Marrying meaties

July 11, 2002

Heartwork wrote:

>

> Hannah

>

> I think what you say is very true. It is possible to find a lot to like or

> love in someone who does not do all the things you do, and there is always

> the chance that they may change their habits anyway.

>

> Jo

You can't plan a relationship on that basis. If you marry a meatie, you

have to expect them to stay that way.

I appreciate that wherever you are, people will conform to the cultural

norm. (In our culture, meat eating.) I've dated meat eaters in the past,

but I've got more set in my ways, and the mere sense of my disapproval

would put a large sabot in the workings of any relationship.

> > I just have to say.....I married a meat-eater and things are great between

> us (granted I don't cook meat and he seems to like my vegan meals and he

> seems to be thinking about becoming a vegetarian-ovo,lacto).

Heh. My veggie ex-GF hated my vegan meals. Actually, she didn't care

much for the ones she prepared either.

> Still if he

> never changes, I love him just the same. I understand the want to share

> your life with another vegan, but from my experience I would have lost out

> on a lot if I had refused to see a meat eater. But then again, he's Baptist

> and I'm Wiccan so I guess we just like being different.

Well, that *is* a difference. Unless the two of you are an exception to

the generalisations, he thinks you are going to hell, and you think he

causes hell for animals.

Yup, that's a difference.

--

Ian McDonald

http://www.mcdonald.me.uk/

July 11, 2002

>>Well, that *is* a difference. Unless the two of you are an exception to

the generalisations, he thinks you are going to hell, and you think he

causes hell for animals.

>>Yup, that's a difference.

Yes, we do have lots of differences. As far as the religion thing goes, I

really don't think he thinks I'm going to hell. We both agreed early on that as

long as we are both happy and it isn't hurting anyone, our own spirtual beliefs

are our own business. In this case we are both very apathetic (sp??) but it

works.

As far as eating meat goes, I was only a ovo-lacto vegetarian when I met him,

and more for enviornmental reasons (although, Ive always loved animals). When

it finally dawned on me how much animal rights did mean to me, I became vegan

and doing much more activist work. This was about four years after we started

dating. So as far as the dynamics of the relationship go, I was the one who

changed, not him.

We have talked about why I am vegan now, as we talked about why I was

vegetarian. I wanted him to know why it means so much to me, and he wanted to

understand. I can't change him, and I don't try to. If he changes it is

because he wants to, not because I want him to. That is the only lasting change

anyway.

He does admit that he thinks my lifestyle choices are better for health,

enviornmental and compassion reasons, but he just can't make the change yet.

Lots of people are that way. I was thirteen when I became vegetarian, but 23

when I went vegan. And that's pretty young. Lots of people are much older

before they go vegetarain. I'm sure many on this list are in thier 30's or over

and just starting to be veg.

My point is that it is a hard transition to make in this culture. I know I was

raised to think of meat as beef and pork not dead cow and pig. I pulled a

" wishbone " or two at Thanksgiving and it sickens me now, but I didn't think

twice about it as a child.

Yes, I see why some want to be with other vegans, and that is fine if that is

critria for a mate. But I perosnally don't want to cut myself off from the

'meat eaters' because I think they are evil. Heck, my own mamma eats fish and

chicken. I feel like I should be in there being a positive example and giving

out the information that many just don't get in today's society to make an

informed choice.

Sorry I ranted on for so long, but I feel that I must be a minority in this

group since no one else seems to be married to a carnivore. And although I

understand the weariness of living with a meat eater, I just wanted to share my

reasons. I hope I didn't offend anyone, I just thought that this might shed

some light on my wacky lifestyle.

(Also, I would like to point to Joanne Stepaniak's web-site, she has a wonderful

article about living with meat eaters, and she puts it much more eleoquently

than I ever could--and her spelling is much better!!)

Hannah

--

Ian McDonald

http://www.mcdonald.me.uk/ <http://www.mcdonald.me.uk/>

To send an email to -

July 11, 2002

>He does admit that he thinks my lifestyle choices are better for health, enviornmental and compassion reasons, but he just can't make the change yet.

Why can't he make the change?

