theist

I would love to read this article. Can someone please direct me to it? Thanks Hare Krsna

Try to see it in the simplest possible way. Abortion rights will only be outlawed in this country through the over turning of Roe v. Wade by the Supreme Court. Yes some will still do it in their own bathrooms and at their own risk. Just like other murders are against the law but some people do it anyway. The only party that has an interest in seeing the Supreme Court reverse that decision is the Republican Party. That can't happen until they a sufficent majority in the Senate to get some pro-life judges on the Supreme Court. Presently we just need to change 1 abortion rights judge in for 1 pro-life judge. The Demoncrats are presently blocking that effort at every chance they get and they have the numbers in Senate to continue blocking. I don't care what anyone's motive is in opposing abortion as long as they do we are on the same side in this issue. For me it really is that simple.

I_L_K, You are already studying the brian so this may interest you. There is a man at San Francisco St. studying consciousness and the brian. I believe his name is Liby, but I am not sure of the spelling. You may want to check him out. He has done studies that show that there is a reaction to danger that occurs before the impulses to and back from the brain have taken place. I can't explain anything because I don't understand anything but I think you might get something out of it. Hare Krsna

Karmic bondage is so complete. Even as we become aware of some sin we committed we are unconsciously committing more. Instead of trying to become aware of each sin indepedently and petitioning the Lord for forgiveness of that sin, it will be best if we just surrender wholesale to the Supreme Lord and learn to act for only His interest only. Of course, that means as we begin we will have to work to stop all that we know to be gross sins as they interfer with the surrendering process, but if our focus is more on how to work to please Krsna than it is to avoid sinful reactions the ultimate result will come to be living a life free from sinful reactions past present and future fo a start, with it all culminating in Krsna preme by the Lord's grace and protection. ---------------------------- TRANSLATION Bhagavad-gita 18.66 Abandon all varieties of religion and just surrender unto Me. I shall deliver you from all sinful reactions. Do not fear. PURPORT The Lord has described various kinds of knowledge and processes of religion—knowledge of the Supreme Brahman, knowledge of the Supersoul, knowledge of the different types of orders and statuses of social life, knowledge of the renounced order of life, knowledge of nonattachment, sense and mind control, meditation, etc. He has described in so many ways different types of religion. Now, in summarizing Bhagavad-gétä, the Lord says that Arjuna should give up all the processes that have been explained to him; he should simply surrender to Krsna. That surrender will save him from all kinds of sinful reactions, for the Lord personally promises to protect him. In the Seventh Chapter it was said that only one who has become free from all sinful reactions can take to the worship of Lord Krsna. Thus one may think that unless he is free from all sinful reactions he cannot take to the surrendering process. To such doubts it is here said that even if one is not free from all sinful reactions, simply by the process of surrendering to Sri Krsna he is automatically freed. There is no need of strenuous effort to free oneself from sinful reactions. One should unhesitatingly accept Krsna as the supreme savior of all living entities. With faith and love, one should surrender unto Him. The process of surrender to Krsna is described in the Hari-bhakti-viläsa (11.676): änukülyasya saìkalpaù prätikülyasya varjanam rakñiñyatéti viçväso goptåtve varanaà tathä ätma-nikñepa-kärpaëye ñaò-vidhä çaraëägatiù According to the devotional process, one should simply accept such religious principles that will lead ultimately to the devotional service of the Lord. One may perform a particular occupational duty according to his position in the social order, but if by executing his duty one does not come to the point of Krsna consciousness, all his activities are in vain. Anything that does not lead to the perfectional stage of Krsna consciousness should be avoided. One should be confident that in all circumstances Kåñëa will protect him from all difficulties. There is no need of thinking how one should keep the body and soul together. Krsna will see to that. One should always think himself helpless and should consider Krsna the only basis for his progress in life. As soon as one seriously engages himself in devotional service to the Lord in full Krsna consciousness, at once he becomes freed from all contamination of material nature. There are different processes of religion and purificatory processes by cultivation of knowledge, meditation in the mystic yoga system, etc., but one who surrenders unto Krsna does not have to execute so many methods. That simple surrender unto Krsna will save him from unnecessarily wasting time. One can thus make all progress at once and be freed from all sinful reactions. One should be attracted by the beautiful vision of Krsna. His name is Krsna because He is all-attractive. One who becomes attracted by the beautiful, all-powerful, omnipotent vision of Krsna is fortunate. There are different kinds of transcendentalists—some of them are attached to the impersonal Brahman vision, some of them are attracted by the Supersoul feature, etc., but one who is attracted to the personal feature of the Supreme Personality of Godhead, and, above all, one who is attracted by the Supreme Personality of Godhead as Krsna Himself, is the most perfect transcendentalist. In other words, devotional service to Krsna, in full consciousness, is the most confidential part of knowledge, and this is the essence of the whole Bhagavad-gétä. Karma-yogés, empiric philosophers, mystics and devotees are all called transcendentalists, but one who is a pure devotee is the best of all. The particular words used here, mä çucaù, “Don’t fear, don’t hesitate, don’t worry,” are very significant. One may be perplexed as to how one can give up all kinds of religious forms and simply surrender unto Krsna, but such worry is useless.

