Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

[Guest guest]

You meant, I suppose: Jungle mein MOR naachaa, kissi-nay na dekha! :-)

 

Achchay achchay laut aatay hain maya-jaal mai because Hasti is mightier than

Nesti until Jaatak transforms into Darshak, hain naa Bhai_Kulbir?

 

Better be a witness rather than the OTHER two MAYAVINI options!

 

 

 

, Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb wrote:

>

> Repected Chandrashekhar Ji, You are absolutely right just a little

> elaboration; HASTI means SELF-concerned existence because existence is only

> as far as SELF is there.

> Regards

> Kulbir Bains.

>

> On Mon, Mar 29, 2010 at 10:59 PM, Chandrashekhar <

> sharma.chandrashekhar wrote:

>

> >

> >

> > Dear Kulbirji,

> >

> > Does ibtedah not mean beginning and inteha mean the end? I suppose hesti is

> >

> > existence and nesti is destruction?

> >

> > Regards,

> > Chandrashekhar.

> >

> > -

> > " Kulbir Bains " <lalkitabkb <lalkitabkb%40gmail.com>>

> > < <%40>

> > >

> > Monday, March 29, 2010 9:16 AM

> > Re: Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> >

> > > Respected Chandershekar ji,

> > > //ibtedah and inteha// In lalkitab it is known as hasti se nesti and

> > nesti

> > > se hasti.

> > > Respect and Regards

> > > KB

> > >

> > > On Sun, Mar 28, 2010 at 11:16 PM, Chandrashekhar <

> > > sharma.chandrashekhar <sharma.chandrashekhar%40gmail.com>>

> > wrote:

> > >

> > >>

> > >>

> > >> Dear Rohini Ranjan,

> > >>

> > >> One meaning of Chandal is worst amongst men and that of Mlecha is a

> > >> wicked

> > >> man, a foreigner, one who does not speak Sanskrit etc. So that too is

> > >> right.

> > >>

> > >> So your contention is also correct. I liked the comment about change of

> > >> perception between ibtedah and inteha. You must be pretty good at Urdu?

> > >>

> > >> Have you heard of a manuscript called Vriddha Parashari?

> > >>

> > >> Regards,

> > >> Chandrashekhar.

> > >>

> > >>

> > >> -

> > >> rohinicrystal

> > >> To:

<%40><Jyotish_Rem\

edies%

> > 40>

> > >> Sunday, March 28, 2010 5:45 AM

> > >> Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> > >>

> > >> Dear Chandrashekhar jee,

> > >>

> > >> I have also heard that rahu represents mlechchaas or 'other

> > >> cultures/foreign cultures'

> > >>

> > >> Often plays a part according to what jyotishis " claim " that it has to do

> > >> with journey abroad or marrying into other cultures and religions and so

> >

> > >> on.

> > >> Just another wrinkle, I suppose! But by no means uncommon, based on the

> > >> queries received by jyotishis working actively on the " Jyotish

> > HOT-LINE! "

> > >>

> > >> As touched upon in my astrotreasures article written long ago and posted

> >

> > >> on

> > >> boloji years later -- BPHS changed its perspective between the ibetadh

> > >> and

> > >> inteha! That was a clue for me that I tuned-in profitably (in terms of

> > >> learning!) -- and the fact that it was placed so close to Sudarshan

> > >> completed the clue for me!

> > >>

> > >> Krishna was the awataar of Vishnu that carried the Sudarshan Chakra and

> > >> was

> > >> Poorna Purusha! If I write anything further on this matter in this

> > august

> > >> forum, I will be insulting the intelligence and Gnan of the inhabitants

> > >> on

> > >> this huge Island!

> > >>

> > >> Rohiniranjan

> > >>

> > >> --- In

> > >> <%40>

> > <%40>,

> >

> > >> " Chandrashekhar " <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote:

> > >> >

> > >> > Dear Inderjee,

> > >> >

> > >> > Does not Rahu rule over the Chandals? That is why he is also called

> > >> Chandal. So Guru Chandala yoga is nothing but conjunction of Guru and

> > >> Rahu.

> > >> >

> > >> > Personally I think that though people tend to connect the word chandal

> > >> with the morals or behaviour of a person who has Guru Chandal yoga, that

> > >> might not be the case always.

> > >> >

> > >> > Rahu gives results of the bhavesha whom he conjoins so Rahu will give

> > >> results of Guru while Guru himself may not be able to give his full

> > >> results

> > >> during its dasha.

> > >> >

> > >> > Chandrashekhar.

> > >> >

> > >> > -

> > >> > inder

> > >> > To:

> > >> > <%40>

> > <%40>

> > >> > Saturday, March 27, 2010 5:12 PM

> > >> > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> > >> >

> > >> >

> > >> >

> > >> > Dear friends,

> > >> >

> > >> > This discussion on Guru-Chaandal Yoga is very interesting.Let me give

> > >> > my

> > >> submissions.

> > >> >

> > >> > Why Rahu was called Chaandal was perhaps to give some derogatotry

> > >> > remark

> > >> to chhaya graha RAHU.

> > >> >

> > >> > Earlier I gave one theory:Karaka for internet is Rahu.So in the

> > mordern

> > >> times real Rahu is internet.

> > >> >

> > >> > Beauty of Rahu is that it is infinite, shapeless, colourless and

> > >> > formless

> > >> and takes shape and characterstics of the planet with which it comes in

> > >> contact.

> > >> >

> > >> > Internet astrology is all about Mercury+ Rahu or Mercury + Jupiter +

> > >> Rahu.

> > >> >

> > >> > Internet can take any shape and character as gets associated with the

> > >> type of people-- astro sites, religious sites, terrorists sits , porno

> > >> sites, sports sites etc.

> > >> >

> > >> > Why Chanadal-- as it distracts mind, makes the mind hazy and infinite.

> > >> >

> > >> > Once with internet religious site or astro site or any site you will

> > >> > have

> > >> distracted mind, cannot perform even your Yoga or daily religious

> > rituals

> > >> with concentration. You can not go and expand inwards when expanding

> > >> infinite outside.

> > >> >

> > >> > Earlier olden days Rahu effects were in the form of Melas,

> > processions,

> > >> committees, rumours, epidemics, foreign influences etc.

> > >> > But the moderm dayday epidemic is internet.

> > >> >

> > >> > My experience is when you are running bhukti/antra /prana [lahiri] of

> > >> planet which is in star sub or subsub of Rahu, you get engulfed in

> > >> internet

> > >> whirlpool and will not have peace of mind.

> > >> >

> > >> > Also I have feeling that if you are seeing a chart of a real Yogi who

> > >> > is

> > >> not at-all connected to out world but only internal Samadhi , we should

> > >> remove Rahu-Ketu from the chart.In any case Rahu is MAYA of relative

> > >> position of earth, Moon and Sun.

> > >> >

> > >> > Some members crtisize that internet astrology is spoiled and it is

> > >> > hasty,

> > >> irreligious etc, but this Chanadal has some positive aspects also as

> > like

> > >> it

> > >> expands your knowledge to limitless sphere.

> > >> > Moreover internet is democratic- leaves you no choice except to

> > >> > tolerate

> > >> difference of opinion. It equilizes[learned and ordinary people] all the

> > >> people in formless networking.

> > >> >

> > >> > It captures you, engulfs you.For your family members ,it is really a

> > >> Chaandal[Guru chandal or budhha chanda or shukra or shani chandal doen

> > >> not

> > >> matter to them]

> > >> >

> > >> > Inder

> > >> > --- In

> > >> > <%40>

> > <%40>,

> > >> Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb@> wrote:

> > >> > >

> > >> > > Sir Raj Bhardwaj ji,

> > >> > > Kamaal kar diya ji aapne, Zinda undhaharan pesh kar di. MARHABA

> > >> > > Regards

> > >> > > Kulbir Bains.

> > >> > >

> > >> > > On Sat, Mar 27, 2010 at 12:12 AM, Raj <rajbhardwaj1949@> wrote:

> > >> > >

> > >> > > >

> > >> > > >

> > >> > > >

> > >> > > >

> > >> > > > Yes Rohini and Kulbeer Bhai, I tend to agree with your anecdote "

> > >> > > > Shape Shifter " ! Here I would just try to also cover the first

> > line

> > >> of

> > >> > > > Kulbeer on the subject - Gurus plays a social role so do the

> > >> > > > prostitutes.

> > >> > > >

> > >> > > > Just 4 days ago , Kanu Sanyal, the man who started a peasants

> > >> movement

> > >> > > > in a very small village named " Naxalbari " , which ultimately

> > >> > > > became to be known the Naxals or Naxalites ; and it's further

> > >> > > > carnation , the present day's PWG(People's War Group), committed

> > >> > > > suicide,found hanging in his one room hutment in his native

> > >> > > > village,

> > >> > > > frustrated with the changes in the ideology of the present CPI(M)

> > >> > > > in

> > >> the

> > >> > > > garb of PWG. He was the GURU of Naxalite movement,which began

> > >> > > > against

> > >> > > > the Zamindars in the end of year 1966 or begening of 1967, and

> > >> > > > slowly

> > >> > > > and steadily spearead in the most states of India.

> > >> > > >

> > >> > > > I had finished my 1 year training in the Air Force and my first

> > >> posting

> > >> > > > was in a place called Bengdubi, about 30 Kms from Naxalbari

> > village

> > >> > > > ,

> > >> > > > near Baghdogra, in Siliguri,Distt Darjeeling in October,1968.

> > >> Movements

> > >> > > > of defence personnel in this region were well guarded.

> > >> > > >

> > >> > > > On a holiday, I was doing the duty as deputy of the `Orderly

> > >> > > > Officer'(who looks after each happenings within the Unit). In the

> > >> > > > evening, he just called his driver to take out the Nissan Jonga.

> > He

> > >> also

> > >> > > > called me out and asked me to sit in the back side of vehicle,with

> >

> > >> > > > my

> > >> > > > Sten Gun. The vehicle moved out of the Unit, and he looked back

> > >> > > > from

> > >> > > > the rear window and asked me Lal-Batti dekhi hai kabhi ? I nodded

> > >> > > > in

> > >> > > > negative. After about 20 minutes drive, we entered the Siliguri,

> > >> > > > and

> > >> > > > headed towards a small colony of huts and mud houses. The vehicle

> > >> > > > stopped. He got down and told me just see around, I shall be back

> > >> > > > quickly. I was looking out and also had to stretch my head out a

> > >> number

> > >> > > > of times , to fathom out that this place was indeed a Red Light

> > >> > > > area.

> > >> > > > Such areas are strictly `Out of Bounds' for the defence

> > >> > > > personnel ,which was taught in our training manuals. And Lo, there

> > >> was

> > >> > > > suddenly a big commotion in the area and I saw a number of civil

> > >> police

> > >> > > > personnel forcing out the women from their living places ; and

> > >> throwing

> > >> > > > them in the police lorry. Then I looked at my Orderly Officer

> > >> > > > running

> > >> > > > running towards our vehicle, trying to hold his pants tightly. A

> > >> > > > fat

> > >> > > > man,must be about 55 years, on the verge of retirement, looking

> > >> > > > very

> > >> > > > funny to me. Then in a flash I noticed a young girl dashing

> > towards

> > >> back

> > >> > > > of our vehicle, trying to catch it and enter. At the same moment,

> > >> > > > our

> > >> > > > vehicle started. I just extended my arm out , the girl found it to

> >

> > >> > > > be

> > >> > > > helping hand, I pulled her inside and she sat on the floor of the

> > >> > > > vehicle. Few policemen did try to run after her, but they had

> > >> stopped,

> > >> > > > having seen that ours was a defence vehicle.

> > >> > > >

> > >> > > > She was trying to get her breathing normal and I was looking at

> > her

> > >> > > > nonchalantly. After few minutes the O.O peeped back from the small

> > >> rear

> > >> > > > window' and shouted " Who the bitch is this?. I did not reply.

> > >> > > > But I think that the driver must have also noticed everything ,

> > >> > > > like

> > >> me

> > >> > > > in the tript to Lal Batti. After about 5 minutes the O.O. again

> > >> peeped

> > >> > > > back and said ` Hey boy I will take this girl to my Barrack. I

> > kept

> > >> > > > mum. My mind was blank. No thought was crossing my mind, as far as

> >

> > >> > > > I

> > >> > > > still remember. In the meantime I asked the girl about herself.

> > She

> > >> told

> > >> > > > that she is from Rajasthan and one of her uncles had brought her

> > to

> > >> > > > this place 6 months back and she will be grateful if I can help

> > her

> > >> to

> > >> > > > go to Rajasthan. I knew that the Railway Station was just on the

> > >> > > > way.

> > >> As

> > >> > > > we reached near the main gate, I called out the driver and

> > >> > > > commanded

> > >> him

> > >> > > > to stop the vehicle. I had just about 3 Rupees with me and gave it

> >

> > >> > > > to

> > >> > > > the girl and apologized that I cannot help her further, she should

> > >> just

> > >> > > > catch any available train and try to take help from any one and

> > not

> > >> to

> > >> > > > worry, YOU will reach your Home. As the vehicle was slowing down,

> > >> > > > the

> > >> > > > O.O. shouted at me and ordered me that the girl with go with us. I

> > >> > > > simply pointed my Sten Gun in his direction and slowly brought it

> > >> near

> > >> > > > his nose where he could feel the heat ..and he closed the rear

> > >> > > > window. The vehicle stopped and I helped the girl out of the

> > >> > > > vehicle.

> > >> I

> > >> > > > still carry the memory of her tearful eyes with full of karuna and

> > >> > > > thanks giving , till the vehicle moved out of her sight. I felt so

> > >> > > > tired and exhausted , I simply slumped on my seat.

> > >> > > >

> > >> > > > On the way back thoughts started crossing my mind that a senior is

> > >> > > > always a senior in the armed forces, if the O.O. wants he can

> > place

> > >> me

> > >> > > > under arrest after reaching the unit and frame any flimsy charge

> > >> sheet

> > >> > > > against me and I could even face a court martial. My soul told me

> > >> > > > no

> > >> > > > fears so be it. Then I took a resolve that if it so happens, I

> > will

> > >> kill

> > >> > > > this son of a Gun senior- the Teacher-the Mentor-The supposed

> > guide

> > >> to

> > >> > > > me, by virtue of his being senior to me in rank in age. But

> > nothing

> > >> ever

> > >> > > > happened further on this count. For years on, I went on feeling

> > >> > > > sorry

> > >> > > > that I could not help her any further and would always wonder

> > >> > > > whether

> > >> > > > she ever reached her home !

> > >> > > >

> > >> > > > Now after such a long gap the discussion on Gurus, Deeksha, Beej

> > >> Mantra,

> > >> > > > Guru Chaandal Yoga, Kanu Sanyal, Naxalbari has brought these

> > >> > > > memories

> > >> > > > back to me as fresh as ever before.

> > >> > > >

> > >> > > > As far me I feel that I have also fully understood that the

> > >> description

> > >> > > > of this yoga in Shastras was indirect and not so direct but it's

> > >> direct

> > >> > > > and literal meaning or name is CHAANDAL GURU-YOGA, If I may rename

> >

> > >> > > > it

> > >> > > > in direct form. The O.O. must have called me by thousand names

> > like

> > >> > > > CHAANDAL or manay more direct expletives , because he was in dire

> > >> needs

> > >> > > > of the wants of his body and mind....and after the police raid, I

> > >> > > > deprived him of this real good oprtunity. But then, I do not find

> > >> > > > any

> > >> > > > such yoga which can directly label me as CHAANDAL SHISHYA. And

> > >> lastly,

> > >> > > > that time I was running the mahadasha of Rahu-Rahu from 19-09-1966

> >

> > >> > > > to

> > >> > > > 01-01-1969.

> > >> > > >

> > >> > > > Raj Bhardwaj

> > >> > > >

> > >> > > > --- In

> > >> > > >

<%40>

> > <%40>

> > >> <%40>,

> > >>

> > >> > > > " rohinicrystal "

> > >> > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote:

> > >> > > > >

> > >> > > > > Just an anecdotal suggestion, Raj_dada, if I may for you to

> > >> > > > > examine

> > >> in

> > >> > > > your collection of charts or test bench.

> > >> > > > >

> > >> > > > > I have always considered the lunar node as 'wild-cards' (The

> > >> > > > > joker

> > >> in

> > >> > > > a game of cards! A chalnaa, a mimic, a 'Shape-shifter' etc). This

> > >> > > > is

> > >> why

> > >> > > > perhaps it is considered as a 'surrogate' that assumes the persona

> > >> and

> > >> > > > role of the planet it is associated with or failing that in whose

> > >> sign

> > >> > > > and nakshatra it is placed in). Particularly when a node is moving

> > >> > > > towards the planet it is co-occuping a varga, it imbibes the

> > >> qualities

> > >> > > > and abilities of the planet concerned (I call it suction-yoga or

> > >> > > > Hoover-Yoga -- after the vacuum cleaner!). The planet so affected

> > >> loses

> > >> > > > some or all of its propensity and natural qualities for good or

> > >> > > > bad!

> > >> So

> > >> > > > a jupiter could lose its 'Teacher/priest-like nature', moon could

> > >> lose

> > >> > > > its sensitive, emotional side or memory, mars could lose its

> > >> > > > aggression... etc!). It may not be a complete loss but a reduction

> >

> > >> > > > in

> > >> > > > the qualities.

> > >> > > > >

> > >> > > > > Such influence is not necessarily good or bad for the individual

> > >> > > > depending on the personal nature of the node in the specific

> > chart!

> > >> > > > >

> > >> > > > > Please remember that it is anecdotal! Try it at your own risk!

> > In

> > >> fact

> > >> > > > for other novice readers, I would venture to add: PLEASE DON'T TRY

> > >> THIS

> > >> > > > AT HOME WITHOUT YOUR TEACHER OR PARENT BEING PRESENT CLOSE BY! :-)

> > >> > > > >

> > >> > > > > So nice to hear that cheerfulness is back in your heart. My

> > >> > > > > prayers

> > >> > > > and best wishes that Ma always shower Her blessings on ALL my

> > >> > > > Dadas!

> > >> > > > >

> > >> > > > > Rohiniranjan

> > >> > > > >

> > >> > > > > --- In

> > >> > > > >

<%40>

> > <%40>

> > >> <%40>,

> > >>

> > >> > > > " rajbhardwaj1949 "

> > >> > > > rajbhardwaj1949@ wrote:

> > >> > > > > >

> > >> > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > Dear Bhai Rohini, Kulbir and Krishnan and all Jyotishis,

> > >> > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > The thread on " Beej Mantra " and " I disagree " have been really

> > >> very

> > >> > > > > > interesting for me. After a long time I was enjoying and

> > >> > > > > > smiling

> > >> > > > while

> > >> > > > > > reading the exchange, and at times I was humming. Completely

> > >> > > > relaxed. My

> > >> > > > > > wife had observed me at a few occasions and called my younger

> > >> > > > daughter

> > >> > > > > > to observe me silently and also enjoyed finding me relaxed

> > with

> > >> > > > smile on

> > >> > > > > > my face. Somehow the subject in both the threads got

> > >> > > > > > intermangled

> > >> > > > very

> > >> > > > > > beautifully. Guru,Shishya,Deekshya,traditions; cunturies old

> > >> > > > > > and

> > >> the

> > >> > > > > > current traits.

> > >> > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > I have firm belief that almost all of us(other jyotishis also

> > >> > > > included),

> > >> > > > > > who try to give answers to the queries to best of their

> > >> knowledge;

> > >> > > > and

> > >> > > > > > most of the times face brickbats and get No thanks, still go

> > on

> > >> > > > > > participating in their respective groups ,like addicts, not

> > >> > > > withstanding

> > >> > > > > > the skirmishes here and there.

> > >> > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > This further strengthens my belief, that all such jyotishis

> > >> > > > > > have

> > >> > > > learned

> > >> > > > > > jyotish with their own efforts, with no Guru or Gurukul. If

> > >> > > > > > this

> > >> is

> > >> > > > not

> > >> > > > > > Junoon, then what else. The will to learn and the will to do

> > >> > > > > > bit

> > >> of

> > >> > > > > > experiment too in the process.How much time it takes to read,

> > >> > > > > > how

> > >> > > > quick

> > >> > > > > > reactions or delayed reactions take seeds in our minds, how we

> > >> > > > prepare

> > >> > > > > > ourselves to gather the thoughts and type these to give them a

> > >> shape

> > >> > > > and

> > >> > > > > > not expecting anything in return. Just the pure joy and

> > >> > > > satisfaction.

> > >> > > > > > This is a continuous process of learning for us and I also

> > have

> > >> no

> > >> > > > doubt

> > >> > > > > > that the young learner also must be picking a lots from what

> > >> appears

> > >> > > > in

> > >> > > > > > the group.

> > >> > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > I will be hanged and stoned by the so called purists, if I

> > were

> > >> to

> > >> > > > say

> > >> > > > > > that there is no need to have Guru, in the times we are

> > living.

> > >> In

> > >> > > > other

> > >> > > > > > words every learner of Jyotish has his own free Will , if it

> > is

> > >> > > > > > Operational , to learn the Jyotish without being bound by any

> > >> > > > > > Rules,Paramparas etc. This is so because the material and

> > >> > > > opportunity

> > >> > > > > > for picking up Jyotish is now really very easily available and

> > >> every

> > >> > > > > > learner has good faculties in the field of education and

> > >> languages.

> > >> > > > One

> > >> > > > > > just needs to have a keen eye and belief in himself. How they

> > >> will

> > >> > > > use

> > >> > > > > > their knowledge will depend solely on themselves.

> > >> > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > While on the subject of , I (like many other Jyotishis) was

> > >> > > > > > also

> > >> > > > witness

> > >> > > > > > to few other happenings involving a Guru and Shishya. I have

> > >> > > > > > been

> > >> > > > > > thinking for quite some time about the " Guru-Chaandal Yoga " .

> > >> > > > > > Why

> > >> > > > such

> > >> > > > > > yoga was mentioned in BPHS. Guru was specifically Jupiter, but

> > >> Rahu

> > >> > > > was

> > >> > > > > > not specifically Chandaal. I am not sure if Rahu has been

> > given

> > >> the

> > >> > > > name

> > >> > > > > > of Chaandal in it's various descriptions. Now how this Yoga is

> > >> > > > feared by

> > >> > > > > > all like Rahu dasha,Shani dasha, Shani Sade Sati etc. When a

> > >> learner

> > >> > > > > > like me perhaps does not get any reason to show the cause of

> > >> > > > problems in

> > >> > > > > > facing the jataka , we the lesser known jyotishis just take

> > >> > > > > > names

> > >> of

> > >> > > > > > such yogas or positions of Shani as the root cause of all the

> > >> > > > problems.

> > >> > > > > > Very easy way out indeed.

> > >> > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > I have been thinking a lot about The Guru-Chaandal Yoga and

> > >> somehow

> > >> > > > tend

> > >> > > > > > to believe, that Guru can become like a Chaandal in the real

> > >> sense.

> > >> > > > His

> > >> > > > > > all faculties are shut and whatever he does and utters is very

> > >> very

> > >> > > > > > surprising, it hits everything and everybody very hard. The

> > >> > > > > > image

> > >> of

> > >> > > > > > Guru becomes that of a Satan,as he breathes fire and breakes

> > >> > > > > > all

> > >> the

> > >> > > > so

> > >> > > > > > called maryada of a Guru, if there is anything called maryada.

> > >> When

> > >> > > > our

> > >> > > > > > Rishis mentioned this Guru -Chaandal Yoga, they really must

> > >> > > > > > have

> > >> all

> > >> > > > the

> > >> > > > > > rishis,munis,gurus who had dual personalities. There is no

> > need

> > >> to

> > >> > > > > > elaborate this. The real meaning of Guru Chaandal Yoga seems

> > to

> > >> have

> > >> > > > > > sink in now. It simply sinks the esteerm of a Guru, where a

> > >> Shishya

> > >> > > > is

> > >> > > > > > forced to challenge his Guru, and more the Guru accuses the

> > >> Shishya,

> > >> > > > > > more he exposes himself, and forces the Shishya to break his

> > >> silence

> > >> > > > and

> > >> > > > > > he starts hesitatingly initially but goes full blast exposing

> > >> > > > > > the

> > >> > > > Guru.

> > >> > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > But, then the Shishya also has to be a real learner, who

> > >> > > > > > perhaps

> > >> > > > never

> > >> > > > > > depends solely and blindly on one Guru. Now a big question

> > >> > > > > > which

> > >> is

> > >> > > > > > staring me and I have been wondering why the fathers of

> > Jyotish

> > >> did

> > >> > > > not

> > >> > > > > > mention about any yoga specifically , which could be termed or

> > >> > > > called as

> > >> > > > > > " SHISHYA CHAANDAL " Yoga in the Jyotish !

> > >> > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > Raj Bhardwaj

> > >> > > > > >

> > >> > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > --- In

> > >> > > > > >

<%40>

> > <%40>

> > >> <%40>,

> > >>

> > >> > > > " rohinicrystal "

> > >> > > > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote:

> > >> > > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > > But Praajee...!

> > >> > > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > > IK HORE thaa jo Dasyaa gadheriyaan de-vichh, unna kol...!

> > >> > > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > > Varah (12) thay unna-di banday! Jotish main jaisay!! Ek do

> > >> ghabraa

> > >> > > > > > gayey shaayad, aisaa sanu sunaa noo! Pher laut aayey US dey

> > >> > > > > > Kaul

> > >> > > > usday

> > >> > > > > > 'marnay' day baad!

> > >> > > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > > Kis-day kaul woh sab logaan lautay, mainu nai pataa!

> > >> > > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > > Asi to sirf dekhnaay may zindagi gawaan dittay! Kinni - Azib

> > >> hai

> > >> > > > yeh

> > >> > > > > > kahaniyan bachchon di! Raab/Khudaa/Parmeshwar/God day

> > >> bachchoon-di!

> > >> > > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > > Maaf karnaa praa -- punjabi bhot pyaari lagdii si magar ik

> > >> > > > > > > saal

> > >> to

> > >> > > > > > nahin naa kafi! Shaayad aglay janam main kuch hor

> > >> > > > > > seekh-layngay,

> > >> jo

> > >> > > > raha

> > >> > > > > > giya si is janam-vich baki!

> > >> > > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > > Aankhaan khulie rakhiyo! Aandar_waali!! ;-)

> > >> > > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > > Happy Easter!!

> > >> > > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > > Rohiniranjan

> > >> > > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > > --- In

> > >> > > > > > >

<%40>

> > <%40>

> > >> <%40>,

> > >>

> > >> > > > Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@

> > >> > > > > > wrote:

> > >> > > > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > > > SiRR ji,

> > >> > > > > > > > HUSH is the word;

> > >> > > > > > > > Bolan naalon chup changeri, chup de naalon parda; je

> > >> > > > > > > > MANSOOR

> > >> na

> > >> > > > > > bolda taan

> > >> > > > > > > > sooli kahnu Chadhda.

> > >> > > > > > > > Silence is golden; veil of secrecy even better, Mansoor

> > >> wouldn't

> > >> > > > > > have been

> > >> > > > > > > > hanged on gallows ;had he preferred silence.

> > >> > > > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > > > Regards

> > >> > > > > > > > Kulbir Bains

> > >> > > > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > > > ------------------------------

> > >> > > > > > > > ** rohinicrystal jyotish_vani@

> > >> > > > > > > > *To:*

> > >> > > > > > > >

<%40>

> > <%40>

> > >> <%40>

> > >> > > > > > > > *Sent:* Sun, 21 March, 2010 6:15:54 AM

> > >> > > > > > > > *Subject:* Re: Information about beej mantra

> > sadhana's

> > >> > > > > > > > ?

> > >> > > > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > > > Kulbir_praaji,

> > >> > > > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > > > This 'regulation' , " ...if deeksha of beej mantra is given

> >

> > >> > > > > > > > by

> > >> > > > > > competent

> > >> > > > > > > > guru, then it becomes the responsibility of the guru to

> > >> > > > > > > > bring

> > >> > > > > > salvation to

> > >> > > > > > > > the disciple. " -- has an interesting wrinkle!

> > >> > > > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > > > It implies that the Guru himself/herself has already

> > >> > > > > > > > attained

> > >> > > > > > salvation!

> > >> > > > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > > > I think it is safe to assume that such deekshas are being

> > >> given

> > >> > > > in

> > >> > > > > > the

> > >> > > > > > > > hundreds of thousands, if not millions, world-wide ;-)

> > >> > > > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > > > Now Chelaa poochtaa hai, " If there are so many millions of

> > >> Gurus

> > >> > > > who

> > >> > > > > > have

> > >> > > > > > > > attained salvation already... Why is the earth and

> > humanity

> > >> > > > > > suffering so

> > >> > > > > > > > much? " :-B

> > >> > > > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > > > ~Sab kuch seekha humnay, naa seekhie hoshiyari, Sach hai

> > >> duniya

> > >> > > > > > walon kay

> > >> > > > > > > > hum SUB hain anadi/anari! ~

> > >> > > > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan

> > >> > > > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > > >

> > >> > > > > > > >

[Guest guest]

Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best pragmatic way

possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says.

House no 11. represents SABKI APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN earning. In 11th

house itself, is the seat of justice/judge. Saturn takes the incurred karma

via Rahu and Ketu before Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the seat of judge

but Saturn is the drishti to guide it).

Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter passes it on Saturn's

recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in mind. (khuda ko hazir

mankar).

Regards

Kulbir Bains.

 

On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder <indervohra2001 wrote:

 

>

>

> Dear Kulbir,

> Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement.[correct or incorrect]

> Saturn is illegal,[but may be correct],thinking.

>

> Jupiter + Saturn becomes philospher.[nothing good or bad, but thinking

> makes it so]

>

> Mars with Jupiter logic[logician], without reading the law books he would

> give arguments which may win him.

>

> Inder

>

>

>

> SURRENDER JOYFULLY TO THE WILL OF THE ULTIMATE DIVINITY AND RELISH THE

> TASTE OF ABSOLUTE BLISS.

>

> [image:

Groups]</;_ylc=X3oDMTJkYWw3dmxoBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAz\

k2OTk4NjIEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDgyNjkwBHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA2dmcARzdGltZQMxMjY5OTM0NDUz>

> Switch to:

Text-Only<-traditional ?subject=Change+Delivery+F\

ormat:+Traditional>,

> Daily

Digest<-digest ?subject=Email+Delivery:+Digest>•

> Un<- ?subject=Un>•

Terms

> of Use <>

> .

>

>

>

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Well written RR_jee, I agree.

Inder

 

, " rohinicrystal " <jyotish_vani

wrote:

>

> Chandrashekhar_jee and Raj bhaisaheb,

>

> I have generally winced a bit when people try to equate and extrapolate

directly and literally from ancient allegories and in my opinion that creates

problems which creates the 'black and white' in astrology. The latest that we

have observed being the words from " Rahu is uncondtionally bad " camp.

>

> My personal preference is to take the allegories as nice mnemonics or memory

aids but not an exhaustive description of the 'planets' concerned from an

astrological point of view. The story of swarbhanu, the story of Kach and

Devyani, and even the story of Harishchandra in Shani Mahatmay are great

pointers and make what can be a rather dry subject (Astrology with its terse

rules and exceptions!) interesting and even lively! But, if we get stuck in the

mindset that those stories and allegories capture the entire essence of

astrological reality or astrological details, then that would be a serious loss

for the astrology learners and practitioners. Particularly the ones who actually

read charts or give readings (the applied and practical astrologers).

>

> The astrological reality (more than sun in leo in 4th will result in this or

that... for instance!) is multifactorial and rather than seeing the

benefic/malefic dichotomy as absolute, I wish people will consider the

modification and modulation of the essential, central characteristics of planets

and realize that without such nuances and influences, astrology will begin to

look rather threadbare.

>

> I am of the opinion that the karakatwas given in Jyotish texts such as BPHS

(and I do not mean BPHS alone!) describe the core properties or values of the

planets and we must not stray too far from those. In contrast, texts such as

uttarkalamrita despite their prolific treatment of karakas must be considered

with a pinch of salt, or at least some of the labels given there in the context

of karakattwas.

>

> Some of the problems inherent in the 'modern' labels (neokarakatwas!) while

being useful raise one question. How careful was the author or proponent in

making sure that what he or she is giving is the nascent karakttwa and not the

result of a multifactorial influence or compound karakattwa? What one is

attributing to Jupiter for instance -- if derived from astrological

observations, how much of the description is for the planet itself and what

component or contamination in chemical mixture terms can be attributed to a

melange of influences? It is often very difficult to tease out the influences of

individual participants in a property or label which sometimes is ascribed to a

single planet.

>

> I am not saying that BPHS alone is correct in all instances but certainly a

safe starting point! Others may differ in their opinion, of course.

>

> Speaking of names, the label MANGAL for mars is intriguing. Why is a malefic

that is cruel and associated with wounds, injuries, aggression, cutting etc

should be associated with mangal which represents beneficience, shubha,

amelioration?

>

> I am sure there are many similar nomenclatural puzzles in Jyotish and I

realize that one lifetime is not sufficient to figure out all the labels and

what not, but certainly makes the study of astrology rather interesting.

>

> Rohiniranjan

>

> , " Chandrashekhar "

<sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote:

> >

> > Dear Raj,

> >

> > I have already read your experience with interest. I can also understand

what you felt as it was an absolutely wicked situation. You did something that

needed great courage, knowing the way Army works.

> >

> > But I am one who can not equate ideologue of a violent movement, even for

good causes, with Guru. In jyotish I always prefer to keep the grahas and our

concepts about what their names should mean in the light of Puranas separate.

May be not exactly separate but my interpretation of the puranic stories in

explaining the nature of grahas is at variance with what is generally thought

and so I prefer to keep it to myself.

> >

> > Take care,

> > Chandrashekhar.

> >

> >

> > -

> > Raj

> >

> > Tuesday, March 30, 2010 9:52 AM

> > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> >

> >

> >

> > Dear Chandrashekhar Ji,

> > I am enjoying your posts. But, I feel you could have missed my msg

No.73157 and what was the context of Guru-Rahu yuti,in the present times. ! I

hope you will like reading it, as the thread began from there.! With my best

regards.

> >

> > Raj Bhardwaj

> >

> > , " Chandrashekhar "

<sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Vattem Krishnan,

> > >

> > > I was responding to Rohini's mail. I have already made clear what is

meant by Chandal and what by MlecCha. I had said " One meaning of Chandal is

worst amongst men and that of Mlecha is a wicked man, a foreigner, one who does

not speak Sanskrit etc. So that too is right. "

> > >

> > > Regards,

> > > Chandrashekhar

> > >

> > >

> > > -

> > > Vattem Krishnan

> > >

> > > Monday, March 29, 2010 12:37 PM

> > > Re: Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Dear Sir,

> > > It is true that persons opeartating from burial grounds are referred

with this term.It's application however to Rahu in litteral terms is not

properly substantiated.mlechas are not chandals.

> > > In our epics more so when we recollect about Raja Satya Harischndra

Story,we find the reference of " Chandal " the one who burns dead bodies and keeps

watch at burial grounds.

> > > Doms are not falling under chandal category.Some where it is also

mentioned to cannibals or narbhakshas as chnadals.

> > >

> > > Vattem Krishnan Cyber Jyotish Services(For all counseling

services)Dr.B.V.Raman " Fools Obey Planets While Wisemen Can Control Them " Planets

are neutral Controllers of Mans Karma

> > >

> > > --- On Sun, 3/28/10, Chandrashekhar <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Chandrashekhar <sharma.chandrashekhar@>

> > > Re: Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> > >

> > > Sunday, March 28, 2010, 3:15 PM

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Dear Rohini Ranjan,

> > >

> > > I am trying to acquire its manuscript, through one of my friends and

hope to learn some more about Paraashara.

> > >

> > > Yes, Chandal is an interesting term. They are generally thought to be

those who operate at funeral sites.

> > >

> > > Rahu is enigmatic planet and so has not rest or does not allow others to

rest.

> > >

> > > Regards,

> > >

> > > Chandrashekhar.

> > >

> > > -

> > >

> > > rohinicrystal

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Sunday, March 28, 2010 11:57 PM

> > >

> > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> > >

> > > Chandrashekhar jee,

> > >

> > > Thanks for taking the time, Sir. I have not had the good fortune of

having seen Vriddha Parashari. I have only studied BPHS, Parashara Samhita and

Laghu/madhya parashari.

> > >

> > > My urdu is rather limited, actually.

> > >

> > > Chandaal is a very interesting term and at one point were thought of as

the '5th caste'! In MP they were called Dom and in bengal nomoshuddoor.

> > >

> > > Poor Rahu! Even on its home-turf (internet according to some) there is

no rest for the wicked :-)

> > >

> > > Rohiniranjan

> > >

> > > , " Chandrashekhar "

<sharma.chandrashek har@> wrote:

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > > Dear Rohini Ranjan,

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > > One meaning of Chandal is worst amongst men and that of Mlecha is a

wicked man, a foreigner, one who does not speak Sanskrit etc. So that too is

right.

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > > So your contention is also correct. I liked the comment about change

of perception between ibtedah and inteha. You must be pretty good at Urdu?

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > > Have you heard of a manuscript called Vriddha Parashari?

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > > Regards,

> > >

> > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > > -

> > >

> > > > rohinicrystal

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > > Sunday, March 28, 2010 5:45 AM

> > >

> > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > > Dear Chandrashekhar jee,

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > > I have also heard that rahu represents mlechchaas or 'other

cultures/foreign cultures'

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > > Often plays a part according to what jyotishis " claim " that it has to

do with journey abroad or marrying into other cultures and religions and so on.

Just another wrinkle, I suppose! But by no means uncommon, based on the queries

received by jyotishis working actively on the " Jyotish HOT-LINE! "

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > > As touched upon in my astrotreasures article written long ago and

posted on boloji years later -- BPHS changed its perspective between the ibetadh

and inteha! That was a clue for me that I tuned-in profitably (in terms of

learning!) -- and the fact that it was placed so close to Sudarshan completed

the clue for me!

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > > Krishna was the awataar of Vishnu that carried the Sudarshan Chakra

and was Poorna Purusha! If I write anything further on this matter in this

august forum, I will be insulting the intelligence and Gnan of the inhabitants

on this huge Island!

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > > Rohiniranjan

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > > , " Chandrashekhar "

<sharma.chandrashek har@> wrote:

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Dear Inderjee,

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Does not Rahu rule over the Chandals? That is why he is also called

Chandal. So Guru Chandala yoga is nothing but conjunction of Guru and Rahu.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Personally I think that though people tend to connect the word

chandal with the morals or behaviour of a person who has Guru Chandal yoga, that

might not be the case always.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Rahu gives results of the bhavesha whom he conjoins so Rahu will

give results of Guru while Guru himself may not be able to give his full results

during its dasha.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > -

> > >

> > > > > inder

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Saturday, March 27, 2010 5:12 PM

> > >

> > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Dear friends,

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > This discussion on Guru-Chaandal Yoga is very interesting. Let me

give my submissions.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Why Rahu was called Chaandal was perhaps to give some derogatotry

remark to chhaya graha RAHU.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Earlier I gave one theory:Karaka for internet is Rahu.So in the

mordern times real Rahu is internet.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Beauty of Rahu is that it is infinite, shapeless, colourless and

formless and takes shape and characterstics of the planet with which it comes in

contact.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Internet astrology is all about Mercury+ Rahu or Mercury + Jupiter +

Rahu.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Internet can take any shape and character as gets associated with

the type of people-- astro sites, religious sites, terrorists sits , porno

sites, sports sites etc.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Why Chanadal-- as it distracts mind, makes the mind hazy and

infinite.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Once with internet religious site or astro site or any site you will

have distracted mind, cannot perform even your Yoga or daily religious rituals

with concentration. You can not go and expand inwards when expanding infinite

outside.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Earlier olden days Rahu effects were in the form of Melas,

processions, committees, rumours, epidemics, foreign influences etc.

> > >

> > > > > But the moderm dayday epidemic is internet.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > My experience is when you are running bhukti/antra /prana [lahiri]

of planet which is in star sub or subsub of Rahu, you get engulfed in internet

whirlpool and will not have peace of mind.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Also I have feeling that if you are seeing a chart of a real Yogi

who is not at-all connected to out world but only internal Samadhi , we should

remove Rahu-Ketu from the chart.In any case Rahu is MAYA of relative position of

earth, Moon and Sun.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Some members crtisize that internet astrology is spoiled and it is

hasty, irreligious etc, but this Chanadal has some positive aspects also as like

it expands your knowledge to limitless sphere.

> > >

> > > > > Moreover internet is democratic- leaves you no choice except to

tolerate difference of opinion. It equilizes[learned and ordinary people] all

the people in formless networking.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > It captures you, engulfs you.For your family members ,it is really a

Chaandal[Guru chandal or budhha chanda or shukra or shani chandal doen not

matter to them]

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Inder

> > >

> > > > > , Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb@

> wrote:

> > >

> > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > Sir Raj Bhardwaj ji,

> > >

> > > > > > Kamaal kar diya ji aapne, Zinda undhaharan pesh kar di. MARHABA

> > >

> > > > > > Regards

> > >

> > > > > > Kulbir Bains.

> > >

> > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > On Sat, Mar 27, 2010 at 12:12 AM, Raj <rajbhardwaj1949@ > wrote:

> > >

> > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > Yes Rohini and Kulbeer Bhai, I tend to agree with your anecdote "

> > >

> > > > > > > Shape Shifter " ! Here I would just try to also cover the first

line of

> > >

> > > > > > > Kulbeer on the subject - Gurus plays a social role so do the

> > >

> > > > > > > prostitutes.

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > Just 4 days ago , Kanu Sanyal, the man who started a peasants

movement

> > >

> > > > > > > in a very small village named " Naxalbari " , which ultimately

> > >

> > > > > > > became to be known the Naxals or Naxalites ; and it's further

> > >

> > > > > > > carnation , the present day's PWG(People's War Group), committed

> > >

> > > > > > > suicide,found hanging in his one room hutment in his native

village,

> > >

> > > > > > > frustrated with the changes in the ideology of the present

CPI(M) in the

> > >

> > > > > > > garb of PWG. He was the GURU of Naxalite movement,which began

against

> > >

> > > > > > > the Zamindars in the end of year 1966 or begening of 1967, and

slowly

> > >

> > > > > > > and steadily spearead in the most states of India.

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > I had finished my 1 year training in the Air Force and my first

posting

> > >

> > > > > > > was in a place called Bengdubi, about 30 Kms from Naxalbari

village ,

> > >

> > > > > > > near Baghdogra, in Siliguri,Distt Darjeeling in October,1968.

Movements

> > >

> > > > > > > of defence personnel in this region were well guarded.

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > On a holiday, I was doing the duty as deputy of the `Orderly

> > >

> > > > > > > Officer'(who looks after each happenings within the Unit). In

the

> > >

> > > > > > > evening, he just called his driver to take out the Nissan Jonga.

He also

> > >

> > > > > > > called me out and asked me to sit in the back side of

vehicle,with my

> > >

> > > > > > > Sten Gun. The vehicle moved out of the Unit, and he looked back

from

> > >

> > > > > > > the rear window and asked me Lal-Batti dekhi hai kabhi ? I

nodded in

> > >

> > > > > > > negative. After about 20 minutes drive, we entered the Siliguri,

and

> > >

> > > > > > > headed towards a small colony of huts and mud houses. The

vehicle

> > >

> > > > > > > stopped. He got down and told me just see around, I shall be

back

> > >

> > > > > > > quickly. I was looking out and also had to stretch my head out a

number

> > >

> > > > > > > of times , to fathom out that this place was indeed a Red Light

area.

> > >

> > > > > > > Such areas are strictly `Out of Bounds' for the defence

> > >

> > > > > > > personnel ,which was taught in our training manuals. And Lo,

there was

> > >

> > > > > > > suddenly a big commotion in the area and I saw a number of civil

police

> > >

> > > > > > > personnel forcing out the women from their living places ; and

throwing

> > >

> > > > > > > them in the police lorry. Then I looked at my Orderly Officer

running

> > >

> > > > > > > running towards our vehicle, trying to hold his pants tightly. A

fat

> > >

> > > > > > > man,must be about 55 years, on the verge of retirement, looking

very

> > >

> > > > > > > funny to me. Then in a flash I noticed a young girl dashing

towards back

> > >

> > > > > > > of our vehicle, trying to catch it and enter. At the same

moment, our

> > >

> > > > > > > vehicle started. I just extended my arm out , the girl found it

to be

> > >

> > > > > > > helping hand, I pulled her inside and she sat on the floor of

the

> > >

> > > > > > > vehicle. Few policemen did try to run after her, but they had

stopped,

> > >

> > > > > > > having seen that ours was a defence vehicle.

