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hraum namah adityaya

 

Dear Jyotishas,

 

Could you help me with one issue? I have one debate with few iskcon

devotees which proclaim that dhoti and sari are not vedic clothes.

Could You give me some classical slokas which describe that Devatas,

Rsis or Sastric Women wearing Dhoti/Sari? I tried to seek in

Bhagavatam, but there is no Sanskrit word for Sari nor Dhoti. What is

Your view? Im not attached to name, but to form of that clothing.

 

 

Regards,

Rafal Gendarz

Sri Jagannath Center Guru

email: rafal

Jyotish pages:

www.rohinaa.com

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Namaste Sri RafalVedic Clothes? That is a new one. Veda as a pramana to Satyam, isn't worried about clothes. Sri Adi Sankaracharya prescribed ochre robes for those taking Sanyasa. Kings, learned men and Sanyasis have all been the knowers of the Truth. They all wore different clothes. Thanks and RegardsBharatOn 7/4/07, Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme wrote:

 

 

 

 

 

hraum namah adityaya

 

Dear Jyotishas,

 

Could you help me with one issue? I have one debate with few iskcon

devotees which proclaim that dhoti and sari are not vedic clothes.

Could You give me some classical slokas which describe that Devatas,

Rsis or Sastric Women wearing Dhoti/Sari? I tried to seek in

Bhagavatam, but there is no Sanskrit word for Sari nor Dhoti. What is

Your view? Im not attached to name, but to form of that clothing.

 

 

Regards,

Rafal Gendarz

Sri Jagannath Center Guru

email: rafal

Jyotish pages:

www.rohinaa.com

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Share on other sites

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hraum namah adityaya

 

Dear Bharat,

 

Indeed Veda is worrying about culture. Clothes are connected to culture

obviously. Differentation based on role in society doesnt negate fact

that we can say some clothing is Vedic or not. I wanted to know how

much Devatas clothes are connected to current dhotis and saris (esp

those worn by Iskcon). I thought that would be very easy for those who

were born in India.

 

 

Regards,

Rafal Gendarz

Sri Jagannath Center Guru

email: rafal

Jyotish pages:

www.rohinaa.com

 

 

Bharat - Hindu Astrology napisał(a):

 

 

 

 

Namaste Sri Rafal

 

Vedic Clothes? That is a new one. Veda as a pramana to Satyam, isn't

worried about clothes. Sri Adi Sankaracharya prescribed ochre robes for

those taking Sanyasa. Kings, learned men and Sanyasis have all been the

knowers of the Truth. They all wore different clothes.

 

Thanks and Regards

Bharat

 

 

On 7/4/07, Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme@ wp.pl> wrote:

 

 

 

 

 

hraum namah adityaya

 

Dear Jyotishas,

 

Could you help me with one issue? I have one debate with few iskcon

devotees which proclaim that dhoti and sari are not vedic clothes.

Could You give me some classical slokas which describe that Devatas,

Rsis or Sastric Women wearing Dhoti/Sari? I tried to seek in

Bhagavatam, but there is no Sanskrit word for Sari nor Dhoti. What is

Your view? Im not attached to name, but to form of that clothing.

 

 

Regards,

Rafal Gendarz

Sri Jagannath Center Guru

email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) com

Jyotish pages:

www.rohinaa. com

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Share on other sites

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Namaste Sri RafalVedas are connected to the Truth. The whole point is that any vesha-bhusha is to be taken that brings thoughts of the Truth. For example, Prabhu Krishna is blue in color and clothed in yellow. The symbolic meaning is that the vastness like the space of Truth (blue color) is clothes in yellow (in Earthly hue). Meaning the Lord in body form. There is symbolism present in the culture. Like a tilak on the forehead reminds us that we reside in the Lord and that makes us auspicious. It makes us remember Prabhu in each human being. So on and so forth. A upasak can connect many clothes to symbolism. So it is best that the change occurs within and clothes be left without so much differentiation. Thanks and RegardsBharat

On 7/5/07, Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme wrote:

 

 

 

 

 

hraum namah adityaya

 

Dear Bharat,

 

Indeed Veda is worrying about culture. Clothes are connected to culture

obviously. Differentation based on role in society doesnt negate fact

that we can say some clothing is Vedic or not. I wanted to know how

much Devatas clothes are connected to current dhotis and saris (esp

those worn by Iskcon). I thought that would be very easy for those who

were born in India.

 

 

Regards,

Rafal Gendarz

Sri Jagannath Center Guru

email: rafal

 

Jyotish pages:

www.rohinaa.com

 

 

Bharat - Hindu Astrology napisa³(a):

 

 

 

 

Namaste Sri Rafal

 

Vedic Clothes? That is a new one. Veda as a pramana to Satyam, isn't

worried about clothes. Sri Adi Sankaracharya prescribed ochre robes for

those taking Sanyasa. Kings, learned men and Sanyasis have all been the

knowers of the Truth. They all wore different clothes.

 

Thanks and Regards

Bharat

 

 

On 7/4/07, Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme@ wp.pl> wrote:

 

 

 

 

 

hraum namah adityaya

 

Dear Jyotishas,

 

Could you help me with one issue? I have one debate with few iskcon

devotees which proclaim that dhoti and sari are not vedic clothes.

Could You give me some classical slokas which describe that Devatas,

Rsis or Sastric Women wearing Dhoti/Sari? I tried to seek in

Bhagavatam, but there is no Sanskrit word for Sari nor Dhoti. What is

Your view? Im not attached to name, but to form of that clothing.

 

 

Regards,

Rafal Gendarz

Sri Jagannath Center Guru

email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) com

Jyotish pages:

www.rohinaa. com

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Share on other sites

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hraum namah adityaya

 

Dear Bharat,

 

Yes, from Dvaita point of view Devatas have these clothes, not only as

symbols and also from eternal substance.

 

Anyway, You must admit that Culture in India has connection to Veda,

Purana. Its not something conventionally only. Therefore there must be

some logic which shows that these types of clothes should be worn by

spiritual people which I believe is very correct. Ajit says it has

connection to Ashtanga Yoga and I also feel that altough its not highly

important still there must be some sense behind it. I wanted to know

slokas in Sastra which says that Devatas are wearing clothes similar to

current dhotis/saris. I couldnt find word Sari, so I suspect it has

non-Vedic origin, however the cloth can have other name than this. What

do You think?

 

 

Regards,

Rafal Gendarz

Sri Jagannath Center Guru

email: rafal

Jyotish pages:

www.rohinaa.com

 

 

Bharat - Hindu Astrology napisa³(a):

 

 

 

 

Namaste Sri Rafal

 

Vedas are connected to the Truth. The whole point is that any

vesha-bhusha is to be taken that brings thoughts of the Truth. For

example, Prabhu Krishna is blue in color and clothed in yellow. The

symbolic meaning is that the vastness like the space of Truth (blue

color) is clothes in yellow (in Earthly hue). Meaning the Lord in body

form. There is symbolism present in the culture. Like a tilak on the

forehead reminds us that we reside in the Lord and that makes us

auspicious. It makes us remember Prabhu in each human being. So on and

so forth.

 

A upasak can connect many clothes to symbolism. So it is best that the

change occurs within and clothes be left without so much

differentiation.

 

Thanks and Regards

Bharat

 

 

On 7/5/07, Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme@ wp.pl> wrote:

 

 

 

 

 

hraum namah adityaya

 

Dear Bharat,

 

Indeed Veda is worrying about culture. Clothes are connected to culture

obviously. Differentation based on role in society doesnt negate fact

that we can say some clothing is Vedic or not. I wanted to know how

much Devatas clothes are connected to current dhotis and saris (esp

those worn by Iskcon). I thought that would be very easy for those who

were born in India.

 

 

Regards,

Rafal Gendarz

Sri Jagannath Center Guru

email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT)

com

 

Jyotish pages:

www.rohinaa. com

 

 

Bharat - Hindu Astrology napisa³(a):

 

 

 

 

 

Namaste Sri Rafal

 

Vedic Clothes? That is a new one. Veda as a pramana to Satyam, isn't

worried about clothes. Sri Adi Sankaracharya prescribed ochre robes for

those taking Sanyasa. Kings, learned men and Sanyasis have all been the

knowers of the Truth. They all wore different clothes.

 

Thanks and Regards

Bharat

 

 

On 7/4/07, Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme@ wp.pl> wrote:

 

 

 

 

 

hraum namah adityaya

 

Dear Jyotishas,

 

Could you help me with one issue? I have one debate with few iskcon

devotees which proclaim that dhoti and sari are not vedic clothes.

Could You give me some classical slokas which describe that Devatas,

Rsis or Sastric Women wearing Dhoti/Sari? I tried to seek in

Bhagavatam, but there is no Sanskrit word for Sari nor Dhoti. What is

Your view? Im not attached to name, but to form of that clothing.

 

 

Regards,

Rafal Gendarz

Sri Jagannath Center Guru

email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) com

Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com

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Dear Rafal, If you can get hold of Satyanarayana Vrata sholokas, or any Vratas of Goddessess, or the Ashtottara of the the 9 planets, you will get enough info..Anand

On 7/5/07, Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme wrote:

 

 

 

 

 

hraum namah adityaya

 

Dear Bharat,

 

Yes, from Dvaita point of view Devatas have these clothes, not only as

symbols and also from eternal substance.

 

Anyway, You must admit that Culture in India has connection to Veda,

Purana. Its not something conventionally only. Therefore there must be

some logic which shows that these types of clothes should be worn by

spiritual people which I believe is very correct. Ajit says it has

connection to Ashtanga Yoga and I also feel that altough its not highly

important still there must be some sense behind it. I wanted to know

slokas in Sastra which says that Devatas are wearing clothes similar to

current dhotis/saris. I couldnt find word Sari, so I suspect it has

non-Vedic origin, however the cloth can have other name than this. What

do You think?

 

 

Regards,

Rafal Gendarz

Sri Jagannath Center Guru

email:

rafal

Jyotish pages:

www.rohinaa.com

 

 

Bharat - Hindu Astrology napisa³(a):

 

 

 

 

Namaste Sri Rafal

 

Vedas are connected to the Truth. The whole point is that any

vesha-bhusha is to be taken that brings thoughts of the Truth. For

example, Prabhu Krishna is blue in color and clothed in yellow. The

symbolic meaning is that the vastness like the space of Truth (blue

color) is clothes in yellow (in Earthly hue). Meaning the Lord in body

form. There is symbolism present in the culture. Like a tilak on the

forehead reminds us that we reside in the Lord and that makes us

auspicious. It makes us remember Prabhu in each human being. So on and

so forth.

 

A upasak can connect many clothes to symbolism. So it is best that the

change occurs within and clothes be left without so much

differentiation.

 

Thanks and Regards

Bharat

 

 

On 7/5/07, Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme@ wp.pl> wrote:

 

 

 

 

 

hraum namah adityaya

 

Dear Bharat,

 

Indeed Veda is worrying about culture. Clothes are connected to culture

obviously. Differentation based on role in society doesnt negate fact

that we can say some clothing is Vedic or not. I wanted to know how

much Devatas clothes are connected to current dhotis and saris (esp

those worn by Iskcon). I thought that would be very easy for those who

were born in India.

 

 

Regards,

Rafal Gendarz

Sri Jagannath Center Guru

email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT)

com

 

Jyotish pages:

www.rohinaa. com

 

 

Bharat - Hindu Astrology napisa³(a):

 

 

 

 

 

Namaste Sri Rafal

 

Vedic Clothes? That is a new one. Veda as a pramana to Satyam, isn't

worried about clothes. Sri Adi Sankaracharya prescribed ochre robes for

those taking Sanyasa. Kings, learned men and Sanyasis have all been the

knowers of the Truth. They all wore different clothes.

 

Thanks and Regards

Bharat

 

 

On 7/4/07, Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme@ wp.pl> wrote:

 

 

 

 

 

hraum namah adityaya

 

Dear Jyotishas,

 

Could you help me with one issue? I have one debate with few iskcon

devotees which proclaim that dhoti and sari are not vedic clothes.

Could You give me some classical slokas which describe that Devatas,

Rsis or Sastric Women wearing Dhoti/Sari? I tried to seek in

Bhagavatam, but there is no Sanskrit word for Sari nor Dhoti. What is

Your view? Im not attached to name, but to form of that clothing.

 

 

Regards,

Rafal Gendarz

Sri Jagannath Center Guru

email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) com

Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

-- ThanksAnand Srivatsa

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Om Gurave Namah

Dear Rafal,

i`m sure there`s much more on traditional clothing than we can

imagine. There`s a mention of sari in the Mahabharata-the famous

story of Krisna`s protecting Draupadi`s virtue that proves long

history of sari.

One of the important thing about sari and other traditional clothes

is believing that the unstitched fabric is pure. Modifications were

done with coming of the Muslims and English. Probably only Indian

scholars of history of clothing and costume could say what is

traditional in clothes we are seeing today.

Color, fabric, ornaments, wearing bring together a specific message

and honestly i think that choice of saris and dhotis of people today

(especially from the west) is accidental or half-understood.

As for Devatas my guess is that the color of the clothes and

ornaments are important.

Hope this helps in some way.

Warm regards,

Tijana

 

sohamsa , Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme wrote:

>

> *hraum namah adityaya*

>

> Dear Bharat,

>

> Indeed Veda is worrying about culture. Clothes are connected to

culture

> obviously. Differentation based on role in society doesnt negate

fact

> that we can say some clothing is Vedic or not. I wanted to know how

much

> Devatas clothes are connected to current dhotis and saris (esp

those

> worn by Iskcon). I thought that would be very easy for those who

were

> born in India.

>

>

> Regards,

> Rafal Gendarz

> Sri Jagannath Center Guru

> email: rafal

> Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa.com

>

>

> Bharat - Hindu Astrology napisa?(a):

> >

> > Namaste Sri Rafal

> >

> > Vedic Clothes? That is a new one. Veda as a pramana to Satyam,

isn't

> > worried about clothes. Sri Adi Sankaracharya prescribed ochre

robes

> > for those taking Sanyasa. Kings, learned men and Sanyasis have

all

> > been the knowers of the Truth. They all wore different clothes.

> >

> > Thanks and Regards

> > Bharat

> >

> > On 7/4/07, *Rafal Gendarz* <starsuponme@ wp.pl

> > <starsuponme> wrote:

> >

> > *hraum namah adityaya*

> >

> > Dear Jyotishas,

> >

> > Could you help me with one issue? I have one debate with few

> > iskcon devotees which proclaim that dhoti and sari are not

vedic

> > clothes. Could You give me some classical slokas which

describe

> > that Devatas, Rsis or Sastric Women wearing Dhoti/Sari? I

tried to

> > seek in Bhagavatam, but there is no Sanskrit word for Sari nor

> > Dhoti. What is Your view? Im not attached to name, but to

form of

> > that clothing.

