tackleberry

If it were that simple, every scripture would've so declared in no uncertain terms. The fact that it doesn't proves otherwise. Nor is it illogical to consider every god as distinct. We do consider every human as distinct, don't we? We don't observe all objects and entities as one, we do perceive differences between various objects such as a table, chair etc. So why is it so hard to consider that every god is distinct?

How so? When you taste chocolates, is it just a relief or do you find real happiness?

Yes, it's given in multiple places, like Madhvacharya's "Mahabharata Tatparya Nirnaya", which is a commentary on the important events of Mahabharata. Aside from this, there are many other scriptures, where either Madhvacharya or his followers like Vyasa Tirtha, Jagannatha Dasa etc. have given the details of the avatars in both Ramayana and Mahabharata. You might want to read Jagannatha Dasa's "Harikathamrthasara" that enumerates this, but I do not remember which part, it's a very huge work containing many parts. Mahabharata Tatparya Nirnaya also gives this detail, not only Lord Shiva's incarnation as Ashvatama, but even others such as Dhrtrashtra, Shalya etc. Try tatvavada.org or any other dvaita website, they might have some resources on this, perhaps also links to these works, especially MBTN.

Madhvacharya accepts Aswathama as an avatar of Lord Shiva. And because Madhvacharya is known to have been very, very meticulous when it comes to pramana, I have no reason to doubt it.

I understand, but this should give happiness to the devotees, if I am not mistaken. That's what I am asking, whether devotees have experienced the transcendental bliss of serving and pleasing the Lord.

Dear Devotees, Are you happy? I don't mean happiness that depends on a certain fulfillment or object, but happiness that comes from within, happiness that comes with an increasing love for Krishna. Obviously, only this type of happiness can be proof that our bhakti for Krishna is genuine. That's why I am asking whether any devotee actually feels that strange kind of happiness, happiness born of love of God, happiness that has no cause. Serious and honest answers only, please. Let's discuss this.

You're a highly disturbed man. Please chant Hare Krishna!

The Lord and His incarnations are one, so even if Krishna is the incarnation of Vishnu, it'd still make Him Supreme. So there's no problem either way, and Krishna's Supremacy remains intact.

Just to give a balanced view here, aside from Gaudiya Vaishnavam, every other Vaishnava school, including Dvaita and Vishishta Advaita, believes that Krishna is an avatar of Vishnu. I think GV is the only Vaishnava school to believe that Vishnu/Narayana is subordinate to Krishna, while ALL VAISHNAVA Schools consider them to be one. As one can see, it's not just "Hinduism" which believes that Krishna is an incarnation of Vishnu, but all Vaishnava systems save GV. Not that I am saying it's right or wrong, but giving a proper perspective on this.

Those rejecting christ will also argue that it's not sectarianism but common sense to reject it for one wishing to enter into devotional service. As you can see, two can play this game. Anyway, Happy New Year, Theist.

By 'change in consciousness', do you mean moving to a higher level, or something of the sort? If so, that's the kind of change I haven't noticed in many people, unfortunately. By change, most people refer to superficial changes like abstinence from meat, and so on, usually OUTER changes. Hardly have I come across any person claiming to have changed within, or having attained a higher level of consciousness. Maybe, this is why people give up, it's because changes don't affect the core of their being, and they simply remain on the surface.

Suuure, he's got an answer for everything, ranging from why his followers went on crusades to witch hunting to genocides and inquisition, and the rest. Let's stop kidding ourselves, please. Jesus has done more harm than good, and the sooner so-called Vaishnavas get rid of this 'Jesus preached KC' line, the better it's for Mahaprabhu's movement.

Totally irrelevant to the topic under discussion.

You're not Prabhupada. At any rate, he wasn't destroying a beautiful vaishnava forum with a plethora of posts on Mary, Holy Ghost, whatever. So your comparison is ludicrous.

Not because Indians and Africans are interested in Catholicism, lol. The only reason it's thriving in these nations is because these nations are poor, and are being exploited by missionaries, give them bread and ask them to convert, big deal.

Why would anyone interfere? Simple, because this is NOT the place to discuss Jesus, go to christian forum if you want to discuss Jesus, Mary, Holy Ghost, and the rest. It's that simple.

Are you even reading the threads and posts that you're asking for factual example? Go through the first page of "spiritual discussions", and you'll get all the evidence you'll ever need.

Good. We need more people like you to provide an honest opinion on how things are moving here. Only based on that, we can make changes for the better. Thanks again for NOT denying the obvious, as Theist has done.

The people who're doing this, will definitely ask this question, so let's wait and see how many people turn up for the show, as you've done.

Dear Friends, This is one of few Vaishnava forums around, but I find many Christians shoving Jesus down our throats, saying a true Vaishnava has to accept him. Let's say this person was real. But that doesn't mean one should accept him, in order to be vaishnava. It's ridiculous. To be Vaishnava, you have to worship Vishnu, follow Vaishnava Scriptures, and so on, where's the rule that says one has to believe in Jesus to be Vaishnava? It makes little sense. The people on this forum who say a true vaishnava must accept Jesus...why can't these ppl go to christian forums and tell them that in order to be a true christian, they must accept Krishna and Gita? You'll be banned immediately. But here, the legendary vaishnava tolerance has been misused by the christians posing as Vaishnavas, constantly talking about Mary, Jesus etc., when it's totally irrelevant to Vaishnavism. I request Christians to stop this crusade. If Christianity fascinates you so much, then pl revert to Christianity, and stop bothering vaishnavas on this board. T

Where did Shvu or any other member mention mayavada? This thread is about labels, but most HKs think anyone who isn't HK must be mayavadi. I find this very annoying, despite being a Vaishnava myself. This attitude is very similar to Christians calling Krishna 'a demon and a womanizer.'

"Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth, but a sword." Mathew 10.34 "For I have come to turn a man against his father, a daughter against her mother, a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law" Mathew 10.35 All this makes Jesus look violent, nothing peaceful here?

Christ's teaching, which resulted in crusades, slavery, and the rest, is NOT poison, then? I am shocked!

It's ok for Christians/others to start threads on Jesus, Mohammed, Mary, Holy Ghost, and glorify them, even though this is a Vaishnava forum. Vaishnavas don't mind. But they DO mind, and will call you names-mayavadi, sleepervadi etc. etc.-if you dare to speak of another school within Vaishnavism. Does this sound crazy and hypocritical? Perhaps, but then this is a vaishnava forum.

If you see no distinction, you wouldn't mind writing your property in my name, then, would you? Seriously, though, what you suggest is illogical. Whether or not you have evil in your mind, evil DOES exist in this world. Murder, rape, terrorism, war etc. are not mental projections, they're concrete facts. All this talk about our evil minds projecting evil is fine, as long as your loved ones don't suffer. If your mom or bro or someone close to you dies in war or terrorism, then we'll see whether or not you stick to the same views.