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > She was trying to get her breathing normal and I was looking at

her

> > >

> > > > > > > nonchalantly. After few minutes the O.O peeped back from the

small rear

> > >

> > > > > > > window' and shouted " Who the bitch is this?. I did not reply.

> > >

> > > > > > > But I think that the driver must have also noticed everything ,

like me

> > >

> > > > > > > in the tript to Lal Batti. After about 5 minutes the O.O. again

peeped

> > >

> > > > > > > back and said ` Hey boy I will take this girl to my Barrack. I

kept

> > >

> > > > > > > mum. My mind was blank. No thought was crossing my mind, as far

as I

> > >

> > > > > > > still remember. In the meantime I asked the girl about herself.

She told

> > >

> > > > > > > that she is from Rajasthan and one of her uncles had brought her

to

> > >

> > > > > > > this place 6 months back and she will be grateful if I can help

her to

> > >

> > > > > > > go to Rajasthan. I knew that the Railway Station was just on the

way. As

> > >

> > > > > > > we reached near the main gate, I called out the driver and

commanded him

> > >

> > > > > > > to stop the vehicle. I had just about 3 Rupees with me and gave

it to

> > >

> > > > > > > the girl and apologized that I cannot help her further, she

should just

> > >

> > > > > > > catch any available train and try to take help from any one and

not to

> > >

> > > > > > > worry, YOU will reach your Home. As the vehicle was slowing

down, the

> > >

> > > > > > > O.O. shouted at me and ordered me that the girl with go with us.

I

> > >

> > > > > > > simply pointed my Sten Gun in his direction and slowly brought

it near

> > >

> > > > > > > his nose where he could feel the heat ..and he closed the rear

> > >

> > > > > > > window. The vehicle stopped and I helped the girl out of the

vehicle. I

> > >

> > > > > > > still carry the memory of her tearful eyes with full of karuna

and

> > >

> > > > > > > thanks giving , till the vehicle moved out of her sight. I felt

so

> > >

> > > > > > > tired and exhausted , I simply slumped on my seat.

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > On the way back thoughts started crossing my mind that a senior

is

> > >

> > > > > > > always a senior in the armed forces, if the O.O. wants he can

place me

> > >

> > > > > > > under arrest after reaching the unit and frame any flimsy charge

sheet

> > >

> > > > > > > against me and I could even face a court martial. My soul told

me no

> > >

> > > > > > > fears so be it. Then I took a resolve that if it so happens, I

will kill

> > >

> > > > > > > this son of a Gun senior- the Teacher-the Mentor-The supposed

guide to

> > >

> > > > > > > me, by virtue of his being senior to me in rank in age. But

nothing ever

> > >

> > > > > > > happened further on this count. For years on, I went on feeling

sorry

> > >

> > > > > > > that I could not help her any further and would always wonder

whether

> > >

> > > > > > > she ever reached her home !

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > Now after such a long gap the discussion on Gurus, Deeksha, Beej

Mantra,

> > >

> > > > > > > Guru Chaandal Yoga, Kanu Sanyal, Naxalbari has brought these

memories

> > >

> > > > > > > back to me as fresh as ever before.

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > As far me I feel that I have also fully understood that the

description

> > >

> > > > > > > of this yoga in Shastras was indirect and not so direct but it's

direct

> > >

> > > > > > > and literal meaning or name is CHAANDAL GURU-YOGA, If I may

rename it

> > >

> > > > > > > in direct form. The O.O. must have called me by thousand names

like

> > >

> > > > > > > CHAANDAL or manay more direct expletives , because he was in

dire needs

> > >

> > > > > > > of the wants of his body and mind....and after the police raid,

I

> > >

> > > > > > > deprived him of this real good oprtunity. But then, I do not

find any

> > >

> > > > > > > such yoga which can directly label me as CHAANDAL SHISHYA. And

lastly,

> > >

> > > > > > > that time I was running the mahadasha of Rahu-Rahu from

19-09-1966 to

> > >

> > > > > > > 01-01-1969.

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > Raj Bhardwaj

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > <%

40. com>,

> > >

> > > > > > > " rohinicrystal "

> > >

> > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@ > wrote:

> > >

> > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > Just an anecdotal suggestion, Raj_dada, if I may for you to

examine in

> > >

> > > > > > > your collection of charts or test bench.

> > >

> > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > I have always considered the lunar node as 'wild-cards' (The

joker in

> > >

> > > > > > > a game of cards! A chalnaa, a mimic, a 'Shape-shifter' etc).

This is why

> > >

> > > > > > > perhaps it is considered as a 'surrogate' that assumes the

persona and

> > >

> > > > > > > role of the planet it is associated with or failing that in

whose sign

> > >

> > > > > > > and nakshatra it is placed in). Particularly when a node is

moving

> > >

> > > > > > > towards the planet it is co-occuping a varga, it imbibes the

qualities

> > >

> > > > > > > and abilities of the planet concerned (I call it suction-yoga or

> > >

> > > > > > > Hoover-Yoga -- after the vacuum cleaner!). The planet so

affected loses

> > >

> > > > > > > some or all of its propensity and natural qualities for good or

bad! So

> > >

> > > > > > > a jupiter could lose its 'Teacher/priest- like nature', moon

could lose

> > >

> > > > > > > its sensitive, emotional side or memory, mars could lose its

> > >

> > > > > > > aggression.. . etc!). It may not be a complete loss but a

reduction in

> > >

> > > > > > > the qualities.

> > >

> > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > Such influence is not necessarily good or bad for the

individual

> > >

> > > > > > > depending on the personal nature of the node in the specific

chart!

> > >

> > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > Please remember that it is anecdotal! Try it at your own risk!

In fact

> > >

> > > > > > > for other novice readers, I would venture to add: PLEASE DON'T

TRY THIS

> > >

> > > > > > > AT HOME WITHOUT YOUR TEACHER OR PARENT BEING PRESENT CLOSE BY!

:-)

> > >

> > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > So nice to hear that cheerfulness is back in your heart. My

prayers

> > >

> > > > > > > and best wishes that Ma always shower Her blessings on ALL my

Dadas!

> > >

> > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan

> > >

> > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > <%

40. com>,

> > >

> > > > > > > " rajbhardwaj1949 "

> > >

> > > > > > > rajbhardwaj1949@ wrote:

> > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > Dear Bhai Rohini, Kulbir and Krishnan and all Jyotishis,

> > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > The thread on " Beej Mantra " and " I disagree " have been

really very

> > >

> > > > > > > > > interesting for me. After a long time I was enjoying and

smiling

> > >

> > > > > > > while

> > >

> > > > > > > > > reading the exchange, and at times I was humming. Completely

> > >

> > > > > > > relaxed. My

> > >

> > > > > > > > > wife had observed me at a few occasions and called my

younger

> > >

> > > > > > > daughter

> > >

> > > > > > > > > to observe me silently and also enjoyed finding me relaxed

with

> > >

> > > > > > > smile on

> > >

> > > > > > > > > my face. Somehow the subject in both the threads got

intermangled

> > >

> > > > > > > very

> > >

> > > > > > > > > beautifully. Guru,Shishya, Deekshya, traditions; cunturies

old and the

> > >

> > > > > > > > > current traits.

> > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > I have firm belief that almost all of us(other jyotishis

also

> > >

> > > > > > > included),

> > >

> > > > > > > > > who try to give answers to the queries to best of their

knowledge;

> > >

> > > > > > > and

> > >

> > > > > > > > > most of the times face brickbats and get No thanks, still go

on

> > >

> > > > > > > > > participating in their respective groups ,like addicts, not

> > >

> > > > > > > withstanding

> > >

> > > > > > > > > the skirmishes here and there.

> > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > This further strengthens my belief, that all such jyotishis

have

> > >

> > > > > > > learned

> > >

> > > > > > > > > jyotish with their own efforts, with no Guru or Gurukul. If

this is

> > >

> > > > > > > not

> > >

> > > > > > > > > Junoon, then what else. The will to learn and the will to do

bit of

> > >

> > > > > > > > > experiment too in the process.How much time it takes to

read, how

> > >

> > > > > > > quick

> > >

> > > > > > > > > reactions or delayed reactions take seeds in our minds, how

we

> > >

> > > > > > > prepare

> > >

> > > > > > > > > ourselves to gather the thoughts and type these to give them

a shape

> > >

> > > > > > > and

> > >

> > > > > > > > > not expecting anything in return. Just the pure joy and

> > >

> > > > > > > satisfaction.

> > >

> > > > > > > > > This is a continuous process of learning for us and I also

have no

> > >

> > > > > > > doubt

> > >

> > > > > > > > > that the young learner also must be picking a lots from what

appears

> > >

> > > > > > > in

> > >

> > > > > > > > > the group.

> > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > I will be hanged and stoned by the so called purists, if I

were to

> > >

> > > > > > > say

> > >

> > > > > > > > > that there is no need to have Guru, in the times we are

living. In

> > >

> > > > > > > other

> > >

> > > > > > > > > words every learner of Jyotish has his own free Will , if it

is

> > >

> > > > > > > > > Operational , to learn the Jyotish without being bound by

any

> > >

> > > > > > > > > Rules,Paramparas etc. This is so because the material and

> > >

> > > > > > > opportunity

> > >

> > > > > > > > > for picking up Jyotish is now really very easily available

and every

> > >

> > > > > > > > > learner has good faculties in the field of education and

languages.

> > >

> > > > > > > One

> > >

> > > > > > > > > just needs to have a keen eye and belief in himself. How

they will

> > >

> > > > > > > use

> > >

> > > > > > > > > their knowledge will depend solely on themselves.

> > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > While on the subject of , I (like many other Jyotishis) was

also

> > >

> > > > > > > witness

> > >

> > > > > > > > > to few other happenings involving a Guru and Shishya. I have

been

> > >

> > > > > > > > > thinking for quite some time about the " Guru-Chaandal Yoga " .

Why

> > >

> > > > > > > such

> > >

> > > > > > > > > yoga was mentioned in BPHS. Guru was specifically Jupiter,

but Rahu

> > >

> > > > > > > was

> > >

> > > > > > > > > not specifically Chandaal. I am not sure if Rahu has been

given the

> > >

> > > > > > > name

> > >

> > > > > > > > > of Chaandal in it's various descriptions. Now how this Yoga

is

> > >

> > > > > > > feared by

> > >

> > > > > > > > > all like Rahu dasha,Shani dasha, Shani Sade Sati etc. When a

learner

> > >

> > > > > > > > > like me perhaps does not get any reason to show the cause of

> > >

> > > > > > > problems in

> > >

> > > > > > > > > facing the jataka , we the lesser known jyotishis just take

names of

> > >

> > > > > > > > > such yogas or positions of Shani as the root cause of all

the

> > >

> > > > > > > problems.

> > >

> > > > > > > > > Very easy way out indeed.

> > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > I have been thinking a lot about The Guru-Chaandal Yoga and

somehow

> > >

> > > > > > > tend

> > >

> > > > > > > > > to believe, that Guru can become like a Chaandal in the real

sense.

> > >

> > > > > > > His

> > >

> > > > > > > > > all faculties are shut and whatever he does and utters is

very very

> > >

> > > > > > > > > surprising, it hits everything and everybody very hard. The

image of

> > >

> > > > > > > > > Guru becomes that of a Satan,as he breathes fire and breakes

all the

> > >

> > > > > > > so

> > >

> > > > > > > > > called maryada of a Guru, if there is anything called

maryada. When

> > >

> > > > > > > our

> > >

> > > > > > > > > Rishis mentioned this Guru -Chaandal Yoga, they really must

have all

> > >

> > > > > > > the

> > >

> > > > > > > > > rishis,munis, gurus who had dual personalities. There is no

need to

> > >

> > > > > > > > > elaborate this. The real meaning of Guru Chaandal Yoga seems

to have

> > >

> > > > > > > > > sink in now. It simply sinks the esteerm of a Guru, where a

Shishya

> > >

> > > > > > > is

> > >

> > > > > > > > > forced to challenge his Guru, and more the Guru accuses the

Shishya,

> > >

> > > > > > > > > more he exposes himself, and forces the Shishya to break his

silence

> > >

> > > > > > > and

> > >

> > > > > > > > > he starts hesitatingly initially but goes full blast

exposing the

> > >

> > > > > > > Guru.

> > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > But, then the Shishya also has to be a real learner, who

perhaps

> > >

> > > > > > > never

> > >

> > > > > > > > > depends solely and blindly on one Guru. Now a big question

which is

> > >

> > > > > > > > > staring me and I have been wondering why the fathers of

Jyotish did

> > >

> > > > > > > not

> > >

> > > > > > > > > mention about any yoga specifically , which could be termed

or

> > >

> > > > > > > called as

> > >

> > > > > > > > > " SHISHYA CHAANDAL " Yoga in the Jyotish !

> > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > Raj Bhardwaj

> > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > <%

40. com>,

> > >

> > > > > > > " rohinicrystal "

> > >

> > > > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@ > wrote:

> > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > But Praajee...!

> > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > IK HORE thaa jo Dasyaa gadheriyaan de-vichh, unna kol...!

> > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > Varah (12) thay unna-di banday! Jotish main jaisay!! Ek do

ghabraa

> > >

> > > > > > > > > gayey shaayad, aisaa sanu sunaa noo! Pher laut aayey US dey

Kaul

> > >

> > > > > > > usday

> > >

> > > > > > > > > 'marnay' day baad!

> > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > Kis-day kaul woh sab logaan lautay, mainu nai pataa!

> > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > Asi to sirf dekhnaay may zindagi gawaan dittay! Kinni -

Azib hai

> > >

> > > > > > > yeh

> > >

> > > > > > > > > kahaniyan bachchon di! Raab/Khudaa/ Parmeshwar/ God day

bachchoon-di!

> > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > Maaf karnaa praa -- punjabi bhot pyaari lagdii si magar ik

saal to

> > >

> > > > > > > > > nahin naa kafi! Shaayad aglay janam main kuch hor

seekh-layngay, jo

> > >

> > > > > > > raha

> > >

> > > > > > > > > giya si is janam-vich baki!

> > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > Aankhaan khulie rakhiyo! Aandar_waali! ! ;-)

> > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > Happy Easter!!

> > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan

> > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > @ .

com<% 40. com>,

> > >

> > > > > > > Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@

> > >

> > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > SiRR ji,

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > HUSH is the word;

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Bolan naalon chup changeri, chup de naalon parda; je

MANSOOR na

> > >

> > > > > > > > > bolda taan

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > sooli kahnu Chadhda.

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Silence is golden; veil of secrecy even better, Mansoor

wouldn't

> > >

> > > > > > > > > have been

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > hanged on gallows ;had he preferred silence.

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Regards

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Kulbir Bains

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > ------------ --------- ---------

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > ** rohinicrystal jyotish_vani@

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > *To:* @ .

com<% 40. com>

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > *Sent:* Sun, 21 March, 2010 6:15:54 AM

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > *Subject:* Re: Information about beej mantra

sadhana's ?

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Kulbir_praaji,

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > This 'regulation' , " ...if deeksha of beej mantra is

given by

> > >

> > > > > > > > > competent

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > guru, then it becomes the responsibility of the guru to

bring

> > >

> > > > > > > > > salvation to

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > the disciple. " -- has an interesting wrinkle!

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > It implies that the Guru himself/herself has already

attained

> > >

> > > > > > > > > salvation!

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > I think it is safe to assume that such deekshas are

being given

> > >

> > > > > > > in

> > >

> > > > > > > > > the

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > hundreds of thousands, if not millions, world-wide ;-)

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Now Chelaa poochtaa hai, " If there are so many millions

of Gurus

> > >

> > > > > > > who

> > >

> > > > > > > > > have

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > attained salvation already... Why is the earth and

humanity

> > >

> > > > > > > > > suffering so

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > much? " :-B

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > ~Sab kuch seekha humnay, naa seekhie hoshiyari, Sach hai

duniya

> > >

> > > > > > > > > walon kay

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > hum SUB hain anadi/anari! ~

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

[Guest guest]

Dear RR_jee,

well written but not understood by me.

Inder

 

, " rohinicrystal " <jyotish_vani

wrote:

>

> Chandrashekhar_jee,

>

> I have noticed that those too preoccupied and focused on nodes run into a

situational problem which has an allegoric correlation! Rahu, unmitigated* could

result in the feet not touching the ground, while ketu unmitigated* could result

in one losing one's head (common sense!) and the analogy should be obvious given

what Vishnu's Chakra did to Swarbhanu :-)

>

> Rohiniranjan

>

> *Important conditional consideration!!

>

>

>

> , " Chandrashekhar "

<sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote:

> >

> > Dear Rohini,

> >

> > Do not be modest unnecessarily.

> >

> > Being Chaya grahas they express themselves through others, so the laser

analogy seems appropriate.

> >

> > It is also wondrous that though we are in a way living on the surface of

Rahu we fail to recognize the Prithvi, as such.

> >

> > Take care,

> > Chandrashekhar.

> > -

> > rohinicrystal

> >

> > Tuesday, March 30, 2010 4:02 AM

> > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> >

> >

> >

> > Dear Chandrashekhar_jee,

> >

> > I may not have the profound experience of many of the currently famous and

vocal Jyotish-pragnaas (Internet and otherwise), but I have been consistently

impressed by the enormous spectrum and capability and potential of both Rahu and

Ketu in the lives of human beings -- particularly those who have diverse

experience as opposed to those who are stuck in a groove, as the expression

goes.

> >

> > The lunar nodes have enormous potential but like a hologram trapped in a

crystal they remain just a piece of decoration unless and until they are ignited

by a beam of laser! Then their message comes alive (I hate to use a movie

reference in this fairly heavy duty serious forum but those still young at heart

may recall the modern EPIC Starwars and Princess Leah's entry and message!)

> >

> > This has reference to my recent message to, I believe Kulbir, where I

referred to the laser, albeit not directly! Parashara did not write about Laser

but BPHS (I dare say, any version, perhaps) refers to it very clearly and

convincingly!

> >

> > Regards,

> >

> > Rohiniranjan

> >

> > , " Chandrashekhar "

<sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Inderji,

> > >

> > > Is Rahu also not said to cause understanding of complex subjects (when

in 5th) and give one Ganga snan(When in 10th)?

> > >

> > > Regards,

> > > Chandrashekhar

> > > -

> > > inder

> > >

> > > Monday, March 29, 2010 3:11 PM

> > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > No dear, we shall not fight. I am again refering to imaginary situation

that if we start fighting here it becomes Guru-Chaandal situation.

> > > Rahu creats sudden, unexpected, good or nasty situations. Rahu is all

about effects.

> > > Inder

> > >

> > > , " Chandrashekhar "

<sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Dear Inderji,

> > > >

> > > > I thought we were talking about effects of Guru Chandal yoga. It seems

like I was wrong and you were alluding to Guru Chandal situation.

> > > >

> > > > Anyway why should we start fight on this as we are obviously talking

about two different things?

> > > >

> > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > -

> > > > inder

> > > >

> > > > Sunday, March 28, 2010 5:05 PM

> > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Dear Chanrashekhar ji,

> > > >

> > > > Think of a hypothetical situation say 200 hundred years ago.

> > > > Two Vidvan Pandit ji are sitting together and nicely exchanging

pleasantries. Now they come out and join a vast gathering of people.

> > > > Very soon they would pick up fight with difference of opinion on some

ritual procedures or some interpretations in presence of mass gathering saving

their egos and creating mass hysteria which would be further spread into

village/town and house discussion.This is sort of Guru Chaandal situation.This

is one example. So they loose their GURUDUM with Rahu effect.

> > > >

> > > > Donot take chaandal in literal terms, most of the people doing menial,

small jobs, even dead body falls under Saturn.May be people carrying petty tales

or rumours fall under Rahu.

> > > >

> > > > If we start fight here for example on this issue, it would certainly

be Rahu effect.

> > > >

> > > > Inder

> > > > , " Chandrashekhar "

<sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear Inderjee,

> > > > >

> > > > > Does not Rahu rule over the Chandals? That is why he is also called

Chandal. So Guru Chandala yoga is nothing but conjunction of Guru and Rahu.

> > > > >

> > > > > Personally I think that though people tend to connect the word

chandal with the morals or behaviour of a person who has Guru Chandal yoga, that

might not be the case always.

> > > > >

> > > > > Rahu gives results of the bhavesha whom he conjoins so Rahu will

give results of Guru while Guru himself may not be able to give his full results

during its dasha.

> > > > >

> > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > >

> > > > > -

> > > > > inder

> > > > >

> > > > > Saturday, March 27, 2010 5:12 PM

> > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear friends,

> > > > >

> > > > > This discussion on Guru-Chaandal Yoga is very interesting.Let me

give my submissions.

> > > > >

> > > > > Why Rahu was called Chaandal was perhaps to give some derogatotry

remark to chhaya graha RAHU.

> > > > >

> > > > > Earlier I gave one theory:Karaka for internet is Rahu.So in the

mordern times real Rahu is internet.

> > > > >

> > > > > Beauty of Rahu is that it is infinite, shapeless, colourless and

formless and takes shape and characterstics of the planet with which it comes in

contact.

> > > > >

> > > > > Internet astrology is all about Mercury+ Rahu or Mercury + Jupiter +

Rahu.

> > > > >

> > > > > Internet can take any shape and character as gets associated with

the type of people-- astro sites, religious sites, terrorists sits , porno

sites, sports sites etc.

> > > > >

> > > > > Why Chanadal-- as it distracts mind, makes the mind hazy and

infinite.

> > > > >

> > > > > Once with internet religious site or astro site or any site you will

have distracted mind, cannot perform even your Yoga or daily religious rituals

with concentration. You can not go and expand inwards when expanding infinite

outside.

> > > > >

> > > > > Earlier olden days Rahu effects were in the form of Melas,

processions, committees, rumours, epidemics, foreign influences etc.

> > > > > But the moderm dayday epidemic is internet.

> > > > >

> > > > > My experience is when you are running bhukti/antra /prana [lahiri]

of planet which is in star sub or subsub of Rahu, you get engulfed in internet

whirlpool and will not have peace of mind.

> > > > >

> > > > > Also I have feeling that if you are seeing a chart of a real Yogi

who is not at-all connected to out world but only internal Samadhi , we should

remove Rahu-Ketu from the chart.In any case Rahu is MAYA of relative position of

earth, Moon and Sun.

> > > > >

> > > > > Some members crtisize that internet astrology is spoiled and it is

hasty, irreligious etc, but this Chanadal has some positive aspects also as like

it expands your knowledge to limitless sphere.

> > > > > Moreover internet is democratic- leaves you no choice except to

tolerate difference of opinion. It equilizes[learned and ordinary people] all

the people in formless networking.

> > > > >

> > > > > It captures you, engulfs you.For your family members ,it is really a

Chaandal[Guru chandal or budhha chanda or shukra or shani chandal doen not

matter to them]

> > > > >

> > > > > Inder

> > > > > , Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb@>

wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Sir Raj Bhardwaj ji,

> > > > > > Kamaal kar diya ji aapne, Zinda undhaharan pesh kar di. MARHABA

> > > > > > Regards

> > > > > > Kulbir Bains.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > On Sat, Mar 27, 2010 at 12:12 AM, Raj <rajbhardwaj1949@> wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Yes Rohini and Kulbeer Bhai, I tend to agree with your anecdote "

> > > > > > > Shape Shifter " ! Here I would just try to also cover the first

line of

> > > > > > > Kulbeer on the subject - Gurus plays a social role so do the

> > > > > > > prostitutes.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Just 4 days ago , Kanu Sanyal, the man who started a peasants

movement

> > > > > > > in a very small village named " Naxalbari " , which ultimately

> > > > > > > became to be known the Naxals or Naxalites ; and it's further

> > > > > > > carnation , the present day's PWG(People's War Group), committed

> > > > > > > suicide,found hanging in his one room hutment in his native

village,

> > > > > > > frustrated with the changes in the ideology of the present

CPI(M) in the

> > > > > > > garb of PWG. He was the GURU of Naxalite movement,which began

against

> > > > > > > the Zamindars in the end of year 1966 or begening of 1967, and

slowly

> > > > > > > and steadily spearead in the most states of India.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I had finished my 1 year training in the Air Force and my first

posting

> > > > > > > was in a place called Bengdubi, about 30 Kms from Naxalbari

village ,

> > > > > > > near Baghdogra, in Siliguri,Distt Darjeeling in October,1968.

Movements

> > > > > > > of defence personnel in this region were well guarded.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > On a holiday, I was doing the duty as deputy of the `Orderly

> > > > > > > Officer'(who looks after each happenings within the Unit). In

the

> > > > > > > evening, he just called his driver to take out the Nissan Jonga.

He also

> > > > > > > called me out and asked me to sit in the back side of

vehicle,with my

> > > > > > > Sten Gun. The vehicle moved out of the Unit, and he looked back

from

> > > > > > > the rear window and asked me Lal-Batti dekhi hai kabhi ? I

nodded in

> > > > > > > negative. After about 20 minutes drive, we entered the Siliguri,

and

> > > > > > > headed towards a small colony of huts and mud houses. The

vehicle

> > > > > > > stopped. He got down and told me just see around, I shall be

back

> > > > > > > quickly. I was looking out and also had to stretch my head out a

number

> > > > > > > of times , to fathom out that this place was indeed a Red Light

area.

> > > > > > > Such areas are strictly `Out of Bounds' for the defence

> > > > > > > personnel ,which was taught in our training manuals. And Lo,

there was

> > > > > > > suddenly a big commotion in the area and I saw a number of civil

police

> > > > > > > personnel forcing out the women from their living places ; and

throwing

> > > > > > > them in the police lorry. Then I looked at my Orderly Officer

running

> > > > > > > running towards our vehicle, trying to hold his pants tightly. A

fat

> > > > > > > man,must be about 55 years, on the verge of retirement, looking

very

> > > > > > > funny to me. Then in a flash I noticed a young girl dashing

towards back

> > > > > > > of our vehicle, trying to catch it and enter. At the same

moment, our

> > > > > > > vehicle started. I just extended my arm out , the girl found it

to be

> > > > > > > helping hand, I pulled her inside and she sat on the floor of

the

> > > > > > > vehicle. Few policemen did try to run after her, but they had

stopped,

> > > > > > > having seen that ours was a defence vehicle.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > She was trying to get her breathing normal and I was looking at

her

> > > > > > > nonchalantly. After few minutes the O.O peeped back from the

small rear

> > > > > > > window' and shouted " Who the bitch is this?. I did not reply.

> > > > > > > But I think that the driver must have also noticed everything ,

like me

> > > > > > > in the tript to Lal Batti. After about 5 minutes the O.O. again

peeped

> > > > > > > back and said ` Hey boy I will take this girl to my Barrack. I

kept

> > > > > > > mum. My mind was blank. No thought was crossing my mind, as far

as I

> > > > > > > still remember. In the meantime I asked the girl about herself.

She told

> > > > > > > that she is from Rajasthan and one of her uncles had brought her

to

> > > > > > > this place 6 months back and she will be grateful if I can help

her to

> > > > > > > go to Rajasthan. I knew that the Railway Station was just on the

way. As

> > > > > > > we reached near the main gate, I called out the driver and

commanded him

> > > > > > > to stop the vehicle. I had just about 3 Rupees with me and gave

it to

> > > > > > > the girl and apologized that I cannot help her further, she

should just

> > > > > > > catch any available train and try to take help from any one and

not to

> > > > > > > worry, YOU will reach your Home. As the vehicle was slowing

down, the

> > > > > > > O.O. shouted at me and ordered me that the girl with go with us.

I

> > > > > > > simply pointed my Sten Gun in his direction and slowly brought

it near

> > > > > > > his nose where he could feel the heat ..and he closed the rear

> > > > > > > window. The vehicle stopped and I helped the girl out of the

vehicle. I

> > > > > > > still carry the memory of her tearful eyes with full of karuna

and

> > > > > > > thanks giving , till the vehicle moved out of her sight. I felt

so

> > > > > > > tired and exhausted , I simply slumped on my seat.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > On the way back thoughts started crossing my mind that a senior

is

> > > > > > > always a senior in the armed forces, if the O.O. wants he can

place me

> > > > > > > under arrest after reaching the unit and frame any flimsy charge

sheet

> > > > > > > against me and I could even face a court martial. My soul told

me no

> > > > > > > fears so be it. Then I took a resolve that if it so happens, I

will kill

> > > > > > > this son of a Gun senior- the Teacher-the Mentor-The supposed

guide to

> > > > > > > me, by virtue of his being senior to me in rank in age. But

nothing ever

> > > > > > > happened further on this count. For years on, I went on feeling

sorry

> > > > > > > that I could not help her any further and would always wonder

whether

> > > > > > > she ever reached her home !

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Now after such a long gap the discussion on Gurus, Deeksha, Beej

Mantra,

> > > > > > > Guru Chaandal Yoga, Kanu Sanyal, Naxalbari has brought these

memories

> > > > > > > back to me as fresh as ever before.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > As far me I feel that I have also fully understood that the

description

> > > > > > > of this yoga in Shastras was indirect and not so direct but it's

direct

> > > > > > > and literal meaning or name is CHAANDAL GURU-YOGA, If I may

rename it

> > > > > > > in direct form. The O.O. must have called me by thousand names

like

> > > > > > > CHAANDAL or manay more direct expletives , because he was in

dire needs

> > > > > > > of the wants of his body and mind....and after the police raid,

I

> > > > > > > deprived him of this real good oprtunity. But then, I do not

find any

> > > > > > > such yoga which can directly label me as CHAANDAL SHISHYA. And

lastly,

> > > > > > > that time I was running the mahadasha of Rahu-Rahu from

19-09-1966 to

> > > > > > > 01-01-1969.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Raj Bhardwaj

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > --- In

<%40>,

> > > > > > > " rohinicrystal "

> > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Just an anecdotal suggestion, Raj_dada, if I may for you to

examine in

> > > > > > > your collection of charts or test bench.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > I have always considered the lunar node as 'wild-cards' (The

joker in

> > > > > > > a game of cards! A chalnaa, a mimic, a 'Shape-shifter' etc).

This is why

> > > > > > > perhaps it is considered as a 'surrogate' that assumes the

persona and

> > > > > > > role of the planet it is associated with or failing that in

whose sign

> > > > > > > and nakshatra it is placed in). Particularly when a node is

moving

> > > > > > > towards the planet it is co-occuping a varga, it imbibes the

qualities

> > > > > > > and abilities of the planet concerned (I call it suction-yoga or

> > > > > > > Hoover-Yoga -- after the vacuum cleaner!). The planet so

affected loses

> > > > > > > some or all of its propensity and natural qualities for good or

bad! So

> > > > > > > a jupiter could lose its 'Teacher/priest-like nature', moon

could lose

> > > > > > > its sensitive, emotional side or memory, mars could lose its

> > > > > > > aggression... etc!). It may not be a complete loss but a

reduction in

> > > > > > > the qualities.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Such influence is not necessarily good or bad for the

individual

> > > > > > > depending on the personal nature of the node in the specific

chart!

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Please remember that it is anecdotal! Try it at your own risk!

In fact

> > > > > > > for other novice readers, I would venture to add: PLEASE DON'T

TRY THIS

> > > > > > > AT HOME WITHOUT YOUR TEACHER OR PARENT BEING PRESENT CLOSE BY!

:-)

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > So nice to hear that cheerfulness is back in your heart. My

prayers

> > > > > > > and best wishes that Ma always shower Her blessings on ALL my

Dadas!

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > --- In

<%40>,

> > > > > > > " rajbhardwaj1949 "

> > > > > > > rajbhardwaj1949@ wrote:

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Dear Bhai Rohini, Kulbir and Krishnan and all Jyotishis,

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > The thread on " Beej Mantra " and " I disagree " have been

really very

> > > > > > > > > interesting for me. After a long time I was enjoying and

smiling

> > > > > > > while

> > > > > > > > > reading the exchange, and at times I was humming. Completely

> > > > > > > relaxed. My

> > > > > > > > > wife had observed me at a few occasions and called my

younger

> > > > > > > daughter

> > > > > > > > > to observe me silently and also enjoyed finding me relaxed

with

> > > > > > > smile on

> > > > > > > > > my face. Somehow the subject in both the threads got

intermangled

> > > > > > > very

> > > > > > > > > beautifully. Guru,Shishya,Deekshya,traditions; cunturies old

and the

> > > > > > > > > current traits.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > I have firm belief that almost all of us(other jyotishis

also

> > > > > > > included),

> > > > > > > > > who try to give answers to the queries to best of their

knowledge;

> > > > > > > and

> > > > > > > > > most of the times face brickbats and get No thanks, still go

on

> > > > > > > > > participating in their respective groups ,like addicts, not

> > > > > > > withstanding

> > > > > > > > > the skirmishes here and there.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > This further strengthens my belief, that all such jyotishis

have

> > > > > > > learned

> > > > > > > > > jyotish with their own efforts, with no Guru or Gurukul. If

this is

> > > > > > > not

> > > > > > > > > Junoon, then what else. The will to learn and the will to do

bit of

> > > > > > > > > experiment too in the process.How much time it takes to

read, how

> > > > > > > quick

> > > > > > > > > reactions or delayed reactions take seeds in our minds, how

we

> > > > > > > prepare

> > > > > > > > > ourselves to gather the thoughts and type these to give them

a shape

> > > > > > > and

> > > > > > > > > not expecting anything in return. Just the pure joy and

> > > > > > > satisfaction.

> > > > > > > > > This is a continuous process of learning for us and I also

have no

> > > > > > > doubt

> > > > > > > > > that the young learner also must be picking a lots from what

appears

> > > > > > > in

> > > > > > > > > the group.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > I will be hanged and stoned by the so called purists, if I

were to

> > > > > > > say

> > > > > > > > > that there is no need to have Guru, in the times we are

living. In

> > > > > > > other

> > > > > > > > > words every learner of Jyotish has his own free Will , if it

is

> > > > > > > > > Operational , to learn the Jyotish without being bound by

any

> > > > > > > > > Rules,Paramparas etc. This is so because the material and

> > > > > > > opportunity

> > > > > > > > > for picking up Jyotish is now really very easily available

and every

> > > > > > > > > learner has good faculties in the field of education and

languages.

> > > > > > > One

> > > > > > > > > just needs to have a keen eye and belief in himself. How

they will

> > > > > > > use

> > > > > > > > > their knowledge will depend solely on themselves.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > While on the subject of , I (like many other Jyotishis) was

also

> > > > > > > witness

> > > > > > > > > to few other happenings involving a Guru and Shishya. I have

been

> > > > > > > > > thinking for quite some time about the " Guru-Chaandal Yoga " .

Why

> > > > > > > such

> > > > > > > > > yoga was mentioned in BPHS. Guru was specifically Jupiter,

but Rahu

> > > > > > > was

> > > > > > > > > not specifically Chandaal. I am not sure if Rahu has been

given the

> > > > > > > name

> > > > > > > > > of Chaandal in it's various descriptions. Now how this Yoga

is

> > > > > > > feared by

> > > > > > > > > all like Rahu dasha,Shani dasha, Shani Sade Sati etc. When a

learner

> > > > > > > > > like me perhaps does not get any reason to show the cause of

> > > > > > > problems in

> > > > > > > > > facing the jataka , we the lesser known jyotishis just take

names of

> > > > > > > > > such yogas or positions of Shani as the root cause of all

the

> > > > > > > problems.

> > > > > > > > > Very easy way out indeed.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > I have been thinking a lot about The Guru-Chaandal Yoga and

somehow

> > > > > > > tend

> > > > > > > > > to believe, that Guru can become like a Chaandal in the real

sense.

> > > > > > > His

> > > > > > > > > all faculties are shut and whatever he does and utters is

very very

> > > > > > > > > surprising, it hits everything and everybody very hard. The

image of

> > > > > > > > > Guru becomes that of a Satan,as he breathes fire and breakes

all the

> > > > > > > so

> > > > > > > > > called maryada of a Guru, if there is anything called

maryada. When

> > > > > > > our

> > > > > > > > > Rishis mentioned this Guru -Chaandal Yoga, they really must

have all

> > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > rishis,munis,gurus who had dual personalities. There is no

need to

> > > > > > > > > elaborate this. The real meaning of Guru Chaandal Yoga seems

to have

> > > > > > > > > sink in now. It simply sinks the esteerm of a Guru, where a

Shishya

> > > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > > forced to challenge his Guru, and more the Guru accuses the

Shishya,

> > > > > > > > > more he exposes himself, and forces the Shishya to break his

silence

> > > > > > > and

> > > > > > > > > he starts hesitatingly initially but goes full blast

exposing the

> > > > > > > Guru.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > But, then the Shishya also has to be a real learner, who

perhaps

> > > > > > > never

> > > > > > > > > depends solely and blindly on one Guru. Now a big question

which is

> > > > > > > > > staring me and I have been wondering why the fathers of

Jyotish did

> > > > > > > not

> > > > > > > > > mention about any yoga specifically , which could be termed

or

> > > > > > > called as

> > > > > > > > > " SHISHYA CHAANDAL " Yoga in the Jyotish !

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Raj Bhardwaj

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > --- In

<%40>,

> > > > > > > " rohinicrystal "

> > > > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > But Praajee...!

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > IK HORE thaa jo Dasyaa gadheriyaan de-vichh, unna kol...!

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Varah (12) thay unna-di banday! Jotish main jaisay!! Ek do

ghabraa

> > > > > > > > > gayey shaayad, aisaa sanu sunaa noo! Pher laut aayey US dey

Kaul

> > > > > > > usday

> > > > > > > > > 'marnay' day baad!

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Kis-day kaul woh sab logaan lautay, mainu nai pataa!

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Asi to sirf dekhnaay may zindagi gawaan dittay! Kinni -

Azib hai

> > > > > > > yeh

> > > > > > > > > kahaniyan bachchon di! Raab/Khudaa/Parmeshwar/God day

bachchoon-di!

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Maaf karnaa praa -- punjabi bhot pyaari lagdii si magar ik

saal to

> > > > > > > > > nahin naa kafi! Shaayad aglay janam main kuch hor

seekh-layngay, jo

> > > > > > > raha

> > > > > > > > > giya si is janam-vich baki!

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Aankhaan khulie rakhiyo! Aandar_waali!! ;-)

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Happy Easter!!

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > --- In

<%40>,

> > > > > > > Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@

> > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > SiRR ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > HUSH is the word;

> > > > > > > > > > > Bolan naalon chup changeri, chup de naalon parda; je

MANSOOR na

> > > > > > > > > bolda taan

> > > > > > > > > > > sooli kahnu Chadhda.

> > > > > > > > > > > Silence is golden; veil of secrecy even better, Mansoor

wouldn't

> > > > > > > > > have been

> > > > > > > > > > > hanged on gallows ;had he preferred silence.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Regards

> > > > > > > > > > > Kulbir Bains

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------

> > > > > > > > > > > ** rohinicrystal jyotish_vani@

> > > > > > > > > > > *To:*

<%40>

> > > > > > > > > > > *Sent:* Sun, 21 March, 2010 6:15:54 AM

> > > > > > > > > > > *Subject:* Re: Information about beej mantra

sadhana's ?

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Kulbir_praaji,

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > This 'regulation' , " ...if deeksha of beej mantra is

given by

> > > > > > > > > competent

> > > > > > > > > > > guru, then it becomes the responsibility of the guru to

bring

> > > > > > > > > salvation to

> > > > > > > > > > > the disciple. " -- has an interesting wrinkle!

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > It implies that the Guru himself/herself has already

attained

> > > > > > > > > salvation!

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > I think it is safe to assume that such deekshas are

being given

> > > > > > > in

> > > > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > > hundreds of thousands, if not millions, world-wide ;-)

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Now Chelaa poochtaa hai, " If there are so many millions

of Gurus

> > > > > > > who

> > > > > > > > > have

> > > > > > > > > > > attained salvation already... Why is the earth and

humanity

> > > > > > > > > suffering so

> > > > > > > > > > > much? " :-B

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > ~Sab kuch seekha humnay, naa seekhie hoshiyari, Sach hai

duniya

> > > > > > > > > walon kay

> > > > > > > > > > > hum SUB hain anadi/anari! ~

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

[Guest guest]

Dear Kulbir,

I donot agree with you.

Anyway does'nt matter.

Inder

 

, Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb wrote:

>

> Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best pragmatic way

> possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says.

> House no 11. represents SABKI APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN earning. In 11th

> house itself, is the seat of justice/judge. Saturn takes the incurred karma

> via Rahu and Ketu before Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the seat of judge

> but Saturn is the drishti to guide it).

> Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter passes it on Saturn's

> recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in mind. (khuda ko hazir

> mankar).

> Regards

> Kulbir Bains.

>

> On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder <indervohra2001 wrote:

>

> >

> >

> > Dear Kulbir,

> > Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement.[correct or incorrect]

> > Saturn is illegal,[but may be correct],thinking.

> >

> > Jupiter + Saturn becomes philospher.[nothing good or bad, but thinking

> > makes it so]

> >

> > Mars with Jupiter logic[logician], without reading the law books he would

> > give arguments which may win him.

> >

> > Inder

> >

> >

> >

> > SURRENDER JOYFULLY TO THE WILL OF THE ULTIMATE DIVINITY AND RELISH THE

> > TASTE OF ABSOLUTE BLISS.

> >

> > [image:

Groups]</;_ylc=X3oDMTJkYWw3dmxoBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAz\

k2OTk4NjIEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDgyNjkwBHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA2dmcARzdGltZQMxMjY5OTM0NDUz>

> > Switch to:

Text-Only<-traditional ?subject=Change+Delivery+F\

ormat:+Traditional>,

> > Daily

Digest<-digest ?subject=Email+Delivery:+Digest>•

> >

Un<- ?subject=Un>•

Terms

> > of Use <>

> > .

> >

> >

> >

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Dear Rohini,

 

Mangal is called that perhaps as he is energy and also mythologically it

absorbed blood of Andhakasur, thus killing him in Andhalaasura Shiva fight?

 

It is perhaps like a weapon of offence giving good results in hands of the

protector of the country but bad in hands of the terrorists.

 

Take care,

Chandrashekhar.

-

rohinicrystal

Wednesday, March 31, 2010 3:43 AM

Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

 

 

 

Chandrashekhar_jee and Raj bhaisaheb,

 

I have generally winced a bit when people try to equate and extrapolate

directly and literally from ancient allegories and in my opinion that creates

problems which creates the 'black and white' in astrology. The latest that we

have observed being the words from " Rahu is uncondtionally bad " camp.

 

My personal preference is to take the allegories as nice mnemonics or memory

aids but not an exhaustive description of the 'planets' concerned from an

astrological point of view. The story of swarbhanu, the story of Kach and

Devyani, and even the story of Harishchandra in Shani Mahatmay are great

pointers and make what can be a rather dry subject (Astrology with its terse

rules and exceptions!) interesting and even lively! But, if we get stuck in the

mindset that those stories and allegories capture the entire essence of

astrological reality or astrological details, then that would be a serious loss

for the astrology learners and practitioners. Particularly the ones who actually

read charts or give readings (the applied and practical astrologers).

 

The astrological reality (more than sun in leo in 4th will result in this or

that... for instance!) is multifactorial and rather than seeing the

benefic/malefic dichotomy as absolute, I wish people will consider the

modification and modulation of the essential, central characteristics of planets

and realize that without such nuances and influences, astrology will begin to

look rather threadbare.

 

I am of the opinion that the karakatwas given in Jyotish texts such as BPHS

(and I do not mean BPHS alone!) describe the core properties or values of the

planets and we must not stray too far from those. In contrast, texts such as

uttarkalamrita despite their prolific treatment of karakas must be considered

with a pinch of salt, or at least some of the labels given there in the context

of karakattwas.

 

Some of the problems inherent in the 'modern' labels (neokarakatwas!) while

being useful raise one question. How careful was the author or proponent in

making sure that what he or she is giving is the nascent karakttwa and not the

result of a multifactorial influence or compound karakattwa? What one is

attributing to Jupiter for instance -- if derived from astrological

observations, how much of the description is for the planet itself and what

component or contamination in chemical mixture terms can be attributed to a

melange of influences? It is often very difficult to tease out the influences of

individual participants in a property or label which sometimes is ascribed to a

single planet.

 

I am not saying that BPHS alone is correct in all instances but certainly a

safe starting point! Others may differ in their opinion, of course.

 

Speaking of names, the label MANGAL for mars is intriguing. Why is a malefic

that is cruel and associated with wounds, injuries, aggression, cutting etc

should be associated with mangal which represents beneficience, shubha,

amelioration?

 

I am sure there are many similar nomenclatural puzzles in Jyotish and I

realize that one lifetime is not sufficient to figure out all the labels and

what not, but certainly makes the study of astrology rather interesting.

