Guest guest Report post Posted April 17, 2004 Hi Jo Yes praying is really like wishing, but looking externally not internally. I found praying works for me..if it didn't I would feel very foolish with myself. Simon > , " Peter " <metalscarab@o...> wrote: > > HI Simon > > > > I have read several accounts of research into the power of prayer. > In one, a group of people was asked to pray for one group of hospital > patients. All factors taken into account, there was a success rate > 25% higher in the prayed for group. The same applies to other forms > of 'intent', not just praying. It's very interesting. > > > > Jo > > > > I believe there is a scientific even mathematical element to > faith in religious matters, much like those that had faith in > building flying machines, landing people on the moon etc.I think you > can test praying and get results as I have found for myself. > > > > > To send an email to - > Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted April 17, 2004 - Peter Thursday, April 15, 2004 11:24 PM Re: Re: Life After Death Hi jo I believe only as cross and confrontational as you might get towards your children if they did something very bad. Simon I'm not sure Jesus was a pacifist. He seemed to be pretty passionate about his beliefs and was known to get cross and confrontational. He sometimes behaved as a pacifist - much like the rest of us. BBJo It seems from the little info I have on Jesus he was a fine example of pacifism in his actions and his teachings.It also seems he was confronted more than he was confronting. To send an email to - Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted April 17, 2004 - " David Brown " <quickformgreen Friday, April 16, 2004 1:50 PM Re: Life After Death > Sorry bud don't agree flying machines were a matter of slow > methodical trial and error as was the moon, that is Sciece. Faith > would have been some guy strapping himself to a ten sorry fire > cracker and lighting the fuse knowing for sure he was going to make > to the moon even thoug he had no previous gounds on which to base his > accertian. See the astronots had no faith that's why most systems in > space craft are double and triple redundances because they don't even > trust good science completely.> If scientists didn't have some faith in what they were trying to achieve in the first place..then by the very nature of the scientific mind...they just wouldn't go ahead with the experiments etc. They have to have some faith or belief in what they are trying to achieve. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted April 17, 2004 - " David Brown " <quickformgreen Friday, April 16, 2004 3:05 PM Re: Life After Death > > > Gonna have to call ya on the Dogma. Compassion can be compartmental > a person can be a completely humanistic compassion and eat-meat. > With no regard for non-human life matter of fact thats what informs > most modern laws and religions for that matter.> With that type of reasoning, it could be argued that the likes of Hitler ,Jack the ripper, Mira Hinley, the Wests etc were all compassionate people.It is a dangerous road to go down...and can distraction from the over-all kind of compassion that veganism, pacifism etc bring. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted April 17, 2004 - Peter Thursday, April 15, 2004 11:17 PM Re: Re: Life After Death Hi Simon > It seems from the little info I have on Jesus he was a fine example of pacifism in his actions and his teachings.It also seems he was confronted more than he > was confronting. What, like the incident in the Temple where he upturned tables? > I think the claim that Jesus was an Essene is very dodgy. If he was an Essene, though, fish would have been a major part of his diet. > I think the claim that he was a meat-eater is more dodgier. Compassion like that just doesn't come from meat-eaters. I think, since we're discussing an historical character, if you're going to make claims that he was a vegetarian and an Essene, you really need to provide some serious evidence rather than coming up with generalisations - considering the time and society he lived in, the scriptural evidence (partaking of the passover lamb, sharing out loaves and fishes, etc.), the evidence is very much stacked up against him being either Essene or vegetarian. Well we dummies for the most part still ignore the sixth day teachings which happen to be scibbled down on paper somewhere. There had to be veggies around Jesus and he is is recorded as reading and pointing out what was and wasn't important in the old testement. Though new testement records in the available Bibles don't record Jesus as being a Veggie...He no doubt at least read the biblical beginning...would he have ignored such a powerful scripture? I doubt Jesus was a savage who partook in any flesh eating rituals. > I've been putting myself in the mind set of the