melvin
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1] Regarding, “God as Mother” –I have been exploring this very topic without other poster’s inputting their thoughts upon this topic, yet.
Yet now, you, iamwhatisayiam have brought it up here.
Below is a story that can be dated –but “what is that date?”
It may be observed that ‘time-line’ clues are sprinkled through-out this puranic tale –but I digress, herein is the story of the birth of maha-sakti [who undoubtly herein is ‘literally’ known and shown as the internal potency of Visnu].
{My super-esoteric contemplation/speculation is, that before Godhead first acted, in any capacity or to any degree HE was dormant and unmanifested and at peace and self-contained with all potentiality, innately asleep ---but then HIS ‘internal-creative-feminine’ opulence/potencies stirred HIM to arise and Create and then to sport etc etc etc --- that’s as far as my speculation goes}
Anyway, the greatest Srimati Maha-Laxshmi Mata Adi-devi-ji uniquely [by default] obtains thee broadchest of MahaVishnu herself exclusively--and that seems just and right and nectarian. It is nectarian to me because I am aware of the sentiments of the servants of the servants of the childhood pastimes down on the dairy farm of vraja dhama that is revealed as the KINGDOM OF THE SUPREME PERSONALITY OF GODHEAD.
God, by definition, is the first person.
God, by definition, possesses all "Six Opulences" in-full, par-excellance.
"Six Opulences" are: All beauty, all strength, all wealth, all intelligence, all fame, & lastly all renunciation.
Mind you, God IS TRANSCENDENTAL TO THE COSMOS --the same cosmos that the demigod Lord Brahma and all of us live in. The realm of heaven is out side the cosmos and that realm of heaven is alit by the light that begins in God's own bodily effulgence and is also the same rays of light that conversely form the 'space/void/field' where the material elements evolve herein Brahma's ''brahmanda" [egg-shaped enclosure of our cosmos] --our cosmos float in the space that is the very thing called BRAHMAN.
The phantasmagoria of the cosmic flux of elements and forms and places and people and names and things and times and seasons and the good and the bad and the rule of duality is: temporary and relative.
Whereas, Brahman is absolute.
Whereas, the soul is transcendental.
Yoga [linking-up] is about the souls "orienting" oneself to restablish 'eternal duty' [sanatana-dharma]
Excerpted from the Bhavisya-uttara Purana:
. . . "It is I.I am Your great maha-sakti,
Your internal potency, who strikes fear into the hearts of all Your enemies. . . .”
Or
How the first Ekadasi Fast day, “Utpanna Ekadasi” was born.
Lord Sri Krishna:
“I will tell you why Ekadasi is the most purifying of all days.
In the Satya-Yuga there once lived an amazingly fearsome demon called Mura.
Always very angry, he terrified all the demigods, defeating even Indra, the king of heaven; Vivasvan, the sun-god; the eight Vasus; Lord Brahma; Vayu. the wind-god; and Agni, the fire-god. With his terrible power he brought them all under his control.
"'Lord Indra then approached Lord Shiva and said, "We have all fallen from our planets and are now wandering helplessly on the earth. O lord, how can we find relief from this affliction? What will be the fate of us demigods?'
"'Lord Shiva replied, "O best of the demigods, go to that place where Lord Vishnu, the rider of Garuda, resides. He is Jagannatha, the master of all the universes and their shelter as well. He is devoted to protecting all souls surrendered to Him.'"
"Lord Krishna continued, 'O Arjuna, winner of wealth, after Lord Indra heard these words of Lord Shiva's, he proceeded with all the demigods to the place where Lord Jagannatha, the Lord of the universe, the protector of all souls, was resting.
Seeing the Lord sleeping upon the water, the demigods joined their palms and, led by Indra, recite the following prayers:
"'"O Supreme Personality of Godhead, all obeisances to You. O Lord of lords, O You who are praised by the foremost demigods, O enemy of all demons, O lotus-eyed Lord, O Madhusudana (killer of the Madhu demon), please protect us. Afraid of the demon Mura, we demigods have come to take shelter of You. O Jagannatha, You are the doer of everything and the creator of everything. You are the mother and the father of all universes. You are the creator, the maintainer, and the destroyer of all. You are the supreme helper of all the demigods, and You alone can bring peace to them. You alone are the earth, the sky, and the universal benefactor.
