Sonic Yogi

chant Hare Krishna and be very happy......feel the bliss... taste the juice... chant Hare Krishna and you WILL love it!!!

There are Vedic sages who also expounded the theory of evolution. Srila Prabhupada mentioned it in his books in a couple of places. ( I will have to search for the reference later, I gotta go to work now) He doesn't give the details of exactly what that theory of evolution involves, so I can't really elaborate. But, there are species that appear to have evolved different features as their location, the climate and the food sources changed. So, I believe that there is both evolution and creationism. Some species have evolved a little. Some species like Alligators haven't evolved in millions of years. Fossil records prove that. So, evolution does not cancel out God and God does not cancel out evolution. They are both possible at the same time in my view. If evolution was a law of nature, then Alligators should have evolved. They haven't changed at all in millions of years going back to the Dinosaurs.

When you are already perfect and supreme, there is no room for evolving. God is absolutely perfect. There is no where to evolve to when you are the highest form of life. There is some evolution of species. That is not hard to accept. But, evolution as being advocated by modern science is just the brain fart of a bunch of guys who get together and eat lunch at McDonald's every day. What can you expect from a bunch of burger heads who make their careers out of speculating and inventing theories. These guys make careers out of these stupid theories and there is no actual science behind it. I know enough about these so called scientists to know that a paycheck is behind all their theories. These people are just parasites on society who refuse work for a living or contribute anything useful to human society. They should all be put to work in the rice fields doing something productive.

So, you are basically saying that any and all religious theories about man being created by God in the image of God is all a hoax? In other words you are saying there is no God who created man as man. Then, what, may I ask are you doing on a forum about spirituality and faith in God? Do you hope to convince all us religious zealots that there is no God and that man evolved from Apes. Maybe you evolved from an Ape. Your level of intelligence seems to indicate that. Myself, I was created by God in his image. That is why I am smarter than you. Is it possible to have an intelligent conversation with an Ape?

Well, since there are 166 known moons in the solar system, that means that there are probably hundreds of them that are further from the Earth than the Sun. The entire universe contains probably thousands of moons. So, yeah, there are thousands of moons further from Earth than the Sun.

You are missing the point in that purport. It says that shakti-tattvas are empowered to become avatars. When the shakti-tattva become shaktyavesha avatar he is then an incarnation of Godhead like Vyasadeva. The shaktyavesha avatars come from the ranks of the shakti-tattva, but when they are empowered avatars they are incarnations of Godhead. Go back and read it again without coloring it with your pink glasses. Yes, jivas are shakti-tattva, but shaktyavesha avatars are incarnations of Godhead. So, if being shakti-tattva means incarnation of Godhead then we are all incarnations of Godhead according to the statement above.

Well, your claim that shaktyavesha avatars are "shakti-tattva" is totally bogus. Shaktyavesha avatars are incarnations of Vishnu. If you bothered to read the shastra I wouldn't have to be here telling you that. Show me anywhere in shastra that Shaktyavesha avatars are shakti tattva. You can't. It's just something you made up to try and defend your lack of knowledge of shaktyavesha avatars.

Shiva, your arrogance and conceit are totally off the chain. You really need to get your head out of your anal sphincter and show a little respect where respect is due. I have resolved to rectify my offenses to Narayana Maharaja and if you were as smart as you would like to presume to be you would too. You are an insect compared to Narayan Maharaja. The sooner you realize that the better off you will be. Narayana Maharaja has a right to differ from Prabhupada. Anybody with eyes can look around ISKCON and see that it is far from perfect. I have come to give Narayan Maharaja his due respect and afford him the right to his own opinion. If you think you are in a position to judge Narayana Maharaja I would just say that you must have really fried your brain on LSD are are suffering permanent hallucinations. I read your story. I know you saw Krishna in the form of a hologram and he looked just like Michael Jackson. So, at this point, your opinion has no value to me.

I knew it...... there is more than one God. Of all the many gods Krishna is just the head of the club. That is so wonderful. In all of Prabhupada's books he never once referred to Krishna as "the head god'. But, some undocumented lecture in Hawaii is what we are supposed to base our understanding on. Wonders never cease.

