directed by the different demigods over mundane creatures is also conspicuous by its absence. In material existence, the living entities are afraid of Satanic influence, but for a devotee on the transcendental plane there is no such fear at all. The living entities change their material bodies in different shapes and forms under the influence of the different modes of material nature, but in the transcendental state the devotee is guNa-tIta, or above the material modes of goodness, passion and ignorance. Thus the false ego of "I am the lord of all I survey" does not arise there. In the material world the false ego of the living being trying to lord it over the material nature is something like the moth's falling in a blazing fire. The moth is captivated by the glaring beauty of the fire, and when he comes to enjoy it, the blazing fire consumes him. In the transcendental state the living being is pure in his consciousness, and as such he has no false ego to lord it over the material nature. Rather, his pure consciousness directs him to surrender unto the Supreme Lord, as stated in the Bhagavad-gItA (7.19): vAsudevaH sarvam iti sa mahAtmA sudurlabhaH. All this indicates that in the transcendental state there is neither material creation nor the Causal Ocean for material nature. The above-mentioned state of affairs is factual on the transcendental plane, but is factually revealed in a transcendentalist's knowledge of the advanced state of pure consciousness. Such transcendentalists are of two types, namely the impersonalists and the devotees. For the impersonalist the ultimate goal or destination is the brahmajyoti of the spiritual sky, but for the devotees the ultimate goal is the VaikuNTha planets. The devotees experience the above-mentioned state of affairs by attainment of spiritual forms for activity in the transcendental loving service of the Lord. But the impersonalist, because of his neglecting the association of the Lord, does not develop a spiritual body for spiritual activity, but remains a spiritual spark only, merged in the effulgent spiritual rays of the Supreme Personality of Godhead. The Lord is the full-fledged form of eternity, bliss and knowledge, but the formless brahmajyoti is simply eternity and knowledge. The VaikuNTha planets are also forms of eternity, bliss and knowledge, and therefore the devotees of the Lord, who are admitted into the abode of the Lord, also get bodies of eternity, bliss and knowledge. As such there is no difference between one and another. The Lord's abode, name, fame, entourage, etc., are of the same transcendental quality, and how this transcendental quality differs from the material world is explained herewith in this verse. In the Bhagavad-gItA, three principal subjects have been explained by Lord SrI KRSNa, namely karma-yoga, jJAna-yoga and bhakti-yoga, but one can reach the VaikuNTha planets by the practice of bhakti-yoga only. The other two are incompetent in helping one reach the VaikuNThalokas, although they can, however, conveniently take one to the effulgent brahmajyoti, as described above. ==== Srimad Bhagavatam 2.9.10 pravartate yatra rajas tamas tayoH sattvaM ca mizraM na ca kAla-vikramaH na yatra mAyA kim utApare harer anuvratA yatra surAsurArcitAH pravartate--prevail; yatra--wherein; rajaH tamaH--the modes of passion and ignorance; tayoH--of both of them; sattvam--the mode of goodness; ca--and; mizram--mixture; na--never; ca--and; kAla--time; vikramaH--influence; na--neither; yatra--therein; mAyA--illusory, external energy; kim--what; uta--there is; apare--others; hareH--of the Personality of Godhead; anuvratAH--devotees; yatra--wherein; sura--by the demigods; asura--and the demons; arcitAH--worshiped. In that personal abode of the Lord, the material modes of ignorance and passion do not prevail, nor is there any of their influence in goodness. There is no predominance of the influence of time, so what to speak of the illusory, external energy; it cannot enter that region. Without discrimination, both the demigods and the demons worship the Lord as devotees. PURPORT The kingdom of God, or the atmosphere of the VaikuNTha nature, which is called the tripAd-vibhUti, is three times bigger than the material universes and is described here, as also in the Bhagavad-gItA, in a nutshell. This universe, containing billions of stars and planets, is one of the billions of such universes clustered together within the compass of the mahat-tattva. And all these millions and billions of universes combined together constitute only one fourth of the magnitude of the whole creation of the Lord. There is the spiritual sky also; beyond this sky are the spiritual planets under the names of VaikuNTha, and all of them constitute three fourths of the entire creation of the Lord. God's creations are always innumerable. Even the leaves of a tree cannot be counted by a man, nor can the hairs on his head. However, foolish men are puffed up with the idea of becoming God Himself, though unable to create a hair of their own bodies. Man may discover so many wonderful vehicles of journey, but even if he reaches the moon by his much advertised spacecraft, he cannot remain there. The sane man, therefore, without being puffed up, as if he were the God of the universe, abides by the instructions of the Vedic literature, the easiest way to acquire knowledge in transcendence. So let us know through the authority of SrImad-BhAgavatam of the nature and constitution of the transcendental world beyond the material sky. In that sky the material qualities, especially the modes of ignorance and passion, are completely absent. The mode of ignorance influences a living entity to the habit of lust and hankering, and this means that in the VaikuNThalokas the living entities are free from these two things. As confirmed in the Bhagavad-gItA, in the brahma-bhUta [sB 4.30.20] stage of life one becomes free from hankering and lamentation. Therefore the conclusion is that the inhabitants of the VaikuNTha planets are all brahma-bhUta living entities, as distinguished from the mundane creatures who are all compact in hankering and lamentation. When one is not in the modes of ignorance and passion, one is supposed to be situated in the mode of goodness in the material world. Goodness in the material world also at times becomes contaminated by touches of the modes of passion and ignorance. In the VaikuNThaloka, it is unalloyed goodness only. The whole situation there is one of freedom from the illusory manifestation of the external energy. Although illusory energy is also part and parcel of the Supreme Lord, illusory energy is differentiated from the Lord. The illusory energy is not, however, false, as claimed by the monist philosophers. The rope accepted as a snake may be an illusion to a particular person, but the rope is a fact, and the snake is also a fact. The illusion of water on the hot desert may be illusion for the ignorant animal searching for water in the desert, but the desert and water are actual facts. Therefore the material creation of the Lord may be an illusion to the nondevotee, but to a devotee even the material creation of the Lord is a fact, as the manifestation of His external energy. But this energy of the Lord is not all. The