ancient_paztriot

Syamasundara dasa: Will only certain individuals attain that higher consciousness, or will the whole world attain it? Srila Prabhupada: That is a nonsensical question. sometimes rascals inquire, “Swamaji, if everyone becomes God conscious and goes back to Godhead, then who will remain here?” What is the meaning of such a nonsensical question? Why is a fool anxious for everyone? Why is he not anxious for himself? It is the same to ask, “If everyone is honest, then who will go to jail?” As if maintaining the jail is a very important business!

I luv this one… ....................... Syamasundara dasa: The mind also occupies space and works in time. Srila Prabhupada: Yes, we are occupying space, and since the mind is within us, the mind also occupies space. From practical experience we can understand that the mind can immediately travel thousands of miles with no difficulties. Syamasundara dasa: But is that distance within me, or does my mind actually travel there? Srila Prabhupada: It travels. It actually occupies space. Unless it occupies space, how could it travel? It travels so fast that you can't exactly remember how it is going, but as soon as it reaches its destination, you can apprehend it. In any case, it occupies space. Syamasundara dasa: The mind can leave the body and go somewhere? Srila Prabhupada: Not leave. It is just like a shoot: it extends. At night, when we are dreaming, the subtle body also extends and comes back again. In fact, we may take the subtle bodies in dreams to be very important at the time.

Syamasundara dasa: Bergson is interested in knowing the course of future evolution. He feels that becasue man has progressed from the instinctive stage to the intelligent and then to the intuitive stages, he will eventually attain the immortal stage. Srila Prabhupada: That is very nice, the idea that man will attain perfection. Progress means that you go forward, that you do not remain stagnent. The Vedas say: tad visnoh paramam padam sada pasyanti surayah divvva caksur atataa visnor yat paramam padam “The lotus feet of Lord Visnu are the supreme objective of all the demigods. These lotus feet of the Lord are as enlightening as the sun in the sky.” (Åg Veda 1.22.20) Those who are learned and advanced in knowledge are called surayah. Modern scientists are looking forward to going to other planets, but hose who are learned are looking forward to going to the lotus feet of Visnu. They are thinking, “When will I reach You?” the goal is there, and those who know it do not miss it. One who is Krsna conscious knows the goal and attempts to reach it. Those who do not know the goal waste their time philosophizing and misleading others. This is the blind leading the blind.

Syamasundara dasa: Does maya mean nothingness? Srila Prabhupada: You cannot say that. It is nothing appearing like something, but we do not say that it is nothing. Mayavadis say that it is nothing, but we say that it is temporary. How can you say that a cloud is nothing? A cloud appears, remains for a while, and then goes. The body is there temporarily for a few years, or a few hours. It is like a cloud. We cannot say that it is nothing, but that it is temporary.