-

Trusty, Hannah

Ian McDonald ;

Thursday, July 11, 2002 8:47 AM

RE: Marrying meaties

>>Well, that *is* a difference. Unless the two of you are an exception tothe generalisations, he thinks you are going to hell, and you think hecauses hell for animals.>>Yup, that's a difference.Yes, we do have lots of differences. As far as the religion thing goes, I really don't think he thinks I'm going to hell. We both agreed early on that as long as we are both happy and it isn't hurting anyone, our own spirtual beliefs are our own business. In this case we are both very apathetic (sp??) but it works.

July 11, 2002

probably cuz its hard fer some folks...

not everyone can make changes in their lifestyle that easy

some folks are addicted

some folks find it hard to go against everything they have been told taught and

has been rammed down their throat all these years

fraggle

kiwi2000 <kiwi2000 wrote:

>>He does admit that he thinks my lifestyle choices are better for health,

enviornmental and compassion reasons, but he just can't make the change yet.

>

> Why can't he make the change?

> -

> Trusty, Hannah

> Ian McDonald ;

> Thursday, July 11, 2002 8:47 AM

> RE: Marrying meaties

>

> >>Well, that *is* a difference. Unless the two of you are an exception to

> the generalisations, he thinks you are going to hell, and you think he

> causes hell for animals.

>

> >>Yup, that's a difference.

>

> Yes, we do have lots of differences. As far as the religion thing goes, I

really don't think he thinks I'm going to hell. We both agreed early on that as

long as we are both happy and it isn't hurting anyone, our own spirtual beliefs

are our own business. In this case we are both very apathetic (sp??) but it

works.

>

July 11, 2002

Ian

> You can't plan a relationship on that basis. If you marry a meatie, you

> have to expect them to stay that way.

I totally agree, otherwise you wouldn't marry them. The point being that

there is always hope. If love is true, people tend to want to please each

other, and sometimes change.

> I appreciate that wherever you are, people will conform to the cultural

> norm. (In our culture, meat eating.) I've dated meat eaters in the past,

> but I've got more set in my ways, and the mere sense of my disapproval

> would put a large sabot in the workings of any relationship.

..... but then if you cared about someone you wouldn't show your disapproval,

and if they loved you they would be sensitive enough to know that eating

meat could upset you. If you love each other enough, you avoid upsetting

each other, which could mean either 1) the meat-eater gives up eating meat,

or 2) the vegan forgives the meat-eater for not being perfect.

> Well, that *is* a difference. Unless the two of you are an exception to

> the generalisations, he thinks you are going to hell, and you think he

> causes hell for animals.

>

> Yup, that's a difference.

.... and proves the point that love is flexible - something that is given

because you cannot help feeling that way.

Jo

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July 11, 2002

Hannah

> He does admit that he thinks my lifestyle choices are better for health,

enviornmental and compassion reasons, but he just >can't make the change

yet. Lots of people are that way. I was thirteen when I became vegetarian,

but 23 when I went >vegan. And that's pretty young. Lots of people are

much older before they go vegetarain. I'm sure many on this list are in

>thier 30's or over and just starting to be veg.

I can't remember how old we were, but we were over 45.

> Sorry I ranted on for so long, but I feel that I must be a minority in

this group since no one else seems to be married to a >carnivore. And

although I understand the weariness of living with a meat eater, I just

wanted to share my reasons. I hope I >didn't offend anyone, I just thought

that this might shed some light on my wacky lifestyle.

How could you possibly offend anyone by being loving? You should be proud

of yourself. If my husband wanted to eat meat I would still love him the

same. Wacky lifestyles can be fun - and that's what life should be.

Jo

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July 11, 2002

Jo,

Thanks for the support. It's nice to know that someone else feels that way.

Hannah

>>How could you possibly offend anyone by being loving? You should be

proud

of yourself. If my husband wanted to eat meat I would still love him

the

same. Wacky lifestyles can be fun - and that's what life should be.

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July 12, 2002

A love that's too flexible has no integrity or meaning. People love each other for real reasons

not in spite of differences but because of things they share. To ignore important differences to have

a relationship that's based on a lie.

