Guruvani

There are even some Christian propagandists who go so far as to say the the legend of Krishna the cowherd boy is a post-Jesus production of the Hindus to fabricate their own God after the legend of Jesus. Many Christians are so Christ-centric that they think that Christ came before Krishna and that Krishna is the Hindu version of Christ. Some Christians have an agenda to prove that Christ was the original concept of God and that Christianity is supreme above anything Hindu. It can get quite ridiculous how far some Christian theologians will go to try and establish Christianity as the only true religion in the world. It appears that some Christians are trying to make Jesus a God in the eyes of the Hindus with this theory that Christ is an incarnation of Balarama. It's just part of the Christian agenda of world domination. Now, they want the Hindus to think the Christ was the incarnation of their Balarama. This mixing and mingling of inter-religious conceptions is the product of scattered minds that are like unprotected women getting abused by every Joe that promises them eternal love.

He appeared to have been a nerdy type school boy who lived in his own little world unable to relate with his classmates. His feigned ecstatic mood just looked to me like a pathetic attempt to garner status as a very advanced devotee tasting prema. He just looked so pretentious and hungry for respect and position. It is noteworthy I guess that he has shown interest in the Utah temple. Is there any ISKCON GBC guru presiding in Utah? Or, is Caru somewhat of a closet ritvik? Who gives diksha in Utah? I don't know much about that temple other than it looks very nice.

Bhagavad-Gita of Sri Krishna:

I joined the movement in L.A. in early 1975. At that time Tulasi das was TP and Jayatirtha was GBC. Ramesvar was VP or something. I am not sure what his official position was but he was working mainly with the BBT in publishing books etc. Anyway, in the year I spend in L.A., Ramesvara never once introduced himself to me or showed any interest in me as a new devotee trying to make advancement in KC. Many devotees introduced themselves to me and extended themselves to me if I had any questions or if they could help me along in some way. I met many nice devotees and felt a nice fraternity and brotherhood with many of the devotees there. But, Ramesvar was always aloof, elitist and somewhat unapproachable. I personally never felt any fraternity or brotherhood with him. Frankly, I thought he was full of himself. I had just come out of the US Navy and I was well familiar with institutional living and relating with people in an institutional environment. Ramesvar just seemed like he had himself on a pedestal. So many other devotees where humble, kind and generous. So, personally, I never really liked Ramesvar but I thought he was a fixed-up devotee. He had this nerdy kind of arrogance and elitism about him. I never connected to him AT ALL in the year I spent in L.A. I did connect with Tulasi das, Jayatirtha and many, many devotees there. I think there were like 75 brahmacaries in the brahmacary ashram at that time and I connected to many of them. Ramesvar? Personally, I always had a weird vibe about him. He was one of the most aloof and elitist devotees I ever saw in ISKCON.

Last night I also dreamed of a large Cobra. We were searching for it because it was seen around the area. Then inside some building the Cobra came out and as we went in chase it turned and started coming at me with great speed hood raised. I thought I was finished, but then out of nowhere some person jumped in and grabbed the great Cobra and captured it. This Cobra also had a white underbottom and was much larger than any Cobra of Earth. I don't remember real vividly the whole dream just parts.

In the verse you quote it says: Are you now going to say that all Lions are Krishna incarnations? What Krishna is giving in that verse are examples of the most powerful of powerful beings. The Lion is King of the jungle as such the Lion represents Krishna. Amongst birds Garuda is the greatest. So, Krishna is saying that these great manifestations and creatures can be seen as representing him in power.

Obviously, you are not alligned with the Gaudiya sampradaya. Your conception is not siddhanta in the Gaudiya school. Prahlada represents Krishna by possessing a particular Godly quality. In the Gaudiya tradition it is said that Prahlada incarnated in Gaura-lila as Vasudeva Datta - not an incarnation of Krishna. Śrī Caitanya Caritāmṛta Madhya 15.165 "tomāra vicitra nahe, tumi — sākṣāt prahlāda tomāra upare kṛṣṇera sampūrṇa prasāda SYNONYMS tomāra — in you; vicitra nahe — this is not extraordinary; tumi — you; sākṣāt prahlāda — incarnation of Prahlāda Mahārāja; tomāra upare — upon you; kṛṣṇera — of Lord Kṛṣṇa; sampūrṇa — complete; prasāda — mercy. TRANSLATION Accepting Vāsudeva Datta as a great devotee, the Lord said, "Such a statement is not at all astonishing because you are the incarnation of Prahlāda Mahārāja. It appears that Lord Kṛṣṇa has bestowed complete mercy upon you. There is no doubt about it.

However, I do concede that internal correction and development of the readers of spiritual books is what the process is all about, yet I do not see that in this specific reference that Bhaktivinode is referring to internal correction and development but of developing a bad road into a good road that can be travelled to the ultimate goal.