 

Rohiniranjan

 

, " Chandrashekhar "

<sharma.chandrashekhar wrote:

>

> Dear Raj,

>

> I have already read your experience with interest. I can also understand

what you felt as it was an absolutely wicked situation. You did something that

needed great courage, knowing the way Army works.

>

> But I am one who can not equate ideologue of a violent movement, even for

good causes, with Guru. In jyotish I always prefer to keep the grahas and our

concepts about what their names should mean in the light of Puranas separate.

May be not exactly separate but my interpretation of the puranic stories in

explaining the nature of grahas is at variance with what is generally thought

and so I prefer to keep it to myself.

>

> Take care,

> Chandrashekhar.

>

>

> -

> Raj

>

> Tuesday, March 30, 2010 9:52 AM

> Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

>

>

>

> Dear Chandrashekhar Ji,

> I am enjoying your posts. But, I feel you could have missed my msg No.73157

and what was the context of Guru-Rahu yuti,in the present times. ! I hope you

will like reading it, as the thread began from there.! With my best regards.

>

> Raj Bhardwaj

>

> , " Chandrashekhar "

<sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote:

> >

> > Dear Vattem Krishnan,

> >

> > I was responding to Rohini's mail. I have already made clear what is meant

by Chandal and what by MlecCha. I had said " One meaning of Chandal is worst

amongst men and that of Mlecha is a wicked man, a foreigner, one who does not

speak Sanskrit etc. So that too is right. "

> >

> > Regards,

> > Chandrashekhar

> >

> >

> > -

> > Vattem Krishnan

> >

> > Monday, March 29, 2010 12:37 PM

> > Re: Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> >

> >

> >

> > Dear Sir,

> > It is true that persons opeartating from burial grounds are referred with

this term.It's application however to Rahu in litteral terms is not properly

substantiated.mlechas are not chandals.

> > In our epics more so when we recollect about Raja Satya Harischndra

Story,we find the reference of " Chandal " the one who burns dead bodies and keeps

watch at burial grounds.

> > Doms are not falling under chandal category.Some where it is also

mentioned to cannibals or narbhakshas as chnadals.

> >

> > Vattem Krishnan Cyber Jyotish Services(For all counseling

services)Dr.B.V.Raman " Fools Obey Planets While Wisemen Can Control Them " Planets

are neutral Controllers of Mans Karma

> >

> > --- On Sun, 3/28/10, Chandrashekhar <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote:

> >

> > Chandrashekhar <sharma.chandrashekhar@>

> > Re: Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> >

> > Sunday, March 28, 2010, 3:15 PM

> >

> >

> >

> > Dear Rohini Ranjan,

> >

> > I am trying to acquire its manuscript, through one of my friends and hope

to learn some more about Paraashara.

> >

> > Yes, Chandal is an interesting term. They are generally thought to be

those who operate at funeral sites.

> >

> > Rahu is enigmatic planet and so has not rest or does not allow others to

rest.

> >

> > Regards,

> >

> > Chandrashekhar.

> >

> > -

> >

> > rohinicrystal

> >

> >

> >

> > Sunday, March 28, 2010 11:57 PM

> >

> > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> >

> > Chandrashekhar jee,

> >

> > Thanks for taking the time, Sir. I have not had the good fortune of having

seen Vriddha Parashari. I have only studied BPHS, Parashara Samhita and

Laghu/madhya parashari.

> >

> > My urdu is rather limited, actually.

> >

> > Chandaal is a very interesting term and at one point were thought of as

the '5th caste'! In MP they were called Dom and in bengal nomoshuddoor.

> >

> > Poor Rahu! Even on its home-turf (internet according to some) there is no

rest for the wicked :-)

> >

> > Rohiniranjan

> >

> > , " Chandrashekhar "

<sharma.chandrashek har@> wrote:

> >

> > >

> >

> > > Dear Rohini Ranjan,

> >

> > >

> >

> > > One meaning of Chandal is worst amongst men and that of Mlecha is a

wicked man, a foreigner, one who does not speak Sanskrit etc. So that too is

right.

> >

> > >

> >

> > > So your contention is also correct. I liked the comment about change of

perception between ibtedah and inteha. You must be pretty good at Urdu?

> >

> > >

> >

> > > Have you heard of a manuscript called Vriddha Parashari?

> >

> > >

> >

> > > Regards,

> >

> > > Chandrashekhar.

> >

> > >

> >

> > > -

> >

> > > rohinicrystal

> >

> > >

> >

> > > Sunday, March 28, 2010 5:45 AM

> >

> > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> >

> > >

> >

> > >

> >

> > >

> >

> > > Dear Chandrashekhar jee,

> >

> > >

> >

> > > I have also heard that rahu represents mlechchaas or 'other

cultures/foreign cultures'

> >

> > >

> >

> > > Often plays a part according to what jyotishis " claim " that it has to do

with journey abroad or marrying into other cultures and religions and so on.

Just another wrinkle, I suppose! But by no means uncommon, based on the queries

received by jyotishis working actively on the " Jyotish HOT-LINE! "

> >

> > >

> >

> > > As touched upon in my astrotreasures article written long ago and posted

on boloji years later -- BPHS changed its perspective between the ibetadh and

inteha! That was a clue for me that I tuned-in profitably (in terms of

learning!) -- and the fact that it was placed so close to Sudarshan completed

the clue for me!

> >

> > >

> >

> > > Krishna was the awataar of Vishnu that carried the Sudarshan Chakra and

was Poorna Purusha! If I write anything further on this matter in this august

forum, I will be insulting the intelligence and Gnan of the inhabitants on this

huge Island!

> >

> > >

> >

> > > Rohiniranjan

> >

> > >

> >

> > > , " Chandrashekhar "

<sharma.chandrashek har@> wrote:

> >

> > > >

> >

> > > > Dear Inderjee,

> >

> > > >

> >

> > > > Does not Rahu rule over the Chandals? That is why he is also called

Chandal. So Guru Chandala yoga is nothing but conjunction of Guru and Rahu.

> >

> > > >

> >

> > > > Personally I think that though people tend to connect the word chandal

with the morals or behaviour of a person who has Guru Chandal yoga, that might

not be the case always.

> >

> > > >

> >

> > > > Rahu gives results of the bhavesha whom he conjoins so Rahu will give

results of Guru while Guru himself may not be able to give his full results

during its dasha.

> >

> > > >

> >

> > > > Chandrashekhar.

> >

> > > >

> >

> > > > -

> >

> > > > inder

> >

> > > >

> >

> > > > Saturday, March 27, 2010 5:12 PM

> >

> > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> >

> > > >

> >

> > > >

> >

> > > >

> >

> > > > Dear friends,

> >

> > > >

> >

> > > > This discussion on Guru-Chaandal Yoga is very interesting. Let me give

my submissions.

> >

> > > >

> >

> > > > Why Rahu was called Chaandal was perhaps to give some derogatotry

remark to chhaya graha RAHU.

> >

> > > >

> >

> > > > Earlier I gave one theory:Karaka for internet is Rahu.So in the

mordern times real Rahu is internet.

> >

> > > >

> >

> > > > Beauty of Rahu is that it is infinite, shapeless, colourless and

formless and takes shape and characterstics of the planet with which it comes in

contact.

> >

> > > >

> >

> > > > Internet astrology is all about Mercury+ Rahu or Mercury + Jupiter +

Rahu.

> >

> > > >

> >

> > > > Internet can take any shape and character as gets associated with the

type of people-- astro sites, religious sites, terrorists sits , porno sites,

sports sites etc.

> >

> > > >

> >

> > > > Why Chanadal-- as it distracts mind, makes the mind hazy and infinite.

> >

> > > >

> >

> > > > Once with internet religious site or astro site or any site you will

have distracted mind, cannot perform even your Yoga or daily religious rituals

with concentration. You can not go and expand inwards when expanding infinite

outside.

> >

> > > >

> >

> > > > Earlier olden days Rahu effects were in the form of Melas,

processions, committees, rumours, epidemics, foreign influences etc.

> >

> > > > But the moderm dayday epidemic is internet.

> >

> > > >

> >

> > > > My experience is when you are running bhukti/antra /prana [lahiri] of

planet which is in star sub or subsub of Rahu, you get engulfed in internet

whirlpool and will not have peace of mind.

> >

> > > >

> >

> > > > Also I have feeling that if you are seeing a chart of a real Yogi who

is not at-all connected to out world but only internal Samadhi , we should

remove Rahu-Ketu from the chart.In any case Rahu is MAYA of relative position of

earth, Moon and Sun.

> >

> > > >

> >

> > > > Some members crtisize that internet astrology is spoiled and it is

hasty, irreligious etc, but this Chanadal has some positive aspects also as like

it expands your knowledge to limitless sphere.

> >

> > > > Moreover internet is democratic- leaves you no choice except to

tolerate difference of opinion. It equilizes[learned and ordinary people] all

the people in formless networking.

> >

> > > >

> >

> > > > It captures you, engulfs you.For your family members ,it is really a

Chaandal[Guru chandal or budhha chanda or shukra or shani chandal doen not

matter to them]

> >

> > > >

> >

> > > > Inder

> >

> > > > , Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb@ >

wrote:

> >

> > > > >

> >

> > > > > Sir Raj Bhardwaj ji,

> >

> > > > > Kamaal kar diya ji aapne, Zinda undhaharan pesh kar di. MARHABA

> >

> > > > > Regards

> >

> > > > > Kulbir Bains.

> >

> > > > >

> >

> > > > > On Sat, Mar 27, 2010 at 12:12 AM, Raj <rajbhardwaj1949@ > wrote:

> >

> > > > >

> >

> > > > > >

> >

> > > > > >

> >

> > > > > >

> >

> > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > Yes Rohini and Kulbeer Bhai, I tend to agree with your anecdote "

> >

> > > > > > Shape Shifter " ! Here I would just try to also cover the first

line of

> >

> > > > > > Kulbeer on the subject - Gurus plays a social role so do the

> >

> > > > > > prostitutes.

> >

> > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > Just 4 days ago , Kanu Sanyal, the man who started a peasants

movement

> >

> > > > > > in a very small village named " Naxalbari " , which ultimately

> >

> > > > > > became to be known the Naxals or Naxalites ; and it's further

> >

> > > > > > carnation , the present day's PWG(People's War Group), committed

> >

> > > > > > suicide,found hanging in his one room hutment in his native

village,

> >

> > > > > > frustrated with the changes in the ideology of the present CPI(M)

in the

> >

> > > > > > garb of PWG. He was the GURU of Naxalite movement,which began

against

> >

> > > > > > the Zamindars in the end of year 1966 or begening of 1967, and

slowly

> >

> > > > > > and steadily spearead in the most states of India.

> >

> > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > I had finished my 1 year training in the Air Force and my first

posting

> >

> > > > > > was in a place called Bengdubi, about 30 Kms from Naxalbari

village ,

> >

> > > > > > near Baghdogra, in Siliguri,Distt Darjeeling in October,1968.

Movements

> >

> > > > > > of defence personnel in this region were well guarded.

> >

> > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > On a holiday, I was doing the duty as deputy of the `Orderly

> >

> > > > > > Officer'(who looks after each happenings within the Unit). In the

> >

> > > > > > evening, he just called his driver to take out the Nissan Jonga.

He also

> >

> > > > > > called me out and asked me to sit in the back side of vehicle,with

my

> >

> > > > > > Sten Gun. The vehicle moved out of the Unit, and he looked back

from

> >

> > > > > > the rear window and asked me Lal-Batti dekhi hai kabhi ? I nodded

in

> >

> > > > > > negative. After about 20 minutes drive, we entered the Siliguri,

and

> >

> > > > > > headed towards a small colony of huts and mud houses. The vehicle

> >

> > > > > > stopped. He got down and told me just see around, I shall be back

> >

> > > > > > quickly. I was looking out and also had to stretch my head out a

number

> >

> > > > > > of times , to fathom out that this place was indeed a Red Light

area.

> >

> > > > > > Such areas are strictly `Out of Bounds' for the defence

> >

> > > > > > personnel ,which was taught in our training manuals. And Lo, there

was

> >

> > > > > > suddenly a big commotion in the area and I saw a number of civil

police

> >

> > > > > > personnel forcing out the women from their living places ; and

throwing

> >

> > > > > > them in the police lorry. Then I looked at my Orderly Officer

running

> >

> > > > > > running towards our vehicle, trying to hold his pants tightly. A

fat

> >

> > > > > > man,must be about 55 years, on the verge of retirement, looking

very

> >

> > > > > > funny to me. Then in a flash I noticed a young girl dashing

towards back

> >

> > > > > > of our vehicle, trying to catch it and enter. At the same moment,

our

> >

> > > > > > vehicle started. I just extended my arm out , the girl found it to

be

> >

> > > > > > helping hand, I pulled her inside and she sat on the floor of the

> >

> > > > > > vehicle. Few policemen did try to run after her, but they had

stopped,

> >

> > > > > > having seen that ours was a defence vehicle.

> >

> > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > She was trying to get her breathing normal and I was looking at

her

> >

> > > > > > nonchalantly. After few minutes the O.O peeped back from the small

rear

> >

> > > > > > window' and shouted " Who the bitch is this?. I did not reply.

> >

> > > > > > But I think that the driver must have also noticed everything ,

like me

> >

> > > > > > in the tript to Lal Batti. After about 5 minutes the O.O. again

peeped

> >

> > > > > > back and said ` Hey boy I will take this girl to my Barrack. I

kept

> >

> > > > > > mum. My mind was blank. No thought was crossing my mind, as far as

I

> >

> > > > > > still remember. In the meantime I asked the girl about herself.

She told

> >

> > > > > > that she is from Rajasthan and one of her uncles had brought her

to

> >

> > > > > > this place 6 months back and she will be grateful if I can help

her to

> >

> > > > > > go to Rajasthan. I knew that the Railway Station was just on the

way. As

> >

> > > > > > we reached near the main gate, I called out the driver and

commanded him

> >

> > > > > > to stop the vehicle. I had just about 3 Rupees with me and gave it

to

> >

> > > > > > the girl and apologized that I cannot help her further, she should

just

> >

> > > > > > catch any available train and try to take help from any one and

not to

> >

> > > > > > worry, YOU will reach your Home. As the vehicle was slowing down,

the

> >

> > > > > > O.O. shouted at me and ordered me that the girl with go with us. I

> >

> > > > > > simply pointed my Sten Gun in his direction and slowly brought it

near

> >

> > > > > > his nose where he could feel the heat ..and he closed the rear

> >

> > > > > > window. The vehicle stopped and I helped the girl out of the

vehicle. I

> >

> > > > > > still carry the memory of her tearful eyes with full of karuna and

> >

> > > > > > thanks giving , till the vehicle moved out of her sight. I felt so

> >

> > > > > > tired and exhausted , I simply slumped on my seat.

> >

> > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > On the way back thoughts started crossing my mind that a senior is

> >

> > > > > > always a senior in the armed forces, if the O.O. wants he can

place me

> >

> > > > > > under arrest after reaching the unit and frame any flimsy charge

sheet

> >

> > > > > > against me and I could even face a court martial. My soul told me

no

> >

> > > > > > fears so be it. Then I took a resolve that if it so happens, I

will kill

> >

> > > > > > this son of a Gun senior- the Teacher-the Mentor-The supposed

guide to

> >

> > > > > > me, by virtue of his being senior to me in rank in age. But

nothing ever

> >

> > > > > > happened further on this count. For years on, I went on feeling

sorry

> >

> > > > > > that I could not help her any further and would always wonder

whether

> >

> > > > > > she ever reached her home !

> >

> > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > Now after such a long gap the discussion on Gurus, Deeksha, Beej

Mantra,

> >

> > > > > > Guru Chaandal Yoga, Kanu Sanyal, Naxalbari has brought these

memories

> >

> > > > > > back to me as fresh as ever before.

> >

> > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > As far me I feel that I have also fully understood that the

description

> >

> > > > > > of this yoga in Shastras was indirect and not so direct but it's

direct

> >

> > > > > > and literal meaning or name is CHAANDAL GURU-YOGA, If I may rename

it

> >

> > > > > > in direct form. The O.O. must have called me by thousand names

like

> >

> > > > > > CHAANDAL or manay more direct expletives , because he was in dire

needs

> >

> > > > > > of the wants of his body and mind....and after the police raid, I

> >

> > > > > > deprived him of this real good oprtunity. But then, I do not find

any

> >

> > > > > > such yoga which can directly label me as CHAANDAL SHISHYA. And

lastly,

> >

> > > > > > that time I was running the mahadasha of Rahu-Rahu from 19-09-1966

to

> >

> > > > > > 01-01-1969.

> >

> > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > Raj Bhardwaj

> >

> > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > <%

40. com>,

> >

> > > > > > " rohinicrystal "

> >

> > > > > > <jyotish_vani@ > wrote:

> >

> > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > Just an anecdotal suggestion, Raj_dada, if I may for you to

examine in

> >

> > > > > > your collection of charts or test bench.

> >

> > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > I have always considered the lunar node as 'wild-cards' (The

joker in

> >

> > > > > > a game of cards! A chalnaa, a mimic, a 'Shape-shifter' etc). This

is why

> >

> > > > > > perhaps it is considered as a 'surrogate' that assumes the persona

and

> >

> > > > > > role of the planet it is associated with or failing that in whose

sign

> >

> > > > > > and nakshatra it is placed in). Particularly when a node is moving

> >

> > > > > > towards the planet it is co-occuping a varga, it imbibes the

qualities

> >

> > > > > > and abilities of the planet concerned (I call it suction-yoga or

> >

> > > > > > Hoover-Yoga -- after the vacuum cleaner!). The planet so affected

loses

> >

> > > > > > some or all of its propensity and natural qualities for good or

bad! So

> >

> > > > > > a jupiter could lose its 'Teacher/priest- like nature', moon could

lose

> >

> > > > > > its sensitive, emotional side or memory, mars could lose its

> >

> > > > > > aggression.. . etc!). It may not be a complete loss but a

reduction in

> >

> > > > > > the qualities.

> >

> > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > Such influence is not necessarily good or bad for the individual

> >

> > > > > > depending on the personal nature of the node in the specific

chart!

> >

> > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > Please remember that it is anecdotal! Try it at your own risk!

In fact

> >

> > > > > > for other novice readers, I would venture to add: PLEASE DON'T TRY

THIS

> >

> > > > > > AT HOME WITHOUT YOUR TEACHER OR PARENT BEING PRESENT CLOSE BY! :-)

> >

> > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > So nice to hear that cheerfulness is back in your heart. My

prayers

> >

> > > > > > and best wishes that Ma always shower Her blessings on ALL my

Dadas!

> >

> > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > Rohiniranjan

> >

> > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > <%

40. com>,

> >

> > > > > > " rajbhardwaj1949 "

> >

> > > > > > rajbhardwaj1949@ wrote:

> >

> > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > Dear Bhai Rohini, Kulbir and Krishnan and all Jyotishis,

> >

> > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > The thread on " Beej Mantra " and " I disagree " have been really

very

> >

> > > > > > > > interesting for me. After a long time I was enjoying and

smiling

> >

> > > > > > while

> >

> > > > > > > > reading the exchange, and at times I was humming. Completely

> >

> > > > > > relaxed. My

> >

> > > > > > > > wife had observed me at a few occasions and called my younger

> >

> > > > > > daughter

> >

> > > > > > > > to observe me silently and also enjoyed finding me relaxed

with

> >

> > > > > > smile on

> >

> > > > > > > > my face. Somehow the subject in both the threads got

intermangled

> >

> > > > > > very

> >

> > > > > > > > beautifully. Guru,Shishya, Deekshya, traditions; cunturies old

and the

> >

> > > > > > > > current traits.

> >

> > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > I have firm belief that almost all of us(other jyotishis also

> >

> > > > > > included),

> >

> > > > > > > > who try to give answers to the queries to best of their

knowledge;

> >

> > > > > > and

> >

> > > > > > > > most of the times face brickbats and get No thanks, still go

on

> >

> > > > > > > > participating in their respective groups ,like addicts, not

> >

> > > > > > withstanding

> >

> > > > > > > > the skirmishes here and there.

> >

> > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > This further strengthens my belief, that all such jyotishis

have

> >

> > > > > > learned

> >

> > > > > > > > jyotish with their own efforts, with no Guru or Gurukul. If

this is

> >

> > > > > > not

> >

> > > > > > > > Junoon, then what else. The will to learn and the will to do

bit of

> >

> > > > > > > > experiment too in the process.How much time it takes to read,

how

> >

> > > > > > quick

> >

> > > > > > > > reactions or delayed reactions take seeds in our minds, how we

> >

> > > > > > prepare

> >

> > > > > > > > ourselves to gather the thoughts and type these to give them a

shape

> >

> > > > > > and

> >

> > > > > > > > not expecting anything in return. Just the pure joy and

> >

> > > > > > satisfaction.

> >

> > > > > > > > This is a continuous process of learning for us and I also

have no

> >

> > > > > > doubt

> >

> > > > > > > > that the young learner also must be picking a lots from what

appears

> >

> > > > > > in

> >

> > > > > > > > the group.

> >

> > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > I will be hanged and stoned by the so called purists, if I

were to

> >

> > > > > > say

> >

> > > > > > > > that there is no need to have Guru, in the times we are

living. In

> >

> > > > > > other

> >

> > > > > > > > words every learner of Jyotish has his own free Will , if it

is

> >

> > > > > > > > Operational , to learn the Jyotish without being bound by any

> >

> > > > > > > > Rules,Paramparas etc. This is so because the material and

> >

> > > > > > opportunity

> >

> > > > > > > > for picking up Jyotish is now really very easily available and

every

> >

> > > > > > > > learner has good faculties in the field of education and

languages.

> >

> > > > > > One

> >

> > > > > > > > just needs to have a keen eye and belief in himself. How they

will

> >

> > > > > > use

> >

> > > > > > > > their knowledge will depend solely on themselves.

> >

> > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > While on the subject of , I (like many other Jyotishis) was

also

> >

> > > > > > witness

> >

> > > > > > > > to few other happenings involving a Guru and Shishya. I have

been

> >

> > > > > > > > thinking for quite some time about the " Guru-Chaandal Yoga " .

Why

> >

> > > > > > such

> >

> > > > > > > > yoga was mentioned in BPHS. Guru was specifically Jupiter, but

Rahu

> >

> > > > > > was

> >

> > > > > > > > not specifically Chandaal. I am not sure if Rahu has been

given the

> >

> > > > > > name

> >

> > > > > > > > of Chaandal in it's various descriptions. Now how this Yoga is

> >

> > > > > > feared by

> >

> > > > > > > > all like Rahu dasha,Shani dasha, Shani Sade Sati etc. When a

learner

> >

> > > > > > > > like me perhaps does not get any reason to show the cause of

> >

> > > > > > problems in

> >

> > > > > > > > facing the jataka , we the lesser known jyotishis just take

names of

> >

> > > > > > > > such yogas or positions of Shani as the root cause of all the

> >

> > > > > > problems.

> >

> > > > > > > > Very easy way out indeed.

> >

> > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > I have been thinking a lot about The Guru-Chaandal Yoga and

somehow

> >

> > > > > > tend

> >

> > > > > > > > to believe, that Guru can become like a Chaandal in the real

sense.

> >

> > > > > > His

> >

> > > > > > > > all faculties are shut and whatever he does and utters is very

very

> >

> > > > > > > > surprising, it hits everything and everybody very hard. The

image of

> >

> > > > > > > > Guru becomes that of a Satan,as he breathes fire and breakes

all the

> >

> > > > > > so

> >

> > > > > > > > called maryada of a Guru, if there is anything called maryada.

When

> >

> > > > > > our

> >

> > > > > > > > Rishis mentioned this Guru -Chaandal Yoga, they really must

have all

> >

> > > > > > the

> >

> > > > > > > > rishis,munis, gurus who had dual personalities. There is no

need to

> >

> > > > > > > > elaborate this. The real meaning of Guru Chaandal Yoga seems

to have

> >

> > > > > > > > sink in now. It simply sinks the esteerm of a Guru, where a

Shishya

> >

> > > > > > is

> >

> > > > > > > > forced to challenge his Guru, and more the Guru accuses the

Shishya,

> >

> > > > > > > > more he exposes himself, and forces the Shishya to break his

silence

> >

> > > > > > and

> >

> > > > > > > > he starts hesitatingly initially but goes full blast exposing

the

> >

> > > > > > Guru.

> >

> > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > But, then the Shishya also has to be a real learner, who

perhaps

> >

> > > > > > never

> >

> > > > > > > > depends solely and blindly on one Guru. Now a big question

which is

> >

> > > > > > > > staring me and I have been wondering why the fathers of

Jyotish did

> >

> > > > > > not

> >

> > > > > > > > mention about any yoga specifically , which could be termed or

> >

> > > > > > called as

> >

> > > > > > > > " SHISHYA CHAANDAL " Yoga in the Jyotish !

> >

> > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > Raj Bhardwaj

> >

> > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > <%

40. com>,

> >

> > > > > > " rohinicrystal "

> >

> > > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@ > wrote:

> >

> > > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > > But Praajee...!

> >

> > > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > > IK HORE thaa jo Dasyaa gadheriyaan de-vichh, unna kol...!

> >

> > > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > > Varah (12) thay unna-di banday! Jotish main jaisay!! Ek do

ghabraa

> >

> > > > > > > > gayey shaayad, aisaa sanu sunaa noo! Pher laut aayey US dey

Kaul

> >

> > > > > > usday

> >

> > > > > > > > 'marnay' day baad!

> >

> > > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > > Kis-day kaul woh sab logaan lautay, mainu nai pataa!

> >

> > > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > > Asi to sirf dekhnaay may zindagi gawaan dittay! Kinni - Azib

hai

> >

> > > > > > yeh

> >

> > > > > > > > kahaniyan bachchon di! Raab/Khudaa/ Parmeshwar/ God day

bachchoon-di!

> >

> > > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > > Maaf karnaa praa -- punjabi bhot pyaari lagdii si magar ik

saal to

> >

> > > > > > > > nahin naa kafi! Shaayad aglay janam main kuch hor

seekh-layngay, jo

> >

> > > > > > raha

> >

> > > > > > > > giya si is janam-vich baki!

> >

> > > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > > Aankhaan khulie rakhiyo! Aandar_waali! ! ;-)

> >

> > > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > > Happy Easter!!

> >

> > > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan

> >

> > > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > > <%

40. com>,

> >

> > > > > > Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@

> >

> > > > > > > > wrote:

> >

> > > > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > > > SiRR ji,

> >

> > > > > > > > > > HUSH is the word;

> >

> > > > > > > > > > Bolan naalon chup changeri, chup de naalon parda; je

MANSOOR na

> >

> > > > > > > > bolda taan

> >

> > > > > > > > > > sooli kahnu Chadhda.

> >

> > > > > > > > > > Silence is golden; veil of secrecy even better, Mansoor

wouldn't

> >

> > > > > > > > have been

> >

> > > > > > > > > > hanged on gallows ;had he preferred silence.

> >

> > > > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > > > Regards

> >

> > > > > > > > > > Kulbir Bains

> >

> > > > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > > > ------------ --------- ---------

> >

> > > > > > > > > > ** rohinicrystal jyotish_vani@

> >

> > > > > > > > > > *To:* <%

40. com>

> >

> > > > > > > > > > *Sent:* Sun, 21 March, 2010 6:15:54 AM

> >

> > > > > > > > > > *Subject:* Re: Information about beej mantra

sadhana's ?

> >

> > > > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > > > Kulbir_praaji,

> >

> > > > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > > > This 'regulation' , " ...if deeksha of beej mantra is given

by

> >

> > > > > > > > competent

> >

> > > > > > > > > > guru, then it becomes the responsibility of the guru to

bring

> >

> > > > > > > > salvation to

> >

> > > > > > > > > > the disciple. " -- has an interesting wrinkle!

> >

> > > > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > > > It implies that the Guru himself/herself has already

attained

> >

> > > > > > > > salvation!

> >

> > > > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > > > I think it is safe to assume that such deekshas are being

given

> >

> > > > > > in

> >

> > > > > > > > the

> >

> > > > > > > > > > hundreds of thousands, if not millions, world-wide ;-)

> >

> > > > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > > > Now Chelaa poochtaa hai, " If there are so many millions of

Gurus

> >

> > > > > > who

> >

> > > > > > > > have

> >

> > > > > > > > > > attained salvation already... Why is the earth and

humanity

> >

> > > > > > > > suffering so

> >

> > > > > > > > > > much? " :-B

> >

> > > > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > > > ~Sab kuch seekha humnay, naa seekhie hoshiyari, Sach hai

duniya

> >

> > > > > > > > walon kay

> >

> > > > > > > > > > hum SUB hain anadi/anari! ~

> >

> > > > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan

> >

> > > > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > > >

[Guest guest]

Dear Inder;

Some reasoned reply may help me instead of this Tughlaki Farmaan.

I have come to learn here so it matters at least to me.

Regards

Kulbir Bains

 

Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

 

Wednesday, 31 March, 2010 6:10 AM

 

 

Dear Kulbir,

I donot agree with you.

Anyway does'nt matter.

Inder

 

, Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb@ ...>

wrote:

>

> Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best pragmatic

way

> possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says.

> House no 11. represents SABKI APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN earning. In 11th

> house itself, is the seat of justice/judge. Saturn takes the incurred

karma

> via Rahu and Ketu before Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the seat of judge

> but Saturn is the drishti to guide it).

> Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter passes it on Saturn's

> recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in mind. (khuda ko hazir

> mankar).

> Regards

> Kulbir Bains.

>

> On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder <indervohra2001@ ...> wrote:

>

> >

> >

> > Dear Kulbir,

> > Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement. [correct or

incorrect]

> > Saturn is illegal,[but may be correct],thinking.

> >

> > Jupiter + Saturn becomes philospher.[ nothing good or bad, but thinking

> > makes it so]

> >

> > Mars with Jupiter logic[logician] , without reading the law books he

would

> > give arguments which may win him.

> >

> > Inder

 

On Wed, Mar 31, 2010 at 8:53 AM, Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb wrote:

 

Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best pragmatic way

possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says.House no 11. represents SABKI

APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN earning. In 11th house itself, is the seat of

justice/judge. Saturn takes the incurred karma via Rahu and Ketu before

Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the seat of judge but Saturn is the drishti

to guide it).Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter passes it on

Saturn's recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in mind. (khuda

ko hazir mankar).

 

Regards

 

Kulbir Bains.

 

On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder <indervohra2001 wrote:

 

Dear Kulbir,

 

Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement.[correct or

incorrect]Saturn is illegal,[but may be correct],thinking.Jupiter + Saturn

becomes philospher.[nothing good or bad, but thinking makes it so]Mars with

Jupiter logic[logician], without reading the law books he would give

arguments which may win him.

 

Inder

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

In the emerging concepts of jyotish,there is scope for accommodating changes

with reference and bring out some more concepts.

It is still fresh in my memory of the final words given by my reverred teachers

that no planets is bad as envisaged and also no benific planets is so benific as

made out in the books for descriptive purposes.

Basic AStrology though considers some planets as very malefic and others as

benific,in reality often v find malefic planets including nodes giving the best

and most desired material benifits and other benific planets letting down many

good things and leaving the humans in a miserable state.

In the context of malefic planets like Mars being referred as  Managal it is

both ways.Some people treat tues day as amangal also and do not take up or do or

attempt for the fear of unwanted happenings.

  It is for the purpose of identifying the week day it looks and the word

mangal is not entirely referred in the context of kuja alone.

It is eferred with reference to the day after Monday and Mnagal and it relates

to Mata Guari known to refer to mangalya for a lady for her happiness.

Infact Mangal vaar is accepted by some as very auspicious for vrat purpose by

women folk and by some as very in auspicious and thery are many people who would

like to avoid this day.

Kuja od Bhauma being related with energy on account of physical features

observed and recorded about this hot planets by ancient sages.Some puranic

references related to lord Kumar swamy.Subrahmanya etc differ based on their

customs and values.

Infact in all functions it is very common to have gauri pooja for women oriented

rituals.The importance of Mars female horoscopy and the karakatwas attributed to

planets Mars further elaborate on theoretical issues.

while considering jyotish what was referred in puranas might be anecdotal but

the relevance of jyotish and application aare on different base. 

 

Vattem Krishnan Cyber Jyotish Services(For all counseling

services)Dr.B.V.Raman " Fools Obey Planets While  Wisemen Can Control

Them " Planets are neutral Controllers of Mans Karma 

 

--- On Wed, 3/31/10, Chandrashekhar <sharma.chandrashekhar wrote:

 

Chandrashekhar <sharma.chandrashekhar

Re: Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

 

Wednesday, March 31, 2010, 1:30 PM

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Dear Rohini,

 

 

 

Mangal is called that perhaps as he is energy and also mythologically it

absorbed blood of Andhakasur, thus killing him in Andhalaasura Shiva fight?

 

 

 

It is perhaps like a weapon of offence giving good results in hands of the

protector of the country but bad in hands of the terrorists.

 

 

 

Take care,

 

Chandrashekhar.

 

-

 

rohinicrystal

 

 

Wednesday, March 31, 2010 3:43 AM

 

Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

 

 

 

Chandrashekhar_ jee and Raj bhaisaheb,

 

 

 

I have generally winced a bit when people try to equate and extrapolate directly

and literally from ancient allegories and in my opinion that creates problems

which creates the 'black and white' in astrology. The latest that we have

observed being the words from " Rahu is uncondtionally bad " camp.

 

 

 

My personal preference is to take the allegories as nice mnemonics or memory

aids but not an exhaustive description of the 'planets' concerned from an

astrological point of view. The story of swarbhanu, the story of Kach and

Devyani, and even the story of Harishchandra in Shani Mahatmay are great

pointers and make what can be a rather dry subject (Astrology with its terse

rules and exceptions!) interesting and even lively! But, if we get stuck in the

mindset that those stories and allegories capture the entire essence of

astrological reality or astrological details, then that would be a serious loss

for the astrology learners and practitioners. Particularly the ones who actually

read charts or give readings (the applied and practical astrologers) .

 

 

 

The astrological reality (more than sun in leo in 4th will result in this or

that... for instance!) is multifactorial and rather than seeing the

benefic/malefic dichotomy as absolute, I wish people will consider the

modification and modulation of the essential, central characteristics of planets

and realize that without such nuances and influences, astrology will begin to

look rather threadbare.

 

 

 

I am of the opinion that the karakatwas given in Jyotish texts such as BPHS (and

I do not mean BPHS alone!) describe the core properties or values of the planets

and we must not stray too far from those. In contrast, texts such as

uttarkalamrita despite their prolific treatment of karakas must be considered

with a pinch of salt, or at least some of the labels given there in the context

of karakattwas.

 

 

 

Some of the problems inherent in the 'modern' labels (neokarakatwas! ) while

being useful raise one question. How careful was the author or proponent in

making sure that what he or she is giving is the nascent karakttwa and not the

result of a multifactorial influence or compound karakattwa? What one is

attributing to Jupiter for instance -- if derived from astrological

observations, how much of the description is for the planet itself and what

component or contamination in chemical mixture terms can be attributed to a

melange of influences? It is often very difficult to tease out the influences of

individual participants in a property or label which sometimes is ascribed to a

single planet.

 

 

 

I am not saying that BPHS alone is correct in all instances but certainly a safe

starting point! Others may differ in their opinion, of course.

 

 

 

Speaking of names, the label MANGAL for mars is intriguing. Why is a malefic

that is cruel and associated with wounds, injuries, aggression, cutting etc

should be associated with mangal which represents beneficience, shubha,

amelioration?

 

 

 

I am sure there are many similar nomenclatural puzzles in Jyotish and I realize

that one lifetime is not sufficient to figure out all the labels and what not,

but certainly makes the study of astrology rather interesting.

 

 

 

Rohiniranjan

 

 

 

, " Chandrashekhar " <sharma.chandrashek

har wrote:

 

>

 

> Dear Raj,

 

>

 

> I have already read your experience with interest. I can also understand

what you felt as it was an absolutely wicked situation. You did something that

needed great courage, knowing the way Army works.

 

>

 

> But I am one who can not equate ideologue of a violent movement, even for

good causes, with Guru. In jyotish I always prefer to keep the grahas and our

concepts about what their names should mean in the light of Puranas separate.

May be not exactly separate but my interpretation of the puranic stories in

explaining the nature of grahas is at variance with what is generally thought

and so I prefer to keep it to myself.

 

>

 

> Take care,

 

> Chandrashekhar.

 

>

 

>

 

> -

 

> Raj

 

>

 

> Tuesday, March 30, 2010 9:52 AM

 

> Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

 

>

 

>

 

>

 

> Dear Chandrashekhar Ji,

 

> I am enjoying your posts. But, I feel you could have missed my msg No.73157

and what was the context of Guru-Rahu yuti,in the present times. ! I hope you

will like reading it, as the thread began from there.! With my best regards.

 

>

 

> Raj Bhardwaj

 

>

 

> , " Chandrashekhar "

<sharma.chandrashek har@> wrote:

 

> >

 

> > Dear Vattem Krishnan,

 

> >

 

> > I was responding to Rohini's mail. I have already made clear what is meant

by Chandal and what by MlecCha. I had said " One meaning of Chandal is worst

amongst men and that of Mlecha is a wicked man, a foreigner, one who does not

speak Sanskrit etc. So that too is right. "

 

> >

 

> > Regards,

 

> > Chandrashekhar

 

> >

 

> >

 

> > -

 

> > Vattem Krishnan

 

> >

 

> > Monday, March 29, 2010 12:37 PM

 

> > Re: Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

 

> >

 

> >

 

> >

 

> > Dear Sir,

 

> > It is true that persons opeartating from burial grounds are referred with

this term.It's application however to Rahu in litteral terms is not properly

substantiated. mlechas are not chandals.

 

> > In our epics more so when we recollect about Raja Satya Harischndra

Story,we find the reference of " Chandal " the one who burns dead bodies and keeps

watch at burial grounds.

 

> > Doms are not falling under chandal category.Some where it is also

mentioned to cannibals or narbhakshas as chnadals.

 

> >

 

> > Vattem Krishnan Cyber Jyotish Services(For all counseling services)Dr.

B.V.Raman " Fools Obey Planets While Wisemen Can Control Them " Planets are neutral

Controllers of Mans Karma

 

> >

 

> > --- On Sun, 3/28/10, Chandrashekhar <sharma.chandrashek har@> wrote:

 

> >

 

> > Chandrashekhar <sharma.chandrashek har@>

 

> > Re: Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

 

> >

 

> > Sunday, March 28, 2010, 3:15 PM

 

> >

 

> >

 

> >

 

> > Dear Rohini Ranjan,

 

> >

 

> > I am trying to acquire its manuscript, through one of my friends and hope

to learn some more about Paraashara.

 

> >

 

> > Yes, Chandal is an interesting term. They are generally thought to be

those who operate at funeral sites.

 

> >

 

> > Rahu is enigmatic planet and so has not rest or does not allow others to

rest.

 

> >

 

> > Regards,

 

> >

 

> > Chandrashekhar.

 

> >

 

> > -

 

> >

 

> > rohinicrystal

 

> >

 

> >

 

> >

 

> > Sunday, March 28, 2010 11:57 PM

 

> >

 

> > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

 

> >

 

> > Chandrashekhar jee,

 

> >

 

> > Thanks for taking the time, Sir. I have not had the good fortune of having

seen Vriddha Parashari. I have only studied BPHS, Parashara Samhita and

Laghu/madhya parashari.

 

> >

 

> > My urdu is rather limited, actually.

 

> >

 

> > Chandaal is a very interesting term and at one point were thought of as

the '5th caste'! In MP they were called Dom and in bengal nomoshuddoor.

 

> >

 

> > Poor Rahu! Even on its home-turf (internet according to some) there is no

rest for the wicked :-)

 

> >

 

> > Rohiniranjan

 

> >

 

> > , " Chandrashekhar "

<sharma.chandrashek har@> wrote:

 

> >

 

> > >

 

> >

 

> > > Dear Rohini Ranjan,

 

> >

 

> > >

 

> >

 

> > > One meaning of Chandal is worst amongst men and that of Mlecha is a

wicked man, a foreigner, one who does not speak Sanskrit etc. So that too is

right.

 

> >

 

> > >

 

> >

 

> > > So your contention is also correct. I liked the comment about change of

perception between ibtedah and inteha. You must be pretty good at Urdu?

 

> >

 

> > >

 

> >

 

> > > Have you heard of a manuscript called Vriddha Parashari?

 

> >

 

> > >

 

> >

 

> > > Regards,

 

> >

 

> > > Chandrashekhar.

 

> >

 

> > >

 

> >

 

> > > -

 

> >

 

> > > rohinicrystal

 

> >

 

> > >

 

> >

 

> > > Sunday, March 28, 2010 5:45 AM

 

> >

 

> > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

 

> >

 

> > >

 

> >

 

> > >

 

> >

 

> > >

 

> >

 

> > > Dear Chandrashekhar jee,

 

> >

 

> > >

 

> >

 

> > > I have also heard that rahu represents mlechchaas or 'other

cultures/foreign cultures'

 

> >

 

> > >

 

> >

 

> > > Often plays a part according to what jyotishis " claim " that it has to do

with journey abroad or marrying into other cultures and religions and so on.

Just another wrinkle, I suppose! But by no means uncommon, based on the queries

received by jyotishis working actively on the " Jyotish HOT-LINE! "

 

> >

 

> > >

 

> >

 

> > > As touched upon in my astrotreasures article written long ago and posted

on boloji years later -- BPHS changed its perspective between the ibetadh and

inteha! That was a clue for me that I tuned-in profitably (in terms of

learning!) -- and the fact that it was placed so close to Sudarshan completed

the clue for me!

 

> >

 

> > >

 

> >

 

> > > Krishna was the awataar of Vishnu that carried the Sudarshan Chakra and

was Poorna Purusha! If I write anything further on this matter in this august

forum, I will be insulting the intelligence and Gnan of the inhabitants on this

huge Island!

 

> >

 

> > >

 

> >

 

> > > Rohiniranjan

 

> >

 

> > >

 

> >

 

> > > , " Chandrashekhar "

<sharma.chandrashek har@> wrote:

 

> >

 

> > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > Dear Inderjee,

 

> >

 

> > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > Does not Rahu rule over the Chandals? That is why he is also called

Chandal. So Guru Chandala yoga is nothing but conjunction of Guru and Rahu.

 

> >

 

> > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > Personally I think that though people tend to connect the word chandal

with the morals or behaviour of a person who has Guru Chandal yoga, that might

not be the case always.

 

> >

 

> > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > Rahu gives results of the bhavesha whom he conjoins so Rahu will give

results of Guru while Guru himself may not be able to give his full results

during its dasha.

 

> >

 

> > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > Chandrashekhar.

 

> >

 

> > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > -

 

> >

 

> > > > inder

 

> >

 

> > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > Saturday, March 27, 2010 5:12 PM

 

> >

 

> > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

 

> >

 

> > > >

 

> >

 

> > > >

 

> >

 

> > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > Dear friends,

 

> >

 

> > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > This discussion on Guru-Chaandal Yoga is very interesting. Let me give

my submissions.

 

> >

 

> > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > Why Rahu was called Chaandal was perhaps to give some derogatotry

remark to chhaya graha RAHU.

 

> >

 

> > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > Earlier I gave one theory:Karaka for internet is Rahu.So in the

mordern times real Rahu is internet.

 

> >

 

> > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > Beauty of Rahu is that it is infinite, shapeless, colourless and

formless and takes shape and characterstics of the planet with which it comes in

contact.

 

> >

 

> > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > Internet astrology is all about Mercury+ Rahu or Mercury + Jupiter +

Rahu.

 

> >

 

> > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > Internet can take any shape and character as gets associated with the

type of people-- astro sites, religious sites, terrorists sits , porno sites,

sports sites etc.

 

> >

 

> > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > Why Chanadal-- as it distracts mind, makes the mind hazy and infinite.

 

> >

 

> > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > Once with internet religious site or astro site or any site you will

have distracted mind, cannot perform even your Yoga or daily religious rituals

with concentration. You can not go and expand inwards when expanding infinite

outside.

 

> >

 

> > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > Earlier olden days Rahu effects were in the form of Melas,

processions, committees, rumours, epidemics, foreign influences etc.

 

> >

 

> > > > But the moderm dayday epidemic is internet.

 

> >

 

> > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > My experience is when you are running bhukti/antra /prana [lahiri] of

planet which is in star sub or subsub of Rahu, you get engulfed in internet

whirlpool and will not have peace of mind.

 

> >

 

> > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > Also I have feeling that if you are seeing a chart of a real Yogi who

is not at-all connected to out world but only internal Samadhi , we should

remove Rahu-Ketu from the chart.In any case Rahu is MAYA of relative position of

earth, Moon and Sun.

