Smiley

...

Teachings attributed to an author are one thing. Rather or not the attributed is historical or rather or not the attributed represents Vaishnavism or something else is an entirely different matter. Such things might be worthy of discussion among reasonable people. That being said - the teachings of Jesus, the best of which are influenced by Buddhism, are not the issue - the issue now is people like you who arrogantly and viscously attack and lambaste people for having a different point of view and wishing to discuss it.

If you want to know what Vaishnavism is, please read the book on Sri Chaitanya Mahaprabhu written by Srila Bhaktivinoda Thakur. Then read his humble position vis a vis those who would not accept Sri Chaitanya Mahaprabhu. Contrast that with your posts in this thread.

Most of the Bible is composed of Old Testament writing which don't deal with Jesus or his message in anyway and most of the New Testament is a collection of letters written by the leaders of the new Christians to other new Christians and trying to establish the teachings of Jesus in newly formed communities ect.

 

The Gospels themselves tell stories about the life and teachings of Jesus. What we have the teachings of Christ form the basis of Vaisnavism as pertains to human conduct.

 

Only a most wretched demon would look upon the basic teachings of Christ and decry them.

... if you want to talk about mythology check out the Puranic stories sometime. You believe all you read there?

No, I don't.

You are attacking Jesus Christ not the Bible. I could care less about the Bible.

I am not attacking anyone. You have equated disagreement with attack. This idea of separating Jesus from the Bible or Mohammed from the Koran is one that I do not agree with and is worthy of discussion.

You say this author speaks for you.

No I did not. I said that I agreed with H.D. Swami Prakashanand Saraswati.

Please stop setting up straw men and being offended by them.

You are attacking Jesus Christ not the Bible. I could care less about the Bible. But if you want to talk about mythology check out the Puranic stories sometime. You believe all you read there?

 

The point still stands. You say this author speaks for you. He says Jesus is junk. So you can live or die by his aparada. As for conversing with you any longer that won't be happening.

Objection noted. Re: Swami Prabhupada, yes it was his opinion that Jesus was a shakyavesa-avatar and he used the same term to describe Mohammed. So if someone doesn't agree with Swami Prabhupada then they have made themselves the topic? I don't think that is reasonable. Ideas are the issue and I don't agree with these ideas. That does not absolve me from the responsibility to be civil however. Since you quoted an authority I will quote one back - H.D. Swami Prakashanand Saraswati - A BIG TIME ACHARYA - has equated the Bible with Greek mythology in his work The Encyclopedia of Authentic Hinduism www.EncyclopediaofAuthenticHinduism.org I share his views on that. BTW, anyone who searches my username can see that I have never made a secret of my views; therefore your statement "It is clear you want to hide behind this author to express your own feelings." is false. If you insist on making ad hominem attacks, at least get them right.

How do we accept the subject s being separate from the thread staters motive. I am accusing you of posting in order to criticize Christ and that I personally object to.So I will call you out on it as I wish.

It was not a request. Everyone on this forum is required to control themselves and not engage in ad hominem attacks. I do not have to agree with you about who is an avatar or who is not. I am still a Hindu and there is no one approved viewpoint in Hinduism. I think these kinds of issues are worthy of discussion from all sides. Now back to the subject of the thread ...

Request denied. I am interested in your motive. There is nothing in your opening post that is edifying in any way. So I ask you what are you trying to accomplish.

 

As far as I am concerned you have made yourself the topic. It is clear you want to hide behind this author to express your own feelings.

 

Like Srila Prabhupada I consider Jesus Christ as shakyavesa-avatar and guru to the world. So in my eyes you are posting crap against God's ambassador. Naturally I am going to challenge you openly.

Well if you have a recipe for delicious almond milk, please share.

... here is an idea for a substitute. Make some almond milk to offer to Krishna. No tree is hurt in the process and the soul of the almond trees will get sukriti and the devotees won't be seen to be engaged in hypocrisy on the cow protection issue.

 

After the soul in the cow body and the soul in the almond tree are to be seen on an equal level so why not help them?

Like the prophecies of Nostradamus, the fulfillment of prophecy is often in the eye of the beholder. Nevertheless, Jews interpret their own prophecies quite differently than Christians do. There is one important point that I think the Jews have been very consistent on - that the messianic age would be known when 'people beat their swords into plowshares and the lion lies down with the lamb'; in other words - when world peace comes. The one who ushers in that age is to be recognized as the 'messiah'. Therefore the Jews still wait for their messiah.

