ARJ

Yes your are correct, the jains know Krishna as Rishabha, as a matter of fact the following verses from Srimad Bhagavatam proves that Rishabha was the eighth Avatara : ashtame merudevyam tu nabher jata urukramah darsayan vartma dhiranam sarvasrama-namaskritam So it shouldn't make any difference if it's Krishna or Rishabha, let's accept Rishabha(with his teachings) as the eighth avatara. Or is it there's no Krishna at all ?

What's wrong with Jainism ?

"Wisdom lies in never forgetting the Self, the Supreme Absolute as the ever present source of both the experiencer and the experiences" this is what kicked Buddha out, but yes Hindus are worst preachers.

From ZERO to number ONE hero Shankara rocks :P

Beautiful. Lord Ram and Lord Hanuman are one & the same.

Thanks barney, for explaining the TRUTH so beautifully.

Peace be the earth, peaceful the ether, peaceful heaven, peaceful the waters, peaceful the herbs, peaceful the trees. May all Gods bring me peace. May there be peace through these invocations of peace. With these invocations of peace which appease everything, I render peaceful whatever here is terrible, whatever here is cruel, whatever here is sinful. Let it become auspicious, let everything be beneficial to us.--Atharva Veda: X. 191. 4 Let us have concord with our own people, and concord with people who are strangers to us; Asvins, create between us and the strangers a unity of hearts. May we unite in our midst, unite in our purposes, and not fight against the divine spirit within us. Let not the battle-cry rise amidst many slain, nor the arrows of the War-God fall with the break of day.--Atharva Veda Let your aims be common, and your hearts be of one accord, and all of you be of one mind, so you may live well together.--Rig Veda X . 191 One should never do that to another which one regards as injurious to one's own self. This, in brief, is the rule of dharma. Yielding to desire and acting differently, one becomes guilty of adharma. --Mahabharata XVIII:113.8. Those high-souled persons who desire beauty, faultlessness of limbs, long life, understanding, mental and physical strength and memory should abstain from acts of injury.--Mahabharata XVIII:115.8. Ahimsa is the highest dharma. Ahimsa is the best tapas. Ahimsa is the greatest gift. Ahimsa is the highest self-control. Ahimsa is the highest sacrifice. Ahimsa is the highest power. Ahimsa is the highest friend. Ahimsa is the highest truth. Ahimsa is the highest teaching.--Mahabharata XVIII:116.37-41. Everyone should make offerings to all creatures; thereby one achieves the propitiation of all creatures. Every day one should make gifts, even if it be only with a cup of water: thus one achieves the propitiation of human beings.--Yajur Veda Brahmins misinterpreted Vedas

Few more reasons why there wasn't any need for a 'Buddha Avatara' or in other words Buddha probably wasn't an Avatara, Some Vedic Verses: <!--[if !supportLists]-->1.Let not wicked impulses destroy your character - Rig. 1.38.6<o:p></o:p><!--[endif]--> <!--[if !supportLists]-->2.Do not retaliate against any man even if he harms you - Rig.1.141.8<o:p></o:p><!--[endif]--> <!--[if !supportLists]-->3.Process of self-realization automatically destroys evil desires - Rig. 2.30.5<o:p></o:p><!--[endif]--> <!--[if !supportLists]-->4.Will power can conquer passionate urges of sense organs - Rig. 5.31.3<o:p></o:p><!--[endif]--> <!--[if !supportLists]-->5.Be humble and not boastful; Avoid egoism - Rig 6.52.1<o:p></o:p><!--[endif]--> <!--[if !supportLists]-->6.Idle mind is an easy pray to evil thoughts - Rig. 10.22.8<o:p></o:p><!--[endif]--> <!--[if !supportLists]-->7.Do not think or act maliciously but tread on righteous path - Rig. 10.57.1<o:p></o:p><!--[endif]--> <!--[if !supportLists]-->8.Dispel ignorance through patience and perseverance (Sadana) - Yajur. 3.61<o:p></o:p><!--[endif]--> <!--[if !supportLists]-->9.Do not forget earthly duties while in spiritual moods - Yajur 5.43<o:p></o:p><!--[endif]--> <o:p> </o:p>10.Rise high and maintain your magnanimity - Yajur. 13.1<o:p></o:p><!--[endif]--> <!--[if !supportLists]-->11.With virtue and vitality establish yourself on the earth (Yoga) - Yajur. 17.72<o:p></o:p><!--[endif]--> <!--[if !supportLists]-->12.Behave with others as you would with yourself - Yajur. 40.6<o:p></o:p><!--[endif]--> <!--[if !supportLists]-->13.Forgiveness, Compassion and Service are qualities that make you lovable by all - Yajur.40.6<o:p></o:p><!--[endif]--> <!--[if !supportLists]-->14.Be always brave. The brave are invincible - Atharva.20.47.3<o:p></o:p><!--[endif]--> <!--[if !supportLists]-->15.Be non-violent and persistent to get rid of all evil and evil impulses - Sama. 308 :pray:..........<o:p></o:p><!--[endif]-->