> >

> >

> > Regards,

> > Rafal Gendarz

> > Sri Jagannath Center Guru

> > email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) com <rafal

> > Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com <http://www.rohinaa.com>

> >

> >

> >

>

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hraum namah adityaya

 

Dear Tijana,

 

Exactly! I gave the same example. Its so obvious from the sastras that

I cant understand their arguments fully.

 

It seems that they say that CURRENT SARIS AND DHOTIS have nothing to do

with VEDIC CLOTHING.

 

Therefore wanted to grasp information about VEDIC CLOTHING.

 

Thank You for help.

 

 

Regards,

Rafal Gendarz

Sri Jagannath Center Guru

email: rafal

Jyotish pages:

www.rohinaa.com

 

nix_nixen napisał(a):

 

 

Om Gurave Namah

Dear Rafal,

i`m sure there`s much more on traditional clothing than we can

imagine. There`s a mention of sari in the Mahabharata-the famous

story of Krisna`s protecting Draupadi`s virtue that proves long

history of sari.

One of the important thing about sari and other traditional clothes

is believing that the unstitched fabric is pure. Modifications were

done with coming of the Muslims and English. Probably only Indian

scholars of history of clothing and costume could say what is

traditional in clothes we are seeing today.

Color, fabric, ornaments, wearing bring together a specific message

and honestly i think that choice of saris and dhotis of people today

(especially from the west) is accidental or half-understood.

As for Devatas my guess is that the color of the clothes and

ornaments are important.

Hope this helps in some way.

Warm regards,

Tijana

 

sohamsa ,

Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme wrote:

>

> *hraum namah adityaya*

>

> Dear Bharat,

>

> Indeed Veda is worrying about culture. Clothes are connected to

culture

> obviously. Differentation based on role in society doesnt negate

fact

> that we can say some clothing is Vedic or not. I wanted to know

how

much

> Devatas clothes are connected to current dhotis and saris (esp

those

> worn by Iskcon). I thought that would be very easy for those who

were

> born in India.

>

>

> Regards,

> Rafal Gendarz

> Sri Jagannath Center Guru

> email: rafal

> Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa.com

>

>

> Bharat - Hindu Astrology napisa?(a):

> >

> > Namaste Sri Rafal

> >

> > Vedic Clothes? That is a new one. Veda as a pramana to

Satyam,

isn't

> > worried about clothes. Sri Adi Sankaracharya prescribed ochre

 

robes

> > for those taking Sanyasa. Kings, learned men and Sanyasis

have

all

> > been the knowers of the Truth. They all wore different

clothes.

> >

> > Thanks and Regards

> > Bharat

> >

> > On 7/4/07, *Rafal Gendarz* <starsuponme@ wp.pl

> > <starsuponme> wrote:

> >

> > *hraum namah adityaya*

> >

> > Dear Jyotishas,

> >

> > Could you help me with one issue? I have one debate with few

> > iskcon devotees which proclaim that dhoti and sari are not

vedic

> > clothes. Could You give me some classical slokas which

describe

> > that Devatas, Rsis or Sastric Women wearing Dhoti/Sari? I

tried to

> > seek in Bhagavatam, but there is no Sanskrit word for Sari nor

> > Dhoti. What is Your view? Im not attached to name, but to

form of

> > that clothing.

> >

> >

> > Regards,

> > Rafal Gendarz

> > Sri Jagannath Center Guru

> > email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) com <rafal

> > Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com <http://www.rohinaa.com>

> >

> >

> >

>

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Dear Scholars,

 

The Rishis were to wear different clothes, than the Kshatriya,

The general people / farmer / traders, they were to wear different clothes.

The fabric used was different.

 

The region, like the Kashi vishwanath 's traditional clothes or say the Priest / Pujari wear different clothes than the south india.

The Gujrati Clothes / Punjabi Clothes / Marathi Culture, Rajasthani Culture. West Bengal, Kashmir.

each state have different type of traditional clothing.

 

The current Sari and Dhoti donot have direct relation with Vedic but they have relation to the culture of the state.

Sari is wore in different styles in each state.

and the similar thing among all the rituals followed in india is the COLOUR, and the colour can be termed as Vedic not the clothes.

Nepal is pure Hindu Country and there culture is also different.

 

Do Someone knows why Orange is our sacred / Vedic colour ?????? neither red, nor green nor white ...

 

Regards,

 

Tarun

 

 

 

 

 

-

Rafal Gendarz

sohamsa

Friday, July 06, 2007 2:35 AM

Re: Re: Vedic Clothes

 

 

hraum namah adityayaDear Tijana,Exactly! I gave the same example. Its so obvious from the sastras that I cant understand their arguments fully.It seems that they say that CURRENT SARIS AND DHOTIS have nothing to do with VEDIC CLOTHING. Therefore wanted to grasp information about VEDIC CLOTHING.Thank You for help.Regards,Rafal Gendarz Sri Jagannath Center Guruemail: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) comJyotish pages: www.rohinaa.comnix_nixen napisał(a):

 

Om Gurave NamahDear Rafal,i`m sure there`s much more on traditional clothing than we can imagine. There`s a mention of sari in the Mahabharata-the famous story of Krisna`s protecting Draupadi`s virtue that proves long history of sari.One of the important thing about sari and other traditional clothes is believing that the unstitched fabric is pure. Modifications were done with coming of the Muslims and English. Probably only Indian scholars of history of clothing and costume could say what is traditional in clothes we are seeing today.Color, fabric, ornaments, wearing bring together a specific message and honestly i think that choice of saris and dhotis of people today (especially from the west) is accidental or half-understood.As for Devatas my guess is that the color of the clothes and ornaments are important.Hope this helps in some way. Warm regards,Tijana sohamsa , Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme wrote:>> *hraum namah adityaya*> > Dear Bharat,> > Indeed Veda is worrying about culture. Clothes are connected to culture > obviously. Differentation based on role in society doesnt negate fact > that we can say some clothing is Vedic or not. I wanted to know how much > Devatas clothes are connected to current dhotis and saris (esp those > worn by Iskcon). I thought that would be very easy for those who were > born in India.> > > Regards,> Rafal Gendarz> Sri Jagannath Center Guru> email: rafal Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa.com> > > Bharat - Hindu Astrology napisa?(a):> >> > Namaste Sri Rafal> >> > Vedic Clothes? That is a new one. Veda as a pramana to Satyam, isn't > > worried about clothes. Sri Adi Sankaracharya prescribed ochre robes > > for those taking Sanyasa. Kings, learned men and Sanyasis have all > > been the knowers of the Truth. They all wore different clothes.> >> > Thanks and Regards> > Bharat> >> > On 7/4/07, *Rafal Gendarz* <starsuponme@ wp.pl > > <starsuponme> wrote:> >> > *hraum namah adityaya*> >> > Dear Jyotishas,> >> > Could you help me with one issue? I have one debate with few> > iskcon devotees which proclaim that dhoti and sari are not vedic> > clothes. Could You give me some classical slokas which describe> > that Devatas, Rsis or Sastric Women wearing Dhoti/Sari? I tried to> > seek in Bhagavatam, but there is no Sanskrit word for Sari nor> > Dhoti. What is Your view? Im not attached to name, but to form of> > that clothing.> >> >> > Regards,> > Rafal Gendarz> > Sri Jagannath Center Guru> > email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) com <rafal> > Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com <http://www.rohinaa.com>> >> >> >>

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||

Om Gurave Namah | Om Namo Naraayanaaya||

 

Dear Rafal &

Tijana,

 

I am afraid your

ISKON friends are correct on this count.

 

Have you

compared the so called Vedic clothes – Dhoti or saree – with the ancient

Egyptian, Greece

or even Roman clothes???

 

They all seem so

similar - all of them wore unstiched cloths, loosely resembling the traditional

dhoti – the only difference was the type, and direction, of the wrap.

 

So also for the

head-gear, or turbans.

 

These changed

with the time, with the development of tailoring skills, and with the local ‘fashion’.

 

Regards,

 

Shailesh

 

 

 

 

 

 

sohamsa [sohamsa ] On Behalf Of Rafal Gendarz

Friday, July 06, 2007 2:35

AM

sohamsa

Re: Re: Vedic

Clothes

 

 

 

 

 

hraum namah adityaya

 

Dear Tijana,

 

Exactly! I gave the same example. Its so obvious from the sastras that I cant

understand their arguments fully.

 

It seems that they say that CURRENT SARIS AND DHOTIS have nothing to do with

VEDIC CLOTHING.

 

Therefore wanted to grasp information about VEDIC CLOTHING.

 

Thank You for help.

 

 

Regards,

Rafal Gendarz

Sri Jagannath

Center Guru

email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) com

Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa.com

 

nix_nixen napisa³(a):

 

 

Om

Gurave Namah

Dear Rafal,

i`m sure there`s much more on traditional clothing than we can

imagine. There`s a mention of sari in the Mahabharata-the famous

story of Krisna`s protecting Draupadi`s virtue that proves long

history of sari.

One of the important thing about sari and other traditional clothes

is believing that the unstitched fabric is pure. Modifications were

done with coming of the Muslims and English. Probably only Indian

scholars of history of clothing and costume could say what is

traditional in clothes we are seeing today.

Color, fabric, ornaments, wearing bring together a specific message

and honestly i think that choice of saris and dhotis of people today

(especially from the west) is accidental or half-understood.

As for Devatas my guess is that the color of the clothes and

ornaments are important.

Hope this helps in some way.

Warm regards,

Tijana

 

sohamsa ,

Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme wrote:

>

> *hraum namah adityaya*

>

> Dear Bharat,

>

> Indeed Veda is worrying about culture. Clothes are connected to

culture

> obviously. Differentation based on role in society doesnt negate

fact

> that we can say some clothing is Vedic or not. I wanted to know how

much

> Devatas clothes are connected to current dhotis and saris (esp

those

> worn by Iskcon). I thought that would be very easy for those who

were

> born in India.

>

>

> Regards,

> Rafal Gendarz

> Sri Jagannath Center

Guru

> email: rafal

> Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa.com

>

>

> Bharat - Hindu Astrology napisa?(a):

> >

> > Namaste Sri Rafal

> >

> > Vedic Clothes? That is a new one. Veda as a pramana to Satyam,

isn't

> > worried about clothes. Sri Adi Sankaracharya prescribed ochre

robes

> > for those taking Sanyasa. Kings, learned men and Sanyasis have

all

> > been the knowers of the Truth. They all wore different clothes.

> >

> > Thanks and Regards

> > Bharat

> >

> > On 7/4/07, *Rafal Gendarz* <starsuponme@ wp.pl

> > <starsuponme>

wrote:

> >

> > *hraum namah adityaya*

> >

> > Dear Jyotishas,

> >

> > Could you help me with one issue? I have one debate with few

> > iskcon devotees which proclaim that dhoti and sari are not

vedic

> > clothes. Could You give me some classical slokas which

describe

> > that Devatas, Rsis or Sastric Women wearing Dhoti/Sari? I

tried to

> > seek in Bhagavatam, but there is no Sanskrit word for Sari nor

> > Dhoti. What is Your view? Im not attached to name, but to

form of

> > that clothing.

> >

> >

> > Regards,

> > Rafal Gendarz

> > Sri Jagannath Center

Guru

> > email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) com <rafal

> > Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com <http://www.rohinaa.com>

> >

> >

> >

>

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Share on other sites

Guest guest

hraum namah adityaya

 

Dear Shaileshji, Tijanaji, Bharatji, Tarunji,

 

Tarun: So which state of India represents closest form? Is some form

closest to Vedic?

 

Shailesh: yes, but what was the Vedic Clothing?

 

Regards,

Rafal Gendarz

Sri Jagannath Center Guru

email: rafal

Jyotish pages:

www.rohinaa.com

 

 

Shailesh C Chadha napisa³(a):

 

 

 

 

 

 

||

Om Gurave Namah | Om Namo Naraayanaaya| |

 

Dear Rafal &

Tijana,

 

I am afraid your

ISKON friends are correct on this count.

 

Have you

compared the so called Vedic clothes – Dhoti or saree – with the

ancient

Egyptian, Greece or even Roman clothes???

 

They all seem so

similar - all of them wore unstiched cloths, loosely resembling the

traditional

dhoti – the only difference was the type, and direction, of the wrap.

 

 

So also for the

head-gear, or turbans.

 

These changed

with the time, with the development of tailoring skills, and with the

local ‘fashion’.

 

Regards,

 

Shailesh

 

 

sohamsa@ .com [sohamsa] On

Behalf Of Rafal Gendarz

Friday, July 06, 2007 2:35

AM

sohamsa@ .com

Re: Re: Vedic

Clothes

 

 

 

 

 

hraum namah adityaya

 

Dear Tijana,

 

Exactly! I gave the same example. Its so obvious from the sastras that

I cant

understand their arguments fully.

 

It seems that they say that CURRENT SARIS AND DHOTIS have nothing to do

with

VEDIC CLOTHING.

 

Therefore wanted to grasp information about VEDIC CLOTHING.

 

Thank You for help.

 

 

Regards,

Rafal Gendarz

Sri Jagannath Center Guru

email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) com

Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com

 

 

nix_nixen napisa³(a):

 

 

Om Gurave Namah

Dear Rafal,

i`m sure there`s much more on traditional clothing than we can

imagine. There`s a mention of sari in the Mahabharata- the famous

story of Krisna`s protecting Draupadi`s virtue that proves long

history of sari.

One of the important thing about sari and other traditional clothes

is believing that the unstitched fabric is pure. Modifications were

done with coming of the Muslims and English. Probably only Indian

scholars of history of clothing and costume could say what is

traditional in clothes we are seeing today.

Color, fabric, ornaments, wearing bring together a specific message

and honestly i think that choice of saris and dhotis of people today

(especially from the west) is accidental or half-understood.

As for Devatas my guess is that the color of the clothes and

ornaments are important.

Hope this helps in some way.

Warm regards,

Tijana

 

sohamsa@

..com,

Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme@ ...> wrote:

>

> *hraum namah adityaya*

>

> Dear Bharat,

>

> Indeed Veda is worrying about culture. Clothes are connected to

culture

> obviously. Differentation based on role in society doesnt negate

fact

> that we can say some clothing is Vedic or not. I wanted to know

how

much

> Devatas clothes are connected to current dhotis and saris (esp

those

> worn by Iskcon). I thought that would be very easy for those who

were

> born in India .

>

>

> Regards,

> Rafal Gendarz

> Sri Jagannath Center Guru

> email: rafal

> Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com

>

>

> Bharat - Hindu Astrology napisa?(a):

> >

> > Namaste Sri Rafal

> >

> > Vedic Clothes? That is a new one. Veda as a pramana to

Satyam,

isn't

> > worried about clothes. Sri Adi Sankaracharya prescribed ochre

 

robes

> > for those taking Sanyasa. Kings, learned men and Sanyasis

have

all

> > been the knowers of the Truth. They all wore different

clothes.

