Rati

I see so many quotations by (I assume your guru) Prabhupada that you have posted, Leyh, but never any statements by you personally. How are we to know the real Leyh? Why are these teachings important to you, and how have they given meaning to your own life? That is what we are really interested in. Can you share something with us beyond repeating what you have read? Do you have any insights to offer? Just curious. Not trying to pressure you or anything. If you are too shy to come out of your shell, then we will not try to pry you loose. [This message has been edited by Rati (edited 04-22-2002).]

I see so many quotations by (I assume your guru) Prabhupada that you have posted, Leyh, but never any statements by you personally. How are we to know the real Leyh? Why are these teachings important to you, and how have they given meaning to your own life? That is what we are really interested in. Can you share something with us beyond repeating what you have read? Do you have any insights to offer? Just curious. Not trying to pressure you or anything. If you are too shy to come out of your shell, then we will not try to pry you loose. [This message has been edited by Rati (edited 04-22-2002).]

Where is the discussion of Proof of God on that website?

The monkey on the hill with the temple in the valley below is a really cool shot.

If pyschedelic drugs were their sacrament, they probably had no dearth of devoted followers. (((((((((((((((((((((((((((((( )))))))))))))))))))))))))))))) (((((((((((((((((((((((((((((( )))))))))))))))))))))))))))))) ((((((((((((( (((((((((((((( )))))))))))))))))))))))))))))) (((((((((((((((((((((((((((((( )))))))))))))))))))))))))))))) (((((((((((((((((((((((((((((( (Remember op art?) [This message has been edited by Rati (edited 04-22-2002).]

That would be great if everyone here would be willing to set aside sectarian disputes and agree to fund a central foundation to promote Gaudiya Vaishnavism, irrespective of sampradaya (or even Vaishnavism or Hinduism in general), or just for book publication by Vaishnava academics. Absent that, the network model has proven effective over the past couple of decades for building business relationships and acquiring clients/customers or jobs via that approach. I have been frustrated with the Elance services part of Ebay for tracking down projects. I think we could develop something much more useful and effective. Then there's the Heaven's Gate model, wherein the people involved get so caught up in a fanatical cult that they resort to bizarre behavior like self-castration and eventually mass suicide - not a good example to follow. [This message has been edited by Rati (edited 04-22-2002).]

You seemed to have missed the point about they psychic. He reveals things that only the relative or loved one of the deceased could possibly know. That is what has made him famous. No conman could do that with trickery. There have been many phony psychics that rely merely on psychology coupled with good guesswork, but they have never demonstrated that type of inexplicable talent. This guy, however, looks like the real deal. To me that is exciting, as he brings to us objective proof of life after death. As far as the mystical and religious experiences themselves go, I agree with you about the individual nature of them that makes them unique to each saint or mystic. However, that does not really demonstrate anything more than a different expression of the same thing by different people. If I were to ask ten different people to write about a painting by Da Vinci, I would expect to get ten totally different points of view in ten totally different accounts. That does not mean that they all were looking at ten different paintings. A counter argument to yours is that there are common threads that run through those various experiences that transcend geographical, cultural and historical boundaries. How do you explain the existence of those patterns? One could say that you are just hallucinating your own existence and the world around you. You would be hard pressed to prove otherwise. Some facts are just accepted prima facie. For the overwhelming majority of people on the planet, there is no question that there is a God and that there are those with direct experience of the Deity. They just accept that fact because it makes the most sense to them. If that were not true, then there would not be so many temples, churches and mosques everywhere you look. Atheism is never going to attract much of a following, because it goes against the grain of humanity. Not only that, but it has little appeal, since it offers no hope or reason for optimism, and it provides no moral imperative of any kind. If all of society were atheistic, then why would there be any need for ethics of any kind? It may make for high record sales of heavy metal albums, but atheism is never going to have any universal appeal. For those of us that are theistic, that is only good news. [This message has been edited by Rati (edited 04-22-2002).]

I'm game. I have a small IT consulting company and have been attempting to network for new clients in an abysmal economy. Any leads would be appreciated. I specialize in development with Microsoft .NET (and previous verions of Visual Studio - C++/VB), SQL Server, Oracle and Rational Rose. Email: mtcorp@attbi.com Much obliged. Also, glad to help anyone else in any way I can (referrals, resume or proposal writing, whatever).

Neither, Tarun: Just chit chat. Maybe not so quiet, after all, with those controversial archaelogical finds off the coast of India and the scandals rocking the Catholic Church. At least the website did not crash, which is a big accomplishment in itself, based on my experience with many websites over the years.

Your thought experiment disappoints, Shiva. I was looking more for something along the lines of Einstein's thought experiment on relativity about people going off on a space voyage and aging at a slower rate than the people they left behind on earth. Put on your thinking cap and try again.

Your thought experiment disappoints, Shiva. I was looking more for something along the lines of Einstein's thought experiment on relativity about people going off on a space voyage and aging at a slower rate than the people they left behind on earth. Put on your thinking cap and try again.

Any evidence they were getting high on marijuana or mushrooms back then, jijaji?

Speaking of dead people, I saw this psychic on the news that actually communicates with them. He has been dead on and has various readings for some celebrities which are unexplainable by rationalistic science. So there is a counter argument for you, mmranmr: If there is no God and no soul, then how is it that this person possesses such powers and gets facts correct from people beyond the grave? How do you explain the sum total of deep religious experiences by saints and mystics through the ages? Do you think they were all just hallucinating? If you seek direct experience of the Deity and your own soul, then that is going to require some inner search, rather than this intellectual process you have embarked on of posing those questions and looking for answers to them in books. One of my sisters (she's Catholic and not at all interested in Vaishnavism) enrolled in a Tai Chi class for self defense and fitness reasons. What she did not expect was the encounter with the paranormal that she had as a result. When she pulled a muscle in class, the instructor healed it instantly by directing the Chi (called prana in yoga philosophy) from his hands into the afflicted leg. My advice is that in addition to reading texts, you take up a discipline as well, such as mantra meditation or yoga practice. You might be surprised. [This message has been edited by Rati (edited 04-22-2002).]

Jijaji: Think we disgusted enough people here yet? Some seem to think we lack the proper level of decorum (and they're probably right about that). [This message has been edited by Rati (edited 04-21-2002).]

You can catch us on pay per view. That was just a little taste.

Things have been pretty quiet in your absence, actually. Hope you enjoyed your trip. Wouldn't mind taking one myself one of these days.

OK, we can't stand the suspense any longer. Please, please reveal what the first prize is.

It is the position of the Gaudiya acaryas that the sadhaka only attains the result of prema by the grace of Sri Krsna. One only attains His grace if one first gets the grace of Srimati Radharani. [This message has been edited by Rati (edited 04-20-2002).]

Have you come up with any thought experiements (ala Einstein) to prove your unified field theory, Shiva? One problem with unpredictability is that it only states that exact predictions fail, whereas there are parameters in which the outcome of events will inevitably occur all of the time, so there is always some level of predictability, never zero. If any one event were entirely unpredictable (viz. no parameters), then that would truly be a state of chaos. It is the sum of all events within a system that makes it chaotic, rather than any single occurance. What are your thoughts on 'influence at a distance' as demonstrated by the experiments where single photons are beamed through a slit? That has been a particularly knotty problem for rationalists. [This message has been edited by Rati (edited 04-20-2002).] [This message has been edited by Rati (edited 04-20-2002).]

Have you come up with any thought experiements (ala Einstein) to prove your unified field theory, Shiva? One problem with unpredictability is that it only states that exact predictions fail, whereas there are parameters in which the outcome of events will inevitably occur all of the time, so there is always some level of predictability, never zero. If any one event were entirely unpredictable (viz. no parameters), then that would truly be a state of chaos. It is the sum of all events within a system that makes it chaotic, rather than any single occurance. What are your thoughts on 'influence at a distance' as demonstrated by the experiments where single photons are beamed through a slit? That has been a particularly knotty problem for rationalists. [This message has been edited by Rati (edited 04-20-2002).] [This message has been edited by Rati (edited 04-20-2002).]

Splendid quote. It should go on its own topic, so that it is more prominently advertised here. Otherwise, many will not be aware of it.

What remarks? I don't see any remarks. [This message has been edited by Rati (edited 04-21-2002).]

Sarasvati: Were you raised in India or here in the West? [This message has been edited by Rati (edited 04-20-2002).]

A website about yoga: http://www.sivasakti.com/ [This message has been edited by Rati (edited 04-19-2002).]

In a sense you are right about that, Shiva. However, the developments in particle physics and quantum mechanics in the last century are indeed very revolutionary in the context of classical Newtonian physics. The interesting thing is that they closely mirror the same types of philosophical paradoxes that ancient Eastern schools have discussed for millenia. I am not going to advise you to get out and a university degree in physics just to get your feet wet on the subject, but I do recommend some of the books out on the topic for the lay public. A number of them were cited on other threads here. If you have already done that reading, then disregard my advice. [This message has been edited by Rati (edited 04-19-2002).]