Sarva gattah

In Srimad Bhagavatam, purport of 3.26.7 Srila Prabhupada states - <?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:" /><o:p></o:p> Srila Prabhupada – “Whatever the material energy dictates, the conditioned soul does. He has no responsibility. He is simply the witness of the actions, he is forced to act that way due to his offence in his eternal relationship with Krsna.” <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> And what is that original offence? <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> The answer is giving up the Lord’s service. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> In Srimad Bhagavatam, 5.14.1, Prabhupada states in the purport - <o:p></o:p> Srila Prabhupada – “When the pure soul wants to give up the Lord’s service to enjoy the material world, Krsna certainly gives him a chance to enter the material world.”<o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> In Tokyo on April 20, 1972 Prabhupada stated – <o:p></o:p> Srila Prabhupada – “He has fallen means he has given up the service of Krsna.” <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Giving up the service to Sri Krsna is due to freewill which leads to more forgetfulness due to the choices one makes due to that free will. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> There are other aspects of freewill, but giving up service means giving up our love to Krsna, or we want to serve in another way that is not compatible in the spiritual world. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Krsna does not force you to love Him. You have to desire it willingly and that is the topmost use of freewill, this is what freewill means, to voluntarily serve Krsna. The living entity is given that ‘choice’ because without it, there is no meaning to individuality or being a marginal living being. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> The other angle is that by misusing our freewill we make the wrong decision and Maya immediately covers us AFTER the living entity chooses to manufacture their existence without Krishna. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Freewill is perfect and imperfect and yes it is an inconceivable truth (Acintya Tattva) It is perfect in the aspect of allowing one to freely choose to endlessly increasingly serve and it is imperfect and not suitable for Goloka when we choose to ignore Krsna. This is one reason why the Lord creates the Mahat-tattva (material creation)<o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> The perfect aspect of this imperfection of the jiva is that you can go back to serve Krsna again. Srimad Bhagavatam 6.11.25 confirms this - <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> “Oh my Lord, O Supreme Personality of Godhead, will I again be able to be a servant of Your eternal servants who find shelter at Your lotus feet? Oh Lord of my life, may I again become their servant so that my mind may always engage in the loving service of Your Lordship.” <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Twice Srila Prabhupada uses the word bhuyah (again), stressing the point. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> When the jivas misuse freewill in Goloka, Vaikuntha it is not like a case of newly transformed envious jivas hanging around. They are instantly covered and ousted from the Lord’s realm. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Bhaktisiddhanta Thakura’s purport to text 44 of Brahma Samhita states – <o:p></o:p> “When he forgets his service of Krsna he is at once deflected by the attracting power of Maya in this world.” <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> On a morning walk in Vrndavana, 9-13-75 Prabhupada said: “He has given you little freedom’ you can use it. Yathecchasi tathaa kuru, Krsna says in Gita (18.63), ‘Whatever you like you do.” <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Some devotees seem to think that this discussion of the “Fall, no fall of the Jiva” started after Prabhupada’s disappearance but that is not a fact. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> In the early 1972, Madhudvisa had to deal with the issue in Australia while travelling around preaching on a Double Decker travelling Temple that I was also personally on and the Crow and Tal Fruit Logic letter is a result of that exchange with devotees who thought we came from the Brahmajyoti. The letter has typed parts, Prabhupada also added his own handwritten notes, and he signed the letter by hand. Madhudvisa has the letter. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> In the early 1970’s, Siddhasvarupananda Swami was preaching that the jivas came from the Brahmajyoti and Srila Prabhupada told him not to preach that in his temples. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> In a letter to Caturbhuja Dasa, L.A., 5-9-73, Prabhupada wrote him - <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Srila Prabhupada – “Your last question ‘How is the soul degraded (by lust, anger and greed) when it is transcendental to the body? <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Srila Prabhupada – “Doesn’t that imply that the soul has changed? ‘No. The soul never changes, but due to his tinyness, he may become forgetful of his relationship with Krsna”. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Srila Prabhupada – “The spiritual quality of the spiritual spark has not changed but he has forgotten his spiritual nature, bewildered by the imperfect desire to become equal or greater than Krsna.” <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Most of the verses from Brahma Vaivarta Purana are showing how a jiva can go to Vaikuntha or Goloka but unless one’s devotion is FULLY developed he will fall back to this material world due to lack of chit (knowledge) strength. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Nevertheless, eventually he/she will return and stay permanently in Vaikuntha/Goloka, regaining his/hers authentic svarupa bodily identity that is actually permanently there in Goloka even if one forgets this fact. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Such comments seem inconceivable, but are they? Actually they are easily understood when one ‘realizes, by dent of bhakti, what the eternal present actually means’. In other words, our perpetual body is permanently locked, protected, and secured in the eternal present because there is no portal of past or future for it to ever leave. Therefore if there id fall down, it is only consciously via ones thoughts, imaginings and dreams, never as ones original body.<o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Now that wasn’t too difficult to understand was it? <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Those verses in shastra that state that one does not fall from Vaikuntha are referring either to jivas who fell originally and are now reinstated, and generally won’t fall again or to those jivas who never fell to begin with. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Bhaktisiddhanta Thakur clarifies the point in Sri Caitanya’s Teachings, p. 101 <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> “The position of the jiva IS a part of the tatastha-sakti that can enjoy, cease to enjoy, and go back to his original position”. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> And Srila Prabhupada says in a similar vein on a morning walk: <o:p></o:p> Paramahamsa - So we can come to the spiritual world and return? <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Prabhupada - Yes.<o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Paramahamsa - Falldown?