I have to admit that there is something refreshing and sweet about the simplicity of the "Christ" oriented Krishna consciousness devotees. In comparison with some of the others we find on the forum, the Christ oriented devotees have a simplicity and a sweetness that just seems to fit so much nicer in the western world than some of these gopimaniacs and their exotic cults that are rooted in another culture, country and social climate. Simplicity is yet a very deep and thoughtful modality. Actually, I am quite partial to that way of spiritual thinking. Christ ki-jaya!

That is another myth and proof that you are infected with the siddha pranali misconceptions. Gaudiyas are now known as Rupanugas NOT Gopal Guru Goswaminugas. The actual line coming down from Srila Rupa Goswami is not a siddha pranali line. That siddha pranali business comes in a line from Gopal Guru Goswami who is a sakhi of Radharani named Tungavidya Devi. The Rupanugas follow Srila Rupa Goswami who is a manjari named Sri Rupa Manjari. Eventually, the siddha-pranali system became so corrupted and abused that great siddha mahatmas like Jagannatha das Babaji steared Gaudiya Vaishnavism away from the practice. The Saraswatas are deliberately distinguished from the bhogus siddha pranali school and that is their permanent position. You have been bitten by the fangs of the siddha pranali snake. Without anti-venom your spiritual death is imminent.

That is where we differ. I think ISKCON probably could learn some ettiquete and some rituals from some of the other Saraswata camps. One reason that ISKCON had to use Narayana Maharaja for Srila Prabhupada's samadhi ritual was because none of the ISKCON men knew how to perform such rituals. Other than maybe learning some ettiquete and ritual from senior Saraswata Vaishnavas, I don't think ISKCON needs to learn one iota of anything from the siddha pranali camp. ISKCON needs to keep a large distance between ISKCON and the siddha pranali. ISKCON is part of the Saraswata school and Srila Prabhupada states that in his books. I don't see any harm in ISKCON learning a few things about ettiquete and ritual or even siddhanta from some of the senior Saraswata Gaudiyas. The proposal that ISKCON or the Saraswatas could learn a few tricks from the siddha pranali school is just plain stupid as far as I am concerned. They only thing ISKCON could learn from them is how to be a sahajiya.

In Teachings of Lord Chaitanya, Srila Prabhupada explains it like this based upon shastric siddhanta: So, the avesa avatars are indirect incarnations representing a specific power or opulence of Krishna or Vishnu. Narada is one such indirect incarnation. Sometimes when shastra refers to "incarnation of Godhead" it simply means that a jiva soul has been empowered with certain powers, abilities or qualities that are superhuman and Godly. When a living being possesses a Godly power, then he is called an incarnation or shaktyavesha incarnation of Godhead. This means that Godhead is manifesting specific powers through a certain living being or devotee of Godhead. Any given human being could become an incarnation of Godhead if Godhead chose to manifest Godly power through that human being.

It's obvious that you have learnt a few tricks from Madhavananda das and the siddha pranali group. That is where you come up with your fault-finding attitude and all this whining and complaining about ISKCON not being "traditional" enough. My estimation is that these siddha pranali types have rubbed-off on you and have affected or infected your thinking. That is your business and your right if you so choose, but I think it is quite duplistic and deceptive for a so-called leading ISKCON member in Poland like yourself to be dabbling in the siddha pranali camp and absorbing some of their critical and offensive outlook on Srila Prabhupada and ISKCON and then proposing to be a leading devotee around ISKCON communities. It's obvious that I have spend some time around their forum and heard some of their propaganda, but I never allowed it to affect my faith in Srila Prabhupada or swing me over to the "traditional camp". I have enough faith in Srila Prabhupada that I could care less about their so-called tradition. Srila Prabhupada is the Gaudiya tradition in the western world and nobody can ever change that now.

Bhaktivinode: Bhaktivinode is talking about correction and development of lower thoughts into higher thoughts and making bad roads into good roads. I don't see that he is talking about development or improvement of the reader but in the reader developing and improving lesser thought into a path leading to higher thought.

I think you don't understand. it's quite obvious what Bhaktivinode is saying: If we get past that one paragraph in context to the paragraphs after that one in the book, it is quite obvious that Bhaktivinode is not speaking in the same line as you are thinking.

Just don't go poking around in places you shouldn't be and we will let you slide.

Probably, but he is not looking at this point. He is a computer wiz and he is a gaming master. He spent his childhood running around the hills of Badger. He's not Krishna crazy yet. Maybe when he gets older.

ok, but you have to put a gold dome on it.

sure, I take PayPal for computer repairs, e-books and about anything else. but, you can use my custon search engine for free. one of my websites: http://www.reviewerchoice.com/

No, he is 5' 11' and he is as strong as a bull. He's got some padding but he is not a rolly-polly. He is also a brahmacary and he doesn't worry about girls. He is a fine young man that I am very pleased with. His name is Nitai Prasad. He is a real nice guy.

don't compare yourself with Kirtanananda Swami unless you can build a palace of gold in the hills of West Virginia.

You better watch your mouth or I will have my 220 lb. son beat you up. Or, my I will have my soccer playing 13 year old daughter kick your butt.

yes, again you have shown me the light. please send me some cash so I can order one off of the infomercial. then, I will lead you to glory.