Lord has His internal energy also, which has another creation known to be the VaikuNThalokas, where there is no ignorance, no passion, no illusion and no past and present. With a poor fund of knowledge one may be unable to understand the existence of such things as the VaikuNTha atmosphere, but that does not nullify its existence. That spacecraft cannot reach these planets does not mean that there are no such planets, for they are described in the revealed scriptures. As quoted by SrIla JIva GosvAmI, we can know from the NArada-paJcarAtra that the transcendental world or VaikuNTha atmosphere is enriched with transcendental qualities. These transcendental qualities, as revealed through the devotional service of the Lord, are distinct from the mundane qualities of ignorance, passion and goodness. Such qualities are not attainable by the nondevotee class of men. In the Padma PurANa, Uttara-khaNDa, it is stated that beyond the one-fourth part of God's creation is the three-fourths manifestation. The marginal line between the material manifestation and the spiritual manifestation is the VirajA River, and beyond the VirajA, which is a transcendental current flowing from the perspiration of the body of the Lord, there is the three-fourths manifestation of God's creation. This part is eternal, everlasting, without deterioration, and unlimited, and it contains the highest perfectional stage of living conditions. In the SAGkhya-kaumudI it is stated that unalloyed goodness or transcendence is just opposite to the material modes. All living entities there are eternally associated without any break, and the Lord is the chief and prime entity. In the Agama PurANas also, the transcendental abode is described as follows: The associated members there are free to go everywhere within the creation of the Lord, and there is no limit to such creation, particularly in the region of the three-fourths magnitude. Since the nature of that region is unlimited, there is no history of such association, nor is there end of it. The conclusion may be drawn that because of the complete absence of the mundane qualities of ignorance and passion, there is no question of creation nor of annihilation. In the material world everything is created, and everything is annihilated, and the duration of life between the creation and annihilation is temporary. In the transcendental realm there is no creation and no destruction, and thus the duration of life is eternal unlimitedly. In other words, everything in the transcendental world is everlasting, full of knowledge and bliss without deterioration. Since there is no deterioration, there is no past, present and future in the estimation of time. It is clearly stated in this verse that the influence of time is conspicuous by its absence. The whole material existence is manifested by actions and reactions of elements which make the influence of time prominent in the matter of past, present and future. There are no such actions and reactions of cause and effects there, so the cycle of birth, growth, existence, transformations, deterioration and annihilation--the six material changes--are not existent there. It is the unalloyed manifestation of the energy of the Lord, without illusion as experienced here in the material world. The whole VaikuNTha existence proclaims that everyone there is a follower of the Lord. The Lord is the chief leader there, without any competition for leadership, and the people in general are all followers of the Lord. It is confirmed in the Vedas, therefore, that the Lord is the chief leader and all other living entities are subordinate to Him, for only the Lord satisfies all the needs of all other living entities. ==== Srimad Bhagavatam 3.4.18 mantreSu mAM vA upahUya yat tvam akuNThitAkhaNDa-sadAtma-bodhaH pRccheH prabho mugdha ivApramattas tan no mano mohayatIva deva mantreSu--in consultations; mAm--unto me; vai--as either; upahUya--by calling; yat--as much as; tvam--Your Lordship; akuNThita--without hesitation; akhaNDa--without being separated; sadA--eternally; Atma--self; bodhaH--intelligent; pRccheH--asked; prabho--O my Lord; mugdhaH--bewildered; iva--as if it were so; apramattaH--although never bewildered; tat--that; naH--our; manaH--mind; mohayati--bewilders; iva--as it is so; deva--O my Lord. O my Lord, Your eternal Self is never divided by the influence of time, and there is no limitation to Your perfect knowledge. Thus You were sufficiently able to consult with Yourself, yet You called upon me for consultation, as if bewildered, although You are never bewildered. And this act of Yours bewilders me. PURPORT Uddhava was never actually bewildered, but he says that all these contradictions appear to be bewildering. The whole discussion between KRSNa and Uddhava was meant for the benefit of Maitreya, who was sitting nearby. The Lord used to call Uddhava for consultation when the city was attacked by JarAsandha and others and when He executed great sacrifices as part of His routine royal work as Lord of DvArakA. The Lord has no past, present and future because He is unhampered by the influence of eternal time and thus nothing is hidden from Him. He is eternally self-intelligent. Therefore His calling for Uddhava to give Him enlightenment is certainly astonishing. All these actions of the Lord appear to be contradictory, although there is no contradiction in the routine activities of the Lord. Therefore it is better to see them as they are and not attempt to explain them. ==== Srimad Bhagavatam 4.8.26 nAradas tad upAkarNya jJAtvA tasya cikIrSitam spRSTvA mUrdhany agha-ghnena pANinA prAha vismitaH nAradaH--the great sage NArada; tat--that; upAkarNya--overhearing; jJAtvA--and knowing; tasya--his (Dhruva MahArAja's); cikIrSitam--activities; spRSTvA--by touching; mUrdhani--on the head; agha-ghnena--which can drive away all sinful activities; pANinA--by the hand; prAha--said; vismitaH--being surprised. The great sage NArada overheard this news, and understanding all the activities of Dhruva MahArAja, he was struck with wonder. He approached Dhruva, and touching the boy's head with his all-virtuous hand, he spoke as follows. PURPORT When Dhruva MahArAja was talking with his mother, SunIti, of all the incidents that had taken place in the palace, NArada was not present. Thus the question may be raised how NArada overheard all these topics. The answer is that NArada is trikAla-jJa; he is so powerful that he can understand the past, future and present of everyone's heart, just like the Supersoul, the Supreme Personality of Godhead. Therefore, after understanding the strong determination of Dhruva MahArAja, NArada came to help him. It may be explained in this way: The Supreme Personality of Godhead is present in everyone's heart, and as soon as He understands that a living entity is serious about entering devotional service, He sends His representative. In this way NArada was sent to Dhruva MahArAja. This is explained in the Caitanya-caritAmRta. Guru-kRSNa-prasAde pAya bhakti-latA-bIja: [Cc. Madhya 19.151] by the grace of the spiritual master and KRSNa, one can enter into devotional service. Because of Dhruva MahArAja's determination, KRSNa, the Supersoul, immediately sent His representative, NArada, to initiate him. ==== Sri