<o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Prabhupada - Yes…. He goes out of his free will; again comes out, again goes. Like that. (Cheviot Hills Golf Course-5-13-73, L.A.) <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Srila Prabhupada stressed the verse: Mahaajano yena gatah sa panthaa - one must follow in the footsteps of the Mahajanas <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Mahabhaarata, Vana Parva, 313.117. And who is speaking these verses from Brahma Vaivarta Purana? <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> They happen to be Mahajanas. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Narayana Rsi is talking to Narada Rsi about what Yamaraj spoke to Savitri (Mother of the vedas). Brahma also joins in later. So, their statements carry weight. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> So, for our Brahma-Vadi friends (no fall avedis) what will they do now? Maybe demonise these verses as Apa siddhantic or of the Kuyogi Sampradaya? <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Or belittle the slokas as simply words to encourage the pious to do Punyas? <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Or try to emphasize that these verses are fanciful imagination? Then better yet they may try to minimize these verses as secondary evidence or not authentic or as interpolations? Any way you want to cut it, there is disagreement on this point and the Patanam Slokas, will stand their ground, and support Srila Prabhupada that jivas can fall (patanam) from Vaikuntha/Goloka. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> So how can apparently contradictory statements be reconciled? Jiva Goswami explains in his Krsna Sandarbha 152.9 that Vedanta Sutra states – <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> “If there are two contradictory statements in scripture, the first statement should be interpreted so that it does not contradict the later statement.” <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> So the way to employ this understanding of Jiva Goswami means that for us, the Fallvadis (as the Brahmavadis call us) we accept both ideas i.e. coming from Brahman and coming from Vaikuntha/Goloka. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> The jivas coming from Brahman are those jivas who did not get liberated in Brahma’s lifetime and entered the body of Maha-Vishnu. So, when they reappear when Maha-Vishnu begins to expand universes again that occurrence is an origin because it is over a time period of trillions and trillions of years, which is like eternity. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> That origin is what the Upanishads describe. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> We accept the understanding that the jivas that have left their service in Vaikuntha/Goloka, due to free will, come here to the material world. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> In all of this discussion one important point to understand is that to Krsna, in Krsna’s transcendental time, or reckoning, we are here in this material world for one or two seconds (NOT EVEN THAT BECAUSE NOTHING IS SEEN AS MISSING WITHIN THE ‘ETERNAL PRESENT)’. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> How is this? <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Again, in Brahma Vaivarta Purana, Krsna Janma Khanda, chapter 25, verse 98-99 it is stated that <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> “ Brahma dies when Krsna winks”. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> So, if a jiva stays in a universe for the life of Lord Brahma, which is trillions of years, and then goes back to Goloka, then in Goloka, it is only an insignificant moment. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> So, in real Transcendental Time (The eternal present that has no past and future as we understand it in the material perishable world) we are here for a very, very short time. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> And to put the icing on the cake we will let Srila Prabhupada have the last word on the topic quoting Srimad Bhagavatam. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> According to Jiva Goswami in the Tattva Sandarbha the Srimad Bhagavatam is the highest sastra and the most perfect of all evidence. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> So, lets hear the verse, as a pure devotee understands it. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> In Bhagavad Gita 6.47 Srila Prabhupada states in the purport: <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Srila Prabhupada – “Every living entity is of the Supreme Personality of Godhead, and thus every living entity is intended to serve the Supreme Lord by his own constitution. Failing to do this, he falls down. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> The Bhagavatam (11.5.3) confirms this as follows: <o:p></o:p> Srila Prabhupada – “Anyone who does not render service and neglects his duty unto the primeval lord, who is the source of all living entities will certainly fall down from his constitutional position.” <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> A Bhagavad-Gita lecture that was given by Srila Prabhupada on 2-21-69, in L.A. (Collected Lectures on Bhagavad-Gita As It Is, Volume 5, pp. 6-7),<o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Srila Prabhupada quotes the same Bhagavatam verse 11.5.3. He then gives this commentary, which throws even more light on it making it clearer – <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Srila Prabhupada – “The Bhagavat says that we are all parts and parcels of the Supreme. If we do not serve the Supreme, then we fall down from our specified place. What is that? <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Srila Prabhupada – “If the part and parcel cannot render service regularly, that means it is painful. So any person who is not rendering service to the Supreme Lord, he’s simply giving pain to the Supreme Lord. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Srila Prabhupada – “He’s simply giving trouble. Therefore, he has to suffer…. The same example, Sthanad bhrastah patanty adhah. And as soon as one thing is very painful, just like the government keeps all these painful citizens into a prison house. Collect together. ‘You live here, you are nonsense, you criminals live here. Don’t live in the open state.’ <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Srila Prabhupada – “Similarly, all these criminals who have violated the laws of God, who have simply given pain to the Lord, they are put in this material world. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Srila Prabhupada – “And, sthanad bhrastah, he falls down from the specified place….So we have fallen down. Being against the principles of God consciousness, we are fallen down. So if we want to revive our original position, we must be placed again in that service attitude.<o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Srila Prabhupada – “The best thing is to revive our original Krsna consciousness and be engaged in the service of the Lord. That is the natural life and that is possible in the spiritual sky or the Goloka Vrndavana.” <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> At the end of the lecture a question was asked: “Why are you teaching about Krsna Consciousness? <o:p></o:p> Srila Prabhupada – “Because you have forgotten the service of Radha and Krsna, therefore you have become the servant of Maya.’” <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> So, in conclusion the Mahajanas have talked about agatya patanam, falling from Vaikuntha/Goloka. Vyasadeva, who compiled the Puranas, has presented slokas about patanam (falldown)<o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> So has Bhaktivinode Thakura and Bhaktisiddhanta Thakura mentioned fall and no fall of the jiva. Srila Prabhupada has quoted Srimad Bhagavatam to stress the point about freewill causing the jiva to fall, so one cannot say that ISKCON devotees are the only ones who have spoken of the fall of the jiva from Vaikuntha and Goloka.

