Humility & learning lessons of life

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Om Gurave Namah

 

Namaste Chandrasekhar ji & Pradeep ji,

 

I recollect writing in my previous e-mails, that the shloka from

Saravali talks about the inner qualities of an

individual/kalapurusha. Does the word "mada" imply intoxication as

an inner quality? Does the word "intoxication" belong in that

context, in that group?

 

I do not think either of you responded to that. perhaps you missed

it out in the avalanche of e-mails:--))

 

Can i have your response(s) please?

 

Regards,

Lakshmi

 

 

, Chandrashekhar

<chandrashekhar46 wrote:

>

> Dear Divine Lakshmi,

>

> Pride is different from ego. Like it or not Mada does mean

intoxication

> or lust. The Kama that is referred to relates to kaamana which

means

> desires for things possessed by others. That is what Asteya, one

of the

> Yamas of Hatha yogas refer to.

>

> We are talking about auspiciousness or other wise of the dormant

or

> awakened Kundalini. As I said all scriptures can be misinterpreted

if

> one wants to do that. But that does not serve any purpose. I would

not

> go into what exactly is meant by Vidya and Avidya related to Maa.

I have

> not yet seen any Pramana, in the form of a shloka, to support your

> proposition that dormant Kundalini is inauspicious and the

awakened

> Kundalini is auspicious so far. I have already posted the way my

> generation has been taught to accept an argument, so I shall not

repeat

> it here.

>

> But I will not resort to conjectures and would like to quote from

> Rudrayamala tantra about the swarUpa of dormant Kundalini. Being

> graduate in sanskrit, I am sure I will not have to translate it

for you.

> Aaxare prdevta Éìjntax> k…{flI devta

> ädhäre paradevatä bhavrajanatädhaù kuëòalé devatä

> devanamixdevta iÇjgtamanNdpuÃiSwta,

> devänämadhidevatä trijagatämänandapuïjasthitä|

> mUlaxarinvaisnI iÇrm[i ya }ainnI mailnI

> mülädhäraniväsiné triramaëé yä jïäniné mäliné

> sa me mat&mnuiSwta k…lpwanNdEkbIjanna.32,21.

> sä me mätåmanusthitä kulapathänandaikabéjänanä||32|21||

>

> I am sure you must have some quote to support your contention. I

would

> like to see the shloka, as against conjectures, so that I can

improve

> upon my knowledge of the swarupaa of Kundalini.

>

> I can understand your reluctance to support your propositions with

> suitable pramanas. I am sorry if I have hurt you by pointing out

the

> inconsistency in the way you treated Surya and Rahu combinations

in two

> different chart as stand out combinations only.

>

> I had no intention to cause any hurt to you and if I have done so

> inadvertently I crave your pardon.

>

> Take care,

>

> Chandrashekhar

>

>

> b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> >

> > Om Gurave Namah

> >

> > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> >

> > The shadripus are kaama (lust), krodha (anger), lobha (greed),

moha

> > (attachment, delusion), mada (pride) and maatsarya (jealousy)

> > If "mada" means "lust" what does "kaama" imply among the

> > shadripus? "Mada" signifies one who is intoxicated/drunk with

> > power/self-grandeur (pride/ego).

> >

> > Mother is known as "Vidya and avidya swaroopini" and correct

> > appreciation of Mother includes understanding of both facets. As

> > Shakti, She respresents raw power which can be routed towards

good

> > deeds as well as bad deeds. Are both ends the same? The wisdom,

> > required to put this immense shakti to good use, is represented

by

> > Shiva, hence the union of Shiva and Parvati, wisdom and power, is

> > said to be auspicious because it ensures the correct/judicious

end

> > use of shakti. Hence the orientation of Shakti is very very

> > important.

> >

> > I always said that Soorya is both sattwik and krura. I also

always

> > said all planets, including Jupiter, can give malefic results, if

> > they are functionally empowered to do so. You can refer to all my

> > previous mails to confirm this.

> >

> > Sir, Truth is much more important than winning or losing an

> > argument. All discussions must proceed as an exploration and

> > celebration of Truth. When this is not the case, I see no

purpose in

> > continuing these discussions.

> >

> > Thanks & Regards,

> > Lakshmi

> >

> >

> > <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > >

> > > Having Icchamrityu and dying at an early age are operating at

> > different

> > > levels. Bhishma had Iccha Mrityu but did not die young. So

please

> > do not

> > > try to mix the issues. If you have read Swamiji's biography you

> > will

> > > find that he fell sick many times despite of apparent robust

> > physique.

> > >

> > > Commenting on Shani in 4th for Rama's chart confirms with his

> > being

> > > capable of giving Vipareeta results. I did not know I was

expected

> > to

> > > analyze the entire chart. By the way if there is a Kuja dosha

how

> > does

> > > that by itself give a Divine wife? Please do not bring our

> > devotion to

> > > Lord Rama (and we both have that) into astrological analysis of

> > his chart.

> > >

> > > Bringing in the dashas when the discussions are on the effects

of

> > grahas

> > > will only lead the discussion to no where. The two have to be

seen

> > > separately as we are not trying to time an event but only

trying

> > to find

> > > what are the effects on bhavas occupied.

> > >

> > > Dear Lakshmi in Ramana Maharshi's chart you have perhaps

forgotten

> > the

> > > saying Kuja vat Ketu. look at the Ketu deha in that perspective

> > and let

> > > me know your views. And if by the way you read my mail, I did

not

> > say

> > > anything about mars being killer for him, only that it gave him

> > Sarcoma

> > > being 3rd lord.

> > >

> > > Also could you explain why Sun being Atma and always

beneficent as

> > you

> > > have claimed all along in the thread on the topic, did its

> > Mahadasha

> > > prove to be Killer to Ramana Maharshi?

> > >

> > > Take care,

> > > Chandrashekhar.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > >

> > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > > For example, remember that in Swami Vivekananda's chart

Surya

> > is

> > > > lord of

> > > > > the 9th occupying the lagna and causing a powerful Raj

yoga. At

> > > > the same

> > > > > time if you thin how long the Swamiji lived, you may have

to

> > think

> > > > again

> > > > > about saying that it did not act as Mahakrura. Think about

> > what it

> > > > did

> > > > > to the 7th bhava of Swamiji, also, before declaring that it

> > became

> > > > > shubha or less malefic.

> > > >

> > > > Lakshmi: I think Swamiji had an icchamrityu and looking at

the

> > dass

> > > > operating on 4th July 1902, I observe that he passed away in

Jup-

> > Ven-

> > > > Jup-Ket-Sat-Sat.

> > > >

> > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > >

> > > > Jup MD: 1893-02-09 (1:35:30 pm) - 1909-02-10 (3:59:13 pm)

> > > > Ven AD: 1900-12-25 (10:03:30 am) - 1903-08-27 (4:48:54 pm)

> > > > Jup PD: 1902-05-02 (1:42:07 pm) - 1902-09-12 (10:43:55 pm)

> > > > Ket SD: 1902-06-29 (9:11:48 am) - 1902-07-07 (5:06:28 am)

> > > > Sat PAD: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-06 (2:29:24 am)

> > > >

> > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > >

> > > > Sat: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-05 (1:27:03 am)

> > > >

> > > > Jupiter is in 2nd house from Moon, Venus is the 2nd lord from

> > Moon

> > > > and is posited in 2nd from lagna, Ketu is in the house of

Venus

> > and

> > > > gives the results of Venus and Saturn is the 2nd lord from

> > > > lagna....all are marakas. the maraka significations are

stronger

> > > > from Moon, and it's the cause of his early death.

> > > >

> > > > I fail to see where Sun comes into all this.

> > > >

> > > > However, I agree that Sun, as AK aspecting 7th house, can

give

> > > > parivraja tendencies. But can you ignore the influence of

Saturn

> > on

> > > > Moon and 4th house, occuring in the 10th house? I am sure

even

> > weak

> > > > Sun would have given him parivraja yoga:--))but without the

raja

> > > > yoga and the strong soul-level impact he created wherever he

> > went.

> > > >

> > > > Or if you like look at what happened to the 7th

> > > > > Bhava of Lord Rama with exalted Mars in the 7th bhava.

> > > >

> > > > Mars in 7th gives kuja dosha, and I think the strong Mars in

7th

> > > > gave him an exalted wife like Sita. You have not commented

on the

> > > > exalted Saturn in 4th house.

> > > >

> > > > In each of the

> > > > > example provided by you look at the bhava that the planets

> > occupy

> > > > > (barring Saturn, for reasons already stated in previous

mail),

> > > > without

> > > > > looking at the charts as belonging to great people, and

then

> > make

> > > > up

> > > > > your mind as to the truth or otherwise of what I said. Did

you

> > > > know

> > > > > Ramana Maharshi died following a malignant sarcoma of left

hand

> > > > and Mars

> > > > > is karaka for the 3rd bhava in 8th in his chart, in

> > exaltation. Do

> > > > you

> > > > > think Mars gave him benevolent results?

> > > >

> > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I also request you to examine the following

dasa

> > > > sequences with an open mind. Sun is the 3rd lord from Moon

(AK) &

> > > > 12th lord from lagna in Sri Ramana's chart, rahu is with Sun

and

> > > > gives Sun'/Saturn's/Jupiter's effects...all of which point to

> > > > dusthanas, Saturn is a maraka in 7th house and ketu can give

the

> > > > effects of Moon/Mercury/mars. Mar's effect, if at all, was

only

> > > > indirect, and he was not the killer.

> > > >

> > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > >

> > > > Sun MD: 1949-02-03 (1:02:22 am) - 1955-02-03 (2:05:32 pm)

> > > > Rah AD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1951-02-21 (8:49:14 am)

> > > > Rah PD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1950-05-18 (12:04:47 am)

> > > > Sat SD: 1950-04-12 (3:37:16 am) - 1950-04-20 (12:18:02 am)

> > > > Ket PAD: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14 (11:08:26 pm)

> > > >

> > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > >

> > > > Ket: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14 (12:47:04 pm)

> > > >

> > > > I think what stands out is the fact that the dasa of the

graha

> > > > conjoined Moon brought about death. I think their mind

willed the

> > > > death.

> > > >

> > > > Can a planet give results in a dasa totally

> > unrelated/unassociated

> > > > with itself? I request you to consider the above objectively.

> > > >

> > > > I will talk about the other charts/issues in my next mail.

> > > >

> > > > Regards,

> > > > Lakshmi

> > > >

> > > > In Paramhans Ramkrishna's chart,

> > > > > I do not know where you find Mars strong as a planet in

> > > > debilitation in

> > > > > Navamsha gives results of debility even when in exaltation

in

> > rasi

> > > > > chart. In case of Saturn Viparitam shane smritam has

already

> > been

> > > > > mentioned by me, in earlier mail.

> > > >

> > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I myself have not considered Mars/Venus in

Thakur's

> > > > chart because they are debilitated. Please go through my

message

> > > > again. I was talking about Saturn and Rahu.

> > > >

> > > > About Shri Aurobindo, I trust you are

> > > > > aware of his revolutionary background and that he was

editor

> > of a

> > > > paper

> > > > > "Vande Mataram" not much known for its soft language.

> > > >

> > > > > Same is the case with strong Malefics giving P.M. Yogas.

Every

> > > > graha is

> > > > > capable of 12 variations of a P.M. Yoga attributed to it,

at

> > the

> > > > very

> > > > > least. It would only be naive to imagine they would all

give

> > > > identical

> > > > > results as indicated by Parashara or all with Pancha

> > Mahapurusha

> > > > Yoga

> > > > > would only rule over different parts of India (barring

Saturn),

> > > > just

> > > > > because the sage said so. The sages gave us principles and

> > > > expected us

> > > > > to apply them to real life horoscope using Viveka.

> > > > >

> > > > > I would gladly give you the shloka giving the reference to

> > > > > "Viparita---Shane..." it is from an old classic respected

> > amongst

> > > > > astrologers, but as you do not seem to accept anything that

> > does

> > > > not fit

> > > > > in with what, you think. is said by Dr. Raman, it would be

an

> > > > exercise

> > > > > in futility. should you yet want the shloka I would of

course

> > be

> > > > glad to

> > > > > give it to you.

> > > > >

> > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Om Gurave namah

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > You seem to be disagreeing with Shri B.V. Raman that

strong

> > > > planets,

> > > > > > whether malefic or benefics give good results, while weak

> > planets

> > > > > > give bad results. Perhaps you also disagree about strong

> > malefics

> > > > > > giving mahapurusha yogas. Isn't it contrary to what all

the

> > > > jyotish

> > > > > > texts teach?

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Then, here are a few examples, where I find that strong

> > malefics

> > > > > > have neither made the natives krura nor that their

> > significations

> > > > > > suffered.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Swami Vivekananda: strong sun in lagna and mars in 5th

house

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Sri Aurobindo: Strong Sun in 2nd house.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Maharshi Mahesh yogi: exalted Mars in lagna.

> > > > > > Ramana Maharshi: strong Mars in 8th house

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Sri Ramakrishna Paramahamsa: Exalted Saturn(9H) and Rahu

> > (4H).

> > > > Mars

> > > > > > and Venus are also exalted in rasi, while debilitated in

> > navamsa.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Sir, can you give me the reference for "vipareetam shaneH

> > > > sritam"?

> > > > > > Does it, by any chance, refer to Saturn's placement in

the

> > 8th

> > > > house

> > > > > > being beneficial?

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I am happy that you agree strong Saturn gives good

results.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Can you tell me from where the saying is because i would

> > like to

> > > > > > read it up myself and understand.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > > > --- Chandrashekhar <chandrashekhar46@

> > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk>>

> > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > About Krura planets the saying is, that with

> > > > > > > > > strength the Krura grahas

> > > > > > > > > become more Krura (Maha-krura) and the shubha

grahas

> > > > > > > > > become more shubha.

> > > > > > > > > Only Shani is more krura when weak and beneficial

or

> > > > > > > > > less krura when

> > > > > > > > > strong "Viparitama shaneH smritam".

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > My sun dasa started when I was 9 years old, and

> > > > > > > > > ended when I was 15

> > > > > > > > > > years old. How come you didn't notice the second

> > > > > > > > > part? I was old

> > > > > > > > > > enough to understand the difference between

> > > > > > > > > success and failure, I

> > > > > > > > > > guess!

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Anyway, if you agree that Rahu is giving Sun's

> > > > > > > > > results, and those

> > > > > > > > > > results are exceptionally good, then it

> > > > > > > > > automatically follows that

> > > > > > > > > > Sun is strong in my chart because according to

> > > > > > > > > Shri B.V Raman, evil

> > > > > > > > > > planets, especially when weak, give bad results

> > > > > > > > > (vide "a catechism

> > > > > > > > > > of astrology"), while strong planets, even if

> > > > > > > > > evil, give good

> > > > > > > > > > results. If my Sun were weak, he wouldn't be

> > > > > > > > > giving such good

> > > > > > > > > > results:--))

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Since Mercury is hopelessly combust and inferior

> > > > > > > > > in shadbala

> > > > > > > > > > strength, the major results of Dharma

> > > > > > > > > karmadhipathi yoga are also

> > > > > > > > > > given by Sun, because according to "300

> > > > > > > > > combinations" of Sri

> > > > > > > > > > Raman, a planet with higher shadbala is more

> > > > > > > > > likely to give the

> > > > > > > > > > results of a yoga.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Regarding Karna, I request you to read the Karna

> > > > > > > > > Parva of

> > > > > > > > > > Mahabharata again. When he died, the nature bowed

> > > > > > > > > in grief, because

> > > > > > > > > > he's one of the noblest persons in Mahabharata.

> > > > > > > > > Even the episode you

> > > > > > > > > > quoted happened because Parashurama would teach

> > > > > > > > > only Brahmins and

> > > > > > > > > > Karna desperately wanted to learn dhanurvidya

from

> > > > > > > > > Parashurama so

> > > > > > > > > > that he can support Duryodhana. Deceit is

> > > > > > > > > certainly punishable and

> > > > > > > > > > Karna did pay dearly. But it's to be borne in

mind

> > > > > > > > > that whatever

> > > > > > > > > > Karna did was only to please Duryodhana, his

> > > > > > > > > dearest friend. Karna

> > > > > > > > > > did not gain anything personally.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the 3rd house from 8th house (I

> > > > > > > > > think there was a typo

> > > > > > > > > > at your end). In the natural zodiac, the 10 th

> > > > > > > > > sign, being the

> > > > > > > > > > cardinal earth sign, represents south /dakshina

> > > > > > > > > disha. South is the

> > > > > > > > > > direction ruled by Yama, the lord of death, hence

> > > > > > > > > 10th house

> > > > > > > > > > represents burial grounds. So, the Rudras

(Saturn,

> > > > > > > > > Sun and Mars) are

> > > > > > > > > > strong in south. Also, Sun resides in south and

> > > > > > > > > starts his

> > > > > > > > > > northern voyage from here. So he has digbala in

> > > > > > > > > 10th house.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > I did clarify that when I referred to Surya as

> > > > > > > > > Karma saakshi, it's

> > > > > > > > > > only to his status as antaraatma and not as a

> > > > > > > > > deity. Perhaps this

> > > > > > > > > > escaped your attention.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > This is my last post on the subject.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > <%40>

> > > > <%40>

> > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > <%40>,

> > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar

> > > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > You were too young for the results of the dasha

> > > > > > > > > to manifest,

> > > > > > > > > > though it

> > > > > > > > > > > is good news that your father had promotions

and

> > > > > > > > > you received

> > > > > > > > > > > prizes/accolades during that time. It is

> > > > > > > > > interesting to know you

> > > > > > > > > > got

> > > > > > > > > > > these results at a young age of 9 or so as that

> > > > > > > > > is when Sun dasha

> > > > > > > > > > was

> > > > > > > > > > > operative. I am relieved you did not have any

> > > > > > > > > health problems in

> > > > > > > > > > > March-August 1970 period.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > But we are talking about Rahu and Rahu would

> > > > > > > > > give results of Sun

> > > > > > > > > > more

> > > > > > > > > > > prominently, by conjunction, as you guessed but

> > > > > > > > > also that of

> > > > > > > > > > Mercury

> > > > > > > > > > > (You have a Dharmakarmaadhipati yoga after all)

> > > > > > > > > and that is why I

> > > > > > > > > > said

> > > > > > > > > > > for understanding Sun its dasha instead of Rahu

> > > > > > > > > dasha needs to be

> > > > > > > > > > analyzed.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Mercury is malefic not because I say so but

> > > > > > > > > because Jyotish says

> > > > > > > > > > that

> > > > > > > > > > > mercury is malefic when conjunct a papa graha

> > > > > > > > > and he is conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > two,

> > > > > > > > > > > Sun and Rahu.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the apex of Artha trikona and

> > > > > > > > > directly involved with

> > > > > > > > > > > efforts to earn money. Though claimed to be

> > > > > > > > > smashana/burial

> > > > > > > > > > ground, it

> > > > > > > > > > > is 4th from ayush sthana (8th) and its home

that

> > > > > > > > > is why affliction

> > > > > > > > > > to it

> > > > > > > > > > > can give death. But 8th is more popularly

called

> > > > > > > > > mrityu sthana and

> > > > > > > > > > hence

> > > > > > > > > > > 10th is called Smashana. If it is really

> > > > > > > > > smashana why would it be

> > > > > > > > > > called

> > > > > > > > > > > karma sthana and why would Sun be at its most

> > > > > > > > > brilliant there?

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > I did not say he can not represent water bodies

> > > > > > > > > in temple, but not

> > > > > > > > > > only

> > > > > > > > > > > those.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > My Sun dasa was excellent too. My father

> > > > > > > > > received promotion(s),

> > > > > > > > > > my

> > > > > > > > > > > > school/college days were great and i received

> > > > > > > > > wide acclaim/prizes

> > > > > > > > > > > > for my ability in creative writing, Veena,

> > > > > > > > > quiz contests etc,

> > > > > > > > > > apart

> > > > > > > > > > > > from studies. So, for a student, I guess

> > > > > > > > > that's excellent!!

> > > > > > > > > > > > How do you justify this, if Sun were weak?

> > > > > > > > > Rahu is certainly

> > > > > > > > > > giving

> > > > > > > > > > > > the yogakaraka results, but being in Sun's

> > > > > > > > > house and being

> > > > > > > > > > conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > > Sun, don't you think Rahu is also giving the

> > > > > > > > > results of Sun? You

> > > > > > > > > > > > said that mercury is malefic and heavily

> > > > > > > > > combust too:--))

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > 1th house also represent burial

> > > > > > > > > ground/smashaana. Is that a place

> > > > > > > > > > > > for attachment?

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Chandra represents all water bodies, so why

> > > > > > > > > can't he represent

> > > > > > > > > > > > temple tank?

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > === message truncated ===

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Tired of spam? Mail has the best spam

protection

> > > > around

> > > > > > > > <>

> > < <>>

> > > > < <>

> > < <>>>

> > > > > > < <>

> > < <>>

> > > > < <>

> > < <>>>>

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > --------------------

----

> > -

> > > > > > -------

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.11.7/435 -

Release

> > > > Date:

> > > > > > 8/31/2006

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

[Guest guest]

Dear Divine Lakshmi,

 

I was trying to translate Abhimana and not pride. And Pride in a King

whom you have all along been trying to equate to a Divine being (I think

amsha of Lord Vishnu or some such thing you said, while arguing why King

is divine and by extension Surya; if memory serves me right), may not be

a divine virtue but would certainly be tantamount to Ego.

 

So please do not try to read something that is not there in the message.

It is always difficult to translate Sanskrit words in English language

due to limitation of words with different flavors in English.

 

Chandrashekhar.

 

b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

>

>

> Om Gurave Namah

>

> Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

>

> It is interesting to see that you do not think that pride and ego

> are not one and the same thing. Please refer to your own message at

>

> /message/11735

> </message/11735>

>

> where you mentioned the following:

>

> "we find that Bhava Manjari does

> attribute Abhimana (pride/ego) to Surya and so does Bhuvan Deepak."

>

> How come pride/ego are synonymous in the case of Sun and not so in

> the case of Rahu? Is this fair? And, is this necessary?

>

> Isn't "abhimaana" a much milder word than "mada"? The

> word "abhimaana" might have positive connotations, but the

> word "mada" has absolutely no positive connotations. Pradeep may

> not understand this but I am sure you do.

>

> Fair arguments never hurt me, sir, but this sort of arguments,

> especially coming from you, certainly confound me.

>

> Can you quote any pramaana that says "mada" means only lust and not

> pride/ego/vanity etc?

>

> Regarding vidyaa/avidyaa and auspicious/inauspicious nature of

> Mother:

>

> Vidyaavidya swaroopini: 402nd name of Mother

>

> Vidyaamchaavidyaamchayasthadvedobhayam saH, avidyayaamritu

> teerthva,vidyayaamritamasnutha, vidyaina charamavrittiroopam

> jnaanam, avidyaa bhedabhraantiroopam jnaanam"

>

> Avidya results in mrityu while vidyaa results in immortality and

> moiksha. Vidyaa gives charama vrittiroopa jnaanam, while avidya

> gives bhedabhraanthiroopa jnaanam.

>

> So, which one is auspicious? The direction which gives

> immortality/moksha or the direction which results in

> differentiation, delusion and death?

>

> Further in the explanation of the name "BhadramoorthiH" it is stated

> in Soubhagyabhaskaram that "brahmam tanmangalam". The true

> auspiciousness is that after which no other inauspiciousness occurs.

> In a state which is dominated by desires, delusions etc

> (mooladhara), this is impossible. This state of " absoluteness

> auspiciousness " is possible only at the state of Brahman

> (sahasraara).

>

> "theshaamcha lokaapibahuvidhaaH parasivaabhinnamahaashaktistu

> sarvalokaatheethaa mahaakailaasaaparaajithaadi padapratipaadye

> sarvalokotthare tisthathi.anyaapaam sivashakteenaam kathipayaanam

> saattwikshareeraanyapi sattwaadhikyagunaantharaalpatwa yukthaani na

> punaH shuddhasattwaani..

>

> "The form where Mother is one with shiva is the highest/mahaashakti

> form. All shiva+shakti roopas are sattwa roopas, but those lower

> than this are a mixture of rajo and tamo gunas.

>

> I hope these suffice, or if you want, I can quote more.

>

> Regards,

> Lakshmi

>

>

> <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> <chandrashekhar46 wrote:

> >

> > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> >

> > Pride is different from ego. Like it or not Mada does mean

> intoxication

> > or lust. The Kama that is referred to relates to kaamana which

> means

> > desires for things possessed by others. That is what Asteya, one

> of the

> > Yamas of Hatha yogas refer to.

> >

> > We are talking about auspiciousness or other wise of the dormant

> or

> > awakened Kundalini. As I said all scriptures can be misinterpreted

> if

> > one wants to do that. But that does not serve any purpose. I would

> not

> > go into what exactly is meant by Vidya and Avidya related to Maa.

> I have

> > not yet seen any Pramana, in the form of a shloka, to support your

> > proposition that dormant Kundalini is inauspicious and the

> awakened

> > Kundalini is auspicious so far. I have already posted the way my

> > generation has been taught to accept an argument, so I shall not

> repeat

> > it here.

