ISKCON - A Gurukuli's view

[Jahnava Nitai Das 2]

After Srila Prabhupada's departure, there were so many deviations that crept withn the ISKCON movement, all in the guise of devotional service. So many in leadership positions simply stood by accepting these deviations without objection. These gutless leaders stood by as the homosexuals ran rampant, pretending to be gurus and acharyas. Other "senior gaudiya acharyas" certified these homosexuals as pure devotees and gurus. As a result many people, especially gurukulis, have left the Krishna consciousness movement, some even blaming Srila Prabhupada for the problems.

 

What have the leaders done? Some have left and pretend they were never part of the problem. They point from a distance, saying, "Look at all those faults." They were themselves the problem. They are the one's who made the mess, both actively and pacively by allowing such things to go on. Now they are comfortably sitting from a distance trying to pretend they had nothing to do with the problems of ISKCON. We still remember the Swami Toms, Swami Dicks, and Swami Harry's. They may have left, but our memory remains. New people will be fooled, but we remember them for what they were - part of the problem of ISKCON. They were even worse than others, for they just ran off, forgetting about all the responsibilities they had. They took the easy way out; make a mess and run.

 

What should we do? We could follow their shallow example, and run off ourselves, blaming everything on someone else. Maybe find a place in the forest and start an isolated ashram, while pointing fingers and blaming ISKCON for everything. Thats what others have done, but I won't do that. I for one am staying. We have a duty to our acharya, Srila Prabhupada, to fix the problem. The first step is a vigorous campaign to defend the integrity of Srila Prabhupada. Those who wish to blame these problems on him are<BR>in fact the creators of the problem. The second step is a vigorous defending of the philosophy. Do not change anything.

 

There was a great attempt to minimize Srila Prabhupada after he left. Every Tom, Dick and Harry wanted to become a mini-Prabhupada, but they lacked the true spiritual qualification of the guru. Within the blink of an eye, these people suddenly became Swami Tom, Swami Dick and Swami Harry. They concocted their own teachings, deviating from Srila Prabhupada, and as a result began to fall down one by one. The so-called leaders stood by as these imposters stole Srila Prabhupada's legacy. The weakest of them ran off, after creating a good enough mess themselves, and pretended they had nothing to do with the problems. Nope, it didn't work. We saw you, we know what you did. We were watching the mess you were making.

 

Now such people want to point fingers at the problems of ISKCON and pretend it wasn't caused by them. They want us to believe that if we change Srila Prabhupada's teachings to suit the modern times, everything will again be fine. That was where the problems started. As soon as they deviated from Srila Prabhupada there was chaos. I won't run off like some other shallow leaders. I will stand up and fix these problems, I won't let this morphing of philosophy continue. I've seen enough fraudulent self-proclaimed Gaudiya matha certified "acharyas" come and go. You've all stood by as Kirtananda and Bhavananda ran rampant as homosexual "acharyas" destroying ISKCON. Are you going to let this go on? Srila Prabhupada is our acharya, and we must follow him, not other self-appointed "acharyas".

 

"Do not change anything", this is Srila Prabhupada's instruction. Do not accept homosexuality in any form as anything other than a weakness. Do not make up stories that there was a secret unrecorded conversation wherein he said his disciples could have homosexual marriages. Do not falsify the Vedic teachings as is going on in websites like Galva, and do not propagate these lies internally within ISKCON on sites like Chakra.

 

Those who left have to stop pretending they weren't part of the problem. They deviated from Srila Prabhupada, and allowed other deviations to go on. Even today so many deviations are continuing. Its time for them to stand up and say, "I will be part of the solution, I will follow Srila Prabhupada's instruction As It Is." Is this too much to ask of a disciple? We don't need more gurus, we need more disciples. Devotees who will faithfully follow the orders of their spiritual master.

 

 

[amanpeter 0]

We especially remember the Swami Dicks, but weren't they homosexuals, if not pedophiles, before Srila Prabhupada gave them sanyasa and placed them in positions of authority? Maybe this belongs on the `Is the guru fallible thread`...

 

JNdas: Are you going to let this go on? Srila Prabhupada is our acharya, and we must follow him, not other self-appointed "acharyas".

 

valaya: ISKCON GBC appointed "acharyas" are somehow automatically superior?

 

 

[This message has been edited by amanpeter (edited 09-07-2001).]

[Guest guest]

Now such people want to point fingers at the problems of ISKCON and pretend it wasn't caused by them.

