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Can one fall from the brahmajyoti?

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Sri Jiva Gosvami has said that the devotees of Lord Krsna are always transcendental to all the modes of material nature; when they feel dizziness or go to sleep, they are not considered to be sleeping under the modes of nature, but are accepted as being in a trance of devotional service.

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:kick:

 

 

 

No use continuing debating how we ended up in this dream (nightmare). Our immediate need to find shelter from samsara.

 

 

Please read the crow and tal fruit logic letter from Srila Prabhupada on this topic. I'll bring it to the top for you Ramana dasi.

 

 

Hare Krishna

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swami prabhupada told his followers it was a topic too hard to understand

 

other acharyas said it is something you can understand - krishnas devotees never come under the influence of illusion, even when they are sleeping

 

bhaktirasamrtasindhu says the souls in goloka are of two kinds. sadhana siddhas and nitya sidhas

 

nityasiddhas have been in goloka forever. sadhana siddhas start off in santa rasa in the light of brahman

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I accept my position as a nitya-baddha soul (as suggested by Srila Bhaktivinoda) for one esoteric reason in relation to bhajan: The nitya-siddha realm (Goloka and all that it entails) is my worshipable object (even the trees and grass). I follow the teaching of Srila Bhaktisiddhanta and worship from a distance that perfect land. Not rushing in and trampling. Not considering myself nitya-siddha (but instead a follower of a nitya-siddha ). This is the fine nuance of Gaura Tattva that mercy has given the nitya-baddha souls of the the tatashta shakti. Such a position of worship is glorious for the nitya-baddha jiva, and will raise such to the fulfillment of her pure heart.

 

Why, because from such a position we can feel the intense ecstatcy of Sri Radha and her maidens. We can receive that grace because we have taken the correct position of deep humility. Servant of the servant of the servant of the servant....

 

If I did consider myself a nitya-siddha in that realm sleeping (and dreaming this ghastly dream), my bhajan would be tainted with two flaws. One, the siddha-deha would be colored with maya. Two, the unique esoteric bhava would be lost as I would be identifying myself as the worshipable object (nitya-siddha) (and that object would hence be corruptible). This is a fine nuance and secret of bhajan in the lineage I follow.

Hopefully in good faith for me to Jeffster (in need of association, and reading material from others to grow). I never want to tear down anyone's faith by my contribution- therefore am really hesitant about entering this debate. And continually questioning myself if I am doing the right thing (in regards to this topic).

 

All that I am asking listeners, is to use great discernment when considering this 'subconscious nitya-siddha dreaming philosophy'. And always use discernment when reading my posts. As you say Jeff, I am not fully realized either and prone to make error.

 

Sorry. Every move I make commits offence (even if just on a subtle level). The most important thing is the other, and to never hurt them. That is a sadhana that must be cultivated more.

Thanks for your postings. I don't think you have anything to be apologetic for. Your quest is a noble one, pujala raga patha gaurava bhange.

There are a couple things re: Sarvah's ideology which I would like bring attention to... The material world is a dream, Vaikuntha and Goloka exist within Brahmajyoti, once we attain to spiritual realization everything becomes sacred.

It is found in numerous places that the material world is a reality, not a dream. It is like a dream in that you can wake up from it's illusionary effect but this plane is a reality. There are three general aspects of Krsna's Potency, that being Antaranga, Tatastha, and Bahiranga (the material energy). Vaikuntha/Goloka are real and exist separate from the Brahmajyoti. The Brahmajyoti is not the causative of Vaikuntha/Goloka. The last one is arguably the most dangerously misinterpreted perception in which, upon enlightment, everything becomes spiritual. This can be used as a last leverage for attachment to the mundane. It is long after we realize what exactly the illusion of Maya is and what spirituality isn't, that spirituality pervades our existence, not that we are pervaded first then realize. Lets not forget the stages and remember our true adhikara. Let us banish exploitation from our hearts and see everything as being for Him. Hare Krsna

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In Srimad Bhagavatam, purport of 3.26.7 Srila Prabhupada states - <?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:" /><o:p></o:p>

