ethos

Trisilex, what I loved about the movie with Kenneau Reves playing Buddha was that Buddha noted and enunciated that the "middle ground" between gratification and abnegation was the "enlightened path". If you can say something more on this I'd love to here it.

I'm glad you decided to stay. You will find answers to questions here that can allieviate the stress and doubt that come from spiritual ignorance. Such confidential knowledge can save you from the greatest danger that even the most impenetrable armour cannot do. I have noticed alot more confidence in newcomer Debbie in just a short while. You will actually get the most satisfaction here from board participation. You have only to ask and comment at your descretion. As you can see, I'm gruff with everyone. I will leave you alone——until you're settled in (lol). Again, I'm glad you made it. It was meant to be. (I'll be watching you).

Excerpt from Hridyananda Tape Ministry: So for example, let us assume that we have understood there is an eternal soul within the body. Then the question arises, "Well what the heck are we doing here in this material world?" If I am an eternal soul, what am I doing here? It may seem unreasonable to say that we’re just created in a fallen condition because due to our clumsiness (you might say our metaphysical or spiritual or moral clumsiness) we are always doing the wrong thing and suffering in this world. We commit sins, we do all kinds of wrong things and in different ways we are punished by nature, punished by the government. We suffer in different ways. We go through psychological problems because we are a little clumsy in this world. We’re always bumping into things psychologically and physically. So are we just by nature clumsy? Are we just by nature inept? Are we always gonna be attached to the wrong things and do and say wrong things and suffer… get ourselves entangled in situations that aren’t really good for us. If that’s true, then our suffering seems to be in a sense meaningless and there’s no way to avoid it. But in fact according to the Bhagavad-gita, we are not condemned or by nature necessarily fallen. We are in this material world covered with a material body because we are trying to pretend something. Everyone of us is trying to pretend something that’s not really true. And as soon as we stop pretending, then we can actually become happy. So what are we trying to pretend? We are trying to pretend that we are more or less God. What does that mean? Does that mean that I’m going around preaching that I’m the Lord of Abraham, Issac and Jacob and I created the world. No. It doesn’t mean necessarily that we are God in this overt way. But in a more subtle sense we think we are God in the sense that everyone is trying to be the most beautiful person… I mean who doesn’t want to be the most beautiful person? Who doesn’t want to be the strongest person? Who doesn’t wanna have the last word and be the most intelligent person on his block? So if you consider what’s actually going on in this world, in different ways we are trying to create and project an image of ourselves… we are trying to be the greatest. Everyone wants to be the best person, everyone wants for everyone else to love him and appreciate him and all that. So this is in fact a perverted, unnatural way for us to think because there is a person who is the most beautiful on every block… and the wealthiest. You see? He’s the wealthiest, the most beautiful, most intelligent. So who is it? Is it Edward Kennedy or is it some famous rock and roll singer? Or some sheik who’s actually the wealthiest person? Who is actually the greatest person? It’s actually God. He wins. You know you say, "The envelop please," and then when you open it up you find out it’s God; He won! So the idea is that if we were not pretending that we’re the greatest, we could just happily recognize the fact God’s the greatest. If we could all agree on that, all of these egotistical games that go on between people could all be called off and everyone could just have a good time worshiping God together. So that’s the whole problem. The whole problem is that we are pretending something that’s not true. We are really eternal servants of God. Everyone of us is a loving servant of God but now we’re pretending "No, I’m this. I’m that. I’m real smart, I’ve got money" or "I’ve got a beautiful body." We’re pretending all kinds of things. Instead of just surrendering unto the Supreme Lord and learning to love Him. Beyond that, when we consider that everything belongs to God, all of these disputes of capitalism and socialism and communism and monarchism and anarchism and all these things are really very artificial because there’s nothing to argue about. Everything belongs to God. So we are fighting… It’s like the story Prabhupada always told that one time there was a gang of thieves and they successfully completed their robbery and they went back to their hideout. And then the leader when he took all the valuables out and got ready to divide them, he admonished, he warned all the other thieves that uh Listen you guys. We’re gonna divide it honestly. So this is the famous honor among thieves. They wanted to honestly divide the stolen property. That is more or less what we call political science and economic theory and conflict between classes and all that. It is all honor among thieves. The capitalists say the everything belongs to the… well to the capitalists. The capitalists say everything belongs to the private individual and they’re willing to die for that sacred principle. And the communists say No, everything belongs to the state which in some incomprehensible way is working for the benefit of the people. So in fact everything belongs to God. So if we can begin with that… get that straight, then we could figure out alot of other things also.

