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The Origins of the Satan Myth and impact to global politics

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The forum I am reading this thread on is not about Krishna-related topics, but rather spiritual topics. There is another forum for Hindu topics and a third for Hare Krishna topics. This one is general.

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NEWS

 

ISRAEL’S armed forces have been ordered by Ariel Sharon, the prime minister, to be ready by the end of March for possible strikes on secret uranium enrichment sites in Iran, military sources have revealed.

 

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,2089-1920074,00.html [was an RSS link]

 

"Some trust in chariots, and some in horses; {N} but we will make mention of the name of the LORD our God." [Psalms 20.8]

 

I just heard on CNN that Iran has offered the U.S. stakes in their atomic energy program - so that is a good gesture.

 

But they must retract all the hate statements issued toward Israel in order to convince them that they do not intend to try to wipe them off the map.

 

 

 

 

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NEWS:

 

Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad said Wednesday the Holocaust is a "myth" that Europeans have used to create a Jewish state in the heart of the Islamic world.

 

http://news./s/cpress/20051214/ca_pr_on_wo/iran_holocaust

 

What a disgusting thing to say! He clings to his bent opinion - no matter how evil and false it is.

 

Where does he intend to take this?

 

He is up against a myriad of youth in his nation who’s sick of the theocracy and the hate. What profit is there for such a leader to continue to focus on illusions and bent exclusivities – the Iranian president must consider that genocide is a practice condemned by God – those who eschew its victims are in turn - eschewed by God.

 

What kind of lies does this guy ascribe to? Just see how this guy is a counter-point to George Bush. Why do these leaders have this power –0 who gives it to them – the same person?

 

So as we see Iran and Syria posturing and making these sorts of comments its just more evidence for why there must be comprehensive and complete resolution of the Palestine – Israel conflict and it must be enforced from outside.

 

The leaders in Israel must demand that Bush and Co. exit the Middle East entirely. There must be consistent steps to convincing her neighbors that she isn’t there as an aberration to goad them – that it is the will of God that makes it last – and that is the same ONE LORD that they too serve.

 

All these extremists in the world are soon to see that their theaters of terror are no longer gathering places – as noted before – this tug-of-war – with the innocent masses everywhere – must stop – otherwise the extremists shall get a rope-burn from their tug-of-war.

 

All those that target and hate shall be hated and targeted by others – is it not so? So where is the profit in such a position? If one is basing his position on illisons and falsehoods then what is the profit?

 

May God empower the GOOD people in Iran to respond to the bent posturing of their president – ISLAM is not a faith of hateful demons and this guy is a making others think it is.

 

The presidents of all these countries have to renounce this collective path to chaos that they are on – they cannot cancel out each other as there are others in the ranks to take the place of the fallen – right? So instead what is the responsibility of these leaders? To work to please God - for the common good and they know it!

 

BDM

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NEWS:

 

Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad said Wednesday the Holocaust is a "myth" that Europeans have used to create a Jewish state in the heart of the Islamic world.

 

http://news./s/cpress/20051214/ca_pr_on_wo/iran_holocaust

 

What a disgusting thing to say! He clings to his bent opinion - no matter how evil and false it is.

 

Where does he intend to take this?

 

He is up against a myriad of youth in his nation who’s sick of the theocracy and the hate. What profit is there for such a leader to continue to focus on illusions and bent exclusivities – the Iranian president must consider that genocide is a practice condemned by God – those who eschew its victims are in turn - eschewed by God.

 

What kind of lies does this guy ascribe to? Just see how this guy is a counter-point to George Bush. Why do these leaders have this power – who gives it to them – the same person?

 

So as we see Iran and Syria posturing and making these sorts of comments its just more evidence for why there must be comprehensive and complete resolution of the Palestine – Israel conflict and it must be enforced from outside.

 

The leaders in Israel must demand that Bush and Co. exit the Middle East entirely. There must be consistent steps to convincing her neighbors that she isn’t there as an aberration to goad them – that it is the will of God that makes it last – and that is the same ONE LORD that they too serve.

