Braggs

[Guest guest]

Bottle conditioned ale...............yummmmmmmmmmm usualy has some sedement in it, full of b vitamins...........thats my excuse. The Valley Vegan............heartwerk <jo.heartwork wrote: I would call brewers yeast a supplement as it is not something we would eat in the normal course of a day. The B12 comes from the fermenting of the yeast. I think it is an excellent supplement.Jo , "Marcy" <imgreen03 wrote:>> But we can get some of the dirt and bacteria on our root veggies. Since we only need trace amounts of B12, this contributes to our overall need.> > I east Brewers Yeast and Rice Dream as well, both of which contain B12.> > I've been vegan this time for 10 years now. I gave up taking supplements several years ago. I just make sure we eat healthy.> > Marcy> > - > hacktorious > > Tuesday, July 24, 2007 7:58 AM> Re: Braggs> > > I have heard both sides of that. I have read articles stating that is> just a rumor and test's have been done to disprove that. However,

I> don't know if the sources are reliable,as I am just reading this info> on the internet.> > Do cows and monkeys actually need vitamin b12? I was not aware of> that. But that is why I joined this group; so I can learn.....lol> > Thanks.> > , yarrow@ wrote:> >> > Vitamin b-12 is produced by bacteria that live in the soil. That's > > where cows, monkeys and apes, and people who don't wash their fruits > > and vegetables get it from. In the modern overhygienic > > antibacterial-saturated world, most of us no longer eat enough dirt.> > > > > > At 10:12 PM -0400 7/23/07, Scott wrote:> > I am not convinced the human body cannot get vitamin B12 from some > > sort of plant source. Maybe it is in the

inter tree bark of some > > sort of tree, which our ancestors gorged themselves on. Thus, > > creating a dependency for this vitamin in our genes, or maybe it was > > meat; who knows? The fact of the matter is we don't really know.> >>Peter H

 

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[Guest guest]

Funny, I started eating brewer's yeast years ( & years) ago, before I was vegan (I was vegetarian) or knew anything about B12. I just liked the taste of it, sprinkled on cereals, salad, etc... Now we use it to make "Parma", with walnuts and salt, as a parmesan substitute.

 

I can't even recall how I found out about it!

 

I get your point, Jo, about it being a supplement. Historically, I didn't use it for that. How funny. Maybe that's why I didn't keel over from a nerve disorder when I went vegan!? =0)

 

Marcy

 

 

 

-

heartwerk

Tuesday, July 24, 2007 11:34 PM

Re: Braggs

 

 

I would call brewers yeast a supplement as it is not something we would eat in the normal course of a day. The B12 comes from the fermenting of the yeast. I think it is an excellent supplement.Jo , "Marcy" <imgreen03 wrote:>> But we can get some of the dirt and bacteria on our root veggies. Since we only need trace amounts of B12, this contributes to our overall need.> > I east Brewers Yeast and Rice Dream as well, both of which contain B12.> > I've been vegan this time for 10 years now. I gave up taking supplements several years ago. I just make sure we eat healthy.> > Marcy> > - > hacktorious > > Tuesday, July 24, 2007 7:58 AM> Re: Braggs> > > I have heard both sides of that. I have read articles stating that is> just a rumor and test's have been done to disprove that. However, I> don't know if the sources are reliable,as I am just reading this info> on the internet.> > Do cows and monkeys actually need vitamin b12? I was not aware of> that. But that is why I joined this group; so I can learn.....lol> > Thanks.> > , yarrow@ wrote:> >> > Vitamin b-12 is produced by bacteria that live in the soil. That's > > where cows, monkeys and apes, and people who don't wash their fruits > > and vegetables get it from. In the modern overhygienic > > antibacterial-saturated world, most of us no longer eat enough dirt.> > > > > > At 10:12 PM -0400 7/23/07, Scott wrote:> > I am not convinced the human body cannot get vitamin B12 from some > > sort of plant source. Maybe it is in the inter tree bark of some > > sort of tree, which our ancestors gorged themselves on. Thus, > > creating a dependency for this vitamin in our genes, or maybe it was > > meat; who knows? The fact of the matter is we don't really know.> >>

[Guest guest]

I find it difficult to understand people's reluctance to use

supplements. We choose our food carefully for various reasons, so

why shouldn't we choose supplements to suit our needs. Our soil is

not as good as it should be and the food plants do not contain the

amounts of nutrients they should, even the organic ones still do not

contain the amount of nutrients that food used to.

 

 

If we are sensible, as everyone on this list, and eat in a caring way

that we hope will be healthy, then why not make up any shortfalls

with supplements so that we have optimum nutrition.

 

Sometimes people say they don't like supplements because they are not

natural, but the rest of their lives are not lived in 'natural' ways.

 

Jo

, " Marcy " <imgreen03 wrote:

>

> Funny, I started eating brewer's yeast years ( & years) ago, before

I was vegan (I was vegetarian) or knew anything about B12. I just

liked the taste of it, sprinkled on cereals, salad, etc... Now we

use it to make " Parma " , with walnuts and salt, as a parmesan

substitute.

>

> I can't even recall how I found out about it!

>

> I get your point, Jo, about it being a supplement. Historically, I

didn't use it for that. How funny. Maybe that's why I didn't keel

over from a nerve disorder when I went vegan!? =0)

>

> Marcy

>

>

> -

> heartwerk

>

> Tuesday, July 24, 2007 11:34 PM

> Re: Braggs

>

>

> I would call brewers yeast a supplement as it is not something we

> would eat in the normal course of a day. The B12 comes from the

> fermenting of the yeast. I think it is an excellent supplement.