Quote: <TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=6 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #666666 1px solid; PADDING-RIGHT: 3ex; BORDER-TOP: #666666 1px solid; PADDING-LEFT: 3ex; BORDER-LEFT: #666666 1px solid; BORDER-BOTTOM: #666666 1px solid" bgColor=#e0e0e0> Srila Prabhupada – “Existence in the impersonal Brahman is also within the category of non-Krishna consciousness. Those who are in the Brahman effulgence they are also in the fallen condition, so there is no question of falling down from a fallen condition. When fall takes place, it means falling down from the non-fallen condition. The non-fallen condition is Krishna consciousness. to remain in the Brahman effulgence is also another phase of that fallen condition. Just like in the Bhagavad-Gita it is stated that conditioned souls by their pious activities are elevated to the higher planetary system, but as soon as the stock of pious activities is finished he again comes down on the earthly planet. Similarly those who are elevated beyond the planetary system to the Brahman effulgence, they are also prone to fall down as much as a living entity from the higher planetary system. As such those who are thinking that they are liberated by being situated in Brahman effulgence are described in the Srimad-Bhagavatam as impurely intelligent. In other words, they are actually not liberated, and because they are not actually liberated they again come down to the material world” </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE> <!-- END TEMPLATE: bbcode_quote -->

Welcome back Beggar, I've missed you, Yeah good point, I certainly was not referring to Srila Sridar Maharaj and I think I will drop that 'plain sheet of consciousness' in the future. Instead I will just write we DO NOT originate from the impersonal Brahmajyoti as you already know I believe even though we have been there many times Didn't mean to offend you or anyone else:pray:

Firstly, no-one lays down and sleeps and dreams they are in the mahat-tattva, its not like that, its all to do with ones consciousness, Krishna conscious or self centred consciousness? <?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:" /><o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> And it’s also about the ‘eternal present’ in relation to the mahat-tattva’s past, present and future caused by ones own selfish DREAMS desires that expels one ‘sub-consciously from ‘Goloka’ our nitya-siddha body is always there because of the imperishable nature of Goloka – every living entity has their eternal ‘svarupa’ body there perpetually.<o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> If one is Krishna conscious, they stay in sync with the ‘eternal present’ where not only does one stay lovingly serving Krishna, but also remain aware of their eternal ‘svarupa’ or ‘nitya-siddha’ body they serve Krishna as – this is an important realization that many find hard to realize<o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Actually there is absolutely no life in the mahat-tattva even though it is a real but temporary phenomenon (even in the mundane material heavenly planets, THOUGHT IS REALITY, this point many do not understand when the dream explanation is given, this is also why an actual jiva enters the mahat-tattva, its all real. <o:p></o:p> All life is projected from Vaikuntha or Goloka via a network of Vishnu-tattvas and empowered jiva-tattvas (demigods, 33,000000 to be precise). <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Maha-Vishnu is the general manager of the mahat-tattva or material world who provides vessels to ALL the in-coming sub-conscious souls (baddha-jivas) who have originally been projected from their real eternal bodies in Vaikuntha etc. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> The paradox is, on return it will be as if they never left because of that ‘eternal present’ You see, no-one falls asleep and dreams their material existence, that idea is a great mistake in understating this vet deep philosophy that is ultimately understood vis service and lovind devotion and never bt knowledge alone.<o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> The mahat-tattva also is technically lifeless, it is simply a place created by Maha-Vishnu for the sub-conscious dreams of the living entities in who have CHOSEN to use their free will to forget Krishna and the body they serve Krishna as. <o:p></o:p> The living entity therefore, forgets their nitya-siddha body by choice and transmits their mistaken dreams of grandeur to the mahat-tattva where they are given a costume or vessel to live out their dreams by Maha-Vishnu and receive the sweet and bitter fruits of those dreams (karma) that traps them in His mahat-tattva creation. The mahat-tattva is built for the rebellious souls just as the Government builds the prision house. Frankly we are really not advanced enough to comprehend thr very deep realizations of a universe that has no beginning or end, let alone understand<o:p></o:p> That’s why Prabhupada gave us the simple basics of chanting Hare Krishna to go Back Home Back to Godhead:pray: <o:p></o:p>

Jayapataka Maharaja’s miracle recovery is astounding the medical profession - keep praying <!-- / message --><!-- sig -->

Jayapataka Maharaja’s miracle recovery is astounding the medical profession - keep praying

<TABLE class=ts style="WIDTH: auto"><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 7px" vAlign=top> <TD vAlign=top> [ Please Pray for HH JAYAPATAKA MAHARAJA </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

The impersonal Brahmajyoti is already a terrible fallen state worse than hell as far as a REAL Vaishnava is concerned!! Special thanks to Theist prabhu for his devotional research that has clearly answered this thread. We are already fallen being in the material creation and we become even further fallen if we perform severe penances to foolishly, selfishly and fearfully enter the Impersonal Brahmajyoti by yogic austerities, jnan and philosophical speculative analysis of the universe, because we become so pissed off with everything becoming so frustratingly temporary, and always ending in old age, disease, fear, pain, lonliness and death, then rebirth to again go through the same crap again. <?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:" /><o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> To a devotee of Krishna, the impersonal Brahmajyoti 'liberation' is far worse than the HELLISH Worlds. And some fools think we originate from the Impersonal Brahmajyoti or some clear sheet of dormant consciousness:rolleyes: :rolleyes: <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p>

