Peak Oil Crisis Challenged.

December 2, 2004

Here are some facts that challenge the peak Oil Crisis theory:

1. http://www.wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=38645

2. Oil Companies could be playing on Public fears to charge more for Oil.

Comments/opinions in this regard are welcome.

Vijay

December 2, 2004

well..first off..i would take anything from the worldnetdaily with a HUGE grain

of salt, as much as readin the Globe er Natl. Enquirer

and, its mostly been the oil companies who have been poo-poohing the fact that

oil is coming to an end...

In the colonies, oh sure folks whine and kavetch about the price of

gas...but..its hella cheap considering...

if oil was some sort of geo-miracle where it just re-appeared, then production

wouldn't be crashing world-wide, they wouldn't be travelling farther and farther

afield, deeper into the oceans, laying thousands of miles of roads into jungles,

etc...

they'd just sit and wait a few years fer a refill

it ain't happening

wells are running dry..all over

and since the US hit its peak of production in 1970, and has been declining ever

since, doesn't it stand to reason that all the dry wells in california, texas

and pennsylvania would be spillin the black liquid all over???

rvijay07

Dec 1, 2004 6:18 PM

Peak Oil Crisis Challenged.

<tt>

Here are some facts that challenge the peak Oil Crisis theory:

1. <a

href= " http://www.wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=38645 " >http://www.wnd.com/n\

ews/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=38645</a>

2. Oil Companies could be playing on Public fears to charge more for Oil.

Comments/opinions in this regard are welcome.

Vijay

</tt>

<tt>

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December 2, 2004

and after a few minutes search..came up with

a. eugene island sits on various layers..with deep fissures

b. a geologist made a three d map of the area, and the various pools/res of oil,

instead of the normal graph line...wot he found was the oil company was

basically missin a ton of stuff...

c. they moved the drill holes..poof..oil...

d. a lot of area is ancient sandstone...so..you've got pools of oil, and

sandstone...sandstone ain;t exactly watertight, er in this case, oil tight...oil

under pressure is gonna move...

December 2, 2004

, fraggle <EBbrewpunx@e...> wrote:

> well..first off..i would take anything from the worldnetdaily with a HUGE

grain of salt, as much as readin the Globe er Natl. Enquirer

>

Here is one more:

3. The Govts. have alternatives that are fairly good. However, they don't wish

to reveal it yet for various reasons such as political etc.,. However, once the

oil supplies have gone really low, they will comeup with the alternative.

Vijay

December 2, 2004

Perhaps man is beginning to realize the limits of Natural Resources. For eg.,

yield from fishing in Oceans was dropping steadily, specially for big fish.

Finally a study was conducted and the conclusion was that it takes time for fish

to grow big and that there is only so much of them around. Now, the maritimes in

Canada that were known for fishing are now very hard hit as the yield is so low

that fishing had to be banned.

On a different note:

There are other sources of oil:

1)We can get oil from oil sands, like those in Canada and Venezuela which may

have a trillion or so barrels of oil.

2)We can get oil from oil shale deposits like those in Wyoming. There may be

several hundred billion barrels available.

3)We can make oil from coal, just like the Germans did in World War II and the

South Africans did during the apartheid era sanctions.

4)we can, if pushed, actually make synthetic oil from basic chemicals.

Now none of this will be cheap, and the era of cheap oil is fast ending. But

with oil around $50 per barrel, or more, those types of crude oil prodcution

become economical in comparison.

Vijay

December 2, 2004

there have been

2 big crunches in the last 30 years

1 st one was when America oil peaked around 1971

the second was a series of hiccups over the 80's

the major thing that makes this one different is

a couple of the major oil companies are looking toward alternatives

and BP is even looking at going into hydrogen fuel

that should tell you more than all the other reasons combined

=o]]

Craig

rvijay07 [rvijay07]Thursday, December 02, 2004 10:18 AM Subject: Peak Oil Crisis Challenged.Here are some facts that challenge the peak Oil Crisis theory:1. http://www.wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=386452. Oil Companies could be playing on Public fears to charge more for Oil.Comments/opinions in this regard are welcome.VijayTo send an email to -

