Why Navamsa Chart is so important?

[Guest guest]

Dear Prafulla ji,

* Even if those things are not there in ancient texts every one is

free to make or follow there own choice - yes, there is every chance

that even such new methods might give true results - your argument is

right.

* As far Sanskrit is concerned: Yes, it is your choice - when you

are blind to read and understand Sanskrit your self, and understand

what is there and what not, of course you have to follow someone who

says they see - you are right in that as well.

Love,

Sreenadh

 

, Prafulla Gang <jyotish

wrote:

>

> Well Sreenadh ji - at times, these issues become choice or

prejudices in our own form of reading model. Had there not been any

substance in interpreting D9 charts - lot many stalwarts must not

have explored it - and I presume - many of them know better

sanskrit / jyotish (rather both) than all of us on the forum

collectively. So if at all - anyone wish to contest the

interpretation - then many of those stalwarts are the people - must

be debated with. On the forum, where not many great sanskrit

scholars / jyotish researchers - the arguments may not have any

relevance.

>

> regards / Prafulla Gang

> http://www.prafulla.net

>

> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the right to

be taken seriously. "

> ************************************************

>

>

> >

> > sreesog

> > Tue, 03 Jul 2007 13:56:36 -0000

> >

> > Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important?

> >

> > Dear Prafulla ji,

> > * No ancient text ask us to read Navamsha (not chart) " just like

D1

> > chart " ; nor they provide slokas for the same.

> > * No ancient text provide as the results for " aspects of planets

in

> > Navamasa "

> > * Nor they give us the results to be predicted when planets are

> > placed " x house with reference to navamsa lagna "

> >

> > I hope we are trying to study astrology as taught by the sages;

If

> > not I don't have anything to say.

> >

> > Love,

> > Sreenadh

> >

> >

> > , Prafulla Gang <jyotish@>

> > wrote:

> >>

> >> Dear Sreenadh ji

> >>

> >> I have also observed many jyotish stalwarts using navamsa chart

> > (along with other D charts). Now how to assess D9 charts - can be

> > perspective. But - as most authors say - just like D1 chart.

> >>

> >> I request members to share their experience.

> >>

> >> regards / Prafulla Gang

> >> http://www.prafulla.net

> >>

> >> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the right

to

> > be taken seriously. "

> >> ************************************************

> >>

> >>

> >>>

> >>> sreesog@

> >>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 07:56:49 -0000

> >>>

> >>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important?

> >>>

> >>> Dear Krishna ji,

> >>> ==>

> >>>> I too to the view that Navamsa chart is

> >>>> as important as Rasi chart.

> >>> <==

> >>> * There is not Navamsa " chart " , but only Navamsa. Navamsa chart

> > is

> >>> not as important as Rasi chart and it can never be, because it

is

> >>> only an amsa. But yes, it is more important than other amsas due

> > to

> >>> the prior said reasons.

> >>> ==>

> >>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines the overall

> >>>> strength of a planet?

> >>> <==

> >>> * Because the quality of earth determines the strength of the

> >>> plant. This is applicable to all amsas as per their importance.

> >>> ==>

> >>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa chart like

> >>>> aspects in a Rasi chart?

> >>> <==

> >>> * No, it is not allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa. (There

> > is

> >>> no navamsa 'chart'.)

> >>>

> >>> ==>

> >>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be treated as

if

> >>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart?

> >>> <==

> >>> * No, when planets have sambandha in Navamsa, it only means

that.

> >>> When they have sombandha in Rasi, it only means that. It is

wrong

> > to

> >>> mix the two.

> >>> ==>

> >>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart as well?

> >>> <==

> >>> * No, Yogas should not be looked in Navamsa 'chart'. But yes

> > yoga in

> >>> Navamsa (not navamsa 'chart') can be taken yoga. Because it is

the

> >>> same principles as used in Rasi that are used to predict the

> > result

> >>> in Amsas as well - But Aspect(Drishti) and houses are not

> > applicable

> >>> to amsas. Both Aspect(Drishti) and Houses should be considered

in

> >>> Rasi chart itself. Any reference in ancient texts about aspect

or

> >>> houses essentially mean that they are referring to Rasi chart.

> >>> Love,

> >>> Sreenadh

> >>>

> >>> , Krishnamurthy Seetharama

> >>> <krishna_1998@> wrote:

> >>>>

> >>>> Dear Kolachina ji,

> >>>>

> >>>> It was interesting to read your comments on importance of the

> >>>> Navamsa chart. I too to the view that Navamsa chart

is

> >>>> as important as Rasi chart. This is based on my experience so

> >>>> far reading charts. However, I have still not understood what

> >>>> are the fundamental reasons for a varga chart being so

> >>>> important.

> >>>>

> >>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines the overall

> >>>> strength of a planet?

> >>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa chart like

> >>>> aspects in a Rasi chart?

> >>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be treated as

if

> >>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart?

> >>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart as well?

> >>>>

> >>>> By looking at the kind of importance given to Navamsa chart, it

> >>>> appears that the Rasi chart and Navamsa chart make up two equal

> >>>> halves representing the native.

> >>>>

> >>>> I have no doubts about the importance of Navamsa Chart. What I

> >>>> would like to know is why Navamsa gains such an importance?

What

> >>>> are the fundamental reasons? After all it is one of many varga

> >>>> charts!

> >>>>

> >>>> Regards,

> >>>> Krishna

> >>>>

> >>>> --- Satya Sai Kolachina <skolachi@> wrote:

> >>>>

> >>>>> Dear Sri Pradeep and Sri Chandrasekhar,

> >>>>>

> >>>>> I have been following this thread on karakamsa and both of

> >>>>> your

> >>>>> contributions.

> >>>>>

> >>>>> I whole-heartedly appreciate both of you for your valuable

> >>>>> inputs

> >>>>> you are providing to the astrological community. I would like

> >>>>> to

> >>>>> share my opinion (through my own experience).

> >>>>>

> >>>>> Considering Karakamsa from either Rasi or Navamsa chart alone

> >>>>> most

> >>>>> probably leads to erroneous results, as I found both the

> >>>>> approaches

> >>>>> working. I see the point Pradeep is making as very valuable;

> >>>>> at the

> >>>>> same time I am not against using Navamsa chart as separate

> >>>>> chart (of

> >>>>> course without losing the context of the Rasi chart), since

> >>>>> any of

> >>>>> the varga charts will not give independent results if the Rasi

> >>>>> chart

> >>>>> is ignored, as they themselves do not exist if the Rasi chart

> >>>>> doesn't exist. In fact Sri KN Rao also mentioned in several

> >>>>> occassions in many of his articles and books that yogas viewed

> >>>>> in

> >>>>> the Rasi chart should also exist in the Navamsa chart for

> >>>>> confirming

> >>>>> the results. If we do not see the Navamsa chart as a separate

> >>>>> chart,

> >>>>> how can we see the yogas therein? For the purpose of checking

> >>>>> some

> >>>>> yogas, Yuti and Veekshana (conjunction and aspects) in the

> >>>>> navamsa

> >>>>> chart make sense. This kind of yuti or veekshana should be

> >>>>> considered on a hypothetical level (as mutual influence at the

> >>>>> amsha level) rather than being within a 30 deg. span. of Rasi.

> >>>>>

> >>>>> Take an example. If a planet is exlated or in own house in the

> >>>>> rasi

> >>>>> chart and attains debilitation in the Navamsa chart, it is

> >>>>> condiered

> >>>>> as weakening of the actual strength shown in the Rasi. Why is

> >>>>> this

> >>>>> considered so? It is considered like that because, even though

> >>>>> the

> >>>>> planet is within its own or exlated rasi, still its

> >>>>> positioning

> >>>>> within that particular sector (here navamsa) has weakened it;

> >>>>> means,

> >>>>> within its own rasi, this particular sector is the weakest

> >>>>> point for

> >>>>> the planet within the strongest rasi; hence it loses its

> >>>>> strength

> >>>>> considerably. This means there is a gradation of strengths for

> >>>>> the

> >>>>> planet from first navamsa to the last navamsa. The navamsa

> >>>>> position

> >>>>> of a planet, thus indicates its refined placement within the

> >>>>> rasi.

> >>>>> In fact, Sri KN Rao also gives equal weightage to both the

> >>>>> Rasi and

> >>>>> Navamsa placement of a planet. If a planet is weak in one of

> >>>>> them

> >>>>> that means half the weightage is lost. We may not give the

> >>>>> same

> >>>>> level of treatment to other vargas as we give to Navamsa; but

> >>>>> Navamsa is as important as the Rasi; to the extent that it can

> >>>>> be

> >>>>> viewed as an independent chart (to confirm the promise given

> >>>>> by the

> >>>>> rasi chart).

> >>>>>

> >>>>> Without a confirmation of Navamsa chart, yogas in the rasi

> >>>>> chart

> >>>>> alone cannot and will not give expected results; I have

> >>>>> observed

> >>>>> this phenomenon in several charts.

> >>>>>

> >>>>> My own experience is; I have Chandra and Sukra both in the

> >>>>> 12th

> >>>>> house from Karakamsa in the Navamsa chart (not in the rasi

> >>>>> chart

> >>>>> with the rasi of karakamsa considering as the karakamsa

> >>>>> lagna). I am

> >>>>> a deep devotee of Goddess Parvathi (represented by Chandra)

> >>>>> and

> >>>>> Goddess Lakshmi (represented by Sukra). If the karakamsa is

> >>>>> brought

> >>>>> to the Rasi chart, this cannot be explained. The sequence of

> >>>>> my life

> >>>>> events are better explained only if I consider karakamsa lagna

> >>>>> in

> >>>>> the navamsa chart; I am not discounting Pradeep's opinion

> >>>>> here; I am

> >>>>> just saying that both approaches need to be considered on the

> >>>>> chart,

> >>>>> and a composite opinion be formed, as Sri KN Rao always says.

> >>>>>

> >>>>> On the other hand, considering the specific rasi in the Rasi

> >>>>> chart

> >>>>> that holds karakamsa as the karakamsa lagna, my Sukra is in

> >>>>> the 4th

> >>>>> house indicating my possession of a nice beautiful house, and

> >>>>> education/skills in arts (in addition to other traditional

> >>>>> education).

> >>>>>

> >>>>> I am bringing this to both your knowledge only to summarize

> >>>>> that

> >>>>> both your theories give results; but not necessarily in

> >>>>> isolation of

> >>>>> the other.

> >>>>>

> >>>>> Thanks for all your contribution.

> >>>>>

> >>>>> Best regards,

> >>>>> Satya S Kolachina

> >>>>>

> >>>>>

> >>>>>

> >>>>> , Chandrashekhar

> >>>>> <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>> Dear Pradeep,

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>> I can not comment on views of either Sanjay or K. N. Rao.

> >>>>> First

> >>>>> there is

> >>>>>> no difference in the meaning of Amsha and Amshaka though it

> >>>>> is

> >>>>> perhaps

> >>>>>> being confused. It also needs to be remembered that in

> >>>>> astrological

> >>>>>> translations many a times words are to be understood in the

> >>>>> context that

> >>>>>> they used. So we find Parashara mentioning karakamsha and

> >>>>> Swamsha

> >>>>> in

> >>>>>> alternate lines (almost) while indicating the results of

> >>>>> occupation of

> >>>>>> Karakamsha by Sun etc. and many other places in karakamsha

> >>>>> adhyaaya.

> >>>>>> This does not mean he is speaking about two different

> >>>>> parameters.

> >>>>> I

> >>>>>> think if any Sanskrit scholar who is also well versed in

> >>>>> interpretation

> >>>>>> of astrological texts will confirm this contention of mine

> >>>>> if he

> >>>>> is

> >>>>>> watching this discussion.

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>> If you want my personal opinion, I think that the results

> >>>>> indicated on

> >>>>>> the basis of Karakamsha without reference to the potential

> >>>>> promised by

> >>>>>> the rasi chart and the strength derived by the grahas in

> >>>>> rasi

> >>>>> chart,

> >>>>>> through the Navamsha chart, are not likely to materialize. I

> >>>>> hope

> >>>>> this

> >>>>>> opinion of mine does not create a big storm in the

> >>>>> discussion on

> >>>>> the

> >>>>>> list. But this is my personal opinion, for whatever it is

> >>>>> worth.

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>> Take care,

> >>>>>> Chandrashekhar.

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>> vijayadas_pradeep wrote:

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>> Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Respected members

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>> Shri Sanjay Rath clearly says ,Amshaka is pointing to the

> >>>>> Rashi

> >>>>> in

> >>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha.He also says,Karakamsha has

> >>>>> one

> >>>>>>> meaning ,while Karakamsha KA has another meaning.

> >>>>>>> Chandrashekhar jis view is Amshaka is not pointing to the

> >>>>> Rashi

> >>>>> in

> >>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha.

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>> Now Chandraekhar jis view is prudent as there are some

> >>>>> shlokas

> >>>>> which

> >>>>>>> shri Rath somehow has overlooked,contradicting his view

> >>>>> point.

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>> I respect shri Rath ,but i have to tell this.Sometimes the

> >>>>>

> >>>>> answer and

> >>>>>>> explanations given by shri Rath are not preceded by proper

> >>>>>

> >>>>>

> >>>> === message truncated ===

> >>>>

> >>>>

> >>>>

> >>>>

> >>>>

> >>>

> >

____________________

> >>> ______________

> >>>> Be a PS3 game guru.

> >>>> Get your game face on with the latest PS3 news and previews at

> >>> Games.

> >>>> http://videogames./platform?platform=120121

> >>>>

> >>>

> >>>

> >>>

> >>>

> >>>

> >>>

[Guest guest]

Dear Prafulla ji

 

Regarding Sanskrit -

 

I was quoting scholars(translating shlokas in local language)who

lived almost 800 years back,and trained in Parampara.If their

understanding of amshas is wrong then who is right?Moreover

Thalakkulahu Bhattathiri(Dashadhyayi) quotes sanskrit verses from

giants like Vishnusharama,Graga etc.

 

You can ask any of these contemporary scholars - what can be the

meaning of ''meshadi rashige swamshe''.You should also think why shri

Rath felt that amshaka is a relationship onto a Rashi.He would had

definitely studied numerous texts /commentaries from which ,arrived

at such a conclusion.By reading just a few books(but authentic

ones) ,if a non scholar like me can understand those...it is not at

all a surprise that a scholar like shri Rath will understand.But he

thought amshaka and amsha are different.Regarding amshaka he is

that.If regarding amsha too he can agree ,issue is solved.Whether he

agrees or not -others can check BPHS and read ''Vrishamsha''Ka''

gathe and Tulamshe.

 

Thus please don't assume,some irresponsible individuals are

blabbering something without understanding sanskrit.

 

If you may kindly note,for interpreting Jyotish shlokas,sanskrit

knowledge alone is no sufficient.Understanding fundamentals of

Jyotish too is a must.The translators tied to translate shlokas with

navamsha as a chart in mind.Sage never said so.So they could only

translate within this realm and nobody could reach a common

conclusion.It is not at all a fault of Jyotish or the sages who wrote

them.

 

Kind Regds

Pradeep

, Prafulla Gang <jyotish

wrote:

>

> Well Sreenadh ji - at times, these issues become choice or

prejudices in our own form of reading model. Had there not been any

substance in interpreting D9 charts - lot many stalwarts must not

have explored it - and I presume - many of them know better

sanskrit / jyotish (rather both) than all of us on the forum

collectively. So if at all - anyone wish to contest the

interpretation - then many of those stalwarts are the people - must

be debated with. On the forum, where not many great sanskrit

scholars / jyotish researchers - the arguments may not have any

relevance.

>

> regards / Prafulla Gang

> http://www.prafulla.net

>

> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the right to

be taken seriously. "

> ************************************************

>

>

> >

> > sreesog

> > Tue, 03 Jul 2007 13:56:36 -0000

> >

> > Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important?

> >

> > Dear Prafulla ji,

> > * No ancient text ask us to read Navamsha (not chart) " just like

D1

> > chart " ; nor they provide slokas for the same.

> > * No ancient text provide as the results for " aspects of planets

in

> > Navamasa "

> > * Nor they give us the results to be predicted when planets are

> > placed " x house with reference to navamsa lagna "

> >

> > I hope we are trying to study astrology as taught by the sages;

If

> > not I don't have anything to say.

> >

> > Love,

> > Sreenadh

> >

> >

> > , Prafulla Gang <jyotish@>

> > wrote:

> >>

> >> Dear Sreenadh ji

> >>

> >> I have also observed many jyotish stalwarts using navamsa chart

> > (along with other D charts). Now how to assess D9 charts - can be

> > perspective. But - as most authors say - just like D1 chart.

> >>

> >> I request members to share their experience.

> >>

> >> regards / Prafulla Gang

> >> http://www.prafulla.net

> >>

> >> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the right

to

> > be taken seriously. "

> >> ************************************************

> >>

> >>

> >>>

> >>> sreesog@

> >>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 07:56:49 -0000

> >>>

> >>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important?

> >>>

> >>> Dear Krishna ji,

> >>> ==>

> >>>> I too to the view that Navamsa chart is

> >>>> as important as Rasi chart.

> >>> <==

> >>> * There is not Navamsa " chart " , but only Navamsa. Navamsa chart

> > is

> >>> not as important as Rasi chart and it can never be, because it

is

> >>> only an amsa. But yes, it is more important than other amsas due

> > to

> >>> the prior said reasons.

> >>> ==>

> >>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines the overall

> >>>> strength of a planet?

> >>> <==

> >>> * Because the quality of earth determines the strength of the

> >>> plant. This is applicable to all amsas as per their importance.

> >>> ==>

> >>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa chart like

> >>>> aspects in a Rasi chart?

> >>> <==

> >>> * No, it is not allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa. (There

> > is

> >>> no navamsa 'chart'.)

> >>>

> >>> ==>

> >>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be treated as

if

> >>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart?

> >>> <==

> >>> * No, when planets have sambandha in Navamsa, it only means

that.

> >>> When they have sombandha in Rasi, it only means that. It is

wrong

> > to

> >>> mix the two.

> >>> ==>

> >>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart as well?

> >>> <==

> >>> * No, Yogas should not be looked in Navamsa 'chart'. But yes

> > yoga in

> >>> Navamsa (not navamsa 'chart') can be taken yoga. Because it is

the

> >>> same principles as used in Rasi that are used to predict the

> > result

> >>> in Amsas as well - But Aspect(Drishti) and houses are not

> > applicable

> >>> to amsas. Both Aspect(Drishti) and Houses should be considered

in

> >>> Rasi chart itself. Any reference in ancient texts about aspect

or

> >>> houses essentially mean that they are referring to Rasi chart.

> >>> Love,

> >>> Sreenadh

> >>>

> >>> , Krishnamurthy Seetharama

> >>> <krishna_1998@> wrote:

> >>>>

> >>>> Dear Kolachina ji,

> >>>>

> >>>> It was interesting to read your comments on importance of the

> >>>> Navamsa chart. I too to the view that Navamsa chart

is

> >>>> as important as Rasi chart. This is based on my experience so

> >>>> far reading charts. However, I have still not understood what

> >>>> are the fundamental reasons for a varga chart being so

> >>>> important.

> >>>>

> >>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines the overall

> >>>> strength of a planet?

> >>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa chart like

> >>>> aspects in a Rasi chart?

> >>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be treated as

if

> >>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart?

> >>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart as well?

> >>>>

> >>>> By looking at the kind of importance given to Navamsa chart, it

> >>>> appears that the Rasi chart and Navamsa chart make up two equal

> >>>> halves representing the native.

> >>>>

> >>>> I have no doubts about the importance of Navamsa Chart. What I

> >>>> would like to know is why Navamsa gains such an importance?

What

> >>>> are the fundamental reasons? After all it is one of many varga

> >>>> charts!

> >>>>

> >>>> Regards,

> >>>> Krishna

> >>>>

> >>>> --- Satya Sai Kolachina <skolachi@> wrote:

> >>>>

> >>>>> Dear Sri Pradeep and Sri Chandrasekhar,

> >>>>>

> >>>>> I have been following this thread on karakamsa and both of

> >>>>> your

> >>>>> contributions.

> >>>>>

> >>>>> I whole-heartedly appreciate both of you for your valuable

> >>>>> inputs

> >>>>> you are providing to the astrological community. I would like

> >>>>> to

> >>>>> share my opinion (through my own experience).

> >>>>>

> >>>>> Considering Karakamsa from either Rasi or Navamsa chart alone

> >>>>> most

> >>>>> probably leads to erroneous results, as I found both the

> >>>>> approaches

> >>>>> working. I see the point Pradeep is making as very valuable;

> >>>>> at the

> >>>>> same time I am not against using Navamsa chart as separate

> >>>>> chart (of

> >>>>> course without losing the context of the Rasi chart), since

> >>>>> any of

> >>>>> the varga charts will not give independent results if the Rasi

> >>>>> chart

> >>>>> is ignored, as they themselves do not exist if the Rasi chart

> >>>>> doesn't exist. In fact Sri KN Rao also mentioned in several

> >>>>> occassions in many of his articles and books that yogas viewed

> >>>>> in

> >>>>> the Rasi chart should also exist in the Navamsa chart for

> >>>>> confirming

> >>>>> the results. If we do not see the Navamsa chart as a separate

> >>>>> chart,

> >>>>> how can we see the yogas therein? For the purpose of checking

> >>>>> some

> >>>>> yogas, Yuti and Veekshana (conjunction and aspects) in the

> >>>>> navamsa

> >>>>> chart make sense. This kind of yuti or veekshana should be

> >>>>> considered on a hypothetical level (as mutual influence at the

> >>>>> amsha level) rather than being within a 30 deg. span. of Rasi.

> >>>>>

> >>>>> Take an example. If a planet is exlated or in own house in the

> >>>>> rasi

> >>>>> chart and attains debilitation in the Navamsa chart, it is

> >>>>> condiered

> >>>>> as weakening of the actual strength shown in the Rasi. Why is

> >>>>> this

> >>>>> considered so? It is considered like that because, even though

> >>>>> the

> >>>>> planet is within its own or exlated rasi, still its

> >>>>> positioning

> >>>>> within that particular sector (here navamsa) has weakened it;

> >>>>> means,

> >>>>> within its own rasi, this particular sector is the weakest

> >>>>> point for

> >>>>> the planet within the strongest rasi; hence it loses its

> >>>>> strength

> >>>>> considerably. This means there is a gradation of strengths for

> >>>>> the

> >>>>> planet from first navamsa to the last navamsa. The navamsa

> >>>>> position

> >>>>> of a planet, thus indicates its refined placement within the

> >>>>> rasi.

> >>>>> In fact, Sri KN Rao also gives equal weightage to both the

> >>>>> Rasi and

> >>>>> Navamsa placement of a planet. If a planet is weak in one of

> >>>>> them

> >>>>> that means half the weightage is lost. We may not give the

> >>>>> same

> >>>>> level of treatment to other vargas as we give to Navamsa; but

> >>>>> Navamsa is as important as the Rasi; to the extent that it can

> >>>>> be

> >>>>> viewed as an independent chart (to confirm the promise given

> >>>>> by the

> >>>>> rasi chart).

> >>>>>

> >>>>> Without a confirmation of Navamsa chart, yogas in the rasi

> >>>>> chart

> >>>>> alone cannot and will not give expected results; I have

> >>>>> observed

> >>>>> this phenomenon in several charts.

> >>>>>

> >>>>> My own experience is; I have Chandra and Sukra both in the

> >>>>> 12th

> >>>>> house from Karakamsa in the Navamsa chart (not in the rasi

> >>>>> chart

> >>>>> with the rasi of karakamsa considering as the karakamsa

> >>>>> lagna). I am

> >>>>> a deep devotee of Goddess Parvathi (represented by Chandra)

> >>>>> and

> >>>>> Goddess Lakshmi (represented by Sukra). If the karakamsa is

> >>>>> brought

> >>>>> to the Rasi chart, this cannot be explained. The sequence of

> >>>>> my life

> >>>>> events are better explained only if I consider karakamsa lagna

> >>>>> in

> >>>>> the navamsa chart; I am not discounting Pradeep's opinion

> >>>>> here; I am

> >>>>> just saying that both approaches need to be considered on the

> >>>>> chart,

> >>>>> and a composite opinion be formed, as Sri KN Rao always says.

> >>>>>

> >>>>> On the other hand, considering the specific rasi in the Rasi

> >>>>> chart

> >>>>> that holds karakamsa as the karakamsa lagna, my Sukra is in

> >>>>> the 4th

> >>>>> house indicating my possession of a nice beautiful house, and

> >>>>> education/skills in arts (in addition to other traditional

> >>>>> education).

> >>>>>

> >>>>> I am bringing this to both your knowledge only to summarize

> >>>>> that

> >>>>> both your theories give results; but not necessarily in

> >>>>> isolation of

> >>>>> the other.

> >>>>>

> >>>>> Thanks for all your contribution.

> >>>>>

> >>>>> Best regards,

> >>>>> Satya S Kolachina

> >>>>>

> >>>>>

> >>>>>

> >>>>> , Chandrashekhar

> >>>>> <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>> Dear Pradeep,

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>> I can not comment on views of either Sanjay or K. N. Rao.

> >>>>> First

> >>>>> there is

> >>>>>> no difference in the meaning of Amsha and Amshaka though it

> >>>>> is

> >>>>> perhaps

> >>>>>> being confused. It also needs to be remembered that in

> >>>>> astrological

> >>>>>> translations many a times words are to be understood in the

> >>>>> context that

> >>>>>> they used. So we find Parashara mentioning karakamsha and

> >>>>> Swamsha

> >>>>> in

> >>>>>> alternate lines (almost) while indicating the results of

> >>>>> occupation of

> >>>>>> Karakamsha by Sun etc. and many other places in karakamsha

> >>>>> adhyaaya.

> >>>>>> This does not mean he is speaking about two different

> >>>>> parameters.

> >>>>> I

> >>>>>> think if any Sanskrit scholar who is also well versed in

> >>>>> interpretation

> >>>>>> of astrological texts will confirm this contention of mine

> >>>>> if he

> >>>>> is

> >>>>>> watching this discussion.

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>> If you want my personal opinion, I think that the results

> >>>>> indicated on

> >>>>>> the basis of Karakamsha without reference to the potential

> >>>>> promised by

> >>>>>> the rasi chart and the strength derived by the grahas in

> >>>>> rasi

> >>>>> chart,

> >>>>>> through the Navamsha chart, are not likely to materialize. I

> >>>>> hope

> >>>>> this

> >>>>>> opinion of mine does not create a big storm in the

> >>>>> discussion on

> >>>>> the

> >>>>>> list. But this is my personal opinion, for whatever it is

> >>>>> worth.

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>> Take care,

> >>>>>> Chandrashekhar.

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>> vijayadas_pradeep wrote:

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>> Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Respected members

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>> Shri Sanjay Rath clearly says ,Amshaka is pointing to the

> >>>>> Rashi

> >>>>> in

> >>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha.He also says,Karakamsha has

> >>>>> one

> >>>>>>> meaning ,while Karakamsha KA has another meaning.

> >>>>>>> Chandrashekhar jis view is Amshaka is not pointing to the

> >>>>> Rashi

> >>>>> in

> >>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha.

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>> Now Chandraekhar jis view is prudent as there are some

> >>>>> shlokas

> >>>>> which

> >>>>>>> shri Rath somehow has overlooked,contradicting his view

> >>>>> point.

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>> I respect shri Rath ,but i have to tell this.Sometimes the

> >>>>>

> >>>>> answer and

> >>>>>>> explanations given by shri Rath are not preceded by proper

> >>>>>

> >>>>>

> >>>> === message truncated ===

> >>>>

> >>>>

> >>>>

> >>>>

> >>>>

> >>>

> >

____________________

> >>> ______________

> >>>> Be a PS3 game guru.

> >>>> Get your game face on with the latest PS3 news and previews at

> >>> Games.

> >>>> http://videogames./platform?platform=120121

> >>>>

> >>>

> >>>

> >>>

> >>>

> >>>

> >>>

[Guest guest]

Dear Pradeep,

 

Let us approach the navamsa interpretation from different perspective.

 

I observed from your mails that - you had opoortunity to interact with Shri KN

Rao.

Now my request is to share your experiences with Shri KN Rao on the followings:

 

a. how does he read D charts?

 

b. If he has agreed to your arguments of referring amsha

 

c. does he give prime importance to Navamsa Chart?

 

d. how does he use transits in Navamsa?

 

It will really be enlightening experience for us to hear his views.

 

 

regards / Prafulla Gang

http://www.prafulla.net

 

" Men who never get carried away should be. "

************************************************

 

 

>

> vijayadas_pradeep

> Thu, 05 Jul 2007 07:56:51 -0000

>

> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important?

>

> Dear Prafulla ji

>

> Regarding Sanskrit -

>

> I was quoting scholars(translating shlokas in local language)who

> lived almost 800 years back,and trained in Parampara.If their

> understanding of amshas is wrong then who is right?Moreover

> Thalakkulahu Bhattathiri(Dashadhyayi) quotes sanskrit verses from

> giants like Vishnusharama,Graga etc.

>

> You can ask any of these contemporary scholars - what can be the

> meaning of ''meshadi rashige swamshe''.You should also think why shri

> Rath felt that amshaka is a relationship onto a Rashi.He would had

> definitely studied numerous texts /commentaries from which ,arrived

> at such a conclusion.By reading just a few books(but authentic

> ones) ,if a non scholar like me can understand those...it is not at

> all a surprise that a scholar like shri Rath will understand.But he

> thought amshaka and amsha are different.Regarding amshaka he is

> that.If regarding amsha too he can agree ,issue is solved.Whether he

> agrees or not -others can check BPHS and read ''Vrishamsha''Ka''

> gathe and Tulamshe.

>

> Thus please don't assume,some irresponsible individuals are

> blabbering something without understanding sanskrit.

>

> If you may kindly note,for interpreting Jyotish shlokas,sanskrit

> knowledge alone is no sufficient.Understanding fundamentals of

> Jyotish too is a must.The translators tied to translate shlokas with

> navamsha as a chart in mind.Sage never said so.So they could only

> translate within this realm and nobody could reach a common

> conclusion.It is not at all a fault of Jyotish or the sages who wrote

> them.

>

> Kind Regds

> Pradeep

> , Prafulla Gang <jyotish

> wrote:

>>

>> Well Sreenadh ji - at times, these issues become choice or

> prejudices in our own form of reading model. Had there not been any

> substance in interpreting D9 charts - lot many stalwarts must not

> have explored it - and I presume - many of them know better

> sanskrit / jyotish (rather both) than all of us on the forum

> collectively. So if at all - anyone wish to contest the

> interpretation - then many of those stalwarts are the people - must

> be debated with. On the forum, where not many great sanskrit

> scholars / jyotish researchers - the arguments may not have any

> relevance.

>>

>> regards / Prafulla Gang

>> http://www.prafulla.net

>>

>> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the right to

> be taken seriously. "

>> ************************************************

>>

>>

>>>

>>> sreesog

>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 13:56:36 -0000

>>>

>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important?

>>>

>>> Dear Prafulla ji,

>>> * No ancient text ask us to read Navamsha (not chart) " just like

> D1

>>> chart " ; nor they provide slokas for the same.

>>> * No ancient text provide as the results for " aspects of planets

> in

>>> Navamasa "

>>> * Nor they give us the results to be predicted when planets are

>>> placed " x house with reference to navamsa lagna "

>>>

>>> I hope we are trying to study astrology as taught by the sages;

> If

>>> not I don't have anything to say.

>>>

>>> Love,

>>> Sreenadh

>>>

>>>

>>> , Prafulla Gang <jyotish@>

>>> wrote:

>>>>

>>>> Dear Sreenadh ji

>>>>

>>>> I have also observed many jyotish stalwarts using navamsa chart

>>> (along with other D charts). Now how to assess D9 charts - can be

>>> perspective. But - as most authors say - just like D1 chart.

>>>>

>>>> I request members to share their experience.

>>>>

>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang

>>>> http://www.prafulla.net

>>>>

>>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the right

> to

>>> be taken seriously. "

>>>> ************************************************

>>>>

>>>>

>>>>>

>>>>> sreesog@

>>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 07:56:49 -0000

>>>>>

>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important?

>>>>>

>>>>> Dear Krishna ji,

>>>>> ==>

>>>>>> I too to the view that Navamsa chart is

>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart.

>>>>> <==

>>>>> * There is not Navamsa " chart " , but only Navamsa. Navamsa chart

>>> is

>>>>> not as important as Rasi chart and it can never be, because it

> is

>>>>> only an amsa. But yes, it is more important than other amsas due

>>> to

>>>>> the prior said reasons.

>>>>> ==>

>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines the overall

>>>>>> strength of a planet?

>>>>> <==

>>>>> * Because the quality of earth determines the strength of the

>>>>> plant. This is applicable to all amsas as per their importance.

>>>>> ==>

>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa chart like

>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart?

>>>>> <==

>>>>> * No, it is not allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa. (There

>>> is

>>>>> no navamsa 'chart'.)

>>>>>

>>>>> ==>

>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be treated as

> if

>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart?

>>>>> <==

>>>>> * No, when planets have sambandha in Navamsa, it only means

> that.

>>>>> When they have sombandha in Rasi, it only means that. It is

> wrong

>>> to

>>>>> mix the two.

>>>>> ==>

>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart as well?

>>>>> <==

>>>>> * No, Yogas should not be looked in Navamsa 'chart'. But yes

>>> yoga in

>>>>> Navamsa (not navamsa 'chart') can be taken yoga. Because it is

> the

>>>>> same principles as used in Rasi that are used to predict the

>>> result

>>>>> in Amsas as well - But Aspect(Drishti) and houses are not

>>> applicable

>>>>> to amsas. Both Aspect(Drishti) and Houses should be considered

> in

>>>>> Rasi chart itself. Any reference in ancient texts about aspect

> or

>>>>> houses essentially mean that they are referring to Rasi chart.

>>>>> Love,

>>>>> Sreenadh

>>>>>

>>>>> , Krishnamurthy Seetharama

>>>>> <krishna_1998@> wrote:

>>>>>>

>>>>>> Dear Kolachina ji,

>>>>>>

>>>>>> It was interesting to read your comments on importance of the

>>>>>> Navamsa chart. I too to the view that Navamsa chart

> is

>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart. This is based on my experience so

>>>>>> far reading charts. However, I have still not understood what

>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons for a varga chart being so

>>>>>> important.

>>>>>>

>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines the overall

>>>>>> strength of a planet?

>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa chart like

>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart?

>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be treated as

> if

>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart?

>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart as well?

>>>>>>

>>>>>> By looking at the kind of importance given to Navamsa chart, it

>>>>>> appears that the Rasi chart and Navamsa chart make up two equal

>>>>>> halves representing the native.

>>>>>>

>>>>>> I have no doubts about the importance of Navamsa Chart. What I

>>>>>> would like to know is why Navamsa gains such an importance?

> What

>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons? After all it is one of many varga

>>>>>> charts!

>>>>>>

>>>>>> Regards,

>>>>>> Krishna

>>>>>>

>>>>>> --- Satya Sai Kolachina <skolachi@> wrote:

>>>>>>

>>>>>>> Dear Sri Pradeep and Sri Chandrasekhar,

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> I have been following this thread on karakamsa and both of

>>>>>>> your

>>>>>>> contributions.

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> I whole-heartedly appreciate both of you for your valuable

>>>>>>> inputs

>>>>>>> you are providing to the astrological community. I would like

>>>>>>> to

>>>>>>> share my opinion (through my own experience).

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> Considering Karakamsa from either Rasi or Navamsa chart alone

>>>>>>> most

>>>>>>> probably leads to erroneous results, as I found both the

>>>>>>> approaches

>>>>>>> working. I see the point Pradeep is making as very valuable;

>>>>>>> at the

>>>>>>> same time I am not against using Navamsa chart as separate

>>>>>>> chart (of

>>>>>>> course without losing the context of the Rasi chart), since

>>>>>>> any of

>>>>>>> the varga charts will not give independent results if the Rasi

>>>>>>> chart

>>>>>>> is ignored, as they themselves do not exist if the Rasi chart

>>>>>>> doesn't exist. In fact Sri KN Rao also mentioned in several

>>>>>>> occassions in many of his articles and books that yogas viewed

>>>>>>> in

>>>>>>> the Rasi chart should also exist in the Navamsa chart for

>>>>>>> confirming

>>>>>>> the results. If we do not see the Navamsa chart as a separate

>>>>>>> chart,

>>>>>>> how can we see the yogas therein? For the purpose of checking

>>>>>>> some

>>>>>>> yogas, Yuti and Veekshana (conjunction and aspects) in the

>>>>>>> navamsa

>>>>>>> chart make sense. This kind of yuti or veekshana should be

>>>>>>> considered on a hypothetical level (as mutual influence at the

>>>>>>> amsha level) rather than being within a 30 deg. span. of Rasi.

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> Take an example. If a planet is exlated or in own house in the

>>>>>>> rasi

>>>>>>> chart and attains debilitation in the Navamsa chart, it is

>>>>>>> condiered

>>>>>>> as weakening of the actual strength shown in the Rasi. Why is

>>>>>>> this

>>>>>>> considered so? It is considered like that because, even though

>>>>>>> the

>>>>>>> planet is within its own or exlated rasi, still its

>>>>>>> positioning

>>>>>>> within that particular sector (here navamsa) has weakened it;

>>>>>>> means,

>>>>>>> within its own rasi, this particular sector is the weakest

>>>>>>> point for

>>>>>>> the planet within the strongest rasi; hence it loses its

>>>>>>> strength

>>>>>>> considerably. This means there is a gradation of strengths for

>>>>>>> the

>>>>>>> planet from first navamsa to the last navamsa. The navamsa

>>>>>>> position

>>>>>>> of a planet, thus indicates its refined placement within the

>>>>>>> rasi.

>>>>>>> In fact, Sri KN Rao also gives equal weightage to both the

>>>>>>> Rasi and

>>>>>>> Navamsa placement of a planet. If a planet is weak in one of

>>>>>>> them

>>>>>>> that means half the weightage is lost. We may not give the

>>>>>>> same

>>>>>>> level of treatment to other vargas as we give to Navamsa; but

>>>>>>> Navamsa is as important as the Rasi; to the extent that it can

>>>>>>> be

>>>>>>> viewed as an independent chart (to confirm the promise given

>>>>>>> by the

>>>>>>> rasi chart).

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> Without a confirmation of Navamsa chart, yogas in the rasi

>>>>>>> chart

>>>>>>> alone cannot and will not give expected results; I have

>>>>>>> observed

>>>>>>> this phenomenon in several charts.

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> My own experience is; I have Chandra and Sukra both in the

>>>>>>> 12th

>>>>>>> house from Karakamsa in the Navamsa chart (not in the rasi

>>>>>>> chart

>>>>>>> with the rasi of karakamsa considering as the karakamsa

>>>>>>> lagna). I am

>>>>>>> a deep devotee of Goddess Parvathi (represented by Chandra)

>>>>>>> and

>>>>>>> Goddess Lakshmi (represented by Sukra). If the karakamsa is

>>>>>>> brought

>>>>>>> to the Rasi chart, this cannot be explained. The sequence of

>>>>>>> my life

>>>>>>> events are better explained only if I consider karakamsa lagna

>>>>>>> in

>>>>>>> the navamsa chart; I am not discounting Pradeep's opinion

>>>>>>> here; I am

>>>>>>> just saying that both approaches need to be considered on the

>>>>>>> chart,

>>>>>>> and a composite opinion be formed, as Sri KN Rao always says.

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> On the other hand, considering the specific rasi in the Rasi

>>>>>>> chart

>>>>>>> that holds karakamsa as the karakamsa lagna, my Sukra is in

>>>>>>> the 4th

>>>>>>> house indicating my possession of a nice beautiful house, and

>>>>>>> education/skills in arts (in addition to other traditional

>>>>>>> education).