Only if Buddha had someone like Vashishta or Sandipani to guide him, he would've never made this blunder, it was his ego that never allowed him to ask someone who's more realised than him for directions. On the other hand I don't think Shri Krishna ever had the need for a guru, but it was His humility & modesty that He went to someone for education.

The martial arts we are talkin about are the ones that are perfected & practised by "Ahimsak" Buddhists like Shaolin Kung-Fu, Thai Kick boxing, the Samurai, the tibetan martial arts & various other forms that developed in other buddhist nations. Historians claim that the origins of all forms of eastern martial arts can be traced back to a form of martial art practised in southern india by buddhist monks what is the need for such lethal martial arts if you believe in ahimsa ?

You fool, I meant in Kali Yuga anyone could be a scoundrel, I didn't say everyone who's born in Kali Yuga is a scoundrel. I can ascertain that a couple of Mahatmas born in Kali Yuga are definitely not scoundrels. One of them is the Ninth Avatara Adi Shankara & the other is Swami Ramdev. what should I do ? bark back at you ?

Kali Yuga is meant for scoundrels.

Yes The concepts of anatman, Shunyata, Vegetarianism, Ahimsa all can be traced back to Vedas

On the other hand there are so many verses in Vedas against animal killing & meat eating. The oldest scripture mentioning 'Ahimsa' is the Taittiriya Samhita of the Yajurveda (TS 5.2.8.7) & yet some idiots think that vegetarianism & Ahimsa was a buddhist influence on hinduism The results speak for themselves, can a meat eating buddhist like Dalai Lama be compared with Swami Ramdev ?

You mean buddha whispered this into your ears ? By the way in Pali Canon, Vinaya Pitaka, Chapter on Devadata (Buddha’s first cousin) the Buddha is reported to have said: "I have allowed fish and meat that is pure in the three aspects; when it is not seen or heard or suspected to have been killed for one personally." The above may be found in "The Life of the Buddha" by Bhikkhu Nanamoli pg. 267. Pali Canon, Majjhima Nikaya, Javaka Sutta, verse 5 "Jivaka, I say that there are three instances in which meat should not be eaten: when it is seen, heard, or suspected (that the living being has been slaughtered for the bhikkhu). I say that meat should not be eaten in these three instances. I say that there are three instances in which meat may be eaten: when it is not seen, not heard, and not suspected (that the living being has been slaughtered for the bhikkhu). I say that meat may be eaten in these three instances. The above may be found in "The Middle Length Discourses of the Buddha" by Bhikkhu Nanamoli and Bhikkhu Bodhi pg. 474

can you explain this: Srimad Bhagavata Purana canto 1, chapter 3, verse 13: ashtame merudevyam tu nabher jata urukramah darsayan vartma dhiranam sarvasrama-namaskritam The Chaturyuga Khanda Dvitiyadhyayah, Bhavishya Purana, chapter 19, verse 30: isha muurtirt-dradi praptaa nityashuddha sivamkari ishamasihah iti ca mama nama pratishthitam don't see any difference between you & a guy named zakir naik

lol....than you haven't heard about guys like Zakir Naik & Dr.Vedavyas (not Maharishi Vyas muni). These guys have claimed that not only Virgin Mary or the mission of Jesus Christ has been predicted but also Prophet Muhammed's parents names (leave alone his own name) have been mentioned (in Sanskrit) in Puranas. You should do some more research on this. You are not any different from these guys & lots of others who keep claiming that how their 'Gurus' have been predicted in this & that Puranas. There's no dearth of fools like you. If we believe in each one of you than there would be 'Shata Avatars' & not just 'Dasha Avatars' You are forgetting that Hindus were under the influence of meat eating Muslims & Christians since past 1000 years & were forcefully made to eat meat & beef in order to convert them, on top of that there were people like Buddha who preached that anything that is offered as Bhiksha (including meat) should be accepted without hesitation & the Pali canon scriptures, well lets not even talk about them Today there are hardly any Hindus who live by the Vedas or know whats written in Vedas regarding Ahimsa & animal Killing & moreover the way the Mcdonalds & KfC's entice people, through advertisements, to eat meat, what else can you expect ? Well the purpose of Ram Avatar was not to keep the savages & voracious meat eating Hindus (as the elite historians have portrayed Hindus) from killing animals so a discussion on His diet is immaterial The contention is that how could someone who preached Ahimsa & Vegetarianism (the purpose cited for this Avatar) himself never practised them. That was some info on Kalighat, muchas gracias by the way do you think this 'Shambhala War' is the hidden link between Buddhism & Martial Arts ?

Ever heard about the 'Lies of White Men' Tibet, China , Japan, the West, every where nonvegetarian Buddhists out numbers their vegetarian counterparts, if Buddha really stressed the point even more, the ratios would have been different today. So what ? people have been claiming that Jesus Christ & Prophet Mohammed have been predicted in Puranas, should I start believing in them ? Many Buddhists believe that Buddha wasn't a vegetarian & they have reasons to believe that. So don't blame me if I have doubts if Buddha practised Ahimsa. Exactly, whatever associated with Buddhism can be traced back to Vedas. Atleast I've shown some respect to Buddhism & called it a form of Vedanta. My contention was why something like martial arts never interferred with their (Buddhists) beliefs I still don't believe there's any need to perfect the art of killing anyone with a single blow if you believe in Ahimsa.

If you could please explain how Vedas were 'misused'. I mean if you follow anything thats written in a book tis not a 'misuse' of that book. 1st how did you know it did occur Has anyone, other than yourself, for instance Prabhupada, ever claimed (like the way it is said about Buddha avatar) that one of the purpose of Krishna avatar was to stop the widespread practise of killing animals for yajna & thus "Patram Pushpam Phalam Toyam... I still believe Krishna wouldn't have made allusions but would rather order people to follow Vedas but better skip Rig Veda hymns 1.162 and 1.163. it seems that some sense is prevailing. yes, coz Buddha didn't believed in the concept of God, but why do you believe in Krishna donno about the rest, but I think I am see ya guys later

Dear Suchandra, I think there's someone who probably knows more about Tibet's troubled internal situation than that Bhattacharya chick or anyone in here & that someone is none other than the 'Female Buddha' Tibet's only female living Buddha, who is also a top regional official, said she was upset and angered by riots in Lhasa last month, and accused the Dalai Lama of violating Buddhist teachings, state media reported. The twelfth Samding Dorje Phagmo said that since Tibet's incorporation into Communist China it had been transformed from the backwards feudal society of largely illiterate serfs with little medical care that she knew as a child. "Old Tibet was dark and cruel, the serfs lived worse than horses and cattle," she told the official Xinhua agency in an interview published today. Born in 1942, she was chosen as the incarnation of the deity Vajravarahi aged five. Now head of the Samding monastery, she is also vice-chairwoman of the standing committee of the Tibetan Autonomous Regional People's Congress, or regional parliament. She was in Beijing for a meeting of a national consultative body to Parliament when rioting broke out in Lhasa on March 14, after days of monk-led protests. "Watching on television a tiny number of unscrupulous people burning and smashing shops, schools and public property, brandishing knives and sticks to attack unfortunate passers-by I felt boundless surprise, deep heartache and indignant resentment," she said in the interview in Lhasa. China has accused the Dalai Lama, Tibet's exiled spiritual leader, of plotting the riots and unrest that spread across many ethnic Tibetan parts of the country, in a bid to overshadow the Olympic Games and push for independence. "The sins of the Dalai Lama and his followers seriously violate the basic teachings and precepts of Buddhism and seriously damage traditional Tibetan Buddhism's normal order and good reputation," the Samding Dorje Phagmo was quoted as saying - though she did not detail what his transgressions were. The Dalai Lama rejects China's claims, saying he supports the Olympic Games and seeks only greater autonomy for Tibet. Beijing last week offered talks with his aides, after an international chorus urging dialogue. But state media continue to unleash a barrage of criticism of the Dalai Lama or the Tibet he ruled before the arrival of Communist troops in 1950. http://www.livenews.com.au/Articles/2008/04/30/Female_Buddha_condemns_Dalai_Lama Well, don't you consider Buddha as Krishna's avatar as for the 'Spritual Discussions' forum don't you know how the advertising agencies choose the right slots ? I've applied the same principle.

you completely missed the point as expected. That's defamation at it's worst, however I would still love to know why Narayan as Ram didn't refute Vedas ? As for Krishna, chapter 16 of Bhagvad Gita known as 'Daivasarasaupadwibhagayog', clearly states it is our duty to study the Vedic scriptures. Now when Krishna said "Patram Pushpam Phalam Toyam Yo Me Bhaktya Prayacchati; Tadaham Bhaktyupahritamasanami Prayatatmanah" it means it is not necessary that one should offer gold, silver or costly clothes, but the Lord will accept even a leaf, a flower or a fruit if offered with devotion. Now if at all animal killing was mentioned in the Vedas, there was no need for Krishna to make allusions, but he would've outrightly rejected such practices. If it (animal killing) is mentioned in the Vedas people would practice it no matter what, Krishna wasn't a fool, He would've definitely rejected the Vedas before anyone else. Don't try to mislead anyone. Well I don't think so, let's see what a 'Female Buddha' has to say about P.P.H.H.Dalai Lama Tibet's only female living Buddha, who is also a top regional official, said she was upset and angered by riots in Lhasa last month, and accused the Dalai Lama of violating Buddhist teachings, state media reported. The twelfth Samding Dorje Phagmo said that since Tibet's incorporation into Communist China it had been transformed from the backwards feudal society of largely illiterate serfs with little medical care that she knew as a child. "Old Tibet was dark and cruel, the serfs lived worse than horses and cattle," she told the official Xinhua agency in an interview published today. Born in 1942, she was chosen as the incarnation of the deity Vajravarahi aged five. Now head of the Samding monastery, she is also vice-chairwoman of the standing committee of the Tibetan Autonomous Regional People's Congress, or regional parliament. She was in Beijing for a meeting of a national consultative body to Parliament when rioting broke out in Lhasa on March 14, after days of monk-led protests. "Watching on television a tiny number of unscrupulous people burning and smashing shops, schools and public property, brandishing knives and sticks to attack unfortunate passers-by I felt boundless surprise, deep heartache and indignant resentment," she said in the interview in Lhasa. China has accused the Dalai Lama, Tibet's exiled spiritual leader, of plotting the riots and unrest that spread across many ethnic Tibetan parts of the country, in a bid to overshadow the Olympic Games and push for independence. "The sins of the Dalai Lama and his followers seriously violate the basic teachings and precepts of Buddhism and seriously damage traditional Tibetan Buddhism's normal order and good reputation," the Samding Dorje Phagmo was quoted as saying - though she did not detail what his transgressions were. The Dalai Lama rejects China's claims, saying he supports the Olympic Games and seeks only greater autonomy for Tibet. Beijing last week offered talks with his aides, after an international chorus urging dialogue. But state media continue to unleash a barrage of criticism of the Dalai Lama or the Tibet he ruled before the arrival of Communist troops in 1950. http://www.livenews.com.au/Articles/2008/04/30/Female_Buddha_condemns_Dalai_Lama PS. hey KD that was an interesting article on buddhism & vegetarianism

No wonder Buddhism had to decline or it never got going in India, but still some people think it was the Hindu oppression Even if a few brahmins killed animals it doesn't mean that it was such a widespread practice that Narayan had to descend as an avatar to stop this & if the Vedas did sanction animal killing than why Ram & Krishna didn't refute the authority of Vedas before Buddha, Vedas of course predate both Ram & Krishna. By the way in Pali Canon, Vinaya Pitaka, Chapter on Devadata (Buddha’s first cousin) the Buddha is reported to have said: "I have allowed fish and meat that is pure in the three aspects; when it is not seen or heard or suspected to have been killed for one personally." The above may be found in "The Life of the Buddha" by Bhikkhu Nanamoli pg. 267. Pali Canon, Majjhima Nikaya, Javaka Sutta, verse 5 "Jivaka, I say that there are three instances in which meat should not be eaten: when it is seen, heard, or suspected (that the living being has been slaughtered for the bhikkhu). I say that meat should not be eaten in these three instances. I say that there are three instances in which meat may be eaten: when it is not seen, not heard, and not suspected (that the living being has been slaughtered for the bhikkhu). I say that meat may be eaten in these three instances. The above may be found in "The Middle Length Discourses of the Buddha" by Bhikkhu Nanamoli and Bhikkhu Bodhi pg. 474. Dear Kingdecember the Vedas, don't require any evidence to prove thier truth & yes Jayadeva Goswami was probably under the influence of 'Som Ras' that day