> >

> > But I will not resort to conjectures and would like to quote from

> > Rudrayamala tantra about the swarUpa of dormant Kundalini. Being

> > graduate in sanskrit, I am sure I will not have to translate it

> for you.

> > Aaxare prdevta Éìjntax> k…{flI devta

> > ädhäre paradevatä bhavrajanatädhaù kuëòalé devatä

> > devanamixdevta iÇjgtamanNdpuÃiSwta,

> > devänämadhidevatä trijagatämänandapuïjasthitä|

> > mUlaxarinvaisnI iÇrm[i ya }ainnI mailnI

> > mülädhäraniväsiné triramaëé yä jïäniné mäliné

> > sa me mat&mnuiSwta k…lpwanNdEkbIjanna.32,21.

> > sä me mätåmanusthitä kulapathänandaikabéjänanä||32|21||

> >

> > I am sure you must have some quote to support your contention. I

> would

> > like to see the shloka, as against conjectures, so that I can

> improve

> > upon my knowledge of the swarupaa of Kundalini.

> >

> > I can understand your reluctance to support your propositions with

> > suitable pramanas. I am sorry if I have hurt you by pointing out

> the

> > inconsistency in the way you treated Surya and Rahu combinations

> in two

> > different chart as stand out combinations only.

> >

> > I had no intention to cause any hurt to you and if I have done so

> > inadvertently I crave your pardon.

> >

> > Take care,

> >

> > Chandrashekhar

> >

> >

> > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > >

> > > Om Gurave Namah

> > >

> > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > >

> > > The shadripus are kaama (lust), krodha (anger), lobha (greed),

> moha

> > > (attachment, delusion), mada (pride) and maatsarya (jealousy)

> > > If "mada" means "lust" what does "kaama" imply among the

> > > shadripus? "Mada" signifies one who is intoxicated/drunk with

> > > power/self-grandeur (pride/ego).

> > >

> > > Mother is known as "Vidya and avidya swaroopini" and correct

> > > appreciation of Mother includes understanding of both facets. As

> > > Shakti, She respresents raw power which can be routed towards

> good

> > > deeds as well as bad deeds. Are both ends the same? The wisdom,

> > > required to put this immense shakti to good use, is represented

> by

> > > Shiva, hence the union of Shiva and Parvati, wisdom and power, is

> > > said to be auspicious because it ensures the correct/judicious

> end

> > > use of shakti. Hence the orientation of Shakti is very very

> > > important.

> > >

> > > I always said that Soorya is both sattwik and krura. I also

> always

> > > said all planets, including Jupiter, can give malefic results, if

> > > they are functionally empowered to do so. You can refer to all my

> > > previous mails to confirm this.

> > >

> > > Sir, Truth is much more important than winning or losing an

> > > argument. All discussions must proceed as an exploration and

> > > celebration of Truth. When this is not the case, I see no

> purpose in

> > > continuing these discussions.

> > >

> > > Thanks & Regards,

> > > Lakshmi

> > >

> > >

> <%40>

> > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > >

> > > > Having Icchamrityu and dying at an early age are operating at

> > > different

> > > > levels. Bhishma had Iccha Mrityu but did not die young. So

> please

> > > do not

> > > > try to mix the issues. If you have read Swamiji's biography you

> > > will

> > > > find that he fell sick many times despite of apparent robust

> > > physique.

> > > >

> > > > Commenting on Shani in 4th for Rama's chart confirms with his

> > > being

> > > > capable of giving Vipareeta results. I did not know I was

> expected

> > > to

> > > > analyze the entire chart. By the way if there is a Kuja dosha

> how

> > > does

> > > > that by itself give a Divine wife? Please do not bring our

> > > devotion to

> > > > Lord Rama (and we both have that) into astrological analysis of

> > > his chart.

> > > >

> > > > Bringing in the dashas when the discussions are on the effects

> of

> > > grahas

> > > > will only lead the discussion to no where. The two have to be

> seen

> > > > separately as we are not trying to time an event but only

> trying

> > > to find

> > > > what are the effects on bhavas occupied.

> > > >

> > > > Dear Lakshmi in Ramana Maharshi's chart you have perhaps

> forgotten

> > > the

> > > > saying Kuja vat Ketu. look at the Ketu deha in that perspective

> > > and let

> > > > me know your views. And if by the way you read my mail, I did

> not

> > > say

> > > > anything about mars being killer for him, only that it gave him

> > > Sarcoma

> > > > being 3rd lord.

> > > >

> > > > Also could you explain why Sun being Atma and always

> beneficent as

> > > you

> > > > have claimed all along in the thread on the topic, did its

> > > Mahadasha

> > > > prove to be Killer to Ramana Maharshi?

> > > >

> > > > Take care,

> > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > >

> > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > > For example, remember that in Swami Vivekananda's chart

> Surya

> > > is

> > > > > lord of

> > > > > > the 9th occupying the lagna and causing a powerful Raj

> yoga. At

> > > > > the same

> > > > > > time if you thin how long the Swamiji lived, you may have

> to

> > > think

> > > > > again

> > > > > > about saying that it did not act as Mahakrura. Think about

> > > what it

> > > > > did

> > > > > > to the 7th bhava of Swamiji, also, before declaring that it

> > > became

> > > > > > shubha or less malefic.

> > > > >

> > > > > Lakshmi: I think Swamiji had an icchamrityu and looking at

> the

> > > dass

> > > > > operating on 4th July 1902, I observe that he passed away in

> Jup-

> > > Ven-

> > > > > Jup-Ket-Sat-Sat.

> > > > >

> > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > >

> > > > > Jup MD: 1893-02-09 (1:35:30 pm) - 1909-02-10 (3:59:13 pm)

> > > > > Ven AD: 1900-12-25 (10:03:30 am) - 1903-08-27 (4:48:54 pm)

> > > > > Jup PD: 1902-05-02 (1:42:07 pm) - 1902-09-12 (10:43:55 pm)

> > > > > Ket SD: 1902-06-29 (9:11:48 am) - 1902-07-07 (5:06:28 am)

> > > > > Sat PAD: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-06 (2:29:24 am)

> > > > >

> > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > >

> > > > > Sat: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-05 (1:27:03 am)

> > > > >

> > > > > Jupiter is in 2nd house from Moon, Venus is the 2nd lord from

> > > Moon

> > > > > and is posited in 2nd from lagna, Ketu is in the house of

> Venus

> > > and

> > > > > gives the results of Venus and Saturn is the 2nd lord from

> > > > > lagna....all are marakas. the maraka significations are

> stronger

> > > > > from Moon, and it's the cause of his early death.

> > > > >

> > > > > I fail to see where Sun comes into all this.

> > > > >

> > > > > However, I agree that Sun, as AK aspecting 7th house, can

> give

> > > > > parivraja tendencies. But can you ignore the influence of

> Saturn

> > > on

> > > > > Moon and 4th house, occuring in the 10th house? I am sure

> even

> > > weak

> > > > > Sun would have given him parivraja yoga:--))but without the

> raja

> > > > > yoga and the strong soul-level impact he created wherever he

> > > went.

> > > > >

> > > > > Or if you like look at what happened to the 7th

> > > > > > Bhava of Lord Rama with exalted Mars in the 7th bhava.

> > > > >

> > > > > Mars in 7th gives kuja dosha, and I think the strong Mars in

> 7th

> > > > > gave him an exalted wife like Sita. You have not commented

> on the

> > > > > exalted Saturn in 4th house.

> > > > >

> > > > > In each of the

> > > > > > example provided by you look at the bhava that the planets

> > > occupy

> > > > > > (barring Saturn, for reasons already stated in previous

> mail),

> > > > > without

> > > > > > looking at the charts as belonging to great people, and

> then

> > > make

> > > > > up

> > > > > > your mind as to the truth or otherwise of what I said. Did

> you

> > > > > know

> > > > > > Ramana Maharshi died following a malignant sarcoma of left

> hand

> > > > > and Mars

> > > > > > is karaka for the 3rd bhava in 8th in his chart, in

> > > exaltation. Do

> > > > > you

> > > > > > think Mars gave him benevolent results?

> > > > >

> > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I also request you to examine the following

> dasa

> > > > > sequences with an open mind. Sun is the 3rd lord from Moon

> (AK) &

> > > > > 12th lord from lagna in Sri Ramana's chart, rahu is with Sun

> and

> > > > > gives Sun'/Saturn's/Jupiter's effects...all of which point to

> > > > > dusthanas, Saturn is a maraka in 7th house and ketu can give

> the

> > > > > effects of Moon/Mercury/mars. Mar's effect, if at all, was

> only

> > > > > indirect, and he was not the killer.

> > > > >

> > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > >

> > > > > Sun MD: 1949-02-03 (1:02:22 am) - 1955-02-03 (2:05:32 pm)

> > > > > Rah AD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1951-02-21 (8:49:14 am)

> > > > > Rah PD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1950-05-18 (12:04:47 am)

> > > > > Sat SD: 1950-04-12 (3:37:16 am) - 1950-04-20 (12:18:02 am)

> > > > > Ket PAD: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14 (11:08:26 pm)

> > > > >

> > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > >

> > > > > Ket: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14 (12:47:04 pm)

> > > > >

> > > > > I think what stands out is the fact that the dasa of the

> graha

> > > > > conjoined Moon brought about death. I think their mind

> willed the

> > > > > death.

> > > > >

> > > > > Can a planet give results in a dasa totally

> > > unrelated/unassociated

> > > > > with itself? I request you to consider the above objectively.

> > > > >

> > > > > I will talk about the other charts/issues in my next mail.

> > > > >

> > > > > Regards,

> > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > >

> > > > > In Paramhans Ramkrishna's chart,

> > > > > > I do not know where you find Mars strong as a planet in

> > > > > debilitation in

> > > > > > Navamsha gives results of debility even when in exaltation

> in

> > > rasi

> > > > > > chart. In case of Saturn Viparitam shane smritam has

> already

> > > been

> > > > > > mentioned by me, in earlier mail.

> > > > >

> > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I myself have not considered Mars/Venus in

> Thakur's

> > > > > chart because they are debilitated. Please go through my

> message

> > > > > again. I was talking about Saturn and Rahu.

> > > > >

> > > > > About Shri Aurobindo, I trust you are

> > > > > > aware of his revolutionary background and that he was

> editor

> > > of a

> > > > > paper

> > > > > > "Vande Mataram" not much known for its soft language.

> > > > >

> > > > > > Same is the case with strong Malefics giving P.M. Yogas.

> Every

> > > > > graha is

> > > > > > capable of 12 variations of a P.M. Yoga attributed to it,

> at

> > > the

> > > > > very

> > > > > > least. It would only be naive to imagine they would all

> give

> > > > > identical

> > > > > > results as indicated by Parashara or all with Pancha

> > > Mahapurusha

> > > > > Yoga

> > > > > > would only rule over different parts of India (barring

> Saturn),

> > > > > just

> > > > > > because the sage said so. The sages gave us principles and

> > > > > expected us

> > > > > > to apply them to real life horoscope using Viveka.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I would gladly give you the shloka giving the reference to

> > > > > > "Viparita---Shane..." it is from an old classic respected

> > > amongst

> > > > > > astrologers, but as you do not seem to accept anything that

> > > does

> > > > > not fit

> > > > > > in with what, you think. is said by Dr. Raman, it would be

> an

> > > > > exercise

> > > > > > in futility. should you yet want the shloka I would of

> course

> > > be

> > > > > glad to

> > > > > > give it to you.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Om Gurave namah

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > You seem to be disagreeing with Shri B.V. Raman that

> strong

> > > > > planets,

> > > > > > > whether malefic or benefics give good results, while weak

> > > planets

> > > > > > > give bad results. Perhaps you also disagree about strong

> > > malefics

> > > > > > > giving mahapurusha yogas. Isn't it contrary to what all

> the

> > > > > jyotish

> > > > > > > texts teach?

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Then, here are a few examples, where I find that strong

> > > malefics

> > > > > > > have neither made the natives krura nor that their

> > > significations

> > > > > > > suffered.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Swami Vivekananda: strong sun in lagna and mars in 5th

> house

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Sri Aurobindo: Strong Sun in 2nd house.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Maharshi Mahesh yogi: exalted Mars in lagna.

> > > > > > > Ramana Maharshi: strong Mars in 8th house

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Sri Ramakrishna Paramahamsa: Exalted Saturn(9H) and Rahu

> > > (4H).

> > > > > Mars

> > > > > > > and Venus are also exalted in rasi, while debilitated in

> > > navamsa.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Sir, can you give me the reference for "vipareetam shaneH

> > > > > sritam"?

> > > > > > > Does it, by any chance, refer to Saturn's placement in

> the

> > > 8th

> > > > > house

> > > > > > > being beneficial?

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I am happy that you agree strong Saturn gives good

> results.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Can you tell me from where the saying is because i would

> > > like to

> > > > > > > read it up myself and understand.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > --- Chandrashekhar <chandrashekhar46@

> > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk>>

> > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > About Krura planets the saying is, that with

> > > > > > > > > > strength the Krura grahas

> > > > > > > > > > become more Krura (Maha-krura) and the shubha

> grahas

> > > > > > > > > > become more shubha.

> > > > > > > > > > Only Shani is more krura when weak and beneficial

> or

> > > > > > > > > > less krura when

> > > > > > > > > > strong "Viparitama shaneH smritam".

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > My sun dasa started when I was 9 years old, and

> > > > > > > > > > ended when I was 15

> > > > > > > > > > > years old. How come you didn't notice the second

> > > > > > > > > > part? I was old

> > > > > > > > > > > enough to understand the difference between

> > > > > > > > > > success and failure, I

> > > > > > > > > > > guess!

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Anyway, if you agree that Rahu is giving Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > results, and those

> > > > > > > > > > > results are exceptionally good, then it

> > > > > > > > > > automatically follows that

> > > > > > > > > > > Sun is strong in my chart because according to

> > > > > > > > > > Shri B.V Raman, evil

> > > > > > > > > > > planets, especially when weak, give bad results

> > > > > > > > > > (vide "a catechism

> > > > > > > > > > > of astrology"), while strong planets, even if

> > > > > > > > > > evil, give good

> > > > > > > > > > > results. If my Sun were weak, he wouldn't be

> > > > > > > > > > giving such good

> > > > > > > > > > > results:--))

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Since Mercury is hopelessly combust and inferior

> > > > > > > > > > in shadbala

> > > > > > > > > > > strength, the major results of Dharma

> > > > > > > > > > karmadhipathi yoga are also

> > > > > > > > > > > given by Sun, because according to "300

> > > > > > > > > > combinations" of Sri

> > > > > > > > > > > Raman, a planet with higher shadbala is more

> > > > > > > > > > likely to give the

> > > > > > > > > > > results of a yoga.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Regarding Karna, I request you to read the Karna

> > > > > > > > > > Parva of

> > > > > > > > > > > Mahabharata again. When he died, the nature bowed

> > > > > > > > > > in grief, because

> > > > > > > > > > > he's one of the noblest persons in Mahabharata.

> > > > > > > > > > Even the episode you

> > > > > > > > > > > quoted happened because Parashurama would teach

> > > > > > > > > > only Brahmins and

> > > > > > > > > > > Karna desperately wanted to learn dhanurvidya

> from

> > > > > > > > > > Parashurama so

> > > > > > > > > > > that he can support Duryodhana. Deceit is

> > > > > > > > > > certainly punishable and

> > > > > > > > > > > Karna did pay dearly. But it's to be borne in

> mind

> > > > > > > > > > that whatever

> > > > > > > > > > > Karna did was only to please Duryodhana, his

> > > > > > > > > > dearest friend. Karna

> > > > > > > > > > > did not gain anything personally.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the 3rd house from 8th house (I

> > > > > > > > > > think there was a typo

> > > > > > > > > > > at your end). In the natural zodiac, the 10 th

> > > > > > > > > > sign, being the

> > > > > > > > > > > cardinal earth sign, represents south /dakshina

> > > > > > > > > > disha. South is the

> > > > > > > > > > > direction ruled by Yama, the lord of death, hence

> > > > > > > > > > 10th house

> > > > > > > > > > > represents burial grounds. So, the Rudras

> (Saturn,

> > > > > > > > > > Sun and Mars) are

> > > > > > > > > > > strong in south. Also, Sun resides in south and

> > > > > > > > > > starts his

> > > > > > > > > > > northern voyage from here. So he has digbala in

> > > > > > > > > > 10th house.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > I did clarify that when I referred to Surya as

> > > > > > > > > > Karma saakshi, it's

> > > > > > > > > > > only to his status as antaraatma and not as a

> > > > > > > > > > deity. Perhaps this

> > > > > > > > > > > escaped your attention.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > This is my last post on the subject.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> <%40>

> > > <%40>

> > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > > <%40>,

> > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar

> > > > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > You were too young for the results of the dasha

> > > > > > > > > > to manifest,

> > > > > > > > > > > though it

> > > > > > > > > > > > is good news that your father had promotions

> and

> > > > > > > > > > you received

> > > > > > > > > > > > prizes/accolades during that time. It is

> > > > > > > > > > interesting to know you

> > > > > > > > > > > got

> > > > > > > > > > > > these results at a young age of 9 or so as that

> > > > > > > > > > is when Sun dasha

> > > > > > > > > > > was

> > > > > > > > > > > > operative. I am relieved you did not have any

> > > > > > > > > > health problems in

> > > > > > > > > > > > March-August 1970 period.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > But we are talking about Rahu and Rahu would

> > > > > > > > > > give results of Sun

> > > > > > > > > > > more

> > > > > > > > > > > > prominently, by conjunction, as you guessed but

> > > > > > > > > > also that of

> > > > > > > > > > > Mercury

> > > > > > > > > > > > (You have a Dharmakarmaadhipati yoga after all)

> > > > > > > > > > and that is why I

> > > > > > > > > > > said

> > > > > > > > > > > > for understanding Sun its dasha instead of Rahu

> > > > > > > > > > dasha needs to be

> > > > > > > > > > > analyzed.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Mercury is malefic not because I say so but

> > > > > > > > > > because Jyotish says

> > > > > > > > > > > that

> > > > > > > > > > > > mercury is malefic when conjunct a papa graha

> > > > > > > > > > and he is conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > two,

> > > > > > > > > > > > Sun and Rahu.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the apex of Artha trikona and

> > > > > > > > > > directly involved with

> > > > > > > > > > > > efforts to earn money. Though claimed to be

> > > > > > > > > > smashana/burial

> > > > > > > > > > > ground, it

> > > > > > > > > > > > is 4th from ayush sthana (8th) and its home

> that

> > > > > > > > > > is why affliction

> > > > > > > > > > > to it

> > > > > > > > > > > > can give death. But 8th is more popularly

> called

> > > > > > > > > > mrityu sthana and

> > > > > > > > > > > hence

> > > > > > > > > > > > 10th is called Smashana. If it is really

> > > > > > > > > > smashana why would it be

> > > > > > > > > > > called

> > > > > > > > > > > > karma sthana and why would Sun be at its most

> > > > > > > > > > brilliant there?

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > I did not say he can not represent water bodies

> > > > > > > > > > in temple, but not

> > > > > > > > > > > only

> > > > > > > > > > > > those.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > My Sun dasa was excellent too. My father

> > > > > > > > > > received promotion(s),

> > > > > > > > > > > my

> > > > > > > > > > > > > school/college days were great and i received

> > > > > > > > > > wide acclaim/prizes

> > > > > > > > > > > > > for my ability in creative writing, Veena,

> > > > > > > > > > quiz contests etc,

> > > > > > > > > > > apart

> > > > > > > > > > > > > from studies. So, for a student, I guess

> > > > > > > > > > that's excellent!!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > How do you justify this, if Sun were weak?

> > > > > > > > > > Rahu is certainly

> > > > > > > > > > > giving

> > > > > > > > > > > > > the yogakaraka results, but being in Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > house and being

> > > > > > > > > > > conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun, don't you think Rahu is also giving the

> > > > > > > > > > results of Sun? You

> > > > > > > > > > > > > said that mercury is malefic and heavily

> > > > > > > > > > combust too:--))

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > 1th house also represent burial

> > > > > > > > > > ground/smashaana. Is that a place

> > > > > > > > > > > > > for attachment?

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandra represents all water bodies, so why

> > > > > > > > > > can't he represent

> > > > > > > > > > > > > temple tank?

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > === message truncated ===

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Tired of spam? Mail has the best spam

> protection

> > > > > around

> > > > > > > > > <>

> < <>>

> > > < <>

> < <>>>

> > > > > < <>

> < <>>

> > > < <>

> < <>>>>

> > > > > > > < <>

> < <>>

> > > < <>

> < <>>>

> > > > > < <>

> < <>>

> > > < <>

> < <>>>>>

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > --------------------

> ----

> > > -

> > > > > > > -------

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.11.7/435 -

> Release

> > > > > Date:

> > > > > > > 8/31/2006

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

[Guest guest]

Dear Divine Lakshmi,

 

If you think Sahasrara and Vishuddha Chakras at the same place, and if

Pankaja refers to head and not face, all your arguments are acceptable.

Unfortunately they are not.

 

I see that you have not given anything in support of your argument

barring conjectures and have not commented on the shloka I sent you.

 

Chandrashekhar.

 

b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

>

>

> Om Gurave Namah

>

> Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

>

> Lalitha Sahasranaamam describes Mother thus...

>

> Srimadvaagbhavakootaika swaroopamukha pankajaa

> kanthaadhakatiparyanta madhyakoota swaroopini

> Shaktikootaikathaapanna katyadhobhaagadhaariNi.

>

> The three divisions are

>

> Vagbhava koota - the face/head

> Madhya/kamaraaja koota - from neck to kati

> Shakti koota - the portion after kati to feet

>

> Can you tell me in this division, where does the head come...in the

> vagbhava koota or in shakti koota? Is there any other koota defined

> for the head/rear portion of the face etc? Or do you imply that

> Mother has only a face without the head!!!

>

> You know very well that we are not talking of astrology mappings

> here. Yet why you choose to interpret even a simple principle in

> this strange fashion is some thing beyond me, unless you are

> confused yourself (can happen to all of us) or want to confuse

> others (no comments).

>

> If either Bhagavan Hayagriva or Sage Agasthya intended that "bisa

> tantu taneeyasi" should be understood wrt kundalini at Mooladhara

> also they would have put it immediately after "mooladharaika

> nilayaa.. and not after "shatchakropari samsthithaa".

>

> ofcourse, I do not mean that Kundalini is like a python at

> mooladhara:--)), but definitely much grosser than at sahasraara.

>

> Btw, I am sure you know that kundalini is not agni tattwatmika at

> mooladhara. The agnitattwa of "vidyullekha" happens only from

> swadhisthana, because agni is oordhwa mukha and is ignited only when

> the Kundalini turns upwards.

>

> Regards,

> Lakshmi

>

>

> <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> <chandrashekhar46 wrote:

> >

> > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> >

> > By the way Vag beeja kuta is not only head but a group of

> Panchadhasha

> > mantra and referred to as maa's face indicating the vacha.

> > Raajrajeshwari Kavacha prays that the vagbija protect the throat

> and not

> > the head as you imply. Certainly not head. And her principal abode

> is

> > said to be Mulaadhara and not sahasrara. However if you want to

> distort

> > this to mean she is inauspicious when dormant you are free to do

> so. I

> > would however request you to think why the HrIm beeja is most dear

> to

> > her and not the AiM beeja (Devi Patha, if you need the reference).

> It

> > would perhaps be well to understand that Kundalini means of the

> coiled

> > form and "Visa Tantu..." coming after that certainly does not mean

> what

> > you want to think it does.

> >

> > In the meanwhile, please contemplate on this.

> > Aaxare prdevta Éìjntax> k…{flI devta

> > ädhäre paradevatä bhavrajanatädhaù kuëòalé devatä

> > devanamixdevta iÇjgtamanNdpuÃiSwta,

> > devänämadhidevatä trijagatämänandapuïjasthitä|

> > mUlaxarinvaisnI iÇrm[i ya }ainnI mailnI

> > mülädhäraniväsiné triramaëé yä jïäniné mäliné

> > sa me mat&mnuiSwta k…lpwanNdEkbIjanna.32,21.

> > sä me mätåmanusthitä kulapathänandaikabéjänanä||32|21||

> >

> > This is how Kundalini is described in Rudrayamala Tantra. Do you

> think

> > it is wrong?

> >

> > Chandrashekhar.

> >

> > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > >

> > > Om Gurave Namah

> > >

> > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > >

> > > "vagbhavabeejasya kundalineethi sangnyaa thadroopa"...Kundalini

> as

> > > preceding "bisa tantu taneeyasee" is described as vagbhava beeja

> > > or "aim" (saraswati) beeja. As you have read the yamalas, i am

> sure

> > > you know which part of body comprises of vagbhava koota...it's

> the

> > > head!!

> > >

> > > Let me also explain the term preceding kundalini.

> > > It's "mahaasakthiH" and not "MahashakthiH" and talks of the

> > > eagerness of Mother to unite with Shiva....mahe utsave tatratya

> > > shivashaktisamaayogaroope aasakthiH tatparataa yasyaaH.