December 2, 2004

and of course things like optaining shale and sandstone oils is extremely environmentally destructive, even more so then regular nasty drilling

and, it takes a whole lot of energy to optain the oil from those shale and sandstone deposits... rvijay07 Dec 2, 2004 3:03 AM Re: Peak Oil Crisis Challenged. Perhaps man is beginning to realize the limits of Natural Resources. For eg., yield from fishing in Oceans was dropping steadily, specially for big fish. Finally a study was conducted and the conclusion was that it takes time for fish to grow big and that there is only so much of them around. Now, the maritimes in Canada that were known for fishing are now very hard hit as the yield is so low that fishing had to be banned.On a different note:There are other sources of oil:1)We can get oil from oil sands, like those in Canada and Venezuela which may have a trillion or so barrels of oil. 2)We can get oil from oil shale deposits like those in Wyoming. There may be several hundred billion barrels available.3)We can make oil from coal, just like the Germans did in World War II and the South Africans did during the apartheid era sanctions.4)we can, if pushed, actually make synthetic oil from basic chemicals.Now none of this will be cheap, and the era of cheap oil is fast ending. But with oil around $50 per barrel, or more, those types of crude oil prodcution become economical in comparison.VijayTo send an email to -

December 2, 2004

oh..there have been alternatives fer decades if not longer

a lot of the technology they are bandying about now was pioneered back at the turn of the 1900's

but..to retool an entire economy is going to be a huge undertaking

the longer we wait, the harder and bigger the fall....

picture 200 yrs ago if some disease wiped out all farm animals..horses, oxen, cows, everything...

now up X 100% rvijay07 Dec 1, 2004 7:03 PM Re: Peak Oil Crisis Challenged. , fraggle <EBbrewpunx@e...> wrote:> well..first off..i would take anything from the worldnetdaily with a HUGE grain of salt, as much as readin the Globe er Natl. Enquirer> Here is one more:3. The Govts. have alternatives that are fairly good. However, they don't wish to reveal it yet for various reasons such as political etc.,. However, once the oil supplies have gone really low, they will comeup with the alternative.Vijay To send an email to -

December 2, 2004

, fraggle <EBbrewpunx@e...> wrote:

>

Fraggle, thanks for pointing out the environmental consequences of recovering

oil by alternative means from sand etc., This was an eye opener for me.

Also, today one person remarked to me that methane, propane etc., can be used as

alternative fuel. What are the costs, environmental concerns etc., in regards to

producing these fuels ? Can they sincerely be produced in such a bulk amount to

supply all the world ? If yes, then for how long will these last ? Thanks.

Vijay

December 2, 2004

, fraggle <EBbrewpunx@e...> wrote:

>

I agree, retooling the new whole economy will be a huge undertaking. A whole lot

of new equipment compatible with the new fuel will be needed. With what fuel

will all of those new equipment be manufactured/distributed ? Also what will

happen to all the old gas compatible engines etc., ? This will create a huge

waste/environmental problem to deal with.

Some hope new technology will help to use oil more efficiently giving us more

time. Hope this happens soon.

Vijay

December 2, 2004

What about capturing cow farts? That's a huge source of methane.

December 2, 2004

well..me hopes that if we start now, we can buy ourselves the time needed, ya know?

but..imo, there seems to be soo much stalling..

and a certain administration seems hellbent on the concept of "drill more holes", instead of alternatives

if we start now, we have a chance

its not like overnite there were highways and gas stations and 5 billion cars and all that....

100 yrs ago oil began to make its weight felt...

isn't it time now fer something else to begin? solar? wind? something i haven't even a clue of yet?

one can only hope rvijay07 Dec 2, 2004 11:32 AM Re: Peak Oil Crisis Challenged. , fraggle <EBbrewpunx@e...> wrote:>I agree, retooling the new whole economy will be a huge undertaking. A whole lot of new equipment compatible with the new fuel will be needed. With what fuel will all of those new equipment be manufactured/distributed ? Also what will happen to all the old gas compatible engines etc., ? This will create a huge waste/environmental problem to deal with.Some hope new technology will help to use oil more efficiently giving us more time. Hope this happens soon.VijayTo send an email to -

December 2, 2004

i don't relish the thought of hookin up hoses to cow anus' in some factory...

z.johnson Dec 2, 2004 11:57 AM Re: Re: Peak Oil Crisis Challenged. What about capturing cow farts? That's a huge source of methane. To send an email to -