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> I am bringing this to both your knowledge only to summarize

>>>>>>> that

>>>>>>> both your theories give results; but not necessarily in

>>>>>>> isolation of

>>>>>>> the other.

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> Thanks for all your contribution.

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> Best regards,

>>>>>>> Satya S Kolachina

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> , Chandrashekhar

>>>>>>> <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> Dear Pradeep,

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> I can not comment on views of either Sanjay or K. N. Rao.

>>>>>>> First

>>>>>>> there is

>>>>>>>> no difference in the meaning of Amsha and Amshaka though it

>>>>>>> is

>>>>>>> perhaps

>>>>>>>> being confused. It also needs to be remembered that in

>>>>>>> astrological

>>>>>>>> translations many a times words are to be understood in the

>>>>>>> context that

>>>>>>>> they used. So we find Parashara mentioning karakamsha and

>>>>>>> Swamsha

>>>>>>> in

>>>>>>>> alternate lines (almost) while indicating the results of

>>>>>>> occupation of

>>>>>>>> Karakamsha by Sun etc. and many other places in karakamsha

>>>>>>> adhyaaya.

>>>>>>>> This does not mean he is speaking about two different

>>>>>>> parameters.

>>>>>>> I

>>>>>>>> think if any Sanskrit scholar who is also well versed in

>>>>>>> interpretation

>>>>>>>> of astrological texts will confirm this contention of mine

>>>>>>> if he

>>>>>>> is

>>>>>>>> watching this discussion.

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> If you want my personal opinion, I think that the results

>>>>>>> indicated on

>>>>>>>> the basis of Karakamsha without reference to the potential

>>>>>>> promised by

>>>>>>>> the rasi chart and the strength derived by the grahas in

>>>>>>> rasi

>>>>>>> chart,

>>>>>>>> through the Navamsha chart, are not likely to materialize. I

>>>>>>> hope

>>>>>>> this

>>>>>>>> opinion of mine does not create a big storm in the

>>>>>>> discussion on

>>>>>>> the

>>>>>>>> list. But this is my personal opinion, for whatever it is

>>>>>>> worth.

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> Take care,

>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar.

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> vijayadas_pradeep wrote:

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>> Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Respected members

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>> Shri Sanjay Rath clearly says ,Amshaka is pointing to the

>>>>>>> Rashi

>>>>>>> in

>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha.He also says,Karakamsha has

>>>>>>> one

>>>>>>>>> meaning ,while Karakamsha KA has another meaning.

>>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar jis view is Amshaka is not pointing to the

>>>>>>> Rashi

>>>>>>> in

>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha.

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>> Now Chandraekhar jis view is prudent as there are some

>>>>>>> shlokas

>>>>>>> which

>>>>>>>>> shri Rath somehow has overlooked,contradicting his view

>>>>>>> point.

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>> I respect shri Rath ,but i have to tell this.Sometimes the

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> answer and

>>>>>>>>> explanations given by shri Rath are not preceded by proper

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>

>>>>>> === message truncated ===

>>>>>>

>>>>>>

>>>>>>

>>>>>>

>>>>>>

>>>>>

>>>

> ____________________

>>>>> ______________

>>>>>> Be a PS3 game guru.

>>>>>> Get your game face on with the latest PS3 news and previews at

>>>>> Games.

>>>>>> http://videogames./platform?platform=120121

>>>>>>

>>>>>

>>>>>

>>>>>

>>>>>

>>>>>

>>>>>

[Guest guest]

Dear Sreenadh ji

 

Well - who knows the truth? - Should the person making comment, be construed to

be as truth seeker - until they prove with the application of the principles on

the charts ( both ways - firstly the wrong application of others; and secondly

how to read in correct way). Theorists without predictive support - has little

relevance in jyotish. But yes - if you can justify your statements by case

studies - then at least, I will hear with open mind.

 

Understandably, I have been quoted to be " blind " to commentaries - but my

submission is that - give me one reason to accept the views of " less read

scholars " than to " well read scholars like Late Santhanam / Shri KN Rao / Shri

Sanjay rath / many others " . and More so - as I do not " pretend " to know the

sanskrit and do not " waste " my time on " shloka business " with my " incomplete

knowledge " . So I am happy to be following better quality commentaries - who are

expalining with the case studies.

 

Of course - each one makes his choice.

 

 

regards / Prafulla Gang

http://www.prafulla.net

 

" Men who never get carried away should be. "

************************************************

 

 

>

> sreesog

> Thu, 05 Jul 2007 07:00:31 -0000

>

> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important?

>

> Dear Prafulla ji,

> * Even if those things are not there in ancient texts every one is

> free to make or follow there own choice - yes, there is every chance

> that even such new methods might give true results - your argument is

> right.

> * As far Sanskrit is concerned: Yes, it is your choice - when you

> are blind to read and understand Sanskrit your self, and understand

> what is there and what not, of course you have to follow someone who

> says they see - you are right in that as well.

> Love,

> Sreenadh

>

> , Prafulla Gang <jyotish

> wrote:

>>

>> Well Sreenadh ji - at times, these issues become choice or

> prejudices in our own form of reading model. Had there not been any

> substance in interpreting D9 charts - lot many stalwarts must not

> have explored it - and I presume - many of them know better

> sanskrit / jyotish (rather both) than all of us on the forum

> collectively. So if at all - anyone wish to contest the

> interpretation - then many of those stalwarts are the people - must

> be debated with. On the forum, where not many great sanskrit

> scholars / jyotish researchers - the arguments may not have any

> relevance.

>>

>> regards / Prafulla Gang

>> http://www.prafulla.net

>>

>> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the right to

> be taken seriously. "

>> ************************************************

>>

>>

>>>

>>> sreesog

>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 13:56:36 -0000

>>>

>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important?

>>>

>>> Dear Prafulla ji,

>>> * No ancient text ask us to read Navamsha (not chart) " just like

> D1

>>> chart " ; nor they provide slokas for the same.

>>> * No ancient text provide as the results for " aspects of planets

> in

>>> Navamasa "

>>> * Nor they give us the results to be predicted when planets are

>>> placed " x house with reference to navamsa lagna "

>>>

>>> I hope we are trying to study astrology as taught by the sages;

> If

>>> not I don't have anything to say.

>>>

>>> Love,

>>> Sreenadh

>>>

>>>

>>> , Prafulla Gang <jyotish@>

>>> wrote:

>>>>

>>>> Dear Sreenadh ji

>>>>

>>>> I have also observed many jyotish stalwarts using navamsa chart

>>> (along with other D charts). Now how to assess D9 charts - can be

>>> perspective. But - as most authors say - just like D1 chart.

>>>>

>>>> I request members to share their experience.

>>>>

>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang

>>>> http://www.prafulla.net

>>>>

>>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the right

> to

>>> be taken seriously. "

>>>> ************************************************

>>>>

>>>>

>>>>>

>>>>> sreesog@

>>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 07:56:49 -0000

>>>>>

>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important?

>>>>>

>>>>> Dear Krishna ji,

>>>>> ==>

>>>>>> I too to the view that Navamsa chart is

>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart.

>>>>> <==

>>>>> * There is not Navamsa " chart " , but only Navamsa. Navamsa chart

>>> is

>>>>> not as important as Rasi chart and it can never be, because it

> is

>>>>> only an amsa. But yes, it is more important than other amsas due

>>> to

>>>>> the prior said reasons.

>>>>> ==>

>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines the overall

>>>>>> strength of a planet?

>>>>> <==

>>>>> * Because the quality of earth determines the strength of the

>>>>> plant. This is applicable to all amsas as per their importance.

>>>>> ==>

>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa chart like

>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart?

>>>>> <==

>>>>> * No, it is not allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa. (There

>>> is

>>>>> no navamsa 'chart'.)

>>>>>

>>>>> ==>

>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be treated as

> if

>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart?

>>>>> <==

>>>>> * No, when planets have sambandha in Navamsa, it only means

> that.

>>>>> When they have sombandha in Rasi, it only means that. It is

> wrong

>>> to

>>>>> mix the two.

>>>>> ==>

>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart as well?

>>>>> <==

>>>>> * No, Yogas should not be looked in Navamsa 'chart'. But yes

>>> yoga in

>>>>> Navamsa (not navamsa 'chart') can be taken yoga. Because it is

> the

>>>>> same principles as used in Rasi that are used to predict the

>>> result

>>>>> in Amsas as well - But Aspect(Drishti) and houses are not

>>> applicable

>>>>> to amsas. Both Aspect(Drishti) and Houses should be considered

> in

>>>>> Rasi chart itself. Any reference in ancient texts about aspect

> or

>>>>> houses essentially mean that they are referring to Rasi chart.

>>>>> Love,

>>>>> Sreenadh

>>>>>

>>>>> , Krishnamurthy Seetharama

>>>>> <krishna_1998@> wrote:

>>>>>>

>>>>>> Dear Kolachina ji,

>>>>>>

>>>>>> It was interesting to read your comments on importance of the

>>>>>> Navamsa chart. I too to the view that Navamsa chart

> is

>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart. This is based on my experience so

>>>>>> far reading charts. However, I have still not understood what

>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons for a varga chart being so

>>>>>> important.

>>>>>>

>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines the overall

>>>>>> strength of a planet?

>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa chart like

>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart?

>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be treated as

> if

>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart?

>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart as well?

>>>>>>

>>>>>> By looking at the kind of importance given to Navamsa chart, it

>>>>>> appears that the Rasi chart and Navamsa chart make up two equal

>>>>>> halves representing the native.

>>>>>>

>>>>>> I have no doubts about the importance of Navamsa Chart. What I

>>>>>> would like to know is why Navamsa gains such an importance?

> What

>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons? After all it is one of many varga

>>>>>> charts!

>>>>>>

>>>>>> Regards,

>>>>>> Krishna

>>>>>>

>>>>>> --- Satya Sai Kolachina <skolachi@> wrote:

>>>>>>

>>>>>>> Dear Sri Pradeep and Sri Chandrasekhar,

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> I have been following this thread on karakamsa and both of

>>>>>>> your

>>>>>>> contributions.

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> I whole-heartedly appreciate both of you for your valuable

>>>>>>> inputs

>>>>>>> you are providing to the astrological community. I would like

>>>>>>> to

>>>>>>> share my opinion (through my own experience).

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> Considering Karakamsa from either Rasi or Navamsa chart alone

>>>>>>> most

>>>>>>> probably leads to erroneous results, as I found both the

>>>>>>> approaches

>>>>>>> working. I see the point Pradeep is making as very valuable;

>>>>>>> at the

>>>>>>> same time I am not against using Navamsa chart as separate

>>>>>>> chart (of

>>>>>>> course without losing the context of the Rasi chart), since

>>>>>>> any of

>>>>>>> the varga charts will not give independent results if the Rasi

>>>>>>> chart

>>>>>>> is ignored, as they themselves do not exist if the Rasi chart

>>>>>>> doesn't exist. In fact Sri KN Rao also mentioned in several

>>>>>>> occassions in many of his articles and books that yogas viewed

>>>>>>> in

>>>>>>> the Rasi chart should also exist in the Navamsa chart for

>>>>>>> confirming

>>>>>>> the results. If we do not see the Navamsa chart as a separate

>>>>>>> chart,

>>>>>>> how can we see the yogas therein? For the purpose of checking

>>>>>>> some

>>>>>>> yogas, Yuti and Veekshana (conjunction and aspects) in the

>>>>>>> navamsa

>>>>>>> chart make sense. This kind of yuti or veekshana should be

>>>>>>> considered on a hypothetical level (as mutual influence at the

>>>>>>> amsha level) rather than being within a 30 deg. span. of Rasi.

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> Take an example. If a planet is exlated or in own house in the

>>>>>>> rasi

>>>>>>> chart and attains debilitation in the Navamsa chart, it is

>>>>>>> condiered

>>>>>>> as weakening of the actual strength shown in the Rasi. Why is

>>>>>>> this

>>>>>>> considered so? It is considered like that because, even though

>>>>>>> the

>>>>>>> planet is within its own or exlated rasi, still its

>>>>>>> positioning

>>>>>>> within that particular sector (here navamsa) has weakened it;

>>>>>>> means,

>>>>>>> within its own rasi, this particular sector is the weakest

>>>>>>> point for

>>>>>>> the planet within the strongest rasi; hence it loses its

>>>>>>> strength

>>>>>>> considerably. This means there is a gradation of strengths for

>>>>>>> the

>>>>>>> planet from first navamsa to the last navamsa. The navamsa

>>>>>>> position

>>>>>>> of a planet, thus indicates its refined placement within the

>>>>>>> rasi.

>>>>>>> In fact, Sri KN Rao also gives equal weightage to both the

>>>>>>> Rasi and

>>>>>>> Navamsa placement of a planet. If a planet is weak in one of

>>>>>>> them

>>>>>>> that means half the weightage is lost. We may not give the

>>>>>>> same

>>>>>>> level of treatment to other vargas as we give to Navamsa; but

>>>>>>> Navamsa is as important as the Rasi; to the extent that it can

>>>>>>> be

>>>>>>> viewed as an independent chart (to confirm the promise given

>>>>>>> by the

>>>>>>> rasi chart).

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> Without a confirmation of Navamsa chart, yogas in the rasi

>>>>>>> chart

>>>>>>> alone cannot and will not give expected results; I have

>>>>>>> observed

>>>>>>> this phenomenon in several charts.

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> My own experience is; I have Chandra and Sukra both in the

>>>>>>> 12th

>>>>>>> house from Karakamsa in the Navamsa chart (not in the rasi

>>>>>>> chart

>>>>>>> with the rasi of karakamsa considering as the karakamsa

>>>>>>> lagna). I am

>>>>>>> a deep devotee of Goddess Parvathi (represented by Chandra)

>>>>>>> and

>>>>>>> Goddess Lakshmi (represented by Sukra). If the karakamsa is

>>>>>>> brought

>>>>>>> to the Rasi chart, this cannot be explained. The sequence of

>>>>>>> my life

>>>>>>> events are better explained only if I consider karakamsa lagna

>>>>>>> in

>>>>>>> the navamsa chart; I am not discounting Pradeep's opinion

>>>>>>> here; I am

>>>>>>> just saying that both approaches need to be considered on the

>>>>>>> chart,

>>>>>>> and a composite opinion be formed, as Sri KN Rao always says.

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> On the other hand, considering the specific rasi in the Rasi

>>>>>>> chart

>>>>>>> that holds karakamsa as the karakamsa lagna, my Sukra is in

>>>>>>> the 4th

>>>>>>> house indicating my possession of a nice beautiful house, and

>>>>>>> education/skills in arts (in addition to other traditional

>>>>>>> education).

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> I am bringing this to both your knowledge only to summarize

>>>>>>> that

>>>>>>> both your theories give results; but not necessarily in

>>>>>>> isolation of

>>>>>>> the other.

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> Thanks for all your contribution.

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> Best regards,

>>>>>>> Satya S Kolachina

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> , Chandrashekhar

>>>>>>> <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> Dear Pradeep,

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> I can not comment on views of either Sanjay or K. N. Rao.

>>>>>>> First

>>>>>>> there is

>>>>>>>> no difference in the meaning of Amsha and Amshaka though it

>>>>>>> is

>>>>>>> perhaps

>>>>>>>> being confused. It also needs to be remembered that in

>>>>>>> astrological

>>>>>>>> translations many a times words are to be understood in the

>>>>>>> context that

>>>>>>>> they used. So we find Parashara mentioning karakamsha and

>>>>>>> Swamsha

>>>>>>> in

>>>>>>>> alternate lines (almost) while indicating the results of

>>>>>>> occupation of

>>>>>>>> Karakamsha by Sun etc. and many other places in karakamsha

>>>>>>> adhyaaya.

>>>>>>>> This does not mean he is speaking about two different

>>>>>>> parameters.

>>>>>>> I

>>>>>>>> think if any Sanskrit scholar who is also well versed in

>>>>>>> interpretation

>>>>>>>> of astrological texts will confirm this contention of mine

>>>>>>> if he

>>>>>>> is

>>>>>>>> watching this discussion.

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> If you want my personal opinion, I think that the results

>>>>>>> indicated on

>>>>>>>> the basis of Karakamsha without reference to the potential

>>>>>>> promised by

>>>>>>>> the rasi chart and the strength derived by the grahas in

>>>>>>> rasi

>>>>>>> chart,

>>>>>>>> through the Navamsha chart, are not likely to materialize. I

>>>>>>> hope

>>>>>>> this

>>>>>>>> opinion of mine does not create a big storm in the

>>>>>>> discussion on

>>>>>>> the

>>>>>>>> list. But this is my personal opinion, for whatever it is

>>>>>>> worth.

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> Take care,

>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar.

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> vijayadas_pradeep wrote:

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>> Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Respected members

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>> Shri Sanjay Rath clearly says ,Amshaka is pointing to the

>>>>>>> Rashi

>>>>>>> in

>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha.He also says,Karakamsha has

>>>>>>> one

>>>>>>>>> meaning ,while Karakamsha KA has another meaning.

>>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar jis view is Amshaka is not pointing to the

>>>>>>> Rashi

>>>>>>> in

>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha.

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>> Now Chandraekhar jis view is prudent as there are some

>>>>>>> shlokas

>>>>>>> which

>>>>>>>>> shri Rath somehow has overlooked,contradicting his view

>>>>>>> point.

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>> I respect shri Rath ,but i have to tell this.Sometimes the

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> answer and

>>>>>>>>> explanations given by shri Rath are not preceded by proper

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>

>>>>>> === message truncated ===

>>>>>>

>>>>>>

>>>>>>

>>>>>>

>>>>>>

>>>>>

>>>

> ____________________

>>>>> ______________

>>>>>> Be a PS3 game guru.

>>>>>> Get your game face on with the latest PS3 news and previews at

>>>>> Games.

>>>>>> http://videogames./platform?platform=120121

>>>>>>

>>>>>

>>>>>

>>>>>

>>>>>

>>>>>

>>>>>

[Guest guest]

dont do email me.

 

Prafulla Gang <jyotish wrote: Dear Sreenadh ji

 

Well - who knows the truth? - Should the person making comment, be construed to

be as truth seeker - until they prove with the application of the principles on

the charts ( both ways - firstly the wrong application of others; and secondly

how to read in correct way). Theorists without predictive support - has little

relevance in jyotish. But yes - if you can justify your statements by case

studies - then at least, I will hear with open mind.

 

Understandably, I have been quoted to be " blind " to commentaries - but my

submission is that - give me one reason to accept the views of " less read

scholars " than to " well read scholars like Late Santhanam / Shri KN Rao / Shri

Sanjay rath / many others " . and More so - as I do not " pretend " to know the

sanskrit and do not " waste " my time on " shloka business " with my " incomplete

knowledge " . So I am happy to be following better quality commentaries - who are

expalining with the case studies.

 

Of course - each one makes his choice.

 

regards / Prafulla Gang

http://www.prafulla.net

 

" Men who never get carried away should be. "

************************************************

 

>

> sreesog

> Thu, 05 Jul 2007 07:00:31 -0000

>

> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important?

>

> Dear Prafulla ji,

> * Even if those things are not there in ancient texts every one is

> free to make or follow there own choice - yes, there is every chance

> that even such new methods might give true results - your argument is

> right.

> * As far Sanskrit is concerned: Yes, it is your choice - when you

> are blind to read and understand Sanskrit your self, and understand

> what is there and what not, of course you have to follow someone who

> says they see - you are right in that as well.

> Love,

> Sreenadh

>

> , Prafulla Gang <jyotish

> wrote:

>>

>> Well Sreenadh ji - at times, these issues become choice or

> prejudices in our own form of reading model. Had there not been any

> substance in interpreting D9 charts - lot many stalwarts must not

> have explored it - and I presume - many of them know better

> sanskrit / jyotish (rather both) than all of us on the forum

> collectively. So if at all - anyone wish to contest the

> interpretation - then many of those stalwarts are the people - must

> be debated with. On the forum, where not many great sanskrit

> scholars / jyotish researchers - the arguments may not have any

> relevance.

>>

>> regards / Prafulla Gang

>> http://www.prafulla.net

>>

>> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the right to

> be taken seriously. "

>> ************************************************

>>

>>

>>>

>>> sreesog

>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 13:56:36 -0000

>>>

>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important?

>>>

>>> Dear Prafulla ji,

>>> * No ancient text ask us to read Navamsha (not chart) " just like

> D1

>>> chart " ; nor they provide slokas for the same.

>>> * No ancient text provide as the results for " aspects of planets

> in

>>> Navamasa "

>>> * Nor they give us the results to be predicted when planets are

>>> placed " x house with reference to navamsa lagna "

>>>

>>> I hope we are trying to study astrology as taught by the sages;

> If

>>> not I don't have anything to say.

>>>

>>> Love,

>>> Sreenadh

>>>

>>>

>>> , Prafulla Gang <jyotish@>

>>> wrote:

>>>>

>>>> Dear Sreenadh ji

>>>>

>>>> I have also observed many jyotish stalwarts using navamsa chart

>>> (along with other D charts). Now how to assess D9 charts - can be

>>> perspective. But - as most authors say - just like D1 chart.

>>>>

>>>> I request members to share their experience.

>>>>

>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang

>>>> http://www.prafulla.net

>>>>

>>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the right

> to

>>> be taken seriously. "

>>>> ************************************************

>>>>

>>>>

>>>>>

>>>>> sreesog@

>>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 07:56:49 -0000

>>>>>

>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important?

>>>>>

>>>>> Dear Krishna ji,

>>>>> ==>

>>>>>> I too to the view that Navamsa chart is

>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart.

>>>>> <==

>>>>> * There is not Navamsa " chart " , but only Navamsa. Navamsa chart

>>> is

>>>>> not as important as Rasi chart and it can never be, because it

> is

>>>>> only an amsa. But yes, it is more important than other amsas due

>>> to

>>>>> the prior said reasons.

>>>>> ==>

>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines the overall

>>>>>> strength of a planet?

>>>>> <==

>>>>> * Because the quality of earth determines the strength of the

>>>>> plant. This is applicable to all amsas as per their importance.

>>>>> ==>

>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa chart like

>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart?

>>>>> <==

>>>>> * No, it is not allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa. (There

>>> is

>>>>> no navamsa 'chart'.)

>>>>>

>>>>> ==>

>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be treated as

> if

>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart?

>>>>> <==

>>>>> * No, when planets have sambandha in Navamsa, it only means

> that.

>>>>> When they have sombandha in Rasi, it only means that. It is

> wrong

>>> to

>>>>> mix the two.

>>>>> ==>

>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart as well?

>>>>> <==

>>>>> * No, Yogas should not be looked in Navamsa 'chart'. But yes

>>> yoga in

>>>>> Navamsa (not navamsa 'chart') can be taken yoga. Because it is

> the

>>>>> same principles as used in Rasi that are used to predict the

>>> result

>>>>> in Amsas as well - But Aspect(Drishti) and houses are not

>>> applicable

>>>>> to amsas. Both Aspect(Drishti) and Houses should be considered

> in

>>>>> Rasi chart itself. Any reference in ancient texts about aspect

> or

>>>>> houses essentially mean that they are referring to Rasi chart.

>>>>> Love,

>>>>> Sreenadh

>>>>>

>>>>> , Krishnamurthy Seetharama

>>>>> <krishna_1998@> wrote:

>>>>>>

>>>>>> Dear Kolachina ji,

>>>>>>

>>>>>> It was interesting to read your comments on importance of the

>>>>>> Navamsa chart. I too to the view that Navamsa chart

> is

>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart. This is based on my experience so

>>>>>> far reading charts. However, I have still not understood what

>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons for a varga chart being so

>>>>>> important.

>>>>>>

>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines the overall

>>>>>> strength of a planet?

>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa chart like

>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart?

>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be treated as

> if

>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart?

>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart as well?

>>>>>>

>>>>>> By looking at the kind of importance given to Navamsa chart, it

>>>>>> appears that the Rasi chart and Navamsa chart make up two equal

>>>>>> halves representing the native.

>>>>>>

>>>>>> I have no doubts about the importance of Navamsa Chart. What I

>>>>>> would like to know is why Navamsa gains such an importance?

> What

>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons? After all it is one of many varga

>>>>>> charts!

>>>>>>

>>>>>> Regards,

>>>>>> Krishna

>>>>>>

>>>>>> --- Satya Sai Kolachina <skolachi@> wrote:

>>>>>>

>>>>>>> Dear Sri Pradeep and Sri Chandrasekhar,

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> I have been following this thread on karakamsa and both of

>>>>>>> your

>>>>>>> contributions.

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> I whole-heartedly appreciate both of you for your valuable

>>>>>>> inputs

>>>>>>> you are providing to the astrological community. I would like

>>>>>>> to

>>>>>>> share my opinion (through my own experience).

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> Considering Karakamsa from either Rasi or Navamsa chart alone

>>>>>>> most

>>>>>>> probably leads to erroneous results, as I found both the

>>>>>>> approaches

>>>>>>> working. I see the point Pradeep is making as very valuable;

>>>>>>> at the

>>>>>>> same time I am not against using Navamsa chart as separate

>>>>>>> chart (of

>>>>>>> course without losing the context of the Rasi chart), since

>>>>>>> any of

>>>>>>> the varga charts will not give independent results if the Rasi

>>>>>>> chart

>>>>>>> is ignored, as they themselves do not exist if the Rasi chart

>>>>>>> doesn't exist. In fact Sri KN Rao also mentioned in several

>>>>>>> occassions in many of his articles and books that yogas viewed

>>>>>>> in

>>>>>>> the Rasi chart should also exist in the Navamsa chart for

>>>>>>> confirming

>>>>>>> the results. If we do not see the Navamsa chart as a separate

>>>>>>> chart,

>>>>>>> how can we see the yogas therein? For the purpose of checking

>>>>>>> some

>>>>>>> yogas, Yuti and Veekshana (conjunction and aspects) in the

>>>>>>> navamsa

>>>>>>> chart make sense. This kind of yuti or veekshana should be

>>>>>>> considered on a hypothetical level (as mutual influence at the

>>>>>>> amsha level) rather than being within a 30 deg. span. of Rasi.

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> Take an example. If a planet is exlated or in own house in the

>>>>>>> rasi

>>>>>>> chart and attains debilitation in the Navamsa chart, it is

>>>>>>> condiered

>>>>>>> as weakening of the actual strength shown in the Rasi. Why is

>>>>>>> this

>>>>>>> considered so? It is considered like that because, even though

>>>>>>> the

>>>>>>> planet is within its own or exlated rasi, still its

>>>>>>> positioning

>>>>>>> within that particular sector (here navamsa) has weakened it;

>>>>>>> means,

>>>>>>> within its own rasi, this particular sector is the weakest

>>>>>>> point for

>>>>>>> the planet within the strongest rasi; hence it loses its

>>>>>>> strength

>>>>>>> considerably. This means there is a gradation of strengths for

>>>>>>> the

>>>>>>> planet from first navamsa to the last navamsa. The navamsa

>>>>>>> position

>>>>>>> of a planet, thus indicates its refined placement within the

>>>>>>> rasi.

>>>>>>> In fact, Sri KN Rao also gives equal weightage to both the

>>>>>>> Rasi and

>>>>>>> Navamsa placement of a planet. If a planet is weak in one of

>>>>>>> them

>>>>>>> that means half the weightage is lost. We may not give the

>>>>>>> same

>>>>>>> level of treatment to other vargas as we give to Navamsa; but

>>>>>>> Navamsa is as important as the Rasi; to the extent that it can

>>>>>>> be

>>>>>>> viewed as an independent chart (to confirm the promise given

>>>>>>> by the

>>>>>>> rasi chart).

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> Without a confirmation of Navamsa chart, yogas in the rasi

>>>>>>> chart

>>>>>>> alone cannot and will not give expected results; I have

>>>>>>> observed

>>>>>>> this phenomenon in several charts.

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> My own experience is; I have Chandra and Sukra both in the

>>>>>>> 12th

>>>>>>> house from Karakamsa in the Navamsa chart (not in the rasi

>>>>>>> chart

>>>>>>> with the rasi of karakamsa considering as the karakamsa

>>>>>>> lagna). I am

>>>>>>> a deep devotee of Goddess Parvathi (represented by Chandra)

>>>>>>> and

>>>>>>> Goddess Lakshmi (represented by Sukra). If the karakamsa is

>>>>>>> brought

>>>>>>> to the Rasi chart, this cannot be explained. The sequence of

>>>>>>> my life

>>>>>>> events are better explained only if I consider karakamsa lagna

>>>>>>> in

>>>>>>> the navamsa chart; I am not discounting Pradeep's opinion

>>>>>>> here; I am

>>>>>>> just saying that both approaches need to be considered on the

>>>>>>> chart,

>>>>>>> and a composite opinion be formed, as Sri KN Rao always says.

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> On the other hand, considering the specific rasi in the Rasi

>>>>>>> chart

>>>>>>> that holds karakamsa as the karakamsa lagna, my Sukra is in

>>>>>>> the 4th

>>>>>>> house indicating my possession of a nice beautiful house, and

>>>>>>> education/skills in arts (in addition to other traditional

>>>>>>> education).

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> I am bringing this to both your knowledge only to summarize

>>>>>>> that

>>>>>>> both your theories give results; but not necessarily in

>>>>>>> isolation of

>>>>>>> the other.

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> Thanks for all your contribution.

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> Best regards,

>>>>>>> Satya S Kolachina

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> , Chandrashekhar

>>>>>>> <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> Dear Pradeep,

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> I can not comment on views of either Sanjay or K. N. Rao.

>>>>>>> First

>>>>>>> there is

>>>>>>>> no difference in the meaning of Amsha and Amshaka though it

>>>>>>> is

>>>>>>> perhaps

>>>>>>>> being confused. It also needs to be remembered that in

>>>>>>> astrological

>>>>>>>> translations many a times words are to be understood in the

>>>>>>> context that

>>>>>>>> they used. So we find Parashara mentioning karakamsha and

>>>>>>> Swamsha

>>>>>>> in

>>>>>>>> alternate lines (almost) while indicating the results of

>>>>>>> occupation of

>>>>>>>> Karakamsha by Sun etc. and many other places in karakamsha

>>>>>>> adhyaaya.

>>>>>>>> This does not mean he is speaking about two different

>>>>>>> parameters.

>>>>>>> I

>>>>>>>> think if any Sanskrit scholar who is also well versed in

>>>>>>> interpretation

>>>>>>>> of astrological texts will confirm this contention of mine

>>>>>>> if he

>>>>>>> is

>>>>>>>> watching this discussion.

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> If you want my personal opinion, I think that the results

>>>>>>> indicated on

>>>>>>>> the basis of Karakamsha without reference to the potential

>>>>>>> promised by

>>>>>>>> the rasi chart and the strength derived by the grahas in

>>>>>>> rasi

>>>>>>> chart,

>>>>>>>> through the Navamsha chart, are not likely to materialize. I

>>>>>>> hope

>>>>>>> this

>>>>>>>> opinion of mine does not create a big storm in the

>>>>>>> discussion on

>>>>>>> the

>>>>>>>> list. But this is my personal opinion, for whatever it is

>>>>>>> worth.

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> Take care,

>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar.

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> vijayadas_pradeep wrote:

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>> Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Respected members

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>> Shri Sanjay Rath clearly says ,Amshaka is pointing to the

>>>>>>> Rashi

>>>>>>> in

>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha.He also says,Karakamsha has

>>>>>>> one

>>>>>>>>> meaning ,while Karakamsha KA has another meaning.

>>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar jis view is Amshaka is not pointing to the

>>>>>>> Rashi

>>>>>>> in

>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha.

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>> Now Chandraekhar jis view is prudent as there are some

>>>>>>> shlokas

>>>>>>> which

>>>>>>>>> shri Rath somehow has overlooked,contradicting his view

>>>>>>> point.

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>> I respect shri Rath ,but i have to tell this.Sometimes the

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> answer and

>>>>>>>>> explanations given by shri Rath are not preceded by proper

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>

>>>>>> === message truncated ===

>>>>>>

>>>>>>

>>>>>>

>>>>>>

>>>>>>

>>>>>

>>>

> ________

>>>>> ______________

>>>>>> Be a PS3 game guru.

>>>>>> Get your game face on with the latest PS3 news and previews at

>>>>> Games.

>>>>>> http://videogames./platform?platform=120121

>>>>>>

>>>>>

>>>>>

>>>>>

>>>>>

>>>>>

>>>>>

[Guest guest]

Sir,

 

Very beautiful and humble post by you. Could not resist myself

from writing.

 

Too much of theories or discussion on same, without predictive

support, is like too much of pravacahans without any personal

application of the same, on part of the pravachan giver.

People who claim to be overly knowledgable, about the shastras,

about the explanation of the shlokas given by the Rishi Munis,

should apply this knowledge on the various Forums, where hundreds

are appearing with their help calls. What use is any knowledge

in the world, if it does not appeal to universal brotherhood ?

An ounce of action, is preferable to a quintal of

Pravachan.

 

As long as I understand the meaning of the main shlokas in

Sanskrit, in my nitya Pooja, there is no mandatory rule, that

I should know Sanskrit, to be a good astrologer.Life is

too short, now to continue giving commentaries on the shastras, which

have already been interpreted, by the great wise men before us,

of a better age than us. We should instead spend time on applications

of these knowledge, rather than futile discussions, which lead

nowehre, and on the contrary create differences between colleagues

and supposed to be fraternity brothers of the same fold.

 

There is no sense in trying to take out skin from a hair end

(Baal ki khaal), which has been actually going on in the

subject matter and exchanges on these threads. We are over smart

and even bring in and misquote the Rishi Munis out of context, just to

prove our point, which is what has been happenning with the new cross

breed of writers, who just wish to appear spectacular and come in

limelight, by distracting the general trend of approach and modes

taken by the astrologers since ages.

 

let these great knowledgable scholars try to predict with such great

commentaries and display of knowledge- on small issues, like sex

determination, marriage timings, birth timing, timing change of job,

and scores of such day to day matters. I am sure they will fail

miserably most of the times, in their predictions. Then what was the

boo-ha about, primarily ? i would prefer a normal poor Pundit who does

not know a word of english, who is unassuming, who does not claim to

know much - anyday to these modern scholars who will perish one day

with this abundance of knowledge in their heads- put to naught due to

no use, like a rusted nail.

 

Today we do not need any more knowledge from people. That is there in

gigantic proportions. neither we need further commentaries,

translations or dicussions. We would like to see people who have

already digested this knowledge,before embarking on new untrodden

paths in search of illusions and breakthroughs, where there are none

available., making application of their knowledge on real charts, and

explaining to a small student of astrology like me. how to use the

so n so principles, in other charts as well, with same accuracy of

results. We need application of rules and the knowledge of

application, and not worthless discussions.

 

It is better for one to be blind and - realized, rather than

have eyes, and see only restricted views.

 

hope that i have not touched a withered straw somewhere, and if so,

then it does not start creaking.

 

regards,

Bhaskar.

 

 

 

, Prafulla Gang <jyotish wrote:

>

> Dear Sreenadh ji

>

> Well - who knows the truth? - Should the person making comment, be

construed to be as truth seeker - until they prove with the

application of the principles on the charts ( both ways - firstly the

wrong application of others; and secondly how to read in correct way).

Theorists without predictive support - has little relevance in

jyotish. But yes - if you can justify your statements by case studies

- then at least, I will hear with open mind.

>

> Understandably, I have been quoted to be " blind " to commentaries -

but my submission is that - give me one reason to accept the views of

" less read scholars " than to " well read scholars like Late Santhanam /

Shri KN Rao / Shri Sanjay rath / many others " . and More so - as I do

not " pretend " to know the sanskrit and do not " waste " my time on

" shloka business " with my " incomplete knowledge " . So I am happy to be

following better quality commentaries - who are expalining with the

case studies.

>

> Of course - each one makes his choice.

>

>

> regards / Prafulla Gang

> http://www.prafulla.net

>

> " Men who never get carried away should be. "

> ************************************************

>

>

> >

> > sreesog

> > Thu, 05 Jul 2007 07:00:31 -0000

> >

> > Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important?

> >

> > Dear Prafulla ji,

> > * Even if those things are not there in ancient texts every one is

> > free to make or follow there own choice - yes, there is every chance

> > that even such new methods might give true results - your argument is

> > right.

> > * As far Sanskrit is concerned: Yes, it is your choice - when you

> > are blind to read and understand Sanskrit your self, and understand

> > what is there and what not, of course you have to follow someone who

> > says they see - you are right in that as well.

> > Love,

> > Sreenadh

> >

> > , Prafulla Gang <jyotish@>

> > wrote:

> >>

> >> Well Sreenadh ji - at times, these issues become choice or

> > prejudices in our own form of reading model. Had there not been any

> > substance in interpreting D9 charts - lot many stalwarts must not

> > have explored it - and I presume - many of them know better

> > sanskrit / jyotish (rather both) than all of us on the forum

> > collectively. So if at all - anyone wish to contest the

> > interpretation - then many of those stalwarts are the people - must

> > be debated with. On the forum, where not many great sanskrit

> > scholars / jyotish researchers - the arguments may not have any

> > relevance.

> >>

> >> regards / Prafulla Gang

> >> http://www.prafulla.net

> >>

> >> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the right to

> > be taken seriously. "

> >> ************************************************

> >>

> >>

> >>>

> >>> sreesog@

> >>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 13:56:36 -0000

> >>>

> >>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important?

> >>>

> >>> Dear Prafulla ji,

> >>> * No ancient text ask us to read Navamsha (not chart) " just like

> > D1

> >>> chart " ; nor they provide slokas for the same.

> >>> * No ancient text provide as the results for " aspects of planets

> > in

> >>> Navamasa "

> >>> * Nor they give us the results to be predicted when planets are

> >>> placed " x house with reference to navamsa lagna "

> >>>

> >>> I hope we are trying to study astrology as taught by the sages;

> > If

> >>> not I don't have anything to say.

> >>>

> >>> Love,

> >>> Sreenadh

> >>>

> >>>

> >>> , Prafulla Gang <jyotish@>

> >>> wrote:

> >>>>

> >>>> Dear Sreenadh ji

> >>>>

> >>>> I have also observed many jyotish stalwarts using navamsa chart

> >>> (along with other D charts). Now how to assess D9 charts - can be

> >>> perspective. But - as most authors say - just like D1 chart.

> >>>>

> >>>> I request members to share their experience.

> >>>>

> >>>> regards / Prafulla Gang

> >>>> http://www.prafulla.net

> >>>>

> >>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the right

> > to

> >>> be taken seriously. "

> >>>> ************************************************

> >>>>

> >>>>

> >>>>>

> >>>>> sreesog@

> >>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 07:56:49 -0000

> >>>>>

> >>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important?

> >>>>>

> >>>>> Dear Krishna ji,

> >>>>> ==>

> >>>>>> I too to the view that Navamsa chart is

> >>>>>> as important as Rasi chart.

> >>>>> <==

> >>>>> * There is not Navamsa " chart " , but only Navamsa. Navamsa chart

> >>> is

> >>>>> not as important as Rasi chart and it can never be, because it

> > is

> >>>>> only an amsa. But yes, it is more important than other amsas due

> >>> to

> >>>>> the prior said reasons.

> >>>>> ==>

> >>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines the overall

> >>>>>> strength of a planet?

> >>>>> <==

> >>>>> * Because the quality of earth determines the strength of the

> >>>>> plant. This is applicable to all amsas as per their importance.

> >>>>> ==>

> >>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa chart like

> >>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart?

> >>>>> <==

> >>>>> * No, it is not allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa. (There

> >>> is

> >>>>> no navamsa 'chart'.)

> >>>>>

> >>>>> ==>

> >>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be treated as

> > if

> >>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart?

> >>>>> <==

> >>>>> * No, when planets have sambandha in Navamsa, it only means

> > that.

> >>>>> When they have sombandha in Rasi, it only means that. It is

> > wrong

> >>> to

> >>>>> mix the two.