-

Heartwork

Thursday, July 11, 2002 2:11 PM

Re: Marrying meaties

Ian> You can't plan a relationship on that basis. If you marry a meatie, you> have to expect them to stay that way.I totally agree, otherwise you wouldn't marry them. The point being thatthere is always hope. If love is true, people tend to want to please eachother, and sometimes change.> I appreciate that wherever you are, people will conform to the cultural> norm. (In our culture, meat eating.) I've dated meat eaters in the past,> but I've got more set in my ways, and the mere sense of my disapproval> would put a large sabot in the workings of any relationship..... but then if you cared about someone you wouldn't show your disapproval,and if they loved you they would be sensitive enough to know that eatingmeat could upset you. If you love each other enough, you avoid upsettingeach other, which could mean either 1) the meat-eater gives up eating meat,or 2) the vegan forgives the meat-eater for not being perfect.> Well, that *is* a difference. Unless the two of you are an exception to> the generalisations, he thinks you are going to hell, and you think he> causes hell for animals.>> Yup, that's a difference.... and proves the point that love is flexible - something that is givenbecause you cannot help feeling that way.Jo---Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).Version: 6.0.372 / Virus Database: 207 - Release 20/06/02To send an email to -

July 12, 2002

Killing animals isn't what I'd call a "whacky" lifestyle nor is it fun.

-

Heartwork

Thursday, July 11, 2002 2:30 PM

Re: Marrying meaties

Hannah> He does admit that he thinks my lifestyle choices are better for health,enviornmental and compassion reasons, but he just >can't make the changeyet. Lots of people are that way. I was thirteen when I became vegetarian,but 23 when I went >vegan. And that's pretty young. Lots of people aremuch older before they go vegetarain. I'm sure many on this list are in>thier 30's or over and just starting to be veg.I can't remember how old we were, but we were over 45.> Sorry I ranted on for so long, but I feel that I must be a minority inthis group since no one else seems to be married to a >carnivore. Andalthough I understand the weariness of living with a meat eater, I justwanted to share my reasons. I hope I >didn't offend anyone, I just thoughtthat this might shed some light on my wacky lifestyle.How could you possibly offend anyone by being loving? You should be proudof yourself. If my husband wanted to eat meat I would still love him thesame. Wacky lifestyles can be fun - and that's what life should be.Jo---Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).Version: 6.0.372 / Virus Database: 207 - Release 20/06/02To send an email to -

July 12, 2002

I think you're both just fooling yourselves. You could love anyone or anything. It's all the same right?

It doesn't seem to matter to either of you what another person holds as being important to them.

You'll love them no matter who they are or what they do. Being part of murdering innocent animals

obviously doesn't stop you from loving someone.

I wonder what would?

-

Trusty, Hannah

Heartwork ;

Thursday, July 11, 2002 3:31 PM

RE: Marrying meaties

Jo, Thanks for the support. It's nice to know that someone else feels that way.Hannah>>How could you possibly offend anyone by being loving? You should beproudof yourself. If my husband wanted to eat meat I would still love himthesame. Wacky lifestyles can be fun - and that's what life should be.---Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).<http://www.grisoft.com).> Version: 6.0.372 / Virus Database: 207 - Release 20/06/02To send an email to -

July 12, 2002

Hi Brad

> A love that's too flexible has no integrity or meaning.

What are you talking about? A love that has conditions has no integrity or meaning. Love is an emotion, not a contract.

BB

Peter

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July 12, 2002

Hi Brad

> You'll love them no matter who they are or what they do.

Do I at last see a spark of understanding?

BB

Peter

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July 12, 2002

Some vegans (women more than the men from what I've noticed when this debate comes up) are certainly very illogical when it comes to who they falling in love with. My attitude is more like yours and Angie's as you know.

My husband and I agree that one of us wanting to start eating animals again would constitute evidence of serious mental illness in our case!

