Smiley

The following is an excerpt from wikipedia. Although it is specifically talking about an advait guru, there might be universal principles here which are applicable to any path: The Guru must have the following qualities (see Mundaka Upanishad 1.2.12): Śrotriya — must be learned in the Vedic scriptures and sampradaya Brahmanistha — literally meaning established in Brahman; must have realised the oneness of Brahman in everything and in himself The seeker must serve the Guru and submit questions with all humility in order to remove all doubts (see Bhagavad Gita 4.34). By doing so, advaita says, the seeker will attain moksha (liberation from the cycle of births and deaths). http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Advaita_Vedanta I personally reccomend this Vaishnava guru that I met in India: http://www.mountmadonna.org/yoga/babaji.html

I saw this on YouTube this morning. ........ width="425" height="344"> <embed src="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NXiJPDCvVYc&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344">

I agree with you for the most part. However Moses was the first writer of Jewish scriptures and so he was most likely the founder of Judaism. Jews however point to Abraham (a character in the writings of Moses) as "the father of the faithful".

An intellectually honest reading of either the Bible or the Koran will admit that both texts make exclusive claims to truth. For instance, a Jew or a Muslim can not worship an image - it is forbidden. Those that follow Sanatana Dharma have freedom of conscience on that point. They are not considered evil if they worship images (called murti puja). The idea of an angry and jealous God is antithetical to Bhagavad Gita "If a man desires to worship another God, I will strengthen his faith so that he may attain what he desires". People who talk about everybody coming together and worshiping one God want first that people give up the worship of images which is important to many Hindus (and Catholics). Also many people believe that the Supreme Being can and does incarnate to act like a man - eating, drinking and loving. Sri Rama and Sri Krishna are only two examples. Islam and Judaism can never countenance this. The fact is, it does not bother Hindus that Jews, Christians and Muslims believe as they do. However it does indeed bother Christians and Muslims that Hindus believe as they do. That is a great source of tension and anyone who would deny that fact is not an intellectually honest person.

"I am Lord Siva" Sri Krishna purport: "He is the incarnation of the Supreme Lord" Swami Bhaktivedanta Prabhupada http://www.asitis.com/10/23.html

Dear Bee, You have asked a heart-felt question in an open forum. Now you are perplexed by a divergence of opinion. If you have a guru that you love, then honor his opinion. If not, choose an answer that inspires you and abide in that. That will give you peace.

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Talks with Sri Nisargadatta Maharaj “Come to the conclusion: I am unborn, I was unborn and I shall remain unborn” - Sri Nisargadatta Maharaj Edited by PRADEEP APTE, PhD Composed by Vijayendra Deshpande ACKNOWLEDGEMENTS Mr. Damodar Lund, English and Aesthetics Professor, deeply interested in mysticism and Buddhism and an ardent disciple of Sri Nisargadatta Maharaj, was a regular participant in the satsangs held by Maharaj at his residence. This book is the product of the notes, he took during the meetings, which he left behind, before his untimely death. Mrs. Kamala Lund, his wife, was kind enough to allow me to use the notes for the preparation of the book. She wanted it to be distributed freely on the Internet, as Maharaj would have wanted it, had he been alive. Mr. Pradeep Apte, in spite of his hectic schedule was kind enough to edit the notes in preparation of the book, for which I am extremely grateful. I am also thankful to my friend Mr. Gajanan Netrawali, who encouraged me to take up this task, and also to put up the website for free materials on Maharaj. -VIJAYENDRA DESHPANDE YOU MAY FREELY DISTRIBUTE THIS EBOOK AS A WHOLE. NO ALTERATIONS OF THIS EBOOK IS ALLOWED. THIS EBOOK CANNOT BE USED FOR COMMERCIAL EXPLOITATION IN WHOLE OR IN PART. FOR DETAILS AND OTHER INFORMATION ON THE BOOK, PLEASE MAIL TO vijaydesh7@gmail.com Table of Contents 1. The Elemental Play ...............................................................................................................................4 2. No-beingness ........................................................................................................................................5 3. The Brahma Aperture ............................................................................................................................6 4. This ‘I am’ business ..............................................................................................................................8 5. A Kohinoor Diamond ..........................................................................................................................10 6. Unborn Children ................................................................................................................................12 7. Beyond Concepts ...............................................................................................................................15 8. Beingness ...........................................................................................................................................17 9. Worship the ‘I am’ ..............................................................................................................................19 10. It’s kept in your Palm! ......................................................................................................................21 11. A Wound ..........................................................................................................................................22 12. Nisargadatta .....................................................................................................................................23 13. Take it (‘I am’) as Destiny ................................................................................................................25 14. Mind cannot interpret You ................................................................................................................28 15. The Beingness Dynasty .....................................................................................................................31 16. Everybody listens, few Practice ........................................................................................................33 17. Kick the Thoughts out! .....................................................................................................................35 18. Knowledge has no form ....................................................................................................................37 19. Birth is an illusion .............................................................................................................................39 20. Falseness begins with your Parents ...................................................................................................41 21. Paul’s Redemption ............................................................................................................................42 22. A Village without Day or Night ........................................................................................................47 23.The ‘I am’ is God ...............................................................................................................................49 24. The self-annihilator’s cry (‘Har Har Mahadev!’) ..............................................................................52 25. You are Limitless ..............................................................................................................................54 26. Annihilate yourself by your own identity .........................................................................................56 27. The Soundless Sound ........................................................................................................................58 28. Just be, to realize No-beingness ........................................................................................................60 29. The Telescope ..................................................................................................................................63 30. You are not whatever you Experience ..............................................................................................65 31. How you met your Parents? ..............................................................................................................67 32. The ‘I am’ is the Primary Illusion .....................................................................................................69 33. Meditation means merging with Beingness ......................................................................................71 34. Swallow the Beingness .....................................................................................................................73 35. Body identity is an Illusion ...............................................................................................................75 36. The ‘I am’ is temporary in the Infinite ..............................................................................................76 37. Transcend the ‘I am’ .........................................................................................................................79 38. The Python’s Breath ..........................................................................................................................80 39. The age of an Unborn child ...............................................................................................................82 40. I am not whatever I think ..................................................................................................................85 41. You are, so just be .............................................................................................................................89 42. Your destiny is not death, but the disappearance of ‘I am’ ...............................................................93 43. You are the Principle that rejects the Body .......................................................................................95 44. I am Unborn .....................................................................................................................................97 2 45. From no-knowingness, suddenly ‘I am’ ...........................................................................................99 46. The Witnessing principle ever prevails ...........................................................................................102 47. The ‘I am’ is formless .....................................................................................................................104 48. Guru means, not an individual ........................................................................................................106 49. There is no other Brahman greater than you ...................................................................................108 50. The touch of ‘I amness’ is unreal ....................................................................................................109 51. ‘You are’ has no form .....................................................................................................................111 52. The fish out of water .......................................................................................................................113 53. Awakened Knowledge is Meditation ..............................................................................................120 54. Nothing…. ‘Something for sometime’…. Nothing ........................................................................122 55. The Color of The ‘Seer’ ..................................................................................................................125 56. Everything happens in the Knowledge ‘I am’ .................................................................................127 http://charliehayes36.tripod.com/sri_nisargadatta_i_am_unborn.pdf

Before Islam there was Christianity. Before Christianity there was Judaism. Abraham is called "the father of the faithful" by all three. However formal Judaism was thought to be codified by Moses many generations later. Sanatana Dharma predates all of these 'Abrahamic' religions and has influenced them to some degree. Judaism, the oldest of the three was also influenced by ancient Egyptian mysticism (the Egyptian Book of the Dead is plagiarized by some of the Bible authors) and other religions that predated it. If you read the Jewish Bible you see that people were worshiping different gods and "idols" even before Abraham received his first vision. So the Jewish Bible admits that these so-called 'pagan' religions predated Abraham. Of course if you actually believe the Jewish Bible then all life began with Adam and Eve around 6,000 years ago and the earth was populated with Cain and Seth getting their sisters pregnant. This contradicts the best scientific evidence that we have so it seems best to view that story as an allegory written either by Moses or several different authors writing under that name. Please bear in mind that one of the big reasons that these things seem to be in dispute is that there are heavy-duty agendas, especially among people who are not Hindu or want to water Hinduism down in order to equate it with Abrahamic Theism. These simple-minded people think that Christians and Muslims will perhaps start to hate Hinduism less and maybe even curtail their conversion activities. Here is a pro-Hindu source of information: www.EncyclopediaOfAuthenticHinduism.org (I have no association with the author)

Here is another good place to learn about Hinduism: www.hinduwisdom.info

Bishadi: "such that some people become ill from lack of nutrients by following that paradigm (see the dali lama)" Your statement conflicts with the scientific evidence. I read the Dalai Lama's autobiography Freedom in Exile: The Autobiography of The Dalai Lama. The Tibetans live in contradiction, holding that it is wrong for a monk to kill for food but o.k. for them to eat meat as long as another person killed and prepared it. I say this about the exiled Tibetan community in India. If a balanced vegetarian diet cannot be obtained in certain remote places of Tibet, then they should not be criticized any more than people in arctic regions. The lack of meat has not been scientifically proven to promote disease. An unhealthy diet, rather meatless or not has been proven to promote disease. A healthy vegetarian diet has been scientifically demonstrated to promote overall health and longevity. Bishadi: "Look up the inuit tribes of the arctic regions." Irrelevant. No one is criticizing people whose karma forces them to eat a restricted diet. Here is a relevant question; What kind of diet best promotes the spiritual progress for the aspirant? I will answer that question rhetorically; How many ashrams in India serve meat to their inmates? Here is an article prepared by the the Physicians Committee for Responsible Medicine; several scientific studies are referenced in the footnotes: http://www.pcrm.org/health/veginfo/vegetarian_foods.html I think there is an important distinction to be drawn between hunting, in which an animal lives free until the day it is killed by an animal or human predator and supporting the meat industry: www.meat.org or the leather industry: Given that it is not necessary for most people, why do it? www.CowsAreCool.com

As a person who is familiar with the Sankirtana movement but not part of it, let me say that I think that the congregational chanting of the names of Vishnu can be a beautiful thing. However I think that being obsessed with making more devotees in order to 'save' the world (out of 'causeless mercy') is not. I realize that both are part of the movement, but that is still the way I see it. Sometimes when I see people really happy and into their congregational chanting of the names of Vishnu, I can see how that will be attractive to some and draw them in. However, I think the HK's should be satisfied with what comes in that way (of its own accord) and not push to the point of obnoxiousness. 1. The movie Airplane! was released in 1980. In one scene a traveler making his way through a busy airport smashes a Hare Krishna devotee right in the face with his fist! I heard that in many theatres cheers went up from the audience when this scene was played. If so many people would cheer at something like that, it may be worth considering why? 2. I worked many years at Los Angeles International Airport. Do you know how many Bhagavad Gita As It Is and other books by Bhaktivedanta Prabhupada I found laying on the ground or in the trash over those years? I wish I had a dollar for each one! I would bet that people actually gave donations for those books and after the HK devotees were out of sight - trashed them! Yes, people will give donations for books if you really pressure them. Instead of taking the clue, the organization's lawyers would fight it out with the City of Los Angeles in court for the right to continue their practices. ISKCON is the biggest organization of Hindus outside of India; therefore to many people, this is the face of Sanatana Dharma. I think it is worth contemplating what is going on and whose interests are really being represented.

Dear Trivedi 3, may I ask if you are an authority on what a "true Hindu" believes? Also, if you believe this is God, then do you mean Sri Vishnu, Sri Shiva, a demigod like Sri Ganesha or a deva like Sri Indra? Apparently some Hindus think the differences between Shiva, Vishnu, the demigods and the devas are important considerations. I have heard different 'authorities' hold an opposite opinion of yours. For instance, Voice of India spokesman Sita Ram Goel wrote a very painstakingly researched book on this issue: http://hamsa.org/artifice-intro.htm I also read a book by Swami Prakashanand Saraswati (http://www.barsanadham.org/) in which he compared the Bible to Greek mythology. He feels they are on the same level. It seems (to my simple mind) that the idea of Jesus comes from the Bible and was brought to India on the lips of missionaries who didn't seem to have anything worthwhile to say (to put it mildly) about the indigenous deities . Were these 'blaspheming' (from a Hindu perspective) missionaries really Self-realized Rishis? My interest in this subject is because I am an ex-Christian who thinks that Yoga and vegetarianism (neither of which come from the Bible) are India's greatest gifts to the world.

I have been an admirer of Ammachi for some years now. I also spent a small time at her ashram in Kerala in 2005 and 2006. I read an autobiography of her penned by one of the Swamis in her inner circle. She was born into a Vaishnava household. Even as a child she was a great Krishna Bhakti and composed beautiful poems for her Lord. When I was at her ashram in India, she had her followers recite the entire chapter 15 of Sanskrit Bhagavad Gita before they ate. Also, at the very top of her temple at Amritapuri, Kerala she has a sculpture of Sri Krishna as the chariot driver of Prince Arjuna. Nowadays her followers see her as a manifestation of Sri Mata Durga. Here is the official home page of Sri Mata Amritanandamayi Devi : www.AmritaPuri.org

Hello Jaya Tirtha Charan dasan, I have been linking to these non-religious sites in order to help promote a non-violent diet and cow protection: The Web Site the Meat Industry Doesn't Want You to See http://www.meat.org/ Vegetarian Foods: Powerful for Health http://www.pcrm.org/health/veginfo/vegetarian_foods.html Physicians Committee for Responsible Medicine http://www.pcrm.org/ PCRM Veg Starter Kit http://www.pcrm.org/health/veginfo/vsk/index.html I would also like to remind all my vegetarian friends that not all dairy is vegetarian - be careful!!

As an outsider looking in, this sounds like something to inspire people to preach. I can't see it as a serious attempt to get Theists to stop what they are doing and join the KC movement. Can you imagine what such speech would sound like to them? I don't think any one would go to a place like Saudi Arabia or Pakistan and utter words such as that. Just my opinion.

Tara1, I forgot to add that I seem to get better results by trying to concentrate on the sounds instead of just repeating them mechanically and also from chanting in the morning before taking my first food. However there are no hard and fast rules. Just keep an open mind to experimenting with different ways to improve your sadhana!

Bhaktajan, could you please elaborate on this statement? I had not heard this idea before.

I remember years ago there would be shopping malls in which one of the 'stores' would not be a store at all but would be a Christian Science Reading Room. People could sit there and rest their weary legs while reading materials about Christian Science. This seems like it would be a good idea but it could be a Shiva Dharma Reading Room and you could have selected books, scriptures and multi-media presentations in the local language. Of course you would have to get plenty of donations to open up centers like this around the world, but I think it is possible!

Dear tara1, I have some experience with this mantra and with other ones. First of all, something sweet is known by the tasting, so YOU should decide how you feel about it after you have been chanting for awhile. To get the full 'flavor', try to follow the diet restrictions as much as possible. I have found that this makes a big difference. Also be willing to increase your chanting when you feel ready for it. Please know that there are other mantras out there and if after some time you feel that this one is not for you, there is no reason to give up on the chanting of Sanskrit mantras altogether. I wish you the best!

I agree with what you just said. My perspective needs to be taken into account also - that of trying to slow down the change as much as possible since we are only sliding deeper into Kali Yuga (and therefore more maya) I have nothing against your faith, only the idea that Hindus need to incorporate the Bible or Koran into their Dharma. Or the idea that either is properly classified as Veda. An educated person can say it much better than me. Dr. Frank Morales, Ph.D. (Sri Dharma Pravartaka Acharya) who has been a Vaishnava monk for over 30 years: http://www.dharmacentral.com/universalism.htm

All the more reason for Hindus to start educating their own, instead of leaving it up to other faiths. I think the second richest man in the world is Hindu, and there are a lot of other rich ones around the world.

Please try to follow the thread more carefully. I said references of Sri Shankara or Sri Mahaprabhu making mention of it. Their silence is deafening.

I used hyperbole. Are you familiar with that? 'HerServant' said "all the acharyas". That is also hyperbole. To be precise; I am not aware of any record of them making any such statements. Now are you going to hold everyone on this board to such exacting standards of English usage? If I am incorrect, please cite your sources. Accusing me of lying and prejudice is simply a personal attack which adds nothing of substance.