"'"You are Shiva, Brahma, and also Vishnu, the maintainer of the three worlds. You are the gods of the sun, moon, and fire. You are the clarified butter, the oblation, the sacred fire, the mantras, the rituals, the priests, and the silent chanting of japa. You are the sacrifice itself, its sponsor, and the enjoyer of its results, the Supreme Personality of Godhead. Nothing within these three worlds, whether moveable or immovable, can exist independent of You.
O Supreme Lord, Lord of lords, You are the protector of those who take shelter of You. O supreme mystic, O shelter of the fearful, please rescue and protect us. We demigods have been defeated by the demons and have thus fallen from the heavenly realm. Deprived of our positions, O Lord of the universe, we are now wandering about this earthly planet."'
"Lord Krsna continued, 'Having heard Indra and the other demigods speak these words, Sri Vishnu, the Supreme Personality of Godhead, replied, "What demon possesses such great powers of delusion that he has been able to defeat all the demigods? What is his name, and where does he live? Where does he get his strength and shelter? Tell Me everything, O Indra, and do not fear."
"'Lord Indra replied, "O Supreme Godhead, O Lord of lords, O You who vanquish the fear in Your pure devotees' hearts, O You who are so kind to your faithful servants, there was once a powerful demon of the Brahma dynasty whose name was Nadijangha. he was extraordinarily fearsome and wholly dedicated to destroying the demigods, and he begot an infamous son named Mura.
"'"Mura's great capital city is Chandravati. From that base the terribly evil and powerful Mura demon has conquered the whole world and brought all the demigods under his control, driving them out of their heavenly kingdom. He has assumed the roles of Indra, the king of heaven; Agni, the fire-god; Yama, the lord of death; Vayu, the wind-god; Isha, or Lord Shiva; Soma, the moon-god; Nairrti, the lord of the directions; and Pasi, or Varuna, the water-god. He has also begun emanating light in the role of the sun-god and has turned himself into the clouds as well. It is impossible for the demigods to defeat him. O Lord Vishnu, please kill tis demon and make the demigods victorious."
"'Hearing these words from Indra, Lord Janardana became very angry and said, "O powerful demigods, all together you may now advance on Mura's capital city of Chandravati." Encouraged thus, the assembled demigods proceeded to Chandravati with Lord Hari leading the way.
"'When Mura saw the demigods, that foremost of demons started roaring very loudly in the company of countless thousands of other demons, who were all holding brilliantly shining weapons. The mighty-armed demons struck the demigods, who began abandoning the battlefield and fleeing in the ten directions.
Seeing the Supreme Lord Hrsikesha, the master of the senses, present on the battlefield, the furious demons rushed toward Him with various weapons in their hands. As they charged the Lord, who holds a sword, disk, and club, He immediately pierced all their limbs with His sharp, poisonous arrows. thus many hundred of demons died by the Lord's hand.
"'At last the chief demon, Mura, began fighting with the Lord. Mura used his mystic power to render useless whatever weapons the Supreme Lord Hrsikesa unleashed. Indeed, to the demon the weapons felt just like flowers striking him. When the Lord could not defeat the demon even with various kinds of weapons - whether those that are thrown or those that are held - He began fighting with His bare hands, which were as strong as iron-studded clubs.
The Lord wrestled with Mura for one thousand celestial years and then, apparently fatigued, left for Badarikashrama. There Lord Yogeshvara, the greatest of all yogis, the Lord of the universe, entered a very beautiful cave named Himavati to rest.
O Dhananjaya, winner of wealth, that cave was ninety-six miles in diameter and had only one entrance. I went there out of fear, and also to sleep. There is no doubt about this, O son of Pandu, for the great fight made me very tired. the demon followed Me into that cave and, seeing Me asleep, started thinking within his heart, "Today I will kill this slayer of all demons, Hari."
"'While the wicked-minded Mura was making plans in this way, from My body there manifested a young girl who had a very bright complexion. O son of Pandu, Mura saw that she was equipped with various brilliant weapons and was ready to fight.
Challenged by that female to do battle, Mura prepared himself and then fought with her, but he became very astonished when he saw that she fought him without cessation. The king of the demons then said, "Who has created this angry, fearsome girl who is fighting me so powerfully, just like a thunderbolt falling upon me?' After saying this, the demon continued to fight with the girl.