> >>>>> ==>

> >>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart as well?

> >>>>> <==

> >>>>> * No, Yogas should not be looked in Navamsa 'chart'. But yes

> >>> yoga in

> >>>>> Navamsa (not navamsa 'chart') can be taken yoga. Because it is

> > the

> >>>>> same principles as used in Rasi that are used to predict the

> >>> result

> >>>>> in Amsas as well - But Aspect(Drishti) and houses are not

> >>> applicable

> >>>>> to amsas. Both Aspect(Drishti) and Houses should be considered

> > in

> >>>>> Rasi chart itself. Any reference in ancient texts about aspect

> > or

> >>>>> houses essentially mean that they are referring to Rasi chart.

> >>>>> Love,

> >>>>> Sreenadh

> >>>>>

> >>>>> , Krishnamurthy Seetharama

> >>>>> <krishna_1998@> wrote:

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>> Dear Kolachina ji,

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>> It was interesting to read your comments on importance of the

> >>>>>> Navamsa chart. I too to the view that Navamsa chart

> > is

> >>>>>> as important as Rasi chart. This is based on my experience so

> >>>>>> far reading charts. However, I have still not understood what

> >>>>>> are the fundamental reasons for a varga chart being so

> >>>>>> important.

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines the overall

> >>>>>> strength of a planet?

> >>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa chart like

> >>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart?

> >>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be treated as

> > if

> >>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart?

> >>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart as well?

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>> By looking at the kind of importance given to Navamsa chart, it

> >>>>>> appears that the Rasi chart and Navamsa chart make up two equal

> >>>>>> halves representing the native.

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>> I have no doubts about the importance of Navamsa Chart. What I

> >>>>>> would like to know is why Navamsa gains such an importance?

> > What

> >>>>>> are the fundamental reasons? After all it is one of many varga

> >>>>>> charts!

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>> Regards,

> >>>>>> Krishna

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>> --- Satya Sai Kolachina <skolachi@> wrote:

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>>> Dear Sri Pradeep and Sri Chandrasekhar,

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>> I have been following this thread on karakamsa and both of

> >>>>>>> your

> >>>>>>> contributions.

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>> I whole-heartedly appreciate both of you for your valuable

> >>>>>>> inputs

> >>>>>>> you are providing to the astrological community. I would like

> >>>>>>> to

> >>>>>>> share my opinion (through my own experience).

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>> Considering Karakamsa from either Rasi or Navamsa chart alone

> >>>>>>> most

> >>>>>>> probably leads to erroneous results, as I found both the

> >>>>>>> approaches

> >>>>>>> working. I see the point Pradeep is making as very valuable;

> >>>>>>> at the

> >>>>>>> same time I am not against using Navamsa chart as separate

> >>>>>>> chart (of

> >>>>>>> course without losing the context of the Rasi chart), since

> >>>>>>> any of

> >>>>>>> the varga charts will not give independent results if the Rasi

> >>>>>>> chart

> >>>>>>> is ignored, as they themselves do not exist if the Rasi chart

> >>>>>>> doesn't exist. In fact Sri KN Rao also mentioned in several

> >>>>>>> occassions in many of his articles and books that yogas viewed

> >>>>>>> in

> >>>>>>> the Rasi chart should also exist in the Navamsa chart for

> >>>>>>> confirming

> >>>>>>> the results. If we do not see the Navamsa chart as a separate

> >>>>>>> chart,

> >>>>>>> how can we see the yogas therein? For the purpose of checking

> >>>>>>> some

> >>>>>>> yogas, Yuti and Veekshana (conjunction and aspects) in the

> >>>>>>> navamsa

> >>>>>>> chart make sense. This kind of yuti or veekshana should be

> >>>>>>> considered on a hypothetical level (as mutual influence at the

> >>>>>>> amsha level) rather than being within a 30 deg. span. of Rasi.

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>> Take an example. If a planet is exlated or in own house in the

> >>>>>>> rasi

> >>>>>>> chart and attains debilitation in the Navamsa chart, it is

> >>>>>>> condiered

> >>>>>>> as weakening of the actual strength shown in the Rasi. Why is

> >>>>>>> this

> >>>>>>> considered so? It is considered like that because, even though

> >>>>>>> the

> >>>>>>> planet is within its own or exlated rasi, still its

> >>>>>>> positioning

> >>>>>>> within that particular sector (here navamsa) has weakened it;

> >>>>>>> means,

> >>>>>>> within its own rasi, this particular sector is the weakest

> >>>>>>> point for

> >>>>>>> the planet within the strongest rasi; hence it loses its

> >>>>>>> strength

> >>>>>>> considerably. This means there is a gradation of strengths for

> >>>>>>> the

> >>>>>>> planet from first navamsa to the last navamsa. The navamsa

> >>>>>>> position

> >>>>>>> of a planet, thus indicates its refined placement within the

> >>>>>>> rasi.

> >>>>>>> In fact, Sri KN Rao also gives equal weightage to both the

> >>>>>>> Rasi and

> >>>>>>> Navamsa placement of a planet. If a planet is weak in one of

> >>>>>>> them

> >>>>>>> that means half the weightage is lost. We may not give the

> >>>>>>> same

> >>>>>>> level of treatment to other vargas as we give to Navamsa; but

> >>>>>>> Navamsa is as important as the Rasi; to the extent that it can

> >>>>>>> be

> >>>>>>> viewed as an independent chart (to confirm the promise given

> >>>>>>> by the

> >>>>>>> rasi chart).

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>> Without a confirmation of Navamsa chart, yogas in the rasi

> >>>>>>> chart

> >>>>>>> alone cannot and will not give expected results; I have

> >>>>>>> observed

> >>>>>>> this phenomenon in several charts.

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>> My own experience is; I have Chandra and Sukra both in the

> >>>>>>> 12th

> >>>>>>> house from Karakamsa in the Navamsa chart (not in the rasi

> >>>>>>> chart

> >>>>>>> with the rasi of karakamsa considering as the karakamsa

> >>>>>>> lagna). I am

> >>>>>>> a deep devotee of Goddess Parvathi (represented by Chandra)

> >>>>>>> and

> >>>>>>> Goddess Lakshmi (represented by Sukra). If the karakamsa is

> >>>>>>> brought

> >>>>>>> to the Rasi chart, this cannot be explained. The sequence of

> >>>>>>> my life

> >>>>>>> events are better explained only if I consider karakamsa lagna

> >>>>>>> in

> >>>>>>> the navamsa chart; I am not discounting Pradeep's opinion

> >>>>>>> here; I am

> >>>>>>> just saying that both approaches need to be considered on the

> >>>>>>> chart,

> >>>>>>> and a composite opinion be formed, as Sri KN Rao always says.

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>> On the other hand, considering the specific rasi in the Rasi

> >>>>>>> chart

> >>>>>>> that holds karakamsa as the karakamsa lagna, my Sukra is in

> >>>>>>> the 4th

> >>>>>>> house indicating my possession of a nice beautiful house, and

> >>>>>>> education/skills in arts (in addition to other traditional

> >>>>>>> education).

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>> I am bringing this to both your knowledge only to summarize

> >>>>>>> that

> >>>>>>> both your theories give results; but not necessarily in

> >>>>>>> isolation of

> >>>>>>> the other.

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>> Thanks for all your contribution.

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>> Best regards,

> >>>>>>> Satya S Kolachina

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>> , Chandrashekhar

> >>>>>>> <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> >>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>> Dear Pradeep,

> >>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>> I can not comment on views of either Sanjay or K. N. Rao.

> >>>>>>> First

> >>>>>>> there is

> >>>>>>>> no difference in the meaning of Amsha and Amshaka though it

> >>>>>>> is

> >>>>>>> perhaps

> >>>>>>>> being confused. It also needs to be remembered that in

> >>>>>>> astrological

> >>>>>>>> translations many a times words are to be understood in the

> >>>>>>> context that

> >>>>>>>> they used. So we find Parashara mentioning karakamsha and

> >>>>>>> Swamsha

> >>>>>>> in

> >>>>>>>> alternate lines (almost) while indicating the results of

> >>>>>>> occupation of

> >>>>>>>> Karakamsha by Sun etc. and many other places in karakamsha

> >>>>>>> adhyaaya.

> >>>>>>>> This does not mean he is speaking about two different

> >>>>>>> parameters.

> >>>>>>> I

> >>>>>>>> think if any Sanskrit scholar who is also well versed in

> >>>>>>> interpretation

> >>>>>>>> of astrological texts will confirm this contention of mine

> >>>>>>> if he

> >>>>>>> is

> >>>>>>>> watching this discussion.

> >>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>> If you want my personal opinion, I think that the results

> >>>>>>> indicated on

> >>>>>>>> the basis of Karakamsha without reference to the potential

> >>>>>>> promised by

> >>>>>>>> the rasi chart and the strength derived by the grahas in

> >>>>>>> rasi

> >>>>>>> chart,

> >>>>>>>> through the Navamsha chart, are not likely to materialize. I

> >>>>>>> hope

> >>>>>>> this

> >>>>>>>> opinion of mine does not create a big storm in the

> >>>>>>> discussion on

> >>>>>>> the

> >>>>>>>> list. But this is my personal opinion, for whatever it is

> >>>>>>> worth.

> >>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>> Take care,

> >>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar.

> >>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>> vijayadas_pradeep wrote:

> >>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>> Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Respected members

> >>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>> Shri Sanjay Rath clearly says ,Amshaka is pointing to the

> >>>>>>> Rashi

> >>>>>>> in

> >>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha.He also says,Karakamsha has

> >>>>>>> one

> >>>>>>>>> meaning ,while Karakamsha KA has another meaning.

> >>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar jis view is Amshaka is not pointing to the

> >>>>>>> Rashi

> >>>>>>> in

> >>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha.

> >>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>> Now Chandraekhar jis view is prudent as there are some

> >>>>>>> shlokas

> >>>>>>> which

> >>>>>>>>> shri Rath somehow has overlooked,contradicting his view

> >>>>>>> point.

> >>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>> I respect shri Rath ,but i have to tell this.Sometimes the

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>> answer and

> >>>>>>>>> explanations given by shri Rath are not preceded by proper

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>> === message truncated ===

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>

> >>>

> > ____________________

> >>>>> ______________

> >>>>>> Be a PS3 game guru.

> >>>>>> Get your game face on with the latest PS3 news and previews at

> >>>>> Games.

> >>>>>> http://videogames./platform?platform=120121

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>

> >>>>>

> >>>>>

> >>>>>

> >>>>>

> >>>>>

[Guest guest]

Dear Pradeep,

 

Another important issue - In D9 charts reference - kalyan Varma has given hints

for results for Sun aspecting venus; or mercury aspecting venus. Since they can

never " aspect " in Rashi Kundli - the obvious reference was to Navamsa " chart " .

 

I do not think, kalyan varma can be treated at par with current age scholars !!

 

regards / Prafulla Gang

http://www.prafulla.net

 

" Men who never get carried away should be. "

************************************************

 

 

>

> jyotish

> Thu, 5 Jul 2007 20:23:15 -0800

>

> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important?

>

> Dear Sreenadh ji

>

> Well - who knows the truth? - Should the person making comment, be

> construed to be as truth seeker - until they prove with the application

> of the principles on the charts ( both ways - firstly the wrong

> application of others; and secondly how to read in correct way).

> Theorists without predictive support - has little relevance in jyotish.

> But yes - if you can justify your statements by case studies - then at

> least, I will hear with open mind.

>

> Understandably, I have been quoted to be " blind " to commentaries - but my

> submission is that - give me one reason to accept the views of " less read

> scholars " than to " well read scholars like Late Santhanam / Shri KN Rao /

> Shri Sanjay rath / many others " . and More so - as I do not " pretend " to

> know the sanskrit and do not " waste " my time on " shloka business " with my

> " incomplete knowledge " . So I am happy to be following better quality

> commentaries - who are expalining with the case studies.

>

> Of course - each one makes his choice.

>

>

> regards / Prafulla Gang

> http://www.prafulla.net

>

> " Men who never get carried away should be. "

> ************************************************

>

>

>>

>> sreesog

>> Thu, 05 Jul 2007 07:00:31 -0000

>>

>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important?

>>

>> Dear Prafulla ji,

>> * Even if those things are not there in ancient texts every one is

>> free to make or follow there own choice - yes, there is every chance

>> that even such new methods might give true results - your argument is

>> right.

>> * As far Sanskrit is concerned: Yes, it is your choice - when you

>> are blind to read and understand Sanskrit your self, and understand

>> what is there and what not, of course you have to follow someone who

>> says they see - you are right in that as well.

>> Love,

>> Sreenadh

>>

>> , Prafulla Gang <jyotish

>> wrote:

>>>

>>> Well Sreenadh ji - at times, these issues become choice or

>> prejudices in our own form of reading model. Had there not been any

>> substance in interpreting D9 charts - lot many stalwarts must not

>> have explored it - and I presume - many of them know better

>> sanskrit / jyotish (rather both) than all of us on the forum

>> collectively. So if at all - anyone wish to contest the

>> interpretation - then many of those stalwarts are the people - must

>> be debated with. On the forum, where not many great sanskrit

>> scholars / jyotish researchers - the arguments may not have any

>> relevance.

>>>

>>> regards / Prafulla Gang

>>> http://www.prafulla.net

>>>

>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the right to

>> be taken seriously. "

>>> ************************************************

>>>

>>>

>>>>

>>>> sreesog

>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 13:56:36 -0000

>>>>

>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important?

>>>>

>>>> Dear Prafulla ji,

>>>> * No ancient text ask us to read Navamsha (not chart) " just like

>> D1

>>>> chart " ; nor they provide slokas for the same.

>>>> * No ancient text provide as the results for " aspects of planets

>> in

>>>> Navamasa "

>>>> * Nor they give us the results to be predicted when planets are

>>>> placed " x house with reference to navamsa lagna "

>>>>

>>>> I hope we are trying to study astrology as taught by the sages;

>> If

>>>> not I don't have anything to say.

>>>>

>>>> Love,

>>>> Sreenadh

>>>>

>>>>

>>>> , Prafulla Gang <jyotish@>

>>>> wrote:

>>>>>

>>>>> Dear Sreenadh ji

>>>>>

>>>>> I have also observed many jyotish stalwarts using navamsa chart

>>>> (along with other D charts). Now how to assess D9 charts - can be

>>>> perspective. But - as most authors say - just like D1 chart.

>>>>>

>>>>> I request members to share their experience.

>>>>>

>>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang

>>>>> http://www.prafulla.net

>>>>>

>>>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the right

>> to

>>>> be taken seriously. "

>>>>> ************************************************

>>>>>

>>>>>

>>>>>>

>>>>>> sreesog@

>>>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 07:56:49 -0000

>>>>>>

>>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important?

>>>>>>

>>>>>> Dear Krishna ji,

>>>>>> ==>

>>>>>>> I too to the view that Navamsa chart is

>>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart.

>>>>>> <==

>>>>>> * There is not Navamsa " chart " , but only Navamsa. Navamsa chart

>>>> is

>>>>>> not as important as Rasi chart and it can never be, because it

>> is

>>>>>> only an amsa. But yes, it is more important than other amsas due

>>>> to

>>>>>> the prior said reasons.

>>>>>> ==>

>>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines the overall

>>>>>>> strength of a planet?

>>>>>> <==

>>>>>> * Because the quality of earth determines the strength of the

>>>>>> plant. This is applicable to all amsas as per their importance.

>>>>>> ==>

>>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa chart like

>>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart?

>>>>>> <==

>>>>>> * No, it is not allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa. (There

>>>> is

>>>>>> no navamsa 'chart'.)

>>>>>>

>>>>>> ==>

>>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be treated as

>> if

>>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart?

>>>>>> <==

>>>>>> * No, when planets have sambandha in Navamsa, it only means

>> that.

>>>>>> When they have sombandha in Rasi, it only means that. It is

>> wrong

>>>> to

>>>>>> mix the two.

>>>>>> ==>

>>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart as well?

>>>>>> <==

>>>>>> * No, Yogas should not be looked in Navamsa 'chart'. But yes

>>>> yoga in

>>>>>> Navamsa (not navamsa 'chart') can be taken yoga. Because it is

>> the

>>>>>> same principles as used in Rasi that are used to predict the

>>>> result

>>>>>> in Amsas as well - But Aspect(Drishti) and houses are not

>>>> applicable

>>>>>> to amsas. Both Aspect(Drishti) and Houses should be considered

>> in

>>>>>> Rasi chart itself. Any reference in ancient texts about aspect

>> or

>>>>>> houses essentially mean that they are referring to Rasi chart.

>>>>>> Love,

>>>>>> Sreenadh

>>>>>>

>>>>>> , Krishnamurthy Seetharama

>>>>>> <krishna_1998@> wrote:

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> Dear Kolachina ji,

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> It was interesting to read your comments on importance of the

>>>>>>> Navamsa chart. I too to the view that Navamsa chart

>> is

>>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart. This is based on my experience so

>>>>>>> far reading charts. However, I have still not understood what

>>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons for a varga chart being so

>>>>>>> important.

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines the overall

>>>>>>> strength of a planet?

>>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa chart like

>>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart?

>>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be treated as

>> if

>>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart?

>>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart as well?

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> By looking at the kind of importance given to Navamsa chart, it

>>>>>>> appears that the Rasi chart and Navamsa chart make up two equal

>>>>>>> halves representing the native.

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> I have no doubts about the importance of Navamsa Chart. What I

>>>>>>> would like to know is why Navamsa gains such an importance?

>> What

>>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons? After all it is one of many varga

>>>>>>> charts!

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> Regards,

>>>>>>> Krishna

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> --- Satya Sai Kolachina <skolachi@> wrote:

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> Dear Sri Pradeep and Sri Chandrasekhar,

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> I have been following this thread on karakamsa and both of

>>>>>>>> your

>>>>>>>> contributions.

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> I whole-heartedly appreciate both of you for your valuable

>>>>>>>> inputs

>>>>>>>> you are providing to the astrological community. I would like

>>>>>>>> to

>>>>>>>> share my opinion (through my own experience).

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> Considering Karakamsa from either Rasi or Navamsa chart alone

>>>>>>>> most

>>>>>>>> probably leads to erroneous results, as I found both the

>>>>>>>> approaches

>>>>>>>> working. I see the point Pradeep is making as very valuable;

>>>>>>>> at the

>>>>>>>> same time I am not against using Navamsa chart as separate

>>>>>>>> chart (of

>>>>>>>> course without losing the context of the Rasi chart), since

>>>>>>>> any of

>>>>>>>> the varga charts will not give independent results if the Rasi

>>>>>>>> chart

>>>>>>>> is ignored, as they themselves do not exist if the Rasi chart

>>>>>>>> doesn't exist. In fact Sri KN Rao also mentioned in several

>>>>>>>> occassions in many of his articles and books that yogas viewed

>>>>>>>> in

>>>>>>>> the Rasi chart should also exist in the Navamsa chart for

>>>>>>>> confirming

>>>>>>>> the results. If we do not see the Navamsa chart as a separate

>>>>>>>> chart,

>>>>>>>> how can we see the yogas therein? For the purpose of checking

>>>>>>>> some

>>>>>>>> yogas, Yuti and Veekshana (conjunction and aspects) in the

>>>>>>>> navamsa

>>>>>>>> chart make sense. This kind of yuti or veekshana should be

>>>>>>>> considered on a hypothetical level (as mutual influence at the

>>>>>>>> amsha level) rather than being within a 30 deg. span. of Rasi.

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> Take an example. If a planet is exlated or in own house in the

>>>>>>>> rasi

>>>>>>>> chart and attains debilitation in the Navamsa chart, it is

>>>>>>>> condiered

>>>>>>>> as weakening of the actual strength shown in the Rasi. Why is

>>>>>>>> this

>>>>>>>> considered so? It is considered like that because, even though

>>>>>>>> the

>>>>>>>> planet is within its own or exlated rasi, still its

>>>>>>>> positioning

>>>>>>>> within that particular sector (here navamsa) has weakened it;

>>>>>>>> means,

>>>>>>>> within its own rasi, this particular sector is the weakest

>>>>>>>> point for

>>>>>>>> the planet within the strongest rasi; hence it loses its

>>>>>>>> strength

>>>>>>>> considerably. This means there is a gradation of strengths for

>>>>>>>> the

>>>>>>>> planet from first navamsa to the last navamsa. The navamsa

>>>>>>>> position

>>>>>>>> of a planet, thus indicates its refined placement within the

>>>>>>>> rasi.

>>>>>>>> In fact, Sri KN Rao also gives equal weightage to both the

>>>>>>>> Rasi and

>>>>>>>> Navamsa placement of a planet. If a planet is weak in one of

>>>>>>>> them

>>>>>>>> that means half the weightage is lost. We may not give the

>>>>>>>> same

>>>>>>>> level of treatment to other vargas as we give to Navamsa; but

>>>>>>>> Navamsa is as important as the Rasi; to the extent that it can

>>>>>>>> be

>>>>>>>> viewed as an independent chart (to confirm the promise given

>>>>>>>> by the

>>>>>>>> rasi chart).

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> Without a confirmation of Navamsa chart, yogas in the rasi

>>>>>>>> chart

>>>>>>>> alone cannot and will not give expected results; I have

>>>>>>>> observed

>>>>>>>> this phenomenon in several charts.

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> My own experience is; I have Chandra and Sukra both in the

>>>>>>>> 12th

>>>>>>>> house from Karakamsa in the Navamsa chart (not in the rasi

>>>>>>>> chart

>>>>>>>> with the rasi of karakamsa considering as the karakamsa

>>>>>>>> lagna). I am

>>>>>>>> a deep devotee of Goddess Parvathi (represented by Chandra)

>>>>>>>> and

>>>>>>>> Goddess Lakshmi (represented by Sukra). If the karakamsa is

>>>>>>>> brought

>>>>>>>> to the Rasi chart, this cannot be explained. The sequence of

>>>>>>>> my life

>>>>>>>> events are better explained only if I consider karakamsa lagna

>>>>>>>> in

>>>>>>>> the navamsa chart; I am not discounting Pradeep's opinion

>>>>>>>> here; I am

>>>>>>>> just saying that both approaches need to be considered on the

>>>>>>>> chart,

>>>>>>>> and a composite opinion be formed, as Sri KN Rao always says.

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> On the other hand, considering the specific rasi in the Rasi

>>>>>>>> chart

>>>>>>>> that holds karakamsa as the karakamsa lagna, my Sukra is in

>>>>>>>> the 4th

>>>>>>>> house indicating my possession of a nice beautiful house, and

>>>>>>>> education/skills in arts (in addition to other traditional

>>>>>>>> education).

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> I am bringing this to both your knowledge only to summarize

>>>>>>>> that

>>>>>>>> both your theories give results; but not necessarily in

>>>>>>>> isolation of

>>>>>>>> the other.

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> Thanks for all your contribution.

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> Best regards,

>>>>>>>> Satya S Kolachina

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> , Chandrashekhar

>>>>>>>> <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>> Dear Pradeep,

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>> I can not comment on views of either Sanjay or K. N. Rao.

>>>>>>>> First

>>>>>>>> there is

>>>>>>>>> no difference in the meaning of Amsha and Amshaka though it

>>>>>>>> is

>>>>>>>> perhaps

>>>>>>>>> being confused. It also needs to be remembered that in

>>>>>>>> astrological

>>>>>>>>> translations many a times words are to be understood in the

>>>>>>>> context that

>>>>>>>>> they used. So we find Parashara mentioning karakamsha and

>>>>>>>> Swamsha

>>>>>>>> in

>>>>>>>>> alternate lines (almost) while indicating the results of

>>>>>>>> occupation of

>>>>>>>>> Karakamsha by Sun etc. and many other places in karakamsha

>>>>>>>> adhyaaya.

>>>>>>>>> This does not mean he is speaking about two different

>>>>>>>> parameters.

>>>>>>>> I

>>>>>>>>> think if any Sanskrit scholar who is also well versed in

>>>>>>>> interpretation

>>>>>>>>> of astrological texts will confirm this contention of mine

>>>>>>>> if he

>>>>>>>> is

>>>>>>>>> watching this discussion.

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>> If you want my personal opinion, I think that the results

>>>>>>>> indicated on

>>>>>>>>> the basis of Karakamsha without reference to the potential

>>>>>>>> promised by

>>>>>>>>> the rasi chart and the strength derived by the grahas in

>>>>>>>> rasi

>>>>>>>> chart,

>>>>>>>>> through the Navamsha chart, are not likely to materialize. I

>>>>>>>> hope

>>>>>>>> this

>>>>>>>>> opinion of mine does not create a big storm in the

>>>>>>>> discussion on

>>>>>>>> the

>>>>>>>>> list. But this is my personal opinion, for whatever it is

>>>>>>>> worth.

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>> Take care,

>>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar.

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>> vijayadas_pradeep wrote:

>>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>> Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Respected members

>>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>> Shri Sanjay Rath clearly says ,Amshaka is pointing to the

>>>>>>>> Rashi

>>>>>>>> in

>>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha.He also says,Karakamsha has

>>>>>>>> one

>>>>>>>>>> meaning ,while Karakamsha KA has another meaning.

>>>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar jis view is Amshaka is not pointing to the

>>>>>>>> Rashi

>>>>>>>> in

>>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha.

>>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>> Now Chandraekhar jis view is prudent as there are some

>>>>>>>> shlokas

>>>>>>>> which

>>>>>>>>>> shri Rath somehow has overlooked,contradicting his view

>>>>>>>> point.

>>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>> I respect shri Rath ,but i have to tell this.Sometimes the

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> answer and

>>>>>>>>>> explanations given by shri Rath are not preceded by proper

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> === message truncated ===

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>

>>>>

>> ____________________

>>>>>> ______________

>>>>>>> Be a PS3 game guru.

>>>>>>> Get your game face on with the latest PS3 news and previews at

>>>>>> Games.

>>>>>>> http://videogames./platform?platform=120121

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>

>>>>>>

>>>>>>

>>>>>>

>>>>>>

>>>>>>

[Guest guest]

Dear All,

 

As I was the one who started this thread, I must say that the

debate reamins inconclusive.

 

It makes logical sense to say that one should not use aspects,

conjunctions etc. in D-charts as we are looking only at logical

positions of planets and not their physical positions like in

the Rasi chart. But, then why so many learned people who have

done succesful predictions consider aspects and conjunctions in

D-charts? Let me forget about all the other D-charts for now and

let me stick to only Navamsha as that is what we are discussing

in this thread.

 

In mind, based on my learning, I felt that Navamsha charts are

at a different plane as compared to other D-charts and hence it

is allowed to look at aspects and conjunctions only in Navamsha

and not in other D-Charts. I wanted to know the reasoning behind

this special treatment to Navamsha chart and hence raised this

question.

 

I started learning Jyotish using Shri. B V Raman's books. He

uses Navamsa Chart like Rasi Chart for all practical purposes.

He has been considered as one of the pioneers in modern day

Astrology.

 

I tend to agree with Prafulla. After all, why do we study this

science? The answer for me is that it shows the light and guides

me in my life. Hence, preditive part of the science is as of

paramount importance. I guess the only way to resolve this

deadlock is to take a bunch of charts (with reasonably accurate

birth data) and study them with and without using aspects and

conjunctions in Navamsha and explain the major events in life.

 

I see no other way to end this debate.

 

Regards,

Krishna

 

 

--- Prafulla Gang <jyotish wrote:

 

> Dear Sreenadh ji

>

> Well - who knows the truth? - Should the person making

> comment, be construed to be as truth seeker - until they prove

> with the application of the principles on the charts ( both

> ways - firstly the wrong application of others; and secondly

> how to read in correct way). Theorists without predictive

> support - has little relevance in jyotish. But yes - if you

> can justify your statements by case studies - then at least, I

> will hear with open mind.

>

> Understandably, I have been quoted to be " blind " to

> commentaries - but my submission is that - give me one reason

> to accept the views of " less read scholars " than to " well read

> scholars like Late Santhanam / Shri KN Rao / Shri Sanjay rath

> / many others " . and More so - as I do not " pretend " to know

> the sanskrit and do not " waste " my time on " shloka business "

> with my " incomplete knowledge " . So I am happy to be following

> better quality commentaries - who are expalining with the case

> studies.

>

> Of course - each one makes his choice.

>

>

> regards / Prafulla Gang

> http://www.prafulla.net

>

> " Men who never get carried away should be. "

> ************************************************

>

>

> >

> > sreesog

> > Thu, 05 Jul 2007 07:00:31 -0000

> >

> > Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so

> important?

> >

> > Dear Prafulla ji,

> > * Even if those things are not there in ancient texts every

> one is

> > free to make or follow there own choice - yes, there is

> every chance

> > that even such new methods might give true results - your

> argument is

> > right.

> > * As far Sanskrit is concerned: Yes, it is your choice -

> when you

> > are blind to read and understand Sanskrit your self, and

> understand

> > what is there and what not, of course you have to follow

> someone who

> > says they see - you are right in that as well.

> > Love,

> > Sreenadh

> >

> > , Prafulla Gang

> <jyotish

> > wrote:

> >>

> >> Well Sreenadh ji - at times, these issues become choice or

> > prejudices in our own form of reading model. Had there not

> been any

> > substance in interpreting D9 charts - lot many stalwarts

> must not

> > have explored it - and I presume - many of them know better

> > sanskrit / jyotish (rather both) than all of us on the forum

> > collectively. So if at all - anyone wish to contest the

> > interpretation - then many of those stalwarts are the people

> - must

> > be debated with. On the forum, where not many great sanskrit

> > scholars / jyotish researchers - the arguments may not have

> any

> > relevance.

> >>

> >> regards / Prafulla Gang

> >> http://www.prafulla.net

> >>

> >> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the

> right to

> > be taken seriously. "

> >> ************************************************

> >>

> >>

> >>>

> >>> sreesog

> >>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 13:56:36 -0000

> >>>

> >>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so

> important?

> >>>

> >>> Dear Prafulla ji,

> >>> * No ancient text ask us to read Navamsha (not chart)

> " just like

> > D1

> >>> chart " ; nor they provide slokas for the same.

> >>> * No ancient text provide as the results for " aspects of

> planets

> > in

> >>> Navamasa "

> >>> * Nor they give us the results to be predicted when

> planets are

> >>> placed " x house with reference to navamsa lagna "

> >>>

> >>> I hope we are trying to study astrology as taught by the

> sages;

> > If

> >>> not I don't have anything to say.

> >>>

> >>> Love,

> >>> Sreenadh

> >>>

> >>>

> >>> , Prafulla Gang

> <jyotish@>

> >>> wrote:

> >>>>

> >>>> Dear Sreenadh ji

> >>>>

> >>>> I have also observed many jyotish stalwarts using navamsa

> chart

> >>> (along with other D charts). Now how to assess D9 charts

> - can be

> >>> perspective. But - as most authors say - just like D1

> chart.

> >>>>

> >>>> I request members to share their experience.

> >>>>

> >>>> regards / Prafulla Gang

> >>>> http://www.prafulla.net

> >>>>

> >>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the

> right

> > to

> >>> be taken seriously. "

> >>>> ************************************************

> >>>>

> >>>>

> >>>>>

> >>>>> sreesog@

> >>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 07:56:49 -0000

> >>>>>

> >>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so

> important?

> >>>>>

> >>>>> Dear Krishna ji,

> >>>>> ==>

> >>>>>> I too to the view that Navamsa chart is

> >>>>>> as important as Rasi chart.

> >>>>> <==

> >>>>> * There is not Navamsa " chart " , but only Navamsa.

> Navamsa chart

> >>> is

> >>>>> not as important as Rasi chart and it can never be,

> because it

> > is

> >>>>> only an amsa. But yes, it is more important than other

> amsas due

> >>> to

> >>>>> the prior said reasons.

> >>>>> ==>

> >>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines the

> overall

> >>>>>> strength of a planet?

> >>>>> <==

> >>>>> * Because the quality of earth determines the strength

> of the

> >>>>> plant. This is applicable to all amsas as per their

> importance.

> >>>>> ==>

> >>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa

> chart like

> >>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart?

> >>>>> <==

> >>>>> * No, it is not allowed to consider aspects in

> Navamsa. (There

> >>> is

> >>>>> no navamsa 'chart'.)

> >>>>>

> >>>>> ==>

> >>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be

> treated as

> > if

> >>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart?

> >>>>> <==

> >>>>> * No, when planets have sambandha in Navamsa, it only

> means

> > that.

> >>>>> When they have sombandha in Rasi, it only means that. It

> is

> > wrong

> >>> to

> >>>>> mix the two.

> >>>>> ==>

> >>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart as

> well?

> >>>>> <==

> >>>>> * No, Yogas should not be looked in Navamsa 'chart'.

> But yes

> >>> yoga in

> >>>>> Navamsa (not navamsa 'chart') can be taken yoga. Because

> it

=== message truncated ===

 

 

 

 

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[Guest guest]

Namaste Prafulla and others

 

The major contention of those not using Navamsha not as a separate chart is

that physically the planets positions are shown by the Rashi chart and

cannot by any other chart. This is untrue. Kindly read below:

 

Our eyes can only capture a certain frequency of light waves. If we were

able to see sight on a different frequency the world would change and so

would the planetary positions. There are deeper things to be seen and known.

One should not reject the idea of usage of Amshas as separate charts,

without proper scrutiny.

 

I personally, do not use amshas as separate charts for a simple reason that

I do not know how to use them separately. I am waiting for plausible

answers. I do not stop others from using them, but, do get dismayed at times

when people justify things through any divisional charts. So many rules

should not be made that they are applicable to every human beings chart and

can be used to justify anything in life.

 

Unlike Upanishads, which have bhashyas and a great lineage of Teachers, we

do not have the same for Astrology. Most of the texts are hidden, burnt,

destroyed, misrepresented, misquoted, etc. etc... People with no knowledge

of Sanskrit trying to decipher verses using Sri Apte dictionary. They

haven't the faintest idea on how Sanskrit verse can mean in 5-7 different

ways. In such a scenario, it is difficult to rely on half knowledge. It is

better to have an open mind and use a principle when one has sound knowledge

of it.

 

Thanks and Regards

Bharat

 

 

 

 

 

On 7/6/07, Prafulla Gang <jyotish wrote:

>

> Dear Pradeep,

>

> Another important issue - In D9 charts reference - kalyan Varma has given

> hints for results for Sun aspecting venus; or mercury aspecting venus. Since

> they can never " aspect " in Rashi Kundli - the obvious reference was to

> Navamsa " chart " .

>

> I do not think, kalyan varma can be treated at par with current age

> scholars !!

>

> regards / Prafulla Gang

> http://www.prafulla.net

>

> " Men who never get carried away should be. "

> ************************************************

>

> >

> > jyotish <jyotish%40inbox.com>

> > Thu, 5 Jul 2007 20:23:15 -0800

> > <%40>

> > Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important?

> >

> > Dear Sreenadh ji

> >

> > Well - who knows the truth? - Should the person making comment, be

> > construed to be as truth seeker - until they prove with the application

> > of the principles on the charts ( both ways - firstly the wrong

> > application of others; and secondly how to read in correct way).

> > Theorists without predictive support - has little relevance in jyotish.

> > But yes - if you can justify your statements by case studies - then at

> > least, I will hear with open mind.

> >

> > Understandably, I have been quoted to be " blind " to commentaries - but

> my

> > submission is that - give me one reason to accept the views of " less

> read

> > scholars " than to " well read scholars like Late Santhanam / Shri KN Rao

> /

> > Shri Sanjay rath / many others " . and More so - as I do not " pretend " to

> > know the sanskrit and do not " waste " my time on " shloka business " with

> my

> > " incomplete knowledge " . So I am happy to be following better quality

> > commentaries - who are expalining with the case studies.

> >

> > Of course - each one makes his choice.

> >

> >

> > regards / Prafulla Gang

> > http://www.prafulla.net

> >

> > " Men who never get carried away should be. "

> > ************************************************

> >

> >

> >>

> >> sreesog <sreesog%40>

> >> Thu, 05 Jul 2007 07:00:31 -0000

> >> <%40>

> >> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important?

> >>

> >> Dear Prafulla ji,

> >> * Even if those things are not there in ancient texts every one is

> >> free to make or follow there own choice - yes, there is every chance

> >> that even such new methods might give true results - your argument is

> >> right.

> >> * As far Sanskrit is concerned: Yes, it is your choice - when you

> >> are blind to read and understand Sanskrit your self, and understand

> >> what is there and what not, of course you have to follow someone who

> >> says they see - you are right in that as well.

> >> Love,

> >> Sreenadh

> >>

> >> <%40>,

> Prafulla Gang <jyotish

> >> wrote:

> >>>

> >>> Well Sreenadh ji - at times, these issues become choice or

> >> prejudices in our own form of reading model. Had there not been any

> >> substance in interpreting D9 charts - lot many stalwarts must not

> >> have explored it - and I presume - many of them know better

> >> sanskrit / jyotish (rather both) than all of us on the forum

> >> collectively. So if at all - anyone wish to contest the

> >> interpretation - then many of those stalwarts are the people - must

> >> be debated with. On the forum, where not many great sanskrit

> >> scholars / jyotish researchers - the arguments may not have any

> >> relevance.

> >>>

> >>> regards / Prafulla Gang

> >>> http://www.prafulla.net

> >>>

> >>> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the right to

> >> be taken seriously. "

> >>> ************************************************

> >>>

> >>>

> >>>>

> >>>> sreesog

> >>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 13:56:36 -0000

> >>>> <%40>

> >>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important?

> >>>>

> >>>> Dear Prafulla ji,

> >>>> * No ancient text ask us to read Navamsha (not chart) " just like

> >> D1

> >>>> chart " ; nor they provide slokas for the same.

> >>>> * No ancient text provide as the results for " aspects of planets

> >> in

> >>>> Navamasa "

> >>>> * Nor they give us the results to be predicted when planets are

> >>>> placed " x house with reference to navamsa lagna "

> >>>>

> >>>> I hope we are trying to study astrology as taught by the sages;

> >> If

> >>>> not I don't have anything to say.

> >>>>

> >>>> Love,

> >>>> Sreenadh

> >>>>

> >>>>

> >>>> <%40>,

> Prafulla Gang <jyotish@>

> >>>> wrote:

> >>>>>

> >>>>> Dear Sreenadh ji

> >>>>>

> >>>>> I have also observed many jyotish stalwarts using navamsa chart

> >>>> (along with other D charts). Now how to assess D9 charts - can be

> >>>> perspective. But - as most authors say - just like D1 chart.

> >>>>>

> >>>>> I request members to share their experience.

> >>>>>

> >>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang

> >>>>> http://www.prafulla.net

> >>>>>

> >>>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the right

> >> to

> >>>> be taken seriously. "

> >>>>> ************************************************

> >>>>>

> >>>>>

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>> sreesog@

> >>>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 07:56:49 -0000

> >>>>>> <%40>

> >>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important?

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>> Dear Krishna ji,

> >>>>>> ==>

> >>>>>>> I too to the view that Navamsa chart is

> >>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart.

> >>>>>> <==

> >>>>>> * There is not Navamsa " chart " , but only Navamsa. Navamsa chart

> >>>> is

> >>>>>> not as important as Rasi chart and it can never be, because it

> >> is

> >>>>>> only an amsa. But yes, it is more important than other amsas due

> >>>> to

> >>>>>> the prior said reasons.

> >>>>>> ==>

> >>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines the overall

> >>>>>>> strength of a planet?

> >>>>>> <==

> >>>>>> * Because the quality of earth determines the strength of the

> >>>>>> plant. This is applicable to all amsas as per their importance.

> >>>>>> ==>

> >>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa chart like

> >>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart?

> >>>>>> <==

> >>>>>> * No, it is not allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa. (There

> >>>> is

> >>>>>> no navamsa 'chart'.)

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>> ==>

> >>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be treated as

> >> if

> >>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart?

> >>>>>> <==

> >>>>>> * No, when planets have sambandha in Navamsa, it only means

> >> that.

