Guruvani

Isn't it amazing that us "filthy mlecchas" still have the audacity to preach Bhagavat Dharma and pontificate to the Vaishnavas and other assorted living entities? I mean, if we really felt like "filthy mlecchas" would we really be pontificating and preaching to the Vaishnava community? Enough of the false humility already!! Me, I am Bhagavat Siddha, so therefore I have some authority to pontificate. ( a little humor my friends, just a little humor)

Thats a little bit hypocritical coming from a guy who follows a branch of Gaudiya Matha that has never given female devotees the dignity and rights that ISKCON women enjoyed. No branch or sect of the Gaudiya Matha has ever given female devotees the respect and dignity that Srila Prabhupada gave the women of ISCKON. Srila Prabhupada took prostitutes off the street and gave them respect and dignity. No faction of the Gaudiya Matha ever treated women with as much concern and care as did ISKCON and Srila Prabhupada. Manu is an avatar of Lord Vishnu, so if you have a problem with Manu-samhita it's because you think you know better than the Manvantar incarnations of the Lord. But then again, you appear to be saying you know better than Srila Prabhupada, Lord Vishnu and who else next?

What is very curious though, is that ISKCON, with all it's ills, it's scandals, it's controversies and it's checkered past, is still the world leader in fulfilling the dream and the vision of Srila Bhaktivinode Thakur to take Sanatan Dharma to all the peoples of the world. No branch, faction or remnant of the Gaudiya Matha can ever come close to what ISKCON is still accomplishing today with spreading the mission of Sri Caitanya, even in it's crippled condition. Now, thats amazing and a testimony to the greatness of Srila Prabhupada and what he established. So, what does that say, that even a crippled and controversial ISKCON is still dancing circles around any of the Gaudiya Matha splinter groups when it comes to spreading the Sankirtan movement all over the world to fulfill the mission of Mahaprabhu? Even today, ISKCON is the only hope. These other missions and movements that are feeding off of the conquests of Srila Prabhupada and ISKCON will never be anything more than little fish feeding off of the remnants of the great shark Srila Prabhupada.

Well, Srila Prabhupada told that the Godbrothers ruined the Gaudiya Matha and since he was a disciple of Saraswati Thakur and you are not and since Srila Prabhupada was there to see it and you were not and since you get a very colored version of the events from one party line, there is a good chance that maybe your version of events doesn't jive with what Srila Prabhupada told. To say that the Gaudiay Matha wasn't destroyed is simply a look at the brick and mortar. If you look at the actual facts its quite obvious that his leading diciples failed to execute the orders and the mission of Srila Saraswati Thakur and branched out into splinter groups that dropped the ball on Srila Saraswati Thakur's mission. Maybe you have a different opinion than Srila Prabhupada? Your opinion is based on second hand information, party politics and an attempt at cover-up. Srila Prabhupada was there and got the chance to observe the events from an objective viewpoint. His opinion was based on the facts. Your opinion is based on the cover-up over a half century later.

and you are also free to nurture you illusion that the "whiskered one" was the answer to all of ISKCON's ills, whilst hundreds of his "disciples" have no temples, no training and no service apart from haunting the internet forums and boasting about sadhu-sanga which they maybe get a few minutes a year. Most of the disciples of the "whiskered one" have no temples, no service and no sanga most of the time and all their talk about the need for a physical guru amounts to no more than a few minutes a year. Oh, I guess if you 10 minutes a year of "physical sanga" that makes everything ok? Jackals that live off of the kill of the Lion should never forget who the Lion is and who is the KING OF THE JUNGLE. Srila Prabhupada ki-jaya!!!!

Don't put words in Srila Prabhupada's mouth. He never appointed you to speak for him. He never said anything about admitting his Godbrothers were right. That's a lie. These Gaudiya Matha Swamis all initiated lots of people who never kept up their vows or kept up any proper guru-seva, so there isn't one of them who is in a position to criticize Srila Prabhupada. Who were they? They appointed an acharya to the Gaudiya Matha that resulted in the ruination of the Gaudiya Math. For these Gaudiya Matha sannyasis there could be no greater sin than the destruction of the mission of Srila Saraswati Thakur. A least Srila Prabhupada didn't destroy the mission of his spiritual master like these "godbrothers" did. None of them were in any position to criticise Srila Prabhupada. Their ruination of the Gaudiya Matha and failure to follow the instructions of Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Saraswati Thakur nullified any right they had to criticize Srila Prabhupada who actually accomplished great things in service to his spiritual master while the "bell-ringers" sat around their Mathas waiting for people to drop a coin in the collection box.

Srila Prabhupada isn't the only "guru" who gave sannyasa to men who fell down. When most of them got sannyasa they were practicing a respectable level of sadhana and had some preaching skills, but later, for some reason or other, they fell down. So, to say that Srila Prabhupada gave sannyasa to a bunch of unqualifieds is offensive in my view, because when he gave them sannyasa they were all fixed-up in the regulative principles, chanting their rounds and natural leaders within ISKCON. Srila Prabhupada didn't give sannyasa to a bunch of derelicts. He gave sannyasa to leading disciples who were natural leaders and helping him move ISKCON forward in the direction of progress. Later, they stumbled as many others have done in the past and many more will do in the future. The men that Srila Prabhupada gave sannyasa to showed lots of promise and were motivators and preachers in ISKCON. To say that Srila Prabhupada was giving out sannyasa to unqualified men is very harsh and rude. Srila Prabhupada needed some Generals and Captains in his army. He chose the men that were best positioned for that as the most charismatic and dynamic personalities. He did the best he could with what he had to work with.