"'Suddenly that effulgent goddess shattered all of Mura's weapons and in a moment deprived him of his chariot. He ran toward her to attacker with his bare hands, but when she saw him coming she angrily cut off his head.
Thus the demon at once fell to the ground and went to the abode of Yamaraja. The rest of the Lord's enemies, out of fear and helplessness, entered the subterranean Patala region.
"'Then the Supreme Lord woke up and saw the dead demon before Him, as well as the maiden bowing down to him with joined palms. His face expressing His astonishment, the Lord of the universe said, "Who has killed this vicious demon? He easily defeated all the demigods, Gandharvas, and even Indra himself, along with Indra's companions, the Maruts, and he also defeated the Nagas (snakes), the rulers of the lower planets.
He even defeated Me, making Me hide in this cave out of fear. Who is it that has so mercifully protected Me after I ran from the battlefield and went to sleep in this cave?"
"'The maiden said, "It is I who have killed this demon after appearing from Your transcendental body. Indeed, O Lord Hari, when he saw You sleeping he wanted to kill You. Understanding the intention of this thorn in the side of the three worlds, I killed the evil rascal and this freed all the demigods from fear.
I am Your great maha-sakti, Your internal potency, who strikes fear into the hearts of all Your enemies. I have killed this universally terrifying demon to protect the three worlds. Please tell me why You are surprised to see that this demon has been killed, O Lord."
"'The Supreme Personality of Godhead said, "O sinless one, I am very satisfied to see that it is you who have killed this king of the demons. In this way you have made the demigods happy, prosperous, and full of bliss.
Because you have given pleasure to all the demigods in the three worlds, I am very pleased with you. Ask any boon you may desire, O auspicious one. I will give it to you without a doubt, though it be very rare among the demigods."
""The maiden said, "O Lord, if You are pleased with me and wish to give me a boon, then give me the power to deliver from the greatest sins that person who fasts of this day.
I wish that half the pious credit obtained by one who fasts will accrue to one who eats only in the evening (abstaining from grains and beans), and that half of this pious credit will be earned by one who eats only at midday.
Also, may one who strictly observes a complete fast on my appearance day, with controlled senses, go to the abode of Lord Vishnu for one billion kalpas after he has enjoyed all kinds of pleasures in this world.
This is the boon I desire to attain by Your mercy, my Lord, O Lord Janardana, whether a person observes complete fasting, eats only in the evening, or eats only at midday, please grant him a religious attitude, wealth, and at last liberation."
"'The Supreme Personality of Godhead said, "O most auspicious lady, what you have requested is granted. All My devotees in this world will surely fast on your day, and thus they will become famous throughout the three worlds and finally come and stay with me in My abode. Because you, My transcendental potency, have appeared on the eleventh day of the waning moon, let your name by Ekadasi. If a person fasts on Ekadasi, I will burn up all his sins and bestow upon him My transcendental abode.
"'"These are the days of the waxing and waning moon that are most dear to Me: Tritiya (the third day), Ashthami (the eighth day), Navami (the ninth day), Chaturdasi (the fourteenth day), and especially Ekadasi (the eleventh day).
"'"The merit one attains by fasting on Ekadasi is greater than that achieved by observing any other kind of fast or by going to a place of pilgrimage, and even greater than that achieved by giving charity to brahmanas. I tell you most emphatically that this is true."
"'Having thus given the maiden His benediction, the Supreme Lord suddenly disappeared. From that time onward the Ekadasi day became most meritorious and famous all over the universe. O Arjuna, if a person strictly observes Ekadasi, I kill all his enemies and grant him the highest destination. Indeed, if a person observes this great Ekadasi fast in any of the prescribed way, I remove all obstacles to his spiritual progress and grant him the perfection of life.
"'Thus, O son of Prtha, I have described to you the origin of Ekadasi. This one day removes all sins eternally. Indeed, it is the most meritorious day for destroying all kinds of sins, and it has appeared in order to benefit everyone in the universe by bestowing all varieties of perfection.
This was excerpted from Utpanna Ekadasi [from the Bhavisya-uttara Purana] as found in the celebrated book, "Ekadasi: The Day of Lord Hari" 1986. pages 13 - 22. HH Krishna Balaram Swami. Bhaktivedanta Institute Press.