 

All these extremists in the world are soon to see that their theaters of terror are no longer gathering places – as noted before – this tug-of-war – with the innocent masses everywhere – must stop – otherwise the extremists shall get a rope-burn from their tug-of-war.

 

All those that target and hate shall be hated and targeted by others – is it not so? So where is the profit in such a position? If one is basing his position on illisons and falsehoods then what is the profit?

 

May God empower the GOOD people in Iran to respond to the bent posturing of their president – ISLAM is not a faith of hateful demons and this guy is a making others think it is.

 

The presidents of all these countries have to renounce this collective path to chaos that they are on – they cannot cancel out each other as there are others in the ranks to take the place of the fallen – right? So instead what is the responsibility of these leaders? To work to please God - for the common good and they know it!

 

BDM

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don't hold yer breath there don boy and even if you get payed off who cares its a simple matter of math as it is a materialistic endeavor fraught with false hopes and expectations of being well off in material life considering the four primary faults inherent in the living human being, greed etc. like attemting to pay for reconstructive surgery of ones prepuce as suggested by one writer...good luck.

 

implant accusations of which party well you mentioned the conservatives and the ndp that leaves the green party and the bloc Quebecois

 

oh boy by the by don you missing the point in ISOPANISADS about who what are trees neither within Isopanisads nor in the purports therein ....

 

mantra 7 purport 2nd paragraph Srila Prabhupada writes "Since the living entities are all members of the same supreme family,their interest and that of the Supreme Being are not different. Every living being is the son of the supreme Being.As stated in the Bhagavad gita (7.5),all living creatures throughout the universe-including birds,reptiles,ants,aquatics,TREES, and so on- are emanations of the marginal potency of the Supreme Lord.

 

mantra 3

in the pursuences of material wealth and life -

therefore the Bhagavad gita rebukes such men by calling them atma-sambhavita meaning they are considered great only on the strength of deception and are empowered by the votes of the ignorant and by their own material wealth.Such asuras,devoid of self realization and knowledge of ISAVASYA, the Lords universal proprietorship, are certain to enter into the darkest regions.

 

The conclusion is that as human beings we are not meant for solving economic problems on a tottering platform but for solving all the problems of the material life into which we have been placed by the laws of nature.

 

in mantra 6 the Isopanisads recommend one should "observe"

"This means that one must follow the previous acaryas, the perfected teachers. Anupasyati is the exact Sanakrit word used in this connection. Anu means "to follow," and pasyati means to observe. Thus the word anupasyati means that one should not see things as he does with the naked eye but should follow the previous acaryas.Due to material defects, the naked eye cannot see anything properly. One cannot see properly unless one has heard from a superior source, and the highest source is the Vedic wisdom, which is spoken by the Lord Himself.

 

in mantra 6 Isopanisad quotes BG.18.54 -only one who is already on the liberated platform can become an uttama adhikari devotee and see every living being as his own brother. This vision cannot be had by politicians, who are always after some material gain.

 

and gee why would you not have the device removed by a doctor on camera ?

 

what ya waiting for ?

 

why the hell would you bother trying to get so much blood money from the commen materialistic lawyers market

 

you really believe Krsna will give that to you ? for what ?He says He loves you so much He takes everything away to help advance us toward the goal of the Godhead.

 

Queen Kuntis prayers are the power for materialistic persona to follow in order to free themselves of the illusion of wealth and uxurious life styles while claiming to be Vaisnavas.

 

Srila Bhaktivinode , Srila Bhaktisiddhanta , Srila Prabhupada these are the acaryas talked about in the Vedas, the six Goswamis this is the whole idea , renunciation . accepting things which are distateful happiness distress hot cold etc whats the difference ?

 

will you be Krsna conscious when your socalled money boat comes in ? really ?

 

FOLLOW THEM !

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Well you’re back - ‘oh nameless one’ - have you posted anything of use here?

 

Quote:

 

don't hold yer breath there don boy and even if you get payed off who cares its a simple matter of math as it is a materialistic endeavor fraught with false hopes and expectations of being well off in material life considering the four primary faults inherent in the living human being, greed etc. like attemting to pay for reconstructive surgery of ones prepuce as suggested by one writer...good luck.

