clothing dilemma

[Guest guest]

You've made a great point anouk! The major reason I quit smoking

years ago was because I felt the hipocracy of preaching all the

health hazards to my children while ignoring them myself. I knew

they'd be more aware of what I DID as compared to what I SAID.

 

GREAT point! I'm tossing the rest of my stuff today ... I just don't

know what to do with it. It seems a waste to throw these items away

yet I don't feel right giving them to charity ... I dunno

 

Thanks for the goose,

*mona

 

 

 

 

, " flower child " <zurumato

wrote:

>

> hi jo,

> I agree with Louis,

>

> that person can wear furs and leather until they wear out.

>

> but they should call themselves vegetarian, since

> the true definition of a vegan is one who abstains from

> animal products.

>

> We also have to bear in my that if someone says they are

> vegan and then a meat-eater sees them wearing leather or fur,

> then they might be called a hipocrite.

>

> It is best to model behavior and set example to carnivores, they

are

> looking at the

> first opportunity to find flaw in us.

>

> I personally would not feel comfortable wearing animal skin.

>

> -anouk

>

>

> , " heartwerk " <jo.heartwork@>

wrote:

> >

> > Hi Louis

> >

> > You do have a turn of phrase that annoys people, don't you! Do

you

> > do it on purpose or is it an accident?

> >

> > I don't think I have lost. I think your logic is faulty on this

> > occasion.

> >

> > It is sensible to use up what you have. It is wasteful to throw

> > something away just because it is not exactly what you now

want.

> > Would it help the animals to be thrown away now? I don't see

how you

> > can advocate wasting anything in this age where we are trying to

get

> > everyone to be frugal and recycle. Even PETA hand out old fur

coats

> > to keep the homeless warm.

> >

> > When the old leather clothes have worn out, that is the time to

buy

> > new vegan clothes.

> >

> > Jo

> >

> > , louis stott <lsstott@> wrote:

> > >

> > > sorry jo

> > > you have lost this on . she is now VEGAN so she needs to say

bye

> > bye bye bye to the stuff

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Yep, it feels " icky " to me too! I try not to think about it but I

can't seem to stop ...

 

*mona

 

, " flower child " <zurumato

wrote:

>

> I know what you mean, mona,

>

> my husbands car has leather seats,

> it is a german car and

> it feels icky to sit on them.

>

> I especially hate the implication in our society that

> leather is " luxurious "

>

> -anouk

>

> , " *mona " <ahnochirah@> wrote:

> >

> > Hi Linda ---

> >

> > I know whatcha mean about it being a dilemma. I have been

getting

> > rid of my dead animal clothes as I can afford it but have not

been

> > able to do a clean sweep. I don't have negative feelings about

it

> > because I'm doing this as fast as I can and that's all I can do.

The

> > only thing I can't get rid of yet are the leather seats in our

new

> > Truck. We've been thinking about buying a dune buggy so maybe

it's

> > finally time.

> >

> > Blessings,

> > *mona

> >

> > In , louis stott <lsstott@> wrote:

> > >

> > > sorry fraggle

> > > i don't agree with you there ...

> > >

> > > linda

> > > your now vegan yes ? say bye bye bye bye to them you feel so

> > much better for it .

> > >

> > >

> > > fraggle <EBbrewpunx@> wrote:

> > > well, since you had them before you went vegan..i

would

> > > keep using them and slowly fade them out

> > > certainly wouldn't buy any new dead critter clothes...

> > > but...

> > > you already have them....

> > > and, i doubt very many people could afford to buy an entirely

new

> > wardrobe from the get go....

> > > fraggle

> > >

> > >

> > > >lnellhaus <lnellhaus@>

> > > >Jan 22, 2007 9:15 AM

> > > >

> > > > clothing dilemma

> > > >

> > > >Hi,

> > > >

> > > >I'm a fairly new vegan. I've been eating a vegan diet for a

> > little

> > > >over a year now. But, I still wear the wool and leather coats

I

> > owned

> > > >before I went vegan. I feel awful about wearing them, but at

the

> > same

> > > >time I feel like I shouldn't waste the clothing. It's been

> > bothering

> > > >me a lot and would appreciate any feedback you all have.

> > > >

> > > >Thanks,

> > > >Linda

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >To send an email to -

> >

> > > >

[Guest guest]

In that case, my feedback should help him to determine how best to do it.

 

Jo

 

-

peter VV

Tuesday, January 23, 2007 6:56 PM

Re: Re: clothing dilemma

 

C,mon now, we have already established that Louis has a problem phrasing his replies and that they are not always as they appear.

Maybe he meant "you have lost ME on this one" and left the ME out?

No-one is right or wrong here, there is only opinion and personal belief.

 

The Valley Vegan............jo <jo.heartwork wrote:

 

 

 

If you are a new vegan and have some non-vegan items left it is wisest and most prudent to use them up/wear them out before discarding them to go into landfill - of which there is too much already.

 

My comment was on your first sentence telling me that I am 'lost on this one'. The fact that I disagree with you does not make me wrong and you right, and your tone is overbearing and patronising.

 

Jo

 

-

louis stott

Tuesday, January 23, 2007 7:49 AM

Re: Re: clothing dilemma

 

hi jo

i do see sort off see your point here but what i call vegan and what you call vegan are 2 diffite things . may i ask what you call and vegan ? i will then tell you i call a vegan . and please xplan what you mean the 1st part of your reply to me . i thout this was a CHAT SITE heartwerk <jo.heartwork > wrote:

 

 

Hi LouisYou do have a turn of phrase that annoys people, don't you! Do you do it on purpose or is it an accident?I don't think I have lost. I think your logic is faulty on this occasion. It is sensible to use up what you have. It is wasteful to throw something away just because it is not exactly what you now want. Would it help the animals to be thrown away now? I don't see how you can advocate wasting anything in this age where we are trying to get everyone to be frugal and recycle. Even PETA hand out old fur coats to keep the homeless warm.When the old leather clothes have worn out, that is the time to buy new vegan clothes.Jo , louis stott <lsstott wrote:>> sorry jo > you have lost this on . she is now VEGAN so she needs to say bye bye bye bye to the stuff> > jo <jo.heartwork wrote:> Hello - welcome to VeganChat.> > Carry on wearing the leather and wool until they wear out. Throwing them> out would not help anything. Use them up, and then see what you can get> that is not vegan.> > Jo> > -> "lnellhaus" <lnellhaus> > Monday, January 22, 2007 5:15 PM> clothing dilemma> > > Hi,> >> > I'm a fairly new vegan. I've been eating a vegan diet for a little> > over a year now. But, I still wear the wool and leather coats I owned> > before I went vegan. I feel awful about wearing them, but at the same> > time I feel like I shouldn't waste the clothing. It's been bothering> > me a lot and would appreciate any feedback you all have.> >> > Thanks,> > Linda> >> >> >> > To send an email to - > >