writer/writers of the sixth day in the " Sixth Day Creation" for some time now. God/Good, He/She/ they whoever....saw it > important that humans and animals should be vegans. Does that not say anything to you about the mind set of those times? The Bible doesn't say that we should be vegans - that is a very modern interpretation of the English translation of the Bible. The Bible says that we should eat plants - it doesn't say that we *shouldn't* eat animals. That is an inference you have drawn from what is said, and comes purely from a 21st century ethical standpoint which simply didn't exist at the time the Genesis stories were written> If you are saying that...statements which we are discussing such as the ones in the 6th day Geneisis beginning somehow can't mean... that we and animals and everything with the breath of life in it should not be in vegan...then I will leave you to argue black is white. If semantics, translations have changes so much since those times then they have ( in my opinion) changed for the best. Simon .... perhaps you could come up with some examples of vegetarians anywhere in the world prior to 600 BCE? To send an email to - Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted April 17, 2004 - Peter Thursday, April 15, 2004 7:32 PM Re: Re: Life After Death Hi Simon > Yes but it seems they didn't go and challenge the false teachings of the religious leaders around them in such a way as Jesus did>>>>>>>> No - they were pacifists who believed that the way to enlightenment was not through confrontation. It seems from the little info I have on Jesus he was a fine example of pacifism in his actions and his teachings.It also seems he was confronted more than he was confronting. > Jesus is reputed to have been from the "Essene Jews" which would have had no part in passover lamb. I think the claim that Jesus was an Essene is very dodgy. If he was an Essene, though, fish would have been a major part of his diet. I think the claim that he was a meat-eater is more dodgier. Compassion like that just doesn't come from meat-eaters.>>>>>> > Anyhow....there had to be Knowledge and practicing veggie Jews around for a long time before Jesus's arrival..as the " Vegan Diet" is the essence of the "Six Day > Creation". I think it's necessary to put ourselves in the mind-set of people living 2000+ years ago if we are going to try to understand how they lived. There were a few, very rare, examples of vegetarians, but looking at the development of the Jewish religion, there is no reason to suspect that they interpreted the scriptures in that way - before the exile, they regularly practiced animal sacrifice - the only reason that stopped was because it was forbidden to perform sacrifice anywhere other than at the Temple. I don't really think people who sacrifice animals (and, according to Deutoronomy, this is a required practice) would be too worried about eating a lamb chop.> If you type in vegetarian essenes..you should get info on essenes and other veggie sects of that time. SimonTo send an email to - Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted April 17, 2004 Then you can go to Orthodox Churches to see more exaxtly the icon of the resurrectioh of Christ. The always have one in every local church. You can find addresses in the internet search machines. Yannissimonpjones <simonpjones wrote: You never have seen in churches Jesus Christ's resurrection from the death?> No I haven't. I have been to quite a few Catholic meetings and went to a convant school for a year as a kid. When living with my Granmother I had to kneel and pray before a statue of Mary. When she died...and we were moving her things the statue was knocked over and broke. I remember thinkings it's only made of clay or chalk. The reason the Sabbath was changed to Sunday in Europe...was because of Constantine wanting to merge Christianity with Sun worshipping Pagans religions. If you think it is so, can you tell me, Simon, why we call it day of the Lord in the main languages of the Roman Empire?> Constantine ruled the Roman Empire, he probably could of called it anything he wanted ... besides that Lord could mean anyone. Why didn't they call it The day of Jesus Christ? What he should of done in my view was try to encourage the Pagans to Christianity by keeping the Sabbath.... Jesus is quoted as saying " the Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath". What you have written here is true The bold written text is Yannis' the reply to Simon. Peter <metalscarab wrote: Hi Yannis > In all the languages I mentioned myself (Greek, Italian, French, Spanish, Portuguese, the word for Sunday means: Day of the Lord, not day of the sun, that is > pagan: The important question when considering etymology is whether the name of the day is derived from the fact it is the Christian Sabbath, or whether the fact it is the Sabbath is