Why Krishna is Supreme

[Guest guest]

Nothing is uncaused. Everything has a source...in the Transcendent. The manifested world is but a degradation of the Transcendent. Which means, everything, be it thought or emotion, physical or subtle, must exist on the highest plane, albeit in a pure form in a much diviner nature.

 

Take lust, for instance. We see it in this world, therefore it must have its source in the Transcendent (Purushotama) as well; otherwise, it wouldn't exist here. But the lust we experience here is a cheap imitation of the love we might find at that supreme level. The same logic applies for all things, physical as well as subtle.

 

But what of names? They are also found in the manifested world, aren't they? Which means they are present in the Purushotama, but in what manner?? Let's consider this deeply. You look at a table and call it that. It remains a table. You call it anything you want (pot, kettle etc.), but it remains a table. So we declare, albeit foolishly, "What's there in a name? You can call god 'siva' or 'krishna' or whatever, it is the same thing."

 

That may be so in the manifested world, but in the Transcendent, the word is no longer a word but the sound. Just as lust exists as love in the Purushotama, so too can word exist as sound in that state. Hence, Krishna's name is not just a name but his sound, the sound of God. It is non-different from God. That's why mantras are pronounded carefully. If you say, "What's there in a name?", then why don't you chant Bin Laden mantra instead of Rama Nama. It is because at the Transcendental level, the name or the word becomes sound, which in turn is identical with form.

 

A table is different from the word table, but that's because it exists in the manifested world. In the Purushotama, names or words are transformed into sounds, the very source of forms. Therefore, form and sound are one. Which means Krishna is identical to the word krishna, because it is not merely a name on the highest plane.

 

That is why if you focus on Krishna, you focus on the Transcendent itself; whereas, siva or other lesser deities belong to lower planes of existence.

[maadhav 0]

the rationale why krishna is supreme presented here by a devotee of krishna is also presented in the vaishnav literature or presented by great vaishnav aacharyas.

 

this however should not cause a strife among the vedic people. everyone chooses his ista deva according to the budddhi and gyan one has. so, the vedic people can change ista deva as their gyan and buddhi changes, or they can realise their own ista deva and find from the deity whether that deity is supreme or not.

 

deities do not lie to their own devotees.

 

so, never get upset or argumetive if some one says siva is supreme or durga is supreme. may discuss/aruge with love and respect, but let the devotee of a deity realise that deity, and find from the deity the truth. same way realize krishna and find from krishna if he is supreme.

 

hope this will help the vedic people to unite for dharma and rashtra interests.

 

[Guest guest]

but was Krishna proclaimed to be Supreme, above all others, even in the Mahabharata, which is supposedly a nonsectarian scripture?

 

IS the Mahabharata non-sectarian?

 

 

[barney 0]

Brahman is the "ULTIMATE TURTH". There is nothing beyond him. He goes by thousands of names and takes thousands of forms and yet he is the personal and impersonal. Krishna is one of his incarnation to save the planet of evil. So if you say Krishna than so be it but remember Krishna is also one of the forms of the Ultimate God Brahman. Brahma, Vishnu, Shiva are all his forms and to deny such would show lack of understanding of the whole concept of the Vedic Scriptures.

[Guest guest]

the lack of understanding is yours when you think that in transcendence there's a "beyond"

 

transcendence is transcendental to such dualisms

 

brahman & bhagavan are at the same level

[Guest guest]

krsna in mahabharata shows at least two times the visvarupa, the universal form,demonstrating that he's the whole existence, that all is inside himself

 

(authentic scriptures are not sectarian, it is our problem if we are not happy when they do not follow our tastes)

[Guest guest]

Brahman is not the highest state. They are three types, Mutable (Ksahara), Immutable (Akshara) and Utttama that could be both. But there is another state, the transcendental state called Purushotama (Krishna) which exceeds all this, yet is the source of all this. That is the highest state, the Supreme Person, from where individual Purushas have descended. Of course, Purushotama descends only when there is a decline in dharma, the diff. being Purushotama knows his real being whereas the purushas don't, once they descend.

[Guest guest]

********* Nothing is uncaused. Everything has a source...in the Transcendent. The manifested world is but a degradation of the Transcendent. Which means, everything, be it thought or emotion, physical or subtle, must exist on the highest plane, albeit in a pure form in a much diviner nature.

Take lust, for instance. We see it in this world, therefore it must have its source in the Transcendent (Purushotama) as well; otherwise, it wouldn't exist here. But the lust we experience here is a cheap imitation of the love we might find at that supreme level. The same logic applies for all things, physical as well as subtle **********

 

 

 

Your logic is good. You say ‘manifested world is but a degradation’. You say ‘But the lust we experience here is a cheap imitation of the love we might find at that supreme level’. But first you said ‘everything, be it thought or emotion, physical or subtle, must exist on the highest plane’.

 

Therefore the degradation, the lust – the rapes, arsonists, wars etc. must also be there in your ‘the Transcendent’? Yes?

 

 

Will you define what is meant by ‘the Transcendent’. What is transcended?