2] The path of “Nirvana” [without quality] is the tradition & the elementary vedic metaphysical yogic goal of those on the journey of ‘meditators’ in quest of inner ‘peace’ etc.
Ultimately, “Nirvana” equates to shedding the ego, thus shedding lust, and then shedding ‘re-birth’ –all due to the analytic vision of the world as:
‘matter & energy forming various elements and forms for only short bursts of time’.
But, the nature of the “Soul” is that it is not transient but eternal, and cannot be desolved –This is explained by God himself in the Gita.
Having said this, it is the status-quo opinion of orthodox vedic adherents that ‘service’ to A PERSON is the ultimate & ‘constitutional’ original position & purpose of the souls existence.
Having said this, it is also the status-quo opinion that the goal of Nirvana is a subtle ‘self-hating’ and a denial of ‘the individual self’. Faced with the un-chartable destiny of each re-birth’s desirable & undesirable outcomes – Nirvana provides an outlet for a gentleman to take refuge.
But, tradition since time immemorial is that there are demigods and there is an “Almighty Singular Godhead-fountainhead–of-personal traits/experience/purpose/sensibilities/personality” ergo, the Goal of life is to “investigate” where are we, and, what are we, and where are we going.
Well, one may ask, “That’s not a new revelation.”
But, now the Bhagavad-gita is finally known outside of <?xml:namespace prefix = st1 ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com
<st1:place w:st=" /><st1:place w:st="on"><st1:country-region w:st="on">India</st1:country-region></st1:place> –after so many many lifetimes later . . . it is indeed a “new revelation” among the same old souls.
3] The Gods of the Vedas are the descendants of the first born person, Brahma. Brahma is the first progenitor and engineer and assembler of the cosmos –Lord Brahma is the overseeing superintendent of the cosmos in the form of a person, literally.
Brahma populated the universe via his grandchildrens’ grandchildrens ad infinitum to this day.
The personalities that populate the Vedic scriptures come from an antiquity pre-dating western lore and hieroglyphics.
Tell that fairytale story to the children and they will love it.
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Thank you for your time.
is it that Sri Krsna is the only one who posseses a spiritual form?
how can one aspect of God be higher than the other?
i dont like sectarian either it makes everything confusing.
Dear iamwhatisayiam,
Would you like to reach the status of Brahman? Brahma the creator of the universe has symbolically 4 heads. Others have ten or hundred heads. There`s a saying: That two heads are better than one. Brahma when he creates use four of his heads before he decides what to create. Maybe this is what they meant of akin to suicide if one wishes to situate himself in Brahman because in Bhagavan, only one head is used.
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Yes, Prabhupad always said that he was a cowherd boy. He also said that Krishna consciousness is intrinsic, that he (Prabhupad) just came to teach us that which we had forgotten. In one sense, whether we came from tathasta-sakti or fell from Goloka isn't really the issue; the issue is where are we headed, not where have we come from. Yes, our souls in their fullness of spiritual consciousness will blossom into our siddha-deha, eternal identity. Right now they are shrivelled up and unrecognizable, although within our hearts, but as we make advancement, our real identity will fully manifest. Some of you may even have a clue already as to your real identity. What part of Krishna lila or Ram lila or Vishnu lila or Chaitanya lila are you most attracted to ?
Pranams, jeffster/AMdas
In other words, if this were Hollywood, some would love to play the villain, Kamsa while others would love to play Krsna, the cowherd boy-hero of Vrndavan.-----
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Not only God is telling us to do good always through the beats of our hearts but He can also give us an account of what really is troubling us. And this can be revealed through our ECG tracings. If it says, SINUS RYTHM, then it means we are well-oriented to the environment surrounding us. But when it says, SINUS BRADYCARDIA, then it means we are slow to react to God`s musings, etc. On the other hand, when it says SINUS TACHYCARDIA, it means we are too quick to judge others` mistakes. These are just examples how God would communicate to us from the results of these ECG tracings. If you want to know what God has to say about your present life, then take an ECG exam.
