High Doses of IV Vitamin C Fight Cancer

[Guest guest]

First of all, I have just begun to be allowed to do acupuncture on patients,

which should help control the healing crises. Also, I think cancer patients have

a level of pathogenicity well beyond that of most other diseases. We are working

to take the problematic reactions out of the equation as much as possible.

>>>>>>

Joseph

Look at some alternatives to regime 6

 

 

 

Oakland, CA 94609

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

considered an intelligent

>>>>>Joseph

He is extremely knowladable and intelligent. That is not what i am questioning

 

 

 

 

Oakland, CA 94609

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

My ex-wife, who is a holistic medical doctor, went to Japan for a week to be

treated by Kobayashi

>>>>>>

Isaac Cohen is interested i K. Do you have contact info

thanks

 

 

 

Oakland, CA 94609

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

hyperthermia

>>>>>>

By the way how much are you guys rasing the pt temp

 

 

 

 

Oakland, CA 94609

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

because aminophylline is a phospho-diesterase blocker which elevates cyclic AMP

>>>>>>

Interesting

thanks

 

 

 

Oakland, CA 94609

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

hyperthermia

>>>>>>

By the way how much are you guys rasing the pt temp

 

There is another practiotner in Auckland who has has additional acupuncture

training from a Korean practioner. (master?) Interestingly, he uses wax

treatments on his cancer patients. Eg if Liver cancer, he drips hot wax covering

the cancer area , th etheory being, th ecancer doesn't like the heat.

 

 

Heiko Lade

M.H.Sc.(TCM)

Lecturer and clinic supervisor

Auckland College of Natural Medicine

Website: www.acnm.co.nz

 

 

 

-

Wednesday, September 28, 2005 2:28 PM

Re: High Doses of IV Vitamin C Fight Cancer

 

 

hyperthermia

>>>>>>

By the way how much are you guys rasing the pt temp

 

 

Oakland, CA 94609

 

[Guest guest]

hyperthermia

>>>>H

Heiko

Hyperthermia has been used for CA for a long time especially in europe

 

 

 

 

Oakland, CA 94609

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Alon,

Thank you. I will look into it. And I wanted to say that I agreed wholeheartedly

with your previous, longer email about the medical community as a whole in

America. One of the main points I wanted to make by wading in on all this stuff

is that there is becoming a place for Chinese medicine in the medical treatment

of serious illness in this country, a part that is more than adjunct therapy. It

is adjunct therapy, too, at the same time, but there is also a role for

acupuncture and CH formulas in the treating/healing side of life-threatening

illness. However, we must play the game as it is laid out, or not play at all.

And if we do not play, we can never win. As long as we shy away from cancer,

heart disease and such, we will never have any credibility. We have been kept

away by the laws, but how many of us would choose to treat them if we could? I

have a golden opportunity to legally help treat these diseases, and I intend to

make the most of it. Heaven help me.

 

I would also like to say that I for one choose not to practice homeopathy at

this time. Yes, I have the luxury of being in an office with a licensed

homeopathic medical doctor who knows homeopathy and homotoxicology way better

than I do. But homeopathy, like CH medicine, is serious medicine. I too find

that homeopathy isn't much good for pain, except maybe when injecting Traumeel

into the right acupuncture point, but it is strong with chronic/serious illness,

and many acute ones. What can do great good can do great harm. I'm definitely

not saying to this forum, " Ooh, let's all do homeopathy, " anymore than I'd say

to MDs, " Ooh, let's all do acupuncture and Chinese herbs. " I suggest to anyone

considering homeopathy to either work with a trained homeopath or become one.

It's not for dabbling, any more than our medicine is. To David Molony, I say

leave homeopathy out of the California acupuncture license.

Joseph

 

<alonmarcus wrote:

First of all, I have just begun to be allowed to do acupuncture on patients,

which should help control the healing crises. Also, I think cancer patients have

a level of pathogenicity well beyond that of most other diseases. We are working

to take the problematic reactions out of the equation as much as possible.

>>>>>>

Joseph

Look at some alternatives to regime 6

 

 

 

Oakland, CA 94609

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Alon,

 

I agree that we need to be more involved with things but how and why we do

it are just as important. If we try to lessen or lower what we do just to

find a broad general factor that allows us to study then it might be

irrellevent to actual practice. This can also be seen as an argument

against the so called biomedicine, which is really a marketing term. The

medicine has little to do with actual biological principles of human beings.

