Shakti-Fan

nitai-pada-kamala, koti-candra-susitala je chayay jagata juray heno nitai bine bhai, radha-krsna paite nai drdha kori' dharo nitair pay The lotus feet of Lord Nityananda are a shelter where one will get the soothing moonlight not only of one, but of millions of moons. If the world wants to have real peace, it should take shelter of Lord Nityänanda. Unless one takes shelter under the shade of the lotus feet of Lord Nityänanda, it will be very difficult for him to approach Radha-Krsna. If one actually wants to enter into the dancing party of Radha-Krsna, he must firmly catch hold of the lotus feet of Lord Nityananda. (translation by Srila A.C Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada) So, if this is true then Srila Sridhar Maharaja wanted to enter into the dancing party of Radha-Krsna. What kind of devotees enter into this divine dancing party? Could this have been the internal meaning of Srila Sridhar Maharaja's focus on Dayal Nitai in the last days of his prakata lila? sakhyaya te mama namo'stu namo'stu nityam dasyaya te mama raso'stu raso'stu satyam But wait a minute; what's the full verse? So here it is: padabjayos tava vina vara-dasyam eva nanyat kadapi samaye kila devi yace sakhyaya te mama namo 'stu namo 'stu nityam dasyaya te mama raso 'stu raso 'stu satyam ["O Goddess! I shall never pray to You for anything else but the excellent service of Your lotus feet. I offer my constant obeisances unto the idea of becoming Your friend, but I truly relish the idea of becoming Your maidservant." (Text 16, Vilap-kusumanjali, translation by Srila Bhaktivedanta Narayana Maharaja) Is Srila Sridhar Maharaja static or dynamic? Again from Srila Sridhar Maharaja himself, What is found there is a new thing, so approach that world with an open mind; understand that everything is possible with the infinite. All your expectations, your past experience, has no value. Why don't you give up trying to dodge this point?"

Sri Balaramaji also appears as Anaga Manjari. So he is also represented there. "Perhaps he was only posing". Find it if you can. I've heard it at least ten times. This philosophy has more twist and turns than you can imagine. "Srila Sridhar Maharaj usually gave the devotees clear and unambiguous answers. He wanted to clear up their confusion". Yes, there confusion that you can hold the knowledge of Krsna in your fist, like as sweet ball. Not so. Jnane prayasam udapasya namanata eva. Srila Sridhar Maharaja has said: An example of acintya-bhedabheda-tattva is found in the way Krsna deals with his devotees. Krsna himself is independent of everything. Still, sometimes he shows himself to be completely subordinate to his servants and must do whatever they want him to. Then again, sometimes he completely ignores them. These are the spontaneous pastimes of the Sweet Absolute. Sometimes He shows absolute submission to Srimati Radharani, and again, sometimes he ignores her. This is the very nature of Krsna'slila. God works wonders. His ways are filled with miracles. We should be prepared for that. We should be prepared that all the knowledge of this world, all our experience, will prove to be wrong. So it is said, jnane prayasam udapasya namanta eva: Be clear of your past experiences, what you have drawn from the world of the senses, empirical knowledge (pratyaksa-jnana). Your tendency will always be to try to push your way into the transcendental world on the strength of mundane knowledge. But this verse is saying, "You fallen people, your capital is the experience of this world, of the senses. But it won't do, it won't have any value in that higher plane. What is found there is a new thing, so approach that world with an open mind; understand that everything is possible with the infinite. All your expectations, your past experience, has no value. Why don't you give up trying to dodge this point?"

An aspect of the Godhead may suffer, namely the jiva who exists in the realm of the tatastha shakti or marginal potency of the lord. "The Vedas, like the Mundaka Upanisad, as well as the Svetasvatara Upanisad, compare the soul and the Supersoul to two friendly birds sitting on the same tree. One of the birds (the individual atomic soul) is eating the fruit of the tree, and the other bird (Krsna) is simply watching His friend. Of these two birds--although they are the same in quality--one is captivated by the fruits of the material tree, while the other is simply witnessing the activities of His friend. ...Although they are friends, one is still the master and the other is the servant. Forgetfulness of this relationship by the atomic soul is the cause of one's changing his position from one tree to another or from one body to another. The jiva soul is struggling very hard on the tree of the material body, but as soon as he agrees to accept the other bird as the supreme spiritual master--as Arjuna agreed to do by voluntary surrender unto Krsna for instruction--the subordinate bird immediately becomes free from all lamentations. ...Although the two birds are in the same tree, the eating bird is fully engrossed with anxiety and moroseness as the enjoyer of the fruits of the tree. But if in some way or other he turns his face to his friend who is the Lord and knows His glories--at once the suffering bird becomes free from all anxieties." Bhagavad-gita 2:22 Purport You should know that there are many kinds of jivas. Some are coming from Baladeva Prabhu in Goloka Vrndavana, and they are serving Radha and Krsna conjugal eternally. They have not seen or realized this material world. Some jivas are coming from Baladeva in Dvaraka, and they are serving Krsna in His form of Dvarakadhisa Some are coming from His manifestation called Maha-Sankarsana, and they are serving in Vaikuntha. They are serving incarnations like Vaikunthesvara Narayana, Sri Ramacandra, Nrsimhadeva and others. Finally, those who are coming from the incarnation of Maha-Sankarsana known as Karanadakasayi Visnu are in the marginal (tatastha) region. We have all come from there, not from Goloka. Those who have received and tasted the service of Krsna can never fall down. They cannot become conditioned souls. If one has gone there by developing bhakti from sraddha all the way to prema, how can he fall down? There is no Mahamaya in Goloka; only Yogamaya. She will always help the devotees, and therefore there is no question of forgetting Krsna there. The conditioned souls have come from the marginal line – from the illuminated glance of Karanadakasayi Visnu. The realized souls coming from Baladeva Prabhu, the kayavyuha (bodily expansions) of Radhika, and also the conditioned souls, are all parts and parcels of Krsna. Krsna has so much unconditional love and causeless mercy towards all living entities. He cannot tolerate to see us suffering the miseries of adhyatmika (bodily or mental), adhibhautika (caused by others) and adhidaivika (caused by nature and the demigods). Even if you are wealthy, healthy, possessed of all good qualities and have a very high position, you'll have to become old one day. All you beautiful ladies and men will be forced to grow old, and one day you will have to die. You cannot take a single farthing from this world; not even a hair from your head. The only thing you may take with you is some sukrti, or pure bhakti; otherwise you leave with nothing. Undoubtedly, Krsna is causelessly merciful. He cannot tolerate the suffering of His minute parts, the jivas, who are His eternal servants. If we worldly people don't want our children to suffer, then how can Krsna tolerate the suffering of the jivas? He mercifully descends Himself, and sometimes He comes as His incarnations like Rama, Nrsimha, Kalki, Vamana, and so on. Jesus Christ is also a messenger of God. Sometimes Krsna comes Himself with all His associates. He displays poignant and heart-breaking pastimes as Rama, and sometimes He manifests the pastimes of Nrsimha Bhagavan who, in a moment, killed a person who had a boon not to die in the day or night, by any weapon or any mantra, or in the sea, sky or land. He was killed in a moment – because he tried to torture a bhakta like Prahlada. If anyone commits an offence or acts neglectfully to the Vaisnavas, Krsna will come in some way. Sometimes He sends His Sudarsana-cakra as He did to protect Ambarisa Maharaja, sometimes He appears as Nrsimhadeva and sometimes as Sri Rama. Los Angeles May 10 2003 So the Lord knows of our pain but he does not necessarily "feel" it. Tridandisvami Sri Srimad Bhaktivedanta Narayana Maharaja

Yes, perhaps everyone has not heard everything. There is also the case of selective hearing, reading and memory. If Sridhar Maharaja said these other things about Prabhupada's eternal rasa, then why would so many or his "followers" pick up on the sakhya rasa part and neglect the rest? pashyan ap na pashyati. We see but we do not see.

Yet its possible that you and a LIVING PRESENCE advocate could agree to suspend all disagreements and just sit down an listen to a recorded lecture of Srila Prabhupada. Then you might chant Hare Krsna and take some prasadam together. Here is the limitation of the forums, it basically gives us the facility to argue, not much else.

Add all this to the fact that since we are not really realized souls, we may not really have much faith at all in the ideas that we zealously push on the Audarya Fellowships. We are really arguing against our own doubts without really following to the process to assuage those doubts. Then we take out our insecurities and fears on others and create an unnecessary "us and them" scenario. I guess I just busted myself.

All Glories to Srila Prabhupada! In another venue your question would just be a question. On this forum its like yelling, "fire" in a crowded virtual theatre while wearing a siddhantic explosive belt. All Glories to Srila Prabhupada! The "glories" we are talking about are infinite so there's enough to go around for all pure devotees.

Yes it would be a kind of omniscience but, "not omniscience in the regular understanding of this word." Just like the Eskimos have 200 words for snow and we only have one. We have to remember that our language is not so good for explaining the subtle qualities of bhakti. So many arguments on this forum are really about semantics and not really substantial. The same can be said about many of the so-called siddhantic disagreements between the different camps. Suppose I wouldn't have clarified and modified the definitions word, "omniscient", as used in this context. And then I said, "No my siksa or diksa guru said omniscient." It would have caused a big fight on the thread and eventually led to some kind of personal attacks by some devotees on others. Anyway what can be done? Many devotees just like to fight.

Anyone who spent time around SP experienced that SP knew things about events in devotees lives that it would be impossible to know under the circumstances. Whether you call it omniscience or whatever, it happened. It took place under the agency of yoga maya by the will of Krsna. Maybe there in lies the confusion. Krsna's will is supreme and no one elses; and of course SP was always quick to point this out.

Here's an example of a hodge podge of opinions. For instance, would you pray to Prabhupada's murti form if you thought he wasn't present there? SrIla Bhakti Sundar Govinda Maharaja calls Saraswati Thakur, "Bhagavan Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Saraswati Thakur" In that sense bhagavan means, according to Srila Jiva Goswami, that person who is so exalted that everyone is drawn to serve him. Most of us also remember the controversy and debates that ensued when Srila Bhaktivedanta Narayana Maharaja said that an uttama bhakta like Prabhupada is omniscient.

Many of the older devotees will remember the claims of the GBC and their followers that Sridhar Maharaja was reinitiating Prabhupada's disciples. I'm sure if they we read this posts they will see the extreme irony. So when Govinda Maharaja chants on the threads and beads of Prabhupada's disciples and they sit in the agni hotra that is diksa? I've heard ISKCONites claim that Govinda Maharaja reinitiates Prabhupada disciples. So does chanting on the threads and beads of one who has diksa mean reinitiation? I thought that it was a more formal type of siksa. Just because Madana Mohana saw chanting on beads and threads and a fire sacrifice, how would he know it was diksa? Puspadanta's wife in Oregon USA has Hare Nama and diksa from Govinda Maharaja. When she asked about her situation Narayana Maharaja told her that she already had diksa from a bonafide guru, but he would chant on her beads and thread as formal siksa. I mean if he wouldn't reinitiate into diksa a Govinda Maharaja disciple, he would reinitiate into diksa a Sridhar Maharaja who he openly worships (performs arati to a picture) and calls his siksa guru? I think that those who read this post will have to judge for themselves. Based on Madana Mohana's observation, report etcetera, you have no case.

One time Govinda Maharaja was about to give an number of initiations and many of the prospective initiates were already initiated by ISKCON gurus. A rumour had spread that Govinda Maharaja was now on good terms with Hrdayanada Maharaja and would no longer reinitiate his disiciples. What really ensued was a "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" policy. All of Hrdayanada Maharaja's disciples received reinitiation from Govinda Maharaja. A friend of mine who had taken shelter of Bhakti Pramode Puri Maharaja told me that one day Jayapataka Maharaja arrived at the math and asked Puri Maharaja to please not reinitiate any of his disciples. I was told that Puri Maharaja said that it is the duty of any sannyasi to offer shelter to anyone seeking it. Jayapataka Maharaja was speechless, left a cash donation then took his leave. I really find it hard to believe that Naryana Maharaja would reinitiate a disciple of Sridhar Maharja. I have heard that he will chant on the beads and threads of Prabhupada and Sridhar Maharaja disciples but not as a formal connection. At some maths they call this "taking siksa".

Yes Beggar is right maybe we should try to forget about this cruel blackish person who has been called the Supreme Personality of Godhead. Maybe our prospect should be elsewhere. According to Srila Bhakti Raksak Sridhar-deva Goswami Maharaja: The Gaudiya Vaisnavas know only Radharani They are concerned only with Her and Her duties, Her necessities. They are ready to serve Her in all respects, and cannot contemplate any service without Her. That is the highest achievement of the Gaudiya Vaisnavas, that is the special feature of Mahaprabhu's party, and that was announced by Raghunatha Dasa Goswami. "There is a hope which is sustaining me and nurturing my existence. With that hope I am somehow passing my days. But my patience has reached its end. I can't endure it any longer. At this moment if You do not show Your grace to me, Sri Radha, I shall lose my prospect forever. I shall have no desire to continue my life. And Vrndavana, which is even dearer to me than my life itself - I am disgusted with it. And what to speak of anything else, I am even disgusted with Krsna. It is shameful to utter such words, but I can have no love even for Krsna unless and until You take me within Your confidential camp of service." - Raghunatha Dasa Once, the Diwan of Bharatpur had come on a pilgrimage with his family to the holiest of places, Sri Radha-kunda, the holy lake of Srimati Radharani. He and his family were circumambulating Radha-kunda. They would fall flat on the ground, offering obeisances lying down with their arms outstretched. Every time they bowed down in this way, they would mark the spot where their fingertips touched the earth. Then they would slowly rise, step forward to where that spot had been marked, and again fall flat, offering their obeisances with great respect and adoration. In this way they were circumambulating the entire Radha-kunda. Upon seeing such intense worship, Paramananda Prabhu, an intimate disciple of our guru maharaja Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Saraswati Thakura, intimated to Prabhupada that the Diwan and his family must have great respect for Radharani to circumambulate the Radha-kunda in such a fashion. At that time Prabhupada said, "Their angle of vision towards Radha-kunda and Radharani is different from ours. They recognize and revere Krsna. And because Radharani is Krsna's favorite, they also have some reverence for Radha-kunda. But our vision is just the opposite. Our concern is with Radharani. And only because She wants Krsna do we have any connection with Him." And so, the Gaudiya Vaisnavas know only Radharani. They are concerned only with Her, and Her duties, Her necessities. They are ready to serve Her in all respects, and cannot contemplate any service without Her. That is the highest achievement of the Gaudiya Vaisnavas, that is the special feature of Mahaprabhu's party, and that was announced by Raghunatha Dasa Goswami in his Vilapa-kusumanjali (102): <CENTER>asabharair-amrta-sindhu-mayaih kathancit kalo mayatigamitah kila sampratam hi tvam cet krpam mayi vidhasyasi naiva kim me pranair vraje na ca varoru bakarinapi </CENTER>This verse is a direct prayer to Radharani. It expresses a particular type of hope which is so sweet and reassuring that it is compared with an unlimited ocean of nectar. He says, "There is a hope which is sustaining me and nurturing my existence. With that hope I am somehow passing my days, dragging my life through these tedious times. That nectarine ocean of hope is attracting me and keeping me alive. But my patience has reached its end. I can't endure it any longer. I can't wait any more. "At this moment if You do not show Your grace to me, I am finished. I shall lose my prospect forever. I shall have no desire to continue my life. It will all be useless. Without Your grace, I can't stand to live another moment. And Vrndavana, which is even dearer to me than my life itself - I am disgusted with it. It is painful; it is always pinching me. And what to speak of anything else, I am even disgusted with Krsna. It is shameful to utter such words, but I can have no love even for Krsna unless and until You take me within Your confidential camp of service." This is the prayer of Raghunatha Dasa. When Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Saraswati Prabhupada would begin to explain this verse, his figure would become transformed. He would become full of emotion; his face would become like that of a phantom. In this verse, Raghunatha Dasa Goswami, taking an extreme risk, says, "O Radha, if I do not get Your favor, I don't want anything. I want You and You alone. To have an independent relationship with anyone else, eliminating You, is impossible in my life. You must be first, and then others. Without You, we can never even think of a separate relationship with Krsna." Bhaktivedanta Swami Maharaja has written that without Radharani's company, Krsna is not beautiful. Everything is relative - dependent. A teacher depends on the student, and the student depends on his teacher. Although Krsna is the enjoyer, He is completely dependent on the enjoyed, Srimati Radharani. The two are correlative; one cannot be separated from the other. As the enjoyed, Radharani is also absolutely dependent on Krsna, the enjoyer. Radharani says, "My fate is lost forever because I have given Myself, I have sold Myself to many places. When I heard the flute, I dedicated Myself to the song of the flute. When I heard the name of Krsna, I dedicated Myself to that sound. And when I saw a beautiful picture of Krsna, I wholly dedicated Myself to that picture. So in three places I have sold Myself completely, with no possibility of any happiness or peace in My life. If I had dedicated Myself to only one thing, there might have been a possibility of peace, but because I have dedicated Myself in three different places, I am hopeless. "Seeing the picture of Krsna, I couldn't contain Myself. I couldn't but give Myself to that beautiful figure, and so I dedicated Myself fully. The name of Krsna also purchased Me fully. And the sweet sound from the flute - that has also drawn Me to the extreme of dedication. So how can I hope for peace in My life? It is impossible, My friends." Radharani did not know it at that time, but the source of Krsna's flute, His name, and His beauty are one. If She could have seen how all three of these meet together, then it would have been possible for Her to have peace of mind. But it is difficult to understand this principle. How is it that the sound of Krsna's flute, the sound of His name, and a picture of His form are nondifferent from Krsna Himself? Idealism. In Hegel's words, ideal realism. The absolute idea is not to be dismissed as an abstract thing; rather, it is the basis of all existence. Reality is there, but it is ideal realism. And the foundation of the reality of Vrndavana is given by Nityananda, Baladeva: nitaiyer koruna habe, braje radha-krsna pabe, dharo nitai-carana du'khani. After Bhaktivinoda Thakura describes the position of Radharani in his Saranagati, he says, "I want to serve those who have the service of Radharani in their heart. I want to serve the feet-dust of those whose only wealth is the service of Sri Radha. I want to fall before them and take the dust of their holy feet. If you cannot fix your mind in the service of Radharani, then all your attempts to serve Krsna are useless. If you cannot achieve earnestness in the service of Srimati Radharani, then all your labor for Krsna has gone to hell." We cannot conceive of a sun without heat, nor can we conceive of Godhead without His potency. So also, no conception of Krsna is possible without Srimati Radharani. We can't know any Madhava without Radha. She is Krsna's other half - in Srila Bhaktisiddhanta's language, the predominated moiety. Devotional service as a whole is represented by Her, because both the intensity and the comprehensiveness of Her service to Krsna are unparalleled. There are so many examples of chaste and pious ladies in the ancient history of the Puranas: Saci, the faithful wife of Indra; Sati, the wife of Lord Siva; Laksmidevi, the goddess of fortune; Satyabhama, Krsna's wife in Dvaraka; Rukmini, the principle queen of Krsna in Dvaraka; and even the antagonists of Radharani, headed by Candravali. All of them represent different aspects of Radharani. They all spring from the main potency which is known as Radha. The name Radha comes from the word aradhana: One who can serve, who can worship, who can give respect, who really loves Krsna, who can render loving service. All of these other ladies who are famous for their chastity and piety are but partial representations of Radharani. If we note the scriptures and scrutinize the position of those virtuous ladies, we'll find that the source of all their chastity and devotion is Srimati Radharani. She is the fountainhead of devotion. And so Bhaktivinoda says, "I bow down and take the dust of the holy feet of those who have as their only wealth the service of Radharani. I hanker after nothing else. " Whoever knows this and always travels on that path with a sincere heart is most fortunate. It is the ideal that makes one great, not any material possession. One who has the highest ideal is really wealthy. The highest ideal is the most valuable thing we may possess. And less valuable things must be eliminated if we are to concentrate our efforts and save ourselves from useless endeavor. Caitanya Mahaprabhu came to show us that highest ideal - the path of divine love. And we find divine love of Godhead in its highest intensity in His life and teachings of Srimad-Bhagavatam. The whole Srimad-Bhagavatam is meant to illustrate the ideal of divine love which reaches its highest expression in Srimati Radharani. The Srimad-Bhagavatam sings very gloriously about the paramour relationship of Radha and Krsna. The Vedas and other Puranas are not so expressive about such confidential pastimes, yet we find a hint of the glories of Radha and Krsna in Srimad-Bhagavatam. And the Goswamis have more fully expressed Radharani's devotion in their writings. In Rupa Goswami's Padyavali, we find Her saying, "My Lord, people say that I have a bad reputation because of My connection with You. I do not feel any trouble in My heart because of this. My concern is that I could not give Myself to You completely. The people in general say that I am illicitly connected with You, but what disturbs Me is that I could not really give Myself to You. I feel that I am not fit for Your service. This is only the trouble within My heart." And the ecstasy of divine love increases in separation. One day, when Krsna was playing with His cowherd boyfriends in the pasturing grounds of Vrndavana, Krsna suddenly felt extreme separation from Radharani. He sent His best friend Subala to Radharani, saying, "Go to My Radha and fetch Her. Without Her, I can't live. Suddenly I have so much desire for Her company that I can't stand it anymore. Somehow manage to bring Her." Subala said, "How is it possible to bring Her here in the jungle in broad daylight?" Krsna told him, "Somehow manage it!" Subala thought, "What should I do?" Subala was very intimately connected with the family of Radharani's husband. He went to the house of Radharani and told Her girlfriends, "Krsna can't tolerate separation from Radharani any longer. He is so eager to meet Her that He is going mad. Somehow you have to arrange for Them to meet." "How is it possible?" the gopis asked. Subala explained to them that Krsna was nearby in the jungle. They discussed between themselves what to do. Subala was a beautiful boy who resembled Radharani. So Subala took the dress of Radharani, and Radharani wore Subala's cowherd dress. When Radharani was discovered wearing the dress of Subala, She was challenged by Her family members: "Subala! What are you doing here?" In the dress of Subala, Radharani said, "A calf is missing and its mother is mooing. So I have come here looking for that calf." So a calf was given to Radharani, and She carried that small calf on her breast into the forest. In this way, Radharani was disguised as Subala, while Subala, who had taken the dress of Radharani, remained behind in Her room. Radharani had been given a hint of where Krsna was hiding near the forest's edge. She went to seek Him out. At last, when Radharani saw Krsna, She approached Him in the garb of Subala. Krsna was mad. He could not detect that Radharani had come, but mistook Her for Subala. He said, "Oh, Subala, you have come back without Radharani! Couldn't you bring Her?" Radharani began cutting jokes: "No," She said, "It was impossible for me to bring Her in the daytime." Krsna said, "Then what am I to do? I can't tolerate My life any longer." Radharani said, "If You say so, I can go to Candravali and bring her.No, no," Krsna said, "Curd cannot satisfy the thirst for milk. It is not possible!" Krsna was faint with disappointment. Then Radharani embraced Him, saying, "My Lord, can't You recognize Your maidservant? You failed to recognize Me!" Then Krsna was again full of joy. Although the pastimes of Radha and Govinda are mentioned in the scriptures, these are all very high things. They are not ordinarily to be expressed in words, but still sometimes we are forced to speak about them because the high ideal of divine love given by Srimad-Bhagavatam is the supreme goal of life. Of course, the scholarship of Sukadeva Goswami and Sri Gauranga Mahaprabhu have helped, to a certain extent, to establish the dignity of the proposal that love is above knowledge. It was admitted by everyone that Sukadeva held the highest attainment of the learned men of knowledge; he was unanimously admitted by the scholars to hold the highest position. Because of this, when Sukadeva Goswami came to inaugurate the principle that divine love is above everything else, the scholars had to take notice. Caitanya Mahaprabhu demonstrated to the scholars that His intelligence and scholarship excelled everyone else's. So when He came with the tidings of divine love, then it was easier for the ordinary men to accept it as the highest ideal and try for it. So Vasudeva Ghosh says, yadi gaura na ha'te tabe ki haita kemane dharitam de. If Mahaprabhu had not appeared in this Kali-yuga, then how could we tolerate living? How could we sustain our lives? What He has given - the very gist of life, the very taste, the charm of life - without that, we think it is impossible for anyone to live in this world. Such a thing has been invented, discovered by Gauranga. If He had not come, then how could we live? It is impossible to live devoid of such a holy and gracious thing as divine love. Without Caitanya Mahaprabhu, how could we know that Radharani stands supreme in the world of divine love? We have received all these things from Him, and now we think that life is worth living. Otherwise to live would be suicidal. And serving those who can serve Radharani is the way to approach Her vicinity. By serving the servants of the servants, we are assured of success in getting the grace of Krsna. If somehow one can be counted in the group of Srimati Radharani's servitors, one's future is assured. Within the group of Radharani's servitors, we aspire to be rupanugas, followers of Sri Rupa. And the followers of Sri Rupa will have great earnestness to look after the order of Sri Rupa, as he does towards Lalita. In this way, through Rupa Goswami, our devotional service is going to the highest plane. And our highest gain is only there. Not even our connection with Radharani or Lalitadevi is the highest goal of life, but our highest aspiration is to serve in the Rupanuga-sampradaya; that means that our highest attainment is in Sri Rupa's connection. Radha-dasyam has been said to be the highest attainment. Why? The quality and quantity of rasa that Radharani can draw from Krsna can never be found anywhere else. So if you are situated just behind Radharani, you'll be allowed to taste not only the quantity, but the highest quality of rasa. No other person can draw such high rasa from Krsna. The fullest, highest type of quality is drawn from Krsna: He gives Himself fully and wholly and deeply. So if you are in Sri Rupa's group, then you can have a taste of that sort of rasa. In Radharani's camp, when Krsna and Radha are enjoying very solitary pastimes in a secluded place, the grown-up sakhis can't venture to enter the room and assist Them. The young girls, the manjaris, are sent there. The leader of that young group can enter where both Radha and Govinda are very closely connected, when even the sakhis do not venture to go for fear of causing some interruption. But Rupa and the manjaris can enter there at that time due to their young age. That sort of rasa that cannot be had even through the sakhis can be had only through the manjaris. Bhaktivinoda Thakura prays to gain admission there. He has such a high quality of aspiration. He says rupanuga hoite sei doy. He runs to be enlisted in the group of Rupa, who can grant us that sort of prospect. And Prabhodananda Saraswati has described the prerequisite for understanding all these things: <CENTER>yatha yatha gaura padaravinde vindeta bhaktim krta punya-rasih tatha tathotsarpati hrdy akasmat radha padambhoja sudhambhurasih </CENTER>"As much as you surrender to the lotus feet of Sri Gauranga, you'll find yourself safely situated in the service of Radha-Govinda. Don't try to approach Radha-Govinda directly; if you do, there may be some difficulty. But the lotus feet of Sri Gauranga will take you there safely." In my Sanskrit poem dedicated to Bhaktivinoda Thakura, I have explained all these points: <CENTER>sri-gauranumatam svarupa-viditam rupagrajenadrtam rupadyaih parivesitam raghu-ganair-asvaditam sevitam jivadyair abhiraksitam suka-siva-brahmadi sammanitam sri-radha-pada-sevanamrtam aho tad datum iso bhavan </CENTER>"What was sanctioned by Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu by His descent was intimately known only to Sri Svarupa Damodara Goswami. It was adored by Sanatana Goswami and served by Rupa Goswami and his followers. Raghunatha Dasa Goswami tasted that wonderful thing fully and enhanced it with his own realization. And Jiva Goswami supported and protected it by quoting the scriptures from different places. The taste of that divine truth is aspired for by Brahma, Siva, and Uddhava, who respect it as the supreme goal of life. What is this wonderful truth? Sri radha-pada-sevana: that the highest nectar of our life is the service of Srimati Radharani. This is most wonderful. O Bhaktivinoda Thakura, you are our master. It is within your power to allow them to bestow their grace upon us. You are in a position to bestow the highest gift ever known to the world upon us all. It is at your disposal. O Bhaktivinoda Thakura, please be kind to us and grant us your mercy." So Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu, our most benevolent Lord, has come to search for His long lost servants and to give to them this highest ideal of divine love. Gaura Hari Bol!

A Question of Inheritance: Reply to Lokaguru das BY: MURALI KRSNA SWAMI Jul 11, USA (SUN) — Dear Lokaguru, you ask why do I “feel” that Bhagavat prabhu is not surrendered to the order of his spiritual master. The answer is very simple. Srila Gour Govinda Maharaja was once speaking fondly about Bhagavat prabhu and the pastime of Srila Prabhupada’s asking Bhagavat to live and serve and help manage ISKCON’s Krsna Balarama Mandir in Bhubaneswar. A disciple of Srila Gour Govinda Maharaja asked, “If Srila Prabhupada gave such a clear instruction to Bhagavat prabhu to dedicate his life in Bhubaneswar and to help you manage here, why is he (Bhagavat prabhu) not following Srila Prabhupada’s direct and specific instructions?” Srila Gour Govinda Maharaja laughed and affectionately replied, “Bhagavat is in maya right now. When he is done with all this nonsense, he will come back to Bhubaneswar and follow Srila Prabhupada’s instructions.” Here is a 1996 Vyasa puja offering to Srila Prabhupada, directly from the lips (pen) of Bhagavat prabhu himself: ..You (Srila Prabhupada) first requested me to come to Orissa with Gour-Govinda Maharaja in 1975. Our initial trip here was unsuccessful. Gour-Govinda Maharaja took sannyasa and returned here alone, and in 1976 I used to visit him when I was selling books to the schools and libraries in Orissa. In 1977, in spite of my unlimited protestations, you gave me the service of staying in Orissa permanently. I remember when you called me into the room (I was told later that you asked Satsvarupa Maharaja, "Get me the fat one"). When I entered the room you asked, "So, Bhagavat Maharaja, how are you?" "Fine, Srila Prabhupada." I replied. Then you told me, "So I would like you to stay here in Bhubaneshwar with Gour-Govinda Maharaja and help him develop this project; you will be co-director with him." I explained that I had just received a letter from Adi-kesava inviting me to go to New York to take up some management responsibilities. You frowned, showing your dissatisfaction. "There are so many devotees in New York already. You don't need to go to New York." I became nervous. "But Srila Prabhupada," I said, protesting, "I am not feeling well. I need to go back to the West to recover." The distress was evident in my voice, but, Srila Prabhupada, you would have none of it. "You can be very healthy right here. There is clean air and clean water, and you can pass stool out in the open and take bath. This is a very healthy place for you." My anxiety grew. "But," I further protested, "I do not get along with Gargamuni Maharaja, and he is the GBC here." You dismissed this as a minor problem. "I will remove Gargamuni Maharaja as GBC and you will work directly under me." Now you made me GBC without title. Grasping for some solution, I finally revealed my offense to you. I was convinced that upon hearing that my sadhana was lacking you would not allow me to take over an entire project. "I am not chanting my rounds, Srila Prabhupada," I confessed. But you were not to be outdone. Your determination was clear. You paused briefly and then said, "I have noted that you work very hard, and when you work hard for Krsna sometimes you cannot chant your rounds. That is all right as long as you work hard for Krsna." Everyone in the room sat in stunned silence, seeing your unflagging determination. I finally surrendered. "It is stated in sastra," I began, "that by following the orders of the spiritual master and pleasing him one will make spiritual advancement and please Krsna. So if you want me to stay here, Srila Prabhupada, then I will." My reward was instantaneous. Your face lit up with a smile a mile wide, and your eyes twinkled with great satisfaction. "Yes," you said, "that is correct. You have understood my books." That was in February of 1977. Later that same year, in the last days before you passed from this world, I confided to you when we were alone late one night that I was concerned about your leaving and about what I would do after you were gone. You simply said, "You should stay in Bhubaneshwar with Gour-Govinda Maharaja." You know why I had to leave Bhubaneshwar. Over the course of the years, bereft of my service, I wandered here and there trying to fit in and find myself and some service, both in and out of ISKCON. Sometimes I would think of my days in Bhubaneshwar, and whenever Gour-Govinda Maharaja came to the US on tour I would go to see him and he (Srila Gour Govinda Maharaja) would remind me that Srila Prabhupada had told me to stay in Orissa and help manage the affairs there. But I was caught in the web of Maya, doing business, making money, paying off loans. I was planning to come to Bhubaneshwar in August of this year when suddenly you came to me in a dream. You asked me what I was doing. I said I was living in Alachua (Florida), doing some work, going to the temple, organizing some programs. You said, "What service are you doing?" I replied, "Well, I plan to go back to Bhubaneshwar and help build the temple in Puri, open an Ayurvedic clinic, do prasadam distribution, and preach in the villages." The whole time you were smiling broadly and shaking your head in a gesture of approval. Then suddenly you stopped and looked at me very seriously and said, "Remember, you must go back to Bhubaneshwar. " I woke up bewildered. When is it that I should go? Today? Tomorrow? Next year? I was not sure. I decided to wait for a while to see if there would be some sign of what I should do. One week later my dear Godbrother Gour-Govinda Maharaja entered into samadhi, and then I understood that I had to go immediately! I left my high-paying job, withdrew my savings from the bank, and came back to the service that you authorized me to do in the first place. Returning after all these years to do this service, I feel your presence and association more deeply then I have in years. I thought I was doing service for you in Alachua, but now I understand that since I was fortunate enough to be given service by you directly then I must do that particular service or else I am not actually pleasing Your Divine Grace . Once in Vrndavana you were talking to a few devotees in your room, and while speaking these words you looked directly at me and said, "We have associated previously, we are associating now, and in the future." In spite of all my sinful offenses you have not forgotten me. You came in the middle of the night while I was sleeping in the lap of Maya, and you rescued me from a fate worse than death. You have not allowed me to forget my promise to you to stay in Bhubaneshwar as you ordered. This is my prabhu-datta-desa, the place where I have been ordered to perform my devotional service to Krsna by my Guru. It is said that the spiritual master lives eternally in his instructions and the disciple lives with him. I have never felt that more deeply in my life than I do right now. As it is also stated, I shall never be able to repay my debt to you. All glories to you, my Divine Master Paramahamsa Paramapujya 108 Sri Srimad A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Srila Prabhupada on this, the hundredth anniversary of your birth! May your glories be spread throughout the three worlds! The devotees in Bhubaneshwar, India (written by Bhagavat dasa) I will leave you with Srila Prabhupada’s SB 3.22.7 Translation and Purport and lastly with a short excerpt from a lecture given by Srila Gour Govinda Maharaja on the topic of surrender in order to be able to hear. SB 3.22.7 : I have fortunately been instructed by you, and thus great favor has been bestowed upon me. I thank God that I have listened with open ears to your pure words. PURPORT Srila Rupa Gosvami has given directions, in his Bhakti-rasamrta-sindhu, on how to accept a bona fide spiritual master and how to deal with him. First, the desiring candidate must find a bona fide spiritual master, and then he must very eagerly receive instructions from him and execute them. This is reciprocal service. Manu said that since he was advised and instructed by Kardama Muni, he was very much favored. He considered himself lucky to receive the message by aural reception. It is especially mentioned here that one should be very inquisitive to hear with open ears from the authorized source of the bona fide spiritual master. </B>How is one to receive? One should receive the transcendental message by aural reception. The word karna-randhraih means "through the holes of the ears." The favor of the spiritual master is not received through any other part of the body but the ears. This does not mean, however, that the spiritual master gives a particular type of mantra through the ears in exchange for some dollars and if the man meditates on that he achieves perfection and becomes God within six months. Such reception through the ears is bogus. The real fact is that a bona fide spiritual master knows the nature of a particular man and what sort of duties he can perform in Krsna consciousness, and he instructs him in that way. He instructs him through the ear, not privately, but publicly. "You are fit for such and such work in Krsna consciousness. You can act in this way." One person is advised to act in Krsna consciousness by working in the Deities' room, another is advised to act in Krsna consciousness by performing editorial work, another is advised to do preaching work, and another is advised to carry out Krsna consciousness in the cooking department. There are different departments of activity in Krsna consciousness, and a spiritual master, knowing the particular ability of a particular man, trains him in such a way that by his tendency to act he becomes perfect. Bhagavad-gita makes it clear that one can attain the highest perfection of spiritual life simply by offering service according to his ability, just as Arjuna served Krsna by his ability in the military art. Arjuna offered his service fully as a military man, and he became perfect. Similarly, an artist can attain perfection simply by performing artistic work under the direction of the spiritual master. If one is a literary man, he can write articles and poetry for the service of the Lord under the direction of the spiritual master. One has to receive the message of the spiritual master regarding how to act in one's capacity, for the spiritual master is expert in giving such instructions. This combination, the instruction of the spiritual master and the faithful execution of the instruction by the disciple, makes the entire process perfect. Srila Visvanatha Cakravarti Thakura describes in his explanation of the verse in Bhagavad-gita, vyavasayatmika buddhih, that one who wants to be certain to achieve spiritual success must take the instruction from the spiritual master as to what his particular function is. He should faithfully try to execute that particular instruction and should consider that his life and soul. The faithful execution of the instruction which he receives from the spiritual master is the only duty of a disciple, and that will bring him all perfection. One should be very careful to receive the message from the spiritual master through the ears and execute it faithfully. That will make one's life successful. Srila Gour Govinda Mahraja Lecture: The Qualification to Hear “So, we say this thing. The first item is sravanam¾hearing, and one who hears is a disciple. But unless you surrender, or dedicate yourself, you cannot hear. This katha will never enter into your ear. In whose ear will this hari-katha enter? It will enter into the ear of one who is completely surrendered. I quoted Prahlada Maharaja’s statement. First one must dedicate himself and surrender, then he develops this navada bhakti. Prahlada Maharaja says, “In my opinion he has studied the best. He is the most learned person, for he has acquired complete knowledge.” So, unless one surrenders he cannot hear. So, the first item is hearing and one who hears this bhagavata-katha, or krsna-katha, must first surrender. He must put complete faith in the words of sadhu, sastra, guru. Then he will surrender and then this katha will enter into his ears. Otherwise, if you don’t surrender, because you have no faith, it will never enter your ear. So, your heart will never be purified. ...If you make your own endeavor you cannot have it, because there is no question of service at all. He is not a servitor at all. Although he is a sisya, he is a pretender only¾a duplicitous person. There is only one purpose, that is, “How can I completely dedicate myself at the lotus feet of the Supremely Full¾purŠa-vastu¾that is Krsna.” No other purpose is there. He is a real disciple, and he inherits the right to hear. It is a question of inheritance. Only he can hear. Otherwise, there is no question of hearing, no right of hearing. This is a very deep thing. So, understand the purport of what I say. He is a real disciple, so, he inherits that right from guru. One who understands this thing very well, in tattva, by hearing from such a guru and by the mercy of that guru, is a real disciple. He is a real servant.” Strictly following the instructions of the bona fide Guru, allows one to inherit the right to be able to hear. It is a question of inheritance. This was the point. As Prabhupada wrote above; “The faithful execution of the instruction which he receives from the spiritual master is the only duty of a disciple, and that will bring him all perfection. One should be very careful to receive the message from the spiritual master through the ears and execute it faithfully. That will make one's life successful.”</U> You see Lokaguru instead of following the clear instruction of Srila Prabhupada, Bhagavat prabhu and many others have chosen to follow a different instruction given by, I suppose, their siksa guru Narayana Maharaja. I live in Bhubaneswar and can safely say that there have been no sightings of Bhagavat prabhu (BFO’s). We sincerely hope he comes back to fulfill his debt and promise to Srila Prabhupada and to Srila Gour Govinda Maharaja. That is how to get Krsna prema. SP Gayatri Mantra Initiation -- Boston, May 9, 1968: “So if anyone who has got implicit faith in the spiritual master and also in God, to him all the imports of Vedic literature, becomes revealed. That is spiritual way of understanding. So, if one has a bona fide spiritual master to guide him, then his life is guaranteed to be perfect. This is the way. Yasya prasadad bhagavat-prasado: ** "By the mercy of the spiritual master, one gets immediately the mercy of the Lord." Yasya prasadad bhagavat-prasado yasyaprasadan na gatih kuto 'pi: ** "And if one dissatisfies the spiritual master, then he has no other way of perfection." So we have to follow. That's all. It doesn't matter that I'm not qualified. But if I follow the instruction of the superior, then automatically I become qualified.” Prabhupada repeatedly states this as being the secret of success in spiritual life. It is a question of receiving mercy, the mercy to hear Hari katha and of our understanding of how to act in such a way as to deserve that mercy given by the spiritual master. If one has an apparent understanding, it simply means he has not heard properly from a tattva vit Guru; one who knows things in tattva from an absolute perspective. You see Lokaguru, Tattva; truth is not established based on speculation, opinions, votes or what the common people say, it is revealed through the heart and lotus mouth of a bona fide Sri Guru. Krsna manifests as Sri Guru and Sastra and the Supersoul. This is how Tattva is established. CC M. 20.123: ‘sastra-guru-atma'-rupe apanare janana ‘krsna mora prabhu, trata' -- jivera haya jnana TRANSLATION "The forgetful conditioned soul is educated by Krsna through the Vedic literatures, the realized spiritual master and the Supersoul. Through these, he can understand the Absolute Truth the Supreme Personality of Godhead as He is, and he can understand that Lord Krsna is his eternal master and deliverer from the clutches of maya. In this way one can acquire real knowledge of his conditioned life and can come to understand how to attain liberation. One who is sincere and serious for getting Krsna, Krsna as Sri Guru and Sastra reveals himself by his own sweet will to the deserving spirit soul who truly wants Krsna. Only Krsna can give Krsna. He then manifests a body and reveals Himself as Guru. It is said that Guru is the external manifestation of the Supersoul. nayam atma pravacanena labhyo na medhaya na bahuna srutena yam evaisa vrnute tena labhyas tasyaisa atma vivrnute tanum svam (Katha Upanisad 1.2.23) The Supreme Lord can never be known by any amount of argument, reasoning, intelligence, or scholarship. The finite can never know the Infinite. By His own sweet will, however, the Infinite Supreme Person may assume a body and reveal Himself to the finite living entity. Those who wish to know the Infinite must therefore submit to Him only through complete loving surrender and service. (Katha Upanisad 1.2.23) If one is faithful to Krsna, Srila Prabhupada, His instructions and His Institution, even with all the tests and difficulties, Sri Guru manifesting as Srila Prabhuapa will reveal how He is always manifested within His ISKCON Society. If you get His mercy then you can see Him. Those who have unflinching faith in Krsna and Srila Prabhupada will always be able to recognize and not anyone else; regardless of what they may proclaim. Thank you very much. All the best, Murali Krsna Swami

Sudhir Goswami gives great classes and is an equally good writer when his focuses on the advices of his guardians. But, I must say I am appalled by the visciousness of his attacks on NM (also T. Swami) and his followers. We become angry when we try to control the environment and the outcome of events. The SCSM needs to let the NM issue go and focus on the positive message of Srila Sridhar Maharaja and Srila Govinda Maharaja. There is no reason to make an unholy alliance with ISKCON. Their GBC men blaspheme Srila Govinda Maharaja behind his and the SCSM devotees backs. I have first hand experience of this. People are going to do what they're going to do, get over it, and get out the positive message of the happy waves emanating from Navadvipa.

In another discussion on the Sampradaya Sun about child abuse and the gurukulas, Vinode Vani devi dasi says, "I find the sarcastic, condescending tone and language of Praghosa prabhu's (ACBSP) letters to be disturbing." I personally find the same mood in his, "Response to Loka Guru". It seems like a tactic to try to destroy the faith of those who do not accept your or your camps interpretation of Krsna Consciousness. Loka Guru Prabhu is just promoting the ideas of his gurus and if it is contradicting other viewpoints, so be it. On the other hand Praghosa Prabhu seems to be in the mood of smashing those who have other viewpoints and interpretations. This might be the tactic that Srila Prabhupada took with mayavadi's but never with other devotees of Krsna in the same line. Particularly disturbing is the tact of making everyone who does not agree with his ideas as somehow unchaste to Srila Prabhupada. Maybe we can't act like a madhyama adhikari but at least we can give up the kannistha mood and begin to think like one.

Reply to HH Murali Krsna Svami BY: LOKAGURU DAS Jul 9, USA (SUN) — Dear Murali Krsna Svami, Dandavats. All glories to His Divine Grace Srila Prabhupada. Please accept my humble obeisances. I have read your reply to Bhagavat prabhu's article. Why do you feel that Bhagavat prabhu is not surrendered to the order of his guru. HDG Srila Prabhupada explains the necessity of hearing from a pure devotee. CC Antya 5.131: ”If you want to understand Srimad Bhagavatam, he said, you must approach a self-realized Vaisnava and hear from him. You can do this when you have completely taken shelter of the lotus feet of Sri Chaitanya Mahaprabhu.” The present tense along with the word “must” is used exclusively, meaning that this process should be done now(in the present) and there is no choice, it has to be done. Also, SB 4.20.24-25: (24) “My dear Lord, I therefore do not wish to have the benediction of merging into Your existence, a benediction in which there is no existence of the nectarian beverage of Your lotus feet. I want the benediction of at least one million ears, for thus I may be able to hear about the glories of Your lotus feet from the mouths of Your pure devotees”;(25) “My dear Lord, You are glorified by the selected verses uttered by great personalities. Such glorification of Your lotus feet is just like saffron particles. When the transcendental vibration from the mouths of great devotees carries the aroma of the saffron dust of Your lotus feet, the forgetful living entity gradually remembers his eternal relationship with You. Devotees thus gradually come to right conclusion about the value of life. My dear Lord, I therefore do not need any other benediction but the opportunity to hear from the mouth of Your pure devotee.”</B> In SB 4.20.24-25 (Translations and purports), Srila Prabhupada states 15 times that we must hear from the mouth of a pure devotee and each sentence is in the present tense(do it now). These are eternal instructions and also very specific instructions to each of us. HDG Gaura Govinda Maharaja also explains in A Living Sadhu: (Chapter Six of Pariprasna: The Process of Inquiry: ..” Devotee: Srila Prabhupada always emphasized that he was eternally present in his books, instructions, tapes, and letters. So when you say we should take association of a sadhu can we do that through Srila Prabhupada's books? Present in His Books Gour Govinda Swami: If Prabhupada says he is there, then you try to see him, associate with him and listen from him. Do you see Prabhupada? Is he speaking to you? Devotee: Through his books. Gour Govinda Swami: Through his books, yes. All sadhus speak through their books. Jiva Goswami, Rupa Goswami, Sanatana Goswami, Bhaktivinoda Thakur, Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati and Srila Prabhupada all say that they speak through books. This is not a new thing. This is our Vaisnava procedure. But you should see him. Can you see Bhaktivinoda Thakur? Can you see Jiva Goswami ? You may say, "Oh I have read their books, I have their association." That won't help you. You cannot understand what they have said merely by reading their books. Your consciousness is very low, so you cannot understand their words. They are very, very merciful, but you should follow the proper path. If you are intelligent you will understand how they are still here, not only in the form of their books but also they are here. You should see them. Why are you thinking so foolishly? So many books were already there, so why has Srila Prabhupada said this? You are thinking, "We need only to read books. There is no need of association with a sadhu who is physically present. Is there any sadhu? No, there is no sadhu at all." Seeing is Believing Your motto is, "Seeing is believing." You cannot see, so you cannot believe. Because you are a conditioned soul your vision is defective. You cannot see a sadhu. Krsna is there, can you see him? No, you cannot, because you are not endowed with proper vision. First develop the proper vision and then you can see Krsna. Then you can see how a sadhu is there. It is not a fact that sadhus are not present. How is everything going on? How does the sun rise, the wind blow, and Indra give rain? All these things are going on. No sadhu? No Krsna? It's nonsense, foolishness. We are so proud and puffed up. We are identifying our self as the body, mind and false ego. We think we are very great. So we say "Oh there is no sadhu." We are in the category of identification with the body and mind. We have not come to the beginning of the stage of purity. No! Devotee : So we have to associate with a living sadhu? Gour Govinda Swami : Definitely. There is always one there. But he is not a cheap person. Such a person is very rare. If you can get his mercy then you can see him. Otherwise, by your own effort and perception you cannot see him. No, no, no. You always think that you are drasta, the seer, and that the sadhu is drsta, the one to be seen. Everyone is like this. They think they are the seers. But it is just the reverse. You are to are to be seen and they are the seer! Think this over very deeply. I think you cannot completely understand what I say. We always think that we are the seer and that they are to be seen, but this is not a fact. It is just the reverse. They are the seers and we are to be seen. Merciful Glance How are we seen by the sadhu, by our service? Gour Govinda Swami: Yes. The sadhu is the seer. If he showers his mercy upon you, he sees you. If you receive that merciful glance then you are very fortunate. However, you are in the category of bodily consciousness. How can you have it? Guru is the manifestation of the Supersoul, caitya-guru in the heart. He manifests a body and appears. He knows your heart. Devotee: I don't quite understand. Gour Govinda Swami: Yes, try to understand. As I told you, just hear patiently. A new bhakta cannot understand it because it is a topic of the highest class. You are in pre-primary class, how can you understand? You are not even in the primary class. How can you understand this topic of the highest class? Just accept the bona fide authorities. That will help you. The teacher says, "Two plus two is four." The primary school student accepts it. If the teacher asks the child, "What is two plus two?" The child will reply, "Two plus two is four.Why is two plus two four? My teacher says." He will answer like this. That means he has accepted authority. This is the only principle in the beginning. How is two plus two four? Why not three or five? That will be explained in a higher mathematics class, not in the beginning. You have to have patience and get a promotion. My guru maharaj says in his purport that the beginning is purity of consciousness. First come to this beginning stage, then gradually other things will come up. You are not in the beginning stage so how will the higher topics come up? This is a very, very subtle and very deep philosophy. Putting full faith in the sadhu you need only submissively hear --- sravanam, sravanam, sravanam. In that way you can get the mercy of that sadhu. That will help you. Only one thing is required, nothing else --- sravanam, sravanam, sravanam. Just hear. Serve that sadhu, please him, hear submissively, surrender yourself at his lotus feet and submissively ask questions. Out of mercy the sadhu will impart tattva-jnana to you. This is the only process. Unless you get association with a living sadhu, what can you do? Will you put some question to Srila Prabhupada and Srila Prabhupada will answer you? This process is a living thing, it is always there, it is always current. It is not that inquiry was done a certain way in the past and now things are done differently. No! It is an eternal process, pranipatena pariprasnena sevaya."... And from Page 113-114: Blind Leading the Blind ...“Devotee: What if a devotee is initiated but he has not reached the stage of nista. Should he accept guidance from a superior Vaisnava? Gour Govinda Swami: Yes, they are teachers-siksa-guru. Devotee: If one thinks I have my guru already, like Prabhupada, and I don't need any guidance? Gour Govinda Swami: No, the moment this enters you are finished! You are welcoming your fall down. If one is not free from anarthas, how can he lead? He is a blind man. If a blind man is leading another blind man all will fall into a ditch, finished! The leader falls then the followers fall. This is going on.”... The real issue here is that Bhagavat prabhu has quoted some sastra to make a point. You, Maharaj, have also quoted from the same sastras to counteract his points and to make your own different points. I am quoting from the same sastras to counteract your points. Which of us is correct? Are there apparent differences within the body of Srila Prabhupada's books and classes? Are there apparent differences within Srila Gaura Govinda's books and classes? There must be apparent differences otherwise why would so many serious devotees arrive at differing conclusions when studying the same sastras and lectures. This is why we place our selves under the guidance of living pure devotees(parampara). The uttama devotee compassionately reconciles or harmonizes any apparent contradictions and in the process elevates our unworthy selves through His divine instructions. Bhagavat prabhu has not left ISKON. He is following the orders that Srila Prabhupada has given to him and is giving him. Bhagavat prabhu is placing himself under the guidance of a pure devotee so that he can receive the mercy of His Divine Grace and become fully realized. He is following in the footsteps of Srila Prabhupada who, when asked by Guru das, while they were standing in Srila Prabhupada's rooms in Sri Sri Radha Damorhara Mandhira, why He (SP) didn't come to the west earlier than 1965, Srila Prabhupada replied that ”I was preparing to preach” (told to me by Guru das in Sri Sri Radha Damodhara Mandhira in March, 1977). Bhagavat prabhu has been very strictly following for several years, not wasting even a moment (his friends know this). Fourteen months ago he severed his marital ties, giving his wife everything. As for Srila Prabhupada being happy or unhappy with Bhagavat prabhu: The only ones who know this are Bhagavat prabhu, Srila Prabhupada, and any pure devotee that Bhagavat prabhu is taking shelter of . Finally, if you think that Srila Narayana Maharaja is just a sadhu who only processes some jnana, you are very mistaken. Srila Narayana Maharaja is an uttama bhakta. He is a transparent via medium of Sri Chaitanya Mahaprabhu and Sri Sri Radha and Krsna. This type of knowledge will always remain hidden from us until we learn to continuously beg our Guru Maharaja to be merciful to our worthless selves. I am also begging, please don't criticize any devotee, what to speak of a pure devotee who has dedicated His life to propagating the holy names. Once upon a time I listened to several GBC and sanyasis and refused to personally hear from Srila Gaura Govinda. In His absence I have tried unsuccessfully to beg His forgiveness. Please, don't make my mistake. I am fully unqualified in all respects. If I have made any errors or made some offense to you please try to excuse and forgive me. Sincerely, Your servant, Lokaguru das Response to Lokaguru Das BY: PRAGHOSA DASA (ACBSP) Jul 10, NEW YORK CITY (SUN) — Just a short note to Lokaguru and his supporters. I wish to extend to you my condolences prabhu. Quite obviously - you imagine that Srila Prabhupada cannot be understood by the simple honest act of hearing from him in each and every page of his books. While I find articles like yours - offered by various men who have been "touched" by the likes of HH Narayana Swami and now much to my surprise, HH Gaur Govinda Swami, unpleasant - I also find them essentially meaningless. Your protest is like a man who derives no pleasure or lasting satisfaction from drinking a cool dhab and then claims that not only does he not derive any benefit there - no one else can either. Sorry prabhu...most men and women who thirst for Krsna Consciousness as it is delivered by His Divine Grace Srila Prabhupada through his Bhaktivedanta Purports experience life as a "Thrill at every moment" when we come together and hear from Srila Prabhupada. We understand Krsna Consciousness very nicely as a consequence of Srila Prabhupada's early morning sessions with his trusty Dictaphone! Your protest is merely an admission that you want something more than the company of those who adore Lord Krsna as He was delivered by Srimati Radharani's dearmost emissary Srila Prabhupada. You are free to seek out any such association. However, claiming that you have done so - in order that you might now understand Srila Prabhupada because his physical absence has rendered him and Krsna Consciousness - out of reach to not only yourself - but everyone - is bogus. You may claim this for yourself - but to claim it ABSOLUTELY for everyone - is simply ignorant and arrogant. And quoting HH Gaur Govinda Swami as having having affirmed this - does not CONFIRM it. It only casts his understanding as deficient. We don't claim that you cannot find merit in your chosen "Messiahs" but merely because you cannot find Srila Prabhupada and Lord Krsna - precisely where he left himself and the Lord - FULLY AVAILABLE does not mean no one else can. Besides - nonsense statements by HH Gaur Govinda Swami - that either imply or directly support your inability - only lead to the inevitable question: "Since Gaur Govinda Goswami directly stated that one cannot approach the Lord through Srila Prabhupada's books - who was HIS living guru?" Surely he was not telling you that "OTHERS need this - but I do not"? Any man who would do this cannot verify his claim in any way. Perhaps some men will inhale this nonsense - but I am certain that most will not..simply because just as when you have eaten your fill - you do not require someone to confirm this - similarly when you are fully content with Srila Prabhupada - the protests of men like yourself that "Srila Prabhupada cannot be understood - unless he is explained by the likes of a Gaur Govinda Goswami or Narayana Swami" will fall on the ears of men who are already full with the nectar of His Divine GRace Srila Prabhupada and will have no effect at all. Loving, chaste, and satisfied devotees of Srila Prabhupada would sooner loose Sonny Liston in a bowl of rice - than they would their ability to find Srila Prabhupada, the Acharyas and the Lord Himself - in ALL His manifestations - in the Divine Words and Servants of Srila Prabhupada! We should all pray that this understanding of Srila Prabhupada saturates this world and all its inhabitants!!! All Glories to His Divine Grace Srila Prabhupada. With respect Praghosa Das ACBSP (NYC)

Let's just say that he/she doesn't have a recent connection, otherwise he would know that Srila Bhakti Sundar Govinda Maharaja is actually behind Bhakti Sudhir Goswami's most recent article on Narayana Maharaja. Despite his correct assessment Muralidhar's approach is quite harsh on this devotee, but he won't read this post because he (Muralidhar) left the kitchen because the fire is too hot.

Yes and the real followers of Srila Naryana Maharaja totally agree with this point. Why, because those who are actually in raga-marga think of themselves as fallen souls in their humility. And neophytes are actually far, far from raga-marga. So why is Srila Bhakti Sundar Govinda Maharaja telling that their is so much sahajiya bhajana going on in other Gaudiya Maths? In his Acarya-abhimana he is trying to keep the neophytes in his charge safe from confusion by going outside the gates. This is the same thing that Srila Bhaktivedanta Swami Maharaja did with his ISKCON. But after 20, 30 or 40 years to we still have to maintain the standard of toddlers?

Me thinks the Babajis are mudding the waters here. This is an internal Gaudiya Math dispute. Srila Narayana Maharaja is also giving extreme honor to Srila Sridhar Maharaja. Pravacana, preaching is for time, place and circumstance. Many devotees are taking Srila Sridhar Maharaja's early 80's preaching to be universal, but who was he preaching to, and what were the conditions? Once Srila Sridhar Maharaja said about Jesus, "Is he static or dynamic, what do you think?" So do you think that Srila Sridhar Maharaja is static or dynamic? Do you think that he really gave his entire realization at that time? And how much of it can we really catch? Your statements are knee jerk Babaji anti Saraswat sentiments. The point that we are making is that Srila Sridhar Maharaja is being taken out of context by those who have not caught the correct mood. If I tell someone driving down the road to slow down and use caution, I am not arguing against forward progress by telling that they should use their brakes. If we argue brakes only then we are dried up sticks in the mud and that is the problem. Srila Sridhar Maharaja was not only as hard as a thunder bolt but mostly he was very soft, like a rose. So your Eunich comment makes a good point, but you need to be more open and broad minded in your approach.

Srila Sridhar Maharaja was not referring to necessarily a "academic meaning of a term", by the use of the word, "denotation". Look at Bhagavad Gita in the tenth chapter, tesam satatam yuktanam... Srila Sridhar Maharaja considered Srila Bhaktivedanta Swami's translation denotative and his translation connotative and they are quite different. I have to get off now, but take the time to compare these translations and you will get an idea of what he meant by denotative and connotative.

Srila Sridhar Maharaja said that, "as denotation increases connotation decreases and as connotation increases denotation increases". I've noticed that Srila Sridhar Maharaja often gives the secondary or connotative meaning of a shloka. This certainly doesn't mean that he's in error but rather the connotation of the shloka is either deeper and more congruous with the higher siddhanta than the denotative meaning. Generally Srila Sridhar Maharaja seems to using a connotative meaning of "pujala raga patha" verse as a warning to keep the neophytes from jumping artificially to a higher position. Srila Sridhar Maharaja assumes that the hearer of the connotative meaning is experienced enough to know the literal or denotative meaning. It seems to me that this is where all the confusion comes about. The "pujala raga patha" verse has different meanings on different levels so how could Jagat be entirely wrong despite his renegade pedigree? But despite Sripad B. Sudhir Goswami's proper Saraswat credentials he and his fellow travelers are convinced that the secondary meaning of "pujala raga patha" is the only way, the truth and the light. In some ways the present day Sri Caitanya Saraswat Math is similiar to present day ISKCON in that both of their prominent acaraya's has entered their nitya lila. It seems to me that B. Sudhir Goswami and his like minded compatriots are bitter that the other Gaudiya Maths and ISKCON do not accept Sridhar Maharaja as the most prominent disciple of Srila Saraswati Thakur. They may also view Srila Sridhar Maharaja as the only real Rupanuga of his generation but by expousing these disassembling concepts and by making aparadhic propaganda campaigns against others they are merely ushering in a dark age and causing Srila Sridhar Maharaja's good name to be draged through the mud.

Wasn't Srila Sridhar Maharaja establishing the same style of murtis, Mahaprabhu and Radha Govinda, as his guru maharaja, Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Saraswati Thakur? Wasn't Saraswati Thakur's idea to show that Mahaprabhu is Radha and Govinda combined? And didn't all his disciples follow this formula except for Srila Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada? Srila Bhaktivedanta Prabhupada was certainly establishing his mission under extremely different conditions. Caitanya Saraswat Rupanuga guru varga ki jaya.

Then since you have already read Sri Guru and His Grace try to enter into the spirit of it, at least in your posts. As far as already having read a transcendental book, remember, "repetition of sensation does not equal experience"(Sridhar Maharaja).

Modern languages are generally inexact. But the general principle given by Srila Sridhar Maharaja is that as denotation increases connotation decreases and as connotation increases denotation decreases. Every statement must be viewed within context. If one is lacking in experience in a particuliar subject they may have to be given more background information. To find the proper context of Srila Narayana Maharaja's statements to the "hippy" read "Sri Guru and His Grace" by Srila Bhakti Raksak Sridhar-deva Goswami Maharaja.