Hayagriva dasa: Bergson sees the universe itself as expanding and evolving. He writes: “For the universe is not made but is being made continually. It is growing , perhaps indefinitely, by the addition of new worlds.” Srila Prabhupada: Yes, the universes emanate from the breathing of Maha-Visnu. If we accept the fact that the universe is increasing, then universes may come out like particles and then begin to develop. We see that for everything material, there is a small beginning. when the living entity enters the womb, he is very small indeed. A banyan tree begins to grow from a small seed. This is the way of nature. It is a fact that the universe is increasing, but not perpetually. It increases to a certain extent, stops, dwindles, and vanishes. Hayagriva dasa: Modern astronomers theorize that the universe is expanding and that the systems are exploding outward into space and moving proportionately further and further from one another, just like raisins expanding in dough when it is heated in the oven. Srila Prabhupada: That expansion goes on to a certain extent. Then it stops. Hayagriva dasa: But Bergson sees the universe as evolving toward some grand harmony. Srila Prabhupada: What does he mean by grand harmony? Everything is increasing, and everything will eventually dwindle and be annihilated. That is the course of material nature, and the harmony is in this process. Hayagriva dasa: In attempting to relate God to the universe, Bergson speaks of “a center from which worlds shoot out like rockets in a fireworks display.” Srila Prabhupada: The creation is like a world rotating. There are spokes, and there is a rim. There is also a center around which everything revolves. Aham sarvasya prabhavo mattah sarvam pravartate. “I am the source of all spiritual and material worlds. Everything emanates from Me.” (Bg. 10.8) That center is God, and all the parts are revolving around Him. In any case, the center remains where it is, and is always the same. Syamasundara dasa: Bergson spoke of the world as “a machine for the making of gods.” In a sense, this world is a training ground wherein we can make ourselves immortal. Srila Prabhupada: You are immortal already. You have just forgotten. mamaivamso jiva-loke jiva-bhutah sanatanah manah-sasthanindriyani prakrti-sthani karsati “The living entities in this conditioned world are My eternal, fragmental parts. Due to conditioned life, they are struggling very hard with the six senses, which include the mind.” (Bg. 15.7) There is bewilderment, but no change. We are fixed as spirit soul. It is as if we are dreaming: “Oh, I have fallen into the Pacific Ocean. I am drowning. Save me!” We may dream so many troublesome things, but actually there is no Pacific Ocean, and we are not drowning. It is simply a dream. the temporary covering of the body is just like a dream, and as soon as you come to Krsna consciousness, you wake up. When you are awake, the dream has no value. However, when the dream is happening, you are thinking that it is real, but since it has no value, it is called maya. Maya means “that which has no real existence but appears to.”

Hayagriva dasa: Bergson sees the material worlds as being basically isolated from one another. He writes: “It is not artificially, for reasons of mere convenience, that we isolate our solar system: Nature itself invites us to isolate it.” Srila Prabhupada: We feel isolated because we are individuals. In a prison, every criminal is different from every other criminal, and everyone has to suffer the consequences of his criminal activities. Thus every individual is suffering or enjoying according to his past deeds. If there is combination, you forget individuality. But that is not possible. Hayagriva dasa: We feel isolated as individuals, but in addition we feel isolated communally on htis planet. Man has never been able to communicate with beings on other planets. Srila Prabhupada: What is the point in communicating with other planets? They are also like this planet. People their have their individuality also. Hayagriva dasa: Well, man has always had the desire to communicate with something outside of this world, something higher. Basically, this must be a desire to reach God. Srila Prabhupada: Since God is there, why not communicate with Him? There is no point in communicating with other planets. Other living entities cannot help us. If we communicate with God, Krsna, we automatically understand everything else. If you hear people talking on other planets, what benefit will you derive? It is better to listen to Krsna speaking Bhagavad - gita. Hayagriva dasa: Is this isolation between worlds characteristic only of the lower and middle planetary systems? Is there as much isolation between the higher systems? Srila Prabhupada: Isolation is always there. Even in this world, crows remain to themselves, and swans remain to themselves. This isolation is natural because everyone is functioning under the different modes of material nature. However, if people come to Krsna consciousness, there is no longer isolation because everyone is engaged in the Lord's service.

Hayagriva dasa: So there is harmony in the beginning, middle, and end? Srila Prabhupada: Everything is in harmony, be it material or spiritual. that is God's law. Hayagriva dasa: If everything is always in harmony, evolution has an incidental meaning. Srila Prabhupada: This is harmony: One is an aquatic, then an insect, then a plant, then a tree, and so on up to the body of a human being. change is there, but there is harmony. Once one has attained a human body, he can decide whether or not to stop this evolutionary process, or to remain in it. If one accepts the instructions of Krsna, he can put an end to this bothersome evolution. If not, he remains. This is the version of Bhagavad - gita: asraddadhanah purusa dharmasyasya parantapa aprapya mam nivartante mrtyu-samsara-vartmani “Those who are not faithful in this devotional service cannot attain Me, O conqueror of enemies. Therefore they return to the path of birth and death in this material world.” (Bg. 9.3) By following Krsna's instructions, we can become completely detached from the cycle of birth and death.