When I was young and single (and I was not too fat and unattractive, believe it or not 15 years ago) I was turned down a few times by vegan men of around my age when I asked them out, that was bloody humiliating. I only ever asked out a few over the years, just those who seemed compatible, and I felt I would definitely click with (no smokers for instance). I was just good friends with my now husband for years when he smoked and could not see myself attracted to him until he quit, which he did. I think the ones who turned me down probably didn't like women who made the first move, that's the only reason I can come up with, because I was really quite logical about it, so I only asked out someone if he clearly seemed suitable. I didn't like the idea of trying to meet someone by going and chatting to strangers in places where most people met other people, bars and stuff, you never know what weirdoes there are out there! Instead I looked in veggie/vegan social and AR campaigning groups, and to some point green and peace groups where there were quite a few veggies and vegans, it seemed logical and safe to me. But not always easy to find Mr Right nevertheless.

My first husband was veggie and did go vegan for a time for me, but we split, partly because he was not open about not being sure how he felt about having kids though until after I said I felt I was ready to try for a baby.

Lesley

kiwi2000 [kiwi2000]12 July 2002 01:46 Subject: Re: Marrying meaties

I think you're both just fooling yourselves. You could love anyone or anything. It's all the same right?

It doesn't seem to matter to either of you what another person holds as being important to them.

You'll love them no matter who they are or what they do. Being part of murdering innocent animals

obviously doesn't stop you from loving someone.

I wonder what would?

-

Trusty, Hannah

Heartwork ;

Thursday, July 11, 2002 3:31 PM

RE: Marrying meaties

Jo, Thanks for the support. It's nice to know that someone else feels that way.Hannah>>How could you possibly offend anyone by being loving? You should beproudof yourself. If my husband wanted to eat meat I would still love himthesame. Wacky lifestyles can be fun - and that's what life should be.---Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).<http://www.grisoft.com).> Version: 6.0.372 / Virus Database: 207 - Release 20/06/02To send an email to -

July 12, 2002

love...logic?

lesley is vulcan!

luv isn't logical dear..its love..its an emotion..pure and simple...

who can predict that? sure, you can try and shape it, ignore it, bend it, but

you can't change it...

people are attracted to each other fer a whole variety of reasons, some fer

this, some fer that...

the bloody miracle of the brain and hormones...

when is someone gonna make those humna destroying robots anyways? maybe they are

hiding in the forests of canada....

cheers

fraggle

" Lesley Dove " <Lesley wrote:

>

>Some vegans (women more than the men from what I've noticed when this debate

>comes up) are certainly very illogical when it comes to who they falling in

>love with. My attitude is more like yours and Angie's as you know.

>

>My husband and I agree that one of us wanting to start eating animals again

>would constitute evidence of serious mental illness in our case!

>

>When I was young and single (and I was not too fat and unattractive, believe

>it or not 15 years ago) I was turned down a few times by vegan men of around

>my age when I asked them out, that was bloody humiliating. I only ever asked

>out a few over the years, just those who seemed compatible, and I felt I

>would definitely click with (no smokers for instance). I was just good

>friends with my now husband for years when he smoked and could not see

>myself attracted to him until he quit, which he did. I think the ones who

>turned me down probably didn't like women who made the first move, that's

>the only reason I can come up with, because I was really quite logical about

>it, so I only asked out someone if he clearly seemed suitable. I didn't like

>the idea of trying to meet someone by going and chatting to strangers in

>places where most people met other people, bars and stuff, you never know

>what weirdoes there are out there! Instead I looked in veggie/vegan social

>and AR campaigning groups, and to some point green and peace groups where

>there were quite a few veggies and vegans, it seemed logical and safe to me.

>But not always easy to find Mr Right nevertheless.

>

>My first husband was veggie and did go vegan for a time for me, but we

>split, partly because he was not open about not being sure how he felt about

>having kids though until after I said I felt I was ready to try for a baby.

>

>Lesley

>

> kiwi2000 [kiwi2000]

> 12 July 2002 01:46

>

> Re: Marrying meaties

>

> I think you're both just fooling yourselves. You could love anyone or

>anything. It's all the same right?

> It doesn't seem to matter to either of you what another person holds as

>being important to them.

> You'll love them no matter who they are or what they do. Being part of

>murdering innocent animals

> obviously doesn't stop you from loving someone.