> >>>>>> When they have sombandha in Rasi, it only means that. It is

> >> wrong

> >>>> to

> >>>>>> mix the two.

> >>>>>> ==>

> >>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart as well?

> >>>>>> <==

> >>>>>> * No, Yogas should not be looked in Navamsa 'chart'. But yes

> >>>> yoga in

> >>>>>> Navamsa (not navamsa 'chart') can be taken yoga. Because it is

> >> the

> >>>>>> same principles as used in Rasi that are used to predict the

> >>>> result

> >>>>>> in Amsas as well - But Aspect(Drishti) and houses are not

> >>>> applicable

> >>>>>> to amsas. Both Aspect(Drishti) and Houses should be considered

> >> in

> >>>>>> Rasi chart itself. Any reference in ancient texts about aspect

> >> or

> >>>>>> houses essentially mean that they are referring to Rasi chart.

> >>>>>> Love,

> >>>>>> Sreenadh

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>> <%40>,

> Krishnamurthy Seetharama

> >>>>>> <krishna_1998@> wrote:

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>> Dear Kolachina ji,

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>> It was interesting to read your comments on importance of the

> >>>>>>> Navamsa chart. I too to the view that Navamsa chart

> >> is

> >>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart. This is based on my experience so

> >>>>>>> far reading charts. However, I have still not understood what

> >>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons for a varga chart being so

> >>>>>>> important.

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines the overall

> >>>>>>> strength of a planet?

> >>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa chart like

> >>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart?

> >>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be treated as

> >> if

> >>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart?

> >>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart as well?

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>> By looking at the kind of importance given to Navamsa chart, it

> >>>>>>> appears that the Rasi chart and Navamsa chart make up two equal

> >>>>>>> halves representing the native.

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>> I have no doubts about the importance of Navamsa Chart. What I

> >>>>>>> would like to know is why Navamsa gains such an importance?

> >> What

> >>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons? After all it is one of many varga

> >>>>>>> charts!

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>> Regards,

> >>>>>>> Krishna

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>> --- Satya Sai Kolachina <skolachi@> wrote:

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>> Dear Sri Pradeep and Sri Chandrasekhar,

> >>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>> I have been following this thread on karakamsa and both of

> >>>>>>>> your

> >>>>>>>> contributions.

> >>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>> I whole-heartedly appreciate both of you for your valuable

> >>>>>>>> inputs

> >>>>>>>> you are providing to the astrological community. I would like

> >>>>>>>> to

> >>>>>>>> share my opinion (through my own experience).

> >>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>> Considering Karakamsa from either Rasi or Navamsa chart alone

> >>>>>>>> most

> >>>>>>>> probably leads to erroneous results, as I found both the

> >>>>>>>> approaches

> >>>>>>>> working. I see the point Pradeep is making as very valuable;

> >>>>>>>> at the

> >>>>>>>> same time I am not against using Navamsa chart as separate

> >>>>>>>> chart (of

> >>>>>>>> course without losing the context of the Rasi chart), since

> >>>>>>>> any of

> >>>>>>>> the varga charts will not give independent results if the Rasi

> >>>>>>>> chart

> >>>>>>>> is ignored, as they themselves do not exist if the Rasi chart

> >>>>>>>> doesn't exist. In fact Sri KN Rao also mentioned in several

> >>>>>>>> occassions in many of his articles and books that yogas viewed

> >>>>>>>> in

> >>>>>>>> the Rasi chart should also exist in the Navamsa chart for

> >>>>>>>> confirming

> >>>>>>>> the results. If we do not see the Navamsa chart as a separate

> >>>>>>>> chart,

> >>>>>>>> how can we see the yogas therein? For the purpose of checking

> >>>>>>>> some

> >>>>>>>> yogas, Yuti and Veekshana (conjunction and aspects) in the

> >>>>>>>> navamsa

> >>>>>>>> chart make sense. This kind of yuti or veekshana should be

> >>>>>>>> considered on a hypothetical level (as mutual influence at the

> >>>>>>>> amsha level) rather than being within a 30 deg. span. of Rasi.

> >>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>> Take an example. If a planet is exlated or in own house in the

> >>>>>>>> rasi

> >>>>>>>> chart and attains debilitation in the Navamsa chart, it is

> >>>>>>>> condiered

> >>>>>>>> as weakening of the actual strength shown in the Rasi. Why is

> >>>>>>>> this

> >>>>>>>> considered so? It is considered like that because, even though

> >>>>>>>> the

> >>>>>>>> planet is within its own or exlated rasi, still its

> >>>>>>>> positioning

> >>>>>>>> within that particular sector (here navamsa) has weakened it;

> >>>>>>>> means,

> >>>>>>>> within its own rasi, this particular sector is the weakest

> >>>>>>>> point for

> >>>>>>>> the planet within the strongest rasi; hence it loses its

> >>>>>>>> strength

> >>>>>>>> considerably. This means there is a gradation of strengths for

> >>>>>>>> the

> >>>>>>>> planet from first navamsa to the last navamsa. The navamsa

> >>>>>>>> position

> >>>>>>>> of a planet, thus indicates its refined placement within the

> >>>>>>>> rasi.

> >>>>>>>> In fact, Sri KN Rao also gives equal weightage to both the

> >>>>>>>> Rasi and

> >>>>>>>> Navamsa placement of a planet. If a planet is weak in one of

> >>>>>>>> them

> >>>>>>>> that means half the weightage is lost. We may not give the

> >>>>>>>> same

> >>>>>>>> level of treatment to other vargas as we give to Navamsa; but

> >>>>>>>> Navamsa is as important as the Rasi; to the extent that it can

> >>>>>>>> be

> >>>>>>>> viewed as an independent chart (to confirm the promise given

> >>>>>>>> by the

> >>>>>>>> rasi chart).

> >>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>> Without a confirmation of Navamsa chart, yogas in the rasi

> >>>>>>>> chart

> >>>>>>>> alone cannot and will not give expected results; I have

> >>>>>>>> observed

> >>>>>>>> this phenomenon in several charts.

> >>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>> My own experience is; I have Chandra and Sukra both in the

> >>>>>>>> 12th

> >>>>>>>> house from Karakamsa in the Navamsa chart (not in the rasi

> >>>>>>>> chart

> >>>>>>>> with the rasi of karakamsa considering as the karakamsa

> >>>>>>>> lagna). I am

> >>>>>>>> a deep devotee of Goddess Parvathi (represented by Chandra)

> >>>>>>>> and

> >>>>>>>> Goddess Lakshmi (represented by Sukra). If the karakamsa is

> >>>>>>>> brought

> >>>>>>>> to the Rasi chart, this cannot be explained. The sequence of

> >>>>>>>> my life

> >>>>>>>> events are better explained only if I consider karakamsa lagna

> >>>>>>>> in

> >>>>>>>> the navamsa chart; I am not discounting Pradeep's opinion

> >>>>>>>> here; I am

> >>>>>>>> just saying that both approaches need to be considered on the

> >>>>>>>> chart,

> >>>>>>>> and a composite opinion be formed, as Sri KN Rao always says.

> >>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>> On the other hand, considering the specific rasi in the Rasi

> >>>>>>>> chart

> >>>>>>>> that holds karakamsa as the karakamsa lagna, my Sukra is in

> >>>>>>>> the 4th

> >>>>>>>> house indicating my possession of a nice beautiful house, and

> >>>>>>>> education/skills in arts (in addition to other traditional

> >>>>>>>> education).

> >>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>> I am bringing this to both your knowledge only to summarize

> >>>>>>>> that

> >>>>>>>> both your theories give results; but not necessarily in

> >>>>>>>> isolation of

> >>>>>>>> the other.

> >>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>> Thanks for all your contribution.

> >>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>> Best regards,

> >>>>>>>> Satya S Kolachina

> >>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>> <%40>,

> Chandrashekhar

> >>>>>>>> <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> >>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>> Dear Pradeep,

> >>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>> I can not comment on views of either Sanjay or K. N. Rao.

> >>>>>>>> First

> >>>>>>>> there is

> >>>>>>>>> no difference in the meaning of Amsha and Amshaka though it

> >>>>>>>> is

> >>>>>>>> perhaps

> >>>>>>>>> being confused. It also needs to be remembered that in

> >>>>>>>> astrological

> >>>>>>>>> translations many a times words are to be understood in the

> >>>>>>>> context that

> >>>>>>>>> they used. So we find Parashara mentioning karakamsha and

> >>>>>>>> Swamsha

> >>>>>>>> in

> >>>>>>>>> alternate lines (almost) while indicating the results of

> >>>>>>>> occupation of

> >>>>>>>>> Karakamsha by Sun etc. and many other places in karakamsha

> >>>>>>>> adhyaaya.

> >>>>>>>>> This does not mean he is speaking about two different

> >>>>>>>> parameters.

> >>>>>>>> I

> >>>>>>>>> think if any Sanskrit scholar who is also well versed in

> >>>>>>>> interpretation

> >>>>>>>>> of astrological texts will confirm this contention of mine

> >>>>>>>> if he

> >>>>>>>> is

> >>>>>>>>> watching this discussion.

> >>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>> If you want my personal opinion, I think that the results

> >>>>>>>> indicated on

> >>>>>>>>> the basis of Karakamsha without reference to the potential

> >>>>>>>> promised by

> >>>>>>>>> the rasi chart and the strength derived by the grahas in

> >>>>>>>> rasi

> >>>>>>>> chart,

> >>>>>>>>> through the Navamsha chart, are not likely to materialize. I

> >>>>>>>> hope

> >>>>>>>> this

> >>>>>>>>> opinion of mine does not create a big storm in the

> >>>>>>>> discussion on

> >>>>>>>> the

> >>>>>>>>> list. But this is my personal opinion, for whatever it is

> >>>>>>>> worth.

> >>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>> Take care,

> >>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar.

> >>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>> vijayadas_pradeep wrote:

> >>>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>>> Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Respected members

> >>>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>>> Shri Sanjay Rath clearly says ,Amshaka is pointing to the

> >>>>>>>> Rashi

> >>>>>>>> in

> >>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha.He also says,Karakamsha has

> >>>>>>>> one

> >>>>>>>>>> meaning ,while Karakamsha KA has another meaning.

> >>>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar jis view is Amshaka is not pointing to the

> >>>>>>>> Rashi

> >>>>>>>> in

> >>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha.

> >>>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>>> Now Chandraekhar jis view is prudent as there are some

> >>>>>>>> shlokas

> >>>>>>>> which

> >>>>>>>>>> shri Rath somehow has overlooked,contradicting his view

> >>>>>>>> point.

> >>>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>>> I respect shri Rath ,but i have to tell this.Sometimes the

> >>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>> answer and

> >>>>>>>>>> explanations given by shri Rath are not preceded by proper

> >>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>> === message truncated ===

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>

> >>>>

> >> ________

> >>>>>> ______________

> >>>>>>> Be a PS3 game guru.

> >>>>>>> Get your game face on with the latest PS3 news and previews at

> >>>>>> Games.

> >>>>>>> http://videogames./platform?platform=120121

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>>

[Guest guest]

The second " not " in the first line of the previous post is an error. It

should read as " The major contention of those not using Navamsha as a

separate chart. "

 

Sorry for the typo.

 

Thanks and Regards

Bharat

 

On 7/6/07, Bharat - Hindu Astrology <astrologyhindu wrote:

>

> Namaste Prafulla and others

>

> The major contention of those not using Navamsha not as a separate chart

> is that physically the planets positions are shown by the Rashi chart and

> cannot by any other chart. This is untrue. Kindly read below:

>

> Our eyes can only capture a certain frequency of light waves. If we were

> able to see sight on a different frequency the world would change and so

> would the planetary positions. There are deeper things to be seen and known.

> One should not reject the idea of usage of Amshas as separate charts,

> without proper scrutiny.

>

> I personally, do not use amshas as separate charts for a simple reason

> that I do not know how to use them separately. I am waiting for plausible

> answers. I do not stop others from using them, but, do get dismayed at times

> when people justify things through any divisional charts. So many rules

> should not be made that they are applicable to every human beings chart and

> can be used to justify anything in life.

>

> Unlike Upanishads, which have bhashyas and a great lineage of Teachers, we

> do not have the same for Astrology. Most of the texts are hidden, burnt,

> destroyed, misrepresented, misquoted, etc. etc... People with no knowledge

> of Sanskrit trying to decipher verses using Sri Apte dictionary. They

> haven't the faintest idea on how Sanskrit verse can mean in 5-7 different

> ways. In such a scenario, it is difficult to rely on half knowledge. It is

> better to have an open mind and use a principle when one has sound knowledge

> of it.

>

> Thanks and Regards

> Bharat

>

>

>

>

>

> On 7/6/07, Prafulla Gang <jyotish wrote:

> >

> > Dear Pradeep,

> >

> > Another important issue - In D9 charts reference - kalyan Varma has

> > given hints for results for Sun aspecting venus; or mercury aspecting venus.

> > Since they can never " aspect " in Rashi Kundli - the obvious reference was to

> > Navamsa " chart " .

> >

> > I do not think, kalyan varma can be treated at par with current age

> > scholars !!

> >

> > regards / Prafulla Gang

> > http://www.prafulla.net

> >

> > " Men who never get carried away should be. "

> > ************************************************

> >

> > >

> > > jyotish <jyotish%40inbox.com>

> > > Thu, 5 Jul 2007 20:23:15 -0800

> > > <%40>

> > > Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important?

> > >

> > > Dear Sreenadh ji

> > >

> > > Well - who knows the truth? - Should the person making comment, be

> > > construed to be as truth seeker - until they prove with the

> > application

> > > of the principles on the charts ( both ways - firstly the wrong

> > > application of others; and secondly how to read in correct way).

> > > Theorists without predictive support - has little relevance in

> > jyotish.

> > > But yes - if you can justify your statements by case studies - then at

> > > least, I will hear with open mind.

> > >

> > > Understandably, I have been quoted to be " blind " to commentaries - but

> > my

> > > submission is that - give me one reason to accept the views of " less

> > read

> > > scholars " than to " well read scholars like Late Santhanam / Shri KN

> > Rao /

> > > Shri Sanjay rath / many others " . and More so - as I do not " pretend "

> > to

> > > know the sanskrit and do not " waste " my time on " shloka business " with

> > my

> > > " incomplete knowledge " . So I am happy to be following better quality

> > > commentaries - who are expalining with the case studies.

> > >

> > > Of course - each one makes his choice.

> > >

> > >

> > > regards / Prafulla Gang

> > > http://www.prafulla.net

> > >

> > > " Men who never get carried away should be. "

> > > ************************************************

> > >

> > >

> > >>

> > >> sreesog <sreesog%40>

> > >> Thu, 05 Jul 2007 07:00:31 -0000

> > >> <%40>

> > >> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important?

> > >>

> > >> Dear Prafulla ji,

> > >> * Even if those things are not there in ancient texts every one is

> > >> free to make or follow there own choice - yes, there is every chance

> > >> that even such new methods might give true results - your argument is

> > >> right.

> > >> * As far Sanskrit is concerned: Yes, it is your choice - when you

> > >> are blind to read and understand Sanskrit your self, and understand

> > >> what is there and what not, of course you have to follow someone who

> > >> says they see - you are right in that as well.

> > >> Love,

> > >> Sreenadh

> > >>

> > >> <%40>,

> > Prafulla Gang <jyotish

> > >> wrote:

> > >>>

> > >>> Well Sreenadh ji - at times, these issues become choice or

> > >> prejudices in our own form of reading model. Had there not been any

> > >> substance in interpreting D9 charts - lot many stalwarts must not

> > >> have explored it - and I presume - many of them know better

> > >> sanskrit / jyotish (rather both) than all of us on the forum

> > >> collectively. So if at all - anyone wish to contest the

> > >> interpretation - then many of those stalwarts are the people - must

> > >> be debated with. On the forum, where not many great sanskrit

> > >> scholars / jyotish researchers - the arguments may not have any

> > >> relevance.

> > >>>

> > >>> regards / Prafulla Gang

> > >>> http://www.prafulla.net

> > >>>

> > >>> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the right to

> > >> be taken seriously. "

> > >>> ************************************************

> > >>>

> > >>>

> > >>>>

> > >>>> sreesog

> > >>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 13:56:36 -0000

> > >>>> <%40>

> > >>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important?

> > >>>>

> > >>>> Dear Prafulla ji,

> > >>>> * No ancient text ask us to read Navamsha (not chart) " just like

> > >> D1

> > >>>> chart " ; nor they provide slokas for the same.

> > >>>> * No ancient text provide as the results for " aspects of planets

> > >> in

> > >>>> Navamasa "

> > >>>> * Nor they give us the results to be predicted when planets are

> > >>>> placed " x house with reference to navamsa lagna "

> > >>>>

> > >>>> I hope we are trying to study astrology as taught by the sages;

> > >> If

> > >>>> not I don't have anything to say.

> > >>>>

> > >>>> Love,

> > >>>> Sreenadh

> > >>>>

> > >>>>

> > >>>> <%40>,

> > Prafulla Gang <jyotish@>

> > >>>> wrote:

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>> Dear Sreenadh ji

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>> I have also observed many jyotish stalwarts using navamsa chart

> > >>>> (along with other D charts). Now how to assess D9 charts - can be

> > >>>> perspective. But - as most authors say - just like D1 chart.

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>> I request members to share their experience.

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang

> > >>>>> http://www.prafulla.net

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the right

> > >> to

> > >>>> be taken seriously. "

> > >>>>> ************************************************

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>> sreesog@

> > >>>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 07:56:49 -0000

> > >>>>>> <%40>

> > >>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important?

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>> Dear Krishna ji,

> > >>>>>> ==>

> > >>>>>>> I too to the view that Navamsa chart is

> > >>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart.

> > >>>>>> <==

> > >>>>>> * There is not Navamsa " chart " , but only Navamsa. Navamsa chart

> > >>>> is

> > >>>>>> not as important as Rasi chart and it can never be, because it

> > >> is

> > >>>>>> only an amsa. But yes, it is more important than other amsas due

> > >>>> to

> > >>>>>> the prior said reasons.

> > >>>>>> ==>

> > >>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines the overall

> > >>>>>>> strength of a planet?

> > >>>>>> <==

> > >>>>>> * Because the quality of earth determines the strength of the

> > >>>>>> plant. This is applicable to all amsas as per their importance.

> > >>>>>> ==>

> > >>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa chart like

> > >>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart?

> > >>>>>> <==

> > >>>>>> * No, it is not allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa. (There

> > >>>> is

> > >>>>>> no navamsa 'chart'.)

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>> ==>

> > >>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be treated as

> > >> if

> > >>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart?

> > >>>>>> <==

> > >>>>>> * No, when planets have sambandha in Navamsa, it only means

> > >> that.

> > >>>>>> When they have sombandha in Rasi, it only means that. It is

> > >> wrong

> > >>>> to

> > >>>>>> mix the two.

> > >>>>>> ==>

> > >>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart as well?

> > >>>>>> <==

> > >>>>>> * No, Yogas should not be looked in Navamsa 'chart'. But yes

> > >>>> yoga in

> > >>>>>> Navamsa (not navamsa 'chart') can be taken yoga. Because it is

> > >> the

> > >>>>>> same principles as used in Rasi that are used to predict the

> > >>>> result

> > >>>>>> in Amsas as well - But Aspect(Drishti) and houses are not

> > >>>> applicable

> > >>>>>> to amsas. Both Aspect(Drishti) and Houses should be considered

> > >> in

> > >>>>>> Rasi chart itself. Any reference in ancient texts about aspect

> > >> or

> > >>>>>> houses essentially mean that they are referring to Rasi chart.

> > >>>>>> Love,

> > >>>>>> Sreenadh

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>> <%40>,

> > Krishnamurthy Seetharama

> > >>>>>> <krishna_1998@> wrote:

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>> Dear Kolachina ji,

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>> It was interesting to read your comments on importance of the

> > >>>>>>> Navamsa chart. I too to the view that Navamsa chart

> > >> is

> > >>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart. This is based on my experience so

> > >>>>>>> far reading charts. However, I have still not understood what

> > >>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons for a varga chart being so

> > >>>>>>> important.

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines the overall

> > >>>>>>> strength of a planet?

> > >>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa chart like

> > >>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart?

> > >>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be treated as

> > >> if

> > >>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart?

> > >>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart as well?

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>> By looking at the kind of importance given to Navamsa chart, it

> > >>>>>>> appears that the Rasi chart and Navamsa chart make up two equal

> > >>>>>>> halves representing the native.

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>> I have no doubts about the importance of Navamsa Chart. What I

> > >>>>>>> would like to know is why Navamsa gains such an importance?

> > >> What

> > >>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons? After all it is one of many varga

> > >>>>>>> charts!

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>> Regards,

> > >>>>>>> Krishna

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>> --- Satya Sai Kolachina <skolachi@> wrote:

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>> Dear Sri Pradeep and Sri Chandrasekhar,

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>> I have been following this thread on karakamsa and both of

> > >>>>>>>> your

> > >>>>>>>> contributions.

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>> I whole-heartedly appreciate both of you for your valuable

> > >>>>>>>> inputs

> > >>>>>>>> you are providing to the astrological community. I would like

> > >>>>>>>> to

> > >>>>>>>> share my opinion (through my own experience).

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>> Considering Karakamsa from either Rasi or Navamsa chart alone

> > >>>>>>>> most

> > >>>>>>>> probably leads to erroneous results, as I found both the

> > >>>>>>>> approaches

> > >>>>>>>> working. I see the point Pradeep is making as very valuable;

> > >>>>>>>> at the

> > >>>>>>>> same time I am not against using Navamsa chart as separate

> > >>>>>>>> chart (of

> > >>>>>>>> course without losing the context of the Rasi chart), since

> > >>>>>>>> any of

> > >>>>>>>> the varga charts will not give independent results if the Rasi

> > >>>>>>>> chart

> > >>>>>>>> is ignored, as they themselves do not exist if the Rasi chart

> > >>>>>>>> doesn't exist. In fact Sri KN Rao also mentioned in several

> > >>>>>>>> occassions in many of his articles and books that yogas viewed

> > >>>>>>>> in

> > >>>>>>>> the Rasi chart should also exist in the Navamsa chart for

> > >>>>>>>> confirming

> > >>>>>>>> the results. If we do not see the Navamsa chart as a separate

> > >>>>>>>> chart,

> > >>>>>>>> how can we see the yogas therein? For the purpose of checking

> > >>>>>>>> some

> > >>>>>>>> yogas, Yuti and Veekshana (conjunction and aspects) in the

> > >>>>>>>> navamsa

> > >>>>>>>> chart make sense. This kind of yuti or veekshana should be

> > >>>>>>>> considered on a hypothetical level (as mutual influence at the

> > >>>>>>>> amsha level) rather than being within a 30 deg. span. of Rasi.

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>> Take an example. If a planet is exlated or in own house in the

> > >>>>>>>> rasi

> > >>>>>>>> chart and attains debilitation in the Navamsa chart, it is

> > >>>>>>>> condiered

> > >>>>>>>> as weakening of the actual strength shown in the Rasi. Why is

> > >>>>>>>> this

> > >>>>>>>> considered so? It is considered like that because, even though

> > >>>>>>>> the

> > >>>>>>>> planet is within its own or exlated rasi, still its

> > >>>>>>>> positioning

> > >>>>>>>> within that particular sector (here navamsa) has weakened it;

> > >>>>>>>> means,

> > >>>>>>>> within its own rasi, this particular sector is the weakest

> > >>>>>>>> point for

> > >>>>>>>> the planet within the strongest rasi; hence it loses its

> > >>>>>>>> strength

> > >>>>>>>> considerably. This means there is a gradation of strengths for

> > >>>>>>>> the

> > >>>>>>>> planet from first navamsa to the last navamsa. The navamsa

> > >>>>>>>> position

> > >>>>>>>> of a planet, thus indicates its refined placement within the

> > >>>>>>>> rasi.

> > >>>>>>>> In fact, Sri KN Rao also gives equal weightage to both the

> > >>>>>>>> Rasi and

> > >>>>>>>> Navamsa placement of a planet. If a planet is weak in one of

> > >>>>>>>> them

> > >>>>>>>> that means half the weightage is lost. We may not give the

> > >>>>>>>> same

> > >>>>>>>> level of treatment to other vargas as we give to Navamsa; but

> > >>>>>>>> Navamsa is as important as the Rasi; to the extent that it can

> > >>>>>>>> be

> > >>>>>>>> viewed as an independent chart (to confirm the promise given

> > >>>>>>>> by the

> > >>>>>>>> rasi chart).

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>> Without a confirmation of Navamsa chart, yogas in the rasi

> > >>>>>>>> chart

> > >>>>>>>> alone cannot and will not give expected results; I have

> > >>>>>>>> observed

> > >>>>>>>> this phenomenon in several charts.

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>> My own experience is; I have Chandra and Sukra both in the

> > >>>>>>>> 12th

> > >>>>>>>> house from Karakamsa in the Navamsa chart (not in the rasi

> > >>>>>>>> chart

> > >>>>>>>> with the rasi of karakamsa considering as the karakamsa

> > >>>>>>>> lagna). I am

> > >>>>>>>> a deep devotee of Goddess Parvathi (represented by Chandra)

> > >>>>>>>> and

> > >>>>>>>> Goddess Lakshmi (represented by Sukra). If the karakamsa is

> > >>>>>>>> brought

> > >>>>>>>> to the Rasi chart, this cannot be explained. The sequence of

> > >>>>>>>> my life

> > >>>>>>>> events are better explained only if I consider karakamsa lagna

> > >>>>>>>> in

> > >>>>>>>> the navamsa chart; I am not discounting Pradeep's opinion

> > >>>>>>>> here; I am

> > >>>>>>>> just saying that both approaches need to be considered on the

> > >>>>>>>> chart,

> > >>>>>>>> and a composite opinion be formed, as Sri KN Rao always says.

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>> On the other hand, considering the specific rasi in the Rasi

> > >>>>>>>> chart

> > >>>>>>>> that holds karakamsa as the karakamsa lagna, my Sukra is in

> > >>>>>>>> the 4th

> > >>>>>>>> house indicating my possession of a nice beautiful house, and

> > >>>>>>>> education/skills in arts (in addition to other traditional

> > >>>>>>>> education).

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>> I am bringing this to both your knowledge only to summarize

> > >>>>>>>> that

> > >>>>>>>> both your theories give results; but not necessarily in

> > >>>>>>>> isolation of

> > >>>>>>>> the other.

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>> Thanks for all your contribution.

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>> Best regards,

> > >>>>>>>> Satya S Kolachina

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>> --- In

<%40>,

> > Chandrashekhar

> > >>>>>>>> <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > >>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>> Dear Pradeep,

> > >>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>> I can not comment on views of either Sanjay or K. N. Rao.

> > >>>>>>>> First

> > >>>>>>>> there is

> > >>>>>>>>> no difference in the meaning of Amsha and Amshaka though it

> > >>>>>>>> is

> > >>>>>>>> perhaps

> > >>>>>>>>> being confused. It also needs to be remembered that in

> > >>>>>>>> astrological

> > >>>>>>>>> translations many a times words are to be understood in the

> > >>>>>>>> context that

> > >>>>>>>>> they used. So we find Parashara mentioning karakamsha and

> > >>>>>>>> Swamsha

> > >>>>>>>> in

> > >>>>>>>>> alternate lines (almost) while indicating the results of

> > >>>>>>>> occupation of

> > >>>>>>>>> Karakamsha by Sun etc. and many other places in karakamsha

> > >>>>>>>> adhyaaya.

> > >>>>>>>>> This does not mean he is speaking about two different

> > >>>>>>>> parameters.

> > >>>>>>>> I

> > >>>>>>>>> think if any Sanskrit scholar who is also well versed in

> > >>>>>>>> interpretation

> > >>>>>>>>> of astrological texts will confirm this contention of mine

> > >>>>>>>> if he

> > >>>>>>>> is

> > >>>>>>>>> watching this discussion.

> > >>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>> If you want my personal opinion, I think that the results

> > >>>>>>>> indicated on

> > >>>>>>>>> the basis of Karakamsha without reference to the potential

> > >>>>>>>> promised by

> > >>>>>>>>> the rasi chart and the strength derived by the grahas in

> > >>>>>>>> rasi

> > >>>>>>>> chart,

> > >>>>>>>>> through the Navamsha chart, are not likely to materialize. I

> > >>>>>>>> hope

> > >>>>>>>> this

> > >>>>>>>>> opinion of mine does not create a big storm in the

> > >>>>>>>> discussion on

> > >>>>>>>> the

> > >>>>>>>>> list. But this is my personal opinion, for whatever it is

> > >>>>>>>> worth.

> > >>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>> Take care,

> > >>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar.

> > >>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>> vijayadas_pradeep wrote:

> > >>>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>>> Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Respected members

> > >>>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>>> Shri Sanjay Rath clearly says ,Amshaka is pointing to the

> > >>>>>>>> Rashi

> > >>>>>>>> in

> > >>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha.He also says,Karakamsha has

> > >>>>>>>> one

> > >>>>>>>>>> meaning ,while Karakamsha KA has another meaning.

> > >>>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar jis view is Amshaka is not pointing to the

> > >>>>>>>> Rashi

> > >>>>>>>> in

> > >>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha.

> > >>>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>>> Now Chandraekhar jis view is prudent as there are some

> > >>>>>>>> shlokas

> > >>>>>>>> which

> > >>>>>>>>>> shri Rath somehow has overlooked,contradicting his view

> > >>>>>>>> point.

> > >>>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>>> I respect shri Rath ,but i have to tell this.Sometimes the

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>> answer and

> > >>>>>>>>>> explanations given by shri Rath are not preceded by proper

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>> === message truncated ===

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>

> > >> ________

> > >>>>>> ______________

> > >>>>>>> Be a PS3 game guru.

> > >>>>>>> Get your game face on with the latest PS3 news and previews at

> > >>>>>> Games.

> > >>>>>>> http://videogames./platform?platform=120121

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>>

[Guest guest]

Dear Sri Bhaskar,

 

Bitter truth; but well said.

 

Best regards,

 

Satya S Kolachina

 

, " Bhaskar " <bhaskar_jyotish

wrote:

>

> Sir,

>

> Very beautiful and humble post by you. Could not resist myself

> from writing.

>

> Too much of theories or discussion on same, without predictive

> support, is like too much of pravacahans without any personal

> application of the same, on part of the pravachan giver.

> People who claim to be overly knowledgable, about the shastras,

> about the explanation of the shlokas given by the Rishi Munis,

> should apply this knowledge on the various Forums, where hundreds

> are appearing with their help calls. What use is any knowledge

> in the world, if it does not appeal to universal brotherhood ?

> An ounce of action, is preferable to a quintal of

> Pravachan.

>

> As long as I understand the meaning of the main shlokas in

> Sanskrit, in my nitya Pooja, there is no mandatory rule, that

> I should know Sanskrit, to be a good astrologer.Life is

> too short, now to continue giving commentaries on the shastras,

which

> have already been interpreted, by the great wise men before us,

> of a better age than us. We should instead spend time on

applications

> of these knowledge, rather than futile discussions, which lead

> nowehre, and on the contrary create differences between colleagues

> and supposed to be fraternity brothers of the same fold.

>

> There is no sense in trying to take out skin from a hair end

> (Baal ki khaal), which has been actually going on in the

> subject matter and exchanges on these threads. We are over smart

> and even bring in and misquote the Rishi Munis out of context, just

to

> prove our point, which is what has been happenning with the new

cross

> breed of writers, who just wish to appear spectacular and come in

> limelight, by distracting the general trend of approach and modes

> taken by the astrologers since ages.

>

> let these great knowledgable scholars try to predict with such great

> commentaries and display of knowledge- on small issues, like sex

> determination, marriage timings, birth timing, timing change of

job,

> and scores of such day to day matters. I am sure they will fail

> miserably most of the times, in their predictions. Then what was the

> boo-ha about, primarily ? i would prefer a normal poor Pundit who

does

> not know a word of english, who is unassuming, who does not claim to

> know much - anyday to these modern scholars who will perish one day

> with this abundance of knowledge in their heads- put to naught due

to

> no use, like a rusted nail.

>

> Today we do not need any more knowledge from people. That is there

in

> gigantic proportions. neither we need further commentaries,

> translations or dicussions. We would like to see people who have

> already digested this knowledge,before embarking on new untrodden

> paths in search of illusions and breakthroughs, where there are none

> available., making application of their knowledge on real charts,

and

> explaining to a small student of astrology like me. how to use the

> so n so principles, in other charts as well, with same accuracy of

> results. We need application of rules and the knowledge of

> application, and not worthless discussions.

>

> It is better for one to be blind and - realized, rather than

> have eyes, and see only restricted views.

>

> hope that i have not touched a withered straw somewhere, and if so,

> then it does not start creaking.

>

> regards,

> Bhaskar.

>

>

>

> , Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> wrote:

> >

> > Dear Sreenadh ji

> >

> > Well - who knows the truth? - Should the person making comment, be

> construed to be as truth seeker - until they prove with the

> application of the principles on the charts ( both ways - firstly

the

> wrong application of others; and secondly how to read in correct

way).

> Theorists without predictive support - has little relevance in

> jyotish. But yes - if you can justify your statements by case

studies

> - then at least, I will hear with open mind.

> >

> > Understandably, I have been quoted to be " blind " to commentaries -

> but my submission is that - give me one reason to accept the views

of

> " less read scholars " than to " well read scholars like Late

Santhanam /

> Shri KN Rao / Shri Sanjay rath / many others " . and More so - as I do

> not " pretend " to know the sanskrit and do not " waste " my time on

> " shloka business " with my " incomplete knowledge " . So I am happy to

be

> following better quality commentaries - who are expalining with the

> case studies.

> >

> > Of course - each one makes his choice.

> >

> >

> > regards / Prafulla Gang

> > http://www.prafulla.net

> >

> > " Men who never get carried away should be. "

> > ************************************************

> >

> >

> > >

> > > sreesog@

> > > Thu, 05 Jul 2007 07:00:31 -0000

> > >

> > > Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important?

> > >

> > > Dear Prafulla ji,

> > > * Even if those things are not there in ancient texts every

one is

> > > free to make or follow there own choice - yes, there is every

chance

> > > that even such new methods might give true results - your

argument is

> > > right.

> > > * As far Sanskrit is concerned: Yes, it is your choice - when

you

> > > are blind to read and understand Sanskrit your self, and

understand

> > > what is there and what not, of course you have to follow

someone who

> > > says they see - you are right in that as well.

> > > Love,

> > > Sreenadh

> > >

> > > , Prafulla Gang <jyotish@>

> > > wrote:

> > >>

> > >> Well Sreenadh ji - at times, these issues become choice or

> > > prejudices in our own form of reading model. Had there not been

any

> > > substance in interpreting D9 charts - lot many stalwarts must

not

> > > have explored it - and I presume - many of them know better

> > > sanskrit / jyotish (rather both) than all of us on the forum

> > > collectively. So if at all - anyone wish to contest the

> > > interpretation - then many of those stalwarts are the people -

must

> > > be debated with. On the forum, where not many great sanskrit

> > > scholars / jyotish researchers - the arguments may not have any

> > > relevance.

> > >>

> > >> regards / Prafulla Gang

> > >> http://www.prafulla.net

> > >>

> > >> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the

right to

> > > be taken seriously. "

> > >> ************************************************

> > >>

> > >>

> > >>>

> > >>> sreesog@

> > >>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 13:56:36 -0000

> > >>>

> > >>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important?

> > >>>

> > >>> Dear Prafulla ji,

> > >>> * No ancient text ask us to read Navamsha (not chart) " just

like

> > > D1

> > >>> chart " ; nor they provide slokas for the same.

> > >>> * No ancient text provide as the results for " aspects of

planets

> > > in

> > >>> Navamasa "

> > >>> * Nor they give us the results to be predicted when planets

are

> > >>> placed " x house with reference to navamsa lagna "

> > >>>

> > >>> I hope we are trying to study astrology as taught by the

sages;

> > > If

> > >>> not I don't have anything to say.

> > >>>

> > >>> Love,

> > >>> Sreenadh

> > >>>

> > >>>

> > >>> , Prafulla Gang <jyotish@>

> > >>> wrote:

> > >>>>

> > >>>> Dear Sreenadh ji

> > >>>>

> > >>>> I have also observed many jyotish stalwarts using navamsa

chart

> > >>> (along with other D charts). Now how to assess D9 charts -

can be

> > >>> perspective. But - as most authors say - just like D1 chart.

> > >>>>

> > >>>> I request members to share their experience.

> > >>>>

> > >>>> regards / Prafulla Gang

> > >>>> http://www.prafulla.net

> > >>>>

> > >>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the

right

> > > to

> > >>> be taken seriously. "

> > >>>> ************************************************

> > >>>>

> > >>>>

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>> sreesog@

> > >>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 07:56:49 -0000

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so

important?

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>> Dear Krishna ji,

> > >>>>> ==>

> > >>>>>> I too to the view that Navamsa chart is

> > >>>>>> as important as Rasi chart.

> > >>>>> <==

> > >>>>> * There is not Navamsa " chart " , but only Navamsa. Navamsa

chart

> > >>> is

> > >>>>> not as important as Rasi chart and it can never be, because

it

> > > is

> > >>>>> only an amsa. But yes, it is more important than other

amsas due

> > >>> to

> > >>>>> the prior said reasons.

> > >>>>> ==>

> > >>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines the

overall

> > >>>>>> strength of a planet?

> > >>>>> <==

> > >>>>> * Because the quality of earth determines the strength of

the

> > >>>>> plant. This is applicable to all amsas as per their

importance.

> > >>>>> ==>

> > >>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa chart

like

> > >>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart?

> > >>>>> <==

> > >>>>> * No, it is not allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa.

(There

> > >>> is

> > >>>>> no navamsa 'chart'.)

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>> ==>

> > >>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be treated

as

> > > if

> > >>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart?

> > >>>>> <==

> > >>>>> * No, when planets have sambandha in Navamsa, it only means

> > > that.

> > >>>>> When they have sombandha in Rasi, it only means that. It is

> > > wrong

> > >>> to

> > >>>>> mix the two.

> > >>>>> ==>

> > >>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart as well?

> > >>>>> <==

> > >>>>> * No, Yogas should not be looked in Navamsa 'chart'. But

yes

> > >>> yoga in

> > >>>>> Navamsa (not navamsa 'chart') can be taken yoga. Because it

is

> > > the

> > >>>>> same principles as used in Rasi that are used to predict the

> > >>> result

> > >>>>> in Amsas as well - But Aspect(Drishti) and houses are not

> > >>> applicable

> > >>>>> to amsas. Both Aspect(Drishti) and Houses should be

considered

> > > in

> > >>>>> Rasi chart itself. Any reference in ancient texts about

aspect

> > > or

> > >>>>> houses essentially mean that they are referring to Rasi

chart.

> > >>>>> Love,

> > >>>>> Sreenadh

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>> , Krishnamurthy

Seetharama

> > >>>>> <krishna_1998@> wrote:

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>> Dear Kolachina ji,

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>> It was interesting to read your comments on importance of

the

> > >>>>>> Navamsa chart. I too to the view that Navamsa

chart

> > > is

> > >>>>>> as important as Rasi chart. This is based on my experience

so

> > >>>>>> far reading charts. However, I have still not understood

what

> > >>>>>> are the fundamental reasons for a varga chart being so

> > >>>>>> important.

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines the

overall

> > >>>>>> strength of a planet?

> > >>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa chart

like

> > >>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart?

> > >>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be treated

as

> > > if

> > >>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart?

> > >>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart as well?

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>> By looking at the kind of importance given to Navamsa

chart, it

> > >>>>>> appears that the Rasi chart and Navamsa chart make up two

equal

> > >>>>>> halves representing the native.

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>> I have no doubts about the importance of Navamsa Chart.

What I

> > >>>>>> would like to know is why Navamsa gains such an importance?