Actually I'm responding to Srila Prabhupada's pro-life rhetoric.

I have never had my ears burn, eyes twitch yes, but ears burning, no. I have had a small time premonition that came true within a couple hours in but I still don't understand it.

we pick up on things like this all the time and barely notice. We suddenly feel the phone is going to ring and then it does, maybe we even start thinking about the very person who is calling. But what I don't get are premonitions. It brings up that whole fixed future & freewill thing that just drives me crazy.

Ever feel that someone was looking at you from behind and you turned around to see somebody staring at you? It's not so much their eyes on you that you feel but rather their concentrated thoughts hitting your aura that gets your attention. Try this. Someone is walking down the street by themself and across the street. Look at them and concentrate your thoughts on them and send the instruction in a strong concentrated fashion for them to turn their head your way and look at you. When they respond the first time it will startle you. /images/graemlins/smile.gif Thoughts are things.

Srila Narottama dasa Thakur sings and prays of his guru; ...janme janme prabhu sei He is my Lord birth after birth My question is how does this sentiment match up with the instruction in the Iskcon law book that if a guru chooses to leave Iskcon he has to leave all his disciples with him? Is it, "He is my Lord birth after birth* " *(unless he/she desires to work independently of Iskcon, in which case I will leave him/her and take shelter of the GBC) I am confused and a bit curious. Do disciples of Iskcon gurus sing Sri Guru-vandana prayers to their initiating spiritual masters, or to Prabhupada or the GBC?

Srila Narottama dasa Thakur sings and prays of his guru; ...janme janme prabhu sei He is my Lord birth after birth My question is how does this sentiment match up with the instruction in the Iskcon law book that if a guru chooses to leave Iskcon he has to leave all his disciples with him? Is it, "He is my Lord birth after birth* " *(unless he/she desires to work independently of Iskcon, in which case I will leave him/her and take shelter of the GBC) I am confused and a bit curious. Do disciples of Iskcon gurus sing Sri Guru-vandana prayers to their initiating spiritual masters, or to Prabhupada or the GBC?