Many Old Testament prophecies of the Messiah were fulfilled in precise detail by Jesus of Nazareth. Neither the Jews nor the disciples of Jesus understood at the time that Jesus was fulfilling the messianic prophecies of the Old Testament, even though at times He told them this was the case. They were looking for a far different Messiah than the one that many prophecies actually described.

 

Astronomer and mathematician Peter Stoner, in his book Science Speaks, offers a mathematical analysis showing that it is impossible that the precise statements about the One to come could be fulfilled in a single person by mere coincidence. The chance of only eight of these dozens of prophecies being fulfilled in the life of one man has been estimated at 1 chance in 100,000,000,000,000,000.

 

Now, the only remaining question is whether the New Testament is a factual account of the life of Jesus, or a total fabrication or fraud. The most definitive argument in favour of the authenticity of Christian scriptures would be any a priori postulation of one omniscient and omnipotent God. Such a God makes no mistakes. It is virtually inconceivable that such a God would allow a total deception in His name or a chance fulfilment of many prophecies in the life of the wrong person, thus misleading hundreds of millions of Christians.

 

Of course, the same would be true for, e.g., Hinduism, Judaism and Islam. In this respect, Christianity just happens to be the latest rendering of universal religious Truth, which is ultimately fully compatible with all monotheistic religions, including (as I argued in another thread) Hinduism/Vaishnavism.

 

Christianity doesn’t claim to be exclusively true, threatening unbelievers with eternal hell and damnation. This is a relatively recent pagan myth that crept into Christianity, and has no actual place in the New Testament. Even when Jesus Christ stated "no one comes to the Father but through Me", He didn’t say that other religions are ultimately invalid. He just described the universal process of God-realisation through Self-realisation. In fact, Krishna stated exactly the same in the Gita. If through all ages God consistently allowed for such religious deception of the masses in His name, the purpose of it would indeed be inconceivable..

I don't think the author considers himself as such. I think he was engaging in self-deprecating humor in an attempt to disarm people who react emotionally when a sensitive topic is broached. Needless to say - I am not the topic. Therefore I respectfully request that you read at least one chapter of his writings and restrict your comments to them.

So the question arises as to why you Smiley would start such a thread based on the brayings of an offensive ass. What is your motive? Do you even know?

Well he seems to admit to being offensive:

I am thinking of writing an essay — "Advantages of Being An Ass"

I couldn't read the whole post. The man is an offensive fool.

I am interested in what people think of the work

by Voice of India spokesman Sita Ram Goel: http://www.hamsa.org/artifice-intro.htm

The book can be read online or downloaded freely as a .pdf file.

Here is the preface:

The first glimpse of the Jesus of the gospels came to me in 1956. My Jesuist friend who had tried to convert me, had failed in the attempt. When we were back at the mission headquarters in Patna, the following dialogue took place between us.

 

"You believe that Jesus was an avatar," he asked.

"Yes, I do," I replied.

"Can an avatar tell a lie?"

"He is not supposed to."

"What if Jesus says he is the only God?"

"He can't say that."

 

My friend picked up a copy of the New Testament and read out several passages from the gospels. Jesus did say in so many words not only that he was the only God but also that those who did not accept his claim would burn for ever in the infernal pit. I realized with painful surprise that Jesus was not all Sermon on the Mount as I had been led to believe by his Hindu votaries.

 

Years passed, and I had no time to spare for Jesus. I turned to him again in the eighties when Ram Swarup made me wise about the character of monotheistic creeds. It was then that I turned to the gospels. I was horrified. Now I could see why the history of Christianity had been what it had been. The source of the poison was in the Jesus of the gospels. The rest of my studies followed.

 

A few years ago I was discussing the menace of Christian missions with a Gandhian friend. He agreed with me that there was something sinister about them. I told him that we shall have to tell our people the truth about Jesus if we wanted to tackle the missions. He was visibly shaken, and said to me in a voice choked with emotion:

 

"Sitabhai. Jesus ko kucch mat kahiye (Brother Sita, do not touch Jesus)!"

"Have you read the gospels," I asked him.

He was annoyed, and shot back, "That is a personal question."

 

I had to drop the subject. Every time I have asked opinionated people about the source of their opinion on a particular question, I have been accused of being personal. I am thinking of writing an essay — "Advantages of Being An Ass".