> >

> > Thanks and Regards

> > Bharat

> >

> > On 7/4/07, *Rafal Gendarz* <starsuponme@ wp.pl

> > <starsuponme

>

wrote:

> >

> > *hraum namah adityaya*

> >

> > Dear Jyotishas,

> >

> > Could you help me with one issue? I have one debate with few

> > iskcon devotees which proclaim that dhoti and sari are not

vedic

> > clothes. Could You give me some classical slokas which

describe

> > that Devatas, Rsis or Sastric Women wearing Dhoti/Sari? I

tried to

> > seek in Bhagavatam, but there is no Sanskrit word for Sari nor

> > Dhoti. What is Your view? Im not attached to name, but to

form of

> > that clothing.

> >

> >

> > Regards,

> > Rafal Gendarz

> > Sri Jagannath Center Guru

> > email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) com <rafal@

....>

> > Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa.

com <http://www.rohinaa. com>

> >

> >

> >

>

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Share on other sites

Guest guest

Dear Rafal,

 

As i wrote in my previous email, that Rishis were to wear Different clothes then the general public.

 

Saree / Dhoti is not vedic one.

 

No state can represent Closest form of Vedic which you are looking for. because all states were to follow the tradition around them.

 

Rishis were to wear unstiched cloth around them, and the same was with women that time.

In south india you will find different way.

unfortunately you wont be able to get this in shastras but this is what we learned from history and from Temples.

 

The current way Saree is worn is a from kind of fashion change.

and dhoti ( for male ) is from traditon.

 

Regards,

 

Tarun

 

 

 

-

Rafal Gendarz

sohamsa

Friday, July 06, 2007 1:05 PM

Re: Re: Vedic Clothes

 

 

hraum namah adityayaDear Shaileshji, Tijanaji, Bharatji, Tarunji,Tarun: So which state of India represents closest form? Is some form closest to Vedic?Shailesh: yes, but what was the Vedic Clothing?Regards,Rafal Gendarz Sri Jagannath Center Guruemail: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) comJyotish pages: www.rohinaa.comShailesh C Chadha napisa³(a):

 

 

 

 

 

|| Om Gurave Namah | Om Namo Naraayanaaya| |

Dear Rafal & Tijana,

I am afraid your ISKON friends are correct on this count.

Have you compared the so called Vedic clothes – Dhoti or saree – with the ancient Egyptian, Greece or even Roman clothes???

They all seem so similar - all of them wore unstiched cloths, loosely resembling the traditional dhoti – the only difference was the type, and direction, of the wrap.

So also for the head-gear, or turbans.

These changed with the time, with the development of tailoring skills, and with the local ‘fashion’.

Regards,

Shailesh

 

 

sohamsa@ .com [sohamsa] On Behalf Of Rafal GendarzFriday, July 06, 2007 2:35 AMsohamsa@ .comRe: Re: Vedic Clothes

 

 

 

hraum namah adityaya Dear Tijana,Exactly! I gave the same example. Its so obvious from the sastras that I cant understand their arguments fully.It seems that they say that CURRENT SARIS AND DHOTIS have nothing to do with VEDIC CLOTHING. Therefore wanted to grasp information about VEDIC CLOTHING.Thank You for help.Regards,Rafal Gendarz Sri Jagannath Center Guruemail: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) comJyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com nix_nixen napisa³(a):

 

 

Om Gurave NamahDear Rafal,i`m sure there`s much more on traditional clothing than we can imagine. There`s a mention of sari in the Mahabharata- the famous story of Krisna`s protecting Draupadi`s virtue that proves long history of sari.One of the important thing about sari and other traditional clothes is believing that the unstitched fabric is pure. Modifications were done with coming of the Muslims and English. Probably only Indian scholars of history of clothing and costume could say what is traditional in clothes we are seeing today.Color, fabric, ornaments, wearing bring together a specific message and honestly i think that choice of saris and dhotis of people today (especially from the west) is accidental or half-understood.As for Devatas my guess is that the color of the clothes and ornaments are important.Hope this helps in some way. Warm regards,Tijana sohamsa@ .com, Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme@ ...> wrote:>> *hraum namah adityaya*> > Dear Bharat,> > Indeed Veda is worrying about culture. Clothes are connected to culture > obviously. Differentation based on role in society doesnt negate fact > that we can say some clothing is Vedic or not. I wanted to know how much > Devatas clothes are connected to current dhotis and saris (esp those > worn by Iskcon). I thought that would be very easy for those who were > born in India .> > > Regards,> Rafal Gendarz> Sri Jagannath Center Guru> email: rafal Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com> > > Bharat - Hindu Astrology napisa?(a):> >> > Namaste Sri Rafal> >> > Vedic Clothes? That is a new one. Veda as a pramana to Satyam, isn't > > worried about clothes. Sri Adi Sankaracharya prescribed ochre robes > > for those taking Sanyasa. Kings, learned men and Sanyasis have all > > been the knowers of the Truth. They all wore different clothes.> >> > Thanks and Regards> > Bharat> >> > On 7/4/07, *Rafal Gendarz* <starsuponme@ wp.pl > > <starsuponme > wrote:> >> > *hraum namah adityaya*> >> > Dear Jyotishas,> >> > Could you help me with one issue? I have one debate with few> > iskcon devotees which proclaim that dhoti and sari are not vedic> > clothes. Could You give me some classical slokas which describe> > that Devatas, Rsis or Sastric Women wearing Dhoti/Sari? I tried to> > seek in Bhagavatam, but there is no Sanskrit word for Sari nor> > Dhoti. What is Your view? Im not attached to name, but to form of> > that clothing.> >> >> > Regards,> > Rafal Gendarz> > Sri Jagannath Center Guru> > email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) com <rafal@ ...>> > Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com <http://www.rohinaa. com>> >> >> >>

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Guest guest

hraum namah adityaya

 

Dear Tarun,

 

Im not talkin about Rsis, but Vedic way of clothing the people in

general. How this model differs from current clothing? I mean from

dhoti, sari.

 

About states: still some state can be closer to what Veda/Puranas

describe.

 

Im sure its there in sastras.

 

 

Regards,

Rafal Gendarz

Sri Jagannath Center Guru

email: rafal

Jyotish pages:

www.rohinaa.com

 

 

~Tarun~ napisa³(a):

 

 

 

 

 

Dear Rafal,

 

As i wrote in my previous email, that Rishis were to wear

Different clothes then the general public.

 

Saree / Dhoti is not vedic one.

 

No state can represent Closest form of Vedic which you are

looking for. because all states were to follow the tradition around

them.

 

Rishis were to wear unstiched cloth around them, and the same

was with women that time.

In south india you will find different way.

unfortunately you wont be able to get this in shastras but this

is what we learned from history and from Temples.

 

The current way Saree is worn is a from kind of fashion change.

 

and dhoti ( for male ) is from traditon.

 

Regards,

 

Tarun

 

 

 

-

Rafal Gendarz

sohamsa@ .com

Friday, July 06, 2007 1:05 PM

Re: Re: Vedic Clothes

 

 

 

hraum namah adityaya

 

Dear Shaileshji, Tijanaji, Bharatji, Tarunji,

 

Tarun: So which state of India represents closest form? Is some form

closest to Vedic?

 

Shailesh: yes, but what was the Vedic Clothing?

 

Regards,

Rafal Gendarz

Sri Jagannath Center Guru

email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) com

Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com

 

 

Shailesh C Chadha napisa³(a):

 

 

 

 

 

|| Om Gurave Namah | Om Namo Naraayanaaya| |

 

Dear Rafal & Tijana,

 

I am afraid your ISKON friends are correct on this

count.

 

Have you compared the so called Vedic clothes – Dhoti or

saree – with the ancient Egyptian, Greece or even Roman clothes???

 

They all seem so similar - all of them wore unstiched

cloths, loosely resembling the traditional dhoti – the only difference

was the type, and direction, of the wrap.

 

So also for the head-gear, or turbans.

 

These changed with the time, with the development of

tailoring skills, and with the local ‘fashion’.

 

Regards,

 

Shailesh

 

 

 

sohamsa@ .com [sohamsa] On

Behalf Of Rafal Gendarz

Friday, July 06, 2007 2:35 AM

sohamsa@ .com

Re: Re: Vedic Clothes

 

 

 

 

 

 

hraum namah adityaya

 

Dear Tijana,

 

Exactly! I gave the same example. Its so obvious from the sastras that

I cant understand their arguments fully.

 

It seems that they say that CURRENT SARIS AND DHOTIS have nothing to do

with VEDIC CLOTHING.

 

Therefore wanted to grasp information about VEDIC CLOTHING.

 

Thank You for help.

 

 

Regards,

Rafal Gendarz

Sri Jagannath Center Guru

email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) com

Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com

 

 

nix_nixen napisa³(a):

 

 

Om Gurave Namah

Dear Rafal,

i`m sure there`s much more on traditional clothing than we can

imagine. There`s a mention of sari in the Mahabharata- the famous

story of Krisna`s protecting Draupadi`s virtue that proves long

history of sari.

One of the important thing about sari and other traditional clothes

is believing that the unstitched fabric is pure. Modifications were

done with coming of the Muslims and English. Probably only Indian

scholars of history of clothing and costume could say what is

traditional in clothes we are seeing today.

Color, fabric, ornaments, wearing bring together a specific message

and honestly i think that choice of saris and dhotis of people today

(especially from the west) is accidental or half-understood.

As for Devatas my guess is that the color of the clothes and

ornaments are important.

Hope this helps in some way.

Warm regards,

Tijana

 

sohamsa@

..com, Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme@ ...> wrote:

>

> *hraum namah adityaya*

>

> Dear Bharat,

>

> Indeed Veda is worrying about culture. Clothes are connected to

culture

> obviously. Differentation based on role in society doesnt negate

fact

> that we can say some clothing is Vedic or not. I wanted to know

how

much

> Devatas clothes are connected to current dhotis and saris (esp

those

> worn by Iskcon). I thought that would be very easy for those who

were

> born in India .

>

>

> Regards,

> Rafal Gendarz

> Sri Jagannath Center Guru

> email: rafal

> Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com

>

>

> Bharat - Hindu Astrology napisa?(a):

> >

> > Namaste Sri Rafal

> >

> > Vedic Clothes? That is a new one. Veda as a pramana to

Satyam,

isn't

> > worried about clothes. Sri Adi Sankaracharya prescribed ochre

 

robes

> > for those taking Sanyasa. Kings, learned men and Sanyasis

have

all

> > been the knowers of the Truth. They all wore different

clothes.

> >

> > Thanks and Regards

> > Bharat

> >

> > On 7/4/07, *Rafal Gendarz* <starsuponme@ wp.pl

> > <starsuponme

> wrote:

> >

> > *hraum namah adityaya*

> >

> > Dear Jyotishas,

> >

> > Could you help me with one issue? I have one debate with few

> > iskcon devotees which proclaim that dhoti and sari are not

vedic

> > clothes. Could You give me some classical slokas which

describe

> > that Devatas, Rsis or Sastric Women wearing Dhoti/Sari? I

tried to

> > seek in Bhagavatam, but there is no Sanskrit word for Sari nor

> > Dhoti. What is Your view? Im not attached to name, but to

form of

> > that clothing.

> >

> >

> > Regards,

> > Rafal Gendarz

> > Sri Jagannath Center Guru

> > email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) com <rafal@

....>

> > Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa.

com <http://www.rohinaa. com>

> >

> >

> >

>

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Share on other sites

Guest guest

Dear Rafal ,

 

I guess you didnt presented your question in specific way.

 

What would you like to know by Vedic System.

 

should vedas tell how to wear clothes ?? or what to wear as clothes.

or what to wear during Yagya or while making some havan etc.

 

 

 

Regards,

 

Tarun

 

 

 

 

-

Rafal Gendarz

sohamsa

Friday, July 06, 2007 1:42 PM

Re: Re: Vedic Clothes

 

 

hraum namah adityayaDear Tarun,Im not talkin about Rsis, but Vedic way of clothing the people in general. How this model differs from current clothing? I mean from dhoti, sari.About states: still some state can be closer to what Veda/Puranas describe.Im sure its there in sastras.Regards,Rafal Gendarz Sri Jagannath Center Guruemail: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) comJyotish pages: www.rohinaa.com~Tarun~ napisa³(a):

 

 

 

 

Dear Rafal,

 

As i wrote in my previous email, that Rishis were to wear Different clothes then the general public.

 

Saree / Dhoti is not vedic one.

 

No state can represent Closest form of Vedic which you are looking for. because all states were to follow the tradition around them.

 

Rishis were to wear unstiched cloth around them, and the same was with women that time.

In south india you will find different way.

unfortunately you wont be able to get this in shastras but this is what we learned from history and from Temples.

 

The current way Saree is worn is a from kind of fashion change.

and dhoti ( for male ) is from traditon.

 

Regards,

 

Tarun

 

 

 

-

Rafal Gendarz

sohamsa@ .com

Friday, July 06, 2007 1:05 PM

Re: Re: Vedic Clothes

 

 

hraum namah adityaya Dear Shaileshji, Tijanaji, Bharatji, Tarunji,Tarun: So which state of India represents closest form? Is some form closest to Vedic?Shailesh: yes, but what was the Vedic Clothing?Regards,Rafal Gendarz Sri Jagannath Center Guru email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) comJyotish pages: www.rohinaa. comShailesh C Chadha napisa³(a):

 

 

 

 

|| Om Gurave Namah | Om Namo Naraayanaaya| |

Dear Rafal & Tijana,

I am afraid your ISKON friends are correct on this count.

Have you compared the so called Vedic clothes – Dhoti or saree – with the ancient Egyptian, Greece or even Roman clothes???

They all seem so similar - all of them wore unstiched cloths, loosely resembling the traditional dhoti – the only difference was the type, and direction, of the wrap.

So also for the head-gear, or turbans.

These changed with the time, with the development of tailoring skills, and with the local ‘fashion’.