It's a shame our culture has such disregard for death. There is alot of empowerment in that awareness. For one thing, one who is sober about it can begin dealing with it now… don't wait 'til the last minute!

We all get knowledge of impending death. But like the cornered hare, we simply close our eyes. Meanwhile… We all get to fake each other out… This is our thrill. "The physical suffering was nothing compared to the mental torture he was experiencing. He became humble, and I dropped everything a couple of times and flew from Vrindavan to be with him." I've seen people people dying of cancer too. They also showed humility. EVERYONE IS FORCED TO BOW DOWN at death. ......................... "I think he really wanted me there and was emotionally dependant on me, as I was the only one offering any tangible solutions." I think the Dad suddenly appreciated his son's knowledge and position along with the newfound humility. ......................... "Nobody questioned my authority, and my mother just backed off and let me do anything. She is a Roman Catholic and doesn't usually allow me to speak about Krishna." When it comes down to facing the real problems, nothing is better than KC. ......................... I controlled everything that went into his mouth. I even started sprinkling Vrindaban dust in his water as well. Love for sure. ......................... Then Supersoul would answer. "Why?" He would say. "He will only offend again." Everyone wants to cheat Krsna at death for sure: "I'll never do it again! If only… " ......................... Then I held him tight for the next three hours, and he slowly gave up his life, through his mouth, peacefully with me chanting right in his ear and dripping Ganga and Jamuna water into his mouth. I stayed fully focused on chanting very close to his ear until he breathed his last, at 6 am. Heart-wrenching. ......................... I don't usually put pen to paper, as I don't feel at all qualified to do so, but mother Radha Kunda Devi Dasi encouraged me and said that this experience should be shared with all the devotees. It is a grave story and should have a sobering effect on the reader… unless he's a fool! ......................... I was thinking myself to be the big hero, going to save my father, only to find that I'm just a big bag of hot air— zero. I am such a fallen rascal that I couldn't help him in his hour of need… Yes. We can't really help each other. We can only help Krsna help them. As far as personally intervening on your family's account, that is shown by Prahlada Maharaja. ......................... Now who can think of Krsna under those circumstances? Better not to see them. If you do, it's probably too late! I could be wrong. Perhaps there are more Ajamila stories.

Syamasundara dasa: Hegel believes that the dominant nation in any epoch represents a dominant phase of the Absolute at that time. For instance, if the United States is currently predominant, the Absolute is being expressed through the United States. Srila Prabhupada: Aeons ago, the Absolute Truth was connected to teh dominant nation. That is, to Maharaja Pariksit. Because Maharaja Pariksit and Maharaja Yudhisthira were representing God, they could dominate the entire world. Now all that is lost, and today there are many small states that are not God conscious; therefore they are fighting each other like cats and dogs. Still, it is a fact that Vedic kings like Maharaja Ramacandra, Maharaja Prthu, Maharaja Yudhisthira, and Maharaja Pariksit were actually representatives of God. In those days, one king ruled the entire world. Therefore there was no trouble. Syamasundara dasa: Could America’s dominance in this century be attributed to God’s will? Srila Prabhupada: Whenever we see some extraordinary power, we should understand that it is derived from God’s power. We may therefore say that the predominance of America is due to God’s favor. However, if Americans spread Krsna consciousness and make their president Krsna conscious, America will be God’s empowered nation. Let the president be Krsna conscious. Why not? Educate the American people to be Krsna conscious and elect a Krsna conscious president. This Krsna consciousness movement is in your hands, and it is up to you to utilize it and become the factual leaders of the world. It was my mission to go to America and educate the Americans in Krsna consciousness becasue I knew that if they become Krsna conscious, the whole world will follow. You are young men, and this mission is in your hands. A few Communists like Stalin and Lenin formed a big Communist Party, and now this Party is dominating most of the world. It was started by a few men. Now many of you young Americans have understood this God conscious philosophy, and it is up to you to spread this movement. You should not become stagnant, thinking, “Now I have understood Krsna consciousness. Now let me sit down and just chant Hare Krsna.” this is not desired. Go spread Krsna consciousness, and in this way glorify your nation.