> I wonder what would?

> -

> Trusty, Hannah

> Heartwork ;

> Thursday, July 11, 2002 3:31 PM

> RE: Marrying meaties

>

> Jo,

> Thanks for the support. It's nice to know that someone else feels that

>way.

>

> Hannah

>

> >>How could you possibly offend anyone by being loving? You should be

> proud

> of yourself. If my husband wanted to eat meat I would still love him

> the

> same. Wacky lifestyles can be fun - and that's what life should be.

>

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>

July 12, 2002

Nope I am far too emotional to be a Vulcan, I FELT as well as THOUGHT that I could not have fallen for an animal eater.

Made sense both practically and emotionally to specifically seek out someone ethically compatible.

Lots of vegan women don't and they wonder why it causes arguments later if they have kids, and he is not happy about her raising them vegan.

Lesley

EBbrewpunx [EBbrewpunx]12 July 2002 17:49 Subject: RE: Marrying meatieslove...logic?lesley is vulcan!:)luv isn't logical dear..its love..its an emotion..pure and simple...who can predict that? sure, you can try and shape it, ignore it, bend it, but you can't change it...people are attracted to each other fer a whole variety of reasons, some fer this, some fer that...the bloody miracle of the brain and hormones...when is someone gonna make those humna destroying robots anyways? maybe they are hiding in the forests of canada....cheersfraggle"Lesley Dove" <Lesley wrote:>>Some vegans (women more than the men from what I've noticed when this debate>comes up) are certainly very illogical when it comes to who they falling in>love with. My attitude is more like yours and Angie's as you know.>>My husband and I agree that one of us wanting to start eating animals again>would constitute evidence of serious mental illness in our case!>>When I was young and single (and I was not too fat and unattractive, believe>it or not 15 years ago) I was turned down a few times by vegan men of around>my age when I asked them out, that was bloody humiliating. I only ever asked>out a few over the years, just those who seemed compatible, and I felt I>would definitely click with (no smokers for instance). I was just good>friends with my now husband for years when he smoked and could not see>myself attracted to him until he quit, which he did. I think the ones who>turned me down probably didn't like women who made the first move, that's>the only reason I can come up with, because I was really quite logical about>it, so I only asked out someone if he clearly seemed suitable. I didn't like>the idea of trying to meet someone by going and chatting to strangers in>places where most people met other people, bars and stuff, you never know>what weirdoes there are out there! Instead I looked in veggie/vegan social>and AR campaigning groups, and to some point green and peace groups where>there were quite a few veggies and vegans, it seemed logical and safe to me.>But not always easy to find Mr Right nevertheless.>>My first husband was veggie and did go vegan for a time for me, but we>split, partly because he was not open about not being sure how he felt about>having kids though until after I said I felt I was ready to try for a baby.>>Lesley>> > kiwi2000 [kiwi2000]> 12 July 2002 01:46> > Re: Marrying meaties>>> I think you're both just fooling yourselves. You could love anyone or>anything. It's all the same right?> It doesn't seem to matter to either of you what another person holds as>being important to them.> You'll love them no matter who they are or what they do. Being part of>murdering innocent animals> obviously doesn't stop you from loving someone.> I wonder what would?> -> Trusty, Hannah> Heartwork ; > Thursday, July 11, 2002 3:31 PM> RE: Marrying meaties>>>> Jo,> Thanks for the support. It's nice to know that someone else feels that>way.>> Hannah>>> >>How could you possibly offend anyone by being loving? You should be> proud> of yourself. If my husband wanted to eat meat I would still love him> the> same. Wacky lifestyles can be fun - and that's what life should be.>>>>>> ---> Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.> Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).> <http://www.grisoft.com).>> Version: 6.0.372 / Virus Database: 207 - Release 20/06/02>>> To send an email to - >>

July 12, 2002

well, i can see lookin fer someone you are compatible with, but sometimes the

" heart " doesn't listen

we all wish we had the perfect mate..some of us find them, some of us search and

search...

fraggle

" Lesley Dove " <Lesley wrote:

>Nope I am far too emotional to be a Vulcan, I FELT as well as THOUGHT that I

>could not have fallen for an animal eater.