Regards,

Shailesh

 

 

sohamsa@ .com [sohamsa] On Behalf Of Rafal GendarzFriday, July 06, 2007 2:35 AMsohamsa@ .comRe: Re: Vedic Clothes

 

 

 

hraum namah adityaya Dear Tijana,Exactly! I gave the same example. Its so obvious from the sastras that I cant understand their arguments fully.It seems that they say that CURRENT SARIS AND DHOTIS have nothing to do with VEDIC CLOTHING. Therefore wanted to grasp information about VEDIC CLOTHING.Thank You for help.Regards,Rafal Gendarz Sri Jagannath Center Guruemail: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) comJyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com nix_nixen napisa³(a):

 

 

Om Gurave NamahDear Rafal,i`m sure there`s much more on traditional clothing than we can imagine. There`s a mention of sari in the Mahabharata- the famous story of Krisna`s protecting Draupadi`s virtue that proves long history of sari.One of the important thing about sari and other traditional clothes is believing that the unstitched fabric is pure. Modifications were done with coming of the Muslims and English. Probably only Indian scholars of history of clothing and costume could say what is traditional in clothes we are seeing today.Color, fabric, ornaments, wearing bring together a specific message and honestly i think that choice of saris and dhotis of people today (especially from the west) is accidental or half-understood.As for Devatas my guess is that the color of the clothes and ornaments are important.Hope this helps in some way. Warm regards,Tijana sohamsa@ .com, Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme@ ...> wrote:>> *hraum namah adityaya*> > Dear Bharat,> > Indeed Veda is worrying about culture. Clothes are connected to culture > obviously. Differentation based on role in society doesnt negate fact > that we can say some clothing is Vedic or not. I wanted to know how much > Devatas clothes are connected to current dhotis and saris (esp those > worn by Iskcon). I thought that would be very easy for those who were > born in India .> > > Regards,> Rafal Gendarz> Sri Jagannath Center Guru> email: rafal Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com> > > Bharat - Hindu Astrology napisa?(a):> >> > Namaste Sri Rafal> >> > Vedic Clothes? That is a new one. Veda as a pramana to Satyam, isn't > > worried about clothes. Sri Adi Sankaracharya prescribed ochre robes > > for those taking Sanyasa. Kings, learned men and Sanyasis have all > > been the knowers of the Truth. They all wore different clothes.> >> > Thanks and Regards> > Bharat> >> > On 7/4/07, *Rafal Gendarz* <starsuponme@ wp.pl > > <starsuponme > wrote:> >> > *hraum namah adityaya*> >> > Dear Jyotishas,> >> > Could you help me with one issue? I have one debate with few> > iskcon devotees which proclaim that dhoti and sari are not vedic> > clothes. Could You give me some classical slokas which describe> > that Devatas, Rsis or Sastric Women wearing Dhoti/Sari? I tried to> > seek in Bhagavatam, but there is no Sanskrit word for Sari nor> > Dhoti. What is Your view? Im not attached to name, but to form of> > that clothing.> >> >> > Regards,> > Rafal Gendarz> > Sri Jagannath Center Guru> > email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) com <rafal@ ...>> > Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com <http://www.rohinaa. com>> >> >> >>

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest guest

hraum namah adityaya

 

Dear Tarun,

 

Vedas & Puranas spoke about everything, every aspect has its own

meaning as Tijana presneted. I was discussing these things with Iskcon

devotees, and wanted to broaden horizons on that aspect. Simple as that.

 

 

Regards,

Rafal Gendarz

Sri Jagannath Center Guru

email: rafal

Jyotish pages:

www.rohinaa.com

 

 

~Tarun~ napisa³(a):

 

 

 

 

 

Dear Rafal ,

 

I guess you didnt presented your question in specific way.

 

What would you like to know by Vedic System.

 

should vedas tell how to wear clothes ?? or what to wear as

clothes.

or what to wear during Yagya or while making some havan etc.

 

 

 

Regards,

 

Tarun

 

 

 

 

-

Rafal Gendarz

sohamsa@ .com

Friday, July 06, 2007 1:42 PM

Re: Re: Vedic Clothes

 

 

 

hraum namah adityaya

 

Dear Tarun,

 

Im not talkin about Rsis, but Vedic way of clothing the people in

general. How this model differs from current clothing? I mean from

dhoti, sari.

 

About states: still some state can be closer to what Veda/Puranas

describe.

 

Im sure its there in sastras.

 

 

Regards,

Rafal Gendarz

Sri Jagannath Center Guru

email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) com

Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com

 

 

~Tarun~ napisa³(a):

 

 

 

 

Dear Rafal,

 

As i wrote in my previous email, that Rishis were to wear

Different clothes then the general public.

 

Saree / Dhoti is not vedic one.

 

No state can represent Closest form of Vedic which you are

looking for. because all states were to follow the tradition around

them.

 

Rishis were to wear unstiched cloth around them, and the

same was with women that time.

In south india you will find different way.

unfortunately you wont be able to get this in shastras but

this is what we learned from history and from Temples.

 

The current way Saree is worn is a from kind of fashion

change.

and dhoti ( for male ) is from traditon.

 

Regards,

 

Tarun

 

 

 

-

Rafal Gendarz

sohamsa@ .com

Friday, July 06, 2007 1:05 PM

Re: Re: Vedic Clothes

 

 

 

hraum namah adityaya

 

Dear Shaileshji, Tijanaji, Bharatji, Tarunji,

 

Tarun: So which state of India represents closest form? Is some form

closest to Vedic?

 

Shailesh: yes, but what was the Vedic Clothing?

 

Regards,

Rafal Gendarz

Sri Jagannath Center Guru

email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) com

Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com

 

 

Shailesh C Chadha napisa³(a):

 

 

 

 

 

|| Om Gurave Namah | Om Namo Naraayanaaya| |

 

Dear Rafal & Tijana,

 

I am afraid your ISKON friends are correct on this

count.

 

Have you compared the so called Vedic clothes –

Dhoti or saree – with the ancient Egyptian, Greece or even Roman

clothes???

 

They all seem so similar - all of them wore

unstiched cloths, loosely resembling the traditional dhoti – the only

difference was the type, and direction, of the wrap.

 

So also for the head-gear, or turbans.

 

These changed with the time, with the development of

tailoring skills, and with the local ‘fashion’.

 

Regards,

 

Shailesh

 

 

 

sohamsa@ .com [sohamsa] On

Behalf Of Rafal Gendarz

Friday, July 06, 2007 2:35 AM

sohamsa@ .com

Re: Re: Vedic Clothes

 

 

 

 

 

 

hraum namah adityaya

 

Dear Tijana,

 

Exactly! I gave the same example. Its so obvious from the sastras that

I cant understand their arguments fully.

 

It seems that they say that CURRENT SARIS AND DHOTIS have nothing to do

with VEDIC CLOTHING.

 

Therefore wanted to grasp information about VEDIC CLOTHING.

 

Thank You for help.

 

 

Regards,

Rafal Gendarz

Sri Jagannath Center Guru

email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) com

Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com

 

 

nix_nixen napisa³(a):

 

 

Om Gurave Namah

Dear Rafal,

i`m sure there`s much more on traditional clothing than we can

imagine. There`s a mention of sari in the Mahabharata- the famous

story of Krisna`s protecting Draupadi`s virtue that proves long

history of sari.

One of the important thing about sari and other traditional clothes

is believing that the unstitched fabric is pure. Modifications were

done with coming of the Muslims and English. Probably only Indian

scholars of history of clothing and costume could say what is

traditional in clothes we are seeing today.

Color, fabric, ornaments, wearing bring together a specific message

and honestly i think that choice of saris and dhotis of people today

(especially from the west) is accidental or half-understood.

As for Devatas my guess is that the color of the clothes and

ornaments are important.

Hope this helps in some way.

Warm regards,

Tijana

 

sohamsa@

..com, Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme@ ...> wrote:

>

> *hraum namah adityaya*

>

> Dear Bharat,

>

> Indeed Veda is worrying about culture. Clothes are connected to

culture

> obviously. Differentation based on role in society doesnt negate

fact

> that we can say some clothing is Vedic or not. I wanted to know

how

much

> Devatas clothes are connected to current dhotis and saris (esp

those

> worn by Iskcon). I thought that would be very easy for those who

were

> born in India .

>

>

> Regards,

> Rafal Gendarz

> Sri Jagannath Center Guru

> email: rafal

> Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com

>

>

> Bharat - Hindu Astrology napisa?(a):

> >

> > Namaste Sri Rafal

> >

> > Vedic Clothes? That is a new one. Veda as a pramana to

Satyam,

isn't

> > worried about clothes. Sri Adi Sankaracharya prescribed ochre

 

robes

> > for those taking Sanyasa. Kings, learned men and Sanyasis

have

all

> > been the knowers of the Truth. They all wore different

clothes.

> >

> > Thanks and Regards

> > Bharat

> >

> > On 7/4/07, *Rafal Gendarz* <starsuponme@ wp.pl

> > <starsuponme

> wrote:

> >

> > *hraum namah adityaya*

> >

> > Dear Jyotishas,

> >

> > Could you help me with one issue? I have one debate with few

> > iskcon devotees which proclaim that dhoti and sari are not

vedic

> > clothes. Could You give me some classical slokas which

describe

> > that Devatas, Rsis or Sastric Women wearing Dhoti/Sari? I

tried to

> > seek in Bhagavatam, but there is no Sanskrit word for Sari nor

> > Dhoti. What is Your view? Im not attached to name, but to

form of

> > that clothing.

> >

> >

> > Regards,

> > Rafal Gendarz

> > Sri Jagannath Center Guru

> > email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) com <rafal@

....>

> > Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa.

com <http://www.rohinaa. com>

> >

> >

> >

>

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Dear Rafal,

 

Tijana talked abt Mahabharat time, and Vedas are much older than that age.

now where is written that Drupadi was wearing Sari which is still used in current age. ??

She might be wearing something else.

 

But you can try in Parampara Library for such notes, definately you can find it there.

 

Warm Regards,

 

Tarun

 

 

 

 

-

Rafal Gendarz

sohamsa

Friday, July 06, 2007 1:53 PM

Re: Re: Vedic Clothes

 

 

hraum namah adityayaDear Tarun,Vedas & Puranas spoke about everything, every aspect has its own meaning as Tijana presneted. I was discussing these things with Iskcon devotees, and wanted to broaden horizons on that aspect. Simple as that.Regards,Rafal Gendarz Sri Jagannath Center Guruemail: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) comJyotish pages: www.rohinaa.com~Tarun~ napisa³(a):

 

 

 

 

Dear Rafal ,

 

I guess you didnt presented your question in specific way.

 

What would you like to know by Vedic System.

 

should vedas tell how to wear clothes ?? or what to wear as clothes.

or what to wear during Yagya or while making some havan etc.

 

 

 

Regards,

 

Tarun

 

 

 

 

-

Rafal Gendarz

sohamsa@ .com

Friday, July 06, 2007 1:42 PM

Re: Re: Vedic Clothes

 

 

hraum namah adityaya Dear Tarun,Im not talkin about Rsis, but Vedic way of clothing the people in general. How this model differs from current clothing? I mean from dhoti, sari.About states: still some state can be closer to what Veda/Puranas describe.Im sure its there in sastras.Regards,Rafal Gendarz Sri Jagannath Center Guru email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) comJyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com~Tarun~ napisa³(a):

 

 

 

 

Dear Rafal,

 

As i wrote in my previous email, that Rishis were to wear Different clothes then the general public.

 

Saree / Dhoti is not vedic one.

 

No state can represent Closest form of Vedic which you are looking for. because all states were to follow the tradition around them.

 

Rishis were to wear unstiched cloth around them, and the same was with women that time.

In south india you will find different way.

unfortunately you wont be able to get this in shastras but this is what we learned from history and from Temples.

 

The current way Saree is worn is a from kind of fashion change.

and dhoti ( for male ) is from traditon.

 

Regards,

 

Tarun

 

 

 

-

Rafal Gendarz

sohamsa@ .com

Friday, July 06, 2007 1:05 PM

Re: Re: Vedic Clothes

 

 

hraum namah adityaya Dear Shaileshji, Tijanaji, Bharatji, Tarunji,Tarun: So which state of India represents closest form? Is some form closest to Vedic?Shailesh: yes, but what was the Vedic Clothing?Regards,Rafal Gendarz Sri Jagannath Center Guru email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) comJyotish pages: www.rohinaa. comShailesh C Chadha napisa³(a):

 

 

 

 

 

|| Om Gurave Namah | Om Namo Naraayanaaya| |

Dear Rafal & Tijana,

I am afraid your ISKON friends are correct on this count.

Have you compared the so called Vedic clothes – Dhoti or saree – with the ancient Egyptian, Greece or even Roman clothes???

They all seem so similar - all of them wore unstiched cloths, loosely resembling the traditional dhoti – the only difference was the type, and direction, of the wrap.

So also for the head-gear, or turbans.

These changed with the time, with the development of tailoring skills, and with the local ‘fashion’.

Regards,

Shailesh

 

 

sohamsa@ .com [sohamsa] On Behalf Of Rafal GendarzFriday, July 06, 2007 2:35 AMsohamsa@ .comRe: Re: Vedic Clothes

 

 

 

hraum namah adityaya Dear Tijana,Exactly! I gave the same example. Its so obvious from the sastras that I cant understand their arguments fully.It seems that they say that CURRENT SARIS AND DHOTIS have nothing to do with VEDIC CLOTHING. Therefore wanted to grasp information about VEDIC CLOTHING.Thank You for help.Regards,Rafal Gendarz Sri Jagannath Center Guruemail: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) comJyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com nix_nixen napisa³(a):

 

 

Om Gurave NamahDear Rafal,i`m sure there`s much more on traditional clothing than we can imagine. There`s a mention of sari in the Mahabharata- the famous story of Krisna`s protecting Draupadi`s virtue that proves long history of sari.One of the important thing about sari and other traditional clothes is believing that the unstitched fabric is pure. Modifications were done with coming of the Muslims and English. Probably only Indian scholars of history of clothing and costume could say what is traditional in clothes we are seeing today.Color, fabric, ornaments, wearing bring together a specific message and honestly i think that choice of saris and dhotis of people today (especially from the west) is accidental or half-understood.As for Devatas my guess is that the color of the clothes and ornaments are important.Hope this helps in some way. Warm regards,Tijana sohamsa@ .com, Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme@ ...> wrote:>> *hraum namah adityaya*> > Dear Bharat,> > Indeed Veda is worrying about culture. Clothes are connected to culture > obviously. Differentation based on role in society doesnt negate fact > that we can say some clothing is Vedic or not. I wanted to know how much > Devatas clothes are connected to current dhotis and saris (esp those > worn by Iskcon). I thought that would be very easy for those who were > born in India .> > > Regards,> Rafal Gendarz> Sri Jagannath Center Guru> email: rafal Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com> > > Bharat - Hindu Astrology napisa?(a):> >> > Namaste Sri Rafal> >> > Vedic Clothes? That is a new one. Veda as a pramana to Satyam, isn't > > worried about clothes. Sri Adi Sankaracharya prescribed ochre robes > > for those taking Sanyasa. Kings, learned men and Sanyasis have all > > been the knowers of the Truth. They all wore different clothes.> >> > Thanks and Regards> > Bharat> >> > On 7/4/07, *Rafal Gendarz* <starsuponme@ wp.pl > > <starsuponme > wrote:> >> > *hraum namah adityaya*> >> > Dear Jyotishas,> >> > Could you help me with one issue? I have one debate with few> > iskcon devotees which proclaim that dhoti and sari are not vedic> > clothes. Could You give me some classical slokas which describe> > that Devatas, Rsis or Sastric Women wearing Dhoti/Sari? I tried to> > seek in Bhagavatam, but there is no Sanskrit word for Sari nor> > Dhoti. What is Your view? Im not attached to name, but to form of> > that clothing.> >> >> > Regards,> > Rafal Gendarz> > Sri Jagannath Center Guru> > email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) com <rafal@ ...>> > Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com <http://www.rohinaa. com>> >> >> >>

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|| Om Gurave Namah | Om Namo Naraayanaaya||

 

Dear Rafal,

Your question is very difficult - almost impossible - to answer.

 

To start with, we do not know what is the 'VEDIC TIME'.

 

To me, Vedas are eternal - SHASHWAT; they represent divine knowledge - not human.

 

Your question relates to human practices.

 

Also, Vedas are part of oral knowledge - there were no written books or pictorial representations at that time. So, there is no 'evidence' of the clothing used at that time.

 

 

The ancient literature - Puranas and Itihaas - generally refer to 'VASTRA', meaning 'cloths', like 'angavastra', 'kativastra', 'adhovastra', etc. I do not recall any mention of the type of clothing - not that my stdies or knowledge is all that exhaustive. But as Tijana mentioned, 'cheera-harana' episode from Mahabharata is so welll-known.

 

 

Also, please appreciate that Vedas represent 'spiritual' knowledge, not the 'social' or the 'cultural' knowledge. And, I would not use the terms VEDAS and PURANAS interchangeably.

 

 

So, the question may remain unresolved; unfortunately.

 

Regards,

 

Shailesh

 

On 7/6/07, Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme wrote:

 

 

 

 

 

hraum namah adityayaDear Shaileshji, Tijanaji, Bharatji, Tarunji,Tarun: So which state of India represents closest form? Is some form closest to Vedic?

Shailesh: yes, but what was the Vedic Clothing?Regards,Rafal Gendarz Sri Jagannath Center Guru

email: rafalJyotish pages:

www.rohinaa.comShailesh C Chadha napisał(a):

 

 

 

 

 

 

|| Om Gurave Namah | Om Namo Naraayanaaya| |

Dear Rafal & Tijana,

I am afraid your ISKON friends are correct on this count.

Have you compared the so called Vedic clothes – Dhoti or saree – with the ancient Egyptian, Greece or even Roman clothes???

They all seem so similar - all of them wore unstiched cloths, loosely resembling the traditional dhoti – the only difference was the type, and direction, of the wrap.

So also for the head-gear, or turbans.

These changed with the time, with the development of tailoring skills, and with the local 'fashion'.

Regards,

Shailesh

 

 

sohamsa@ .com [sohamsa] On Behalf Of

Rafal GendarzFriday, July 06, 2007 2:35 AMsohamsa@ .comRe: Re: Vedic Clothes

 

 

 

hraum namah adityaya Dear Tijana,Exactly! I gave the same example. Its so obvious from the sastras that I cant understand their arguments fully.It seems that they say that CURRENT SARIS AND DHOTIS have nothing to do with VEDIC CLOTHING. Therefore wanted to grasp information about VEDIC CLOTHING.Thank You for help.Regards,Rafal Gendarz Sri Jagannath Center Guruemail:

rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) comJyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com nix_nixen napisał(a):

 

 

Om Gurave NamahDear Rafal,i`m sure there`s much more on traditional clothing than we can imagine. There`s a mention of sari in the Mahabharata- the famous story of Krisna`s protecting Draupadi`s virtue that proves long history of sari.One of the important thing about sari and other traditional clothes is believing that the unstitched fabric is pure. Modifications were done with coming of the Muslims and English. Probably only Indian scholars of history of clothing and costume could say what is traditional in clothes we are seeing today.Color, fabric, ornaments, wearing bring together a specific message and honestly i think that choice of saris and dhotis of people today (especially from the west) is accidental or half-understood.As for Devatas my guess is that the color of the clothes and ornaments are important.Hope this helps in some way. Warm regards,Tijana

sohamsa@ .com, Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme@ ...> wrote:>> *hraum namah adityaya*

> > Dear Bharat,> > Indeed Veda is worrying about culture. Clothes are connected to culture > obviously. Differentation based on role in society doesnt negate fact > that we can say some clothing is Vedic or not. I wanted to know how much > Devatas clothes are connected to current dhotis and saris (esp those > worn by Iskcon). I thought that would be very easy for those who were > born in India .> > > Regards,

> Rafal Gendarz> Sri Jagannath Center Guru> email: rafal Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa

.. com> > > Bharat - Hindu Astrology napisa?(a):> >> > Namaste Sri Rafal> >> > Vedic Clothes? That is a new one. Veda as a pramana to Satyam, isn't > > worried about clothes. Sri Adi Sankaracharya prescribed ochre robes > > for those taking Sanyasa. Kings, learned men and Sanyasis have all > > been the knowers of the Truth. They all wore different clothes.> >> > Thanks and Regards

> > Bharat> >> > On 7/4/07, *Rafal Gendarz* <starsuponme@ wp.pl > > <starsuponme

> wrote:> >> > *hraum namah adityaya*> >> > Dear Jyotishas,> >> > Could you help me with one issue? I have one debate with few> > iskcon devotees which proclaim that dhoti and sari are not vedic> > clothes. Could You give me some classical slokas which describe> > that Devatas, Rsis or Sastric Women wearing Dhoti/Sari? I tried to> > seek in Bhagavatam, but there is no Sanskrit word for Sari nor

> > Dhoti. What is Your view? Im not attached to name, but to form of> > that clothing.> >> >> > Regards,> > Rafal Gendarz> > Sri Jagannath Center Guru

> > email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) com <rafal@ ...>> > Jyotish pages:

www.rohinaa. com <http://www.rohinaa. com>> >> >> >>

 

 

 

-- Shailesh C Chadha

#18A, St#11, Lane#2, East Marredpally, Secunderabad [AP] - 5000 026, INDIATel:+91 40-27733478(O);27737779 ® (Cell) +91 984 999 4837- Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.

- Those who want to be SUCCESSFUL will find a way. Those who don't will find an EXCUSE.________________________________

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Dear Shailesh ji,

 

yes Tijana mentioned Cheer Haran not Sari Haran.

 

so we cannot justify/ find in written that Sari or Dhoti is according to Vedic.

 

Regards,

 

Tarun

 

-

Shailesh Chadha

sohamsa

Friday, July 06, 2007 2:25 PM

Re: Re: Vedic Clothes

 

 

 

|| Om Gurave Namah | Om Namo Naraayanaaya||

 

Dear Rafal,

Your question is very difficult - almost impossible - to answer.

 

To start with, we do not know what is the 'VEDIC TIME'.

 

To me, Vedas are eternal - SHASHWAT; they represent divine knowledge - not human.

 

Your question relates to human practices.

 

Also, Vedas are part of oral knowledge - there were no written books or pictorial representations at that time. So, there is no 'evidence' of the clothing used at that time.

 

The ancient literature - Puranas and Itihaas - generally refer to 'VASTRA', meaning 'cloths', like 'angavastra', 'kativastra', 'adhovastra', etc. I do not recall any mention of the type of clothing - not that my stdies or knowledge is all that exhaustive. But as Tijana mentioned, 'cheera-harana' episode from Mahabharata is so welll-known.

 

Also, please appreciate that Vedas represent 'spiritual' knowledge, not the 'social' or the 'cultural' knowledge. And, I would not use the terms VEDAS and PURANAS interchangeably.

 

So, the question may remain unresolved; unfortunately.

 

Regards,

 

Shailesh

On 7/6/07, Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme (AT) wp (DOT) pl> wrote:

 

 

 

 

hraum namah adityayaDear Shaileshji, Tijanaji, Bharatji, Tarunji,Tarun: So which state of India represents closest form? Is some form closest to Vedic? Shailesh: yes, but what was the Vedic Clothing?Regards,Rafal Gendarz Sri Jagannath Center Guruemail: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) comJyotish pages: www.rohinaa.comShailesh C Chadha napisał(a):

 

 

 

 

 

 

|| Om Gurave Namah | Om Namo Naraayanaaya| |

Dear Rafal & Tijana,

I am afraid your ISKON friends are correct on this count.

Have you compared the so called Vedic clothes – Dhoti or saree – with the ancient Egyptian, Greece or even Roman clothes???

They all seem so similar - all of them wore unstiched cloths, loosely resembling the traditional dhoti – the only difference was the type, and direction, of the wrap.

So also for the head-gear, or turbans.

These changed with the time, with the development of tailoring skills, and with the local 'fashion'.

Regards,

Shailesh

 

 

sohamsa@ .com [sohamsa] On Behalf Of Rafal GendarzFriday, July 06, 2007 2:35 AMsohamsa@ .comRe: Re: Vedic Clothes

 

 

 

hraum namah adityaya Dear Tijana,Exactly! I gave the same example. Its so obvious from the sastras that I cant understand their arguments fully.It seems that they say that CURRENT SARIS AND DHOTIS have nothing to do with VEDIC CLOTHING. Therefore wanted to grasp information about VEDIC CLOTHING.Thank You for help.Regards,Rafal Gendarz Sri Jagannath Center Guruemail: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) comJyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com nix_nixen napisał(a):

 

 

Om Gurave NamahDear Rafal,i`m sure there`s much more on traditional clothing than we can imagine. There`s a mention of sari in the Mahabharata- the famous story of Krisna`s protecting Draupadi`s virtue that proves long history of sari.One of the important thing about sari and other traditional clothes is believing that the unstitched fabric is pure. Modifications were done with coming of the Muslims and English. Probably only Indian scholars of history of clothing and costume could say what is traditional in clothes we are seeing today.Color, fabric, ornaments, wearing bring together a specific message and honestly i think that choice of saris and dhotis of people today (especially from the west) is accidental or half-understood.As for Devatas my guess is that the color of the clothes and ornaments are important.Hope this helps in some way. Warm regards,Tijana sohamsa@ .com, Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme@ ...> wrote:>> *hraum namah adityaya* > > Dear Bharat,> > Indeed Veda is worrying about culture. Clothes are connected to culture > obviously. Differentation based on role in society doesnt negate fact > that we can say some clothing is Vedic or not. I wanted to know how much > Devatas clothes are connected to current dhotis and saris (esp those > worn by Iskcon). I thought that would be very easy for those who were > born in India .> > > Regards, > Rafal Gendarz> Sri Jagannath Center Guru> email: rafal Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa . com> > > Bharat - Hindu Astrology napisa?(a):> >> > Namaste Sri Rafal> >> > Vedic Clothes? That is a new one. Veda as a pramana to Satyam, isn't > > worried about clothes. Sri Adi Sankaracharya prescribed ochre robes > > for those taking Sanyasa. Kings, learned men and Sanyasis have all > > been the knowers of the Truth. They all wore different clothes.> >> > Thanks and Regards> > Bharat> >> > On 7/4/07, *Rafal Gendarz* <starsuponme@ wp.pl > > <starsuponme > wrote:> >> > *hraum namah adityaya*> >> > Dear Jyotishas,> >> > Could you help me with one issue? I have one debate with few> > iskcon devotees which proclaim that dhoti and sari are not vedic> > clothes. Could You give me some classical slokas which describe> > that Devatas, Rsis or Sastric Women wearing Dhoti/Sari? I tried to> > seek in Bhagavatam, but there is no Sanskrit word for Sari nor > > Dhoti. What is Your view? Im not attached to name, but to form of> > that clothing.> >> >> > Regards,> > Rafal Gendarz> > Sri Jagannath Center Guru > > email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) com <rafal@ ...>> > Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com <http://www.rohinaa. com>> >> >> >>

 

 

 

-- Shailesh C Chadha#18A, St#11, Lane#2, East Marredpally, Secunderabad [AP] - 5000 026, INDIATel:+91 40-27733478(O);27737779 ® (Cell) +91 984 999 4837- Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind. - Those who want to be SUCCESSFUL will find a way. Those who don't will find an EXCUSE.________________________________

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hraum namah adityaya

 

Dear Shailesh,

 

#1 Vedic means what is described by Veda or Purana (Panca-Veda). If we

could get accurate description then our problem is over. Agree?

 

#2 Divine is author, but subject surely refers to humans. So clothes

also.

 

#3 How Cheera differs from Sari - that is question.

 

 

Regards,

Rafal Gendarz

Sri Jagannath Center Guru

email: rafal

Jyotish pages:

www.rohinaa.com

 

 

Shailesh Chadha napisał(a):

 

 

 

 

|| Om Gurave Namah | Om Namo Naraayanaaya| |

Dear Rafal,

Your question is very difficult - almost impossible - to

answer.

 

To start with, we do not know what is the 'VEDIC TIME'.

 

 

To me, Vedas are eternal - SHASHWAT; they represent

divine knowledge - not human.

 

Your question relates to human practices.

 

Also, Vedas are part of oral knowledge - there were no

written books or pictorial representations at that time. So, there is

no 'evidence' of the clothing used at that time.

 

 

The ancient literature - Puranas and Itihaas - generally

refer to 'VASTRA', meaning 'cloths', like 'angavastra', 'kativastra',

'adhovastra', etc. I do not recall any mention of the type of clothing

- not that my stdies or knowledge is all that exhaustive. But as Tijana

mentioned, 'cheera-harana' episode from Mahabharata is so welll-known.

 

 

Also, please appreciate that Vedas represent 'spiritual'

knowledge, not the 'social' or the 'cultural' knowledge. And, I would

not use the terms VEDAS and PURANAS interchangeably.

 

 

So, the question may remain unresolved; unfortunately.

 

 

Regards,

Shailesh

 

 

On 7/6/07, Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme@ wp.pl> wrote:

 

 

 

 

 

hraum namah adityaya

 

Dear Shaileshji, Tijanaji, Bharatji, Tarunji,

 

Tarun: So which state of India represents closest form? Is some form

closest to Vedic?

 

 

Shailesh: yes, but what was the Vedic Clothing?

 

Regards,

Rafal Gendarz

Sri Jagannath Center Guru

email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT)

com

Jyotish pages:

www.rohinaa. com

 

 

Shailesh C Chadha napisał(a):

 

 

 

 

 

 

|| Om Gurave Namah | Om Namo Naraayanaaya| |

 

Dear Rafal & Tijana,

 

I am afraid your ISKON friends are correct on this

count.

 

Have you compared the so called Vedic clothes – Dhoti or

saree – with the ancient Egyptian, Greece or even Roman clothes???

 

They all seem so similar - all of them wore unstiched

cloths, loosely resembling the traditional dhoti – the only difference

was the type, and direction, of the wrap.

 

So also for the head-gear, or turbans.

 

These changed with the time, with the development of

tailoring skills, and with the local 'fashion'.