> > >

> > > Is this enough to show that "bisa tantu taneeyasee" is the

> climactic

> > > name of shakti in ascension?

> > >

> > > Regarding Devi worshippers wrt unawakened kundalini, let me quote

> > > this sentence.....hey Srividyopaasakaah. uttishtatha. maa

> > > swaptha....meaning o srividyopaasaka! wake up( the kundalini).

> don't

> > > let it sleep!!

> > >

> > > Many thanks for this extended discussion on Kundalini. It's time

> for

> > > taking leave.

> > >

> > > Regards,

> > > Lakshmi

> > >

> > >

> <%40>

> > > <%40>, "b_lakshmi_ramesh"

> > > <b_lakshmi_ramesh@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > >

> > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > >

> > > > The shadripus are kaama (lust), krodha (anger), lobha (greed),

> > > moha

> > > > (attachment, delusion), mada (pride) and maatsarya (jealousy)

> > > > If "mada" means "lust" what does "kaama" imply among the

> > > > shadripus? "Mada" signifies one who is intoxicated/drunk with

> > > > power/self-grandeur (pride/ego).

> > > >

> > > > Mother is known as "Vidya and avidya swaroopini" and correct

> > > > appreciation of Mother includes understanding of both facets.

> As

> > > > Shakti, She respresents raw power which can be routed towards

> good

> > > > deeds as well as bad deeds. Are both ends the same? The wisdom,

> > > > required to put this immense shakti to good use, is

> represented by

> > > > Shiva, hence the union of Shiva and Parvati, wisdom and power,

> is

> > > > said to be auspicious because it ensures the correct/judicious

> end

> > > > use of shakti. Hence the orientation of Shakti is very very

> > > > important.

> > > >

> > > > I always said that Soorya is both sattwik and krura. I also

> always

> > > > said all planets, including Jupiter, can give malefic results,

> if

> > > > they are functionally empowered to do so. You can refer to all

> my

> > > > previous mails to confirm this.

> > > >

> > > > Sir, Truth is much more important than winning or losing an

> > > > argument. All discussions must proceed as an exploration and

> > > > celebration of Truth. When this is not the case, I see no

> purpose

> > > in

> > > > continuing these discussions.

> > > >

> > > > Thanks & Regards,

> > > > Lakshmi

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> <%40>

> > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > >

> > > > > Having Icchamrityu and dying at an early age are operating at

> > > > different

> > > > > levels. Bhishma had Iccha Mrityu but did not die young. So

> > > please

> > > > do not

> > > > > try to mix the issues. If you have read Swamiji's biography

> you

> > > > will

> > > > > find that he fell sick many times despite of apparent robust

> > > > physique.

> > > > >

> > > > > Commenting on Shani in 4th for Rama's chart confirms with his

> > > > being

> > > > > capable of giving Vipareeta results. I did not know I was

> > > expected

> > > > to

> > > > > analyze the entire chart. By the way if there is a Kuja dosha

> > > how

> > > > does

> > > > > that by itself give a Divine wife? Please do not bring our

> > > > devotion to

> > > > > Lord Rama (and we both have that) into astrological analysis

> of

> > > > his chart.

> > > > >

> > > > > Bringing in the dashas when the discussions are on the

> effects

> > > of

> > > > grahas

> > > > > will only lead the discussion to no where. The two have to be

> > > seen

> > > > > separately as we are not trying to time an event but only

> trying

> > > > to find

> > > > > what are the effects on bhavas occupied.

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear Lakshmi in Ramana Maharshi's chart you have perhaps

> > > forgotten

> > > > the

> > > > > saying Kuja vat Ketu. look at the Ketu deha in that

> perspective

> > > > and let

> > > > > me know your views. And if by the way you read my mail, I did

> > > not

> > > > say

> > > > > anything about mars being killer for him, only that it gave

> him

> > > > Sarcoma

> > > > > being 3rd lord.

> > > > >

> > > > > Also could you explain why Sun being Atma and always

> beneficent

> > > as

> > > > you

> > > > > have claimed all along in the thread on the topic, did its

> > > > Mahadasha

> > > > > prove to be Killer to Ramana Maharshi?

> > > > >

> > > > > Take care,

> > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > > For example, remember that in Swami Vivekananda's chart

> > > Surya

> > > > is

> > > > > > lord of

> > > > > > > the 9th occupying the lagna and causing a powerful Raj

> yoga.

> > > At

> > > > > > the same

> > > > > > > time if you thin how long the Swamiji lived, you may

> have to

> > > > think

> > > > > > again

> > > > > > > about saying that it did not act as Mahakrura. Think

> about

> > > > what it

> > > > > > did

> > > > > > > to the 7th bhava of Swamiji, also, before declaring that

> it

> > > > became

> > > > > > > shubha or less malefic.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Lakshmi: I think Swamiji had an icchamrityu and looking at

> the

> > > > dass

> > > > > > operating on 4th July 1902, I observe that he passed away

> in

> > > Jup-

> > > > Ven-

> > > > > > Jup-Ket-Sat-Sat.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Jup MD: 1893-02-09 (1:35:30 pm) - 1909-02-10 (3:59:13 pm)

> > > > > > Ven AD: 1900-12-25 (10:03:30 am) - 1903-08-27 (4:48:54 pm)

> > > > > > Jup PD: 1902-05-02 (1:42:07 pm) - 1902-09-12 (10:43:55 pm)

> > > > > > Ket SD: 1902-06-29 (9:11:48 am) - 1902-07-07 (5:06:28 am)

> > > > > > Sat PAD: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-06 (2:29:24 am)

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Sat: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-05 (1:27:03 am)

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Jupiter is in 2nd house from Moon, Venus is the 2nd lord

> from

> > > > Moon

> > > > > > and is posited in 2nd from lagna, Ketu is in the house of

> > > Venus

> > > > and

> > > > > > gives the results of Venus and Saturn is the 2nd lord from

> > > > > > lagna....all are marakas. the maraka significations are

> > > stronger

> > > > > > from Moon, and it's the cause of his early death.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I fail to see where Sun comes into all this.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > However, I agree that Sun, as AK aspecting 7th house, can

> give

> > > > > > parivraja tendencies. But can you ignore the influence of

> > > Saturn

> > > > on

> > > > > > Moon and 4th house, occuring in the 10th house? I am sure

> even

> > > > weak

> > > > > > Sun would have given him parivraja yoga:--))but without the

> > > raja

> > > > > > yoga and the strong soul-level impact he created wherever

> he

> > > > went.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Or if you like look at what happened to the 7th

> > > > > > > Bhava of Lord Rama with exalted Mars in the 7th bhava.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Mars in 7th gives kuja dosha, and I think the strong Mars

> in

> > > 7th

> > > > > > gave him an exalted wife like Sita. You have not commented

> on

> > > the

> > > > > > exalted Saturn in 4th house.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > In each of the

> > > > > > > example provided by you look at the bhava that the

> planets

> > > > occupy

> > > > > > > (barring Saturn, for reasons already stated in previous

> > > mail),

> > > > > > without

> > > > > > > looking at the charts as belonging to great people, and

> then

> > > > make

> > > > > > up

> > > > > > > your mind as to the truth or otherwise of what I said.

> Did

> > > you

> > > > > > know

> > > > > > > Ramana Maharshi died following a malignant sarcoma of

> left

> > > hand

> > > > > > and Mars

> > > > > > > is karaka for the 3rd bhava in 8th in his chart, in

> > > > exaltation. Do

> > > > > > you

> > > > > > > think Mars gave him benevolent results?

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I also request you to examine the following

> dasa

> > > > > > sequences with an open mind. Sun is the 3rd lord from Moon

> (AK)

> > > &

> > > > > > 12th lord from lagna in Sri Ramana's chart, rahu is with

> Sun

> > > and

> > > > > > gives Sun'/Saturn's/Jupiter's effects...all of which point

> to

> > > > > > dusthanas, Saturn is a maraka in 7th house and ketu can

> give

> > > the

> > > > > > effects of Moon/Mercury/mars. Mar's effect, if at all, was

> only

> > > > > > indirect, and he was not the killer.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Sun MD: 1949-02-03 (1:02:22 am) - 1955-02-03 (2:05:32 pm)

> > > > > > Rah AD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1951-02-21 (8:49:14 am)

> > > > > > Rah PD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1950-05-18 (12:04:47 am)

> > > > > > Sat SD: 1950-04-12 (3:37:16 am) - 1950-04-20 (12:18:02 am)

> > > > > > Ket PAD: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14 (11:08:26

> pm)

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Ket: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14 (12:47:04 pm)

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I think what stands out is the fact that the dasa of the

> graha

> > > > > > conjoined Moon brought about death. I think their mind

> willed

> > > the

> > > > > > death.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Can a planet give results in a dasa totally

> > > > unrelated/unassociated

> > > > > > with itself? I request you to consider the above

> objectively.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I will talk about the other charts/issues in my next mail.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > >

> > > > > > In Paramhans Ramkrishna's chart,

> > > > > > > I do not know where you find Mars strong as a planet in

> > > > > > debilitation in

> > > > > > > Navamsha gives results of debility even when in

> exaltation

> > > in

> > > > rasi

> > > > > > > chart. In case of Saturn Viparitam shane smritam has

> already

> > > > been

> > > > > > > mentioned by me, in earlier mail.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I myself have not considered Mars/Venus in

> > > Thakur's

> > > > > > chart because they are debilitated. Please go through my

> > > message

> > > > > > again. I was talking about Saturn and Rahu.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > About Shri Aurobindo, I trust you are

> > > > > > > aware of his revolutionary background and that he was

> editor

> > > > of a

> > > > > > paper

> > > > > > > "Vande Mataram" not much known for its soft language.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > > Same is the case with strong Malefics giving P.M. Yogas.

> > > Every

> > > > > > graha is

> > > > > > > capable of 12 variations of a P.M. Yoga attributed to

> it, at

> > > > the

> > > > > > very

> > > > > > > least. It would only be naive to imagine they would all

> give

> > > > > > identical

> > > > > > > results as indicated by Parashara or all with Pancha

> > > > Mahapurusha

> > > > > > Yoga

> > > > > > > would only rule over different parts of India (barring

> > > Saturn),

> > > > > > just

> > > > > > > because the sage said so. The sages gave us principles

> and

> > > > > > expected us

> > > > > > > to apply them to real life horoscope using Viveka.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I would gladly give you the shloka giving the reference

> to

> > > > > > > "Viparita---Shane..." it is from an old classic respected

> > > > amongst

> > > > > > > astrologers, but as you do not seem to accept anything

> that

> > > > does

> > > > > > not fit

> > > > > > > in with what, you think. is said by Dr. Raman, it would

> be an

> > > > > > exercise

> > > > > > > in futility. should you yet want the shloka I would of

> > > course

> > > > be

> > > > > > glad to

> > > > > > > give it to you.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Om Gurave namah

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > You seem to be disagreeing with Shri B.V. Raman that

> strong

> > > > > > planets,

> > > > > > > > whether malefic or benefics give good results, while

> weak

> > > > planets

> > > > > > > > give bad results. Perhaps you also disagree about

> strong

> > > > malefics

> > > > > > > > giving mahapurusha yogas. Isn't it contrary to what

> all the

> > > > > > jyotish

> > > > > > > > texts teach?

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Then, here are a few examples, where I find that strong

> > > > malefics

> > > > > > > > have neither made the natives krura nor that their

> > > > significations

> > > > > > > > suffered.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Swami Vivekananda: strong sun in lagna and mars in 5th

> > > house

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Sri Aurobindo: Strong Sun in 2nd house.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Maharshi Mahesh yogi: exalted Mars in lagna.

> > > > > > > > Ramana Maharshi: strong Mars in 8th house

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Sri Ramakrishna Paramahamsa: Exalted Saturn(9H) and

> Rahu

> > > > (4H).

> > > > > > Mars

> > > > > > > > and Venus are also exalted in rasi, while debilitated

> in

> > > > navamsa.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Sir, can you give me the reference for "vipareetam

> shaneH

> > > > > > sritam"?

> > > > > > > > Does it, by any chance, refer to Saturn's placement in

> the

> > > > 8th

> > > > > > house

> > > > > > > > being beneficial?

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > I am happy that you agree strong Saturn gives good

> results.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Can you tell me from where the saying is because i

> would

> > > > like to

> > > > > > > > read it up myself and understand.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > --- Chandrashekhar <chandrashekhar46@

> > > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk>>

> > > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > About Krura planets the saying is, that with

> > > > > > > > > > > strength the Krura grahas

> > > > > > > > > > > become more Krura (Maha-krura) and the shubha

> grahas

> > > > > > > > > > > become more shubha.

> > > > > > > > > > > Only Shani is more krura when weak and

> beneficial or

> > > > > > > > > > > less krura when

> > > > > > > > > > > strong "Viparitama shaneH smritam".

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > My sun dasa started when I was 9 years old, and

> > > > > > > > > > > ended when I was 15

> > > > > > > > > > > > years old. How come you didn't notice the

> second

> > > > > > > > > > > part? I was old

> > > > > > > > > > > > enough to understand the difference between

> > > > > > > > > > > success and failure, I

> > > > > > > > > > > > guess!

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Anyway, if you agree that Rahu is giving Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > > results, and those

> > > > > > > > > > > > results are exceptionally good, then it

> > > > > > > > > > > automatically follows that

> > > > > > > > > > > > Sun is strong in my chart because according to

> > > > > > > > > > > Shri B.V Raman, evil

> > > > > > > > > > > > planets, especially when weak, give bad results

> > > > > > > > > > > (vide "a catechism

> > > > > > > > > > > > of astrology"), while strong planets, even if

> > > > > > > > > > > evil, give good

> > > > > > > > > > > > results. If my Sun were weak, he wouldn't be

> > > > > > > > > > > giving such good

> > > > > > > > > > > > results:--))

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Since Mercury is hopelessly combust and

> inferior

> > > > > > > > > > > in shadbala

> > > > > > > > > > > > strength, the major results of Dharma

> > > > > > > > > > > karmadhipathi yoga are also

> > > > > > > > > > > > given by Sun, because according to "300

> > > > > > > > > > > combinations" of Sri

> > > > > > > > > > > > Raman, a planet with higher shadbala is more

> > > > > > > > > > > likely to give the

> > > > > > > > > > > > results of a yoga.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Regarding Karna, I request you to read the

> Karna

> > > > > > > > > > > Parva of

> > > > > > > > > > > > Mahabharata again. When he died, the nature

> bowed

> > > > > > > > > > > in grief, because

> > > > > > > > > > > > he's one of the noblest persons in Mahabharata.

> > > > > > > > > > > Even the episode you

> > > > > > > > > > > > quoted happened because Parashurama would teach

> > > > > > > > > > > only Brahmins and

> > > > > > > > > > > > Karna desperately wanted to learn dhanurvidya

> from

> > > > > > > > > > > Parashurama so

> > > > > > > > > > > > that he can support Duryodhana. Deceit is

> > > > > > > > > > > certainly punishable and

> > > > > > > > > > > > Karna did pay dearly. But it's to be borne in

> mind

> > > > > > > > > > > that whatever

> > > > > > > > > > > > Karna did was only to please Duryodhana, his

> > > > > > > > > > > dearest friend. Karna

> > > > > > > > > > > > did not gain anything personally.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the 3rd house from 8th house (I

> > > > > > > > > > > think there was a typo

> > > > > > > > > > > > at your end). In the natural zodiac, the 10 th

> > > > > > > > > > > sign, being the

> > > > > > > > > > > > cardinal earth sign, represents south /dakshina

> > > > > > > > > > > disha. South is the

> > > > > > > > > > > > direction ruled by Yama, the lord of death,

> hence

> > > > > > > > > > > 10th house

> > > > > > > > > > > > represents burial grounds. So, the Rudras

> (Saturn,

> > > > > > > > > > > Sun and Mars) are

> > > > > > > > > > > > strong in south. Also, Sun resides in south and

> > > > > > > > > > > starts his

> > > > > > > > > > > > northern voyage from here. So he has digbala in

> > > > > > > > > > > 10th house.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > I did clarify that when I referred to Surya as

> > > > > > > > > > > Karma saakshi, it's

> > > > > > > > > > > > only to his status as antaraatma and not as a

> > > > > > > > > > > deity. Perhaps this

> > > > > > > > > > > > escaped your attention.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > This is my last post on the subject.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> <%40>

> > > <%40>

> > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > > > <%40>,

> > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar

> > > > > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > You were too young for the results of the

> dasha

> > > > > > > > > > > to manifest,

> > > > > > > > > > > > though it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > is good news that your father had promotions

> and

> > > > > > > > > > > you received

> > > > > > > > > > > > > prizes/accolades during that time. It is

> > > > > > > > > > > interesting to know you

> > > > > > > > > > > > got

> > > > > > > > > > > > > these results at a young age of 9 or so as

> that

> > > > > > > > > > > is when Sun dasha

> > > > > > > > > > > > was

> > > > > > > > > > > > > operative. I am relieved you did not have any

> > > > > > > > > > > health problems in

> > > > > > > > > > > > > March-August 1970 period.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > But we are talking about Rahu and Rahu would

> > > > > > > > > > > give results of Sun

> > > > > > > > > > > > more

> > > > > > > > > > > > > prominently, by conjunction, as you guessed

> but

> > > > > > > > > > > also that of

> > > > > > > > > > > > Mercury

> > > > > > > > > > > > > (You have a Dharmakarmaadhipati yoga after

> all)

> > > > > > > > > > > and that is why I

> > > > > > > > > > > > said

> > > > > > > > > > > > > for understanding Sun its dasha instead of

> Rahu

> > > > > > > > > > > dasha needs to be

> > > > > > > > > > > > analyzed.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Mercury is malefic not because I say so but

> > > > > > > > > > > because Jyotish says

> > > > > > > > > > > > that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > mercury is malefic when conjunct a papa graha

> > > > > > > > > > > and he is conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > > two,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun and Rahu.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the apex of Artha trikona and

> > > > > > > > > > > directly involved with

> > > > > > > > > > > > > efforts to earn money. Though claimed to be

> > > > > > > > > > > smashana/burial

> > > > > > > > > > > > ground, it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > is 4th from ayush sthana (8th) and its home

> that

> > > > > > > > > > > is why affliction

> > > > > > > > > > > > to it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > can give death. But 8th is more popularly

> called

> > > > > > > > > > > mrityu sthana and

> > > > > > > > > > > > hence

> > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th is called Smashana. If it is really

> > > > > > > > > > > smashana why would it be

> > > > > > > > > > > > called

> > > > > > > > > > > > > karma sthana and why would Sun be at its most

> > > > > > > > > > > brilliant there?

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > I did not say he can not represent water

> bodies

> > > > > > > > > > > in temple, but not

> > > > > > > > > > > > only

> > > > > > > > > > > > > those.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > My Sun dasa was excellent too. My father

> > > > > > > > > > > received promotion(s),

> > > > > > > > > > > > my

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > school/college days were great and i

> received

> > > > > > > > > > > wide acclaim/prizes

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > for my ability in creative writing, Veena,

> > > > > > > > > > > quiz contests etc,

> > > > > > > > > > > > apart

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > from studies. So, for a student, I guess

> > > > > > > > > > > that's excellent!!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > How do you justify this, if Sun were weak?

> > > > > > > > > > > Rahu is certainly

> > > > > > > > > > > > giving

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > the yogakaraka results, but being in Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > > house and being

> > > > > > > > > > > > conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun, don't you think Rahu is also giving

> the

> > > > > > > > > > > results of Sun? You

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > said that mercury is malefic and heavily

> > > > > > > > > > > combust too:--))

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1th house also represent burial

> > > > > > > > > > > ground/smashaana. Is that a place

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > for attachment?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandra represents all water bodies, so why

> > > > > > > > > > > can't he represent

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > temple tank?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > === message truncated ===

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Tired of spam? Mail has the best spam

> protection

> > > > > > around

> > > > > > > > > > <>

> < <>>

> > > < <>

> < <>>>

> > > > > > < <>

> < <>>

> > > < <>

> < <>>>>

> > > > > > > > < <>

> < <>>

> > > < <>

> < <>>>

> > > > > > < <>

> < <>>

> > > < <>

> < <>>>>>

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > ------------------

> ----

> > > --

> > > > -

> > > > > > > > -------

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.11.7/435 -

> > > Release

> > > > > > Date:

> > > > > > > > 8/31/2006

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

[Guest guest]

Dear Divine Lakshmi,

The translation is by Dr. Murlidhar Chaturvedi Jyotishaacharya and Vidya

Vaaridhi, of Sanskrit Vishwa Vidyalaya Varanasi, and Mada is translated

as Mada only for obvious reasons.

 

Rahu is more associated with intoxication and one can also be

intoxicated with lust. Sukha is happiness is that not so? Why should

Rahu when associated with Lust be Kalatra karaka? Moon is also

attributed Lust by the Venerated Parashara. I do not finding him using

such convoluted logic and make him Kalatra karaka.

 

Of course for the sake of argument we may go on playing around with

words to the exclusion of astrological principles, but that will not

serve any purpose.

Chandrashekhar.

 

b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

>

>

> Om Gurave Namah

>

> Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

>

> I forgot to add:

>

> 1) you must be having a copy of Saravali yourself. Who translated

> it? Can you share with us how the shloka had been translated and how

> the word "mada" been treated?

>

> 2)If "mada" is lust, then is Rahu the karaka for sexual pleasures in

> your view, and not Venus? Should Rahu become the kalatra karaka?

> The "sukha" attributed to Venus by Kalyana Varma... does it not

> encompass physical pleasures? If it does, then why did the author

> choose to include "lust" as a separate karakatwa under a different

> planet? Was he being redundant?

>

> 3) Sir, i would humbly request you to consider all these heated

> discussions in the nature of an enquiry. My great regard and

> affection for you remain the same, as yours remain for me. Please

> forgive me if i have hurt you in the course of these discussions.

>

> All of us are winners here and no losers, because we all are

> learning in the process, and I always liked to believe that one who

> learns never loses:--))

>

> regards,

> Lakshmi

>

>

> <%40>, "b_lakshmi_ramesh"

> <b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> >

> > Om Gurave Namah

> >

> > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> >

> > It is interesting to see that you do not think that pride and ego

> > are not one and the same thing. Please refer to your own message at

> >

> > /message/11735

> </message/11735>

> >

> > where you mentioned the following:

> >

> > "we find that Bhava Manjari does

> > attribute Abhimana (pride/ego) to Surya and so does Bhuvan Deepak."

> >

> > How come pride/ego are synonymous in the case of Sun and not so in

> > the case of Rahu? Is this fair? And, is this necessary?

> >

> > Isn't "abhimaana" a much milder word than "mada"? The

> > word "abhimaana" might have positive connotations, but the

> > word "mada" has absolutely no positive connotations. Pradeep may

> > not understand this but I am sure you do.

> >

> > Fair arguments never hurt me, sir, but this sort of arguments,

> > especially coming from you, certainly confound me.

> >

> > Can you quote any pramaana that says "mada" means only lust and

> not

> > pride/ego/vanity etc?

> >

> > Regarding vidyaa/avidyaa and auspicious/inauspicious nature of

> > Mother:

> >

> > Vidyaavidya swaroopini: 402nd name of Mother

> >

> > Vidyaamchaavidyaamchayasthadvedobhayam saH, avidyayaamritu

> > teerthva,vidyayaamritamasnutha, vidyaina charamavrittiroopam

> > jnaanam, avidyaa bhedabhraantiroopam jnaanam"

> >

> > Avidya results in mrityu while vidyaa results in immortality and

> > moiksha. Vidyaa gives charama vrittiroopa jnaanam, while avidya

> > gives bhedabhraanthiroopa jnaanam.

> >

> > So, which one is auspicious? The direction which gives

> > immortality/moksha or the direction which results in

> > differentiation, delusion and death?

> >

> > Further in the explanation of the name "BhadramoorthiH" it is

> stated

> > in Soubhagyabhaskaram that "brahmam tanmangalam". The true

> > auspiciousness is that after which no other inauspiciousness

> occurs.

> > In a state which is dominated by desires, delusions etc

> > (mooladhara), this is impossible. This state of " absoluteness

> > auspiciousness " is possible only at the state of Brahman

> > (sahasraara).

> >

> > "theshaamcha lokaapibahuvidhaaH parasivaabhinnamahaashaktistu

> > sarvalokaatheethaa mahaakailaasaaparaajithaadi padapratipaadye

> > sarvalokotthare tisthathi.anyaapaam sivashakteenaam kathipayaanam

> > saattwikshareeraanyapi sattwaadhikyagunaantharaalpatwa yukthaani

> na

> > punaH shuddhasattwaani..

> >

> > "The form where Mother is one with shiva is the

> highest/mahaashakti

> > form. All shiva+shakti roopas are sattwa roopas, but those lower

> > than this are a mixture of rajo and tamo gunas.

> >

> > I hope these suffice, or if you want, I can quote more.