 

> >

 

> > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > Some members crtisize that internet astrology is spoiled and it is

hasty, irreligious etc, but this Chanadal has some positive aspects also as like

it expands your knowledge to limitless sphere.

 

> >

 

> > > > Moreover internet is democratic- leaves you no choice except to

tolerate difference of opinion. It equilizes[learned and ordinary people] all

the people in formless networking.

 

> >

 

> > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > It captures you, engulfs you.For your family members ,it is really a

Chaandal[Guru chandal or budhha chanda or shukra or shani chandal doen not

matter to them]

 

> >

 

> > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > Inder

 

> >

 

> > > > , Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb@ >

wrote:

 

> >

 

> > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > Sir Raj Bhardwaj ji,

 

> >

 

> > > > > Kamaal kar diya ji aapne, Zinda undhaharan pesh kar di. MARHABA

 

> >

 

> > > > > Regards

 

> >

 

> > > > > Kulbir Bains.

 

> >

 

> > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > On Sat, Mar 27, 2010 at 12:12 AM, Raj <rajbhardwaj1949@ > wrote:

 

> >

 

> > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > Yes Rohini and Kulbeer Bhai, I tend to agree with your anecdote "

 

> >

 

> > > > > > Shape Shifter " ! Here I would just try to also cover the first

line of

 

> >

 

> > > > > > Kulbeer on the subject - Gurus plays a social role so do the

 

> >

 

> > > > > > prostitutes.

 

> >

 

> > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > Just 4 days ago , Kanu Sanyal, the man who started a peasants

movement

 

> >

 

> > > > > > in a very small village named " Naxalbari " , which ultimately

 

> >

 

> > > > > > became to be known the Naxals or Naxalites ; and it's further

 

> >

 

> > > > > > carnation , the present day's PWG(People's War Group), committed

 

> >

 

> > > > > > suicide,found hanging in his one room hutment in his native

village,

 

> >

 

> > > > > > frustrated with the changes in the ideology of the present CPI(M)

in the

 

> >

 

> > > > > > garb of PWG. He was the GURU of Naxalite movement,which began

against

 

> >

 

> > > > > > the Zamindars in the end of year 1966 or begening of 1967, and

slowly

 

> >

 

> > > > > > and steadily spearead in the most states of India.

 

> >

 

> > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > I had finished my 1 year training in the Air Force and my first

posting

 

> >

 

> > > > > > was in a place called Bengdubi, about 30 Kms from Naxalbari

village ,

 

> >

 

> > > > > > near Baghdogra, in Siliguri,Distt Darjeeling in October,1968.

Movements

 

> >

 

> > > > > > of defence personnel in this region were well guarded.

 

> >

 

> > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > On a holiday, I was doing the duty as deputy of the `Orderly

 

> >

 

> > > > > > Officer'(who looks after each happenings within the Unit). In the

 

> >

 

> > > > > > evening, he just called his driver to take out the Nissan Jonga.

He also

 

> >

 

> > > > > > called me out and asked me to sit in the back side of vehicle,with

my

 

> >

 

> > > > > > Sten Gun. The vehicle moved out of the Unit, and he looked back

from

 

> >

 

> > > > > > the rear window and asked me Lal-Batti dekhi hai kabhi ? I nodded

in

 

> >

 

> > > > > > negative. After about 20 minutes drive, we entered the Siliguri,

and

 

> >

 

> > > > > > headed towards a small colony of huts and mud houses. The vehicle

 

> >

 

> > > > > > stopped. He got down and told me just see around, I shall be back

 

> >

 

> > > > > > quickly. I was looking out and also had to stretch my head out a

number

 

> >

 

> > > > > > of times , to fathom out that this place was indeed a Red Light

area.

 

> >

 

> > > > > > Such areas are strictly `Out of Bounds' for the defence

 

> >

 

> > > > > > personnel ,which was taught in our training manuals. And Lo, there

was

 

> >

 

> > > > > > suddenly a big commotion in the area and I saw a number of civil

police

 

> >

 

> > > > > > personnel forcing out the women from their living places ; and

throwing

 

> >

 

> > > > > > them in the police lorry. Then I looked at my Orderly Officer

running

 

> >

 

> > > > > > running towards our vehicle, trying to hold his pants tightly. A

fat

 

> >

 

> > > > > > man,must be about 55 years, on the verge of retirement, looking

very

 

> >

 

> > > > > > funny to me. Then in a flash I noticed a young girl dashing

towards back

 

> >

 

> > > > > > of our vehicle, trying to catch it and enter. At the same moment,

our

 

> >

 

> > > > > > vehicle started. I just extended my arm out , the girl found it to

be

 

> >

 

> > > > > > helping hand, I pulled her inside and she sat on the floor of the

 

> >

 

> > > > > > vehicle. Few policemen did try to run after her, but they had

stopped,

 

> >

 

> > > > > > having seen that ours was a defence vehicle.

 

> >

 

> > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > She was trying to get her breathing normal and I was looking at

her

 

> >

 

> > > > > > nonchalantly. After few minutes the O.O peeped back from the small

rear

 

> >

 

> > > > > > window' and shouted " Who the bitch is this?. I did not reply.

 

> >

 

> > > > > > But I think that the driver must have also noticed everything ,

like me

 

> >

 

> > > > > > in the tript to Lal Batti. After about 5 minutes the O.O. again

peeped

 

> >

 

> > > > > > back and said ` Hey boy I will take this girl to my Barrack. I

kept

 

> >

 

> > > > > > mum. My mind was blank. No thought was crossing my mind, as far as

I

 

> >

 

> > > > > > still remember. In the meantime I asked the girl about herself.

She told

 

> >

 

> > > > > > that she is from Rajasthan and one of her uncles had brought her

to

 

> >

 

> > > > > > this place 6 months back and she will be grateful if I can help

her to

 

> >

 

> > > > > > go to Rajasthan. I knew that the Railway Station was just on the

way. As

 

> >

 

> > > > > > we reached near the main gate, I called out the driver and

commanded him

 

> >

 

> > > > > > to stop the vehicle. I had just about 3 Rupees with me and gave it

to

 

> >

 

> > > > > > the girl and apologized that I cannot help her further, she should

just

 

> >

 

> > > > > > catch any available train and try to take help from any one and

not to

 

> >

 

> > > > > > worry, YOU will reach your Home. As the vehicle was slowing down,

the

 

> >

 

> > > > > > O.O. shouted at me and ordered me that the girl with go with us. I

 

> >

 

> > > > > > simply pointed my Sten Gun in his direction and slowly brought it

near

 

> >

 

> > > > > > his nose where he could feel the heat ..and he closed the rear

 

> >

 

> > > > > > window. The vehicle stopped and I helped the girl out of the

vehicle. I

 

> >

 

> > > > > > still carry the memory of her tearful eyes with full of karuna and

 

> >

 

> > > > > > thanks giving , till the vehicle moved out of her sight. I felt so

 

> >

 

> > > > > > tired and exhausted , I simply slumped on my seat.

 

> >

 

> > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > On the way back thoughts started crossing my mind that a senior is

 

> >

 

> > > > > > always a senior in the armed forces, if the O.O. wants he can

place me

 

> >

 

> > > > > > under arrest after reaching the unit and frame any flimsy charge

sheet

 

> >

 

> > > > > > against me and I could even face a court martial. My soul told me

no

 

> >

 

> > > > > > fears so be it. Then I took a resolve that if it so happens, I

will kill

 

> >

 

> > > > > > this son of a Gun senior- the Teacher-the Mentor-The supposed

guide to

 

> >

 

> > > > > > me, by virtue of his being senior to me in rank in age. But

nothing ever

 

> >

 

> > > > > > happened further on this count. For years on, I went on feeling

sorry

 

> >

 

> > > > > > that I could not help her any further and would always wonder

whether

 

> >

 

> > > > > > she ever reached her home !

 

> >

 

> > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > Now after such a long gap the discussion on Gurus, Deeksha, Beej

Mantra,

 

> >

 

> > > > > > Guru Chaandal Yoga, Kanu Sanyal, Naxalbari has brought these

memories

 

> >

 

> > > > > > back to me as fresh as ever before.

 

> >

 

> > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > As far me I feel that I have also fully understood that the

description

 

> >

 

> > > > > > of this yoga in Shastras was indirect and not so direct but it's

direct

 

> >

 

> > > > > > and literal meaning or name is CHAANDAL GURU-YOGA, If I may rename

it

 

> >

 

> > > > > > in direct form. The O.O. must have called me by thousand names

like

 

> >

 

> > > > > > CHAANDAL or manay more direct expletives , because he was in dire

needs

 

> >

 

> > > > > > of the wants of his body and mind....and after the police raid, I

 

> >

 

> > > > > > deprived him of this real good oprtunity. But then, I do not find

any

 

> >

 

> > > > > > such yoga which can directly label me as CHAANDAL SHISHYA. And

lastly,

 

> >

 

> > > > > > that time I was running the mahadasha of Rahu-Rahu from 19-09-1966

to

 

> >

 

> > > > > > 01-01-1969.

 

> >

 

> > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > Raj Bhardwaj

 

> >

 

> > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > <Jyotish_ Remedies%

40. com>,

 

> >

 

> > > > > > " rohinicrystal "

 

> >

 

> > > > > > <jyotish_vani@ > wrote:

 

> >

 

> > > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > Just an anecdotal suggestion, Raj_dada, if I may for you to

examine in

 

> >

 

> > > > > > your collection of charts or test bench.

 

> >

 

> > > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > I have always considered the lunar node as 'wild-cards' (The

joker in

 

> >

 

> > > > > > a game of cards! A chalnaa, a mimic, a 'Shape-shifter' etc). This

is why

 

> >

 

> > > > > > perhaps it is considered as a 'surrogate' that assumes the persona

and

 

> >

 

> > > > > > role of the planet it is associated with or failing that in whose

sign

 

> >

 

> > > > > > and nakshatra it is placed in). Particularly when a node is moving

 

> >

 

> > > > > > towards the planet it is co-occuping a varga, it imbibes the

qualities

 

> >

 

> > > > > > and abilities of the planet concerned (I call it suction-yoga or

 

> >

 

> > > > > > Hoover-Yoga -- after the vacuum cleaner!). The planet so affected

loses

 

> >

 

> > > > > > some or all of its propensity and natural qualities for good or

bad! So

 

> >

 

> > > > > > a jupiter could lose its 'Teacher/priest- like nature', moon could

lose

 

> >

 

> > > > > > its sensitive, emotional side or memory, mars could lose its

 

> >

 

> > > > > > aggression.. . etc!). It may not be a complete loss but a

reduction in

 

> >

 

> > > > > > the qualities.

 

> >

 

> > > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > Such influence is not necessarily good or bad for the individual

 

> >

 

> > > > > > depending on the personal nature of the node in the specific

chart!

 

> >

 

> > > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > Please remember that it is anecdotal! Try it at your own risk!

In fact

 

> >

 

> > > > > > for other novice readers, I would venture to add: PLEASE DON'T TRY

THIS

 

> >

 

> > > > > > AT HOME WITHOUT YOUR TEACHER OR PARENT BEING PRESENT CLOSE BY! :-)

 

> >

 

> > > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > So nice to hear that cheerfulness is back in your heart. My

prayers

 

> >

 

> > > > > > and best wishes that Ma always shower Her blessings on ALL my

Dadas!

 

> >

 

> > > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > Rohiniranjan

 

> >

 

> > > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > <Jyotish_ Remedies%

40. com>,

 

> >

 

> > > > > > " rajbhardwaj1949 "

 

> >

 

> > > > > > rajbhardwaj1949@ wrote:

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > Dear Bhai Rohini, Kulbir and Krishnan and all Jyotishis,

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > The thread on " Beej Mantra " and " I disagree " have been really

very

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > interesting for me. After a long time I was enjoying and

smiling

 

> >

 

> > > > > > while

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > reading the exchange, and at times I was humming. Completely

 

> >

 

> > > > > > relaxed. My

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > wife had observed me at a few occasions and called my younger

 

> >

 

> > > > > > daughter

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > to observe me silently and also enjoyed finding me relaxed

with

 

> >

 

> > > > > > smile on

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > my face. Somehow the subject in both the threads got

intermangled

 

> >

 

> > > > > > very

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > beautifully. Guru,Shishya, Deekshya, traditions; cunturies old

and the

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > current traits.

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > I have firm belief that almost all of us(other jyotishis also

 

> >

 

> > > > > > included),

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > who try to give answers to the queries to best of their

knowledge;

 

> >

 

> > > > > > and

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > most of the times face brickbats and get No thanks, still go

on

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > participating in their respective groups ,like addicts, not

 

> >

 

> > > > > > withstanding

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > the skirmishes here and there.

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > This further strengthens my belief, that all such jyotishis

have

 

> >

 

> > > > > > learned

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > jyotish with their own efforts, with no Guru or Gurukul. If

this is

 

> >

 

> > > > > > not

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > Junoon, then what else. The will to learn and the will to do

bit of

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > experiment too in the process.How much time it takes to read,

how

 

> >

 

> > > > > > quick

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > reactions or delayed reactions take seeds in our minds, how we

 

> >

 

> > > > > > prepare

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > ourselves to gather the thoughts and type these to give them a

shape

 

> >

 

> > > > > > and

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > not expecting anything in return. Just the pure joy and

 

> >

 

> > > > > > satisfaction.

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > This is a continuous process of learning for us and I also

have no

 

> >

 

> > > > > > doubt

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > that the young learner also must be picking a lots from what

appears

 

> >

 

> > > > > > in

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > the group.

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > I will be hanged and stoned by the so called purists, if I

were to

 

> >

 

> > > > > > say

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > that there is no need to have Guru, in the times we are

living. In

 

> >

 

> > > > > > other

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > words every learner of Jyotish has his own free Will , if it

is

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > Operational , to learn the Jyotish without being bound by any

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > Rules,Paramparas etc. This is so because the material and

 

> >

 

> > > > > > opportunity

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > for picking up Jyotish is now really very easily available and

every

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > learner has good faculties in the field of education and

languages.

 

> >

 

> > > > > > One

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > just needs to have a keen eye and belief in himself. How they

will

 

> >

 

> > > > > > use

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > their knowledge will depend solely on themselves.

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > While on the subject of , I (like many other Jyotishis) was

also

 

> >

 

> > > > > > witness

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > to few other happenings involving a Guru and Shishya. I have

been

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > thinking for quite some time about the " Guru-Chaandal Yoga " .

Why

 

> >

 

> > > > > > such

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > yoga was mentioned in BPHS. Guru was specifically Jupiter, but

Rahu

 

> >

 

> > > > > > was

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > not specifically Chandaal. I am not sure if Rahu has been

given the

 

> >

 

> > > > > > name

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > of Chaandal in it's various descriptions. Now how this Yoga is

 

> >

 

> > > > > > feared by

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > all like Rahu dasha,Shani dasha, Shani Sade Sati etc. When a

learner

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > like me perhaps does not get any reason to show the cause of

 

> >

 

> > > > > > problems in

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > facing the jataka , we the lesser known jyotishis just take

names of

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > such yogas or positions of Shani as the root cause of all the

 

> >

 

> > > > > > problems.

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > Very easy way out indeed.

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > I have been thinking a lot about The Guru-Chaandal Yoga and

somehow

 

> >

 

> > > > > > tend

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > to believe, that Guru can become like a Chaandal in the real

sense.

 

> >

 

> > > > > > His

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > all faculties are shut and whatever he does and utters is very

very

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > surprising, it hits everything and everybody very hard. The

image of

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > Guru becomes that of a Satan,as he breathes fire and breakes

all the

 

> >

 

> > > > > > so

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > called maryada of a Guru, if there is anything called maryada.

When

 

> >

 

> > > > > > our

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > Rishis mentioned this Guru -Chaandal Yoga, they really must

have all

 

> >

 

> > > > > > the

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > rishis,munis, gurus who had dual personalities. There is no

need to

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > elaborate this. The real meaning of Guru Chaandal Yoga seems

to have

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > sink in now. It simply sinks the esteerm of a Guru, where a

Shishya

 

> >

 

> > > > > > is

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > forced to challenge his Guru, and more the Guru accuses the

Shishya,

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > more he exposes himself, and forces the Shishya to break his

silence

 

> >

 

> > > > > > and

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > he starts hesitatingly initially but goes full blast exposing

the

 

> >

 

> > > > > > Guru.

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > But, then the Shishya also has to be a real learner, who

perhaps

 

> >

 

> > > > > > never

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > depends solely and blindly on one Guru. Now a big question

which is

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > staring me and I have been wondering why the fathers of

Jyotish did

 

> >

 

> > > > > > not

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > mention about any yoga specifically , which could be termed or

 

> >

 

> > > > > > called as

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > " SHISHYA CHAANDAL " Yoga in the Jyotish !

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > Raj Bhardwaj

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > <Jyotish_ Remedies%

40. com>,

 

> >

 

> > > > > > " rohinicrystal "

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@ > wrote:

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > But Praajee...!

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > IK HORE thaa jo Dasyaa gadheriyaan de-vichh, unna kol...!

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > Varah (12) thay unna-di banday! Jotish main jaisay!! Ek do

ghabraa

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > gayey shaayad, aisaa sanu sunaa noo! Pher laut aayey US dey

Kaul

 

> >

 

> > > > > > usday

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > 'marnay' day baad!

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > Kis-day kaul woh sab logaan lautay, mainu nai pataa!

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > Asi to sirf dekhnaay may zindagi gawaan dittay! Kinni - Azib

hai

 

> >

 

> > > > > > yeh

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > kahaniyan bachchon di! Raab/Khudaa/ Parmeshwar/ God day

bachchoon-di!

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > Maaf karnaa praa -- punjabi bhot pyaari lagdii si magar ik

saal to

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > nahin naa kafi! Shaayad aglay janam main kuch hor

seekh-layngay, jo

 

> >

 

> > > > > > raha

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > giya si is janam-vich baki!

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > Aankhaan khulie rakhiyo! Aandar_waali! ! ;-)

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > Happy Easter!!

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > <Jyotish_ Remedies%

40. com>,

 

> >

 

> > > > > > Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > wrote:

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > > SiRR ji,

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > > HUSH is the word;

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > > Bolan naalon chup changeri, chup de naalon parda; je

MANSOOR na

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > bolda taan

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > > sooli kahnu Chadhda.

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > > Silence is golden; veil of secrecy even better, Mansoor

wouldn't

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > have been

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > > hanged on gallows ;had he preferred silence.

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > > Regards

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > > Kulbir Bains

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > > ------------ --------- ---------

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > > ** rohinicrystal jyotish_vani@

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > > *To:* <Jyotish_

Remedies% 40. com>

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > > *Sent:* Sun, 21 March, 2010 6:15:54 AM

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > > *Subject:* Re: Information about beej mantra

sadhana's ?

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > > Kulbir_praaji,

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > > This 'regulation' , " ...if deeksha of beej mantra is given

by

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > competent

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > > guru, then it becomes the responsibility of the guru to

bring

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > salvation to

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > > the disciple. " -- has an interesting wrinkle!

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > > It implies that the Guru himself/herself has already

attained

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > salvation!

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > > I think it is safe to assume that such deekshas are being

given

 

> >

 

> > > > > > in

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > the

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > > hundreds of thousands, if not millions, world-wide ;-)

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > > Now Chelaa poochtaa hai, " If there are so many millions of

Gurus

 

> >

 

> > > > > > who

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > have

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > > attained salvation already... Why is the earth and

humanity

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > suffering so

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > > much? " :-B

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > > ~Sab kuch seekha humnay, naa seekhie hoshiyari, Sach hai

duniya

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > walon kay

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > > hum SUB hain anadi/anari! ~

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > >

 

> >

 

> > > > > > > > > >

[Guest guest]

Why Vohrajee!

 

Rahu is dragon's head while ketu is the headless part or the tail!

 

Rahu does not need shoes and ketu does not need a hat!

 

RR_,

 

, " inder " <indervohra2001 wrote:

>

> Dear RR_jee,

> well written but not understood by me.

> Inder

>

> , " rohinicrystal " <jyotish_vani@>

wrote:

> >

> > Chandrashekhar_jee,

> >

> > I have noticed that those too preoccupied and focused on nodes run into a

situational problem which has an allegoric correlation! Rahu, unmitigated* could

result in the feet not touching the ground, while ketu unmitigated* could result

in one losing one's head (common sense!) and the analogy should be obvious given

what Vishnu's Chakra did to Swarbhanu :-)

> >

> > Rohiniranjan

> >

> > *Important conditional consideration!!

> >

> >

> >

> > , " Chandrashekhar "

<sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Rohini,

> > >

> > > Do not be modest unnecessarily.

> > >

> > > Being Chaya grahas they express themselves through others, so the laser

analogy seems appropriate.

> > >

> > > It is also wondrous that though we are in a way living on the surface of

Rahu we fail to recognize the Prithvi, as such.

> > >

> > > Take care,

> > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > -

> > > rohinicrystal

> > >

> > > Tuesday, March 30, 2010 4:02 AM

> > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Dear Chandrashekhar_jee,

> > >

> > > I may not have the profound experience of many of the currently famous

and vocal Jyotish-pragnaas (Internet and otherwise), but I have been

consistently impressed by the enormous spectrum and capability and potential of

both Rahu and Ketu in the lives of human beings -- particularly those who have

diverse experience as opposed to those who are stuck in a groove, as the

expression goes.

> > >

> > > The lunar nodes have enormous potential but like a hologram trapped in a

crystal they remain just a piece of decoration unless and until they are ignited

by a beam of laser! Then their message comes alive (I hate to use a movie

reference in this fairly heavy duty serious forum but those still young at heart

may recall the modern EPIC Starwars and Princess Leah's entry and message!)

> > >

> > > This has reference to my recent message to, I believe Kulbir, where I

referred to the laser, albeit not directly! Parashara did not write about Laser

but BPHS (I dare say, any version, perhaps) refers to it very clearly and

convincingly!

> > >

> > > Regards,

> > >

> > > Rohiniranjan

> > >

> > > , " Chandrashekhar "

<sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Dear Inderji,

> > > >

> > > > Is Rahu also not said to cause understanding of complex subjects (when

in 5th) and give one Ganga snan(When in 10th)?

> > > >

> > > > Regards,

> > > > Chandrashekhar

> > > > -

> > > > inder

> > > >

> > > > Monday, March 29, 2010 3:11 PM

> > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > No dear, we shall not fight. I am again refering to imaginary

situation that if we start fighting here it becomes Guru-Chaandal situation.

> > > > Rahu creats sudden, unexpected, good or nasty situations. Rahu is all

about effects.

> > > > Inder

> > > >

> > > > , " Chandrashekhar "

<sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear Inderji,

> > > > >

> > > > > I thought we were talking about effects of Guru Chandal yoga. It

seems like I was wrong and you were alluding to Guru Chandal situation.

> > > > >

> > > > > Anyway why should we start fight on this as we are obviously talking

about two different things?

> > > > >

> > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > -

> > > > > inder

> > > > >

> > > > > Sunday, March 28, 2010 5:05 PM

> > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear Chanrashekhar ji,

> > > > >

> > > > > Think of a hypothetical situation say 200 hundred years ago.

> > > > > Two Vidvan Pandit ji are sitting together and nicely exchanging

pleasantries. Now they come out and join a vast gathering of people.

> > > > > Very soon they would pick up fight with difference of opinion on

some ritual procedures or some interpretations in presence of mass gathering

saving their egos and creating mass hysteria which would be further spread into

village/town and house discussion.This is sort of Guru Chaandal situation.This

is one example. So they loose their GURUDUM with Rahu effect.

> > > > >

> > > > > Donot take chaandal in literal terms, most of the people doing

menial, small jobs, even dead body falls under Saturn.May be people carrying

petty tales or rumours fall under Rahu.

> > > > >

> > > > > If we start fight here for example on this issue, it would certainly

be Rahu effect.

> > > > >

> > > > > Inder

> > > > > , " Chandrashekhar "

<sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Dear Inderjee,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Does not Rahu rule over the Chandals? That is why he is also

called Chandal. So Guru Chandala yoga is nothing but conjunction of Guru and

Rahu.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Personally I think that though people tend to connect the word

chandal with the morals or behaviour of a person who has Guru Chandal yoga, that

might not be the case always.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Rahu gives results of the bhavesha whom he conjoins so Rahu will

give results of Guru while Guru himself may not be able to give his full results

during its dasha.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > -

> > > > > > inder

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Saturday, March 27, 2010 5:12 PM

> > > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Dear friends,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > This discussion on Guru-Chaandal Yoga is very interesting.Let me

give my submissions.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Why Rahu was called Chaandal was perhaps to give some derogatotry

remark to chhaya graha RAHU.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Earlier I gave one theory:Karaka for internet is Rahu.So in the

mordern times real Rahu is internet.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Beauty of Rahu is that it is infinite, shapeless, colourless and

formless and takes shape and characterstics of the planet with which it comes in

contact.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Internet astrology is all about Mercury+ Rahu or Mercury + Jupiter

+ Rahu.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Internet can take any shape and character as gets associated with

the type of people-- astro sites, religious sites, terrorists sits , porno

sites, sports sites etc.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Why Chanadal-- as it distracts mind, makes the mind hazy and

infinite.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Once with internet religious site or astro site or any site you

will have distracted mind, cannot perform even your Yoga or daily religious

rituals with concentration. You can not go and expand inwards when expanding

infinite outside.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Earlier olden days Rahu effects were in the form of Melas,

processions, committees, rumours, epidemics, foreign influences etc.

> > > > > > But the moderm dayday epidemic is internet.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > My experience is when you are running bhukti/antra /prana [lahiri]

of planet which is in star sub or subsub of Rahu, you get engulfed in internet

whirlpool and will not have peace of mind.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Also I have feeling that if you are seeing a chart of a real Yogi

who is not at-all connected to out world but only internal Samadhi , we should

remove Rahu-Ketu from the chart.In any case Rahu is MAYA of relative position of

earth, Moon and Sun.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Some members crtisize that internet astrology is spoiled and it is

hasty, irreligious etc, but this Chanadal has some positive aspects also as like

it expands your knowledge to limitless sphere.

> > > > > > Moreover internet is democratic- leaves you no choice except to

tolerate difference of opinion. It equilizes[learned and ordinary people] all

the people in formless networking.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > It captures you, engulfs you.For your family members ,it is really

a Chaandal[Guru chandal or budhha chanda or shukra or shani chandal doen not

matter to them]

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Inder

> > > > > > , Kulbir Bains

<lalkitabkb@> wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Sir Raj Bhardwaj ji,

> > > > > > > Kamaal kar diya ji aapne, Zinda undhaharan pesh kar di. MARHABA

> > > > > > > Regards

> > > > > > > Kulbir Bains.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > On Sat, Mar 27, 2010 at 12:12 AM, Raj <rajbhardwaj1949@> wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Yes Rohini and Kulbeer Bhai, I tend to agree with your

anecdote "

> > > > > > > > Shape Shifter " ! Here I would just try to also cover the first

line of

> > > > > > > > Kulbeer on the subject - Gurus plays a social role so do the

> > > > > > > > prostitutes.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Just 4 days ago , Kanu Sanyal, the man who started a peasants

movement

> > > > > > > > in a very small village named " Naxalbari " , which ultimately

> > > > > > > > became to be known the Naxals or Naxalites ; and it's further

> > > > > > > > carnation , the present day's PWG(People's War Group),

committed

> > > > > > > > suicide,found hanging in his one room hutment in his native

village,

> > > > > > > > frustrated with the changes in the ideology of the present

CPI(M) in the

> > > > > > > > garb of PWG. He was the GURU of Naxalite movement,which began

against

> > > > > > > > the Zamindars in the end of year 1966 or begening of 1967, and

slowly

> > > > > > > > and steadily spearead in the most states of India.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > I had finished my 1 year training in the Air Force and my

first posting

> > > > > > > > was in a place called Bengdubi, about 30 Kms from Naxalbari

village ,

> > > > > > > > near Baghdogra, in Siliguri,Distt Darjeeling in October,1968.

Movements

> > > > > > > > of defence personnel in this region were well guarded.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > On a holiday, I was doing the duty as deputy of the `Orderly

> > > > > > > > Officer'(who looks after each happenings within the Unit). In

the

> > > > > > > > evening, he just called his driver to take out the Nissan

Jonga. He also

> > > > > > > > called me out and asked me to sit in the back side of

vehicle,with my

> > > > > > > > Sten Gun. The vehicle moved out of the Unit, and he looked

back from

> > > > > > > > the rear window and asked me Lal-Batti dekhi hai kabhi ? I

nodded in

> > > > > > > > negative. After about 20 minutes drive, we entered the

Siliguri, and

> > > > > > > > headed towards a small colony of huts and mud houses. The

vehicle

> > > > > > > > stopped. He got down and told me just see around, I shall be

back

> > > > > > > > quickly. I was looking out and also had to stretch my head out

a number

> > > > > > > > of times , to fathom out that this place was indeed a Red

Light area.

> > > > > > > > Such areas are strictly `Out of Bounds' for the defence

> > > > > > > > personnel ,which was taught in our training manuals. And Lo,

there was

> > > > > > > > suddenly a big commotion in the area and I saw a number of

civil police

> > > > > > > > personnel forcing out the women from their living places ; and

throwing

> > > > > > > > them in the police lorry. Then I looked at my Orderly Officer

running

> > > > > > > > running towards our vehicle, trying to hold his pants tightly.

A fat

> > > > > > > > man,must be about 55 years, on the verge of retirement,

looking very

> > > > > > > > funny to me. Then in a flash I noticed a young girl dashing

towards back

> > > > > > > > of our vehicle, trying to catch it and enter. At the same

moment, our

> > > > > > > > vehicle started. I just extended my arm out , the girl found

it to be

> > > > > > > > helping hand, I pulled her inside and she sat on the floor of

the

> > > > > > > > vehicle. Few policemen did try to run after her, but they had

stopped,

> > > > > > > > having seen that ours was a defence vehicle.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > She was trying to get her breathing normal and I was looking

at her

> > > > > > > > nonchalantly. After few minutes the O.O peeped back from the

small rear

> > > > > > > > window' and shouted " Who the bitch is this?. I did not reply.

> > > > > > > > But I think that the driver must have also noticed everything

, like me

> > > > > > > > in the tript to Lal Batti. After about 5 minutes the O.O.

again peeped

> > > > > > > > back and said ` Hey boy I will take this girl to my Barrack. I

kept

> > > > > > > > mum. My mind was blank. No thought was crossing my mind, as

far as I

> > > > > > > > still remember. In the meantime I asked the girl about

herself. She told

> > > > > > > > that she is from Rajasthan and one of her uncles had brought

her to

> > > > > > > > this place 6 months back and she will be grateful if I can

help her to

> > > > > > > > go to Rajasthan. I knew that the Railway Station was just on

the way. As

> > > > > > > > we reached near the main gate, I called out the driver and

commanded him

> > > > > > > > to stop the vehicle. I had just about 3 Rupees with me and

gave it to

> > > > > > > > the girl and apologized that I cannot help her further, she

should just

> > > > > > > > catch any available train and try to take help from any one

and not to

> > > > > > > > worry, YOU will reach your Home. As the vehicle was slowing

down, the

> > > > > > > > O.O. shouted at me and ordered me that the girl with go with

us. I

> > > > > > > > simply pointed my Sten Gun in his direction and slowly brought

it near

> > > > > > > > his nose where he could feel the heat ..and he closed the rear

> > > > > > > > window. The vehicle stopped and I helped the girl out of the

vehicle. I

> > > > > > > > still carry the memory of her tearful eyes with full of karuna

and

> > > > > > > > thanks giving , till the vehicle moved out of her sight. I

felt so

> > > > > > > > tired and exhausted , I simply slumped on my seat.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > On the way back thoughts started crossing my mind that a

senior is

> > > > > > > > always a senior in the armed forces, if the O.O. wants he can

place me

> > > > > > > > under arrest after reaching the unit and frame any flimsy

charge sheet

> > > > > > > > against me and I could even face a court martial. My soul told

me no

> > > > > > > > fears so be it. Then I took a resolve that if it so happens, I

will kill

> > > > > > > > this son of a Gun senior- the Teacher-the Mentor-The supposed

guide to

> > > > > > > > me, by virtue of his being senior to me in rank in age. But

nothing ever

> > > > > > > > happened further on this count. For years on, I went on

feeling sorry

> > > > > > > > that I could not help her any further and would always wonder

whether

> > > > > > > > she ever reached her home !

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Now after such a long gap the discussion on Gurus, Deeksha,

Beej Mantra,

> > > > > > > > Guru Chaandal Yoga, Kanu Sanyal, Naxalbari has brought these

memories

> > > > > > > > back to me as fresh as ever before.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > As far me I feel that I have also fully understood that the

description

> > > > > > > > of this yoga in Shastras was indirect and not so direct but

it's direct

> > > > > > > > and literal meaning or name is CHAANDAL GURU-YOGA, If I may

rename it

> > > > > > > > in direct form. The O.O. must have called me by thousand names

like

> > > > > > > > CHAANDAL or manay more direct expletives , because he was in

dire needs

> > > > > > > > of the wants of his body and mind....and after the police

raid, I

> > > > > > > > deprived him of this real good oprtunity. But then, I do not

find any

> > > > > > > > such yoga which can directly label me as CHAANDAL SHISHYA. And

lastly,

> > > > > > > > that time I was running the mahadasha of Rahu-Rahu from

19-09-1966 to

> > > > > > > > 01-01-1969.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Raj Bhardwaj

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > --- In

<%40>,

> > > > > > > > " rohinicrystal "

> > > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Just an anecdotal suggestion, Raj_dada, if I may for you to

examine in

> > > > > > > > your collection of charts or test bench.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > I have always considered the lunar node as 'wild-cards' (The

joker in

> > > > > > > > a game of cards! A chalnaa, a mimic, a 'Shape-shifter' etc).

This is why

> > > > > > > > perhaps it is considered as a 'surrogate' that assumes the

persona and

> > > > > > > > role of the planet it is associated with or failing that in

whose sign

> > > > > > > > and nakshatra it is placed in). Particularly when a node is

moving

> > > > > > > > towards the planet it is co-occuping a varga, it imbibes the

qualities

> > > > > > > > and abilities of the planet concerned (I call it suction-yoga

or

> > > > > > > > Hoover-Yoga -- after the vacuum cleaner!). The planet so

affected loses

> > > > > > > > some or all of its propensity and natural qualities for good

or bad! So

> > > > > > > > a jupiter could lose its 'Teacher/priest-like nature', moon

could lose

> > > > > > > > its sensitive, emotional side or memory, mars could lose its

> > > > > > > > aggression... etc!). It may not be a complete loss but a

reduction in

> > > > > > > > the qualities.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Such influence is not necessarily good or bad for the

individual

> > > > > > > > depending on the personal nature of the node in the specific

chart!

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Please remember that it is anecdotal! Try it at your own

risk! In fact

> > > > > > > > for other novice readers, I would venture to add: PLEASE DON'T

TRY THIS

> > > > > > > > AT HOME WITHOUT YOUR TEACHER OR PARENT BEING PRESENT CLOSE BY!

:-)

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > So nice to hear that cheerfulness is back in your heart. My

prayers

> > > > > > > > and best wishes that Ma always shower Her blessings on ALL my

Dadas!

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > --- In

<%40>,

> > > > > > > > " rajbhardwaj1949 "

> > > > > > > > rajbhardwaj1949@ wrote:

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Dear Bhai Rohini, Kulbir and Krishnan and all Jyotishis,

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > The thread on " Beej Mantra " and " I disagree " have been

really very

> > > > > > > > > > interesting for me. After a long time I was enjoying and

smiling

> > > > > > > > while

> > > > > > > > > > reading the exchange, and at times I was humming.

Completely

> > > > > > > > relaxed. My

> > > > > > > > > > wife had observed me at a few occasions and called my

younger

> > > > > > > > daughter

> > > > > > > > > > to observe me silently and also enjoyed finding me relaxed

with

> > > > > > > > smile on

> > > > > > > > > > my face. Somehow the subject in both the threads got

intermangled

> > > > > > > > very

> > > > > > > > > > beautifully. Guru,Shishya,Deekshya,traditions; cunturies

old and the

> > > > > > > > > > current traits.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > I have firm belief that almost all of us(other jyotishis

also

> > > > > > > > included),

> > > > > > > > > > who try to give answers to the queries to best of their

knowledge;

> > > > > > > > and

> > > > > > > > > > most of the times face brickbats and get No thanks, still

go on

> > > > > > > > > > participating in their respective groups ,like addicts,

not

> > > > > > > > withstanding

> > > > > > > > > > the skirmishes here and there.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > This further strengthens my belief, that all such

jyotishis have

> > > > > > > > learned

> > > > > > > > > > jyotish with their own efforts, with no Guru or Gurukul.

If this is

> > > > > > > > not

> > > > > > > > > > Junoon, then what else. The will to learn and the will to

do bit of

> > > > > > > > > > experiment too in the process.How much time it takes to

read, how

> > > > > > > > quick

> > > > > > > > > > reactions or delayed reactions take seeds in our minds,

how we

> > > > > > > > prepare

> > > > > > > > > > ourselves to gather the thoughts and type these to give

them a shape

> > > > > > > > and

> > > > > > > > > > not expecting anything in return. Just the pure joy and

> > > > > > > > satisfaction.

> > > > > > > > > > This is a continuous process of learning for us and I also

have no

> > > > > > > > doubt

> > > > > > > > > > that the young learner also must be picking a lots from

what appears

> > > > > > > > in

> > > > > > > > > > the group.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > I will be hanged and stoned by the so called purists, if I

were to

> > > > > > > > say

> > > > > > > > > > that there is no need to have Guru, in the times we are

living. In

> > > > > > > > other

> > > > > > > > > > words every learner of Jyotish has his own free Will , if

it is

> > > > > > > > > > Operational , to learn the Jyotish without being bound by

any

> > > > > > > > > > Rules,Paramparas etc. This is so because the material and

> > > > > > > > opportunity

> > > > > > > > > > for picking up Jyotish is now really very easily available

and every

> > > > > > > > > > learner has good faculties in the field of education and

languages.

> > > > > > > > One

> > > > > > > > > > just needs to have a keen eye and belief in himself. How

they will

> > > > > > > > use

> > > > > > > > > > their knowledge will depend solely on themselves.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > While on the subject of , I (like many other Jyotishis)

was also

> > > > > > > > witness

> > > > > > > > > > to few other happenings involving a Guru and Shishya. I

have been

> > > > > > > > > > thinking for quite some time about the " Guru-Chaandal

Yoga " . Why

> > > > > > > > such

> > > > > > > > > > yoga was mentioned in BPHS. Guru was specifically Jupiter,

but Rahu

> > > > > > > > was

> > > > > > > > > > not specifically Chandaal. I am not sure if Rahu has been

given the

> > > > > > > > name

> > > > > > > > > > of Chaandal in it's various descriptions. Now how this

Yoga is

> > > > > > > > feared by

> > > > > > > > > > all like Rahu dasha,Shani dasha, Shani Sade Sati etc. When

a learner

> > > > > > > > > > like me perhaps does not get any reason to show the cause

of

> > > > > > > > problems in

> > > > > > > > > > facing the jataka , we the lesser known jyotishis just

take names of

> > > > > > > > > > such yogas or positions of Shani as the root cause of all

the

> > > > > > > > problems.

> > > > > > > > > > Very easy way out indeed.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > I have been thinking a lot about The Guru-Chaandal Yoga

and somehow

> > > > > > > > tend

> > > > > > > > > > to believe, that Guru can become like a Chaandal in the

real sense.

> > > > > > > > His

> > > > > > > > > > all faculties are shut and whatever he does and utters is

very very

> > > > > > > > > > surprising, it hits everything and everybody very hard.

The image of

> > > > > > > > > > Guru becomes that of a Satan,as he breathes fire and

breakes all the

> > > > > > > > so

> > > > > > > > > > called maryada of a Guru, if there is anything called

maryada. When

> > > > > > > > our

> > > > > > > > > > Rishis mentioned this Guru -Chaandal Yoga, they really

must have all

> > > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > rishis,munis,gurus who had dual personalities. There is no

need to

> > > > > > > > > > elaborate this. The real meaning of Guru Chaandal Yoga

seems to have

> > > > > > > > > > sink in now. It simply sinks the esteerm of a Guru, where

a Shishya

> > > > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > > > forced to challenge his Guru, and more the Guru accuses

the Shishya,

> > > > > > > > > > more he exposes himself, and forces the Shishya to break

his silence

> > > > > > > > and

> > > > > > > > > > he starts hesitatingly initially but goes full blast

exposing the

> > > > > > > > Guru.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > But, then the Shishya also has to be a real learner, who

perhaps

> > > > > > > > never

> > > > > > > > > > depends solely and blindly on one Guru. Now a big question

which is

> > > > > > > > > > staring me and I have been wondering why the fathers of

Jyotish did

> > > > > > > > not

> > > > > > > > > > mention about any yoga specifically , which could be

termed or

> > > > > > > > called as

> > > > > > > > > > " SHISHYA CHAANDAL " Yoga in the Jyotish !

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Raj Bhardwaj

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > --- In

<%40>,

> > > > > > > > " rohinicrystal "

> > > > > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > But Praajee...!

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > IK HORE thaa jo Dasyaa gadheriyaan de-vichh, unna

kol...!

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Varah (12) thay unna-di banday! Jotish main jaisay!! Ek

do ghabraa

> > > > > > > > > > gayey shaayad, aisaa sanu sunaa noo! Pher laut aayey US

dey Kaul

> > > > > > > > usday

> > > > > > > > > > 'marnay' day baad!

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Kis-day kaul woh sab logaan lautay, mainu nai pataa!

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Asi to sirf dekhnaay may zindagi gawaan dittay! Kinni -

Azib hai

> > > > > > > > yeh

> > > > > > > > > > kahaniyan bachchon di! Raab/Khudaa/Parmeshwar/God day

bachchoon-di!

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Maaf karnaa praa -- punjabi bhot pyaari lagdii si magar

ik saal to

> > > > > > > > > > nahin naa kafi! Shaayad aglay janam main kuch hor

seekh-layngay, jo

> > > > > > > > raha

> > > > > > > > > > giya si is janam-vich baki!

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Aankhaan khulie rakhiyo! Aandar_waali!! ;-)

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Happy Easter!!

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > --- In

<%40>,

> > > > > > > > Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@

> > > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > SiRR ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > HUSH is the word;

> > > > > > > > > > > > Bolan naalon chup changeri, chup de naalon parda; je

MANSOOR na

> > > > > > > > > > bolda taan

> > > > > > > > > > > > sooli kahnu Chadhda.

> > > > > > > > > > > > Silence is golden; veil of secrecy even better,

Mansoor wouldn't

> > > > > > > > > > have been

> > > > > > > > > > > > hanged on gallows ;had he preferred silence.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Regards

> > > > > > > > > > > > Kulbir Bains

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------

> > > > > > > > > > > > ** rohinicrystal jyotish_vani@

> > > > > > > > > > > > *To:*

<%40>

> > > > > > > > > > > > *Sent:* Sun, 21 March, 2010 6:15:54 AM

> > > > > > > > > > > > *Subject:* Re: Information about beej mantra

sadhana's ?

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Kulbir_praaji,

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > This 'regulation' , " ...if deeksha of beej mantra is

given by

> > > > > > > > > > competent

> > > > > > > > > > > > guru, then it becomes the responsibility of the guru

to bring

> > > > > > > > > > salvation to

> > > > > > > > > > > > the disciple. " -- has an interesting wrinkle!

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > It implies that the Guru himself/herself has already

attained

> > > > > > > > > > salvation!

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > I think it is safe to assume that such deekshas are

being given

> > > > > > > > in

> > > > > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > > > hundreds of thousands, if not millions, world-wide ;-)

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Now Chelaa poochtaa hai, " If there are so many

millions of Gurus

> > > > > > > > who

> > > > > > > > > > have

> > > > > > > > > > > > attained salvation already... Why is the earth and

humanity

> > > > > > > > > > suffering so

> > > > > > > > > > > > much? " :-B

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > ~Sab kuch seekha humnay, naa seekhie hoshiyari, Sach

hai duniya

> > > > > > > > > > walon kay

> > > > > > > > > > > > hum SUB hain anadi/anari! ~

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

[Guest guest]

Dear Praaji...,

 

 

, Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb wrote:

>

>... Although RR ji has answered the query in best pragmatic way

> possible...>

 

 

Kyon bhaayaa -- budhapay main Maar khilwaanay kaa iraada hai kya ...? ;-)

---<EoQm>---

 

Hum to youn hi BADnaam thay, teray zikr say pahlay!

Aab aur paththar aayengay, kam thay jo khaayay pahlay?