 

As for research, I conducted a limited amount of biological research as an

undergrad (also had a research project accepted for funding) and found that

much to my dismay, the obvious concepts were seldom considered. I guess

that I see less and less common sense and more and more propaganda on the

western side. I have also been in contact and procurred documents to help

me finish a book on the biological principles of OM. I am more interested

in science than I am in WM and there are many discoveries that make sense

and should be looked into but again there appears to be no understanding of

the theory behind it. This is probably the single most important part.

 

I am involved with a group here in MN that is organized and promoting

legislation on single payer, universal healthcare coverage. I mention this

as we seem to forget what drives this machine and think that it is only

about patients. If you knew about the economics of this and how things tend

to get covered up (healthcare admin costs) you might have another take on

things. By the way, I think it was Kaiser that tried to hire and use RN's

with no training to do acupuncture. They lost in the lawsuit. They also

had several RN who happened to be L Ac in their employ yet chose to

disregard them. First part to keeping eye on the ball is to be honest about

the totality of things and how they really are. From there it becomes

easier.

 

Later

 

Mike W. Bowser, L Ac

 

 

 

 

 

> " " <alonmarcus

>

>

>Re: High Doses of IV Vitamin C Fight Cancer

>Tue, 27 Sep 2005 19:18:35 -0700

>

>Do you really think that the establishment is that concerned about you or

>me

>and the work that we do with acu and herbs?

>

>I would have to say not. They are concerned with the big illnesses, those

>being cancer, aids, heart problems, etc. Even more so if they can do this

>without side-effects. You should remember that this is a business to them

>and that is all. Profit and loss is what matters most.

> >>>>>>

>Real interest usually follows intent. I am sure you are not very interested

>in WM developments. The question is monopoly, economically and

>informationally. I have to say that things are mixed and not as black and

>white as presented here. The fact that i and many other were able to

>published in WM J shows some openness. The fact that places like Kaiser

>have LAc, DCs, and alternative medical clinics and is doing research on

>alternative and integrative med shows a mixed state of offers. Granted,

>there is much resistance as well. On our side, we are stubbornly refusing

>to learn and participate in the scientific world. We want to change it

>before we can even speak its language and are part of the playground.

>Taking black and white stances does nothing to advance patient care. There

>are many open, innovative MDs and other W scientists that daily increase

>our knowledge and are increasingly incorporating alternative methods to so

>called traditional medicine. US medicine is just extremely conservative and

>lately so influenced by $$$$ that nothing is clear anylonger. Alternative

>medical distributors are no better, they often promote products and

>services that are equational at best with outrageous claims. They have been

>curing CA and any known disease to man for ever.Every year they come up

>with new cures for diseases they already had cures. It reminds me a little

>of the TCM acup crowd that suddenly discovered Japanese acup and now again

>make claims they used to say about TCM style acup but now know were greatly

>exaggerated.

>Anyway Mike, i believe there is much to offer as well as criticize in both

>alternative and mainstream med. If we keep our eye on the ball and be less

>reactionary and defensive i think our goals are much more likely to be

>realized

>

>

>

>

>Oakland, CA 94609

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Alon,

 

Not sure what this was to represent but he makes only a small income. He is

one of the few true scientists who spend their lives conducting research and

has no outside hobbies of note. When was the last time you met someone like

this?

 

 

Mike W. Bowser, L Ac

 

 

 

 

 

> " " <alonmarcus

>

>

>Re: High Doses of IV Vitamin C Fight Cancer

>Tue, 27 Sep 2005 18:46:55 -0700

>

>interests like the

>pharmaceutical industry to lie to us and manipulate truth. The scientist

>was Gaston Naessens of Quebec.

> >?>>>>>>>>

>$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

>

>

>

>

>Oakland, CA 94609

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Alon,

Yes, Dr. Gordon is a bit salesman-y, but I for one do not question his

integrity. You could do a lot worse. He does tend to make statements with a

broad sweep, perhaps, but he has nothing to gain and everything to lose by

making mis-statements. I live in Arizona, and many of the name holistic MDs in

the US are here due to the laws. I have known Gary for years. He's OK, really.

And I'm sure you're going to jump to change your opinion because I say so.

Joseph

 

<alonmarcus wrote:

considered an intelligent

>>>>>Joseph

He is extremely knowladable and intelligent. That is not what i am questioning

 

 

 

 

Oakland, CA 94609

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Alon,

I asked my ex-wife. She says she likes to screen these situations. She has

connected people to Dr. K. via email, and so far all that has happened is that

people in the US keep him occupied with lots of emails and questions, and then

they go for chemo and radiation anyway. It is a problem for all the alternative

cancer doctors. Please, if you would, email me something about this to my

personal email. I will connect you, or Isaac Cohen, with her, and perhaps Dr.

