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Sonic Yogi

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  1. Jnana is about cultivating expanded consciousness in impersonal brahman realization. Cultivating knowledge of the Gaudiya shastra, Bhagavatam etc. has nothing to do with jnana. It is a limb of devotional service. It is vital in spiritual growth in devotional service. Before we go to talk about the evils of jnana, we must first have a clear conception of what is jnana. Jnana is cultivation of the impersonal brahman and the aspiration to attain a position like Lord Siva in mastery of the material energy. Knowledge in Krsna consciousness has nothing to do with jnana.
  2. Yeah right. I don't trust you cowherd boys. :eek2::outta:
  3. In the same vein one could say that breaking the no bathing in Radha kunda rule can also be done without becoming an aparadhi to the guru. As "Rupanugas" it seems a little out of character for a devotee to go through his whole life without taking some Radha Kunda water on his head or bathing in the kunda. Rupa Goswami highly recommended it. Why should a "Rupanuga" be so against it? I have never seen any written or spoken record of Srila Prabhupada restricting the bathing in Radha Kunda even when he wrote a purport recommending that very thing in his translation of Upadesamritam. Prabhupada was no carbon copy of Srila Saraswati Thakur. I wouldn't be surprised even if Srila Prabhupada actually enjoyed the idea of hordes of his disciples descending on Radha Kunda en masse and stepping on the toes of the babajis there.
  4. You took the words right out of my mouth. Would you please stop stealing my thunder?
  5. Well, whether or not Govinda Dasi aspires for madhurya-rasa herself or not does not change the point I am trying to make that Srila Prabhupada did encourage the pursuit of manjari-bhava, even if Govinda Dasi was not particularly aspiring in that way. That just enhances the point I am trying to make that in the Prabhupada era he did encourage disciples to think about pursuing manjari-bhava even in such an early stage in the early years of ISKCON. Where she is at today is not really affecting the point I make by posting the letter to her from Srila Prabhupada. It really just makes my point all the more strong. Your suggestion about getting Tulasi seeds from here in Florida is a good one I am sure. I don't know if I am quite ready to commit to it at this time, but if and when I get more serious and able to improve my sadhana I will try and do that. Right now I am just a working man with little time for anything except my 16 rounds in the morning which I just took up again last year after many years away from nama-bhajan. I am trying to crawl back to Krsna consciousness one step at a time. For sure though, I am getting a lot of results from my chanting the 16 rounds and am becoming quite addicted to the pleasure and taste of chanting on beads. I don't remember getting this much taste in my ISKCON years and I can't account for why I now seem to get some taste, but I am very grateful that Sri Harinama is so kind to me. I am a believer. There really is something to this chanting Hare Krsna. That I can practically experience now.
  6. It is a well known fact in the camp of Srila Sridhara Maharaja that Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Saraswati Thakur was not pleased with the babaji lifestyle of Krsnadas Babaji. So, to use him as an example of a disciple of Srila Saraswati Thakur who did not follow the manjari bhava of his Gurudeva is not a very strong argument. I don't have an exact formal quote from any web page of book quote, but in the camp of Sridhar Maharaja it is well known that Sridhar Maharaja told that Srila Siddhanta Saraswati Thakur said about Krsnadas Babaji: He did not consider the babaji lifestyle of Krsnadas Babaji as favorable for the cultivation of Krsna consciousness. (Krsnanusilanam) Srila Bhaktisaiddhanta neither approved, authorized or appreciiated the babaji lifestyle of his disciple Krsnadas babaji. That is a well known story in the camp of Sridhar Maharaja. So, to use Krsnadas Babaji in the same breath as Srila Prabhupada as both being in sakhya-rasa could be seen by some as actually offensive to Srila Prabhuapda. If the Guru of Krsnadas Babaji was not pleased with his babaji lifestyle, then how are we supposed to believe that Krsnadas Babaji was actually on the transcendental platform in his so-called position in sakhya-rasa? Bhaktisiddhanta Saraswati Thakur was not pleased with Krsnadas Babaji. So, without the blessings of the spiritual master, then how are we to think that his position in sakhya-rasa was actually genuine and transcendental? I am not convinced. He was no doubt a very nice devotee, but he could not please his guru with his babaji lifestyle. His perfection in sakhya-rasa is questionable. His claim to sakhya-rasa along with his unapproved babaji lifestyle do not seem to be a very good combination for pleasing the acharya who's blessing are the secret to spiritual perfection and revelation of siddha-deha.