> >

> > Regards,

> > Lakshmi

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > >

> > > Pride is different from ego. Like it or not Mada does mean

> > intoxication

> > > or lust. The Kama that is referred to relates to kaamana which

> > means

> > > desires for things possessed by others. That is what Asteya, one

> > of the

> > > Yamas of Hatha yogas refer to.

> > >

> > > We are talking about auspiciousness or other wise of the dormant

> > or

> > > awakened Kundalini. As I said all scriptures can be

> misinterpreted

> > if

> > > one wants to do that. But that does not serve any purpose. I

> would

> > not

> > > go into what exactly is meant by Vidya and Avidya related to

> Maa.

> > I have

> > > not yet seen any Pramana, in the form of a shloka, to support

> your

> > > proposition that dormant Kundalini is inauspicious and the

> > awakened

> > > Kundalini is auspicious so far. I have already posted the way my

> > > generation has been taught to accept an argument, so I shall not

> > repeat

> > > it here.

> > >

> > > But I will not resort to conjectures and would like to quote

> from

> > > Rudrayamala tantra about the swarUpa of dormant Kundalini. Being

> > > graduate in sanskrit, I am sure I will not have to translate it

> > for you.

> > > Aaxare prdevta Éìjntax> k…{flI devta

> > > ädhäre paradevatä bhavrajanatädhaù kuëòalé devatä

> > > devanamixdevta iÇjgtamanNdpuÃiSwta,

> > > devänämadhidevatä trijagatämänandapuïjasthitä|

> > > mUlaxarinvaisnI iÇrm[i ya }ainnI mailnI

> > > mülädhäraniväsiné triramaëé yä jïäniné mäliné

> > > sa me mat&mnuiSwta k…lpwanNdEkbIjanna.32,21.

> > > sä me mätåmanusthitä kulapathänandaikabéjänanä||32|21||

> > >

> > > I am sure you must have some quote to support your contention. I

> > would

> > > like to see the shloka, as against conjectures, so that I can

> > improve

> > > upon my knowledge of the swarupaa of Kundalini.

> > >

> > > I can understand your reluctance to support your propositions

> with

> > > suitable pramanas. I am sorry if I have hurt you by pointing out

> > the

> > > inconsistency in the way you treated Surya and Rahu combinations

> > in two

> > > different chart as stand out combinations only.

> > >

> > > I had no intention to cause any hurt to you and if I have done

> so

> > > inadvertently I crave your pardon.

> > >

> > > Take care,

> > >

> > > Chandrashekhar

> > >

> > >

> > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > >

> > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > >

> > > > The shadripus are kaama (lust), krodha (anger), lobha (greed),

> > moha

> > > > (attachment, delusion), mada (pride) and maatsarya (jealousy)

> > > > If "mada" means "lust" what does "kaama" imply among the

> > > > shadripus? "Mada" signifies one who is intoxicated/drunk with

> > > > power/self-grandeur (pride/ego).

> > > >

> > > > Mother is known as "Vidya and avidya swaroopini" and correct

> > > > appreciation of Mother includes understanding of both facets.

> As

> > > > Shakti, She respresents raw power which can be routed towards

> > good

> > > > deeds as well as bad deeds. Are both ends the same? The wisdom,

> > > > required to put this immense shakti to good use, is

> represented

> > by

> > > > Shiva, hence the union of Shiva and Parvati, wisdom and power,

> is

> > > > said to be auspicious because it ensures the correct/judicious

> > end

> > > > use of shakti. Hence the orientation of Shakti is very very

> > > > important.

> > > >

> > > > I always said that Soorya is both sattwik and krura. I also

> > always

> > > > said all planets, including Jupiter, can give malefic results,

> if

> > > > they are functionally empowered to do so. You can refer to all

> my

> > > > previous mails to confirm this.

> > > >

> > > > Sir, Truth is much more important than winning or losing an

> > > > argument. All discussions must proceed as an exploration and

> > > > celebration of Truth. When this is not the case, I see no

> > purpose in

> > > > continuing these discussions.

> > > >

> > > > Thanks & Regards,

> > > > Lakshmi

> > > >

> > > >

> <%40>

> > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > >

> > > > > Having Icchamrityu and dying at an early age are operating at

> > > > different

> > > > > levels. Bhishma had Iccha Mrityu but did not die young. So

> > please

> > > > do not

> > > > > try to mix the issues. If you have read Swamiji's biography

> you

> > > > will

> > > > > find that he fell sick many times despite of apparent robust

> > > > physique.

> > > > >

> > > > > Commenting on Shani in 4th for Rama's chart confirms with his

> > > > being

> > > > > capable of giving Vipareeta results. I did not know I was

> > expected

> > > > to

> > > > > analyze the entire chart. By the way if there is a Kuja

> dosha

> > how

> > > > does

> > > > > that by itself give a Divine wife? Please do not bring our

> > > > devotion to

> > > > > Lord Rama (and we both have that) into astrological analysis

> of

> > > > his chart.

> > > > >

> > > > > Bringing in the dashas when the discussions are on the

> effects

> > of

> > > > grahas

> > > > > will only lead the discussion to no where. The two have to

> be

> > seen

> > > > > separately as we are not trying to time an event but only

> > trying

> > > > to find

> > > > > what are the effects on bhavas occupied.

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear Lakshmi in Ramana Maharshi's chart you have perhaps

> > forgotten

> > > > the

> > > > > saying Kuja vat Ketu. look at the Ketu deha in that

> perspective

> > > > and let

> > > > > me know your views. And if by the way you read my mail, I

> did

> > not

> > > > say

> > > > > anything about mars being killer for him, only that it gave

> him

> > > > Sarcoma

> > > > > being 3rd lord.

> > > > >

> > > > > Also could you explain why Sun being Atma and always

> > beneficent as

> > > > you

> > > > > have claimed all along in the thread on the topic, did its

> > > > Mahadasha

> > > > > prove to be Killer to Ramana Maharshi?

> > > > >

> > > > > Take care,

> > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > > For example, remember that in Swami Vivekananda's chart

> > Surya

> > > > is

> > > > > > lord of

> > > > > > > the 9th occupying the lagna and causing a powerful Raj

> > yoga. At

> > > > > > the same

> > > > > > > time if you thin how long the Swamiji lived, you may

> have

> > to

> > > > think

> > > > > > again

> > > > > > > about saying that it did not act as Mahakrura. Think

> about

> > > > what it

> > > > > > did

> > > > > > > to the 7th bhava of Swamiji, also, before declaring that

> it

> > > > became

> > > > > > > shubha or less malefic.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Lakshmi: I think Swamiji had an icchamrityu and looking at

> > the

> > > > dass

> > > > > > operating on 4th July 1902, I observe that he passed away

> in

> > Jup-

> > > > Ven-

> > > > > > Jup-Ket-Sat-Sat.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Jup MD: 1893-02-09 (1:35:30 pm) - 1909-02-10 (3:59:13 pm)

> > > > > > Ven AD: 1900-12-25 (10:03:30 am) - 1903-08-27 (4:48:54 pm)

> > > > > > Jup PD: 1902-05-02 (1:42:07 pm) - 1902-09-12 (10:43:55 pm)

> > > > > > Ket SD: 1902-06-29 (9:11:48 am) - 1902-07-07 (5:06:28 am)

> > > > > > Sat PAD: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-06 (2:29:24 am)

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Sat: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-05 (1:27:03 am)

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Jupiter is in 2nd house from Moon, Venus is the 2nd lord

> from

> > > > Moon

> > > > > > and is posited in 2nd from lagna, Ketu is in the house of

> > Venus

> > > > and

> > > > > > gives the results of Venus and Saturn is the 2nd lord from

> > > > > > lagna....all are marakas. the maraka significations are

> > stronger

> > > > > > from Moon, and it's the cause of his early death.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I fail to see where Sun comes into all this.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > However, I agree that Sun, as AK aspecting 7th house, can

> > give

> > > > > > parivraja tendencies. But can you ignore the influence of

> > Saturn

> > > > on

> > > > > > Moon and 4th house, occuring in the 10th house? I am sure

> > even

> > > > weak

> > > > > > Sun would have given him parivraja yoga:--))but without

> the

> > raja

> > > > > > yoga and the strong soul-level impact he created wherever

> he

> > > > went.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Or if you like look at what happened to the 7th

> > > > > > > Bhava of Lord Rama with exalted Mars in the 7th bhava.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Mars in 7th gives kuja dosha, and I think the strong Mars

> in

> > 7th

> > > > > > gave him an exalted wife like Sita. You have not commented

> > on the

> > > > > > exalted Saturn in 4th house.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > In each of the

> > > > > > > example provided by you look at the bhava that the

> planets

> > > > occupy

> > > > > > > (barring Saturn, for reasons already stated in previous

> > mail),

> > > > > > without

> > > > > > > looking at the charts as belonging to great people, and

> > then

> > > > make

> > > > > > up

> > > > > > > your mind as to the truth or otherwise of what I said.

> Did

> > you

> > > > > > know

> > > > > > > Ramana Maharshi died following a malignant sarcoma of

> left

> > hand

> > > > > > and Mars

> > > > > > > is karaka for the 3rd bhava in 8th in his chart, in

> > > > exaltation. Do

> > > > > > you

> > > > > > > think Mars gave him benevolent results?

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I also request you to examine the following

> > dasa

> > > > > > sequences with an open mind. Sun is the 3rd lord from Moon

> > (AK) &

> > > > > > 12th lord from lagna in Sri Ramana's chart, rahu is with

> Sun

> > and

> > > > > > gives Sun'/Saturn's/Jupiter's effects...all of which point

> to

> > > > > > dusthanas, Saturn is a maraka in 7th house and ketu can

> give

> > the

> > > > > > effects of Moon/Mercury/mars. Mar's effect, if at all, was

> > only

> > > > > > indirect, and he was not the killer.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Sun MD: 1949-02-03 (1:02:22 am) - 1955-02-03 (2:05:32 pm)

> > > > > > Rah AD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1951-02-21 (8:49:14 am)

> > > > > > Rah PD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1950-05-18 (12:04:47 am)

> > > > > > Sat SD: 1950-04-12 (3:37:16 am) - 1950-04-20 (12:18:02 am)

> > > > > > Ket PAD: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14 (11:08:26

> pm)

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Ket: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14 (12:47:04 pm)

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I think what stands out is the fact that the dasa of the

> > graha

> > > > > > conjoined Moon brought about death. I think their mind

> > willed the

> > > > > > death.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Can a planet give results in a dasa totally

> > > > unrelated/unassociated

> > > > > > with itself? I request you to consider the above

> objectively.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I will talk about the other charts/issues in my next mail.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > >

> > > > > > In Paramhans Ramkrishna's chart,

> > > > > > > I do not know where you find Mars strong as a planet in

> > > > > > debilitation in

> > > > > > > Navamsha gives results of debility even when in

> exaltation

> > in

> > > > rasi

> > > > > > > chart. In case of Saturn Viparitam shane smritam has

> > already

> > > > been

> > > > > > > mentioned by me, in earlier mail.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I myself have not considered Mars/Venus in

> > Thakur's

> > > > > > chart because they are debilitated. Please go through my

> > message

> > > > > > again. I was talking about Saturn and Rahu.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > About Shri Aurobindo, I trust you are

> > > > > > > aware of his revolutionary background and that he was

> > editor

> > > > of a

> > > > > > paper

> > > > > > > "Vande Mataram" not much known for its soft language.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > > Same is the case with strong Malefics giving P.M. Yogas.

> > Every

> > > > > > graha is

> > > > > > > capable of 12 variations of a P.M. Yoga attributed to

> it,

> > at

> > > > the

> > > > > > very

> > > > > > > least. It would only be naive to imagine they would all

> > give

> > > > > > identical

> > > > > > > results as indicated by Parashara or all with Pancha

> > > > Mahapurusha

> > > > > > Yoga

> > > > > > > would only rule over different parts of India (barring

> > Saturn),

> > > > > > just

> > > > > > > because the sage said so. The sages gave us principles

> and

> > > > > > expected us

> > > > > > > to apply them to real life horoscope using Viveka.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I would gladly give you the shloka giving the reference

> to

> > > > > > > "Viparita---Shane..." it is from an old classic respected

> > > > amongst

> > > > > > > astrologers, but as you do not seem to accept anything

> that

> > > > does

> > > > > > not fit

> > > > > > > in with what, you think. is said by Dr. Raman, it would

> be

> > an

> > > > > > exercise

> > > > > > > in futility. should you yet want the shloka I would of

> > course

> > > > be

> > > > > > glad to

> > > > > > > give it to you.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Om Gurave namah

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > You seem to be disagreeing with Shri B.V. Raman that

> > strong

> > > > > > planets,

> > > > > > > > whether malefic or benefics give good results, while

> weak

> > > > planets

> > > > > > > > give bad results. Perhaps you also disagree about

> strong

> > > > malefics

> > > > > > > > giving mahapurusha yogas. Isn't it contrary to what

> all

> > the

> > > > > > jyotish

> > > > > > > > texts teach?

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Then, here are a few examples, where I find that strong

> > > > malefics

> > > > > > > > have neither made the natives krura nor that their

> > > > significations

> > > > > > > > suffered.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Swami Vivekananda: strong sun in lagna and mars in 5th

> > house

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Sri Aurobindo: Strong Sun in 2nd house.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Maharshi Mahesh yogi: exalted Mars in lagna.

> > > > > > > > Ramana Maharshi: strong Mars in 8th house

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Sri Ramakrishna Paramahamsa: Exalted Saturn(9H) and

> Rahu

> > > > (4H).

> > > > > > Mars

> > > > > > > > and Venus are also exalted in rasi, while debilitated

> in

> > > > navamsa.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Sir, can you give me the reference for "vipareetam

> shaneH

> > > > > > sritam"?

> > > > > > > > Does it, by any chance, refer to Saturn's placement in

> > the

> > > > 8th

> > > > > > house

> > > > > > > > being beneficial?

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > I am happy that you agree strong Saturn gives good

> > results.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Can you tell me from where the saying is because i

> would

> > > > like to

> > > > > > > > read it up myself and understand.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > --- Chandrashekhar <chandrashekhar46@

> > > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk>>

> > > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > About Krura planets the saying is, that with

> > > > > > > > > > > strength the Krura grahas

> > > > > > > > > > > become more Krura (Maha-krura) and the shubha

> > grahas

> > > > > > > > > > > become more shubha.

> > > > > > > > > > > Only Shani is more krura when weak and

> beneficial

> > or

> > > > > > > > > > > less krura when

> > > > > > > > > > > strong "Viparitama shaneH smritam".

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > My sun dasa started when I was 9 years old, and

> > > > > > > > > > > ended when I was 15

> > > > > > > > > > > > years old. How come you didn't notice the

> second

> > > > > > > > > > > part? I was old

> > > > > > > > > > > > enough to understand the difference between

> > > > > > > > > > > success and failure, I

> > > > > > > > > > > > guess!

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Anyway, if you agree that Rahu is giving Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > > results, and those

> > > > > > > > > > > > results are exceptionally good, then it

> > > > > > > > > > > automatically follows that

> > > > > > > > > > > > Sun is strong in my chart because according to

> > > > > > > > > > > Shri B.V Raman, evil

> > > > > > > > > > > > planets, especially when weak, give bad results

> > > > > > > > > > > (vide "a catechism

> > > > > > > > > > > > of astrology"), while strong planets, even if

> > > > > > > > > > > evil, give good

> > > > > > > > > > > > results. If my Sun were weak, he wouldn't be

> > > > > > > > > > > giving such good

> > > > > > > > > > > > results:--))

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Since Mercury is hopelessly combust and

> inferior

> > > > > > > > > > > in shadbala

> > > > > > > > > > > > strength, the major results of Dharma

> > > > > > > > > > > karmadhipathi yoga are also

> > > > > > > > > > > > given by Sun, because according to "300

> > > > > > > > > > > combinations" of Sri

> > > > > > > > > > > > Raman, a planet with higher shadbala is more

> > > > > > > > > > > likely to give the

> > > > > > > > > > > > results of a yoga.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Regarding Karna, I request you to read the

> Karna

> > > > > > > > > > > Parva of

> > > > > > > > > > > > Mahabharata again. When he died, the nature

> bowed

> > > > > > > > > > > in grief, because

> > > > > > > > > > > > he's one of the noblest persons in Mahabharata.

> > > > > > > > > > > Even the episode you

> > > > > > > > > > > > quoted happened because Parashurama would teach

> > > > > > > > > > > only Brahmins and

> > > > > > > > > > > > Karna desperately wanted to learn dhanurvidya

> > from

> > > > > > > > > > > Parashurama so

> > > > > > > > > > > > that he can support Duryodhana. Deceit is

> > > > > > > > > > > certainly punishable and

> > > > > > > > > > > > Karna did pay dearly. But it's to be borne in

> > mind

> > > > > > > > > > > that whatever

> > > > > > > > > > > > Karna did was only to please Duryodhana, his

> > > > > > > > > > > dearest friend. Karna

> > > > > > > > > > > > did not gain anything personally.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the 3rd house from 8th house (I

> > > > > > > > > > > think there was a typo

> > > > > > > > > > > > at your end). In the natural zodiac, the 10 th

> > > > > > > > > > > sign, being the

> > > > > > > > > > > > cardinal earth sign, represents south /dakshina

> > > > > > > > > > > disha. South is the

> > > > > > > > > > > > direction ruled by Yama, the lord of death,

> hence

> > > > > > > > > > > 10th house

> > > > > > > > > > > > represents burial grounds. So, the Rudras

> > (Saturn,

> > > > > > > > > > > Sun and Mars) are

> > > > > > > > > > > > strong in south. Also, Sun resides in south and

> > > > > > > > > > > starts his

> > > > > > > > > > > > northern voyage from here. So he has digbala in

> > > > > > > > > > > 10th house.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > I did clarify that when I referred to Surya as

> > > > > > > > > > > Karma saakshi, it's

> > > > > > > > > > > > only to his status as antaraatma and not as a

> > > > > > > > > > > deity. Perhaps this

> > > > > > > > > > > > escaped your attention.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > This is my last post on the subject.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> <%40>

> > > > <%40>

> > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > > > <%40>,

> > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar

> > > > > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > You were too young for the results of the

> dasha

> > > > > > > > > > > to manifest,

> > > > > > > > > > > > though it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > is good news that your father had promotions

> > and

> > > > > > > > > > > you received

> > > > > > > > > > > > > prizes/accolades during that time. It is

> > > > > > > > > > > interesting to know you

> > > > > > > > > > > > got

> > > > > > > > > > > > > these results at a young age of 9 or so as

> that

> > > > > > > > > > > is when Sun dasha

> > > > > > > > > > > > was

> > > > > > > > > > > > > operative. I am relieved you did not have any

> > > > > > > > > > > health problems in

> > > > > > > > > > > > > March-August 1970 period.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > But we are talking about Rahu and Rahu would

> > > > > > > > > > > give results of Sun

> > > > > > > > > > > > more

> > > > > > > > > > > > > prominently, by conjunction, as you guessed

> but

> > > > > > > > > > > also that of

> > > > > > > > > > > > Mercury

> > > > > > > > > > > > > (You have a Dharmakarmaadhipati yoga after

> all)

> > > > > > > > > > > and that is why I

> > > > > > > > > > > > said

> > > > > > > > > > > > > for understanding Sun its dasha instead of

> Rahu

> > > > > > > > > > > dasha needs to be

> > > > > > > > > > > > analyzed.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Mercury is malefic not because I say so but

> > > > > > > > > > > because Jyotish says

> > > > > > > > > > > > that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > mercury is malefic when conjunct a papa graha

> > > > > > > > > > > and he is conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > > two,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun and Rahu.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the apex of Artha trikona and

> > > > > > > > > > > directly involved with

> > > > > > > > > > > > > efforts to earn money. Though claimed to be

> > > > > > > > > > > smashana/burial

> > > > > > > > > > > > ground, it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > is 4th from ayush sthana (8th) and its home

> > that

> > > > > > > > > > > is why affliction

> > > > > > > > > > > > to it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > can give death. But 8th is more popularly

> > called

> > > > > > > > > > > mrityu sthana and

> > > > > > > > > > > > hence

> > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th is called Smashana. If it is really

> > > > > > > > > > > smashana why would it be

> > > > > > > > > > > > called

> > > > > > > > > > > > > karma sthana and why would Sun be at its most

> > > > > > > > > > > brilliant there?

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > I did not say he can not represent water

> bodies

> > > > > > > > > > > in temple, but not

> > > > > > > > > > > > only

> > > > > > > > > > > > > those.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > My Sun dasa was excellent too. My father

> > > > > > > > > > > received promotion(s),

> > > > > > > > > > > > my

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > school/college days were great and i

> received

> > > > > > > > > > > wide acclaim/prizes

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > for my ability in creative writing, Veena,

> > > > > > > > > > > quiz contests etc,

> > > > > > > > > > > > apart

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > from studies. So, for a student, I guess

> > > > > > > > > > > that's excellent!!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > How do you justify this, if Sun were weak?

> > > > > > > > > > > Rahu is certainly

> > > > > > > > > > > > giving

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > the yogakaraka results, but being in Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > > house and being

> > > > > > > > > > > > conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun, don't you think Rahu is also giving

> the

> > > > > > > > > > > results of Sun? You

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > said that mercury is malefic and heavily

> > > > > > > > > > > combust too:--))

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1th house also represent burial

> > > > > > > > > > > ground/smashaana. Is that a place

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > for attachment?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandra represents all water bodies, so why

> > > > > > > > > > > can't he represent

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > temple tank?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > === message truncated ===

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Tired of spam? Mail has the best spam

> > protection

> > > > > > around

> > > > > > > > > > <>

> < <>>

> > > > < <>

> < <>>>

> > > > > > < <>

> < <>>

> > > > < <>

> < <>>>>

> > > > > > > > < <>

> < <>>

> > > > < <>

> < <>>>

> > > > > > < <>

> < <>>

> > > > < <>

> < <>>>>>

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > ------------------

> --

> > ----

> > > > -

> > > > > > > > -------

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.11.7/435 -

> > Release

> > > > > > Date:

> > > > > > > > 8/31/2006

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

[Guest guest]

Dear Divine Lakshmi,

 

At least AI did not answer as I did not want to split hairs over whether

all that is mentioned in the referred shloka is inner quality since I do

not find Kalyan Varman mentioning or implying so. However as you want an

reply, let me ask as to why if speech, attributed to Budha in the

shloka, can be internal quality according to you then why should

intoxication not be?

 

Chandrashekhar.

 

 

b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

>

>

> Om Gurave Namah

>

> Namaste Chandrasekhar ji & Pradeep ji,

>

> I recollect writing in my previous e-mails, that the shloka from

> Saravali talks about the inner qualities of an

> individual/kalapurusha. Does the word "mada" imply intoxication as

> an inner quality? Does the word "intoxication" belong in that

> context, in that group?

>

> I do not think either of you responded to that. perhaps you missed

> it out in the avalanche of e-mails:--))

>

> Can i have your response(s) please?

>

> Regards,

> Lakshmi

>

>

> <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> <chandrashekhar46 wrote:

> >

> > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> >

> > Pride is different from ego. Like it or not Mada does mean

> intoxication

> > or lust. The Kama that is referred to relates to kaamana which

> means

> > desires for things possessed by others. That is what Asteya, one

> of the

> > Yamas of Hatha yogas refer to.

> >

> > We are talking about auspiciousness or other wise of the dormant

> or

> > awakened Kundalini. As I said all scriptures can be misinterpreted

> if

> > one wants to do that. But that does not serve any purpose. I would

> not

> > go into what exactly is meant by Vidya and Avidya related to Maa.

> I have

> > not yet seen any Pramana, in the form of a shloka, to support your

> > proposition that dormant Kundalini is inauspicious and the

> awakened

> > Kundalini is auspicious so far. I have already posted the way my

> > generation has been taught to accept an argument, so I shall not

> repeat

> > it here.

> >

> > But I will not resort to conjectures and would like to quote from

> > Rudrayamala tantra about the swarUpa of dormant Kundalini. Being

> > graduate in sanskrit, I am sure I will not have to translate it

> for you.

> > Aaxare prdevta Éìjntax> k…{flI devta

> > ädhäre paradevatä bhavrajanatädhaù kuëòalé devatä

> > devanamixdevta iÇjgtamanNdpuÃiSwta,

> > devänämadhidevatä trijagatämänandapuïjasthitä|

> > mUlaxarinvaisnI iÇrm[i ya }ainnI mailnI

> > mülädhäraniväsiné triramaëé yä jïäniné mäliné

> > sa me mat&mnuiSwta k…lpwanNdEkbIjanna.32,21.

> > sä me mätåmanusthitä kulapathänandaikabéjänanä||32|21||

> >

> > I am sure you must have some quote to support your contention. I

> would

> > like to see the shloka, as against conjectures, so that I can

> improve

> > upon my knowledge of the swarupaa of Kundalini.

> >

> > I can understand your reluctance to support your propositions with

> > suitable pramanas. I am sorry if I have hurt you by pointing out

> the

> > inconsistency in the way you treated Surya and Rahu combinations

> in two

> > different chart as stand out combinations only.

> >

> > I had no intention to cause any hurt to you and if I have done so

> > inadvertently I crave your pardon.

> >

> > Take care,

> >

> > Chandrashekhar

> >

> >

> > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > >

> > > Om Gurave Namah

> > >

> > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > >

> > > The shadripus are kaama (lust), krodha (anger), lobha (greed),

> moha

> > > (attachment, delusion), mada (pride) and maatsarya (jealousy)

> > > If "mada" means "lust" what does "kaama" imply among the

> > > shadripus? "Mada" signifies one who is intoxicated/drunk with

> > > power/self-grandeur (pride/ego).

> > >

> > > Mother is known as "Vidya and avidya swaroopini" and correct

> > > appreciation of Mother includes understanding of both facets. As

> > > Shakti, She respresents raw power which can be routed towards

> good

> > > deeds as well as bad deeds. Are both ends the same? The wisdom,

> > > required to put this immense shakti to good use, is represented

> by

> > > Shiva, hence the union of Shiva and Parvati, wisdom and power, is

> > > said to be auspicious because it ensures the correct/judicious

> end

> > > use of shakti. Hence the orientation of Shakti is very very

> > > important.

> > >

> > > I always said that Soorya is both sattwik and krura. I also

> always

> > > said all planets, including Jupiter, can give malefic results, if

> > > they are functionally empowered to do so. You can refer to all my

> > > previous mails to confirm this.

> > >

> > > Sir, Truth is much more important than winning or losing an

> > > argument. All discussions must proceed as an exploration and

> > > celebration of Truth. When this is not the case, I see no

> purpose in

> > > continuing these discussions.

> > >

> > > Thanks & Regards,

> > > Lakshmi

> > >

> > >

> <%40>

> > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > >

> > > > Having Icchamrityu and dying at an early age are operating at

> > > different

> > > > levels. Bhishma had Iccha Mrityu but did not die young. So

> please

> > > do not

> > > > try to mix the issues. If you have read Swamiji's biography you

> > > will

> > > > find that he fell sick many times despite of apparent robust

> > > physique.

> > > >

> > > > Commenting on Shani in 4th for Rama's chart confirms with his

> > > being

> > > > capable of giving Vipareeta results. I did not know I was

> expected

> > > to

> > > > analyze the entire chart. By the way if there is a Kuja dosha

> how

> > > does

> > > > that by itself give a Divine wife? Please do not bring our

> > > devotion to

> > > > Lord Rama (and we both have that) into astrological analysis of

> > > his chart.

> > > >

> > > > Bringing in the dashas when the discussions are on the effects

> of

> > > grahas

> > > > will only lead the discussion to no where. The two have to be

> seen

> > > > separately as we are not trying to time an event but only

> trying

> > > to find

> > > > what are the effects on bhavas occupied.

> > > >

> > > > Dear Lakshmi in Ramana Maharshi's chart you have perhaps

> forgotten

> > > the

> > > > saying Kuja vat Ketu. look at the Ketu deha in that perspective

> > > and let

> > > > me know your views. And if by the way you read my mail, I did

> not

> > > say

> > > > anything about mars being killer for him, only that it gave him

> > > Sarcoma

> > > > being 3rd lord.

> > > >

> > > > Also could you explain why Sun being Atma and always

> beneficent as

> > > you

> > > > have claimed all along in the thread on the topic, did its

> > > Mahadasha

> > > > prove to be Killer to Ramana Maharshi?

> > > >

> > > > Take care,

> > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > >

> > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > > For example, remember that in Swami Vivekananda's chart

> Surya

> > > is

> > > > > lord of

> > > > > > the 9th occupying the lagna and causing a powerful Raj

> yoga. At

> > > > > the same

> > > > > > time if you thin how long the Swamiji lived, you may have

> to

> > > think

> > > > > again

> > > > > > about saying that it did not act as Mahakrura. Think about

> > > what it

> > > > > did

> > > > > > to the 7th bhava of Swamiji, also, before declaring that it

> > > became

> > > > > > shubha or less malefic.

> > > > >

> > > > > Lakshmi: I think Swamiji had an icchamrityu and looking at

> the

> > > dass

> > > > > operating on 4th July 1902, I observe that he passed away in

> Jup-

> > > Ven-

> > > > > Jup-Ket-Sat-Sat.

> > > > >

> > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > >

> > > > > Jup MD: 1893-02-09 (1:35:30 pm) - 1909-02-10 (3:59:13 pm)

> > > > > Ven AD: 1900-12-25 (10:03:30 am) - 1903-08-27 (4:48:54 pm)

> > > > > Jup PD: 1902-05-02 (1:42:07 pm) - 1902-09-12 (10:43:55 pm)

> > > > > Ket SD: 1902-06-29 (9:11:48 am) - 1902-07-07 (5:06:28 am)

> > > > > Sat PAD: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-06 (2:29:24 am)

> > > > >

> > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > >

> > > > > Sat: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-05 (1:27:03 am)

> > > > >

> > > > > Jupiter is in 2nd house from Moon, Venus is the 2nd lord from

> > > Moon

> > > > > and is posited in 2nd from lagna, Ketu is in the house of

> Venus

> > > and

> > > > > gives the results of Venus and Saturn is the 2nd lord from

> > > > > lagna....all are marakas. the maraka significations are

> stronger

> > > > > from Moon, and it's the cause of his early death.

> > > > >

> > > > > I fail to see where Sun comes into all this.

> > > > >

> > > > > However, I agree that Sun, as AK aspecting 7th house, can

> give

> > > > > parivraja tendencies. But can you ignore the influence of

> Saturn

> > > on

> > > > > Moon and 4th house, occuring in the 10th house? I am sure

> even

> > > weak

> > > > > Sun would have given him parivraja yoga:--))but without the

> raja

> > > > > yoga and the strong soul-level impact he created wherever he

> > > went.

> > > > >

> > > > > Or if you like look at what happened to the 7th

> > > > > > Bhava of Lord Rama with exalted Mars in the 7th bhava.

> > > > >

> > > > > Mars in 7th gives kuja dosha, and I think the strong Mars in

> 7th

> > > > > gave him an exalted wife like Sita. You have not commented

> on the

> > > > > exalted Saturn in 4th house.

> > > > >

> > > > > In each of the

> > > > > > example provided by you look at the bhava that the planets

> > > occupy

> > > > > > (barring Saturn, for reasons already stated in previous

> mail),

> > > > > without

> > > > > > looking at the charts as belonging to great people, and

> then

> > > make

> > > > > up

> > > > > > your mind as to the truth or otherwise of what I said. Did

> you

> > > > > know

> > > > > > Ramana Maharshi died following a malignant sarcoma of left

> hand

> > > > > and Mars

> > > > > > is karaka for the 3rd bhava in 8th in his chart, in

> > > exaltation. Do

> > > > > you

> > > > > > think Mars gave him benevolent results?

> > > > >

> > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I also request you to examine the following

> dasa

> > > > > sequences with an open mind. Sun is the 3rd lord from Moon

> (AK) &

> > > > > 12th lord from lagna in Sri Ramana's chart, rahu is with Sun

> and

> > > > > gives Sun'/Saturn's/Jupiter's effects...all of which point to

> > > > > dusthanas, Saturn is a maraka in 7th house and ketu can give

> the

> > > > > effects of Moon/Mercury/mars. Mar's effect, if at all, was

> only

> > > > > indirect, and he was not the killer.

> > > > >

> > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > >

> > > > > Sun MD: 1949-02-03 (1:02:22 am) - 1955-02-03 (2:05:32 pm)

> > > > > Rah AD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1951-02-21 (8:49:14 am)

> > > > > Rah PD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1950-05-18 (12:04:47 am)

> > > > > Sat SD: 1950-04-12 (3:37:16 am) - 1950-04-20 (12:18:02 am)

> > > > > Ket PAD: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14 (11:08:26 pm)

> > > > >

> > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > >

> > > > > Ket: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14 (12:47:04 pm)

> > > > >

> > > > > I think what stands out is the fact that the dasa of the

> graha

> > > > > conjoined Moon brought about death. I think their mind

> willed the

> > > > > death.

> > > > >

> > > > > Can a planet give results in a dasa totally

> > > unrelated/unassociated

> > > > > with itself? I request you to consider the above objectively.

> > > > >

> > > > > I will talk about the other charts/issues in my next mail.

> > > > >

> > > > > Regards,

> > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > >

> > > > > In Paramhans Ramkrishna's chart,

> > > > > > I do not know where you find Mars strong as a planet in

> > > > > debilitation in

> > > > > > Navamsha gives results of debility even when in exaltation

> in

> > > rasi

> > > > > > chart. In case of Saturn Viparitam shane smritam has

> already

> > > been

> > > > > > mentioned by me, in earlier mail.

> > > > >

> > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I myself have not considered Mars/Venus in

> Thakur's

> > > > > chart because they are debilitated. Please go through my

> message

> > > > > again. I was talking about Saturn and Rahu.

> > > > >

> > > > > About Shri Aurobindo, I trust you are

> > > > > > aware of his revolutionary background and that he was

> editor

> > > of a

> > > > > paper

> > > > > > "Vande Mataram" not much known for its soft language.

> > > > >

> > > > > > Same is the case with strong Malefics giving P.M. Yogas.

> Every

> > > > > graha is

> > > > > > capable of 12 variations of a P.M. Yoga attributed to it,

> at

> > > the

> > > > > very

> > > > > > least. It would only be naive to imagine they would all

> give

> > > > > identical

> > > > > > results as indicated by Parashara or all with Pancha

> > > Mahapurusha

> > > > > Yoga

> > > > > > would only rule over different parts of India (barring

> Saturn),

> > > > > just

> > > > > > because the sage said so. The sages gave us principles and

> > > > > expected us

> > > > > > to apply them to real life horoscope using Viveka.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I would gladly give you the shloka giving the reference to

> > > > > > "Viparita---Shane..." it is from an old classic respected

> > > amongst

> > > > > > astrologers, but as you do not seem to accept anything that

> > > does

> > > > > not fit

> > > > > > in with what, you think. is said by Dr. Raman, it would be

> an

> > > > > exercise

> > > > > > in futility. should you yet want the shloka I would of

> course

> > > be

> > > > > glad to

> > > > > > give it to you.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Om Gurave namah

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > You seem to be disagreeing with Shri B.V. Raman that

> strong

> > > > > planets,

> > > > > > > whether malefic or benefics give good results, while weak

> > > planets

> > > > > > > give bad results. Perhaps you also disagree about strong

> > > malefics

> > > > > > > giving mahapurusha yogas. Isn't it contrary to what all

> the

> > > > > jyotish

> > > > > > > texts teach?

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Then, here are a few examples, where I find that strong

> > > malefics

> > > > > > > have neither made the natives krura nor that their

> > > significations

> > > > > > > suffered.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Swami Vivekananda: strong sun in lagna and mars in 5th

> house

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Sri Aurobindo: Strong Sun in 2nd house.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Maharshi Mahesh yogi: exalted Mars in lagna.

> > > > > > > Ramana Maharshi: strong Mars in 8th house

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Sri Ramakrishna Paramahamsa: Exalted Saturn(9H) and Rahu

> > > (4H).

> > > > > Mars

> > > > > > > and Venus are also exalted in rasi, while debilitated in

> > > navamsa.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Sir, can you give me the reference for "vipareetam shaneH

> > > > > sritam"?

> > > > > > > Does it, by any chance, refer to Saturn's placement in

> the

> > > 8th

> > > > > house

> > > > > > > being beneficial?

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I am happy that you agree strong Saturn gives good

> results.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Can you tell me from where the saying is because i would

> > > like to

> > > > > > > read it up myself and understand.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > --- Chandrashekhar <chandrashekhar46@

> > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk>>

> > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > About Krura planets the saying is, that with

> > > > > > > > > > strength the Krura grahas

> > > > > > > > > > become more Krura (Maha-krura) and the shubha

> grahas

> > > > > > > > > > become more shubha.

> > > > > > > > > > Only Shani is more krura when weak and beneficial

> or

> > > > > > > > > > less krura when

> > > > > > > > > > strong "Viparitama shaneH smritam".

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > My sun dasa started when I was 9 years old, and

> > > > > > > > > > ended when I was 15

> > > > > > > > > > > years old. How come you didn't notice the second

> > > > > > > > > > part? I was old

> > > > > > > > > > > enough to understand the difference between

> > > > > > > > > > success and failure, I

> > > > > > > > > > > guess!

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Anyway, if you agree that Rahu is giving Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > results, and those

> > > > > > > > > > > results are exceptionally good, then it

> > > > > > > > > > automatically follows that

> > > > > > > > > > > Sun is strong in my chart because according to

> > > > > > > > > > Shri B.V Raman, evil

> > > > > > > > > > > planets, especially when weak, give bad results

> > > > > > > > > > (vide "a catechism

> > > > > > > > > > > of astrology"), while strong planets, even if

> > > > > > > > > > evil, give good

> > > > > > > > > > > results. If my Sun were weak, he wouldn't be

> > > > > > > > > > giving such good

> > > > > > > > > > > results:--))

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Since Mercury is hopelessly combust and inferior

> > > > > > > > > > in shadbala

> > > > > > > > > > > strength, the major results of Dharma

> > > > > > > > > > karmadhipathi yoga are also

> > > > > > > > > > > given by Sun, because according to "300

> > > > > > > > > > combinations" of Sri

> > > > > > > > > > > Raman, a planet with higher shadbala is more

> > > > > > > > > > likely to give the

> > > > > > > > > > > results of a yoga.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Regarding Karna, I request you to read the Karna

> > > > > > > > > > Parva of

> > > > > > > > > > > Mahabharata again. When he died, the nature bowed

> > > > > > > > > > in grief, because

> > > > > > > > > > > he's one of the noblest persons in Mahabharata.

> > > > > > > > > > Even the episode you

> > > > > > > > > > > quoted happened because Parashurama would teach

> > > > > > > > > > only Brahmins and

> > > > > > > > > > > Karna desperately wanted to learn dhanurvidya

> from

> > > > > > > > > > Parashurama so

> > > > > > > > > > > that he can support Duryodhana. Deceit is

> > > > > > > > > > certainly punishable and

> > > > > > > > > > > Karna did pay dearly. But it's to be borne in

> mind

> > > > > > > > > > that whatever

> > > > > > > > > > > Karna did was only to please Duryodhana, his

> > > > > > > > > > dearest friend. Karna

> > > > > > > > > > > did not gain anything personally.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the 3rd house from 8th house (I

> > > > > > > > > > think there was a typo

> > > > > > > > > > > at your end). In the natural zodiac, the 10 th

> > > > > > > > > > sign, being the

> > > > > > > > > > > cardinal earth sign, represents south /dakshina

> > > > > > > > > > disha. South is the

> > > > > > > > > > > direction ruled by Yama, the lord of death, hence

> > > > > > > > > > 10th house

> > > > > > > > > > > represents burial grounds. So, the Rudras

> (Saturn,

> > > > > > > > > > Sun and Mars) are

> > > > > > > > > > > strong in south. Also, Sun resides in south and

> > > > > > > > > > starts his

> > > > > > > > > > > northern voyage from here. So he has digbala in

> > > > > > > > > > 10th house.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > I did clarify that when I referred to Surya as

> > > > > > > > > > Karma saakshi, it's

> > > > > > > > > > > only to his status as antaraatma and not as a

> > > > > > > > > > deity. Perhaps this

> > > > > > > > > > > escaped your attention.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > This is my last post on the subject.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> <%40>

> > > <%40>

> > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > > <%40>,

> > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar

> > > > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > You were too young for the results of the dasha

> > > > > > > > > > to manifest,

> > > > > > > > > > > though it

> > > > > > > > > > > > is good news that your father had promotions

> and

> > > > > > > > > > you received

> > > > > > > > > > > > prizes/accolades during that time. It is

> > > > > > > > > > interesting to know you

> > > > > > > > > > > got

> > > > > > > > > > > > these results at a young age of 9 or so as that

> > > > > > > > > > is when Sun dasha

> > > > > > > > > > > was

> > > > > > > > > > > > operative. I am relieved you did not have any

> > > > > > > > > > health problems in

> > > > > > > > > > > > March-August 1970 period.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > But we are talking about Rahu and Rahu would

> > > > > > > > > > give results of Sun

> > > > > > > > > > > more

> > > > > > > > > > > > prominently, by conjunction, as you guessed but

> > > > > > > > > > also that of

> > > > > > > > > > > Mercury

> > > > > > > > > > > > (You have a Dharmakarmaadhipati yoga after all)

> > > > > > > > > > and that is why I

> > > > > > > > > > > said

> > > > > > > > > > > > for understanding Sun its dasha instead of Rahu

> > > > > > > > > > dasha needs to be

> > > > > > > > > > > analyzed.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Mercury is malefic not because I say so but

> > > > > > > > > > because Jyotish says

> > > > > > > > > > > that

> > > > > > > > > > > > mercury is malefic when conjunct a papa graha

> > > > > > > > > > and he is conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > two,

> > > > > > > > > > > > Sun and Rahu.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the apex of Artha trikona and

> > > > > > > > > > directly involved with

> > > > > > > > > > > > efforts to earn money. Though claimed to be

> > > > > > > > > > smashana/burial

> > > > > > > > > > > ground, it

> > > > > > > > > > > > is 4th from ayush sthana (8th) and its home

> that

> > > > > > > > > > is why affliction

> > > > > > > > > > > to it

> > > > > > > > > > > > can give death. But 8th is more popularly

> called

> > > > > > > > > > mrityu sthana and

> > > > > > > > > > > hence

> > > > > > > > > > > > 10th is called Smashana. If it is really

> > > > > > > > > > smashana why would it be

> > > > > > > > > > > called

> > > > > > > > > > > > karma sthana and why would Sun be at its most

> > > > > > > > > > brilliant there?

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > I did not say he can not represent water bodies

> > > > > > > > > > in temple, but not

> > > > > > > > > > > only

> > > > > > > > > > > > those.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > My Sun dasa was excellent too. My father

> > > > > > > > > > received promotion(s),

> > > > > > > > > > > my

> > > > > > > > > > > > > school/college days were great and i received

> > > > > > > > > > wide acclaim/prizes

> > > > > > > > > > > > > for my ability in creative writing, Veena,

> > > > > > > > > > quiz contests etc,

> > > > > > > > > > > apart

> > > > > > > > > > > > > from studies. So, for a student, I guess

> > > > > > > > > > that's excellent!!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > How do you justify this, if Sun were weak?

> > > > > > > > > > Rahu is certainly

> > > > > > > > > > > giving

> > > > > > > > > > > > > the yogakaraka results, but being in Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > house and being

> > > > > > > > > > > conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun, don't you think Rahu is also giving the

> > > > > > > > > > results of Sun? You

> > > > > > > > > > > > > said that mercury is malefic and heavily

> > > > > > > > > > combust too:--))

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > 1th house also represent burial

> > > > > > > > > > ground/smashaana. Is that a place

> > > > > > > > > > > > > for attachment?

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandra represents all water bodies, so why

> > > > > > > > > > can't he represent

> > > > > > > > > > > > > temple tank?

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > === message truncated ===

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Tired of spam? Mail has the best spam

> protection

> > > > > around

> > > > > > > > > <>

> < <>>

> > > < <>

> < <>>>

> > > > > < <>

> < <>>

> > > < <>

> < <>>>>

> > > > > > > < <>

> < <>>

> > > < <>

> < <>>>

> > > > > < <>

> < <>>

> > > < <>

> < <>>>>>

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > --------------------

> ----

> > > -

> > > > > > > -------

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.11.7/435 -

> Release

> > > > > Date:

> > > > > > > 8/31/2006

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

[Guest guest]

Dear Prabodh,

 

You are not wrong when you say that "So in a Vedic Jyotish way the Sun

in strength will have PRIDE in being ideal king' for his subjects(other

Grahas)." But if the King is doing what is only his duty as per the

Vedic Dharma, then pride in such context will be Ego. Most of the

speeches that you quote, if read with due detachment and ignoring the

personalities making them, would sound most egoist speeches to all and

sundry. I know saying this would raise

tempers on the list but truth must prevail.

 

But one can go on arguing on this aspect to no end and bringing in the

ideal king as an example of King and conjecturing the Parashara meant

that King, while good for argument's sake may not be the right way to

look at astrological principles. The first pitfall would be that though

it is fashionable these days to say that all Kings of Vedic times acted

as they should the fact remains that Puranas and Vedas are replete with

stories of Kings who were very cruel t their subjects and harassed those

performing vedic Rituals. When this is pointed out tempers flare which

is a sure beginning of a rational discussion on the principles of

astrology going awry.

 

That is why it is better to steer clear of the scriptures when

discussing astrology, specially on a public list, as the scriptures are

subject to different interpretations.

 

Do you think Mada does not mean intoxication or state of intoxication in

Sanskrit? I am sure that Unmaada is one of the five arrows of Madana.

And that is Mada represented by Rahu. That is what flows through the

temporal glands of a bull elephant and then the bull elephant becomes

uncontrollable like being intoxicated.

 

Again if you happen to refer to kosha you will find synonyms for the

five types of pride to be Garva, Abhimaana, Ahankara, Maana etc. While

in English language Pride has certain connotation, to find exact

synonyms to Sanskrit words is always difficult.

 

Letting apart these discussions which will more often mislead than solve

anything, let us at least agree that the sage does say that Rahu and

Ketu behave as the lords of the house occupied by them or the lord of a

house that they conjoin.

 

If we are agreed on this then think why should Rahu, or Ketu for that

matter, who can not deliver own results but has to depend on other

planets to express itself would, by itself and devoid of other graha

combination; be endowed with the quality of Ego by the writer. More so

why when Rahu when alone is said to give results of Shani (Manda Sama

Rahu..) as Shani is certainly not connected with ego by any stretch of

imagination.

 

Take care,

Chandrashekhar.

 

 

Prabodh Vekhande wrote:

>

>

> Dear Chandrashekhar ji Namste

>

> It was indeed a great plesure to read your mails regarding

> interpretations of the astrological text and more specially how

> Sanskrit language words can mislead at times. Now I have some doubts.

>

> I think Pride means Self-respect and Ego means Inflated or False

> Pride. Parashara has attributed the Sun to being Raja or King. In the

> vedic philosophy we see that Raja was suppose to take care of the

> welfare of his subjects. In the Chandogya Upanishad the king

> Ashvapati describes his kingdom and his subjects as: "In my kingdom

> there is no thief,no coward,nor amiser,no drunked,nor is there one

> who has not taken the vow of worship of the'Fire', no idots, nor men

> of loose character.Where could therefore be here women without

> morals?"(Chandogya 5-11). We as well see similar references in

> Ramayana regarding RamaRajya. Rama says: I will forsake everything,

> affection,compassion,happiness,even my beloved wife Janaki, for the

> sake of the welfare of my subjects. I will not mind any affliction in

> abondoning my wife for the good of my subjects". We find many such

> references in RigVeda and Atherva veda as well. The great epic of

> VedaVyasa as well gives similar attributes to King.Such was the

> concept of the ideal of the institution of kingship, which every

> Vedic king took PRIDE in realising.

>

> In the pasasge of Time there came the western counterpart for Vedic

> Kings. In the west the mediaeval thinkers invested divine inheritance

> on the king who was considered to be the representative of God. The

> king having received his authority to rule by divine right was not

> answerable to the people and therefore was an absolute in his own

> right.The people had no right to rebel against the king or demand his

> dethronement. The predominant thought behind that concept was to

> bestow sovereign and absolute powers on the king. This naturally made

> Kings to have 'inflated pride' or EGO. This western mediaeval concept

> of king had great influence in Mediaeval indian kings as well.

>

> In Bharat, however, political thinkers never advocated or offered any

> abolute power and authority to the king. Kingship was always regared

> as subservient to the will and dependent upon the sanction of the

> people and was alwyas answerable to them. So there was no concept

> of 'Inflated or False Pride' in the Vedic King. The king being fully

> aware that all his authority and power were derived from his

> subjects would try to look to their welfare.

>

> So in a Vedic Jyotish way the Sun in strength will have PRIDE in

> being ideal 'king' for his subjects(other Grahas). Same, if seen in

> Western way can mean the Sun will have EGO.

>

> Moreover, we see that Western(foreign) cocept of Absolute power with

> the King is exactly opposite that of Vedic concept of King. So in a

> vedic way of thinking what is wrong in attributting Rahu to foreign

> concept of inflated & false Pride or EGO.?

>

> Finally, Mada does mean Pride in sanskrit. When attributed to Rahu,

> will naturally have the element of falsehood/deceit associated with

> pride and hence may lead to EGO. Am I wrong?

>

> Thanks a lot for your Time and Sapce.

>

> Prabodh Vekhande

> Jai Jai Shankar

> Har Har Shankar

>

>

> <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> <chandrashekhar46 wrote:

> >

> > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> >

> > Pride is different from ego. Like it or not Mada does mean

> intoxication

> > or lust. The Kama that is referred to relates to kaamana which

> means

> > desires for things possessed by others. That is what Asteya, one of

> the

> > Yamas of Hatha yogas refer to.

