Sephiroth

The greatest insult to the Hindus is that the current Bharat gov. is controlling funds and management of the Hindu temples. This should be protested strongly. MIC in Malaysia is controlling the funds and managements of Hindu temples and many of them have been demolished under orders of Indian traitors (to their own religion and people). Mosques allowed to build opposite of temples (Hindu and Buddhist) and many of them will blast their azans and speech in loudspeakers during prayer time in Hindu temples. Protesting alone will not work. I believe following Mahatma Gandhi's way of non-complience to their orders is a good way. Also, temples need people's support, so railing people to come and aid the temples also a good step. Temple management can do this by conducting various activites like dance and singing classes, Tamil and Veda classes also is good.

perhaps the story means that there was a gandharva who used to play music in some royal court and was distracted by dancing women. this gandharva was supposed to be an ideal good person as narada, but his distraction caused by teh opposite sex caused him to be cursed to live amongst regular people. The story comes from Skanda Purana and narrated by Narada himself to Sage Vyasa.

Jews beleive in yahweh, thats what they call their god. When Moses asked his God, who He was and what He had done, God simply replied that He is Eternal, so the name Yahweh comes out of that - which in Hebrew language means "He who is Eternal". The Jewish Kabbalah tradition teaches of man's descent from the highest spiritual world through a series of planes ending with his reincarnation in a physical body. Like I said before, Jews do not believe (or DENY) Reincarnation because Jewish Laws do not stated such concept. They concentrate in living properly and leave the matters of Afterlife to God. Kaballah is study of God's attributes in order to understand Him better, NOT to ascend or descend Human spiritual plains. Hindu scriptures often speak of the many lokas or planes of existence and dvipa or islands. They talk of beings coming from other lokas to this loka, possibly even of spaceships in which they could travel. These lokas, however, are more commonly interpreted as other dimensions of existence rather than physical planets. Yeah ... I have read about such puranas where Lokas means Realms. And what amazing to me that, modern Science begin to discover concepts such as possibilities of Life on other worlds, Black Holes, MultiVerses (more than one Universe) etc. BTW ... did you notice the name "uniVERSE"? Verse means a Word or maybe a Sentence and even this is accordance to Creation Myth in Hindusm, where the 1st sound which comes out God's crouchshell (which marks beginning of creation) is Oum. How JUDAISM, Christianity, Islam, and Buddhism were all influenced by the Vedic tradition and still contain many Vedic elements within them, not the other way round. Agreed.

And then talking about insulting any spiritual master , one straight away falls in hell,(even if he has done tons of spiritual practice ) so better be carefull in this regard. Is this Hindusm's practise? I don't remember recollecting such a thing. It is not in any Puranas, Gita or even in practise. Where did such nonsense comes from?

I say leave them be. As long as they don't disturb our religions and beliefs and spread their concepts into our children, they should be left alone. After all, they have right to teach whatever misconception they want to teach their children. However, some could crawl into our backyard and begin to promote their own misconception of Reality onto us (I have seen one or two around here also). What are we going to do about them? In real world, if they did that in my house, I probably chop their head off. /images/graemlins/smirk.gif But this is the Internet where one cannot take arms, so Lies must be dealt with Truth. So, if you see an atheist spread a misconception on anything (Vedic and such), approach the subject and speak the Truth (at least what you know). Don't worry if you not good at it ... God bound to send someone to assist you. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