Syamasundara dasa: He claims that there is no higher body to judge the states, and that their differences must be settled by war. Srila Prabhupada: There is higher authority if there is religion, philosophy and learned brahmanas. Syamasundara dasa: He can see no potential world authority. Srila Prabhupada: That is because the Vedic varnasrama-dharma has been rejected. According to that system, the brahminical culture was superior to the ksatriya culture. The brahmanas are to advise the kings. Because people have rejected the Vedic system, they say that there is no authority. Syamasundara dasa: Well, there was no judge to settle the dispute between Rama and Ravana, and that resulted in war. Srila Prabhupada: The judge was Lord Ramacandra Himself. He is God. Syamasundara dasa: In a sense, hegel glorifies war. “War protects the people from the corruption which an everlasting peace would bring upon them,” he says. Srila Prabhupada: At the conclusion of the battle of Kuruksetra, Sanjaya points out that wherever there is Krsna, there will be victory (Bg. 18.78). If there is a war, the party that is God conscious will be victorious. If neither side is God conscious, it is a demonic war. It is not justified; it is just like a cat and dog fight. If we fight, we should fight on behalf of the Supreme God. That is called dharma-yuddha. Arjuna did not want to fight, but Krsna told him, “I am on your side. Fight.” Arjuna was victorious because God was on his side. Syamasundara dasa: For Hegel, because the conflict itself is purifying, it has some ethical value. He writes, “By war, the ethical health of the nation is preserved, and its finite aims uprooted.” Srila Prabhupada: Then he wants continuous war? If that is the case, Hitler is a first-class man. But why is he condemned? Of course, in the material world, there are opposing elements, and therefore there must be war. It is not that war can be stopped. Rather, the party that has Krsna’s support will emerge victorious. We don’t say that you can stop war, but that if you fight, you should fight on behalf of Krsna. Syamasundara dasa: But what of Hegel’s view that progress comes only through conflict, and that peace means stagnation? Srila Prabhupada: We do not agree that peace is stagnation. Our peace is working for Krsna. That is real peace. We are educating people to understand that Krsna is our friend, and this is not stagnation. Telling people about Krsna is our peace. Syamasundara dasa: Are we not in a state of war with material nature, maya? Srila Prabhupada: We don’t fight with maya. Those who are under maya’s clutches and who are being kicked by maya are struggling with maya. We have nothing to do with maya. daivi hy esa guna-mayi mama maya duratyaya mam eva ye prapadyante mayam etam taranti te SYNONYMS “This divine energy of Mine, consisting of the three modes of material nature, is difficult to overcome. But those who have surrendered unto Me can easily cross beyond it.” (Bg. 7.14) If maya does not disturb us, what is the point of fighting?

Hayagriva dasa: Although an impersonalist, Fichte is certainly not an inactivist. In The Vocation of Man, he writes: “Not merely to know, but according to thy knowledge to do, is thy vocation… Not for idle contemplation of thyself, not for brooding over devout sensations––no, for action art thou here; thine action, and thine action alone, determines thy worth.” Srila Prabhupada: Yes, and that is also the philsophy of our Krsna consciousness movement, which meaintains that we are meant for rendering daily service to Krsna. We do not believe that you should simply sit down, smoke cigarettes, and speculate on God. What will be the use of such speculation? We advocate a practical life of action devoted to Krsna.