>Made sense both practically and emotionally to specifically seek out someone

>ethically compatible.

>Lots of vegan women don't and they wonder why it causes arguments later if

>they have kids, and he is not happy about her raising them vegan.

>

>Lesley

>

> EBbrewpunx [EBbrewpunx]

> 12 July 2002 17:49

>

> RE: Marrying meaties

>

> love...logic?

> lesley is vulcan!

>

> luv isn't logical dear..its love..its an emotion..pure and simple...

> who can predict that? sure, you can try and shape it, ignore it, bend it,

>but you can't change it...

> people are attracted to each other fer a whole variety of reasons, some

>fer this, some fer that...

> the bloody miracle of the brain and hormones...

> when is someone gonna make those humna destroying robots anyways? maybe

>they are hiding in the forests of canada....

> cheers

> fraggle

>

> " Lesley Dove " <Lesley wrote:

>

> >

> >Some vegans (women more than the men from what I've noticed when this

>debate

> >comes up) are certainly very illogical when it comes to who they falling

>in

> >love with. My attitude is more like yours and Angie's as you know.

> >

> >My husband and I agree that one of us wanting to start eating animals

>again

> >would constitute evidence of serious mental illness in our case!

> >

> >When I was young and single (and I was not too fat and unattractive,

>believe

> >it or not 15 years ago) I was turned down a few times by vegan men of

>around

> >my age when I asked them out, that was bloody humiliating. I only ever

>asked

> >out a few over the years, just those who seemed compatible, and I felt I

> >would definitely click with (no smokers for instance). I was just good

> >friends with my now husband for years when he smoked and could not see

> >myself attracted to him until he quit, which he did. I think the ones who

> >turned me down probably didn't like women who made the first move, that's

> >the only reason I can come up with, because I was really quite logical

>about

> >it, so I only asked out someone if he clearly seemed suitable. I didn't

>like

> >the idea of trying to meet someone by going and chatting to strangers in

> >places where most people met other people, bars and stuff, you never know

> >what weirdoes there are out there! Instead I looked in veggie/vegan

>social

> >and AR campaigning groups, and to some point green and peace groups where

> >there were quite a few veggies and vegans, it seemed logical and safe to

>me.

> >But not always easy to find Mr Right nevertheless.

> >

> >My first husband was veggie and did go vegan for a time for me, but we

> >split, partly because he was not open about not being sure how he felt

>about

> >having kids though until after I said I felt I was ready to try for a

>baby.

> >

> >Lesley

> >

> > kiwi2000 [kiwi2000]

> > 12 July 2002 01:46

> >

> > Re: Marrying meaties

> >

> > I think you're both just fooling yourselves. You could love anyone or

> >anything. It's all the same right?

> > It doesn't seem to matter to either of you what another person holds as

> >being important to them.

> > You'll love them no matter who they are or what they do. Being part of

> >murdering innocent animals

> > obviously doesn't stop you from loving someone.

> > I wonder what would?

> > -

> > Trusty, Hannah

> > Heartwork ;

> > Thursday, July 11, 2002 3:31 PM

> > RE: Marrying meaties

> >

> > Jo,

> > Thanks for the support. It's nice to know that someone else feels

>that

> >way.

> >

> > Hannah

> >

> > >>How could you possibly offend anyone by being loving? You should

>be

> > proud

> > of yourself. If my husband wanted to eat meat I would still love him

> > the

> > same. Wacky lifestyles can be fun - and that's what life should be.

> >

> > ---

> > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.

> > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).

> > <http://www.grisoft.com).>

> > Version: 6.0.372 / Virus Database: 207 - Release 20/06/02

> >

> > To send an email to

>-

> >

July 12, 2002

Maybe my youth helped inspired my relationship with my husband. I was not so

set in my ways. I was 18 when we first started dating and we married when I was

21 (we just celebrated our 2nd wedding anniversary a couple of months ago!) I

wasn't even looking for ANY partner when I met him. I just started college and

din't want to be 'tied down' to a relationship. But I couldn't stay away from

him.