 

 

While I agree with all of your remarks, I have to reply that there is a distintion between "rank and file" devotees and "authority" devotees.

 

Those of us who were not in a position of authority had no say in the matter of deviations, except to say ADIOS!

[Guest guest]

Another small point: Some of us were brutally murdered when we spoke up about deviations.

 

So my point is: you have to differentiate between those who knowingly "went along with the program" and those who realised they were part of an incredible demonic conspiracy against our guru maharaj, and the best choice was to jump off the ship and let the rats sink, and to continue our bhajan separite.

[Bhaktavasya 0]

 

jndas; again, why lump 'the swami Toms' in with the pedophiles? That is more than unfair, it is concocting hatred towards a devotee of Chaitanya Mahaprabhu and Radha and Krishna. Why are you pesisting in this way?

[Janus 0]

I left the movement two years before Srila Prabhupada died, after interviewing Hansaduta whose mindset was apparent to me and upon deciding that if such stuff were the heir apparents made from, leaving the movement was the only option for me at that time.

One thing I would like to comment upon and that was the rather impassioned request from the author of this thread that we should select the option of vigorously defending our philosophy.

It is my opinion that you can quote from shastra until the cows come home, but that real conviction of the truth of the philosophy is only attained to through experince. Prior to that it is all blind faith.

Another thing is that Srila Prabhupadas responsibility or lack of responsibility is a question that cannot be avoided simply because it is uncomfortable. The truth has nothing to fear.

Hari bol

[Gauracandra 1]

I am glad someone is finally standing up for Srila Prabhupada. First defend Srila Prabhupada. Then defend the philosophy. So many people have started to concoct their own philosophy. Jahnava Nitai is very simply saying "Do exactly what the guru orders and your life will be successful". He is taking it upon himself this responsibility. Everywhere we look today Srila Prabhupada is being demeaned. He "didn't know this, he was wrong on that, he was a sexist, he was a homophobe...." Nonsense. But no one has the guts to stand up and say so. Everyone is afraid that if they stand up for Srila Prabhupada then they too will be attacked as sexist, and homophobes. Finally, someone is willing to say enough is enough. Finally someone is standing up for Srila Prabhupada. The gurukulis were supposed to be our future. So many have left, become inimical, taken up bad habits. They have been conditioned by those who attack Srila Prabhupada to blame him for the problems Iskcon has faced. Well here is one gurukuli who has stayed. And as he says he will be "part of the solution".

 

Gauracandra

[Guest guest]

Originally posted by Janus:

Another thing is that Srila Prabhupadas responsibility or lack of responsibility is a question that cannot be avoided simply because it is uncomfortable. The truth has nothing to fear.

Hari bol

If you think that Srila Prabhupada is responsible for any actions that his disciples performed, then I know that you are not his disciple.

 

Am I correct wyspery?

 

[Janus 0]

Had Srila Prabhupada not trusted them then they never could have betrayed his trust. Had he not have taken their word then they could never have broken their word to him, and had not he have accepted their oaths then they would not now be forsworn; oathbreakers or "Warlocks" to use the most hated appelation of my tradition.

But no, I am not a disciple of A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada. A recipiant of his mercy yes, but I am not now, nor have I ever been a nominal member of your tradition.

"The fault Dear Brutus is not in our stars but in ourselves." Shakespeare, and while "yes", at times to my normal vision it might appear that Srila Prabhupada was unwise to trust some particular one or to take him or her at their word, that he should appear to act at times like a normal man does not at all mean that he was. What was his fault anyway, that he was to good for us? Let it stand at that then if fault must be named, that he was to good.

It has been a long, long very long time since he who was closer to me, closer to my sentiments, closer to my heart, went into the ground. No, I was not his disciple, and yet he was the only one I ever felt who truely understood me, the only person who I could trust completely, who I could depend upon entirely, who I could count on completely. No, whatever for would I curse such a great soul with myself, to be his disciple, a stone in his shoe, a milstone round his neck. I escaped becoming his disciple, but his mercy was to quick for me, I didn't escape that.

Srila Prabhupada was Mahajana, according to time and to place and capacity, this is not something that is a conscious choice "Oh, I am Mahajana, let me think how to present it." Tumi Hrisikesa, Hrisika damiya "Make me dance, O Lord make me dance."

So.

[atma 0]

A big thumbs up to Jahnava Nitai Das. I have lots of gurukuli friends and to know that he is one of them, gives me hope for the secure future of Srila Prabhupada's movement.

Thank you for the good work. Keep it up!