 

I have wondered over the years why we Hindus have remained preoccupied with the behaviour patterns of Muslims and Christians and not with the belief systems which create those behaviour patterns. We object to Christian missions, but refuse to discuss Christianity and its God, Jesus. We object to Islamic terrorism, but refuse to have a look at Islam and its prophet, Muhammad. I see no sense or logic in this Hindu habit.

 

In fact, we go a step further. We appeal to the Christian missionaries in the name of Jesus, and ask them not to do what they have been doing. We appeal to the Muslims in the name of Muhammad, and ask them to stop doing what they have been doing. In the process, we have invented a "real" Jesus and a "true" Christianity. We have also invented a "real" Muhammad and a "true" Islam. The missionary and the mullah smiles at our inventions but goes ahead and makes good use of our soft-headedness. That is why we have failed to solve the "communal problem" all these years. We have never tried to find out why our own people, which both Christians and Muslims are, should become alienated from us when they pass under the spell of Christianity and Islam.

 

Flattering the bully may become necessary when the bully is powerful and there remains no other way of softening him except by extolling his heroes or his cult. Hindus have experienced such emergencies vis-à-vis both Islam and Christianity. But there is no reason for their continuing with the same psychology. Hindus should not convert an apaddharma into Sanatana Dharma.

 

New Delhi

Sita Ram Goel

15 April 1994

I for one am not trying to have it both ways. You are simply appealing to your authority (Swami Prabhupada) instead of trying to evaluate the issue objectively. The arguments of Theist are cogent and strong. Apparently Prabhupada is not his authority - neither is he mine.

However I must ask this - is their really something wrong with taking the milk from protected cows only? The argument is not against the idea of milk but against taking it from unprotected cows. Milk from unprotected cows is a product of violence. Also it is the demand for such milk that creates male calves for veal. Instead of countering any of these arguments, people are just making appeals to authority and trying to act like Swami Prabhupada would actually be displeased if they took milk only from protected cows!

I have heard people engage in similar fallacious reasoning vis a vis vegetarianism because Jesus ("a pure devotee") ate fish (apparently he also ate lamb). How can anyone who supports the US dairy industry preach Dharma to Atheist vegans who don't make any of these rationalizations but prefer to restrict their senses because of their compassion for all living creatures?

I asked a very simple question, and the answer is also very simple. Let me therefore ask it a different way.

 

Since Sri Prabhupada's approach to things is generally taken by Hare Krishnas to be valid, and since Theist argues that people who drink milk are enabling the torture and slaughter of cows, and since Sri Prabhupada did consume milk in the United States and allowed its use in his temples....

 

Are all milk drinkers including Sri Prabhupada guilty of enabling cow torture, or are none of them guilty by the very fact of consuming milk?

 

You can't have it both ways, i.e. milk drinking is wrong for most people but not for Prabhupada. That is hypocrisy.

There is an interesting debate on this subject here: http://www.indiadivine.org/audarya/spiritual-discussions/454839-cows-milk-again.html

Just a thought that came to my mind.

What would u say about TAKING the milk away from the calf - and drinking it. Cow does not willingly gives it away. I think even that is wrong.

What are your thoughts.

But aren't veal calves a necessary product of the repeated isemination of dairy cattle? Please tell me what should be done with all the male calves that are born as a result of that process. I am sincerely asking for an answer because I don't know if there is a workable economic model that can meet current US demand and also protect cows.

But the question relates to people who buy milk, not meat. Female cows are allowed to live a while because their milk produces revenue for the exploiters. If the cows were only good for meat, they would be murdered after fattening, along with the males. Is this what we want?

One can't have it both ways. If you support the dairy industry you support the mistreatment of cows and veal production. If milk is important to spiritual development then why not establish KC dairies and only accept milk from them? Wouldn't that satisfy everything? BTW, milk does not contain all vitamins, perhaps Swami Prabhupada was referring to all the essential

amino acids.

 

 

Milk... Krsna's Miracle Gift To Mankind

BY: MAHANANDA DASA

 

Jul 19, USA (SUN) — Vegan or not Vegan, which is correct?

 

"

The protection of cows maintains the most miraculous form of food, i.e., milk for maintaining the finer tissues of the brain for understanding higher aims of life." Srila Prabhupada

 

In response to the article posted on Sampradaya Sun promoting veganism in ISKCON temples, I would like to present our view of milk drinking that we have accepted from our spiritual master.

