Jahnava Nitai Das

No, actually you attempted to make a logical conclusion as to the reason why Prabhupada said what he said: But that stance didn't hold up to the rest of your post, as you showed Prabhupada said things which would not appeal to certain audiences. In other words, he was not just speaking to satisfy everyone around him. When he said Christ was a pure devotee, it wasn't to attract Christians, but rather because he truly believed Christ was a pure devotee of God.

Your logic is self contradictory. On one hand you claim Srila Prabhupada spoke to satisfy one group (christians), yet the other statements you attribute to him will not satisfy any of the connected groups (africans, women,etc.).

This post was removed because the person who posted it was previously banned for not following the rules of the forum. Those who refuse to follow the minimal rules will not be allowed to post messages, even as "guest".

Today the forums were down for several hours as we upgraded the software again. If you notice any bugs please report them to me by email: bvashram@

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This has already been discussed here: http://www.indiadivine.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=UBB1&Number=2717&page=&view=&sb=&o=&fpart=1&vc=1

Devotees of ISKCON do not accept Jesus as God, but as a shaktyavesha-avatara, an empowered living entity. Thus there is a clear difference between someone saying Sai Baba is God, and someone saying Jesus was an empowered saint. Personally, I rely on the words of the saints to identity the liberated souls, not on a confused notion of history.

Haribol! I had made a mistake. I reviewed the picture again to make sure I understood what they were saying, and I had made a mistake. I just checked it in photoshop a second time, and it is true, the colors of the squares are identical. It was hard for me to believe, but it is true. This is a pretty amazing optical illusion.

Crooked Disciples By Sri Srimad Gour Govinda Swami The following article appeared in issue number 10 of Sri Krishna Kathamrita Bindu, the free fortnightly email magazine from ISKCON Gopal Jiu Publications. Once a guru went to the house of one of his disciples. The disciple prepared nice food, and after the guru had eaten, the disciple wanted to show his guru-bhakti. In Ayurveda the haritaki fruit is recommended for good digestion, so the disciple came with haritaki for his guru. The guru said, "All right. Remove the unnecessary things and give me the necessary part." That disciple was a speculator, a crooked person. He thought, "Oh, the outer portion of the haritaki is unnecessary and the inner portion is necessary." So he threw away the outer skin and gave the inner portion, the hard seed, to the guru. But with haritaki the outer skin is necessary and the inner portion is thrown away. That disciple did the opposite because he was a speculator— bharavahi, saragrahi nahin— he always accepted the unnecessary things that are not the essence. His guru could not enjoy the haritaki. "You are such a unintelligent fellow," he said. "Don't you know? The inner portion, the hard nut of haritaki, is unnecessary. The outer portion, the skin, is necessary." Incurable The next day, after the guru had eaten, that so-called disciple brought some cardamom. Remembering the previous day's event, he thought, "Oh, the guru has taught that this inner portion is unnecessary and this outer portion is necessary." So he threw away the inner portion of the cardamom and offered the outer skin to the guru. But with cardamom, the seed is necessary and the skin is useless. That means that those who are kapati, crooked persons, only speculate. They will not accept anything as it is. Therefore the mahajanas have said that one who is very serious and eager to achieve perfection in his human birth, that is krsna-bhakti, should cultivate simplicity. Simplicity is Vaishnavism. Those who are real vaisnavas are simple by nature. Kapatya, crookedness, is a great hindrance on this path of perfection. It is a sort of disease. And because a crooked person becomes envious towards the doctor who has come to cure him, his disease is incurable. In Bhakti-Sandarbha, Jiva Goswami has said that there are many such persons who pretend to be devoted, but inside their heart there is great crookedness. Outwardly they pay dandavats, falling down like a rod from a great distance, as if they are very humble. Yet they criticize sadhu, acarya, and gurus. They may even offer worship, but actually they have no respect at all. They are very keen to find out the faults of the sadhu. Such persons take to karma, jnana, yoga, tapasya, tyaga, and niti— fruitive activities, speculative knowledge, penance, renunciation, and morality. Externally they practice these things and pose as if they are of very high moral character, but actually their hearts are very hard. Unreal Shelter Those persons who leave the bona fide guru and go elsewhere due to crookedness cannot be delivered. In Skanda Purana it is said, bhumau skhalita-padanam, bhumir evavalambanam — "If your feet slip up from the ground, only that same ground can give you shelter." Similarly, if you have slipped up from the lotus feet of a bona fide guru, only that guru can give you shelter. A crooked person who pretends to be a humble follower of the guru will leave that guru and go somewhere else to take shelter. But he should understand that no one can give him shelter. It may seem that someone may give him shelter, but that is not real shelter at all because he cannot make any advancement there. Rather, for his offense he will definitely fall down and go to hell. If he does not come back to his guru and beg to be excused, his offense cannot be destroyed or counteracted. If he is really an intelligent, simple-hearted person, he will understand this and come back. Unless he comes back, he must be entrapped by this crookedness. In this way, Jiva Goswami has discussed kapatya in his Bhakti-Sandarbha, and how it is a great stumbling block on the path of devotional service. Stool of a Hog Sastra, sadhus, and mahajanas have all warned us about kapatya. But still you will find this crookedness going on in the Vaisnava community. Why is it that people do not become simple? It is because they are running after name, fame, and prestige. Our Vaisnava acaryas have said, vaisnava pratistha, sukarera vistha, such fame is the stool of a hog. A real Vaisnava will never run after it. But all are running after this by cultivating crookedness. "How can I get labha, puja and pratistha? How can I get worship from others and occupy a superior position?" Those who think in this way cannot understand that an incurable disease has infected them. They have given up kanaka and kamini, wealth and women, but they have not given up this pratistha, the desire for worldly reputation. ========== Sri Krishna Kathamrita Bindu is published every ekadasi in PDF format, and is designed for those who want to go deep into the pastimes, philosophy, literature, and history of Gaudiya Vaishnavism. Bindu regularly features articles from previous acaryas such as Srila A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada, Srila Thakur Bhaktivinode, Viswanath Chakravarti, Rupa Goswami etc., as well as new translations, research findings and contemporary articles. Sri Krishna Kathamrita Bindu is being produced in pursuance of the instructions of Sri Srimad Gour Govinda Swami, whose articles are also a common feature. Sri Krishna Kathamrita Bindu contains no politics, mundane solicitations, or institution promotion or bashing — only pure Krishna-katha. It is produced by ISKCON Gopal Jiu Publications, Bhubaneswar, Orissa, India.