Caitanya-caritamrta Adi 2.44 ithe yata jIva, tAra trai-kAlika karma tAhA dekha, sAkSI tumi, jAna saba marma ithe--in these; yata--as many; jIva--living beings; tAra--of them; trai-kAlika--past, present and future; karma--the activities; tAhA--that; dekha--You see; sAkSi--witness; tumi--You; jAna--You know; saba--of everything; marma--the essence. "Both in this material world and in the transcendental world, You see all the deeds of all living beings, in the past, present and future. Since You are the witness of all such deeds, You know the essence of everything. ==== Sri Caitanya-caritamrta Adi 2.46 nArera ayana yAte kara darazana tAhAteo hao tumi mUla nArAyaNa nArera--of the living beings; ayana--the motion; yAte--since; kara--You do; darazana--seeing; tAhAteo--therefore; hao--are; tumi--You; mUla--original; nArAyaNa--NArAyaNa. "You oversee the wanderings of all living beings. For this reason also, You are the primeval Lord NArAyaNa." PURPORT SrI KRSNa, in His ParamAtmA feature, lives in the hearts of all living beings in both the transcendental and mundane creations. As the ParamAtmA, He witnesses all actions the living beings perform in all phases of time, namely past, present and future. SrI KRSNa knows what the living beings have done for hundreds and thousands of past births, and He sees what they are doing now; therefore He knows the results of their present actions that will fructify in the future. As stated in the Bhagavad-gItA, the entire cosmic situation is created as soon as He glances over the material energy. Nothing can exist without His superintendence. Since He sees even the abode where the collective living beings rest, He is the original NArAyaNa. ==== Sri Caitanya-caritamrta Madhya 6.141 'nirvizeSa' tAGre kahe yei zruti-gaNa 'prAkRta' niSedhi kare 'aprAkRta' sthApana nirvizeSa--impersonal; tAGre--Him; kahe--say; yei--whatever; zruti-gaNa--the Vedas; prAkRta--mundane; niSedhi--forbidding; kare--does; aprAkRta--transcendental; sthApana--confirmation. "Wherever there is an impersonal description in the Vedas, the Vedas mean to establish that everything belonging to the Supreme Personality of Godhead is transcendental and free of mundane characteristics." PURPORT There are many impersonal statements about the Supreme Personality of Godhead. As stated in the SvetAzvatara UpaniSad (3.19): apANi-pAdo javano grahItA pazyaty acakSuH sa zRNoty akarNaH sa vetti vedyaM na ca tasyAsti vettA tam Ahur agryaM puruSaM mahAntam Although the Supreme Lord is described as having no hands and legs, He nonetheless accepts all sacrificial offerings. He has no eyes, yet He sees everything. He has no ears, yet He hears everything. When it is stated that the Supreme Lord has no hands and legs, one should not think that He is impersonal. Rather, He has no mundane hands or legs like ours. "He has no eyes, yet He sees." This means that He does not have mundane, limited eyes like ours. Rather, He has such eyes that He can see past, present and future, everywhere, in every corner of the universe and in every corner of the heart of every living entity. Thus the impersonal descriptions in the Vedas intend to deny mundane characteristics in the Supreme Lord. They do not intend to establish the Supreme Lord as impersonal. ==== From The Teachings of Lord Caitanya 24 Whenever we speak of the Supreme Personality of Godhead, we add the word zrI, indicating that He is full with six opulences. In other words, He is eternally a person; if He were not a person, the six opulences could not be present in fullness. If we say that the Supreme Absolute Truth is impersonal, we mean that His personality is not material. Thus in order to distinguish His transcendental body from ordinary material bodies, some philosophers have explained Him as being impersonal from the material point of view. In other words, material personality is denied, and spiritual personality is established. In the SvetAzvatara UpaniSad (3.19) it is clearly explained that the Absolute Truth has no material legs and hands, but in that scripture it is indicated that He has spiritual hands by which He accepts everything offered to Him. Similarly, He has no material eyes, but He does have spiritual eyes by which He can see everything and anything. Although He has no material ears, He can hear everything and anything. Having perfect senses, He knows past, future and present. Indeed, He knows everything, but no one can understand Him, for by material senses He cannot be understood. Being the origin of all emanations, He is the supreme, the greatest, the Personality of Godhead. ==== From The Teachings of Lord Caitanya 31 In Brahma-saMhitA the transcendental land of VRndAvana is described as being always spiritual. That spiritual land is populated by goddesses of fortune, who are known as gopIs. These are all beloved of KRSNa, and KRSNa is the only lover of all those gopIs. The trees of that land are kalpa-vRkSa, wish fulfilling trees, and one can have anything he wants from them. The land is made of touchstone and the water of nectar. In that land all speech is song, and all walking is dancing, and one's constant companion is the flute. Everything is self-luminous, just like the sun in this material world. The human form of life is meant for understanding this transcendental land of VRndAvana, and one who is fortunate should cultivate knowledge of VRndAvana and its residents. In that supreme abode are surabhi cows that overflood the land with milk. Since not even a moment there is misused, there is no past, present or future. An expansion of this VRndAvana, which is the supreme abode of KRSNa, is also present on this earth, and superior devotees worship it as the supreme abode. However, no one can appreciate VRndAvana without being highly elevated in spiritual knowledge, KRSNa consciousness. According to ordinary experience, VRndAvana appears to be just like an ordinary village, but in the eyes of a highly elevated devotee, it is as good as the original VRndAvana. A great saintly AcArya has sung: "When will my mind be cleared of all contamination so I will be able to see VRndAvana as it is? And when will I be able to understand the literatures left by the GosvAmIs so that I will be able to know of the transcendental pastimes of RAdhA and KRSNa?" ==== From a lecture But KRSNa, about KRSNa, it is said, vijJAnena vijRmbhitaH. He's full, fully conscious. He knows. VedAhaM samatItAni. "I know everything," KRSNa says, "past, present, future." Just like KRSNa said to Arjuna, imaM vivasvate yogaM proktavAn aham avyayam, aham avyayam: [bg. 4.1] "Formerly I spoke to the sun-god." So because He does not forget past, present, future... VijJAnena vijRmbhitaH. He's always conscious, fully conscious. Whatever was done in the past, what will happen in the future, and what is happening, everything is known to KRSNa. VijJAnena vijRmbhitaH. But we have lost our consciousness. We have lost our memory that we have past, that we are parts and parcels of KRSNa, and we are identifying with this material world in different capacities. Somebody's identifying with this body; somebody's identifying with the society or community or nation or country. But KRSNa does not become such materially affected. VijJAnena vijRmbhitaH. He's always conscious.