  7. Friday, May 28, 1971 Calcutta My Dear Govinda Dasi, <!-- BEGIN TEMPLATE: bbcode_quote --> Quote: <table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="100%"><tbody><tr><td style="border: 1px solid rgb(102, 102, 102); padding-left: 3ex; padding-right: 3ex;" bgcolor="#e0e0e0"> .............................May Tulasi be kind upon you and introduce you to Krishna, to be one of the assistant maid-servant gopis in Vrindaban.......................</td></tr></tbody></table> One thing I noticed in this letter to Govinda Das is the concept that Tulasi Devi worship can grant madhurya-bhava. Even if the guru acharya is in sakhya-rasa he was very particular to establish Tulasi worship in all his ISKCON temples, which according to this letter of blessings from Prabhupada to Govinda dasi has the potential to attract the blessings of Tulasi Devi and grant one entry into the madhurya-rasa lila. From this letter of Srila Prabhupada we can see the value and the benefit as well as the potential attainment of Tulasi Devi worship. I need to get me some Tulasi seeds. I have been wanting to cultivate Tulasi worship for a long time but have not done that here at my home. I did do the Tulasi worship in the temples for years. So, maybe it had some benefit. I would love to get some Tulasi seeds from Govinda dasi. I wonder if she can be reached?
  8. But, Hrisikesa prabhu who worked closely with Srila Prabhupada on the Upadesamrita was not instructed by Srila Prabhupada to put anything about any restrictions on his disciples from going to Radha-kunda in that purport. Prabhupada had that option in the writing of the book, but he made no effort to do so. In fact, wasn't his senior disciple Svarupa Damodar Maharaja placed in samadhi there? Obviously, this senior disciple of Srila Prabhupada was culturing madhurya-rasa which he imbibed from his Gurudeva Srila Prabhupada. Mainly, the restrictions on Radha kunda are coming in the line of Srila Sridhar Maharaja. I would like to know if all the other Gaudiya Math Godbrothers observed such strict distancing from Radha kunda.
  9. Hriskesha prabhu recalls his session with Srila Prabhupada during the couple of weeks he spend with Srila Prabhupada working on the Upadeshamrta translation, http://www.bvml.org/contemporary/HD_sposrb.html When Hriskesha prabhu asked if the manjari-bhava was always the case in the Rupanuga sampradaya, Srila Prabhupada said "yes".
  10. April 25, 1970 Los Angeles My Dear Daughter Kasturikadevi Dasi, In this letter from Srila Prabhupada we can see the vatsalya-rasa that Srila Prabhupada felt for his disciples. He referred to Kasturika Devi as "my dear daughter". In caring for so many disciples, even this vatsalya-rasa between the guru and the disciple can be a very profound mood of the acharya.
  11. On a previous topic one devotee suggested that the concept pf manjari bhava was never encouraged by Srila Prabhupada and was not advocated in ISKCON during the Prabhupada era. This topic will expose the fallacy of such a claim and present evidence from the teachings of Srila Prabhupada to the contrary. In the books and writings of Srila Prabhupada the term manjari is translated as "assistant maidservant of the gopis". I will start off this topic with a quote from a letter from Srila Prabhupada to his disciple Govinda dasi........... Friday, May 28, 1971 Calcutta My Dear Govinda Dasi,
  12. So, in the evolution from sakhya-rasa to madhurya-rasa there is no loss of the sakhya-rasa. It does not go away, but something more and better is added to it. It's not like the sakhya-rasa devotee become dissatisfied and rejects his rasa for another one. No, he advances in love of Krsna and the sakhya-rasa evolves into vatsalya-rasa and then later into madhurya-rasa keeping all the previous rasas intact.
  13. NOD ch. 15 <!-- BEGIN TEMPLATE: bbcode_quote --> Quote: <table border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0" width="100%"> <tbody><tr> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(102, 102, 102); padding-left: 3ex; padding-right: 3ex;" bgcolor="#e0e0e0"> Great devotees up to the standard of Uddhava are very dear friends of the Lord, and they desire to follow in the footsteps of the gopīs. So the gopīs' love for Kṛṣṇa is certainly not material lusty desire. Otherwise, how could Uddhava aspire to follow in their footsteps? </td> </tr> </tbody></table> TLC ch.30 This assistant maidservant of the gopis is called manjari in shastric terms. So, here Srila Prabhupada is recommending manjari-bhava. <!-- END TEMPLATE: bbcode_quote -->
  14. The highest perfectional stage of love of Krsna is madhurya-rasa.
  15. TLC ch. 29 It says here that relationships with Krsna develop from one type to another until reaching the highest point in conjugal love. Here again we hear about "the gradual process" of development of rasa.