> > > What

> > >>>>>> are the fundamental reasons? After all it is one of many

varga

> > >>>>>> charts!

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>> Regards,

> > >>>>>> Krishna

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>> --- Satya Sai Kolachina <skolachi@> wrote:

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>>> Dear Sri Pradeep and Sri Chandrasekhar,

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>> I have been following this thread on karakamsa and both of

> > >>>>>>> your

> > >>>>>>> contributions.

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>> I whole-heartedly appreciate both of you for your valuable

> > >>>>>>> inputs

> > >>>>>>> you are providing to the astrological community. I would

like

> > >>>>>>> to

> > >>>>>>> share my opinion (through my own experience).

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>> Considering Karakamsa from either Rasi or Navamsa chart

alone

> > >>>>>>> most

> > >>>>>>> probably leads to erroneous results, as I found both the

> > >>>>>>> approaches

> > >>>>>>> working. I see the point Pradeep is making as very

valuable;

> > >>>>>>> at the

> > >>>>>>> same time I am not against using Navamsa chart as separate

> > >>>>>>> chart (of

> > >>>>>>> course without losing the context of the Rasi chart),

since

> > >>>>>>> any of

> > >>>>>>> the varga charts will not give independent results if the

Rasi

> > >>>>>>> chart

> > >>>>>>> is ignored, as they themselves do not exist if the Rasi

chart

> > >>>>>>> doesn't exist. In fact Sri KN Rao also mentioned in

several

> > >>>>>>> occassions in many of his articles and books that yogas

viewed

> > >>>>>>> in

> > >>>>>>> the Rasi chart should also exist in the Navamsa chart for

> > >>>>>>> confirming

> > >>>>>>> the results. If we do not see the Navamsa chart as a

separate

> > >>>>>>> chart,

> > >>>>>>> how can we see the yogas therein? For the purpose of

checking

> > >>>>>>> some

> > >>>>>>> yogas, Yuti and Veekshana (conjunction and aspects) in the

> > >>>>>>> navamsa

> > >>>>>>> chart make sense. This kind of yuti or veekshana should be

> > >>>>>>> considered on a hypothetical level (as mutual influence

at the

> > >>>>>>> amsha level) rather than being within a 30 deg. span. of

Rasi.

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>> Take an example. If a planet is exlated or in own house

in the

> > >>>>>>> rasi

> > >>>>>>> chart and attains debilitation in the Navamsa chart, it is

> > >>>>>>> condiered

> > >>>>>>> as weakening of the actual strength shown in the Rasi.

Why is

> > >>>>>>> this

> > >>>>>>> considered so? It is considered like that because, even

though

> > >>>>>>> the

> > >>>>>>> planet is within its own or exlated rasi, still its

> > >>>>>>> positioning

> > >>>>>>> within that particular sector (here navamsa) has weakened

it;

> > >>>>>>> means,

> > >>>>>>> within its own rasi, this particular sector is the weakest

> > >>>>>>> point for

> > >>>>>>> the planet within the strongest rasi; hence it loses its

> > >>>>>>> strength

> > >>>>>>> considerably. This means there is a gradation of

strengths for

> > >>>>>>> the

> > >>>>>>> planet from first navamsa to the last navamsa. The navamsa

> > >>>>>>> position

> > >>>>>>> of a planet, thus indicates its refined placement within

the

> > >>>>>>> rasi.

> > >>>>>>> In fact, Sri KN Rao also gives equal weightage to both the

> > >>>>>>> Rasi and

> > >>>>>>> Navamsa placement of a planet. If a planet is weak in one

of

> > >>>>>>> them

> > >>>>>>> that means half the weightage is lost. We may not give the

> > >>>>>>> same

> > >>>>>>> level of treatment to other vargas as we give to Navamsa;

but

> > >>>>>>> Navamsa is as important as the Rasi; to the extent that

it can

> > >>>>>>> be

> > >>>>>>> viewed as an independent chart (to confirm the promise

given

> > >>>>>>> by the

> > >>>>>>> rasi chart).

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>> Without a confirmation of Navamsa chart, yogas in the rasi

> > >>>>>>> chart

> > >>>>>>> alone cannot and will not give expected results; I have

> > >>>>>>> observed

> > >>>>>>> this phenomenon in several charts.

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>> My own experience is; I have Chandra and Sukra both in the

> > >>>>>>> 12th

> > >>>>>>> house from Karakamsa in the Navamsa chart (not in the rasi

> > >>>>>>> chart

> > >>>>>>> with the rasi of karakamsa considering as the karakamsa

> > >>>>>>> lagna). I am

> > >>>>>>> a deep devotee of Goddess Parvathi (represented by

Chandra)

> > >>>>>>> and

> > >>>>>>> Goddess Lakshmi (represented by Sukra). If the karakamsa

is

> > >>>>>>> brought

> > >>>>>>> to the Rasi chart, this cannot be explained. The sequence

of

> > >>>>>>> my life

> > >>>>>>> events are better explained only if I consider karakamsa

lagna

> > >>>>>>> in

> > >>>>>>> the navamsa chart; I am not discounting Pradeep's opinion

> > >>>>>>> here; I am

> > >>>>>>> just saying that both approaches need to be considered on

the

> > >>>>>>> chart,

> > >>>>>>> and a composite opinion be formed, as Sri KN Rao always

says.

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>> On the other hand, considering the specific rasi in the

Rasi

> > >>>>>>> chart

> > >>>>>>> that holds karakamsa as the karakamsa lagna, my Sukra is

in

> > >>>>>>> the 4th

> > >>>>>>> house indicating my possession of a nice beautiful house,

and

> > >>>>>>> education/skills in arts (in addition to other traditional

> > >>>>>>> education).

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>> I am bringing this to both your knowledge only to

summarize

> > >>>>>>> that

> > >>>>>>> both your theories give results; but not necessarily in

> > >>>>>>> isolation of

> > >>>>>>> the other.

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>> Thanks for all your contribution.

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>> Best regards,

> > >>>>>>> Satya S Kolachina

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>> , Chandrashekhar

> > >>>>>>> <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>> Dear Pradeep,

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>> I can not comment on views of either Sanjay or K. N. Rao.

> > >>>>>>> First

> > >>>>>>> there is

> > >>>>>>>> no difference in the meaning of Amsha and Amshaka though

it

> > >>>>>>> is

> > >>>>>>> perhaps

> > >>>>>>>> being confused. It also needs to be remembered that in

> > >>>>>>> astrological

> > >>>>>>>> translations many a times words are to be understood in

the

> > >>>>>>> context that

> > >>>>>>>> they used. So we find Parashara mentioning karakamsha and

> > >>>>>>> Swamsha

> > >>>>>>> in

> > >>>>>>>> alternate lines (almost) while indicating the results of

> > >>>>>>> occupation of

> > >>>>>>>> Karakamsha by Sun etc. and many other places in

karakamsha

> > >>>>>>> adhyaaya.

> > >>>>>>>> This does not mean he is speaking about two different

> > >>>>>>> parameters.

> > >>>>>>> I

> > >>>>>>>> think if any Sanskrit scholar who is also well versed in

> > >>>>>>> interpretation

> > >>>>>>>> of astrological texts will confirm this contention of

mine

> > >>>>>>> if he

> > >>>>>>> is

> > >>>>>>>> watching this discussion.

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>> If you want my personal opinion, I think that the results

> > >>>>>>> indicated on

> > >>>>>>>> the basis of Karakamsha without reference to the

potential

> > >>>>>>> promised by

> > >>>>>>>> the rasi chart and the strength derived by the grahas in

> > >>>>>>> rasi

> > >>>>>>> chart,

> > >>>>>>>> through the Navamsha chart, are not likely to

materialize. I

> > >>>>>>> hope

> > >>>>>>> this

> > >>>>>>>> opinion of mine does not create a big storm in the

> > >>>>>>> discussion on

> > >>>>>>> the

> > >>>>>>>> list. But this is my personal opinion, for whatever it is

> > >>>>>>> worth.

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>> Take care,

> > >>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar.

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>> vijayadas_pradeep wrote:

> > >>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>> Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Respected members

> > >>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>> Shri Sanjay Rath clearly says ,Amshaka is pointing to

the

> > >>>>>>> Rashi

> > >>>>>>> in

> > >>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha.He also says,Karakamsha

has

> > >>>>>>> one

> > >>>>>>>>> meaning ,while Karakamsha KA has another meaning.

> > >>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar jis view is Amshaka is not pointing to

the

> > >>>>>>> Rashi

> > >>>>>>> in

> > >>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha.

> > >>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>> Now Chandraekhar jis view is prudent as there are some

> > >>>>>>> shlokas

> > >>>>>>> which

> > >>>>>>>>> shri Rath somehow has overlooked,contradicting his view

> > >>>>>>> point.

> > >>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>> I respect shri Rath ,but i have to tell this.Sometimes

the

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>> answer and

> > >>>>>>>>> explanations given by shri Rath are not preceded by

proper

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>> === message truncated ===

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>

> > >>>

> > >

____________________

> > >>>>> ______________

> > >>>>>> Be a PS3 game guru.

> > >>>>>> Get your game face on with the latest PS3 news and

previews at

> > >>>>> Games.

> > >>>>>> http://videogames./platform?platform=120121

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>>

[Guest guest]

Dear Bharat ji

 

Many thanks for your point of view. Yes - we must remain open to hidden

treasures and apply - if it works consistently.

 

regards / Prafulla Gang

http://www.prafulla.net

 

" Men who never get carried away should be. "

************************************************

 

astrologyhindu

Fri, 6 Jul 2007 17:40:01 +0530

 

Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important?

 

The second " not " in the first line of the previous post is an error. It

should read as " The major contention of those not using Navamsha as a

separate chart. "

 

Sorry for the typo.

 

Thanks and Regards

Bharat

 

On 7/6/07, Bharat - Hindu Astrology <astrologyhindu wrote:

>

> Namaste Prafulla and others

>

> The major contention of those not using Navamsha not as a separate chart

> is that physically the planets positions are shown by the Rashi chart and

> cannot by any other chart. This is untrue. Kindly read below:

>

> Our eyes can only capture a certain frequency of light waves. If we were

> able to see sight on a different frequency the world would change and so

> would the planetary positions. There are deeper things to be seen and known.

> One should not reject the idea of usage of Amshas as separate charts,

> without proper scrutiny.

>

> I personally, do not use amshas as separate charts for a simple reason

> that I do not know how to use them separately. I am waiting for plausible

> answers. I do not stop others from using them, but, do get dismayed at times

> when people justify things through any divisional charts. So many rules

> should not be made that they are applicable to every human beings chart and

> can be used to justify anything in life.

>

> Unlike Upanishads, which have bhashyas and a great lineage of Teachers, we

> do not have the same for Astrology. Most of the texts are hidden, burnt,

> destroyed, misrepresented, misquoted, etc. etc... People with no knowledge

> of Sanskrit trying to decipher verses using Sri Apte dictionary. They

> haven't the faintest idea on how Sanskrit verse can mean in 5-7 different

> ways. In such a scenario, it is difficult to rely on half knowledge. It is

> better to have an open mind and use a principle when one has sound knowledge

> of it.

>

> Thanks and Regards

> Bharat

>

>

>

>

>

> On 7/6/07, Prafulla Gang <jyotish wrote:

> >

> > Dear Pradeep,

> >

> > Another important issue - In D9 charts reference - kalyan Varma has

> > given hints for results for Sun aspecting venus; or mercury aspecting venus.

> > Since they can never " aspect " in Rashi Kundli - the obvious reference was to

> > Navamsa " chart " .

> >

> > I do not think, kalyan varma can be treated at par with current age

> > scholars !!

> >

> > regards / Prafulla Gang

> > http://www.prafulla.net [http://www.prafulla.net]

> >

> > " Men who never get carried away should be. "

> > ************************************************

> >

> > >

> > > jyotish <jyotish%40inbox.com>

> > > Thu, 5 Jul 2007 20:23:15 -0800

> > > <%40>

> > > Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important?

> > >

> > > Dear Sreenadh ji

> > >

> > > Well - who knows the truth? - Should the person making comment, be

> > > construed to be as truth seeker - until they prove with the

> > application

> > > of the principles on the charts ( both ways - firstly the wrong

> > > application of others; and secondly how to read in correct way).

> > > Theorists without predictive support - has little relevance in

> > jyotish.

> > > But yes - if you can justify your statements by case studies - then at

> > > least, I will hear with open mind.

> > >

> > > Understandably, I have been quoted to be " blind " to commentaries - but

> > my

> > > submission is that - give me one reason to accept the views of " less

> > read

> > > scholars " than to " well read scholars like Late Santhanam / Shri KN

> > Rao /

> > > Shri Sanjay rath / many others " . and More so - as I do not " pretend "

> > to

> > > know the sanskrit and do not " waste " my time on " shloka business " with

> > my

> > > " incomplete knowledge " . So I am happy to be following better quality

> > > commentaries - who are expalining with the case studies.

> > >

> > > Of course - each one makes his choice.

> > >

> > >

> > > regards / Prafulla Gang

> > > http://www.prafulla.net [http://www.prafulla.net]

> > >

> > > " Men who never get carried away should be. "

> > > ************************************************

> > >

> > >

> > >>

> > >> sreesog <sreesog%40>

> > >> Thu, 05 Jul 2007 07:00:31 -0000

> > >> <%40>

> > >> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important?

> > >>

> > >> Dear Prafulla ji,

> > >> * Even if those things are not there in ancient texts every one is

> > >> free to make or follow there own choice - yes, there is every chance

> > >> that even such new methods might give true results - your argument is

> > >> right.

> > >> * As far Sanskrit is concerned: Yes, it is your choice - when you

> > >> are blind to read and understand Sanskrit your self, and understand

> > >> what is there and what not, of course you have to follow someone who

> > >> says they see - you are right in that as well.

> > >> Love,

> > >> Sreenadh

> > >>

> > >> <%40>,

> > Prafulla Gang <jyotish

> > >> wrote:

> > >>>

> > >>> Well Sreenadh ji - at times, these issues become choice or

> > >> prejudices in our own form of reading model. Had there not been any

> > >> substance in interpreting D9 charts - lot many stalwarts must not

> > >> have explored it - and I presume - many of them know better

> > >> sanskrit / jyotish (rather both) than all of us on the forum

> > >> collectively. So if at all - anyone wish to contest the

> > >> interpretation - then many of those stalwarts are the people - must

> > >> be debated with. On the forum, where not many great sanskrit

> > >> scholars / jyotish researchers - the arguments may not have any

> > >> relevance.

> > >>>

> > >>> regards / Prafulla Gang

> > >>> http://www.prafulla.net [http://www.prafulla.net]

> > >>>

> > >>> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the right to

> > >> be taken seriously. "

> > >>> ************************************************

> > >>>

> > >>>

> > >>>>

> > >>>> sreesog

> > >>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 13:56:36 -0000

> > >>>> <%40>

> > >>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important?

> > >>>>

> > >>>> Dear Prafulla ji,

> > >>>> * No ancient text ask us to read Navamsha (not chart) " just like

> > >> D1

> > >>>> chart " ; nor they provide slokas for the same.

> > >>>> * No ancient text provide as the results for " aspects of planets

> > >> in

> > >>>> Navamasa "

> > >>>> * Nor they give us the results to be predicted when planets are

> > >>>> placed " x house with reference to navamsa lagna "

> > >>>>

> > >>>> I hope we are trying to study astrology as taught by the sages;

> > >> If

> > >>>> not I don't have anything to say.

> > >>>>

> > >>>> Love,

> > >>>> Sreenadh

> > >>>>

> > >>>>

> > >>>> <%40>,

> > Prafulla Gang <jyotish@>

> > >>>> wrote:

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>> Dear Sreenadh ji

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>> I have also observed many jyotish stalwarts using navamsa chart

> > >>>> (along with other D charts). Now how to assess D9 charts - can be

> > >>>> perspective. But - as most authors say - just like D1 chart.

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>> I request members to share their experience.

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang

> > >>>>> http://www.prafulla.net [http://www.prafulla.net]

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the right

> > >> to

> > >>>> be taken seriously. "

> > >>>>> ************************************************

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>> sreesog@

> > >>>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 07:56:49 -0000

> > >>>>>> <%40>

> > >>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important?

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>> Dear Krishna ji,

> > >>>>>> ==>

> > >>>>>>> I too to the view that Navamsa chart is

> > >>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart.

> > >>>>>> <==

> > >>>>>> * There is not Navamsa " chart " , but only Navamsa. Navamsa chart

> > >>>> is

> > >>>>>> not as important as Rasi chart and it can never be, because it

> > >> is

> > >>>>>> only an amsa. But yes, it is more important than other amsas due

> > >>>> to

> > >>>>>> the prior said reasons.

> > >>>>>> ==>

> > >>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines the overall

> > >>>>>>> strength of a planet?

> > >>>>>> <==

> > >>>>>> * Because the quality of earth determines the strength of the

> > >>>>>> plant. This is applicable to all amsas as per their importance.

> > >>>>>> ==>

> > >>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa chart like

> > >>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart?

> > >>>>>> <==

> > >>>>>> * No, it is not allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa. (There

> > >>>> is

> > >>>>>> no navamsa 'chart'.)

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>> ==>

> > >>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be treated as

> > >> if

> > >>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart?

> > >>>>>> <==

> > >>>>>> * No, when planets have sambandha in Navamsa, it only means

> > >> that.

> > >>>>>> When they have sombandha in Rasi, it only means that. It is

> > >> wrong

> > >>>> to

> > >>>>>> mix the two.

> > >>>>>> ==>

> > >>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart as well?

> > >>>>>> <==

> > >>>>>> * No, Yogas should not be looked in Navamsa 'chart'. But yes

> > >>>> yoga in

> > >>>>>> Navamsa (not navamsa 'chart') can be taken yoga. Because it is

> > >> the

> > >>>>>> same principles as used in Rasi that are used to predict the

> > >>>> result

> > >>>>>> in Amsas as well - But Aspect(Drishti) and houses are not

> > >>>> applicable

> > >>>>>> to amsas. Both Aspect(Drishti) and Houses should be considered

> > >> in

> > >>>>>> Rasi chart itself. Any reference in ancient texts about aspect

> > >> or

> > >>>>>> houses essentially mean that they are referring to Rasi chart.

> > >>>>>> Love,

> > >>>>>> Sreenadh

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>> <%40>,

> > Krishnamurthy Seetharama

> > >>>>>> <krishna_1998@> wrote:

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>> Dear Kolachina ji,

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>> It was interesting to read your comments on importance of the

> > >>>>>>> Navamsa chart. I too to the view that Navamsa chart

> > >> is

> > >>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart. This is based on my experience so

> > >>>>>>> far reading charts. However, I have still not understood what

> > >>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons for a varga chart being so

> > >>>>>>> important.

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines the overall

> > >>>>>>> strength of a planet?

> > >>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa chart like

> > >>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart?

> > >>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be treated as

> > >> if

> > >>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart?

> > >>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart as well?

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>> By looking at the kind of importance given to Navamsa chart, it

> > >>>>>>> appears that the Rasi chart and Navamsa chart make up two equal

> > >>>>>>> halves representing the native.

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>> I have no doubts about the importance of Navamsa Chart. What I

> > >>>>>>> would like to know is why Navamsa gains such an importance?

> > >> What

> > >>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons? After all it is one of many varga

> > >>>>>>> charts!

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>> Regards,

> > >>>>>>> Krishna

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>> --- Satya Sai Kolachina <skolachi@> wrote:

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>> Dear Sri Pradeep and Sri Chandrasekhar,

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>> I have been following this thread on karakamsa and both of

> > >>>>>>>> your

> > >>>>>>>> contributions.

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>> I whole-heartedly appreciate both of you for your valuable

> > >>>>>>>> inputs

> > >>>>>>>> you are providing to the astrological community. I would like

> > >>>>>>>> to

> > >>>>>>>> share my opinion (through my own experience).

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>> Considering Karakamsa from either Rasi or Navamsa chart alone

> > >>>>>>>> most

> > >>>>>>>> probably leads to erroneous results, as I found both the

> > >>>>>>>> approaches

> > >>>>>>>> working. I see the point Pradeep is making as very valuable;

> > >>>>>>>> at the

> > >>>>>>>> same time I am not against using Navamsa chart as separate

> > >>>>>>>> chart (of

> > >>>>>>>> course without losing the context of the Rasi chart), since

> > >>>>>>>> any of

> > >>>>>>>> the varga charts will not give independent results if the Rasi

> > >>>>>>>> chart

> > >>>>>>>> is ignored, as they themselves do not exist if the Rasi chart

> > >>>>>>>> doesn't exist. In fact Sri KN Rao also mentioned in several

> > >>>>>>>> occassions in many of his articles and books that yogas viewed

> > >>>>>>>> in

> > >>>>>>>> the Rasi chart should also exist in the Navamsa chart for

> > >>>>>>>> confirming

> > >>>>>>>> the results. If we do not see the Navamsa chart as a separate

> > >>>>>>>> chart,

> > >>>>>>>> how can we see the yogas therein? For the purpose of checking

> > >>>>>>>> some

> > >>>>>>>> yogas, Yuti and Veekshana (conjunction and aspects) in the

> > >>>>>>>> navamsa

> > >>>>>>>> chart make sense. This kind of yuti or veekshana should be

> > >>>>>>>> considered on a hypothetical level (as mutual influence at the

> > >>>>>>>> amsha level) rather than being within a 30 deg. span. of Rasi.

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>> Take an example. If a planet is exlated or in own house in the

> > >>>>>>>> rasi

> > >>>>>>>> chart and attains debilitation in the Navamsa chart, it is

> > >>>>>>>> condiered

> > >>>>>>>> as weakening of the actual strength shown in the Rasi. Why is

> > >>>>>>>> this

> > >>>>>>>> considered so? It is considered like that because, even though

> > >>>>>>>> the

> > >>>>>>>> planet is within its own or exlated rasi, still its

> > >>>>>>>> positioning

> > >>>>>>>> within that particular sector (here navamsa) has weakened it;

> > >>>>>>>> means,

> > >>>>>>>> within its own rasi, this particular sector is the weakest

> > >>>>>>>> point for

> > >>>>>>>> the planet within the strongest rasi; hence it loses its

> > >>>>>>>> strength

> > >>>>>>>> considerably. This means there is a gradation of strengths for

> > >>>>>>>> the

> > >>>>>>>> planet from first navamsa to the last navamsa. The navamsa

> > >>>>>>>> position

> > >>>>>>>> of a planet, thus indicates its refined placement within the

> > >>>>>>>> rasi.

> > >>>>>>>> In fact, Sri KN Rao also gives equal weightage to both the

> > >>>>>>>> Rasi and

> > >>>>>>>> Navamsa placement of a planet. If a planet is weak in one of

> > >>>>>>>> them

> > >>>>>>>> that means half the weightage is lost. We may not give the

> > >>>>>>>> same

> > >>>>>>>> level of treatment to other vargas as we give to Navamsa; but

> > >>>>>>>> Navamsa is as important as the Rasi; to the extent that it can

> > >>>>>>>> be

> > >>>>>>>> viewed as an independent chart (to confirm the promise given

> > >>>>>>>> by the

> > >>>>>>>> rasi chart).

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>> Without a confirmation of Navamsa chart, yogas in the rasi

> > >>>>>>>> chart

> > >>>>>>>> alone cannot and will not give expected results; I have

> > >>>>>>>> observed

> > >>>>>>>> this phenomenon in several charts.

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>> My own experience is; I have Chandra and Sukra both in the

> > >>>>>>>> 12th

> > >>>>>>>> house from Karakamsa in the Navamsa chart (not in the rasi

> > >>>>>>>> chart

> > >>>>>>>> with the rasi of karakamsa considering as the karakamsa

> > >>>>>>>> lagna). I am

> > >>>>>>>> a deep devotee of Goddess Parvathi (represented by Chandra)

> > >>>>>>>> and

> > >>>>>>>> Goddess Lakshmi (represented by Sukra). If the karakamsa is

> > >>>>>>>> brought

> > >>>>>>>> to the Rasi chart, this cannot be explained. The sequence of

> > >>>>>>>> my life

> > >>>>>>>> events are better explained only if I consider karakamsa lagna

> > >>>>>>>> in

> > >>>>>>>> the navamsa chart; I am not discounting Pradeep's opinion

> > >>>>>>>> here; I am

> > >>>>>>>> just saying that both approaches need to be considered on the

> > >>>>>>>> chart,

> > >>>>>>>> and a composite opinion be formed, as Sri KN Rao always says.

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>> On the other hand, considering the specific rasi in the Rasi

> > >>>>>>>> chart

> > >>>>>>>> that holds karakamsa as the karakamsa lagna, my Sukra is in

> > >>>>>>>> the 4th

> > >>>>>>>> house indicating my possession of a nice beautiful house, and

> > >>>>>>>> education/skills in arts (in addition to other traditional

> > >>>>>>>> education).

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>> I am bringing this to both your knowledge only to summarize

> > >>>>>>>> that

> > >>>>>>>> both your theories give results; but not necessarily in

> > >>>>>>>> isolation of

> > >>>>>>>> the other.

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>> Thanks for all your contribution.

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>> Best regards,

> > >>>>>>>> Satya S Kolachina

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>> --- In

<%40>,

> > Chandrashekhar

> > >>>>>>>> <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > >>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>> Dear Pradeep,

> > >>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>> I can not comment on views of either Sanjay or K. N. Rao.

> > >>>>>>>> First

> > >>>>>>>> there is

> > >>>>>>>>> no difference in the meaning of Amsha and Amshaka though it

> > >>>>>>>> is

> > >>>>>>>> perhaps

> > >>>>>>>>> being confused. It also needs to be remembered that in

> > >>>>>>>> astrological

> > >>>>>>>>> translations many a times words are to be understood in the

> > >>>>>>>> context that

> > >>>>>>>>> they used. So we find Parashara mentioning karakamsha and

> > >>>>>>>> Swamsha

> > >>>>>>>> in

> > >>>>>>>>> alternate lines (almost) while indicating the results of

> > >>>>>>>> occupation of

> > >>>>>>>>> Karakamsha by Sun etc. and many other places in karakamsha

> > >>>>>>>> adhyaaya.

> > >>>>>>>>> This does not mean he is speaking about two different

> > >>>>>>>> parameters.

> > >>>>>>>> I

> > >>>>>>>>> think if any Sanskrit scholar who is also well versed in

> > >>>>>>>> interpretation

> > >>>>>>>>> of astrological texts will confirm this contention of mine

> > >>>>>>>> if he

> > >>>>>>>> is

> > >>>>>>>>> watching this discussion.

> > >>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>> If you want my personal opinion, I think that the results

> > >>>>>>>> indicated on

> > >>>>>>>>> the basis of Karakamsha without reference to the potential

> > >>>>>>>> promised by

> > >>>>>>>>> the rasi chart and the strength derived by the grahas in

> > >>>>>>>> rasi

> > >>>>>>>> chart,

> > >>>>>>>>> through the Navamsha chart, are not likely to materialize. I

> > >>>>>>>> hope

> > >>>>>>>> this

> > >>>>>>>>> opinion of mine does not create a big storm in the

> > >>>>>>>> discussion on

> > >>>>>>>> the

> > >>>>>>>>> list. But this is my personal opinion, for whatever it is

> > >>>>>>>> worth.

> > >>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>> Take care,

> > >>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar.

> > >>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>> vijayadas_pradeep wrote:

> > >>>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>>> Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Respected members

> > >>>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>>> Shri Sanjay Rath clearly says ,Amshaka is pointing to the

> > >>>>>>>> Rashi

> > >>>>>>>> in

> > >>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha.He also says,Karakamsha has

> > >>>>>>>> one

> > >>>>>>>>>> meaning ,while Karakamsha KA has another meaning.

> > >>>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar jis view is Amshaka is not pointing to the

> > >>>>>>>> Rashi

> > >>>>>>>> in

> > >>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha.

> > >>>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>>> Now Chandraekhar jis view is prudent as there are some

> > >>>>>>>> shlokas

> > >>>>>>>> which

> > >>>>>>>>>> shri Rath somehow has overlooked,contradicting his view

> > >>>>>>>> point.

> > >>>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>>> I respect shri Rath ,but i have to tell this.Sometimes the

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>> answer and

> > >>>>>>>>>> explanations given by shri Rath are not preceded by proper

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>> === message truncated ===

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>

> > >> ________

> > >>>>>> ______________

> > >>>>>>> Be a PS3 game guru.

> > >>>>>>> Get your game face on with the latest PS3 news and previews at

> > >>>>>> Games.

> > >>>>>>> http://videogames./platform?platform=120121

[http://videogames./platform?platform=120121]

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>>

[Guest guest]

Prafullaji,

 

Kalyan verma does not say in which division to look

for this aspect. D-9, D-10, D-60 ? This is the only

place where argument can be made for use of D charts.

Most places they talk aboput amsha and not a chart or

a bhava in a division.

 

Satish

--- Prafulla Gang <jyotish wrote:

 

> Dear Pradeep,

>

> Another important issue - In D9 charts reference -

> kalyan Varma has given hints for results for Sun

> aspecting venus; or mercury aspecting venus. Since

> they can never " aspect " in Rashi Kundli - the

> obvious reference was to Navamsa " chart " .

>

> I do not think, kalyan varma can be treated at par

> with current age scholars !!

>

> regards / Prafulla Gang

> http://www.prafulla.net

>

> " Men who never get carried away should be. "

> ************************************************

>

>

> >

> > jyotish

> > Thu, 5 Jul 2007 20:23:15 -0800

> >

> > Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so

> important?

> >

> > Dear Sreenadh ji

> >

> > Well - who knows the truth? - Should the person

> making comment, be

> > construed to be as truth seeker - until they prove

> with the application

> > of the principles on the charts ( both ways -

> firstly the wrong

> > application of others; and secondly how to read in

> correct way).

> > Theorists without predictive support - has little

> relevance in jyotish.

> > But yes - if you can justify your statements by

> case studies - then at

> > least, I will hear with open mind.

> >

> > Understandably, I have been quoted to be " blind "

> to commentaries - but my

> > submission is that - give me one reason to accept

> the views of " less read

> > scholars " than to " well read scholars like Late

> Santhanam / Shri KN Rao /

> > Shri Sanjay rath / many others " . and More so - as

> I do not " pretend " to

> > know the sanskrit and do not " waste " my time on

> " shloka business " with my

> > " incomplete knowledge " . So I am happy to be

> following better quality

> > commentaries - who are expalining with the case

> studies.

> >

> > Of course - each one makes his choice.

> >

> >

> > regards / Prafulla Gang

> > http://www.prafulla.net

> >

> > " Men who never get carried away should be. "

> > ************************************************

> >

> >

> >>

> >> sreesog

> >> Thu, 05 Jul 2007 07:00:31 -0000

> >>

> >> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is

> so important?

> >>

> >> Dear Prafulla ji,

> >> * Even if those things are not there in ancient

> texts every one is

> >> free to make or follow there own choice - yes,

> there is every chance

> >> that even such new methods might give true

> results - your argument is

> >> right.

> >> * As far Sanskrit is concerned: Yes, it is your

> choice - when you

> >> are blind to read and understand Sanskrit your

> self, and understand

> >> what is there and what not, of course you have to

> follow someone who

> >> says they see - you are right in that as well.

> >> Love,

> >> Sreenadh

> >>

> >> , Prafulla

> Gang <jyotish

> >> wrote:

> >>>

> >>> Well Sreenadh ji - at times, these issues become

> choice or

> >> prejudices in our own form of reading model. Had

> there not been any

> >> substance in interpreting D9 charts - lot many

> stalwarts must not

> >> have explored it - and I presume - many of them

> know better

> >> sanskrit / jyotish (rather both) than all of us

> on the forum

> >> collectively. So if at all - anyone wish to

> contest the

> >> interpretation - then many of those stalwarts are

> the people - must

> >> be debated with. On the forum, where not many

> great sanskrit

> >> scholars / jyotish researchers - the arguments

> may not have any

> >> relevance.

> >>>

> >>> regards / Prafulla Gang

> >>> http://www.prafulla.net

> >>>

> >>> " The right to be heard does not automatically

> include the right to

> >> be taken seriously. "

> >>> ************************************************

> >>>

> >>>

> >>>>

> >>>> sreesog

> >>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 13:56:36 -0000

> >>>>

> >>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is

> so important?

> >>>>

> >>>> Dear Prafulla ji,

> >>>> * No ancient text ask us to read Navamsha (not

> chart) " just like

> >> D1

> >>>> chart " ; nor they provide slokas for the same.

> >>>> * No ancient text provide as the results for

> " aspects of planets

> >> in

> >>>> Navamasa "

> >>>> * Nor they give us the results to be predicted

> when planets are

> >>>> placed " x house with reference to navamsa

> lagna "

> >>>>

> >>>> I hope we are trying to study astrology as

> taught by the sages;

> >> If

> >>>> not I don't have anything to say.

> >>>>

> >>>> Love,

> >>>> Sreenadh

> >>>>

> >>>>

> >>>> , Prafulla

> Gang <jyotish@>

> >>>> wrote:

> >>>>>

> >>>>> Dear Sreenadh ji

> >>>>>

> >>>>> I have also observed many jyotish stalwarts

> using navamsa chart

> >>>> (along with other D charts). Now how to assess

> D9 charts - can be

> >>>> perspective. But - as most authors say - just

> like D1 chart.

> >>>>>

> >>>>> I request members to share their experience.

> >>>>>

> >>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang

> >>>>> http://www.prafulla.net

> >>>>>

> >>>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically

> include the right

> >> to

> >>>> be taken seriously. "

> >>>>>

> ************************************************

> >>>>>

> >>>>>

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>> sreesog@

> >>>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 07:56:49 -0000

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart

> is so important?

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>> Dear Krishna ji,

> >>>>>> ==>

> >>>>>>> I too to the view that Navamsa

> chart is

> >>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart.

> >>>>>> <==

> >>>>>> * There is not Navamsa " chart " , but only

> Navamsa. Navamsa chart

> >>>> is

> >>>>>> not as important as Rasi chart and it can

> never be, because it

> >> is

> >>>>>> only an amsa. But yes, it is more important

> than other amsas due

>

=== message truncated ===

 

 

 

 

______________________________\

____

Be a better Globetrotter. Get better travel answers from someone who knows.

Answers - Check it out.

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[Guest guest]

Saravali by Kalyan verma-

atha Rashibhed adhayaya 3rd

 

Shloka 12 (Sub Divisions Essential)

means- The effects of a Horoscope should be predicted

according to the divisions of houses. Without knowing the

strength of such lords, one cannot lay even a step forward,

in the direction of astrology.

 

If required, I can post the

shloka but to put in English it takes some effort, and I

may make a mistake in process of making it readable.

 

I am coming in my next mail about the clarification of

aspects by Saravali. (If I get the time to write).

 

regards,

Bhaskar

 

 

 

 

, SPK <aquaris_rising wrote:

>

> Prafullaji,

>

> Kalyan verma does not say in which division to look

> for this aspect. D-9, D-10, D-60 ? This is the only

> place where argument can be made for use of D charts.

> Most places they talk aboput amsha and not a chart or

> a bhava in a division.

>

> Satish

> --- Prafulla Gang <jyotish wrote:

>

> > Dear Pradeep,

> >

> > Another important issue - In D9 charts reference -

> > kalyan Varma has given hints for results for Sun

> > aspecting venus; or mercury aspecting venus. Since

> > they can never " aspect " in Rashi Kundli - the

> > obvious reference was to Navamsa " chart " .

> >

> > I do not think, kalyan varma can be treated at par

> > with current age scholars !!

> >

> > regards / Prafulla Gang

> > http://www.prafulla.net

> >

> > " Men who never get carried away should be. "

> > ************************************************

> >

> >

> > >

> > > jyotish

> > > Thu, 5 Jul 2007 20:23:15 -0800

> > >

> > > Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so

> > important?

> > >

> > > Dear Sreenadh ji

> > >

> > > Well - who knows the truth? - Should the person

> > making comment, be

> > > construed to be as truth seeker - until they prove

> > with the application

> > > of the principles on the charts ( both ways -

> > firstly the wrong

> > > application of others; and secondly how to read in

> > correct way).

> > > Theorists without predictive support - has little

> > relevance in jyotish.

> > > But yes - if you can justify your statements by

> > case studies - then at

> > > least, I will hear with open mind.

> > >

> > > Understandably, I have been quoted to be " blind "

> > to commentaries - but my

> > > submission is that - give me one reason to accept

> > the views of " less read

> > > scholars " than to " well read scholars like Late

> > Santhanam / Shri KN Rao /

> > > Shri Sanjay rath / many others " . and More so - as

> > I do not " pretend " to

> > > know the sanskrit and do not " waste " my time on

> > " shloka business " with my

> > > " incomplete knowledge " . So I am happy to be

> > following better quality

> > > commentaries - who are expalining with the case

> > studies.

> > >

> > > Of course - each one makes his choice.

> > >

> > >

> > > regards / Prafulla Gang

> > > http://www.prafulla.net

> > >

> > > " Men who never get carried away should be. "

> > > ************************************************

> > >

> > >

> > >>

> > >> sreesog

> > >> Thu, 05 Jul 2007 07:00:31 -0000

> > >>

> > >> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is

> > so important?

> > >>

> > >> Dear Prafulla ji,

> > >> * Even if those things are not there in ancient

> > texts every one is

> > >> free to make or follow there own choice - yes,

> > there is every chance

> > >> that even such new methods might give true

> > results - your argument is

> > >> right.

> > >> * As far Sanskrit is concerned: Yes, it is your

> > choice - when you

> > >> are blind to read and understand Sanskrit your

> > self, and understand

> > >> what is there and what not, of course you have to

> > follow someone who

> > >> says they see - you are right in that as well.

> > >> Love,

> > >> Sreenadh

> > >>

> > >> , Prafulla

> > Gang <jyotish@>

> > >> wrote:

> > >>>

> > >>> Well Sreenadh ji - at times, these issues become

> > choice or

> > >> prejudices in our own form of reading model. Had

> > there not been any

> > >> substance in interpreting D9 charts - lot many

> > stalwarts must not

> > >> have explored it - and I presume - many of them

> > know better

> > >> sanskrit / jyotish (rather both) than all of us

> > on the forum

> > >> collectively. So if at all - anyone wish to

> > contest the

> > >> interpretation - then many of those stalwarts are

> > the people - must

> > >> be debated with. On the forum, where not many

> > great sanskrit

> > >> scholars / jyotish researchers - the arguments

> > may not have any

> > >> relevance.

> > >>>

> > >>> regards / Prafulla Gang

> > >>> http://www.prafulla.net

> > >>>

> > >>> " The right to be heard does not automatically

> > include the right to

> > >> be taken seriously. "

> > >>> ************************************************

> > >>>

> > >>>

> > >>>>

> > >>>> sreesog@

> > >>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 13:56:36 -0000

> > >>>>

> > >>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is

> > so important?

> > >>>>

> > >>>> Dear Prafulla ji,

> > >>>> * No ancient text ask us to read Navamsha (not

> > chart) " just like

> > >> D1

> > >>>> chart " ; nor they provide slokas for the same.

> > >>>> * No ancient text provide as the results for

> > " aspects of planets

> > >> in

> > >>>> Navamasa "

> > >>>> * Nor they give us the results to be predicted

> > when planets are

> > >>>> placed " x house with reference to navamsa

> > lagna "

> > >>>>

> > >>>> I hope we are trying to study astrology as

> > taught by the sages;

> > >> If

> > >>>> not I don't have anything to say.

> > >>>>

> > >>>> Love,

> > >>>> Sreenadh

> > >>>>

> > >>>>

> > >>>> , Prafulla

> > Gang <jyotish@>

> > >>>> wrote:

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>> Dear Sreenadh ji

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>> I have also observed many jyotish stalwarts

> > using navamsa chart

> > >>>> (along with other D charts). Now how to assess

> > D9 charts - can be

> > >>>> perspective. But - as most authors say - just

> > like D1 chart.