Avinash, You never did address the real issue which was defined at least twice: past, present and future are only aspects of time in the material world. Krsna creates time; then why can He not do so in a way that allows Him to view it all at once? He can view all space at once; indeed existing in every atom. It seems to me that you are limiting Krsna for no reason; except for rules that apply only to our tiny world encased in time and space, but not to Krsna. From inside the material world we conclude that "Nothing comes from nothing", "Matter is neither created nor destroyed". From outside the world, it looks entirely different. You accept that Krsna creates space and time from nothing, yet see it as inconceivable that He can see all of time at once. I find it no greater a trick for such a master magician. gHari

Are we saying that God cannot see the future if man is allowed free will? Are we saying that God cannot create the material cosmos from nothing? He cannot create time and space from nothing? He is afterall, limited by the natural laws we observe in our world? God must see the causal plane sequentially as we do. Do the stories in the Vedas that present the entire future of the cosmos, demand that free will is non-existent? Yet, why would Krsna preach the Gita if no one has the choice to remember Him or not remember Him? I conclude that Sri Krsna is not a simple fellow like I am. I must accept His inconceivable potencies as He describes Them, verbatim. If we read this thread properly, we have learned that free will means surrendering to Krsna, otherwise we are forced to act in fortune or folly in accordance with the reactions of our previously accumulated karma. That is, in truth, the conditioned soul acting for his own amusement has no free will, although that illusion is a major feature of the false ego trap, affording us the fantasy of being masters of all that we survey.