 

RR_,

[Guest guest]

Dear Chandrashekhar jee,

 

Thank you for your kind and as always very thoughtful thoughts. You have struck

a very resonant CHORD! I once came across, thankfully very early on during my

astrological journey two charts of individuals born 'poles' apart in the sense

of Longitudes within few days of one another with same ascendant and in kshetra

with just one planet that was placed differently! One of them was a very skilled

surgeon while the other was a serial killer!

 

The lagna was scorpio in both cases.

 

Your answer was way better than what I received a few years ago in other

'settings'!

 

One astrologer of bengali origin said that " Mongol " did not refer to 'mongol'

but to the cruel MONGOLS.

 

Another Jyotish " Vidwan " in Varanasi told me that it was a clever remedial ploy

to appease CRUEL LORD MANGAL just as some astrologers used to appease their

protectors and sponsors: Royalty!

 

Believe it or not...!

 

Rohiniranjan

 

 

, " Chandrashekhar "

<sharma.chandrashekhar wrote:

>

> Dear Rohini,

>

> Mangal is called that perhaps as he is energy and also mythologically it

absorbed blood of Andhakasur, thus killing him in Andhalaasura Shiva fight?

>

> It is perhaps like a weapon of offence giving good results in hands of the

protector of the country but bad in hands of the terrorists.

>

> Take care,

> Chandrashekhar.

> -

> rohinicrystal

>

> Wednesday, March 31, 2010 3:43 AM

> Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

>

>

>

> Chandrashekhar_jee and Raj bhaisaheb,

>

> I have generally winced a bit when people try to equate and extrapolate

directly and literally from ancient allegories and in my opinion that creates

problems which creates the 'black and white' in astrology. The latest that we

have observed being the words from " Rahu is uncondtionally bad " camp.

>

> My personal preference is to take the allegories as nice mnemonics or memory

aids but not an exhaustive description of the 'planets' concerned from an

astrological point of view. The story of swarbhanu, the story of Kach and

Devyani, and even the story of Harishchandra in Shani Mahatmay are great

pointers and make what can be a rather dry subject (Astrology with its terse

rules and exceptions!) interesting and even lively! But, if we get stuck in the

mindset that those stories and allegories capture the entire essence of

astrological reality or astrological details, then that would be a serious loss

for the astrology learners and practitioners. Particularly the ones who actually

read charts or give readings (the applied and practical astrologers).

>

> The astrological reality (more than sun in leo in 4th will result in this or

that... for instance!) is multifactorial and rather than seeing the

benefic/malefic dichotomy as absolute, I wish people will consider the

modification and modulation of the essential, central characteristics of planets

and realize that without such nuances and influences, astrology will begin to

look rather threadbare.

>

> I am of the opinion that the karakatwas given in Jyotish texts such as BPHS

(and I do not mean BPHS alone!) describe the core properties or values of the

planets and we must not stray too far from those. In contrast, texts such as

uttarkalamrita despite their prolific treatment of karakas must be considered

with a pinch of salt, or at least some of the labels given there in the context

of karakattwas.

>

> Some of the problems inherent in the 'modern' labels (neokarakatwas!) while

being useful raise one question. How careful was the author or proponent in

making sure that what he or she is giving is the nascent karakttwa and not the

result of a multifactorial influence or compound karakattwa? What one is

attributing to Jupiter for instance -- if derived from astrological

observations, how much of the description is for the planet itself and what

component or contamination in chemical mixture terms can be attributed to a

melange of influences? It is often very difficult to tease out the influences of

individual participants in a property or label which sometimes is ascribed to a

single planet.

>

> I am not saying that BPHS alone is correct in all instances but certainly a

safe starting point! Others may differ in their opinion, of course.

>

> Speaking of names, the label MANGAL for mars is intriguing. Why is a malefic

that is cruel and associated with wounds, injuries, aggression, cutting etc

should be associated with mangal which represents beneficience, shubha,

amelioration?

>

> I am sure there are many similar nomenclatural puzzles in Jyotish and I

realize that one lifetime is not sufficient to figure out all the labels and

what not, but certainly makes the study of astrology rather interesting.

>

> Rohiniranjan

>

> , " Chandrashekhar "

<sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote:

> >

> > Dear Raj,

> >

> > I have already read your experience with interest. I can also understand

what you felt as it was an absolutely wicked situation. You did something that

needed great courage, knowing the way Army works.

> >

> > But I am one who can not equate ideologue of a violent movement, even for

good causes, with Guru. In jyotish I always prefer to keep the grahas and our

concepts about what their names should mean in the light of Puranas separate.

May be not exactly separate but my interpretation of the puranic stories in

explaining the nature of grahas is at variance with what is generally thought

and so I prefer to keep it to myself.

> >

> > Take care,

> > Chandrashekhar.

> >

> >

> > -

> > Raj

> >

> > Tuesday, March 30, 2010 9:52 AM

> > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> >

> >

> >

> > Dear Chandrashekhar Ji,

> > I am enjoying your posts. But, I feel you could have missed my msg

No.73157 and what was the context of Guru-Rahu yuti,in the present times. ! I

hope you will like reading it, as the thread began from there.! With my best

regards.

> >

> > Raj Bhardwaj

> >

> > , " Chandrashekhar "

<sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Vattem Krishnan,

> > >

> > > I was responding to Rohini's mail. I have already made clear what is

meant by Chandal and what by MlecCha. I had said " One meaning of Chandal is

worst amongst men and that of Mlecha is a wicked man, a foreigner, one who does

not speak Sanskrit etc. So that too is right. "

> > >

> > > Regards,

> > > Chandrashekhar

> > >

> > >

> > > -

> > > Vattem Krishnan

> > >

> > > Monday, March 29, 2010 12:37 PM

> > > Re: Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Dear Sir,

> > > It is true that persons opeartating from burial grounds are referred

with this term.It's application however to Rahu in litteral terms is not

properly substantiated.mlechas are not chandals.

> > > In our epics more so when we recollect about Raja Satya Harischndra

Story,we find the reference of " Chandal " the one who burns dead bodies and keeps

watch at burial grounds.

> > > Doms are not falling under chandal category.Some where it is also

mentioned to cannibals or narbhakshas as chnadals.

> > >

> > > Vattem Krishnan Cyber Jyotish Services(For all counseling

services)Dr.B.V.Raman " Fools Obey Planets While Wisemen Can Control Them " Planets

are neutral Controllers of Mans Karma

> > >

> > > --- On Sun, 3/28/10, Chandrashekhar <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Chandrashekhar <sharma.chandrashekhar@>

> > > Re: Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> > >

> > > Sunday, March 28, 2010, 3:15 PM

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Dear Rohini Ranjan,

> > >

> > > I am trying to acquire its manuscript, through one of my friends and

hope to learn some more about Paraashara.

> > >

> > > Yes, Chandal is an interesting term. They are generally thought to be

those who operate at funeral sites.

> > >

> > > Rahu is enigmatic planet and so has not rest or does not allow others to

rest.

> > >

> > > Regards,

> > >

> > > Chandrashekhar.

> > >

> > > -

> > >

> > > rohinicrystal

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Sunday, March 28, 2010 11:57 PM

> > >

> > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> > >

> > > Chandrashekhar jee,

> > >

> > > Thanks for taking the time, Sir. I have not had the good fortune of

having seen Vriddha Parashari. I have only studied BPHS, Parashara Samhita and

Laghu/madhya parashari.

> > >

> > > My urdu is rather limited, actually.

> > >

> > > Chandaal is a very interesting term and at one point were thought of as

the '5th caste'! In MP they were called Dom and in bengal nomoshuddoor.

> > >

> > > Poor Rahu! Even on its home-turf (internet according to some) there is

no rest for the wicked :-)

> > >

> > > Rohiniranjan

> > >

> > > , " Chandrashekhar "

<sharma.chandrashek har@> wrote:

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > > Dear Rohini Ranjan,

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > > One meaning of Chandal is worst amongst men and that of Mlecha is a

wicked man, a foreigner, one who does not speak Sanskrit etc. So that too is

right.

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > > So your contention is also correct. I liked the comment about change

of perception between ibtedah and inteha. You must be pretty good at Urdu?

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > > Have you heard of a manuscript called Vriddha Parashari?

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > > Regards,

> > >

> > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > > -

> > >

> > > > rohinicrystal

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > > Sunday, March 28, 2010 5:45 AM

> > >

> > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > > Dear Chandrashekhar jee,

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > > I have also heard that rahu represents mlechchaas or 'other

cultures/foreign cultures'

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > > Often plays a part according to what jyotishis " claim " that it has to

do with journey abroad or marrying into other cultures and religions and so on.

Just another wrinkle, I suppose! But by no means uncommon, based on the queries

received by jyotishis working actively on the " Jyotish HOT-LINE! "

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > > As touched upon in my astrotreasures article written long ago and

posted on boloji years later -- BPHS changed its perspective between the ibetadh

and inteha! That was a clue for me that I tuned-in profitably (in terms of

learning!) -- and the fact that it was placed so close to Sudarshan completed

the clue for me!

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > > Krishna was the awataar of Vishnu that carried the Sudarshan Chakra

and was Poorna Purusha! If I write anything further on this matter in this

august forum, I will be insulting the intelligence and Gnan of the inhabitants

on this huge Island!

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > > Rohiniranjan

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > > , " Chandrashekhar "

<sharma.chandrashek har@> wrote:

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Dear Inderjee,

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Does not Rahu rule over the Chandals? That is why he is also called

Chandal. So Guru Chandala yoga is nothing but conjunction of Guru and Rahu.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Personally I think that though people tend to connect the word

chandal with the morals or behaviour of a person who has Guru Chandal yoga, that

might not be the case always.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Rahu gives results of the bhavesha whom he conjoins so Rahu will

give results of Guru while Guru himself may not be able to give his full results

during its dasha.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > -

> > >

> > > > > inder

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Saturday, March 27, 2010 5:12 PM

> > >

> > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Dear friends,

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > This discussion on Guru-Chaandal Yoga is very interesting. Let me

give my submissions.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Why Rahu was called Chaandal was perhaps to give some derogatotry

remark to chhaya graha RAHU.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Earlier I gave one theory:Karaka for internet is Rahu.So in the

mordern times real Rahu is internet.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Beauty of Rahu is that it is infinite, shapeless, colourless and

formless and takes shape and characterstics of the planet with which it comes in

contact.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Internet astrology is all about Mercury+ Rahu or Mercury + Jupiter +

Rahu.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Internet can take any shape and character as gets associated with

the type of people-- astro sites, religious sites, terrorists sits , porno

sites, sports sites etc.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Why Chanadal-- as it distracts mind, makes the mind hazy and

infinite.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Once with internet religious site or astro site or any site you will

have distracted mind, cannot perform even your Yoga or daily religious rituals

with concentration. You can not go and expand inwards when expanding infinite

outside.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Earlier olden days Rahu effects were in the form of Melas,

processions, committees, rumours, epidemics, foreign influences etc.

> > >

> > > > > But the moderm dayday epidemic is internet.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > My experience is when you are running bhukti/antra /prana [lahiri]

of planet which is in star sub or subsub of Rahu, you get engulfed in internet

whirlpool and will not have peace of mind.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Also I have feeling that if you are seeing a chart of a real Yogi

who is not at-all connected to out world but only internal Samadhi , we should

remove Rahu-Ketu from the chart.In any case Rahu is MAYA of relative position of

earth, Moon and Sun.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Some members crtisize that internet astrology is spoiled and it is

hasty, irreligious etc, but this Chanadal has some positive aspects also as like

it expands your knowledge to limitless sphere.

> > >

> > > > > Moreover internet is democratic- leaves you no choice except to

tolerate difference of opinion. It equilizes[learned and ordinary people] all

the people in formless networking.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > It captures you, engulfs you.For your family members ,it is really a

Chaandal[Guru chandal or budhha chanda or shukra or shani chandal doen not

matter to them]

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Inder

> > >

> > > > > , Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb@

> wrote:

> > >

> > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > Sir Raj Bhardwaj ji,

> > >

> > > > > > Kamaal kar diya ji aapne, Zinda undhaharan pesh kar di. MARHABA

> > >

> > > > > > Regards

> > >

> > > > > > Kulbir Bains.

> > >

> > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > On Sat, Mar 27, 2010 at 12:12 AM, Raj <rajbhardwaj1949@ > wrote:

> > >

> > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > Yes Rohini and Kulbeer Bhai, I tend to agree with your anecdote "

> > >

> > > > > > > Shape Shifter " ! Here I would just try to also cover the first

line of

> > >

> > > > > > > Kulbeer on the subject - Gurus plays a social role so do the

> > >

> > > > > > > prostitutes.

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > Just 4 days ago , Kanu Sanyal, the man who started a peasants

movement

> > >

> > > > > > > in a very small village named " Naxalbari " , which ultimately

> > >

> > > > > > > became to be known the Naxals or Naxalites ; and it's further

> > >

> > > > > > > carnation , the present day's PWG(People's War Group), committed

> > >

> > > > > > > suicide,found hanging in his one room hutment in his native

village,

> > >

> > > > > > > frustrated with the changes in the ideology of the present

CPI(M) in the

> > >

> > > > > > > garb of PWG. He was the GURU of Naxalite movement,which began

against

> > >

> > > > > > > the Zamindars in the end of year 1966 or begening of 1967, and

slowly

> > >

> > > > > > > and steadily spearead in the most states of India.

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > I had finished my 1 year training in the Air Force and my first

posting

> > >

> > > > > > > was in a place called Bengdubi, about 30 Kms from Naxalbari

village ,

> > >

> > > > > > > near Baghdogra, in Siliguri,Distt Darjeeling in October,1968.

Movements

> > >

> > > > > > > of defence personnel in this region were well guarded.

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > On a holiday, I was doing the duty as deputy of the `Orderly

> > >

> > > > > > > Officer'(who looks after each happenings within the Unit). In

the

> > >

> > > > > > > evening, he just called his driver to take out the Nissan Jonga.

He also

> > >

> > > > > > > called me out and asked me to sit in the back side of

vehicle,with my

> > >

> > > > > > > Sten Gun. The vehicle moved out of the Unit, and he looked back

from

> > >

> > > > > > > the rear window and asked me Lal-Batti dekhi hai kabhi ? I

nodded in

> > >

> > > > > > > negative. After about 20 minutes drive, we entered the Siliguri,

and

> > >

> > > > > > > headed towards a small colony of huts and mud houses. The

vehicle

> > >

> > > > > > > stopped. He got down and told me just see around, I shall be

back

> > >

> > > > > > > quickly. I was looking out and also had to stretch my head out a

number

> > >

> > > > > > > of times , to fathom out that this place was indeed a Red Light

area.

> > >

> > > > > > > Such areas are strictly `Out of Bounds' for the defence

> > >

> > > > > > > personnel ,which was taught in our training manuals. And Lo,

there was

> > >

> > > > > > > suddenly a big commotion in the area and I saw a number of civil

police

> > >

> > > > > > > personnel forcing out the women from their living places ; and

throwing

> > >

> > > > > > > them in the police lorry. Then I looked at my Orderly Officer

running

> > >

> > > > > > > running towards our vehicle, trying to hold his pants tightly. A

fat

> > >

> > > > > > > man,must be about 55 years, on the verge of retirement, looking

very

> > >

> > > > > > > funny to me. Then in a flash I noticed a young girl dashing

towards back

> > >

> > > > > > > of our vehicle, trying to catch it and enter. At the same

moment, our

> > >

> > > > > > > vehicle started. I just extended my arm out , the girl found it

to be

> > >

> > > > > > > helping hand, I pulled her inside and she sat on the floor of

the

> > >

> > > > > > > vehicle. Few policemen did try to run after her, but they had

stopped,

> > >

> > > > > > > having seen that ours was a defence vehicle.

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > She was trying to get her breathing normal and I was looking at

her

> > >

> > > > > > > nonchalantly. After few minutes the O.O peeped back from the

small rear

> > >

> > > > > > > window' and shouted " Who the bitch is this?. I did not reply.

> > >

> > > > > > > But I think that the driver must have also noticed everything ,

like me

> > >

> > > > > > > in the tript to Lal Batti. After about 5 minutes the O.O. again

peeped

> > >

> > > > > > > back and said ` Hey boy I will take this girl to my Barrack. I

kept

> > >

> > > > > > > mum. My mind was blank. No thought was crossing my mind, as far

as I

> > >

> > > > > > > still remember. In the meantime I asked the girl about herself.

She told

> > >

> > > > > > > that she is from Rajasthan and one of her uncles had brought her

to

> > >

> > > > > > > this place 6 months back and she will be grateful if I can help

her to

> > >

> > > > > > > go to Rajasthan. I knew that the Railway Station was just on the

way. As

> > >

> > > > > > > we reached near the main gate, I called out the driver and

commanded him

> > >

> > > > > > > to stop the vehicle. I had just about 3 Rupees with me and gave

it to

> > >

> > > > > > > the girl and apologized that I cannot help her further, she

should just

> > >

> > > > > > > catch any available train and try to take help from any one and

not to

> > >

> > > > > > > worry, YOU will reach your Home. As the vehicle was slowing

down, the

> > >

> > > > > > > O.O. shouted at me and ordered me that the girl with go with us.

I

> > >

> > > > > > > simply pointed my Sten Gun in his direction and slowly brought

it near

> > >

> > > > > > > his nose where he could feel the heat ..and he closed the rear

> > >

> > > > > > > window. The vehicle stopped and I helped the girl out of the

vehicle. I

> > >

> > > > > > > still carry the memory of her tearful eyes with full of karuna

and

> > >

> > > > > > > thanks giving , till the vehicle moved out of her sight. I felt

so

> > >

> > > > > > > tired and exhausted , I simply slumped on my seat.

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > On the way back thoughts started crossing my mind that a senior

is

> > >

> > > > > > > always a senior in the armed forces, if the O.O. wants he can

place me

> > >

> > > > > > > under arrest after reaching the unit and frame any flimsy charge

sheet

> > >

> > > > > > > against me and I could even face a court martial. My soul told

me no

> > >

> > > > > > > fears so be it. Then I took a resolve that if it so happens, I

will kill

> > >

> > > > > > > this son of a Gun senior- the Teacher-the Mentor-The supposed

guide to

> > >

> > > > > > > me, by virtue of his being senior to me in rank in age. But

nothing ever

> > >

> > > > > > > happened further on this count. For years on, I went on feeling

sorry

> > >

> > > > > > > that I could not help her any further and would always wonder

whether

> > >

> > > > > > > she ever reached her home !

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > Now after such a long gap the discussion on Gurus, Deeksha, Beej

Mantra,

> > >

> > > > > > > Guru Chaandal Yoga, Kanu Sanyal, Naxalbari has brought these

memories

> > >

> > > > > > > back to me as fresh as ever before.

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > As far me I feel that I have also fully understood that the

description

> > >

> > > > > > > of this yoga in Shastras was indirect and not so direct but it's

direct

> > >

> > > > > > > and literal meaning or name is CHAANDAL GURU-YOGA, If I may

rename it

> > >

> > > > > > > in direct form. The O.O. must have called me by thousand names

like

> > >

> > > > > > > CHAANDAL or manay more direct expletives , because he was in

dire needs

> > >

> > > > > > > of the wants of his body and mind....and after the police raid,

I

> > >

> > > > > > > deprived him of this real good oprtunity. But then, I do not

find any

> > >

> > > > > > > such yoga which can directly label me as CHAANDAL SHISHYA. And

lastly,

> > >

> > > > > > > that time I was running the mahadasha of Rahu-Rahu from

19-09-1966 to

> > >

> > > > > > > 01-01-1969.

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > Raj Bhardwaj

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > <%

40. com>,

> > >

> > > > > > > " rohinicrystal "

> > >

> > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@ > wrote:

> > >

> > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > Just an anecdotal suggestion, Raj_dada, if I may for you to

examine in

> > >

> > > > > > > your collection of charts or test bench.

> > >

> > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > I have always considered the lunar node as 'wild-cards' (The

joker in

> > >

> > > > > > > a game of cards! A chalnaa, a mimic, a 'Shape-shifter' etc).

This is why

> > >

> > > > > > > perhaps it is considered as a 'surrogate' that assumes the

persona and

> > >

> > > > > > > role of the planet it is associated with or failing that in

whose sign

> > >

> > > > > > > and nakshatra it is placed in). Particularly when a node is

moving

> > >

> > > > > > > towards the planet it is co-occuping a varga, it imbibes the

qualities

> > >

> > > > > > > and abilities of the planet concerned (I call it suction-yoga or

> > >

> > > > > > > Hoover-Yoga -- after the vacuum cleaner!). The planet so

affected loses

> > >

> > > > > > > some or all of its propensity and natural qualities for good or

bad! So

> > >

> > > > > > > a jupiter could lose its 'Teacher/priest- like nature', moon

could lose

> > >

> > > > > > > its sensitive, emotional side or memory, mars could lose its

> > >

> > > > > > > aggression.. . etc!). It may not be a complete loss but a

reduction in

> > >

> > > > > > > the qualities.

> > >

> > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > Such influence is not necessarily good or bad for the

individual

> > >

> > > > > > > depending on the personal nature of the node in the specific

chart!

> > >

> > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > Please remember that it is anecdotal! Try it at your own risk!

In fact

> > >

> > > > > > > for other novice readers, I would venture to add: PLEASE DON'T

TRY THIS

> > >

> > > > > > > AT HOME WITHOUT YOUR TEACHER OR PARENT BEING PRESENT CLOSE BY!

:-)

> > >

> > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > So nice to hear that cheerfulness is back in your heart. My

prayers

> > >

> > > > > > > and best wishes that Ma always shower Her blessings on ALL my

Dadas!

> > >

> > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan

> > >

> > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > <%

40. com>,

> > >

> > > > > > > " rajbhardwaj1949 "

> > >

> > > > > > > rajbhardwaj1949@ wrote:

> > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > Dear Bhai Rohini, Kulbir and Krishnan and all Jyotishis,

> > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > The thread on " Beej Mantra " and " I disagree " have been

really very

> > >

> > > > > > > > > interesting for me. After a long time I was enjoying and

smiling

> > >

> > > > > > > while

> > >

> > > > > > > > > reading the exchange, and at times I was humming. Completely

> > >

> > > > > > > relaxed. My

> > >

> > > > > > > > > wife had observed me at a few occasions and called my

younger

> > >

> > > > > > > daughter

> > >

> > > > > > > > > to observe me silently and also enjoyed finding me relaxed

with

> > >

> > > > > > > smile on

> > >

> > > > > > > > > my face. Somehow the subject in both the threads got

intermangled

> > >

> > > > > > > very

> > >

> > > > > > > > > beautifully. Guru,Shishya, Deekshya, traditions; cunturies

old and the

> > >

> > > > > > > > > current traits.

> > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > I have firm belief that almost all of us(other jyotishis

also

> > >

> > > > > > > included),

> > >

> > > > > > > > > who try to give answers to the queries to best of their

knowledge;

> > >

> > > > > > > and

> > >

> > > > > > > > > most of the times face brickbats and get No thanks, still go

on

> > >

> > > > > > > > > participating in their respective groups ,like addicts, not

> > >

> > > > > > > withstanding

> > >

> > > > > > > > > the skirmishes here and there.

> > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > This further strengthens my belief, that all such jyotishis

have

> > >

> > > > > > > learned

> > >

> > > > > > > > > jyotish with their own efforts, with no Guru or Gurukul. If

this is

> > >

> > > > > > > not

> > >

> > > > > > > > > Junoon, then what else. The will to learn and the will to do

bit of

> > >

> > > > > > > > > experiment too in the process.How much time it takes to

read, how

> > >

> > > > > > > quick

> > >

> > > > > > > > > reactions or delayed reactions take seeds in our minds, how

we

> > >

> > > > > > > prepare

> > >

> > > > > > > > > ourselves to gather the thoughts and type these to give them

a shape

> > >

> > > > > > > and

> > >

> > > > > > > > > not expecting anything in return. Just the pure joy and

> > >

> > > > > > > satisfaction.

> > >

> > > > > > > > > This is a continuous process of learning for us and I also

have no

> > >

> > > > > > > doubt

> > >

> > > > > > > > > that the young learner also must be picking a lots from what

appears

> > >

> > > > > > > in

> > >

> > > > > > > > > the group.

> > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > I will be hanged and stoned by the so called purists, if I

were to

> > >

> > > > > > > say

> > >

> > > > > > > > > that there is no need to have Guru, in the times we are

living. In

> > >

> > > > > > > other

> > >

> > > > > > > > > words every learner of Jyotish has his own free Will , if it

is

> > >

> > > > > > > > > Operational , to learn the Jyotish without being bound by

any

> > >

> > > > > > > > > Rules,Paramparas etc. This is so because the material and

> > >

> > > > > > > opportunity

> > >

> > > > > > > > > for picking up Jyotish is now really very easily available

and every

> > >

> > > > > > > > > learner has good faculties in the field of education and

languages.

> > >

> > > > > > > One

> > >

> > > > > > > > > just needs to have a keen eye and belief in himself. How

they will

> > >

> > > > > > > use

> > >

> > > > > > > > > their knowledge will depend solely on themselves.

> > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > While on the subject of , I (like many other Jyotishis) was

also

> > >

> > > > > > > witness

> > >

> > > > > > > > > to few other happenings involving a Guru and Shishya. I have

been

> > >

> > > > > > > > > thinking for quite some time about the " Guru-Chaandal Yoga " .

Why

> > >

> > > > > > > such

> > >

> > > > > > > > > yoga was mentioned in BPHS. Guru was specifically Jupiter,

but Rahu

> > >

> > > > > > > was

> > >

> > > > > > > > > not specifically Chandaal. I am not sure if Rahu has been

given the

> > >

> > > > > > > name

> > >

> > > > > > > > > of Chaandal in it's various descriptions. Now how this Yoga

is

> > >

> > > > > > > feared by

> > >

> > > > > > > > > all like Rahu dasha,Shani dasha, Shani Sade Sati etc. When a

learner

> > >

> > > > > > > > > like me perhaps does not get any reason to show the cause of

> > >

> > > > > > > problems in

> > >

> > > > > > > > > facing the jataka , we the lesser known jyotishis just take

names of

> > >

> > > > > > > > > such yogas or positions of Shani as the root cause of all

the

> > >

> > > > > > > problems.

> > >

> > > > > > > > > Very easy way out indeed.

> > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > I have been thinking a lot about The Guru-Chaandal Yoga and

somehow

> > >

> > > > > > > tend

> > >

> > > > > > > > > to believe, that Guru can become like a Chaandal in the real

sense.

> > >

> > > > > > > His

> > >

> > > > > > > > > all faculties are shut and whatever he does and utters is

very very

> > >

> > > > > > > > > surprising, it hits everything and everybody very hard. The

image of

> > >

> > > > > > > > > Guru becomes that of a Satan,as he breathes fire and breakes

all the

> > >

> > > > > > > so

> > >

> > > > > > > > > called maryada of a Guru, if there is anything called

maryada. When

> > >

> > > > > > > our

> > >

> > > > > > > > > Rishis mentioned this Guru -Chaandal Yoga, they really must

have all

> > >

> > > > > > > the

> > >

> > > > > > > > > rishis,munis, gurus who had dual personalities. There is no

need to

> > >

> > > > > > > > > elaborate this. The real meaning of Guru Chaandal Yoga seems

to have

> > >

> > > > > > > > > sink in now. It simply sinks the esteerm of a Guru, where a

Shishya

> > >

> > > > > > > is

> > >

> > > > > > > > > forced to challenge his Guru, and more the Guru accuses the

Shishya,

> > >

> > > > > > > > > more he exposes himself, and forces the Shishya to break his

silence

> > >

> > > > > > > and

> > >

> > > > > > > > > he starts hesitatingly initially but goes full blast

exposing the

> > >

> > > > > > > Guru.

> > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > But, then the Shishya also has to be a real learner, who

perhaps

> > >

> > > > > > > never

> > >

> > > > > > > > > depends solely and blindly on one Guru. Now a big question

which is

> > >

> > > > > > > > > staring me and I have been wondering why the fathers of

Jyotish did

> > >

> > > > > > > not

> > >

> > > > > > > > > mention about any yoga specifically , which could be termed

or

> > >

> > > > > > > called as

> > >

> > > > > > > > > " SHISHYA CHAANDAL " Yoga in the Jyotish !

> > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > Raj Bhardwaj

> > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > <%

40. com>,

> > >

> > > > > > > " rohinicrystal "

> > >

> > > > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@ > wrote:

> > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > But Praajee...!

> > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > IK HORE thaa jo Dasyaa gadheriyaan de-vichh, unna kol...!

> > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > Varah (12) thay unna-di banday! Jotish main jaisay!! Ek do

ghabraa

> > >

> > > > > > > > > gayey shaayad, aisaa sanu sunaa noo! Pher laut aayey US dey

Kaul

> > >

> > > > > > > usday

> > >

> > > > > > > > > 'marnay' day baad!

> > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > Kis-day kaul woh sab logaan lautay, mainu nai pataa!

> > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > Asi to sirf dekhnaay may zindagi gawaan dittay! Kinni -

Azib hai

> > >

> > > > > > > yeh

> > >

> > > > > > > > > kahaniyan bachchon di! Raab/Khudaa/ Parmeshwar/ God day

bachchoon-di!

> > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > Maaf karnaa praa -- punjabi bhot pyaari lagdii si magar ik

saal to

> > >

> > > > > > > > > nahin naa kafi! Shaayad aglay janam main kuch hor

seekh-layngay, jo

> > >

> > > > > > > raha

> > >

> > > > > > > > > giya si is janam-vich baki!

> > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > Aankhaan khulie rakhiyo! Aandar_waali! ! ;-)

> > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > Happy Easter!!

> > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan

> > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > @ .

com<% 40. com>,

> > >

> > > > > > > Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@

> > >

> > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > SiRR ji,

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > HUSH is the word;

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Bolan naalon chup changeri, chup de naalon parda; je

MANSOOR na

> > >

> > > > > > > > > bolda taan

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > sooli kahnu Chadhda.

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Silence is golden; veil of secrecy even better, Mansoor

wouldn't

> > >

> > > > > > > > > have been

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > hanged on gallows ;had he preferred silence.

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Regards

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Kulbir Bains

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > ------------ --------- ---------

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > ** rohinicrystal jyotish_vani@

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > *To:* @ .

com<% 40. com>

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > *Sent:* Sun, 21 March, 2010 6:15:54 AM

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > *Subject:* Re: Information about beej mantra

sadhana's ?

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Kulbir_praaji,

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > This 'regulation' , " ...if deeksha of beej mantra is

given by

> > >

> > > > > > > > > competent

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > guru, then it becomes the responsibility of the guru to

bring

> > >

> > > > > > > > > salvation to

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > the disciple. " -- has an interesting wrinkle!

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > It implies that the Guru himself/herself has already

attained

> > >

> > > > > > > > > salvation!

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > I think it is safe to assume that such deekshas are

being given

> > >

> > > > > > > in

> > >

> > > > > > > > > the

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > hundreds of thousands, if not millions, world-wide ;-)

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Now Chelaa poochtaa hai, " If there are so many millions

of Gurus

> > >

> > > > > > > who

> > >

> > > > > > > > > have

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > attained salvation already... Why is the earth and

humanity

> > >

> > > > > > > > > suffering so

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > much? " :-B

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > ~Sab kuch seekha humnay, naa seekhie hoshiyari, Sach hai

duniya

> > >

> > > > > > > > > walon kay

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > hum SUB hain anadi/anari! ~

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

[Guest guest]

Yeah yeah,

Not needing hat and shoes saves lot of money.

If we also donot understand the things we save lot of efforts andtime and

energy!!

Inder

, " rohinicrystal " <jyotish_vani

wrote:

>

> Why Vohrajee!

>

> Rahu is dragon's head while ketu is the headless part or the tail!

>

> Rahu does not need shoes and ketu does not need a hat!

>

> RR_,

>

> , " inder " <indervohra2001@> wrote:

> >

> > Dear RR_jee,

> > well written but not understood by me.

> > Inder

> >

> > , " rohinicrystal " <jyotish_vani@>

wrote:

> > >

> > > Chandrashekhar_jee,

> > >

> > > I have noticed that those too preoccupied and focused on nodes run into a

situational problem which has an allegoric correlation! Rahu, unmitigated* could

result in the feet not touching the ground, while ketu unmitigated* could result

in one losing one's head (common sense!) and the analogy should be obvious given

what Vishnu's Chakra did to Swarbhanu :-)

> > >

> > > Rohiniranjan

> > >

> > > *Important conditional consideration!!

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > , " Chandrashekhar "

<sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Dear Rohini,

> > > >

> > > > Do not be modest unnecessarily.

> > > >

> > > > Being Chaya grahas they express themselves through others, so the laser

analogy seems appropriate.

> > > >

> > > > It is also wondrous that though we are in a way living on the surface of

Rahu we fail to recognize the Prithvi, as such.

> > > >

> > > > Take care,

> > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > -

> > > > rohinicrystal

> > > >

> > > > Tuesday, March 30, 2010 4:02 AM

> > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Dear Chandrashekhar_jee,

> > > >

> > > > I may not have the profound experience of many of the currently famous

and vocal Jyotish-pragnaas (Internet and otherwise), but I have been

consistently impressed by the enormous spectrum and capability and potential of

both Rahu and Ketu in the lives of human beings -- particularly those who have

diverse experience as opposed to those who are stuck in a groove, as the

expression goes.

> > > >

> > > > The lunar nodes have enormous potential but like a hologram trapped in

a crystal they remain just a piece of decoration unless and until they are

ignited by a beam of laser! Then their message comes alive (I hate to use a

movie reference in this fairly heavy duty serious forum but those still young at

heart may recall the modern EPIC Starwars and Princess Leah's entry and

message!)

> > > >

> > > > This has reference to my recent message to, I believe Kulbir, where I

referred to the laser, albeit not directly! Parashara did not write about Laser

but BPHS (I dare say, any version, perhaps) refers to it very clearly and

convincingly!

> > > >

> > > > Regards,

> > > >

> > > > Rohiniranjan

> > > >

> > > > , " Chandrashekhar "

<sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear Inderji,

> > > > >

> > > > > Is Rahu also not said to cause understanding of complex subjects

(when in 5th) and give one Ganga snan(When in 10th)?

> > > > >

> > > > > Regards,

> > > > > Chandrashekhar

> > > > > -

> > > > > inder

> > > > >

> > > > > Monday, March 29, 2010 3:11 PM

> > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > No dear, we shall not fight. I am again refering to imaginary

situation that if we start fighting here it becomes Guru-Chaandal situation.

> > > > > Rahu creats sudden, unexpected, good or nasty situations. Rahu is

all about effects.

> > > > > Inder

> > > > >

> > > > > , " Chandrashekhar "

<sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Dear Inderji,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I thought we were talking about effects of Guru Chandal yoga. It

seems like I was wrong and you were alluding to Guru Chandal situation.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Anyway why should we start fight on this as we are obviously

talking about two different things?

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > -

> > > > > > inder

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Sunday, March 28, 2010 5:05 PM

> > > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Dear Chanrashekhar ji,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Think of a hypothetical situation say 200 hundred years ago.

> > > > > > Two Vidvan Pandit ji are sitting together and nicely exchanging

pleasantries. Now they come out and join a vast gathering of people.

> > > > > > Very soon they would pick up fight with difference of opinion on

some ritual procedures or some interpretations in presence of mass gathering

saving their egos and creating mass hysteria which would be further spread into

village/town and house discussion.This is sort of Guru Chaandal situation.This

is one example. So they loose their GURUDUM with Rahu effect.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Donot take chaandal in literal terms, most of the people doing

menial, small jobs, even dead body falls under Saturn.May be people carrying

petty tales or rumours fall under Rahu.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > If we start fight here for example on this issue, it would

certainly be Rahu effect.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Inder

> > > > > > , " Chandrashekhar "

<sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Dear Inderjee,

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Does not Rahu rule over the Chandals? That is why he is also

called Chandal. So Guru Chandala yoga is nothing but conjunction of Guru and

Rahu.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Personally I think that though people tend to connect the word

chandal with the morals or behaviour of a person who has Guru Chandal yoga, that

might not be the case always.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Rahu gives results of the bhavesha whom he conjoins so Rahu will

give results of Guru while Guru himself may not be able to give his full results

during its dasha.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > -

> > > > > > > inder

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Saturday, March 27, 2010 5:12 PM

> > > > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Dear friends,

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > This discussion on Guru-Chaandal Yoga is very interesting.Let me

give my submissions.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Why Rahu was called Chaandal was perhaps to give some

derogatotry remark to chhaya graha RAHU.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Earlier I gave one theory:Karaka for internet is Rahu.So in the

mordern times real Rahu is internet.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Beauty of Rahu is that it is infinite, shapeless, colourless and

formless and takes shape and characterstics of the planet with which it comes in

contact.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Internet astrology is all about Mercury+ Rahu or Mercury +

Jupiter + Rahu.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Internet can take any shape and character as gets associated

with the type of people-- astro sites, religious sites, terrorists sits , porno

sites, sports sites etc.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Why Chanadal-- as it distracts mind, makes the mind hazy and

infinite.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Once with internet religious site or astro site or any site you

will have distracted mind, cannot perform even your Yoga or daily religious

rituals with concentration. You can not go and expand inwards when expanding

infinite outside.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Earlier olden days Rahu effects were in the form of Melas,

processions, committees, rumours, epidemics, foreign influences etc.

> > > > > > > But the moderm dayday epidemic is internet.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > My experience is when you are running bhukti/antra /prana

[lahiri] of planet which is in star sub or subsub of Rahu, you get engulfed in

internet whirlpool and will not have peace of mind.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Also I have feeling that if you are seeing a chart of a real

Yogi who is not at-all connected to out world but only internal Samadhi , we

should remove Rahu-Ketu from the chart.In any case Rahu is MAYA of relative

position of earth, Moon and Sun.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Some members crtisize that internet astrology is spoiled and it

is hasty, irreligious etc, but this Chanadal has some positive aspects also as

like it expands your knowledge to limitless sphere.

> > > > > > > Moreover internet is democratic- leaves you no choice except to

tolerate difference of opinion. It equilizes[learned and ordinary people] all

the people in formless networking.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > It captures you, engulfs you.For your family members ,it is

really a Chaandal[Guru chandal or budhha chanda or shukra or shani chandal doen

not matter to them]

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Inder

> > > > > > > , Kulbir Bains

<lalkitabkb@> wrote:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Sir Raj Bhardwaj ji,

> > > > > > > > Kamaal kar diya ji aapne, Zinda undhaharan pesh kar di.

MARHABA

> > > > > > > > Regards

> > > > > > > > Kulbir Bains.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > On Sat, Mar 27, 2010 at 12:12 AM, Raj <rajbhardwaj1949@>

wrote:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Yes Rohini and Kulbeer Bhai, I tend to agree with your

anecdote "

> > > > > > > > > Shape Shifter " ! Here I would just try to also cover the

first line of

> > > > > > > > > Kulbeer on the subject - Gurus plays a social role so do the

> > > > > > > > > prostitutes.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Just 4 days ago , Kanu Sanyal, the man who started a

peasants movement

> > > > > > > > > in a very small village named " Naxalbari " , which ultimately

> > > > > > > > > became to be known the Naxals or Naxalites ; and it's

further

> > > > > > > > > carnation , the present day's PWG(People's War Group),

committed

> > > > > > > > > suicide,found hanging in his one room hutment in his native

village,

> > > > > > > > > frustrated with the changes in the ideology of the present

CPI(M) in the

> > > > > > > > > garb of PWG. He was the GURU of Naxalite movement,which

began against

> > > > > > > > > the Zamindars in the end of year 1966 or begening of 1967,

and slowly

> > > > > > > > > and steadily spearead in the most states of India.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > I had finished my 1 year training in the Air Force and my

first posting

> > > > > > > > > was in a place called Bengdubi, about 30 Kms from Naxalbari

village ,

> > > > > > > > > near Baghdogra, in Siliguri,Distt Darjeeling in

October,1968. Movements

> > > > > > > > > of defence personnel in this region were well guarded.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > On a holiday, I was doing the duty as deputy of the `Orderly

> > > > > > > > > Officer'(who looks after each happenings within the Unit).

In the

> > > > > > > > > evening, he just called his driver to take out the Nissan

Jonga. He also

> > > > > > > > > called me out and asked me to sit in the back side of

vehicle,with my

> > > > > > > > > Sten Gun. The vehicle moved out of the Unit, and he looked

back from

> > > > > > > > > the rear window and asked me Lal-Batti dekhi hai kabhi ? I

nodded in

> > > > > > > > > negative. After about 20 minutes drive, we entered the

Siliguri, and

> > > > > > > > > headed towards a small colony of huts and mud houses. The

vehicle

> > > > > > > > > stopped. He got down and told me just see around, I shall be

back

> > > > > > > > > quickly. I was looking out and also had to stretch my head

out a number

> > > > > > > > > of times , to fathom out that this place was indeed a Red

Light area.

> > > > > > > > > Such areas are strictly `Out of Bounds' for the defence

> > > > > > > > > personnel ,which was taught in our training manuals. And Lo,

there was

> > > > > > > > > suddenly a big commotion in the area and I saw a number of

civil police

> > > > > > > > > personnel forcing out the women from their living places ;

and throwing

> > > > > > > > > them in the police lorry. Then I looked at my Orderly

Officer running

> > > > > > > > > running towards our vehicle, trying to hold his pants

tightly. A fat

> > > > > > > > > man,must be about 55 years, on the verge of retirement,

looking very

> > > > > > > > > funny to me. Then in a flash I noticed a young girl dashing

towards back

> > > > > > > > > of our vehicle, trying to catch it and enter. At the same

moment, our

> > > > > > > > > vehicle started. I just extended my arm out , the girl found

it to be

> > > > > > > > > helping hand, I pulled her inside and she sat on the floor

of the

> > > > > > > > > vehicle. Few policemen did try to run after her, but they

had stopped,

> > > > > > > > > having seen that ours was a defence vehicle.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > She was trying to get her breathing normal and I was looking

at her

> > > > > > > > > nonchalantly. After few minutes the O.O peeped back from the

small rear

> > > > > > > > > window' and shouted " Who the bitch is this?. I did not

reply.

> > > > > > > > > But I think that the driver must have also noticed

everything , like me

> > > > > > > > > in the tript to Lal Batti. After about 5 minutes the O.O.

again peeped

> > > > > > > > > back and said ` Hey boy I will take this girl to my Barrack.

I kept

> > > > > > > > > mum. My mind was blank. No thought was crossing my mind, as

far as I

> > > > > > > > > still remember. In the meantime I asked the girl about

herself. She told

> > > > > > > > > that she is from Rajasthan and one of her uncles had brought

her to

> > > > > > > > > this place 6 months back and she will be grateful if I can

help her to

> > > > > > > > > go to Rajasthan. I knew that the Railway Station was just on

the way. As

> > > > > > > > > we reached near the main gate, I called out the driver and

commanded him

> > > > > > > > > to stop the vehicle. I had just about 3 Rupees with me and

gave it to

> > > > > > > > > the girl and apologized that I cannot help her further, she

should just

> > > > > > > > > catch any available train and try to take help from any one

and not to

> > > > > > > > > worry, YOU will reach your Home. As the vehicle was slowing

down, the

> > > > > > > > > O.O. shouted at me and ordered me that the girl with go with

us. I

> > > > > > > > > simply pointed my Sten Gun in his direction and slowly

brought it near

> > > > > > > > > his nose where he could feel the heat ..and he closed the

rear

> > > > > > > > > window. The vehicle stopped and I helped the girl out of the

vehicle. I

> > > > > > > > > still carry the memory of her tearful eyes with full of

karuna and

> > > > > > > > > thanks giving , till the vehicle moved out of her sight. I

felt so

> > > > > > > > > tired and exhausted , I simply slumped on my seat.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > On the way back thoughts started crossing my mind that a

senior is

> > > > > > > > > always a senior in the armed forces, if the O.O. wants he

can place me

> > > > > > > > > under arrest after reaching the unit and frame any flimsy

charge sheet

> > > > > > > > > against me and I could even face a court martial. My soul

told me no

> > > > > > > > > fears so be it. Then I took a resolve that if it so happens,

I will kill

> > > > > > > > > this son of a Gun senior- the Teacher-the Mentor-The

supposed guide to

> > > > > > > > > me, by virtue of his being senior to me in rank in age. But

nothing ever

> > > > > > > > > happened further on this count. For years on, I went on

feeling sorry

> > > > > > > > > that I could not help her any further and would always

wonder whether

> > > > > > > > > she ever reached her home !