8

Our wonderful Godbrother and loving Guru to thousands is be discharged from the Hospital Friday, December 19 - Evening Report:<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:" /><o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> HH Jayapataka Swami Maharaja's status report by Dr Madhavananda das, Director of Bhaktivedanta Hospital, Mumbai:<o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Maharaja is being discharged from Hindhuja hospital and it has been decided to take him to Bhaktivedanta hospital tomorrow morning to continue his ongoing physiotherapy. He walked using the parallel bars today. He was able to move his feet well in coordination, but since his right side is weak, he has difficulty coordinating his hand and shoulder. But everyday he is showing improvement in his muscle power in all the limbs especially right hand. Please continue to pray. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Friday, December 19 - Report from HG Vaikunthapati prabhu:<o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> 18th Dec 2008 - Afternoon shift, 12 noon to 6 pm<o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> We reached the Hinduja Hospital at 1 pm. HG Premadata prabhu, the Agartala temple president had come to meet with Guru Maharaja and was about to leave when we arrived. After HG Premadata prabhu left, Bhadra Balaram prabhu and myself, we started preparing to serve lunch for Guru Maharaja. Guru Maharaja was sitting on the bed and Bhadra Balaram prabhu fed lunch to him affectionately. Guru Maharaja was unable to sit straight and he kept leaning sideways. Therefore I was holding Guru Maharaja to give him support. Dr. Syamlal prabhu asked Guru Maharaja to sit straight by himself. Guru Maharaja tried to follow his instruction; whenever he would lean sideways he held the rails of the bed and managed to push himself back into the position. Guru Maharaja surprised all of us by suddenly picking up the water cup kept on the eating table with his left hand and drank the water. This was the first time Guru Maharaja drank water by himself without the help of the devotees! Dr. Syamalal prabhu and everyone encouraged Guru Maharaja by saying loudly, "Hari Bol!!"<o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Dr. Syamalal prabhu made Guru Maharaja to use his right hand which has been weaker than the left. So he asked Guru Maharaja to eat the small sweet balls (made by Stevia) using his right hand. Guru Maharaja tried hard and reached almost to the mouth, but the ball was smashed just below his lower lips. Then Guru Maharaja was asked to eat the balls with his left hand and he did it comfortably.<o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> After prasadam a nurse came and checked his BP. Guru Maharaja asked and confirmed with the nurse if his BP was normal and it was. Around 2 pm the physiotherapist came and with some bigger grains (motor and black beans) gave practice for the right hand. Guru Maharaja was asked to sit on the bed, his legs resting on the floor and his hands on top of the small eating table. He was asked to collect the grains from the plate which was on the table and pour it back. After many times he tried just to collect few grains and poured it back into the plate. Next the therapist asked him to pick up the grains one by one and put it out of the plate, he couldn't do that, but the doctor was encouraging his efforts. He had few more practices with the grains and with the dish washing sponges to test the sensibility in his hands. At the end of the therapy Guru Maharaja was asked to hold the small eating table with his both hands and to sit straight for 20 minutes. Guru Maharaja enjoyed listening to Srila Prabhupada's Hare Krishna kirtan by gently moving his body sideways in harmony with the music. Guru Maharaja sat for 20 minutes without much strain. It was nice to see him cooperating with the therapists and making improvements day by day.<o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> During this time a famous Hindi actress who had come to Hindhuja hospital for her personal reason spontaneously wanted to see Guru Maharaja to get blessings from him. She was encouraging Guru Maharaja that he will get back all his limbs working normal. She was explaining that one of her relative was in a very severe situation for six months and she couldn't even move her fingers but now she is much better and even is using computer! She was asking Guru Maharaja's blessings so that her relative will heal completely. Guru Maharaja suggested her to take caranamrita from the temple and give it to her relative and he recited the mantra, akala-mrtyu-haranam sarva-vyadhi-vinasanam visnoh padodakam pitva sirasa dharayamy aham (which means, "Having drunk the water from the lotus feet of Lord Visnu, which destroys all disease and takes away the chance of dying untimely, I hold that water on my head.") and asked her to chant this mantra while taking the caranamrita. She immediately responded to Guru Maharaja saying she would follow his instruction. She must be a fortunate lady to get the darshan of Guru Maharaja.<o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> The acupuncturist came around 4 pm and started checking the weak points on Guru Maharaja's fingers. The treatment is for strengthening his overall muscles and for improving the functions of his middle brain. According to the acupuncturist, Guru Maharaja showed improvement on his face, he is not staring anymore when he looks at someone and the coordination of his eye balls has improved.<o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> At around 5 pm, HG Braja Hari prabhu and HG Devakinandan prabhu came to see Guru Maharaja and were discussing about the details to move Guru Maharaja out of the Hinduja Hospital. HG Braja Hari prabhu also read letters from a book of get well letters made by Sri Lanka devotees and showed the drawings of the devotee kids. Few of the kids had drawn Hanuman and Guru Maharaja put that page of the book on his head. Jai Hanuman Ji Ki Jai!<o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> JPS Servants<o:p></o:p>