Srila Prabhupada – “Whatever the material energy dictates, the conditioned soul does. He has no responsibility. He is simply the witness of the actions, he is forced to act that way due to his offence in his eternal relationship with Krsna.” <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

And what is that original offence? <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

The answer is giving up the Lord’s service. <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

In Srimad Bhagavatam, 5.14.1, Prabhupada states in the purport - <o:p></o:p>

Srila Prabhupada – “When the pure soul wants to give up the Lord’s service to enjoy the material world, Krsna certainly gives him a chance to enter the material world.”<o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

In Tokyo on April 20, 1972 Prabhupada stated – <o:p></o:p>

Srila Prabhupada – “He has fallen means he has given up the service of Krsna.” <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

Giving up the service to Sri Krsna is due to freewill which leads to more forgetfulness due to the choices one makes due to that free will. <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

There are other aspects of freewill, but giving up service means giving up our love to Krsna, or we want to serve in another way that is not compatible in the spiritual world. <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

Krsna does not force you to love Him. You have to desire it willingly and that is the topmost use of freewill, this is what freewill means, to voluntarily serve Krsna. The living entity is given that ‘choice’ because without it, there is no meaning to individuality or being a marginal living being. <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

The other angle is that by misusing our freewill we make the wrong decision and Maya immediately covers us AFTER the living entity chooses to manufacture their existence without Krishna. <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

Freewill is perfect and imperfect and yes it is an inconceivable truth (Acintya Tattva) It is perfect in the aspect of allowing one to freely choose to endlessly increasingly serve and it is imperfect and not suitable for Goloka when we choose to ignore Krsna. This is one reason why the Lord creates the Mahat-tattva (material creation)<o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

The perfect aspect of this imperfection of the jiva is that you can go back to serve Krsna again. Srimad Bhagavatam 6.11.25 confirms this - <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

“Oh my Lord, O Supreme Personality of Godhead, will I again be able to be a servant of Your eternal servants who find shelter at Your lotus feet? Oh Lord of my life, may I again become their servant so that my mind may always engage in the loving service of Your Lordship.” <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

Twice Srila Prabhupada uses the word bhuyah (again), stressing the point. <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

When the jivas misuse freewill in Goloka, Vaikuntha it is not like a case of newly transformed envious jivas hanging around. They are instantly covered and ousted from the Lord’s realm. <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

Bhaktisiddhanta Thakura’s purport to text 44 of Brahma Samhita states – <o:p></o:p>

“When he forgets his service of Krsna he is at once deflected by the attracting power of Maya in this world.” <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

On a morning walk in Vrndavana, 9-13-75 Prabhupada said: “He has given you little freedom’ you can use it. Yathecchasi tathaa kuru, Krsna says in Gita (18.63), ‘Whatever you like you do.” <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

Some devotees seem to think that this discussion of the “Fall, no fall of the Jiva” started after Prabhupada’s disappearance but that is not a fact. <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

In the early 1972, Madhudvisa had to deal with the issue in Australia while travelling around preaching on a Double Decker travelling Temple that I was also personally on and the Crow and Tal Fruit Logic letter is a result of that exchange with devotees who thought we came from the Brahmajyoti. The letter has typed parts, Prabhupada also added his own handwritten notes, and he signed the letter by hand. Madhudvisa has the letter. <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

In the early 1970’s, Siddhasvarupananda Swami was preaching that the jivas came from the Brahmajyoti and Srila Prabhupada told him not to preach that in his temples. <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

In a letter to Caturbhuja Dasa, L.A., 5-9-73, Prabhupada wrote him - <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

Srila Prabhupada – “Your last question ‘How is the soul degraded (by lust, anger and greed) when it is transcendental to the body? <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

Srila Prabhupada – “Doesn’t that imply that the soul has changed? ‘No. The soul never changes, but due to his tinyness, he may become forgetful of his relationship with Krsna”. <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

Srila Prabhupada – “The spiritual quality of the spiritual spark has not changed but he has forgotten his spiritual nature, bewildered by the imperfect desire to become equal or greater than Krsna.” <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

