suchandra 1 Report post Posted August 16, 2007 http://www.sivaramaswami.com/?p=1663 Misunderstandings on the change of asramas have caused chaos in devotees’ lives. The true meaning of brahmacari. A spiritual institution doesn’t exist to fulfil the individual natures and inclinations of those who would join it. Dependency on the institution means acknowledgement of the limit of engagements, and serving according to those needs. A dharmic life will lead to success. Brahmacari means subjugating independence. HH Shivarama swami says in this lecture that brahmacari means to live in a temple and only performing activities ordered by the temple authorities. "As soon a brahmacari does something independent, he's no longer brahmacari but in the waiting line of becoming grhastha." Somehow it seems that Vaishnavas like Bhismadeva are no longer considered as brahmacari by present ISKCON leaders? At least Lord Sri Krishna didnt consider Bhismadeva as pseudo brahmacari like present ISKCON does. Prabhupada, London, August 16, 1973: Bhismadeva is the first-grade brahmachari in the universe. He promised to Satyavati's father... You know the story. Satyavati's father... His, Bhismadeva's father was attracted by a fisherwoman, fishergirl. So he wanted to marry. And the father of the girl denied, "No, I cannot give my daughter to you." So "Why? I am king, I am asking your daughter.No, you have got a son." Bhismadeva was the son of his first wife, mother Ganges. The mother Ganges was wife of Santanu Maharaja, and Bhismadeva was the only remaining son. The contract was between Santanu Maharaja and Ganges, Mother Ganges, that "I can marry you if you allow me that all the children born I shall throw in the water of the Ganges. And if you do not allow me, then immediately I shall leave your company." So Santanu Maharaja said, "All right, still, I shall marry you." So she was throwing all the children in the Ganges. So this Bhismadeva... So after all, father, so he became very much sorry, that "What is this? What kind of wife I have got? She is simply throwing all the children in the water." So at the time of Bhismadeva, Santanu Maharaja said, "No, I cannot allow it. I cannot allow it." Then mother Ganges said, "Then I am going.Yes, you can go, I don't want you. I want this son." So he was wifeless. Again he wanted to marry the Satyavati. So the father said, "No, I cannot give my daughter to you because you have got a son, grown-up son. He will be king. So I cannot give my daughter to you to become your maidservant. Her... If I would have thought that her son would be the king, then I can offer you my daughter." So he said, "No, that is not possible." But Bhismadeva understood that "My father is attracted with this girl." So he approached. He said to the fisherman that "You can offer your daughter to my father, but you are thinking that I shall become king. So your daughter's son will be king. On this condition you can offer your daughter." So he replied, "No, I cannot.Why?You may not be king, but your son may be king." Just see, this material calculation. Then at that time he said, "No, I shall not marry. That's all. I promise. I shall not marry." So he remained brahmachari. Therefore his name is Bhisma. Bhisma means very solid, firmly fixed. So he was a brahmachari. For the sake, for the satisfaction of his father's senses, he remained brahmachari. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guruvani 0 Report post Posted August 16, 2007 [url="http://www.sivaramaswami.com/?p=1663"]HH Shivarama swami says in this lecture that brahmacari means to live in a temple and only performing activities ordered by the temple authorities. "As soon a brahmacari does something independent, he's no longer brahmacari but in the waiting line of becoming grhastha." The solution is that the brahmacary should take sannyasa and be independent, have bank accounts, jet-set around the world and convince people to give him money to support the lifestyle. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
theist 1 Report post Posted August 16, 2007 This is what happens when a person sees the limits of an instituiton as the boundary line of his own experience. If in an authoritative position he will insist that those under him also must live within the same box he has made for himself. Institutional consciousness is very tiny & confining like a prision cell. Krsna consciousness has no limits because Krsna is unlimited and ever expanding. One can become Krsna conscious whle serving in an instituion but the danger is to mistake instituional consciousness for Krsna consciousness. This is noted in the expression "I am a devotee of Iskcon," should be "I am a devotee of Krsna presently serving with Iskcon." Big difference. As big as spiritual realization vs. religion. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