  16. TLC ch.28 So, contrary to the "innate eternal rasa in the heart" theory, Prabhupada says here that in the beginning there is no rasa established. Again, he refers to the rasas as "stages".
  17. NOD ch. 15 So, Uddhava aspired to follow in the foosteps of the gopis but somehow he was just not allowed to because he is eternally locked in his mixed rasa of servitude and friendship with Krsna? Uddhava wanted to follow the gopi-bhava, but he is eternally prohibited from attaining that?
  18. True, the sadhaka should not think himself to be the original prototype of the parshada but simply aspiring to emulate that parshada. Then, upon perfection the devotee can attain to such a position. One should not artificially think one is the parshada during the sadhaka stage. Upon perfection the siddha bhakta can then attain to an identical position in the unlimited realm of Goloka that is beyond mental and intellectual capacity. Unlimited numbers of living beings have the position of Uddhava in that they are inconceivably one and different from the original Uddhava. They aren't the original Uddhava, but through their bhakti they have come to attain oneness with Uddhava tattva.
  19. it refers to the bhava of the devotee. It, the bhava of the devotee, may develop in to conjugal love if there is a subjective experience that elevates him to a higher platform. I just don't buy the theory that some souls are limited in the spiritual growth potential. They can all grow to full maturity of saranagati if they get the subjective experience of association with more advanced devotees who enlighten them to higher and deeper kinds of love of Krsna. There is certainly no shortage of good association in Goloka. We have only been given a peep into spiritual reality. The higher truths and realities of Krsna consciousness must be realized as in this world only basic and elementary information is given. There is unlimitedly more knowledge and spiritual growth in the spiritual world than there is here in the material world. Spiritual growth does not stop upon entering the spiritual world. In fact, that is where spiritual growth has it's greatest potential. We know very little. Almost nothing. Just a glimpse and a peep. There is so much more to know that is not even available in this material world. In this world we have just been given a drop from the ocean of truth. Even less than a drop. A few molecules of knowledge is all we get here.
  20. My response would be that of course it is best for him at that particular time in his spiritual growth. I don't to the school of thought that one living entity has the potential to grow more excellent in his devotion than another. I believe that all living beings have the same growth capacity and potential and as Sridhar Maharaja coined "the subjective evolution of consciousness" will run it's course as the subjective experience of the living being stimulates growth and evolution of rasa in the soul. When subjected to particular situations and associations the consciousness of the soul evolves to higher and higher platforms. I don't believe that such a process stops upon entering Goloka Dhama. If anything, I would say that spiritual growth there is a lot more natural than here in the world of misconception. I personally see these parshada descriptions as posts and positions. I don't believe that ONE Rupa Manjari is appearing in millions of universes at the same time and yet remains in Goloka at the same time. I believe that millions of souls have the position of Rupa Manjari in the millions of universes where the pastimes of Mahaprabhu are adventing. I don't believe that one soul other than the Vishnu and Shakti tattva can manifest millions forms at the same time. Uddhava is a post, a generic rasa with Krsna. Many living beings attain to and pass beyond the position of an Uddhava. After advancing beyond the Uddhava platform the living being will enter into vatsalya-rasa and then madhurya-rasa and get a position as a gopi at the summit of perfection. But, there will always be a living being coming up and fit for the Uddhava post to play the role in the pastimes of Krsna. OK, I know my ideas are a bit radical. But, that is my thinking.
  21. TLC ch.1 Here our Srila Prabhupada refers to these rasa as "stages". There are different stages of life as baby to youth to adult etc. We all know what a "stage" of growth is don't we? When a living entity reaches a fully mature stage he will surrender to Krsna in madhurya-rasa the most excellent of all rasas and the highest platform of saranagati.
  22. Yes, for us Prabhupada fanatics that is quite acceptable. Others out there I am sure will question this statement as being valid. It is after all a summary study of NOD and not a word for word translation.
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