derived from the name of the day. I suspect it was the former rather than the latter. To suggest that the Sabbath is celebrated on that day because of the name of the day, is a bit like saying your parents were given the names they have because you like those names! The good ole English phrase "putting the cart before the horses" would seem to apply here. BB PeterTo send an email to - Messenger - Communicate instantly..."Ping" your friends today! Download Messenger Now To send an email to - To send an email to - Messenger - Communicate instantly..."Ping" your friends today! Download Messenger Now To send an email to - To send an email to - Messenger - Communicate instantly..."Ping" your friends today! Download Messenger Now Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted April 17, 2004 - " David Brown " <quickformgreen Friday, April 16, 2004 2:48 PM Re: Life After Death > Sorry double tap on this one. All of my prayers' answers have been > negative, the Faithful would say " Some of Gods greatest gift are > unanswered prayers! " How convenient. In my book the only gifts God > has in stock are unanswered prayrs. Maybe I was just praying for the > wrong thing right, well who does't, there wouldn't be a need to pray > if they were the right things, again how convenient....> Who knows..sometimes the ego likes to take centre stage and won't allow humble praying. > > , " simonpjones " <simonpjones@o...> > wrote: > > I believe there is a scientific even mathematical element to faith > in religious matters, much like those that had faith in building > flying machines, landing people on the moon etc.I think you can test > praying and get results as I have found for myself. > > - > > ioannis Tsoucas > > > > Thursday, April 15, 2004 6:28 PM > > Re: Re: Life After Death > > > > > > Faith is science for someone like me, who wants to know first, > what is true and then to accept it. > > For the most people faith may be not science, but they are not > faithful. They only have a religion and they don't know what it is > and they don't ask why. > > This is the big difference between conscious faithful persons and > the many religious people. The real faithful, according to my > discription don't have a religion. They have the revelation of God. > This is the correct Christianism and the correct believe or the > correct faith, if you want to give a name to it. This is a faith with > evidences, not with words like: maybe, if, then, etc. > > > > Yannis > > > > simonpjones <simonpjones@o...> wrote: > > > > - > > fartybriivismeisteranushead ta-da! > > > > Tuesday, April 13, 2004 8:50 AM > > Re: Re: Life After Death > > > > > > faith is not a science. it's speculative and subjective; > felt but not proven. if anything is not logical, it's religion> > > > > Is science a faith. it seems so sometimes when theories that > are treated as fact> > > > > . > > > > > > > > To send an email to - > > > > > > > > > > > -- > ---------- > > Messenger - Communicate instantly... " Ping " your friends > today! Download Messenger Now > > > > To send an email to - > > > > > > > > > -- > ---------- > > Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted April 17, 2004 Again: I AM NOT A CATHOLIC. So the Vatican cannot have influenced me. I am an Orthodox Christian and this was my own choice to be. Between Catholics and Orthodox Christiana are many differences. The Vatican wanted to have political power and has changed the Christian Creed. This was not accepted and this is the reason why the Vatican has made the own Catholic Church about 1000 years ago. Yannissimonpjones <simonpjones wrote: - ioannis Tsoucas Thursday, April 15, 2004 12:20 PM Re: Re: Life After Death Christianity has started at Pentecost, i.e. at the 50th day after the resurrection of the Lord Jesus Christ from the death, i.e. at the day when the Apostles, formerly disciples, have received the Holy Spirit and at the same day have started to preach to the public in Jerusalem. They were able to preach in all the various languages after they had received the Holy Spirit, as they didn't lernt such languages. There were 4000 people baptised and they were the first Christian community.> I would say Christianity started with Christ. It is profane to seperate Christianity from Christs teachings.I wouldn't like to tell Jesus and his early followers( given what that had to go through) that Christianity didn't start with them. I understand it is the Vaticans influence that makes you think in such a way. Simon Simon simonpjones <simonpjones wrote: - Peter Monday, April 12, 2004 6:31 PM Re: Re: Life After Death Hi Peter > No I haven't read that. Christianity was being distorted while Christ was on the earth.Christianity is basically loving what is good and right and one another. At the risk of seeming particularly picky... Christianity didn't exist while Jesus was around, so it can't have been distorted during that time. Christianity really didn't start until something like 30 years after Jesus' crucifixion, and it was very different then to what it became of the next few centuries.> I know Christianity wasn't wide spread. But Christianity has to start with Jesus Christ much like Marxism had to start with Karl Marx, soism had to start with so and so etc. SimonTo send an email to - To send an email to - Messenger - Communicate instantly..."Ping" your friends today! Download Messenger Now To send an email to - To send an email to - Messenger - Communicate instantly..."Ping" your friends today! Download Messenger Now Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted April 17, 2004 spelling correction - simonpjones Saturday, April 17, 2004 6:41 PM Re: Re: Life After Death - Peter Thursday, April 15, 2004 11:17 PM Re: Re: Life After Death Hi Simon > It seems from the little info I have on Jesus he was a fine example of pacifism in his actions and his teachings.It also seems he was confronted more than he > was confronting. What, like the incident in the Temple where he upturned tables? > I think the claim that Jesus was an Essene is very dodgy. If he was an Essene, though, fish would have been a major part of his diet. > I think the claim that he was a meat-eater is more dodgier. Compassion like that just doesn't come from meat-eaters. I think, since we're discussing an historical character, if you're going to make claims that he was a vegetarian and an Essene, you really need to provide some serious evidence rather than coming up with generalisations - considering the time and society he lived in, the scriptural evidence (partaking of the passover lamb, sharing out loaves and fishes, etc.), the evidence is very much stacked up against him being either Essene or vegetarian. Well we dummies for the most part still ignore the sixth day teachings which happen to be scibbled down on paper somewhere. There had to be veggies around Jesus and he is is recorded as reading and pointing out what was and wasn't important in the old testement. Though new testement records in the available Bibles don't record Jesus as being a Veggie...He no doubt at least read the biblical beginning...would he have ignored such a powerful scripture? I doubt Jesus was a savage who partook in any flesh eating rituals. > I've been putting myself in the mind set of the writer/writers of the sixth day in the " Sixth Day Creation" for some time now. God/Good, He/She/ they whoever....saw it > important that humans and animals should be vegans. Does that not say anything to you about the mind set of those times? The Bible doesn't say that we should be vegans - that is a very modern interpretation of the English translation of the Bible. The Bible says that we should eat plants - it doesn't say that we *shouldn't* eat animals. That is an inference you have drawn from what is said, and comes purely from a 21st century ethical standpoint which simply didn't exist at the time the Genesis stories were written> If you are saying that...statements which we are discussing such as the ones in the 6th day Geneisis beginning somehow can't mean... that we and animals and everything with the breath of life in it should not be vegan...then I will leave you to argue black is white. If semantics, translations have changes so much since those times then they have ( in my opinion) changed for the best. Simon .... perhaps you could come up with some examples of vegetarians anywhere in the world prior to 600 BCE? To send an email to - To send an email to - Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted April 17, 2004 Hi Yannis > Why not Peter, you were not there to forbid it. And if you want to know. Jesus was buried on Friday. Who buried him? According to the Bible, it was Jews, who would never have buried him on the Sabbath (which runs from sunset on Friday to sunset on Saturday). You really should try reading a bit of basic history about the era we're talking about. As to "forbidding it", God forbids it, it has nothing to do with me. You can't have it both ways - either Jesus was buried by Jews, or he was buried on Friday... it can't be both. BB Peter Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted April 17, 2004 Hi Simon > With that type of reasoning, it could be argued that the likes of Hitler > ,Jack the ripper, Mira Hinley, the Wests etc were all compassionate > people.It is a dangerous road to go down...and can distraction from the > over-all kind of compassion that veganism, pacifism etc bring. Of course, Hitler was a vegetarian... so even he apparently had some compassion! BB Peter Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted April 17, 2004 Hi Simon > Well we dummies for the most part still ignore the sixth day teachings which happen to be scibbled down on paper somewhere. There had to be veggies