And that is indeed the most difficult thing to do without getting all sentimental in a sahajiya sort of way. Personally, I think the best way to bring the heart in to it is by really absorbing into the books and the purports. By reading the books hour after hour, day after day year after year we might finally start to "feel the love" shared by the spiritual master. Of course that needs to be tempered with chanting the rounds etc. I know for many older devotees they seem to feel as if they have already read the books for along time and then they sorta just get all off into ISKCON politics or some other social situation involving other devotees and put the books on the shelf to collect dust. The books should always be a new, fresh experience. If they aren't we are spiritual dead and aren't going to go anywhere in spiritual advancement. Are the books without some flaw or error? Probably not. But, they are probably 99% right on the money and that is enough to get us where we want to go. We have to make sacrifice. That is they key. The more we really and truly give of ourselves for the benefit of others the more the love will actually start to blossom in our hearts. If we aren't sacrificing for the cause of love, then we will never feel the love.

Here she is folks, my pride and joy!! Isn't she a beauty?

Ok, I get it. You left your reading glasses at the office?

You always thought? But, does what you always thought match what is stated in shastra? Sounds to me like hladini and chit shakti are something that has to be bestowed upon the living entity. Bhaktivinode covers the matter in some detail in his books. If we were so complete from the beginning, then how the heck did we end up in maya for billions of lifetimes?

But, how is a person a home? Back Home is a place. Why does Prabhupada refer to Godhead as a home? How about we change it to "Back to Him, Back to Godhead". yeah, that works for me....... I have never met a person yet that was a home. Home is where you hang your hat.

True. The tatastha jiva is lacking in chit-shakti and hladini-shakti. The gurus invests the disciples with both these shaktis through siksha and diksha. A tatastha jiva is incomplete in comparison to the liberated souls. The guru completes us and gives us the power to rise above the marginal plane of consciousness and enter the internal world of love of Krishna.

Sorry, but you are wrong about that. That is what a shaktyavesha avatar is - Vishnu manifesting through a jiva. Do some more homework before you jump to conclusions so hastily. Vyasadeva started out as a jiva and then he became an incarnation of Narayan. So, as far as I am concerned that is Vishnu manifesting through a jiva. SB 4.19.37 purport, So, the only way to become God is by being his devotee. It's amazing what you can learn if you read the books of Srila Prabhupada.

So, now you have to resort to claiming that purports have been miswritten by the BBT editors in order to defend your claim that Siva is just a common jiva? Ok, Gaurahari, I understand why you want to leave the discussion and claim a false victory on the basis that the books of Srila Prabhupada are seriously flawed. If you think Vishnu cannot become a jiva, then you surely have a very limted concept of the abilities of Lord Vishnu who is the smallest of the small. He can become even smaller than the jiva if he so chooses. Vishnu can even manifest Vishnu-tattva through a jiva if he so chooses. In short, Vishnu can do anything he wants.

See bro that is your problem. You want Siva-tattva to fit nicely into the corner of the box of your mind all nice and simple like a bag of weed in your pocket. Siva-tattva is beyond your mind, your joint and your LSD. Here is Srila Prabhupada's version.. CC Adi 7.69 purport, So, Gaurahari my old pal, Srila Prabhupada says that Siva-tattva is simultaneously Vishnu and jiva. But, that is not acceptable to you because you insist to reduce Siva down to a jiva like yourself rolling up joints and smoking them. In fact, you even call yourself Shiva because you smoke weed and imitate Lord Siva in drinking poison.

That is odd. A few years ago I brought up a similar discussion and I had quite a bit of disagreement and one person was actually able to produce a quote from Prabhupada to the effect that Godhead was in fact synonymous with Krsnaloka. Most everyone treated me like an idiot the last time I proposed that Godhead was not a place.

Nice, but that is the purport I first quoted when this whole discussion started. post #129

Worship of God.

Maybe you should expose your mind to scientists. http://krishnascience.comDarwin_defeated.html

The bank of the ocean is actually most commonly referred to as the beach. Like I have been telling you peeps, we are all originally beach dwellers, surfers of the waves of illusion, soaking in the Sun of the brahmajyoti rays. Then, JAWS came and snatched us and took a big bite out of our consciousness. So, the lifeguard of the spiritual master has jumper in the ocean to come and rescue us from the JAWS of illusion. For the jiva, live is a beach!