 

Regards,

 

Shailesh

 

 

 

sohamsa@ .com [sohamsa] On

Behalf Of

Rafal Gendarz

Friday, July 06, 2007 2:35 AM

sohamsa@ .com

Re: Re: Vedic Clothes

 

 

 

 

 

 

hraum namah adityaya

 

Dear Tijana,

 

Exactly! I gave the same example. Its so obvious from the sastras that

I cant understand their arguments fully.

 

It seems that they say that CURRENT SARIS AND DHOTIS have nothing to do

with VEDIC CLOTHING.

 

Therefore wanted to grasp information about VEDIC CLOTHING.

 

Thank You for help.

 

 

Regards,

Rafal Gendarz

Sri Jagannath Center Guru

email:

rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) com

Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com

 

 

nix_nixen napisał(a):

 

 

Om Gurave Namah

Dear Rafal,

i`m sure there`s much more on traditional clothing than we can

imagine. There`s a mention of sari in the Mahabharata- the famous

story of Krisna`s protecting Draupadi`s virtue that proves long

history of sari.

One of the important thing about sari and other traditional clothes

is believing that the unstitched fabric is pure. Modifications were

done with coming of the Muslims and English. Probably only Indian

scholars of history of clothing and costume could say what is

traditional in clothes we are seeing today.

Color, fabric, ornaments, wearing bring together a specific message

and honestly i think that choice of saris and dhotis of people today

(especially from the west) is accidental or half-understood.

As for Devatas my guess is that the color of the clothes and

ornaments are important.

Hope this helps in some way.

Warm regards,

Tijana

 

sohamsa@

..com, Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme@ ...> wrote:

>

> *hraum namah adityaya*

 

>

> Dear Bharat,

>

> Indeed Veda is worrying about culture. Clothes are connected to

culture

> obviously. Differentation based on role in society doesnt negate

fact

> that we can say some clothing is Vedic or not. I wanted to know

how

much

> Devatas clothes are connected to current dhotis and saris (esp

those

> worn by Iskcon). I thought that would be very easy for those who

were

> born in India .

>

>

> Regards,

 

> Rafal Gendarz

> Sri Jagannath Center Guru

> email: rafal

> Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa

.. com

>

>

> Bharat - Hindu Astrology napisa?(a):

> >

> > Namaste Sri Rafal

> >

> > Vedic Clothes? That is a new one. Veda as a pramana to

Satyam,

isn't

> > worried about clothes. Sri Adi Sankaracharya prescribed ochre

 

robes

> > for those taking Sanyasa. Kings, learned men and Sanyasis

have

all

> > been the knowers of the Truth. They all wore different

clothes.

> >

> > Thanks and Regards

> > Bharat

> >

> > On 7/4/07, *Rafal Gendarz* <starsuponme@ wp.pl

> > <starsuponme

> wrote:

> >

> > *hraum namah adityaya*

> >

> > Dear Jyotishas,

> >

> > Could you help me with one issue? I have one debate with few

> > iskcon devotees which proclaim that dhoti and sari are not

vedic

> > clothes. Could You give me some classical slokas which

describe

> > that Devatas, Rsis or Sastric Women wearing Dhoti/Sari? I

tried to

> > seek in Bhagavatam, but there is no Sanskrit word for Sari

nor

 

> > Dhoti. What is Your view? Im not attached to name, but to

form of

> > that clothing.

> >

> >

> > Regards,

> > Rafal Gendarz

> > Sri Jagannath Center Guru

 

> > email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) com <rafal@

....>

> > Jyotish pages:

www.rohinaa. com <http://www.rohinaa.

com>

> >

> >

> >

>

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

--

Shailesh C Chadha

 

#18A, St#11, Lane#2, East Marredpally,

Secunderabad [AP] - 5000 026, INDIA

Tel:+91 40-27733478( O);27737779 ®

      (Cell) +91 984 999 4837

____________ _________ _________ ____- Be who you are and say what you

feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't

mind.

 

- Those who want to be SUCCESSFUL will find a way. Those who don't will

find an EXCUSE.

____________ _________ _________ __

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest guest



Dear Rafal,

 

cheer means cloth, not sari.

 

Regards,

 

Tarun

 

 

-

Rafal Gendarz

sohamsa

Friday, July 06, 2007 2:45 PM

Re: Re: Vedic Clothes

 

 

hraum namah adityayaDear Shailesh,#1 Vedic means what is described by Veda or Purana (Panca-Veda). If we could get accurate description then our problem is over. Agree?#2 Divine is author, but subject surely refers to humans. So clothes also.#3 How Cheera differs from Sari - that is question.Regards,Rafal Gendarz Sri Jagannath Center Guruemail: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) comJyotish pages: www.rohinaa.comShailesh Chadha napisał(a):

 

 

 

|| Om Gurave Namah | Om Namo Naraayanaaya| |

 

Dear Rafal,

Your question is very difficult - almost impossible - to answer.

 

To start with, we do not know what is the 'VEDIC TIME'.

 

To me, Vedas are eternal - SHASHWAT; they represent divine knowledge - not human.

 

Your question relates to human practices.

 

Also, Vedas are part of oral knowledge - there were no written books or pictorial representations at that time. So, there is no 'evidence' of the clothing used at that time.

 

The ancient literature - Puranas and Itihaas - generally refer to 'VASTRA', meaning 'cloths', like 'angavastra', 'kativastra', 'adhovastra', etc. I do not recall any mention of the type of clothing - not that my stdies or knowledge is all that exhaustive. But as Tijana mentioned, 'cheera-harana' episode from Mahabharata is so welll-known.

 

Also, please appreciate that Vedas represent 'spiritual' knowledge, not the 'social' or the 'cultural' knowledge. And, I would not use the terms VEDAS and PURANAS interchangeably.

 

So, the question may remain unresolved; unfortunately.

 

Regards,

 

Shailesh

On 7/6/07, Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme@ wp.pl> wrote:

 

 

 

 

hraum namah adityaya Dear Shaileshji, Tijanaji, Bharatji, Tarunji,Tarun: So which state of India represents closest form? Is some form closest to Vedic? Shailesh: yes, but what was the Vedic Clothing?Regards,Rafal Gendarz Sri Jagannath Center Guru email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) comJyotish pages: www.rohinaa. comShailesh C Chadha napisał(a):

 

 

 

 

 

 

|| Om Gurave Namah | Om Namo Naraayanaaya| |

Dear Rafal & Tijana,

I am afraid your ISKON friends are correct on this count.

Have you compared the so called Vedic clothes – Dhoti or saree – with the ancient Egyptian, Greece or even Roman clothes???

They all seem so similar - all of them wore unstiched cloths, loosely resembling the traditional dhoti – the only difference was the type, and direction, of the wrap.

So also for the head-gear, or turbans.

These changed with the time, with the development of tailoring skills, and with the local 'fashion'.

Regards,

Shailesh

 

 

sohamsa@ .com [sohamsa] On Behalf Of Rafal GendarzFriday, July 06, 2007 2:35 AMsohamsa@ .comRe: Re: Vedic Clothes

 

 

 

hraum namah adityaya Dear Tijana,Exactly! I gave the same example. Its so obvious from the sastras that I cant understand their arguments fully.It seems that they say that CURRENT SARIS AND DHOTIS have nothing to do with VEDIC CLOTHING. Therefore wanted to grasp information about VEDIC CLOTHING.Thank You for help.Regards,Rafal Gendarz Sri Jagannath Center Guruemail: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) comJyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com nix_nixen napisał(a):

 

 

Om Gurave NamahDear Rafal,i`m sure there`s much more on traditional clothing than we can imagine. There`s a mention of sari in the Mahabharata- the famous story of Krisna`s protecting Draupadi`s virtue that proves long history of sari.One of the important thing about sari and other traditional clothes is believing that the unstitched fabric is pure. Modifications were done with coming of the Muslims and English. Probably only Indian scholars of history of clothing and costume could say what is traditional in clothes we are seeing today.Color, fabric, ornaments, wearing bring together a specific message and honestly i think that choice of saris and dhotis of people today (especially from the west) is accidental or half-understood.As for Devatas my guess is that the color of the clothes and ornaments are important.Hope this helps in some way. Warm regards,Tijana sohamsa@ .com, Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme@ ...> wrote:>> *hraum namah adityaya* > > Dear Bharat,> > Indeed Veda is worrying about culture. Clothes are connected to culture > obviously. Differentation based on role in society doesnt negate fact > that we can say some clothing is Vedic or not. I wanted to know how much > Devatas clothes are connected to current dhotis and saris (esp those > worn by Iskcon). I thought that would be very easy for those who were > born in India .> > > Regards, > Rafal Gendarz> Sri Jagannath Center Guru> email: rafal Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa . com> > > Bharat - Hindu Astrology napisa?(a):> >> > Namaste Sri Rafal> >> > Vedic Clothes? That is a new one. Veda as a pramana to Satyam, isn't > > worried about clothes. Sri Adi Sankaracharya prescribed ochre robes > > for those taking Sanyasa. Kings, learned men and Sanyasis have all > > been the knowers of the Truth. They all wore different clothes.> >> > Thanks and Regards> > Bharat> >> > On 7/4/07, *Rafal Gendarz* <starsuponme@ wp.pl > > <starsuponme > wrote:> >> > *hraum namah adityaya*> >> > Dear Jyotishas,> >> > Could you help me with one issue? I have one debate with few> > iskcon devotees which proclaim that dhoti and sari are not vedic> > clothes. Could You give me some classical slokas which describe> > that Devatas, Rsis or Sastric Women wearing Dhoti/Sari? I tried to> > seek in Bhagavatam, but there is no Sanskrit word for Sari nor > > Dhoti. What is Your view? Im not attached to name, but to form of> > that clothing.> >> >> > Regards,> > Rafal Gendarz> > Sri Jagannath Center Guru > > email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) com <rafal@ ...>> > Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com <http://www.rohinaa. com>> >> >> >>

 

-- Shailesh C Chadha#18A, St#11, Lane#2, East Marredpally, Secunderabad [AP] - 5000 026, INDIATel:+91 40-27733478( O);27737779 ® (Cell) +91 984 999 4837____________ _________ _________ ____- Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind. - Those who want to be SUCCESSFUL will find a way. Those who don't will find an EXCUSE.____________ _________ _________ __

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest guest

hraum namah adityaya

 

Dear Tarun,

 

Yes, what is the difference between current and those described in

Vedas - clear question.

 

 

Regards,

Rafal Gendarz

Sri Jagannath Center Guru

email: rafal

Jyotish pages:

www.rohinaa.com

 

 

~Tarun~ napisał(a):

 

 



 

Dear

Rafal,

 

cheer

means cloth, not sari.

 

Regards,

 

Tarun

 

 

-----

Original Message -----

 

Rafal

Gendarz

To:

sohamsa

 

Sent:

Friday, July 06, 2007 2:45 PM

Subject:

Re: Re: Vedic Clothes

 

 

 

hraum namah

adityaya

 

Dear Shailesh,

 

#1 Vedic means what is described by Veda or Purana (Panca-Veda).

If we could get accurate description then our problem is over. Agree?

 

#2 Divine is author, but subject surely refers to humans. So clothes

also.

 

#3 How Cheera differs from Sari - that is question.

 

 

Regards,

Rafal Gendarz

Sri Jagannath Center Guru

email:

rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) com

Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa.com

 

 

Shailesh Chadha napisał(a):

 

 

 

 

|| Om Gurave Namah | Om Namo Naraayanaaya| |

 

Dear Rafal,

Your question is very difficult - almost impossible -

to answer.

 

To start with, we do not know what is the 'VEDIC

TIME'.

 

To me, Vedas are eternal - SHASHWAT; they represent

divine knowledge - not human.

 

Your question relates to human practices.

 

Also, Vedas are part of oral knowledge - there were no

written books or pictorial representations at that time. So, there is

no 'evidence' of the clothing used at that time.

 

The ancient literature - Puranas and Itihaas -

generally refer to 'VASTRA', meaning 'cloths', like 'angavastra',

'kativastra', 'adhovastra', etc. I do not recall any mention

of the type of clothing - not that my stdies or knowledge is all that

exhaustive. But as Tijana mentioned, 'cheera-harana' episode from

Mahabharata is so welll-known.

 

Also, please appreciate that Vedas represent

'spiritual' knowledge, not the 'social' or the 'cultural' knowledge.

And, I would not use the terms VEDAS and PURANAS interchangeably.

 

So, the question may remain unresolved; unfortunately.

 

 

Regards,

 

Shailesh

 

 

On 7/6/07, Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme@ wp.pl> wrote:

 

 

 

 

 

hraum namah adityaya

 

Dear Shaileshji, Tijanaji, Bharatji, Tarunji,

 

Tarun: So which state of India represents closest form? Is some form

closest to Vedic?

 

Shailesh: yes, but what was the Vedic Clothing?

 

Regards,

Rafal Gendarz

Sri Jagannath Center Guru

email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT)

com

Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com

 

 

Shailesh C Chadha napisał(a):

 

 

 

 

 

 

|| Om Gurave Namah | Om Namo Naraayanaaya| |

 

Dear Rafal & Tijana,

 

I am afraid your ISKON friends are correct on this

count.

 

Have you compared the so called Vedic clothes –

Dhoti or saree – with the ancient Egyptian, Greece or even Roman

clothes???

 

They all seem so similar - all of them wore

unstiched cloths, loosely resembling the traditional dhoti – the only

difference was the type, and direction, of the wrap.

 

So also for the head-gear, or turbans.

 

These changed with the time, with the development of

tailoring skills, and with the local 'fashion'.

 

Regards,

 

Shailesh

 

 

 

sohamsa@ .com [sohamsa] On

Behalf Of Rafal Gendarz

Friday, July 06, 2007 2:35 AM

sohamsa@ .com

Re: Re: Vedic Clothes

 

 

 

 

 

 

hraum namah adityaya

 

Dear Tijana,

 

Exactly! I gave the same example. Its so obvious from the sastras that

I cant understand their arguments fully.

 

It seems that they say that CURRENT SARIS AND DHOTIS have nothing to do

with VEDIC CLOTHING.

 

Therefore wanted to grasp information about VEDIC CLOTHING.

 

Thank You for help.

 

 

Regards,

Rafal Gendarz

Sri Jagannath Center Guru

email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) com

Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com

 

 

nix_nixen napisał(a):

 

 

Om Gurave Namah

Dear Rafal,

i`m sure there`s much more on traditional clothing than we can

imagine. There`s a mention of sari in the Mahabharata- the famous

story of Krisna`s protecting Draupadi`s virtue that proves long

history of sari.

One of the important thing about sari and other traditional clothes

is believing that the unstitched fabric is pure. Modifications were

done with coming of the Muslims and English. Probably only Indian

scholars of history of clothing and costume could say what is

traditional in clothes we are seeing today.

Color, fabric, ornaments, wearing bring together a specific message

and honestly i think that choice of saris and dhotis of people today

(especially from the west) is accidental or half-understood.