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Now after such a long gap the discussion on Gurus, Deeksha,

Beej Mantra,

> > > > > > > > > Guru Chaandal Yoga, Kanu Sanyal, Naxalbari has brought these

memories

> > > > > > > > > back to me as fresh as ever before.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > As far me I feel that I have also fully understood that the

description

> > > > > > > > > of this yoga in Shastras was indirect and not so direct but

it's direct

> > > > > > > > > and literal meaning or name is CHAANDAL GURU-YOGA, If I may

rename it

> > > > > > > > > in direct form. The O.O. must have called me by thousand

names like

> > > > > > > > > CHAANDAL or manay more direct expletives , because he was in

dire needs

> > > > > > > > > of the wants of his body and mind....and after the police

raid, I

> > > > > > > > > deprived him of this real good oprtunity. But then, I do not

find any

> > > > > > > > > such yoga which can directly label me as CHAANDAL SHISHYA.

And lastly,

> > > > > > > > > that time I was running the mahadasha of Rahu-Rahu from

19-09-1966 to

> > > > > > > > > 01-01-1969.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Raj Bhardwaj

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > --- In

<%40>,

> > > > > > > > > " rohinicrystal "

> > > > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Just an anecdotal suggestion, Raj_dada, if I may for you

to examine in

> > > > > > > > > your collection of charts or test bench.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > I have always considered the lunar node as 'wild-cards'

(The joker in

> > > > > > > > > a game of cards! A chalnaa, a mimic, a 'Shape-shifter' etc).

This is why

> > > > > > > > > perhaps it is considered as a 'surrogate' that assumes the

persona and

> > > > > > > > > role of the planet it is associated with or failing that in

whose sign

> > > > > > > > > and nakshatra it is placed in). Particularly when a node is

moving

> > > > > > > > > towards the planet it is co-occuping a varga, it imbibes the

qualities

> > > > > > > > > and abilities of the planet concerned (I call it

suction-yoga or

> > > > > > > > > Hoover-Yoga -- after the vacuum cleaner!). The planet so

affected loses

> > > > > > > > > some or all of its propensity and natural qualities for good

or bad! So

> > > > > > > > > a jupiter could lose its 'Teacher/priest-like nature', moon

could lose

> > > > > > > > > its sensitive, emotional side or memory, mars could lose its

> > > > > > > > > aggression... etc!). It may not be a complete loss but a

reduction in

> > > > > > > > > the qualities.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Such influence is not necessarily good or bad for the

individual

> > > > > > > > > depending on the personal nature of the node in the specific

chart!

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Please remember that it is anecdotal! Try it at your own

risk! In fact

> > > > > > > > > for other novice readers, I would venture to add: PLEASE

DON'T TRY THIS

> > > > > > > > > AT HOME WITHOUT YOUR TEACHER OR PARENT BEING PRESENT CLOSE

BY! :-)

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > So nice to hear that cheerfulness is back in your heart.

My prayers

> > > > > > > > > and best wishes that Ma always shower Her blessings on ALL

my Dadas!

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > --- In

<%40>,

> > > > > > > > > " rajbhardwaj1949 "

> > > > > > > > > rajbhardwaj1949@ wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Dear Bhai Rohini, Kulbir and Krishnan and all Jyotishis,

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > The thread on " Beej Mantra " and " I disagree " have been

really very

> > > > > > > > > > > interesting for me. After a long time I was enjoying and

smiling

> > > > > > > > > while

> > > > > > > > > > > reading the exchange, and at times I was humming.

Completely

> > > > > > > > > relaxed. My

> > > > > > > > > > > wife had observed me at a few occasions and called my

younger

> > > > > > > > > daughter

> > > > > > > > > > > to observe me silently and also enjoyed finding me

relaxed with

> > > > > > > > > smile on

> > > > > > > > > > > my face. Somehow the subject in both the threads got

intermangled

> > > > > > > > > very

> > > > > > > > > > > beautifully. Guru,Shishya,Deekshya,traditions; cunturies

old and the

> > > > > > > > > > > current traits.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > I have firm belief that almost all of us(other jyotishis

also

> > > > > > > > > included),

> > > > > > > > > > > who try to give answers to the queries to best of their

knowledge;

> > > > > > > > > and

> > > > > > > > > > > most of the times face brickbats and get No thanks,

still go on

> > > > > > > > > > > participating in their respective groups ,like addicts,

not

> > > > > > > > > withstanding

> > > > > > > > > > > the skirmishes here and there.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > This further strengthens my belief, that all such

jyotishis have

> > > > > > > > > learned

> > > > > > > > > > > jyotish with their own efforts, with no Guru or Gurukul.

If this is

> > > > > > > > > not

> > > > > > > > > > > Junoon, then what else. The will to learn and the will

to do bit of

> > > > > > > > > > > experiment too in the process.How much time it takes to

read, how

> > > > > > > > > quick

> > > > > > > > > > > reactions or delayed reactions take seeds in our minds,

how we

> > > > > > > > > prepare

> > > > > > > > > > > ourselves to gather the thoughts and type these to give

them a shape

> > > > > > > > > and

> > > > > > > > > > > not expecting anything in return. Just the pure joy and

> > > > > > > > > satisfaction.

> > > > > > > > > > > This is a continuous process of learning for us and I

also have no

> > > > > > > > > doubt

> > > > > > > > > > > that the young learner also must be picking a lots from

what appears

> > > > > > > > > in

> > > > > > > > > > > the group.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > I will be hanged and stoned by the so called purists, if

I were to

> > > > > > > > > say

> > > > > > > > > > > that there is no need to have Guru, in the times we are

living. In

> > > > > > > > > other

> > > > > > > > > > > words every learner of Jyotish has his own free Will ,

if it is

> > > > > > > > > > > Operational , to learn the Jyotish without being bound

by any

> > > > > > > > > > > Rules,Paramparas etc. This is so because the material

and

> > > > > > > > > opportunity

> > > > > > > > > > > for picking up Jyotish is now really very easily

available and every

> > > > > > > > > > > learner has good faculties in the field of education and

languages.

> > > > > > > > > One

> > > > > > > > > > > just needs to have a keen eye and belief in himself. How

they will

> > > > > > > > > use

> > > > > > > > > > > their knowledge will depend solely on themselves.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > While on the subject of , I (like many other Jyotishis)

was also

> > > > > > > > > witness

> > > > > > > > > > > to few other happenings involving a Guru and Shishya. I

have been

> > > > > > > > > > > thinking for quite some time about the " Guru-Chaandal

Yoga " . Why

> > > > > > > > > such

> > > > > > > > > > > yoga was mentioned in BPHS. Guru was specifically

Jupiter, but Rahu

> > > > > > > > > was

> > > > > > > > > > > not specifically Chandaal. I am not sure if Rahu has

been given the

> > > > > > > > > name

> > > > > > > > > > > of Chaandal in it's various descriptions. Now how this

Yoga is

> > > > > > > > > feared by

> > > > > > > > > > > all like Rahu dasha,Shani dasha, Shani Sade Sati etc.

When a learner

> > > > > > > > > > > like me perhaps does not get any reason to show the

cause of

> > > > > > > > > problems in

> > > > > > > > > > > facing the jataka , we the lesser known jyotishis just

take names of

> > > > > > > > > > > such yogas or positions of Shani as the root cause of

all the

> > > > > > > > > problems.

> > > > > > > > > > > Very easy way out indeed.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > I have been thinking a lot about The Guru-Chaandal Yoga

and somehow

> > > > > > > > > tend

> > > > > > > > > > > to believe, that Guru can become like a Chaandal in the

real sense.

> > > > > > > > > His

> > > > > > > > > > > all faculties are shut and whatever he does and utters

is very very

> > > > > > > > > > > surprising, it hits everything and everybody very hard.

The image of

> > > > > > > > > > > Guru becomes that of a Satan,as he breathes fire and

breakes all the

> > > > > > > > > so

> > > > > > > > > > > called maryada of a Guru, if there is anything called

maryada. When

> > > > > > > > > our

> > > > > > > > > > > Rishis mentioned this Guru -Chaandal Yoga, they really

must have all

> > > > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > > rishis,munis,gurus who had dual personalities. There is

no need to

> > > > > > > > > > > elaborate this. The real meaning of Guru Chaandal Yoga

seems to have

> > > > > > > > > > > sink in now. It simply sinks the esteerm of a Guru,

where a Shishya

> > > > > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > > > > forced to challenge his Guru, and more the Guru accuses

the Shishya,

> > > > > > > > > > > more he exposes himself, and forces the Shishya to break

his silence

> > > > > > > > > and

> > > > > > > > > > > he starts hesitatingly initially but goes full blast

exposing the

> > > > > > > > > Guru.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > But, then the Shishya also has to be a real learner, who

perhaps

> > > > > > > > > never

> > > > > > > > > > > depends solely and blindly on one Guru. Now a big

question which is

> > > > > > > > > > > staring me and I have been wondering why the fathers of

Jyotish did

> > > > > > > > > not

> > > > > > > > > > > mention about any yoga specifically , which could be

termed or

> > > > > > > > > called as

> > > > > > > > > > > " SHISHYA CHAANDAL " Yoga in the Jyotish !

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Raj Bhardwaj

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > --- In

<%40>,

> > > > > > > > > " rohinicrystal "

> > > > > > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > But Praajee...!

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > IK HORE thaa jo Dasyaa gadheriyaan de-vichh, unna

kol...!

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Varah (12) thay unna-di banday! Jotish main jaisay!!

Ek do ghabraa

> > > > > > > > > > > gayey shaayad, aisaa sanu sunaa noo! Pher laut aayey US

dey Kaul

> > > > > > > > > usday

> > > > > > > > > > > 'marnay' day baad!

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Kis-day kaul woh sab logaan lautay, mainu nai pataa!

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Asi to sirf dekhnaay may zindagi gawaan dittay! Kinni

- Azib hai

> > > > > > > > > yeh

> > > > > > > > > > > kahaniyan bachchon di! Raab/Khudaa/Parmeshwar/God day

bachchoon-di!

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Maaf karnaa praa -- punjabi bhot pyaari lagdii si

magar ik saal to

> > > > > > > > > > > nahin naa kafi! Shaayad aglay janam main kuch hor

seekh-layngay, jo

> > > > > > > > > raha

> > > > > > > > > > > giya si is janam-vich baki!

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Aankhaan khulie rakhiyo! Aandar_waali!! ;-)

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Happy Easter!!

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > --- In

<%40>,

> > > > > > > > > Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@

> > > > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > SiRR ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > HUSH is the word;

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Bolan naalon chup changeri, chup de naalon parda; je

MANSOOR na

> > > > > > > > > > > bolda taan

> > > > > > > > > > > > > sooli kahnu Chadhda.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Silence is golden; veil of secrecy even better,

Mansoor wouldn't

> > > > > > > > > > > have been

> > > > > > > > > > > > > hanged on gallows ;had he preferred silence.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Kulbir Bains

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------

> > > > > > > > > > > > > ** rohinicrystal jyotish_vani@

> > > > > > > > > > > > > *To:*

<%40>

> > > > > > > > > > > > > *Sent:* Sun, 21 March, 2010 6:15:54 AM

> > > > > > > > > > > > > *Subject:* Re: Information about beej mantra

sadhana's ?

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Kulbir_praaji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > This 'regulation' , " ...if deeksha of beej mantra is

given by

> > > > > > > > > > > competent

> > > > > > > > > > > > > guru, then it becomes the responsibility of the guru

to bring

> > > > > > > > > > > salvation to

> > > > > > > > > > > > > the disciple. " -- has an interesting wrinkle!

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > It implies that the Guru himself/herself has already

attained

> > > > > > > > > > > salvation!

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > I think it is safe to assume that such deekshas are

being given

> > > > > > > > > in

> > > > > > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > hundreds of thousands, if not millions, world-wide

;-)

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Now Chelaa poochtaa hai, " If there are so many

millions of Gurus

> > > > > > > > > who

> > > > > > > > > > > have

> > > > > > > > > > > > > attained salvation already... Why is the earth and

humanity

> > > > > > > > > > > suffering so

> > > > > > > > > > > > > much? " :-B

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > ~Sab kuch seekha humnay, naa seekhie hoshiyari, Sach

hai duniya

> > > > > > > > > > > walon kay

> > > > > > > > > > > > > hum SUB hain anadi/anari! ~

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

removed]

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

[Guest guest]

Dear Kulbir jee,

Not Tughlaki farman, it was well and deep thought of farman.

But but..

Tughlaki farmans were also well planned,and thought off, but went topsy turvy.

Rahu was not favorable to poor Tughlak.

Inder

 

, Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb wrote:

>

> Dear Inder;

> Some reasoned reply may help me instead of this Tughlaki Farmaan.

> I have come to learn here so it matters at least to me.

> Regards

> Kulbir Bains

>

> Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

>

> Wednesday, 31 March, 2010 6:10 AM

>

>

> Dear Kulbir,

> I donot agree with you.

> Anyway does'nt matter.

> Inder

>

> , Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb@ ...>

> wrote:

> >

> > Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best pragmatic

> way

> > possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says.

> > House no 11. represents SABKI APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN earning. In 11th

> > house itself, is the seat of justice/judge. Saturn takes the incurred

> karma

> > via Rahu and Ketu before Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the seat of judge

> > but Saturn is the drishti to guide it).

> > Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter passes it on Saturn's

> > recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in mind. (khuda ko hazir

> > mankar).

> > Regards

> > Kulbir Bains.

> >

> > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder <indervohra2001@ ...> wrote:

> >

> > >

> > >

> > > Dear Kulbir,

> > > Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement. [correct or

> incorrect]

> > > Saturn is illegal,[but may be correct],thinking.

> > >

> > > Jupiter + Saturn becomes philospher.[ nothing good or bad, but thinking

> > > makes it so]

> > >

> > > Mars with Jupiter logic[logician] , without reading the law books he

> would

> > > give arguments which may win him.

> > >

> > > Inder

>

> On Wed, Mar 31, 2010 at 8:53 AM, Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb wrote:

>

> Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best pragmatic way

> possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says.House no 11. represents SABKI

> APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN earning. In 11th house itself, is the seat of

> justice/judge. Saturn takes the incurred karma via Rahu and Ketu before

> Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the seat of judge but Saturn is the drishti

> to guide it).Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter passes it on

> Saturn's recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in mind. (khuda

> ko hazir mankar).

>

> Regards

>

> Kulbir Bains.

>

> On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder <indervohra2001 wrote:

>

> Dear Kulbir,

>

> Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement.[correct or

> incorrect]Saturn is illegal,[but may be correct],thinking.Jupiter + Saturn

> becomes philospher.[nothing good or bad, but thinking makes it so]Mars with

> Jupiter logic[logician], without reading the law books he would give

> arguments which may win him.

>

> Inder

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Inder Sahib,

Bad Acha; Badnaam Bura. Kare koi ,Bhare koi?

Why blame poor Rahu?, Tughlaq's farmaans planning was meticulous just ahead of

time. EXECUTION went wrong.

Just to drive home the point Jupiter in 3rd house surrounded by Mercury, Venus,

Rahu , Saturn. and Moon in 12. makes a fit Tughlaq Sahib's nature/case.

Regards

Kulbir Bains

 

, " inder " <indervohra2001 wrote:

>

> Dear Kulbir jee,

> Not Tughlaki farman, it was well and deep thought of farman.

> But but..

> Tughlaki farmans were also well planned,and thought off, but went topsy turvy.

Rahu was not favorable to poor Tughlak.

> Inder

>

> , Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb@> wrote:

> >

> > Dear Inder;

> > Some reasoned reply may help me instead of this Tughlaki Farmaan.

> > I have come to learn here so it matters at least to me.

> > Regards

> > Kulbir Bains

> >

> > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> >

> > Wednesday, 31 March, 2010 6:10 AM

> >

> >

> > Dear Kulbir,

> > I donot agree with you.

> > Anyway does'nt matter.

> > Inder

> >

> > , Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb@ ...>

> > wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best pragmatic

> > way

> > > possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says.

> > > House no 11. represents SABKI APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN earning. In 11th

> > > house itself, is the seat of justice/judge. Saturn takes the incurred

> > karma

> > > via Rahu and Ketu before Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the seat of judge

> > > but Saturn is the drishti to guide it).

> > > Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter passes it on Saturn's

> > > recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in mind. (khuda ko hazir

> > > mankar).

> > > Regards

> > > Kulbir Bains.

> > >

> > > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder <indervohra2001@ ...> wrote:

> > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Dear Kulbir,

> > > > Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement. [correct or

> > incorrect]

> > > > Saturn is illegal,[but may be correct],thinking.

> > > >

> > > > Jupiter + Saturn becomes philospher.[ nothing good or bad, but thinking

> > > > makes it so]

> > > >

> > > > Mars with Jupiter logic[logician] , without reading the law books he

> > would

> > > > give arguments which may win him.

> > > >

> > > > Inder

> >

> > On Wed, Mar 31, 2010 at 8:53 AM, Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb@> wrote:

> >

> > Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best pragmatic way

> > possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says.House no 11. represents SABKI

> > APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN earning. In 11th house itself, is the seat of

> > justice/judge. Saturn takes the incurred karma via Rahu and Ketu before

> > Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the seat of judge but Saturn is the drishti

> > to guide it).Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter passes it on

> > Saturn's recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in mind. (khuda

> > ko hazir mankar).

> >

> > Regards

> >

> > Kulbir Bains.

> >

> > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder <indervohra2001@> wrote:

> >

> > Dear Kulbir,

> >

> > Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement.[correct or

> > incorrect]Saturn is illegal,[but may be correct],thinking.Jupiter + Saturn

> > becomes philospher.[nothing good or bad, but thinking makes it so]Mars with

> > Jupiter logic[logician], without reading the law books he would give

> > arguments which may win him.

> >

> > Inder

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Inder Sahib,

Bad Acha; Badnaam Bura. Kare koi ,Bhare koi?

Why blame poor Rahu?, Tughlaq's farmaans planning was meticulous just ahead

of time. EXECUTION went wrong.

Just to drive home the point Jupiter in 3rd house surrounded by Mercury,

Venus, Rahu , Saturn. and Moon in 12. makes a fit Tughlaq Sahib's

nature/case.

Regards

Kulbir Bains

 

, " inder " <indervohra2001 wrote:

>

> Dear Kulbir jee,

> Not Tughlaki farman, it was well and deep thought of farman.

> But but..

> Tughlaki farmans were also well planned,and thought off, but went topsy

turvy. Rahu was not favorable to poor Tughlak.

> Inder

>

> , Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb@> wrote:

> >

> > Dear Inder;

> > Some reasoned reply may help me instead of this Tughlaki Farmaan.

> > I have come to learn here so it matters at least to me.

> > Regards

> > Kulbir Bains

> >

> > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> >

> > Wednesday, 31 March, 2010 6:10 AM

> >

> >

> > Dear Kulbir,

> > I donot agree with you.

> > Anyway does'nt matter.

> > Inder

> >

> > , Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb

 

>

>

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Dear all,

 

All my dears who have commented on the Guru-Chaandal so far, I would

like to request that I am still waiting for my query about such a Yoga

which can be termed as 'CHAANDAL SHISHYA `. The thread so far has

been very lively and en-lightening! There is fear that Mishras and Jhas

could hijack this thread too, like the Mahapandit Raavaan Ji maharaj.

Because as it is, there is centuries old rivalry between Mishr and Jha

in Darbhanga side of Bihar. Mishr says , he is the top class Brahmin and

Jha says he is the Number One. It is other matter that Ojha is also

there somewhere in North India. At least I have a shield with me because

Bhardwaj, Bharadwaj and Bharadwaja are in all parts of the country.

 

I am in bit of hurry, as my Shani-Shukra-Ketu is ending on 10/04/2010. I

have one more feeling that in the end I may have to sing a duet, which

can be between lovers ( Premi and Premika) or Guru-Shishya or

Shishya-Guru or may be....any two less or more enlighted persons,

which Sahir Ludhianavi Saheb gave to the world in the era of romanticism

after we won our freedom. Now there is no romanticism only crude xxx,

RDxxx.. in all it's perceived Roopas or Ku-roopas.

 

Tum mujhe Bhool bhi jayo, toh yeh hak hai tumko,

 

Meri Baat aur hai, maine to Mohabbat ki hai.

 

1. " Tumkoo duniya ke ghamo daard se phursaat na sahee,

 

sabse ulfaat sahee, mujhse hi Mohabbat na sahee,

 

Main tumhara (i) hoon , yahee mere liye kya kam hai,

 

Tum mere ho ke raho , yeh meri kismet naa sahi

 

Tum agar jee ko churayo, toh yeh haq hai tumko, meri baat aur hai….

 

2. Zindagee sirf mohabbat nahin, kuchh aur bhi hai,

 

Zulf-o-rukhsaar ki jannat nahin kuchh aur bhi hai,

 

Bhookh aur Pyaas ki maree hui iss duniya main,

 

Ishq hi ek haqeeqat nahin kuchh aur bhee hai,

 

Tum agar aankh churayo, toh yeh haq hai tumko,

 

Maine Tumse hi nahin Sab se Mohabbat ki hai………..!

 

AND... another great poet Kavi Pradeep in `Jagriti'

 

Atom bamo ke zor pe ainthee hai ye duniya,

 

Barood ke ik dher pe baithee hai ye duniya,

 

Tum har kaadam uthaana zaara dekh-bhaal ke

 

Iss Desh ko rakhna mere Bachho sambhal ke

 

Ham layen hai toofan se kishti nikaal ke , iss desh ko rakhna….

 

Raj Bhardwaj

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

, " inder " <indervohra2001

wrote:

>

> Dear Kulbir jee,

> Not Tughlaki farman, it was well and deep thought of farman.

> But but..

> Tughlaki farmans were also well planned,and thought off, but went

topsy turvy. Rahu was not favorable to poor Tughlak.

> Inder

>

> , Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@

wrote:

> >

> > Dear Inder;

> > Some reasoned reply may help me instead of this Tughlaki Farmaan.

> > I have come to learn here so it matters at least to me.

> > Regards

> > Kulbir Bains

> >

> > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> >

> > Wednesday, 31 March, 2010 6:10 AM

> >

> >

> > Dear Kulbir,

> > I donot agree with you.

> > Anyway does'nt matter.

> > Inder

> >

> > , Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb@

....>

> > wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best

pragmatic

> > way

> > > possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says.

> > > House no 11. represents SABKI APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN earning.

In 11th

> > > house itself, is the seat of justice/judge. Saturn takes the

incurred

> > karma

> > > via Rahu and Ketu before Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the seat

of judge

> > > but Saturn is the drishti to guide it).

> > > Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter passes it on

Saturn's

> > > recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in mind. (khuda

ko hazir

> > > mankar).

> > > Regards

> > > Kulbir Bains.

> > >

> > > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder <indervohra2001@ ...>

wrote:

> > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Dear Kulbir,

> > > > Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement. [correct

or

> > incorrect]

> > > > Saturn is illegal,[but may be correct],thinking.

> > > >

> > > > Jupiter + Saturn becomes philospher.[ nothing good or bad, but

thinking

> > > > makes it so]

> > > >

> > > > Mars with Jupiter logic[logician] , without reading the law

books he

> > would

> > > > give arguments which may win him.

> > > >

> > > > Inder

> >

> > On Wed, Mar 31, 2010 at 8:53 AM, Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@ wrote:

> >

> > Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best

pragmatic way

> > possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says.House no 11.

represents SABKI

> > APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN earning. In 11th house itself, is the

seat of

> > justice/judge. Saturn takes the incurred karma via Rahu and Ketu

before

> > Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the seat of judge but Saturn is the

drishti

> > to guide it).Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter passes

it on

> > Saturn's recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in mind.

(khuda

> > ko hazir mankar).

> >

> > Regards

> >

> > Kulbir Bains.

> >

> > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder indervohra2001@ wrote:

> >

> > Dear Kulbir,

> >

> > Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement.[correct or

> > incorrect]Saturn is illegal,[but may be correct],thinking.Jupiter +

Saturn

> > becomes philospher.[nothing good or bad, but thinking makes it

so]Mars with

> > Jupiter logic[logician], without reading the law books he would give

> > arguments which may win him.

> >

> > Inder

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Sir Raj Bharadwaj ji.

UTHHE karman de hone ne nibede; kisse na teri puchni.

 

Respect and Regards

Kulbir Bains.

 

On Thu, Apr 1, 2010 at 8:44 PM, Raj <rajbhardwaj1949 wrote:

 

>

>

>

> Dear all,

>

> All my dears who have commented on the Guru-Chaandal so far, I would

> like to request that I am still waiting for my query about such a Yoga

> which can be termed as 'CHAANDAL SHISHYA `. The thread so far has

> been very lively and en-lightening! There is fear that Mishras and Jhas

> could hijack this thread too, like the Mahapandit Raavaan Ji maharaj.

> Because as it is, there is centuries old rivalry between Mishr and Jha

> in Darbhanga side of Bihar. Mishr says , he is the top class Brahmin and

> Jha says he is the Number One. It is other matter that Ojha is also

> there somewhere in North India. At least I have a shield with me because

> Bhardwaj, Bharadwaj and Bharadwaja are in all parts of the country.

>

> I am in bit of hurry, as my Shani-Shukra-Ketu is ending on 10/04/2010. I

> have one more feeling that in the end I may have to sing a duet, which

> can be between lovers ( Premi and Premika) or Guru-Shishya or

> Shishya-Guru or may be....any two less or more enlighted persons,

> which Sahir Ludhianavi Saheb gave to the world in the era of romanticism

> after we won our freedom. Now there is no romanticism only crude xxx,

> RDxxx.. in all it's perceived Roopas or Ku-roopas.

>

> Tum mujhe Bhool bhi jayo, toh yeh hak hai tumko,

>

> Meri Baat aur hai, maine to Mohabbat ki hai.

>

> 1. " Tumkoo duniya ke ghamo daard se phursaat na sahee,

>

> sabse ulfaat sahee, mujhse hi Mohabbat na sahee,

>

> Main tumhara (i) hoon , yahee mere liye kya kam hai,

>

> Tum mere ho ke raho , yeh meri kismet naa sahi

>

> Tum agar jee ko churayo, toh yeh haq hai tumko, meri baat aur hai….

>

> 2. Zindagee sirf mohabbat nahin, kuchh aur bhi hai,

>

> Zulf-o-rukhsaar ki jannat nahin kuchh aur bhi hai,

>

> Bhookh aur Pyaas ki maree hui iss duniya main,

>

> Ishq hi ek haqeeqat nahin kuchh aur bhee hai,

>

> Tum agar aankh churayo, toh yeh haq hai tumko,

>

> Maine Tumse hi nahin Sab se Mohabbat ki hai………..!

>

> AND... another great poet Kavi Pradeep in `Jagriti'

>

> Atom bamo ke zor pe ainthee hai ye duniya,

>

> Barood ke ik dher pe baithee hai ye duniya,

>

> Tum har kaadam uthaana zaara dekh-bhaal ke

>

> Iss Desh ko rakhna mere Bachho sambhal ke

>

> Ham layen hai toofan se kishti nikaal ke , iss desh ko rakhna….

>

> Raj Bhardwaj

>

>

> <%40>,

> " inder " <indervohra2001

> wrote:

> >

> > Dear Kulbir jee,

> > Not Tughlaki farman, it was well and deep thought of farman.

> > But but..

> > Tughlaki farmans were also well planned,and thought off, but went

> topsy turvy. Rahu was not favorable to poor Tughlak.

> > Inder

> >

> > <%40>,

> Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@

> wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Inder;

> > > Some reasoned reply may help me instead of this Tughlaki Farmaan.

> > > I have come to learn here so it matters at least to me.

> > > Regards

> > > Kulbir Bains

> > >

> > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> > >

> > > Wednesday, 31 March, 2010 6:10 AM

> > >

> > >

> > > Dear Kulbir,

> > > I donot agree with you.

> > > Anyway does'nt matter.

> > > Inder

> > >

> > > , Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb@

> ...>

> > > wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best

> pragmatic

> > > way

> > > > possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says.

> > > > House no 11. represents SABKI APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN earning.

> In 11th

> > > > house itself, is the seat of justice/judge. Saturn takes the

> incurred

> > > karma

> > > > via Rahu and Ketu before Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the seat

> of judge

> > > > but Saturn is the drishti to guide it).

> > > > Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter passes it on

> Saturn's

> > > > recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in mind. (khuda

> ko hazir

> > > > mankar).

> > > > Regards

> > > > Kulbir Bains.

> > > >

> > > > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder <indervohra2001@ ...>

> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear Kulbir,

> > > > > Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement. [correct

> or

> > > incorrect]

> > > > > Saturn is illegal,[but may be correct],thinking.

> > > > >

> > > > > Jupiter + Saturn becomes philospher.[ nothing good or bad, but

> thinking

> > > > > makes it so]

> > > > >

> > > > > Mars with Jupiter logic[logician] , without reading the law

> books he

> > > would

> > > > > give arguments which may win him.

> > > > >

> > > > > Inder

> > >

> > > On Wed, Mar 31, 2010 at 8:53 AM, Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@ wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best

> pragmatic way

> > > possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says.House no 11.

> represents SABKI

> > > APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN earning. In 11th house itself, is the

> seat of

> > > justice/judge. Saturn takes the incurred karma via Rahu and Ketu

> before

> > > Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the seat of judge but Saturn is the

> drishti

> > > to guide it).Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter passes

> it on

> > > Saturn's recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in mind.

> (khuda

> > > ko hazir mankar).

> > >

> > > Regards

> > >

> > > Kulbir Bains.

> > >

> > > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder indervohra2001@ wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Kulbir,

> > >

> > > Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement.[correct or

> > > incorrect]Saturn is illegal,[but may be correct],thinking.Jupiter +

> Saturn

> > > becomes philospher.[nothing good or bad, but thinking makes it

> so]Mars with

> > > Jupiter logic[logician], without reading the law books he would give

> > > arguments which may win him.

> > >

> > > Inder

>

> > >

> > >

> > >

[Guest guest]

Typo error Sir,

UTHHE karman de hone ne nibede; na teri JAAT puchani.

 

On Thu, Apr 1, 2010 at 10:16 PM, Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb wrote:

 

> Sir Raj Bharadwaj ji.

> UTHHE karman de hone ne nibede; kisse na teri puchni.

>

> Respect and Regards

> Kulbir Bains.

>

>

> On Thu, Apr 1, 2010 at 8:44 PM, Raj <rajbhardwaj1949 wrote:

>

>>

>>

>>

>> Dear all,

>>

>> All my dears who have commented on the Guru-Chaandal so far, I would

>> like to request that I am still waiting for my query about such a Yoga

>> which can be termed as 'CHAANDAL SHISHYA `. The thread so far has

>> been very lively and en-lightening! There is fear that Mishras and Jhas

>> could hijack this thread too, like the Mahapandit Raavaan Ji maharaj.

>> Because as it is, there is centuries old rivalry between Mishr and Jha

>> in Darbhanga side of Bihar. Mishr says , he is the top class Brahmin and

>> Jha says he is the Number One. It is other matter that Ojha is also

>> there somewhere in North India. At least I have a shield with me because

>> Bhardwaj, Bharadwaj and Bharadwaja are in all parts of the country.

>>

>> I am in bit of hurry, as my Shani-Shukra-Ketu is ending on 10/04/2010. I

>> have one more feeling that in the end I may have to sing a duet, which

>> can be between lovers ( Premi and Premika) or Guru-Shishya or

>> Shishya-Guru or may be....any two less or more enlighted persons,

>> which Sahir Ludhianavi Saheb gave to the world in the era of romanticism

>> after we won our freedom. Now there is no romanticism only crude xxx,

>> RDxxx.. in all it's perceived Roopas or Ku-roopas.

>>

>> Tum mujhe Bhool bhi jayo, toh yeh hak hai tumko,

>>

>> Meri Baat aur hai, maine to Mohabbat ki hai.

>>

>> 1. " Tumkoo duniya ke ghamo daard se phursaat na sahee,

>>

>> sabse ulfaat sahee, mujhse hi Mohabbat na sahee,

>>

>> Main tumhara (i) hoon , yahee mere liye kya kam hai,

>>

>> Tum mere ho ke raho , yeh meri kismet naa sahi

>>

>> Tum agar jee ko churayo, toh yeh haq hai tumko, meri baat aur hai….

>>

>> 2. Zindagee sirf mohabbat nahin, kuchh aur bhi hai,

>>

>> Zulf-o-rukhsaar ki jannat nahin kuchh aur bhi hai,

>>

>> Bhookh aur Pyaas ki maree hui iss duniya main,

>>

>> Ishq hi ek haqeeqat nahin kuchh aur bhee hai,

>>

>> Tum agar aankh churayo, toh yeh haq hai tumko,

>>

>> Maine Tumse hi nahin Sab se Mohabbat ki hai………..!

>>

>> AND... another great poet Kavi Pradeep in `Jagriti'

>>

>> Atom bamo ke zor pe ainthee hai ye duniya,

>>

>> Barood ke ik dher pe baithee hai ye duniya,

>>

>> Tum har kaadam uthaana zaara dekh-bhaal ke

>>

>> Iss Desh ko rakhna mere Bachho sambhal ke

>>

>> Ham layen hai toofan se kishti nikaal ke , iss desh ko rakhna….

>>

>> Raj Bhardwaj

>>

>>

>> <%40>,

>> " inder " <indervohra2001

>> wrote:

>> >

>> > Dear Kulbir jee,

>> > Not Tughlaki farman, it was well and deep thought of farman.

>> > But but..

>> > Tughlaki farmans were also well planned,and thought off, but went

>> topsy turvy. Rahu was not favorable to poor Tughlak.

>> > Inder

>> >

>> > --- In

<%40>,

>> Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@

>> wrote:

>> > >

>> > > Dear Inder;

>> > > Some reasoned reply may help me instead of this Tughlaki Farmaan.

>> > > I have come to learn here so it matters at least to me.

>> > > Regards

>> > > Kulbir Bains

>> > >

>> > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

>> > >

>> > > Wednesday, 31 March, 2010 6:10 AM

>> > >

>> > >

>> > > Dear Kulbir,

>> > > I donot agree with you.

>> > > Anyway does'nt matter.

>> > > Inder

>> > >

>> > > , Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb@

>> ...>

>> > > wrote:

>> > > >

>> > > > Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best

>> pragmatic

>> > > way

>> > > > possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says.

>> > > > House no 11. represents SABKI APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN earning.

>> In 11th

>> > > > house itself, is the seat of justice/judge. Saturn takes the

>> incurred

>> > > karma

>> > > > via Rahu and Ketu before Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the seat

>> of judge

>> > > > but Saturn is the drishti to guide it).

>> > > > Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter passes it on

>> Saturn's

>> > > > recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in mind. (khuda

>> ko hazir

>> > > > mankar).

>> > > > Regards

>> > > > Kulbir Bains.

>> > > >

>> > > > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder <indervohra2001@ ...>

>> wrote:

>> > > >

>> > > > >

>> > > > >

>> > > > > Dear Kulbir,

>> > > > > Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement. [correct

>> or

>> > > incorrect]

>> > > > > Saturn is illegal,[but may be correct],thinking.

>> > > > >

>> > > > > Jupiter + Saturn becomes philospher.[ nothing good or bad, but

>> thinking

>> > > > > makes it so]

>> > > > >

>> > > > > Mars with Jupiter logic[logician] , without reading the law

>> books he

>> > > would

>> > > > > give arguments which may win him.

>> > > > >

>> > > > > Inder

>> > >

>> > > On Wed, Mar 31, 2010 at 8:53 AM, Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@ wrote:

>> > >

>> > > Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best

>> pragmatic way

>> > > possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says.House no 11.

>> represents SABKI

>> > > APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN earning. In 11th house itself, is the

>> seat of

>> > > justice/judge. Saturn takes the incurred karma via Rahu and Ketu

>> before

>> > > Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the seat of judge but Saturn is the

>> drishti

>> > > to guide it).Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter passes

>> it on

>> > > Saturn's recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in mind.

>> (khuda

>> > > ko hazir mankar).

>> > >

>> > > Regards

>> > >

>> > > Kulbir Bains.

>> > >

>> > > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder indervohra2001@ wrote:

>> > >

>> > > Dear Kulbir,

>> > >

>> > > Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement.[correct or

>> > > incorrect]Saturn is illegal,[but may be correct],thinking.Jupiter +

>> Saturn

>> > > becomes philospher.[nothing good or bad, but thinking makes it

>> so]Mars with

>> > > Jupiter logic[logician], without reading the law books he would give

>> > > arguments which may win him.

>> > >

>> > > Inder

>>

>> > >

>> > >

>> > >

[Guest guest]

Dear Rohini Ranjan,

 

You are very kind.

 

I must say that both the respondents to your original query did have a vivid

imagination, if not rationale.

 

Regards,

Chandrashekhar

-

rohinicrystal

Thursday, April 01, 2010 5:26 AM

Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

 

 

 

Dear Chandrashekhar jee,

 

Thank you for your kind and as always very thoughtful thoughts. You have

struck a very resonant CHORD! I once came across, thankfully very early on

during my astrological journey two charts of individuals born 'poles' apart in

the sense of Longitudes within few days of one another with same ascendant and

in kshetra with just one planet that was placed differently! One of them was a

very skilled surgeon while the other was a serial killer!

 

The lagna was scorpio in both cases.

 

Your answer was way better than what I received a few years ago in other

'settings'!

 

One astrologer of bengali origin said that " Mongol " did not refer to 'mongol'

but to the cruel MONGOLS.

 

Another Jyotish " Vidwan " in Varanasi told me that it was a clever remedial

ploy to appease CRUEL LORD MANGAL just as some astrologers used to appease their

protectors and sponsors: Royalty!

 

Believe it or not...!

 

Rohiniranjan

 

 

, " Chandrashekhar "

<sharma.chandrashekhar wrote:

>

> Dear Rohini,

>

> Mangal is called that perhaps as he is energy and also mythologically it

absorbed blood of Andhakasur, thus killing him in Andhalaasura Shiva fight?

>

> It is perhaps like a weapon of offence giving good results in hands of the

protector of the country but bad in hands of the terrorists.

>

> Take care,

> Chandrashekhar.

> -

> rohinicrystal

>

> Wednesday, March 31, 2010 3:43 AM

> Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

>

>

>

> Chandrashekhar_jee and Raj bhaisaheb,

>

> I have generally winced a bit when people try to equate and extrapolate

directly and literally from ancient allegories and in my opinion that creates

problems which creates the 'black and white' in astrology. The latest that we

have observed being the words from " Rahu is uncondtionally bad " camp.

>

> My personal preference is to take the allegories as nice mnemonics or memory

aids but not an exhaustive description of the 'planets' concerned from an

astrological point of view. The story of swarbhanu, the story of Kach and

Devyani, and even the story of Harishchandra in Shani Mahatmay are great

pointers and make what can be a rather dry subject (Astrology with its terse

rules and exceptions!) interesting and even lively! But, if we get stuck in the

mindset that those stories and allegories capture the entire essence of

astrological reality or astrological details, then that would be a serious loss

for the astrology learners and practitioners. Particularly the ones who actually

read charts or give readings (the applied and practical astrologers).

>

> The astrological reality (more than sun in leo in 4th will result in this or

that... for instance!) is multifactorial and rather than seeing the

benefic/malefic dichotomy as absolute, I wish people will consider the

modification and modulation of the essential, central characteristics of planets

and realize that without such nuances and influences, astrology will begin to

look rather threadbare.

>

> I am of the opinion that the karakatwas given in Jyotish texts such as BPHS

(and I do not mean BPHS alone!) describe the core properties or values of the

planets and we must not stray too far from those. In contrast, texts such as

uttarkalamrita despite their prolific treatment of karakas must be considered

with a pinch of salt, or at least some of the labels given there in the context

of karakattwas.

>

> Some of the problems inherent in the 'modern' labels (neokarakatwas!) while

being useful raise one question. How careful was the author or proponent in

making sure that what he or she is giving is the nascent karakttwa and not the

result of a multifactorial influence or compound karakattwa? What one is

attributing to Jupiter for instance -- if derived from astrological

observations, how much of the description is for the planet itself and what

component or contamination in chemical mixture terms can be attributed to a

melange of influences? It is often very difficult to tease out the influences of

individual participants in a property or label which sometimes is ascribed to a

single planet.

>

> I am not saying that BPHS alone is correct in all instances but certainly a

safe starting point! Others may differ in their opinion, of course.

>

> Speaking of names, the label MANGAL for mars is intriguing. Why is a malefic

that is cruel and associated with wounds, injuries, aggression, cutting etc

should be associated with mangal which represents beneficience, shubha,

amelioration?

>

> I am sure there are many similar nomenclatural puzzles in Jyotish and I

realize that one lifetime is not sufficient to figure out all the labels and

what not, but certainly makes the study of astrology rather interesting.

>

> Rohiniranjan

>

> , " Chandrashekhar "

<sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote:

> >

> > Dear Raj,

> >

> > I have already read your experience with interest. I can also understand

what you felt as it was an absolutely wicked situation. You did something that

needed great courage, knowing the way Army works.

> >

> > But I am one who can not equate ideologue of a violent movement, even for

good causes, with Guru. In jyotish I always prefer to keep the grahas and our

concepts about what their names should mean in the light of Puranas separate.

May be not exactly separate but my interpretation of the puranic stories in

explaining the nature of grahas is at variance with what is generally thought

and so I prefer to keep it to myself.

> >

> > Take care,

> > Chandrashekhar.

> >

> >

> > -

> > Raj

> >

> > Tuesday, March 30, 2010 9:52 AM

> > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> >

> >

> >

> > Dear Chandrashekhar Ji,

> > I am enjoying your posts. But, I feel you could have missed my msg

No.73157 and what was the context of Guru-Rahu yuti,in the present times. ! I

hope you will like reading it, as the thread began from there.! With my best

regards.

> >

> > Raj Bhardwaj

> >

> > , " Chandrashekhar "

<sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Vattem Krishnan,

> > >

> > > I was responding to Rohini's mail. I have already made clear what is

meant by Chandal and what by MlecCha. I had said " One meaning of Chandal is

worst amongst men and that of Mlecha is a wicked man, a foreigner, one who does

not speak Sanskrit etc. So that too is right. "

> > >

> > > Regards,

> > > Chandrashekhar

> > >

> > >

> > > -

> > > Vattem Krishnan

> > >

> > > Monday, March 29, 2010 12:37 PM

> > > Re: Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Dear Sir,

> > > It is true that persons opeartating from burial grounds are referred

with this term.It's application however to Rahu in litteral terms is not

properly substantiated.mlechas are not chandals.

> > > In our epics more so when we recollect about Raja Satya Harischndra

Story,we find the reference of " Chandal " the one who burns dead bodies and keeps

watch at burial grounds.

> > > Doms are not falling under chandal category.Some where it is also

mentioned to cannibals or narbhakshas as chnadals.

> > >

> > > Vattem Krishnan Cyber Jyotish Services(For all counseling

services)Dr.B.V.Raman " Fools Obey Planets While Wisemen Can Control Them " Planets

are neutral Controllers of Mans Karma

> > >

> > > --- On Sun, 3/28/10, Chandrashekhar <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Chandrashekhar <sharma.chandrashekhar@>

> > > Re: Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> > >

> > > Sunday, March 28, 2010, 3:15 PM

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Dear Rohini Ranjan,

> > >

> > > I am trying to acquire its manuscript, through one of my friends and

hope to learn some more about Paraashara.

> > >

> > > Yes, Chandal is an interesting term. They are generally thought to be

those who operate at funeral sites.

> > >

> > > Rahu is enigmatic planet and so has not rest or does not allow others to

rest.

> > >

> > > Regards,

> > >

> > > Chandrashekhar.

> > >

> > > -

> > >

> > > rohinicrystal

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Sunday, March 28, 2010 11:57 PM

> > >

> > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> > >

> > > Chandrashekhar jee,

> > >

> > > Thanks for taking the time, Sir. I have not had the good fortune of

having seen Vriddha Parashari. I have only studied BPHS, Parashara Samhita and

Laghu/madhya parashari.

> > >

> > > My urdu is rather limited, actually.

> > >

> > > Chandaal is a very interesting term and at one point were thought of as

the '5th caste'! In MP they were called Dom and in bengal nomoshuddoor.

> > >

> > > Poor Rahu! Even on its home-turf (internet according to some) there is

no rest for the wicked :-)

> > >

> > > Rohiniranjan

> > >

> > > , " Chandrashekhar "

<sharma.chandrashek har@> wrote:

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > > Dear Rohini Ranjan,

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > > One meaning of Chandal is worst amongst men and that of Mlecha is a

wicked man, a foreigner, one who does not speak Sanskrit etc. So that too is

right.

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > > So your contention is also correct. I liked the comment about change

of perception between ibtedah and inteha. You must be pretty good at Urdu?

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > > Have you heard of a manuscript called Vriddha Parashari?