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Well, on September 11, 2007 I suffered what was known as an acute inferior wall myocardial infarction. I was confined in the hospital`s CCU for 2 days and another 2 days in the hospital`s private room. If not for the enzyme STREPTOKINASE they gave me intravenously, the clot lodged inside my coronary artery supplying blood and oxygen in my heart`s inferior wall would have stayed and further damaging my heart. And angiogram taken and possibly they would have rushed me to the operating room for an emergency heart by-pass. Today, my ECG tracing result reads this way: Sinus rythm, Inferior wall myocardial infarction(old) and abnormal ECG tracings. A smile appears on my face each time I rearrange the acronym AMI(acute myocardial infarction) to MIA(maya).-
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:popcorn:yeps, maybe he is a boy.
(ja joshi by the way is one of our forum members...nice author and follower of mirabi)
Yes! Srila Prabhupada is only a boy. If there are pictures of him smiling it`s because they never thought of him as a boy!Maybe His Divine Grace had so much fun in his life teaching his students Krsna consciousness. His pupils were so serious in going home back to Godhead that they didn`t know their professor was only a boy!
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Really? Where did he declare that? Please quote your sources.
In the Narada Pancaratra. It`s a statement from Narada Muni found inside the book, Teachings of Lord Chaitanya, Chapter 18, page 203.
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there is a tv show on here melvin called grumpy old men, there is another one called grumpy old women. funny show about middle age people and up (and their minds)...now thats maya hey, grumpy old minds ( a tv is just a tv)
i suppose the good thing about grace of god is that we can see deeper than grumpiness:eek4: when the childhood innocence leaves...and find some peace in knowing we are not these material minds and bodies - and reality is not all we project.
oh...I forgot...krsna was a boy wasn't he
you are right melvin.
Dear Bija
Your reply immediately made me remember Srila Prabhupada. To the the devotees and admirers of His Divine Grace maybe they looked up to him as a grumpy old man but deep inside Abhay was only a boy.
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she has been referred to as devi , maheshwari , ishwari , etc which can be interpreted in english as goddess.
merely elevated beings ? you think so ? ill show you......................
1-- " sura asura siro ratna nighrishta charanam buje............" [markendaya purana]
the crow jewels of sura( gods) and asuras(demons) are sitauted at your lotus feet.
2--"krishnena samstute devi shashadbhyakta sada ambike............"
[markendaya purana]
krishna always worships your lotus feet with unfaltering bhakti.
3--tvam swaha tvam swadha tvam hi basatkarah swaratmika.
sudha tvam ahshare nityye tridha matratmika stitha"
[markendaya purana, brahma stuti to devi]
o devi you are the swaha mantra of yajnas, swadha mantra of sraddha(funeral) , vasat mantra of invokoing the gods, you are amrita swarup and omkara (tridha matra)
4--"..............twameva sa tvam savitri tvam dev janani para"
[markendaya purana , brahma stuti]
o devi you are the revered savitri of the gayatri mantra and the mother of all gods(devajanani)
5--"vishrishtau shrishti rupa tvam stithirupa cha paalane
tatha samhriti rupaante jagatohasya jaganmaye"
you are the one responsible for creation and its maintenence.in the end its you who destroys it with parlaya.
6--" yaya twaya jagatshrashta jagatpaataatti yo jagat
sohapi nidrabasham nitah..........vishnu sarirgrahan mahamishaan eva cha"
[brahma stuti]
o devi !! you are resomsible for causing the yoganidra of vishnu himself.who can realise your mahima?
you are the cause of vishnu , maheshwar and myself......
6--tvam ambika akhila deva maharshi pujyam ....."
we bow to that ambika who is revered by all devas and maharshis.
7--"yasyah prabhavam atulam bhagavan ananto
brahma harascha na hi baktumalam balancha"
we bow to that devi who is incomprehensible even by bhagavan ananta , brahma and hara(shiva) himself.
8--".............na gyayase hari haradi bhirapyapaara."
even hari hara and other gods cannot understand you
9--"...............mavyakrita hi prakitistvam adya"
you are without sadavikar(janma , astitwa , vridhi , viparinaam , apakshay , vinash ) and you are the eternal prakriti.
10--"moksharthi-bhirmuni-bhirasta-samasta-doshai......................"
you are the cause of mukti or moksh.