 

Reply:

 

‘As suggested by one writer’ – that 'writer' was you.

 

I won’t need reconstructive surgery - unless they can ‘detonate’ their implanted hardware - from an outside actuation.

 

As for collecting or not collecting – this is about a deterrent - they pay with money that isn’t there’s or – with reputation and position that is.

 

What are you blathering about in this “prepuce” point – why don’t you speak with ‘terms’ that are common?

 

As for false hopes – don’t preach to me about that – I am well aware of these points – or is your pointing this out ‘alternately motivated’ or - envy based?

 

What wonderful service I’ll be able to do for Prabhupada when I collect!

 

Quote:

 

implant accusations of which party well you mentioned the conservatives and the ndp that leaves the green party and the bloc Quebecois

 

Reply:

 

Those political parties are not relevant – [in part] because they shall not form a federal government – it’s between the Liberals and the conservatives.

 

Quote:

 

oh boy by the by don you missing the point in ISOPANISADS about who what are trees neither within Isopanisads nor in the purports therein ....

 

Reply:

 

This ‘trees’ point is moot – so low and behold – there is a reference in the Ishopanisad purports about “trees” – but it makes little difference - as my point was about mantra one – resources misappropriations…

 

Quote:

 

The conclusion is that as human beings we are not meant for solving economic problems on a tottering platform but for solving all the problems of the material life into which we have been placed by the laws of nature.

 

in mantra 6 Isopanisad quotes BG.18.54 -only one who is already on the liberated platform can become an uttama adhikari devotee and see every living being as his own brother. This vision cannot be had by politicians, who are always after some material gain.

 

Reply:

 

Well we can all give up this nonsense life and go to the forest – right? We can all emulate this platform as far as possible – not imitate – as for it not being possible for politicos – well – you're generalizing.

 

Of course our human life is meant for solving ‘the real problems’ of life – but - these other issues are to be ‘managed’.

 

Did Srila Prabhupada ever make managerial decisions and adjustments - with the ‘mundane’ issues of life? Your point is very limited….

 

As for your uttama point – again – it’s out of context – just try to think more broadly – there is only ‘one way’ to understand this and - you’re not even trying.

 

Quote:

 

and gee why would you not have the device removed by a doctor on camera ? what ya waiting for ?

 

Reply:

 

Oh gee why didn’t I think of that – what a fool am I – be realistic – no doctor shall remove it without knowing something about it first such as – [who and] how it was put there and - it’s composition of the implant and any subsequent risks in the removal - should it break-open in the sinus.

 

No instead - I am cursed to have it remain in place until the authorities do the right thing.

 

Quote:

 

why the hell would you bother trying to get so much blood money from the commen materialistic lawyers market

 

you really believe Krsna will give that to you ? for what ?He says He loves you so much He takes everything away to help advance us toward the goal of the Godhead.

 

Reply:

 

A true yogi observes Me in all beings, and also sees every being in Me. Indeed, the self-realized man sees Me everywhere. [bG 6.29]

 

All of them—as they surrender unto Me—I reward accordingly. Everyone follows My path in all respects, O son of Prtha. [bG 4.11]

 

A devotee who is not dependant on the ordinary course of activities, who is pure, expert, without cares, free from all pains, and who does not strive for some result, is very dear to Me. [bG 12.16]

 

…In a chaotic condition, in a confused state of life, one should approach another, who is in full knowledge of the matter. You go to a lawyer to solve legal problems, and you go to a physician to solve medical problems. Everyone in the material world is confused about spiritual identity. It is therefore our duty to approach a bona fide spiritual master, who can give us real knowledge... [sSR.7]

 