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>> I request members to share their experience.

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang

> > >>>>> http://www.prafulla.net

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically

> > include the right

> > >> to

> > >>>> be taken seriously. "

> > >>>>>

> > ************************************************

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>> sreesog@

> > >>>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 07:56:49 -0000

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart

> > is so important?

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>> Dear Krishna ji,

> > >>>>>> ==>

> > >>>>>>> I too to the view that Navamsa

> > chart is

> > >>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart.

> > >>>>>> <==

> > >>>>>> * There is not Navamsa " chart " , but only

> > Navamsa. Navamsa chart

> > >>>> is

> > >>>>>> not as important as Rasi chart and it can

> > never be, because it

> > >> is

> > >>>>>> only an amsa. But yes, it is more important

> > than other amsas due

> >

> === message truncated ===

>

>

>

>

>

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[Guest guest]

Bhaskarji,

 

There is no debate about finding the strength of

planets in vargas. So if a graha gets good amshas in

various divisions it gains strength.

 

Tyhe whole discussion is about using these divisions

as separate charts, with aspects, houses etc.

 

Are there houses in divisions ? Are there aspects in

divisions ? Thats is the debate. NO ONE is questioning

use of divisions/amshas.

 

Let me ask you a simple question I had posed a few

months back.

 

Lets take Kumbha lagna chart ( D-1)

 

Lets say shani is in dhanu rashi and tula navansha.

 

Now lets say the lagna navansha is

Case 1) Lagna navansha is kumbha itself

Case 2) Lagna navansha is Meena.

 

So in one case one shani the lord of lagna of D-1 goes

to 9th house ( For those who use houses in navansha).

 

In the second case it goes to 8th house in navansha.

 

Now please tell me how shani will behave based on

these two criteria.

 

The people who propose using houses will read it

differently tahn people who don't use houses.

 

Lets not cluod this with " lets look at the whole

chart " stuff. It is a one parameter one planet

question.

 

Thanks

 

Satish

--- Bhaskar <bhaskar_jyotish wrote:

 

>

> Saravali by Kalyan verma-

> atha Rashibhed adhayaya 3rd

>

> Shloka 12 (Sub Divisions Essential)

> means- The effects of a Horoscope should be

> predicted

> according to the divisions of houses. Without

> knowing the

> strength of such lords, one cannot lay even a step

> forward,

> in the direction of astrology.

>

> If required, I can post the

> shloka but to put in English it takes some effort,

> and I

> may make a mistake in process of making it readable.

>

> I am coming in my next mail about the clarification

> of

> aspects by Saravali. (If I get the time to write).

>

> regards,

> Bhaskar

>

>

>

>

> , SPK

> <aquaris_rising wrote:

> >

> > Prafullaji,

> >

> > Kalyan verma does not say in which division to

> look

> > for this aspect. D-9, D-10, D-60 ? This is the

> only

> > place where argument can be made for use of D

> charts.

> > Most places they talk aboput amsha and not a chart

> or

> > a bhava in a division.

> >

> > Satish

> > --- Prafulla Gang <jyotish wrote:

> >

> > > Dear Pradeep,

> > >

> > > Another important issue - In D9 charts reference

> -

> > > kalyan Varma has given hints for results for Sun

> > > aspecting venus; or mercury aspecting venus.

> Since

> > > they can never " aspect " in Rashi Kundli - the

> > > obvious reference was to Navamsa " chart " .

> > >

> > > I do not think, kalyan varma can be treated at

> par

> > > with current age scholars !!

> > >

> > > regards / Prafulla Gang

> > > http://www.prafulla.net

> > >

> > > " Men who never get carried away should be. "

> > > ************************************************

> > >

> > >

> > > >

> > > > jyotish

> > > > Thu, 5 Jul 2007 20:23:15 -0800

> > > >

> > > > Re: Why Navamsa Chart

> is so

> > > important?

> > > >

> > > > Dear Sreenadh ji

> > > >

> > > > Well - who knows the truth? - Should the

> person

> > > making comment, be

> > > > construed to be as truth seeker - until they

> prove

> > > with the application

> > > > of the principles on the charts ( both ways -

> > > firstly the wrong

> > > > application of others; and secondly how to

> read in

> > > correct way).

> > > > Theorists without predictive support - has

> little

> > > relevance in jyotish.

> > > > But yes - if you can justify your statements

> by

> > > case studies - then at

> > > > least, I will hear with open mind.

> > > >

> > > > Understandably, I have been quoted to be

> " blind "

> > > to commentaries - but my

> > > > submission is that - give me one reason to

> accept

> > > the views of " less read

> > > > scholars " than to " well read scholars like

> Late

> > > Santhanam / Shri KN Rao /

> > > > Shri Sanjay rath / many others " . and More so -

> as

> > > I do not " pretend " to

> > > > know the sanskrit and do not " waste " my time

> on

> > > " shloka business " with my

> > > > " incomplete knowledge " . So I am happy to be

> > > following better quality

> > > > commentaries - who are expalining with the

> case

> > > studies.

> > > >

> > > > Of course - each one makes his choice.

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > regards / Prafulla Gang

> > > > http://www.prafulla.net

> > > >

> > > > " Men who never get carried away should be. "

> > > >

> ************************************************

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >>

> > > >> sreesog

> > > >> Thu, 05 Jul 2007 07:00:31 -0000

> > > >>

> > > >> Re: Why Navamsa Chart

> is

> > > so important?

> > > >>

> > > >> Dear Prafulla ji,

> > > >> * Even if those things are not there in

> ancient

> > > texts every one is

> > > >> free to make or follow there own choice -

> yes,

> > > there is every chance

> > > >> that even such new methods might give true

> > > results - your argument is

> > > >> right.

> > > >> * As far Sanskrit is concerned: Yes, it is

> your

> > > choice - when you

> > > >> are blind to read and understand Sanskrit

> your

> > > self, and understand

> > > >> what is there and what not, of course you

> have to

> > > follow someone who

> > > >> says they see - you are right in that as

> well.

> > > >> Love,

> > > >> Sreenadh

> > > >>

> > > >> , Prafulla

> > > Gang <jyotish@>

> > > >> wrote:

> > > >>>

> > > >>> Well Sreenadh ji - at times, these issues

> become

> > > choice or

> > > >> prejudices in our own form of reading model.

> Had

> > > there not been any

> > > >> substance in interpreting D9 charts - lot

> many

> > > stalwarts must not

> > > >> have explored it - and I presume - many of

> them

> > > know better

> > > >> sanskrit / jyotish (rather both) than all of

> us

> > > on the forum

> > > >> collectively. So if at all - anyone wish to

> > > contest the

> > > >> interpretation - then many of those stalwarts

> are

> > > the people - must

> > > >> be debated with. On the forum, where not many

> > > great sanskrit

> > > >> scholars / jyotish researchers - the

> arguments

> > > may not have any

> > > >> relevance.

> > > >>>

> > > >>> regards / Prafulla Gang

> > > >>> http://www.prafulla.net

> > > >>>

> > > >>> " The right to be heard does not

> automatically

> > > include the right to

> > > >> be taken seriously. "

> > > >>>

> ************************************************

> > > >>>

>

=== message truncated ===

 

 

 

 

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[Guest guest]

Dear Shri Bhaskar ji

 

I had opportunity to read two best quality mails. One from Shri Sunil John on

another forum and this one.

 

Keep posting your wisdom.

 

But I have another contention. Why do not they have arguments with more learned

people (who understand sanskrit and have read those literature; and have applied

over decades). Perhaps - people like me, can not question some of these " sage's "

wisdom. I could only understand one simple thing in past 20 years of astro

journey - that we all are short of time (perhaps few are not !!) and we must

take the journey forward from the point where, researchers have published their

knowledge base. if a particular dictum is correct or not - - can only be proved

by its application. It does not matter - if I am quoting a new theory or old

theory. Even if I am quoting a new theory, it might not be new - but taken from

someone's research (again from astrology literature) - but it is not necessary

that those are to be revealed by those research scholars. I am happier - even

with that proposition, as long as they demonstrate its success.

 

I give you the classic example of System's astrology by Shri VK Chowdhry ji or

Krushna Ashtakvarga System by Shri Krushna ji. Both have been produced

brilliantly by the respective great astrologers - just not by words (or writing

long articles / books or shloka interpretations) but by demonstarting their

application on thousands of charts. And, they have demonstrated consistent

applications (no unnecessary contradictions / overriders etc) - so Why should

not they be believed and used. Well - everyone has choice to make, and I feel

pride in learning from these living sages. Likewise, only those jyotish

scholars, who can produce their theories with consistent application - must be

appreciated.

 

regards / Prafulla Gang

http://www.prafulla.net

 

" Men who never get carried away should be. "

************************************************

 

 

>

> bhaskar_jyotish

> Fri, 06 Jul 2007 05:22:30 -0000

>

> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important?

>

> Sir,

>

> Very beautiful and humble post by you. Could not resist myself

> from writing.

>

> Too much of theories or discussion on same, without predictive

> support, is like too much of pravacahans without any personal

> application of the same, on part of the pravachan giver.

> People who claim to be overly knowledgable, about the shastras,

> about the explanation of the shlokas given by the Rishi Munis,

> should apply this knowledge on the various Forums, where hundreds

> are appearing with their help calls. What use is any knowledge

> in the world, if it does not appeal to universal brotherhood ?

> An ounce of action, is preferable to a quintal of

> Pravachan.

>

> As long as I understand the meaning of the main shlokas in

> Sanskrit, in my nitya Pooja, there is no mandatory rule, that

> I should know Sanskrit, to be a good astrologer.Life is

> too short, now to continue giving commentaries on the shastras, which

> have already been interpreted, by the great wise men before us,

> of a better age than us. We should instead spend time on applications

> of these knowledge, rather than futile discussions, which lead

> nowehre, and on the contrary create differences between colleagues

> and supposed to be fraternity brothers of the same fold.

>

> There is no sense in trying to take out skin from a hair end

> (Baal ki khaal), which has been actually going on in the

> subject matter and exchanges on these threads. We are over smart

> and even bring in and misquote the Rishi Munis out of context, just to

> prove our point, which is what has been happenning with the new cross

> breed of writers, who just wish to appear spectacular and come in

> limelight, by distracting the general trend of approach and modes

> taken by the astrologers since ages.

>

> let these great knowledgable scholars try to predict with such great

> commentaries and display of knowledge- on small issues, like sex

> determination, marriage timings, birth timing, timing change of job,

> and scores of such day to day matters. I am sure they will fail

> miserably most of the times, in their predictions. Then what was the

> boo-ha about, primarily ? i would prefer a normal poor Pundit who does

> not know a word of english, who is unassuming, who does not claim to

> know much - anyday to these modern scholars who will perish one day

> with this abundance of knowledge in their heads- put to naught due to

> no use, like a rusted nail.

>

> Today we do not need any more knowledge from people. That is there in

> gigantic proportions. neither we need further commentaries,

> translations or dicussions. We would like to see people who have

> already digested this knowledge,before embarking on new untrodden

> paths in search of illusions and breakthroughs, where there are none

> available., making application of their knowledge on real charts, and

> explaining to a small student of astrology like me. how to use the

> so n so principles, in other charts as well, with same accuracy of

> results. We need application of rules and the knowledge of

> application, and not worthless discussions.

>

> It is better for one to be blind and - realized, rather than

> have eyes, and see only restricted views.

>

> hope that i have not touched a withered straw somewhere, and if so,

> then it does not start creaking.

>

> regards,

> Bhaskar.

>

>

>

> , Prafulla Gang <jyotish wrote:

>>

>> Dear Sreenadh ji

>>

>> Well - who knows the truth? - Should the person making comment, be

> construed to be as truth seeker - until they prove with the

> application of the principles on the charts ( both ways - firstly the

> wrong application of others; and secondly how to read in correct way).

> Theorists without predictive support - has little relevance in

> jyotish. But yes - if you can justify your statements by case studies

> - then at least, I will hear with open mind.

>>

>> Understandably, I have been quoted to be " blind " to commentaries -

> but my submission is that - give me one reason to accept the views of

> " less read scholars " than to " well read scholars like Late Santhanam /

> Shri KN Rao / Shri Sanjay rath / many others " . and More so - as I do

> not " pretend " to know the sanskrit and do not " waste " my time on

> " shloka business " with my " incomplete knowledge " . So I am happy to be

> following better quality commentaries - who are expalining with the

> case studies.

>>

>> Of course - each one makes his choice.

>>

>>

>> regards / Prafulla Gang

>> http://www.prafulla.net

>>

>> " Men who never get carried away should be. "

>> ************************************************

>>

>>

>>>

>>> sreesog

>>> Thu, 05 Jul 2007 07:00:31 -0000

>>>

>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important?

>>>

>>> Dear Prafulla ji,

>>> * Even if those things are not there in ancient texts every one is

>>> free to make or follow there own choice - yes, there is every chance

>>> that even such new methods might give true results - your argument is

>>> right.

>>> * As far Sanskrit is concerned: Yes, it is your choice - when you

>>> are blind to read and understand Sanskrit your self, and understand

>>> what is there and what not, of course you have to follow someone who

>>> says they see - you are right in that as well.

>>> Love,

>>> Sreenadh

>>>

>>> , Prafulla Gang <jyotish@>

>>> wrote:

>>>>

>>>> Well Sreenadh ji - at times, these issues become choice or

>>> prejudices in our own form of reading model. Had there not been any

>>> substance in interpreting D9 charts - lot many stalwarts must not

>>> have explored it - and I presume - many of them know better

>>> sanskrit / jyotish (rather both) than all of us on the forum

>>> collectively. So if at all - anyone wish to contest the

>>> interpretation - then many of those stalwarts are the people - must

>>> be debated with. On the forum, where not many great sanskrit

>>> scholars / jyotish researchers - the arguments may not have any

>>> relevance.

>>>>

>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang

>>>> http://www.prafulla.net

>>>>

>>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the right to

>>> be taken seriously. "

>>>> ************************************************

>>>>

>>>>

>>>>>

>>>>> sreesog@

>>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 13:56:36 -0000

>>>>>

>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important?

>>>>>

>>>>> Dear Prafulla ji,

>>>>> * No ancient text ask us to read Navamsha (not chart) " just like

>>> D1

>>>>> chart " ; nor they provide slokas for the same.

>>>>> * No ancient text provide as the results for " aspects of planets

>>> in

>>>>> Navamasa "

>>>>> * Nor they give us the results to be predicted when planets are

>>>>> placed " x house with reference to navamsa lagna "

>>>>>

>>>>> I hope we are trying to study astrology as taught by the sages;

>>> If

>>>>> not I don't have anything to say.

>>>>>

>>>>> Love,

>>>>> Sreenadh

>>>>>

>>>>>

>>>>> , Prafulla Gang <jyotish@>

>>>>> wrote:

>>>>>>

>>>>>> Dear Sreenadh ji

>>>>>>

>>>>>> I have also observed many jyotish stalwarts using navamsa chart

>>>>> (along with other D charts). Now how to assess D9 charts - can be

>>>>> perspective. But - as most authors say - just like D1 chart.

>>>>>>

>>>>>> I request members to share their experience.

>>>>>>

>>>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang

>>>>>> http://www.prafulla.net

>>>>>>

>>>>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the right

>>> to

>>>>> be taken seriously. "

>>>>>> ************************************************

>>>>>>

>>>>>>

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> sreesog@

>>>>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 07:56:49 -0000

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important?

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> Dear Krishna ji,

>>>>>>> ==>

>>>>>>>> I too to the view that Navamsa chart is

>>>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart.

>>>>>>> <==

>>>>>>> * There is not Navamsa " chart " , but only Navamsa. Navamsa chart

>>>>> is

>>>>>>> not as important as Rasi chart and it can never be, because it

>>> is

>>>>>>> only an amsa. But yes, it is more important than other amsas due

>>>>> to

>>>>>>> the prior said reasons.

>>>>>>> ==>

>>>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines the overall

>>>>>>>> strength of a planet?

>>>>>>> <==

>>>>>>> * Because the quality of earth determines the strength of the

>>>>>>> plant. This is applicable to all amsas as per their importance.

>>>>>>> ==>

>>>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa chart like

>>>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart?

>>>>>>> <==

>>>>>>> * No, it is not allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa. (There

>>>>> is

>>>>>>> no navamsa 'chart'.)

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> ==>

>>>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be treated as

>>> if

>>>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart?

>>>>>>> <==

>>>>>>> * No, when planets have sambandha in Navamsa, it only means

>>> that.

>>>>>>> When they have sombandha in Rasi, it only means that. It is

>>> wrong

>>>>> to

>>>>>>> mix the two.

>>>>>>> ==>

>>>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart as well?

>>>>>>> <==

>>>>>>> * No, Yogas should not be looked in Navamsa 'chart'. But yes

>>>>> yoga in

>>>>>>> Navamsa (not navamsa 'chart') can be taken yoga. Because it is

>>> the

>>>>>>> same principles as used in Rasi that are used to predict the

>>>>> result

>>>>>>> in Amsas as well - But Aspect(Drishti) and houses are not

>>>>> applicable

>>>>>>> to amsas. Both Aspect(Drishti) and Houses should be considered

>>> in

>>>>>>> Rasi chart itself. Any reference in ancient texts about aspect

>>> or

>>>>>>> houses essentially mean that they are referring to Rasi chart.

>>>>>>> Love,

>>>>>>> Sreenadh

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> , Krishnamurthy Seetharama

>>>>>>> <krishna_1998@> wrote:

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> Dear Kolachina ji,

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> It was interesting to read your comments on importance of the

>>>>>>>> Navamsa chart. I too to the view that Navamsa chart

>>> is

>>>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart. This is based on my experience so

>>>>>>>> far reading charts. However, I have still not understood what

>>>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons for a varga chart being so

>>>>>>>> important.

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines the overall

>>>>>>>> strength of a planet?

>>>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa chart like

>>>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart?

>>>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be treated as

>>> if

>>>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart?

>>>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart as well?

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> By looking at the kind of importance given to Navamsa chart, it

>>>>>>>> appears that the Rasi chart and Navamsa chart make up two equal

>>>>>>>> halves representing the native.

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> I have no doubts about the importance of Navamsa Chart. What I

>>>>>>>> would like to know is why Navamsa gains such an importance?

>>> What

>>>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons? After all it is one of many varga

>>>>>>>> charts!

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> Regards,

>>>>>>>> Krishna

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> --- Satya Sai Kolachina <skolachi@> wrote:

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>> Dear Sri Pradeep and Sri Chandrasekhar,

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>> I have been following this thread on karakamsa and both of

>>>>>>>>> your

>>>>>>>>> contributions.

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>> I whole-heartedly appreciate both of you for your valuable

>>>>>>>>> inputs

>>>>>>>>> you are providing to the astrological community. I would like

>>>>>>>>> to

>>>>>>>>> share my opinion (through my own experience).

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>> Considering Karakamsa from either Rasi or Navamsa chart alone

>>>>>>>>> most

>>>>>>>>> probably leads to erroneous results, as I found both the

>>>>>>>>> approaches

>>>>>>>>> working. I see the point Pradeep is making as very valuable;

>>>>>>>>> at the

>>>>>>>>> same time I am not against using Navamsa chart as separate

>>>>>>>>> chart (of

>>>>>>>>> course without losing the context of the Rasi chart), since

>>>>>>>>> any of

>>>>>>>>> the varga charts will not give independent results if the Rasi

>>>>>>>>> chart

>>>>>>>>> is ignored, as they themselves do not exist if the Rasi chart

>>>>>>>>> doesn't exist. In fact Sri KN Rao also mentioned in several

>>>>>>>>> occassions in many of his articles and books that yogas viewed

>>>>>>>>> in

>>>>>>>>> the Rasi chart should also exist in the Navamsa chart for

>>>>>>>>> confirming

>>>>>>>>> the results. If we do not see the Navamsa chart as a separate

>>>>>>>>> chart,

>>>>>>>>> how can we see the yogas therein? For the purpose of checking

>>>>>>>>> some

>>>>>>>>> yogas, Yuti and Veekshana (conjunction and aspects) in the

>>>>>>>>> navamsa

>>>>>>>>> chart make sense. This kind of yuti or veekshana should be

>>>>>>>>> considered on a hypothetical level (as mutual influence at the

>>>>>>>>> amsha level) rather than being within a 30 deg. span. of Rasi.

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>> Take an example. If a planet is exlated or in own house in the

>>>>>>>>> rasi

>>>>>>>>> chart and attains debilitation in the Navamsa chart, it is

>>>>>>>>> condiered

>>>>>>>>> as weakening of the actual strength shown in the Rasi. Why is

>>>>>>>>> this

>>>>>>>>> considered so? It is considered like that because, even though

>>>>>>>>> the

>>>>>>>>> planet is within its own or exlated rasi, still its

>>>>>>>>> positioning

>>>>>>>>> within that particular sector (here navamsa) has weakened it;

>>>>>>>>> means,

>>>>>>>>> within its own rasi, this particular sector is the weakest

>>>>>>>>> point for

>>>>>>>>> the planet within the strongest rasi; hence it loses its

>>>>>>>>> strength

>>>>>>>>> considerably. This means there is a gradation of strengths for

>>>>>>>>> the

>>>>>>>>> planet from first navamsa to the last navamsa. The navamsa

>>>>>>>>> position

>>>>>>>>> of a planet, thus indicates its refined placement within the

>>>>>>>>> rasi.

>>>>>>>>> In fact, Sri KN Rao also gives equal weightage to both the

>>>>>>>>> Rasi and

>>>>>>>>> Navamsa placement of a planet. If a planet is weak in one of

>>>>>>>>> them

>>>>>>>>> that means half the weightage is lost. We may not give the

>>>>>>>>> same

>>>>>>>>> level of treatment to other vargas as we give to Navamsa; but

>>>>>>>>> Navamsa is as important as the Rasi; to the extent that it can

>>>>>>>>> be

>>>>>>>>> viewed as an independent chart (to confirm the promise given

>>>>>>>>> by the

>>>>>>>>> rasi chart).

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>> Without a confirmation of Navamsa chart, yogas in the rasi

>>>>>>>>> chart

>>>>>>>>> alone cannot and will not give expected results; I have

>>>>>>>>> observed

>>>>>>>>> this phenomenon in several charts.

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>> My own experience is; I have Chandra and Sukra both in the

>>>>>>>>> 12th

>>>>>>>>> house from Karakamsa in the Navamsa chart (not in the rasi

>>>>>>>>> chart

>>>>>>>>> with the rasi of karakamsa considering as the karakamsa

>>>>>>>>> lagna). I am

>>>>>>>>> a deep devotee of Goddess Parvathi (represented by Chandra)

>>>>>>>>> and

>>>>>>>>> Goddess Lakshmi (represented by Sukra). If the karakamsa is

>>>>>>>>> brought

>>>>>>>>> to the Rasi chart, this cannot be explained. The sequence of

>>>>>>>>> my life

>>>>>>>>> events are better explained only if I consider karakamsa lagna

>>>>>>>>> in

>>>>>>>>> the navamsa chart; I am not discounting Pradeep's opinion

>>>>>>>>> here; I am

>>>>>>>>> just saying that both approaches need to be considered on the

>>>>>>>>> chart,

>>>>>>>>> and a composite opinion be formed, as Sri KN Rao always says.

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>> On the other hand, considering the specific rasi in the Rasi

>>>>>>>>> chart

>>>>>>>>> that holds karakamsa as the karakamsa lagna, my Sukra is in

>>>>>>>>> the 4th

>>>>>>>>> house indicating my possession of a nice beautiful house, and

>>>>>>>>> education/skills in arts (in addition to other traditional

>>>>>>>>> education).

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>> I am bringing this to both your knowledge only to summarize

>>>>>>>>> that

>>>>>>>>> both your theories give results; but not necessarily in

>>>>>>>>> isolation of

>>>>>>>>> the other.

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>> Thanks for all your contribution.

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>> Best regards,

>>>>>>>>> Satya S Kolachina

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>> , Chandrashekhar

>>>>>>>>> <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

>>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>> Dear Pradeep,

>>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>> I can not comment on views of either Sanjay or K. N. Rao.

>>>>>>>>> First

>>>>>>>>> there is

>>>>>>>>>> no difference in the meaning of Amsha and Amshaka though it

>>>>>>>>> is

>>>>>>>>> perhaps

>>>>>>>>>> being confused. It also needs to be remembered that in

>>>>>>>>> astrological

>>>>>>>>>> translations many a times words are to be understood in the

>>>>>>>>> context that

>>>>>>>>>> they used. So we find Parashara mentioning karakamsha and

>>>>>>>>> Swamsha

>>>>>>>>> in

>>>>>>>>>> alternate lines (almost) while indicating the results of

>>>>>>>>> occupation of

>>>>>>>>>> Karakamsha by Sun etc. and many other places in karakamsha

>>>>>>>>> adhyaaya.

>>>>>>>>>> This does not mean he is speaking about two different

>>>>>>>>> parameters.

>>>>>>>>> I

>>>>>>>>>> think if any Sanskrit scholar who is also well versed in

>>>>>>>>> interpretation

>>>>>>>>>> of astrological texts will confirm this contention of mine

>>>>>>>>> if he

>>>>>>>>> is

>>>>>>>>>> watching this discussion.

>>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>> If you want my personal opinion, I think that the results

>>>>>>>>> indicated on

>>>>>>>>>> the basis of Karakamsha without reference to the potential

>>>>>>>>> promised by

>>>>>>>>>> the rasi chart and the strength derived by the grahas in

>>>>>>>>> rasi

>>>>>>>>> chart,

>>>>>>>>>> through the Navamsha chart, are not likely to materialize. I

>>>>>>>>> hope

>>>>>>>>> this

>>>>>>>>>> opinion of mine does not create a big storm in the

>>>>>>>>> discussion on

>>>>>>>>> the

>>>>>>>>>> list. But this is my personal opinion, for whatever it is

>>>>>>>>> worth.

>>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>> Take care,

>>>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar.

>>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>> vijayadas_pradeep wrote:

>>>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>>> Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Respected members

>>>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>>> Shri Sanjay Rath clearly says ,Amshaka is pointing to the

>>>>>>>>> Rashi

>>>>>>>>> in

>>>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha.He also says,Karakamsha has

>>>>>>>>> one

>>>>>>>>>>> meaning ,while Karakamsha KA has another meaning.

>>>>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar jis view is Amshaka is not pointing to the

>>>>>>>>> Rashi

>>>>>>>>> in

>>>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha.

>>>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>>> Now Chandraekhar jis view is prudent as there are some

>>>>>>>>> shlokas

>>>>>>>>> which

>>>>>>>>>>> shri Rath somehow has overlooked,contradicting his view

>>>>>>>>> point.

>>>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>>> I respect shri Rath ,but i have to tell this.Sometimes the

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>> answer and

>>>>>>>>>>> explanations given by shri Rath are not preceded by proper

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> === message truncated ===

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>

>>>>>

>>> ____________________

>>>>>>> ______________

>>>>>>>> Be a PS3 game guru.

>>>>>>>> Get your game face on with the latest PS3 news and previews at

>>>>>>> Games.

>>>>>>>> http://videogames./platform?platform=120121

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>

[Guest guest]

Dear Satishji,

 

Personally I see the sublords of the planets and the

houses, which is not the 1/9th division,

but more precise, so for me to talk on such levels

is like learning again to know the gears in a car,

for driving License,

which I learned 27 year back. I am a Kp

practioner if you may not be aware,

which stage comes after

going through traditional astrology.

 

regards,

Bhaskar.

 

 

 

, SPK <aquaris_rising wrote:

>

> Bhaskarji,

>

> There is no debate about finding the strength of

> planets in vargas. So if a graha gets good amshas in

> various divisions it gains strength.

>

> Tyhe whole discussion is about using these divisions

> as separate charts, with aspects, houses etc.

>

> Are there houses in divisions ? Are there aspects in

> divisions ? Thats is the debate. NO ONE is questioning

> use of divisions/amshas.

>

> Let me ask you a simple question I had posed a few

> months back.

>

> Lets take Kumbha lagna chart ( D-1)

>

> Lets say shani is in dhanu rashi and tula navansha.

>

> Now lets say the lagna navansha is

> Case 1) Lagna navansha is kumbha itself

> Case 2) Lagna navansha is Meena.

>

> So in one case one shani the lord of lagna of D-1 goes

> to 9th house ( For those who use houses in navansha).

>

> In the second case it goes to 8th house in navansha.

>

> Now please tell me how shani will behave based on

> these two criteria.

>

> The people who propose using houses will read it

> differently tahn people who don't use houses.

>

> Lets not cluod this with " lets look at the whole

> chart " stuff. It is a one parameter one planet

> question.

>

> Thanks

>

> Satish

> --- Bhaskar <bhaskar_jyotish wrote:

>

> >

> > Saravali by Kalyan verma-

> > atha Rashibhed adhayaya 3rd

> >

> > Shloka 12 (Sub Divisions Essential)

> > means- The effects of a Horoscope should be

> > predicted

> > according to the divisions of houses. Without

> > knowing the

> > strength of such lords, one cannot lay even a step

> > forward,

> > in the direction of astrology.

> >

> > If required, I can post the

> > shloka but to put in English it takes some effort,

> > and I

> > may make a mistake in process of making it readable.

> >

> > I am coming in my next mail about the clarification

> > of

> > aspects by Saravali. (If I get the time to write).

> >

> > regards,

> > Bhaskar

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > , SPK

> > <aquaris_rising@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Prafullaji,

> > >

> > > Kalyan verma does not say in which division to

> > look

> > > for this aspect. D-9, D-10, D-60 ? This is the

> > only

> > > place where argument can be made for use of D

> > charts.

> > > Most places they talk aboput amsha and not a chart

> > or

> > > a bhava in a division.

> > >

> > > Satish

> > > --- Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> wrote:

> > >

> > > > Dear Pradeep,

> > > >

> > > > Another important issue - In D9 charts reference

> > -

> > > > kalyan Varma has given hints for results for Sun

> > > > aspecting venus; or mercury aspecting venus.

> > Since

> > > > they can never " aspect " in Rashi Kundli - the

> > > > obvious reference was to Navamsa " chart " .

> > > >

> > > > I do not think, kalyan varma can be treated at

> > par

> > > > with current age scholars !!

> > > >

> > > > regards / Prafulla Gang

> > > > http://www.prafulla.net

> > > >

> > > > " Men who never get carried away should be. "

> > > > ************************************************

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > jyotish@

> > > > > Thu, 5 Jul 2007 20:23:15 -0800

> > > > >

> > > > > Re: Why Navamsa Chart

> > is so

> > > > important?

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear Sreenadh ji

> > > > >

> > > > > Well - who knows the truth? - Should the

> > person

> > > > making comment, be

> > > > > construed to be as truth seeker - until they

> > prove

> > > > with the application

> > > > > of the principles on the charts ( both ways -

> > > > firstly the wrong

> > > > > application of others; and secondly how to

> > read in

> > > > correct way).

> > > > > Theorists without predictive support - has

> > little

> > > > relevance in jyotish.

> > > > > But yes - if you can justify your statements

> > by

> > > > case studies - then at

> > > > > least, I will hear with open mind.

> > > > >

> > > > > Understandably, I have been quoted to be

> > " blind "

> > > > to commentaries - but my

> > > > > submission is that - give me one reason to

> > accept

> > > > the views of " less read

> > > > > scholars " than to " well read scholars like

> > Late

> > > > Santhanam / Shri KN Rao /

> > > > > Shri Sanjay rath / many others " . and More so -

> > as

> > > > I do not " pretend " to

> > > > > know the sanskrit and do not " waste " my time

> > on

> > > > " shloka business " with my

> > > > > " incomplete knowledge " . So I am happy to be

> > > > following better quality

> > > > > commentaries - who are expalining with the

> > case

> > > > studies.

> > > > >

> > > > > Of course - each one makes his choice.

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang

> > > > > http://www.prafulla.net

> > > > >

> > > > > " Men who never get carried away should be. "

> > > > >

> > ************************************************

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >>

> > > > >> sreesog@

> > > > >> Thu, 05 Jul 2007 07:00:31 -0000

> > > > >>

> > > > >> Re: Why Navamsa Chart

> > is

> > > > so important?

> > > > >>

> > > > >> Dear Prafulla ji,

> > > > >> * Even if those things are not there in

> > ancient

> > > > texts every one is

> > > > >> free to make or follow there own choice -

> > yes,

> > > > there is every chance

> > > > >> that even such new methods might give true

> > > > results - your argument is

> > > > >> right.

> > > > >> * As far Sanskrit is concerned: Yes, it is

> > your

> > > > choice - when you

> > > > >> are blind to read and understand Sanskrit

> > your

> > > > self, and understand

> > > > >> what is there and what not, of course you

> > have to

> > > > follow someone who

> > > > >> says they see - you are right in that as

> > well.

> > > > >> Love,

> > > > >> Sreenadh

> > > > >>

> > > > >> , Prafulla

> > > > Gang <jyotish@>

> > > > >> wrote:

> > > > >>>

> > > > >>> Well Sreenadh ji - at times, these issues

> > become

> > > > choice or

> > > > >> prejudices in our own form of reading model.

> > Had

> > > > there not been any

> > > > >> substance in interpreting D9 charts - lot

> > many

> > > > stalwarts must not

> > > > >> have explored it - and I presume - many of

> > them

> > > > know better

> > > > >> sanskrit / jyotish (rather both) than all of

> > us

> > > > on the forum

> > > > >> collectively. So if at all - anyone wish to

> > > > contest the

> > > > >> interpretation - then many of those stalwarts

> > are

> > > > the people - must

> > > > >> be debated with. On the forum, where not many

> > > > great sanskrit

> > > > >> scholars / jyotish researchers - the

> > arguments

> > > > may not have any

> > > > >> relevance.

> > > > >>>

> > > > >>> regards / Prafulla Gang

> > > > >>> http://www.prafulla.net

> > > > >>>

> > > > >>> " The right to be heard does not

> > automatically

> > > > include the right to

> > > > >> be taken seriously. "

> > > > >>>

> > ************************************************

> > > > >>>

> >

> === message truncated ===

>

>

>

>

>

______________________________\

____

> Pinpoint customers who are looking for what you sell.

> http://searchmarketing./

>

[Guest guest]

Dear Krishna ji

 

It is not only the technical debate. We are also sharing our approach to jyotish

and each one has his prefences / approach. Many a times, we all do learn and

induct them in our astro journey.

 

Many thanks for starting the thread.

 

regards / Prafulla Gang

http://www.prafulla.net

 

" Men who never get carried away should be. "

************************************************

 

 

>

> krishna_1998

> Fri, 6 Jul 2007 00:41:55 -0700 (PDT)

>

> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important?

>

> Dear All,

>

> As I was the one who started this thread, I must say that the

> debate reamins inconclusive.

>

> It makes logical sense to say that one should not use aspects,

> conjunctions etc. in D-charts as we are looking only at logical

> positions of planets and not their physical positions like in

> the Rasi chart. But, then why so many learned people who have

> done succesful predictions consider aspects and conjunctions in

> D-charts? Let me forget about all the other D-charts for now and

> let me stick to only Navamsha as that is what we are discussing

> in this thread.

>

> In mind, based on my learning, I felt that Navamsha charts are

> at a different plane as compared to other D-charts and hence it

> is allowed to look at aspects and conjunctions only in Navamsha

> and not in other D-Charts. I wanted to know the reasoning behind

> this special treatment to Navamsha chart and hence raised this

> question.

>

> I started learning Jyotish using Shri. B V Raman's books. He

> uses Navamsa Chart like Rasi Chart for all practical purposes.

> He has been considered as one of the pioneers in modern day

> Astrology.

>

> I tend to agree with Prafulla. After all, why do we study this

> science? The answer for me is that it shows the light and guides

> me in my life. Hence, preditive part of the science is as of

> paramount importance. I guess the only way to resolve this

> deadlock is to take a bunch of charts (with reasonably accurate

> birth data) and study them with and without using aspects and

> conjunctions in Navamsha and explain the major events in life.

>

> I see no other way to end this debate.

>

> Regards,

> Krishna

>

>

> --- Prafulla Gang <jyotish wrote:

>

>> Dear Sreenadh ji

>>

>> Well - who knows the truth? - Should the person making

>> comment, be construed to be as truth seeker - until they prove

>> with the application of the principles on the charts ( both

>> ways - firstly the wrong application of others; and secondly

>> how to read in correct way). Theorists without predictive

>> support - has little relevance in jyotish. But yes - if you

>> can justify your statements by case studies - then at least, I

>> will hear with open mind.

>>

>> Understandably, I have been quoted to be " blind " to

>> commentaries - but my submission is that - give me one reason

>> to accept the views of " less read scholars " than to " well read

>> scholars like Late Santhanam / Shri KN Rao / Shri Sanjay rath

>> / many others " . and More so - as I do not " pretend " to know

>> the sanskrit and do not " waste " my time on " shloka business "

>> with my " incomplete knowledge " . So I am happy to be following

>> better quality commentaries - who are expalining with the case

>> studies.

>>

>> Of course - each one makes his choice.

>>

>>

>> regards / Prafulla Gang

>> http://www.prafulla.net

>>

>> " Men who never get carried away should be. "

>> ************************************************

>>

>>

>>>

>>> sreesog

>>> Thu, 05 Jul 2007 07:00:31 -0000

>>>

>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so

>> important?

>>>

>>> Dear Prafulla ji,

>>> * Even if those things are not there in ancient texts every

>> one is

>>> free to make or follow there own choice - yes, there is

>> every chance

>>> that even such new methods might give true results - your

>> argument is

>>> right.

>>> * As far Sanskrit is concerned: Yes, it is your choice -

>> when you

>>> are blind to read and understand Sanskrit your self, and

>> understand

>>> what is there and what not, of course you have to follow

>> someone who

>>> says they see - you are right in that as well.

>>> Love,

>>> Sreenadh

>>>

>>> , Prafulla Gang

>> <jyotish

>>> wrote:

>>>>

>>>> Well Sreenadh ji - at times, these issues become choice or

>>> prejudices in our own form of reading model. Had there not

>> been any

>>> substance in interpreting D9 charts - lot many stalwarts

>> must not

>>> have explored it - and I presume - many of them know better

>>> sanskrit / jyotish (rather both) than all of us on the forum

>>> collectively. So if at all - anyone wish to contest the

>>> interpretation - then many of those stalwarts are the people

>> - must

>>> be debated with. On the forum, where not many great sanskrit

>>> scholars / jyotish researchers - the arguments may not have

>> any

>>> relevance.

>>>>

>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang

>>>> http://www.prafulla.net

>>>>

>>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the

>> right to

>>> be taken seriously. "

>>>> ************************************************

>>>>

>>>>

>>>>>

>>>>> sreesog

>>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 13:56:36 -0000

>>>>>

>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so

>> important?

>>>>>

>>>>> Dear Prafulla ji,

>>>>> * No ancient text ask us to read Navamsha (not chart)

>> " just like

>>> D1

>>>>> chart " ; nor they provide slokas for the same.

>>>>> * No ancient text provide as the results for " aspects of

>> planets

>>> in

>>>>> Navamasa "

>>>>> * Nor they give us the results to be predicted when

>> planets are

>>>>> placed " x house with reference to navamsa lagna "

>>>>>

>>>>> I hope we are trying to study astrology as taught by the

>> sages;

>>> If

>>>>> not I don't have anything to say.

>>>>>

>>>>> Love,

>>>>> Sreenadh

>>>>>

>>>>>

>>>>> , Prafulla Gang

>> <jyotish@>

>>>>> wrote:

>>>>>>

>>>>>> Dear Sreenadh ji

>>>>>>

>>>>>> I have also observed many jyotish stalwarts using navamsa

>> chart

>>>>> (along with other D charts). Now how to assess D9 charts

>> - can be

>>>>> perspective. But - as most authors say - just like D1

>> chart.