December 2, 2004

methane can be gotten from a lot of sources...like cow butts as zac pointed out

old landfills, etc

the problem with propane and natural gas is, they come from the same source as oil generally...same fields.etc

natural gas is hard to ship long distances....it has to be basicaly frozen, to turn it into a liquid..and then moved...

also, natural gas has a steeper drop off point once you reach its peak then oil does...

ie: u run out a lot faster

someone else want to take this..?

i don't want to hog the spotlight

fraggle rvijay07 Dec 2, 2004 11:04 AM Re: Peak Oil Crisis Challenged. , fraggle <EBbrewpunx@e...> wrote:>Fraggle, thanks for pointing out the environmental consequences of recovering oil by alternative means from sand etc., This was an eye opener for me.Also, today one person remarked to me that methane, propane etc., can be used as alternative fuel. What are the costs, environmental concerns etc., in regards to producing these fuels ? Can they sincerely be produced in such a bulk amount to supply all the world ? If yes, then for how long will these last ? Thanks.VijayTo send an email to -

December 2, 2004

I realize I may be opening up HUGE can of worms here, but could there be such thing as a nuclear powered car?

Love,

Anna

-

fraggle

12/2/2004 1:17:27 PM

Re: Re: Peak Oil Crisis Challenged.

well..me hopes that if we start now, we can buy ourselves the time needed, ya know?

but..imo, there seems to be soo much stalling..

and a certain administration seems hellbent on the concept of "drill more holes", instead of alternatives

if we start now, we have a chance

its not like overnite there were highways and gas stations and 5 billion cars and all that....

100 yrs ago oil began to make its weight felt...

isn't it time now fer something else to begin? solar? wind? something i haven't even a clue of yet?

one can only hope rvijay07 Dec 2, 2004 11:32 AM Re: Peak Oil Crisis Challenged. , fraggle <EBbrewpunx@e...> wrote:>I agree, retooling the new whole economy will be a huge undertaking. A whole lot of new equipment compatible with the new fuel will be needed. With what fuel will all of those new equipment be manufactured/distributed ? Also what will happen to all the old gas compatible engines etc., ? This will create a huge waste/environmental problem to deal with.Some hope new technology will help to use oil more efficiently giving us more time. Hope this happens soon.VijayTo send an email to -

December 2, 2004

, " Anna Blaine " <anna333@e...> wrote:

> I realize I may be opening up HUGE can of worms here, but could there be

such thing as a nuclear powered car?

>

> Love,

> Anna

>

With oil running low, for sure Nuclear power will be exploited to the maximum.

So might as well discuss this. Thanks for bringing this subject up.

Vijay

December 2, 2004

depends on how you mean

the Bush admin is pushing fer hydrogen celled cars, and to get the energy they propose..more nuclear plants

as fer the old propaganda about droppin in a uranium pill into yer tank and away you go, in a nutshell, no

nuclear energy needs a huge plant to produce energy, and to cool it, store the rods etc...

technically, there has never been a nuclear power plant which has made money in the Us either..they have huge cost over-runs, etc and so forth..the whole thing is supported by tax dollars..yeehaw

so, if you wanted perhaps an SUV the size of a convience store, and cost about $5 million..then..maybe

you want to get into the horrendous dangers if nuclear power/energy now? Anna Blaine Dec 2, 2004 12:29 PM Re: Re: Peak Oil Crisis Challenged.

I realize I may be opening up HUGE can of worms here, but could there be such thing as a nuclear powered car?

Love,

Anna

-

fraggle

12/2/2004 1:17:27 PM

Re: Re: Peak Oil Crisis Challenged.

well..me hopes that if we start now, we can buy ourselves the time needed, ya know?

but..imo, there seems to be soo much stalling..

and a certain administration seems hellbent on the concept of "drill more holes", instead of alternatives

if we start now, we have a chance

its not like overnite there were highways and gas stations and 5 billion cars and all that....