I don't know how you got the impression that I have a female form. The crying Gaurahari is not I. 'gHari' is the informal initiation name of 'Bhakta Gary Maharaja'.<font color="#dedfdf"> [This message has been edited by gHari (edited 02-16-2002).]

I think that in a few years or maybe even right mow, the skaters will realize that this way was the best for their fame and upcoming professional careers. They have appeared on Jay Leno and Larry King. Even Dave Letterman said "30 million saw the Olympics. I guess the only people that didn't, are the ice skating judges." They even joined the pop rock group BNL at the televised concert from the Olympic Center. The two routines were pretty comparable. Sale and Peltier were breath-taking. Thirty million saw that. Speaking of the Canadian band, BNL (Barenaked Ladies), I taped it and studied their incredibly creative and talented show. The tall singer (Ed) used to come to my farm with my son for weekends and summer vacations when they were 4 and 5. Little Eddie was a gifted kid and was sent to a special school for the gifted. There he and three other gifted kids decided to become rock stars. I could see Eddie's renunciation. He even wrote a song about "Figuring out what it's all about". I am very pleased with little Eddie; after 25 years he is still a wonderful happy kid, and spreading his happiness around bigtime. That band name is a little, well, unusual; in fact their first Toronto concert was cancelled because City Hall was afraid of a band with such a name - not realizeing their popularity and clean wholesome content and message. One favorite lyric is "If I had a million dollars; I'd buy you a fur coat - but not a real fur coat, that would be cruel." And then later "If I had a million dollars; I'd buy you a nice green dress - but not a real green dress, that would be cruel." I was trying to determine what the affect had been of his exposure to temple prasadam and Krsna pictures and sounds in his youth. It's odd how both he and my son have become famous doing the jobs all kids dream of doing; a rock star and skateboard pro. Hopefully Krsna will arrange for them to use their fame in His service at some point. "If I had a million dollars; if I had a million dollars, I'd buy you love."<font color="#f7f7f7"> [This message has been edited by gHari (edited 02-16-2002).]