>

> Jo

>

> , " Marcy " <imgreen03@> wrote:

> >

> > But we can get some of the dirt and bacteria on our root

veggies.

> Since we only need trace amounts of B12, this contributes to our

> overall need.

> >

> > I east Brewers Yeast and Rice Dream as well, both of which

contain

> B12.

> >

> > I've been vegan this time for 10 years now. I gave up taking

> supplements several years ago. I just make sure we eat healthy.

> >

> > Marcy

> >

> > -

> > hacktorious

> >

> > Tuesday, July 24, 2007 7:58 AM

> > Re: Braggs

> >

> >

> > I have heard both sides of that. I have read articles stating

> that is

> > just a rumor and test's have been done to disprove that.

However,

> I

> > don't know if the sources are reliable,as I am just reading

this

> info

> > on the internet.

> >

> > Do cows and monkeys actually need vitamin b12? I was not aware

of

> > that. But that is why I joined this group; so I can

learn.....lol

> >

> > Thanks.

> >

> > , yarrow@ wrote:

> > >

> > > Vitamin b-12 is produced by bacteria that live in the soil.

> That's

> > > where cows, monkeys and apes, and people who don't wash their

> fruits

> > > and vegetables get it from. In the modern overhygienic

> > > antibacterial-saturated world, most of us no longer eat

enough

> dirt.

> > >

> > >

> > > At 10:12 PM -0400 7/23/07, Scott wrote:

> > > I am not convinced the human body cannot get vitamin B12 from

> some

> > > sort of plant source. Maybe it is in the inter tree bark of

> some

> > > sort of tree, which our ancestors gorged themselves on. Thus,

> > > creating a dependency for this vitamin in our genes, or maybe

> it was

> > > meat; who knows? The fact of the matter is we don't really

know.

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

The trouble is how do you tell what you are deficient in? you could say I will take a vitamin just in case, or you can do a bit of research and eat healithily, and maybe listen to your body and take a vitamin/suppliment when run down, or havent been eating as well as normal. Or you could take every pill under the sun and end up poisoning yourself. IMO The human body is a very forgiving thing. People survived for centuries without suppliments, and I believe there is too much paranoia, sponsored by the pharmacutical companies about what you should be taking. They get rich feeding on peoples insecurities. The Valley Vegan...........heartwerk <jo.heartwork wrote: I find it difficult to understand people's reluctance to use supplements. We choose our food carefully for various reasons, so why shouldn't we choose supplements to suit our needs. Our soil is not as good as it should be and the food plants do not contain the amounts of nutrients they should, even the organic ones still do not contain the amount of nutrients that food used to.If we are sensible, as everyone on this list, and eat in a caring way that we hope will be healthy, then why not make up any shortfalls with supplements so that we have optimum nutrition.Sometimes people say they don't like supplements because they are not natural, but the rest of their lives are not lived in 'natural' ways.Jo , "Marcy" <imgreen03 wrote:>> Funny, I started eating brewer's yeast years ( & years) ago, before I was vegan (I was vegetarian) or knew anything about B12. I just liked the taste of it, sprinkled on cereals, salad, etc... Now we use it to make "Parma", with walnuts and salt, as a parmesan substitute.> > I can't even recall how I found out about it!> > I get your point, Jo, about it being a supplement. Historically, I didn't use it for that. How funny. Maybe that's why I didn't keel over from a nerve disorder when I went vegan!? =0)> > Marcy> > > - > heartwerk > > Tuesday, July 24, 2007 11:34 PM> Re:

Braggs> > > I would call brewers yeast a supplement as it is not something we > would eat in the normal course of a day. The B12 comes from the > fermenting of the yeast. I think it is an excellent supplement.> > Jo> > , "Marcy" <imgreen03@> wrote:> >> > But we can get some of the dirt and bacteria on our root veggies. > Since we only need trace amounts of B12, this contributes to our > overall need.> > > > I east Brewers Yeast and Rice Dream as well, both of which contain > B12.> > > > I've been vegan this time for 10 years now. I gave up taking > supplements several years ago. I just make sure we eat healthy.> > > > Marcy> > > > - > >

hacktorious > > > > Tuesday, July 24, 2007 7:58 AM> > Re: Braggs> > > > > > I have heard both sides of that. I have read articles stating > that is> > just a rumor and test's have been done to disprove that. However, > I> > don't know if the sources are reliable,as I am just reading this > info> > on the internet.> > > > Do cows and monkeys actually need vitamin b12? I was not aware of> > that. But that is why I joined this group; so I can learn.....lol> > > > Thanks.> > > > , yarrow@ wrote:> > >> > > Vitamin b-12 is produced by bacteria that live in the

soil. > That's > > > where cows, monkeys and apes, and people who don't wash their > fruits > > > and vegetables get it from. In the modern overhygienic > > > antibacterial-saturated world, most of us no longer eat enough > dirt.> > > > > > > > > At 10:12 PM -0400 7/23/07, Scott wrote:> > > I am not convinced the human body cannot get vitamin B12 from > some > > > sort of plant source. Maybe it is in the inter tree bark of > some > > > sort of tree, which our ancestors gorged themselves on. Thus, > > > creating a dependency for this vitamin in our genes, or maybe > it was > > > meat; who knows? The fact of the matter is we don't really know.> > >> >>Peter H

 

Answers - Get better answers from someone who knows. Try

it now.