Most solidarity and environmental groups supporting the Tibetan people's cause have not questioned the Dalai Lama's role in Tibetan history or addressed what it would mean for the Tibetan people if the Dalai Lama and his coterie returned to power. A 1995 document distributed by the Dalai Lama's Office of Tibet aggressively states that ``China tries to justify its occupation and repressive rule of Tibet by pretending that it `liberated' Tibetan society from `medieval feudal serfdom' and `slavery'. Beijing trots out this myth to counter every international pressure to review its repressive policies in Tibet.'' It then coyly concedes: ``Traditional Tibetan society was by no means perfect ... However, it was not as bad as China would have us believe.'' Was this a myth? Tibet's Buddhist monastic nobility controlled all land on behalf of the ``gods''. They monopolised the country's wealth by exacting tribute and labour services from peasants and herders. This system was similar to how the medieval Catholic Church exploited peasants in feudal Europe. Tibetan peasants and herders had little personal freedom. Without the permission of the priests, or lamas, they could not do anything. They were considered appendages to the monastery. The peasantry lived in dire poverty while enormous wealth accumulated in the monasteries and in the Dalai Lama's palace in Lhasa. In 1956 the Dalai Lama, fearing that the Chinese government would soon move on Lhasa, issued an appeal for gold and jewels to construct another throne for himself. This, he argued, would help rid Tibet of ``bad omens''. One hundred and twenty tons were collected. When the Dalai Lama fled to India in 1959, he was preceded by more than 60 tons of treasure. Romantic notions about the ``peaceful'' and ``harmonious'' nature of Tibetan Buddhist monastic life should be tested against reality. The Lithang Monastery in eastern Tibet was where a major rebellion against Chinese rule erupted in 1956. Beijing tried to levy taxes on its trade and wealth. The monastery housed 5000 monks and operated 113 ``satellite'' monasteries, all supported by the labour of the peasants. Chris Mullin, writing in the Far Eastern Economic Review in 1975, described Lithang's monks as ``not monks in the Western sense ... many were involved in private trade; some carried guns and spent much of their time violently feuding with rival monasteries. One former citizen describes Lithang as `like the Wild West'.'' The Tibetan ``government'' in Lhasa was composed of lamas selected for their religious piety. At the head of this theocracy was the Dalai Lama. The concepts democracy, human rights or universal education were unknown. The Dalai Lama and the majority of the elite agreed to give away Tibet's de facto independence in 1950 once they were assured by Beijing their exploitative system would be maintained. Nine years later, only when they felt their privileges were threatened, did they revolt. Suddenly the words ``democracy'' and ``human rights'' entered the vocabulary of the government-in-exile, operating out of Dharamsala in India ever since. Dharamsala and the Dalai Lama's commitment to democracy seems weak. An Office of Tibet document claims ``soon after His Holiness the Dalai Lama's arrival in India, he re-established the Tibetan Government in exile, based on modern democratic principles''. Yet it took more than 30 years for an Assembly of Tibetan People's Deputies to be directly elected from among the 130,000 exiles. Of 46 assembly members, only 30 are elected. The other 16 are appointed by religious authorities or directly by the Dalai Lama. All assembly decisions must be approved by the Dalai Lama, whose sole claim to the status of head of state is that he has been selected by the gods. The separation of church and state is yet to be recognised by the Dalai Lama as a ``modern democratic principle''. The right-wing nature of the Dalai Lama and the government-in-exile was further exposed by its relationship with the US CIA. The Dalai Lama concealed the CIA's role in the 1959 uprising until 1975. Between 1956 and 1972 the CIA armed and trained Tibetan guerillas. The Dalai Lama's brothers acted as intermediaries. Before the 1959 uprising, the CIA parachuted arms and trained guerillas into eastern Tibet. The Dalai Lama maintained radio contact with the CIA during his 1959 escape to India. Even the Dalai Lama's commitment to allowing the Tibetan people a genuine act of self-determination is debatable. Without consultation with the Tibetan people, the Dalai Lama openly abandoned his movement's demand for independence in 1987. This shift was first communicated to Beijing secretly in 1984. The Dalai Lama's proposals now amount to calling for negotiations with Beijing to allow him and his exiled government to resume administrative power in an ``autonomous'', albeit larger, Tibet. The Dalai Lama's call for international pressure on Beijing seeks only to achieve this. There are indications that a younger generation of exiled Tibetans is now questioning the traditional leadership. In Dharamsala, the New Internationalist reported recently, young Tibetans have criticised the abandonment of the demand for independence and the Dalai Lama's rejection of armed struggle. They openly question the influence of religion, saying it holds back the struggle. Some have received death threats for challenging the old guard. Several recently-arrived refugees were elected to the Assembly of Tibetan People's Deputies. The Tibetan people deserve the right to national self-determination. However, supporting their struggle should not mean that we uncritically support the self-proclaimed leadership of the Dalai Lama and his compromised ``government-in-exile''. Their commitment to human rights, democracy and support for genuine self-determination can only be judged from their actions and their willingness to tell the truth. http://www.greenleft.org.au/1996/248/13397

Dear Mr/Ms RadheRade1657, isn't Dalai Lama the Cheif Executive, I mean does a Bodhisattva Tara holds as much power as a Dalai Lama ? you seem to know a lot about Buddhism, if you could tell me why the Mahayana Buddhists belive in 'Atman' ? 'Atman' & Buddhism don't go together, Buddha always taught the 'dumb' Hindus there is no Jeev Atman or a Param Atman, nothing is permanent, so now why these Mahayana Buddhists against the core philosophy of Buddhism ? These Mahayana Buddhists must be makin Buddha to roll over in his samadhi You people are nothing but ignorant fools and sheeps with herd mentality deeply engrained in you. For your kind information even in Kaliyuga if at all Ahimsa exists any where in this world, it exists in the Brahman & Jain families of India ONLY. As per Buddha there is no such thing as Supreme Lord or Krishna, so why don't you follow His instructions ?

so white skinned people have the first right to become Buddha or Jesus or US Presidents, Popes, Dalai Lamas or God or to be called as "beautiful" ?????