> >

> > We are talking about auspiciousness or other wise of the dormant or

> > awakened Kundalini. As I said all scriptures can be misinterpreted

> if

> > one wants to do that. But that does not serve any purpose. I would

> not

> > go into what exactly is meant by Vidya and Avidya related to Maa. I

> have

> > not yet seen any Pramana, in the form of a shloka, to support your

> > proposition that dormant Kundalini is inauspicious and the awakened

> > Kundalini is auspicious so far. I have already posted the way my

> > generation has been taught to accept an argument, so I shall not

> repeat

> > it here.

> >

> > But I will not resort to conjectures and would like to quote from

> > Rudrayamala tantra about the swarUpa of dormant Kundalini. Being

> > graduate in sanskrit, I am sure I will not have to translate it for

> you.

> > Aaxare prdevta Éìjntax> k…{flI devta

> > ädhäre paradevatä bhavrajanatädhaù kuëòalé devatä

> > devanamixdevta iÇjgtamanNdpuÃiSwta,

> > devänämadhidevatä trijagatämänandapuïjasthitä|

> > mUlaxarinvaisnI iÇrm[i ya }ainnI mailnI

> > mülädhäraniväsiné triramaëé yä jïäniné mäliné

> > sa me mat&mnuiSwta k…lpwanNdEkbIjanna.32,21.

> > sä me mätåmanusthitä kulapathänandaikabéjänanä||32|21||

> >

> > I am sure you must have some quote to support your contention. I

> would

> > like to see the shloka, as against conjectures, so that I can

> improve

> > upon my knowledge of the swarupaa of Kundalini.

> >

> > I can understand your reluctance to support your propositions with

> > suitable pramanas. I am sorry if I have hurt you by pointing out

> the

> > inconsistency in the way you treated Surya and Rahu combinations in

> two

> > different chart as stand out combinations only.

> >

> > I had no intention to cause any hurt to you and if I have done so

> > inadvertently I crave your pardon.

> >

> > Take care,

> >

> > Chandrashekhar

> >

> >

> > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > >

> > > Om Gurave Namah

> > >

> > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > >

> > > The shadripus are kaama (lust), krodha (anger), lobha (greed),

> moha

> > > (attachment, delusion), mada (pride) and maatsarya (jealousy)

> > > If "mada" means "lust" what does "kaama" imply among the

> > > shadripus? "Mada" signifies one who is intoxicated/drunk with

> > > power/self-grandeur (pride/ego).

> > >

> > > Mother is known as "Vidya and avidya swaroopini" and correct

> > > appreciation of Mother includes understanding of both facets. As

> > > Shakti, She respresents raw power which can be routed towards good

> > > deeds as well as bad deeds. Are both ends the same? The wisdom,

> > > required to put this immense shakti to good use, is represented by

> > > Shiva, hence the union of Shiva and Parvati, wisdom and power, is

> > > said to be auspicious because it ensures the correct/judicious end

> > > use of shakti. Hence the orientation of Shakti is very very

> > > important.

> > >

> > > I always said that Soorya is both sattwik and krura. I also always

> > > said all planets, including Jupiter, can give malefic results, if

> > > they are functionally empowered to do so. You can refer to all my

> > > previous mails to confirm this.

> > >

> > > Sir, Truth is much more important than winning or losing an

> > > argument. All discussions must proceed as an exploration and

> > > celebration of Truth. When this is not the case, I see no purpose

> in

> > > continuing these discussions.

> > >

> > > Thanks & Regards,

> > > Lakshmi

> > >

> > >

> <%40>

> > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > >

> > > > Having Icchamrityu and dying at an early age are operating at

> > > different

> > > > levels. Bhishma had Iccha Mrityu but did not die young. So

> please

> > > do not

> > > > try to mix the issues. If you have read Swamiji's biography you

> > > will

> > > > find that he fell sick many times despite of apparent robust

> > > physique.

> > > >

> > > > Commenting on Shani in 4th for Rama's chart confirms with his

> > > being

> > > > capable of giving Vipareeta results. I did not know I was

> expected

> > > to

> > > > analyze the entire chart. By the way if there is a Kuja dosha

> how

> > > does

> > > > that by itself give a Divine wife? Please do not bring our

> > > devotion to

> > > > Lord Rama (and we both have that) into astrological analysis of

> > > his chart.

> > > >

> > > > Bringing in the dashas when the discussions are on the effects

> of

> > > grahas

> > > > will only lead the discussion to no where. The two have to be

> seen

> > > > separately as we are not trying to time an event but only trying

> > > to find

> > > > what are the effects on bhavas occupied.

> > > >

> > > > Dear Lakshmi in Ramana Maharshi's chart you have perhaps

> forgotten

> > > the

> > > > saying Kuja vat Ketu. look at the Ketu deha in that perspective

> > > and let

> > > > me know your views. And if by the way you read my mail, I did

> not

> > > say

> > > > anything about mars being killer for him, only that it gave him

> > > Sarcoma

> > > > being 3rd lord.

> > > >

> > > > Also could you explain why Sun being Atma and always beneficent

> as

> > > you

> > > > have claimed all along in the thread on the topic, did its

> > > Mahadasha

> > > > prove to be Killer to Ramana Maharshi?

> > > >

> > > > Take care,

> > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > >

> > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > > For example, remember that in Swami Vivekananda's chart

> Surya

> > > is

> > > > > lord of

> > > > > > the 9th occupying the lagna and causing a powerful Raj

> yoga. At

> > > > > the same

> > > > > > time if you thin how long the Swamiji lived, you may have to

> > > think

> > > > > again

> > > > > > about saying that it did not act as Mahakrura. Think about

> > > what it

> > > > > did

> > > > > > to the 7th bhava of Swamiji, also, before declaring that it

> > > became

> > > > > > shubha or less malefic.

> > > > >

> > > > > Lakshmi: I think Swamiji had an icchamrityu and looking at the

> > > dass

> > > > > operating on 4th July 1902, I observe that he passed away in

> Jup-

> > > Ven-

> > > > > Jup-Ket-Sat-Sat.

> > > > >

> > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > >

> > > > > Jup MD: 1893-02-09 (1:35:30 pm) - 1909-02-10 (3:59:13 pm)

> > > > > Ven AD: 1900-12-25 (10:03:30 am) - 1903-08-27 (4:48:54 pm)

> > > > > Jup PD: 1902-05-02 (1:42:07 pm) - 1902-09-12 (10:43:55 pm)

> > > > > Ket SD: 1902-06-29 (9:11:48 am) - 1902-07-07 (5:06:28 am)

> > > > > Sat PAD: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-06 (2:29:24 am)

> > > > >

> > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > >

> > > > > Sat: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-05 (1:27:03 am)

> > > > >

> > > > > Jupiter is in 2nd house from Moon, Venus is the 2nd lord from

> > > Moon

> > > > > and is posited in 2nd from lagna, Ketu is in the house of

> Venus

> > > and

> > > > > gives the results of Venus and Saturn is the 2nd lord from

> > > > > lagna....all are marakas. the maraka significations are

> stronger

> > > > > from Moon, and it's the cause of his early death.

> > > > >

> > > > > I fail to see where Sun comes into all this.

> > > > >

> > > > > However, I agree that Sun, as AK aspecting 7th house, can give

> > > > > parivraja tendencies. But can you ignore the influence of

> Saturn

> > > on

> > > > > Moon and 4th house, occuring in the 10th house? I am sure even

> > > weak

> > > > > Sun would have given him parivraja yoga:--))but without the

> raja

> > > > > yoga and the strong soul-level impact he created wherever he

> > > went.

> > > > >

> > > > > Or if you like look at what happened to the 7th

> > > > > > Bhava of Lord Rama with exalted Mars in the 7th bhava.

> > > > >

> > > > > Mars in 7th gives kuja dosha, and I think the strong Mars in

> 7th

> > > > > gave him an exalted wife like Sita. You have not commented on

> the

> > > > > exalted Saturn in 4th house.

> > > > >

> > > > > In each of the

> > > > > > example provided by you look at the bhava that the planets

> > > occupy

> > > > > > (barring Saturn, for reasons already stated in previous

> mail),

> > > > > without

> > > > > > looking at the charts as belonging to great people, and then

> > > make

> > > > > up

> > > > > > your mind as to the truth or otherwise of what I said. Did

> you

> > > > > know

> > > > > > Ramana Maharshi died following a malignant sarcoma of left

> hand

> > > > > and Mars

> > > > > > is karaka for the 3rd bhava in 8th in his chart, in

> > > exaltation. Do

> > > > > you

> > > > > > think Mars gave him benevolent results?

> > > > >

> > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I also request you to examine the following dasa

> > > > > sequences with an open mind. Sun is the 3rd lord from Moon

> (AK) &

> > > > > 12th lord from lagna in Sri Ramana's chart, rahu is with Sun

> and

> > > > > gives Sun'/Saturn's/Jupiter's effects...all of which point to

> > > > > dusthanas, Saturn is a maraka in 7th house and ketu can give

> the

> > > > > effects of Moon/Mercury/mars. Mar's effect, if at all, was

> only

> > > > > indirect, and he was not the killer.

> > > > >

> > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > >

> > > > > Sun MD: 1949-02-03 (1:02:22 am) - 1955-02-03 (2:05:32 pm)

> > > > > Rah AD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1951-02-21 (8:49:14 am)

> > > > > Rah PD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1950-05-18 (12:04:47 am)

> > > > > Sat SD: 1950-04-12 (3:37:16 am) - 1950-04-20 (12:18:02 am)

> > > > > Ket PAD: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14 (11:08:26 pm)

> > > > >

> > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > >

> > > > > Ket: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14 (12:47:04 pm)

> > > > >

> > > > > I think what stands out is the fact that the dasa of the graha

> > > > > conjoined Moon brought about death. I think their mind willed

> the

> > > > > death.

> > > > >

> > > > > Can a planet give results in a dasa totally

> > > unrelated/unassociated

> > > > > with itself? I request you to consider the above objectively.

> > > > >

> > > > > I will talk about the other charts/issues in my next mail.

> > > > >

> > > > > Regards,

> > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > >

> > > > > In Paramhans Ramkrishna's chart,

> > > > > > I do not know where you find Mars strong as a planet in

> > > > > debilitation in

> > > > > > Navamsha gives results of debility even when in exaltation

> in

> > > rasi

> > > > > > chart. In case of Saturn Viparitam shane smritam has already

> > > been

> > > > > > mentioned by me, in earlier mail.

> > > > >

> > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I myself have not considered Mars/Venus in

> Thakur's

> > > > > chart because they are debilitated. Please go through my

> message

> > > > > again. I was talking about Saturn and Rahu.

> > > > >

> > > > > About Shri Aurobindo, I trust you are

> > > > > > aware of his revolutionary background and that he was editor

> > > of a

> > > > > paper

> > > > > > "Vande Mataram" not much known for its soft language.

> > > > >

> > > > > > Same is the case with strong Malefics giving P.M. Yogas.

> Every

> > > > > graha is

> > > > > > capable of 12 variations of a P.M. Yoga attributed to it, at

> > > the

> > > > > very

> > > > > > least. It would only be naive to imagine they would all give

> > > > > identical

> > > > > > results as indicated by Parashara or all with Pancha

> > > Mahapurusha

> > > > > Yoga

> > > > > > would only rule over different parts of India (barring

> Saturn),

> > > > > just

> > > > > > because the sage said so. The sages gave us principles and

> > > > > expected us

> > > > > > to apply them to real life horoscope using Viveka.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I would gladly give you the shloka giving the reference to

> > > > > > "Viparita---Shane..." it is from an old classic respected

> > > amongst

> > > > > > astrologers, but as you do not seem to accept anything that

> > > does

> > > > > not fit

> > > > > > in with what, you think. is said by Dr. Raman, it would be

> an

> > > > > exercise

> > > > > > in futility. should you yet want the shloka I would of

> course

> > > be

> > > > > glad to

> > > > > > give it to you.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Om Gurave namah

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > You seem to be disagreeing with Shri B.V. Raman that

> strong

> > > > > planets,

> > > > > > > whether malefic or benefics give good results, while weak

> > > planets

> > > > > > > give bad results. Perhaps you also disagree about strong

> > > malefics

> > > > > > > giving mahapurusha yogas. Isn't it contrary to what all

> the

> > > > > jyotish

> > > > > > > texts teach?

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Then, here are a few examples, where I find that strong

> > > malefics

> > > > > > > have neither made the natives krura nor that their

> > > significations

> > > > > > > suffered.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Swami Vivekananda: strong sun in lagna and mars in 5th

> house

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Sri Aurobindo: Strong Sun in 2nd house.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Maharshi Mahesh yogi: exalted Mars in lagna.

> > > > > > > Ramana Maharshi: strong Mars in 8th house

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Sri Ramakrishna Paramahamsa: Exalted Saturn(9H) and Rahu

> > > (4H).

> > > > > Mars

> > > > > > > and Venus are also exalted in rasi, while debilitated in

> > > navamsa.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Sir, can you give me the reference for "vipareetam shaneH

> > > > > sritam"?

> > > > > > > Does it, by any chance, refer to Saturn's placement in the

> > > 8th

> > > > > house

> > > > > > > being beneficial?

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I am happy that you agree strong Saturn gives good

> results.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Can you tell me from where the saying is because i would

> > > like to

> > > > > > > read it up myself and understand.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > --- Chandrashekhar <chandrashekhar46@

> > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk>>

> > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > About Krura planets the saying is, that with

> > > > > > > > > > strength the Krura grahas

> > > > > > > > > > become more Krura (Maha-krura) and the shubha grahas

> > > > > > > > > > become more shubha.

> > > > > > > > > > Only Shani is more krura when weak and beneficial or

> > > > > > > > > > less krura when

> > > > > > > > > > strong "Viparitama shaneH smritam".

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > My sun dasa started when I was 9 years old, and

> > > > > > > > > > ended when I was 15

> > > > > > > > > > > years old. How come you didn't notice the second

> > > > > > > > > > part? I was old

> > > > > > > > > > > enough to understand the difference between

> > > > > > > > > > success and failure, I

> > > > > > > > > > > guess!

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Anyway, if you agree that Rahu is giving Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > results, and those

> > > > > > > > > > > results are exceptionally good, then it

> > > > > > > > > > automatically follows that

> > > > > > > > > > > Sun is strong in my chart because according to

> > > > > > > > > > Shri B.V Raman, evil

> > > > > > > > > > > planets, especially when weak, give bad results

> > > > > > > > > > (vide "a catechism

> > > > > > > > > > > of astrology"), while strong planets, even if

> > > > > > > > > > evil, give good

> > > > > > > > > > > results. If my Sun were weak, he wouldn't be

> > > > > > > > > > giving such good

> > > > > > > > > > > results:--))

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Since Mercury is hopelessly combust and inferior

> > > > > > > > > > in shadbala

> > > > > > > > > > > strength, the major results of Dharma

> > > > > > > > > > karmadhipathi yoga are also

> > > > > > > > > > > given by Sun, because according to "300

> > > > > > > > > > combinations" of Sri

> > > > > > > > > > > Raman, a planet with higher shadbala is more

> > > > > > > > > > likely to give the

> > > > > > > > > > > results of a yoga.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Regarding Karna, I request you to read the Karna

> > > > > > > > > > Parva of

> > > > > > > > > > > Mahabharata again. When he died, the nature bowed

> > > > > > > > > > in grief, because

> > > > > > > > > > > he's one of the noblest persons in Mahabharata.

> > > > > > > > > > Even the episode you

> > > > > > > > > > > quoted happened because Parashurama would teach

> > > > > > > > > > only Brahmins and

> > > > > > > > > > > Karna desperately wanted to learn dhanurvidya from

> > > > > > > > > > Parashurama so

> > > > > > > > > > > that he can support Duryodhana. Deceit is

> > > > > > > > > > certainly punishable and

> > > > > > > > > > > Karna did pay dearly. But it's to be borne in mind

> > > > > > > > > > that whatever

> > > > > > > > > > > Karna did was only to please Duryodhana, his

> > > > > > > > > > dearest friend. Karna

> > > > > > > > > > > did not gain anything personally.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the 3rd house from 8th house (I

> > > > > > > > > > think there was a typo

> > > > > > > > > > > at your end). In the natural zodiac, the 10 th

> > > > > > > > > > sign, being the

> > > > > > > > > > > cardinal earth sign, represents south /dakshina

> > > > > > > > > > disha. South is the

> > > > > > > > > > > direction ruled by Yama, the lord of death, hence

> > > > > > > > > > 10th house

> > > > > > > > > > > represents burial grounds. So, the Rudras (Saturn,

> > > > > > > > > > Sun and Mars) are

> > > > > > > > > > > strong in south. Also, Sun resides in south and

> > > > > > > > > > starts his

> > > > > > > > > > > northern voyage from here. So he has digbala in

> > > > > > > > > > 10th house.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > I did clarify that when I referred to Surya as

> > > > > > > > > > Karma saakshi, it's

> > > > > > > > > > > only to his status as antaraatma and not as a

> > > > > > > > > > deity. Perhaps this

> > > > > > > > > > > escaped your attention.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > This is my last post on the subject.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> <%40>

> > > <%40>

> > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > > <%40>,

> > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar

> > > > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > You were too young for the results of the dasha

> > > > > > > > > > to manifest,

> > > > > > > > > > > though it

> > > > > > > > > > > > is good news that your father had promotions and

> > > > > > > > > > you received

> > > > > > > > > > > > prizes/accolades during that time. It is

> > > > > > > > > > interesting to know you

> > > > > > > > > > > got

> > > > > > > > > > > > these results at a young age of 9 or so as that

> > > > > > > > > > is when Sun dasha

> > > > > > > > > > > was

> > > > > > > > > > > > operative. I am relieved you did not have any

> > > > > > > > > > health problems in

> > > > > > > > > > > > March-August 1970 period.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > But we are talking about Rahu and Rahu would

> > > > > > > > > > give results of Sun

> > > > > > > > > > > more

> > > > > > > > > > > > prominently, by conjunction, as you guessed but

> > > > > > > > > > also that of

> > > > > > > > > > > Mercury

> > > > > > > > > > > > (You have a Dharmakarmaadhipati yoga after all)

> > > > > > > > > > and that is why I

> > > > > > > > > > > said

> > > > > > > > > > > > for understanding Sun its dasha instead of Rahu

> > > > > > > > > > dasha needs to be

> > > > > > > > > > > analyzed.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Mercury is malefic not because I say so but

> > > > > > > > > > because Jyotish says

> > > > > > > > > > > that

> > > > > > > > > > > > mercury is malefic when conjunct a papa graha

> > > > > > > > > > and he is conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > two,

> > > > > > > > > > > > Sun and Rahu.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the apex of Artha trikona and

> > > > > > > > > > directly involved with

> > > > > > > > > > > > efforts to earn money. Though claimed to be

> > > > > > > > > > smashana/burial

> > > > > > > > > > > ground, it

> > > > > > > > > > > > is 4th from ayush sthana (8th) and its home that

> > > > > > > > > > is why affliction

> > > > > > > > > > > to it

> > > > > > > > > > > > can give death. But 8th is more popularly called

> > > > > > > > > > mrityu sthana and

> > > > > > > > > > > hence

> > > > > > > > > > > > 10th is called Smashana. If it is really

> > > > > > > > > > smashana why would it be

> > > > > > > > > > > called

> > > > > > > > > > > > karma sthana and why would Sun be at its most

> > > > > > > > > > brilliant there?

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > I did not say he can not represent water bodies

> > > > > > > > > > in temple, but not

> > > > > > > > > > > only

> > > > > > > > > > > > those.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > My Sun dasa was excellent too. My father

> > > > > > > > > > received promotion(s),

> > > > > > > > > > > my

> > > > > > > > > > > > > school/college days were great and i received

> > > > > > > > > > wide acclaim/prizes

> > > > > > > > > > > > > for my ability in creative writing, Veena,

> > > > > > > > > > quiz contests etc,

> > > > > > > > > > > apart

> > > > > > > > > > > > > from studies. So, for a student, I guess

> > > > > > > > > > that's excellent!!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > How do you justify this, if Sun were weak?

> > > > > > > > > > Rahu is certainly

> > > > > > > > > > > giving

> > > > > > > > > > > > > the yogakaraka results, but being in Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > house and being

> > > > > > > > > > > conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun, don't you think Rahu is also giving the

> > > > > > > > > > results of Sun? You

> > > > > > > > > > > > > said that mercury is malefic and heavily

> > > > > > > > > > combust too:--))

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > 1th house also represent burial

> > > > > > > > > > ground/smashaana. Is that a place

> > > > > > > > > > > > > for attachment?

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandra represents all water bodies, so why

> > > > > > > > > > can't he represent

> > > > > > > > > > > > > temple tank?

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > === message truncated ===

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Tired of spam? Mail has the best spam

> protection

> > > > > around

> > > > > > > > > <>

> < <>>

> > > < <>

> < <>>>

> > > > > < <>

> < <>>

> > > < <>

> < <>>>>

> > > > > > > < <>

> < <>>

> > > < <>

> < <>>>

> > > > > < <>

> < <>>

> > > < <>

> < <>>>>>

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > ---------------------

> ---

> > > -

> > > > > > > -------

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.11.7/435 -

> Release

> > > > > Date:

> > > > > > > 8/31/2006

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

[Guest guest]

Dear Lakshmi ji

 

Infact i had answered it clearly.You had missed it.I did say what is

the context for this shloka!!!quoting Dahsadhyayi karaka.The

evolutionary order sequence in manushya relating

Kalapurusha,Time,Planets,Body.It is also painful to make me

repeat:-).This is also the order for 7 days of week.Neither in

VarahaHora nor BPHS nor Jataka Parijata Rahu is mentioned along with

Kalatma shloka.Only Kalyan Varma is mentioning.Kalyan Varma included

the illusionary factor which can catalyse all of the above and result

in dukham.But we are in this universe for such experiences and hence

Rahu is a teacher as well.TIME is the best teacher.

 

 

Thus we have to look for the meaning suiting the context.Why Rahu is

just one among the shad ripus?Why not lust,kaama,moha,krodha? Rahu is

not any of these.He makes us have all these.Sun called as Atma karaka

is karaka for lagna in astrology.Am i wrong? Once he enters the body

he is trapped and just wanders wherever the mind is taking ,until self

realization.Am i wrong?What is BHagavatham mentioning about individual

soul and its plight.

 

Rahu does not enter on its own nor is it a feeling of ''I''.It is just

our assumption.Rahu is formed by the contact between Atma/Mana padhas

w.r to earth(our existence).Am i wrong astrononomically?Also this is

happening within us(even if we take your inner qualities -intoxication

is inside/inner.Beacause of its effect outside view is oscured).Why is

it KalaSarpam?Is TIME EGO?.Rahu is a common catalyst.It is the clutch

of TIME.Thats why planets between Rahu/Ketu are said to be between

KaalaSarpam or TIME serpent.

 

Now please tell me which meaning of mada suits the context?Rahu as

just one among shad ripus?Rahu as lust? Or Rahu the intoxication or

illusion surrounding us giving us a smoky/obscurant idea?

 

Thanks

Pradeep

 

, "b_lakshmi_ramesh"

<b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

>

> Om Gurave Namah

>

> Namaste Chandrasekhar ji & Pradeep ji,

>

> I recollect writing in my previous e-mails, that the shloka from

> Saravali talks about the inner qualities of an

> individual/kalapurusha. Does the word "mada" imply intoxication as

> an inner quality? Does the word "intoxication" belong in that

> context, in that group?

>

> I do not think either of you responded to that. perhaps you missed

> it out in the avalanche of e-mails:--))

>

> Can i have your response(s) please?

>

> Regards,

> Lakshmi

>

>

> , Chandrashekhar

> <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> >

> > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> >

> > Pride is different from ego. Like it or not Mada does mean

> intoxication

> > or lust. The Kama that is referred to relates to kaamana which

> means

> > desires for things possessed by others. That is what Asteya, one

> of the

> > Yamas of Hatha yogas refer to.

> >

> > We are talking about auspiciousness or other wise of the dormant

> or

> > awakened Kundalini. As I said all scriptures can be misinterpreted

> if

> > one wants to do that. But that does not serve any purpose. I would

> not

> > go into what exactly is meant by Vidya and Avidya related to Maa.

> I have

> > not yet seen any Pramana, in the form of a shloka, to support your

> > proposition that dormant Kundalini is inauspicious and the

> awakened

> > Kundalini is auspicious so far. I have already posted the way my

> > generation has been taught to accept an argument, so I shall not

> repeat

> > it here.

> >

> > But I will not resort to conjectures and would like to quote from

> > Rudrayamala tantra about the swarUpa of dormant Kundalini. Being

> > graduate in sanskrit, I am sure I will not have to translate it

> for you.

> > Aaxare prdevta Éìjntax> k…{flI devta

> > ädhäre paradevatä bhavrajanatädhaù kuëòalé devatä

> > devanamixdevta iÇjgtamanNdpuÃiSwta,

> > devänämadhidevatä trijagatämänandapuïjasthitä|

> > mUlaxarinvaisnI iÇrm[i ya }ainnI mailnI

> > mülädhäraniväsiné triramaëé yä jïäniné mäliné

> > sa me mat&mnuiSwta k…lpwanNdEkbIjanna.32,21.