Is it clear? Yes. So that suffering is there. It does not require any education, simply thinking that, a slight thinking, that “I do not want all these sufferings, but I am suffering. Why? Is there any solution? Is there...?” But there is solution. All these scriptures, all these Vedic knowledge, everything... And not only Vedic knowledge... Now... Oh, why you are going to school? Why you are going to college? Why you are taking scientific education? Why you are taking law education? Everything is meant for ending our sufferings. If there was no suffering, then nobody would have taken education. You see? But he thinks that “If I educated, if I become a doctor or if I become a lawyer or if I become an engineer, I will be happy.” Happy. That is the ultimate aim. “I will get a good job, government job. I’ll be happy.” So happiness is the end of every, I mean to say, pursuance. So... But these mitigation of sufferings, they are temporary. Real suffering, real suffering is due to our, this material existence, these three kinds of suffering. So when one is conscious about his suffering and he wants to make a solution of this suffering, then there is necessary of a spiritual master. Now, if you want to make a solution of your sufferings, and you want to consult a person, now what sort of person you must meet who can end your all sufferings? That selection must be there. If you want to purchase a jewel, diamond, and very valuable thing, and if you go to a grocer’s shop... Such kind of ignorance—you must be cheated. You must be cheated. At least you must approach to a jewelry shop. Jewelry shop, you see? So much knowledge you must have. So is that question solved? [bG lecture March 2, 1966]

 

Quote:

 

Queen Kuntis prayers are the power for materialistic persona to follow in order to free themselves of the illusion of wealth and uxurious life styles while claiming to be Vaisnavas.

 

Reply:

 

She prayed to be always in calamity so as to not forget Krishna.

 

Quote:

 

Srila Bhaktivinode , Srila Bhaktisiddhanta , Srila Prabhupada these are the acaryas talked about in the Vedas, the six Goswamis this is the whole idea , renunciation . accepting things which are distateful happiness distress hot cold etc whats the difference ?

 

Reply:

 

So what is the point? We are to accept the dictatorial autocratic push for a police state [one inimical to the innocent] – like we accept other dualistic juxtapositions like - the cold? I think you better memorize those books - because if you accept thus - they’re going to be confiscated not long after…

 

If there are devotees in communist China who have the books and they see the points about the communism in the books are they to ignore them? If the communist state suppresses the devotees are they to say oh well it’s a cold day – better to tolerate it - than to resist? Your point is out of context.

 

The point is we are faced with many issues and it’s up to us to know what to do with each based upon a Krishna conscious approach. You aren’t doing that.

 

Quote:

 

will you be Krsna conscious when your socalled money boat comes in ? really ?

 

Reply:

 

Why not?

 

Quote:

 

FOLLOW THEM

 

Reply:

 

Please see above…

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hare krishna.

 

i simpathize with your situation and believe it was probably true not because of sentimentality but because of the state of affairs the world is in now because of the leaders and the elite pushing there games on society.

 

we are living in a society with technological advancement which has enabled the animal propensity in us to exploit one another come to new hights, what a shame.

 

this is what society has come to playing stupid pathetic childish games with one another because of no other better engagement, the elite are no better than dogs dressed up posing as the intelligent class, what a shame.

 

what a shame, what a shame, what a shame, we have been reduced to barking like the dog thinking it to be something great, i am powerful like the dog.

 

it is said that respect will be given to someone only with wealth in the age of kali, what a shame.

 

it seems nowaday's the slightest provocation is an excuse to harras one another as what is left to do once your rich and powerful and have all material acquisitions, what else is there to satisfy the senses than to engage the animal propensity in doggish games to get a kick out of life, what a shame, what we have become reduced to, do not feel sorry for yourself as a victim(not saying you are) but feel sorry for the illusioned elite for acting like the dog, how ashamed they should be, but because of pride they never would admit they are like the dog.

 

why do we play games with one another, it is the business of the animals, what a waste of time, it just shows the lack of humanity and intelligence that they possess, thinking themselves to be something great but in reality they are the lowest of the mankind wasting there valuable time as a human in pursuit of animalistic propensity's, what a shame.

 

i believe your cause to be just and probably true as i have also experienced the powers that be in this society of pathetic excuse for humans, what a shame they are leading the rest of human society into the hellish regions of life while making this region also hellish at the same time, what a shame, i have also experienced the elite's games or the government(still can't work out which one or maybe both) through unfortunate circumstances before i was a devotee and new any better and it seems i am still recieving some of my due karma as this has being going on for years now and wonder if it will ever finish, like i said before no better than dogs, no good qualities not even human.