around Jesus > and he is is recorded as reading and pointing out what was and wasn't important in the old testement. Though new testement records in the available Bibles don't record > Jesus as being a Veggie...He no doubt at least read the biblical beginning...would he have ignored such a powerful scripture? I doubt Jesus was a savage who partook in > any flesh eating rituals. We seem to be going round in circles here - you're still applying a 21st century morality and interpretation to someone who lived 20 centuries ago in a completely different society. Meat eating and vegetarianism simply weren't viewed the same in that society as they are in ours. > If you are saying that...statements which we are discussing such as the ones in the 6th day Geneisis beginning somehow can't mean... that we and animals and > everything with the breath of life in it should not be in vegan...then I will leave you to argue black is white. If semantics, translations have changes so much since those > times then they have ( in my opinion) changed for the best. I agree that I like your interpretation, and I think for the world we live in at the moment, it is a very good and valid interpretation. I just don't think anyone living 20 centuries ago would have read those passages in the same way. BB Peter Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted April 17, 2004 Hi Simon > If you type in vegetarian essenes..you should get info on essenes and other veggie sects of that time. It's an unfortunate fact that the first real historical expert on Essenes, Hugh Schonfeld, didn't understand the term vegetarian. He actually stated that "The Essenes were vegetarian. They weren't vegan because they ate fish." His misunderstanding of the term has led to one of those great myths of history, alongside the ones that Druids built stonehenge, or that Glenn Miller was abducted by aliens. I also wouldn't recommend relying on internet articles for information - there's an awful lot (pun intended) of articles written by people who know nothing about the subject they are writing about. BB Peter Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted April 17, 2004 Hi Yannis > Again: I AM NOT A CATHOLIC. So the Vatican cannot have influenced me. I am an Orthodox Christian and this was my own choice to be. Between > Catholics and Orthodox Christiana are many differences. The Vatican wanted to have political power and has changed the Christian Creed. This was not > accepted and this is the reason why the Vatican has made the own Catholic Church about 1000 years ago. Indeed, the split between the Catholic and Orthodox churches ocurred when the Western church inserted the word "filioque" into the Nicene Creed. However, let's not forget that the original Creed was written in the fourth century, and had already been changed at least three times and those changes had been accepted by both the Eastern and Western churches. BB Peter Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted April 17, 2004 I think of science as another faith. Over the years the 'facts' change though. Jo > > If scientists didn't have some faith in what they were trying to achieve in > the first place..then by the very nature of the scientific mind...they just > wouldn't go ahead with the experiments etc. > They have to have some faith or belief in what they are trying to achieve. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted April 18, 2004 Though the commonly used bibles Jesus is not don't protray Jesus as a vegetarian...I believe he would of been. but isn't it in the bible that jesus killed masses of fish to feed to humans? (i think i read here that it was one fish whom he turned into many to kill for humans, but that's not much different) also, i find the "jesus fish" extremely disrespectful-- not only did he kill the fish, but, out of a life otherwise filled with giving love, he's symbolized by (and revered for) the only creatures he did harm to. >"simonpjones" <simonpjones > > >Re: Re: Life After Death >Thu, 15 Apr 2004 12:55:23 +0100 > > > - > Peter > > Wednesday, April 14, 2004 5:54 PM > Re: Re: Life After Death > > > Hi Simon > I think we should turn that question around... do you not think it is possible for people to understand love and compassion without reading about it? Personally, I think love and compassion is within all of us, whether or not we read about it in a book.> > > Yes I think it is... once we have the desire to. It 's just that I havn't heard of anyone else before Jesus that demostrated in such a way what love and compassion were. I believe the vegetarians before Jesus and during his time had to be compassionate people, but there is no record as far I know of anyone challenging the authorities with what some of us might even call common sense theses days. You know how easy it is for people to be lead astray..killing, hating, eating animals etc.