Most of the verses from Brahma Vaivarta Purana are showing how a jiva can go to Vaikuntha or Goloka but unless one’s devotion is FULLY developed he will fall back to this material world due to lack of chit (knowledge) strength. <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

Nevertheless, eventually he/she will return and stay permanently in Vaikuntha/Goloka, regaining his/hers authentic svarupa bodily identity that is actually permanently there in Goloka even if one forgets this fact. <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

Such comments seem inconceivable, but are they? Actually they are easily understood when one ‘realizes, by dent of bhakti, what the eternal present actually means’. In other words, our perpetual body is permanently locked, protected, and secured in the eternal present because there is no portal of past or future for it to ever leave. Therefore if there id fall down, it is only consciously via ones thoughts, imaginings and dreams, never as ones original body.<o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

Now that wasn’t too difficult to understand was it? <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

Those verses in shastra that state that one does not fall from Vaikuntha are referring either to jivas who fell originally and are now reinstated, and generally won’t fall again or to those jivas who never fell to begin with. <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

Bhaktisiddhanta Thakur clarifies the point in Sri Caitanya’s Teachings, p. 101 <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

“The position of the jiva IS a part of the tatastha-sakti that can enjoy, cease to enjoy, and go back to his original position”. <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

And Srila Prabhupada says in a similar vein on a morning walk: <o:p></o:p>

Paramahamsa - So we can come to the spiritual world and return? <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

Prabhupada - Yes.<o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

Paramahamsa - Falldown?<o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

Prabhupada - Yes…. He goes out of his free will; again comes out, again goes. Like that. (Cheviot Hills Golf Course-5-13-73, L.A.) <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

Srila Prabhupada stressed the verse: Mahaajano yena gatah sa panthaa - one must follow in the footsteps of the Mahajanas <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

Mahabhaarata, Vana Parva, 313.117. And who is speaking these verses from Brahma Vaivarta Purana? <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

They happen to be Mahajanas. <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

Narayana Rsi is talking to Narada Rsi about what Yamaraj spoke to Savitri (Mother of the vedas). Brahma also joins in later. So, their statements carry weight. <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

So, for our Brahma-Vadi friends (no fall avedis) what will they do now? Maybe demonise these verses as Apa siddhantic or of the Kuyogi Sampradaya? <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

Or belittle the slokas as simply words to encourage the pious to do Punyas? <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

Or try to emphasize that these verses are fanciful imagination? Then better yet they may try to minimize these verses as secondary evidence or not authentic or as interpolations? Any way you want to cut it, there is disagreement on this point and the Patanam Slokas, will stand their ground, and support Srila Prabhupada that jivas can fall (patanam) from Vaikuntha/Goloka. <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

So how can apparently contradictory statements be reconciled? Jiva Goswami explains in his Krsna Sandarbha 152.9 that Vedanta Sutra states – <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

“If there are two contradictory statements in scripture, the first statement should be interpreted so that it does not contradict the later statement.” <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

So the way to employ this understanding of Jiva Goswami means that for us, the Fallvadis (as the Brahmavadis call us) we accept both ideas i.e. coming from Brahman and coming from Vaikuntha/Goloka. <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

The jivas coming from Brahman are those jivas who did not get liberated in Brahma’s lifetime and entered the body of Maha-Vishnu. So, when they reappear when Maha-Vishnu begins to expand universes again that occurrence is an origin because it is over a time period of trillions and trillions of years, which is like eternity. <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

That origin is what the Upanishads describe. <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

We accept the understanding that the jivas that have left their service in Vaikuntha/Goloka, due to free will, come here to the material world. <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

In all of this discussion one important point to understand is that to Krsna, in Krsna’s transcendental time, or reckoning, we are here in this material world for one or two seconds (NOT EVEN THAT BECAUSE NOTHING IS SEEN AS MISSING WITHIN THE ‘ETERNAL PRESENT)’. <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

How is this? <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

Again, in Brahma Vaivarta Purana, Krsna Janma Khanda, chapter 25, verse 98-99 it is stated that <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