 

J.S das

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Hare Krishna!

 

Thank you for your nice understanding!

 

Indeed you make so many valuable points in your post - I pray to Lord Narasinghadeva [blessed be His Holy Name] that your situation with the kali yuga is at last resolved in some fashion to bring balance and fair closure.

 

Quote:

 

…feel sorry for the illusioned elite…

 

Reply:

 

Patina Pavana - All Glories to Sri Krishna Chaitanya Mahaprabhu!

 

Here is a good point:

 

....But at the present moment, the democracy is also not perfect. Because the mass of people, they have no perfect knowledge. By sentiment. So it may be they’re electing a wrong person. That is the defect of democracy...if you try to educate the mass of people to become educated to elect the right person, that is very difficult. But if a king, a person, is educated nicely, that is easier. That is my point of view... [Conversation, July 23, 1973]

 

So ‘there’ is the point:

 

If you try to educate the mass of people to elect the right person - that is very difficult - but if a king - an elected person - is educated nicely - that is easier...

 

That might be ‘why’ the [yet-to-be-expected] messiah is described in Isaiah as a ‘servant of rulers’ – and in Zechariah it is written that ten rulers shall rule the world in the ‘latter times’ and they shall take hold of the coat of him who is this ‘servant of rulers’ – as they ‘hear’ that ‘God is with him’ – so indeed – as you point out - the Mercy IS for everyone.

 

Just like we are given the analogy of the watering process for a plant. If we water the root - the whole plant is served – if we water the leaves - it’ll slowly wither and die.

 

In the case of our leaders – they are the representatives of the Supreme Lord – even where they are inimical.

 

Thus the leaders are the - Root of Society - thus our preaching or - our watering process - must also consider ‘that’ - as far as possible.

 

Naturally - that is why this WWW is so very nice in that regard – thus ‘this’ [and other] discussion thread.

 

The key is that we have to be detached [they hear or they don’t hear – it’s not our problem] and we must remain objective [not to go on conversion crusades in the process] in relating the ‘cause’ of educating ‘leaders’ in as inclusive manner as possible.

 

This morning on Vision I watched Catholic Mass – I’ll share the nectar later…

 

So I again thank you for your nice posting – I certainly do use this implant abuse as a preaching tool and I hope it is pleasing to Srila Prabhupada.

 

Yer servant,

 

BDM

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NEWS:

 

"He wanted to say that if certain people have created troubles for the Jewish community they should bear the expenses, and it is not others who should pay for that," he said, speaking through a translator.

 

http://news./s/cpress/20051216/..._wo/iran_israel

 

Whatever - that is hardly what he meant - the original words were clear enough - even in translation!

 

So this kind of back-peddling is less compunction and more of an attempt to stave of any sanctions.

 

Instead of having someone else speak for him on this issue – he should issue [i won't hold my breath] a written statement – explaining why his ‘perceived’ comments are an offense to God – there is a great deal of material in the Koran to this end – otherwise - who can accept that he understands anything.

 

There are ill-mutating age of quarrel atheistic humans in the world which shall incinerate ALL believers – they won’t care what faith you are following!

 

Karmic permutation is unfolding a future genocide - of ALL believers – does the president of Iran understand that he is helping ‘that’ future environment to manifest with his posturing of ignorant hate and exclusivity?

 

Does he believe in God? Does he really? Does he think that if he were of a people who are thus in all the world - hunted - for centuries upon centuries - would not desire a place to be free of the hate and extermination pogroms forced upon them? Would he not wish to go to the place where their ancestors were? Of course he would!

 

Yes there have been many problems in the creation of this state of affairs – but that isn’t a reason not to accept things and make real peace – why not?

 

This whole Ashkenazi issue is also an offense to God.

 

Would this president say that so-called Europeans - who are Muslims - are somehow not worthy of the same respect as those - who are residing in the Middle East? No he would not. He is not showing any understanding…

 

So it is time for some REAL understanding in the peoples – ignorance leads to a hate-boomerang!