Hayagriva dasa: Fichte believes that true atheism consists in “… refusing to obey the voice of one’s conscience until one thinks that one can foresee the succes of one’s actions and thus elevating one’s own judgement above that of God and in making oneself into God. He who wills to do evil in order to produce good is a godless person.” Srila Prabhupada: If you do not know God or His orders, how can you verify your duty? Do you simply manufacture your duty? Anyone can do that. First of all, you must understand what is meant by duty. Duty means following the orders given by your superior, but if you have no superior, if you have no conception of the Supreme and His order, how can you knwo your duty? Of course, you may imagine your duty. Is this what he advises? Hayagriva dasa: He is vague on this point. Srila Prabhupada: Becasue he does not know. According to the Vedas, we have definite, prescribed duties. Society is divided into eight divisions comprising the varnasrama-dharma. there are four varnas (brahmana, ksatriya, vaisya, and sudra) and four asramas (brahmacari, grhastha, vanaprastha, and sannyasa). Whateverr you do, you must function according to one of these varnas or asramas, and there are duties prescribed for each. If you follow the principles that are set forth specifically for each stage of life, you are doing your duty. Hayagriva dasa: For Fichte, our knowledge of God arises from the enactment of our duty. Srila Prabhupada: That is all right, but what is our duty? God must assign our duty for us to understand God by enacting our duty. But if we have no conception of God, how can we know what our duty is?

Usually, the only difference between the rich and poor are a few shady tax breaks.

Syamasundara dasa: Kant believes that there should be a world state in which everyone can participate, and a system of international law regulating relationships between various nations or states. Srila Prabhupada: This is also our position, the proposition of the International Society for Krsna Consciousness. There is one God, and there should be one state. If we can turn the majority of people to Krsna consciousness, they will vote for Krsna conscious people, and they will not be exploited. The principles that we are following individually can be introduced on a larger scale.

Syamasundara dasa: For Kant, the summum bonum is virtue combined with happiness. Happiness is the knowledge of doing what is right. Srila Prabhupada: Happiness means spiritual happiness. There is no material happiness because whatever is material is temporary. Since the spirit soul is eternal, he must have spiritual happiness. That happiness is Krsna consciousness. If you know that you are the eternal servant of Krsna, and you are serving Krsna, that service is your happiness. Even if your duty is painful, you are still happy because you know that you are acting for Krsna. Syamasundara dasa: Kant points out that on earth, happiness does not necessarily accompany goodness; therefore there must be a God who sees that a virtuous man finds his deserved happiness in a future life. Without such justice, there would be no meaning to morality. Srila Prabhupada: Yes, in the last mantra of Isopanisad, it is stated agne naya supatha raye asman visvani deva vayunani vidvan yuyodhy asmaj juhuranam eno bhuyistham te nama-uktim vidhema “O my Lord, powerful as fire, omnipotent one, now I offer You all obeisances, falling on the ground at Your feet. O my Lord, please lead me on the right path to reach You, and, since You know all that I have done in the past, please free me from the reactions to my past sins so that there will be no hindrance to my progress.” (Isopanisad 18) We should be very sincere in our service to God so that He will relieve us of the reactions of our karma. Unless there is a Supreme, what is the value of morality? Syamasundara dasa: Kant would say that in his earthly life, a man should not be motivated toward moral conduct out of any expectation of happiness, but out of a sense of duty, or reverence for the moral law. Srila Prabhupada: Yes, that means unmotivated service. It is not that we love Krsna just to receive some benefit. It is our duty. That is pure morality. Knowing that we are part and parcel of Krsna, we should render service to Krsna without ulterior motivation. Syamasundara dasa: The goal of Kant’s personal ethics is twofold: it is a person’s duty to attain his own perfection and also to seek the happiness of others. Srila Prabhupada: Yes that is Krsna consciousness. A Krsna conscious man is not happy thinking, “I have now contacted Krsna; therefore my business is finished.” Other living entities are also part and parcel of Krsna, but due to misguidance, they are not serving Him. Consequently, they are not ataining happiness. It is the duty of one who knows Krsna to preach about Him out of mercy. Those who are satisfied just tending to their own personal spiritual life are not as highly elevated as those who try to enlighten others.

