Guruvani

Actually Srila Prabhupada said he was the only son of Bhaktisiddhanta. All the others were daughters, because the daughters stay home, while the son goes out into the world to do his father's bidding.

Thats cute.

Now prove it with an actual verifiable quote.

"Prabhupada said"

Choose topics that will foment disagreement and offense.

So, maybe we should all just buy into the doctrine that all the disciples of Srila Bhaktisiddhanta except Srila Prabhupada were mayavadis?

Bhaktisiddhanta only had ONE real disciple and Srila Prabhupada has hundreds?

That is about what they are trying to say.

That's a little too open-ended. What way? I present the facts also. The topic produces controversy- that is a fact.

A topic that produces controversy is controversial. That is another fact.

So the Vedas ignore the facts?

So, to resolve the controversy we can refer to the senior Gaudiyas like Sridhar Maharaja and Narayana Maharaja who both rejected the fall-from-goloka fairytale.

Before some ISKCON crackpots invented the idea it was NOT within the conception of the Gaudiya tradition.

Which is sensationalistic. Choose topics that will foment disagreement and offense. Like the yellow journalist papers.

The GBC inaugurated the debate when they commissioned Drutakarma to defeat the Godbrothers of Srila Prabhupada by showing that they preach Mayavada origins.

This is the issue that exposes the GBC and the ISKCON party-line as misfits and renegades of the Gaudiya tradition.

It is one of my favorite topics.

Vaisnavism has unlimited topics to discuss. Topics that are not under the magisterial control of the GBC. Why obsess over the fall down, which after all has no impact on our spiritual life -which is about extricating ourselves from the material illusion. Or do you disagree with that also?

Then start an interesting topic and see how long it lives on the forum.

The fall/origins topics get more hits than the other topics.

Obviously, many people find it interesting.

Once again you bring sobering truth and sanity into the discussion.

The problem is that he can't support his statements with authorized shastric reference.

So, he is just rambling on off the top of his head.

This position gets defeated immediately if one goes to discuss anything with scholars who actually know the language of the Gaudiya shastra.

He claims there is no shanta-rasa in brahman realization.

Can he support that with shastra?

No.

It's Mahaks opinion.

It is not supported in shastra.

Their opinion doesn't warrant so much consideration. First off anybody who is in ISKCON will be summarily chastized if not kicked out for questioning the GBC magisterium. Anybody who isn't their institutional gumba isn't going to be much influenced by their opinion and so will not be misled.

In short - the controversy is moot.

Well, I guess we could all just hang out on the forum and talk about the weather, the president of Iran or Jesus?

I find the topic interesting.

It is a major issue that the ISKCON party-liners use to assault and attack all non-ISKCON parties and I personally think the issue is strategic for future generations to get a proper grasp of apart from the ISKCON propaganda.

Such a complex topic which even Babaji avoids answering directly, .

I think that is a false claim and a false conclusion.

There has been presented plenty of evidence from the Babaji in Jaiva Dharma on the jiva-tattva in support of the Gaudiya siddhanta on the origin of the jiva.

This is a strawman argument.

Make an unsubstantiated claim and them watch all the little toy soldiers fall in line.

This the typical tactic of persons who wants to win the debate at any cost, even at the cost of truth.

More importantly what's in it for Guruvani, that he keeps harping on it?

 

What is in it for me?

Satisfaction.

Satisfaction of being able to deconstruct the fall-from-goloka sleepervadi siddhanta by going to the books fo Srila Prabhupada and finding the evidence that they are wrong.

I just get a little tickled everytime I find some new evidence that exposes the sleepervadi nonsense.

Otherwise, I don't associate with ANY camp at all and haven't for about 21 years.

I am a loner and I simply say it the way I see it.

I have only one loyaltly and that is to the truth.

COULD LIFE ARISE BY CHANCE? by Drutakarma das & Sadaputa das

by Divya-prabandha das on Mon 30 Oct 2006 11:34 PM LKT | Permanent Link | Cosmos

 

 

Drutakarma - guru to the ISKCON gurus and GBC.

Drutakarma:

3. In resolving philosophical controversies, the teachings, instructions, and personal example of Srila Prabhupada are the first and primary resource. If a conclusion, recognized by the GBC, can be drawn from careful study of this resource, it shall guide further research into the Vedic literature, the writings of previous acaryas, and the teachings of currentbona fide Vaisnava acaryas outside ISKCON. Everything that can be harmonized to the conclusion arrived at from Srila Prabhupada’s teachings shall be accepted. Any contradictions that cannot be resolved shall be placed in the category of “differences among the acaryas.” But ISKCON members shall follow the conclusion of Srila Prabhupada when there is such a difference.

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all the quotes and references you see on this forum by Vigraha and Sarva-Gatah come from this thesis by Drutakarma.

Here is the download to his complete treatise on the sleepvada siddhanta and fall of the jiva.

http://www.dipika.org/downloads/jiva.zip

Yeah, tell that to Lance.

Isn't the whole concept of brahmacharya and celibacy about testosterone?

How many times have we heard Srila Prabhupada talk about the value of semina?

Doesn't semina equal testosterone?

Maybe lance has ONE huge nut that produces more testosterone than two of a normal male?

Two raisins are not equal to ONE mango.

Paramatma worship is the system of the yogis.

Yogis are after mystic siddhis to control the material elements.

Since the pursuit of the yogi is more-or-less self-centered desire for mystical powers they are not classified as Bhaktas proper.

The Bhakta must become free of all these personal ambitions and desires for mystic powers.

As long as the yogi is seeking mystic siddhi he is not practicing bhakti proper.

Mystic siddhis are for exploiting the material energy for personal pleasure.

As such, the yogis are not amongst the pure devotees as they worship Paramatma for personal gain.

it is just a reasonable way to describe the disease of too much testosterone

Unless one is using steroids, there is no problem of too much testosterone.

A guy I work with had one testicle removed because of cancer and his testosterone is low and he is always fatigued and dragging ass around the shop.

He can only work two days at a time then he has to have a day off.

I am ten years older than him and I work circles around him all day long.

Testosterone is stamina.

Without it, one is a limp-wristed sissy.

MEDIC actually came from the word VEDIC.

Or, is it short for medical?

By the way Melvin, have you taken your medication lately?

Can you send me your recipe for lunatic base? I'm catering an ISKCON wedding.

Just make a pot of Sleepervadi stew sprinkled with nuts.

Brilliant my friend! The persons that you call "Sleeper Vadis" along with the IRM are most certainly the lunatic fringe of the Hare Krishna Movement.

True, but the fringe of the Hare Krishna movement aren't the only lunatics in the Hare Krishna movement.

The CORE of GBC and gurus are a bunch of lunatics as far as I am concerned.

So, I guess a lunatic fringe is about all you can have around a lunatic base.

Jayadvaita's opinion isn't worth a plug nickel.

He is a bogus neophyte career ISKCON guru with his nose in the air.

Anyone that can stand in the face of the teachings of Mahaprabhu and the great Goswamis of Vrindavan and deny their actual teachings doesn't deserve the time of day from anyone that actually wants a non-political, authentic explanation of Gaudiya siddhanta.

Not a single disciple of Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Saraswati Thakur or any of their disciples agree with the fall-from-goloka fairtytale.

That fairytale was invented by some ISKCON dorks who take themselves way too seriously.

It is NOT a genuine Gaudiya Vaishnava conclusion.

It is a fairytale for the ISKCON sleepyheads.

Guruvani What do you mean with beaners?

Pintos smashed into a delectable paste that goes great on a Tostada.

I make 'me at home all the time.

Love that beaner food.

Sounds like a personal gripe that should be taken up with Admin.

A spiritual topic?

DUH??

Better than -$53,000,000 tho.

What did you do?

Sink one of them nuclear subs accidently smoking a doob in the boiler room?