I think it's really because the stories are just so absurd that they are hard to believe. There may be some historical info there but it looks like it is largely clouded by myths. But why don't you see it as mythology? we have no problem seeing the Greek gods stories as myths and the same for the Egyptian gods so why not the same with the puranas? What is so absurd that you have problem believing? A blind person who is lazy to do his/her own research could say there is no Sun and all the lights shining on his/her face is just from some artifical source (like street lights, lamps, torch etc) which s/he could touch and examine. True ... We have no problem believing Greek and Egyptian mythology. WHY? Because such mythology didn't provide any knowledge to us. Stories of Puranas and those who believed in it had progressed so much in terms of knowledge and Science; and IF it is false, they couldn't have done it, could they? /images/graemlins/wink.gif In the Puranas you have so many contradictory stories of one god being superior over the others that sectarian movements have taken only their puranas as true and the others as false or less true. But maybe they are all false? You judge God by misinterpretation (via Ego) by some people. That is like saying Person A is a liar because Person B had told you so. Lie or false can only be brought to light by those who are have researched and studied properly the facts by ALL possible means, not blindly following what some Swami said is true or false. But the key word in your sentence is "represented" - if they are historical, why do they need to be represented? When you are 5 years old, your parents will teach you Fables with morale in it, so you could follow by "pictorial" example of that morale and what happens if you do something bad. Now, if you are 30 years old, do you expect your parents to come and retell the same old Fable Stories to get the morale they want you to understand? No, right? WHY? Did your parents lied to you when you are 5 years old and telling the truth now? Are you going to say the Morale is false because your parents "represented" in a straightforward manner and didn't to the same thing as they did 5 years ago? Ability to accept Truth depends not on the Truth itself, but in ability to understand and draw the Truth from its means of delivery (whether in straightforward manner or through stories). In another word ... IF you want to know Truth, Grow Up first. /images/graemlins/smirk.gif

And I believe the single-celled lifeformed was the earlier results of this. Lord Brahma probably did what the Bible (however corrupted it may) said "God" did - create Life (they didn't say which lifeform, did they?) by "His" own image. "Image" of Lord Brahma is single-minded and single-purposed. His task was to create. So, He probably created lifeforms which mimic Him in lower-level - single-celled organisms with single purpose (to break down higher level organic and inorganic materials). Just as He is without Death, Lord Brahma didn't put "Death" to the lower-lifeforms thus, a "failure" occured. His creations could only multiple continuously, and dead occured only by absorbing each other (in energy level, this is not death since the energy is transfered from one level to another equal level). Thus, produce a "waste" and there is no mechanism for Evolution to occur. I'm not very familiar with Lord Brahma's children. All I know is there was 7 Sages, if not mistaken and Narada is one of them. I also don't know why some refused and some couldn't either. Design of Male and Female worked because they provided means of carrying genes from two separate organisms into a single individual who has at least 25% of both parent's genes, and 50% chance of acquiring their own individual set of genes (to pass to their children). Thus, in Evolutional level, this is a success. And besides, none of us are complaining about design of Male and Females, are we?

Again, you have demonstrated that you do not know History. Jews cannot be compared with Japan or anyother in the scale of enemity they have developed in the last couple of decades. Japan does not have enemies of the scale of muslim palestine which is pulling together a force across the world with it. Japan had BIGGER problem than Hebrews (Jews) did. They had enemies who were Koreans and Chinese for nearly 300 years or more. Over a dozen assaults were launched by Koreans throughtout History in order to capture Japan and Japanese held on. The deep hatred of this can still be felt today also. In 1930s when China and Korea was in the receiving end, the Japanese return the Koreans' and Chinese's treatment back to them tenfold. But when they lost to Americans (and sacrificed 200,000 people in two days), Japanese adapted Buddhism and learn that, Karma is a wheel. One day you on top, the next day, you under it. What you see today is Koreans and Chinese trying to rekindle their hatred toward Japan again, unsatisfied with the blows and humililations they receive and wanted to return the favour to Japan. Japan, adopting Ahimsa-type of reactions still holding firm to peace. Muslim palestine problem is a creation in the backyard of the jews, and the world is paying a price for it. And WHO and WHERE may I ask did did the Kashmir problem was created? And Al Queda problem? Philipine Muslim Separation problem? Fighting in South Thailand problem? /images/graemlins/smirk.gif Muslim-lovers like you can only see others as problem, not themselves. Real problem is Islam itself. Islam had taught that Muslims (peaceful ones) after their dead will remain in the ground for a long period. If they become good Muslims, they will not be harmed but if they were bad Muslims, they will be tortured till Judgement Day. In Judgement Day itself, this dead ones will be brought out, questioned again, and those who did not follow Islamic ways will be damned to hell permanently. This fear of double-damnation is what fuels Muslims to continue to fight. They are not fighting injustice of others toward them, they are fighting injustice of their God (according to Islam) toward them. And also, since those who died as Shayids (matrydom) do not receive punishment in the grave (while waiting for the actual punishment), it only added fire to their wanting to die a meaningless death in terrorist ways. So, don't blame terrorism to Jews for Jews have not spoilt your religion, took what is not ours, withheld what supposed to be your rightfull and such. Islam IS the source of terrorism as it gives deep fear in hearts of its followers. Jews should own the problem and fix it without the help of -USA -Other european nations -Muslim oil rich countries -without religious bodies ever taking any credit for it Hahahaha ... You should preach what you demand others. /images/graemlins/smirk.gif Who do Muslims look for peace plans? Muslim nations? No ... USA. Who runs to European nations to support other Muslims, especially during 1980s draught, Palestine Peace Plan, Economics and such? Muslims. Jews don't owe anything to or except anything from Muslim oil nations. Matter a fact, Muslim oil nations do not do anything for fellow Muslims, WHAT makes you think they will do anything for Jews? Jews (or Hindus or Buddhist for that matter) has NO religious body which takes ANY credits for ANYTHING. Christians had Vaticans and Muslims have OIC ... both are useless, by the way. Jew should fix their palestinian muslim problem just as good neighbours are expected. Else every neighbourhood of muslims living across the world can be affected with this jewish behaviour, over a period of time. We are trying ... cannot get tanks throught into your district to blow you all to hell. /images/graemlins/smirk.gif Besides, Muslims fight not because of justice, they fight because of their injust religion (toward themselves). They are commiting suicide in mass scale. Hardly any reason why Jews needs to be blamed for your religion. /images/graemlins/smirk.gif Longevity of their creations is guranteed only if the jews become enteprising without the stigma of being victims. I hope your personal opinionons on jews are worng. Else jews will be only inviting upon themselves an un-natural speed of the natures cycle of creation & destruction. It's the worlds way of saying that it can live without such pseudo productivity. Wrong ... God will look after His Chosen Flocks. Despite of over 1,000 years of abuse, ONLY two religions still stands the test of time - Judaism and Hindusm. That alone shows who God is with. We don't need your sympathy when we have God by our side, do we? Save your sympathies for your brethen when the oil supply finishes and Muslims split apart even further than now.