> > sä me mätåmanusthitä kulapathänandaikabéjänanä||32|21||

> >

> > I am sure you must have some quote to support your contention. I

> would

> > like to see the shloka, as against conjectures, so that I can

> improve

> > upon my knowledge of the swarupaa of Kundalini.

> >

> > I can understand your reluctance to support your propositions with

> > suitable pramanas. I am sorry if I have hurt you by pointing out

> the

> > inconsistency in the way you treated Surya and Rahu combinations

> in two

> > different chart as stand out combinations only.

> >

> > I had no intention to cause any hurt to you and if I have done so

> > inadvertently I crave your pardon.

> >

> > Take care,

> >

> > Chandrashekhar

> >

> >

> > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > >

> > > Om Gurave Namah

> > >

> > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > >

> > > The shadripus are kaama (lust), krodha (anger), lobha (greed),

> moha

> > > (attachment, delusion), mada (pride) and maatsarya (jealousy)

> > > If "mada" means "lust" what does "kaama" imply among the

> > > shadripus? "Mada" signifies one who is intoxicated/drunk with

> > > power/self-grandeur (pride/ego).

> > >

> > > Mother is known as "Vidya and avidya swaroopini" and correct

> > > appreciation of Mother includes understanding of both facets. As

> > > Shakti, She respresents raw power which can be routed towards

> good

> > > deeds as well as bad deeds. Are both ends the same? The wisdom,

> > > required to put this immense shakti to good use, is represented

> by

> > > Shiva, hence the union of Shiva and Parvati, wisdom and power, is

> > > said to be auspicious because it ensures the correct/judicious

> end

> > > use of shakti. Hence the orientation of Shakti is very very

> > > important.

> > >

> > > I always said that Soorya is both sattwik and krura. I also

> always

> > > said all planets, including Jupiter, can give malefic results, if

> > > they are functionally empowered to do so. You can refer to all my

> > > previous mails to confirm this.

> > >

> > > Sir, Truth is much more important than winning or losing an

> > > argument. All discussions must proceed as an exploration and

> > > celebration of Truth. When this is not the case, I see no

> purpose in

> > > continuing these discussions.

> > >

> > > Thanks & Regards,

> > > Lakshmi

> > >

> > >

> > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > >

> > > > Having Icchamrityu and dying at an early age are operating at

> > > different

> > > > levels. Bhishma had Iccha Mrityu but did not die young. So

> please

> > > do not

> > > > try to mix the issues. If you have read Swamiji's biography you

> > > will

> > > > find that he fell sick many times despite of apparent robust

> > > physique.

> > > >

> > > > Commenting on Shani in 4th for Rama's chart confirms with his

> > > being

> > > > capable of giving Vipareeta results. I did not know I was

> expected

> > > to

> > > > analyze the entire chart. By the way if there is a Kuja dosha

> how

> > > does

> > > > that by itself give a Divine wife? Please do not bring our

> > > devotion to

> > > > Lord Rama (and we both have that) into astrological analysis of

> > > his chart.

> > > >

> > > > Bringing in the dashas when the discussions are on the effects

> of

> > > grahas

> > > > will only lead the discussion to no where. The two have to be

> seen

> > > > separately as we are not trying to time an event but only

> trying

> > > to find

> > > > what are the effects on bhavas occupied.

> > > >

> > > > Dear Lakshmi in Ramana Maharshi's chart you have perhaps

> forgotten

> > > the

> > > > saying Kuja vat Ketu. look at the Ketu deha in that perspective

> > > and let

> > > > me know your views. And if by the way you read my mail, I did

> not

> > > say

> > > > anything about mars being killer for him, only that it gave him

> > > Sarcoma

> > > > being 3rd lord.

> > > >

> > > > Also could you explain why Sun being Atma and always

> beneficent as

> > > you

> > > > have claimed all along in the thread on the topic, did its

> > > Mahadasha

> > > > prove to be Killer to Ramana Maharshi?

> > > >

> > > > Take care,

> > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > >

> > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > > For example, remember that in Swami Vivekananda's chart

> Surya

> > > is

> > > > > lord of

> > > > > > the 9th occupying the lagna and causing a powerful Raj

> yoga. At

> > > > > the same

> > > > > > time if you thin how long the Swamiji lived, you may have

> to

> > > think

> > > > > again

> > > > > > about saying that it did not act as Mahakrura. Think about

> > > what it

> > > > > did

> > > > > > to the 7th bhava of Swamiji, also, before declaring that it

> > > became

> > > > > > shubha or less malefic.

> > > > >

> > > > > Lakshmi: I think Swamiji had an icchamrityu and looking at

> the

> > > dass

> > > > > operating on 4th July 1902, I observe that he passed away in

> Jup-

> > > Ven-

> > > > > Jup-Ket-Sat-Sat.

> > > > >

> > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > >

> > > > > Jup MD: 1893-02-09 (1:35:30 pm) - 1909-02-10 (3:59:13 pm)

> > > > > Ven AD: 1900-12-25 (10:03:30 am) - 1903-08-27 (4:48:54 pm)

> > > > > Jup PD: 1902-05-02 (1:42:07 pm) - 1902-09-12 (10:43:55 pm)

> > > > > Ket SD: 1902-06-29 (9:11:48 am) - 1902-07-07 (5:06:28 am)

> > > > > Sat PAD: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-06 (2:29:24 am)

> > > > >

> > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > >

> > > > > Sat: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-05 (1:27:03 am)

> > > > >

> > > > > Jupiter is in 2nd house from Moon, Venus is the 2nd lord from

> > > Moon

> > > > > and is posited in 2nd from lagna, Ketu is in the house of

> Venus

> > > and

> > > > > gives the results of Venus and Saturn is the 2nd lord from

> > > > > lagna....all are marakas. the maraka significations are

> stronger

> > > > > from Moon, and it's the cause of his early death.

> > > > >

> > > > > I fail to see where Sun comes into all this.

> > > > >

> > > > > However, I agree that Sun, as AK aspecting 7th house, can

> give

> > > > > parivraja tendencies. But can you ignore the influence of

> Saturn

> > > on

> > > > > Moon and 4th house, occuring in the 10th house? I am sure

> even

> > > weak

> > > > > Sun would have given him parivraja yoga:--))but without the

> raja

> > > > > yoga and the strong soul-level impact he created wherever he

> > > went.

> > > > >

> > > > > Or if you like look at what happened to the 7th

> > > > > > Bhava of Lord Rama with exalted Mars in the 7th bhava.

> > > > >

> > > > > Mars in 7th gives kuja dosha, and I think the strong Mars in

> 7th

> > > > > gave him an exalted wife like Sita. You have not commented

> on the

> > > > > exalted Saturn in 4th house.

> > > > >

> > > > > In each of the

> > > > > > example provided by you look at the bhava that the planets

> > > occupy

> > > > > > (barring Saturn, for reasons already stated in previous

> mail),

> > > > > without

> > > > > > looking at the charts as belonging to great people, and

> then

> > > make

> > > > > up

> > > > > > your mind as to the truth or otherwise of what I said. Did

> you

> > > > > know

> > > > > > Ramana Maharshi died following a malignant sarcoma of left

> hand

> > > > > and Mars

> > > > > > is karaka for the 3rd bhava in 8th in his chart, in

> > > exaltation. Do

> > > > > you

> > > > > > think Mars gave him benevolent results?

> > > > >

> > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I also request you to examine the following

> dasa

> > > > > sequences with an open mind. Sun is the 3rd lord from Moon

> (AK) &

> > > > > 12th lord from lagna in Sri Ramana's chart, rahu is with Sun

> and

> > > > > gives Sun'/Saturn's/Jupiter's effects...all of which point to

> > > > > dusthanas, Saturn is a maraka in 7th house and ketu can give

> the

> > > > > effects of Moon/Mercury/mars. Mar's effect, if at all, was

> only

> > > > > indirect, and he was not the killer.

> > > > >

> > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > >

> > > > > Sun MD: 1949-02-03 (1:02:22 am) - 1955-02-03 (2:05:32 pm)

> > > > > Rah AD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1951-02-21 (8:49:14 am)

> > > > > Rah PD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1950-05-18 (12:04:47 am)

> > > > > Sat SD: 1950-04-12 (3:37:16 am) - 1950-04-20 (12:18:02 am)

> > > > > Ket PAD: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14 (11:08:26 pm)

> > > > >

> > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > >

> > > > > Ket: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14 (12:47:04 pm)

> > > > >

> > > > > I think what stands out is the fact that the dasa of the

> graha

> > > > > conjoined Moon brought about death. I think their mind

> willed the

> > > > > death.

> > > > >

> > > > > Can a planet give results in a dasa totally

> > > unrelated/unassociated

> > > > > with itself? I request you to consider the above objectively.

> > > > >

> > > > > I will talk about the other charts/issues in my next mail.

> > > > >

> > > > > Regards,

> > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > >

> > > > > In Paramhans Ramkrishna's chart,

> > > > > > I do not know where you find Mars strong as a planet in

> > > > > debilitation in

> > > > > > Navamsha gives results of debility even when in exaltation

> in

> > > rasi

> > > > > > chart. In case of Saturn Viparitam shane smritam has

> already

> > > been

> > > > > > mentioned by me, in earlier mail.

> > > > >

> > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I myself have not considered Mars/Venus in

> Thakur's

> > > > > chart because they are debilitated. Please go through my

> message

> > > > > again. I was talking about Saturn and Rahu.

> > > > >

> > > > > About Shri Aurobindo, I trust you are

> > > > > > aware of his revolutionary background and that he was

> editor

> > > of a

> > > > > paper

> > > > > > "Vande Mataram" not much known for its soft language.

> > > > >

> > > > > > Same is the case with strong Malefics giving P.M. Yogas.

> Every

> > > > > graha is

> > > > > > capable of 12 variations of a P.M. Yoga attributed to it,

> at

> > > the

> > > > > very

> > > > > > least. It would only be naive to imagine they would all

> give

> > > > > identical

> > > > > > results as indicated by Parashara or all with Pancha

> > > Mahapurusha

> > > > > Yoga

> > > > > > would only rule over different parts of India (barring

> Saturn),

> > > > > just

> > > > > > because the sage said so. The sages gave us principles and

> > > > > expected us

> > > > > > to apply them to real life horoscope using Viveka.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I would gladly give you the shloka giving the reference to

> > > > > > "Viparita---Shane..." it is from an old classic respected

> > > amongst

> > > > > > astrologers, but as you do not seem to accept anything that

> > > does

> > > > > not fit

> > > > > > in with what, you think. is said by Dr. Raman, it would be

> an

> > > > > exercise

> > > > > > in futility. should you yet want the shloka I would of

> course

> > > be

> > > > > glad to

> > > > > > give it to you.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Om Gurave namah

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > You seem to be disagreeing with Shri B.V. Raman that

> strong

> > > > > planets,

> > > > > > > whether malefic or benefics give good results, while weak

> > > planets

> > > > > > > give bad results. Perhaps you also disagree about strong

> > > malefics

> > > > > > > giving mahapurusha yogas. Isn't it contrary to what all

> the

> > > > > jyotish

> > > > > > > texts teach?

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Then, here are a few examples, where I find that strong

> > > malefics

> > > > > > > have neither made the natives krura nor that their

> > > significations

> > > > > > > suffered.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Swami Vivekananda: strong sun in lagna and mars in 5th

> house

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Sri Aurobindo: Strong Sun in 2nd house.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Maharshi Mahesh yogi: exalted Mars in lagna.

> > > > > > > Ramana Maharshi: strong Mars in 8th house

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Sri Ramakrishna Paramahamsa: Exalted Saturn(9H) and Rahu

> > > (4H).

> > > > > Mars

> > > > > > > and Venus are also exalted in rasi, while debilitated in

> > > navamsa.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Sir, can you give me the reference for "vipareetam shaneH

> > > > > sritam"?

> > > > > > > Does it, by any chance, refer to Saturn's placement in

> the

> > > 8th

> > > > > house

> > > > > > > being beneficial?

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I am happy that you agree strong Saturn gives good

> results.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Can you tell me from where the saying is because i would

> > > like to

> > > > > > > read it up myself and understand.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > --- Chandrashekhar <chandrashekhar46@

> > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk>>

> > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > About Krura planets the saying is, that with

> > > > > > > > > > strength the Krura grahas

> > > > > > > > > > become more Krura (Maha-krura) and the shubha

> grahas

> > > > > > > > > > become more shubha.

> > > > > > > > > > Only Shani is more krura when weak and beneficial

> or

> > > > > > > > > > less krura when

> > > > > > > > > > strong "Viparitama shaneH smritam".

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > My sun dasa started when I was 9 years old, and

> > > > > > > > > > ended when I was 15

> > > > > > > > > > > years old. How come you didn't notice the second

> > > > > > > > > > part? I was old

> > > > > > > > > > > enough to understand the difference between

> > > > > > > > > > success and failure, I

> > > > > > > > > > > guess!

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Anyway, if you agree that Rahu is giving Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > results, and those

> > > > > > > > > > > results are exceptionally good, then it

> > > > > > > > > > automatically follows that

> > > > > > > > > > > Sun is strong in my chart because according to

> > > > > > > > > > Shri B.V Raman, evil

> > > > > > > > > > > planets, especially when weak, give bad results

> > > > > > > > > > (vide "a catechism

> > > > > > > > > > > of astrology"), while strong planets, even if

> > > > > > > > > > evil, give good

> > > > > > > > > > > results. If my Sun were weak, he wouldn't be

> > > > > > > > > > giving such good

> > > > > > > > > > > results:--))

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Since Mercury is hopelessly combust and inferior

> > > > > > > > > > in shadbala

> > > > > > > > > > > strength, the major results of Dharma

> > > > > > > > > > karmadhipathi yoga are also

> > > > > > > > > > > given by Sun, because according to "300

> > > > > > > > > > combinations" of Sri

> > > > > > > > > > > Raman, a planet with higher shadbala is more

> > > > > > > > > > likely to give the

> > > > > > > > > > > results of a yoga.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Regarding Karna, I request you to read the Karna

> > > > > > > > > > Parva of

> > > > > > > > > > > Mahabharata again. When he died, the nature bowed

> > > > > > > > > > in grief, because

> > > > > > > > > > > he's one of the noblest persons in Mahabharata.

> > > > > > > > > > Even the episode you

> > > > > > > > > > > quoted happened because Parashurama would teach

> > > > > > > > > > only Brahmins and

> > > > > > > > > > > Karna desperately wanted to learn dhanurvidya

> from

> > > > > > > > > > Parashurama so

> > > > > > > > > > > that he can support Duryodhana. Deceit is

> > > > > > > > > > certainly punishable and

> > > > > > > > > > > Karna did pay dearly. But it's to be borne in

> mind

> > > > > > > > > > that whatever

> > > > > > > > > > > Karna did was only to please Duryodhana, his

> > > > > > > > > > dearest friend. Karna

> > > > > > > > > > > did not gain anything personally.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the 3rd house from 8th house (I

> > > > > > > > > > think there was a typo

> > > > > > > > > > > at your end). In the natural zodiac, the 10 th

> > > > > > > > > > sign, being the

> > > > > > > > > > > cardinal earth sign, represents south /dakshina

> > > > > > > > > > disha. South is the

> > > > > > > > > > > direction ruled by Yama, the lord of death, hence

> > > > > > > > > > 10th house

> > > > > > > > > > > represents burial grounds. So, the Rudras

> (Saturn,

> > > > > > > > > > Sun and Mars) are

> > > > > > > > > > > strong in south. Also, Sun resides in south and

> > > > > > > > > > starts his

> > > > > > > > > > > northern voyage from here. So he has digbala in

> > > > > > > > > > 10th house.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > I did clarify that when I referred to Surya as

> > > > > > > > > > Karma saakshi, it's

> > > > > > > > > > > only to his status as antaraatma and not as a

> > > > > > > > > > deity. Perhaps this

> > > > > > > > > > > escaped your attention.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > This is my last post on the subject.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > <%40>

> > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > > <%40>,

> > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar

> > > > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > You were too young for the results of the dasha

> > > > > > > > > > to manifest,

> > > > > > > > > > > though it

> > > > > > > > > > > > is good news that your father had promotions

> and

> > > > > > > > > > you received

> > > > > > > > > > > > prizes/accolades during that time. It is

> > > > > > > > > > interesting to know you

> > > > > > > > > > > got

> > > > > > > > > > > > these results at a young age of 9 or so as that

> > > > > > > > > > is when Sun dasha

> > > > > > > > > > > was

> > > > > > > > > > > > operative. I am relieved you did not have any

> > > > > > > > > > health problems in

> > > > > > > > > > > > March-August 1970 period.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > But we are talking about Rahu and Rahu would

> > > > > > > > > > give results of Sun

> > > > > > > > > > > more

> > > > > > > > > > > > prominently, by conjunction, as you guessed but

> > > > > > > > > > also that of

> > > > > > > > > > > Mercury

> > > > > > > > > > > > (You have a Dharmakarmaadhipati yoga after all)

> > > > > > > > > > and that is why I

> > > > > > > > > > > said

> > > > > > > > > > > > for understanding Sun its dasha instead of Rahu

> > > > > > > > > > dasha needs to be

> > > > > > > > > > > analyzed.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Mercury is malefic not because I say so but

> > > > > > > > > > because Jyotish says

> > > > > > > > > > > that

> > > > > > > > > > > > mercury is malefic when conjunct a papa graha

> > > > > > > > > > and he is conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > two,

> > > > > > > > > > > > Sun and Rahu.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the apex of Artha trikona and

> > > > > > > > > > directly involved with

> > > > > > > > > > > > efforts to earn money. Though claimed to be

> > > > > > > > > > smashana/burial

> > > > > > > > > > > ground, it

> > > > > > > > > > > > is 4th from ayush sthana (8th) and its home

> that

> > > > > > > > > > is why affliction

> > > > > > > > > > > to it

> > > > > > > > > > > > can give death. But 8th is more popularly

> called

> > > > > > > > > > mrityu sthana and

> > > > > > > > > > > hence

> > > > > > > > > > > > 10th is called Smashana. If it is really

> > > > > > > > > > smashana why would it be

> > > > > > > > > > > called

> > > > > > > > > > > > karma sthana and why would Sun be at its most

> > > > > > > > > > brilliant there?

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > I did not say he can not represent water bodies

> > > > > > > > > > in temple, but not

> > > > > > > > > > > only

> > > > > > > > > > > > those.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > My Sun dasa was excellent too. My father

> > > > > > > > > > received promotion(s),

> > > > > > > > > > > my

> > > > > > > > > > > > > school/college days were great and i received

> > > > > > > > > > wide acclaim/prizes

> > > > > > > > > > > > > for my ability in creative writing, Veena,

> > > > > > > > > > quiz contests etc,

> > > > > > > > > > > apart

> > > > > > > > > > > > > from studies. So, for a student, I guess

> > > > > > > > > > that's excellent!!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > How do you justify this, if Sun were weak?

> > > > > > > > > > Rahu is certainly

> > > > > > > > > > > giving

> > > > > > > > > > > > > the yogakaraka results, but being in Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > house and being

> > > > > > > > > > > conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun, don't you think Rahu is also giving the

> > > > > > > > > > results of Sun? You

> > > > > > > > > > > > > said that mercury is malefic and heavily

> > > > > > > > > > combust too:--))

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > 1th house also represent burial

> > > > > > > > > > ground/smashaana. Is that a place

> > > > > > > > > > > > > for attachment?

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandra represents all water bodies, so why

> > > > > > > > > > can't he represent

> > > > > > > > > > > > > temple tank?

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > === message truncated ===

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Tired of spam? Mail has the best spam

> protection

> > > > > around

> > > > > > > > > <>

> > > < <>>

> > > > > < <>

> > > < <>>>

> > > > > > > < <>

> > > < <>>

> > > > > < <>

> > > < <>>>>

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > --------------------

> ----

> > > -

> > > > > > > -------

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.11.7/435 -

> Release

> > > > > Date:

> > > > > > > 8/31/2006

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

[Guest guest]

Om Gurave Namah

 

Namaste Pradeep,

 

Only Kalyan Varma is mentioning.Kalyan Varma included

> the illusionary factor which can catalyse all of the above and

result

> in dukham.

 

Lakshmi: I must remind you that The Kalyana Varma reference was not

chosen by me. It was chosen by Chandrasekhar ji and certified to be

impeccable.

 

Can you tell me if any other astro-book says that Saturn gives

contrary results (except in 8th house)? I do not recall

Parashara/Varahamihira saying it. If you can find it, please let me

know.

 

I must honestly say that Parashara/Varahamihira do not say anything

about Rahu representing "mada". But have they explicitly said any

thing about Sun having "ego" either? Were we not drawing convoluted

conclusions then?

 

Should we quote a book when it suits us and dump it when it doesn't?

 

Pradeep, please do not think that I am championing either Sun or

Rahu. I am sure you have read the mail where I said that Rahu is

also capable of giving great spirituality when involved in such

yogas. Infact what I have been fighting for all these days is for

fair treatment of all planets.

 

> Thus we have to look for the meaning suiting the context.Why Rahu

is

> just one among the shad ripus?Why not lust,kaama,moha,krodha? Rahu

is

> not any of these.He makes us have all these.

 

Lakshmi: You are very correct. Rahu is the generator of "I"- a false

feeling as a separate entity, which is the basis of ego (as

defined/argued by you in the earlier mails). This feeling is also

the basis of the shadripus which are based on one individual being

different from other.

 

Sun called as Atma karaka

> is karaka for lagna in astrology.Am i wrong? Once he enters the

body

> he is trapped and just wanders wherever the mind is taking ,until

self

> realization.Am i wrong?What is BHagavatham mentioning about

individual

> soul and its plight.

>

> Rahu does not enter on its own nor is it a feeling of ''I''.It is

just

> our assumption.

 

Lakshmi: Since we are talking about astrology, can you tell me

why "kumbha" (pindanda)has been given the dual lordship by Saturn

and Rahu? Why does birth take place? Because of karma (Saturn) and

unsatisfied kaama (Rahu) or because of aatma? If birth takes place

because of aatma, why should Aatma be unhappy or feel trapped in a

body? I request you to reflect on these and answer.

 

Why is Rahu called "Kaala sarpam" and represents Time? Does he cause

day/night? does he cause seasons? Then why? It's because he causes

the interminable birth cycle.

 

According to your own/Chandrasekhar ji's previous e-mails, "ego" is

a false feeling of differentiation. Now you yourself have said

that " Rahu the intoxication or illusion surrounding us giving us a

smoky/obscurant idea".

 

I agree with all that you say. Now putting all this together, please

tell me if Rahu does not give a illusiory/intoxicated/false idea of

oneself.

 

Btw, I really appreciate the way you research and i understand the

way you feel about Rahu. I again reiterate that I have nothing

against Rahu...my own Rahu dasa is excellent and is bringing me

immense spiritual benefits, like the present discussion:--))

 

Regards,

Lakshmi

 

 

 

 

 

 

>

 

 

> Thanks

> Pradeep

>

> , "b_lakshmi_ramesh"

> <b_lakshmi_ramesh@> wrote:

> >

> > Om Gurave Namah

> >

> > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji & Pradeep ji,

> >

> > I recollect writing in my previous e-mails, that the shloka from

> > Saravali talks about the inner qualities of an

> > individual/kalapurusha. Does the word "mada" imply intoxication

as

> > an inner quality? Does the word "intoxication" belong in that

> > context, in that group?

> >

> > I do not think either of you responded to that. perhaps you

missed

> > it out in the avalanche of e-mails:--))

> >

> > Can i have your response(s) please?

> >

> > Regards,

> > Lakshmi

> >

> >

> > , Chandrashekhar

> > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > >

> > > Pride is different from ego. Like it or not Mada does mean

> > intoxication

> > > or lust. The Kama that is referred to relates to kaamana which

> > means

> > > desires for things possessed by others. That is what Asteya,

one

> > of the

> > > Yamas of Hatha yogas refer to.

> > >

> > > We are talking about auspiciousness or other wise of the

dormant

> > or

> > > awakened Kundalini. As I said all scriptures can be

misinterpreted

> > if

> > > one wants to do that. But that does not serve any purpose. I

would

> > not

> > > go into what exactly is meant by Vidya and Avidya related to

Maa.

> > I have

> > > not yet seen any Pramana, in the form of a shloka, to support

your

> > > proposition that dormant Kundalini is inauspicious and the

> > awakened

> > > Kundalini is auspicious so far. I have already posted the way

my

> > > generation has been taught to accept an argument, so I shall

not

> > repeat

> > > it here.

> > >

> > > But I will not resort to conjectures and would like to quote

from

> > > Rudrayamala tantra about the swarUpa of dormant Kundalini.

Being

> > > graduate in sanskrit, I am sure I will not have to translate

it

> > for you.