 

 

 

 

 

******** But what of names? -----." That may be so in the manifested world, but in the Transcendent, the word is no longer a word but the sound. --------. If you say, "What's there in a name?", then why don't you chant Bin Laden mantra instead of Rama Nama. It is because at the Transcendental level, the name or the word becomes sound, which in turn is identical with form. *******

 

 

 

Good. But AUM is the sound that is the foundation of the Universe and when OM is transcended then is found Vishnu’s highest state. You understand this?

 

 

 

 

******** whereas, siva or other lesser deities belong to lower planes of existence. ***********

 

 

This is going on and on. These asuras who claim to follow Gita has no respect for Vedas.

 

 

You ignoramus; before making such comments show from shruti. You understand? You have not seen God. He has not told you. Without scriptures how dare you proclaim such?

 

 

‘Om Namah Sivayya’ is a Vedic mantra and name and you deride it? Show me a vedic mantra where Krishna name is there? If you do it then I will accept you and abide by what you say.

 

 

Know that Krishna received brahma gyan from Ghora angirasa.

 

 

CHANDOGYA UP.

 

III-xvii-6: Ghora Angirasa expounded this well-known doctrine to Devaki’s son Krishna and said, ‘Such a knower should, at the time of death, repeat this triad – "Thou art the imperishable, Thou art unchangeable, Thou art the subtle essence of Prana". (On hearing the above) he became thirstless. There are these two Rik stanzas in regard to this.

III-xvii-7: (Those knowers of Brahman who have purified their mind through the withdrawal of the senses and other means like Brahmacharya) see everywhere (the day – like the supreme light) of the ancient One who is the seed of the universe, (the light that shines in the Effulgent Brahman). May we, too having perceived the highest light which dispels darkness, reach it. Having perceived the highest light in our own heart we have reached that highest light, which is the dispeller (of water, rays of light and the Pranas), shining in all gods – yea, we have reached that highest light.

 

 

 

FROM THE MAHABHARATA, ANUSASANA PARVA

Section XIV

 

Krishna -16000 Wives (Part 1)

 

The blessed Vishnu said: "I salute Mahadeva. Salutations to Thee. O Thou that art eternal origin of all things. The Rishis say that Thou art the Lord of the Vedas. The righteous say that Thou art Penance, Thou art Sattwa, Thou art Rajas, Thou art Tamas, and Thou art truth…….

 

The puissant Sankara then, devoted to the good of the universe, looked at the goddess Uma and the lord of the celestials and myself also, and thus spoke unto me":

 

"We know, O Krishna, that Thou, O slayer of foes, art filled with the greatest devotion towards us. Do what is for Thy good. My love and affection for Thee is very great. Do Thou ask for eight boons. I shall verily give them unto Thee. O Krishna, O best of all persons, tell me what they are, O chief of the Yadavas. Name what Thou wishest. However difficult of attainment they be, Thou shalt have them still".

 

 

 

BHAGAVATAM

 

 

Kansa had sent a cruel ogress Pootana to kill all the newly born babies in his kingdom. ----------. Lord Krishna was only six days old then.

 

Pootana's breasts were filled with poison. ----------- Lord Krishna prayed to Lord Shiva who came to stay in His throat and drank all the poison from the milk.

 

 

 

 

Lord Krishna is purna incarnate of the Supreme and He declares “I am Cipivista”. And about this there is a Rig Veda verse, where Vishnu proclaims “I am cipivista” during a war.

 

 

We all accept it. As, Vishnu is Rudra’s lofty arrow.

YV iv. 5. 1.

a Homage to thy wrath, O Rudra,

To thine arrow homage also;

Homage to thy bow,

-------

Be gentle to us, O Rudra.

 

Yajur Veda vi. 2. 3.

The Asuras had three citadels; the lowest was of iron, then there was one of silver, then one of gold. The gods could not conquer them; they sought to conquer them by siege; therefore they say--both those who know thus and those who do not--'By siege they conquer great citadels.' They made ready an arrow, Agni as the point, Soma as the socket, Visnu as the shaft. They said, 'Who shall shoot it?' [1] 'Rudra', they said, let him shoot it.'

 

 

 

 

SU III, 3-4

 

i) 3. On all sides eye, on all sides face,

on all sides arms, on all sides feet,

he, God, the One, creates heaven and earth,

forging them together with arms and wings.

 

4. He who is source and origin of the Gods,

the Lord of all, Rudra, the mighty sage,

who produced in ancient days the Golden Germ--

may he endow us with purity of mind!

 

 

 

Show us from shruti what you claim or stop this degradation of santanah dharma.

 

 

 

 

Om Namah Shri Vasudevayya Namah

Om Namah Sivayya

 

 

namaH SivAya cha SivatarAya cha

 

 

[Guest guest]

"stop this degradation of santanah dharma. "

 

that's what we say to you

 

[Guest guest]

Say it with a name.

 

And say it with shruti.

 

 

Om Namah Bhagavate Shri Vasudevayya Namah

Om Namah Sivayya