11--"sabdatmika subimalam...............samnaam"
you are the shavda brhman omkaar
12 --" prathame pujita sa cha krishnena paramatmana.
vrindavane cha srishtaadyaou golake raas mandale..........
...........................................................................
..................................sarittwate"
[ brahmavairvarta purana , pratikandha , 57 ]
devi was first worshipped by bhagavan sri krishna in raas mandal and golaka secondly by brahma due to fear of madhukaitav, thirdly by mahadev or shiva seeking respite from tripurasur, fourthly by devaraaj indra after being cursed by durvasa. at that time all munis, liberated souls, devas and demigods( not isckon demigod) came to worship her...................
13-- subhadra is also anothother expansion of durga. here is subhadra dhyanam for you to realise...............
"subhadram swarna padmabhyam padmapatraaya-tekhshanam . bichitra vastrasamchhannam haar keyur shovitam . vichitra bharanopetam muktahaar bilamvitam . pinnonnata kucham rama madyam prakritirupikaam. bhkti mukti pradatrincha dhyayet ambikam param ."
i meditate upon subhadra with the complexion of a golden lotus and eyes like padma patra . she's dressed in multi hued clothings and decorated with necklace and earrings.her full breasts are adorned with necklace of pearls and she is ramaa(lakshmi) herself. she grants both BHUKTI and MUKTI. she is AMBIKA AND PARAMA PRAKRITI.
14--subhadra stava
devi tvam vishnu mayasi mohayanti characharm. hrit padma samsthasi vishnu bhavanusarini. tvam mata jagatm devi pita narayano hi sah . stri rupam sarvameva tvam purusho jagadishwara.............................................................................
............................jaya bhadre subhadreyam sarvesham bhadradayini . bhadraa bhadra swarupe tvam BHADRAKALI namahastute."
o devi , you as vishnu maya ia the cause of ignorance. you reside in the heart of vishnu and follow the bhava of vishnu . you are our mother and narayana is our father . you are the ultimate prakriti and narayan is the ultimate purusha. i bow to bhadre in form of subhadra who is bestower of vidya. she herself is all good things in earth . i bow to BHADRAKAALI .
I THINK ITS CLEAR BY NOW THAT SUBHADRA AND DURGA ARE NON DIFFERENT.
15-- jiva goswami in bhagavat sandarva says--
" yah krishna sa iva durga syat ya durga krishna eva sah.
anayorantaradarshi samsaronno vimuchyate "
the same krishna is also called as durga and that durga is also krishna himself.ignorant people seperate the two
16--she has numerous incarnations as naarasimhi( female component of nrisimha , looka like nrishimhadev) , vaarahi( female component of lord varaha with boar head) , narayani( female component of narayan shown as seated on garuda with sankha chakra etc in hand) , aindri (female of lord indra with thousand eyes) , braahmi( female part of brahma with beads and vedas in hand) , kaumari( shakti of skanda seated on peacock) etc.
this clearly shows that durga or devi is the inherent shakti of all deities. she is the only existing energy in this manifestation(also in non manifestation)
also ckeck out the nondifference of radha and durga in the other thread titled --" radha and chandi - same?"
there are numerous other scriptural qoutations which i didnt qoute because i think this much is sufficient.
clearly durga being nitya(eternal) and lords potency ( before advent of radha the only potency) cannot be merely a elevated being.
neither can she be called demigod. if she is bahiranga shakti of vishnu she can never be demigod.for if she were , that would instantly turn a part of vishnu into demigod and make thus make him imperfect( demigods are finite and imperfect) and hence not god.
I DO NOT WANT TO PROOVE THE SUPREMACY OF DURGA OVER OTHER DEITIES. I JUST WANT TO SHOW THE GAUDIYAS THAT ITS NOT JUST KRISHNA WHO IS GLORIFIED TO THE TOPMOST POSITION IN THE SHASTRAS.
we all know that puranas were written till 18th century , so qouting from them to establish supremacy of one deity is not an intelligent idea. but since all vaishnavas like to rely more on smriti than on shruti i resorted to puranic qoutations.
now dont come up saying padma purana has a list of satvik purana. satvik purana is a self proclaimatory statement by padma purana and is not verifiable by any other text. going by this logic one i can show millions of similar tantric texts establishing the superiority of tantras and kaali over the rest . self proclaimatory texts cannot be the basis of arguments. one must show that 'non satvik' puranas accepts this grouping before qouting such things.
puranas were all written to glorify a particular diety which vaishnavs tend to disagree.