 

All people of faith must stop this fighting and see each other on a more respectful platform.

 

I hope that the President of Iran has a real change of heart – along with all the rest of the point and counter-point leaders.

 

Can we expect to form an inter-faith allegiance - to save the innocents of the world faiths - from an emerging atheistic global menace – godless communism?

 

A political scientist from China wrote a few years ago:

 

WWIII will be fought everywhere – by everyone – using everyday common household objects’ – sounds like kali yuga – the age of quarrel – fully unleashed – and how far away are we? It’s everyone’s problem – everyone’s fault and - everyone’s responsibility to prevent it…

 

BDM

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yes i agree that times are becoming more and more tense through repercussions of huge karmic proportions as we have credited up quite a debt in the bad karma department, what is it all leading to and yes we all have a small part in that global karma.

 

Many scientist's, prophets, religions, governments and average people around the world believe something is going to happen soon, BIG.

 

It could be sudden climate change, oil shortage, disease (h51n), global recession or monetary collapse, world war 3 and other contributing factors or a combination of any of the above that are predicted to happen shortly, so many options for something to go wrong and so little time.

 

Lucky we have the holy name to chant for some relief of the mental anguish someone could or will recieve if the above happens, we have already seen signs of the above

ie.

 

america's war with iraq over oil, signs of desperation that will escorlate with the reduction of global oil as countries scramble and fight over remaining oil depositories, everything we need to survive in current society is based on the necessity of oil.

 

hurricanes in america are picking up the pace and are expected to get worse in the coming years scientists predict.

 

countries are armed with extremely dangerous nuclear weapons today and if they are used @#$!!$##%#!%&^$$@

tensions are building worldwide with terrorist propaganda which generally would mean a coming war????????

 

The bird flu disease is very nearly our next major threat if it turns nasty and mutates with a human flu strain combines and spreads.

 

so the list goes on, something's gonna happen and probably karmicly over due.

 

what a shame

 

J.S das

 

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you said resource misappropriations .....gee trees are now a resouce are they? rather than what it says in vedas ?

you said no where in the ISOPANISADS your simply an idiot you waste valuable time speculating and whinning about your sinus BUG and blathering about suing you won't do squat for Srila Prabhupadawith with your new found wealth (when and if it ever happens)you know why ? cause he dosen't need your blood money.you blather as well world events that have nothing to do with KC.

so regarding you and your sad situation again we ask what ya waiting for who gives a sh-t who put it there or why you must be very special heh ?

"no doctor shall remove it until " what ya right as if it makes any difference if its metal and plastic if at all you say its there... so pull it out !

or you simply bask in the special feeling of such great importance to the "government"ha ha ha ha ha

we are so sorry for your great tribulation donny boy keep up the humour .LOL

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i am curious what the hell does LOL mean, i have seen it before but can't figure it out.

 

and guest make sense of your post ......can udnesrtand hrdaly it....

 

bounce back bhakta don with a left hook..haahahahahh!!!!!!

just kidding....we must learn to laugh at ourselves.....

 

J.S das

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Wow - listen to you - wa wa wa! Give them a bottle!

 

First of all - if you could read you would understand that the issue of composition and removal is centered around the power source - duh - would you like to have a potential radioactive material break open in your sinus?

 

AS for the comment about trees - if you have a point - just say it - I am a 'preacher' [said with tongue in cheek] - not a telepath.

 

Are all trees the same - how about this:

 

"...We find herein the mention of pious trees which produce seasonal flowers and fruits. The impious trees...can only be used to supply fuels. In the modern civilization such impious trees are planted on the sides of roads..." [sB 1.11.12, purport]

 

...There was an estimation that the New York Times required, to publish one day’s publication, to kill so many trees. Because the paper is now in scarcity. Why? Because they’re killing the trees and making this gramya-katha newspaper, bunch of Useless... [sB 3.25.12, Lecture]

 

So what exavtly is your point about the trees - what?

 

Quote:

 

we are so sorry for your great tribulation donny boy keep up the humour

 

Reply:

 

Again - who is this "we" of which you speak....

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