Of course, second guessing or criticizing or even giving advice to a pure devotee is offensive to Krsna. If Prabhupada exhibited anger, then we can understand that Krsna was directly or subtly being slighted. The typical scientific material mind is offensive to the Lord; denying His personal existence or supreme dominion.

Of course, second guessing or criticizing or even giving advice to a pure devotee is offensive to Krsna. If Prabhupada exhibited anger, then we can understand that Krsna was directly or subtly being slighted. The typical scientific material mind is offensive to the Lord; denying His personal existence or supreme dominion.

Canadian skaters get GOLD too! There is a God.

I got an F on the test. Then I tried to poke fun at the men who build their lives around Prabhupada's comment about women having six ounce brains. I got an F on that too.

You definitely have the mercy flowing there, Leyh.

Okay, forget the time machine. They don't really exist. It was only a vehicle to try to get us to see Krsna's special position, and to forget our limited perception of time as a linear causal plane string of events; to actually consider the implications of Krsna's ability to know the future; to stop seeing Him as just a superhuman, bound by our same limitations. Most can accept that Krsna is everywhere. Is it difficult to equally conceive that He is also everywhen? For Him, past, present and future exist simultaneously. Past, present and future are terms only meaningful in the material world. He is beyond space and time, giving Him access to all space and all time simultaneously; placing Him everywhere all the time, simultaneously; while still remaining in His Origin Being. The earlier Gita quote showed that He knows the future. For Him, the future exists now. The past exists now.

We would have to weigh the variables, track conditions, fairness of the French judges, etc. However, Krsna, from His unique position beyond time and space, has access to all space and all time. It's not that He divines (pardon the pun) the future; He can literally see it. For us, it would be like having a time machine. Our excellent adventure would take us to 8PM on March 1st, 2002. We go to the library and find Leyh studying. We find him there because, in the future, that is what he will be doing at that time. Or consider the present: had you used the time machine a week ago to arrive at this moment at my place, you would find me typing this mind-boggling message. It is clear that someone with a time machine who knows that I will be typing this message now, has no affect on the fact that this is precisely what I am doing. Our seeing Leyh at the library on March 1st is caused by Leyh going to the library to study for his March 2nd exam; not that our time travel has caused him to go to the library like some sort of zombie. That is, the future causes/affects our perception of the future; not the other way around, that our perception of the future causes/affects the future.<font color="#f7f7f7"> [This message has been edited by gHari (edited 02-14-2002).]

Took the words right out my fingertips, Tarun.

THE ESSENCE OF MEDITATION Preface to The Teachings of Lord Caitanya: