amanpeter

GOD BLESS AMERICA!!!

Dear Dr. Melvin, I really don't know what to say, but this revealing post has hung here long enough and deserves some response, however feeble. Thank you for sharing all this with us. For myself, I find it most humbling, considering my own useless lazy situation financially supported by the government. Your spirit is obviously strong. I hope that your physical health remains good, as well. That job must provide a lot of personal satisfaction, knowing how much others depend on you, even if the monetary rewards are few. Perhaps we could speak by telephone sometime. Feel free to Email me, if you like. Best wishes, prabhu. HARIBOL! Peter/valaya ------------------ amanpeter@hotmail.com

Are we to take these words of Srila Prabhupada as mere encouragement or literally verbatim, the way we choose to accept so many other things he said? Similar words were said to other devotees and `gurus` who subsequently `fell down`, is it not true? What should we make of all this? Here's how I see it, prabhus. Lord Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu's Sankirtan Movement has barely just begun. Prabhupada has captured and will continue to capture so many troops worldwide, to be used in this divine mission. Isn't it possible that he actually saw/sees our real identities and roles? It may take many more generations and individual rebirths for all the forces to assemble fully and our roles to become perfected, but the process has clearly begun! Now is the time to keep and build faith in our true identities, individually and collectively. Anyone who is attracted in any way has been sent to us. All are of some potential benefit. It is our responsibility to sort everything out and somehow UNIFY! I'm sure that each of us can try a little harder in that regard/respect...valaya

Winzip with windows 98SE? I can't even understand the questions, let alone answer them! Arghh!!!

They are putting foreign Christian aid workers on trial. My source is the Toronto Star, this city's main newspaper.

That's nothing, prabhu! My photo is often posted in ISKCON temples as least wanted!

What continues to astound me is how every little thing, that would appear to me common sense for a devotee, must apparently be spelled out in detail. Then `devotees` have to be reminded, cajoled, and/or paid to perform bhakti! Bhakti-marg Swami often seems thoroughly disgusted and I can only sympathize, while the constant struggle goes on. Really, you have to see to believe, prabhu. I have a friend there, an old Indian man 86 years of age, who ends up doing heavy work neglected by others whose job it is to do! ******************************************* Just edited here since I want to make it clear that I'm not speaking in this post about eastern European or any other particular group. [This message has been edited by amanpeter (edited 09-11-2001).]

Condescension and patronizing will never satisfy, nor will the pretense of normalcy, particularly when differences are considered a source of pride. Political representation is one thing, but I don't think anyone would want to enter into a `gay` partnership just so their program might become more acceptable. The best thing we can possibly do for anyone is to be truthful and that begins with telling them that they are not their body, along with all that entails. Deception and duplicity in the name of spreading Lord Caitanya's movement is what got ISKCON in such a mess to begin with. Or am I wrong, prabhus? valaya

Well, he sent me an attachment which I unzipped into as a file on C drive, now what? Maybe Radharani won't even let me visit Vrndavan by video CD...woe is I! p.s. he says he can't help me by Email any further. Dumb is me!

Does anyone recollect Prabhupada encouraging us to dovetail our emotions towards Radha-Krsna and away from mundane relationships, such as family? Or how about telling us that we have no friends in this world? Didn't he say that sex, gross and subtle, is what binds us to material conciousness? Guess we all have our own ways to rationalize personal attachments, still I'd appreciate further clarification of these points, prabhus. Thank you. valaya ------------------ amanpeter@hotmail.com

One point worth noting, perhaps, is the `muslims'` objection to the `christians` glorifying Lord Jesus (guru) as greater than God...

A thread I am reluctant to let go...

Radha-Krsna=Light in Dark...JAI RADHE!

Peter/valaya to Kailasa (from another thread): Bad news, prabhu. I spoke to Bhakti-marg Swami yesterday and he told me that there have been many problems in ISKCON with eastern European devotees who came to temples in the west. Apparently they tend to lose their original committment and cause some difficulties. I'm starting a separate thread here, because this might be worthy of discussion within our world-wide virtual assembly of devotees. ISKCON Toronto now requires devotees that live in the temple to sign a contract (I'll try to find a scanner), but without the devotional spirit, what can be done? I have much more to say about all of this, however will wait to see if others are interested and if so, what direction the discussion takes. [This message has been edited by amanpeter (edited 09-10-2001).]

Re: Sadhu: all 28, more like 27, really 26... Mon, Sep 10 2001 13:56 valaya Keywords: ROFLOL! Haribol Tarun! That is just TOO funny, prabhu! Hope you don't mind my posting this on Good Clean Jokes at indiadivine. > From Tarun on Dharma-mela forum: > > > Shri Shri Guru Gaurangau Jayatah !!! > > > > The Supreme Lord ZrI KRSNa tells Uddhava about the qualities of SAdhus 11/11/29-31: > > > > "The following are the twenty eight qualities of SAdhus: > > (1) compassionate and merciful (2) spite-less (3) truthful (4) dispassionate (5) clean externally and within (6) charitable (7) gentle (8) pure (9) akincana (has nothing to call his own except his devotion for Shri Hari, Gurudev and Vaishnavas) (10) universal benefactor (11) self-controlled (12) has absolute reliance on ZrI KRSNa - the essence of all qualities (13) free from selfish desire (14) harmless (15) firm in his faith in for ZrI Hari, Gurudeva and Vaishnavas (16) conqueror of sixfold miseries (hunger, thirst, misfortune, illusion, infirmity and death) (17) temperate in diet (18) watchful and cautious (19) respectful of others (20) without ego (21) wise (22) soft-hearted (23) grave (24) friendly to all (25) Intelligent (26) dexterous (27) intent in singing and dancing (in HarinAm SankIrtan) (28) not given to idle gossip > > [This message has been edited by amanpeter (edited 09-10-2001).]

Prabhu, please don't feel that it was you being addressed! It's not so much a question of whether one speaks out as how. Our tempers must be tempered with self-reflection. Certainly these situations bring pain to the heart, but such pain can also be a great impetus for the sincere disciple to surrender himself/herself more deeply, knowing that blasphemers are better saved than `destroyed`. JAI SRI RADHE! valaya

From the latest official "Contract Between ISKCON Toronto and a Devotee Wishing to Live in the Temple": "Fraternizing with the members of the opposite sex is strictly forbidden." This does seem to create opportunities for homosexuals that are not available to heterosexuals. Witness certain late night `pizza parties` in one of the cook's rooms which continued until his advances towards young bhakta's became too obvious to ignore. Any atmosphere of enforced celibacy can become a `breeding` ground for homosexual liasons when the sexes are separated yet still present together. In that sense, those who are pre-disposed to those activities could be considered advantagedand not disadvantaged... Unfortunately, many(most?) are using ISKCON temples for anything but the cultivation of Krsna conciousness and thus interfering unnecessarily with the few sincere souls, whatever their sexual orientation, that come seeking exactly that.

Don't you just hate those stubborn stains?!! Taking offense on behalf of others, who may never have taken offense themselves, as an excuse to exercise our false ego's fighting propensity in the name of truth, justice and even love does not a pure devotee make. To `defend`, `glorify`, `praise` the acharya's is not the same as actually following them, nor can Sri Guru and Gauranga be deceived by such a show of cheap deception. Often, knowing from whom/whence it comes, even the casual observer can understand that it is only a hollow mockery of true devotion.

Ananga: From the above quote by Ananga it would appear that he/she is not seeking pure bhakti so much as an objective philosophical understanding of it. Anyone reading Srila Prabhupada's books will become a Krsna bhakta eventually, somehow or other, by the potency therein. His are not ordinary books as he was not an ordinary person. Actions speak far louder than words and when both are powerfully in unison along with the Grace of God, miracles must happen. Those not looking for such in their lives may be best to avoid the books written by our acharya Srila AC Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada.

"When you are slandered, and therefore grow disturbed and sick at heart, it shows that pride is in you, and that it must be wounded and driven out by outward dishonor. Therefore do not be irritated by derision, and do not bear malice against those who hate you and slander you, but love them as your physicians, whom God has sent you to instruct you and to teach you humility, and pray to God for them." St. John of Kronstadt.

WOW!

jndas prabhu, please clarify whether guru conciousness and God conciousness are identical according to your understanding, from the perspective of an ordinary jiva soul. In other words, are Prabhupada conciousness and Krsna conciousness the same and leading to the same end or possibly an end in themselves? Would Prabhupada katha be equivalent to Radha-Krsna katha? Sorry for my inability to express these questions better. [This message has been edited by amanpeter (edited 09-09-2001).]

Thanks prabhu! Met a devotee at the temple tonight who says he'll Email what I need. Apparently Mediaplayer is not enough without additional software. Will let you all know tomorrow.

Thank you very much, Atma prabhu!

Better yet, I want to push the off button and STOP!!! [This message has been edited by amanpeter (edited 09-09-2001).]