“ Brahma dies when Krsna winks”. <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

So, if a jiva stays in a universe for the life of Lord Brahma, which is trillions of years, and then goes back to Goloka, then in Goloka, it is only an insignificant moment. <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

So, in real Transcendental Time (The eternal present that has no past and future as we understand it in the material perishable world) we are here for a very, very short time. <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

And to put the icing on the cake we will let Srila Prabhupada have the last word on the topic quoting Srimad Bhagavatam. <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

According to Jiva Goswami in the Tattva Sandarbha the Srimad Bhagavatam is the highest sastra and the most perfect of all evidence. <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

So, lets hear the verse, as a pure devotee understands it. <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

In Bhagavad Gita 6.47 Srila Prabhupada states in the purport: <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

Srila Prabhupada – “Every living entity is of the Supreme Personality of Godhead, and thus every living entity is intended to serve the Supreme Lord by his own constitution. Failing to do this, he falls down. <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

The Bhagavatam (11.5.3) confirms this as follows: <o:p></o:p>

Srila Prabhupada – “Anyone who does not render service and neglects his duty unto the primeval lord, who is the source of all living entities will certainly fall down from his constitutional position.” <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

A Bhagavad-Gita lecture that was given by Srila Prabhupada on 2-21-69, in L.A. (Collected Lectures on Bhagavad-Gita As It Is, Volume 5, pp. 6-7),<o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

Srila Prabhupada quotes the same Bhagavatam verse 11.5.3. He then gives this commentary, which throws even more light on it making it clearer – <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

Srila Prabhupada – “The Bhagavat says that we are all parts and parcels of the Supreme. If we do not serve the Supreme, then we fall down from our specified place. What is that? <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

Srila Prabhupada – “If the part and parcel cannot render service regularly, that means it is painful. So any person who is not rendering service to the Supreme Lord, he’s simply giving pain to the Supreme Lord. <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

Srila Prabhupada – “He’s simply giving trouble. Therefore, he has to suffer…. The same example, Sthanad bhrastah patanty adhah. And as soon as one thing is very painful, just like the government keeps all these painful citizens into a prison house. Collect together. ‘You live here, you are nonsense, you criminals live here. Don’t live in the open state.’ <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

Srila Prabhupada – “Similarly, all these criminals who have violated the laws of God, who have simply given pain to the Lord, they are put in this material world. <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

Srila Prabhupada – “And, sthanad bhrastah, he falls down from the specified place….So we have fallen down. Being against the principles of God consciousness, we are fallen down. So if we want to revive our original position, we must be placed again in that service attitude.<o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

Srila Prabhupada – “The best thing is to revive our original Krsna consciousness and be engaged in the service of the Lord. That is the natural life and that is possible in the spiritual sky or the Goloka Vrndavana.” <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

At the end of the lecture a question was asked: “Why are you teaching about Krsna Consciousness? <o:p></o:p>

Srila Prabhupada – “Because you have forgotten the service of Radha and Krsna, therefore you have become the servant of Maya.’” <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

So, in conclusion the Mahajanas have talked about agatya patanam, falling from Vaikuntha/Goloka. Vyasadeva, who compiled the Puranas, has presented slokas about patanam (falldown)<o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

So has Bhaktivinode Thakura and Bhaktisiddhanta Thakura mentioned fall and no fall of the jiva.

 

Srila Prabhupada has quoted Srimad Bhagavatam to stress the point about freewill causing the jiva to fall, so one cannot say that ISKCON devotees are the only ones who have spoken of the fall of the jiva from Vaikuntha and Goloka.

The eternal present is just that, eternally present. This means within that realm of 'eternal present', time is transcendental, beyond our material mundane perceptional senses and especially beyond the material or biological mind. <o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

CONCLUSION FOR THEIST

 

In other words past, present and future in Goloka of Krsnas pastimes IS eternally in the 'present', where there is no past or future as we know it in the mahat-tattva or the temporary MATERIAL dream creation of Maha Vishnu

 

The eternal present corresponds with an impersishable state.

 

While past, present and future of the mahat-tattva corresponds with a perishable creation with multiple divisions of time (past , present and future) spread out through the heavenly, middle and hellish worlds within Maha-Vishnu's dream creation.

 

Also, regardless of what some may believe, ANY jiva tattva can fall down from Goloka, but as Prabhupada says, most CHOOSE not to come.

 

This free will is important to understand, it's what makes us an independant marginal living entity.

 

There are only two kinds of living entities - Vishnu tattva and jiva tattva and both originate in Goloka or Krsnaloka and NOT the impersonal Brahmajyoti that if reached, is already a fallen state of individual consciousness.

 

Futhermore, one can only fall to the impersonal Brahman or Brahmajyoti as Prabhupada has clearly said, it is nonsense to believe we originate from there, such an idea is impersonalism

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The eternal present is just that, eternally present. This means within that realm of 'eternal present', time is transcendental, beyond our material mundane perceptional senses and especially beyond the material or biological mind. <?xml:namespace prefix = o /><o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

CONCLUSION FOR THEIST

 

In other words past, present and future in Goloka of Krsnas pastimes IS eternally in the 'present', where there is no past or future as we know it in the mahat-tattva or the temporary MATERIAL dream creation of Maha Vishnu

 

The eternal present corresponds with an impersishable state.

 

While past, present and future of the mahat-tattva corresponds with a perishable creation with multiple divisions of time (past , present and future) spread out through the heavenly, middle and hellish worlds within Maha-Vishnu's dream creation.

 

Also, regardless of what some may believe, ANY jiva tattva can fall down from Goloka, but as Prabhupada says, most CHOOSE not to come.

 

This free will is important to understand, it's what makes us an independant marginal living entity.

 

There are only two kinds of living entities - Vishnu tattva and jiva tattva and both originate in Goloka or Krsnaloka and NOT the impersonal Brahmajyoti that if reached, is already a fallen state of individual consciousness.

 

Futhermore, one can only fall to the impersonal Brahman or Brahmajyoti as Prabhupada has clearly said, it is nonsense to believe we originate from there, such an idea is impersonalism

 

Why can`t we be like Narada Muni who is always excused each time he falls?

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The Physical Universe (Mahat Tattva) is Real, but Temporary<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:" /><o:p></o:p>

 

 

All marginal living entities in Vaikuntha can project a holographic version of the sub-conscious self that is a real feature of their jiva tattva individual personality and physic.

 

This inferior lower self is known as the nitya-baddha consciousness. When one desires to forget Krishna and the svarupa body they serve Krishna as in Goloka, they can enter the dreams of Maha-Vishnu within His mahat tattva creation as this nitya-baddha echo of the self.

<o:p></o:p>

This secondary self or baddha-jiva consciousness, activated by free will and the desire to forget Krishna, is a living real holographic counterfeit projection of the marginal living entity that enables one to enter the mahat-tattva without their real nitya-siddha body leaving Goloka or Vaikuntha. <o:p></o:p>

 

It is there in the mahat-tattva, that is a real reality but temporary, the living entity, manifesting as their secondary jiva projected consciousness, attempts to fulfil their mistaken dreams to achieve anything they want. Such material facilities are provided by Maha Vishnu and simultaneously gained and created by their own material desires.

<o:p></o:p>

Srila Prabhupada - "This material creation is the spirit soul's dream, all existence in this world is the dream of Maha-Vishnu. The real, factual platform is the spiritual world, but when the spirit soul wants to imitate the Supreme Personality of Godhead, he is put into this dreamland of material creation." (Srimad Bhagavatam 4.29.83)

<o:p></o:p>

Srila Prabhupada - “Everything happening within time, which consists of past, present and future, is merely a dream. This is the secret in understanding in all the Vedic literature.” (Srimad Bhagavatam 4.29.2b)

<o:p></o:p>

Srila Prabhupada is saying that our original and perpetual state of being an eternal nitya-siddha bodily servant of Krishna means one never falls down, that is, their nitya-siddha body never leaves Goloka. However, he also tells us that the memory of being nitya-siddha can be covered over or forgotten by the choice to imagine your own existence without Krishna.

 

This is just like dreaming in our present material body where we dream, or think we are King of a world, but actually our material body has not moved. <o:p></o:p>

In this way Srila Prabhupada is saying that our nitya-siddha or svarupa body can be covered over only and the memory of being nitya-siddha forgotten, like one forgets their material body while dreaming.

<o:p></o:p>

In this way, our present baddha jiva mundane consciousness dream state enters material vessels due to our thoughts of material desires and our imagination to be master instead of servant.

 

Due to such selfish desires manifested by our free will to choose, our awareness of reality within Goloka is transferred to temporary reality of the mahat-tattva cloud, or the physical universe of virtual reality.

<o:p></o:p>

It is there, within the dreams of Maha Vishnu, one may remain trapped in their own psychosis within that virtual reality dream state, as depicted in the movie 'The Matrix,' for a very, very, very, very, very long duration, therefore many creations within the mahat-tattva are coming and going. <o:p></o:p>

 

Srila Prabhupada - “Due to this long period of time, it is sometimes said that we are ever conditioned. But this long duration of time becomes very insignificant when one actually wakes up from the material dream and comes to Krishna consciousness”.

<o:p></o:p>

When that happens, one wakes up from their nitya-baddha condition and realizes their nitya-siddha body and that they were with Krishna all along. <o:p></o:p>

What does the word 'real' mean?

<o:p></o:p>

In Goloka-Vrndavana/Vaikuntha, the actions, thoughts and dreams of the marginal living entity are ALL REAL, are all on the same level of a reality that exists eternally in God's Kingdom in a perpetual atmosphere devoid of past, future and impermanence.

<o:p></o:p>

So, what is the difference between what is REAL in Goloka and what is REAL in the material creation known as the mahat tattva?

<o:p></o:p>

The answer is, there is NO difference in the meaning of word reality in both places because both creations are real solid realities devoid of apparitions to those who have true Knowledge.

<o:p></o:p>

In other words, they are both the same within the criteria of the word real however, one reality (Goloka) is imperishable situated within the eternal present mode of eternal loving bhakti, while the other reality (maha tattva) is also real but is perishable, exists for sometime then fades to be as if it never was.

<o:p></o:p>

The highest and natural expression of the marginal living entity is realizing their full potential as their perpetual nitya-siddha-svarupa devotional body, as already explained. This state is also the full potential of the word 'REAL'.

<o:p></o:p>

This is hard for us to understand from our present dimensional platform of consciousness that is trapped in the mahat-tattva because we are governed by the divided eternal presents that manifests as past, present, future, which causes the reaction of decay and forgetfulness.

<o:p></o:p>

By foolishly desiring to ignore God and the perpetual body one REALLY is in Goloka in their full potential, we are restricted to our secondary dream state conscious REALITY (nitya-baddha) that is constrained to the laws of the mahat-tattva or material creation.

<o:p></o:p>

On the absolute level every dream and thought is as real as ones deeds.

<o:p></o:p>

Even in the heavenly planets within the mahat-tattva, where the nitya-baddha dream state is confined to an ethereal body in a sub-space dimension of the mahat-tattva, one's thoughts and deeds are on an equal footing.

<o:p></o:p>

The heavenly realm or atmosphere is completely different from our secular condition on this gross material planet, where the ethereal or subtle body that houses the baddha jiva consciousness is further restricted and restrained by a biological vessel.

<o:p></o:p>

However, both the secular world of biological bodies and the subtle bodies of ghost or ethereal vessels IN THE MATERIAL WORLD are also REAL. But it must be understood that that reality created by the baddha jiva contained in those ethereal and biological vessels, fades away or perishes.

<o:p></o:p>

The full potential of what is REAL, of what is REALITY is that it is imperishable, and never fades away, which means it is always in the perpetual state of originality.

<o:p></o:p>

So how are we to understand that our dreams on the absolute level are also real and transmitted as the nitya-baddha conscious state to the material creation?

 

Now we cannot compare the dreams we have in our material body that are illusion, with the dreams we have in our pure state initiated by free will and choice.

<o:p></o:p>

Nitya-siddha is when we are in our natural pure state of REALITY, eternally liberated in Goloka, serving God or Krishna. <o:p></o:p>

 

Nitya-baddha state is when we are in our unnatural impure state of TRANSITORY REALITY eternally conditioned in the mahat tattva, serving one's selfish interests, unaware of their PERMANENTLY REAL nitya-siddha authentic self in Goloka.

<o:p></o:p>

The original and eternal position of all living individuals, known as the marginal living entities, is their perpetual rasa (devotional mood) nitya-siddha-svarupa body that is eternally serving Krishna in the ‘eternal present’ where there is no past or future, as previously explained.

<o:p></o:p>

This means there is also no decay, impermanence birth, disease, old age, death and forgetfulness in the perpetual REALITY Kingdom of God known as Goloka-Vrndavana and the Vaikuntha planets.

<o:p></o:p>

If we are to correctly understand that we all originate from Goloka-Vrndavana/Vaikuntha, such realizations are only possible by the mercy of Srila Prabhupada, and without his mercy one will never understand. Everything Srila Prabhupada said and wrote must be understood in the context of His books, lectures, morning walks, and classes.

<o:p></o:p>

This is the correct way to appreciate the criteria of guru, sadhu, and shastra. All interpretations of his teachings that fail these criteria of guru, sadu and shastra are to be considered bogus; therefore everything in this book is based very clearly on the teachings of His Divine Grace A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami.

<o:p></o:p>

Lord Krishna or the Supreme Personality of Godhead is always the absolute truth with an all-attractive Vigraha or Bodily Form yet is also simultaneously everywhere personally and impersonally within His creation.

<o:p></o:p>

Krishna is always as His beautiful Syamasundara form that never vacates from His Goloka-Vrndavana central abode, yet is simultaneously manifested as unlimited four-armed Vishnu Forms throughout the Vaikuntha planets. Both these abodes are the perpetual Kingdom of Krishna that exists in the eternal present devoid of past and future, as the Brahma Samhita tells us.

<o:p></o:p>

Vishnu and Lakshmi in the Vaikunthas where their devotees are in the mood of servitorship, and Radha Krishna in Goloka-Vrndavana where Krishnas mood is more intimate with His devotees in the disposition of friendship and conjugal love.

<o:p></o:p>

Even though Krishna is eternally in His central Goloka-Vrndavana Planet that resembles a lotus flower as shown above, He also resides as Vishnu in the surrounding Vaikuntha Planets.

<o:p></o:p>

Krishna further expands Himself from His Sankarsana or Balarama bodily form to the sleeping Maha-Vishnu form who builds His own abode in one corner of the Spiritual Sky, as shown above that is called the mahat-tattva or material creation.

<o:p></o:p>

Maha-Vishnu is never affected by this dark cloud OF TEMPORARY OR FADING REALITY He has constructed in His corner of the Spiritual Sky (shown above) that exists in a completely different dimensional phenomenon of time and space than the Vaikuntha planets.

<o:p></o:p>

In His mahat-tattva (jada-jagat- lifeless world) there is also eternal time however, it is divided by past, present and future which has the by-product phenomenon of impermanence, decay birth and death that does not exist in the perpetual ‘present’ in Goloka-Vrndavana or Vaikuntha (cid-jagat) which makes up the majority of the Spiritual Sky or Brahmajyoti.

<o:p></o:p>

The original and eternal position of all living individuals, known as the marginal living entities is their perpetual rasa (devotional mood) nitya-siddha-svarupa body, that is eternally serving Krishna in the ‘eternal present’ where there is no past or future, as previously explained. <o:p></o:p>

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hare krishna,

i am sorry, ido not know if there is fall from brahmajyoti. But please answer me where you managed to find brahmajyoti.

 

I found it on a two-way street, but lost it on a lonely highway.:crazy2:

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