Excerpt from Hridyananda Tape Ministry: So for example, let us assume that we have understood there is an eternal soul within the body. Then the question arises, "Well what the heck are we doing here in this material world?" If I am an eternal soul, what am I doing here? It may seem unreasonable to say that we’re just created in a fallen condition because due to our clumsiness (you might say our metaphysical or spiritual or moral clumsiness) we are always doing the wrong thing and suffering in this world. We commit sins, we do all kinds of wrong things and in different ways we are punished by nature, punished by the government. We suffer in different ways. We go through psychological problems because we are a little clumsy in this world. We’re always bumping into things psychologically and physically. So are we just by nature clumsy? Are we just by nature inept? Are we always gonna be attached to the wrong things and do and say wrong things and suffer… get ourselves entangled in situations that aren’t really good for us. If that’s true, then our suffering seems to be in a sense meaningless and there’s no way to avoid it. But in fact according to the Bhagavad-gita, we are not condemned or by nature necessarily fallen. We are in this material world covered with a material body because we are trying to pretend something. Everyone of us is trying to pretend something that’s not really true. And as soon as we stop pretending, then we can actually become happy. So what are we trying to pretend? We are trying to pretend that we are more or less God. What does that mean? Does that mean that I’m going around preaching that I’m the Lord of Abraham, Issac and Jacob and I created the world. No. It doesn’t mean necessarily that we are God in this overt way. But in a more subtle sense we think we are God in the sense that everyone is trying to be the most beautiful person… I mean who doesn’t want to be the most beautiful person? Who doesn’t want to be the strongest person? Who doesn’t wanna have the last word and be the most intelligent person on his block? So if you consider what’s actually going on in this world, in different ways we are trying to create and project an image of ourselves… we are trying to be the greatest. Everyone wants to be the best person, everyone wants for everyone else to love him and appreciate him and all that. So this is in fact a perverted, unnatural way for us to think because there is a person who is the most beautiful on every block… and the wealthiest. You see? He’s the wealthiest, the most beautiful, most intelligent. So who is it? Is it Edward Kennedy or is it some famous rock and roll singer? Or some sheik who’s actually the wealthiest person? Who is actually the greatest person? It’s actually God. He wins. You know you say, "The envelop please," and then when you open it up you find out it’s God; He won! So the idea is that if we were not pretending that we’re the greatest, we could just happily recognize the fact God’s the greatest. If we could all agree on that, all of these egotistical games that go on between people could all be called off and everyone could just have a good time worshiping God together. So that’s the whole problem. The whole problem is that we are pretending something that’s not true. We are really eternal servants of God. Everyone of us is a loving servant of God but now we’re pretending "No, I’m this. I’m that. I’m real smart, I’ve got money" or "I’ve got a beautiful body." We’re pretending all kinds of things. Instead of just surrendering unto the Supreme Lord and learning to love Him. Beyond that, when we consider that everything belongs to God, all of these disputes of capitalism and socialism and communism and monarchism and anarchism and all these things are really very artificial because there’s nothing to argue about. Everything belongs to God. So we are fighting… It’s like the story Prabhupada always told that one time there was a gang of thieves and they successfully completed their robbery and they went back to their hideout. And then the leader when he took all the valuables out and got ready to divide them, he admonished, he warned all the other thieves that uh Listen you guys. We’re gonna divide it honestly. So this is the famous honor among thieves. They wanted to honestly divide the stolen property. That is more or less what we call political science and economic theory and conflict between classes and all that. It is all honor among thieves. The capitalists say the everything belongs to the… well to the capitalists. The capitalists say everything belongs to the private individual and they’re willing to die for that sacred principle. And the communists say No, everything belongs to the state which in some incomprehensible way is working for the benefit of the people. So in fact everything belongs to God. So if we can begin with that… get that straight, then we could figure out alot of other things also.

I've seen this before. Sounds like a great deal. I feel more confident ordering here now that you recommend it. Thanks. Hare Krsna.

A real acarya refers to one who can deliver a conditioned soul; one who can quote authoritative scripture and follow enunciated precepts (or live by example). An real acarya has an established relationship with the Supreme and he is thus a conduit for Krsna's mercy–a transparent medium. He is not attracted by this world nor does he unnecessarily contemplate it. He is perfection in the sense that he is properly situated. He knows samadhi and spiritual refuge. He knows the goal because he has attained it. And he is unfathomable. An apparent acarya in my estimation refers to one who knows and cultivates religious philosophy and practice, yet lacks the perfection above. He is still trying to achieve perfection. He is still qualified and authoritative as long as there is no deviation. Real acaryas have already reached the goal of direct communion. Apparent acaryas hope to achieve perfection in the next life. Real acaryas are the very rare exception Krsna refers to in the Bhagavad Gita as knowing Him in truth. Apparent acaryas are those still endeavoring for perfection with perhaps more success than most. Such is my reaction to your title. I don't know if that's what you had in mind.