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > > Regards,

> > >

> > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > > -

> > >

> > > > rohinicrystal

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > > Sunday, March 28, 2010 5:45 AM

> > >

> > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > > Dear Chandrashekhar jee,

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > > I have also heard that rahu represents mlechchaas or 'other

cultures/foreign cultures'

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > > Often plays a part according to what jyotishis " claim " that it has to

do with journey abroad or marrying into other cultures and religions and so on.

Just another wrinkle, I suppose! But by no means uncommon, based on the queries

received by jyotishis working actively on the " Jyotish HOT-LINE! "

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > > As touched upon in my astrotreasures article written long ago and

posted on boloji years later -- BPHS changed its perspective between the ibetadh

and inteha! That was a clue for me that I tuned-in profitably (in terms of

learning!) -- and the fact that it was placed so close to Sudarshan completed

the clue for me!

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > > Krishna was the awataar of Vishnu that carried the Sudarshan Chakra

and was Poorna Purusha! If I write anything further on this matter in this

august forum, I will be insulting the intelligence and Gnan of the inhabitants

on this huge Island!

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > > Rohiniranjan

> > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > > , " Chandrashekhar "

<sharma.chandrashek har@> wrote:

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Dear Inderjee,

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Does not Rahu rule over the Chandals? That is why he is also called

Chandal. So Guru Chandala yoga is nothing but conjunction of Guru and Rahu.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Personally I think that though people tend to connect the word

chandal with the morals or behaviour of a person who has Guru Chandal yoga, that

might not be the case always.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Rahu gives results of the bhavesha whom he conjoins so Rahu will

give results of Guru while Guru himself may not be able to give his full results

during its dasha.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > -

> > >

> > > > > inder

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Saturday, March 27, 2010 5:12 PM

> > >

> > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Dear friends,

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > This discussion on Guru-Chaandal Yoga is very interesting. Let me

give my submissions.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Why Rahu was called Chaandal was perhaps to give some derogatotry

remark to chhaya graha RAHU.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Earlier I gave one theory:Karaka for internet is Rahu.So in the

mordern times real Rahu is internet.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Beauty of Rahu is that it is infinite, shapeless, colourless and

formless and takes shape and characterstics of the planet with which it comes in

contact.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Internet astrology is all about Mercury+ Rahu or Mercury + Jupiter +

Rahu.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Internet can take any shape and character as gets associated with

the type of people-- astro sites, religious sites, terrorists sits , porno

sites, sports sites etc.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Why Chanadal-- as it distracts mind, makes the mind hazy and

infinite.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Once with internet religious site or astro site or any site you will

have distracted mind, cannot perform even your Yoga or daily religious rituals

with concentration. You can not go and expand inwards when expanding infinite

outside.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Earlier olden days Rahu effects were in the form of Melas,

processions, committees, rumours, epidemics, foreign influences etc.

> > >

> > > > > But the moderm dayday epidemic is internet.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > My experience is when you are running bhukti/antra /prana [lahiri]

of planet which is in star sub or subsub of Rahu, you get engulfed in internet

whirlpool and will not have peace of mind.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Also I have feeling that if you are seeing a chart of a real Yogi

who is not at-all connected to out world but only internal Samadhi , we should

remove Rahu-Ketu from the chart.In any case Rahu is MAYA of relative position of

earth, Moon and Sun.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Some members crtisize that internet astrology is spoiled and it is

hasty, irreligious etc, but this Chanadal has some positive aspects also as like

it expands your knowledge to limitless sphere.

> > >

> > > > > Moreover internet is democratic- leaves you no choice except to

tolerate difference of opinion. It equilizes[learned and ordinary people] all

the people in formless networking.

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > It captures you, engulfs you.For your family members ,it is really a

Chaandal[Guru chandal or budhha chanda or shukra or shani chandal doen not

matter to them]

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > Inder

> > >

> > > > > , Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb@

> wrote:

> > >

> > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > Sir Raj Bhardwaj ji,

> > >

> > > > > > Kamaal kar diya ji aapne, Zinda undhaharan pesh kar di. MARHABA

> > >

> > > > > > Regards

> > >

> > > > > > Kulbir Bains.

> > >

> > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > On Sat, Mar 27, 2010 at 12:12 AM, Raj <rajbhardwaj1949@ > wrote:

> > >

> > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > Yes Rohini and Kulbeer Bhai, I tend to agree with your anecdote "

> > >

> > > > > > > Shape Shifter " ! Here I would just try to also cover the first

line of

> > >

> > > > > > > Kulbeer on the subject - Gurus plays a social role so do the

> > >

> > > > > > > prostitutes.

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > Just 4 days ago , Kanu Sanyal, the man who started a peasants

movement

> > >

> > > > > > > in a very small village named " Naxalbari " , which ultimately

> > >

> > > > > > > became to be known the Naxals or Naxalites ; and it's further

> > >

> > > > > > > carnation , the present day's PWG(People's War Group), committed

> > >

> > > > > > > suicide,found hanging in his one room hutment in his native

village,

> > >

> > > > > > > frustrated with the changes in the ideology of the present

CPI(M) in the

> > >

> > > > > > > garb of PWG. He was the GURU of Naxalite movement,which began

against

> > >

> > > > > > > the Zamindars in the end of year 1966 or begening of 1967, and

slowly

> > >

> > > > > > > and steadily spearead in the most states of India.

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > I had finished my 1 year training in the Air Force and my first

posting

> > >

> > > > > > > was in a place called Bengdubi, about 30 Kms from Naxalbari

village ,

> > >

> > > > > > > near Baghdogra, in Siliguri,Distt Darjeeling in October,1968.

Movements

> > >

> > > > > > > of defence personnel in this region were well guarded.

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > On a holiday, I was doing the duty as deputy of the `Orderly

> > >

> > > > > > > Officer'(who looks after each happenings within the Unit). In

the

> > >

> > > > > > > evening, he just called his driver to take out the Nissan Jonga.

He also

> > >

> > > > > > > called me out and asked me to sit in the back side of

vehicle,with my

> > >

> > > > > > > Sten Gun. The vehicle moved out of the Unit, and he looked back

from

> > >

> > > > > > > the rear window and asked me Lal-Batti dekhi hai kabhi ? I

nodded in

> > >

> > > > > > > negative. After about 20 minutes drive, we entered the Siliguri,

and

> > >

> > > > > > > headed towards a small colony of huts and mud houses. The

vehicle

> > >

> > > > > > > stopped. He got down and told me just see around, I shall be

back

> > >

> > > > > > > quickly. I was looking out and also had to stretch my head out a

number

> > >

> > > > > > > of times , to fathom out that this place was indeed a Red Light

area.

> > >

> > > > > > > Such areas are strictly `Out of Bounds' for the defence

> > >

> > > > > > > personnel ,which was taught in our training manuals. And Lo,

there was

> > >

> > > > > > > suddenly a big commotion in the area and I saw a number of civil

police

> > >

> > > > > > > personnel forcing out the women from their living places ; and

throwing

> > >

> > > > > > > them in the police lorry. Then I looked at my Orderly Officer

running

> > >

> > > > > > > running towards our vehicle, trying to hold his pants tightly. A

fat

> > >

> > > > > > > man,must be about 55 years, on the verge of retirement, looking

very

> > >

> > > > > > > funny to me. Then in a flash I noticed a young girl dashing

towards back

> > >

> > > > > > > of our vehicle, trying to catch it and enter. At the same

moment, our

> > >

> > > > > > > vehicle started. I just extended my arm out , the girl found it

to be

> > >

> > > > > > > helping hand, I pulled her inside and she sat on the floor of

the

> > >

> > > > > > > vehicle. Few policemen did try to run after her, but they had

stopped,

> > >

> > > > > > > having seen that ours was a defence vehicle.

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > She was trying to get her breathing normal and I was looking at

her

> > >

> > > > > > > nonchalantly. After few minutes the O.O peeped back from the

small rear

> > >

> > > > > > > window' and shouted " Who the bitch is this?. I did not reply.

> > >

> > > > > > > But I think that the driver must have also noticed everything ,

like me

> > >

> > > > > > > in the tript to Lal Batti. After about 5 minutes the O.O. again

peeped

> > >

> > > > > > > back and said ` Hey boy I will take this girl to my Barrack. I

kept

> > >

> > > > > > > mum. My mind was blank. No thought was crossing my mind, as far

as I

> > >

> > > > > > > still remember. In the meantime I asked the girl about herself.

She told

> > >

> > > > > > > that she is from Rajasthan and one of her uncles had brought her

to

> > >

> > > > > > > this place 6 months back and she will be grateful if I can help

her to

> > >

> > > > > > > go to Rajasthan. I knew that the Railway Station was just on the

way. As

> > >

> > > > > > > we reached near the main gate, I called out the driver and

commanded him

> > >

> > > > > > > to stop the vehicle. I had just about 3 Rupees with me and gave

it to

> > >

> > > > > > > the girl and apologized that I cannot help her further, she

should just

> > >

> > > > > > > catch any available train and try to take help from any one and

not to

> > >

> > > > > > > worry, YOU will reach your Home. As the vehicle was slowing

down, the

> > >

> > > > > > > O.O. shouted at me and ordered me that the girl with go with us.

I

> > >

> > > > > > > simply pointed my Sten Gun in his direction and slowly brought

it near

> > >

> > > > > > > his nose where he could feel the heat ..and he closed the rear

> > >

> > > > > > > window. The vehicle stopped and I helped the girl out of the

vehicle. I

> > >

> > > > > > > still carry the memory of her tearful eyes with full of karuna

and

> > >

> > > > > > > thanks giving , till the vehicle moved out of her sight. I felt

so

> > >

> > > > > > > tired and exhausted , I simply slumped on my seat.

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > On the way back thoughts started crossing my mind that a senior

is

> > >

> > > > > > > always a senior in the armed forces, if the O.O. wants he can

place me

> > >

> > > > > > > under arrest after reaching the unit and frame any flimsy charge

sheet

> > >

> > > > > > > against me and I could even face a court martial. My soul told

me no

> > >

> > > > > > > fears so be it. Then I took a resolve that if it so happens, I

will kill

> > >

> > > > > > > this son of a Gun senior- the Teacher-the Mentor-The supposed

guide to

> > >

> > > > > > > me, by virtue of his being senior to me in rank in age. But

nothing ever

> > >

> > > > > > > happened further on this count. For years on, I went on feeling

sorry

> > >

> > > > > > > that I could not help her any further and would always wonder

whether

> > >

> > > > > > > she ever reached her home !

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > Now after such a long gap the discussion on Gurus, Deeksha, Beej

Mantra,

> > >

> > > > > > > Guru Chaandal Yoga, Kanu Sanyal, Naxalbari has brought these

memories

> > >

> > > > > > > back to me as fresh as ever before.

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > As far me I feel that I have also fully understood that the

description

> > >

> > > > > > > of this yoga in Shastras was indirect and not so direct but it's

direct

> > >

> > > > > > > and literal meaning or name is CHAANDAL GURU-YOGA, If I may

rename it

> > >

> > > > > > > in direct form. The O.O. must have called me by thousand names

like

> > >

> > > > > > > CHAANDAL or manay more direct expletives , because he was in

dire needs

> > >

> > > > > > > of the wants of his body and mind....and after the police raid,

I

> > >

> > > > > > > deprived him of this real good oprtunity. But then, I do not

find any

> > >

> > > > > > > such yoga which can directly label me as CHAANDAL SHISHYA. And

lastly,

> > >

> > > > > > > that time I was running the mahadasha of Rahu-Rahu from

19-09-1966 to

> > >

> > > > > > > 01-01-1969.

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > Raj Bhardwaj

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > <%

40. com>,

> > >

> > > > > > > " rohinicrystal "

> > >

> > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@ > wrote:

> > >

> > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > Just an anecdotal suggestion, Raj_dada, if I may for you to

examine in

> > >

> > > > > > > your collection of charts or test bench.

> > >

> > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > I have always considered the lunar node as 'wild-cards' (The

joker in

> > >

> > > > > > > a game of cards! A chalnaa, a mimic, a 'Shape-shifter' etc).

This is why

> > >

> > > > > > > perhaps it is considered as a 'surrogate' that assumes the

persona and

> > >

> > > > > > > role of the planet it is associated with or failing that in

whose sign

> > >

> > > > > > > and nakshatra it is placed in). Particularly when a node is

moving

> > >

> > > > > > > towards the planet it is co-occuping a varga, it imbibes the

qualities

> > >

> > > > > > > and abilities of the planet concerned (I call it suction-yoga or

> > >

> > > > > > > Hoover-Yoga -- after the vacuum cleaner!). The planet so

affected loses

> > >

> > > > > > > some or all of its propensity and natural qualities for good or

bad! So

> > >

> > > > > > > a jupiter could lose its 'Teacher/priest- like nature', moon

could lose

> > >

> > > > > > > its sensitive, emotional side or memory, mars could lose its

> > >

> > > > > > > aggression.. . etc!). It may not be a complete loss but a

reduction in

> > >

> > > > > > > the qualities.

> > >

> > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > Such influence is not necessarily good or bad for the

individual

> > >

> > > > > > > depending on the personal nature of the node in the specific

chart!

> > >

> > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > Please remember that it is anecdotal! Try it at your own risk!

In fact

> > >

> > > > > > > for other novice readers, I would venture to add: PLEASE DON'T

TRY THIS

> > >

> > > > > > > AT HOME WITHOUT YOUR TEACHER OR PARENT BEING PRESENT CLOSE BY!

:-)

> > >

> > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > So nice to hear that cheerfulness is back in your heart. My

prayers

> > >

> > > > > > > and best wishes that Ma always shower Her blessings on ALL my

Dadas!

> > >

> > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan

> > >

> > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > <%

40. com>,

> > >

> > > > > > > " rajbhardwaj1949 "

> > >

> > > > > > > rajbhardwaj1949@ wrote:

> > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > Dear Bhai Rohini, Kulbir and Krishnan and all Jyotishis,

> > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > The thread on " Beej Mantra " and " I disagree " have been

really very

> > >

> > > > > > > > > interesting for me. After a long time I was enjoying and

smiling

> > >

> > > > > > > while

> > >

> > > > > > > > > reading the exchange, and at times I was humming. Completely

> > >

> > > > > > > relaxed. My

> > >

> > > > > > > > > wife had observed me at a few occasions and called my

younger

> > >

> > > > > > > daughter

> > >

> > > > > > > > > to observe me silently and also enjoyed finding me relaxed

with

> > >

> > > > > > > smile on

> > >

> > > > > > > > > my face. Somehow the subject in both the threads got

intermangled

> > >

> > > > > > > very

> > >

> > > > > > > > > beautifully. Guru,Shishya, Deekshya, traditions; cunturies

old and the

> > >

> > > > > > > > > current traits.

> > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > I have firm belief that almost all of us(other jyotishis

also

> > >

> > > > > > > included),

> > >

> > > > > > > > > who try to give answers to the queries to best of their

knowledge;

> > >

> > > > > > > and

> > >

> > > > > > > > > most of the times face brickbats and get No thanks, still go

on

> > >

> > > > > > > > > participating in their respective groups ,like addicts, not

> > >

> > > > > > > withstanding

> > >

> > > > > > > > > the skirmishes here and there.

> > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > This further strengthens my belief, that all such jyotishis

have

> > >

> > > > > > > learned

> > >

> > > > > > > > > jyotish with their own efforts, with no Guru or Gurukul. If

this is

> > >

> > > > > > > not

> > >

> > > > > > > > > Junoon, then what else. The will to learn and the will to do

bit of

> > >

> > > > > > > > > experiment too in the process.How much time it takes to

read, how

> > >

> > > > > > > quick

> > >

> > > > > > > > > reactions or delayed reactions take seeds in our minds, how

we

> > >

> > > > > > > prepare

> > >

> > > > > > > > > ourselves to gather the thoughts and type these to give them

a shape

> > >

> > > > > > > and

> > >

> > > > > > > > > not expecting anything in return. Just the pure joy and

> > >

> > > > > > > satisfaction.

> > >

> > > > > > > > > This is a continuous process of learning for us and I also

have no

> > >

> > > > > > > doubt

> > >

> > > > > > > > > that the young learner also must be picking a lots from what

appears

> > >

> > > > > > > in

> > >

> > > > > > > > > the group.

> > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > I will be hanged and stoned by the so called purists, if I

were to

> > >

> > > > > > > say

> > >

> > > > > > > > > that there is no need to have Guru, in the times we are

living. In

> > >

> > > > > > > other

> > >

> > > > > > > > > words every learner of Jyotish has his own free Will , if it

is

> > >

> > > > > > > > > Operational , to learn the Jyotish without being bound by

any

> > >

> > > > > > > > > Rules,Paramparas etc. This is so because the material and

> > >

> > > > > > > opportunity

> > >

> > > > > > > > > for picking up Jyotish is now really very easily available

and every

> > >

> > > > > > > > > learner has good faculties in the field of education and

languages.

> > >

> > > > > > > One

> > >

> > > > > > > > > just needs to have a keen eye and belief in himself. How

they will

> > >

> > > > > > > use

> > >

> > > > > > > > > their knowledge will depend solely on themselves.

> > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > While on the subject of , I (like many other Jyotishis) was

also

> > >

> > > > > > > witness

> > >

> > > > > > > > > to few other happenings involving a Guru and Shishya. I have

been

> > >

> > > > > > > > > thinking for quite some time about the " Guru-Chaandal Yoga " .

Why

> > >

> > > > > > > such

> > >

> > > > > > > > > yoga was mentioned in BPHS. Guru was specifically Jupiter,

but Rahu

> > >

> > > > > > > was

> > >

> > > > > > > > > not specifically Chandaal. I am not sure if Rahu has been

given the

> > >

> > > > > > > name

> > >

> > > > > > > > > of Chaandal in it's various descriptions. Now how this Yoga

is

> > >

> > > > > > > feared by

> > >

> > > > > > > > > all like Rahu dasha,Shani dasha, Shani Sade Sati etc. When a

learner

> > >

> > > > > > > > > like me perhaps does not get any reason to show the cause of

> > >

> > > > > > > problems in

> > >

> > > > > > > > > facing the jataka , we the lesser known jyotishis just take

names of

> > >

> > > > > > > > > such yogas or positions of Shani as the root cause of all

the

> > >

> > > > > > > problems.

> > >

> > > > > > > > > Very easy way out indeed.

> > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > I have been thinking a lot about The Guru-Chaandal Yoga and

somehow

> > >

> > > > > > > tend

> > >

> > > > > > > > > to believe, that Guru can become like a Chaandal in the real

sense.

> > >

> > > > > > > His

> > >

> > > > > > > > > all faculties are shut and whatever he does and utters is

very very

> > >

> > > > > > > > > surprising, it hits everything and everybody very hard. The

image of

> > >

> > > > > > > > > Guru becomes that of a Satan,as he breathes fire and breakes

all the

> > >

> > > > > > > so

> > >

> > > > > > > > > called maryada of a Guru, if there is anything called

maryada. When

> > >

> > > > > > > our

> > >

> > > > > > > > > Rishis mentioned this Guru -Chaandal Yoga, they really must

have all

> > >

> > > > > > > the

> > >

> > > > > > > > > rishis,munis, gurus who had dual personalities. There is no

need to

> > >

> > > > > > > > > elaborate this. The real meaning of Guru Chaandal Yoga seems

to have

> > >

> > > > > > > > > sink in now. It simply sinks the esteerm of a Guru, where a

Shishya

> > >

> > > > > > > is

> > >

> > > > > > > > > forced to challenge his Guru, and more the Guru accuses the

Shishya,

> > >

> > > > > > > > > more he exposes himself, and forces the Shishya to break his

silence

> > >

> > > > > > > and

> > >

> > > > > > > > > he starts hesitatingly initially but goes full blast

exposing the

> > >

> > > > > > > Guru.

> > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > But, then the Shishya also has to be a real learner, who

perhaps

> > >

> > > > > > > never

> > >

> > > > > > > > > depends solely and blindly on one Guru. Now a big question

which is

> > >

> > > > > > > > > staring me and I have been wondering why the fathers of

Jyotish did

> > >

> > > > > > > not

> > >

> > > > > > > > > mention about any yoga specifically , which could be termed

or

> > >

> > > > > > > called as

> > >

> > > > > > > > > " SHISHYA CHAANDAL " Yoga in the Jyotish !

> > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > Raj Bhardwaj

> > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > <%

40. com>,

> > >

> > > > > > > " rohinicrystal "

> > >

> > > > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@ > wrote:

> > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > But Praajee...!

> > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > IK HORE thaa jo Dasyaa gadheriyaan de-vichh, unna kol...!

> > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > Varah (12) thay unna-di banday! Jotish main jaisay!! Ek do

ghabraa

> > >

> > > > > > > > > gayey shaayad, aisaa sanu sunaa noo! Pher laut aayey US dey

Kaul

> > >

> > > > > > > usday

> > >

> > > > > > > > > 'marnay' day baad!

> > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > Kis-day kaul woh sab logaan lautay, mainu nai pataa!

> > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > Asi to sirf dekhnaay may zindagi gawaan dittay! Kinni -

Azib hai

> > >

> > > > > > > yeh

> > >

> > > > > > > > > kahaniyan bachchon di! Raab/Khudaa/ Parmeshwar/ God day

bachchoon-di!

> > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > Maaf karnaa praa -- punjabi bhot pyaari lagdii si magar ik

saal to

> > >

> > > > > > > > > nahin naa kafi! Shaayad aglay janam main kuch hor

seekh-layngay, jo

> > >

> > > > > > > raha

> > >

> > > > > > > > > giya si is janam-vich baki!

> > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > Aankhaan khulie rakhiyo! Aandar_waali! ! ;-)

> > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > Happy Easter!!

> > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan

> > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > @ .

com<% 40. com>,

> > >

> > > > > > > Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@

> > >

> > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > SiRR ji,

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > HUSH is the word;

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Bolan naalon chup changeri, chup de naalon parda; je

MANSOOR na

> > >

> > > > > > > > > bolda taan

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > sooli kahnu Chadhda.

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Silence is golden; veil of secrecy even better, Mansoor

wouldn't

> > >

> > > > > > > > > have been

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > hanged on gallows ;had he preferred silence.

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Regards

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Kulbir Bains

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > ------------ --------- ---------

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > ** rohinicrystal jyotish_vani@

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > *To:* @ .

com<% 40. com>

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > *Sent:* Sun, 21 March, 2010 6:15:54 AM

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > *Subject:* Re: Information about beej mantra

sadhana's ?

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Kulbir_praaji,

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > This 'regulation' , " ...if deeksha of beej mantra is

given by

> > >

> > > > > > > > > competent

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > guru, then it becomes the responsibility of the guru to

bring

> > >

> > > > > > > > > salvation to

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > the disciple. " -- has an interesting wrinkle!

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > It implies that the Guru himself/herself has already

attained

> > >

> > > > > > > > > salvation!

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > I think it is safe to assume that such deekshas are

being given

> > >

> > > > > > > in

> > >

> > > > > > > > > the

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > hundreds of thousands, if not millions, world-wide ;-)

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Now Chelaa poochtaa hai, " If there are so many millions

of Gurus

> > >

> > > > > > > who

> > >

> > > > > > > > > have

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > attained salvation already... Why is the earth and

humanity

> > >

> > > > > > > > > suffering so

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > much? " :-B

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > ~Sab kuch seekha humnay, naa seekhie hoshiyari, Sach hai

duniya

> > >

> > > > > > > > > walon kay

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > hum SUB hain anadi/anari! ~

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

[Guest guest]

Sir Raj Bharadwaj ji,

I am preparing a detailed note on the topic but for

immediate reference sake.

lalkitab 1952 for Ketu 6 says *'sher kad khunkhaar kutta' *

* " hazam kutta gar ghee duniya mein karta,*

* chupe firta har ghar mein buzdil na darta " *

Page no 75 of 1940 edition says

" khanna no 8 mein mangal shanichar ki buri nazar ko khanna no.2 ka maalik

brahspat dekh kar hi pehchan lega magar bolega nahin. us bure nazar ke asar

ko brahspat jab khanna no. 6 ke malik ketu ke yahan bhejega to wahan budh

bhi hone ketu bol kar (budh ki taqat) bata dega.

This refers to/explains shishya chandal yog.

as to how Ketu disobeys Guru and is/becomes responsible for

creating enmity between Jupiter and Mercury.

Regards

Kulbir bains.

 

 

On Thu, Apr 1, 2010 at 8:44 PM, Raj <rajbhardwaj1949 wrote:

 

>

>

>

> Dear all,

>

> All my dears who have commented on the Guru-Chaandal so far, I would

> like to request that I am still waiting for my query about such a Yoga

> which can be termed as 'CHAANDAL SHISHYA `. The thread so far has

> been very lively and en-lightening! There is fear that Mishras and Jhas

> could hijack this thread too, like the Mahapandit Raavaan Ji maharaj.

> Because as it is, there is centuries old rivalry between Mishr and Jha

> in Darbhanga side of Bihar. Mishr says , he is the top class Brahmin and

> Jha says he is the Number One. It is other matter that Ojha is also

> there somewhere in North India. At least I have a shield with me because

> Bhardwaj, Bharadwaj and Bharadwaja are in all parts of the country.

>

> I am in bit of hurry, as my Shani-Shukra-Ketu is ending on 10/04/2010. I

> have one more feeling that in the end I may have to sing a duet, which

> can be between lovers ( Premi and Premika) or Guru-Shishya or

> Shishya-Guru or may be....any two less or more enlighted persons,

> which Sahir Ludhianavi Saheb gave to the world in the era of romanticism

> after we won our freedom. Now there is no romanticism only crude xxx,

> RDxxx.. in all it's perceived Roopas or Ku-roopas.

>

> Tum mujhe Bhool bhi jayo, toh yeh hak hai tumko,

>

> Meri Baat aur hai, maine to Mohabbat ki hai.

>

> 1. " Tumkoo duniya ke ghamo daard se phursaat na sahee,

>

> sabse ulfaat sahee, mujhse hi Mohabbat na sahee,

>

> Main tumhara (i) hoon , yahee mere liye kya kam hai,

>

> Tum mere ho ke raho , yeh meri kismet naa sahi

>

> Tum agar jee ko churayo, toh yeh haq hai tumko, meri baat aur hai….

>

> 2. Zindagee sirf mohabbat nahin, kuchh aur bhi hai,

>

> Zulf-o-rukhsaar ki jannat nahin kuchh aur bhi hai,

>

> Bhookh aur Pyaas ki maree hui iss duniya main,

>

> Ishq hi ek haqeeqat nahin kuchh aur bhee hai,

>

> Tum agar aankh churayo, toh yeh haq hai tumko,

>

> Maine Tumse hi nahin Sab se Mohabbat ki hai………..!

>

> AND... another great poet Kavi Pradeep in `Jagriti'

>

> Atom bamo ke zor pe ainthee hai ye duniya,

>

> Barood ke ik dher pe baithee hai ye duniya,

>

> Tum har kaadam uthaana zaara dekh-bhaal ke

>

> Iss Desh ko rakhna mere Bachho sambhal ke

>

> Ham layen hai toofan se kishti nikaal ke , iss desh ko rakhna….

>

> Raj Bhardwaj

>

> <%40>,

> " inder " <indervohra2001

> wrote:

> >

> > Dear Kulbir jee,

> > Not Tughlaki farman, it was well and deep thought of farman.

> > But but..

> > Tughlaki farmans were also well planned,and thought off, but went

> topsy turvy. Rahu was not favorable to poor Tughlak.

>

> > Inder

> >

> > <%40>,

> Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@

> wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Inder;

> > > Some reasoned reply may help me instead of this Tughlaki Farmaan.

> > > I have come to learn here so it matters at least to me.

> > > Regards

> > > Kulbir Bains

> > >

> > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> > >

> > > Wednesday, 31 March, 2010 6:10 AM

> > >

> > >

> > > Dear Kulbir,

> > > I donot agree with you.

> > > Anyway does'nt matter.

>

> > > Inder

> > >

> > > , Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb@

> ...>

> > > wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best

> pragmatic

> > > way

> > > > possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says.

> > > > House no 11. represents SABKI APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN earning.

> In 11th

> > > > house itself, is the seat of justice/judge. Saturn takes the

> incurred

> > > karma

> > > > via Rahu and Ketu before Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the seat

> of judge

> > > > but Saturn is the drishti to guide it).

> > > > Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter passes it on

> Saturn's

> > > > recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in mind. (khuda

> ko hazir

> > > > mankar).

> > > > Regards

> > > > Kulbir Bains.

> > > >

> > > > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder <indervohra2001@ ...>

> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear Kulbir,

> > > > > Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement. [correct

> or

> > > incorrect]

> > > > > Saturn is illegal,[but may be correct],thinking.

> > > > >

> > > > > Jupiter + Saturn becomes philospher.[ nothing good or bad, but

> thinking

> > > > > makes it so]

> > > > >

> > > > > Mars with Jupiter logic[logician] , without reading the law

> books he

> > > would

> > > > > give arguments which may win him.

> > > > >

> > > > > Inder

> > >

> > > On Wed, Mar 31, 2010 at 8:53 AM, Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@ wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best

> pragmatic way

> > > possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says.House no 11.

> represents SABKI

> > > APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN earning. In 11th house itself, is the

> seat of

> > > justice/judge. Saturn takes the incurred karma via Rahu and Ketu

> before

> > > Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the seat of judge but Saturn is the

> drishti

> > > to guide it).Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter passes

> it on

> > > Saturn's recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in mind.

> (khuda

> > > ko hazir mankar).

> > >

> > > Regards

> > >

> > > Kulbir Bains.

> > >

> > > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder indervohra2001@ wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Kulbir,

> > >

> > > Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement.[correct or

> > > incorrect]Saturn is illegal,[but may be correct],thinking.Jupiter +

> Saturn

> > > becomes philospher.[nothing good or bad, but thinking makes it

> so]Mars with

> > > Jupiter logic[logician], without reading the law books he would give

> > > arguments which may win him.

> > >

> > > Inder

>

> > >

> > >

> > >

[Guest guest]

Pyare Kulbeer Jio,

Chaanga hai Pooranmasi noon nan jam ke main Nauvin noo hi jam giya see,

nahin te mainu saare Rajoo Bawra kahinde ! Thoda hi farak te safar reh

giya hai hun taan ! Dhallan da safar shuru ho gaya hai.........

 

 

Where is Adi Shankaracharya,Tagore,Nur-ul-Islam, Bade Ghulam Ali , MS

Subbulakshmi,Bismillah Khan, Mirza Ghalib, Shiv Batalvi, Kavi Kaalidas,

Tulsidas, Soordas,Meera, Subramanyam Bharti, Bhagat Singh , our great

Soofi Saints, and to top them all Kabir, all the Sagunas and

Nirgunas(list is really long one) AND lastly Sri Guru Granth Sahib - The

only Granth,which is great collection of rachnaas of Saints poets of all

dharmas of whole country and each Chhanda of this Greatest Grantha is

sung only on all the Hindustaani Raggas by the Raagis in Guru-Dwaras.

AND the 10th Guru ,the Saint-Warrior Guru Gobind Singh who delivered his

his last surmon - Agya Bhai Akkal ki sabhi chalaio Panth, Sab Sikhan(THE

learned one, the initiated one, the skilled one ,the trained ones -

followers of Satkarmas and Satmargas ) ko Hukum hai Guru manio GRANTH.

All these great Indians were born with beautiful minds, listned to

their inner-self , with exalted minds and souls- Did they have any

GURU...really....??? There are quite a few countrieswhere I have met

students and ask them something about India- I get only one name

" 'GANDHI " Enough ! Not the other one who could order Indian Army to

attack Shri Harmandir Sahib in Amritsar with Tanks and Infantry..just

to flush out terrorists, her own creation....and the whole Panjab burned

for 8 longs years, but never any other place of worship of any other

religion in the Dharam Nirpeksha Bharat what to say of even arrest the

so called Gurus of other religions,beliefs,sects. Perhaps I have gone

too far !

 

-Ashkon se jo paya hai, wo geeton main diya hai, iss par bhi sunaa hai

ki ..zamaane ko gilaa hai....! Let it be the Last Post and.. ...reverse

arms ! With my lots of love to you and the sweet little daughter. I will

be in touch with you and the legacy of second Deepak !

 

Raj Bhardwaj

 

 

, Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb

wrote:

>

> Typo error Sir,

> UTHHE karman de hone ne nibede; na teri JAAT puchani.

>

> On Thu, Apr 1, 2010 at 10:16 PM, Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb wrote:

>

> > Sir Raj Bharadwaj ji.

> > UTHHE karman de hone ne nibede; kisse na teri puchni.

> >

> > Respect and Regards

> > Kulbir Bains.

> >

> >

> > On Thu, Apr 1, 2010 at 8:44 PM, Raj rajbhardwaj1949 wrote:

> >

> >>

> >>

> >>

> >> Dear all,

> >>

> >> All my dears who have commented on the Guru-Chaandal so far, I

would

> >> like to request that I am still waiting for my query about such a

Yoga

> >> which can be termed as 'CHAANDAL SHISHYA `. The thread so far has

> >> been very lively and en-lightening! There is fear that Mishras and

Jhas

> >> could hijack this thread too, like the Mahapandit Raavaan Ji

maharaj.

> >> Because as it is, there is centuries old rivalry between Mishr and

Jha

> >> in Darbhanga side of Bihar. Mishr says , he is the top class

Brahmin and

> >> Jha says he is the Number One. It is other matter that Ojha is also

> >> there somewhere in North India. At least I have a shield with me

because

> >> Bhardwaj, Bharadwaj and Bharadwaja are in all parts of the country.

> >>

> >> I am in bit of hurry, as my Shani-Shukra-Ketu is ending on

10/04/2010. I

> >> have one more feeling that in the end I may have to sing a duet,

which

> >> can be between lovers ( Premi and Premika) or Guru-Shishya or

> >> Shishya-Guru or may be....any two less or more enlighted persons,

> >> which Sahir Ludhianavi Saheb gave to the world in the era of

romanticism

> >> after we won our freedom. Now there is no romanticism only crude

xxx,

> >> RDxxx.. in all it's perceived Roopas or Ku-roopas.

> >>

> >> Tum mujhe Bhool bhi jayo, toh yeh hak hai tumko,

> >>

> >> Meri Baat aur hai, maine to Mohabbat ki hai.

> >>

> >> 1. " Tumkoo duniya ke ghamo daard se phursaat na sahee,

> >>

> >> sabse ulfaat sahee, mujhse hi Mohabbat na sahee,

> >>

> >> Main tumhara (i) hoon , yahee mere liye kya kam hai,

> >>

> >> Tum mere ho ke raho , yeh meri kismet naa sahi

> >>

> >> Tum agar jee ko churayo, toh yeh haq hai tumko, meri baat aur

hai….

> >>

> >> 2. Zindagee sirf mohabbat nahin, kuchh aur bhi hai,

> >>

> >> Zulf-o-rukhsaar ki jannat nahin kuchh aur bhi hai,

> >>

> >> Bhookh aur Pyaas ki maree hui iss duniya main,

> >>

> >> Ishq hi ek haqeeqat nahin kuchh aur bhee hai,

> >>

> >> Tum agar aankh churayo, toh yeh haq hai tumko,

> >>

> >> Maine Tumse hi nahin Sab se Mohabbat ki hai………..!

> >>

> >> AND... another great poet Kavi Pradeep in `Jagriti'

> >>

> >> Atom bamo ke zor pe ainthee hai ye duniya,

> >>

> >> Barood ke ik dher pe baithee hai ye duniya,

> >>

> >> Tum har kaadam uthaana zaara dekh-bhaal ke

> >>

> >> Iss Desh ko rakhna mere Bachho sambhal ke

> >>

> >> Ham layen hai toofan se kishti nikaal ke , iss desh ko rakhna….

> >>

> >> Raj Bhardwaj

> >>

> >>

> >> --- In

<%40>,

> >> " inder " indervohra2001@

> >> wrote:

> >> >

> >> > Dear Kulbir jee,

> >> > Not Tughlaki farman, it was well and deep thought of farman.

> >> > But but..

> >> > Tughlaki farmans were also well planned,and thought off, but went

> >> topsy turvy. Rahu was not favorable to poor Tughlak.

> >> > Inder

> >> >

> >> > --- In

<%40>,

> >> Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@

> >> wrote:

> >> > >

> >> > > Dear Inder;

> >> > > Some reasoned reply may help me instead of this Tughlaki

Farmaan.

> >> > > I have come to learn here so it matters at least to me.

> >> > > Regards

> >> > > Kulbir Bains

> >> > >

> >> > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> >> > >

> >> > > Wednesday, 31 March, 2010 6:10 AM

> >> > >

> >> > >

> >> > > Dear Kulbir,

> >> > > I donot agree with you.

> >> > > Anyway does'nt matter.

> >> > > Inder

> >> > >

> >> > > , Kulbir Bains

<lalkitabkb@

> >> ...>

> >> > > wrote:

> >> > > >

> >> > > > Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best

> >> pragmatic

> >> > > way

> >> > > > possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says.

> >> > > > House no 11. represents SABKI APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN

earning.

> >> In 11th

> >> > > > house itself, is the seat of justice/judge. Saturn takes the

> >> incurred

> >> > > karma

> >> > > > via Rahu and Ketu before Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the

seat

> >> of judge

> >> > > > but Saturn is the drishti to guide it).

> >> > > > Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter passes it on

> >> Saturn's

> >> > > > recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in mind.

(khuda

> >> ko hazir

> >> > > > mankar).

> >> > > > Regards

> >> > > > Kulbir Bains.

> >> > > >

> >> > > > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder <indervohra2001@ ...>

> >> wrote:

> >> > > >

> >> > > > >

> >> > > > >

> >> > > > > Dear Kulbir,

> >> > > > > Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement.

[correct

> >> or

> >> > > incorrect]

> >> > > > > Saturn is illegal,[but may be correct],thinking.

> >> > > > >

> >> > > > > Jupiter + Saturn becomes philospher.[ nothing good or bad,

but

> >> thinking

> >> > > > > makes it so]

> >> > > > >

> >> > > > > Mars with Jupiter logic[logician] , without reading the law

> >> books he

> >> > > would

> >> > > > > give arguments which may win him.

> >> > > > >

> >> > > > > Inder

> >> > >

> >> > > On Wed, Mar 31, 2010 at 8:53 AM, Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@

wrote:

> >> > >

> >> > > Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best

> >> pragmatic way

> >> > > possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says.House no 11.

> >> represents SABKI

> >> > > APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN earning. In 11th house itself, is

the

> >> seat of

> >> > > justice/judge. Saturn takes the incurred karma via Rahu and

Ketu

> >> before

> >> > > Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the seat of judge but Saturn is

the

> >> drishti

> >> > > to guide it).Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter

passes

> >> it on

> >> > > Saturn's recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in

mind.

> >> (khuda

> >> > > ko hazir mankar).

> >> > >

> >> > > Regards

> >> > >

> >> > > Kulbir Bains.

> >> > >

> >> > > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder indervohra2001@ wrote:

> >> > >

> >> > > Dear Kulbir,

> >> > >

> >> > > Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement.[correct

or

> >> > > incorrect]Saturn is illegal,[but may be

correct],thinking.Jupiter +

> >> Saturn

> >> > > becomes philospher.[nothing good or bad, but thinking makes it

> >> so]Mars with

> >> > > Jupiter logic[logician], without reading the law books he would

give

> >> > > arguments which may win him.

> >> > >

> >> > > Inder

> >>

> >> > >

> >> > >

> >> > >

[Guest guest]

Two exclamation points = 20 units of energy! ;-)

 

Keep spending, Vohra jee...

 

RR_,

 

, " inder " <indervohra2001 wrote:

>

>

> Yeah yeah,

> Not needing hat and shoes saves lot of money.

> If we also donot understand the things we save lot of efforts andtime and

energy!!

> Inder

> , " rohinicrystal " <jyotish_vani@>

wrote:

> >

> > Why Vohrajee!

> >

> > Rahu is dragon's head while ketu is the headless part or the tail!

> >

> > Rahu does not need shoes and ketu does not need a hat!

> >

> > RR_,

> >

> > , " inder " <indervohra2001@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear RR_jee,

> > > well written but not understood by me.

> > > Inder

> > >

> > > , " rohinicrystal " <jyotish_vani@>

wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Chandrashekhar_jee,

> > > >

> > > > I have noticed that those too preoccupied and focused on nodes run into

a situational problem which has an allegoric correlation! Rahu, unmitigated*

could result in the feet not touching the ground, while ketu unmitigated* could

result in one losing one's head (common sense!) and the analogy should be

obvious given what Vishnu's Chakra did to Swarbhanu :-)

> > > >

> > > > Rohiniranjan

> > > >

> > > > *Important conditional consideration!!

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > , " Chandrashekhar "

<sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear Rohini,

> > > > >

> > > > > Do not be modest unnecessarily.

> > > > >

> > > > > Being Chaya grahas they express themselves through others, so the

laser analogy seems appropriate.

> > > > >

> > > > > It is also wondrous that though we are in a way living on the surface

of Rahu we fail to recognize the Prithvi, as such.

> > > > >

> > > > > Take care,

> > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > -

> > > > > rohinicrystal

> > > > >

> > > > > Tuesday, March 30, 2010 4:02 AM

> > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar_jee,

> > > > >

> > > > > I may not have the profound experience of many of the currently

famous and vocal Jyotish-pragnaas (Internet and otherwise), but I have been

consistently impressed by the enormous spectrum and capability and potential of

both Rahu and Ketu in the lives of human beings -- particularly those who have

diverse experience as opposed to those who are stuck in a groove, as the

expression goes.

> > > > >

> > > > > The lunar nodes have enormous potential but like a hologram trapped

in a crystal they remain just a piece of decoration unless and until they are

ignited by a beam of laser! Then their message comes alive (I hate to use a

movie reference in this fairly heavy duty serious forum but those still young at

heart may recall the modern EPIC Starwars and Princess Leah's entry and

message!)

> > > > >

> > > > > This has reference to my recent message to, I believe Kulbir, where

I referred to the laser, albeit not directly! Parashara did not write about

Laser but BPHS (I dare say, any version, perhaps) refers to it very clearly and

convincingly!

> > > > >

> > > > > Regards,

> > > > >

> > > > > Rohiniranjan

> > > > >

> > > > > , " Chandrashekhar "

<sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Dear Inderji,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Is Rahu also not said to cause understanding of complex subjects

(when in 5th) and give one Ganga snan(When in 10th)?

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > Chandrashekhar

> > > > > > -

> > > > > > inder

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Monday, March 29, 2010 3:11 PM

> > > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > No dear, we shall not fight. I am again refering to imaginary

situation that if we start fighting here it becomes Guru-Chaandal situation.

> > > > > > Rahu creats sudden, unexpected, good or nasty situations. Rahu is

all about effects.

> > > > > > Inder

> > > > > >

> > > > > > , " Chandrashekhar "

<sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Dear Inderji,

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I thought we were talking about effects of Guru Chandal yoga. It

seems like I was wrong and you were alluding to Guru Chandal situation.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Anyway why should we start fight on this as we are obviously

talking about two different things?

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > -

> > > > > > > inder

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Sunday, March 28, 2010 5:05 PM

> > > > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Dear Chanrashekhar ji,

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Think of a hypothetical situation say 200 hundred years ago.

> > > > > > > Two Vidvan Pandit ji are sitting together and nicely exchanging

pleasantries. Now they come out and join a vast gathering of people.

> > > > > > > Very soon they would pick up fight with difference of opinion on

some ritual procedures or some interpretations in presence of mass gathering

saving their egos and creating mass hysteria which would be further spread into

village/town and house discussion.This is sort of Guru Chaandal situation.This

is one example. So they loose their GURUDUM with Rahu effect.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Donot take chaandal in literal terms, most of the people doing

menial, small jobs, even dead body falls under Saturn.May be people carrying

petty tales or rumours fall under Rahu.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > If we start fight here for example on this issue, it would

certainly be Rahu effect.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Inder

> > > > > > > , " Chandrashekhar "

<sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Dear Inderjee,

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Does not Rahu rule over the Chandals? That is why he is also

called Chandal. So Guru Chandala yoga is nothing but conjunction of Guru and

Rahu.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Personally I think that though people tend to connect the word

chandal with the morals or behaviour of a person who has Guru Chandal yoga, that

might not be the case always.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Rahu gives results of the bhavesha whom he conjoins so Rahu

will give results of Guru while Guru himself may not be able to give his full

results during its dasha.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > -

> > > > > > > > inder

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Saturday, March 27, 2010 5:12 PM

> > > > > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Dear friends,

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > This discussion on Guru-Chaandal Yoga is very interesting.Let

me give my submissions.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Why Rahu was called Chaandal was perhaps to give some

derogatotry remark to chhaya graha RAHU.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Earlier I gave one theory:Karaka for internet is Rahu.So in

the mordern times real Rahu is internet.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Beauty of Rahu is that it is infinite, shapeless, colourless

and formless and takes shape and characterstics of the planet with which it

comes in contact.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Internet astrology is all about Mercury+ Rahu or Mercury +

Jupiter + Rahu.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Internet can take any shape and character as gets associated

with the type of people-- astro sites, religious sites, terrorists sits , porno

sites, sports sites etc.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Why Chanadal-- as it distracts mind, makes the mind hazy and

infinite.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Once with internet religious site or astro site or any site

you will have distracted mind, cannot perform even your Yoga or daily religious

rituals with concentration. You can not go and expand inwards when expanding

infinite outside.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Earlier olden days Rahu effects were in the form of Melas,

processions, committees, rumours, epidemics, foreign influences etc.