I thought this thread was to give suggestion to the Administrator about the forum ... why is there discussion on Shi Pradupada (or whatever his name is). Stick to the topic

Rayaru gave darshan to my enemies and helped them. but he hasnt given me darshan nor helped me. so i had decided to end up my life. Go and do better things with your life than picking up enemies. Sigh ... /images/graemlins/wink.gif I come from Muslim site where Muslims AND Atheists works together against me (Christians rarely does so), and I have no cried over this as well. If you choose to fight, then fight properly or don't fight at all. Sri Krishna don't love people who attach themselves to fruits of their actions or people who do half-hearted actions.

Who is Rayaru? Never heard that name before.

Compare India's history for the past 1,500 years to European History for the last 500 years (both during Golden Age and Decline of their religions) and compare it. IF Hindusm is created by Satan, then ask them WHICH nation prospered more and WHY. You can run a search on demons and find details stating that early Christians actually believed that Knowledge was brought in by Demons who used it to tempt Christians away from Christianity.

So, you saying that if you see a man take a gun and about to shoot someone else; and if you have a chance to stop him, you will not do so because, to the victim, it is victim's karma to be killed?

as a hindu i would have to disagree with this as evolution is proven. Even so scientists don't have the entire details, Evolution theory is proven and provided enough to proof that Man evolved in such stated. And NO, Vedic point of view is NOT against Evolution. Matter a fact, you can scan through this forum and find several links under my nickname where I have provided several arguements to support Vedas are in level with Evolutional theory and more. You will find it interesting.

dinasors are not mentioned. True ... Dinosaurs not mentioned but others like Protozoa, single-cell organisms, Cambrian Explosion, Pangean Continent and Evolution of Man is mentioned (in an indirect way) in Puranas from the 1st Avatar all the way to Sri Krishna. god, being supreme, does not need to experiment and learn from it for new design. god has all teh designs he wants, and can make any new design instantly just bu wishing it. Not according to Purana, He didn't. Job of creating falls down to Lord Brahma and, according to Puranas, the first lifeforms has no death so considered "failure". Then Lord Shiva was brought forward and the wheel of Creation - Annihilation is complete. it can also be argued that god did not bother what kind of bodies souls want. he let them chose for themselves. if this is the case, then the desires of each soul to survive and live in certain environment made a body suitable for the soul, but still god did play part in it, because, unless god wishes something does not happen. this argument can explain evolution as the learning by the soul to wish and get different kinds of bodies where god did not play direct role but just supportive. Mind showing me some proof on this? That God didn't play direct role but a supportive one. I say He did play a direct role by initializing the Cambrian Explosion which brought in Mitochondria and creation of new bodily functions. From there, a push in the right direction brought forward Man as we know today.