100 yrs ago oil began to make its weight felt...

isn't it time now fer something else to begin? solar? wind? something i haven't even a clue of yet?

one can only hope rvijay07 Dec 2, 2004 11:32 AM Re: Peak Oil Crisis Challenged. , fraggle <EBbrewpunx@e...> wrote:>I agree, retooling the new whole economy will be a huge undertaking. A whole lot of new equipment compatible with the new fuel will be needed. With what fuel will all of those new equipment be manufactured/distributed ? Also what will happen to all the old gas compatible engines etc., ? This will create a huge waste/environmental problem to deal with.Some hope new technology will help to use oil more efficiently giving us more time. Hope this happens soon.VijayTo send an email to -

December 2, 2004

, fraggle <EBbrewpunx@e...> wrote:

>

Don't worry about hogging the spotlight. Your responses are very

informative/helpful and on topic. Please feel free to share all your opinions

and any other related information that you have. Thank you in advance.

Vijay

December 2, 2004

That conjures up a strange picture :-) Job description 'cow fart

collector'.

Jo

, z.johnson@m... wrote:

> What about capturing cow farts? That's a huge source of methane.

December 2, 2004

where's peter?

he ususally has a ton to say

well..both peter's do....

come on guys...don't let me dig this hole by myself....

teeheehee...

welcome to all the new ppl wh ohave joined in the last couple days..

fraggle rvijay07 Dec 2, 2004 12:44 PM Re: Peak Oil Crisis Challenged. , fraggle <EBbrewpunx@e...> wrote:>Don't worry about hogging the spotlight. Your responses are very informative/helpful and on topic. Please feel free to share all your opinions and any other related information that you have. Thank you in advance.VijayTo send an email to -

December 2, 2004

all i can picture is some weird orwellian/matrix scene of millions of cows hooked up to some sort of big building...a food tube on one end, a hose out the other....

i think i need ot go listen o cows with guns again now... rvijay07 Dec 2, 2004 12:49 PM Re: Peak Oil Crisis Challenged. , "heartwerk" <Heartwork@b...> wrote:> > That conjures up a strange picture :-) Job description 'cow fart > collector'.> > JoGiven the way cows are treated, that is not going to be Vegan.VijayTo send an email to -

December 2, 2004

I'm sure there could be - but I don't think it would be a good idea.

Jo

, " Anna Blaine " <anna333@e...> wrote:

> I realize I may be opening up HUGE can of worms here, but could

there be such thing as a nuclear powered car?

>

> Love,

> Anna

>

> -

> fraggle

>

> 12/2/2004 1:17:27 PM

> Re: Re: Peak Oil Crisis Challenged.

>

> well..me hopes that if we start now, we can buy ourselves the time

needed, ya know?

> but..imo, there seems to be soo much stalling..

> and a certain administration seems hellbent on the concept

of " drill more holes " , instead of alternatives

> if we start now, we have a chance

> its not like overnite there were highways and gas stations and 5

billion cars and all that....

> 100 yrs ago oil began to make its weight felt...

> isn't it time now fer something else to begin? solar? wind?

something i haven't even a clue of yet?

> one can only hope

>

> rvijay07@m...

> Dec 2, 2004 11:32 AM

>

> Re: Peak Oil Crisis Challenged.

>

> , fraggle <EBbrewpunx@e...> wrote:

> >

>

> I agree, retooling the new whole economy will be a huge

undertaking. A whole lot of new equipment compatible with the new

fuel will be needed. With what fuel will all of those new equipment

be manufactured/distributed ? Also what will happen to all the old

gas compatible engines etc., ? This will create a huge

waste/environmental problem to deal with.

>

> Some hope new technology will help to use oil more efficiently

giving us more time. Hope this happens soon.

>

> Vijay

>

> To send an email to -

>

December 2, 2004

ack

now i feel the pressure! heartwerk Dec 2, 2004 12:57 PM Re: Peak Oil Crisis Challenged. Hi FraggleI would love to take it - but don't know anywhere near as much about it as you - so carry on, please.Jo , fraggle <EBbrewpunx@e...> wrote:> To send an email to -

December 2, 2004

I reckon Peter's out enjoying himself - either that or buried in

history books!

BB

Jo

, fraggle <EBbrewpunx@e...> wrote:

Where's Peter?

>

December 2, 2004

Maintenance, future planning was never really cherished by the majority. Rather

than focusing on the oil crisis and alternatives, major Govts. are spending more

on Space exploration that uses up a lot of Gas.

Vijay

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