Our wonderful Godbrother and loving Guru to thousands is be discharged from the Hospital Friday, December 19 - Evening Report:<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:" /> HH Jayapataka Swami Maharaja's status report by Dr Madhavananda das, Director of Bhaktivedanta Hospital, Mumbai: Maharaja is being discharged from Hindhuja hospital and it has been decided to take him to Bhaktivedanta hospital tomorrow morning to continue his ongoing physiotherapy. He walked using the parallel bars today. He was able to move his feet well in coordination, but since his right side is weak, he has difficulty coordinating his hand and shoulder. But everyday he is showing improvement in his muscle power in all the limbs especially right hand. Please continue to pray. Friday, December 19 - Report from HG Vaikunthapati prabhu (my [Gaura] dear old friend): 18th Dec 2008 - Afternoon shift, 12 noon to 6 pm We reached the Hinduja Hospital at 1 pm. HG Premadata prabhu, the Agartala temple president had come to meet with Guru Maharaja and was about to leave when we arrived. After HG Premadata prabhu left, Bhadra Balaram prabhu and myself, we started preparing to serve lunch for Guru Maharaja. Guru Maharaja was sitting on the bed and Bhadra Balaram prabhu fed lunch to him affectionately. Guru Maharaja was unable to sit straight and he kept leaning sideways. Therefore I was holding Guru Maharaja to give him support. Dr. Syamlal prabhu asked Guru Maharaja to sit straight by himself. Guru Maharaja tried to follow his instruction; whenever he would lean sideways he held the rails of the bed and managed to push himself back into the position. Guru Maharaja surprised all of us by suddenly picking up the water cup kept on the eating table with his left hand and drank the water. This was the first time Guru Maharaja drank water by himself without the help of the devotees! Dr. Syamalal prabhu and everyone encouraged Guru Maharaja by saying loudly, "Hari Bol!!" Dr. Syamalal prabhu made Guru Maharaja to use his right hand which has been weaker than the left. So he asked Guru Maharaja to eat the small sweet balls (made by Stevia) using his right hand. Guru Maharaja tried hard and reached almost to the mouth, but the ball was smashed just below his lower lips. Then Guru Maharaja was asked to eat the balls with his left hand and he did it comfortably. After prasadam a nurse came and checked his BP. Guru Maharaja asked and confirmed with the nurse if his BP was normal and it was. Around 2 pm the physiotherapist came and with some bigger grains (motor and black beans) gave practice for the right hand. Guru Maharaja was asked to sit on the bed, his legs resting on the floor and his hands on top of the small eating table. He was asked to collect the grains from the plate which was on the table and pour it back. After many times he tried just to collect few grains and poured it back into the plate. Next the therapist asked him to pick up the grains one by one and put it out of the plate, he couldn't do that, but the doctor was encouraging his efforts. He had few more practices with the grains and with the dish washing sponges to test the sensibility in his hands. At the end of the therapy Guru Maharaja was asked to hold the small eating table with his both hands and to sit straight for 20 minutes. Guru Maharaja enjoyed listening to Srila Prabhupada's Hare Krishna kirtan by gently moving his body sideways in harmony with the music. Guru Maharaja sat for 20 minutes without much strain. It was nice to see him cooperating with the therapists and making improvements day by day. During this time a famous Hindi actress who had come to Hindhuja hospital for her personal reason spontaneously wanted to see Guru Maharaja to get blessings from him. She was encouraging Guru Maharaja that he will get back all his limbs working normal. She was explaining that one of her relative was in a very severe situation for six months and she couldn't even move her fingers but now she is much better and even is using computer! She was asking Guru Maharaja's blessings so that her relative will heal completely. Guru Maharaja suggested her to take caranamrita from the temple and give it to her relative and he recited the mantra, akala-mrtyu-haranam sarva-vyadhi-vinasanam visnoh padodakam pitva sirasa dharayamy aham (which means, "Having drunk the water from the lotus feet of Lord Visnu, which destroys all disease and takes away the chance of dying untimely, I hold that water on my head.") and asked her to chant this mantra while taking the caranamrita. She immediately responded to Guru Maharaja saying she would follow his instruction. She must be a fortunate lady to get the darshan of Guru Maharaja. The acupuncturist came around 4 pm and started checking the weak points on Guru Maharaja's fingers. The treatment is for strengthening his overall muscles and for improving the functions of his middle brain. According to the acupuncturist, Guru Maharaja showed improvement on his face, he is not staring anymore when he looks at someone and the coordination of his eye balls has improved. At around 5 pm, HG Braja Hari prabhu and HG Devakinandan prabhu came to see Guru Maharaja and were discussing about the details to move Guru Maharaja out of the Hinduja Hospital. HG Braja Hari prabhu also read letters from a book of get well letters made by Sri Lanka devotees and showed the drawings of the devotee kids. Few of the kids had drawn Hanuman and Guru Maharaja put that page of the book on his head. Jai Hanuman Ji Ki Jai! JPS Servants