[Guest guest]

My reason is that I don't trust the companies that make them. Who knows what kind of garbage they put in them.--ScottDon't under estimate the wisdom of nature.--- jo.heartwork wrote:"heartwerk" <jo.heartwork Subject: Re: BraggsThu, 26 Jul 2007 06:43:00 -0000I find it difficult to understand people's reluctance to use supplements. We choose our food carefully for various reasons, so why shouldn't we choose supplements to suit our needs. Our soil is not as good as it should be and the food plants do not contain the amounts of nutrients they should, even the organic ones still do not contain the amount of nutrients that food used to.If we are sensible, as everyone on this list, and eat in a caring way that we hope will be healthy, then why not make up any shortfalls with supplements so that we have optimum nutrition.Sometimes people say they don't like supplements because they are not natural, but the rest of their lives are not lived in 'natural' ways.Jo , "Marcy" <imgreen03 wrote:>> Funny, I started eating brewer's yeast years ( & years) ago, before I was vegan (I was vegetarian) or knew anything about B12. I just liked the taste of it, sprinkled on cereals, salad, etc... Now we use it to make "Parma", with walnuts and salt, as a parmesan substitute.> > I can't even recall how I found out about it!> > I get your point, Jo, about it being a supplement. Historically, I didn't use it for that. How funny. Maybe that's why I didn't keel over from a nerve disorder when I went vegan!? =0)> > Marcy> > > - > heartwerk > > Tuesday, July 24, 2007 11:34 PM> Re: Braggs> > > I would call brewers yeast a supplement as it is not something we > would eat in the normal course of a day. The B12 comes from the > fermenting of the yeast. I think it is an excellent supplement.> > Jo> > , "Marcy" <imgreen03@> wrote:> >> > But we can get some of the dirt and bacteria on our root veggies. > Since we only need trace amounts of B12, this contributes to our > overall need.> > > > I east Brewers Yeast and Rice Dream as well, both of which contain > B12.> > > > I've been vegan this time for 10 years now. I gave up taking > supplements several years ago. I just make sure we eat healthy.> > > > Marcy> > > > - > > hacktorious > > > > Tuesday, July 24, 2007 7:58 AM> > Re: Braggs> > > > > > I have heard both sides of that. I have read articles stating > that is> > just a rumor and test's have been done to disprove that. However, > I> > don't know if the sources are reliable,as I am just reading this > info> > on the internet.> > > > Do cows and monkeys actually need vitamin b12? I was not aware of> > that. But that is why I joined this group; so I can learn.....lol> > > > Thanks.> > > > , yarrow@ wrote:> > >> > > Vitamin b-12 is produced by bacteria that live in the soil. > That's > > > where cows, monkeys and apes, and people who don't wash their > fruits > > > and vegetables get it from. In the modern overhygienic > > > antibacterial-saturated world, most of us no longer eat enough > dirt.> > > > > > > > > At 10:12 PM -0400 7/23/07, Scott wrote:> > > I am not convinced the human body cannot get vitamin B12 from > some > > > sort of plant source. Maybe it is in the inter tree bark of > some > > > sort of tree, which our ancestors gorged themselves on. Thus, > > > creating a dependency for this vitamin in our genes, or maybe > it was > > > meat; who knows? The fact of the matter is we don't really know.> > >> >> Learn about the power of raw foods at ---> http://www.rawfoods.com

[Guest guest]

Very well said.--ScottDon't under estimate the wisdom of nature.--- swpgh01 wrote:Peter VV <swpgh01 Subject: Re: Re: BraggsThu, 26 Jul 2007 09:34:34 +0100 (BST)

 

 

 

The trouble is how do you tell what you are deficient in? you could say I will take a vitamin just in case, or you can do a bit of research and eat healithily, and maybe listen to your body and take a vitamin/suppliment when run down, or havent been eating as well as normal. Or you could take every pill under the sun and end up poisoning yourself. IMO The human body is a very forgiving thing. People survived for centuries without suppliments, and I believe there is too much paranoia, sponsored by the pharmacutical companies about what you should be taking. They get rich feeding on peoples insecurities. The Valley Vegan...........

Learn about the power of raw foods at ---> http://www.rawfoods.com

[Guest guest]

I read up about nutrition and optimum nutrition. I don't believe in

taking every vitamin under the sun and not always in large amounts.

There is plenty of literature on research about vitamins and

minerals, and information on what is the minimum you need (rda) and

the amount for optimum nutrition to keep you healthy, and then how to

use large doses to treat illnesses. There are only a few vitamins

that you can overdose on.

 

Jo

 

, Peter VV <swpgh01 wrote:

>

> The trouble is how do you tell what you are deficient in? you could

say I will take a vitamin just in case, or you can do a bit of

research and eat healithily, and maybe listen to your body and take a

vitamin/suppliment when run down, or havent been eating as well as

normal. Or you could take every pill under the sun and end up

poisoning yourself.

> IMO The human body is a very forgiving thing. People survived for

centuries without suppliments, and I believe there is too much

paranoia, sponsored by the pharmacutical companies about what you

should be taking. They get rich feeding on peoples insecurities.

>

> The Valley Vegan...........

>

> heartwerk <jo.heartwork wrote:

> I find it difficult to understand people's reluctance to

use

> supplements. We choose our food carefully for various reasons, so

> why shouldn't we choose supplements to suit our needs. Our soil is

> not as good as it should be and the food plants do not contain the

> amounts of nutrients they should, even the organic ones still do

not

> contain the amount of nutrients that food used to.