 

Despite the evils of modern dairies and the cruel methods of obtaining milk from the mother cows, or despite the unwanted chemicals that store bought milk might introduce into your body and cause ill effects, still, we do not condemn drinking milk nor support veganism as part of our philosophy.

 

Quite the contrary. The glories of drinking cow's milk are everywhere in Srila Prabhupada's books. And though this may cause some doubts in the minds of those who have embraced vegan-ism, we as devotees faithfully follow the advice of our teacher, though it is sometimes contrary to fads or scientific theory.

 

To sometimes reject scientific evidence is basic to a devotee's understanding of how to reach real knowledge of the actual condition of the living entities, both spiritually and materially. In a few years, vegans may become milk drinkers, or theorist may change their minds many times about the affects of milk, but a devotee remains steady and accepts the Vedic version as it is handed down through disciplic succession.

 

Among the few thousands references to milk in Srila Prabhupada's books and lectures, I would like to point out a few here that will give a different perspective of drinking milk than that of the vegans. Srila Prabhupada says. ''Cow has got special importance because it supplies milk, and milk is very essential food that is... From the childhood, a child lives on milk, and there are many saintly persons, they also live by drinking milk. Milk is very important item in the human society, and it supplies all vitamins. "

 

Also he says "But He's (Krsna) speaking of go-raksya for our special material benefit, that if we protect the cows, we can have the facility of drinking milk, which will help us in keeping our health in order and developing very nice brain tissues to understand spiritual subject matter."

 

Of course, like the vegans, we condemn the inhuman treatment of the cows at the dairies and slaughterhouses. Srila Prabhupada says "the cow's calf not only is beautiful to look at, but also gives satisfaction to the cow, and so she delivers as much milk as possible. But in the Kali-yuga, the calves are separated from the cows as early as possible for purposes which may not be mentioned in these pages of Srimad-Bhagavatam. The cow stands with tears in her eyes, the sudra milkman draws milk from the cow artificially, and when there is no milk the cow is sent to be slaughtered. These greatly sinful acts are responsible for all the troubles in present society. People do not know what they are doing in the name of economic development."

 

Srila Prabhupada also instructed us, "Milk is compared to nectar, which one can drink to become immortal. Of course, simply drinking milk will not make one immortal, but it can increase the duration of one's life. In modern civilization, men do not think milk to be important, and therefore they do not live very long. Although in this age men can live up to one hundred years, their duration of life is reduced because they do not drink large quantities of milk. This is a sign of Kali-yuga. In Kali-yuga, instead of drinking milk, people prefer to slaughter an animal and eat its flesh. The Supreme Personality of Godhead, in His instructions of Bhagavad-Gita, advises go-raksya, which means cow protection. The cow should be protected, milk should be drawn from the cows, and this milk should be prepared in various ways. One should take ample milk, and thus one can prolong one's life, develop his brain, execute devotional service, and ultimately attain the favor of the Supreme Personality of Godhead. As it is essential to get food grains and water by digging the earth, it is also essential to give protection to the cows and take nectarean milk from their milk bags."

 

Another reason for milk's consumption is given here. "Animal fat is available in the form of milk, which is the most wonderful of all foods. Milk, butter, cheese and similar products give animal fat in a form which rules out any need for the killing of innocent creatures. It is only through brute mentality that this killing goes on. The civilized method of obtaining needed fat is by milk."

 

Our position on milk drinking as taught in the Vedic literature is summed up in the following words spoken by a disciple of Srila Prabhupada (Madhudvisa dasa), who was with his spiritual master speaking to a Dr. Muncing.....

 

Madhudvisa: "One thing that we would like to mention, as our spiritual master says, there is a definite, according to the Vedic scripture, there is a definite link between consumption of milk and development of fine brain tissues. And if your department of knowledge has some research in that area, we think it would be a great service to mankind if they can be informed how they can develop fine brain tissues. Fine brain tissues which are needed for coping with the problems of this day and age. Not that simply if I disagree with you we'll just fight. There has to be fine brain tissues in order to say, 'Let us sit down and talk about this together. ' And we say, not we, but according to the scripture, there is a definite link between the consumption of milk products, not just milk, but cheese and all different milk products, the consumption of milk products and development of the necessary intellect. This is why, as our spiritual master said, the highly intelligent people of India have lived predominantly, not just drinking milk, but everything they ate was cooked in milk products. The vegetables, rice, even if rice was boiled, milk was put on, ghee was put on the rice. So that is like an unavoidable essential in their diet, not simply from the palatable standpoint, but actually from the relationship between the physical and the metaphysical progress."