There are many paths and many religions, many gods and many books of knowledge. Some foolish people like to think that you can follow any path and everyone is going to end up at the same destination. Well, that is just their wishful thinking. Each path will take you to a particular destination and these destinations have comparitive gradations of higher and lower. The Puranas and other books of knowledge given by self-realized sages and rishis have delineated the comparitive understanding of the different levels of consciousness that correspond to these different levels of existence. Sure, everybody can pick and choose what faith or what religion or what yoga practice they choose, but they all produce a different result. All roads don't lead to Rome. Worshiping gods that keep you in the material world of birth and death is not the same as worshiping the Surpeme Personality of Godhead who can award mukti to his devotees.

Srila Bhaktivinode: This is the actual Vaishnava siddhanta. The attempt to stereotype the concept of Parampara and bottle it up, put it in a cage and hold it ransom by a horde of unfit "gurus" is not what the Vaishnava siddhanta is actually about. The dictums of the great modern sages like Srila Prabhupada are every bit as spiritual as anything the ancient sages of bygone eras have given. This is the siddhanta. Self-realized sages establish religious codes according to the necessity they see. Parampara is not dogma. It's a lineage of descending knowledge. There is more than one way to transmit knowledge now that human society is out of the stone age. Apparently, we still have some cavemen around who like to do it the old fashioed way.

Srila Prabhupada - instructions to Hansadutta)

As far as the term "ritvik" is concerned, Srila Prabhupada personally used the term several times. He also sent letters to some of his senior men instructing to continue to be "ritvik" and develop their preaching in that way. Tamal first heard the term from Srila Prabhupada before the "ritvik" appointments and was simply recalling the way in which Srila Prabhupada had previously referred to his representatives who initiated disciples on behalf of Srila Prabhupada. Tamal didn't know Sanskrit. He couldn't even read the script. (even I can do that). So, when he brought up the term ritvik in regards to the "officiating acharyas" he was simply wanting to understand this position in terms of Sanskrit nomenclature. One thing for sure, Tamal did not invent the term ritvik. Some antagonists like to propose that he did, but that is just due to their ignorance of the long history of ritvik initiation is ISKCON before 11 ritviks were given the authority to approve initiations even without final approval from the acting secretary of Srila Prabhupada. Anyone that thinks Tamal invented the term "ritvik" is wrong. Srila Prabhupada had used that term on other occasions to describe the priests in ISKCON who performed initiations on behalf of the acharya of the institution. Tamal didn't have a clue what a ritvik was before Srila Prabhupada had explained it to him previously. So, he was just recalling the terminology that Srila Prabhupada has used on other occasioins. These people who say that Tamal introduced the term "ritvik" into ISKCON are fools. They don't know what the hell they are talking about. ISKCON had ritviks for years before the appointment of the 11 officiating acharyas that Srila Prabhupada appointed. Actually these officiating acharyas were both officiating acharyas and ritvik if they approved the initiation into ISKCON as well as performed the fire sacrifice. The officiating acharyas were given authority to approve initiations in ISKCON. The ritviks were the temple presidents, brahmans and sannyasis who performed the initiation ceremony. Tamal managed to confuse everything with his lack of understanding and his tendency to want to be the supreme controller in ISKCON.

You said there is no such thing a akarma. I showed references in Sri Gita and Bhagavat to show you are wrong. You come back with arrogant condescending accusations that it is Gaudiya interpretation when Sri Gita and Bhagavat both existed long before ever there was any Gaudiya sect of Vaishnavism. It appears you have some grudge against the Gaudiyas who are a majority in this part of the forum, so it appears you are mostly here to insult and be arrogant. My guess is you are a typically confused Hindu that grew up in a family that doesn't know which demigod is which and that it doesn't matter because they are all the same One brahman? Akarma means the same thing in Sanskrit no matter which cult or sect you identify with. Your claim that something is a Gaudiya interpretation simply makes you look like an uneducated fool.

I can definitely testify without any reservation that the spiritual practice of mantra japa in regards the the Maha-mantra relieves stress and brings a feeling of happiness and blissfullness. I took quite a bit of practice to get to the point of actually realizing how powerful is mantra japa in relieving stress, but even with a serious lacking in my spiritual disciplines the mantra japa never fails to relieve a lot of stress and create a feeling of joyfulness and happiness. Mantra japa makes life a lot easier to get through. That is one reason I have never lost my faith, because the effects of mantra japa are so much more powerful than any meditation of yoga practice I have ever done. Chanting of spiritual mantras is very powerful. The pleasing effects of mantra japa is like a shower of cool fragrant water on the soul.