This is wierd. Why would anyone want to identify with a community which considers itself as victim and exploited for One thousand four hundred years. Jews are productive by nature and enterprising, and this victim-impression upon them will make their actions only imbalance any possibility of stability where-ever. Wrong ... do you know WHY Jews have become productive and enterprising by nature? Because Jews have been victimized by others. Instead of accepting it as faith, Jews strive forward in every field they could venture into while holding onto their own beliefs. Very much like what the Japanese (Buddhist) are doing now also, after their defeat in 1945s. While you claim to be a theist, there is no sense of surrender by assuming that God is now in your side. Surrender is to say that you are in god's side. Surrender which you spoke of and Surrender which I know of is two different thing. For a Muslim, Surrender means do stupid things and say it is Will of God (like following how Muhammad wash his a$$). /images/graemlins/smirk.gif For a Christian, Surrender means accept Jesus as Savior ... never mind the fact that no one (non-Christians) can proof whether he existed or not. /images/graemlins/smirk.gif For a Hindu, Surrender means to devoid of taking fruits of the action and summit it to God, thus cutting one's self from the Karma which follows due to that action. For Buddhist, same as above except Buddhist do not summit it to God but avoid doing something with negavite (or positive) emotions. For a Jewish person, it same as above, do according to what Laws had stated and hope God will be happy with your conducts according to the Laws. In this context, Jews srive to make God happy (not themselves) by their conducts. The twisted Surrender here is Muslims ... they summit actions, NOT fruits of the actions. The fruits is still theirs to enjoy (pleasure or pain, love or hate, anger or calmness etc). This is because Muhammad taught them how to summit action but not the fruit of the actions.

gandarvas are not extraterrestrial beings as in todays concept of aliens. they refer to the people of gandhara, modern day nothern afghanistan (centered around kandahar) I persume Maharishi Narada is an Afghan as well? /images/graemlins/smirk.gif Because according to Skanda Purana, Narada was a Gandharva who were good at music. During one of his playing of music (during a ceremony) in heaven, his attention was distracted by present of Asparas and he was cursed to be born on Earth. By your defination, you can say, Narada was an Afghan and his king kick him out to India. /images/graemlins/smirk.gif

I was sitting alone in my car and think about Yama Dharma again (We have a common bond, so attend to do that sometimes ) and thought how ALL life on this Planet comes to an end. Then I remember that low-level lifeforms such as bacteria, ameaboes etc didn't have a "true" death because they don't die. What they do is, they multiply by replicating itself into another "copy" of itself. Even by consuming another low-level lifeforms, the consumed ones do not die but absorbed into the other lifeforms. So, I thought, Yama Dharma had his limits after all, when something "hit" me. I finally found Lord Brahma's "failure". He was speaking of this low-level lifeforms which first appeared on the Planet 3 Billion years ago. It fit perfectly ... a lifeform which has a beginning but no end. It continues to strive and multiply without a purpose and seemingly a waste of creation. It breaks down organic and inorganic materials, which probably the reasons for it's existence. So, why is it considered a "failure"? Simply because, there is no advancement in low-level lifeforms. Bacteria and Ameobeos do not evolve forward into higher-level lifeforms, they just go round and around in multiple, absorb old ones and multiple further. Source : http://wwwf.countryday.net/FacStf/ms/schniebec/Time/Geologic%20Time%20Line.htm I now open thread for debate.

I was reading through some sites regarding Yama Dharma a few months ago and noticed something interesting. It said, according to the Purana, Lord Brahma's first attempt to create Life was a "failure" because the creation didn't have an ending (or Death/Annihilation). So, Lord Brahma brought forward Lord Shiva /Rudra to help Him destroy what He had created. So, I was wondering about this "failure" which Lord Brahma made. What was it? Why did it considered to be a failure?