My guess is the original drawing or painting may be real (and thus the illusion probably exists), but the digitized version present here is not.

I took the graphic over to Photoshop to compare the two grays, and they are no where similar. One is way, way darker than the other.

Knowledge should be taken from anywhere, just as gold is taken even from a dirty place. Any statement that is in line with the Vedas is apaurusheya regardless of the language it may be conveyed in. The root form of all knowledge is beyond langauge, it is within the consciousness. Externally we may manifest it in the form of vaikhari sound through langauges, but the actual meaning is beyond all language. Thus even our Vedas are mundane sound on the external level, but when communicated to the soul they manifest their original form as shabda. The same apaurusheya knowledge of the Vedas can manifest in a different mundane dialect, but the essential nature remains the same.

The Niti-shastra and the Vedanta (Upanishads) speak on completely different topics and have very little to do with each other. It is like saying if my history text book isn't in line with my math text book, then we reject it. Math and history are two separate topics and we cant expect one to speak about the other.

Yes, there is reference in the Matsya Purana.

Vatican confirms Mother Teresa 'miracle' Action brings nun a step closer to canonization From Satinder Bindra Tuesday, October 1, 2002 Posted: 3:59 PM EDT (1959 GMT KOLKATA, India (CNN) -- Two things are certain. Doctors said a cancerous tumor ballooned Monika Besra's stomach to the size of a woman's in the last trimester of pregnancy. Now, the cancer is gone. The mystery surrounding her recovery will bring the sainthood of Roman Catholic nun Mother Teresa one step closer. Besra, 30, claims that within 24 hours of arriving at a home operated by the Mother Teresa's order and praying to the deceased missionary, her tumor vanished. Besra's sudden and complete recovery stunned her doctors, who insist their diagnosis was accurate. They have repeatedly examined her for signs of surgery and found none. After consulting with doctors, a Vatican panel found no scientific explanation for the Kolkata homemaker's recovery and deemed her healing a miracle, an Italian news agency reported. The church has conferred the title of "venerable" on Mother Teresa, who died in 1997, renowned around the world for dedicating her life to the poor. Now, if the church can establish that Mother Teresa performed another miracle, she will be declared a saint. Besra's physician, R.N. Bhattaccharya, agrees with the Vatican committee's conclusion. "I did not find any reason that without an operation a tumor of such size would disappear overnight," he said. "So I think maybe the Mother's blessings were on Monika...." The committee's conclusion launches the fourth step of a five-part process in designating Mother Teresa a saint. Doctors had determined that Besra's tumor was the size of a 7-month-old fetus. They elected not to perform surgery, believing she was too weak to survive an operation. As a last measure, in September 1998, Besra went to The Missionaries of Charity, a home Mother Teresa's order operates. "As soon as I stepped into the church, there was a photograph of Mother Teresa, and there was a light from the photograph that came toward me and I was stunned," Besra told CNN. "Later, the sisters prayed for me, and I went to sleep. When I got up at 1 in the morning, I found the big tumor had disappeared.'' The Roman Catholic church is bending its own rules by starting the beatification process for the late nun before the usual five-year waiting period after death. Mother Teresa died in 1997, but she is purportedly on the fast track to sainthood because the pope is one of her biggest supporters. He wants to promulgate her message of love and kindness to the poor. Besra said she thinks about Mother Teresa all the time, and her doctor said it is a professional milestone for him. "It is difficult to describe what I felt with this whole event," Bhattaccharya said. "But this is one of the very wonderful experiences that I ever had in my medical career."