February 20, 2003, 9:10 a.m. Kucinich’s Choice Does the presidential contender mean what he says on abortion? By David Enrich http://www.nationalreview.com/comment/comment-enrich022003.asp If Dennis Kucinich has his way, he will use his long-shot presidential campaign to rail against war with Iraq and free-trade agreements like NAFTA. Conventional wisdom holds that if the Ohio congressman is to have any impact in the Democratic primary, it will be by pushing his more mainstream rivals to the left on war and trade issues. But a less conspicuous issue — Kucinich's shifting stances on abortion — could come out of the woodwork to haunt the candidate, and perhaps his party. During his first three terms in Congress, Kucinich compiled a consistently pro-life voting record, earning a 95-percent rating from the National Right to Life Committee in 2000. "He absolutely believes in the sanctity of life and that life begins at conception," Kucinich's spokeswoman explained last year. But the feisty 56-year-old Catholic, whose political career is littered with upset victories, has changed course. "I support a woman's right to freedom of choice," Kucinich says now. "I do not believe that Roe v. Wade should be overturned." He vowed last week to an Iowa audience that "as president, I would protect that right [to abortion], and I would also make sure that appointees to the Supreme Court protected that right." Kucinich is following in the footsteps of Al Gore, Dick Gephardt, and other Democrats who flip-flopped on abortion shortly before launching presidential bids. Pro-choice groups are divided over whether the metamorphosis is genuine or a political ploy. "He understands that this is a fundamental freedom. Do I think that's sincere? Yes I do," says Kate Michelman, president of NARAL Pro-Choice America. She says the transformations of Kucinich and past Democrats are "the opposite of being political. When they were being anti-choice, it was the political thing to do maybe. At that time, their position was expected of them to be anti-choice. I think they've thought a lot more about this issue and came to the decision after a great deal of thought and not as a reflex." Others are not so sure. Kucinich's pro-choice makeover "is testament to the fact that he realizes the power of this issue, certainly within the Democratic camp," says David Williams, political director of Planned Parenthood. "This is something that remains a very powerful issue and will in time emerge in the selection process of a Democratic candidate." Williams says he isn't persuaded by Kucinich's recent pro-choice rhetoric. Another possible sign that Kucinich's morphing position could push abortion into Democratic debates: Democrats for Life, a national group, is urging members to contact Kucinich to tell him "to stick by his principles and continue his strong pro-life advocacy." Democrats could face growing pressure to confront the abortion question if Kucinich ever is seen as a relevant candidate. "The Kucinich position on abortion could have a real impact, but that assumes he becomes a factor," says Larry J. Sabato, the head of University of Virginia's Center for Politics. "The other candidates are going to let him get away with anything unless he becomes a factor, in which case they will unload on him, and so will the press." And Kucinich's candidacy probably will fizzle out if the economy recovers and a war with Iraq doesn't drag on. But assuming that the war and economy are issues that resonate with Democrats this fall, protest candidates like Kucinich will not need outright victories to be successful. In Iowa, which holds its crucial first-in-the-nation caucuses in less than a year, Kucinich could exploit his strong labor ties to siphon votes away from Gephardt, widely considered the frontrunner in Iowa because of his 1988 victory and his union support. "If Kucinich gets two or three percent from Gephardt," Sabato says, "it could cost him the caucuses" — and the campaign. That scenario might not trouble Kucinich, because Gephardt infuriated many Democratic doves when he endorsed last year's congressional war resolution. So far, Kucinich's abortion transformation hasn't received much attention from the media or Democratic activists in Iowa or elsewhere. The Des Moines Register, for example, has not mentioned his stand on abortion. But if his campaign gains traction, Kucinich's voting record probably will become more important, forcing some Democrats to balance their opposition to war against their support for abortion rights. "I think that would be a real stumbling block for a Democrat," says Cary R. Covington, a political scientist at the University of Iowa. "The Democrats are trying to make domestic issues more prominent, so certainly if a candidate challenges one of the core constituencies of the party, that is something that would have to be resolved." Iowa caucus-goers "tend to be more liberal-leaning, which means that pro-life is not necessarily a position given much consideration," says a Democratic-party official in Iowa. "His pro-life position is certainly going to hurt him among [unions'] rank and file." At the same time, the official says, Kucinich's abortion stance "may help him in other areas [such as Dubuque] where Catholic Democrats vote pro-life." Ultimately, the biggest impact of Kucinich's handling of the abortion issue could be self-destructive, undercutting his from-the-heart appeal. "When he is forced to talk about [abortion], he's going to mouth the word 'choice,'" Sabato says. "He's going to try to fuzz it up and let the war [issue] satisfy the left wing. This fellow isn't exactly the straight-talker he says he is. "

He is on the wrong side now. Kucinich used to be pro-life. That is until he decided to run for the top office as a Democrat, so now he has changed to pro-choice. You can't be a Democrat and successfully run for office. being a Democrat means you have to go KA at NARAL. Anyone who can change convictions on such an issue isn't worth 5 pieces of used toilet paper. He is also a vegan but once he got in their is nothing practical he could do to stop animal slaughter. The difference Mahak on the abortion issue to animal slaughter is its just a matter of getting the right people in the Supreme Court. Right now I believe it is 5 to 4 abortion rights. We just need 1 judge. That is why the Democrats blocked the recent nomination of Miguel Estrada by filibuster. They are afraid of his views on life and were also afraid he would rise from a federal judgeship into the Supreme Court some day. Even though the Republicans hold a one vote majority it takes 60 of 100 votes to override a filibuster just to get to have a vote on the floor where a simple majority of 51 would have accepted him. This was ALL about abortion. It is so close, but as long as Demoncrats keep getting elected it won't change. During the dark Clinton years there were two bills that made it through Congess to stop partial birth abortion. Clinton vetoed them both. We still have partial birth abortions in the USA thanks to one disciple of Kamsa, Bill Clinton. Babhru this is not hell fire. Abortion is hell fire.

Paramatma is already controling, directing the wanderings of all conditioned souls. Do we really believe that or just quote it to others? Since He is directing everything already why don't we believe He would then also direct the sincere soul to His true devotee? We may not be able to always hear His voice, or feel His impressions upon our heart but still He is already directing us and has been since time immemorable. Another point is that He can make His will known dispite our lack of hearing ability. How did anyone recognize Prabhupada as a pure devotee? There were no GBC committees to direct them. Who told them? You seem to believe that only the GBC is in contact with the Supersoul. So you must listen to them because you can't hear Supersoul yourself. So again I ask the question why then is there a need for a vote? One person hearing from Supersoul should be enough. Or is it Supersoul that is telling one to vote yes and another to vote no? Why the disagreement? Here is the hard core truth. Unless you are sure that the Lord is directing you to accept someone as guru you have no business formally accepting a guru. Just continue hearing and chanting and praying and serving until you do hear His will for you from Him. By accepting the GBC's word as final in the matter you are really accepting GBC as guru. And then how is it that you can be sure their opinions are bone fide? Do you require another committee for that? ad infinitum. This process is cleverly disquised atheism. Theism as philosophy but without any direct faith in the Lord. Sorry to be so blunt. It is also a form of robbery against the new people trying to learn. They are being robbed of the hard but necessary learning process that one must go through in order to establish their own connection with the Lord in the heart. Instead their faith is lazily directed to some managerial board. No need to pray on their own, or study on their own under some more advanced devotees guidance, "just believe in the GBC brother." All in the name of get them offically initiated. Where have I heard something similar? O' yeah, from some Christians, "Just believe brother and be saved." Robbery. Straight up street hustle. Think you're looking for Vrndaban and you get misdirected to New Jack City along the way. Directing someone to have their own connection with the Lord is the whole point of this movement. It may seem harder and longer but that is just tough. It's the only reality. Hare Krsna

Paramatma is already controling, directing the wanderings of all conditioned souls. Do we really believe that or just quote it to others? Since He is directing everything already why don't we believe He would then also direct the sincere soul to His true devotee? We may not be able to always hear His voice, or feel His impressions upon our heart but still He is already directing us and has been since time immemorable. Another point is that He can make His will known dispite our lack of hearing ability. How did anyone recognize Prabhupada as a pure devotee? There were no GBC committees to direct them. Who told them? You seem to believe that only the GBC is in contact with the Supersoul. So you must listen to them because you can't hear Supersoul yourself. So again I ask the question why then is there a need for a vote? One person hearing from Supersoul should be enough. Or is it Supersoul that is telling one to vote yes and another to vote no? Why the disagreement? Here is the hard core truth. Unless you are sure that the Lord is directing you to accept someone as guru you have no business formally accepting a guru. Just continue hearing and chanting and praying and serving until you do hear His will for you from Him. By accepting the GBC's word as final in the matter you are really accepting GBC as guru. And then how is it that you can be sure their opinions are bone fide? Do you require another committee for that? ad infinitum. This process is cleverly disquised atheism. Theism as philosophy but without any direct faith in the Lord. Sorry to be so blunt. It is also a form of robbery against the new people trying to learn. They are being robbed of the hard but necessary learning process that one must go through in order to establish their own connection with the Lord in the heart. Instead their faith is lazily directed to some managerial board. No need to pray on their own, or study on their own under some more advanced devotees guidance, "just believe in the GBC brother." All in the name of get them offically initiated. Where have I heard something similar? O' yeah, from some Christians, "Just believe brother and be saved." Robbery. Straight up street hustle. Think you're looking for Vrndaban and you get misdirected to New Jack City along the way. Directing someone to have their own connection with the Lord is the whole point of this movement. It may seem harder and longer but that is just tough. It's the only reality. Hare Krsna

it is simple but finding the sincerity to put it into practice is rare in this world. I am in such ignorance that I can't tell a real self realized lover of Krsna devotee from one who has only taken on the external mannerisms of one, including extensive(but external) knowledge of the scriptures. I am deaf dumb and blind so what can I do? Turning to Krsna in my heart is my only viable option. Krsna knows who His real devotee is. We must acknowledge our helpless position before the Lord and beg His guidance. He will hook us up and point out His beloved devotee in a way that we will understand. If we are sincere He will strengthen our faith in His sincere devotee. This simple direct truth seems to be missing in the current Iskcon scheme. The GBC appears to be trying to take His role upon themselves. You see, it is Krsna's pleasure to play that role of matchmaker. For so many births and deaths Supersoul has been linking us up with the results of our past karma. The act of connecting disciple and guru is a spiritual act, not a karmic one. A spiritual act takes Krsna's pleasure only into account. All such concocted schemes are really an attempt to try and continue usurping Krsna's pleasure and position. Building a maze that one must find their way through to get to Krsna. The guru maze. GBC: "here is guru" that guru falls down. GBC "well in that case, there is another guru over there"...Then that one leaves to start his own mission. GBC: "you can't go with him because you really belong to us" Now the totally confused and burnt out student throws up his hands and says "I quit". We have scene this scenario played out before or own eyes. To avoid such problems one only needs to tell new people to continue to read Prabhupada's books while chanting Hare Krsna in the association of devotees AND PRAY TO KRNSA WITHIN HIS HEART TO LINK HIM UP WITH KRSNA'S TRUE DEVOTEE. Or is it we don't really believe there is a personal God in everyone heart that will hear and answer? All such voting, appointment scemes are just faithless and usless.

it is simple but finding the sincerity to put it into practice is rare in this world. I am in such ignorance that I can't tell a real self realized lover of Krsna devotee from one who has only taken on the external mannerisms of one, including extensive(but external) knowledge of the scriptures. I am deaf dumb and blind so what can I do? Turning to Krsna in my heart is my only viable option. Krsna knows who His real devotee is. We must acknowledge our helpless position before the Lord and beg His guidance. He will hook us up and point out His beloved devotee in a way that we will understand. If we are sincere He will strengthen our faith in His sincere devotee. This simple direct truth seems to be missing in the current Iskcon scheme. The GBC appears to be trying to take His role upon themselves. You see, it is Krsna's pleasure to play that role of matchmaker. For so many births and deaths Supersoul has been linking us up with the results of our past karma. The act of connecting disciple and guru is a spiritual act, not a karmic one. A spiritual act takes Krsna's pleasure only into account. All such concocted schemes are really an attempt to try and continue usurping Krsna's pleasure and position. Building a maze that one must find their way through to get to Krsna. The guru maze. GBC: "here is guru" that guru falls down. GBC "well in that case, there is another guru over there"...Then that one leaves to start his own mission. GBC: "you can't go with him because you really belong to us" Now the totally confused and burnt out student throws up his hands and says "I quit". We have scene this scenario played out before or own eyes. To avoid such problems one only needs to tell new people to continue to read Prabhupada's books while chanting Hare Krsna in the association of devotees AND PRAY TO KRNSA WITHIN HIS HEART TO LINK HIM UP WITH KRSNA'S TRUE DEVOTEE. Or is it we don't really believe there is a personal God in everyone heart that will hear and answer? All such voting, appointment scemes are just faithless and usless.

Is it all really this simple? By the grace of Krsna one gets guru, by the grace of guru one gets Krsna.

Is it all really this simple? By the grace of Krsna one gets guru, by the grace of guru one gets Krsna.

Now I'm starting to really <marquee> feel the power</marquee> When I come back this evening I'll try something else. By then I_L_K and Govindarama should be approaching the mid-master level. Thanks guys /images/graemlins/smile.gif

Now I'm starting to really <marquee> feel the power</marquee> When I come back this evening I'll try something else. By then I_L_K and Govindarama should be approaching the mid-master level. Thanks guys /images/graemlins/smile.gif

Who appointed Prabhupada? Who voted for Prabhupada? Whose offical seal of approval did Prabhupada seek to prove he was guru? How was Prabhupada recognized by others as guru? Under whose order did Prabhupada ascend to the vyasasana and accept worship on Krsna's behalf? Isn't Supersoul the answer to all of the above? Isn't thinking we can improve on this system a faithless act?

Who appointed Prabhupada? Who voted for Prabhupada? Whose offical seal of approval did Prabhupada seek to prove he was guru? How was Prabhupada recognized by others as guru? Under whose order did Prabhupada ascend to the vyasasana and accept worship on Krsna's behalf? Isn't Supersoul the answer to all of the above? Isn't thinking we can improve on this system a faithless act?

<marquee> KRSNA please help, I am a slow learner </marquee>

<marquee> KRSNA please help, I am a slow learner </marquee>

it is confusing. Good for organizational unity but it appears to me to weaken the guru disciple relationship. I mean shouldn't someone who is initiating one into Krsna consciousness themselves be able to hear Krsna's instruction to do so from within their own heart? What happens if Krsna says do it and the GBC votes against you doing it? Also if one of these guru's decides to work on his own he is supposed to surrender his disciples to ISKCON at the door as he leaves. So whose disciples are they? The guru's or the GBC's? Of course the abandoned disciples are told to then take shelter of Prabhupada until they can get reinitiated. Which brings up the question that if I can still take shelter of Prabhupada as my guru then why do I even need another offical one from ISKCON? Why did I need the one that just left? Is this what they call soft ritvik? Is ISKCON already ritvik in essence, even as they verbaly decry it?