<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:" /><o:p></o:p> The full potential of what is REAL, of what is REALITY is that it is imperishable, and never fades away, which means it is always in the perpetual state of originality. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> So how are we to understand that our dreams on the absolute level are also real and transmitted as the nitya-baddha conscious state to the material creation? Now we cannot compare the dreams we have in our material body that are illusion, with the dreams we have in our pure state initiated by free will and choice. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Nitya-siddha is when we are in our natural pure state of REALITY, eternally liberated in Goloka, serving God or Krishna. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Nitya-baddha state is when we are in our unnatural impure state of TRANSITORY REALITY eternally conditioned in the mahat tattva, serving one's selfish interests, unaware of their PERMANENTLY REAL nitya-siddha authentic self in Goloka. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> The original and eternal position of all living individuals, known as the marginal living entities, is their perpetual rasa (devotional mood) nitya-siddha-svarupa body that is eternally serving Krishna in the ‘eternal present’ where there is no past or future, as previously explained. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> This means there is also no decay, impermanence birth, disease, old age, death and forgetfulness in the perpetual REALITY Kingdom of God known as Goloka-Vrndavana and the Vaikuntha planets. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Therefore, it is not due to forgetfulness we ‘sub-conscious’ project our awareness from our perpetual body in Goloka and enter the virtual world of the mahat tattva, it is initiated due to choice. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> If we are to correctly understand that we all originate from Goloka-Vrndavana/Vaikuntha, such realizations are only possible by the mercy of Srila Prabhupada, and without his mercy one will never understand. Everything Srila Prabhupada said and wrote must be understood in the context of His books, lectures, morning walks, and classes. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> This is the correct way to appreciate the criteria of guru, sadhu, and shastra. All interpretations of his teachings that fail these criteria of guru, sadu and shastra are to be considered bogus; therefore everything in this book is based very clearly on the teachings of His Divine Grace A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Lord Krishna or the Supreme Personality of Godhead is always the absolute truth with an all-attractive Vigraha or Bodily Form yet is also simultaneously everywhere personally and impersonally within His creation. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Krishna is always as His beautiful Syamasundara form that never vacates from His Goloka-Vrndavana central abode, yet is simultaneously manifested as unlimited four-armed Vishnu Forms throughout the Vaikuntha planets. Both these abodes are the perpetual Kingdom of Krishna that exists in the eternal present devoid of past and future, as the Brahma Samhita tells us. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Vishnu and Lakshmi in the Vaikunthas where their devotees are in the mood of servitorship, and Radha Krishna in Goloka-Vrndavana where Krishnas mood is more intimate with His devotees in the disposition of friendship and conjugal love. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Even though Krishna is eternally in His central Goloka-Vrndavana Planet that resembles a lotus flower as shown above, He also resides as Vishnu in the surrounding Vaikuntha Planets. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Krishna further expands Himself from His Sankarsana or Balarama bodily form to the sleeping Maha-Vishnu form who builds His own abode in one corner of the Spiritual Sky, as shown above that is called the mahat-tattva or material creation. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Maha-Vishnu is never affected by this dark cloud OF TEMPORARY OR FADING REALITY He has constructed in His corner of the Spiritual Sky (shown above) that exists in a completely different dimensional phenomenon of time and space than the Vaikuntha planets. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> In His mahat-tattva (jada-jagat- lifeless world) there is also eternal time however, it is divided by past, present and future which has the by-product phenomenon of impermanence, decay birth and death that does not exist in the perpetual ‘present’ in Goloka-Vrndavana or Vaikuntha (cid-jagat) which makes up the majority of the Spiritual Sky or Brahmajyoti. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> The original and eternal position of all living individuals, known as the marginal living entities is their perpetual rasa (devotional mood) nitya-siddha-svarupa body, that is eternally serving Krishna in the ‘eternal present’ where there is no past or future, as previously explained. The jiva in its natural state serves in the ‘eternal present’ in Goloka Vrndavana or Vaikuntha worlds that, not only have no past or future as we trapped in the material world experience, but also has no beginning or end, birth or death, decay, pain or suffering. The eternal presents of Goloka with Krishna and His living entities is imperishable and therefore has always existed. The jivas were never created, we have always been. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> The Vedas mention creation because they are referring to the mahat tattva that is created and eventually destroyed. The Vaikunthas on the other hand, were NEVER created because the Kingdom of God has always been as you have mentioned in your quote of the Brahma Samhita<o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> It is very hard trying to understand no beginning nor end then hear the paradox that Krishna created everything. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> There is no creation except for the mahat tattva or material 'creation' Vaikuntha has always been, will always be, and will never cease to be.<o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Its all coming from within your heart, pray to Krishna and Guru to guide you, only then will you understand<o:p></o:p> The jiva in its natural state serves in the ‘eternal present’ in Goloka Vrndavana or Vaikuntha worlds that, not only have no past or future as we trapped in the material world experience, but also has no beginning or end, birth or death, decay, pain or suffering. The eternal presents of Goloka with Krishna and His living entities is imperishable and therefore has always existed. The jivas were never created, we have always been. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> The Vedas mention creation because they are referring to the mahat tattva that is created and eventually destroyed. The Vaikunthas on the other hand, were NEVER created because the Kingdom of God has always been as you have mentioned in your quote of the Brahma Samhita<o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> It is very hard trying to understand no beginning nor end then hear the paradox that Krishna created everything. <o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> There is no creation except for the mahat tattva or material 'creation' Vaikuntha has always been, will always be, and will never cease to be.<o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Its all coming from within your heart, pray to Krishna and Guru to guide you, only then will you understand

Srila Prabhupada - 'There are instances where marginal energy jiva souls have fallen from the spiritual world, so the potency to fall under the influence of the lower energy is always there. (68-12-02)