George, and let them take it from there. Dr. Kobayashi is their connection, and

I am connected through them, so I do not want to step out of line. Nor do I wish

to keep him under wraps. I did wish to tell more people about him, and I did.

Now if people wish to contact him, they must go the route he set up, which is

through--among others--these two doctors here.

 

After typing all that, she suggested we email Dr. K. and ask him how he wants to

handle such inquiries. So I will get back to you on this. Not meaning to be

conspiratorial or difficult, just proper. Thank you for your patience. I would

like for you and others to become involved in knowing this doctor and his work

for yourself, so you can make up your own mind.

Joseph

<alonmarcus wrote:

My ex-wife, who is a holistic medical doctor, went to Japan for a week to be

treated by Kobayashi

>>>>>>

Isaac Cohen is interested i K. Do you have contact info

thanks

 

 

 

Oakland, CA 94609

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Alon,

It varies, but it gets from 103 to as much as 105 or so. At least this is what I

am aware of. I'm too busy to keep up with what others are doing all the time.

Joseph

 

<alonmarcus wrote:

hyperthermia

>>>>>>

By the way how much are you guys rasing the pt temp

 

 

 

 

Oakland, CA 94609

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Heiko,

How hot are we talking here? Paraffin baths feel good. Really hot wax burns like

a mother.

Joseph

 

Heiko Lade <heikolade.acnm wrote:

hyperthermia

>>>>>>

By the way how much are you guys rasing the pt temp

 

There is another practiotner in Auckland who has has additional acupuncture

training from a Korean practioner. (master?) Interestingly, he uses wax

treatments on his cancer patients. Eg if Liver cancer, he drips hot wax covering

the cancer area , th etheory being, th ecancer doesn't like the heat.

 

 

Heiko Lade

M.H.Sc.(TCM)

Lecturer and clinic supervisor

Auckland College of Natural Medicine

Website: www.acnm.co.nz

 

 

 

-

Wednesday, September 28, 2005 2:28 PM

Re: High Doses of IV Vitamin C Fight Cancer

 

 

hyperthermia

>>>>>>

By the way how much are you guys rasing the pt temp

 

 

Oakland, CA 94609

 

[Guest guest]

I am involved with a group here in MN that is organized and promoting

legislation on single payer, universal healthcare coverage.

>>>>>We must have this as a nation but i do not think it will be good for us.

Kaiser has done many things in different reagins some good some bed. Again

nothing is black and white

 

 

 

Oakland, CA 94609

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Isaac Cohen

>>>>>

Joseph, Isaac is a well known MD, LAc doing cancer work.He is not a patient. He

also does homotox and many other intervention

 

 

 

 

Oakland, CA 94609

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

I asked my ex-wife. She says she likes to screen these situations. She has

connected people to Dr. K. via email

>>>>>

Thanks

 

 

 

 

Oakland, CA 94609

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

It's not for dabbling, any more than our medicine is. To David Molony, I say

leave homeopathy out of the California acupuncture license.

>>>>>>

I do not see homotoxicology as homeopathy. It is based on some very different

principles and i think can be learned without some of the detail needed to

become a homeopath. The only reason i would like to see homeopathy part of our

lic is that i do not trust our ability to have excess to herbs. There have been

two many scary development is the past. Much of homeopathy is herbal based and

is a legal FDA approved drugs

 

 

 

Oakland, CA 94609

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Just today I tried to get two formulas from KPC in granules, shao fu

zhu yu tang and ge xia zhu yu tang, and was told they are not

available. They are being held 'on the docks' by the FDA because

they contain an animal ingredient (wu ling zhi). The FDA is not

allowing animal parts into the country to be used as medicine.

 

 

On Sep 27, 2005, at 9:42 PM, wrote:

 

> I do not see homotoxicology as homeopathy. It is based on some very

> different principles and i think can be learned without some of the

> detail needed to become a homeopath. The only reason i would like

> to see homeopathy part of our lic is that i do not trust our

> ability to have excess to herbs. There have been two many scary

> development is the past. Much of homeopathy is herbal based and is

> a legal FDA approved drugs

>

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Heiko,

How hot are we talking here? Paraffin baths feel good. Really hot wax burns like

a mother.

Joseph

 

 

I don't know but I will find out

Heiko Lade

M.H.Sc.(TCM)

Lecturer and clinic supervisor

Auckland College of Natural Medicine

Website: www.acnm.co.nz

 

 

 

-

Joseph Garner

Wednesday, September 28, 2005 4:19 PM

Re: High Doses of IV Vitamin C Fight Cancer

 

 

Heiko,

How hot are we talking here? Paraffin baths feel good. Really hot wax burns

like a mother.