>

> If we are sensible, as everyone on this list, and eat in a caring

way

> that we hope will be healthy, then why not make up any shortfalls

> with supplements so that we have optimum nutrition.

>

> Sometimes people say they don't like supplements because they are

not

> natural, but the rest of their lives are not lived in 'natural'

ways.

>

> Jo

> , " Marcy " <imgreen03@> wrote:

> >

> > Funny, I started eating brewer's yeast years ( & years) ago,

before

> I was vegan (I was vegetarian) or knew anything about B12. I just

> liked the taste of it, sprinkled on cereals, salad, etc... Now we

> use it to make " Parma " , with walnuts and salt, as a parmesan

> substitute.

> >

> > I can't even recall how I found out about it!

> >

> > I get your point, Jo, about it being a supplement. Historically,

I

> didn't use it for that. How funny. Maybe that's why I didn't keel

> over from a nerve disorder when I went vegan!? =0)

> >

> > Marcy

> >

> >

> > -

> > heartwerk

> >

> > Tuesday, July 24, 2007 11:34 PM

> > Re: Braggs

> >

> >

> > I would call brewers yeast a supplement as it is not something we

> > would eat in the normal course of a day. The B12 comes from the

> > fermenting of the yeast. I think it is an excellent supplement.

> >

> > Jo

> >

> > , " Marcy " <imgreen03@> wrote:

> > >

> > > But we can get some of the dirt and bacteria on our root

> veggies.

> > Since we only need trace amounts of B12, this contributes to our

> > overall need.

> > >

> > > I east Brewers Yeast and Rice Dream as well, both of which

> contain

> > B12.

> > >

> > > I've been vegan this time for 10 years now. I gave up taking

> > supplements several years ago. I just make sure we eat healthy.

> > >

> > > Marcy

> > >

> > > -

> > > hacktorious

> > >

> > > Tuesday, July 24, 2007 7:58 AM

> > > Re: Braggs

> > >

> > >

> > > I have heard both sides of that. I have read articles stating

> > that is

> > > just a rumor and test's have been done to disprove that.

> However,

> > I

> > > don't know if the sources are reliable,as I am just reading

> this

> > info

> > > on the internet.

> > >

> > > Do cows and monkeys actually need vitamin b12? I was not aware

> of

> > > that. But that is why I joined this group; so I can

> learn.....lol

> > >

> > > Thanks.

> > >

> > > , yarrow@ wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Vitamin b-12 is produced by bacteria that live in the soil.

> > That's

> > > > where cows, monkeys and apes, and people who don't wash their

> > fruits

> > > > and vegetables get it from. In the modern overhygienic

> > > > antibacterial-saturated world, most of us no longer eat

> enough

> > dirt.

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > At 10:12 PM -0400 7/23/07, Scott wrote:

> > > > I am not convinced the human body cannot get vitamin B12 from

> > some

> > > > sort of plant source. Maybe it is in the inter tree bark of

> > some

> > > > sort of tree, which our ancestors gorged themselves on. Thus,

> > > > creating a dependency for this vitamin in our genes, or maybe

> > it was

> > > > meat; who knows? The fact of the matter is we don't really

> know.

> > > >

> > >

> >

Peter H

>

>

>

>

> Answers - Get better answers from someone who knows. Tryit

now.

>

[Guest guest]

It usually says on the label what the tablets contain. If you are

sensible, read up on it all, know your own health, use supplements

made by non-pharmaceutical companies - you should be okay - or even

more than okay.

 

If you are in America, I beleive it is not so easy to find good

supplements.

 

Jo

 

 

 

Re: Re: Braggs

 

 

My reason is that I don't trust the companies that make them. Who

knows what kind of garbage they put in them.

 

--

Scott

Don't under estimate the wisdom of nature.

 

--- jo.heartwork wrote:

 

" heartwerk " <jo.heartwork

 

Re: Braggs

Thu, 26 Jul 2007 06:43:00 -0000

 

 

I find it difficult to understand people's reluctance to use

supplements. We choose our food carefully for various reasons, so

why shouldn't we choose supplements to suit our needs. Our soil is

not as good as it should be and the food plants do not contain the

amounts of nutrients they should, even the organic ones still do not

contain the amount of nutrients that food used to.

 

If we are sensible, as everyone on this list, and eat in a caring way

that we hope will be healthy, then why not make up any shortfalls

with supplements so that we have optimum nutrition.

 

Sometimes people say they don't like supplements because they are not

natural, but the rest of their lives are not lived in 'natural' ways.

 

Jo

[Guest guest]

Read about it!

 

Incidentally, people of the past have lived without supplements.

Prove to me that they would not have lived longer if they had

supplements.

 

Jo

 

Re: Re: Braggs

 

 

Very well said.

 

--

Scott

Don't under estimate the wisdom of nature.

 

--- swpgh01 wrote:

 

Peter VV <swpgh01

 

Re: Re: Braggs

Thu, 26 Jul 2007 09:34:34 +0100 (BST)

 

 

 

The trouble is how do you tell what you are deficient in? you could

say I will take a vitamin just in case, or you can do a bit of

research and eat healithily, and maybe listen to your body and take a

vitamin/suppliment when run down, or havent been eating as well as

normal. Or you could take every pill under the sun and end up

poisoning yourself.

IMO The human body is a very forgiving thing. People survived for

centuries without suppliments, and I believe there is too much

paranoia, sponsored by the pharmacutical companies about what you

should be taking. They get rich feeding on peoples insecurities.

 

The Valley Vegan...........