Leyh, you keep hammering on this offense trip. I guess I'm not counted as one of those offended. What happened is this: You tried to reprimand me in the middle of my conversation with Giveawayboy. When I didn't swallow your pill, you became more forceful. So did I in response. You brought some comments out in me that would not have offered otherwise. We all have opinions and feelings we don't advertise. Yet, saying those to you in my frank way, Bill was shocked. And so were you. Then suddenly I'm the bad guy for scaring Bill when I wasn't even talking to him. You think I should have been more sensitive? Well where was you descretion? Why did you indulge in spatting with me and not direct your positive energy toward Bill as I had called for? Actually I appeared to be doing fine till you and Theist and others took it on yourself to correct me untimely. Battles are distasteful. Yet, I have a part of me that thrives on them. You should have known that by now. You must have wanted a fight. I certainly won't be coddled by a bunch of charlatans. You wrote… "You have made sweeping personal attacks on "you people" or the 'clowns" in "the peanut gallery", calling everyone all kinds of names in the name of truth and being philosophical. I beg to submit that some of your words have been so recklessly acidic towards the Forum Members that Vaisnava aparadha has clearly been committed." Yeah, that means alot coming from a hypocrite. Your favorite pastime with me is putting words in my mouth and claiming I advertise myself as the next Prabhupada. I have been honest and call it like I see it–as I always do. If you are offended, then maybe it's really you and not me. You wrote: "However, I am mortified to see that many of your recent posts can only be described as venomous. I know I am unqualified to preach nor should I engage in fault finding, but I cannot sit back in silence to watch you unleash your hurtful words on others.Your words are hurtful. Can you not see that?" Again, I don't count here because nothing I say matters and you have determined everything I say is wrong. You continue to bash and criticize me all in the name of righteousness while my activities in defense are simply sin. It is all my fault for not being a good patriot and Democrat. What mundane ideas. You just can't take what you give out and you are a hypocrite for pursuing this. You wrote: "In the expression of truth, we have to take some risks and sometimes in dealings with devotees, Vaisnava aparadha may be committed especially by foolish persons like myself." Again, appropriate for you and not for me. I call you all the peanut gallery because in my estimation you have lost all descrimination. Just words... no reflection. Not even the recent memory of what happened; who began it and why it developed. I stand by my words. They are true.

Where can it be purchased?

Above is my final statement to all you in the peanut gallery. It pretty much sums up what I think of you people. Now will I be attacked for expressing another opinion?

We all want you to stay Bill. No one "ever" wanted you to leave. You wrote "Still, it is clear to me that I am not welcome here." Well, none of us can figure out how you arrived at that conclusion–especially me. As for the rest of you, you first demonstrated apathy and disregard to Bill's original inquiries and my solicitations for help with the exceptions of Gaurachandra and Leyh, then began to feed on a fight with me that did alot to scare him off, and then call, "Please return Bill. We are here to help you" when he runs. What a bunch of clowns.

Yes, I agree. Useless words if you can't practice them. Where were you earlier?

I liked the first one the best. The elephant one I don't quite get. What's the answer.

