nimbo pani

Once again, "Theist, the mind-reader." Theist, I can assure you that you are mistaken, and I find it offensive that you continue to propagate this misconception whenever Puru prabhu posts. He studies the works of many different Acaryas and Sadhus. He enjoys discussing siddhanta. Please allow him to do this without your constant barking that he has some agenda to promote or that he's only here to "tout" (as you say) one of his siksa gurus.

Mark wrote: Mark then subsequently engaged in dialogue with Puru prabhu utilizing a not-so-witty, (for someone with a self-described "sharp intellect"), dreadful collage of sarcasm, insults, projection, hubris, falsehoods, false accusations, and other not-so-humble, not-so-courteous, not-so-respectful words and phrases: And speaking of strawmen and putting words into someone's mouth, Mark wrote:

Originally Posted by SishirSaha (quoted from Urmila dasi's article on Chakra): Reply by Syamarani dasi: For the full reply by Syamarani dasi to this and other attempts to discredit Srila Maharaja: http://www.vnn.org/editorials/ET0206/ET08-7376.html

...Grief. No, it will be about your imperfect conception of Supersoul. Besides, I rarely read your posts anymore. However, if you're going to quote me and then misrepresent me, then most likely I will read and respond. Please... do not be delusional and think for one moment that I wish for you to "entertain" me. My goodness. And oh, btw, you are free to not read my posts anymore as well. I would very much prefer this. I am not here to engage in irrational conversation with judgemental people. Thus spaketh Theist. Which point? Oh never mind, don't bother. Beggar made a reply to you by saying "From another angle of vision the guru's body is purely spiritual", in reply to your stating that the Guru is not his body. You have yet to respond, let alone acknowledge him. Again, which point? I never addressed your point one way or another. I was making a point about the hearing vs reading controversy and how I would rather receive the mantra in writing than from a rascal "devotee" who was having an affair with my wife. If you hadn't been so hasty to pass judgement, perhaps we could have explored your issue further. But I see by your proclamation above that this is not to be explored further, that you have already realized the truth.

So you fancy yourself as a mindreader now. I fully understand exactly where you are coming from, whether you believe it or not. After reading your posts for several years, they have become all too repetitive and oh so predictable. Maybe instead of accusing me of being too simple to understand, why not examine your own heart (with the help of Supersoul) and try to determine if perhaps there is still something yet for you to learn. You come across as if you have a monopoly on the truth, on nearly every issue, and then you are condescending with those who disagree. You know, it is quite possible that we could have explored this topic further, but if you are going to pass judgement and come across as a know-it-all, then obviously this isn't conducive for further discussion. BTW, I was replying more to Kulapavana prabhu's post than I was to yours. Had you been just a little patient, I would probably have addressed your post directly.

Being that there are a lot of devotees who believe hearing and reading to be exactly the same, despite evidence to the contrary from Bhagavata prabhu, then why not simply have the mantra written on a piece of paper and hand a photocopy to the initiate for him to read. Engage the photocopier (yukta vairagya.) I would rather receive the mantra in that method rather than hear it from the mouth of a rascal TP who was engaging in illicit sex with my wife. Kinko's ki jaya!

I've made carrot pakoras once or twice (at home) and they were pretty yukky, 3rd class, compared to other veggies such as cauliflower and broccoli. I can see why that head pujari would consider it horse food. I had a similar experience once where my Temple President chastised me for preparing an offering with a fairly common garden vegetable (can't remember what it was, turnips maybe) and said it was "horse food." I actually can't think of too many uses for carrots. I sometimes use them in split pea soup or kichari, although even then, it's 2nd class at best. I was mainly thinking along the lines of using them for juicing, as a health tonic. Anyway, that is nice to hear that our Acaryas have granted this concession for westerners. In the Dhama, naturally one would need to be more strict, especially on Ekadasis and during the months of Caturmasya. Thankyou again for your pakka feedback on these matters.

Dandavats Puru prabhu, Thankyou for all the valuable info. Regarding carrots, I asked a very close sisya of Srila Narayana Maharaja about this, and he told me that this referred to carrots grown in India, that those carrots are reddish and different from the orange-colored carrots grown in the West. He told me that it was okay to eat western grown carrots. Something similar to what Stonehearted prabhu was saying about cows; that the benefits attributed to milk in ayurveda actually apply to the milk of zebus, not the European cows such as Holsteins, Guernseys, Brown Swiss, etc. I was just wondering about your take on this.

Hare Krsna gHari, Vaishnava dasa and Manjari dasi were from his first marriage. I knew them briefly at one time and if I had to guess their ages, it would be 34 and 32 respectively, give or take a year. I know very little about his post-Iskcon marriage or any kids since that time. I'm sure I could find out more if you like, although it might take a week or two. Yes, Bhagavan prabhu was a very special devotee during Srila Prabhupada's manifest pastimes. He had a true pioneer spirit, and was an excellent preacher. The first BTG I ever received, a few months before I joined the Movement, contained a photo on the inside cover with Srila Prabhupada walking down a path, and Bhagavan prabhu and a few other devotees behind him, walking single file. I recall that this photo really struck me at the time.

Hello gHari, This is from a personal email I received from a devotee who lives in the Badger, California area, regarding Bhagavan prabhu: ***Every single year he comes for at least 2 or 3 days of the festival and each year gurudev is very kind and affectionate to him. He says that because he served Prabhupada so much therefore, "I like him." Last year he said that and everyone laughed. Gurudev always offers him a chair and calls him up to sit close. Last year bhagavan would not accept the chair but at least he is very respectful to gurudev. All of his kids and his ex-wife and her current husband are all followers of gurudev-the kids are diksha and the others are of course siksa.*** nb: I believe that his 2 kids, Manjari dasi and Vaishnava dasa are in their early 30's now.

Dear Trying, I believe I understand the dilemma which you are trying to express: that due to your regular and fairly extensive association with your Gurudeva, and even becoming somewhat "familiar", you wish to clarify the proper etiquette. (Please correct me if I'm wrong.) Your situation is somewhat unique, as most of us probably have not had that kind of close, daily interraction with our Spiritual Masters. The tendency to become familiar is probably fairly common amongst those who are or who have been in your situation. How to maintain a mood of awe and reverence? Most likely it is easier said than done. However, praying, (as you mentioned), and especially reciting prayers from previous Acharyas (recommended in NOD) such as Srila Bhaktivinode Thakur and Srila Narottama das Thakur will surely help. There are some sweet songs devoted towards internalizing one's faith in Sri Guru, as well as towards Sri Nityananda Prabhu. As you know, the Guru is a manifestation of Nityananda Prabhu's causeless mercy and compassion. Remembering your devotional mood of awe and reverence for Lord Nityananda, you can transfer that same mood towards your Gurudeva and overcome these feelings of familiarity. Sometimes the tendency may exist whereby we overcompensate our feelings of familiarity by overglorifying (externally) our Gurudeva while in his physical presence. However, he knows our hearts, which is why it is more important to internalize our moods. Then, when we offer obeisances and say "Jai Srila Gurudeva", it will be genuine, and the Guru will surely sense what is heartfelt and what is not.

It sounds as though you have a fairly close relationship with your Guru, being that you are able to speak with him regularly. I would think that you could offer your obeisances to him when you see him, and when you arise, with hands folded, say something simple like "Jai Srila Gurudeva". And perhaps upon leaving his darshan, say something like "You are an ocean of mercy." I wouldn't think that it would be necessary to overdo it, as his time is most likely limited and he would probably rather preach and interract with other devotees as well. If he visits your home, or on special days like Guru Puja, then those are times when you may glorify your Guru further, expressing your gratitude and appreciation, along with offering flowers at his lotus feet, and perhaps bathing his lotus feet. I doubt that he's expecting personal lavish praise on a daily basis. When one chants the mangal arotika prayers, as well as Gayatri mantra and other prayers, this is also a form of offering respects to one's Gurudeva. As long as he knows that you respect him, he's probably far more interested that you perform your daily sadhana and service to the best of your abilities. Hope this helps somewhat.

One could easily conclude that you are the one engaging in "propaganda." In fact, that is exactly the way I take it. I have read Srila Sridhara Maharaja's books several times, and his mood was that of "harmonizing." You obviously do not share this mood. Judging by your disrespectful, (if not down-right inimical) tone, I seriously doubt that any answer (or refutation) would meet your approval.

It is one thing to debate controversial issues. Yet another to engage in smear tactics to win your argument. That was totally unecessary. How does this in any way, shape, or form encourage lively, healthy discussion amongst Vaishnavas? Paraphrasing an (alleged) account from an anonymous source, (3rd hand? 5th hand?), taken out of context (assuming there WAS any context), and supposedly "verified" by RSwarupa and Prthu, both of whom have dark histories of engaging in smear tactics against "Gaudiya Math" Vaishnavas, and have even been caught lying, lends them (and their story) zero credibility as far as I'm concerned. What are you trying to do, Krsna das, instigate wars between Vaishnava groups? During the 80's, I knew a (well-known) devotee who worked himself into a violent rage when he repeated, out of context, something that Srila Sridhara Maharaja had said. He threatened physical violence towards a great saint. And all because of what: hearsay, quotes taken out of context, unwillingness to understand and bridge the gaps... Srila Narayana Maharaja would never say anything like that. He would never try to break one's faith in Srila Prabhupada. He uses Srila Prabhupada's books to give classes. He considers Srila Prabhupada his Siksa Guru. He already has a few thousand disciples. Does anyone really believe that he is so "desparate" to make another disciple that he would grab someone's arm and try to break someone's faith in Srila Prabhupada? That is simply outrageous. The people who propagate such malarky are offenders extraordinaire. And here I thought that relations amongst the various sangas were improving. As long as dishonesty prevails, (and we know what Mother Bhumi has to say about that), there will never be harmony amongst Vaishnava groups. How sad. Vaishnavas are so rare. And if we can't get along with one another despite relative differences, then what chance do we have of spreading the Sankirtan Movement in a big way, as Srila Prabhupada had hoped.

gHari prabhu, please don't take this that I'm trying to give you a hard time. I'm just curious about some of your above statements. In regards to Satsvarupa M., do you feel that he is still qualified to edit, given his rather long history of illness which has required psychotropics and an avoidance-behaviour pattern regarding devotees? I don't mean this as a criticism of Maharaja, I'm sure he's still a very sincere devotee, I just wonder if Srila Prabhupada's instruction was intended for the time at hand, or for the duration of Maharaja's life. Also, in regards to critics always being wrong, which you later stated was not only for the editing issue, it should probably be mentioned that Jayadvaita Maharaja himself has been a critic. We've all been critics at one time or another. We'd still have a Zonal Acharya system were it not for Jayadvaita Swami and many of his godbrothers. I'm not suggesting that one criticize for criticism's sake. Clearly, some people overdo it. At the same time, positive change will never be realized without someone stepping forward as a critic. Maybe it's not just the critics who are "tearing Prabhupada's army apart." Perhaps the "status quo" folks, along with the critics, and the critics of the critics, are all to blame to some degree or another. It depends upon the issue or challenge at hand, I would guess. Again, no offense intended. I normally enjoy your posts. I was simply curious as to some of your comments.