Does it mean that Durga and Radha are on equal footing? Because all these descriptions you made regarding Durga points to Radha.
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In a higher sense all things are spiritual - even maha-maya - because all is God's energy. But our behaviours as conditioned souls, under the influence of maya, are considered not spiritual.
In the spiritual world there is yoga-maya. For example yoga maya potency was used to bewilder Brahma in the stealing of the cows pastime. Yoga maya is used to slowly lift the veil so that the Lord's associates can get a glimpse of who He truly is - the Supreme controller. Yoga-maya can also influence the devotees in this world.
Yes, Bija you are correct. It`s our behavior as conditioned souls which is considered unspiritual. In other words, we should behave like a child not an adult if we are aiming for ultimate spirituality. Adults are conditioned while children are not. Adults are predictable while children are spontaneous.
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We were and still are Brahman, spirit, part and parcel of God, a minute spark which is part of the dazzling light of brahmajyoti. How is that not being a part of God?
Why do shastras speak about svarupya mukti? Receiving a boon of having a spiritual body just like Lord's Vishnu? Because at the present time you DO NOT have such a developed spiritual body. Gaudiya bhaktas do not desire svarupya mukti because they want to DEVELOP their own spiritual body of the servant of the servants of Krsna.
And for the last time, there is NO MAYA in the spiritual world. It was not maya that brought you to the material world. It was your own desire to explore the dark bank of the Viraja River.
What do you mean there`s no MAYA in the spiritual world? Maya is God`s external energy. He uses illusion like a magician to deceive us all. God is the cause of our forgetfulness, remembrance and intelligence. We are like puppets controlled by God the master puppeteer. We are just toys which God can do whatever He wants from us to do. If God wants us to jump over the cliff. He can do that. If He wants us to dance hip hop, He could also do that. God is the ultimate enjoyer and we are the enjoyed. God even let us enjoy soma rasa so we could forget Him.
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Thank you mahak for the information. All glories to Lord Chaitanya`s sankirtana-yazna!
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Perhaps by underworld, Melvin means the Mafia realm. The Gotti family in the west, Dawood and gang in India, etc., perform Durga Puja before starting any major activity, like planning an execution, or expanding their extortion rackets.
Perhaps he means Durga makes their desires come true - as the Goddess of the underworld.
Cheers
Well, I have a penchant for re-arranging words. DURga to Druga. And druga in our dialect means drug. There are legitimate drugs and illegal drugs, the latter peddled by drug lords.
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Here we go again the argument which came first, the chicken or egg. If we didn`t have our original spiritual bodies then there`s no substance to the statement that we are part and parcel of God. It was maya which made us forget we have an original spiritual body with the same Godly qualities as the Lord. We are the original spiritual bodies but just doesn`t know where and what they were because of forgetfulness.
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thats a misconception . she is not the goddess of underworld.
how one percieves durga depends on the faith he follows.
to vaishnavas she is primarily visnu maya or yogamaya who helps in krishna lila and causes ignorance in form of maya. she is suordinate to krishna and have no power to grant liberation........
to pure advaitins(hard to find these days) maya is an abstract phenomenon .this cannot be described in a few words.
to shaktas and tantrics durga is the highest truth and merely another name of what is known in vedas as brahman. she is superior to all other gods , because it is she who is the main power of all gods including vishnu himself.and she has the capacity to both cause ignorance and liberate an individual by removing it.
I`m sorry if I have offended any of goddess Durga`s devotees. I was raised by my parents who are devout catholics. I even thought goddess Durga was a monster because she exhibits multiple arms holding sharp bladed weapons. But when she rescued Bharata from those dacoits who wanted him sacrificed at her feet, my negative views about her immediately changed.----
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yes i felt that this body is a jail................................its trully a jail when we are in pure awareness state
If you think you are inside a prison cell, then do what these people want to do(www.youtube.com/cpdrc) when they are actually inside one of them.
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Just found this..."very small", should have posted the whole text......