The U.S. Bio-Warfare Building Boom By Marylia Kelley, Ann Seitz and Inga Olson From Tri-Valley CAREs' December 2002 newsletter, Citizen's Watch In recent months, more than a dozen new or expanded bio-warfare facilities have been proposed in nine U.S. states, including at Livermore Lab and U.C. Davis in California. Multiple federal agencies have been bitten by the bio-facility building bug, including the National Institutes of Health, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention and the Dept. of Energy (DOE), the agency that designs and produces nuclear weapons. The reason? Most likely it's the $6 billion for biodefense that Congress hastily appropriated after last fall's anthrax mailings. That money, if ill-used in a multi-agency bio-lab construction frenzy, may serve to undermine rather than enhance our collective security. A new, national non-profit coalition - including Tri-Valley CAREs - has emerged to urge Congress and the public to reassess U.S. bio-warfare spending. The coalition is not opposed to all biodefense work, but is concerned that too much funding and too little planning will produce a dangerous proliferation of bio-warfare agents and the knowledge to use them. The coalition recently issued a statement warning that the current situation "poses dangers to local communities, to arms control and to U.S. national security." Coalition groups called on the government to freeze new bio-lab construction and to reorient U.S. biodefense spending toward "unclassified, public research to bolster local public health capabilities." Two of the new bio-warfare facilities are slated to be run by the DOE and housed within the nation's two principal nuclear weapons design laboratories - here at Livermore and at the Los Alamos Lab in New Mexico. The nuclear labs are seeking authority to experiment with some of the most hazardous biological agents on earth, including anthrax, botulism and bubonic plague. Additionally, the two weapons labs are planning to genetically modify bio-warfare agents. The planning document for Livermore Lab's bio-facility, for example, says it will "produce small amounts of biological material (enzymes, DNA, ribonucleic acid [RNA], etc.) using infections agents and genetically modified agents..." The bio-facility's inventory may total up to ten liters of various cultured microorganisms at a time. Livermore Lab already houses a bioreactor (fermenter) that could be modified in the future to produce agents on a large scale, if the policy were to change. Moreover, Livermore plans to aerosolize some bio-agents and "challenge" small animals with them. National coalition members expressed alarm at the proposed commingling of new bio-warfare agent capabilities with nuclear weapons activities. The initial steps for developing a military capability, (i.e., a bio-weapon) are the same as for developing a defensive capability (e.g., a bio-agent vaccine or detector), according to experts. The U.S. weapons labs are not open for international inspections, noted the coalition. Nor are they planning to be. At a minimum, this will cause other countries to question U.S. intentions. Conceivably, it could cripple international efforts to construct an effective nonproliferation regime for biological weapons. The Bush administration has already single-handedly quashed negotiations on verification and enforcement measures needed to detect and prevent violations to the Biological and Toxin Weapons Convention. The coalition believes that strengthening, not gutting, this international treaty will increase U.S. security. Our security can also be enhanced by developing a comprehensive, primary prevention approach toward all forms of infectious disease, say coalition members. This means "providing adequate resources to combat AIDS, antibiotic-resistant tuberculosis, as well as the rise in diseases such as malaria predicted to increase from global climate change," explained Dr. Robert Gould, President of the SF Bay Area Physicians for Social Responsibility and a coalition member. The coalition is currently working on biodefense lab and program expansions proposed at Livermore Lab and U.C. Davis in CA, Los Alamos Lab in NM, Utah State Univ. and Dugway Proving Ground in Utah, Rocky Mountain Laboratory in MT, and the Univ. of Texas in Galveston. Other new and upgraded bio-facilities are proposed in San Antonio and Lubbock, TX, Manhattan, KS, Albuquerque, NM, Honolulu, HI, and Plum Island, NY. More are believed to be on the drawing board. In addition to Tri-Valley CAREs and SF Bay Area PSR, coalition member groups include the Citizens Education Project, UT, Coalition for a Safe Lab, MT, Los Alamos Study Group, NM, Nuclear Watch of New Mexico, The Sunshine Project, TX, and Western States Legal Foundation, CA. For a copy of the national statement, please call our office. For more information, or to get involved, join us on January 9. (Please see the enclosed flier or our Citizen's Alerts section for details.) Marylia Kelley Executive Director Tri-Valley CAREs (Communities Against a Radioactive Environment) 2582 Old First Street Livermore, CA USA 94551 <http://www.trivalleycares.org> - is our web site address. Please visit us there! (925) 443-7148 - is our phone (925) 443-0177 - is our fax

Post deleted by Admin5

Thankyou Leyh for that official version and expertise. I shall try harder in the future to give you the respect you deserve.

Post deleted by Admin5

Post deleted by Admin5

Post deleted by Admin5

Post deleted by Admin5

Post deleted by Admin5

Very nice post.

And "overintelligence" comes to mind. Hardcore sentiments Leyh. You "ooze" with that righteous feeling. My obeisances. Ki jai!

Guest, You and Theist obviously agree as you so succinctly reiterated. I understood your point and title (with some effort). I understand how Theist could misconstrue. We are representing the same family. Theist, I posted a quip to you in response to your "not too much" post misunderstanding you to be challenging me… but then immediately erased it. Such are the imperfect senses.

Yeah, these arguments you might expect from some newcomer with very mundane vision. I would never have expected this from Shiva or devotees at Chakra. I'm flabbergasted. It's sad to know what some people think, especially when you feel betrayed… They act as if you never knew them at all.

Paul 108, "A new low" is /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif (funny) Theist, "The door is wide open As It Is" - beautifully said. Applause!!!