 

I have submitted this document in all humility to the Vaisnavas. All glories to Srila Prabhupada.

 

"The cow delivers milk, the miracle of aggregate food values." (Srila Prabhupada)

 

Sincerely,

Mahananda dasa

 

 

 

----------

 

Apparently Mahananda dasa did not pay attention to his own article.

 

 

 

Here again is the first sentence:

 

 

 

Mahananda dasa needs to understand the difference of protecting cows and exploiting cows.

 

 

Another question is ifthis commercial milk is so essential for the development of fine brain tissues why is America so lacking in spiritual consciousness?

 

First of all, relying on what Jesus or Hitler did is not germane to a discussion on principles of Sanatana Dharma. One should follow a guru. If there is no guru then I think sound reasoning should be employed. This is my reasoning:

Dairy cows have to be repeatedly impregnated to keep up their milk production. What is to be done with all the male calves which are born as a result of those pregnancies? The answer is that they are kept in tiny veal cages so that they can not move during their entire short and miserable lives - keeping their muscles soft so that the veal is tender. To just go to the market and buy some milk - organic or not - is to be complicit in veal production. That is simply a fact. Those calves are brought into existence because people like dairy. Offering milk produced in that way is offering the produce of terrible violence against cows. Milk production = veal production. If that is not so then tell me what is done with all the male calves that are produced by the impregnated cows. If you have verified knowledge of a milk producer that has found a way around this then please let me know about it. I don't think Shree Vishnu wants me to offer Him the milk of tortured cows any more than He wants me to offer Him the veal which is a direct byproduct of that milk production. Cow torture is not cow protection.

http://www.milksucks.com/dump.asp

Those are good reasons and also if you are concerned with karma then you do not want to acquire your food though violence. if you kill yourself or have another kill for you it is the same - violence to please the palate. definitely not the mode of sattva.

Are you just going to defend any law in India simply because it is already in place? India also pays Haj subsidy to help Muslims do pilgrimage but there is no equivalent for poor Hindus who want to do Yatra. Also, although Islam is a minority religion in India - it is the second largest and fastest growing in the world. Therefore they do not need special rights. Also I was not aware of any prohibition of polygamy in Hindu scriptures. Sri Krishna gave special mention to King Janaka as a perfected being although he had hundreds of wives. There are also other examples of polygamy in Hindu scriptures.

JAI SHRI RAMAWell Muslims are a minority in India and they dont have want to have polygamy among hindus who are a majority maybe thats why.

Remeber sati,child amrriage all these social evils.Polygamy was one of them.

Anyway these were decided in the interests of all and there might have been was discussion hindus and muslims before decidng the laws.

Also some rights are given to backward classes such as scheduled tribes for example reservation in government jobs through quotas etc.

It should be that these classses should not be left out and should be uplifted.

JAI SHRI RAM

I have become convinced that all of the Vedic literature does not harmonize and my frustration ended when I accepted that. As far as "there are no hard and fast rules for chanting these holy names" - I believe that can be attributed to Sri Chaitanya Mahaprabhu and perhaps the many 'hard and fast rules' came from other Vaishnava acharyas who will nonetheless swear that they are upholding that principle.

I think I can see your point and it is well taken but I am still stuck in that Vedic quandry where I just cannot seem to harmonize the contradictions of the Vedas. Sometimes it says there are no hard fast rules to chanting then other times it says you are going to hell if you don't chant perfectly right. Even despite constantly struggling with these contradictions for years upon years I still always seem to retain some level of fascination with the Vedas. I go back to science and psychology to try to explain what the hell is going on with life and sometimes find some interesting theories etc. but I still find myself of thinking about the Vedas and trying to factor that knowledge into the equation somehow.

Please explain what you mean by this:

Chanting while sleeping and thinking that rounds are over.

and this:

Chanting to finish the rounds somehow

thank you

League Of Devotees

Chanting while Bhagavatam class in going on

 

Chanting while reading newspaper

 

Chanting while discussing Hari Katha

 

Chanting while cooking with left hand

 

Chanting while watching spiritual video

 

Chanting while listening what other's are talking

 

Chanting while attending telephone calls

 

Chanting to show other that I am chanting

 

Chanting while thinking about sense gratification

 

Chanting while sleeping and thinking that rounds are over.