While singapore/london would have great infrastructure expense, there is no guarnatee that when disaster strikes they are going to be more resilient than cities in india. While it is true what you say, I believe if disasters struck in London and Singapore, the authorities will know what to do and how to do is faster. From the news I see, it seems many of the help comes from local people (aided by Police and such), using crude materials and equipments and sere strength to save lives. For a country which boost 7% economical growth and Nuclear and Stallite capabilities, India could at least provide some technology to save life, no? The chances of resilience is high in india as we are a denser population than other countries. And in the end of the day, there is no help like the help from a fellow human being. This may also be the reason why we are more effective than other countries in foiling terrorist plots or catching terrorists. Simply fantastic, many many people, many many faces, many many people ringing the door bell, many many people to depend upon for a normal living. Don't be so over-confident. USA also boosted the same way back in 1943 before Pearl Harbour and before the Sept-11 Incident. But one thing I love about Indian Police is ... they don't cut any slacks in saving their homeland (unlike US's Armed forces). British following good example also - shoot first and ask later. /images/graemlins/grin.gif

While Man can sit and wait for changes (because of their own limitations) God will not. I believe He had already taken steps because I have seen changes is coming slowly to India. India's fall into materialism and rejecting Spiritualims as basis is because of Colonial influence and also because of India choosing America as a role model. First steps India can take is pushing aside this corrupted role model and choose another. I see India begin to look toward the East to Malaysia (where fellow Indians live) and toward Japan. This is a start in a step toward changes.

Ah yes, very true. There have even been some moron hindus that tried to make out that jesus and mohammed were avatars of God, even though their message is different. These hindus always shy away from explaining how come the religions' messages are so contradictory. Beware of such people for they prey upon the unsuspecting and young ones in your society. Also, Lack of knowledge and new meanings in old puranas is another reasons why such people can easily influence youngsters nowadays. But it's hard to believe that the Vedic civilasation being so great but still couldn't work out how to write and needed outside help from Aryans to learn how to write. What was the language of Aryans at that time since they were from outside India? Actually, India had its own writing system but it was not advanced as wha Aryans brought in. According to excavations into Harappan civilizations, they have found an ancient writing systems which pre-dated the language brought in by Aryans. This shows that India had its own writing. Unfortunately, this writing didn't branch into other higher forms (like Aryan writing branch to Sankrit) and died out. Records found in Harappan ruins are left untranslated because of this factor. Another factor on why India didn't produce its own writing is because, India didn't need one. India had one elements other ancient civilization didn't have (thus needed writing skills) - they had Brahmins. We are talking about a specialized group of highly intelligence people who's sole purpose in existence was to memory (words for words) the Puranas and the Gita. This people are living libraries and also researchers, doctors, scientists and so on. And since they do not do other work, do not go to war and supported by the government, they have no other duties but to ensure that the puranas and Gita is well-perserved. Maybe God knows Christians and Muslims going to come, so He send Hebrews with their writing skills first to ensure some of their old ways are perserved. By the way the Vedas mention the Aryas, but if the Vedas were passed down through oral tradition before the Aryas (Aryans) came into India, which Aryas were the Vedas alredy talking about? I believe the Aryas which Vedas spoke off is not the ones who brought the writings but the ones which lives in societies in Mesotamphia region up to 4,600 years. The so-called "Invasion" is maybe the migration of Aryans after the flood into India and British could have mistaken Muslims for being Aryans (because both are white-skinned, settled in the northern section, do not mix much with dark-skinned Shivatties and also came from the West).

You have your words to speak about you, your awareness level and spiritual growth. Yes, and I may agree that Dr. David Frawley is person who has deep awareness and good spiritual growth, but in the end, I don't know him. All I know is God (whether you call Him Lord Vishnu or Lord Shiva) and all I trust is God, NOT fellow men's words which they themselves sometimes utter by mistake. Truth hidden by God within your scriptures. God also gave you intelligence and awareness to grow by finding that Truth. That is your responsiblity, NOT to follow someone's words blindly just because he has the title "Doctor" in front of his name. Did it not India recently stopped the usage of ALL NON-Medical personals from using the name "Doctor" in their initials?