As for Devatas my guess is that the color of the clothes and

ornaments are important.

Hope this helps in some way.

Warm regards,

Tijana

 

sohamsa@

..com, Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme@ ...> wrote:

>

> *hraum namah adityaya*

>

> Dear Bharat,

>

> Indeed Veda is worrying about culture. Clothes are connected to

culture

> obviously. Differentation based on role in society doesnt negate

fact

> that we can say some clothing is Vedic or not. I wanted to know

how

much

> Devatas clothes are connected to current dhotis and saris (esp

those

> worn by Iskcon). I thought that would be very easy for those who

were

> born in India .

>

>

> Regards,

> Rafal Gendarz

> Sri Jagannath Center Guru

> email: rafal

> Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa . com

>

>

> Bharat - Hindu Astrology napisa?(a):

> >

> > Namaste Sri Rafal

> >

> > Vedic Clothes? That is a new one. Veda as a pramana to

Satyam,

isn't

> > worried about clothes. Sri Adi Sankaracharya prescribed ochre

 

robes

> > for those taking Sanyasa. Kings, learned men and Sanyasis

have

all

> > been the knowers of the Truth. They all wore different

clothes.

> >

> > Thanks and Regards

> > Bharat

> >

> > On 7/4/07, *Rafal Gendarz* <starsuponme@ wp.pl

> > <starsuponme >

wrote:

> >

> > *hraum namah adityaya*

> >

> > Dear Jyotishas,

> >

> > Could you help me with one issue? I have one debate with few

> > iskcon devotees which proclaim that dhoti and sari are not

vedic

> > clothes. Could You give me some classical slokas which

describe

> > that Devatas, Rsis or Sastric Women wearing Dhoti/Sari? I

tried to

> > seek in Bhagavatam, but there is no Sanskrit word for Sari

nor

> > Dhoti. What is Your view? Im not attached to name, but to

form of

> > that clothing.

> >

> >

> > Regards,

> > Rafal Gendarz

> > Sri Jagannath Center Guru

> > email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) com <rafal@

....>

> > Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa.

com <http://www.rohinaa. com>

> >

> >

> >

>

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

--

Shailesh C Chadha

 

#18A, St#11, Lane#2, East Marredpally,

Secunderabad [AP] - 5000 026, INDIA

Tel:+91 40-27733478( O);27737779 ®

      (Cell) +91 984 999 4837

____________ _________ _________ ____- Be who you are and say what you

feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't

mind.

- Those who want to be SUCCESSFUL will find a way. Those who don't will

find an EXCUSE.

____________ _________ _________ __

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest guest



Dear Rafal,

 

The clear answer is that there was no such kind of stiching that time.

Neither the use of silk or other fabric was done

they were to use cotton made fabrics.

 

They were to wrap around the Cloth around there body. I hope this is helps.

 

Regards,

 

tarun

 

 

 

-

Rafal Gendarz

sohamsa

Friday, July 06, 2007 3:07 PM

Re: Re: Vedic Clothes

 

 

hraum namah adityayaDear Tarun,Yes, what is the difference between current and those described in Vedas - clear question.Regards,Rafal Gendarz Sri Jagannath Center Guruemail: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) comJyotish pages: www.rohinaa.com~Tarun~ napisał(a):

 



Dear Rafal,

 

cheer means cloth, not sari.

 

Regards,

 

Tarun

 

 

-

Rafal Gendarz

sohamsa

Friday, July 06, 2007 2:45 PM

Re: Re: Vedic Clothes

 

 

hraum namah adityayaDear Shailesh,#1 Vedic means what is described by Veda or Purana (Panca-Veda). If we could get accurate description then our problem is over. Agree?#2 Divine is author, but subject surely refers to humans. So clothes also.#3 How Cheera differs from Sari - that is question.Regards,Rafal Gendarz Sri Jagannath Center Guruemail: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) comJyotish pages: www.rohinaa.comShailesh Chadha napisał(a):

 

 

 

 

|| Om Gurave Namah | Om Namo Naraayanaaya| |

 

Dear Rafal,

Your question is very difficult - almost impossible - to answer.

 

To start with, we do not know what is the 'VEDIC TIME'.

 

To me, Vedas are eternal - SHASHWAT; they represent divine knowledge - not human.

 

Your question relates to human practices.

 

Also, Vedas are part of oral knowledge - there were no written books or pictorial representations at that time. So, there is no 'evidence' of the clothing used at that time.

 

The ancient literature - Puranas and Itihaas - generally refer to 'VASTRA', meaning 'cloths', like 'angavastra', 'kativastra', 'adhovastra', etc. I do not recall any mention of the type of clothing - not that my stdies or knowledge is all that exhaustive. But as Tijana mentioned, 'cheera-harana' episode from Mahabharata is so welll-known.

 

Also, please appreciate that Vedas represent 'spiritual' knowledge, not the 'social' or the 'cultural' knowledge. And, I would not use the terms VEDAS and PURANAS interchangeably.

 

So, the question may remain unresolved; unfortunately.

 

Regards,

 

Shailesh

On 7/6/07, Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme@ wp.pl> wrote:

 

 

 

 

hraum namah adityaya Dear Shaileshji, Tijanaji, Bharatji, Tarunji,Tarun: So which state of India represents closest form? Is some form closest to Vedic? Shailesh: yes, but what was the Vedic Clothing?Regards,Rafal Gendarz Sri Jagannath Center Guru email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) comJyotish pages: www.rohinaa. comShailesh C Chadha napisał(a):

 

 

 

 

 

 

|| Om Gurave Namah | Om Namo Naraayanaaya| |

Dear Rafal & Tijana,

I am afraid your ISKON friends are correct on this count.

Have you compared the so called Vedic clothes – Dhoti or saree – with the ancient Egyptian, Greece or even Roman clothes???

They all seem so similar - all of them wore unstiched cloths, loosely resembling the traditional dhoti – the only difference was the type, and direction, of the wrap.

So also for the head-gear, or turbans.

These changed with the time, with the development of tailoring skills, and with the local 'fashion'.

Regards,

Shailesh

 

 

sohamsa@ .com [sohamsa] On Behalf Of Rafal GendarzFriday, July 06, 2007 2:35 AMsohamsa@ .comRe: Re: Vedic Clothes

 

 

 

hraum namah adityaya Dear Tijana,Exactly! I gave the same example. Its so obvious from the sastras that I cant understand their arguments fully.It seems that they say that CURRENT SARIS AND DHOTIS have nothing to do with VEDIC CLOTHING. Therefore wanted to grasp information about VEDIC CLOTHING.Thank You for help.Regards,Rafal Gendarz Sri Jagannath Center Guruemail: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) comJyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com nix_nixen napisał(a):

 

 

Om Gurave NamahDear Rafal,i`m sure there`s much more on traditional clothing than we can imagine. There`s a mention of sari in the Mahabharata- the famous story of Krisna`s protecting Draupadi`s virtue that proves long history of sari.One of the important thing about sari and other traditional clothes is believing that the unstitched fabric is pure. Modifications were done with coming of the Muslims and English. Probably only Indian scholars of history of clothing and costume could say what is traditional in clothes we are seeing today.Color, fabric, ornaments, wearing bring together a specific message and honestly i think that choice of saris and dhotis of people today (especially from the west) is accidental or half-understood.As for Devatas my guess is that the color of the clothes and ornaments are important.Hope this helps in some way. Warm regards,Tijana sohamsa@ .com, Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme@ ...> wrote:>> *hraum namah adityaya* > > Dear Bharat,> > Indeed Veda is worrying about culture. Clothes are connected to culture > obviously. Differentation based on role in society doesnt negate fact > that we can say some clothing is Vedic or not. I wanted to know how much > Devatas clothes are connected to current dhotis and saris (esp those > worn by Iskcon). I thought that would be very easy for those who were > born in India .> > > Regards, > Rafal Gendarz> Sri Jagannath Center Guru> email: rafal Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa . com> > > Bharat - Hindu Astrology napisa?(a):> >> > Namaste Sri Rafal> >> > Vedic Clothes? That is a new one. Veda as a pramana to Satyam, isn't > > worried about clothes. Sri Adi Sankaracharya prescribed ochre robes > > for those taking Sanyasa. Kings, learned men and Sanyasis have all > > been the knowers of the Truth. They all wore different clothes.> >> > Thanks and Regards> > Bharat> >> > On 7/4/07, *Rafal Gendarz* <starsuponme@ wp.pl > > <starsuponme > wrote:> >> > *hraum namah adityaya*> >> > Dear Jyotishas,> >> > Could you help me with one issue? I have one debate with few> > iskcon devotees which proclaim that dhoti and sari are not vedic> > clothes. Could You give me some classical slokas which describe> > that Devatas, Rsis or Sastric Women wearing Dhoti/Sari? I tried to> > seek in Bhagavatam, but there is no Sanskrit word for Sari nor > > Dhoti. What is Your view? Im not attached to name, but to form of> > that clothing.> >> >> > Regards,> > Rafal Gendarz> > Sri Jagannath Center Guru > > email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) com <rafal@ ...>> > Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com <http://www.rohinaa. com>> >> >> >>

 

-- Shailesh C Chadha#18A, St#11, Lane#2, East Marredpally, Secunderabad [AP] - 5000 026, INDIATel:+91 40-27733478( O);27737779 ® (Cell) +91 984 999 4837____________ _________ _________ ____- Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind. - Those who want to be SUCCESSFUL will find a way. Those who don't will find an EXCUSE.____________ _________ _________ __

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Namaste Sri RafalOf course, the culture of India is purely connected to Vedas and Puranas. In fact, it is this culture that binds the entire country together. The culture of Hindutva - the way of life as per Vedas and Puranas, is the binding force of the Bharatvarsha (India). If the question pertains to what qualifies as a spiritual cloth - then, it would mean the one that has come after least harm to anyone. Let's say - cotton, jute, leafs, etc. Definitely not silk which comes from harming a whole load of insects. As a basic rule - just decide which disturbs the nature least and causes least harm to any living organism.

As far as origins of Saree are concerned, you'd have to talk to historians. Someone once told me that there is a reference of Saree in the Rig Veda, but, I do not generally worry about such references so did not ask him the exact verse. You can also check Markendya Purana. When each of the Gods gave powers to Ma Durga, is there a reference on who gave the Vastra or a Saree? Thanks and RegardsBharatOn 7/5/07, Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme wrote:

 

 

 

 

 

hraum namah adityaya

 

Dear Bharat,

 

Yes, from Dvaita point of view Devatas have these clothes, not only as

symbols and also from eternal substance.

 

Anyway, You must admit that Culture in India has connection to Veda,

Purana. Its not something conventionally only. Therefore there must be

some logic which shows that these types of clothes should be worn by

spiritual people which I believe is very correct. Ajit says it has

connection to Ashtanga Yoga and I also feel that altough its not highly

important still there must be some sense behind it. I wanted to know

slokas in Sastra which says that Devatas are wearing clothes similar to

current dhotis/saris. I couldnt find word Sari, so I suspect it has

non-Vedic origin, however the cloth can have other name than this. What

do You think?

 

 

Regards,

Rafal Gendarz

Sri Jagannath Center Guru

email:

rafal

Jyotish pages:

www.rohinaa.com

 

 

Bharat - Hindu Astrology napisa³(a):

 

 

 

 

Namaste Sri Rafal

 

Vedas are connected to the Truth. The whole point is that any

vesha-bhusha is to be taken that brings thoughts of the Truth. For

example, Prabhu Krishna is blue in color and clothed in yellow. The

symbolic meaning is that the vastness like the space of Truth (blue

color) is clothes in yellow (in Earthly hue). Meaning the Lord in body

form. There is symbolism present in the culture. Like a tilak on the

forehead reminds us that we reside in the Lord and that makes us

auspicious. It makes us remember Prabhu in each human being. So on and

so forth.

 

A upasak can connect many clothes to symbolism. So it is best that the

change occurs within and clothes be left without so much

differentiation.

 

Thanks and Regards

Bharat

 

 

On 7/5/07, Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme@ wp.pl> wrote:

 

 

 

 

 

hraum namah adityaya

 

Dear Bharat,

 

Indeed Veda is worrying about culture. Clothes are connected to culture

obviously. Differentation based on role in society doesnt negate fact

that we can say some clothing is Vedic or not. I wanted to know how

much Devatas clothes are connected to current dhotis and saris (esp

those worn by Iskcon). I thought that would be very easy for those who

were born in India.

 

 

Regards,

Rafal Gendarz

Sri Jagannath Center Guru

email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT)

com

 

Jyotish pages:

www.rohinaa. com

 

 

Bharat - Hindu Astrology napisa³(a):

 

 

 

 

 

Namaste Sri Rafal

 

Vedic Clothes? That is a new one. Veda as a pramana to Satyam, isn't

worried about clothes. Sri Adi Sankaracharya prescribed ochre robes for

those taking Sanyasa. Kings, learned men and Sanyasis have all been the

knowers of the Truth. They all wore different clothes.

 

Thanks and Regards

Bharat

 

 

On 7/4/07, Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme@ wp.pl> wrote:

 

 

 

 

 

hraum namah adityaya

 

Dear Jyotishas,

 

Could you help me with one issue? I have one debate with few iskcon

devotees which proclaim that dhoti and sari are not vedic clothes.

Could You give me some classical slokas which describe that Devatas,

Rsis or Sastric Women wearing Dhoti/Sari? I tried to seek in

Bhagavatam, but there is no Sanskrit word for Sari nor Dhoti. What is

Your view? Im not attached to name, but to form of that clothing.

 

 

Regards,

Rafal Gendarz

Sri Jagannath Center Guru

email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) com

Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com

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Om Namah Shivaya

 

Dear Tarun, Namaste

 

Cotton or Linen - I trust linen. Linen was used in Egypt for mummification too. Please correct me if

Iam wrong.

 

In South India (Esp. Hindu and Nambootri) dhoti and saree for some special occation is tied in a specific

way. Is this very close to the ones done during the Vedic times. I remember they tied my dothi

to in this way during Upanayanam.

 

Rgds

Anand

On 7/6/07, ~Tarun~ <tarun.virgo wrote:

 

 

 

 

 

 Dear Rafal,

 

The clear answer is that there was no such kind of stiching that time.

Neither the use of silk or other fabric was done

they were to use cotton made fabrics.

 

They were to wrap around the Cloth around there body. I hope this is helps.

 

Regards,

 

tarun

 

 

 

-

Rafal Gendarz

sohamsa

Friday, July 06, 2007 3:07 PM

Re: Re: Vedic Clothes

 

 

hraum namah adityayaDear Tarun,Yes, what is the difference between current and those described in Vedas - clear question.

Regards,Rafal Gendarz Sri Jagannath Center Guruemail:

rafalJyotish pages: www.rohinaa.com~Tarun~ napisał(a):

 



Dear Rafal,

 

cheer means cloth, not sari.