[Guest guest]

hear we go again peter bb . how can you call yourself vegan ?? in my books your veg not vegan well if you feel awful bout wearing then .. i got 2 things to say to you dump them . you are veg not vegan !Peter Kebbell <metalscarab wrote: Hi Linda >I'm a fairly new vegan. I've been eating a vegan diet for a little >over a year now. But, I still wear the wool and leather coats I owned >before I went

vegan. I feel awful about wearing them, but at the same >time I feel like I shouldn't waste the clothing. It's been bothering >me a lot and would appreciate any feedback you all have. I reckon this is something everyone goes through when they first go vegan. I went for a fairly "middle road". Everything that I could easily give away I did (so my leather wallet went within a couple of days!). More expensive items like shoes, I continued to wear until they wore out. In fact, 8 years after going vegan, I still have a suit which is 40% wool, which I've had since before I was vegan. I take the view that the animal has already suffered, and throwing out the item concerned isn't going to help that animal now, and it's just going to increase the huge amount of waste that our society produces. For me the point of being vegan is to stop contributing to cruelty - I

can't change what I did before I went vegan, but I can live in a way that will make my future less harmful. BB Peter

The all-new Mail goes wherever you go - free your email address from your Internet provider.

[Guest guest]

peter 1st things 1st i have no attitude probs .. i think if look up what vegan means etc it may help you lot . i think you should rename this group to vegan & veg_chat talscarab wrote: Hi Louis >your now vegan yes ? say bye bye bye bye to them you feel so much better for it . See, I have a bit of a problem with this sort of attitude. You seem to

be taking the view that anything which was produced or developed by a method with which we now have an ethical issue should be thrown out. In which case, I have to ask - do you support the way in which Auschwitz was run, or are you going to say bye bye bye bye to your PC? BB Peter

What kind of emailer are you? Find out today - get a free analysis of your email personality. Take the quiz at the Mail Championship.

[Guest guest]

Presumably, if you use a bus or train that has some leather or animal

parts in it, or use an aeroplane that has leather seats, you will not

call yourself a vegan. In these instances you are paying to use

something that has animal parts. If you use up an old pair of leather

shoes you are not currently paying for them.

 

Are you absolutely sure that you do not pay for anythimg that uses

animal parts? and if so can you ever call yourself a vegan?

 

Jo

 

, louis stott <lsstott wrote:

>

> hi anouk

> thank you . at least someone understands what I'm trying to say ..

> so in my book shes veg not vegan yet .

>

> hi jo

> please try to understand my replys a bit more you know i find it

hard to phrasing my replys

>

> flower child <zurumato wrote:

> hi jo,

> I agree with Louis,

>

> that person can wear furs and leather until they wear out.

>

> but they should call themselves vegetarian, since

> the true definition of a vegan is one who abstains from

> animal products.

>

> We also have to bear in my that if someone says they are

> vegan and then a meat-eater sees them wearing leather or fur,

> then they might be called a hipocrite.

>

> It is best to model behavior and set example to carnivores, they are

> looking at the

> first opportunity to find flaw in us.

>

> I personally would not feel comfortable wearing animal skin.

>

> -anouk

>

> , " heartwerk " <jo.heartwork@> wrote:

> >

> > Hi Louis

> >

> > You do have a turn of phrase that annoys people, don't you! Do you

> > do it on purpose or is it an accident?

> >

> > I don't think I have lost. I think your logic is faulty on this

> > occasion.

> >

> > It is sensible to use up what you have. It is wasteful to throw

> > something away just because it is not exactly what you now want.

> > Would it help the animals to be thrown away now? I don't see how you

> > can advocate wasting anything in this age where we are trying to get

> > everyone to be frugal and recycle. Even PETA hand out old fur coats

> > to keep the homeless warm.

> >

> > When the old leather clothes have worn out, that is the time to buy

> > new vegan clothes.

> >

> > Jo

> >

> > , louis stott <lsstott@> wrote:

> > >

> > > sorry jo

> > > you have lost this on . she is now VEGAN so she needs to say bye

> > bye bye bye to the stuff

> > >

> >

 

> What kind of emailer are you? Find out today - get a free analysis

of your email personality. Take the quiz at the Mail Championship.

>

[Guest guest]

Louis

 

The name of the group is not open for discussion.

 

If you read the introductory page you will see that it includes

vegetarians.

 

Jo

 

, louis stott <lsstott wrote:

>

> jo

> so whats point of namein this chat room ? it should be

renamed too vegan & veg_chat please tell me what you

call a vegan ?

>

> jo <jo.heartwork wrote:

> If you are a new vegan and have some non-vegan items

left it is wisest and most prudent to use them up/wear them out before

discarding them to go into landfill - of which there is too much

already.

>

> My comment was on your first sentence telling me that I am 'lost

on this one'. The fact that I disagree with you does not make me

wrong and you right, and your tone is overbearing and patronising.

>

> Jo

> -

> louis stott

>

> Tuesday, January 23, 2007 7:49 AM

> Re: Re: clothing dilemma

>

>

> hi jo

> i do see sort off see your point here but what i call vegan and

what you call vegan are 2 diffite things . may i ask what you call and

vegan ? i will then tell you i call a vegan . and please xplan what

you mean the 1st part of your reply to me . i thout this was a CHAT SITE

>

> heartwerk <jo.heartwork wrote:

> Hi Louis

>

> You do have a turn of phrase that annoys people, don't you! Do you

> do it on purpose or is it an accident?

>

> I don't think I have lost. I think your logic is faulty on this

> occasion.

>

> It is sensible to use up what you have. It is wasteful to throw

> something away just because it is not exactly what you now want.

> Would it help the animals to be thrown away now? I don't see how you

> can advocate wasting anything in this age where we are trying to get

> everyone to be frugal and recycle. Even PETA hand out old fur coats

> to keep the homeless warm.