Here are some references to AKARMA in Sri Gita and Bhagavat Purana:

Lord Brahma prays to Lord Siva: Lord Siva is non-different than the Paramatma in the hearts of all living entities.

Srila Prabhupada:

Srila Prabhupada:

Well, the Shaivas don't have any monopoly on Siva worship. The Gaudiya Vaishnavas worship Lord Siva in his form as Sri Advaita Acharya. So, the Gaudiyas worship Lord Siva in his most cherished position as a devotee of Sri Krishna Chaitanya Mahaprabhu. Sri Krishna Chaitanya Prabhu Nityananda Sri Advaita Gadadhar Srivasadi Gaura bhakta vrinda

In terms of Puranic dharma shastras, karma is the law of cause and effect. so, karma, according to the Vedic definition, refers to the laws of material nature and how actions always result in reactions. Spiritual activity on behalf of the Supreme Absolute is not considered as karma but as "akarma" or not involving the actions and reactions of material nature. Karma-yoga is the system of performing fruitive activity and then offering the fruits of that activity unto the service of the Absolute Integer - the Supreme Spirit.(Krishna) Activity in service, obediance and harmony with the Absolute Good is known as bhakti, not karma.

The question now is who are the real scoundrels amongst the ISKCON gurus, the ones that left or that ones that stayed on to continue the fraud? Is Ramesvar really worse than the ones still hanging around ISKCON setting on thrones in the Holy dhams?

With the GBC guru system that has been adopted in ISKCON, ISKCON is now doomed to perpetual scandal, controversy and disturbance as the phenomenon of falling gurus will never go away as long as immature and unfit individuals are allowed to assume the position of acharya in ISKCON and become diksha gurus. That means that ISKCON has lost all credibility and will never get it back as long as this system of fallible gurus is conducted in ISKCON. It's not like there was only one or two disasters. There has been disaster after disaster after disaster over and over again since these fallible people have been acting as acharyas in ISKCON. This would NEVER be acceptable to Srila Prabhupada - not in a million years. Anyone who thinks that Srila Prabhupada supports the GBC guru sytsem is out of touch with reality and living in a fantasyland of illusion. Whats the solution? Is ISKCON going to die an ignonimous death at the hands of the fallible GBC guru system? Or has it already? The majority of western Vaishnavas now look at ISKCON with disgust and disappointment. Just because these people manage to make a few disciples here and there doesn't change the fact that the majority of western Vaishnavas consider ISKCON as defunct.

I don't whine and complain. I debate issues and I always present shastric references to support my viewpoints. This topic isn't about me. Can we get out of each others backside and get back to the topic at hand?

Like I already said, try not to get too personal and get off on any crusade to correct what it is you don't like about my character. I have been on these internet forums for over 5 years and I have never come upon such a whiner and complainer as you. As if you Hindus are all one big happy family? As far as worship of Lord Shiva or any other demigods is concerned, well maybe you should scold Lord Krishna for being so critical when he says: kāmais tais tair hṛta-jñānāḥ prapadyante 'nya-devatāḥ taḿ taḿ niyamam āsthāya prakṛtyā niyatāḥ svayā TRANSLATION Those whose intelligence has been stolen by material desires surrender unto demigods and follow the particular rules and regulations of worship according to their own natures. Just see! That Lord Krishna is such an extremist fanatic? Why is he talking so harshly about the demigod worshipers?

Vikram babu, You don't know me really to be making such a severe assessment of my character. Yet, I do not pose myself or present myself as being any representative of Mahaprabhu or Prabhupada or anyone. On the forums I play the role of the anti-party most of the time because I think it evokes thought, discussion and alternative ways of looking as issues. If we were all in here just having an orgy of brotherly love and mutual ego stroking of each other I think it would be very boring and intellectually constipating. I don't think you need to go on some personal crusade to assail my character as I openly admit I am not any kind of representative of anybody. I don't put tilak on my head nor do I wear Vaishnava vesh. So, attacking me for being a bad representative is not fair because I am not posing as anybody. Let's just stick to the issues and debate our own views with shastric information and not get all up into each others personal orafices over our own personalities. I debate issues on the basis of the shastric information available to me. Let's stick to the issues and avoid personal attacks on each other as you have been jabbing at me lately. I am not out to satisfy every Shaiva, Buddhist, Muslim or Christian that comes in to the forum trying to minimize Lord Krishna. When they do that, I take the opportunity to hand them their ass if possible. Sorry, that is just the kind of personality I have and I am not going to change over any tongue lashings from you babu. Other than that, Srila Prabhupada specifically mentioned that "nitai gaura radhe syam" mantra as a mantra of the sahajiyas, so I think it is very unbecoming of you to be using that mantra as your personal slogan in your forum signature. then again, my opinion isn't worth a rat's ass, so you shouldn't be very concerned about it.

One thing for sure, if you are performing a Vedic sacrifice in pursuance of karma-kanda rituals, you certainly don't want to forget to invite Lord Shiva to participate. No doubt, Siva is the next most powerful god to Lord Vishnu. His followers should definitely not piss him off by offending his Lord Krishna or the Vaishnavas.