>>>>>>

>>>>>> I request members to share their experience.

>>>>>>

>>>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang

>>>>>> http://www.prafulla.net

>>>>>>

>>>>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the

>> right

>>> to

>>>>> be taken seriously. "

>>>>>> ************************************************

>>>>>>

>>>>>>

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> sreesog@

>>>>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 07:56:49 -0000

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so

>> important?

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> Dear Krishna ji,

>>>>>>> ==>

>>>>>>>> I too to the view that Navamsa chart is

>>>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart.

>>>>>>> <==

>>>>>>> * There is not Navamsa " chart " , but only Navamsa.

>> Navamsa chart

>>>>> is

>>>>>>> not as important as Rasi chart and it can never be,

>> because it

>>> is

>>>>>>> only an amsa. But yes, it is more important than other

>> amsas due

>>>>> to

>>>>>>> the prior said reasons.

>>>>>>> ==>

>>>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines the

>> overall

>>>>>>>> strength of a planet?

>>>>>>> <==

>>>>>>> * Because the quality of earth determines the strength

>> of the

>>>>>>> plant. This is applicable to all amsas as per their

>> importance.

>>>>>>> ==>

>>>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa

>> chart like

>>>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart?

>>>>>>> <==

>>>>>>> * No, it is not allowed to consider aspects in

>> Navamsa. (There

>>>>> is

>>>>>>> no navamsa 'chart'.)

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> ==>

>>>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be

>> treated as

>>> if

>>>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart?

>>>>>>> <==

>>>>>>> * No, when planets have sambandha in Navamsa, it only

>> means

>>> that.

>>>>>>> When they have sombandha in Rasi, it only means that. It

>> is

>>> wrong

>>>>> to

>>>>>>> mix the two.

>>>>>>> ==>

>>>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart as

>> well?

>>>>>>> <==

>>>>>>> * No, Yogas should not be looked in Navamsa 'chart'.

>> But yes

>>>>> yoga in

>>>>>>> Navamsa (not navamsa 'chart') can be taken yoga. Because

>> it

> === message truncated ===

>

>

>

>

>

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____

> Get the toolbar and be alerted to new email wherever you're

> surfing.

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[Guest guest]

Dear Satish ji

 

I will like to hear the view on aspects in D charts (on kalyan Varma's

references) from other scholars. In the absence of specific D chart - I have

assumed the reference to all possible charts and since D9 is one of the most

vital divisional chart - the reference must be applicable there as well.

 

Well - Satyacharya has used aspects and mutual relations in D charts for event

fructification. If there are aspects then - there ought to be a " chart " . So has

Devakeralam used the transits in D9 chart at many places. I presume kalyan

varma, Satyacharya and Chandrakala nadi etc are from ancient heritage.

 

Above all - many great astrologers have advocated the use of D9 chart like rashi

chart. I presume - they had access to many technique from parampara / nadis etc

- which perhaps person like me are not aware of. But they have demonstrated the

use as well.

 

regards / Prafulla Gang

http://www.prafulla.net

 

" Men who never get carried away should be. "

************************************************

 

 

>

> aquaris_rising

> Fri, 6 Jul 2007 06:37:40 -0700 (PDT)

>

> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important?

>

> Prafullaji,

>

> Kalyan verma does not say in which division to look

> for this aspect. D-9, D-10, D-60 ? This is the only

> place where argument can be made for use of D charts.

> Most places they talk aboput amsha and not a chart or

> a bhava in a division.

>

> Satish

> --- Prafulla Gang <jyotish wrote:

>

>> Dear Pradeep,

>>

>> Another important issue - In D9 charts reference -

>> kalyan Varma has given hints for results for Sun

>> aspecting venus; or mercury aspecting venus. Since

>> they can never " aspect " in Rashi Kundli - the

>> obvious reference was to Navamsa " chart " .

>>

>> I do not think, kalyan varma can be treated at par

>> with current age scholars !!

>>

>> regards / Prafulla Gang

>> http://www.prafulla.net

>>

>> " Men who never get carried away should be. "

>> ************************************************

>>

>>

>>>

>>> jyotish

>>> Thu, 5 Jul 2007 20:23:15 -0800

>>>

>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so

>> important?

>>>

>>> Dear Sreenadh ji

>>>

>>> Well - who knows the truth? - Should the person

>> making comment, be

>>> construed to be as truth seeker - until they prove

>> with the application

>>> of the principles on the charts ( both ways -

>> firstly the wrong

>>> application of others; and secondly how to read in

>> correct way).

>>> Theorists without predictive support - has little

>> relevance in jyotish.

>>> But yes - if you can justify your statements by

>> case studies - then at

>>> least, I will hear with open mind.

>>>

>>> Understandably, I have been quoted to be " blind "

>> to commentaries - but my

>>> submission is that - give me one reason to accept

>> the views of " less read

>>> scholars " than to " well read scholars like Late

>> Santhanam / Shri KN Rao /

>>> Shri Sanjay rath / many others " . and More so - as

>> I do not " pretend " to

>>> know the sanskrit and do not " waste " my time on

>> " shloka business " with my

>>> " incomplete knowledge " . So I am happy to be

>> following better quality

>>> commentaries - who are expalining with the case

>> studies.

>>>

>>> Of course - each one makes his choice.

>>>

>>>

>>> regards / Prafulla Gang

>>> http://www.prafulla.net

>>>

>>> " Men who never get carried away should be. "

>>> ************************************************

>>>

>>>

>>>>

>>>> sreesog

>>>> Thu, 05 Jul 2007 07:00:31 -0000

>>>>

>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is

>> so important?

>>>>

>>>> Dear Prafulla ji,

>>>> * Even if those things are not there in ancient

>> texts every one is

>>>> free to make or follow there own choice - yes,

>> there is every chance

>>>> that even such new methods might give true

>> results - your argument is

>>>> right.

>>>> * As far Sanskrit is concerned: Yes, it is your

>> choice - when you

>>>> are blind to read and understand Sanskrit your

>> self, and understand

>>>> what is there and what not, of course you have to

>> follow someone who

>>>> says they see - you are right in that as well.

>>>> Love,

>>>> Sreenadh

>>>>

>>>> , Prafulla

>> Gang <jyotish

>>>> wrote:

>>>>>

>>>>> Well Sreenadh ji - at times, these issues become

>> choice or

>>>> prejudices in our own form of reading model. Had

>> there not been any

>>>> substance in interpreting D9 charts - lot many

>> stalwarts must not

>>>> have explored it - and I presume - many of them

>> know better

>>>> sanskrit / jyotish (rather both) than all of us

>> on the forum

>>>> collectively. So if at all - anyone wish to

>> contest the

>>>> interpretation - then many of those stalwarts are

>> the people - must

>>>> be debated with. On the forum, where not many

>> great sanskrit

>>>> scholars / jyotish researchers - the arguments

>> may not have any

>>>> relevance.

>>>>>

>>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang

>>>>> http://www.prafulla.net

>>>>>

>>>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically

>> include the right to

>>>> be taken seriously. "

>>>>> ************************************************

>>>>>

>>>>>

>>>>>>

>>>>>> sreesog

>>>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 13:56:36 -0000

>>>>>>

>>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is

>> so important?

>>>>>>

>>>>>> Dear Prafulla ji,

>>>>>> * No ancient text ask us to read Navamsha (not

>> chart) " just like

>>>> D1

>>>>>> chart " ; nor they provide slokas for the same.

>>>>>> * No ancient text provide as the results for

>> " aspects of planets

>>>> in

>>>>>> Navamasa "

>>>>>> * Nor they give us the results to be predicted

>> when planets are

>>>>>> placed " x house with reference to navamsa

>> lagna "

>>>>>>

>>>>>> I hope we are trying to study astrology as

>> taught by the sages;

>>>> If

>>>>>> not I don't have anything to say.

>>>>>>

>>>>>> Love,

>>>>>> Sreenadh

>>>>>>

>>>>>>

>>>>>> , Prafulla

>> Gang <jyotish@>

>>>>>> wrote:

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> Dear Sreenadh ji

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> I have also observed many jyotish stalwarts

>> using navamsa chart

>>>>>> (along with other D charts). Now how to assess

>> D9 charts - can be

>>>>>> perspective. But - as most authors say - just

>> like D1 chart.

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> I request members to share their experience.

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang

>>>>>>> http://www.prafulla.net

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically

>> include the right

>>>> to

>>>>>> be taken seriously. "

>>>>>>>

>> ************************************************

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> sreesog@

>>>>>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 07:56:49 -0000

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart

>> is so important?

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> Dear Krishna ji,

>>>>>>>> ==>

>>>>>>>>> I too to the view that Navamsa

>> chart is

>>>>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart.

>>>>>>>> <==

>>>>>>>> * There is not Navamsa " chart " , but only

>> Navamsa. Navamsa chart

>>>>>> is

>>>>>>>> not as important as Rasi chart and it can

>> never be, because it

>>>> is

>>>>>>>> only an amsa. But yes, it is more important

>> than other amsas due

>>

> === message truncated ===

>

>

>

>

>

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> knows. Answers - Check it out.

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[Guest guest]

Dear Sri Krishnamurthy,

 

This debate is never ending; since astrologers arguing on either side

are strong in their opinions. It is upto the observers to decide

which way to go, as you decided in your message below.

 

But, it does not simply mean that those who do not reply are agreeing

to the others message. I stopped interacting, as I have understood

both sides arguments and made my own observation. Whatever I had to

contribute I said in my two mails. I don't think this is ever going

to end. If you are interested, please refer to the archives in this

group, around a year and half ago; there was similar debate between

Sri Vijaydas Pradeep (against the Navamsa or amsa charts in general)

and Sri PVR Narasimha Rao (in support of the Navamsa or amsa charts

in general). Both are learned, respected astrologers and have their

own merits. This debate is not going to end, as it happened in the

past. It only ends when people are one side are tired of arguing.

 

A healthy debate is one where both the parties present their

opinions, without giving a chance to anticipate credit for something

they propose, or what they understood. WHen the credit is due, it

automatically comes, according to astrology. Since we are all

learners, this approach will bring out good aspects of the debate and

the subject being debated; as we have been observing from the

discussion from Sri Vijaydas Pradeep and Sri Chandrasekhar.

 

I personally think the debate is not going to end, since both of them

are strong in their opinions and I take value in both the views.

 

Best regards,

 

Satya S Kolachina

 

 

, Krishnamurthy Seetharama

<krishna_1998 wrote:

>

> Dear All,

>

> As I was the one who started this thread, I must say that the

> debate reamins inconclusive.

>

> It makes logical sense to say that one should not use aspects,

> conjunctions etc. in D-charts as we are looking only at logical

> positions of planets and not their physical positions like in

> the Rasi chart. But, then why so many learned people who have

> done succesful predictions consider aspects and conjunctions in

> D-charts? Let me forget about all the other D-charts for now and

> let me stick to only Navamsha as that is what we are discussing

> in this thread.

>

> In mind, based on my learning, I felt that Navamsha charts are

> at a different plane as compared to other D-charts and hence it

> is allowed to look at aspects and conjunctions only in Navamsha

> and not in other D-Charts. I wanted to know the reasoning behind

> this special treatment to Navamsha chart and hence raised this

> question.

>

> I started learning Jyotish using Shri. B V Raman's books. He

> uses Navamsa Chart like Rasi Chart for all practical purposes.

> He has been considered as one of the pioneers in modern day

> Astrology.

>

> I tend to agree with Prafulla. After all, why do we study this

> science? The answer for me is that it shows the light and guides

> me in my life. Hence, preditive part of the science is as of

> paramount importance. I guess the only way to resolve this

> deadlock is to take a bunch of charts (with reasonably accurate

> birth data) and study them with and without using aspects and

> conjunctions in Navamsha and explain the major events in life.

>

> I see no other way to end this debate.

>

> Regards,

> Krishna

>

>

> --- Prafulla Gang <jyotish wrote:

>

> > Dear Sreenadh ji

> >

> > Well - who knows the truth? - Should the person making

> > comment, be construed to be as truth seeker - until they prove

> > with the application of the principles on the charts ( both

> > ways - firstly the wrong application of others; and secondly

> > how to read in correct way). Theorists without predictive

> > support - has little relevance in jyotish. But yes - if you

> > can justify your statements by case studies - then at least, I

> > will hear with open mind.

> >

> > Understandably, I have been quoted to be " blind " to

> > commentaries - but my submission is that - give me one reason

> > to accept the views of " less read scholars " than to " well read

> > scholars like Late Santhanam / Shri KN Rao / Shri Sanjay rath

> > / many others " . and More so - as I do not " pretend " to know

> > the sanskrit and do not " waste " my time on " shloka business "

> > with my " incomplete knowledge " . So I am happy to be following

> > better quality commentaries - who are expalining with the case

> > studies.

> >

> > Of course - each one makes his choice.

> >

> >

> > regards / Prafulla Gang

> > http://www.prafulla.net

> >

> > " Men who never get carried away should be. "

> > ************************************************

> >

> >

> > >

> > > sreesog

> > > Thu, 05 Jul 2007 07:00:31 -0000

> > >

> > > Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so

> > important?

> > >

> > > Dear Prafulla ji,

> > > * Even if those things are not there in ancient texts every

> > one is

> > > free to make or follow there own choice - yes, there is

> > every chance

> > > that even such new methods might give true results - your

> > argument is

> > > right.

> > > * As far Sanskrit is concerned: Yes, it is your choice -

> > when you

> > > are blind to read and understand Sanskrit your self, and

> > understand

> > > what is there and what not, of course you have to follow

> > someone who

> > > says they see - you are right in that as well.

> > > Love,

> > > Sreenadh

> > >

> > > , Prafulla Gang

> > <jyotish@>

> > > wrote:

> > >>

> > >> Well Sreenadh ji - at times, these issues become choice or

> > > prejudices in our own form of reading model. Had there not

> > been any

> > > substance in interpreting D9 charts - lot many stalwarts

> > must not

> > > have explored it - and I presume - many of them know better

> > > sanskrit / jyotish (rather both) than all of us on the forum

> > > collectively. So if at all - anyone wish to contest the

> > > interpretation - then many of those stalwarts are the people

> > - must

> > > be debated with. On the forum, where not many great sanskrit

> > > scholars / jyotish researchers - the arguments may not have

> > any

> > > relevance.

> > >>

> > >> regards / Prafulla Gang

> > >> http://www.prafulla.net

> > >>

> > >> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the

> > right to

> > > be taken seriously. "

> > >> ************************************************

> > >>

> > >>

> > >>>

> > >>> sreesog@

> > >>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 13:56:36 -0000

> > >>>

> > >>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so

> > important?

> > >>>

> > >>> Dear Prafulla ji,

> > >>> * No ancient text ask us to read Navamsha (not chart)

> > " just like

> > > D1

> > >>> chart " ; nor they provide slokas for the same.

> > >>> * No ancient text provide as the results for " aspects of

> > planets

> > > in

> > >>> Navamasa "

> > >>> * Nor they give us the results to be predicted when

> > planets are

> > >>> placed " x house with reference to navamsa lagna "

> > >>>

> > >>> I hope we are trying to study astrology as taught by the

> > sages;

> > > If

> > >>> not I don't have anything to say.

> > >>>

> > >>> Love,

> > >>> Sreenadh

> > >>>

> > >>>

> > >>> , Prafulla Gang

> > <jyotish@>

> > >>> wrote:

> > >>>>

> > >>>> Dear Sreenadh ji

> > >>>>

> > >>>> I have also observed many jyotish stalwarts using navamsa

> > chart

> > >>> (along with other D charts). Now how to assess D9 charts

> > - can be

> > >>> perspective. But - as most authors say - just like D1

> > chart.

> > >>>>

> > >>>> I request members to share their experience.

> > >>>>

> > >>>> regards / Prafulla Gang

> > >>>> http://www.prafulla.net

> > >>>>

> > >>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the

> > right

> > > to

> > >>> be taken seriously. "

> > >>>> ************************************************

> > >>>>

> > >>>>

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>> sreesog@

> > >>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 07:56:49 -0000

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so

> > important?

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>> Dear Krishna ji,

> > >>>>> ==>

> > >>>>>> I too to the view that Navamsa chart is

> > >>>>>> as important as Rasi chart.

> > >>>>> <==

> > >>>>> * There is not Navamsa " chart " , but only Navamsa.

> > Navamsa chart

> > >>> is

> > >>>>> not as important as Rasi chart and it can never be,

> > because it

> > > is

> > >>>>> only an amsa. But yes, it is more important than other

> > amsas due

> > >>> to

> > >>>>> the prior said reasons.

> > >>>>> ==>

> > >>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines the

> > overall

> > >>>>>> strength of a planet?

> > >>>>> <==

> > >>>>> * Because the quality of earth determines the strength

> > of the

> > >>>>> plant. This is applicable to all amsas as per their

> > importance.

> > >>>>> ==>

> > >>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa

> > chart like

> > >>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart?

> > >>>>> <==

> > >>>>> * No, it is not allowed to consider aspects in

> > Navamsa. (There

> > >>> is

> > >>>>> no navamsa 'chart'.)

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>> ==>

> > >>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be

> > treated as

> > > if

> > >>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart?

> > >>>>> <==

> > >>>>> * No, when planets have sambandha in Navamsa, it only

> > means

> > > that.

> > >>>>> When they have sombandha in Rasi, it only means that. It

> > is

> > > wrong

> > >>> to

> > >>>>> mix the two.

> > >>>>> ==>

> > >>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart as

> > well?

> > >>>>> <==

> > >>>>> * No, Yogas should not be looked in Navamsa 'chart'.

> > But yes

> > >>> yoga in

> > >>>>> Navamsa (not navamsa 'chart') can be taken yoga. Because

> > it

> === message truncated ===

>

>

>

>

>

____________________

______________

> Get the toolbar and be alerted to new email wherever you're

surfing.

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[Guest guest]

I would also like to add the following:

 

Mere theory discussion is not going to take us anywhere. My

observation on practical charts urges me to value both sides of the

arguments.

 

Satya S Kolachina

 

, " Satya Sai Kolachina "

<skolachi wrote:

>

> Dear Sri Krishnamurthy,

>

> This debate is never ending; since astrologers arguing on either

side

> are strong in their opinions. It is upto the observers to decide

> which way to go, as you decided in your message below.

>

> But, it does not simply mean that those who do not reply are

agreeing

> to the others message. I stopped interacting, as I have understood

> both sides arguments and made my own observation. Whatever I had to

> contribute I said in my two mails. I don't think this is ever going

> to end. If you are interested, please refer to the archives in this

> group, around a year and half ago; there was similar debate between

> Sri Vijaydas Pradeep (against the Navamsa or amsa charts in

general)

> and Sri PVR Narasimha Rao (in support of the Navamsa or amsa charts

> in general). Both are learned, respected astrologers and have their

> own merits. This debate is not going to end, as it happened in the

> past. It only ends when people are one side are tired of arguing.

>

> A healthy debate is one where both the parties present their

> opinions, without giving a chance to anticipate credit for

something

> they propose, or what they understood. WHen the credit is due, it

> automatically comes, according to astrology. Since we are all

> learners, this approach will bring out good aspects of the debate

and

> the subject being debated; as we have been observing from the

> discussion from Sri Vijaydas Pradeep and Sri Chandrasekhar.

>

> I personally think the debate is not going to end, since both of

them

> are strong in their opinions and I take value in both the views.

>

> Best regards,

>

> Satya S Kolachina

>

>

> , Krishnamurthy Seetharama

> <krishna_1998@> wrote:

> >

> > Dear All,

> >

> > As I was the one who started this thread, I must say that the

> > debate reamins inconclusive.

> >

> > It makes logical sense to say that one should not use aspects,

> > conjunctions etc. in D-charts as we are looking only at logical

> > positions of planets and not their physical positions like in

> > the Rasi chart. But, then why so many learned people who have

> > done succesful predictions consider aspects and conjunctions in

> > D-charts? Let me forget about all the other D-charts for now and

> > let me stick to only Navamsha as that is what we are discussing

> > in this thread.

> >

> > In mind, based on my learning, I felt that Navamsha charts are

> > at a different plane as compared to other D-charts and hence it

> > is allowed to look at aspects and conjunctions only in Navamsha

> > and not in other D-Charts. I wanted to know the reasoning behind

> > this special treatment to Navamsha chart and hence raised this

> > question.

> >

> > I started learning Jyotish using Shri. B V Raman's books. He

> > uses Navamsa Chart like Rasi Chart for all practical purposes.

> > He has been considered as one of the pioneers in modern day

> > Astrology.

> >

> > I tend to agree with Prafulla. After all, why do we study this

> > science? The answer for me is that it shows the light and guides

> > me in my life. Hence, preditive part of the science is as of

> > paramount importance. I guess the only way to resolve this

> > deadlock is to take a bunch of charts (with reasonably accurate

> > birth data) and study them with and without using aspects and

> > conjunctions in Navamsha and explain the major events in life.

> >

> > I see no other way to end this debate.

> >

> > Regards,

> > Krishna

> >

> >

> > --- Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> wrote:

> >

> > > Dear Sreenadh ji

> > >

> > > Well - who knows the truth? - Should the person making

> > > comment, be construed to be as truth seeker - until they prove

> > > with the application of the principles on the charts ( both

> > > ways - firstly the wrong application of others; and secondly

> > > how to read in correct way). Theorists without predictive

> > > support - has little relevance in jyotish. But yes - if you

> > > can justify your statements by case studies - then at least, I

> > > will hear with open mind.

> > >

> > > Understandably, I have been quoted to be " blind " to

> > > commentaries - but my submission is that - give me one reason

> > > to accept the views of " less read scholars " than to " well read

> > > scholars like Late Santhanam / Shri KN Rao / Shri Sanjay rath

> > > / many others " . and More so - as I do not " pretend " to know

> > > the sanskrit and do not " waste " my time on " shloka business "

> > > with my " incomplete knowledge " . So I am happy to be following

> > > better quality commentaries - who are expalining with the case

> > > studies.

> > >

> > > Of course - each one makes his choice.

> > >

> > >

> > > regards / Prafulla Gang

> > > http://www.prafulla.net

> > >

> > > " Men who never get carried away should be. "

> > > ************************************************

> > >

> > >

> > > >

> > > > sreesog@

> > > > Thu, 05 Jul 2007 07:00:31 -0000

> > > >

> > > > Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so

> > > important?

> > > >

> > > > Dear Prafulla ji,

> > > > * Even if those things are not there in ancient texts every

> > > one is

> > > > free to make or follow there own choice - yes, there is

> > > every chance

> > > > that even such new methods might give true results - your

> > > argument is

> > > > right.

> > > > * As far Sanskrit is concerned: Yes, it is your choice -

> > > when you

> > > > are blind to read and understand Sanskrit your self, and

> > > understand

> > > > what is there and what not, of course you have to follow

> > > someone who

> > > > says they see - you are right in that as well.

> > > > Love,

> > > > Sreenadh

> > > >

> > > > , Prafulla Gang

> > > <jyotish@>

> > > > wrote:

> > > >>

> > > >> Well Sreenadh ji - at times, these issues become choice or

> > > > prejudices in our own form of reading model. Had there not

> > > been any

> > > > substance in interpreting D9 charts - lot many stalwarts

> > > must not

> > > > have explored it - and I presume - many of them know better

> > > > sanskrit / jyotish (rather both) than all of us on the forum

> > > > collectively. So if at all - anyone wish to contest the

> > > > interpretation - then many of those stalwarts are the people

> > > - must

> > > > be debated with. On the forum, where not many great sanskrit

> > > > scholars / jyotish researchers - the arguments may not have

> > > any

> > > > relevance.

> > > >>

> > > >> regards / Prafulla Gang

> > > >> http://www.prafulla.net

> > > >>

> > > >> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the

> > > right to

> > > > be taken seriously. "

> > > >> ************************************************

> > > >>

> > > >>

> > > >>>

> > > >>> sreesog@

> > > >>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 13:56:36 -0000

> > > >>>

> > > >>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so

> > > important?

> > > >>>

> > > >>> Dear Prafulla ji,

> > > >>> * No ancient text ask us to read Navamsha (not chart)

> > > " just like

> > > > D1

> > > >>> chart " ; nor they provide slokas for the same.

> > > >>> * No ancient text provide as the results for " aspects of

> > > planets

> > > > in

> > > >>> Navamasa "

> > > >>> * Nor they give us the results to be predicted when

> > > planets are

> > > >>> placed " x house with reference to navamsa lagna "

> > > >>>

> > > >>> I hope we are trying to study astrology as taught by the

> > > sages;

> > > > If

> > > >>> not I don't have anything to say.

> > > >>>

> > > >>> Love,

> > > >>> Sreenadh

> > > >>>

> > > >>>

> > > >>> , Prafulla Gang

> > > <jyotish@>

> > > >>> wrote:

> > > >>>>

> > > >>>> Dear Sreenadh ji

> > > >>>>

> > > >>>> I have also observed many jyotish stalwarts using navamsa

> > > chart

> > > >>> (along with other D charts). Now how to assess D9 charts

> > > - can be

> > > >>> perspective. But - as most authors say - just like D1

> > > chart.

> > > >>>>

> > > >>>> I request members to share their experience.

> > > >>>>

> > > >>>> regards / Prafulla Gang

> > > >>>> http://www.prafulla.net

> > > >>>>

> > > >>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the

> > > right

> > > > to

> > > >>> be taken seriously. "

> > > >>>> ************************************************

> > > >>>>

> > > >>>>

> > > >>>>>

> > > >>>>> sreesog@

> > > >>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 07:56:49 -0000

> > > >>>>>

> > > >>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so

> > > important?

> > > >>>>>

> > > >>>>> Dear Krishna ji,

> > > >>>>> ==>

> > > >>>>>> I too to the view that Navamsa chart is

> > > >>>>>> as important as Rasi chart.

> > > >>>>> <==

> > > >>>>> * There is not Navamsa " chart " , but only Navamsa.

> > > Navamsa chart

> > > >>> is

> > > >>>>> not as important as Rasi chart and it can never be,

> > > because it

> > > > is

> > > >>>>> only an amsa. But yes, it is more important than other

> > > amsas due

> > > >>> to

> > > >>>>> the prior said reasons.

> > > >>>>> ==>

> > > >>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines the

> > > overall

> > > >>>>>> strength of a planet?

> > > >>>>> <==

> > > >>>>> * Because the quality of earth determines the strength

> > > of the

> > > >>>>> plant. This is applicable to all amsas as per their

> > > importance.

> > > >>>>> ==>

> > > >>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa

> > > chart like

> > > >>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart?

> > > >>>>> <==

> > > >>>>> * No, it is not allowed to consider aspects in

> > > Navamsa. (There

> > > >>> is

> > > >>>>> no navamsa 'chart'.)

> > > >>>>>

> > > >>>>> ==>

> > > >>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be

> > > treated as

> > > > if

> > > >>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart?

> > > >>>>> <==

> > > >>>>> * No, when planets have sambandha in Navamsa, it only

> > > means

> > > > that.

> > > >>>>> When they have sombandha in Rasi, it only means that. It

> > > is

> > > > wrong

> > > >>> to

> > > >>>>> mix the two.

> > > >>>>> ==>

> > > >>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart as

> > > well?

> > > >>>>> <==

> > > >>>>> * No, Yogas should not be looked in Navamsa 'chart'.

> > > But yes

> > > >>> yoga in

> > > >>>>> Navamsa (not navamsa 'chart') can be taken yoga. Because

> > > it

> > === message truncated ===

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

>

____________________

> ______________

> > Get the toolbar and be alerted to new email wherever

you're

> surfing.

> > http://new.toolbar./toolbar/features/mail/index.php

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Dear Prafulla ji

 

K.N.Raoji is a learned scholar.I can debate with him only if he feels

so.

Thus during our personal mails,i have mentioned my views and Raoji is

aware of it.In Jyotish group you can see the views of Raoji,during my

discussion with shri Rao.

 

But in his writings and books he has used aspects and houses.Late

Santhanam says as per Parasharas definition one cannot use

aspects.Learned scholar D.V.Subburao says bhavas and aspects should

not be used.

K.N.Raoji says karakamsha has to be seen from Rashi.Shri Sanjay Rath

says amshaka has to be seen from rashi.

 

So you see apart from late Subburao all scholars are agreeing on some

while disagreeing on other.Late Subburao Telugu scholar,is very clear

with fundamentals.

 

But when we see ancient commentaries in local language,they all have

one view.They were trained in Gurukula.They never talk of these

charts or aspects thereof.They take them as amsha.

 

Thus it is upto us to decide if there was an errror in understanding

basics.What is a Varga?.

 

Whenever in doubt go back to root basics.We will then see it s clear

as the ancient sages used to do.

 

I prefer not to take side with anyone.I prefer to understanthe

basics.Without learning abcd,how will i learn english.Thus i am still

learning my basics.

 

You may choose the path you like.

 

Thanks

Pradeep

Pradeep

 

 

 

 

, Prafulla Gang <jyotish

wrote:

>

> Dear Pradeep,

>

> Let us approach the navamsa interpretation from different

perspective.

>

> I observed from your mails that - you had opoortunity to interact

with Shri KN Rao.

> Now my request is to share your experiences with Shri KN Rao on the

followings:

>

> a. how does he read D charts?

>

> b. If he has agreed to your arguments of referring amsha

>

> c. does he give prime importance to Navamsa Chart?

>

> d. how does he use transits in Navamsa?

>

> It will really be enlightening experience for us to hear his views.

>

>

> regards / Prafulla Gang

> http://www.prafulla.net

>

> " Men who never get carried away should be. "

> ************************************************

>

>

> >

> > vijayadas_pradeep

> > Thu, 05 Jul 2007 07:56:51 -0000

> >

> > Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important?

> >

> > Dear Prafulla ji

> >

> > Regarding Sanskrit -

> >

> > I was quoting scholars(translating shlokas in local language)who

> > lived almost 800 years back,and trained in Parampara.If their

> > understanding of amshas is wrong then who is right?Moreover

> > Thalakkulahu Bhattathiri(Dashadhyayi) quotes sanskrit verses from

> > giants like Vishnusharama,Graga etc.

> >

> > You can ask any of these contemporary scholars - what can be the

> > meaning of ''meshadi rashige swamshe''.You should also think why

shri

> > Rath felt that amshaka is a relationship onto a Rashi.He would had

> > definitely studied numerous texts /commentaries from

which ,arrived

> > at such a conclusion.By reading just a few books(but authentic

> > ones) ,if a non scholar like me can understand those...it is not

at

> > all a surprise that a scholar like shri Rath will understand.But

he

> > thought amshaka and amsha are different.Regarding amshaka he is

> > that.If regarding amsha too he can agree ,issue is solved.Whether

he

> > agrees or not -others can check BPHS and read ''Vrishamsha''Ka''

> > gathe and Tulamshe.

> >

> > Thus please don't assume,some irresponsible individuals are

> > blabbering something without understanding sanskrit.

> >

> > If you may kindly note,for interpreting Jyotish shlokas,sanskrit

> > knowledge alone is no sufficient.Understanding fundamentals of

> > Jyotish too is a must.The translators tied to translate shlokas

with

> > navamsha as a chart in mind.Sage never said so.So they could only

> > translate within this realm and nobody could reach a common

> > conclusion.It is not at all a fault of Jyotish or the sages who

wrote

> > them.

> >

> > Kind Regds

> > Pradeep

> > , Prafulla Gang <jyotish@>

> > wrote:

> >>

> >> Well Sreenadh ji - at times, these issues become choice or

> > prejudices in our own form of reading model. Had there not been

any

> > substance in interpreting D9 charts - lot many stalwarts must not

> > have explored it - and I presume - many of them know better

> > sanskrit / jyotish (rather both) than all of us on the forum

> > collectively. So if at all - anyone wish to contest the

> > interpretation - then many of those stalwarts are the people -

must

> > be debated with. On the forum, where not many great sanskrit

> > scholars / jyotish researchers - the arguments may not have any

> > relevance.

> >>

> >> regards / Prafulla Gang

> >> http://www.prafulla.net

> >>

> >> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the right

to

> > be taken seriously. "

> >> ************************************************

> >>

> >>

> >>>

> >>> sreesog@

> >>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 13:56:36 -0000

> >>>

> >>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important?

> >>>

> >>> Dear Prafulla ji,

> >>> * No ancient text ask us to read Navamsha (not chart) " just

like

> > D1

> >>> chart " ; nor they provide slokas for the same.

> >>> * No ancient text provide as the results for " aspects of

planets

> > in

> >>> Navamasa "

> >>> * Nor they give us the results to be predicted when planets are

> >>> placed " x house with reference to navamsa lagna "

> >>>

> >>> I hope we are trying to study astrology as taught by the sages;

> > If

> >>> not I don't have anything to say.

> >>>

> >>> Love,

> >>> Sreenadh

> >>>

> >>>

> >>> , Prafulla Gang <jyotish@>

> >>> wrote:

> >>>>

> >>>> Dear Sreenadh ji

> >>>>

> >>>> I have also observed many jyotish stalwarts using navamsa chart

> >>> (along with other D charts). Now how to assess D9 charts - can

be

> >>> perspective. But - as most authors say - just like D1 chart.

> >>>>

> >>>> I request members to share their experience.

> >>>>

> >>>> regards / Prafulla Gang

> >>>> http://www.prafulla.net

> >>>>

> >>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the right

> > to

> >>> be taken seriously. "

> >>>> ************************************************

> >>>>

> >>>>

> >>>>>

> >>>>> sreesog@

> >>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 07:56:49 -0000

> >>>>>

> >>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important?

> >>>>>

> >>>>> Dear Krishna ji,

> >>>>> ==>

> >>>>>> I too to the view that Navamsa chart is

> >>>>>> as important as Rasi chart.

> >>>>> <==

> >>>>> * There is not Navamsa " chart " , but only Navamsa. Navamsa

chart

> >>> is

> >>>>> not as important as Rasi chart and it can never be, because it

> > is

> >>>>> only an amsa. But yes, it is more important than other amsas

due

> >>> to

> >>>>> the prior said reasons.

> >>>>> ==>

> >>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines the overall

> >>>>>> strength of a planet?

> >>>>> <==

> >>>>> * Because the quality of earth determines the strength of

the

> >>>>> plant. This is applicable to all amsas as per their

importance.

> >>>>> ==>

> >>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa chart like

> >>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart?

> >>>>> <==

> >>>>> * No, it is not allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa.

(There

> >>> is

> >>>>> no navamsa 'chart'.)

> >>>>>

> >>>>> ==>

> >>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be treated as

> > if

> >>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart?

> >>>>> <==

> >>>>> * No, when planets have sambandha in Navamsa, it only means

> > that.

> >>>>> When they have sombandha in Rasi, it only means that. It is

> > wrong

> >>> to

> >>>>> mix the two.

> >>>>> ==>

> >>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart as well?

> >>>>> <==

> >>>>> * No, Yogas should not be looked in Navamsa 'chart'. But yes

> >>> yoga in

> >>>>> Navamsa (not navamsa 'chart') can be taken yoga. Because it is

> > the

> >>>>> same principles as used in Rasi that are used to predict the

> >>> result

> >>>>> in Amsas as well - But Aspect(Drishti) and houses are not

> >>> applicable

> >>>>> to amsas. Both Aspect(Drishti) and Houses should be considered

> > in

> >>>>> Rasi chart itself. Any reference in ancient texts about aspect

> > or

> >>>>> houses essentially mean that they are referring to Rasi chart.

> >>>>> Love,

> >>>>> Sreenadh

> >>>>>

> >>>>> , Krishnamurthy Seetharama

> >>>>> <krishna_1998@> wrote:

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>> Dear Kolachina ji,

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>> It was interesting to read your comments on importance of the

> >>>>>> Navamsa chart. I too to the view that Navamsa chart

> > is

> >>>>>> as important as Rasi chart. This is based on my experience so

> >>>>>> far reading charts. However, I have still not understood what

> >>>>>> are the fundamental reasons for a varga chart being so

> >>>>>> important.

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines the overall

> >>>>>> strength of a planet?

> >>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa chart like

> >>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart?

> >>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be treated as

> > if

> >>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart?

> >>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart as well?

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>> By looking at the kind of importance given to Navamsa chart,

it

> >>>>>> appears that the Rasi chart and Navamsa chart make up two

equal

> >>>>>> halves representing the native.

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>> I have no doubts about the importance of Navamsa Chart. What

I

> >>>>>> would like to know is why Navamsa gains such an importance?

> > What

> >>>>>> are the fundamental reasons? After all it is one of many

varga

> >>>>>> charts!

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>> Regards,

> >>>>>> Krishna

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>> --- Satya Sai Kolachina <skolachi@> wrote:

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>>> Dear Sri Pradeep and Sri Chandrasekhar,

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>> I have been following this thread on karakamsa and both of

> >>>>>>> your

> >>>>>>> contributions.

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>> I whole-heartedly appreciate both of you for your valuable

> >>>>>>> inputs

> >>>>>>> you are providing to the astrological community. I would

like

> >>>>>>> to

> >>>>>>> share my opinion (through my own experience).

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>> Considering Karakamsa from either Rasi or Navamsa chart

alone

> >>>>>>> most

> >>>>>>> probably leads to erroneous results, as I found both the

> >>>>>>> approaches

> >>>>>>> working. I see the point Pradeep is making as very valuable;

> >>>>>>> at the

> >>>>>>> same time I am not against using Navamsa chart as separate

> >>>>>>> chart (of

> >>>>>>> course without losing the context of the Rasi chart), since

> >>>>>>> any of

> >>>>>>> the varga charts will not give independent results if the

Rasi

> >>>>>>> chart

> >>>>>>> is ignored, as they themselves do not exist if the Rasi

chart

> >>>>>>> doesn't exist. In fact Sri KN Rao also mentioned in several

> >>>>>>> occassions in many of his articles and books that yogas

viewed

> >>>>>>> in

> >>>>>>> the Rasi chart should also exist in the Navamsa chart for

> >>>>>>> confirming

> >>>>>>> the results. If we do not see the Navamsa chart as a

separate

> >>>>>>> chart,

> >>>>>>> how can we see the yogas therein? For the purpose of

checking

> >>>>>>> some

> >>>>>>> yogas, Yuti and Veekshana (conjunction and aspects) in the

> >>>>>>> navamsa

> >>>>>>> chart make sense. This kind of yuti or veekshana should be

> >>>>>>> considered on a hypothetical level (as mutual influence at

the

> >>>>>>> amsha level) rather than being within a 30 deg. span. of

Rasi.

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>> Take an example. If a planet is exlated or in own house in

the

> >>>>>>> rasi

> >>>>>>> chart and attains debilitation in the Navamsa chart, it is

> >>>>>>> condiered

> >>>>>>> as weakening of the actual strength shown in the Rasi. Why

is

> >>>>>>> this

> >>>>>>> considered so? It is considered like that because, even

though

> >>>>>>> the

> >>>>>>> planet is within its own or exlated rasi, still its

> >>>>>>> positioning

> >>>>>>> within that particular sector (here navamsa) has weakened

it;

> >>>>>>> means,

> >>>>>>> within its own rasi, this particular sector is the weakest

> >>>>>>> point for

> >>>>>>> the planet within the strongest rasi; hence it loses its

> >>>>>>> strength

> >>>>>>> considerably. This means there is a gradation of strengths

for

> >>>>>>> the

> >>>>>>> planet from first navamsa to the last navamsa. The navamsa

> >>>>>>> position

> >>>>>>> of a planet, thus indicates its refined placement within the

> >>>>>>> rasi.

> >>>>>>> In fact, Sri KN Rao also gives equal weightage to both the

> >>>>>>> Rasi and

> >>>>>>> Navamsa placement of a planet. If a planet is weak in one of

> >>>>>>> them

> >>>>>>> that means half the weightage is lost. We may not give the

> >>>>>>> same

> >>>>>>> level of treatment to other vargas as we give to Navamsa;

but

> >>>>>>> Navamsa is as important as the Rasi; to the extent that it

can

> >>>>>>> be

> >>>>>>> viewed as an independent chart (to confirm the promise given

> >>>>>>> by the

> >>>>>>> rasi chart).