Also, for those who are uneasy about co-habitating with a 'meatie', I look at it

this way. Before I met my husband he was a real meat and potato man, but now he

eats a LOT less meat, if only by the virture that I cook the meals (I love to

cook). That is saving at least a couple of cows/pigs/chickens a year. These

animals are saved by our union-we are saving them together. If I was with

someone who would be vegan regardless of me, and he was with another meateater,

then he would probably never been exposed to the veg. lifestyle and would have

kept on eating lots of meat. Yeah, I know it would save a lot more if he didn't

eat any meat at all, but every little bit helps.

Hannah

>Nope I am far too emotional to be a Vulcan, I FELT as well as THOUGHT

>that I could not have fallen for an animal eater.

>Made sense both practically and emotionally to specifically seek out

>someone ethically compatible.

>Lots of vegan women don't and they wonder why it causes arguments later

>if they have kids, and he is not happy about her raising them vegan.

>Lesley

EBbrewpunx [EBbrewpunx]

12 July 2002 17:49

RE: Marrying meaties

love...logic?

lesley is vulcan!

luv isn't logical dear..its love..its an emotion..pure and simple...

who can predict that? sure, you can try and shape it, ignore it, bend

it, but you can't change it...

people are attracted to each other fer a whole variety of reasons, some

fer this, some fer that...

the bloody miracle of the brain and hormones...

when is someone gonna make those humna destroying robots anyways? maybe

they are hiding in the forests of canada....

cheers

fraggle

" Lesley Dove " <Lesley wrote:

>

>Some vegans (women more than the men from what I've noticed when this

debate

>comes up) are certainly very illogical when it comes to who they

falling in

>love with. My attitude is more like yours and Angie's as you know.

>

>My husband and I agree that one of us wanting to start eating animals

again

>would constitute evidence of serious mental illness in our case!

>

>When I was young and single (and I was not too fat and unattractive,

believe

>it or not 15 years ago) I was turned down a few times by vegan men of

around

>my age when I asked them out, that was bloody humiliating. I only ever

asked

>out a few over the years, just those who seemed compatible, and I felt

I

>would definitely click with (no smokers for instance). I was just good

>friends with my now husband for years when he smoked and could not see

>myself attracted to him until he quit, which he did. I think the ones

who

>turned me down probably didn't like women who made the first move,

that's

>the only reason I can come up with, because I was really quite logical

about

>it, so I only asked out someone if he clearly seemed suitable. I didn't

like

>the idea of trying to meet someone by going and chatting to strangers

in

>places where most people met other people, bars and stuff, you never

know

>what weirdoes there are out there! Instead I looked in veggie/vegan

social

>and AR campaigning groups, and to some point green and peace groups

where

>there were quite a few veggies and vegans, it seemed logical and safe

to me.

>But not always easy to find Mr Right nevertheless.

>

>My first husband was veggie and did go vegan for a time for me, but we

>split, partly because he was not open about not being sure how he felt

about

>having kids though until after I said I felt I was ready to try for a

baby.

>

>Lesley

>

> kiwi2000 [kiwi2000]

> 12 July 2002 01:46

>

> Re: Marrying meaties

>

> I think you're both just fooling yourselves. You could love anyone or

>anything. It's all the same right?

> It doesn't seem to matter to either of you what another person holds

as

>being important to them.

> You'll love them no matter who they are or what they do. Being part

of

>murdering innocent animals

> obviously doesn't stop you from loving someone.

> I wonder what would?

> -

> Trusty, Hannah

> Heartwork ;

> Thursday, July 11, 2002 3:31 PM

> RE: Marrying meaties

>

> Jo,

> Thanks for the support. It's nice to know that someone else feels

that

>way.

>

> Hannah

>

> >>How could you possibly offend anyone by being loving? You should

be

> proud

> of yourself. If my husband wanted to eat meat I would still love

him

> the

> same. Wacky lifestyles can be fun - and that's what life should

be.

>

> ---

> Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.

> Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).

<http://www.grisoft.com).>

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> Version: 6.0.372 / Virus Database: 207 - Release 20/06/02

>

> To send an email to

-

>

July 12, 2002

Hey hannah, you don't have to justify yourself to anyone, no matter

what Brad might think about that...

