theist 1 Report post Posted July 26, 2003 Abortion and reincarnation/karma http://www.reincarnation-abortion.org/index.html Is there a Krsna bhakta counterpart to this Christian oriented effort? Just an idea for the web savvy Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
I_love_krishna_ 0 Report post Posted July 26, 2003 They believe that they are pregnant at an early age because of their Karma?! As if it was already written? I think they should reconsider what they are teaching in their website. Saying pregnancy is not in their control is preposterous. They have sex at a certain time, they can be pregnant. It is something they can control. They chose to have sex and they have to deal with it or get an abortion. Both ruin their life anyway, its a sad story. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
I_love_krishna_ 0 Report post Posted July 26, 2003 They have twisted the principle of Reincarnation , so that they may say , reincarnation is only for those who have not lived their life to the fullest. I think they should read hindu and buddhist scriptures all over again. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
theist 1 Report post Posted July 26, 2003 Well reincarnation is only for those of us who are not living up to our full potential. I just brought it up as a seed idea for someone to run a similar website that may be similar in message but from Krsna conscious shastra. I mean how many click the word abortion into their web search everyday. On the site one could explain why abortion is horrid karma and slip some even higher conceptions of the soul in as well,along with the maha-mantra. The denial of the human form which is the only boat for transversing the ocean of birth and death could be more fully explained as a main opotion point to abortion. they touched on it but a devotee may fill it out more. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted July 26, 2003 Haribol, theist, thanks for starting this topic instead of usin the other one. I just have a little time today, but I wanted to make a political point here. Kicinich's change, as alluded to on the other topic, is not a happy one for me. I never really appreciated those against abortion who nevertheless, did nothing about it. But, the fact that one candidate states he will not interfere with rowe vs wade does not necessarily disturb me for the following reason. The christian right and the neo-cons have a strong rhetorical platform on this rowe v wade issue, but where are they. These fanatics control all three branches of our government, yet rowe vs wade is not going anywhere. Ill continue right away. mahak Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mahak 0 Report post Posted July 26, 2003 Haribol, theist, thanks for starting this topic instead of usin the other one. I just have a little time today, but I wanted to make a political point here. Kicinich's change, as alluded to on the other topic, is not a happy one for me. I never really appreciated those against abortion who nevertheless, did nothing about it. But, the fact that one candidate states he will not interfere with rowe vs wade does not necessarily disturb me for the following reason. The christian right and the neo-cons have a strong rhetorical platform on this rowe v wade issue, but where are they. These fanatics control all three branches of our government, yet rowe vs wade is not going anywhere. The problem with abortion is not that some 16 yo girl has an unwanted pregnancy, the problem is the abortion industry. As a multi billion dollar industry, neither the democrats nor republicans will tackle it. Some pro-life democrats such as kicinich are just honest about it. The best way to tackle the abortion problem is not by arresting 16 year old girls or physicians (though some physicians should be put out), it is in creating an atmosphere where abortion is not a requirement. This stance is not feasable to fanatic republicans who could care less about poverty stricken mothers, they are under some kind of voodoo when it comes to basic sex-ed, even discussions about celabacy and abstinance are taboo to such folks because they think sex is dirty and evil, and any kind of such discussion is some kind of sin. So the republicans, who despite their rhetoric will never hurt the abortion industry (though I do appreciate bush's partial birth ban, but this is not special, this is not a platform of anyone but the most demoniac, and the so-called "health of the mother" position has never been outlawed anyway). Their failure to have any kind of compassionate social programs for the poor only leads to solutions that are horrible. I go with the pro-life democrats, even those who promise to not interfere with r-v-w, because the final result of their work on the abortion problem (ie education, wic, etc) is that abortion is less and less necessary. Sorry I got political here, because you seem to be discussing karmic implications. Perhaps on the spiritual discussion board, we can tackle these issues, because there are implications that go way beyond abortion, i.e. the killing of the sperm, the killing of the ovum, equal issues as far as I am concerned. The life force is carried by the woman for nine months, but the same life force is carried by the male for two years (according to some sources, including Srila Prabhupada.) So, isnt masterbation another form of abortion in a strict sense? I hope this discussion does not get out of hand, I have worked life centers for over 25 years, but I have resigned because many who are supporters of life centers are just too wierd for me. They dont care about abortion of third worlders, or crack babies, the folks I tried to work with have no compassion at all for anyone, just want a rhetorical tool they think will sway the pious ignorant who love them sound bites. If the republicans were serious about overturning roe v wade, it could happen on monday, the congress, the executive branch and the supreme court are all controlled, so I think only a fool will use a position statement about roe v wade as a litmus test come election time. Haribol, ys, mahaksadasa Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
theist 1 Report post Posted July 27, 2003 mahak, I'm not going to get into it at all. The demoncrats are currently filibustering 4 or five of Bushs' judical appoints because they fear they will try to overturn row v wade. Enough said. Support who you wish. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
I_love_krishna_ 0 Report post Posted July 27, 2003 but what can we do? Sadly, the society today is not on our level of consciousness and it will take many decades to come to the level of our thinking. About politics?- well I think the Republicans are racist, wealthy , WASP supporting idiots who care only for the people who give them money. Democrats- Are worse than the republicans. They support bunch of wierdos who are clearly gay/lesbians and wish to make them be considered "normal" in the society. The sad part is that our government and the whole nation is controlled not just by three branches of the government... but also a fourth branch, which is BUSINESS> May be it is the most powerful branch in our entire history. and we can't avoid it or take it out of power.... it is sad but true. The only hope is to change the whole society's view on teenage pregnant mothers. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
theist 1 Report post Posted July 27, 2003 Well I_L_K it would be nice to change all of society but if just one or two can be persuaded to not become implicated in this process then we can claim a certain victory. The real thing is that this issue is really tied to our not being the body. I believe it is important to use social issues with this linkage in mind. We need to inject aham brahmasmi into the general social discourse where ever possible. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
I_love_krishna_ 0 Report post Posted July 27, 2003 The biggest virus is "I am my body". Well, to tackle it we need to inject the Anti Virus "I am not my body" , and you are right. However, the younger generation today has turned so materialistic that they think that the wisdom and knowledge that scriptures carry is B.S. its just so boring to read. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
livingentity 0 Report post Posted July 27, 2003 However, the younger generation today has turned so materialistic that they think that the wisdom and knowledge that scriptures carry is B.S. its just so boring to read. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
I_love_krishna_ 0 Report post Posted July 27, 2003 well, I got this from my friends who are even though very intelligent are very ignorant. Only a few are spiritually inclined in our group... Me and two others... the rest are all ... fools... and the two others don't really fit in due to the fact that they are mocked. Their spirituality is also linked with greed. They are into stock exchange and are very spiritually inclined due to that fact. Enough said, by my view, the younger generation today is not really spiritually inclined as the older generation. Why? because of very publicized stupidity of other's when they preach. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted July 27, 2003 So preach with inteeligence. make them prove scientifically that the body is the self. That they can't do. Then use the same science to show how the body can't be the self. For instance Francis Crick (the DNA man) has spent his life in trying to locate the self in the body to no avail. he has search every conceivable brain cell and can't do it. his conclusion, there is no self. Point out this defect that this very intelligent scientist is left denying his own existence by refusing to consider that the sense of I am could possibly have a nonmaterial origin. They demand proof from, well we demand proof from them back. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
theist 1 Report post Posted July 27, 2003 I hate it when I get logged off when I am making a post. I can't go back and edit out my spelling mistakes. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
