Is the soul more powerful, illuminating and dazzling than the Sun or Moon?

[Guruvani 0]

What do you think?

[Murali_Mohan_das 0]

Can't think now--UFC is on.

 

[Murali_Mohan_das 0]

According to this, no:

 

http://vedabase.net/bg/2/13/

 

 

The stars can be compared to the living entities and the sun or the moon to the Supreme Lord.

 

Found with Google search:

site:vedabase.net soul sun moon

[Guruvani 0]

 

According to this, no:

 

http://vedabase.net/bg/2/13/

 

 

 

Found with Google search:

site:vedabase.net soul sun moon

 

close, but no cigar....

keep searching grasshopper!

You haven't found the secret yet!

[Guruvani 0]

 

Can't think now--UFC is on.

 

 

Don't tell untruth grasshopper.

It is beneath your dignity!

[Murali_Mohan_das 0]

 

close, but no cigar....

keep searching grasshopper!

You haven't found the secret yet!

 

No, because the soul is invisible.

 

http://vedabase.net/bg/2/25/

 

 

As described previously, the magnitude of the soul is so small for our material calculation that he cannot be seen even by the most powerful microscope; therefore, he is invisible. As far as the soul's existence is concerned, no one can establish his existence experimentally beyond the proof of śruti, or Vedic wisdom.

[Murali_Mohan_das 0]

Perhaps this sums it all up:

http://vedabase.net/bg/2/29/

 

 

Some people who are inclined to hear about the soul may be attending lectures, in good association, but sometimes, owing to ignorance, they are misguided by acceptance of the Supersoul and the atomic soul as one without distinction of magnitude. It is very difficult to find a man who perfectly understands the position of the Supersoul, the atomic soul, their respective functions and relationships and all other major and minor details. And it is still more difficult to find a man who has actually derived full benefit from knowledge of the soul, and who is able to describe the position of the soul in different aspects. But if, somehow or other, one is able to understand the subject matter of the soul, then one's life is successful.

The verse itself:

 

Some look on the soul as amazing, some describe him as amazing, and some hear of him as amazing, while others, even after hearing about him, cannot understand him at all.

I think I fall into category 3.

[Guruvani 0]

 

Perhaps this sums it all up:

http://vedabase.net/bg/2/29/

 

 

The verse itself:

 

I think I fall into category 3.

 

Grasshopper...... go deeper......find the truth...... find your soul that is brighter than the Sun.

[Guruvani 0]

 

 

Found with Google search:

site:vedabase.net soul sun moon

 

Grasshopper..... you cannot find your soul in the Vedabase search.

[suchandra 1]

 

What do you think?

The soul is more powerful in that sense that the soul is eternal whereas Sun and Moon are temporary.

[Guruvani 0]

Alright, you have all failed your Vedabase search challenge.

 

Śrī Caitanya Caritāmṛta Ādi 5.22 purport,

 

The bestial civilization of eating, sleeping, fearing and sense-gratifying has misled modern man into forgetting how powerful a soul he has. As we have already described, the soul is a spiritual spark many, many times more illuminating, dazzling and powerful than the sun, moon or electricity.

 

The soul is MANY, MANY times more powerful than the Sun.

[Kulapavana 0]

 

The soul is MANY, MANY times more powerful than the Sun.

 

I wonder if Prabhupada actually refers here to our perception of sunlight, moonlight, or electric light, as compared with the blilliance of the uncovered soul. When a demon is killed by Krsna a dazzling white light was seen entering Krsna's personal radiance. That was the light of Brahman. Brahmajyoti (the totality of individual spirit sparks) is infinitely more powerful then any material sun (our Sun is small because our Universe is small - the 1000-headed Brahmas preside in larger universes with larger suns for example).

[gHari 0]

<center>By the rays of the sun, even the moon,

We can see - dark matter, all around.

 

The soul, however, is so bright that,

There is just no dark matter to see.