> > > > > > > > But the moderm dayday epidemic is internet.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > My experience is when you are running bhukti/antra /prana

[lahiri] of planet which is in star sub or subsub of Rahu, you get engulfed in

internet whirlpool and will not have peace of mind.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Also I have feeling that if you are seeing a chart of a real

Yogi who is not at-all connected to out world but only internal Samadhi , we

should remove Rahu-Ketu from the chart.In any case Rahu is MAYA of relative

position of earth, Moon and Sun.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Some members crtisize that internet astrology is spoiled and

it is hasty, irreligious etc, but this Chanadal has some positive aspects also

as like it expands your knowledge to limitless sphere.

> > > > > > > > Moreover internet is democratic- leaves you no choice except

to tolerate difference of opinion. It equilizes[learned and ordinary people] all

the people in formless networking.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > It captures you, engulfs you.For your family members ,it is

really a Chaandal[Guru chandal or budhha chanda or shukra or shani chandal doen

not matter to them]

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Inder

> > > > > > > > , Kulbir Bains

<lalkitabkb@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Sir Raj Bhardwaj ji,

> > > > > > > > > Kamaal kar diya ji aapne, Zinda undhaharan pesh kar di.

MARHABA

> > > > > > > > > Regards

> > > > > > > > > Kulbir Bains.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > On Sat, Mar 27, 2010 at 12:12 AM, Raj <rajbhardwaj1949@>

wrote:

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Yes Rohini and Kulbeer Bhai, I tend to agree with your

anecdote "

> > > > > > > > > > Shape Shifter " ! Here I would just try to also cover the

first line of

> > > > > > > > > > Kulbeer on the subject - Gurus plays a social role so do

the

> > > > > > > > > > prostitutes.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Just 4 days ago , Kanu Sanyal, the man who started a

peasants movement

> > > > > > > > > > in a very small village named " Naxalbari " , which

ultimately

> > > > > > > > > > became to be known the Naxals or Naxalites ; and it's

further

> > > > > > > > > > carnation , the present day's PWG(People's War Group),

committed

> > > > > > > > > > suicide,found hanging in his one room hutment in his

native village,

> > > > > > > > > > frustrated with the changes in the ideology of the present

CPI(M) in the

> > > > > > > > > > garb of PWG. He was the GURU of Naxalite movement,which

began against

> > > > > > > > > > the Zamindars in the end of year 1966 or begening of 1967,

and slowly

> > > > > > > > > > and steadily spearead in the most states of India.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > I had finished my 1 year training in the Air Force and my

first posting

> > > > > > > > > > was in a place called Bengdubi, about 30 Kms from

Naxalbari village ,

> > > > > > > > > > near Baghdogra, in Siliguri,Distt Darjeeling in

October,1968. Movements

> > > > > > > > > > of defence personnel in this region were well guarded.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > On a holiday, I was doing the duty as deputy of the

`Orderly

> > > > > > > > > > Officer'(who looks after each happenings within the Unit).

In the

> > > > > > > > > > evening, he just called his driver to take out the Nissan

Jonga. He also

> > > > > > > > > > called me out and asked me to sit in the back side of

vehicle,with my

> > > > > > > > > > Sten Gun. The vehicle moved out of the Unit, and he looked

back from

> > > > > > > > > > the rear window and asked me Lal-Batti dekhi hai kabhi ? I

nodded in

> > > > > > > > > > negative. After about 20 minutes drive, we entered the

Siliguri, and

> > > > > > > > > > headed towards a small colony of huts and mud houses. The

vehicle

> > > > > > > > > > stopped. He got down and told me just see around, I shall

be back

> > > > > > > > > > quickly. I was looking out and also had to stretch my head

out a number

> > > > > > > > > > of times , to fathom out that this place was indeed a Red

Light area.

> > > > > > > > > > Such areas are strictly `Out of Bounds' for the defence

> > > > > > > > > > personnel ,which was taught in our training manuals. And

Lo, there was

> > > > > > > > > > suddenly a big commotion in the area and I saw a number of

civil police

> > > > > > > > > > personnel forcing out the women from their living places ;

and throwing

> > > > > > > > > > them in the police lorry. Then I looked at my Orderly

Officer running

> > > > > > > > > > running towards our vehicle, trying to hold his pants

tightly. A fat

> > > > > > > > > > man,must be about 55 years, on the verge of retirement,

looking very

> > > > > > > > > > funny to me. Then in a flash I noticed a young girl

dashing towards back

> > > > > > > > > > of our vehicle, trying to catch it and enter. At the same

moment, our

> > > > > > > > > > vehicle started. I just extended my arm out , the girl

found it to be

> > > > > > > > > > helping hand, I pulled her inside and she sat on the floor

of the

> > > > > > > > > > vehicle. Few policemen did try to run after her, but they

had stopped,

> > > > > > > > > > having seen that ours was a defence vehicle.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > She was trying to get her breathing normal and I was

looking at her

> > > > > > > > > > nonchalantly. After few minutes the O.O peeped back from

the small rear

> > > > > > > > > > window' and shouted " Who the bitch is this?. I did not

reply.

> > > > > > > > > > But I think that the driver must have also noticed

everything , like me

> > > > > > > > > > in the tript to Lal Batti. After about 5 minutes the O.O.

again peeped

> > > > > > > > > > back and said ` Hey boy I will take this girl to my

Barrack. I kept

> > > > > > > > > > mum. My mind was blank. No thought was crossing my mind,

as far as I

> > > > > > > > > > still remember. In the meantime I asked the girl about

herself. She told

> > > > > > > > > > that she is from Rajasthan and one of her uncles had

brought her to

> > > > > > > > > > this place 6 months back and she will be grateful if I can

help her to

> > > > > > > > > > go to Rajasthan. I knew that the Railway Station was just

on the way. As

> > > > > > > > > > we reached near the main gate, I called out the driver and

commanded him

> > > > > > > > > > to stop the vehicle. I had just about 3 Rupees with me and

gave it to

> > > > > > > > > > the girl and apologized that I cannot help her further,

she should just

> > > > > > > > > > catch any available train and try to take help from any

one and not to

> > > > > > > > > > worry, YOU will reach your Home. As the vehicle was

slowing down, the

> > > > > > > > > > O.O. shouted at me and ordered me that the girl with go

with us. I

> > > > > > > > > > simply pointed my Sten Gun in his direction and slowly

brought it near

> > > > > > > > > > his nose where he could feel the heat ..and he closed the

rear

> > > > > > > > > > window. The vehicle stopped and I helped the girl out of

the vehicle. I

> > > > > > > > > > still carry the memory of her tearful eyes with full of

karuna and

> > > > > > > > > > thanks giving , till the vehicle moved out of her sight. I

felt so

> > > > > > > > > > tired and exhausted , I simply slumped on my seat.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > On the way back thoughts started crossing my mind that a

senior is

> > > > > > > > > > always a senior in the armed forces, if the O.O. wants he

can place me

> > > > > > > > > > under arrest after reaching the unit and frame any flimsy

charge sheet

> > > > > > > > > > against me and I could even face a court martial. My soul

told me no

> > > > > > > > > > fears so be it. Then I took a resolve that if it so

happens, I will kill

> > > > > > > > > > this son of a Gun senior- the Teacher-the Mentor-The

supposed guide to

> > > > > > > > > > me, by virtue of his being senior to me in rank in age.

But nothing ever

> > > > > > > > > > happened further on this count. For years on, I went on

feeling sorry

> > > > > > > > > > that I could not help her any further and would always

wonder whether

> > > > > > > > > > she ever reached her home !

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Now after such a long gap the discussion on Gurus,

Deeksha, Beej Mantra,

> > > > > > > > > > Guru Chaandal Yoga, Kanu Sanyal, Naxalbari has brought

these memories

> > > > > > > > > > back to me as fresh as ever before.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > As far me I feel that I have also fully understood that

the description

> > > > > > > > > > of this yoga in Shastras was indirect and not so direct

but it's direct

> > > > > > > > > > and literal meaning or name is CHAANDAL GURU-YOGA, If I

may rename it

> > > > > > > > > > in direct form. The O.O. must have called me by thousand

names like

> > > > > > > > > > CHAANDAL or manay more direct expletives , because he was

in dire needs

> > > > > > > > > > of the wants of his body and mind....and after the police

raid, I

> > > > > > > > > > deprived him of this real good oprtunity. But then, I do

not find any

> > > > > > > > > > such yoga which can directly label me as CHAANDAL SHISHYA.

And lastly,

> > > > > > > > > > that time I was running the mahadasha of Rahu-Rahu from

19-09-1966 to

> > > > > > > > > > 01-01-1969.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Raj Bhardwaj

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > --- In

<%40>,

> > > > > > > > > > " rohinicrystal "

> > > > > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Just an anecdotal suggestion, Raj_dada, if I may for you

to examine in

> > > > > > > > > > your collection of charts or test bench.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > I have always considered the lunar node as 'wild-cards'

(The joker in

> > > > > > > > > > a game of cards! A chalnaa, a mimic, a 'Shape-shifter'

etc). This is why

> > > > > > > > > > perhaps it is considered as a 'surrogate' that assumes the

persona and

> > > > > > > > > > role of the planet it is associated with or failing that

in whose sign

> > > > > > > > > > and nakshatra it is placed in). Particularly when a node

is moving

> > > > > > > > > > towards the planet it is co-occuping a varga, it imbibes

the qualities

> > > > > > > > > > and abilities of the planet concerned (I call it

suction-yoga or

> > > > > > > > > > Hoover-Yoga -- after the vacuum cleaner!). The planet so

affected loses

> > > > > > > > > > some or all of its propensity and natural qualities for

good or bad! So

> > > > > > > > > > a jupiter could lose its 'Teacher/priest-like nature',

moon could lose

> > > > > > > > > > its sensitive, emotional side or memory, mars could lose

its

> > > > > > > > > > aggression... etc!). It may not be a complete loss but a

reduction in

> > > > > > > > > > the qualities.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Such influence is not necessarily good or bad for the

individual

> > > > > > > > > > depending on the personal nature of the node in the

specific chart!

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Please remember that it is anecdotal! Try it at your own

risk! In fact

> > > > > > > > > > for other novice readers, I would venture to add: PLEASE

DON'T TRY THIS

> > > > > > > > > > AT HOME WITHOUT YOUR TEACHER OR PARENT BEING PRESENT CLOSE

BY! :-)

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > So nice to hear that cheerfulness is back in your heart.

My prayers

> > > > > > > > > > and best wishes that Ma always shower Her blessings on ALL

my Dadas!

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > --- In

<%40>,

> > > > > > > > > > " rajbhardwaj1949 "

> > > > > > > > > > rajbhardwaj1949@ wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Bhai Rohini, Kulbir and Krishnan and all

Jyotishis,

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > The thread on " Beej Mantra " and " I disagree " have been

really very

> > > > > > > > > > > > interesting for me. After a long time I was enjoying

and smiling

> > > > > > > > > > while

> > > > > > > > > > > > reading the exchange, and at times I was humming.

Completely

> > > > > > > > > > relaxed. My

> > > > > > > > > > > > wife had observed me at a few occasions and called my

younger

> > > > > > > > > > daughter

> > > > > > > > > > > > to observe me silently and also enjoyed finding me

relaxed with

> > > > > > > > > > smile on

> > > > > > > > > > > > my face. Somehow the subject in both the threads got

intermangled

> > > > > > > > > > very

> > > > > > > > > > > > beautifully. Guru,Shishya,Deekshya,traditions;

cunturies old and the

> > > > > > > > > > > > current traits.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > I have firm belief that almost all of us(other

jyotishis also

> > > > > > > > > > included),

> > > > > > > > > > > > who try to give answers to the queries to best of

their knowledge;

> > > > > > > > > > and

> > > > > > > > > > > > most of the times face brickbats and get No thanks,

still go on

> > > > > > > > > > > > participating in their respective groups ,like

addicts, not

> > > > > > > > > > withstanding

> > > > > > > > > > > > the skirmishes here and there.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > This further strengthens my belief, that all such

jyotishis have

> > > > > > > > > > learned

> > > > > > > > > > > > jyotish with their own efforts, with no Guru or

Gurukul. If this is

> > > > > > > > > > not

> > > > > > > > > > > > Junoon, then what else. The will to learn and the will

to do bit of

> > > > > > > > > > > > experiment too in the process.How much time it takes

to read, how

> > > > > > > > > > quick

> > > > > > > > > > > > reactions or delayed reactions take seeds in our

minds, how we

> > > > > > > > > > prepare

> > > > > > > > > > > > ourselves to gather the thoughts and type these to

give them a shape

> > > > > > > > > > and

> > > > > > > > > > > > not expecting anything in return. Just the pure joy

and

> > > > > > > > > > satisfaction.

> > > > > > > > > > > > This is a continuous process of learning for us and I

also have no

> > > > > > > > > > doubt

> > > > > > > > > > > > that the young learner also must be picking a lots

from what appears

> > > > > > > > > > in

> > > > > > > > > > > > the group.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > I will be hanged and stoned by the so called purists,

if I were to

> > > > > > > > > > say

> > > > > > > > > > > > that there is no need to have Guru, in the times we

are living. In

> > > > > > > > > > other

> > > > > > > > > > > > words every learner of Jyotish has his own free Will ,

if it is

> > > > > > > > > > > > Operational , to learn the Jyotish without being bound

by any

> > > > > > > > > > > > Rules,Paramparas etc. This is so because the material

and

> > > > > > > > > > opportunity

> > > > > > > > > > > > for picking up Jyotish is now really very easily

available and every

> > > > > > > > > > > > learner has good faculties in the field of education

and languages.

> > > > > > > > > > One

> > > > > > > > > > > > just needs to have a keen eye and belief in himself.

How they will

> > > > > > > > > > use

> > > > > > > > > > > > their knowledge will depend solely on themselves.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > While on the subject of , I (like many other

Jyotishis) was also

> > > > > > > > > > witness

> > > > > > > > > > > > to few other happenings involving a Guru and Shishya.

I have been

> > > > > > > > > > > > thinking for quite some time about the " Guru-Chaandal

Yoga " . Why

> > > > > > > > > > such

> > > > > > > > > > > > yoga was mentioned in BPHS. Guru was specifically

Jupiter, but Rahu

> > > > > > > > > > was

> > > > > > > > > > > > not specifically Chandaal. I am not sure if Rahu has

been given the

> > > > > > > > > > name

> > > > > > > > > > > > of Chaandal in it's various descriptions. Now how this

Yoga is

> > > > > > > > > > feared by

> > > > > > > > > > > > all like Rahu dasha,Shani dasha, Shani Sade Sati etc.

When a learner

> > > > > > > > > > > > like me perhaps does not get any reason to show the

cause of

> > > > > > > > > > problems in

> > > > > > > > > > > > facing the jataka , we the lesser known jyotishis just

take names of

> > > > > > > > > > > > such yogas or positions of Shani as the root cause of

all the

> > > > > > > > > > problems.

> > > > > > > > > > > > Very easy way out indeed.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > I have been thinking a lot about The Guru-Chaandal

Yoga and somehow

> > > > > > > > > > tend

> > > > > > > > > > > > to believe, that Guru can become like a Chaandal in

the real sense.

> > > > > > > > > > His

> > > > > > > > > > > > all faculties are shut and whatever he does and utters

is very very

> > > > > > > > > > > > surprising, it hits everything and everybody very

hard. The image of

> > > > > > > > > > > > Guru becomes that of a Satan,as he breathes fire and

breakes all the

> > > > > > > > > > so

> > > > > > > > > > > > called maryada of a Guru, if there is anything called

maryada. When

> > > > > > > > > > our

> > > > > > > > > > > > Rishis mentioned this Guru -Chaandal Yoga, they really

must have all

> > > > > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > > > rishis,munis,gurus who had dual personalities. There

is no need to

> > > > > > > > > > > > elaborate this. The real meaning of Guru Chaandal Yoga

seems to have

> > > > > > > > > > > > sink in now. It simply sinks the esteerm of a Guru,

where a Shishya

> > > > > > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > > > > > forced to challenge his Guru, and more the Guru

accuses the Shishya,

> > > > > > > > > > > > more he exposes himself, and forces the Shishya to

break his silence

> > > > > > > > > > and

> > > > > > > > > > > > he starts hesitatingly initially but goes full blast

exposing the

> > > > > > > > > > Guru.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > But, then the Shishya also has to be a real learner,

who perhaps

> > > > > > > > > > never

> > > > > > > > > > > > depends solely and blindly on one Guru. Now a big

question which is

> > > > > > > > > > > > staring me and I have been wondering why the fathers

of Jyotish did

> > > > > > > > > > not

> > > > > > > > > > > > mention about any yoga specifically , which could be

termed or

> > > > > > > > > > called as

> > > > > > > > > > > > " SHISHYA CHAANDAL " Yoga in the Jyotish !

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Raj Bhardwaj

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > --- In

<%40>,

> > > > > > > > > > " rohinicrystal "

> > > > > > > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > But Praajee...!

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > IK HORE thaa jo Dasyaa gadheriyaan de-vichh, unna

kol...!

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Varah (12) thay unna-di banday! Jotish main jaisay!!

Ek do ghabraa

> > > > > > > > > > > > gayey shaayad, aisaa sanu sunaa noo! Pher laut aayey

US dey Kaul

> > > > > > > > > > usday

> > > > > > > > > > > > 'marnay' day baad!

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Kis-day kaul woh sab logaan lautay, mainu nai pataa!

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Asi to sirf dekhnaay may zindagi gawaan dittay!

Kinni - Azib hai

> > > > > > > > > > yeh

> > > > > > > > > > > > kahaniyan bachchon di! Raab/Khudaa/Parmeshwar/God day

bachchoon-di!

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Maaf karnaa praa -- punjabi bhot pyaari lagdii si

magar ik saal to

> > > > > > > > > > > > nahin naa kafi! Shaayad aglay janam main kuch hor

seekh-layngay, jo

> > > > > > > > > > raha

> > > > > > > > > > > > giya si is janam-vich baki!

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Aankhaan khulie rakhiyo! Aandar_waali!! ;-)

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Happy Easter!!

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In

<%40>,

> > > > > > > > > > Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@

> > > > > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > SiRR ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > HUSH is the word;

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bolan naalon chup changeri, chup de naalon parda;

je MANSOOR na

> > > > > > > > > > > > bolda taan

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > sooli kahnu Chadhda.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Silence is golden; veil of secrecy even better,

Mansoor wouldn't

> > > > > > > > > > > > have been

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > hanged on gallows ;had he preferred silence.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kulbir Bains

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > ** rohinicrystal jyotish_vani@

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > *To:*

<%40>

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > *Sent:* Sun, 21 March, 2010 6:15:54 AM

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > *Subject:* Re: Information about beej mantra

sadhana's ?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kulbir_praaji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > This 'regulation' , " ...if deeksha of beej mantra

is given by

> > > > > > > > > > > > competent

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > guru, then it becomes the responsibility of the

guru to bring

> > > > > > > > > > > > salvation to

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > the disciple. " -- has an interesting wrinkle!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > It implies that the Guru himself/herself has

already attained

> > > > > > > > > > > > salvation!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > I think it is safe to assume that such deekshas

are being given

> > > > > > > > > > in

> > > > > > > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > hundreds of thousands, if not millions, world-wide

;-)

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now Chelaa poochtaa hai, " If there are so many

millions of Gurus

> > > > > > > > > > who

> > > > > > > > > > > > have

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > attained salvation already... Why is the earth and

humanity

> > > > > > > > > > > > suffering so

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > much? " :-B

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > ~Sab kuch seekha humnay, naa seekhie hoshiyari,

Sach hai duniya

> > > > > > > > > > > > walon kay

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > hum SUB hain anadi/anari! ~

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

removed]

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

[Guest guest]

Raj Wadday praaji (Wp)!

 

Yeh 'knotty/naughty' Kulbir Veeraa main_noo *sambhodit* kaardaa si Wp aur main

twaanoo! I suppose the three of us make a sort of lineage sort of:-)

 

Isn't this how lineages get established? Humnavaas finding a common island where

they find one another!

 

WOH SUB Waddhay Praaji exist right here (pointing to the heart chakra!) but

while They try to reach out, how can THEY be found and touched if ONE is never

trying to reach and touch the INSIDE?

 

Macrocosm is OUTSIDE while microcosm is inside. Including the inner physician,

inner teacher, inner deity, inner oracle, and inner friend!

 

The biggest MAYA that exists in our current reality is that 'we will bring about

a change'

 

We pit ourselves against MA NATURE when we begin to think like that!

 

She watches our puny half-hearted attempts to bring about a GREEN change in the

world and some go with Global warming, the others with Global cooling

(confusions similar to the parade we are seeing in Jyotish about what is pure

and what is KNOT!) and then when SHE has had enough of our infantile noise, SHE

reminds us brats WHO is RULING the REALITY: by sending an Earthquake, Tsunami

and so on and so forth!

 

Rohiniranjan

 

, " Raj " <rajbhardwaj1949 wrote:

>

>

> Pyare Kulbeer Jio,

> Chaanga hai Pooranmasi noon nan jam ke main Nauvin noo hi jam giya see,

> nahin te mainu saare Rajoo Bawra kahinde ! Thoda hi farak te safar reh

> giya hai hun taan ! Dhallan da safar shuru ho gaya hai.........

>

>

> Where is Adi Shankaracharya,Tagore,Nur-ul-Islam, Bade Ghulam Ali , MS

> Subbulakshmi,Bismillah Khan, Mirza Ghalib, Shiv Batalvi, Kavi Kaalidas,

> Tulsidas, Soordas,Meera, Subramanyam Bharti, Bhagat Singh , our great

> Soofi Saints, and to top them all Kabir, all the Sagunas and

> Nirgunas(list is really long one) AND lastly Sri Guru Granth Sahib - The

> only Granth,which is great collection of rachnaas of Saints poets of all

> dharmas of whole country and each Chhanda of this Greatest Grantha is

> sung only on all the Hindustaani Raggas by the Raagis in Guru-Dwaras.

> AND the 10th Guru ,the Saint-Warrior Guru Gobind Singh who delivered his

> his last surmon - Agya Bhai Akkal ki sabhi chalaio Panth, Sab Sikhan(THE

> learned one, the initiated one, the skilled one ,the trained ones -

> followers of Satkarmas and Satmargas ) ko Hukum hai Guru manio GRANTH.

> All these great Indians were born with beautiful minds, listned to

> their inner-self , with exalted minds and souls- Did they have any

> GURU...really....??? There are quite a few countrieswhere I have met

> students and ask them something about India- I get only one name

> " 'GANDHI " Enough ! Not the other one who could order Indian Army to

> attack Shri Harmandir Sahib in Amritsar with Tanks and Infantry..just

> to flush out terrorists, her own creation....and the whole Panjab burned

> for 8 longs years, but never any other place of worship of any other

> religion in the Dharam Nirpeksha Bharat what to say of even arrest the

> so called Gurus of other religions,beliefs,sects. Perhaps I have gone

> too far !

>

> -Ashkon se jo paya hai, wo geeton main diya hai, iss par bhi sunaa hai

> ki ..zamaane ko gilaa hai....! Let it be the Last Post and.. ...reverse

> arms ! With my lots of love to you and the sweet little daughter. I will

> be in touch with you and the legacy of second Deepak !

>

> Raj Bhardwaj

>

>

> , Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb@>

> wrote:

> >

> > Typo error Sir,

> > UTHHE karman de hone ne nibede; na teri JAAT puchani.

> >

> > On Thu, Apr 1, 2010 at 10:16 PM, Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@ wrote:

> >

> > > Sir Raj Bharadwaj ji.

> > > UTHHE karman de hone ne nibede; kisse na teri puchni.

> > >

> > > Respect and Regards

> > > Kulbir Bains.

> > >

> > >

> > > On Thu, Apr 1, 2010 at 8:44 PM, Raj rajbhardwaj1949@ wrote:

> > >

> > >>

> > >>

> > >>

> > >> Dear all,

> > >>

> > >> All my dears who have commented on the Guru-Chaandal so far, I

> would

> > >> like to request that I am still waiting for my query about such a

> Yoga

> > >> which can be termed as 'CHAANDAL SHISHYA `. The thread so far has

> > >> been very lively and en-lightening! There is fear that Mishras and

> Jhas

> > >> could hijack this thread too, like the Mahapandit Raavaan Ji

> maharaj.

> > >> Because as it is, there is centuries old rivalry between Mishr and

> Jha

> > >> in Darbhanga side of Bihar. Mishr says , he is the top class

> Brahmin and

> > >> Jha says he is the Number One. It is other matter that Ojha is also

> > >> there somewhere in North India. At least I have a shield with me

> because

> > >> Bhardwaj, Bharadwaj and Bharadwaja are in all parts of the country.

> > >>

> > >> I am in bit of hurry, as my Shani-Shukra-Ketu is ending on

> 10/04/2010. I

> > >> have one more feeling that in the end I may have to sing a duet,

> which

> > >> can be between lovers ( Premi and Premika) or Guru-Shishya or

> > >> Shishya-Guru or may be....any two less or more enlighted persons,

> > >> which Sahir Ludhianavi Saheb gave to the world in the era of

> romanticism

> > >> after we won our freedom. Now there is no romanticism only crude

> xxx,

> > >> RDxxx.. in all it's perceived Roopas or Ku-roopas.

> > >>

> > >> Tum mujhe Bhool bhi jayo, toh yeh hak hai tumko,

> > >>

> > >> Meri Baat aur hai, maine to Mohabbat ki hai.

> > >>

> > >> 1. " Tumkoo duniya ke ghamo daard se phursaat na sahee,

> > >>

> > >> sabse ulfaat sahee, mujhse hi Mohabbat na sahee,

> > >>

> > >> Main tumhara (i) hoon , yahee mere liye kya kam hai,

> > >>

> > >> Tum mere ho ke raho , yeh meri kismet naa sahi

> > >>

> > >> Tum agar jee ko churayo, toh yeh haq hai tumko, meri baat aur

> hai….

> > >>

> > >> 2. Zindagee sirf mohabbat nahin, kuchh aur bhi hai,

> > >>

> > >> Zulf-o-rukhsaar ki jannat nahin kuchh aur bhi hai,

> > >>

> > >> Bhookh aur Pyaas ki maree hui iss duniya main,

> > >>

> > >> Ishq hi ek haqeeqat nahin kuchh aur bhee hai,

> > >>

> > >> Tum agar aankh churayo, toh yeh haq hai tumko,

> > >>

> > >> Maine Tumse hi nahin Sab se Mohabbat ki hai………..!

> > >>

> > >> AND... another great poet Kavi Pradeep in `Jagriti'

> > >>

> > >> Atom bamo ke zor pe ainthee hai ye duniya,

> > >>

> > >> Barood ke ik dher pe baithee hai ye duniya,

> > >>

> > >> Tum har kaadam uthaana zaara dekh-bhaal ke

> > >>

> > >> Iss Desh ko rakhna mere Bachho sambhal ke

> > >>

> > >> Ham layen hai toofan se kishti nikaal ke , iss desh ko rakhna….

> > >>

> > >> Raj Bhardwaj

> > >>

> > >>

> > >> --- In

> <%40>,

> > >> " inder " indervohra2001@

> > >> wrote:

> > >> >

> > >> > Dear Kulbir jee,

> > >> > Not Tughlaki farman, it was well and deep thought of farman.

> > >> > But but..

> > >> > Tughlaki farmans were also well planned,and thought off, but went

> > >> topsy turvy. Rahu was not favorable to poor Tughlak.

> > >> > Inder

> > >> >

> > >> > --- In

> <%40>,

> > >> Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@

> > >> wrote:

> > >> > >

> > >> > > Dear Inder;

> > >> > > Some reasoned reply may help me instead of this Tughlaki

> Farmaan.

> > >> > > I have come to learn here so it matters at least to me.

> > >> > > Regards

> > >> > > Kulbir Bains

> > >> > >

> > >> > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> > >> > >

> > >> > > Wednesday, 31 March, 2010 6:10 AM

> > >> > >

> > >> > >

> > >> > > Dear Kulbir,

> > >> > > I donot agree with you.

> > >> > > Anyway does'nt matter.

> > >> > > Inder

> > >> > >

> > >> > > , Kulbir Bains

> <lalkitabkb@

> > >> ...>

> > >> > > wrote:

> > >> > > >

> > >> > > > Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best

> > >> pragmatic

> > >> > > way

> > >> > > > possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says.

> > >> > > > House no 11. represents SABKI APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN

> earning.

> > >> In 11th

> > >> > > > house itself, is the seat of justice/judge. Saturn takes the

> > >> incurred

> > >> > > karma

> > >> > > > via Rahu and Ketu before Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the

> seat

> > >> of judge

> > >> > > > but Saturn is the drishti to guide it).

> > >> > > > Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter passes it on

> > >> Saturn's

> > >> > > > recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in mind.

> (khuda

> > >> ko hazir

> > >> > > > mankar).

> > >> > > > Regards

> > >> > > > Kulbir Bains.

> > >> > > >

> > >> > > > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder <indervohra2001@ ...>

> > >> wrote:

> > >> > > >

> > >> > > > >

> > >> > > > >

> > >> > > > > Dear Kulbir,

> > >> > > > > Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement.

> [correct

> > >> or

> > >> > > incorrect]

> > >> > > > > Saturn is illegal,[but may be correct],thinking.

> > >> > > > >

> > >> > > > > Jupiter + Saturn becomes philospher.[ nothing good or bad,

> but

> > >> thinking

> > >> > > > > makes it so]

> > >> > > > >

> > >> > > > > Mars with Jupiter logic[logician] , without reading the law

> > >> books he

> > >> > > would

> > >> > > > > give arguments which may win him.

> > >> > > > >

> > >> > > > > Inder

> > >> > >

> > >> > > On Wed, Mar 31, 2010 at 8:53 AM, Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@

> wrote:

> > >> > >

> > >> > > Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best

> > >> pragmatic way

> > >> > > possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says.House no 11.

> > >> represents SABKI

> > >> > > APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN earning. In 11th house itself, is

> the

> > >> seat of

> > >> > > justice/judge. Saturn takes the incurred karma via Rahu and

> Ketu

> > >> before

> > >> > > Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the seat of judge but Saturn is

> the

> > >> drishti

> > >> > > to guide it).Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter

> passes

> > >> it on

> > >> > > Saturn's recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in

> mind.

> > >> (khuda

> > >> > > ko hazir mankar).

> > >> > >

> > >> > > Regards

> > >> > >

> > >> > > Kulbir Bains.

> > >> > >

> > >> > > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder indervohra2001@ wrote:

> > >> > >

> > >> > > Dear Kulbir,

> > >> > >

> > >> > > Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement.[correct

> or

> > >> > > incorrect]Saturn is illegal,[but may be

> correct],thinking.Jupiter +

> > >> Saturn

> > >> > > becomes philospher.[nothing good or bad, but thinking makes it

> > >> so]Mars with

> > >> > > Jupiter logic[logician], without reading the law books he would

> give

> > >> > > arguments which may win him.

> > >> > >

> > >> > > Inder

> > >>

> > >> > >

> > >> > >

> > >> > >

[Guest guest]

Dear Raj,

 

As compared to poised and elagant and fatty Jupiter, Shishya may be a

Mercury-weak fellow.

 

Rahu can not magnify the fatty Jupiter but Mercury gets more vibrant, manificant

and so on with Rahu and Ketu.

 

So Shishya Chandal match is perfect match.

 

With the effects Rahu so many kingdoms and Tughlaks are destroyed.

 

Mordern days elections are all about effects.Election are won and lost by

ripples and effects.

 

And for post martem analysis on TV etc our Mecurian bhais journalists magnfy

their expainations to make you understand the things which are not there.

Chaandal Shishya effects.

 

Inder

 

, " Raj " <rajbhardwaj1949 wrote:

>

>

> Dear all,

>

> All my dears who have commented on the Guru-Chaandal so far, I would

> like to request that I am still waiting for my query about such a Yoga

> which can be termed as 'CHAANDAL SHISHYA `. The thread so far has

> been very lively and en-lightening! There is fear that Mishras and Jhas

> could hijack this thread too, like the Mahapandit Raavaan Ji maharaj.

> Because as it is, there is centuries old rivalry between Mishr and Jha

> in Darbhanga side of Bihar. Mishr says , he is the top class Brahmin and

> Jha says he is the Number One. It is other matter that Ojha is also

> there somewhere in North India. At least I have a shield with me because

> Bhardwaj, Bharadwaj and Bharadwaja are in all parts of the country.

>

> I am in bit of hurry, as my Shani-Shukra-Ketu is ending on 10/04/2010. I

> have one more feeling that in the end I may have to sing a duet, which

> can be between lovers ( Premi and Premika) or Guru-Shishya or

> Shishya-Guru or may be....any two less or more enlighted persons,

> which Sahir Ludhianavi Saheb gave to the world in the era of romanticism

> after we won our freedom. Now there is no romanticism only crude xxx,

> RDxxx.. in all it's perceived Roopas or Ku-roopas.

>

> Tum mujhe Bhool bhi jayo, toh yeh hak hai tumko,

>

> Meri Baat aur hai, maine to Mohabbat ki hai.

>

> 1. " Tumkoo duniya ke ghamo daard se phursaat na sahee,

>

> sabse ulfaat sahee, mujhse hi Mohabbat na sahee,

>

> Main tumhara (i) hoon , yahee mere liye kya kam hai,

>

> Tum mere ho ke raho , yeh meri kismet naa sahi

>

> Tum agar jee ko churayo, toh yeh haq hai tumko, meri baat aur hai….

>

> 2. Zindagee sirf mohabbat nahin, kuchh aur bhi hai,

>

> Zulf-o-rukhsaar ki jannat nahin kuchh aur bhi hai,

>

> Bhookh aur Pyaas ki maree hui iss duniya main,

>

> Ishq hi ek haqeeqat nahin kuchh aur bhee hai,

>

> Tum agar aankh churayo, toh yeh haq hai tumko,

>

> Maine Tumse hi nahin Sab se Mohabbat ki hai………..!

>

> AND... another great poet Kavi Pradeep in `Jagriti'

>

> Atom bamo ke zor pe ainthee hai ye duniya,

>

> Barood ke ik dher pe baithee hai ye duniya,

>

> Tum har kaadam uthaana zaara dekh-bhaal ke

>

> Iss Desh ko rakhna mere Bachho sambhal ke

>

> Ham layen hai toofan se kishti nikaal ke , iss desh ko rakhna….

>

> Raj Bhardwaj

>

>

, " inder " <indervohra2001@>

> wrote:

> >

> > Dear Kulbir jee,

> > Not Tughlaki farman, it was well and deep thought of farman.

> > But but..

> > Tughlaki farmans were also well planned,and thought off, but went

> topsy turvy. Rahu was not favorable to poor Tughlak.

> > Inder

> >

> > , Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@

> wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Inder;

> > > Some reasoned reply may help me instead of this Tughlaki Farmaan.

> > > I have come to learn here so it matters at least to me.

> > > Regards

> > > Kulbir Bains

> > >

> > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> > >

> > > Wednesday, 31 March, 2010 6:10 AM

> > >

> > >

> > > Dear Kulbir,

> > > I donot agree with you.

> > > Anyway does'nt matter.

> > > Inder

> > >

> > > , Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb@

> ...>

> > > wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best

> pragmatic

> > > way

> > > > possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says.

> > > > House no 11. represents SABKI APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN earning.

> In 11th

> > > > house itself, is the seat of justice/judge. Saturn takes the

> incurred

> > > karma

> > > > via Rahu and Ketu before Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the seat

> of judge

> > > > but Saturn is the drishti to guide it).

> > > > Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter passes it on

> Saturn's

> > > > recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in mind. (khuda

> ko hazir

> > > > mankar).

> > > > Regards

> > > > Kulbir Bains.

> > > >

> > > > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder <indervohra2001@ ...>

> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear Kulbir,

> > > > > Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement. [correct

> or

> > > incorrect]

> > > > > Saturn is illegal,[but may be correct],thinking.

> > > > >

> > > > > Jupiter + Saturn becomes philospher.[ nothing good or bad, but

> thinking

> > > > > makes it so]

> > > > >

> > > > > Mars with Jupiter logic[logician] , without reading the law

> books he

> > > would

> > > > > give arguments which may win him.

> > > > >

> > > > > Inder

> > >

> > > On Wed, Mar 31, 2010 at 8:53 AM, Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@ wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best

> pragmatic way

> > > possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says.House no 11.

> represents SABKI

> > > APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN earning. In 11th house itself, is the

> seat of

> > > justice/judge. Saturn takes the incurred karma via Rahu and Ketu

> before

> > > Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the seat of judge but Saturn is the

> drishti

> > > to guide it).Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter passes

> it on

> > > Saturn's recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in mind.

> (khuda

> > > ko hazir mankar).

> > >

> > > Regards

> > >

> > > Kulbir Bains.

> > >

> > > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder indervohra2001@ wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Kulbir,

> > >

> > > Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement.[correct or

> > > incorrect]Saturn is illegal,[but may be correct],thinking.Jupiter +

> Saturn

> > > becomes philospher.[nothing good or bad, but thinking makes it

> so]Mars with

> > > Jupiter logic[logician], without reading the law books he would give

> > > arguments which may win him.

> > >

> > > Inder

> > >

> > >

> > >

[Guest guest]

Given all the typos in your posting, Inder bhai, perhaps you meant:

" Shishya may be a Mercury-weak fOllow... "

 

Mercury and Saturn make poor followers for obvious reasons! And ketu too!

 

RR_,

 

, " inder " <indervohra2001 wrote:

>

> Dear Raj,

>

> As compared to poised and elagant and fatty Jupiter, Shishya may be a

Mercury-weak fellow.

>

> Rahu can not magnify the fatty Jupiter but Mercury gets more vibrant,

manificant and so on with Rahu and Ketu.

>

> So Shishya Chandal match is perfect match.

>

> With the effects Rahu so many kingdoms and Tughlaks are destroyed.

>

> Mordern days elections are all about effects.Election are won and lost by

ripples and effects.

>

> And for post martem analysis on TV etc our Mecurian bhais journalists magnfy

their expainations to make you understand the things which are not there.

Chaandal Shishya effects.

>

> Inder

>

> , " Raj " <rajbhardwaj1949@> wrote:

> >

> >

> > Dear all,

> >

> > All my dears who have commented on the Guru-Chaandal so far, I would

> > like to request that I am still waiting for my query about such a Yoga

> > which can be termed as 'CHAANDAL SHISHYA `. The thread so far has

> > been very lively and en-lightening! There is fear that Mishras and Jhas

> > could hijack this thread too, like the Mahapandit Raavaan Ji maharaj.

> > Because as it is, there is centuries old rivalry between Mishr and Jha

> > in Darbhanga side of Bihar. Mishr says , he is the top class Brahmin and

> > Jha says he is the Number One. It is other matter that Ojha is also

> > there somewhere in North India. At least I have a shield with me because

> > Bhardwaj, Bharadwaj and Bharadwaja are in all parts of the country.

> >

> > I am in bit of hurry, as my Shani-Shukra-Ketu is ending on 10/04/2010. I

> > have one more feeling that in the end I may have to sing a duet, which

> > can be between lovers ( Premi and Premika) or Guru-Shishya or

> > Shishya-Guru or may be....any two less or more enlighted persons,

> > which Sahir Ludhianavi Saheb gave to the world in the era of romanticism

> > after we won our freedom. Now there is no romanticism only crude xxx,

> > RDxxx.. in all it's perceived Roopas or Ku-roopas.

> >

> > Tum mujhe Bhool bhi jayo, toh yeh hak hai tumko,

> >

> > Meri Baat aur hai, maine to Mohabbat ki hai.

> >

> > 1. " Tumkoo duniya ke ghamo daard se phursaat na sahee,

> >

> > sabse ulfaat sahee, mujhse hi Mohabbat na sahee,

> >

> > Main tumhara (i) hoon , yahee mere liye kya kam hai,

> >

> > Tum mere ho ke raho , yeh meri kismet naa sahi

> >

> > Tum agar jee ko churayo, toh yeh haq hai tumko, meri baat aur hai….

> >

> > 2. Zindagee sirf mohabbat nahin, kuchh aur bhi hai,

> >

> > Zulf-o-rukhsaar ki jannat nahin kuchh aur bhi hai,

> >

> > Bhookh aur Pyaas ki maree hui iss duniya main,

> >

> > Ishq hi ek haqeeqat nahin kuchh aur bhee hai,

> >

> > Tum agar aankh churayo, toh yeh haq hai tumko,

> >

> > Maine Tumse hi nahin Sab se Mohabbat ki hai………..!

> >

> > AND... another great poet Kavi Pradeep in `Jagriti'

> >

> > Atom bamo ke zor pe ainthee hai ye duniya,

> >

> > Barood ke ik dher pe baithee hai ye duniya,

> >

> > Tum har kaadam uthaana zaara dekh-bhaal ke

> >

> > Iss Desh ko rakhna mere Bachho sambhal ke

> >

> > Ham layen hai toofan se kishti nikaal ke , iss desh ko rakhna….

> >

> > Raj Bhardwaj

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > , " inder " <indervohra2001@>

> > wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Kulbir jee,

> > > Not Tughlaki farman, it was well and deep thought of farman.

> > > But but..

> > > Tughlaki farmans were also well planned,and thought off, but went

> > topsy turvy. Rahu was not favorable to poor Tughlak.

> > > Inder

> > >

> > > , Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@

> > wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Dear Inder;

> > > > Some reasoned reply may help me instead of this Tughlaki Farmaan.

> > > > I have come to learn here so it matters at least to me.

> > > > Regards

> > > > Kulbir Bains

> > > >

> > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

> > > >

> > > > Wednesday, 31 March, 2010 6:10 AM

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Dear Kulbir,

> > > > I donot agree with you.

> > > > Anyway does'nt matter.

> > > > Inder

> > > >

> > > > , Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb@

> > ...>

> > > > wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best

> > pragmatic

> > > > way

> > > > > possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says.

> > > > > House no 11. represents SABKI APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN earning.

> > In 11th

> > > > > house itself, is the seat of justice/judge. Saturn takes the

> > incurred

> > > > karma

> > > > > via Rahu and Ketu before Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the seat

> > of judge

> > > > > but Saturn is the drishti to guide it).

> > > > > Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter passes it on

> > Saturn's

> > > > > recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in mind. (khuda

> > ko hazir

> > > > > mankar).

> > > > > Regards

> > > > > Kulbir Bains.

> > > > >

> > > > > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder <indervohra2001@ ...>

> > wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Dear Kulbir,

> > > > > > Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement. [correct

> > or

> > > > incorrect]

> > > > > > Saturn is illegal,[but may be correct],thinking.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Jupiter + Saturn becomes philospher.[ nothing good or bad, but

> > thinking

> > > > > > makes it so]

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Mars with Jupiter logic[logician] , without reading the law

> > books he

> > > > would

> > > > > > give arguments which may win him.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Inder

> > > >

> > > > On Wed, Mar 31, 2010 at 8:53 AM, Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@ wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best

> > pragmatic way

> > > > possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says.House no 11.

> > represents SABKI

> > > > APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN earning. In 11th house itself, is the

> > seat of

> > > > justice/judge. Saturn takes the incurred karma via Rahu and Ketu

> > before

> > > > Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the seat of judge but Saturn is the

> > drishti

> > > > to guide it).Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter passes

> > it on

> > > > Saturn's recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in mind.

> > (khuda

> > > > ko hazir mankar).

> > > >

> > > > Regards

> > > >

> > > > Kulbir Bains.

> > > >

> > > > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder indervohra2001@ wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Dear Kulbir,

> > > >

> > > > Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement.[correct or

> > > > incorrect]Saturn is illegal,[but may be correct],thinking.Jupiter +

> > Saturn

> > > > becomes philospher.[nothing good or bad, but thinking makes it

> > so]Mars with

> > > > Jupiter logic[logician], without reading the law books he would give

> > > > arguments which may win him.

> > > >

> > > > Inder

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >