Ego, realization, conceptual and nonconceptual

July 25, 2009

Nisargadatta , " geo " <inandor wrote:

>

> -

> dan330033

> Nisargadatta

> Friday, July 24, 2009 8:03 PM

> Re: Ego, realization, conceptual and nonconceptual

>

> Nisargadatta , " Tim G. " <fewtch@> wrote:

> >

> > Nisargadatta , " skywhilds " <skywords@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Agreed.

> > >

> > > However, " honest, direct words " are what the sufferer

> > >

> > > Believes MOST heartily in:

> > >

> > > Absolutely, from the sufferer's point of view.

> >

> > " Untruth " is very deceptive. There's nothing honest or direct about it.

> >

> > Honest, direct words are still untruth, but point away from the more

> > dramatic forms of verbal untruth.

>

> I find that dishonest communication subtly or overtly encourages belief,

> generally in something that is supposed to benefit the " me. "

>

> Honest communication doesn't involve a motive to distort or split, it's not

> " duplicitous " (double), but sincere, single-purposed.

>

> - D-

>

> Yes but, two atorneys talking about their common client also feel they are

> communicating in a very positive way - single purposed.

> -geo-

Yes, because they honestly want to get their client off of the charges.

And they honestly agree that if they need to distort the truth to do so, it is

good, it is their honestly dishonest job!

Wow.

How did we come to this?

And we think civilization is an advancement?

OMG --

But, this is the human adventure, is it not?

The project of being honestly dishonest?

Lawyers are nothing special.

- Dan -

July 25, 2009

Nisargadatta , " dan330033 " <dan330033 wrote:

>

> Nisargadatta , " geo " <inandor@> wrote:

> >

> > -

> > dan330033

> > Nisargadatta

> > Friday, July 24, 2009 8:03 PM

> > Re: Ego, realization, conceptual and nonconceptual

> >

> > Nisargadatta , " Tim G. " <fewtch@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Nisargadatta , " skywhilds " <skywords@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Agreed.

> > > >

> > > > However, " honest, direct words " are what the sufferer

> > > >

> > > > Believes MOST heartily in:

> > > >

> > > > Absolutely, from the sufferer's point of view.

> > >

> > > " Untruth " is very deceptive. There's nothing honest or direct about it.

> > >

> > > Honest, direct words are still untruth, but point away from the more

> > > dramatic forms of verbal untruth.

> >

> > I find that dishonest communication subtly or overtly encourages belief,

> > generally in something that is supposed to benefit the " me. "

> >

> > Honest communication doesn't involve a motive to distort or split, it's not

> > " duplicitous " (double), but sincere, single-purposed.

> >

> > - D-

> >

> > Yes but, two atorneys talking about their common client also feel they are

> > communicating in a very positive way - single purposed.

> > -geo-

>

> Yes, because they honestly want to get their client off of the charges.

>

> And they honestly agree that if they need to distort the truth to do so, it is

good, it is their honestly dishonest job!

>

> Wow.

>

> How did we come to this?

>

> And we think civilization is an advancement?

>

> OMG --

>

> But, this is the human adventure, is it not?

>

> The project of being honestly dishonest?

>

> Lawyers are nothing special.

>

> - Dan -

what the hell is?

that's a prissy statement of a phony.

..b b.b.

July 25, 2009

Nisargadatta , " geo " <inandor wrote:

>

> Honest, direct words are still untruth, but point away from the more

> dramatic forms of verbal untruth.

> -tim-

>

> Ah..no. More dramatic and less dramatic..then more truer then that other,

> then less truer. No.

> -geo-

There are no absolutes when it comes to words, concepts and thought. It's all

relative.

If I bought a brand new computer, to say " There's a new computer sitting on the

desk " is truer than " There's an old computer sitting on the desk " -- which, in

turn, is truer than " there's a purple elephant sitting on the desk " .

Clear and obvious.

July 25, 2009

Nisargadatta , " roberibus111 " <Roberibus111 wrote:

>

> i'm too modest.

>

> i'm not ~skyzie nor you.

>

> there is no difference between positive /negative/neutral.

Of course there's a difference.

There's a big difference between misery, and the lack of it.

Between unnecessary mental suffering, and the lack of it.

Between positive feelings toward someone, and unmitigated hatred toward someone.

This is so obvious, I'm amazed anyone has to be told this.

July 25, 2009

Nisargadatta , " skywhilds " <skywords wrote:

>

> Yes, I've asked myself precisely those questions.

>

> And I've COMPLETELY changed from believing in

>

> " no freedom, hence, compassion. "

>

> To " absolute freedom, hence no need for compassion "

There is no need for anything... but compassion arises, anyway.

One cannot but tend toward compassion toward another, when that other is

oneself.

July 25, 2009

Nisargadatta , " Tim G. " <fewtch wrote:

>

> Nisargadatta , " roberibus111 " <Roberibus111@> wrote:

> >

> > i'm too modest.

> >

> > i'm not ~skyzie nor you.

> >

> > there is no difference between positive /negative/neutral.

>

> Of course there's a difference.

>

> There's a big difference between misery, and the lack of it.

>

> Between unnecessary mental suffering, and the lack of it.

>

> Between positive feelings toward someone, and unmitigated hatred toward

someone.

>

> This is so obvious, I'm amazed anyone has to be told this.

what's the difference between that..

and a fundamentalist Christian saying:

" i know it's so because the bible tells me so "

i'm amazed anyone couldn't see the exact obvious sameness of the two.

are you a Baptist?

or just an ill-informed ego-centrist?

LOL!

..b b.b.

July 25, 2009

Nisargadatta , " roberibus111 " <Roberibus111 wrote:

>

> Nisargadatta , " Tim G. " <fewtch@> wrote:

> >

> > Nisargadatta , " skywhilds " <skywords@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Yes, I've asked myself precisely those questions.

> > >

> > > And I've COMPLETELY changed from believing in

> > >

> > > " no freedom, hence, compassion. "

> > >

> > > To " absolute freedom, hence no need for compassion "

> >

> > There is no need for anything... but compassion arises, anyway.

> >

> > One cannot but tend toward compassion toward another, when that other is

oneself.

>

> how do you know this?

>

> .b b.b.

>

Well, that precisely sums up your presence on this group,

" you know nothing b.b.b.onkey, absolutely nothing.

Begone cretin, begone...

July 25, 2009

Nisargadatta , " roberibus111 " <Roberibus111 wrote:

>

> Nisargadatta , " Tim G. " <fewtch@> wrote:

> >

> > Nisargadatta , " skywhilds " <skywords@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Yes, I've asked myself precisely those questions.

> > >

> > > And I've COMPLETELY changed from believing in

> > >

> > > " no freedom, hence, compassion. "

> > >

> > > To " absolute freedom, hence no need for compassion "

> >

> > There is no need for anything... but compassion arises, anyway.

> >

> > One cannot but tend toward compassion toward another, when that other is

oneself.

>

> how do you know this?

>

> .b b.b.

>

Hi Bobby,

Compassion definition: " Sympathetic consciousnes of others' distress

together with a desire to alleviate it. " Merriam-Webster on-line Dictionary.

Compassion is the epitome of being human, the solution to the paradox of SELF &

OTHER.

It is the Bodhisattvic vow put into practice. It is the knowing that in Self

there is no *other*...

~A

July 25, 2009

Nisargadatta , " mstrdmmlbrn " <mstrdmmlbrn wrote:

>

> Nisargadatta , " roberibus111 " <Roberibus111@> wrote:

> >

> > Nisargadatta , " Tim G. " <fewtch@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Nisargadatta , " skywhilds " <skywords@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Yes, I've asked myself precisely those questions.

> > > >

> > > > And I've COMPLETELY changed from believing in

> > > >

> > > > " no freedom, hence, compassion. "

> > > >

> > > > To " absolute freedom, hence no need for compassion "

> > >

> > > There is no need for anything... but compassion arises, anyway.

> > >

> > > One cannot but tend toward compassion toward another, when that other is

oneself.

> >

> > how do you know this?

> >

> > .b b.b.

> >

>

> Well, that precisely sums up your presence on this group,

>

> " you know nothing b.b.b.onkey, absolutely nothing.

>

> Begone cretin, begone...

oh i see el cheapo.

this is your friendly reciprocation for the free CDs...

containing thousands of dollars of material..

and $17.50 airmail postage..plus $7.00 postal insurance..

and paid for post office bubble packaging for shipping.

and gracious time consuming burning of said material..

worked on and sent after repeated begging without reprieve from you.

or is this just another dumb ass moronic excuse..

for being a lowlife trying to sound..

as if he had the slightest idea of what is considered..

among the commonality of most people..

to be socially apropos behavior after receiving such gracious gift?

and your adolescent schoolgirl attempts at writing sickening..

and imbecilic poetry are really an offense to anyone..

with an ounce of education or brains or appreciation of literature.

you say begone and because you haven't gone anywhere in your life...

beyond begging and taking whatever is donated.

and complaining when your loser status is pointed out to you.

whine on cisco.

LOL!

..b b.b.

July 25, 2009

Nisargadatta , " anabebe57 " <kailashana wrote:

>

> Nisargadatta , " roberibus111 " <Roberibus111@> wrote:

> >

> > Nisargadatta , " Tim G. " <fewtch@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Nisargadatta , " skywhilds " <skywords@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Yes, I've asked myself precisely those questions.

> > > >

> > > > And I've COMPLETELY changed from believing in

> > > >

> > > > " no freedom, hence, compassion. "

> > > >

> > > > To " absolute freedom, hence no need for compassion "

> > >

> > > There is no need for anything... but compassion arises, anyway.

> > >

> > > One cannot but tend toward compassion toward another, when that other is

oneself.

> >

> > how do you know this?

> >

> > .b b.b.

> >

>

> Hi Bobby,

>

> Compassion definition: " Sympathetic consciousnes of others' distress

> together with a desire to alleviate it. " Merriam-Webster on-line Dictionary.

>

> Compassion is the epitome of being human, the solution to the paradox of SELF

& OTHER.

>

> It is the Bodhisattvic vow put into practice. It is the knowing that in Self

there is no *other*...

>

> ~A

i'm no Bodhisattva.

i need not return.

Perfection is me.

what need of compassion?

:-)

..b b.b.

July 25, 2009

Nisargadatta , " Tim G. " <fewtch wrote:

>

> Nisargadatta , " skywhilds " <skywords@> wrote:

> >

> > Yes, I've asked myself precisely those questions.

> >

> > And I've COMPLETELY changed from believing in

> >

> > " no freedom, hence, compassion. "

> >

> > To " absolute freedom, hence no need for compassion "

>

> There is no need for anything... but compassion arises, anyway.

>

> One cannot but tend toward compassion toward another, when that other is

oneself.

>

Yes, AND

There are choices made

Decisions change things

The will has an effect

One can resist one's Self

July 25, 2009

Nisargadatta , " skywhilds " <skywords wrote:

>

> Nisargadatta , " Tim G. " <fewtch@> wrote:

> >

> > Nisargadatta , " skywhilds " <skywords@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Yes, I've asked myself precisely those questions.

> > >

> > > And I've COMPLETELY changed from believing in

> > >

> > > " no freedom, hence, compassion. "

> > >

> > > To " absolute freedom, hence no need for compassion "

> >

> > There is no need for anything... but compassion arises, anyway.

> >

> > One cannot but tend toward compassion toward another, when that other is

oneself.

> >

>

> Yes, AND

>

> There are choices made

>

> Decisions change things

>

> The will has an effect

>

> One can resist one's Self

>

and

There is the freedom to be utterly

Demonic, destructive, idiotic, trivial

Negative and UNFREE for it's own sake:

Merely to be free to be unfree

and (for me, this is the BEST NEWS)

One CAN

Consciously and deliberately decide to willfully:

Truly be blissfully happy, loving, compassionate

Most Freely in the Now

Most Gleefully in the Know

(without ANY prerequisites, processes, etc.

the idea of " not this without that, not that without this, "

is pure suffering, spiritually. Science is NOT exactly

poetry/spirit/feeling and poetry/spirit/feeling is NOT

exactly science. To equate the two realms is suffering.)

July 25, 2009

Nisargadatta , " skywhilds " <skywords wrote:

>

> Nisargadatta , " skywhilds " <skywords@> wrote:

> >

> > Nisargadatta , " Tim G. " <fewtch@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Nisargadatta , " skywhilds " <skywords@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Yes, I've asked myself precisely those questions.

> > > >

> > > > And I've COMPLETELY changed from believing in

> > > >

> > > > " no freedom, hence, compassion. "

> > > >

> > > > To " absolute freedom, hence no need for compassion "

> > >

> > > There is no need for anything... but compassion arises, anyway.

> > >

> > > One cannot but tend toward compassion toward another, when that other is

oneself.

> > >

> >

> > Yes, AND

> >

> > There are choices made

> >

> > Decisions change things

> >

> > The will has an effect

> >

> > One can resist one's Self

> >

>

> and

>

> There is the freedom to be utterly

>

> Demonic, destructive, idiotic, trivial

>

> Negative and UNFREE for it's own sake:

>

> Merely to be free to be unfree

>

> and (for me, this is the BEST NEWS)

>

> One CAN

>

> Consciously and deliberately decide to willfully:

>

> Truly be blissfully happy, loving, compassionate

>

> Most Freely in the Now

>

> Most Gleefully in the Know

>

> (without ANY prerequisites, processes, etc.

>

> the idea of " not this without that, not that without this, "

>

> is pure suffering, spiritually. Science is NOT exactly

>

> poetry/spirit/feeling and poetry/spirit/feeling is NOT

>

> exactly science. To equate the two realms is suffering.)

and one is free to be a cheap bastard..

and not admit it..

and to try and pontificate to others about..

being smoooooooooooth.

well smoothy..

suffer your psychotic belief...

and self delusional and phony sang-froids.

just keep on pretending.

it's so unimpressive and ludicrous.

we'd miss it if you didn't display it.

almost as much as anna's missing your absence.

LOL!

..b b.b.

July 25, 2009

Nisargadatta , " skywhilds " <skywords wrote:

>

> Nisargadatta , " skywhilds " <skywords@> wrote:

> >

> > Nisargadatta , " Tim G. " <fewtch@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Nisargadatta , " skywhilds " <skywords@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Yes, I've asked myself precisely those questions.

> > > >

> > > > And I've COMPLETELY changed from believing in

> > > >

> > > > " no freedom, hence, compassion. "

> > > >

> > > > To " absolute freedom, hence no need for compassion "

> > >

> > > There is no need for anything... but compassion arises, anyway.

> > >

> > > One cannot but tend toward compassion toward another, when that other is

oneself.

> > >

> >

> > Yes, AND

> >

> > There are choices made

> >

> > Decisions change things

> >

> > The will has an effect

> >

> > One can resist one's Self

> >

>

> and

>

> There is the freedom to be utterly

>

> Demonic, destructive, idiotic, trivial

>

> Negative and UNFREE for it's own sake:

>

> Merely to be free to be unfree

>

> and (for me, this is the BEST NEWS)

>

> One CAN

>

> Consciously and deliberately decide to willfully:

>

> Truly be blissfully happy, loving, compassionate

>

> Most Freely in the Now

>

> Most Gleefully in the Know

>

> (without ANY prerequisites, processes, etc.

>

> the idea of " not this without that, not that without this, "

>

> is pure suffering, spiritually. Science is NOT exactly

>

> poetry/spirit/feeling and poetry/spirit/feeling is NOT

>

> exactly science. To equate the two realms is suffering.)

>

In " I AM That " Nisargadatta said, " I do not need to make an effort; the deed

follows the thought, without delay and friction. I have also found that

thoughts become self-fulfilling; things would fall into place smoothly and

rightly. The main change was in the mind; it became motionless and silent,

responding quickly, but not perpetuating the response. Spontaneity became a way

of life, the real became natural and the natural became real. And above all,

infinite affection, love, dark and quiet, radiating in all directions, embracing

all, making all interesting and beautiful, significant and auspicious. "

July 25, 2009

Nisargadatta , " douglasmitch1963 " <douglasmitch1963

wrote:

>

> Nisargadatta , " skywhilds " <skywords@> wrote:

> >

> > Nisargadatta , " skywhilds " <skywords@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Nisargadatta , " Tim G. " <fewtch@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Nisargadatta , " skywhilds " <skywords@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Yes, I've asked myself precisely those questions.

> > > > >

> > > > > And I've COMPLETELY changed from believing in

> > > > >

> > > > > " no freedom, hence, compassion. "

> > > > >

> > > > > To " absolute freedom, hence no need for compassion "

> > > >

> > > > There is no need for anything... but compassion arises, anyway.

> > > >

> > > > One cannot but tend toward compassion toward another, when that other is

oneself.

> > > >

> > >

> > > Yes, AND

> > >

> > > There are choices made

> > >

> > > Decisions change things

> > >

> > > The will has an effect

> > >

> > > One can resist one's Self

> > >

> >

> > and

> >

> > There is the freedom to be utterly

> >

> > Demonic, destructive, idiotic, trivial

> >

> > Negative and UNFREE for it's own sake:

> >

> > Merely to be free to be unfree

> >

> > and (for me, this is the BEST NEWS)

> >

> > One CAN

> >

> > Consciously and deliberately decide to willfully:

> >

> > Truly be blissfully happy, loving, compassionate

> >

> > Most Freely in the Now

> >

> > Most Gleefully in the Know

> >

> > (without ANY prerequisites, processes, etc.

> >

> > the idea of " not this without that, not that without this, "

> >

> > is pure suffering, spiritually. Science is NOT exactly

> >

> > poetry/spirit/feeling and poetry/spirit/feeling is NOT

> >

> > exactly science. To equate the two realms is suffering.)

> >

>

> In " I AM That " Nisargadatta said, " I do not need to make an effort; the deed

follows the thought, without delay and friction. I have also found that

thoughts become self-fulfilling; things would fall into place smoothly and

rightly. The main change was in the mind; it became motionless and silent,

responding quickly, but not perpetuating the response. Spontaneity became a way

of life, the real became natural and the natural became real. And above all,

infinite affection, love, dark and quiet, radiating in all directions, embracing

all, making all interesting and beautiful, significant and auspicious. "

BEAUTIFUL!

July 25, 2009

Nisargadatta , " skywhilds " <skywords wrote:

>

> Nisargadatta , " douglasmitch1963 " <douglasmitch1963@>

wrote:

> >

> > Nisargadatta , " skywhilds " <skywords@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Nisargadatta , " skywhilds " <skywords@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Nisargadatta , " Tim G. " <fewtch@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Nisargadatta , " skywhilds " <skywords@> wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Yes, I've asked myself precisely those questions.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > And I've COMPLETELY changed from believing in

> > > > > >

> > > > > > " no freedom, hence, compassion. "

> > > > > >

> > > > > > To " absolute freedom, hence no need for compassion "

> > > > >

> > > > > There is no need for anything... but compassion arises, anyway.

> > > > >

> > > > > One cannot but tend toward compassion toward another, when that other

is oneself.

> > > > >

> > > >

> > > > Yes, AND

> > > >

> > > > There are choices made

> > > >

> > > > Decisions change things

> > > >

> > > > The will has an effect

> > > >

> > > > One can resist one's Self

> > > >

> > >

> > > and

> > >

> > > There is the freedom to be utterly

> > >

> > > Demonic, destructive, idiotic, trivial

> > >

> > > Negative and UNFREE for it's own sake:

> > >

> > > Merely to be free to be unfree

> > >

> > > and (for me, this is the BEST NEWS)

> > >

> > > One CAN

> > >

> > > Consciously and deliberately decide to willfully:

> > >

> > > Truly be blissfully happy, loving, compassionate

> > >

> > > Most Freely in the Now

> > >

> > > Most Gleefully in the Know

> > >

> > > (without ANY prerequisites, processes, etc.

> > >

> > > the idea of " not this without that, not that without this, "

> > >

> > > is pure suffering, spiritually. Science is NOT exactly

> > >

> > > poetry/spirit/feeling and poetry/spirit/feeling is NOT

> > >

> > > exactly science. To equate the two realms is suffering.)

> > >

> >

> > In " I AM That " Nisargadatta said, " I do not need to make an effort; the deed

follows the thought, without delay and friction. I have also found that

thoughts become self-fulfilling; things would fall into place smoothly and

rightly. The main change was in the mind; it became motionless and silent,

responding quickly, but not perpetuating the response. Spontaneity became a way

of life, the real became natural and the natural became real. And above all,

infinite affection, love, dark and quiet, radiating in all directions, embracing

all, making all interesting and beautiful, significant and auspicious. "

>

> BEAUTIFUL!

>

smoooooooooooooooth eh pancho?

just like you'd like it to be.

it's not.

it's just words on a page like words in a bible.

the believers in both kinds of nonsense..

are believers because they just want to..

or have to....... believe.

it's the only way they can live with themselves..

and their hollow lives.

it's an " excuse " little cisco.

..b b.b.

July 25, 2009

Nisargadatta , " roberibus111 " <Roberibus111 wrote:

>

> Nisargadatta , " skywhilds " <skywords@> wrote:

> >

> > Nisargadatta , " douglasmitch1963 " <douglasmitch1963@>

wrote:

> > >

> > > Nisargadatta , " skywhilds " <skywords@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Nisargadatta , " skywhilds " <skywords@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Nisargadatta , " Tim G. " <fewtch@> wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Nisargadatta , " skywhilds " <skywords@> wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Yes, I've asked myself precisely those questions.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > And I've COMPLETELY changed from believing in

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > " no freedom, hence, compassion. "

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > To " absolute freedom, hence no need for compassion "

> > > > > >

> > > > > > There is no need for anything... but compassion arises, anyway.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > One cannot but tend toward compassion toward another, when that

other is oneself.

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Yes, AND

> > > > >

> > > > > There are choices made

> > > > >

> > > > > Decisions change things

> > > > >

> > > > > The will has an effect

> > > > >

> > > > > One can resist one's Self

> > > > >

> > > >

> > > > and

> > > >

> > > > There is the freedom to be utterly

> > > >

> > > > Demonic, destructive, idiotic, trivial

> > > >

> > > > Negative and UNFREE for it's own sake:

> > > >

> > > > Merely to be free to be unfree

> > > >

> > > > and (for me, this is the BEST NEWS)

> > > >

> > > > One CAN

> > > >

> > > > Consciously and deliberately decide to willfully:

> > > >

> > > > Truly be blissfully happy, loving, compassionate

> > > >

> > > > Most Freely in the Now

> > > >

> > > > Most Gleefully in the Know

> > > >

> > > > (without ANY prerequisites, processes, etc.

> > > >

> > > > the idea of " not this without that, not that without this, "

> > > >

> > > > is pure suffering, spiritually. Science is NOT exactly

> > > >

> > > > poetry/spirit/feeling and poetry/spirit/feeling is NOT

> > > >

> > > > exactly science. To equate the two realms is suffering.)

> > > >

> > >

> > > In " I AM That " Nisargadatta said, " I do not need to make an effort; the

deed follows the thought, without delay and friction. I have also found that

thoughts become self-fulfilling; things would fall into place smoothly and

rightly. The main change was in the mind; it became motionless and silent,

responding quickly, but not perpetuating the response. Spontaneity became a way

of life, the real became natural and the natural became real. And above all,

infinite affection, love, dark and quiet, radiating in all directions, embracing

all, making all interesting and beautiful, significant and auspicious. "

> >

> > BEAUTIFUL!

> >

>

> smoooooooooooooooth eh pancho?

>

> just like you'd like it to be.

>

> it's not.

>

> it's just words on a page like words in a bible.

>

> the believers in both kinds of nonsense..

>

> are believers because they just want to..

>

> or have to....... believe.

>

> it's the only way they can live with themselves..

>

> and their hollow lives.

>

> it's an " excuse " little cisco.

>

> .b b.b.

>

It boils down to whether or not you trust the words of the guru - the Self as

manifested as Nisargadatta.

July 25, 2009

Nisargadatta , " douglasmitch1963 " <douglasmitch1963

wrote:

>

> Nisargadatta , " roberibus111 " <Roberibus111@> wrote:

> >

> > Nisargadatta , " skywhilds " <skywords@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Nisargadatta , " douglasmitch1963 "

<douglasmitch1963@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Nisargadatta , " skywhilds " <skywords@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Nisargadatta , " skywhilds " <skywords@> wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Nisargadatta , " Tim G. " <fewtch@> wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " skywhilds " <skywords@>

wrote:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Yes, I've asked myself precisely those questions.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > And I've COMPLETELY changed from believing in

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > " no freedom, hence, compassion. "

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > To " absolute freedom, hence no need for compassion "

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > There is no need for anything... but compassion arises, anyway.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > One cannot but tend toward compassion toward another, when that

other is oneself.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Yes, AND

> > > > > >

> > > > > > There are choices made

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Decisions change things

> > > > > >

> > > > > > The will has an effect

> > > > > >

> > > > > > One can resist one's Self

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > and

> > > > >

> > > > > There is the freedom to be utterly

> > > > >

> > > > > Demonic, destructive, idiotic, trivial

> > > > >

> > > > > Negative and UNFREE for it's own sake:

> > > > >

> > > > > Merely to be free to be unfree

> > > > >

> > > > > and (for me, this is the BEST NEWS)

> > > > >

> > > > > One CAN

> > > > >

> > > > > Consciously and deliberately decide to willfully:

> > > > >

> > > > > Truly be blissfully happy, loving, compassionate

> > > > >

> > > > > Most Freely in the Now

> > > > >

> > > > > Most Gleefully in the Know

> > > > >

> > > > > (without ANY prerequisites, processes, etc.

> > > > >

> > > > > the idea of " not this without that, not that without this, "

> > > > >

> > > > > is pure suffering, spiritually. Science is NOT exactly

> > > > >

> > > > > poetry/spirit/feeling and poetry/spirit/feeling is NOT

> > > > >

> > > > > exactly science. To equate the two realms is suffering.)

> > > > >

> > > >

> > > > In " I AM That " Nisargadatta said, " I do not need to make an effort; the

deed follows the thought, without delay and friction. I have also found that

thoughts become self-fulfilling; things would fall into place smoothly and

rightly. The main change was in the mind; it became motionless and silent,

responding quickly, but not perpetuating the response. Spontaneity became a way

of life, the real became natural and the natural became real. And above all,

infinite affection, love, dark and quiet, radiating in all directions, embracing

all, making all interesting and beautiful, significant and auspicious. "

> > >

> > > BEAUTIFUL!

> > >

> >

> > smoooooooooooooooth eh pancho?

> >

> > just like you'd like it to be.

> >

> > it's not.

> >

> > it's just words on a page like words in a bible.

> >

> > the believers in both kinds of nonsense..

> >

> > are believers because they just want to..

> >

> > or have to....... believe.

> >

> > it's the only way they can live with themselves..

> >

> > and their hollow lives.

> >

> > it's an " excuse " little cisco.

> >

> > .b b.b.

> >

>

> It boils down to whether or not you trust the words of the guru - the Self as

manifested as Nisargadatta.

>

I don't get it, that you'd say that!

Your quote is awesome but I was also assuming! that

You yourself were having the same experience as Nis.

For me, " it all boils down " to my own personal experience:

My trusting my own experience:

I would never trust another's experience, ever..

Until it was also, PRIMARILY, my own.

Still, I think you're probably on the

" Right track, "

(whatever that means...hope I don't sound too presumptuous)

July 25, 2009

Nisargadatta , " skywhilds " <skywords wrote:

>

> Nisargadatta , " douglasmitch1963 " <douglasmitch1963@>

wrote:

> >

> > Nisargadatta , " roberibus111 " <Roberibus111@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Nisargadatta , " skywhilds " <skywords@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Nisargadatta , " douglasmitch1963 "

<douglasmitch1963@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Nisargadatta , " skywhilds " <skywords@> wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Nisargadatta , " skywhilds " <skywords@> wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " Tim G. " <fewtch@> wrote:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " skywhilds " <skywords@>

wrote:

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Yes, I've asked myself precisely those questions.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > And I've COMPLETELY changed from believing in

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > " no freedom, hence, compassion. "

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > To " absolute freedom, hence no need for compassion "

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > There is no need for anything... but compassion arises, anyway.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > One cannot but tend toward compassion toward another, when that

other is oneself.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Yes, AND

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > There are choices made

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Decisions change things

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > The will has an effect

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > One can resist one's Self

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > and

> > > > > >

> > > > > > There is the freedom to be utterly

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Demonic, destructive, idiotic, trivial

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Negative and UNFREE for it's own sake:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Merely to be free to be unfree

> > > > > >

> > > > > > and (for me, this is the BEST NEWS)

> > > > > >

> > > > > > One CAN

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Consciously and deliberately decide to willfully:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Truly be blissfully happy, loving, compassionate

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Most Freely in the Now

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Most Gleefully in the Know

> > > > > >

> > > > > > (without ANY prerequisites, processes, etc.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > the idea of " not this without that, not that without this, "

> > > > > >

> > > > > > is pure suffering, spiritually. Science is NOT exactly

> > > > > >

> > > > > > poetry/spirit/feeling and poetry/spirit/feeling is NOT

> > > > > >

> > > > > > exactly science. To equate the two realms is suffering.)

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > In " I AM That " Nisargadatta said, " I do not need to make an effort;

the deed follows the thought, without delay and friction. I have also found

that thoughts become self-fulfilling; things would fall into place smoothly and

rightly. The main change was in the mind; it became motionless and silent,

responding quickly, but not perpetuating the response. Spontaneity became a way

of life, the real became natural and the natural became real. And above all,

infinite affection, love, dark and quiet, radiating in all directions, embracing

all, making all interesting and beautiful, significant and auspicious. "

> > > >

> > > > BEAUTIFUL!

> > > >

> > >

> > > smoooooooooooooooth eh pancho?

> > >

> > > just like you'd like it to be.

> > >

> > > it's not.

> > >

> > > it's just words on a page like words in a bible.

> > >

> > > the believers in both kinds of nonsense..

> > >

> > > are believers because they just want to..

> > >

> > > or have to....... believe.

> > >

> > > it's the only way they can live with themselves..

> > >

> > > and their hollow lives.

> > >

> > > it's an " excuse " little cisco.

> > >

> > > .b b.b.

> > >

> >

> > It boils down to whether or not you trust the words of the guru - the Self

as manifested as Nisargadatta.

> I don't get it, that you'd say that!

>

> Your quote is awesome but I was also assuming! that

>

> You yourself were having the same experience as Nis.

>

> For me, " it all boils down " to my own personal experience:

>

> My trusting my own experience:

>

> I would never trust another's experience, ever..

>

> Until it was also, PRIMARILY, my own.

>

> Still, I think you're probably on the

>

> " Right track, "

>

> (whatever that means...hope I don't sound too presumptuous)

>

My own experience would quite possibly never have happened had " i " not trusted

the words of the guru is the point.

July 25, 2009

Nisargadatta , " douglasmitch1963 " <douglasmitch1963

wrote:

>

> Nisargadatta , " skywhilds " <skywords@> wrote:

> >

> > Nisargadatta , " douglasmitch1963 " <douglasmitch1963@>

wrote:

> > >

> > > Nisargadatta , " roberibus111 " <Roberibus111@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Nisargadatta , " skywhilds " <skywords@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Nisargadatta , " douglasmitch1963 "

<douglasmitch1963@> wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Nisargadatta , " skywhilds " <skywords@> wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " skywhilds " <skywords@>

wrote:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " Tim G. " <fewtch@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " skywhilds " <skywords@>

wrote:

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Yes, I've asked myself precisely those questions.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > And I've COMPLETELY changed from believing in

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > " no freedom, hence, compassion. "

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > To " absolute freedom, hence no need for compassion "

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > There is no need for anything... but compassion arises,

anyway.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > One cannot but tend toward compassion toward another, when

that other is oneself.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Yes, AND

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > There are choices made

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Decisions change things

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > The will has an effect

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > One can resist one's Self

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > and

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > There is the freedom to be utterly

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Demonic, destructive, idiotic, trivial

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Negative and UNFREE for it's own sake:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Merely to be free to be unfree

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > and (for me, this is the BEST NEWS)

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > One CAN

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Consciously and deliberately decide to willfully:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Truly be blissfully happy, loving, compassionate

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Most Freely in the Now

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Most Gleefully in the Know

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > (without ANY prerequisites, processes, etc.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > the idea of " not this without that, not that without this, "

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > is pure suffering, spiritually. Science is NOT exactly

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > poetry/spirit/feeling and poetry/spirit/feeling is NOT

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > exactly science. To equate the two realms is suffering.)

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > In " I AM That " Nisargadatta said, " I do not need to make an effort;

the deed follows the thought, without delay and friction. I have also found

that thoughts become self-fulfilling; things would fall into place smoothly and

rightly. The main change was in the mind; it became motionless and silent,

responding quickly, but not perpetuating the response. Spontaneity became a way

of life, the real became natural and the natural became real. And above all,

infinite affection, love, dark and quiet, radiating in all directions, embracing

all, making all interesting and beautiful, significant and auspicious. "

> > > > >

> > > > > BEAUTIFUL!

> > > > >

> > > >

> > > > smoooooooooooooooth eh pancho?

> > > >

> > > > just like you'd like it to be.

> > > >

> > > > it's not.

> > > >

> > > > it's just words on a page like words in a bible.

> > > >

> > > > the believers in both kinds of nonsense..

> > > >

> > > > are believers because they just want to..

> > > >

> > > > or have to....... believe.

> > > >

> > > > it's the only way they can live with themselves..

> > > >

> > > > and their hollow lives.

> > > >

> > > > it's an " excuse " little cisco.

> > > >

> > > > .b b.b.

> > > >

> > >

> > > It boils down to whether or not you trust the words of the guru - the Self

as manifested as Nisargadatta.

> > >

> >

> > I don't get it, that you'd say that!

> >

> > Your quote is awesome but I was also assuming! that

> >

> > You yourself were having the same experience as Nis.

> >

> > For me, " it all boils down " to my own personal experience:

> >

> > My trusting my own experience:

> >

> > I would never trust another's experience, ever..

> >

> > Until it was also, PRIMARILY, my own.

> >

> > Still, I think you're probably on the

> >

> > " Right track, "

> >

> > (whatever that means...hope I don't sound too presumptuous)

> >

>

> My own experience would quite possibly never have happened had " i " not trusted

the words of the guru is the point.

>

That clears up my confusion: perfect!

July 25, 2009

Nisargadatta , " skywhilds " <skywords wrote:

>

> Nisargadatta , " douglasmitch1963 " <douglasmitch1963@>

wrote:

> >

> > Nisargadatta , " skywhilds " <skywords@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Nisargadatta , " douglasmitch1963 "

<douglasmitch1963@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Nisargadatta , " roberibus111 " <Roberibus111@>

wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Nisargadatta , " skywhilds " <skywords@> wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Nisargadatta , " douglasmitch1963 "

<douglasmitch1963@> wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " skywhilds " <skywords@>

wrote:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " skywhilds " <skywords@>

wrote:

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " Tim G. " <fewtch@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " skywhilds " <skywords@>

wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Yes, I've asked myself precisely those questions.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > And I've COMPLETELY changed from believing in

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > " no freedom, hence, compassion. "

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > To " absolute freedom, hence no need for compassion "

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > There is no need for anything... but compassion arises,

anyway.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > One cannot but tend toward compassion toward another, when

that other is oneself.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Yes, AND

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > There are choices made

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Decisions change things

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > The will has an effect

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > One can resist one's Self

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > and

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > There is the freedom to be utterly

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Demonic, destructive, idiotic, trivial

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Negative and UNFREE for it's own sake:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Merely to be free to be unfree

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > and (for me, this is the BEST NEWS)

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > One CAN

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Consciously and deliberately decide to willfully:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Truly be blissfully happy, loving, compassionate

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Most Freely in the Now

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Most Gleefully in the Know

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > (without ANY prerequisites, processes, etc.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > the idea of " not this without that, not that without this, "

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > is pure suffering, spiritually. Science is NOT exactly

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > poetry/spirit/feeling and poetry/spirit/feeling is NOT

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > exactly science. To equate the two realms is suffering.)

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > In " I AM That " Nisargadatta said, " I do not need to make an

effort; the deed follows the thought, without delay and friction. I have also

found that thoughts become self-fulfilling; things would fall into place

smoothly and rightly. The main change was in the mind; it became motionless and

silent, responding quickly, but not perpetuating the response. Spontaneity

became a way of life, the real became natural and the natural became real. And

above all, infinite affection, love, dark and quiet, radiating in all

directions, embracing all, making all interesting and beautiful, significant and

auspicious. "

> > > > > >

> > > > > > BEAUTIFUL!

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > smoooooooooooooooth eh pancho?

> > > > >

> > > > > just like you'd like it to be.

> > > > >

> > > > > it's not.

> > > > >

> > > > > it's just words on a page like words in a bible.

> > > > >

> > > > > the believers in both kinds of nonsense..

> > > > >

> > > > > are believers because they just want to..

> > > > >

> > > > > or have to....... believe.

> > > > >

> > > > > it's the only way they can live with themselves..

> > > > >

> > > > > and their hollow lives.

> > > > >

> > > > > it's an " excuse " little cisco.

> > > > >

> > > > > .b b.b.

> > > > >

> > > >

> > > > It boils down to whether or not you trust the words of the guru - the

Self as manifested as Nisargadatta.

> > > >

> > >

> > > I don't get it, that you'd say that!

> > >

> > > Your quote is awesome but I was also assuming! that

> > >

> > > You yourself were having the same experience as Nis.

> > >

> > > For me, " it all boils down " to my own personal experience:

> > >

> > > My trusting my own experience:

> > >

> > > I would never trust another's experience, ever..

> > >

> > > Until it was also, PRIMARILY, my own.

> > >

> > > Still, I think you're probably on the

> > >

> > > " Right track, "

> > >

> > > (whatever that means...hope I don't sound too presumptuous)

> > >

> >

> > My own experience would quite possibly never have happened had " i " not

trusted the words of the guru is the point.

> >

>

> That clears up my confusion: perfect!

>

Have you ever had the experience but not your own words to relate it? That is

why I refer to the guru's words and not my own.

July 25, 2009