"When he’s released from the hospital or jail, the same dress is again returned. Otherwise his present dress is taken and a separate dress is given. Similarly, we have got our spiritual body, not that we are zero, as the Mayavadi thinks. We are not zero. We have got our spiritual body but very, very small. Very small. The measurement is given: one ten- thousandth part of the tip of the hair, very minute. Aṇor aṇiyan mahato mahiyan. The Supreme Lord is great. “God is great.” He’s greater than the greatest, and He is smaller than the smallest. He is… The living entity is even smaller than the atom, but it has got a body. It is not that without body. We cannot imagine. Just like sometimes we see at night some microbic ant, very small, almost like full stop, but it is moving very nicely here and there. So the same physiological contruction, anatomy, is there. Everything is there. So this is God’s creation. Aṇor aṇīyan mahato mahiyan."
This thread started with a question: Where is your spiritual body not what. In other words, I`m asking all the members here in this forum where are their original bodies(spiritual bodies) now located? I believe many here are not using their original spiritual bodies and are now using copies of spiritual bodies long gone.
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My spiritual body is my original body before I got entangled with maya. For example my original username in this forum was melvin when I changed my mind and used mateo,marco melvin108, sanatana, krsnaraja, krsnaraj1, etc as my other usernames in this forum. Now, I`m back to using melvin.
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Hare Krsna
all glories to Srila Prabhupada!!
Please devotees accept my humble obeisances.
I have a question and I need help please...
Today I was talking with a devotee about the incarnation of Krsna and He said me that sancaracarya has taught the worship of the five most importants gods and demigods (LOrd Vishnu, Ganesa Durga, Shiva and Brahma?)and this sistem is followed by the indian today. also he said me that Sancaracarya also taught that whatever god you worship, the result is the same...
Is this true? In what book can I get information about this? I am very interesting... Hare Krsna!
Prior to death you must only worship Krsna not Vishnu, Ganesh ,Durga, Siva and Brahma because the results are always not the same. Believe it or not.
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Let`s give due respects to the mayavadis. They, too, are self-realized souls who acknowledge that Krsna is Bhagavan. Yet they have to step down on a lower level to attract souls whose lives are situated at the margins.
Christians for example are a good example of souls who live lives in a marginal way. And it is just a matter of time when they get to hear a bonafide spiritual master like Srila PRabhupada that they prepare and start going home, Back to Godhead.
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incessant use of material logic in speculations on vedic mantras has perhaps made mayavadis impotent on exercising the same in obvious matters.
Mayavadis are not self-realized because If they were, they would have not called themselves God-like?
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That advaita is an impersonalistic philosophy and yet it`s not. When one( who thinks himself to be a self-realized soul) starts accepting that he`s really not God but His servant/associate only. Lord Chaitanya was even acknowledged by the mayavadis as Krsna himself and yet the Lord refused to hear them say it. Why?
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That the spiritual body is awarded to the soul upon liberation fit to be an associate of God even in the present life. Who among you here in this board says they are liberated? Raise your hands, please.
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Narada Muni has declared: That all vedic rituals, mantras etc are summarized into only just 8 words, " Hare Krsna Hare Krsna Krsna Krsna Hare Hare."
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What I know about acintya-behda-bheda-tattva advocated by Lord Chaitanya Mahaprabhu is that Krsna is one with the individual soul and yet both are not same in terms of power, opulence and omnipotence.
A democrat-senator for example maybe one with the newly-elected US Pres. Obama and yet both are not on the same level of power and glory. The former is good only at legislating and approving a bill but it`s the latter who signs the bill into a law.
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Where is your spiritual body?
in Spiritual Discussions
Posted
Jeffster, Krsna is the greatest actor. He plays a lot of roles. Considering most of us here want to play supporting roles rather than playing the role of Krsna himself, there are souls, too, who just love to play the role of Kamsa, a villain in the Krsna-lila story. And yet in the end of the story, Kamsa, too, was liberated. Just like Putana. Even if she played the role of Krsna`s surrogate mother Krsna breastfed on her milk that was poison unharmed while he snuffed the life-air out from her yet in the end Putana also achieved liberation. What I`m trying to say here is that the Krsna-lila story and other related stories if these were produced in Hollywood, the best actors and actresses fit to play the role of Krsna, Kamsa, or Putana are those who are well-versed with the scripts found in Srimad Bhagavatam.
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