>

> When the old leather clothes have worn out, that is the time to buy

> new vegan clothes.

>

> Jo

>

> , louis stott <lsstott@> wrote:

> >

> > sorry jo

> > you have lost this on . she is now VEGAN so she needs to say bye

> bye bye bye to the stuff

> >

> > jo <jo.heartwork@> wrote:

> > Hello - welcome to VeganChat.

> >

> > Carry on wearing the leather and wool until they wear out. Throwing

> them

> > out would not help anything. Use them up, and then see what you can

> get

> > that is not vegan.

> >

> > Jo

> >

> > -

> > " lnellhaus " <lnellhaus@>

> >

> > Monday, January 22, 2007 5:15 PM

> > clothing dilemma

> >

> > > Hi,

> > >

> > > I'm a fairly new vegan. I've been eating a vegan diet for a little

> > > over a year now. But, I still wear the wool and leather coats I

> owned

> > > before I went vegan. I feel awful about wearing them, but at the

> same

> > > time I feel like I shouldn't waste the clothing. It's been

> bothering

> > > me a lot and would appreciate any feedback you all have.

> > >

> > > Thanks,

> > > Linda

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > To send an email to -

>

> > >

[Guest guest]

Hi Peter,

 

I see your point,

my husband has got a blanket, given to him for

christmas once when he was a teen, and it's got some wool in it.

 

Veganism was a gradual step for me to because I

would wear a leather mini skirt in college when

my husband and I would go out on dates or to the movies.

 

I got it in greenwich village because I associated leather

with rock and roll cool. (I was vegetarian)and in my early twenties.

 

then it was just lying around my house and I didn't feel the

need to wear it anymore. but I did have emotional attachement

because I had good times back then, while wearing it,

but it had nothing to do it really. It was just a connatation

 

know I have a different connotation.

 

-anouk

 

 

 

 

then it was laying around and I didn't felt the need to wear it anymore

 

 

, " Peter Kebbell " <metalscarab

wrote:

>

> I reckon this is something everyone goes through when they first go

vegan. I

> went for a fairly " middle road " . Everything that I could easily give

away I

> did (so my leather wallet went within a couple of days!). More expensive

> items like shoes, I continued to wear until they wore out. In fact,

8 years

> after going vegan, I still have a suit which is 40% wool, which I've had

> since before I was vegan.

>

> I take the view that the animal has already suffered, and throwing

out the

> item concerned isn't going to help that animal now, and it's just

going to

> increase the huge amount of waste that our society produces. For me the

> point of being vegan is to stop contributing to cruelty - I can't change

> what I did before I went vegan, but I can live in a way that will

make my

> future less harmful.

>

> BB

> Peter

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Louis,

 

unfortunately the world in which we live in, almost everything has

got animal parts in it.

 

This makes me sad. supposedly, the very same computer on which

I type has got some plastic with animal oil on it. (at least

that is what someone told me.)

 

If you go around my house, there is almost nothing with animals in it.

except for that blanket which has wool in it, and has semential reasons

for my husband. We don't use it. but maybe he will trow it out?

who knows?

 

I'ts very hard to be a perfect vegan. but I try

 

I want to show the world that it is possible to live whithout hurting

or using others

 

I think that we must applaud little acts, which make the world a

better place. Many times, people can't be vegan cold turkey

and vegetarianism can be a path to vegansim.

 

but now that I know, it is like an AWARENESS and I can't go back.

 

my Aunt, said I was too strict because I wouldn't eat something

with butter.

That's right, I am strict about being kind.

 

-anouk

 

 

 

 

, " heartwerk " <jo.heartwork wrote:

>

> Louis

>

> The name of the group is not open for discussion.

>

> If you read the introductory page you will see that it includes

> vegetarians.

>

> Jo

>

> , louis stott <lsstott@> wrote:

> >

> > jo

> > so whats point of namein this chat room ? it should be

> renamed too vegan & veg_chat please tell me what you

> call a vegan ?

> >

> > jo <jo.heartwork@> wrote:

> > If you are a new vegan and have some non-vegan items

> left it is wisest and most prudent to use them up/wear them out before

> discarding them to go into landfill - of which there is too much

> already.

> >

> > My comment was on your first sentence telling me that I am 'lost

> on this one'. The fact that I disagree with you does not make me

> wrong and you right, and your tone is overbearing and patronising.

> >

> > Jo

> > -

> > louis stott

> >

> > Tuesday, January 23, 2007 7:49 AM

> > Re: Re: clothing dilemma

> >

> >

> > hi jo

> > i do see sort off see your point here but what i call vegan and

> what you call vegan are 2 diffite things . may i ask what you call and

> vegan ? i will then tell you i call a vegan . and please xplan what

> you mean the 1st part of your reply to me . i thout this was a CHAT

SITE

> >

> > heartwerk <jo.heartwork@> wrote:

> > Hi Louis

> >

> > You do have a turn of phrase that annoys people, don't you! Do you

> > do it on purpose or is it an accident?

> >

> > I don't think I have lost. I think your logic is faulty on this

> > occasion.

> >

> > It is sensible to use up what you have. It is wasteful to throw

> > something away just because it is not exactly what you now want.

> > Would it help the animals to be thrown away now? I don't see how you

> > can advocate wasting anything in this age where we are trying to get

> > everyone to be frugal and recycle. Even PETA hand out old fur coats

> > to keep the homeless warm.

> >

> > When the old leather clothes have worn out, that is the time to buy

> > new vegan clothes.

> >

> > Jo

> >

> > , louis stott <lsstott@> wrote:

> > >

> > > sorry jo

> > > you have lost this on . she is now VEGAN so she needs to say bye

> > bye bye bye to the stuff

> > >

> > > jo <jo.heartwork@> wrote:

> > > Hello - welcome to VeganChat.

> > >

> > > Carry on wearing the leather and wool until they wear out. Throwing

> > them

> > > out would not help anything. Use them up, and then see what you can

> > get

> > > that is not vegan.

> > >

> > > Jo

> > >

> > > -

> > > " lnellhaus " <lnellhaus@>

> > >

> > > Monday, January 22, 2007 5:15 PM

> > > clothing dilemma

> > >

> > > > Hi,

> > > >

> > > > I'm a fairly new vegan. I've been eating a vegan diet for a little

> > > > over a year now. But, I still wear the wool and leather coats I

> > owned

> > > > before I went vegan. I feel awful about wearing them, but at the

> > same

> > > > time I feel like I shouldn't waste the clothing. It's been

> > bothering

> > > > me a lot and would appreciate any feedback you all have.

> > > >

> > > > Thanks,

> > > > Linda

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > To send an email to -

> >

> > > >

[Guest guest]

Hi Louis:

 

Thank you for your response. I do aspire to the vegan lifestyle and

am trying to make the changes as best I can. I'm not sure I follow

the importance that you seem to place on " when " one can and cannot

claim to be vegan but I respect your position.

 

I liken it a lot to one's religious preference in that once the

commitment is made to go in a certain direction, you begin

the " process " of learning and of identifying with that philosophy

and its people. I joined this group because I know NO ONE in my

circle of life that is following this path and I hoped being here

would help keep me focused and it does.

 

Believe what you will Louis, to me, anyone willingly making the

effort to adjust their life accordingly can call themselves whatever

they wish ... I don't call myself a vegan in public because I don't

have all the ropes down yet. I say that I am a veg with vegan

tendencies ... that opens the conversation up to why I am choosing

to go in that direction which is always a fun topic for dicussion.

 

By the way, I didn't buy the truck. It's actually my husband's ... I

gave my car to my son when he turned 16 last year and I'm in the

market for a vegan friendly ride !! ;-P

 

Have a great day!

*mona

 

, louis stott <lsstott wrote:

>

> hi mona

> like i said to jo . how can you call your self vegan ? your not

vegan your veg becos you have leather in your truck i have a new

name for this chat room it should bee vegan & veg_chat

>

> *mona <ahnochirah wrote:

> Hi Linda ---

>

> I know whatcha mean about it being a dilemma. I have been getting

> rid of my dead animal clothes as I can afford it but have not been

> able to do a clean sweep. I don't have negative feelings about it

> because I'm doing this as fast as I can and that's all I can do.

The

> only thing I can't get rid of yet are the leather seats in our new

> Truck. We've been thinking about buying a dune buggy so maybe it's

> finally time.

>

> Blessings,

> *mona

>

> In , louis stott <lsstott@> wrote:

> >

> > sorry fraggle

> > i don't agree with you there ...

> >

> > linda

> > your now vegan yes ? say bye bye bye bye to them you feel so

> much better for it .

> >

> >

> > fraggle <EBbrewpunx@> wrote:

> > well, since you had them before you went vegan..i would

> > keep using them and slowly fade them out

> > certainly wouldn't buy any new dead critter clothes...

> > but...

> > you already have them....

> > and, i doubt very many people could afford to buy an entirely

new

> wardrobe from the get go....

> > fraggle

> >

> >

> > >lnellhaus <lnellhaus@>

> > >Jan 22, 2007 9:15 AM

> > >

> > > clothing dilemma

> > >

> > >Hi,

> > >

> > >I'm a fairly new vegan. I've been eating a vegan diet for a

> little

> > >over a year now. But, I still wear the wool and leather coats I

> owned

> > >before I went vegan. I feel awful about wearing them, but at

the

> same

> > >time I feel like I shouldn't waste the clothing. It's been

> bothering

> > >me a lot and would appreciate any feedback you all have.

> > >

> > >Thanks,

> > >Linda

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >To send an email to -

>

> > >

[Guest guest]

Lets get one thing straight, no-one could ever be 100% vegan, it just is not possible, unless you stop breathing or drinking anything. Everyone tries and makes a concious decision to be as vegan as possible. To some people that turn vegan and still have animal skin products, it is a bigger crime and wastefull to discard them after buying them than to wear them out and replace them with a vegan alternative. To others, possibly more afluent, they will replace them immediatly. The important thing is that since they turned vegan, that they do not sponsor an animals demise by purchasing an animal skin product. Judging is not helpful, your concience should be your guide not peer pressure. We are not children here, no-one should stand up and say " I`m a bigger vegan than you are", that is self defeating. Sorry to have my straight head on at the moment, normal service will be

resumed......... The Valley Vegan................heartwerk <jo.heartwork wrote: Presumably, if you use a bus or train that has some leather or animalparts in it, or use an aeroplane that has leather seats, you will notcall yourself a vegan. In these instances you are paying to usesomething that has animal parts. If you use up an old pair of leathershoes you are not currently paying for them.Are you absolutely sure that you do not pay for anythimg that

usesanimal parts? and if so can you ever call yourself a vegan?Jo , louis stott <lsstott wrote:>> hi anouk > thank you . at least someone understands what I'm trying to say .. > so in my book shes veg not vegan yet .> > hi jo > please try to understand my replys a bit more you know i find ithard to phrasing my replys> > flower child <zurumato wrote:> hi jo, > I agree with Louis, > > that person can wear furs and leather until they wear out. > > but they should call themselves vegetarian, since> the true definition of a vegan is one who abstains from > animal products. > > We also have to bear in my that if someone says they are > vegan and then a meat-eater sees them wearing leather or

fur,> then they might be called a hipocrite. > > It is best to model behavior and set example to carnivores, they are> looking at the > first opportunity to find flaw in us. > > I personally would not feel comfortable wearing animal skin. > > -anouk> > , "heartwerk" <jo.heartwork@> wrote:> >> > Hi Louis> > > > You do have a turn of phrase that annoys people, don't you! Do you > > do it on purpose or is it an accident?> > > > I don't think I have lost. I think your logic is faulty on this > > occasion. > > > > It is sensible to use up what you have. It is wasteful to throw > > something away just because it is not exactly what you now want. > > Would it help the animals to be thrown

away now? I don't see how you > > can advocate wasting anything in this age where we are trying to get > > everyone to be frugal and recycle. Even PETA hand out old fur coats > > to keep the homeless warm.> > > > When the old leather clothes have worn out, that is the time to buy > > new vegan clothes.> > > > Jo> > > > , louis stott <lsstott@> wrote:> > >> > > sorry jo > > > you have lost this on . she is now VEGAN so she needs to say bye > > bye bye bye to the stuff> > > > > > > > > > > > > What kind of emailer are you? Find out today - get a free analysisof your email personality. Take the quiz at the

Mail Championship.>Peter H

 

What kind of emailer are you? Find out today - get a free analysis of your email personality. Take the quiz at the Mail Championship.

[Guest guest]

Louis, Everyone is entitled to an opinion, we all know what vegan means and you know it. We use this chat room in a friendly way which is why we welcome vegetarians and future vegans and try and encourage each other as much as possible. Its much nicer to be possitive? I`m starting to sound too sensible now! The Valley Vegan............louis stott <lsstott wrote: peter 1st things 1st i have no attitude probs .. i

think if look up what vegan means etc it may help you lot . i think you should rename this group to vegan & veg_chat talscarab > wrote: Hi Louis >your now vegan yes ? say bye bye bye bye to them you feel so much better for it . See, I have a bit of a problem with this sort of attitude. You seem to be taking the view that anything which was produced or developed by a method with which we now have an ethical issue should be thrown out. In which case, I have to ask - do you support the way in which Auschwitz was run, or are you going to say bye bye bye bye to your PC? BB Peter What kind of emailer are you? Find out today - get a free analysis of your email personality. Take the quiz at the Mail Championship. Peter H

 

The all-new Mail goes wherever you go - free your email address from your Internet provider.

[Guest guest]

Yeah, I've been pondering this on and off today per our postings

back and forth and I see your point. Like I've said before, I still

don't know HOW MUCH I don't know but am enjoying the learning

process and enjoying this group.

 

Blessings,

*mona

 

, peter VV <swpgh01 wrote:

>

> Lets get one thing straight, no-one could ever be 100% vegan, it

just is not possible, unless you stop breathing or drinking anything.

> Everyone tries and makes a concious decision to be as vegan as

possible.

> To some people that turn vegan and still have animal skin

products, it is a bigger crime and wastefull to discard them after

buying them than to wear them out and replace them with a vegan

alternative. To others, possibly more afluent, they will replace

them immediatly.

> The important thing is that since they turned vegan, that they

do not sponsor an animals demise by purchasing an animal skin

product.

> Judging is not helpful, your concience should be your guide not

peer pressure.

> We are not children here, no-one should stand up and say " I`m a

bigger vegan than you are " , that is self defeating.

>

> Sorry to have my straight head on at the moment, normal service

will be resumed.........

>

> The Valley Vegan................

>

> heartwerk <jo.heartwork wrote:

> Presumably, if you use a bus or train that has some

leather or animal

> parts in it, or use an aeroplane that has leather seats, you will

not

> call yourself a vegan. In these instances you are paying to use

> something that has animal parts. If you use up an old pair of

leather

> shoes you are not currently paying for them.

>

> Are you absolutely sure that you do not pay for anythimg that uses

> animal parts? and if so can you ever call yourself a vegan?

>

> Jo

>

> , louis stott <lsstott@> wrote:

> >

> > hi anouk

> > thank you . at least someone understands what I'm trying to

say ..

> > so in my book shes veg not vegan yet .

> >

> > hi jo

> > please try to understand my replys a bit more you know i find it

> hard to phrasing my replys

> >

> > flower child <zurumato@> wrote:

> > hi jo,

> > I agree with Louis,

> >

> > that person can wear furs and leather until they wear out.

> >

> > but they should call themselves vegetarian, since

> > the true definition of a vegan is one who abstains from

> > animal products.

> >

> > We also have to bear in my that if someone says they are

> > vegan and then a meat-eater sees them wearing leather or fur,

> > then they might be called a hipocrite.

> >

> > It is best to model behavior and set example to carnivores, they

are

> > looking at the

> > first opportunity to find flaw in us.

> >

> > I personally would not feel comfortable wearing animal skin.

> >

> > -anouk

> >

> > , " heartwerk " <jo.heartwork@>

wrote:

> > >

> > > Hi Louis

> > >

> > > You do have a turn of phrase that annoys people, don't you! Do

you

> > > do it on purpose or is it an accident?

> > >

> > > I don't think I have lost. I think your logic is faulty on

this

> > > occasion.

> > >

> > > It is sensible to use up what you have. It is wasteful to

throw

> > > something away just because it is not exactly what you now

want.

> > > Would it help the animals to be thrown away now? I don't see

how you

> > > can advocate wasting anything in this age where we are trying

to get

> > > everyone to be frugal and recycle. Even PETA hand out old fur

coats

> > > to keep the homeless warm.

> > >

> > > When the old leather clothes have worn out, that is the time

to buy

> > > new vegan clothes.

> > >

> > > Jo

> > >

> > > , louis stott <lsstott@>

wrote:

> > > >

> > > > sorry jo

> > > > you have lost this on . she is now VEGAN so she needs to say

bye

> > > bye bye bye to the stuff

> > > >

> > >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > What kind of emailer are you? Find out today - get a free

analysis

> of your email personality. Take the quiz at the Mail

Championship.

> >

Peter H

>

>

>

>

> What kind of emailer are you? Find out today - get a free

analysis of your email personality. Take the quiz at the Mail

Championship.

>

[Guest guest]

Why dont you feel right giving it away to charity? you could be stopping someone buying new dead animal skins and sponsoring the industry a bit more? Also it seems even more disrespectful to the original skins owner to be thrown away when no longer wanted, rather than used until worn out? Maybe its just my way of thinking? The Valley Vegan.............*mona <ahnochirah wrote: You've made a great point anouk! The major reason I quit smoking years ago was

because I felt the hipocracy of preaching all the health hazards to my children while ignoring them myself. I knew they'd be more aware of what I DID as compared to what I SAID. GREAT point! I'm tossing the rest of my stuff today ... I just don't know what to do with it. It seems a waste to throw these items away yet I don't feel right giving them to charity ... I dunnoThanks for the goose,*mona , "flower child" <zurumato wrote:>> hi jo, > I agree with Louis, > > that person can wear furs and leather until they wear out. > > but they should call themselves vegetarian, since> the true definition of a vegan is one who abstains from > animal products. > > We also have to bear in my that if someone says they are > vegan and then a meat-eater sees

them wearing leather or fur,> then they might be called a hipocrite. > > It is best to model behavior and set example to carnivores, they are> looking at the > first opportunity to find flaw in us. > > I personally would not feel comfortable wearing animal skin. > > -anouk> > > , "heartwerk" <jo.heartwork@> wrote:> >> > Hi Louis> > > > You do have a turn of phrase that annoys people, don't you! Do you > > do it on purpose or is it an accident?> > > > I don't think I have lost. I think your logic is faulty on this > > occasion. > > > > It is sensible to use up what you have. It is wasteful to throw > > something away just because it is not exactly what you now want.

> > Would it help the animals to be thrown away now? I don't see how you > > can advocate wasting anything in this age where we are trying to get > > everyone to be frugal and recycle. Even PETA hand out old fur coats > > to keep the homeless warm.> > > > When the old leather clothes have worn out, that is the time to buy > > new vegan clothes.> > > > Jo> > > > , louis stott <lsstott@> wrote:> > >> > > sorry jo > > > you have lost this on . she is now VEGAN so she needs to say bye > > bye bye bye to the stuff> > > > >>Peter H

 

Now you can scan emails quickly with a reading pane. Get the new Mail.

[Guest guest]

i think veganism is a journey

 

with each step along the way trying to bring you closer to whatever your goal

is.

 

it is nearly impossible to be 100% vegan and live in modern society.

 

but, all we can do is try.

 

who here smokes?

guess what..not vegan....

 

do you drive a car?

use anything that was made in a steel plant?

is everything in your haus 100% animal free?

ever eat out?

 

living in Western culture, and being a part of said culture, you are surrounded

by products, consumables, objects, that either use animals in their production

or have animal base to them

 

all we can do is try and limit to the best of our abilities

to contiually learn and educate ourselves

to look for alternatives....

 

fraggle

 

" Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired, signifies

in the final sense a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are

cold and are not clothed. "

-- Dwight Eisenhower

[Guest guest]

Hi mona,

 

I agree,

the important thing is to not

contiNUe supporting such industries that abuse animals for profit.

 

once I became more aware of the suffering I caused

by being part of it.. then I just acted on my conscience.

 

and for the earth

 

reuse reduce recycle, of course

 

 

 

, " *mona " <ahnochirah wrote:

>

> Yeah, I've been pondering this on and off today per our postings

> back and forth and I see your point. Like I've said before, I still

> don't know HOW MUCH I don't know but am enjoying the learning

> process and enjoying this group.

>

> Blessings,

> *mona

>

> , peter VV <swpgh01@> wrote:

> >

> > Lets get one thing straight, no-one could ever be 100% vegan, it

> just is not possible, unless you stop breathing or drinking anything.

> > Everyone tries and makes a concious decision to be as vegan as

> possible.

> > To some people that turn vegan and still have animal skin

>

[Guest guest]

hi peter,

 

i think what Peta did with giving out donated fur coats to the

homeless is great because it provided warmth, and it too the

" Glamour " out of it.

 

which is something the fur business

relies on for sales.. the luxury aspect.

 

how do you like that Anna Wintour!

 

 

-- In , peter VV <swpgh01 wrote:

>

> Why dont you feel right giving it away to charity? you could be

stopping someone buying new dead animal skins and sponsoring the

industry a bit more? Also it seems even more disrespectful to the

original skins owner to be thrown away when no longer wanted, rather

than used until worn out?

> Maybe its just my way of thinking?

>

> The Valley Vegan.............

>

> *mona <ahnochirah wrote:

> You've made a great point anouk! The major reason I quit

smoking

> years ago was because I felt the hipocracy of preaching all the

> health hazards to my children while ignoring them myself. I knew

> they'd be more aware of what I DID as compared to what I SAID.

>

[Guest guest]

I liked what you said about it being " disrespectful to the original

skins owner to be thrown away " ... that makes a lot of sense to me

so thank you for putting it into perspective.

 

I like the way you think!

 

*mona

 

, peter VV <swpgh01 wrote:

>

> Why dont you feel right giving it away to charity? you could be

stopping someone buying new dead animal skins and sponsoring the

industry a bit more? Also it seems even more disrespectful to the

original skins owner to be thrown away when no longer wanted, rather

than used until worn out?

> Maybe its just my way of thinking?

>

> The Valley Vegan.............

>

> *mona <ahnochirah wrote:

> You've made a great point anouk! The major reason I quit

smoking

> years ago was because I felt the hipocracy of preaching all the

> health hazards to my children while ignoring them myself. I knew

> they'd be more aware of what I DID as compared to what I SAID.

>

> GREAT point! I'm tossing the rest of my stuff today ... I just

don't

> know what to do with it. It seems a waste to throw these items

away

> yet I don't feel right giving them to charity ... I dunno

>

> Thanks for the goose,

> *mona

>

> , " flower child " <zurumato@>

> wrote:

> >

> > hi jo,

> > I agree with Louis,

> >

> > that person can wear furs and leather until they wear out.

> >

> > but they should call themselves vegetarian, since

> > the true definition of a vegan is one who abstains from

> > animal products.

> >

> > We also have to bear in my that if someone says they are

> > vegan and then a meat-eater sees them wearing leather or fur,

> > then they might be called a hipocrite.

> >

> > It is best to model behavior and set example to carnivores, they

> are

> > looking at the

> > first opportunity to find flaw in us.

> >

> > I personally would not feel comfortable wearing animal skin.

> >

> > -anouk

> >

> >

> > , " heartwerk " <jo.heartwork@>

> wrote:

> > >

> > > Hi Louis

> > >

> > > You do have a turn of phrase that annoys people, don't you! Do

> you

> > > do it on purpose or is it an accident?

> > >

> > > I don't think I have lost. I think your logic is faulty on

this

> > > occasion.

> > >

> > > It is sensible to use up what you have. It is wasteful to

throw

> > > something away just because it is not exactly what you now

> want.

> > > Would it help the animals to be thrown away now? I don't see

> how you

> > > can advocate wasting anything in this age where we are trying

to

> get

> > > everyone to be frugal and recycle. Even PETA hand out old fur

> coats

> > > to keep the homeless warm.

> > >

> > > When the old leather clothes have worn out, that is the time

to

> buy

> > > new vegan clothes.

> > >

> > > Jo

> > >

> > > , louis stott <lsstott@>

wrote:

> > > >

> > > > sorry jo

> > > > you have lost this on . she is now VEGAN so she needs to say

> bye

> > > bye bye bye to the stuff

> > > >

> > >

> >

Peter H

>

>

>

>

> Now you can scan emails quickly with a reading pane. Get the new

Mail.

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Louis, I understand that you have a problem some times with your replies, which is why I bring it to the attention of the others.I want to avoid uneccessary conflict if at all possible. The Valley Vegan.............louis stott <lsstott wrote: hi peter w i ow you a thank you . so thank you , i think you are the only one what knows i find it with my replys peter VV <swpgh01 (AT) talk21 (DOT) com> wrote: To me waste is worse than good intentions. As long as you have not bought anything made from animals since being vegan, then I think that there is nothing wrong in either wearing what you have until it is worn out, or give to a charity shop if you can afford to replace them. The Valley Vegan....................lnellhaus <lnellhaus > wrote: Hi,I'm a fairly new vegan. I've been eating a vegan diet for a little over a year now. But, I still wear the wool and leather coats I owned before I went vegan. I feel awful about wearing them, but at the same time I feel like I shouldn't waste the clothing. It's been bothering me a lot and

would appreciate any feedback you all have.Thanks,Linda Peter H Messenger - with free PC-PC calling and photo sharing. What kind of emailer are you? Find out today - get a free analysis of your email personality. Take the quiz at the Mail Championship. Peter H

 

What kind of emailer are you? Find out today - get a free analysis of your email personality. Take the quiz at the Mail Championship.

[Guest guest]

My point precisely - and therefore should have been aimed elsewhere!

 

Jo

 

-

peter VV

Wednesday, January 24, 2007 7:55 PM

Re: Re: clothing dilemma

 

Lets get one thing straight, no-one could ever be 100% vegan, it just is not possible, unless you stop breathing or drinking anything.

Everyone tries and makes a concious decision to be as vegan as possible.

To some people that turn vegan and still have animal skin products, it is a bigger crime and wastefull to discard them after buying them than to wear them out and replace them with a vegan alternative. To others, possibly more afluent, they will replace them immediatly.

The important thing is that since they turned vegan, that they do not sponsor an animals demise by purchasing an animal skin product.

Judging is not helpful, your concience should be your guide not peer pressure.

We are not children here, no-one should stand up and say " I`m a bigger vegan than you are", that is self defeating.

 

Sorry to have my straight head on at the moment, normal service will be resumed.........

 

The Valley Vegan................heartwerk <jo.heartwork wrote:

 

 

Presumably, if you use a bus or train that has some leather or animalparts in it, or use an aeroplane that has leather seats, you will notcall yourself a vegan. In these instances you are paying to usesomething that has animal parts. If you use up an old pair of leathershoes you are not currently paying for them.Are you absolutely sure that you do not pay for anythimg that usesanimal parts? and if so can you ever call yourself a vegan?Jo , louis stott <lsstott wrote:>> hi anouk > thank you . at least someone understands what I'm trying to say .. > so in my book shes veg not vegan yet .> > hi jo > please try to understand my replys a bit more you know i find ithard to phrasing my replys> > flower child <zurumato wrote:> hi jo, > I agree with Louis, > > that person can wear furs and leather until they wear out. > > but they should call themselves vegetarian, since> the true definition of a vegan is one who abstains from > animal products. > > We also have to bear in my that if someone says they are > vegan and then a meat-eater sees them wearing leather or fur,> then they might be called a hipocrite. > > It is best to model behavior and set example to carnivores, they are> looking at the > first opportunity to find flaw in us. > > I personally would not feel comfortable wearing animal skin. > > -anouk> > , "heartwerk" <jo.heartwork@> wrote:> >> > Hi Louis> > > > You do have a turn of phrase that annoys people, don't you! Do you > > do it on purpose or is it an accident?> > > > I don't think I have lost. I think your logic is faulty on this > > occasion. > > > > It is sensible to use up what you have. It is wasteful to throw > > something away just because it is not exactly what you now want. > > Would it help the animals to be thrown away now? I don't see how you > > can advocate wasting anything in this age where we are trying to get > > everyone to be frugal and recycle. Even PETA hand out old fur coats > > to keep the homeless warm.> > > > When the old leather clothes have worn out, that is the time to buy > > new vegan clothes.> > > > Jo> > > > , louis stott <lsstott@> wrote:> > >> > > sorry jo > > > you have lost this on . she is now VEGAN so she needs to say bye > > bye bye bye to the stuff> > > > > > > > > > > > > What kind of emailer are you? Find out today - get a free analysisof your email personality. Take the quiz at the Mail Championship.>

Peter H

 

 

 

What kind of emailer are you? Find out today - get a free analysis of your email personality. Take the quiz at the Mail Championship.

[Guest guest]

Louis

 

You seem to be answering something to the wrong person.

 

I thinkit is about time we stopped this conversation, as you seem to have nothing new to add to it.

 

Jo

 

-

louis stott

Wednesday, January 24, 2007 2:38 PM

Re: clothing dilemma

 

hear we go again

peter bb . how can you call yourself vegan ?? in my books your veg not vegan well if you feel awful bout wearing then .. i got 2 things to say to you dump them . you are veg not vegan !Peter Kebbell <metalscarab wrote:

 

 

 

Hi Linda

 

>I'm a fairly new vegan. I've been eating a vegan diet for a little

>over a year now. But, I still wear the wool and leather coats I owned

>before I went vegan. I feel awful about wearing them, but at the same

>time I feel like I shouldn't waste the clothing. It's been bothering

>me a lot and would appreciate any feedback you all have.

 

I reckon this is something everyone goes through when they first go vegan. I went for a fairly "middle road". Everything that I could easily give away I did (so my leather wallet went within a couple of days!). More expensive items like shoes, I continued to wear until they wore out. In fact, 8 years after going vegan, I still have a suit which is 40% wool, which I've had since before I was vegan.

 

I take the view that the animal has already suffered, and throwing out the item concerned isn't going to help that animal now, and it's just going to increase the huge amount of waste that our society produces. For me the point of being vegan is to stop contributing to cruelty - I can't change what I did before I went vegan, but I can live in a way that will make my future less harmful.

 

BB

Peter

 

 

 

The all-new Mail goes wherever you go - free your email address from your Internet provider.

[Guest guest]

hi jo in reply to one of your replys to ( me ) when i call a cab etc i always say to them that im vegan and dont wont leather seats etc bet you dont ?jo <jo.heartwork wrote: My point precisely - and therefore should have been aimed elsewhere! Jo ----- Original

Message ----- peter VV Wednesday, January 24, 2007 7:55 PM Re: Re: clothing dilemma Lets get one thing straight, no-one could ever be 100% vegan, it just is not possible, unless you stop breathing or drinking anything. Everyone tries and makes a concious decision to be as vegan as possible. To some people that turn vegan and still have animal skin products, it is a bigger crime and wastefull to discard them after buying them than to wear them out and replace them with a vegan alternative. To others, possibly more

afluent, they will replace them immediatly. The important thing is that since they turned vegan, that they do not sponsor an animals demise by purchasing an animal skin product. Judging is not helpful, your concience should be your guide not peer pressure. We are not children here, no-one should stand up and say " I`m a bigger vegan than you are", that is self defeating. Sorry to have my straight head on at the moment, normal service will be resumed......... The Valley Vegan................heartwerk <jo.heartwork > wrote: Presumably, if you use a bus or train that has some leather or animalparts in it, or use an aeroplane that has leather seats, you will notcall yourself a vegan. In these instances

you are paying to usesomething that has animal parts. If you use up an old pair of leathershoes you are not currently paying for them.Are you absolutely sure that you do not pay for anythimg that usesanimal parts? and if so can you ever call yourself a vegan?Jo , louis stott <lsstott wrote:>> hi anouk > thank you . at least someone understands what I'm trying to say .. > so in my book shes veg not vegan yet .> > hi jo > please try to understand my replys a bit more you know i find ithard to phrasing my replys> > flower child <zurumato wrote:> hi jo, > I agree with Louis, > > that person can wear furs and leather until they wear out. > > but they should call themselves vegetarian, since> the true definition

of a vegan is one who abstains from > animal products. > > We also have to bear in my that if someone says they are > vegan and then a meat-eater sees them wearing leather or fur,> then they might be called a hipocrite. > > It is best to model behavior and set example to carnivores, they are> looking at the > first opportunity to find flaw in us. > > I personally would not feel comfortable wearing animal skin. > > -anouk> > , "heartwerk" <jo.heartwork@> wrote:> >> > Hi Louis> > > > You do have a turn of phrase that annoys people, don't you! Do you > > do it on purpose or is it an accident?> > > > I don't think I have lost. I think your logic is faulty on this > > occasion. > >

> > It is sensible to use up what you have. It is wasteful to throw > > something away just because it is not exactly what you now want. > > Would it help the animals to be thrown away now? I don't see how you > > can advocate wasting anything in this age where we are trying to get > > everyone to be frugal and recycle. Even PETA hand out old fur coats > > to keep the homeless warm.> > > > When the old leather clothes have worn out, that is the time to buy > > new vegan clothes.> > > > Jo> > > > , louis stott <lsstott@> wrote:> > >> > > sorry jo > > > you have lost this on . she is now VEGAN so she needs to say bye > > bye bye bye to the stuff> > > > > > > >

> > > > > What kind of emailer are you? Find out today - get a free analysisof your email personality. Take the quiz at the Mail Championship.> Peter H What kind of emailer are you? Find out today - get a free analysis of your email personality. Take the quiz at the Mail Championship.

The all-new Mail goes wherever you go - free your email address from your Internet provider.

[Guest guest]

Hi Peter

 

>We are not children here, no-one should stand up and say " I`m a bigger vegan than you are", that is self defeating.

 

I'm a ninth degree vegan... I don't eat anything that casts a shadow :-)

 

BB

Peter

[Guest guest]

Hi Louis

 

So, since that's the way you feel, presumably your using a PC means that you call yourself a nazi....

 

BB

Peter

 

-

louis stott

Wednesday, January 24, 2007 2:38 PM

Re: clothing dilemma

 

hear we go again

peter bb . how can you call yourself vegan ?? in my books your veg not vegan well if you feel awful bout wearing then .. i got 2 things to say to you dump them . you are veg not vegan !Peter Kebbell <metalscarab wrote:

 

 

 

Hi Linda

 

>I'm a fairly new vegan. I've been eating a vegan diet for a little

>over a year now. But, I still wear the wool and leather coats I owned

>before I went vegan. I feel awful about wearing them, but at the same

>time I feel like I shouldn't waste the clothing. It's been bothering

>me a lot and would appreciate any feedback you all have.

 

I reckon this is something everyone goes through when they first go vegan. I went for a fairly "middle road". Everything that I could easily give away I did (so my leather wallet went within a couple of days!). More expensive items like shoes, I continued to wear until they wore out. In fact, 8 years after going vegan, I still have a suit which is 40% wool, which I've had since before I was vegan.

 

I take the view that the animal has already suffered, and throwing out the item concerned isn't going to help that animal now, and it's just going to increase the huge amount of waste that our society produces. For me the point of being vegan is to stop contributing to cruelty - I can't change what I did before I went vegan, but I can live in a way that will make my future less harmful.

 

BB

Peter

 

 

 

The all-new Mail goes wherever you go - free your email address from your Internet provider.

[Guest guest]

sorry i dont know what a nazi is ? so i cart reply Peter <metalscarab wrote: Hi Louis So, since that's the way you feel, presumably your using a PC means that you call yourself a nazi.... BB Peter

- louis stott Wednesday, January 24, 2007 2:38 PM Re: clothing dilemma hear we go again peter bb . how can you call yourself vegan ?? in my books your veg not vegan well if you feel awful bout wearing then .. i got 2 things to say to you dump them . you are veg not vegan !Peter Kebbell <metalscarab > wrote: Hi Linda >I'm a fairly new vegan. I've been eating a vegan diet for a little >over a year now. But, I still wear the wool and leather coats I owned >before I went vegan. I feel awful about wearing them, but at the same >time I feel like I shouldn't waste the clothing. It's been bothering >me a lot and would appreciate any feedback you all have. I reckon this is something everyone goes through when they first go vegan. I went for a fairly "middle road". Everything that I could easily give away I did (so my leather wallet went within a couple of days!). More expensive items like shoes, I continued to wear until they wore out. In fact, 8 years after going vegan, I still have a suit which is 40% wool, which I've had since before I was vegan.

I take the view that the animal has already suffered, and throwing out the item concerned isn't going to help that animal now, and it's just going to increase the huge amount of waste that our society produces. For me the point of being vegan is to stop contributing to cruelty - I can't change what I did before I went vegan, but I can live in a way that will make my future less harmful. BB Peter The all-new Mail goes wherever you go - free your email address from your Internet provider.

New Mail is the ultimate force in competitive emailing. Find out more at the Mail Championships. Plus: play games and win prizes.