This is probably a school report of some sort. Why don't we all try answering it from each of our perspectives and see what we come up with. I will post something when I get sometime.

Unfortunately AOL is giving big ranges, like in this case 172.34 - 172 .65 (second digit variable, not only third). I dont want to ban the complete 172.x IP, as it is too broad. So I am slowly banning each exact one as they come up.

I can ban IP ranges, but I dont want to ban other users of AOL from other nearby cities, so I was doing it the slow way.

Dear Guest: 1) Agenda posts are deleted. 2) Spam is deleted. 3) Posts in wrong forums are deleted. IPs who do the above get banned. Since AOL gives several different IPs each time you dial up, you will be able to hang around awhile till all your IPs get banned.

Yes, there is. Messages that are not spiritual discussions will be deleted and IPs of offending posters will be banned.

Actually, Hare Krishna's should preach their own beliefs, not beliefs forced down their throats by westernized Hindus who couldn't care less about their religious beliefs. The beliefs of the Hare Krishna's are very clear and established by the founder of their organization. If you or anyone does not like those beliefs, then you are free to start your own organization that preaches the opposite, or whatever it is you want to preach. It is stupid to demand others to preach your own beliefs simply because you disagree with theirs.

OFFICIAL MESSAGE FROM THE GBC EXECUTIVE COMMITTEE REGARDING VIPRAMUKHYA DASA Dear devotees, Please accept our humble obeisances. All glories to Srila Prabhupada. It is with heavy hearts that we inform you of the departure of Vipramukhya prabhu from his services as guru and sannyasa. He has been a dedicated servant of Srila Prabhupada's movement over the last 29 years: a kind and considerate person, an attractive preacher, and always jovial and fun to be with. In recent years he took on the great burden of being the temple president of Bhaktivedanta Manor, one of Srila Prabhupada's flagship temples. Of course his departure from sannyasa also raises other questions regarding how to better help maintain all our sannyasi's in their chosen asrama. This indeed is a subject that will require more thoughtful reflection and meditation and one that requires a very measured and considered response. In the meantime we wish Vipramukhya prabhu well during this difficult time and are looking forward to and praying for his association again in the not too distance future. To all of Vipramukhya prabhu's disciples and followers we also offer our heartfelt concerns and request them (as Vipramukhya prabhu has himself) to take shelter in Srila Prabhupada and Srila Prabhupada's senior disciples in ISKCON, who in turn will humbly try to serve and guide you through this difficult moment in your spiritual lives. Your servants, Giridhari Swami, Bhakti Caitanya Swami, Gopal Krsna Goswami, Bir Krishna das Goswami, Praghosa dasa.

The brahma sutra (or vedanta sutra) is a treatise written by vyasa as a conclusion to vedic knowledge. Vedanta refers to the Upanishads (veda anta meaning "the end of the Vedas"). The Vedanta sutras provide a conclusion to the Upanishads. Prior to Vyasa's Vedanta Sutra, six sages formulated six different schools of vedantic thought, known as the shad-darshanas (six views). Each school used the Upanishads to establish an ultimate source of creation, but they each misunderstood the conclusion of the Upanishads in various ways. For example, one school established the atom as the source of everything, another established the material nature as the absolute source, another established karma as the origin of all. In this way, each school utilized the Upanishads to develop their school of thought, but they all missed the ultimate source, the absolute truth Sri Krishna, or Brahman. Thus Vyasa composed this treatise (the brahma sutra) in response to the six misunderstandings of the Upanishads in order to establish Brahman (Sri Krishna) as the ultimate source of everything. For more information, please read the following article: Vedanta and Six Systems of Philosophy http://www.indiadivine.com/upanishads-darshanas1.htm

Tha seems like a good idea. Come up with a name for the thread, and keep posting additions as replies. This way others wont complain of cluttering.