Graham

> Also, for those who are uneasy about co-habitating with

a 'meatie', I look at it this way. Before I met my husband he was a

real meat and potato man, but now he eats a LOT less meat, if only

by the virture that I cook the meals (I love to cook). That is

saving at least a couple of cows/pigs/chickens a year. These

animals are saved by our union-we are saving them together. If I

was with someone who would be vegan regardless of me, and he was

with another meateater, then he would probably never been exposed to

the veg. lifestyle and would have kept on eating lots of meat. Yeah,

I know it would save a lot more if he didn't eat any meat at all,

but every little bit helps.

>

info/terms/> .

July 12, 2002

Why shouldn't she explain it to those of us who find it hard to understand if she so chooses? Anyway you are not with a meat eater, could you be happy with one who would not raise your kids vegan?

Lesley

quercusrobur2002 [grahamburnett]12 July 2002 18:50 Subject: Re: Marrying meatiesHey hannah, you don't have to justify yourself to anyone, no matter what Brad might think about that...Graham> Also, for those who are uneasy about co-habitating with a 'meatie', I look at it this way. Before I met my husband he was a real meat and potato man, but now he eats a LOT less meat, if only by the virture that I cook the meals (I love to cook). That is saving at least a couple of cows/pigs/chickens a year. These animals are saved by our union-we are saving them together. If I was with someone who would be vegan regardless of me, and he was with another meateater, then he would probably never been exposed to the veg. lifestyle and would have kept on eating lots of meat. Yeah, I know it would save a lot more if he didn't eat any meat at all, but every little bit helps. > info/terms/> .To send an email to -

July 12, 2002

because it's nobody else's business???

Who elected Brad to be judge and jury of other people's lives?

, " Lesley Dove " <Lesley@v...> wrote:

>

> Why shouldn't she explain it to those of us who find it hard to

understand

> if she so chooses? Anyway you are not with a meat eater, could you

be happy

> with one who would not raise your kids vegan?

>

> Lesley

>

> quercusrobur2002 [grahamburnett@b...]

> 12 July 2002 18:50

>

> Re: Marrying meaties

>

> Hey hannah, you don't have to justify yourself to anyone, no

matter

> what Brad might think about that...

>

> Graham

>

> > Also, for those who are uneasy about co-habitating with

> a 'meatie', I look at it this way. Before I met my husband he

was a

> real meat and potato man, but now he eats a LOT less meat, if

only

> by the virture that I cook the meals (I love to cook). That is

> saving at least a couple of cows/pigs/chickens a year. These

> animals are saved by our union-we are saving them together. If I

> was with someone who would be vegan regardless of me, and he was

> with another meateater, then he would probably never been

exposed to

> the veg. lifestyle and would have kept on eating lots of meat.

Yeah,

> I know it would save a lot more if he didn't eat any meat at all,

> but every little bit helps.

> >

> info/terms/> .

>

July 12, 2002

I took Graham's comments as supportive and I appreciate that. Also, I was just

trying to explain. People can take it or leave it, I know I'm not going to

change their minds-that's okay. I support the idea of marrying a fellow vegan

if that's what someone wants. And as far as my own marriage goes, both my

husband and I are very happy and that is all that matters. I do feel this is a

good topic, because it seems to affect just about everyone at some point in

their life.

As far as kids go, there are none in my near future, but maybe someday. We've

talked about it and they will be raised vegan. There won't be any meat in the

house and I will tell them why it is best to be vegan. My husband supports me

in this. He might eat meat outside the home, but not with the kids. My dad

smoked for 23 years and I never saw him light up. It was kind of the same deal

my mom and dad had about that, I guess.

Hannah

Lesley Dove

7/12/02 1:59 PM

RE: Re: Marrying meaties

>Why shouldn't she explain it to those of us who find it hard to

understand if she so chooses? Anyway you are not with a meat eater,

could you be happy with one who would not raise your kids vegan?

Lesley

quercusrobur2002 [grahamburnett]

12 July 2002 18:50