Joseph

 

Heiko Lade <heikolade.acnm wrote:

hyperthermia

>>>>>>

By the way how much are you guys rasing the pt temp

 

There is another practiotner in Auckland who has has additional acupuncture

training from a Korean practioner. (master?) Interestingly, he uses wax

treatments on his cancer patients. Eg if Liver cancer, he drips hot wax covering

the cancer area , th etheory being, th ecancer doesn't like the heat.

 

 

Heiko Lade

M.H.Sc.(TCM)

Lecturer and clinic supervisor

Auckland College of Natural Medicine

Website: www.acnm.co.nz

 

 

 

-

Wednesday, September 28, 2005 2:28 PM

Re: High Doses of IV Vitamin C Fight Cancer

 

 

hyperthermia

>>>>>>

By the way how much are you guys rasing the pt temp

 

 

Oakland, CA 94609

 

[Guest guest]

>

>

> On Behalf Of Joseph Garner

> Tuesday, September 27, 2005 6:30 PM

>

> RE: High Doses of IV Vitamin C Fight Cancer

>

> Jason,

> I am actually grateful for Alon's skepticism. But if you were seeing and

> hearing what I have been seeing and hearing, and having it come from the

> people I have had it come from, you would perhaps be less doubtful. In any

> case, I am not selling anything, just sharing information with colleagues.

> Joseph

 

Thanx for sharing...

 

-Jason

 

>

> wrote:

> I back alon's skepticism, especially when it comes to something like

> Cancer.

> There are snake oil salesman everywhere, and they all get great results,

> right???. Conspiracy theories IMO don't give these guys any more

> credibility. Proof is in the pudding.

>

>

> -

>

> >

> >

> > On Behalf Of

> > Monday, September 26, 2005 10:20 PM

> >

> > Re: High Doses of IV Vitamin C Fight Cancer

> >

> > Gary Gordon

> > >>>>

> > Well if you want to believe this guy i also have some stuff to sell. I

> > have followed him for over 10 years and at this point i do not believe a

> > word he says, and all my mentors feel the same (some of most known names

> > in alternative med)

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Oakland, CA 94609

> >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Alon,

 

What is your concern with single payer? As I understand it, all

professionals that are licensed would be allowed to provide care and

covered. There are many myths and propaganda flying on this so let me know

if you have a specific question.

 

 

Mike W. Bowser, L Ac

 

 

 

 

> " " <alonmarcus

>

>

>Re: High Doses of IV Vitamin C Fight Cancer

>Tue, 27 Sep 2005 21:27:03 -0700

>

>I am involved with a group here in MN that is organized and promoting

>legislation on single payer, universal healthcare coverage.

> >>>>>We must have this as a nation but i do not think it will be good for

>us. Kaiser has done many things in different reagins some good some bed.

>Again nothing is black and white

>

>

>

>Oakland, CA 94609

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

As I understand it, all

professionals that are licensed would be allowed to provide care and

covered.

>>>>>>

I do not believe that will ever fly. No national program anywhere in the world

can afford it. Our health care system is going to implode and we will have

single payer as a result. But i am afraid that only mainstream, managed care,

will be covered.

 

 

 

Oakland, CA 94609

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Alon,

Dr. Wright will soon get Dr. Kobayashi's email address, and we will send it to

your personal email address, and you can give it to Dr. Cohen, and he can email

Dr. K. himself, she says.

Joseph

 

<alonmarcus wrote:

Isaac Cohen

>>>>>

Joseph, Isaac is a well known MD, LAc doing cancer work.He is not a patient. He

also does homotox and many other intervention

 

 

 

 

Oakland, CA 94609

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Alon,

You are correct that homotoxicology is one thing and homeopathy another. I

acknowledge what you say after that, but though homeopathics are herbs, they are

not what we are trained to use in our schools. Having homeopathy on our license

would be nice, and when that is part of our curriculum, it may happen. Otherwise

we will be starting a war with our homeopath colleagues, I'm quite sure--lay

homeopaths as well as medical homeopaths. As things stand, some lay homeopaths

have gone to war with the medical homeopaths, at least in Arizona. If they'll

take on the doctors, I don't think they'll hesitate to take us on.

Joseph

 

<alonmarcus wrote:

It's not for dabbling, any more than our medicine is. To David Molony, I say

leave homeopathy out of the California acupuncture license.

>>>>>>

I do not see homotoxicology as homeopathy. It is based on some very different

principles and i think can be learned without some of the detail needed to

become a homeopath. The only reason i would like to see homeopathy part of our

lic is that i do not trust our ability to have excess to herbs. There have been

two many scary development is the past. Much of homeopathy is herbal based and

is a legal FDA approved drugs

 

 

 

Oakland, CA 94609