As there is no reason why the Jews cannot live without the victim-image, similarly there is no point comparing the victim-images of Jews/Japanese/Muslims. Statement from someone stuck and cannot speak. /images/graemlins/wink.gif Yes, there IS point in comparing victim-image (as you called it) of Jew, Japanese and Muslims(?). The past 1,400 years, Jews have been victims of Christianity and Islam - Fact. Japanese suffered the atomic bombs because of their Karma (actions during the war) - Fact. Muslims are suffering - False. Therefore my answer to your first three question is, Prove it to me that Jews of TODAY CANNOT live without their historical image of Holocaust-victims. You answered NOTHING. My question was : WHAT evil events that Jews had done to the extend that Holocaust was acceptable to occur on them? Let's look at the problems from your own statement : -The terrorism from palestine is being globalised. Who conduct Terrorism? Muslims who cannot accept the peace treaty from negoitations since 1950s. -Lots more muslims are considering themselves as victims in their home-country WW by continously relating their situation to that of the muslims in Isreal. Who's playing Victim-Image now, huh? /images/graemlins/smirk.gif Jews are not responsible for delusional fools who consider themselves as Victims. /images/graemlins/wink.gif -With the involvement of imams and religious leaders, the palestine issue is not becoming viewed as a roti-kapada-makan issue, but lot volatile. Again, nothing to do with Jews. This is affairs of Muslims as Imans and their leaders are more concern about waging war than living. -But for jews the muslims would have been a far more tolerent religion Islam NEVER was a tolerant religion and NEVER WILL BE one either. To say otherwise is to say Muslims NEVER invaded India and other countries. -The world is paying a huge price to entertain a community as victims of the past. This price the world pays will get lot bigger, if we don't stop this psuedo emotion of considering the jewish community as holocaust-victims. The so-called drama of "We are the Victims here" is played out by Muslims who have NO interest in living a proper lives. The religion didn't promote peace, their imans and leaders WILL NOT promote peace and Muslims WILL NOT find peace. Jews should help the fellow muslims voluntarily without waiting for a permission or help from US or other european countries. Jews should just do it. They will only benefit. They should resign from the psuedo-fear of the holocaust. We don't have fear of the holocaust ... it is something which had passed and no use of crying over it (unlike some race who always do their level best to potray themselves as Victims). Therefore, we don't need to help anyone for free without any beneficts for us. Instead of wasting the resources in helping a race which don't bother helping itself, we can use that resource in helping and advancing our own societies (that include non-Muslims like Hindus and Buddhist as well). Agreed, that the jews require to seperately take help to overcome the fear of the holocaust repeating itself, similar to that of a tsunami-affected victim or that of the mumbai-floods. The Holocaust WILL NOT repeat. Do you know why? Because the oppossers WILL be crushed and vanquished. It just matter of time. In the past, Jews were separated from the World which surrounded by Christians and Muslims, so they view the entire world as an enemy and didn't learn other people's culture and religion. God changed that by allowing the Internet to come to be ... now Jews can approach other oppressed races who are in the same boat as they are (Hindus and Buddhists). In the past, Jews were victims because of their depends on Christians and Muslims. Now, we will become something you need to depend on or perish. Also, Jews were victims because they didn't have technology and Science to use. That has changing now with America (Jewish/Christian) being 2nd advantaged country in the world, Japan (Buddhist) being the 1st (because they are good at implementing what they learn) and IF India (Hindus) could only become like what it was a Trinity of Power which will ensure such thing as Holocaust will not occur again. Also, Muslim nations are collapsing ... their time limit is almost up. Their powers resides in Oil (God given them to be fair also) and that will be finished in about 25 to 30 years or so. Japan already pionering in alternative fuel and America is trying to catch up. Muslims WILL be left behind to die a horrible death. /images/graemlins/smirk.gif

pl read David Frawley before making any comment. His is a must be read for any Hindu. Hindus should read what some white man said about Hindusm in order to understand Hindusm? Very funny. What writen in the Historical Datas and Archological finds is enough for me. It is not a single person's account of what he think is right but data which is accepted and proven by numerous historians and archeologists with proof. My proof is Mitochondria Eve Theory, Out-Of-Africa Theory, Studiest on Rosatta Stone (regarding ancient civilization in Mesotamphia region) and many more. Your proof is this person named David Frawley.