( Though the commonly used bibles Jesus is not don't protray Jesus as a vegetarian...I believe he would of been. > > Simon > > > > To send an email to - > > > > > Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted April 18, 2004 The real faithful, according to my discription don't have a religion. They have the revelation of God. just as truly faithful wiccans have the revelation of gods? or can a wiccan never be "truly faithful"? ~~brii (faith can never be a science. faith cannot be tested --even through prayers, as another had said-- because the same experiment would have to be set up and have to yield the same results each time, many times, in order for it to be recognized as a science. additionally, it'd be impossible to set up an experiment to test god, because there would be no control; the god in question, if present, pervades EVERYthing, thus hopelessly tainting the experiment) >ioannis Tsoucas <itsoucas > > >Re: Re: Life After Death >Thu, 15 Apr 2004 18:28:01 +0100 (BST) > >Faith is science for someone like me, who wants to know first, what is true and then to accept it. >For the most people faith may be not science, but they are not faithful. They only have a religion and they don't know what it is and they don't ask why. >This is the big difference between conscious faithful persons and the many religious people. The real faithful, according to my discription don't have a religion. They have the revelation of God. This is the correct Christianism and the correct believe or the correct faith, if you want to give a name to it. This is a faith with evidences, not with words like: maybe, if, then, etc. > >Yannis > >simonpjones <simonpjones wrote: > >- >fartybriivismeisteranushead ta-da! > >Tuesday, April 13, 2004 8:50 AM >Re: Re: Life After Death > > > > faith is not a science. it's speculative and subjective; felt but not proven. if anything is not logical, it's religion> > >Is science a faith. it seems so sometimes when theories that are treated as fact> > >. > > > > >To send an email to - > > > > > Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted April 18, 2004 I agree that I like your interpretation, and I think for the world we live in at the moment, it is a very good and valid interpretation. I just don't think anyone living 20 centuries ago would have read those passages in the same way. not that it wasn't intended that way! (just that the people at the time wouldn't've read it that way) i think the modern interpretation is a VERY beneficial thing to be passing around now! it may save some lives. ~~brii >"Peter" <metalscarab > > >Re: Re: Life After Death >Sat, 17 Apr 2004 23:07:44 +0100 > >Hi Simon > > Well we dummies for the most part still ignore the sixth day teachings which happen to be scibbled down on paper somewhere. There had to be veggies around Jesus > > and he is is recorded as reading and pointing out what was and wasn't important in the old testement. Though new testement records in the available Bibles don't record > > Jesus as being a Veggie...He no doubt at least read the biblical beginning...would he have ignored such a powerful scripture? I doubt Jesus was a savage who partook in > > any flesh eating rituals. > >We seem to be going round in circles here - you're still applying a 21st century morality and interpretation to someone who lived 20 centuries ago in a completely different society. Meat eating and vegetarianism simply weren't viewed the same in that society as they are in ours. > > > If you are saying that...statements which we are discussing such as the ones in the 6th day Geneisis beginning somehow can't mean... that we and animals and > > everything with the breath of life in it should not be in vegan...then I will leave you to argue black is white. If semantics, translations have changes so much since those > > times then they have ( in my opinion) changed for the best. > >I agree that I like your interpretation, and I think for the world we live in at the moment, it is a very good and valid interpretation. I just don't think anyone living 20 centuries ago would have read those passages in the same way. > >BB >Peter From must-see cities to the best beaches, plan a getaway with the Spring Travel Guide! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted April 18, 2004 - " Peter " <metalscarab Saturday, April 17, 2004 11:04 PM Re: Re: Life After Death > Hi Peter > > Of course, Hitler was a vegetarian... so even he apparently had some > compassion! > I think Hitler was adviced not to eat meat for a health problem. Agreed, he might of had some compassion on some of the Jews like having them gassed rather than having their throats cut n. > > > To send an email to - > Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted April 18, 2004 - Peter Saturday, April 17, 2004 11:07 PM Re: Re: Life After Death Hi Peter I'm of the belief morality and immorality are the backbones of right and and wrong are infinately so. And however people viewed morality past, present and future, the fundementals won't change. > If you are saying that...statements which we are discussing such as the ones in the 6th day Geneisis beginning somehow can't mean... that we and animals and > everything with the breath of life in it should not be vegan...then I will leave you to argue black is white. If semantics, translations have changes so much since those > times then they have ( in my opinion) changed for the best. I agree that I like your interpretation, and I think for the world we live in at the moment, it is a very good and valid interpretation. I just don't think anyone living 20 centuries ago would have read those passages in the same way.> Maybe a lot of people didn't get the chance to. Simon To send an email to - Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted April 18, 2004 - Peter Saturday, April 17, 2004 11:13 PM Re: Re: Life After Death I also wouldn't recommend relying on internet articles for information - there's an awful lot (pun intended) of articles written by people who know nothing about the subject they are writing about. I agree....books can also be misleading....as well as word and mouth communications. SimonTo send an email to - Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted April 18, 2004 Hi Yannis > Again: I AM NOT A CATHOLIC. So the Vatican cannot have influenced me. I am an Orthodox Christian and this was my own choice to be. Between > Catholics and Orthodox Christiana are many differences. The Vatican wanted to have political power and has changed the Christian Creed. This was not > accepted and this is the reason why the Vatican has made the own Catholic Church about 1000 years ago.> You may not be Catholic,But why do you have your meetings on the Sunday..A Catholic traditonal meeting day? / Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted April 18, 2004 Yes, as does interpretation of the facts. - " Heartwork " <Heartwork Saturday, April 17, 2004 11:52 PM Re: Re: Life After Death > I think of science as another faith. Over the years the 'facts' change > though. > > Jo > > > > If scientists didn't have some faith in what they were trying to achieve > in > > the first place..then by the very nature of the scientific mind...they > just > > wouldn't go ahead with the experiments etc. > > They have to have some faith or belief in what they are trying to achieve. > > > > > > To send an email to - > Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted April 18, 2004 There has been different translations of the bible. No disrepect to jews in general, with the Prominence of Jesus. fish merchants could incoporated that story in the Gospels for promotion. - fartybriivismeisteranushead ta-da! Sunday, April 18, 2004 6:42 AM Re: Re: Life After Death Though the commonly used bibles Jesus is not don't protray Jesus as a vegetarian...I believe he would of been. but isn't it in the bible that jesus killed masses of fish to feed to humans? (i think i read here that it was one fish whom he turned into many to kill for humans, but that's not much different) also, i find the "jesus fish" extremely disrespectful-- not only did he kill the fish, but, out of a life otherwise filled with giving love, he's symbolized by (and revered for) the only creatures he did harm to. There has been different translations of the bible with the prominence of Jesus fish merchants could have incoporated that story in the Gospels for promotion. With the different translations of the bible a little slip of the pen and the word fruit could easily have become fish, who knows what the tranlators were up to. Simon >"simonpjones" <simonpjones > > >Re: Re: Life After Death >Thu, 15 Apr 2004 12:55:23 +0100 > > > - > Peter > > Wednesday, April 14, 2004 5:54 PM > Re: Re: Life After Death > > > Hi Simon > I think we should turn that question around... do you not think it is possible for people to understand love and compassion without reading about it? Personally, I think love and compassion is within all of us, whether or not we read about it in a book.> > > Yes I think it is... once we have the desire to. It 's just that I havn't heard of anyone else before Jesus that demostrated in such a way what love and compassion were. I believe the vegetarians before Jesus and during his time had to be compassionate people, but there is no record as far I know of anyone challenging the authorities with what some of us might even call common sense theses days. You know how easy it is for people to be lead astray..killing, hating, eating animals etc.( Though the commonly used bibles Jesus is not don't protray Jesus as a vegetarian...I believe he would of been. > > Simon > > > > To send an email to - > > > > > Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