 

And only the Supersoul can really be seen,

For He Just Is - infinitely more effulgent than we.

</center>

[Murali_Mohan_das 0]

Huh!!

 

I actually *did* do this search: "site:vedabase.net soul dazzling". I guess I was too impatient. Your chosen purport was on page 3 of the results.

 

 

 

Alright, you have all failed your Vedabase search challenge.

 

Śrī Caitanya Caritāmṛta Ādi 5.22 purport,

 

 

The soul is MANY, MANY times more powerful than the Sun.

[Murali_Mohan_das 0]

 

The soul is more powerful in that sense that the soul is eternal whereas Sun and Moon are temporary.

 

You're making the classical error of mistaking the body for the soul.

 

The Moon and the Sun (the spirits animating the Moon and the Sun) are as eternal as our own souls, though their bodies may be temporary.

 

Surya-dev and Chandra-dev do not die.

[Murali_Mohan_das 0]

That's lovely!! Can you put it in haiku form now?

 

 

 

<center>By the rays of the sun, even the moon,

We can see - dark matter, all around.

 

The soul, however, is so bright that,

There is just no dark matter to see.

 

And only the Supersoul can really be seen,

For He Just Is - infinitely more effulgent than we.

</center>

[theist 1]

Which is more illuminating, the atma or the sun?

 

Hard to say since they are both inconceivable to me.The sunlight is a reflection of the brahmajyoti as it enters into this gross plane and is limited in how much of that light it is able to reflect.

 

So on that basis I would have to say the sun cannot compare to the brahmajyoti.

 

So the question comes up well since the jiva is individual Brahman and infintesimal perhaps the sun is more powerful than one tiny jiva. Maybe the sun in our solar system is equal to a million jivas and other more powerful suns equal to ten million jivas. But no sun or amount of suns could be equal to to the totality of the Brahman.

 

But I question this approach. It seems flawed to even compare the limited with the unlimited in this way. But they are both the energies of the Lord so in that sense maybe since all energies of the Lord are unlimited.

 

The example of the hologram may be helpful for us. In any part of a hologram the whole is also contained. Is that not how it is between the atma and the totality of the Brahman effulgence. So how could even the totality of suns in all universes be equal to one atma?...at least from that angle.

 

Is that not how it is between the atma and the Supreme Lord? Oneness yet difference? Difference of course because the Supreme Lord always has qualities reserved unto Himself. But if each atma has this oneness with the Brahman and even the Supreme Lord how could it ever be said to be in anyway less than a mere materially manifested sun?

 

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.....?

 

Nice meditation Guruvani.

[Murali_Mohan_das 0]

A nice meditation, to be sure.

 

All of these comparisons *must* be purely illustrative, though, wouldn't you say?

 

In reality, how can we compare the all-spiritual jivAtma to material hair. If the soul is spiritual, how can we say it has *any* material dimensions whatsoever? The comparison is used to illustrate the infinitessimal nature of the jiva-soul's potency, is it not?

 

Similarly, while the energy output of the sun can be measured in Watts/meter squared at a particular distance from the sun, how can we make a similar measurement of the brightness of the individual soul? It's not possible, is it?

 

So, these comparisons, to my ken, are not to be taken literally.

 

 

Which is more illuminating, the atma or the sun?

 

Hard to say since they are both inconceivable to me.The sunlight is a reflection of the brahmajyoti as it enters into this gross plane and is limited in how much of that light it is able to reflect.

 

So on that basis I would have to say the sun cannot compare to the brahmajyoti.

 

So the question comes up well since the jiva is individual Brahman and infintesimal perhaps the sun is more powerful than one tiny jiva. Maybe the sun in our solar system is equal to a million jivas and other more powerful suns equal to ten million jivas. But no sun or amount of suns could be equal to to the totality of the Brahman.

 

But I question this approach. It seems flawed to even compare the limited with the unlimited in this way. But they are both the energies of the Lord so in that sense maybe since all energies of the Lord are unlimited.