[Guest guest]

That is an impossible task. How can you prove something on people who are already dead? There is absolutely no way to prove this. Prove to me that they would have been better off taking vitamins? You can't......... There are always two sides to the argument.--ScottDon't under estimate the wisdom of nature.--- jo.heartwork wrote:"heartwerk" <jo.heartwork Subject: Re: BraggsThu, 26 Jul 2007 15:20:08 -0000

 

 

 

Read about it!

 

Incidentally, people of the past have lived without supplements.

Prove to me that they would not have lived longer if they had

supplements.

 

Jo

 

Learn about the power of raw foods at ---> http://www.rawfoods.com

[Guest guest]

Prove to me that they would have!, that is not an arguement surely? The Valley Vegan...........heartwerk <jo.heartwork wrote: Read about it!Incidentally, people of the past have lived without supplements. Prove to me that they would not have lived longer if they had supplements.JoRe: Re: Braggs Very well said.--ScottDon't under estimate the wisdom of nature.--- swpgh01 (AT) talk21 (DOT) com wrote:Peter VV <swpgh01 (AT) talk21 (DOT) com> Subject: Re: Re: BraggsThu, 26 Jul 2007 09:34:34 +0100 (BST)The trouble is how do you tell what you are deficient in? you could say I will take a vitamin just in case, or you can do a bit of research and eat healithily, and maybe listen to your body and take a vitamin/suppliment when run down, or havent been eating as well as normal. Or you could take every pill under the sun and end up poisoning yourself.IMO The human body is a very forgiving thing. People survived for centuries without suppliments, and I believe there is too much paranoia, sponsored by the pharmacutical companies about what you should be taking. They get rich feeding on peoples

insecurities.The Valley Vegan...........Peter H

 

Mail is the world's favourite email. Don't settle for less, sign up for your free

account today.

[Guest guest]

I agree, as i said you need to do some homework and eat healthily, and listen to your body, it knows what it needs. There are only a few vitamins that you can overdose on, but one is too many.So unless you are worried, or feel ill or can identify something lacking in your nutrition, then why bother? The Valley Vegan............heartwerk <jo.heartwork wrote: I read up about nutrition and optimum nutrition. I don't believe in taking every vitamin under the sun

and not always in large amounts. There is plenty of literature on research about vitamins and minerals, and information on what is the minimum you need (rda) and the amount for optimum nutrition to keep you healthy, and then how to use large doses to treat illnesses. There are only a few vitamins that you can overdose on.Jo , Peter VV <swpgh01 wrote:>> The trouble is how do you tell what you are deficient in? you could say I will take a vitamin just in case, or you can do a bit of research and eat healithily, and maybe listen to your body and take a vitamin/suppliment when run down, or havent been eating as well as normal. Or you could take every pill under the sun and end up poisoning yourself.> IMO The human body is a very forgiving thing. People survived for centuries without suppliments,

and I believe there is too much paranoia, sponsored by the pharmacutical companies about what you should be taking. They get rich feeding on peoples insecurities.> > The Valley Vegan...........> > heartwerk <jo.heartwork wrote:> I find it difficult to understand people's reluctance to use > supplements. We choose our food carefully for various reasons, so > why shouldn't we choose supplements to suit our needs. Our soil is > not as good as it should be and the food plants do not contain the > amounts of nutrients they should, even the organic ones still do not > contain the amount of nutrients that food used to.> > If we are sensible, as everyone on this list, and eat in a caring way > that we hope will be healthy, then why not make up any shortfalls > with supplements so that we have optimum nutrition.> > Sometimes people

say they don't like supplements because they are not > natural, but the rest of their lives are not lived in 'natural' ways.> > Jo> , "Marcy" <imgreen03@> wrote:> >> > Funny, I started eating brewer's yeast years ( & years) ago, before > I was vegan (I was vegetarian) or knew anything about B12. I just > liked the taste of it, sprinkled on cereals, salad, etc... Now we > use it to make "Parma", with walnuts and salt, as a parmesan > substitute.> > > > I can't even recall how I found out about it!> > > > I get your point, Jo, about it being a supplement. Historically, I > didn't use it for that. How funny. Maybe that's why I didn't keel > over from a nerve disorder when I went vegan!? =0)> > > > Marcy> >

> > > > - > > heartwerk > > > > Tuesday, July 24, 2007 11:34 PM> > Re: Braggs> > > > > > I would call brewers yeast a supplement as it is not something we > > would eat in the normal course of a day. The B12 comes from the > > fermenting of the yeast. I think it is an excellent supplement.> > > > Jo> > > > , "Marcy" <imgreen03@> wrote:> > >> > > But we can get some of the dirt and bacteria on our root > veggies. > > Since we only need trace amounts of B12, this contributes to our > > overall need.> > > > > > I

east Brewers Yeast and Rice Dream as well, both of which > contain > > B12.> > > > > > I've been vegan this time for 10 years now. I gave up taking > > supplements several years ago. I just make sure we eat healthy.> > > > > > Marcy> > > > > > - > > > hacktorious > > > > > > Tuesday, July 24, 2007 7:58 AM> > > Re: Braggs> > > > > > > > > I have heard both sides of that. I have read articles stating > > that is> > > just a rumor and test's have been done to disprove that. > However, > > I> > > don't know if the sources are reliable,as I am just reading > this > >

info> > > on the internet.> > > > > > Do cows and monkeys actually need vitamin b12? I was not aware > of> > > that. But that is why I joined this group; so I can > learn.....lol> > > > > > Thanks.> > > > > > , yarrow@ wrote:> > > >> > > > Vitamin b-12 is produced by bacteria that live in the soil. > > That's > > > > where cows, monkeys and apes, and people who don't wash their > > fruits > > > > and vegetables get it from. In the modern overhygienic > > > > antibacterial-saturated world, most of us no longer eat > enough > > dirt.> > > > > > > > > > > > At 10:12 PM -0400 7/23/07, Scott wrote:>

> > > I am not convinced the human body cannot get vitamin B12 from > > some > > > > sort of plant source. Maybe it is in the inter tree bark of > > some > > > > sort of tree, which our ancestors gorged themselves on. Thus, > > > > creating a dependency for this vitamin in our genes, or maybe > > it was > > > > meat; who knows? The fact of the matter is we don't really > know.> > > >> > >> >> > > > > > > Peter H > > > > > Answers - Get better answers from someone who knows. Tryit now.>Peter H

 

Answers - Get better answers from someone who knows. Try

it now.

[Guest guest]

My point is that it cannot be proven either way.--ScottDon't under estimate the wisdom of nature.--- swpgh01 wrote:Peter VV <swpgh01 Subject: Re: Re: BraggsThu, 26 Jul 2007 19:47:11 +0100 (BST)

 

 

 

Prove to me that they would have!, that is not an arguement surely? The Valley Vegan...........

Learn about the power of raw foods at ---> http://www.rawfoods.com

[Guest guest]

I agree, that was my point also. The Valley Vegan...............Scott Macri <scottm wrote: My point is that it cannot be proven either way.--ScottDon't under estimate the wisdom of nature.--- swpgh01 (AT) talk21 (DOT) com wrote:Peter VV <swpgh01 (AT) talk21 (DOT) com>To:

Subject: Re: Re: BraggsThu, 26 Jul 2007 19:47:11 +0100 (BST) Prove to me that they would have!, that is not an arguement surely? The Valley Vegan........... Learn about the power of raw foods at ---> http://www.rawfoods.com Peter H

 

Answers - Get better answers from someone who knows. Try

it now.

[Guest guest]



Hi Scott

 

While I don't know which way the results would come out, it is quite easy to see whether people who are dead would have been better off with supplements by the use of some simple tests on their bodies to investigate vitamin and mineral deficiencies. If there are deficiencies, then it could reasonably be argued that those deficiencies could have been countered with the use of supplements, and their lives extended or improved.

 

So, not really an "impossible task", and I suspect someone somewhere has done just this research - although I can't be bothered to search for it myself.

 

BB

Peter

 

-

Scott Macri

Thursday, July 26, 2007 4:27 PM

Re: Re: Braggs

 

That is an impossible task. How can you prove something on people who are already dead? There is absolutely no way to prove this. Prove to me that they would have been better off taking vitamins? You can't......... There are always two sides to the argument.--ScottDon't under estimate the wisdom of nature.--- jo.heartwork wrote:"heartwerk" <jo.heartwork Subject: Re: BraggsThu, 26 Jul 2007 15:20:08 -0000

 

 

 

Read about it!Incidentally, people of the past have lived without supplements. Prove to me that they would not have lived longer if they had supplements.Jo

 

Learn about the power of raw foods at ---> http://www.rawfoods.com

[Guest guest]

The fact of the matter is that you don't know if the supplements will contribute to , or cause diseases. At least until someone does a study. Supplements are all processed. I don't believe they are 100% safe to take.--ScottDon't under estimate the wisdom of nature.--- metalscarab wrote:"metalscarab" <metalscarabRe: Re: BraggsThu, 26 Jul 2007 21:48:50 +0100Hi Scott While I don't know which way the results would come out, it is quite easy to see whether people who are dead would have been better off with supplements by the use of some simple tests on their bodies to investigate vitamin and mineral deficiencies. If there are deficiencies, then it could reasonably be argued that those deficiencies could have been countered with the use of supplements, and their lives extended or improved. So, not really an "impossible task", and I suspect someone somewhere has done just this research - although I can't be bothered to search for it myself. BBPeter Learn about the power of raw foods at ---> http://www.rawfoods.com

[Guest guest]

Thanks Scott - you just proved my point :-)

 

Jo

 

Re: Re: Braggs

 

 

That is an impossible task. How can you prove something on people

who are already dead? There is absolutely no way to prove this.

 

Prove to me that they would have been better off taking vitamins?

You can't.........

 

There are always two sides to the argument.

 

--

Scott

Don't under estimate the wisdom of nature.

 

--- jo.heartwork wrote:

 

" heartwerk " <jo.heartwork

 

Re: Braggs

Thu, 26 Jul 2007 15:20:08 -0000

 

 

Read about it!

 

Incidentally, people of the past have lived without supplements.

Prove to me that they would not have lived longer if they had

supplements.

 

Jo

[Guest guest]

Was yours?

 

Jo

 

, Peter VV <swpgh01 wrote:

>

> Prove to me that they would have!, that is not an arguement surely?

>

> The Valley Vegan...........

>

> heartwerk <jo.heartwork wrote:

> Read about it!

>

> Incidentally, people of the past have lived without supplements.

> Prove to me that they would not have lived longer if they had

> supplements.

>

> Jo

>

> Re: Re: Braggs

>

> Very well said.

>

> --

> Scott

> Don't under estimate the wisdom of nature.

>

> --- swpgh01 wrote:

>

> Peter VV <swpgh01

>

> Re: Re: Braggs

> Thu, 26 Jul 2007 09:34:34 +0100 (BST)

>

> The trouble is how do you tell what you are deficient in? you could

> say I will take a vitamin just in case, or you can do a bit of

> research and eat healithily, and maybe listen to your body and take

a

> vitamin/suppliment when run down, or havent been eating as well as

> normal. Or you could take every pill under the sun and end up

> poisoning yourself.

> IMO The human body is a very forgiving thing. People survived for

> centuries without suppliments, and I believe there is too much

> paranoia, sponsored by the pharmacutical companies about what you

> should be taking. They get rich feeding on peoples insecurities.

>

> The Valley Vegan...........

Peter H

>

>

>

>

> Mail is the world's favourite email. Don't settle for less,

sign up for your freeaccount today.

>

[Guest guest]

I certainly wouldn't advise people dosing themselves if they are not

capable of reading up on a subject and making an intelligent decision.

 

Jo

 

, Peter VV <swpgh01 wrote:

>

> I agree, as i said you need to do some homework and eat healthily,

and listen to your body, it knows what it needs.

> There are only a few vitamins that you can overdose on, but one

is too many.So unless you are worried, or feel ill or can identify

something lacking in your nutrition, then why bother?

>

> The Valley Vegan............

>

> heartwerk <jo.heartwork wrote:

> I read up about nutrition and optimum nutrition. I don't

believe in

> taking every vitamin under the sun and not always in large amounts.

> There is plenty of literature on research about vitamins and

> minerals, and information on what is the minimum you need (rda) and

> the amount for optimum nutrition to keep you healthy, and then how

to

> use large doses to treat illnesses. There are only a few vitamins

> that you can overdose on.

>

> Jo

>

> , Peter VV <swpgh01@> wrote:

> >

> > The trouble is how do you tell what you are deficient in? you

could

> say I will take a vitamin just in case, or you can do a bit of

> research and eat healithily, and maybe listen to your body and take

a

> vitamin/suppliment when run down, or havent been eating as well as

> normal. Or you could take every pill under the sun and end up

> poisoning yourself.

> > IMO The human body is a very forgiving thing. People survived for

> centuries without suppliments, and I believe there is too much

> paranoia, sponsored by the pharmacutical companies about what you

> should be taking. They get rich feeding on peoples insecurities.

> >

> > The Valley Vegan...........

> >

> > heartwerk <jo.heartwork@> wrote:

> > I find it difficult to understand people's reluctance to

> use

> > supplements. We choose our food carefully for various reasons, so

> > why shouldn't we choose supplements to suit our needs. Our soil

is

> > not as good as it should be and the food plants do not contain

the

> > amounts of nutrients they should, even the organic ones still do

> not

> > contain the amount of nutrients that food used to.

> >

> > If we are sensible, as everyone on this list, and eat in a caring

> way

> > that we hope will be healthy, then why not make up any shortfalls

> > with supplements so that we have optimum nutrition.

> >

> > Sometimes people say they don't like supplements because they are

> not

> > natural, but the rest of their lives are not lived in 'natural'

> ways.

> >

> > Jo

> > , " Marcy " <imgreen03@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Funny, I started eating brewer's yeast years ( & years) ago,

> before

> > I was vegan (I was vegetarian) or knew anything about B12. I just

> > liked the taste of it, sprinkled on cereals, salad, etc... Now we

> > use it to make " Parma " , with walnuts and salt, as a parmesan

> > substitute.

> > >

> > > I can't even recall how I found out about it!

> > >

> > > I get your point, Jo, about it being a supplement.

Historically,

> I

> > didn't use it for that. How funny. Maybe that's why I didn't keel

> > over from a nerve disorder when I went vegan!? =0)

> > >

> > > Marcy

> > >

> > >

> > > -

> > > heartwerk

> > >

> > > Tuesday, July 24, 2007 11:34 PM

> > > Re: Braggs

> > >

> > >

> > > I would call brewers yeast a supplement as it is not something

we

> > > would eat in the normal course of a day. The B12 comes from the

> > > fermenting of the yeast. I think it is an excellent supplement.

> > >

> > > Jo

> > >

> > > , " Marcy " <imgreen03@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > But we can get some of the dirt and bacteria on our root

> > veggies.

> > > Since we only need trace amounts of B12, this contributes to

our

> > > overall need.

> > > >

> > > > I east Brewers Yeast and Rice Dream as well, both of which

> > contain

> > > B12.

> > > >

> > > > I've been vegan this time for 10 years now. I gave up taking

> > > supplements several years ago. I just make sure we eat healthy.

> > > >

> > > > Marcy

> > > >

> > > > -

> > > > hacktorious

> > > >

> > > > Tuesday, July 24, 2007 7:58 AM

> > > > Re: Braggs

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > I have heard both sides of that. I have read articles stating

> > > that is

> > > > just a rumor and test's have been done to disprove that.

> > However,

> > > I

> > > > don't know if the sources are reliable,as I am just reading

> > this

> > > info

> > > > on the internet.

> > > >

> > > > Do cows and monkeys actually need vitamin b12? I was not

aware

> > of

> > > > that. But that is why I joined this group; so I can

> > learn.....lol

> > > >

> > > > Thanks.

> > > >

> > > > , yarrow@ wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Vitamin b-12 is produced by bacteria that live in the soil.

> > > That's

> > > > > where cows, monkeys and apes, and people who don't wash

their

> > > fruits

> > > > > and vegetables get it from. In the modern overhygienic

> > > > > antibacterial-saturated world, most of us no longer eat

> > enough

> > > dirt.

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > At 10:12 PM -0400 7/23/07, Scott wrote:

> > > > > I am not convinced the human body cannot get vitamin B12

from

> > > some

> > > > > sort of plant source. Maybe it is in the inter tree bark of

> > > some

> > > > > sort of tree, which our ancestors gorged themselves on.

Thus,

> > > > > creating a dependency for this vitamin in our genes, or

maybe

> > > it was

> > > > > meat; who knows? The fact of the matter is we don't really

> > know.

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Peter H

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Answers - Get better answers from someone who knows. Tryit

> now.

> >

Peter H

>

>

>

>

> Answers - Get better answers from someone who knows. Tryit

now.

>

[Guest guest]

Which was my point also, and all such comments are slightly

irrelevant. The argument that people used to live live ~something~

could be said of anything - doesn't mean it is best though.

 

Jo

[Guest guest]

To repeat, it seems endlessly, that is my point too.

 

Jo

 

, Peter VV <swpgh01 wrote:

>

> I agree, that was my point also.

>

> The Valley Vegan...............

>

> Scott Macri <scottm wrote:

> My point is that it cannot be proven either way.

>

> --

> Scott

> Don't under estimate the wisdom of nature.

>

> --- swpgh01 wrote:

>

> Peter VV <swpgh01

>

> Re: Re: Braggs

> Thu, 26 Jul 2007 19:47:11 +0100 (BST)

>

>

> Prove to me that they would have!, that is not an arguement

surely?

>

> The Valley Vegan...........

>

>

 

> Learn about the power of raw foods at ---> http://www.rawfoods.com

>

>

>

>

>

> Peter H

>

>

>

>

> Answers - Get better answers from someone who knows. Tryit

now.

>

[Guest guest]

Good point Peter. I had not even begun to think that way in the

present discussion.

 

I was merely trying to point out that VVs assertion that people have

lived before was not a good point.

 

Jo

 

, " metalscarab " <metalscarab

wrote:

>

> Hi Scott

>

> While I don't know which way the results would come out, it is

quite easy to see whether people who are dead would have been better

off with supplements by the use of some simple tests on their bodies

to investigate vitamin and mineral deficiencies. If there are

deficiencies, then it could reasonably be argued that those

deficiencies could have been countered with the use of supplements,

and their lives extended or improved.

>

> So, not really an " impossible task " , and I suspect someone

somewhere has done just this research - although I can't be bothered

to search for it myself.

>

> BB

> Peter

> -

> Scott Macri

>

> Thursday, July 26, 2007 4:27 PM

> Re: Re: Braggs

>

>

> That is an impossible task. How can you prove something on

people who are already dead? There is absolutely no way to prove

this.

>

> Prove to me that they would have been better off taking

vitamins? You can't.........

>

> There are always two sides to the argument.

>

> --

> Scott

> Don't under estimate the wisdom of nature.

>

> --- jo.heartwork wrote:

>

> " heartwerk " <jo.heartwork

>

> Re: Braggs

> Thu, 26 Jul 2007 15:20:08 -0000

>

> Read about it!

>

> Incidentally, people of the past have lived without supplements.

> Prove to me that they would not have lived longer if they had

> supplements.

>

> Jo

>

>

>

>

>

> --

----------

> Learn about the power of raw foods at ---> http://www.rawfoods.com

>

[Guest guest]

Which someone should do a study?

 

There are already hundreds of thousands of studies!

 

Do you want someone to post one in your door. You could find them

yourself you know, if you were interested in doing so.

 

Jo

[Guest guest]



Hi Scott

 

I'm not entirely sure I follow your logic - all food we eat is processed, unless we grow it ourselves.

 

What do you think would be in a supplement that would cause disease?

 

I agree we should be careful about what we consume, but paranoia about supplements is simply going to play straight into the hands of the pharmaceutical companies who want to have them removed from public sale, so that they can control the supply and make more money from them.

 

As a matter of interest - how would you suggest getting vitamin B12 without a supplement, or a food which has been fortified (i.e. processed)?

 

BB

Peter

 

-

Scott

Thursday, July 26, 2007 10:20 PM

Re: Re: Braggs

 

The fact of the matter is that you don't know if the supplements will contribute to , or cause diseases. At least until someone does a study. Supplements are all processed. I don't believe they are 100% safe to take.--ScottDon't under estimate the wisdom of nature.--- metalscarab wrote:"metalscarab" <metalscarabRe: Re: BraggsThu, 26 Jul 2007 21:48:50 +0100

 

 

 



Hi Scott

 

While I don't know which way the results would come out, it is quite easy to see whether people who are dead would have been better off with supplements by the use of some simple tests on their bodies to investigate vitamin and mineral deficiencies. If there are deficiencies, then it could reasonably be argued that those deficiencies could have been countered with the use of supplements, and their lives extended or improved.

 

So, not really an "impossible task", and I suspect someone somewhere has done just this research - although I can't be bothered to search for it myself.

 

BB

Peter

 

Learn about the power of raw foods at ---> http://www.rawfoods.com

[Guest guest]

Hi Jo

 

Of course, it's also worth remembering that average life-spans are still

rising, so we're obviously doing something right that they weren't a few

generations ago!

 

BB

Peter

 

-

" heartwerk " <jo.heartwork

 

Friday, July 27, 2007 7:44 AM

Re: Braggs

 

 

> Which was my point also, and all such comments are slightly

> irrelevant. The argument that people used to live live ~something~

> could be said of anything - doesn't mean it is best though.

>

> Jo

>

>

>

> To send an email to -

>