 

Regards,

 

Tarun

 

 

-

 

Rafal Gendarz

 

sohamsa

Friday, July 06, 2007 2:45 PM

Re: Re: Vedic Clothes

 

 

hraum namah adityayaDear Shailesh,#1 Vedic means what is described by Veda or Purana (Panca-Veda). If we could get accurate description then our problem is over. Agree?

#2 Divine is author, but subject surely refers to humans. So clothes also.#3 How Cheera differs from Sari - that is question.Regards,Rafal Gendarz

Sri Jagannath Center Guruemail:

rafalJyotish pages: www.rohinaa.comShailesh Chadha napisał(a):

 

 

 

 

|| Om Gurave Namah | Om Namo Naraayanaaya| |

 

Dear Rafal,

Your question is very difficult - almost impossible - to answer.

 

To start with, we do not know what is the 'VEDIC TIME'.

 

To me, Vedas are eternal - SHASHWAT; they represent divine knowledge - not human.

 

Your question relates to human practices.

 

Also, Vedas are part of oral knowledge - there were no written books or pictorial representations at that time. So, there is no 'evidence' of the clothing used at that time.

 

The ancient literature - Puranas and Itihaas - generally refer to 'VASTRA', meaning 'cloths', like 'angavastra', 'kativastra', 'adhovastra', etc. I do not recall any mention of the type of clothing - not that my stdies or knowledge is all that exhaustive. But as Tijana mentioned, 'cheera-harana' episode from Mahabharata is so welll-known.

 

Also, please appreciate that Vedas represent 'spiritual' knowledge, not the 'social' or the 'cultural' knowledge. And, I would not use the terms VEDAS and PURANAS interchangeably.

 

 

So, the question may remain unresolved; unfortunately.

 

Regards,

 

Shailesh

On 7/6/07, Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme@ wp.pl> wrote:

 

 

 

 

hraum namah adityaya Dear Shaileshji, Tijanaji, Bharatji, Tarunji,Tarun: So which state of India represents closest form? Is some form closest to Vedic? Shailesh: yes, but what was the Vedic Clothing?

Regards,Rafal Gendarz Sri Jagannath Center Guru email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) com

Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. comShailesh C Chadha napisał(a):

 

 

 

 

 

 

|| Om Gurave Namah | Om Namo Naraayanaaya| |

Dear Rafal & Tijana,

I am afraid your ISKON friends are correct on this count.

Have you compared the so called Vedic clothes – Dhoti or saree – with the ancient Egyptian, Greece or even Roman clothes???

They all seem so similar - all of them wore unstiched cloths, loosely resembling the traditional dhoti – the only difference was the type, and direction, of the wrap.

So also for the head-gear, or turbans.

These changed with the time, with the development of tailoring skills, and with the local 'fashion'.

Regards,

Shailesh

 

 

sohamsa@ .com [sohamsa] On Behalf Of

Rafal GendarzFriday, July 06, 2007 2:35 AMsohamsa@ .comRe: Re: Vedic Clothes

 

 

 

hraum namah adityaya Dear Tijana,Exactly! I gave the same example. Its so obvious from the sastras that I cant understand their arguments fully.It seems that they say that CURRENT SARIS AND DHOTIS have nothing to do with VEDIC CLOTHING. Therefore wanted to grasp information about VEDIC CLOTHING.Thank You for help.Regards,Rafal Gendarz Sri Jagannath Center Guruemail:

rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) comJyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com nix_nixen napisał(a):

 

 

Om Gurave NamahDear Rafal,i`m sure there`s much more on traditional clothing than we can imagine. There`s a mention of sari in the Mahabharata- the famous story of Krisna`s protecting Draupadi`s virtue that proves long history of sari.One of the important thing about sari and other traditional clothes is believing that the unstitched fabric is pure. Modifications were done with coming of the Muslims and English. Probably only Indian scholars of history of clothing and costume could say what is traditional in clothes we are seeing today.Color, fabric, ornaments, wearing bring together a specific message and honestly i think that choice of saris and dhotis of people today (especially from the west) is accidental or half-understood.As for Devatas my guess is that the color of the clothes and ornaments are important.Hope this helps in some way. Warm regards,Tijana

sohamsa@ .com, Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme@ ...> wrote:>> *hraum namah adityaya* > > Dear Bharat,> > Indeed Veda is worrying about culture. Clothes are connected to culture > obviously. Differentation based on role in society doesnt negate fact > that we can say some clothing is Vedic or not. I wanted to know how much > Devatas clothes are connected to current dhotis and saris (esp those > worn by Iskcon). I thought that would be very easy for those who were > born in India .> > > Regards, > Rafal Gendarz> Sri Jagannath Center Guru> email: rafal Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa

.. com> > > Bharat - Hindu Astrology napisa?(a):> >> > Namaste Sri Rafal> >> > Vedic Clothes? That is a new one. Veda as a pramana to Satyam, isn't

> > worried about clothes. Sri Adi Sankaracharya prescribed ochre robes > > for those taking Sanyasa. Kings, learned men and Sanyasis have all > > been the knowers of the Truth. They all wore different clothes.

> >> > Thanks and Regards> > Bharat> >> > On 7/4/07, *Rafal Gendarz* <starsuponme@ wp.pl > > <

starsuponme > wrote:> >> > *hraum namah adityaya*> >> > Dear Jyotishas,> >> > Could you help me with one issue? I have one debate with few

> > iskcon devotees which proclaim that dhoti and sari are not vedic> > clothes. Could You give me some classical slokas which describe> > that Devatas, Rsis or Sastric Women wearing Dhoti/Sari? I tried to> > seek in Bhagavatam, but there is no Sanskrit word for Sari nor > > Dhoti. What is Your view? Im not attached to name, but to form of> > that clothing.> >> >

> > Regards,> > Rafal Gendarz> > Sri Jagannath Center Guru > > email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) com <

rafal@ ...>> > Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com <

http://www.rohinaa. com>> >> >> >>

 

-- Shailesh C Chadha#18A, St#11, Lane#2, East Marredpally, Secunderabad [AP] - 5000 026, INDIATel:+91 40-27733478( O);27737779 ®

(Cell) +91 984 999 4837____________ _________ _________ ____- Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind. - Those who want to be SUCCESSFUL will find a way. Those who don't will find an EXCUSE.

____________ _________ _________ __

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Dear Anand ji,

 

It was cotton or linen , but the thing is it was hand made cloth :-)

 

as Bharat ji said

""If the question pertains to what qualifies as a spiritual cloth - then, it would mean the one that has come after least harm to anyone. Let's say - cotton, jute, leafs, etc. Definitely not silk which comes from harming a whole load of insects. As a basic rule - just decide which disturbs the nature least and causes least harm to any living organism. ""

 

The Term Saree is not the correct word, Vastra was to be used in those times ,and no where we can find the term saree. We now call them saree actually.

 

Yes thats wht i asked in my previous mail to Rafal that , do he want to find wht Vedas say to wear or wht to wear and how to wear in Temples or Havan Yagya etc.

 

If we go by term then it will be Angvastra, or more detailed, but Sari is not the exact term.

Saree is an updated thing which is worn in current age.

as Shailesh ji too said in his mail

 

"The ancient literature - Puranas and Itihaas - generally refer to 'VASTRA', meaning 'cloths', like 'angavastra', 'kativastra', 'adhovastra', etc.

""

 

 

 

 

Regards,

 

Tarun

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

-

Anand Ravi

sohamsa

Friday, July 06, 2007 5:28 PM

Re: Re: Vedic Clothes

 

 

 

Om Namah Shivaya

 

Dear Tarun, Namaste

 

Cotton or Linen - I trust linen. Linen was used in Egypt for mummification too. Please correct me if

Iam wrong.

 

In South India (Esp. Hindu and Nambootri) dhoti and saree for some special occation is tied in a specific

way. Is this very close to the ones done during the Vedic times. I remember they tied my dothi

to in this way during Upanayanam.

 

Rgds

Anand

On 7/6/07, ~Tarun~ <tarun.virgo > wrote:

 

 

 

 

 Dear Rafal,

 

The clear answer is that there was no such kind of stiching that time.

Neither the use of silk or other fabric was done

they were to use cotton made fabrics.

 

They were to wrap around the Cloth around there body. I hope this is helps.

 

Regards,

 

tarun

 

 

 

-

Rafal Gendarz

sohamsa

Friday, July 06, 2007 3:07 PM

Re: Re: Vedic Clothes

 

 

hraum namah adityayaDear Tarun,Yes, what is the difference between current and those described in Vedas - clear question.Regards,Rafal Gendarz Sri Jagannath Center Guruemail: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) comJyotish pages: www.rohinaa.com~Tarun~ napisał(a):

 



Dear Rafal,

 

cheer means cloth, not sari.

 

Regards,

 

Tarun

 

 

-

Rafal Gendarz

sohamsa

Friday, July 06, 2007 2:45 PM

Re: Re: Vedic Clothes

 

 

hraum namah adityayaDear Shailesh,#1 Vedic means what is described by Veda or Purana (Panca-Veda). If we could get accurate description then our problem is over. Agree? #2 Divine is author, but subject surely refers to humans. So clothes also.#3 How Cheera differs from Sari - that is question.Regards,Rafal Gendarz Sri Jagannath Center Guruemail: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) comJyotish pages: www.rohinaa.comShailesh Chadha napisał(a):

 

 

 

 

|| Om Gurave Namah | Om Namo Naraayanaaya| |

 

Dear Rafal,

Your question is very difficult - almost impossible - to answer.

 

To start with, we do not know what is the 'VEDIC TIME'.

 

To me, Vedas are eternal - SHASHWAT; they represent divine knowledge - not human.

 

Your question relates to human practices.

 

Also, Vedas are part of oral knowledge - there were no written books or pictorial representations at that time. So, there is no 'evidence' of the clothing used at that time.

 

The ancient literature - Puranas and Itihaas - generally refer to 'VASTRA', meaning 'cloths', like 'angavastra', 'kativastra', 'adhovastra', etc. I do not recall any mention of the type of clothing - not that my stdies or knowledge is all that exhaustive. But as Tijana mentioned, 'cheera-harana' episode from Mahabharata is so welll-known.

 

Also, please appreciate that Vedas represent 'spiritual' knowledge, not the 'social' or the 'cultural' knowledge. And, I would not use the terms VEDAS and PURANAS interchangeably.

 

So, the question may remain unresolved; unfortunately.

 

Regards,

 

Shailesh

On 7/6/07, Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme@ wp.pl> wrote:

 

 

 

 

hraum namah adityaya Dear Shaileshji, Tijanaji, Bharatji, Tarunji,Tarun: So which state of India represents closest form? Is some form closest to Vedic? Shailesh: yes, but what was the Vedic Clothing? Regards,Rafal Gendarz Sri Jagannath Center Guru email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) com Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. comShailesh C Chadha napisał(a):

 

 

 

 

 

 

|| Om Gurave Namah | Om Namo Naraayanaaya| |

Dear Rafal & Tijana,

I am afraid your ISKON friends are correct on this count.

Have you compared the so called Vedic clothes – Dhoti or saree – with the ancient Egyptian, Greece or even Roman clothes???

They all seem so similar - all of them wore unstiched cloths, loosely resembling the traditional dhoti – the only difference was the type, and direction, of the wrap.

So also for the head-gear, or turbans.

These changed with the time, with the development of tailoring skills, and with the local 'fashion'.

Regards,

Shailesh

 

 

sohamsa@ .com [sohamsa] On Behalf Of Rafal GendarzFriday, July 06, 2007 2:35 AMsohamsa@ .comRe: Re: Vedic Clothes

 

 

 

hraum namah adityaya Dear Tijana,Exactly! I gave the same example. Its so obvious from the sastras that I cant understand their arguments fully.It seems that they say that CURRENT SARIS AND DHOTIS have nothing to do with VEDIC CLOTHING. Therefore wanted to grasp information about VEDIC CLOTHING.Thank You for help.Regards,Rafal Gendarz Sri Jagannath Center Guruemail: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) comJyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com nix_nixen napisał(a):

 

Om Gurave NamahDear Rafal,i`m sure there`s much more on traditional clothing than we can imagine. There`s a mention of sari in the Mahabharata- the famous story of Krisna`s protecting Draupadi`s virtue that proves long history of sari.One of the important thing about sari and other traditional clothes is believing that the unstitched fabric is pure. Modifications were done with coming of the Muslims and English. Probably only Indian scholars of history of clothing and costume could say what is traditional in clothes we are seeing today.Color, fabric, ornaments, wearing bring together a specific message and honestly i think that choice of saris and dhotis of people today (especially from the west) is accidental or half-understood.As for Devatas my guess is that the color of the clothes and ornaments are important.Hope this helps in some way. Warm regards,Tijana sohamsa@ .com, Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme@ ...> wrote:>> *hraum namah adityaya* > > Dear Bharat,> > Indeed Veda is worrying about culture. Clothes are connected to culture > obviously. Differentation based on role in society doesnt negate fact > that we can say some clothing is Vedic or not. I wanted to know how much > Devatas clothes are connected to current dhotis and saris (esp those > worn by Iskcon). I thought that would be very easy for those who were > born in India .> > > Regards, > Rafal Gendarz> Sri Jagannath Center Guru> email: rafal Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa . com> > > Bharat - Hindu Astrology napisa?(a):> >> > Namaste Sri Rafal> >> > Vedic Clothes? That is a new one. Veda as a pramana to Satyam, isn't > > worried about clothes. Sri Adi Sankaracharya prescribed ochre robes > > for those taking Sanyasa. Kings, learned men and Sanyasis have all > > been the knowers of the Truth. They all wore different clothes. > >> > Thanks and Regards> > Bharat> >> > On 7/4/07, *Rafal Gendarz* <starsuponme@ wp.pl > > < starsuponme > wrote:> >> > *hraum namah adityaya*> >> > Dear Jyotishas,> >> > Could you help me with one issue? I have one debate with few> > iskcon devotees which proclaim that dhoti and sari are not vedic> > clothes. Could You give me some classical slokas which describe> > that Devatas, Rsis or Sastric Women wearing Dhoti/Sari? I tried to> > seek in Bhagavatam, but there is no Sanskrit word for Sari nor > > Dhoti. What is Your view? Im not attached to name, but to form of> > that clothing.> >> > > > Regards,> > Rafal Gendarz> > Sri Jagannath Center Guru > > email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) com < rafal@ ...>> > Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com < http://www.rohinaa. com>> >> >> >>

 

-- Shailesh C Chadha#18A, St#11, Lane#2, East Marredpally, Secunderabad [AP] - 5000 026, INDIATel:+91 40-27733478( O);27737779 ® (Cell) +91 984 999 4837____________ _________ _________ ____- Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind. - Those who want to be SUCCESSFUL will find a way. Those who don't will find an EXCUSE. ____________ _________ _________ __

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