 

The example of the hologram may be helpful for us. In any part of a hologram the whole is also contained. Is that not how it is between the atma and the totality of the Brahman effulgence. So how could even the totality of suns in all universes be equal to one atma?...at least from that angle.

 

Is that not how it is between the atma and the Supreme Lord? Oneness yet difference? Difference of course because the Supreme Lord always has qualities reserved unto Himself. But if each atma has this oneness with the Brahman and even the Supreme Lord how could it ever be said to be in anyway less than a mere materially manifested sun?

 

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.....?

 

Nice meditation Guruvani.

[mahak 0]

I heard it said that if we could see the actual self, it would be like viewing 10,000 sunrises at the same time.

 

The sun and the moon are both planets that are under the full control by the predominating deity of each planet, Surya and Chandra. Neither of these beings are Visnu, Lord Siva, or Srimati Radharani, therefore, we must assume that such posts can be attained by any living being. So this tells me that any living being is more powerful than such stones like the moon or the sun.

 

But we are weakened by illusion only, so we are not even more powerful than a car engine, some are less powerful than a flashlight.

 

haribol, mahaksadasa (soon to retire, BTW)

[Murali_Mohan_das 0]

 

haribol, mahaksadasa (soon to retire, BTW)

 

Soon to retire??!?!?! From your day job, from posting to Audarya, or????!?!?!

 

Say it ain't so!!

[suchandra 1]

 

You're making the classical error of mistaking the body for the soul.

 

The Moon and the Sun (the spirits animating the Moon and the Sun) are as eternal as our own souls, though their bodies may be temporary.

 

Surya-dev and Chandra-dev do not die.

 

Sun and Moon are not planets? This is new, I have to learn all this.

 

Śrīmad Bhāgavatam 12.4.3

 

tad-ante pralayas tāvān

brāhmī rātrir udāhṛtā

trayo lokā ime tatra

kalpante pralayāya hi

 

SYNONYMS

 

tat-ante — after those (thousand cycles of ages); pralayaḥ — the annihilation; tāvān — of the same duration; brāhmī — of Brahmā; rātriḥ — the nighttime; udāhṛtā — is described; trayaḥ — the three; lokāḥ — worlds; ime — these; tatra — at that time; kalpante — are prone; pralayāya — to annihilation; hi — indeed.

 

TRANSLATION

 

After one day of Brahmā, annihilation occurs during his night, which is of the same duration. At that time all the three planetary systems are subject to destruction.

 

Prabhupada, London, August 27, 1973: For hundreds of years there will be no water, and then when everything is finished, dried up, burned into ashes due to and the sunshine, the glare of the sunshine will be twelve times increased and there will be no water. How one can live? So everything on this planet will be finished. And then, being warmer, warmer, there will be fire. In the fire, all planets of the universe will be burned into ashes. Then there will be rainfall. Another. For hundred years. So the whole universe will be filled up with water. Then it will be evaporated, and the whole universe, cosmic manifestation finished. This is called annihilation.

[Murali_Mohan_das 0]

 

Sun and Moon are not planets? This is new, I have to learn all this.

 

The Sun and the Moon are spirit souls. Don't confuse them with their planetary bodies which will die like any other material bodies (just as none of us should confuse our own mortal bodies for our selves).

[Murali_Mohan_das 0]

And, yes, I'm splitting hairs here.

 

 

The Sun and the Moon are spirit souls. Don't confuse them with their planetary bodies which will die like any other material bodies (just as none of us should confuse our own mortal bodies for our selves).

[suchandra 1]

 

And, yes, I'm splitting hairs here.

 

Thanks so much prabhu! You're a great teacher!

[gHari 0]

 

That's lovely!! Can you put it in haiku form now?

 

I was counting on Eminem_das from skateboard Mecca for that. Carve me a line, young Siddhartha.