Syamasundara dasa: Since our knowledge is limited to mere phenomena, faith is necessary to acquire knowledge of God, freedom, and immortality. Srila Prabhupada: No, faith is not a fact but a compromise. It is good that he admits that we cannot approach God ultimately by our senses or reason, but faith alone also is not sufficient, not perfect. Western philosophers have created so many different faiths. One may believe in one faith, and another person in another, but this is faith, not fact. the fact is this: if we are convinced that there is a God and that he is omnipotent, we have to admit that by His omnipotnce he can descend into the world. In Bhagavad-gita, Krsna says that he descends into the world for two reaons: To rectify the discrepancies in religion, and to please His devotees who are always anxious to see Him. Some people may say that God is partial, but he is not. God is kind both to His devotees and to the miscreants and demons. When the miscreants are killed by God, they attain immediate salvation, and when the devotees see god, they can understand His actual position. In Vrndavana, God displays Himself just as He does in the spiritual world. It is His nature to play with the cowherd boys and dance with the gopis. When the devotees understand this, they become incouraged by knowing that after finishing the material body, they will return to Krsna to join in His pastimes. This information is not only understood from the sastras, but is actually demonstrated by Krsna. Thus this knowledge is doubly confirmed. When we hear about God and His activities, we can also realize them because God is absolute. There is no difference between seeing Him and hearing about Him. In this way, true knowledge is attained. However expert a logician one may be, it is not possible by reason, logic, or mundane knowledge to approach the Supreme Absolute. It is possible to understand God only when He descends Himself, gives information about Himself, and displays His pastimes. Srimad-Bhagavatam is a chronicle of the descents of God. If we try to understand God through Srimad-Bhagavatam or Bhagavad-gita, God speaks about Himself and His activites, and Srimad-Bhagavatam is a record of God’s activites and pastimes. the first nine cantos are devoted to the understanding of the transcendental nature of God, and the Tenth Canto is a chronicle of God’s activities before the eyes of the people of the world. However, those who are miscreants will think that God is just a famous person, or a superhuman being, and that’s all. Hayagriva dasa: Concerning religious faith, Kant writes: “There is only one (true) religion, but there can be faiths of several kinds. It is therefore more fitting to say, “This man is of this or that faith (Jewish, Mohammedan, Catholic, Lutheran), than he is of this or that religion.”’ Srila Prabhupada: That is correct. Since religion means obedience to God, it does not refer to some sect. People are trying to understand God in different ways, but these ways are not real religion; they are methods of understanding God. Religion begins when we have understood God and are rendering Him service.

SB 4.17.26 Any cruel person—be he a man, woman or impotent eunuch—who is only interested in his personal maintenance and has no compassion for other living entities may be killed by the king. Such killing can never be considered actual killing. .................... Ya know, Krsna impresses me as being very dedicated to social welfare here… best for you, me and WE. I interpret the king as whoever is best serving Krsna here.

… that you are practicing. You have some rather perverted concepts like preaching while you don't care… as you've bragged about twice now. But not to get sucked in… that's all I care to say. Like I said, let me know WHEN you get there. It looks like you're gonna be there before me.

WHEN you get there. (You 2 post alot more than I do).

Been trying to reach you on the phone for 30 minutes. 9am now.

A boy that age with those memories… And the details just keep coming! How do you deny what your senses tell you? I thought him wanting meat-loaf was a really interesting twist. Seems he has a penchant for meat and war (like so many). I think they'll learn more about reincarnation from KC than researching their own past lives though. But it all points in the same direction. Maybe they'll advance to KC through their research. Very interesting post. Thanks.

You plan to expose him? Let the public know!

GOOD LUCK. That can't always be done. Let me know the results of your investigation. I'm hooked.

You expected self-investigation?