 

Chanting while monitoring the time clock

 

Chanting while fingers are faster than the mantra

 

Chanting while watching if others are chanting properly

 

Chanting while shaking japa bags continuously

 

Chanting while missing some of the syllable

 

Chanting while bargaining the price

 

Chanting while sleeping on the bed

 

Chanting for material prosperity

 

Chanting two japas simultaneously to finish prescribed rounds

 

Chanting while driving to work

 

Chanitng occassionally

 

Chanting less than 16 rounds a day

 

Chanting to finish the rounds somehow

 

League Of Devotees

The press in India reports on mayhem in a rather peculiar way. They often use words like "communal clashes broke out" without any elucidation as to why the clashes broke out. On occasion of such obfuscation you must wonder if there really were 'clashes' in the straightforward sense of the word or have perhaps members of one religious community actually gone into a homicidal rage and targeted easily identifiable members of another community. Of course playing fast and loose with the facts may be the way the press tries to keep simmering communal tensions in check ... but it seems that unless the underlying cause of all this tension (between Hindus and Muslims) is actually addressed it may eventually serve as a catalyst for another horrific partition of India.

Here is one 'complete' press report:

Ahead of Pranab visit, clashes in Murshidabad claim 4, curfew clamped

Four persons were killed, including two in police firing, as communal clashes broke out on Friday at a village in Beldanga in Murshidabad district.

The death toll is likely to go up as several people were missing after the clash and about 15 houses and 20 shops were set on fire by rampaging mobs. Curfew has been imposed in the area.

A deputy superintendent of police was also seriously injured in the incident.

Murshidabad District Magistrate Perwez Ahmed Siddiqui on Saturday said the situation, though tense, was under control.

The incident has put the police in a spot as Murshidabad district includes Jangipur, the home constituency of Union Finance Minister Pranab Mukherjee who is scheduled to visit his constituency on Sunday.

According to district administration sources, the clashes erupted on Friday evening and continued till the early hours of Saturday in at least three adjoining villages under Nowda police station. Police had to resort to firing and lob teargas shells to quell the disturbance. Two companies of BSF have been called to enforce law and order. http://www.indianexpress.com/news/ahead-of-pranab-visit-clashes-in-murshidabad-claim-4-curfew-clamped/488211/

more light on what may actually have happened:

 

MAJOR COMMUNAL RIOT IN MURSHIDABAD, 12 HINDU DEAD, HUNDREDS INJURED INCLUDING ONE DEPUTY SUPERINTENDENT OF POLICE

Today, 10th July, a major communal riot broke in Murshidabad district. Till now 12 persons dead, most of them Hindus, hundreds injured including 10 policemen and one D.S.P. rank police officer. Two village markets and hundreds of Hindu houses were looted and burnt. Firing between police and Muslim rioters still going on at 11.30 night. Curfew imposed in the whole area. BSF and CRPF deployed to help police and RAF.

Perhaps the whole incident planned to welcome the proposed Aligarh Muslim University Campus in this district.

Jhaubona High School is a big higher secondary school in Jhaubona village under Nawda polie station in Beldanga sub division in Murshidabad district. Among total 1000 students of this school, about 50% are Muslim students. For long they were demanding to offer Friday Namaz inside the school. But school management and the Hindu students resisted it apprehending that it will create a virtual mosque inside the school. So, the furious Muslim students made objection against Saraswati Puja in the school and the school management has been compelled to stop Saraswati puja last year in the school. In spite of that, the Muslim students were not satisfied. So they planned to offer Friday Namaz today (10 July) by force inside the school without any permission from Head Master or School Management. Hindu students protested and altercation started at 12 noon between two groups of students. Muslims were prepared. Through cell phone they spread the false message that Hindu students attacked Muslim students in the school. Within 10-15 minutes, thousands of Muslims led by the students of nearby Trimohini Madrasa rushed to the school. They attacked the school students, the big village market of Trimohini, and two Hindu villages Jhaubona and Trimohini. Many Hindu shops in the Trimohini market were burnt and looted. Many Hindu houses were burnt and looted in the villages Jhaubona and Garapara. In one house 4 Hindus died in the fire including one father and his daughter were burnt alive.