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>> Without a confirmation of Navamsa chart, yogas in the rasi

> >>>>>>> chart

> >>>>>>> alone cannot and will not give expected results; I have

> >>>>>>> observed

> >>>>>>> this phenomenon in several charts.

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>> My own experience is; I have Chandra and Sukra both in the

> >>>>>>> 12th

> >>>>>>> house from Karakamsa in the Navamsa chart (not in the rasi

> >>>>>>> chart

> >>>>>>> with the rasi of karakamsa considering as the karakamsa

> >>>>>>> lagna). I am

> >>>>>>> a deep devotee of Goddess Parvathi (represented by Chandra)

> >>>>>>> and

> >>>>>>> Goddess Lakshmi (represented by Sukra). If the karakamsa is

> >>>>>>> brought

> >>>>>>> to the Rasi chart, this cannot be explained. The sequence of

> >>>>>>> my life

> >>>>>>> events are better explained only if I consider karakamsa

lagna

> >>>>>>> in

> >>>>>>> the navamsa chart; I am not discounting Pradeep's opinion

> >>>>>>> here; I am

> >>>>>>> just saying that both approaches need to be considered on

the

> >>>>>>> chart,

> >>>>>>> and a composite opinion be formed, as Sri KN Rao always

says.

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>> On the other hand, considering the specific rasi in the Rasi

> >>>>>>> chart

> >>>>>>> that holds karakamsa as the karakamsa lagna, my Sukra is in

> >>>>>>> the 4th

> >>>>>>> house indicating my possession of a nice beautiful house,

and

> >>>>>>> education/skills in arts (in addition to other traditional

> >>>>>>> education).

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>> I am bringing this to both your knowledge only to summarize

> >>>>>>> that

> >>>>>>> both your theories give results; but not necessarily in

> >>>>>>> isolation of

> >>>>>>> the other.

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>> Thanks for all your contribution.

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>> Best regards,

> >>>>>>> Satya S Kolachina

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>> , Chandrashekhar

> >>>>>>> <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> >>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>> Dear Pradeep,

> >>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>> I can not comment on views of either Sanjay or K. N. Rao.

> >>>>>>> First

> >>>>>>> there is

> >>>>>>>> no difference in the meaning of Amsha and Amshaka though it

> >>>>>>> is

> >>>>>>> perhaps

> >>>>>>>> being confused. It also needs to be remembered that in

> >>>>>>> astrological

> >>>>>>>> translations many a times words are to be understood in the

> >>>>>>> context that

> >>>>>>>> they used. So we find Parashara mentioning karakamsha and

> >>>>>>> Swamsha

> >>>>>>> in

> >>>>>>>> alternate lines (almost) while indicating the results of

> >>>>>>> occupation of

> >>>>>>>> Karakamsha by Sun etc. and many other places in karakamsha

> >>>>>>> adhyaaya.

> >>>>>>>> This does not mean he is speaking about two different

> >>>>>>> parameters.

> >>>>>>> I

> >>>>>>>> think if any Sanskrit scholar who is also well versed in

> >>>>>>> interpretation

> >>>>>>>> of astrological texts will confirm this contention of mine

> >>>>>>> if he

> >>>>>>> is

> >>>>>>>> watching this discussion.

> >>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>> If you want my personal opinion, I think that the results

> >>>>>>> indicated on

> >>>>>>>> the basis of Karakamsha without reference to the potential

> >>>>>>> promised by

> >>>>>>>> the rasi chart and the strength derived by the grahas in

> >>>>>>> rasi

> >>>>>>> chart,

> >>>>>>>> through the Navamsha chart, are not likely to materialize.

I

> >>>>>>> hope

> >>>>>>> this

> >>>>>>>> opinion of mine does not create a big storm in the

> >>>>>>> discussion on

> >>>>>>> the

> >>>>>>>> list. But this is my personal opinion, for whatever it is

> >>>>>>> worth.

> >>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>> Take care,

> >>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar.

> >>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>> vijayadas_pradeep wrote:

> >>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>> Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Respected members

> >>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>> Shri Sanjay Rath clearly says ,Amshaka is pointing to the

> >>>>>>> Rashi

> >>>>>>> in

> >>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha.He also says,Karakamsha has

> >>>>>>> one

> >>>>>>>>> meaning ,while Karakamsha KA has another meaning.

> >>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar jis view is Amshaka is not pointing to the

> >>>>>>> Rashi

> >>>>>>> in

> >>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha.

> >>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>> Now Chandraekhar jis view is prudent as there are some

> >>>>>>> shlokas

> >>>>>>> which

> >>>>>>>>> shri Rath somehow has overlooked,contradicting his view

> >>>>>>> point.

> >>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>> I respect shri Rath ,but i have to tell this.Sometimes the

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>> answer and

> >>>>>>>>> explanations given by shri Rath are not preceded by proper

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>> === message truncated ===

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>

> >>>

> >

____________________

> >>>>> ______________

> >>>>>> Be a PS3 game guru.

> >>>>>> Get your game face on with the latest PS3 news and previews

at

> >>>>> Games.

> >>>>>> http://videogames./platform?platform=120121

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>

> >>>>>

> >>>>>

> >>>>>

> >>>>>

> >>>>>

[Guest guest]

Dear Pradeep ji

 

My reference to term " debate " was from acadameic discussion

perspective.

 

<vijayadas_pradeep wrote:

>

>

> K.N.Raoji is a learned scholar.I can debate with him only if he

feels

> so.

 

[Prafulla] I respect your sentiments and word of respect for such

great astrologers.

 

> Thus during our personal mails,i have mentioned my views and Raoji

is

> aware of it.In Jyotish group you can see the views of Raoji,during

my

> discussion with shri Rao.

>

> But in his writings and books he has used aspects and houses.

 

[Prafulla] Yes, he has used it categorically. My presumptions are

that - he might have access to many hidden technique, where its use

is elaborated, which perhaps - he may not like to reveal. But going

by case studies, he has applied that consistently and proved the

predictive success.

 

>Late

> Santhanam says as per Parasharas definition one cannot use

> aspects.

 

[Prafulla] Well, late Santhanam ji have applied aspects in D charts

and have considered D charts as indentepent chart - in many of his

articles (you may refer it in TOA old issues and also in his english

translation of Deva Keralam). If he has erred in the basic

interpretation, and have acknowledged in private conversation with

you / any other scholar - then it is different issue. In one of the

personal interaction in 1994 - he did mention the mutual opposition

of Jupiter / venus in D9 as good for married life - in one of the

case study. I am not familiar, if he changed his opinion thereafter.

 

>Learned scholar D.V.Subburao says bhavas and aspects should

> not be used.

 

[Prafulla] I never got opportunity to read him, so I am unable to

comment. But I presume, he might have some rationale of - not to

apply, if he has stated so.

 

> K.N.Raoji says karakamsha has to be seen from Rashi.Shri Sanjay

Rath

> says amshaka has to be seen from rashi.

 

[Prafulla] I am not disputing / debating on interpretation of

karkamsha. My argument / understanding on this thread is only around

use of D charts and aspects therein. Shri Sanjay rath ji also

consider D chart and aspects therein. I look forward to read your /

his thread, if he chooses to discuss this upon your invitation.

 

>

> So you see apart from late Subburao all scholars are agreeing on

some

> while disagreeing on other.Late Subburao Telugu scholar,is very

clear

> with fundamentals.

>

> But when we see ancient commentaries in local language,they all

have

> one view.They were trained in Gurukula.They never talk of these

> charts or aspects thereof.They take them as amsha.

>

 

[Prafulla] I referred notes from satyacharya - where he used them

categorically in dasha interpretation. I can quote many references

from there - on mutual angular positions in navamsa chakra.

 

> Thus it is upto us to decide if there was an errror in

understanding

> basics.What is a Varga?.

>

 

[Prafulla] very well said. There is never late, if we may arrive at

conclusive stage of any interpretation.

 

> Whenever in doubt go back to root basics.We will then see it s

clear

> as the ancient sages used to do.

>

 

[Prafulla] Yes. I agree. and i look forward to case studies,

whenever you find time and decide to pen in.

 

> I prefer not to take side with anyone.I prefer to understanthe

> basics.Without learning abcd,how will i learn english.Thus i am

still

> learning my basics.

>

 

[Prafulla] Well, we all are on one side - i.e. reaching at

predictive application of jyotish. As I explained, my limitation of

Sanskrit, and dependence upon the approach of seeing its application

in sample charts.

 

> You may choose the path you like.

>

{Prafulla} of course, we all have to make various decisions /

selections from time to time. But as you nicely pointed out in the

story of pencil - we all must be flexible to erase the wrong one,

and write the correct one.

 

 

regards / Prafulla

 

>

>

> , Prafulla Gang <jyotish@>

> wrote:

> >

> > Dear Pradeep,

> >

> > Let us approach the navamsa interpretation from different

> perspective.

> >

> > I observed from your mails that - you had opoortunity to

interact

> with Shri KN Rao.

> > Now my request is to share your experiences with Shri KN Rao on

the

> followings:

> >

> > a. how does he read D charts?

> >

> > b. If he has agreed to your arguments of referring amsha

> >

> > c. does he give prime importance to Navamsa Chart?

> >

> > d. how does he use transits in Navamsa?

> >

> > It will really be enlightening experience for us to hear his

views.

> >

> >

> > regards / Prafulla Gang

> > http://www.prafulla.net

> >

> > " Men who never get carried away should be. "

> > ************************************************

> >

> >

> > >

> > > vijayadas_pradeep@

> > > Thu, 05 Jul 2007 07:56:51 -0000

> > >

> > > Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important?

> > >

> > > Dear Prafulla ji

> > >

> > > Regarding Sanskrit -

> > >

> > > I was quoting scholars(translating shlokas in local language)

who

> > > lived almost 800 years back,and trained in Parampara.If their

> > > understanding of amshas is wrong then who is right?Moreover

> > > Thalakkulahu Bhattathiri(Dashadhyayi) quotes sanskrit verses

from

> > > giants like Vishnusharama,Graga etc.

> > >

> > > You can ask any of these contemporary scholars - what can be

the

> > > meaning of ''meshadi rashige swamshe''.You should also think

why

> shri

> > > Rath felt that amshaka is a relationship onto a Rashi.He would

had

> > > definitely studied numerous texts /commentaries from

> which ,arrived

> > > at such a conclusion.By reading just a few books(but authentic

> > > ones) ,if a non scholar like me can understand those...it is

not

> at

> > > all a surprise that a scholar like shri Rath will

understand.But

> he

> > > thought amshaka and amsha are different.Regarding amshaka he is

> > > that.If regarding amsha too he can agree ,issue is

solved.Whether

> he

> > > agrees or not -others can check BPHS and

read ''Vrishamsha''Ka''

> > > gathe and Tulamshe.

> > >

> > > Thus please don't assume,some irresponsible individuals are

> > > blabbering something without understanding sanskrit.

> > >

> > > If you may kindly note,for interpreting Jyotish

shlokas,sanskrit

> > > knowledge alone is no sufficient.Understanding fundamentals of

> > > Jyotish too is a must.The translators tied to translate

shlokas

> with

> > > navamsha as a chart in mind.Sage never said so.So they could

only

> > > translate within this realm and nobody could reach a common

> > > conclusion.It is not at all a fault of Jyotish or the sages

who

> wrote

> > > them.

> > >

> > > Kind Regds

> > > Pradeep

> > > , Prafulla Gang <jyotish@>

> > > wrote:

> > >>

> > >> Well Sreenadh ji - at times, these issues become choice or

> > > prejudices in our own form of reading model. Had there not

been

> any

> > > substance in interpreting D9 charts - lot many stalwarts must

not

> > > have explored it - and I presume - many of them know better

> > > sanskrit / jyotish (rather both) than all of us on the forum

> > > collectively. So if at all - anyone wish to contest the

> > > interpretation - then many of those stalwarts are the people -

> must

> > > be debated with. On the forum, where not many great sanskrit

> > > scholars / jyotish researchers - the arguments may not have any

> > > relevance.

> > >>

> > >> regards / Prafulla Gang

> > >> http://www.prafulla.net

> > >>

> > >> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the

right

> to

> > > be taken seriously. "

> > >> ************************************************

> > >>

> > >>

> > >>>

> > >>> sreesog@

> > >>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 13:56:36 -0000

> > >>>

> > >>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important?

> > >>>

> > >>> Dear Prafulla ji,

> > >>> * No ancient text ask us to read Navamsha (not chart) " just

> like

> > > D1

> > >>> chart " ; nor they provide slokas for the same.

> > >>> * No ancient text provide as the results for " aspects of

> planets

> > > in

> > >>> Navamasa "

> > >>> * Nor they give us the results to be predicted when planets

are

> > >>> placed " x house with reference to navamsa lagna "

> > >>>

> > >>> I hope we are trying to study astrology as taught by the

sages;

> > > If

> > >>> not I don't have anything to say.

> > >>>

> > >>> Love,

> > >>> Sreenadh

> > >>>

> > >>>

> > >>> , Prafulla Gang <jyotish@>

> > >>> wrote:

> > >>>>

> > >>>> Dear Sreenadh ji

> > >>>>

> > >>>> I have also observed many jyotish stalwarts using navamsa

chart

> > >>> (along with other D charts). Now how to assess D9 charts -

can

> be

> > >>> perspective. But - as most authors say - just like D1 chart.

> > >>>>

> > >>>> I request members to share their experience.

> > >>>>

> > >>>> regards / Prafulla Gang

> > >>>> http://www.prafulla.net

> > >>>>

> > >>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the

right

> > > to

> > >>> be taken seriously. "

> > >>>> ************************************************

> > >>>>

> > >>>>

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>> sreesog@

> > >>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 07:56:49 -0000

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so

important?

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>> Dear Krishna ji,

> > >>>>> ==>

> > >>>>>> I too to the view that Navamsa chart is

> > >>>>>> as important as Rasi chart.

> > >>>>> <==

> > >>>>> * There is not Navamsa " chart " , but only Navamsa. Navamsa

> chart

> > >>> is

> > >>>>> not as important as Rasi chart and it can never be,

because it

> > > is

> > >>>>> only an amsa. But yes, it is more important than other

amsas

> due

> > >>> to

> > >>>>> the prior said reasons.

> > >>>>> ==>

> > >>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines the

overall

> > >>>>>> strength of a planet?

> > >>>>> <==

> > >>>>> * Because the quality of earth determines the strength

of

> the

> > >>>>> plant. This is applicable to all amsas as per their

> importance.

> > >>>>> ==>

> > >>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa chart

like

> > >>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart?

> > >>>>> <==

> > >>>>> * No, it is not allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa.

> (There

> > >>> is

> > >>>>> no navamsa 'chart'.)

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>> ==>

> > >>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be

treated as

> > > if

> > >>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart?

> > >>>>> <==

> > >>>>> * No, when planets have sambandha in Navamsa, it only

means

> > > that.

> > >>>>> When they have sombandha in Rasi, it only means that. It is

> > > wrong

> > >>> to

> > >>>>> mix the two.

> > >>>>> ==>

> > >>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart as well?

> > >>>>> <==

> > >>>>> * No, Yogas should not be looked in Navamsa 'chart'. But

yes

> > >>> yoga in

> > >>>>> Navamsa (not navamsa 'chart') can be taken yoga. Because

it is

> > > the

> > >>>>> same principles as used in Rasi that are used to predict

the

> > >>> result

> > >>>>> in Amsas as well - But Aspect(Drishti) and houses are not

> > >>> applicable

> > >>>>> to amsas. Both Aspect(Drishti) and Houses should be

considered

> > > in

> > >>>>> Rasi chart itself. Any reference in ancient texts about

aspect

> > > or

> > >>>>> houses essentially mean that they are referring to Rasi

chart.

> > >>>>> Love,

> > >>>>> Sreenadh

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>> , Krishnamurthy

Seetharama

> > >>>>> <krishna_1998@> wrote:

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>> Dear Kolachina ji,

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>> It was interesting to read your comments on importance of

the

> > >>>>>> Navamsa chart. I too to the view that Navamsa

chart

> > > is

> > >>>>>> as important as Rasi chart. This is based on my

experience so

> > >>>>>> far reading charts. However, I have still not understood

what

> > >>>>>> are the fundamental reasons for a varga chart being so

> > >>>>>> important.

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines the

overall

> > >>>>>> strength of a planet?

> > >>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa chart

like

> > >>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart?

> > >>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be

treated as

> > > if

> > >>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart?

> > >>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart as well?

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>> By looking at the kind of importance given to Navamsa

chart,

> it

> > >>>>>> appears that the Rasi chart and Navamsa chart make up two

> equal

> > >>>>>> halves representing the native.

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>> I have no doubts about the importance of Navamsa Chart.

What

> I

> > >>>>>> would like to know is why Navamsa gains such an

importance?

> > > What

> > >>>>>> are the fundamental reasons? After all it is one of many

> varga

> > >>>>>> charts!

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>> Regards,

> > >>>>>> Krishna

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>> --- Satya Sai Kolachina <skolachi@> wrote:

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>>> Dear Sri Pradeep and Sri Chandrasekhar,

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>> I have been following this thread on karakamsa and both

of

> > >>>>>>> your

> > >>>>>>> contributions.

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>> I whole-heartedly appreciate both of you for your

valuable

> > >>>>>>> inputs

> > >>>>>>> you are providing to the astrological community. I would

> like

> > >>>>>>> to

> > >>>>>>> share my opinion (through my own experience).

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>> Considering Karakamsa from either Rasi or Navamsa chart

> alone

> > >>>>>>> most

> > >>>>>>> probably leads to erroneous results, as I found both the

> > >>>>>>> approaches

> > >>>>>>> working. I see the point Pradeep is making as very

valuable;

> > >>>>>>> at the

> > >>>>>>> same time I am not against using Navamsa chart as

separate

> > >>>>>>> chart (of

> > >>>>>>> course without losing the context of the Rasi chart),

since

> > >>>>>>> any of

> > >>>>>>> the varga charts will not give independent results if

the

> Rasi

> > >>>>>>> chart

> > >>>>>>> is ignored, as they themselves do not exist if the Rasi

> chart

> > >>>>>>> doesn't exist. In fact Sri KN Rao also mentioned in

several

> > >>>>>>> occassions in many of his articles and books that yogas

> viewed

> > >>>>>>> in

> > >>>>>>> the Rasi chart should also exist in the Navamsa chart for

> > >>>>>>> confirming

> > >>>>>>> the results. If we do not see the Navamsa chart as a

> separate

> > >>>>>>> chart,

> > >>>>>>> how can we see the yogas therein? For the purpose of

> checking

> > >>>>>>> some

> > >>>>>>> yogas, Yuti and Veekshana (conjunction and aspects) in

the

> > >>>>>>> navamsa

> > >>>>>>> chart make sense. This kind of yuti or veekshana should

be

> > >>>>>>> considered on a hypothetical level (as mutual influence

at

> the

> > >>>>>>> amsha level) rather than being within a 30 deg. span. of

> Rasi.

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>> Take an example. If a planet is exlated or in own house

in

> the

> > >>>>>>> rasi

> > >>>>>>> chart and attains debilitation in the Navamsa chart, it

is

> > >>>>>>> condiered

> > >>>>>>> as weakening of the actual strength shown in the Rasi.

Why

> is

> > >>>>>>> this

> > >>>>>>> considered so? It is considered like that because, even

> though

> > >>>>>>> the

> > >>>>>>> planet is within its own or exlated rasi, still its

> > >>>>>>> positioning

> > >>>>>>> within that particular sector (here navamsa) has

weakened

> it;

> > >>>>>>> means,

> > >>>>>>> within its own rasi, this particular sector is the

weakest

> > >>>>>>> point for

> > >>>>>>> the planet within the strongest rasi; hence it loses its

> > >>>>>>> strength

> > >>>>>>> considerably. This means there is a gradation of

strengths

> for

> > >>>>>>> the

> > >>>>>>> planet from first navamsa to the last navamsa. The

navamsa

> > >>>>>>> position

> > >>>>>>> of a planet, thus indicates its refined placement within

the

> > >>>>>>> rasi.

> > >>>>>>> In fact, Sri KN Rao also gives equal weightage to both

the

> > >>>>>>> Rasi and

> > >>>>>>> Navamsa placement of a planet. If a planet is weak in

one of

> > >>>>>>> them

> > >>>>>>> that means half the weightage is lost. We may not give

the

> > >>>>>>> same

> > >>>>>>> level of treatment to other vargas as we give to

Navamsa;

> but

> > >>>>>>> Navamsa is as important as the Rasi; to the extent that

it

> can

> > >>>>>>> be

> > >>>>>>> viewed as an independent chart (to confirm the promise

given

> > >>>>>>> by the

> > >>>>>>> rasi chart).

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>> Without a confirmation of Navamsa chart, yogas in the

rasi

> > >>>>>>> chart

> > >>>>>>> alone cannot and will not give expected results; I have

> > >>>>>>> observed

> > >>>>>>> this phenomenon in several charts.

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>> My own experience is; I have Chandra and Sukra both in

the

> > >>>>>>> 12th

> > >>>>>>> house from Karakamsa in the Navamsa chart (not in the

rasi

> > >>>>>>> chart

> > >>>>>>> with the rasi of karakamsa considering as the karakamsa

> > >>>>>>> lagna). I am

> > >>>>>>> a deep devotee of Goddess Parvathi (represented by

Chandra)

> > >>>>>>> and

> > >>>>>>> Goddess Lakshmi (represented by Sukra). If the karakamsa

is

> > >>>>>>> brought

> > >>>>>>> to the Rasi chart, this cannot be explained. The

sequence of

> > >>>>>>> my life

> > >>>>>>> events are better explained only if I consider karakamsa

> lagna

> > >>>>>>> in

> > >>>>>>> the navamsa chart; I am not discounting Pradeep's opinion

> > >>>>>>> here; I am

> > >>>>>>> just saying that both approaches need to be considered

on

> the

> > >>>>>>> chart,

> > >>>>>>> and a composite opinion be formed, as Sri KN Rao always

> says.

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>> On the other hand, considering the specific rasi in the

Rasi

> > >>>>>>> chart

> > >>>>>>> that holds karakamsa as the karakamsa lagna, my Sukra is

in

> > >>>>>>> the 4th

> > >>>>>>> house indicating my possession of a nice beautiful

house,

> and

> > >>>>>>> education/skills in arts (in addition to other

traditional

> > >>>>>>> education).

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>> I am bringing this to both your knowledge only to

summarize

> > >>>>>>> that

> > >>>>>>> both your theories give results; but not necessarily in

> > >>>>>>> isolation of

> > >>>>>>> the other.

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>> Thanks for all your contribution.

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>> Best regards,

> > >>>>>>> Satya S Kolachina

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>> , Chandrashekhar

> > >>>>>>> <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>> Dear Pradeep,

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>> I can not comment on views of either Sanjay or K. N.

Rao.

> > >>>>>>> First

> > >>>>>>> there is

> > >>>>>>>> no difference in the meaning of Amsha and Amshaka

though it

> > >>>>>>> is

> > >>>>>>> perhaps

> > >>>>>>>> being confused. It also needs to be remembered that in

> > >>>>>>> astrological

> > >>>>>>>> translations many a times words are to be understood in

the

> > >>>>>>> context that

> > >>>>>>>> they used. So we find Parashara mentioning karakamsha

and

> > >>>>>>> Swamsha

> > >>>>>>> in

> > >>>>>>>> alternate lines (almost) while indicating the results of

> > >>>>>>> occupation of

> > >>>>>>>> Karakamsha by Sun etc. and many other places in

karakamsha

> > >>>>>>> adhyaaya.

> > >>>>>>>> This does not mean he is speaking about two different

> > >>>>>>> parameters.

> > >>>>>>> I

> > >>>>>>>> think if any Sanskrit scholar who is also well versed in

> > >>>>>>> interpretation

> > >>>>>>>> of astrological texts will confirm this contention of

mine

> > >>>>>>> if he

> > >>>>>>> is

> > >>>>>>>> watching this discussion.

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>> If you want my personal opinion, I think that the

results

> > >>>>>>> indicated on

> > >>>>>>>> the basis of Karakamsha without reference to the

potential

> > >>>>>>> promised by

> > >>>>>>>> the rasi chart and the strength derived by the grahas in

> > >>>>>>> rasi

> > >>>>>>> chart,

> > >>>>>>>> through the Navamsha chart, are not likely to

materialize.

> I

> > >>>>>>> hope

> > >>>>>>> this

> > >>>>>>>> opinion of mine does not create a big storm in the

> > >>>>>>> discussion on

> > >>>>>>> the

> > >>>>>>>> list. But this is my personal opinion, for whatever it

is

> > >>>>>>> worth.

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>> Take care,

> > >>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar.

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>> vijayadas_pradeep wrote:

> > >>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>> Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Respected members

> > >>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>> Shri Sanjay Rath clearly says ,Amshaka is pointing to

the

> > >>>>>>> Rashi

> > >>>>>>> in

> > >>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha.He also says,Karakamsha

has

> > >>>>>>> one

> > >>>>>>>>> meaning ,while Karakamsha KA has another meaning.

> > >>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar jis view is Amshaka is not pointing to

the

> > >>>>>>> Rashi

> > >>>>>>> in

> > >>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha.

> > >>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>> Now Chandraekhar jis view is prudent as there are some

> > >>>>>>> shlokas

> > >>>>>>> which

> > >>>>>>>>> shri Rath somehow has overlooked,contradicting his view

> > >>>>>>> point.

> > >>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>> I respect shri Rath ,but i have to tell this.Sometimes

the

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>> answer and

> > >>>>>>>>> explanations given by shri Rath are not preceded by

proper

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>> === message truncated ===

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>

> > >>>

> > >

>

___________________

_

> > >>>>> ______________

> > >>>>>> Be a PS3 game guru.

> > >>>>>> Get your game face on with the latest PS3 news and

previews

> at

> > >>>>> Games.

> > >>>>>> http://videogames./platform?platform=120121

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>>

[Guest guest]

Dear Kolachina ji,

 

Yes, I agree with you. It appears that this debate will go on

till both sides get tired. I am pretty clear about the path I

have chosen. It works for me and that is what matters the most.

I give more importance to what the charts indicate than what is

said in the texts (By no way I am disrespecting our sages by

saying this, because it is possible that we have not understood

them correctly). I believe that Truth lies in reality and and

reality lies in the charts. And, I have seen that the relations

of planets in Navamsha play an important role. I don't need more

evidence. When I raised the question, I was not looking for

evidence, I only wanted to understand the reasons behind such a

reality. But, I failed to get the answer.

 

Regards,

Krishna

 

 

--- Satya Sai Kolachina <skolachi wrote:

 

> Dear Sri Krishnamurthy,

>

> This debate is never ending; since astrologers arguing on

> either side

> are strong in their opinions. It is upto the observers to

> decide

> which way to go, as you decided in your message below.

>

> But, it does not simply mean that those who do not reply are

> agreeing

> to the others message. I stopped interacting, as I have

> understood

> both sides arguments and made my own observation. Whatever I

> had to

> contribute I said in my two mails. I don't think this is ever

> going

> to end. If you are interested, please refer to the archives in

> this

> group, around a year and half ago; there was similar debate

> between

> Sri Vijaydas Pradeep (against the Navamsa or amsa charts in

> general)

> and Sri PVR Narasimha Rao (in support of the Navamsa or amsa

> charts

> in general). Both are learned, respected astrologers and have

> their

> own merits. This debate is not going to end, as it happened in

> the

> past. It only ends when people are one side are tired of

> arguing.

>

> A healthy debate is one where both the parties present their

> opinions, without giving a chance to anticipate credit for

> something

> they propose, or what they understood. WHen the credit is due,

> it

> automatically comes, according to astrology. Since we are all

> learners, this approach will bring out good aspects of the

> debate and

> the subject being debated; as we have been observing from the

> discussion from Sri Vijaydas Pradeep and Sri Chandrasekhar.

>

> I personally think the debate is not going to end, since both

> of them

> are strong in their opinions and I take value in both the

> views.

>

> Best regards,

>

> Satya S Kolachina

>

>

> , Krishnamurthy Seetharama

> <krishna_1998 wrote:

> >

> > Dear All,

> >

> > As I was the one who started this thread, I must say that

> the

> > debate reamins inconclusive.

> >

> > It makes logical sense to say that one should not use

> aspects,

> > conjunctions etc. in D-charts as we are looking only at

> logical

> > positions of planets and not their physical positions like

> in

> > the Rasi chart. But, then why so many learned people who

> have

> > done succesful predictions consider aspects and conjunctions

> in

> > D-charts? Let me forget about all the other D-charts for now

> and

> > let me stick to only Navamsha as that is what we are

> discussing

> > in this thread.

> >

> > In mind, based on my learning, I felt that Navamsha charts

> are

> > at a different plane as compared to other D-charts and hence

> it

> > is allowed to look at aspects and conjunctions only in

> Navamsha

> > and not in other D-Charts. I wanted to know the reasoning

> behind

> > this special treatment to Navamsha chart and hence raised

> this

> > question.

> >

> > I started learning Jyotish using Shri. B V Raman's books. He

> > uses Navamsa Chart like Rasi Chart for all practical

> purposes.

> > He has been considered as one of the pioneers in modern day

> > Astrology.

> >

> > I tend to agree with Prafulla. After all, why do we study

> this

> > science? The answer for me is that it shows the light and

> guides

> > me in my life. Hence, preditive part of the science is as of

> > paramount importance. I guess the only way to resolve this

> > deadlock is to take a bunch of charts (with reasonably

> accurate

> > birth data) and study them with and without using aspects

> and

> > conjunctions in Navamsha and explain the major events in

> life.

> >

> > I see no other way to end this debate.

> >

> > Regards,

> > Krishna

> >

> >

> > --- Prafulla Gang <jyotish wrote:

> >

> > > Dear Sreenadh ji

> > >

> > > Well - who knows the truth? - Should the person making

> > > comment, be construed to be as truth seeker - until they

> prove

> > > with the application of the principles on the charts (

> both

> > > ways - firstly the wrong application of others; and

> secondly

> > > how to read in correct way). Theorists without predictive

> > > support - has little relevance in jyotish. But yes - if

> you

> > > can justify your statements by case studies - then at

> least, I

> > > will hear with open mind.

> > >

> > > Understandably, I have been quoted to be " blind " to

> > > commentaries - but my submission is that - give me one

> reason

> > > to accept the views of " less read scholars " than to " well

> read

> > > scholars like Late Santhanam / Shri KN Rao / Shri Sanjay

> rath

> > > / many others " . and More so - as I do not " pretend " to

> know

> > > the sanskrit and do not " waste " my time on " shloka

> business "

> > > with my " incomplete knowledge " . So I am happy to be

> following

> > > better quality commentaries - who are expalining with the

> case

> > > studies.

> > >

> > > Of course - each one makes his choice.

> > >

> > >

> > > regards / Prafulla Gang

> > > http://www.prafulla.net

> > >

> > > " Men who never get carried away should be. "

> > > ************************************************

> > >

> > >

> > > >

> > > > sreesog

> > > > Thu, 05 Jul 2007 07:00:31 -0000

> > > >

> > > > Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so

> > > important?

> > > >

> > > > Dear Prafulla ji,

> > > > * Even if those things are not there in ancient texts

> every

> > > one is

> > > > free to make or follow there own choice - yes, there is

> > > every chance

> > > > that even such new methods might give true results -

> your

> > > argument is

> > > > right.

> > > > * As far Sanskrit is concerned: Yes, it is your choice

> -

> > > when you

> > > > are blind to read and understand Sanskrit your self, and

> > > understand

> > > > what is there and what not, of course you have to follow

> > > someone who

> > > > says they see - you are right in that as well.

> > > > Love,

> > > > Sreenadh

> > > >

> > > > , Prafulla Gang

> > > <jyotish@>

> > > > wrote:

> > > >>

> > > >> Well Sreenadh ji - at times, these issues become choice

> or

> > > > prejudices in our own form of reading model. Had there

> not

> > > been any

> > > > substance in interpreting D9 charts - lot many stalwarts

> > > must not

> > > > have explored it - and I presume - many of them know

> better

> > > > sanskrit / jyotish (rather both) than all of us on the

> forum

>

=== message truncated ===

 

 

 

______________________________\

____

Fussy? Opinionated? Impossible to please? Perfect. Join 's user panel and

lay it on us. http://surveylink./gmrs/_panel_invite.asp?a=7

[Guest guest]

Hi Krishna,

 

Seems you have a logical & balanced head above your shoulder.

I too think the best way is to test it and not debate endlessly. I was

once given a simple piece of advice, if K.N.Rao uses a method he has not

tested it on 1 chart or read shlokas, he has tested it minimum on 50,000

charts over a period of years before he even talks about it or writes

about it. I would not blindly follow what Shri Rao says but would myself

test it and have often found most ideas working that he has put forth.

Unfortunately we find most astrologers only debate, debate, debate but

do not test it on many charts.

 

 

Regards,

Sushmita

 

 

 

 

 

, Krishnamurthy Seetharama

<krishna_1998 wrote:

>

> Dear Kolachina ji,

>

> Yes, I agree with you. It appears that this debate will go on

> till both sides get tired. I am pretty clear about the path I

> have chosen. It works for me and that is what matters the most.

> I give more importance to what the charts indicate than what is

> said in the texts (By no way I am disrespecting our sages by

> saying this, because it is possible that we have not understood

> them correctly). I believe that Truth lies in reality and and

> reality lies in the charts. And, I have seen that the relations

> of planets in Navamsha play an important role. I don't need more

> evidence. When I raised the question, I was not looking for

> evidence, I only wanted to understand the reasons behind such a

> reality. But, I failed to get the answer.

>

> Regards,

> Krishna

>

>

> --- Satya Sai Kolachina skolachi wrote:

>

> > Dear Sri Krishnamurthy,

> >

> > This debate is never ending; since astrologers arguing on

> > either side

> > are strong in their opinions. It is upto the observers to

> > decide

> > which way to go, as you decided in your message below.

> >

> > But, it does not simply mean that those who do not reply are

> > agreeing

> > to the others message. I stopped interacting, as I have

> > understood

> > both sides arguments and made my own observation. Whatever I

> > had to

> > contribute I said in my two mails. I don't think this is ever

> > going

> > to end. If you are interested, please refer to the archives in

> > this

> > group, around a year and half ago; there was similar debate

> > between

> > Sri Vijaydas Pradeep (against the Navamsa or amsa charts in

> > general)

> > and Sri PVR Narasimha Rao (in support of the Navamsa or amsa

> > charts

> > in general). Both are learned, respected astrologers and have

> > their

> > own merits. This debate is not going to end, as it happened in

> > the

> > past. It only ends when people are one side are tired of

> > arguing.

> >

> > A healthy debate is one where both the parties present their

> > opinions, without giving a chance to anticipate credit for

> > something

> > they propose, or what they understood. WHen the credit is due,

> > it

> > automatically comes, according to astrology. Since we are all

> > learners, this approach will bring out good aspects of the

> > debate and

> > the subject being debated; as we have been observing from the

> > discussion from Sri Vijaydas Pradeep and Sri Chandrasekhar.

> >

> > I personally think the debate is not going to end, since both

> > of them

> > are strong in their opinions and I take value in both the

> > views.

> >

> > Best regards,

> >

> > Satya S Kolachina

> >

> >

> > , Krishnamurthy Seetharama

> > krishna_1998@ wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear All,

> > >

> > > As I was the one who started this thread, I must say that

> > the

> > > debate reamins inconclusive.

> > >

> > > It makes logical sense to say that one should not use

> > aspects,

> > > conjunctions etc. in D-charts as we are looking only at

> > logical

> > > positions of planets and not their physical positions like

> > in

> > > the Rasi chart. But, then why so many learned people who

> > have

> > > done succesful predictions consider aspects and conjunctions

> > in

> > > D-charts? Let me forget about all the other D-charts for now

> > and

> > > let me stick to only Navamsha as that is what we are

> > discussing

> > > in this thread.

> > >

> > > In mind, based on my learning, I felt that Navamsha charts

> > are

> > > at a different plane as compared to other D-charts and hence

> > it

> > > is allowed to look at aspects and conjunctions only in

> > Navamsha

> > > and not in other D-Charts. I wanted to know the reasoning

> > behind

> > > this special treatment to Navamsha chart and hence raised

> > this

> > > question.

> > >

> > > I started learning Jyotish using Shri. B V Raman's books. He

> > > uses Navamsa Chart like Rasi Chart for all practical

> > purposes.

> > > He has been considered as one of the pioneers in modern day

> > > Astrology.

> > >

> > > I tend to agree with Prafulla. After all, why do we study

> > this

> > > science? The answer for me is that it shows the light and

> > guides

> > > me in my life. Hence, preditive part of the science is as of

> > > paramount importance. I guess the only way to resolve this

> > > deadlock is to take a bunch of charts (with reasonably

> > accurate

> > > birth data) and study them with and without using aspects

> > and

> > > conjunctions in Navamsha and explain the major events in

> > life.

> > >

> > > I see no other way to end this debate.

> > >

> > > Regards,

> > > Krishna

> > >

> > >

> > > --- Prafulla Gang jyotish@ wrote:

> > >

> > > > Dear Sreenadh ji

> > > >

> > > > Well - who knows the truth? - Should the person making

> > > > comment, be construed to be as truth seeker - until they

> > prove

> > > > with the application of the principles on the charts (

> > both

> > > > ways - firstly the wrong application of others; and

> > secondly

> > > > how to read in correct way). Theorists without predictive

> > > > support - has little relevance in jyotish. But yes - if

> > you

> > > > can justify your statements by case studies - then at

> > least, I

> > > > will hear with open mind.

> > > >

> > > > Understandably, I have been quoted to be " blind " to

> > > > commentaries - but my submission is that - give me one

> > reason

> > > > to accept the views of " less read scholars " than to " well

> > read

> > > > scholars like Late Santhanam / Shri KN Rao / Shri Sanjay

> > rath

> > > > / many others " . and More so - as I do not " pretend " to

> > know

> > > > the sanskrit and do not " waste " my time on " shloka

> > business "

> > > > with my " incomplete knowledge " . So I am happy to be

> > following

> > > > better quality commentaries - who are expalining with the

> > case

> > > > studies.

> > > >

> > > > Of course - each one makes his choice.

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > regards / Prafulla Gang

> > > > http://www.prafulla.net

> > > >

> > > > " Men who never get carried away should be. "

> > > > ************************************************

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > sreesog@

> > > > > Thu, 05 Jul 2007 07:00:31 -0000

> > > > >

> > > > > Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so

> > > > important?

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear Prafulla ji,

> > > > > * Even if those things are not there in ancient texts

> > every

> > > > one is

> > > > > free to make or follow there own choice - yes, there is

> > > > every chance

> > > > > that even such new methods might give true results -

> > your

> > > > argument is

> > > > > right.

> > > > > * As far Sanskrit is concerned: Yes, it is your choice

> > -

> > > > when you

> > > > > are blind to read and understand Sanskrit your self, and

> > > > understand

> > > > > what is there and what not, of course you have to follow

> > > > someone who

> > > > > says they see - you are right in that as well.

> > > > > Love,

> > > > > Sreenadh

> > > > >

> > > > > , Prafulla Gang

> > > > <jyotish@>

> > > > > wrote:

> > > > >>

> > > > >> Well Sreenadh ji - at times, these issues become choice

> > or

> > > > > prejudices in our own form of reading model. Had there

> > not

> > > > been any

> > > > > substance in interpreting D9 charts - lot many stalwarts

> > > > must not

> > > > > have explored it - and I presume - many of them know

> > better

> > > > > sanskrit / jyotish (rather both) than all of us on the

> > forum

> >

> === message truncated ===

>

>

>

>

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