The Spiritual Sky or it's other word 'the Brahmajyoti' is full of Spiritual Vaikuntha planets howver, within that same Spiritual Sky or Brahmajyoti, is the mahat tattva creation of Maha Vishnu. Only on the IN the mahat-tattva can the impersonal aspect of the Brahmajyoti exist. Technically, the entire mahat-tattva is impersonal. One can only enter it as a bodiless consciousness after the living entity sub-consciously leaves THRIR REAL BODY in Goloka and is projected from their that bodily form in Goloka tp their mistaken non-Krishna conscious DREAMS The nitya-baddha-jiva is actually a formless individual until Maha Vishnu provides such ‘consciousness’ a bodily vessel. The Mayavadis or impersonalists cannot understand this. All they see is the mahat tattva amd the formles spark of conscious. This is due to denying the fact THAT there is Goloka and that perpetual IS the origin of ALL nitya-siddha or marginal living entities - This is called PERSONALISM I have intensly searched Prabhupada's Books, letters, lectures and morning walks and found statements others were not aware of about how we came down from Vaikuntha, not as our Spiritual body, but rather as a sub-conscious projection called the baddha-jiva. Srila Prabhupada: You are already in the spiritual sky, but you are simply covered. Just like the sun is already there. You are also already there…so actually we are always in the spiritual world. But when you forget Krishna by the cloud of illusion that is material. Try to understand”. From a Srimad-Bhagavatam lecture given in London, on July 30, 1971 <O></O> Srila Prabhupada - “Actually we are not fallen therefore, at any moment we can revive our Krishna consciousness. As soon as we understand that, “I have nothing to do with. I am simply Krishna’s servant. Eternal servant. That’s all.lecture Tokyo Japan 1972: Śrīmad Bhāgavatam 2.9.1 <O></O> Srila Prabhupada - “You are eternally liberated (nitya-siddha) but since we have become conditioned on account of our desire to enjoy materialistic way of life, from time immemorial, therefore it appears that we are eternally conditioned (nitya-baddha)” Letter to Aniruddha, dated November 14, 1966

Yes, very good excellent research theist, anyone like yogis, impersonalists, philosophers coming from the impersonal Brahmajyoti are coming already from a fallen state they entered after going through the mahat-tattva (material creation). Merging into the Brahmajyoti (attempting to escape from the suffering and temporary nature of the material world) is also temporary and eventually ALLl from there as well. To a Vaishnava, merging into the impersonal Brahmajyoti is considered spiritual suicide because one is attempting to eradicate their individuality.<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:" /><o:p></o:p> <o:p></o:p> Some foolishly say we originate from the impersonal Brahmajyoti or some plain sheet of inactive consciousness but long, long, long before that we were originally with Krishna in Goloka.<o:p></o:p>

Jayapataka Maharaja broke into laughter, Ha ha ha...Ha ha ha. Wednesday, December 17 - Evening Report: HH Jayapataka Swami Maharaja's status report by Dr Madhavananda das, Director of Bhaktivedanta Hospital, Mumbai: Maharaja is doing progressively well. The physiotherapist commented that what they expect Maharaja to do in 10 days, he accomplishes in 5 days. The doctors are very enthused by Maharaja's enthusiasm and determination to walk and get back to normal life. Maharaja asked the neurologist how he's doing. The neurologist said Maharaja is doing excellent. Even though Maharaja is dependant for various things, physiotherapy is making him independent gradually. Maharaja still can't sit up from a lying down position on his own or lie down from a sitting position. But with physiotherapy he's getting more strength in his trunk. Once made to sit he can sit with minimal support. Please continue praying. Wednesday, December 17 - Report from HG Maha Varaha prabhu: 14th Dec 2008 - Night Shift, 6 pm – 6 am At 7.20pm Guru Maharaja had his evening fruit. After the evening fruit Braj Hari Prabhu, Bhadra Balaram Prabhu and myself made Guru Maharaja to sit on the edge of the bed for 15 minutes. He was sitting without any support. Then we made him to relax on the bed before taking his dinner. While relaxing Guru Maharaja was discussing with Braja Hari Prabhu about the facilities available for him to stay in Juhu Temple. After the dinner we cleaned Guru Maharaja's mouth and brushed his teeth. Dr. Acyutananda, who is representing the Bhaktivedanta Hospital has been coming for the last one month without fail as a doctor on night shift. At11pm we both made Guru aharaja to lie down on his left hand side for him to take rest. Everynight Guru Maharaja goes to sleep by lying on his left hand side. Then around 1am we change his position to right hand side or sometimes facing up. Tonight, after changing his position, Dr.Acyutananda held Guru Maharaja's hand and brought his hand next to railing of the bed for Guru Maharaja to feel the servant's calling bell. He told Guru Maharaja, "Maharaj the bellll(bell) is here. Maharaj the bellll(bell)...is here." with the 'l' sound little thick. Guru Maharaja replied while pointing his belly, "My belly is here, My belly is here." Then Wednesday, December 17 - Evening Report: HH Jayapataka Swami Maharaja's status report by Dr Madhavananda das, Director of Bhaktivedanta Hospital, Mumbai: Maharaja is doing progressively well. The physiotherapist commented that what they expect Maharaja to do in 10 days, he accomplishes in 5 days. The doctors are very enthused by Maharaja's enthusiasm and determination to walk and get back to normal life. Maharaja asked the neurologist how he's doing. The neurologist said Maharaja is doing excellent. Even though Maharaja is dependant for various things, physiotherapy is making him independent gradually. Maharaja still can't sit up from a lying down position on his own or lie down from a sitting position. But with physiotherapy he's getting more strength in his trunk. Once made to sit he can sit with minimal support. Please continue praying. Wednesday, December 17 - Report from HG Maha Varaha prabhu: 14th Dec 2008 - Night Shift, 6 pm – 6 am At 7.20pm Guru Maharaja had his evening fruit. After the evening fruit Braj Hari Prabhu, Bhadra Balaram Prabhu and myself made Guru Maharaja to sit on the edge of the bed for 15 minutes. He was sitting without any support. Then we made him to relax on the bed before taking his dinner. While relaxing Guru Maharaja was discussing with Braja Hari Prabhu about the facilities available for him to stay in Juhu Temple. After the dinner we cleaned Guru Maharaja's mouth and brushed his teeth. Dr. Acyutananda, who is representing the Bhaktivedanta Hospital has been coming for the last one month without fail as a doctor on night shift. At11pm we both made Guru aharaja to lie down on his left hand side for him to take rest. Everynight Guru Maharaja goes to sleep by lying on his left hand side. Then around 1am we change his position to right hand side or sometimes facing up. Tonight, after changing his position, Dr.Acyutananda held Guru Maharaja's hand and brought his hand next to railing of the bed for Guru Maharaja to feel the servant's calling bell. He told Guru Maharaja, "Maharaj the bellll(bell) is here. Maharaj the bellll(bell)...is here." with the 'l' sound little thick. Guru Maharaja replied while pointing his belly, "My belly is here, My belly is here." Then Guru Maharaja broke into laughter, Ha ha ha...Ha ha ha. JPS servants:pray: :pray:

Jayapataka Maharaja broke into laughter, Ha ha ha...Ha ha ha. Wednesday, December 17 - Evening Report: HH Jayapataka Swami Maharaja's status report by Dr Madhavananda das, Director of Bhaktivedanta Hospital, Mumbai: Maharaja is doing progressively well. The physiotherapist commented that what they expect Maharaja to do in 10 days, he accomplishes in 5 days. The doctors are very enthused by Maharaja's enthusiasm and determination to walk and get back to normal life. Maharaja asked the neurologist how he's doing. The neurologist said Maharaja is doing excellent. Even though Maharaja is dependant for various things, physiotherapy is making him independent gradually. Maharaja still can't sit up from a lying down position on his own or lie down from a sitting position. But with physiotherapy he's getting more strength in his trunk. Once made to sit he can sit with minimal support. Please continue praying. Wednesday, December 17 - Report from HG Maha Varaha prabhu: 14th Dec 2008 - Night Shift, 6 pm – 6 am At 7.20pm Guru Maharaja had his evening fruit. After the evening fruit Braj Hari Prabhu, Bhadra Balaram Prabhu and myself made Guru Maharaja to sit on the edge of the bed for 15 minutes. He was sitting without any support. Then we made him to relax on the bed before taking his dinner. While relaxing Guru Maharaja was discussing with Braja Hari Prabhu about the facilities available for him to stay in Juhu Temple. After the dinner we cleaned Guru Maharaja's mouth and brushed his teeth. Dr. Acyutananda, who is representing the Bhaktivedanta Hospital has been coming for the last one month without fail as a doctor on night shift. At11pm we both made Guru aharaja to lie down on his left hand side for him to take rest. Everynight Guru Maharaja goes to sleep by lying on his left hand side. Then around 1am we change his position to right hand side or sometimes facing up. Tonight, after changing his position, Dr.Acyutananda held Guru Maharaja's hand and brought his hand next to railing of the bed for Guru Maharaja to feel the servant's calling bell. He told Guru Maharaja, "Maharaj the bellll(bell) is here. Maharaj the bellll(bell)...is here." with the 'l' sound little thick. Guru Maharaja replied while pointing his belly, "My belly is here, My belly is here." Then Wednesday, December 17 - Evening Report: HH Jayapataka Swami Maharaja's status report by Dr Madhavananda das, Director of Bhaktivedanta Hospital, Mumbai: Maharaja is doing progressively well. The physiotherapist commented that what they expect Maharaja to do in 10 days, he accomplishes in 5 days. The doctors are very enthused by Maharaja's enthusiasm and determination to walk and get back to normal life. Maharaja asked the neurologist how he's doing. The neurologist said Maharaja is doing excellent. Even though Maharaja is dependant for various things, physiotherapy is making him independent gradually. Maharaja still can't sit up from a lying down position on his own or lie down from a sitting position. But with physiotherapy he's getting more strength in his trunk. Once made to sit he can sit with minimal support. Please continue praying. Wednesday, December 17 - Report from HG Maha Varaha prabhu: 14th Dec 2008 - Night Shift, 6 pm – 6 am At 7.20pm Guru Maharaja had his evening fruit. After the evening fruit Braj Hari Prabhu, Bhadra Balaram Prabhu and myself made Guru Maharaja to sit on the edge of the bed for 15 minutes. He was sitting without any support. Then we made him to relax on the bed before taking his dinner. While relaxing Guru Maharaja was discussing with Braja Hari Prabhu about the facilities available for him to stay in Juhu Temple. After the dinner we cleaned Guru Maharaja's mouth and brushed his teeth. Dr. Acyutananda, who is representing the Bhaktivedanta Hospital has been coming for the last one month without fail as a doctor on night shift. At11pm we both made Guru aharaja to lie down on his left hand side for him to take rest. Everynight Guru Maharaja goes to sleep by lying on his left hand side. Then around 1am we change his position to right hand side or sometimes facing up. Tonight, after changing his position, Dr.Acyutananda held Guru Maharaja's hand and brought his hand next to railing of the bed for Guru Maharaja to feel the servant's calling bell. He told Guru Maharaja, "Maharaj the bellll(bell) is here. Maharaj the bellll(bell)...is here." with the 'l' sound little thick. Guru Maharaja replied while pointing his belly, "My belly is here, My belly is here." Then Guru Maharaja broke into laughter, Ha ha ha...Ha ha ha. JPS servants:pray: :pray:

Obviously, every moment is eternal devoid of past and future in Goloka, but how are we idiot souls to understand such elevated mellows? It is not mundane time of the material impermanent world, and frankly if we are not pure, we will NEVER understand the 'eternal present ' concept of transcendental past, present and future TIME, that DOES AND must exist as part pf Krishna’s personal devotional Kingdom of activity, Lila pr pastime. Deep question by the great theist but only realized and experienced by purification and loving service to the pure devotees of Krishna’s devotees, and Never by jnan.

<HR style="COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=1><!-- / icon and title --><!-- message --> With his Mum above

With his Mum above

2008 1978

2008 1978