Till now, according to our sources, 12 Hindus are dead, more than one hundred injured, though the district administration will surely give a lesser number.

Many are missing. Nobody knows how many of the missing persons are already dead.

Police and RAF could not control the situation. So, BSF and CRPF are called in. Till evening, police fired 250 rounds. 10 policemen were injured, among them condition of 4 are very serious. One D.S.P. is seriously injured. He has been admitted in a private nursing home to avoid media scrutiny. On the road at Begunbari village, Muslims burnt 2 buses and one matador. One Tata Sumo car and its passengers were attacked. The broken car and its passengers have been brought to Beldanga Bharat Sevashram Sangha for their safety.

The injured persons have been admitted to Baharampur and Amtala hospitals. Till mid night, firing was going on between Muslim rioters and security forces at Trimohini bazaar.

As usual, the electronic media/ TV channels are silent and totally blacked out this major incident.

Murshidabad district is a Muslim majority distrct. All the 3 police stations in Beldanga sub division – Beldanga, Nawda and Hariharpara – are Muslim majority. This is a border sub division. All the Hindu villages under Nawda and Hariharpara p.s. are awake tonight. They are scared of possible Muslim attack upon their villages.

In sub divisional town Beldanga, in evening Muslims gathered in front of Congress office. Hindus are fearing that the famous Bharat Sevashram Sangha, whose President highly revered Swami Pradiptanandaji (Kartik Maharaj) may be attacked by communal Muslims. Swamiji is now away from Ashram. He went pilgrimage to Mansarovar-Kailas. He is expected to return in 5-6 days.

India’s Finance Minister Mr. Pranab Mukherjee has been elected from this Murshidabad district. As a gratitude to the Muslims of this district, he announced in his finance Budget in parliament that he would allocate a huge sum of money to establish a campus of Aligarh Muslim University in this district. This Aligarh Muslim University spearheaded the separatist movement for creation of Pakistan in pre 1947 years. http://www.hindusamhati.org/

It will also cure heterosexually.

Well Swami Ramdev has sworn off sex, saying "it is not love".

However many Westerners claim that Hatha Yoga makes gives

them a better sex life. Perhaps it depends on the individual?

I agree with you Theist; and the homosexuals are pushing their agenda worldwide. They were not satisfied with decriminalization - they want to brainwash everyone into seeing their carnal relationships as equivalent to heterosexual marriage. Sometimes they are very subtle with their arguments, such as

in ancient India, they even celebrated sex as an enjoyable part of procreation, where priests were invited for ceremonies in their home to mark the beginning of the process http://blogs.yogajournal.com/yogabuzz/2009/07/swami-baba-ramdev-says-yoga-can-cure-homosexuality.html

Perhaps all of this nonsense will hasten the advent of Sri Kalki.

How about 'sriman' and 'sripad'? What do they mean?

Hindu guru claims homosexuality can be 'cured' by yoga

The world's most popular Hindu guru, Swami "Baba" Ramdev,

has claimed homosexuality can be "cured" by yoga in a petition

to India's Supreme Court.

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/india/5780028/Hindu-guru-claims-homosexuality-can-be-cured-by-yoga.html

Yogevangelist Swami Ramdev Protests Homosexuality,

Claims it a ‘Defect’ ‘Cured’ with Yoga

www.yogadork.com/2009/07/09/yogevangelist-swami-ramdev-protests-homosexuality-claims-it-a-defect-to-be-cured-with-yoga

sant it is you that is "talking through emotions" and you are trying to project that on me. Try to read carefully what I actually say. I never said who I believed lived or did not. I already said that believing someone lived and believing that they are relevant are two different things. Then you start talking about if someone existed or not. I do not want to debate that with you since someone already has debated that with you.

I do not care if someone who is irrelevant to my beliefs and practices existed or not. Many people existed in ancient times - it does not mean that they attained any kind of realization or that there is any good basis for believing they performed miracles or that any of the other mythology associated with that personality has any factual basis. Forgive me

but I do not know how to be more clearer than I have been.

What i meant was beleiving someone lived.

Christ is a historical figure.

Whole history dating is based on A.D. and BC.

If there are people who amount to billions and who brleve christ didint live then you can use the figure.

whats happened to you.

YOu can beleive all the hindu god and goddeses are living but cant beleive that jesus lived.That shows your just talking through emotions and not proof.