> > > Aaxare prdevta Éìjntax> k…{flI devta

> > > ädhäre paradevatä bhavrajanatädhaù kuëòalé devatä

> > > devanamixdevta iÇjgtamanNdpuÃiSwta,

> > > devänämadhidevatä trijagatämänandapuïjasthitä|

> > > mUlaxarinvaisnI iÇrm[i ya }ainnI mailnI

> > > mülädhäraniväsiné triramaëé yä jïäniné mäliné

> > > sa me mat&mnuiSwta k…lpwanNdEkbIjanna.32,21.

> > > sä me mätåmanusthitä kulapathänandaikabéjänanä||32|21||

> > >

> > > I am sure you must have some quote to support your contention.

I

> > would

> > > like to see the shloka, as against conjectures, so that I can

> > improve

> > > upon my knowledge of the swarupaa of Kundalini.

> > >

> > > I can understand your reluctance to support your propositions

with

> > > suitable pramanas. I am sorry if I have hurt you by pointing

out

> > the

> > > inconsistency in the way you treated Surya and Rahu

combinations

> > in two

> > > different chart as stand out combinations only.

> > >

> > > I had no intention to cause any hurt to you and if I have done

so

> > > inadvertently I crave your pardon.

> > >

> > > Take care,

> > >

> > > Chandrashekhar

> > >

> > >

> > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > >

> > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > >

> > > > The shadripus are kaama (lust), krodha (anger), lobha

(greed),

> > moha

> > > > (attachment, delusion), mada (pride) and maatsarya (jealousy)

> > > > If "mada" means "lust" what does "kaama" imply among the

> > > > shadripus? "Mada" signifies one who is intoxicated/drunk with

> > > > power/self-grandeur (pride/ego).

> > > >

> > > > Mother is known as "Vidya and avidya swaroopini" and correct

> > > > appreciation of Mother includes understanding of both

facets. As

> > > > Shakti, She respresents raw power which can be routed

towards

> > good

> > > > deeds as well as bad deeds. Are both ends the same? The

wisdom,

> > > > required to put this immense shakti to good use, is

represented

> > by

> > > > Shiva, hence the union of Shiva and Parvati, wisdom and

power, is

> > > > said to be auspicious because it ensures the

correct/judicious

> > end

> > > > use of shakti. Hence the orientation of Shakti is very very

> > > > important.

> > > >

> > > > I always said that Soorya is both sattwik and krura. I also

> > always

> > > > said all planets, including Jupiter, can give malefic

results, if

> > > > they are functionally empowered to do so. You can refer to

all my

> > > > previous mails to confirm this.

> > > >

> > > > Sir, Truth is much more important than winning or losing an

> > > > argument. All discussions must proceed as an exploration and

> > > > celebration of Truth. When this is not the case, I see no

> > purpose in

> > > > continuing these discussions.

> > > >

> > > > Thanks & Regards,

> > > > Lakshmi

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > >

> > > > > Having Icchamrityu and dying at an early age are operating

at

> > > > different

> > > > > levels. Bhishma had Iccha Mrityu but did not die young. So

> > please

> > > > do not

> > > > > try to mix the issues. If you have read Swamiji's

biography you

> > > > will

> > > > > find that he fell sick many times despite of apparent

robust

> > > > physique.

> > > > >

> > > > > Commenting on Shani in 4th for Rama's chart confirms with

his

> > > > being

> > > > > capable of giving Vipareeta results. I did not know I was

> > expected

> > > > to

> > > > > analyze the entire chart. By the way if there is a Kuja

dosha

> > how

> > > > does

> > > > > that by itself give a Divine wife? Please do not bring our

> > > > devotion to

> > > > > Lord Rama (and we both have that) into astrological

analysis of

> > > > his chart.

> > > > >

> > > > > Bringing in the dashas when the discussions are on the

effects

> > of

> > > > grahas

> > > > > will only lead the discussion to no where. The two have to

be

> > seen

> > > > > separately as we are not trying to time an event but only

> > trying

> > > > to find

> > > > > what are the effects on bhavas occupied.

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear Lakshmi in Ramana Maharshi's chart you have perhaps

> > forgotten

> > > > the

> > > > > saying Kuja vat Ketu. look at the Ketu deha in that

perspective

> > > > and let

> > > > > me know your views. And if by the way you read my mail, I

did

> > not

> > > > say

> > > > > anything about mars being killer for him, only that it

gave him

> > > > Sarcoma

> > > > > being 3rd lord.

> > > > >

> > > > > Also could you explain why Sun being Atma and always

> > beneficent as

> > > > you

> > > > > have claimed all along in the thread on the topic, did its

> > > > Mahadasha

> > > > > prove to be Killer to Ramana Maharshi?

> > > > >

> > > > > Take care,

> > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > > For example, remember that in Swami Vivekananda's

chart

> > Surya

> > > > is

> > > > > > lord of

> > > > > > > the 9th occupying the lagna and causing a powerful Raj

> > yoga. At

> > > > > > the same

> > > > > > > time if you thin how long the Swamiji lived, you may

have

> > to

> > > > think

> > > > > > again

> > > > > > > about saying that it did not act as Mahakrura. Think

about

> > > > what it

> > > > > > did

> > > > > > > to the 7th bhava of Swamiji, also, before declaring

that it

> > > > became

> > > > > > > shubha or less malefic.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Lakshmi: I think Swamiji had an icchamrityu and looking

at

> > the

> > > > dass

> > > > > > operating on 4th July 1902, I observe that he passed

away in

> > Jup-

> > > > Ven-

> > > > > > Jup-Ket-Sat-Sat.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Jup MD: 1893-02-09 (1:35:30 pm) - 1909-02-10 (3:59:13 pm)

> > > > > > Ven AD: 1900-12-25 (10:03:30 am) - 1903-08-27 (4:48:54

pm)

> > > > > > Jup PD: 1902-05-02 (1:42:07 pm) - 1902-09-12 (10:43:55

pm)

> > > > > > Ket SD: 1902-06-29 (9:11:48 am) - 1902-07-07 (5:06:28 am)

> > > > > > Sat PAD: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-06 (2:29:24

am)

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Sat: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-05 (1:27:03 am)

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Jupiter is in 2nd house from Moon, Venus is the 2nd lord

from

> > > > Moon

> > > > > > and is posited in 2nd from lagna, Ketu is in the house

of

> > Venus

> > > > and

> > > > > > gives the results of Venus and Saturn is the 2nd lord

from

> > > > > > lagna....all are marakas. the maraka significations are

> > stronger

> > > > > > from Moon, and it's the cause of his early death.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I fail to see where Sun comes into all this.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > However, I agree that Sun, as AK aspecting 7th house,

can

> > give

> > > > > > parivraja tendencies. But can you ignore the influence

of

> > Saturn

> > > > on

> > > > > > Moon and 4th house, occuring in the 10th house? I am

sure

> > even

> > > > weak

> > > > > > Sun would have given him parivraja yoga:--))but without

the

> > raja

> > > > > > yoga and the strong soul-level impact he created

wherever he

> > > > went.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Or if you like look at what happened to the 7th

> > > > > > > Bhava of Lord Rama with exalted Mars in the 7th bhava.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Mars in 7th gives kuja dosha, and I think the strong

Mars in

> > 7th

> > > > > > gave him an exalted wife like Sita. You have not

commented

> > on the

> > > > > > exalted Saturn in 4th house.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > In each of the

> > > > > > > example provided by you look at the bhava that the

planets

> > > > occupy

> > > > > > > (barring Saturn, for reasons already stated in

previous

> > mail),

> > > > > > without

> > > > > > > looking at the charts as belonging to great people,

and

> > then

> > > > make

> > > > > > up

> > > > > > > your mind as to the truth or otherwise of what I said.

Did

> > you

> > > > > > know

> > > > > > > Ramana Maharshi died following a malignant sarcoma of

left

> > hand

> > > > > > and Mars

> > > > > > > is karaka for the 3rd bhava in 8th in his chart, in

> > > > exaltation. Do

> > > > > > you

> > > > > > > think Mars gave him benevolent results?

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I also request you to examine the

following

> > dasa

> > > > > > sequences with an open mind. Sun is the 3rd lord from

Moon

> > (AK) &

> > > > > > 12th lord from lagna in Sri Ramana's chart, rahu is with

Sun

> > and

> > > > > > gives Sun'/Saturn's/Jupiter's effects...all of which

point to

> > > > > > dusthanas, Saturn is a maraka in 7th house and ketu can

give

> > the

> > > > > > effects of Moon/Mercury/mars. Mar's effect, if at all,

was

> > only

> > > > > > indirect, and he was not the killer.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Sun MD: 1949-02-03 (1:02:22 am) - 1955-02-03 (2:05:32 pm)

> > > > > > Rah AD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1951-02-21 (8:49:14 am)

> > > > > > Rah PD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1950-05-18 (12:04:47

am)

> > > > > > Sat SD: 1950-04-12 (3:37:16 am) - 1950-04-20 (12:18:02

am)

> > > > > > Ket PAD: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14 (11:08:26

pm)

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Ket: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14 (12:47:04 pm)

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I think what stands out is the fact that the dasa of the

> > graha

> > > > > > conjoined Moon brought about death. I think their mind

> > willed the

> > > > > > death.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Can a planet give results in a dasa totally

> > > > unrelated/unassociated

> > > > > > with itself? I request you to consider the above

objectively.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I will talk about the other charts/issues in my next

mail.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > >

> > > > > > In Paramhans Ramkrishna's chart,

> > > > > > > I do not know where you find Mars strong as a planet in

> > > > > > debilitation in

> > > > > > > Navamsha gives results of debility even when in

exaltation

> > in

> > > > rasi

> > > > > > > chart. In case of Saturn Viparitam shane smritam has

> > already

> > > > been

> > > > > > > mentioned by me, in earlier mail.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I myself have not considered Mars/Venus in

> > Thakur's

> > > > > > chart because they are debilitated. Please go through my

> > message

> > > > > > again. I was talking about Saturn and Rahu.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > About Shri Aurobindo, I trust you are

> > > > > > > aware of his revolutionary background and that he was

> > editor

> > > > of a

> > > > > > paper

> > > > > > > "Vande Mataram" not much known for its soft language.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > > Same is the case with strong Malefics giving P.M.

Yogas.

> > Every

> > > > > > graha is

> > > > > > > capable of 12 variations of a P.M. Yoga attributed to

it,

> > at

> > > > the

> > > > > > very

> > > > > > > least. It would only be naive to imagine they would

all

> > give

> > > > > > identical

> > > > > > > results as indicated by Parashara or all with Pancha

> > > > Mahapurusha

> > > > > > Yoga

> > > > > > > would only rule over different parts of India (barring

> > Saturn),

> > > > > > just

> > > > > > > because the sage said so. The sages gave us principles

and

> > > > > > expected us

> > > > > > > to apply them to real life horoscope using Viveka.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I would gladly give you the shloka giving the

reference to

> > > > > > > "Viparita---Shane..." it is from an old classic

respected

> > > > amongst

> > > > > > > astrologers, but as you do not seem to accept anything

that

> > > > does

> > > > > > not fit

> > > > > > > in with what, you think. is said by Dr. Raman, it

would be

> > an

> > > > > > exercise

> > > > > > > in futility. should you yet want the shloka I would of

> > course

> > > > be

> > > > > > glad to

> > > > > > > give it to you.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Om Gurave namah

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > You seem to be disagreeing with Shri B.V. Raman that

> > strong

> > > > > > planets,

> > > > > > > > whether malefic or benefics give good results, while

weak

> > > > planets

> > > > > > > > give bad results. Perhaps you also disagree about

strong

> > > > malefics

> > > > > > > > giving mahapurusha yogas. Isn't it contrary to what

all

> > the

> > > > > > jyotish

> > > > > > > > texts teach?

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Then, here are a few examples, where I find that

strong

> > > > malefics

> > > > > > > > have neither made the natives krura nor that their

> > > > significations

> > > > > > > > suffered.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Swami Vivekananda: strong sun in lagna and mars in

5th

> > house

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Sri Aurobindo: Strong Sun in 2nd house.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Maharshi Mahesh yogi: exalted Mars in lagna.

> > > > > > > > Ramana Maharshi: strong Mars in 8th house

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Sri Ramakrishna Paramahamsa: Exalted Saturn(9H) and

Rahu

> > > > (4H).

> > > > > > Mars

> > > > > > > > and Venus are also exalted in rasi, while

debilitated in

> > > > navamsa.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Sir, can you give me the reference for "vipareetam

shaneH

> > > > > > sritam"?

> > > > > > > > Does it, by any chance, refer to Saturn's placement

in

> > the

> > > > 8th

> > > > > > house

> > > > > > > > being beneficial?

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > I am happy that you agree strong Saturn gives good

> > results.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Can you tell me from where the saying is because i

would

> > > > like to

> > > > > > > > read it up myself and understand.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > --- Chandrashekhar <chandrashekhar46@

> > > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk>>

> > > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > About Krura planets the saying is, that with

> > > > > > > > > > > strength the Krura grahas

> > > > > > > > > > > become more Krura (Maha-krura) and the shubha

> > grahas

> > > > > > > > > > > become more shubha.

> > > > > > > > > > > Only Shani is more krura when weak and

beneficial

> > or

> > > > > > > > > > > less krura when

> > > > > > > > > > > strong "Viparitama shaneH smritam".

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > My sun dasa started when I was 9 years old,

and

> > > > > > > > > > > ended when I was 15

> > > > > > > > > > > > years old. How come you didn't notice the

second

> > > > > > > > > > > part? I was old

> > > > > > > > > > > > enough to understand the difference between

> > > > > > > > > > > success and failure, I

> > > > > > > > > > > > guess!

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Anyway, if you agree that Rahu is giving

Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > > results, and those

> > > > > > > > > > > > results are exceptionally good, then it

> > > > > > > > > > > automatically follows that

> > > > > > > > > > > > Sun is strong in my chart because according

to

> > > > > > > > > > > Shri B.V Raman, evil

> > > > > > > > > > > > planets, especially when weak, give bad

results

> > > > > > > > > > > (vide "a catechism

> > > > > > > > > > > > of astrology"), while strong planets, even if

> > > > > > > > > > > evil, give good

> > > > > > > > > > > > results. If my Sun were weak, he wouldn't be

> > > > > > > > > > > giving such good

> > > > > > > > > > > > results:--))

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Since Mercury is hopelessly combust and

inferior

> > > > > > > > > > > in shadbala

> > > > > > > > > > > > strength, the major results of Dharma

> > > > > > > > > > > karmadhipathi yoga are also

> > > > > > > > > > > > given by Sun, because according to "300

> > > > > > > > > > > combinations" of Sri

> > > > > > > > > > > > Raman, a planet with higher shadbala is more

> > > > > > > > > > > likely to give the

> > > > > > > > > > > > results of a yoga.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Regarding Karna, I request you to read the

Karna

> > > > > > > > > > > Parva of

> > > > > > > > > > > > Mahabharata again. When he died, the nature

bowed

> > > > > > > > > > > in grief, because

> > > > > > > > > > > > he's one of the noblest persons in

Mahabharata.

> > > > > > > > > > > Even the episode you

> > > > > > > > > > > > quoted happened because Parashurama would

teach

> > > > > > > > > > > only Brahmins and

> > > > > > > > > > > > Karna desperately wanted to learn

dhanurvidya

> > from

> > > > > > > > > > > Parashurama so

> > > > > > > > > > > > that he can support Duryodhana. Deceit is

> > > > > > > > > > > certainly punishable and

> > > > > > > > > > > > Karna did pay dearly. But it's to be borne

in

> > mind

> > > > > > > > > > > that whatever

> > > > > > > > > > > > Karna did was only to please Duryodhana, his

> > > > > > > > > > > dearest friend. Karna

> > > > > > > > > > > > did not gain anything personally.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the 3rd house from 8th house (I

> > > > > > > > > > > think there was a typo

> > > > > > > > > > > > at your end). In the natural zodiac, the 10

th

> > > > > > > > > > > sign, being the

> > > > > > > > > > > > cardinal earth sign, represents

south /dakshina

> > > > > > > > > > > disha. South is the

> > > > > > > > > > > > direction ruled by Yama, the lord of death,

hence

> > > > > > > > > > > 10th house

> > > > > > > > > > > > represents burial grounds. So, the Rudras

> > (Saturn,

> > > > > > > > > > > Sun and Mars) are

> > > > > > > > > > > > strong in south. Also, Sun resides in south

and

> > > > > > > > > > > starts his

> > > > > > > > > > > > northern voyage from here. So he has digbala

in

> > > > > > > > > > > 10th house.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > I did clarify that when I referred to Surya

as

> > > > > > > > > > > Karma saakshi, it's

> > > > > > > > > > > > only to his status as antaraatma and not as a

> > > > > > > > > > > deity. Perhaps this

> > > > > > > > > > > > escaped your attention.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > This is my last post on the subject.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > <%40>

> > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > > > <%40>,

> > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar

> > > > > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > You were too young for the results of the

dasha

> > > > > > > > > > > to manifest,

> > > > > > > > > > > > though it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > is good news that your father had

promotions

> > and

> > > > > > > > > > > you received

> > > > > > > > > > > > > prizes/accolades during that time. It is

> > > > > > > > > > > interesting to know you

> > > > > > > > > > > > got

> > > > > > > > > > > > > these results at a young age of 9 or so as

that

> > > > > > > > > > > is when Sun dasha

> > > > > > > > > > > > was

> > > > > > > > > > > > > operative. I am relieved you did not have

any

> > > > > > > > > > > health problems in

> > > > > > > > > > > > > March-August 1970 period.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > But we are talking about Rahu and Rahu

would

> > > > > > > > > > > give results of Sun

> > > > > > > > > > > > more

> > > > > > > > > > > > > prominently, by conjunction, as you

guessed but

> > > > > > > > > > > also that of

> > > > > > > > > > > > Mercury

> > > > > > > > > > > > > (You have a Dharmakarmaadhipati yoga after

all)

> > > > > > > > > > > and that is why I

> > > > > > > > > > > > said

> > > > > > > > > > > > > for understanding Sun its dasha instead of

Rahu

> > > > > > > > > > > dasha needs to be

> > > > > > > > > > > > analyzed.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Mercury is malefic not because I say so but

> > > > > > > > > > > because Jyotish says

> > > > > > > > > > > > that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > mercury is malefic when conjunct a papa

graha

> > > > > > > > > > > and he is conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > > two,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun and Rahu.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the apex of Artha trikona and

> > > > > > > > > > > directly involved with

> > > > > > > > > > > > > efforts to earn money. Though claimed to be

> > > > > > > > > > > smashana/burial

> > > > > > > > > > > > ground, it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > is 4th from ayush sthana (8th) and its

home

> > that

> > > > > > > > > > > is why affliction

> > > > > > > > > > > > to it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > can give death. But 8th is more popularly

> > called

> > > > > > > > > > > mrityu sthana and

> > > > > > > > > > > > hence

> > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th is called Smashana. If it is really

> > > > > > > > > > > smashana why would it be

> > > > > > > > > > > > called

> > > > > > > > > > > > > karma sthana and why would Sun be at its

most

> > > > > > > > > > > brilliant there?

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > I did not say he can not represent water

bodies

> > > > > > > > > > > in temple, but not

> > > > > > > > > > > > only

> > > > > > > > > > > > > those.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > My Sun dasa was excellent too. My father

> > > > > > > > > > > received promotion(s),

> > > > > > > > > > > > my

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > school/college days were great and i

received

> > > > > > > > > > > wide acclaim/prizes

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > for my ability in creative writing,

Veena,

> > > > > > > > > > > quiz contests etc,

> > > > > > > > > > > > apart

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > from studies. So, for a student, I guess

> > > > > > > > > > > that's excellent!!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > How do you justify this, if Sun were

weak?

> > > > > > > > > > > Rahu is certainly

> > > > > > > > > > > > giving

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > the yogakaraka results, but being in

Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > > house and being

> > > > > > > > > > > > conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun, don't you think Rahu is also giving

the

> > > > > > > > > > > results of Sun? You

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > said that mercury is malefic and heavily

> > > > > > > > > > > combust too:--))

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1th house also represent burial

> > > > > > > > > > > ground/smashaana. Is that a place

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > for attachment?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandra represents all water bodies, so

why

> > > > > > > > > > > can't he represent

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > temple tank?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > === message truncated ===

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

 

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Tired of spam? Mail has the best spam

> > protection

> > > > > > around

> > > > > > > > > > <>

> > > > < <>>

> > > > > > < <>

> > > > < <>>>

> > > > > > > > < <>

> > > > < <>>

> > > > > > < <>

> > > > < <>>>>

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > ----------------

----

> > ----

> > > > -

> > > > > > > > -------

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.11.7/435 -

 

> > Release

> > > > > > Date:

> > > > > > > > 8/31/2006

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

removed]

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > --------------------

----

> > -

> > > > > > -------

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.12.2/441 -

Release

> > > > Date:

> > > > > > 9/7/2006

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

[Guest guest]

Om Gurave Namah

 

Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

 

What i meant by "inner" quality is an "inherent/natural " quality of

human being. Please refer to my original mail in this respect.

 

Now, all of us have soul, mind, strength, speech, knowledge,

happiness, ego (sense of being different from others) and grief.

Even a 5 year old kid has all these qualities, as appropriate to

his/her age, unless handicapped. Are we intoxicated? Is the 5 year

old intoxicated? Is "intoxication" a natural or unnatural quality?

Is the bull elephant in a permanent state of intoxication?

 

Regards,

Lakshmi

 

 

 

 

 

 

, Chandrashekhar

<chandrashekhar46 wrote:

>

> Dear Divine Lakshmi,

>

> At least AI did not answer as I did not want to split hairs over

whether

> all that is mentioned in the referred shloka is inner quality

since I do

> not find Kalyan Varman mentioning or implying so. However as you

want an

> reply, let me ask as to why if speech, attributed to Budha in the

> shloka, can be internal quality according to you then why should

> intoxication not be?

>

> Chandrashekhar.

>

>

> b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> >

> >

> > Om Gurave Namah

> >

> > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji & Pradeep ji,

> >

> > I recollect writing in my previous e-mails, that the shloka from

> > Saravali talks about the inner qualities of an

> > individual/kalapurusha. Does the word "mada" imply intoxication

as

> > an inner quality? Does the word "intoxication" belong in that

> > context, in that group?

> >

> > I do not think either of you responded to that. perhaps you

missed

> > it out in the avalanche of e-mails:--))

> >

> > Can i have your response(s) please?

> >

> > Regards,

> > Lakshmi

> >

> >

> > <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > >

> > > Pride is different from ego. Like it or not Mada does mean

> > intoxication

> > > or lust. The Kama that is referred to relates to kaamana which

> > means

> > > desires for things possessed by others. That is what Asteya,

one

> > of the

> > > Yamas of Hatha yogas refer to.

> > >

> > > We are talking about auspiciousness or other wise of the

dormant

> > or

> > > awakened Kundalini. As I said all scriptures can be

misinterpreted

> > if

> > > one wants to do that. But that does not serve any purpose. I

would

> > not

> > > go into what exactly is meant by Vidya and Avidya related to

Maa.

> > I have

> > > not yet seen any Pramana, in the form of a shloka, to support

your

> > > proposition that dormant Kundalini is inauspicious and the

> > awakened

> > > Kundalini is auspicious so far. I have already posted the way

my

> > > generation has been taught to accept an argument, so I shall

not

> > repeat

> > > it here.

> > >

> > > But I will not resort to conjectures and would like to quote

from

> > > Rudrayamala tantra about the swarUpa of dormant Kundalini.

Being

> > > graduate in sanskrit, I am sure I will not have to translate

it

> > for you.

> > > Aaxare prdevta Éìjntax> k…{flI devta

> > > ädhäre paradevatä bhavrajanatädhaù kuëòalé devatä

> > > devanamixdevta iÇjgtamanNdpuÃiSwta,

> > > devänämadhidevatä trijagatämänandapuïjasthitä|

> > > mUlaxarinvaisnI iÇrm[i ya }ainnI mailnI

> > > mülädhäraniväsiné triramaëé yä jïäniné mäliné

> > > sa me mat&mnuiSwta k…lpwanNdEkbIjanna.32,21.

> > > sä me mätåmanusthitä kulapathänandaikabéjänanä||32|21||

> > >

> > > I am sure you must have some quote to support your

contention. I

> > would

> > > like to see the shloka, as against conjectures, so that I can

> > improve

> > > upon my knowledge of the swarupaa of Kundalini.

> > >

> > > I can understand your reluctance to support your propositions

with

> > > suitable pramanas. I am sorry if I have hurt you by pointing

out

> > the

> > > inconsistency in the way you treated Surya and Rahu

combinations

> > in two

> > > different chart as stand out combinations only.

> > >

> > > I had no intention to cause any hurt to you and if I have

done so

> > > inadvertently I crave your pardon.

> > >

> > > Take care,

> > >

> > > Chandrashekhar

> > >

> > >

> > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > >

> > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > >

> > > > The shadripus are kaama (lust), krodha (anger), lobha

(greed),

> > moha

> > > > (attachment, delusion), mada (pride) and maatsarya

(jealousy)

> > > > If "mada" means "lust" what does "kaama" imply among the

> > > > shadripus? "Mada" signifies one who is intoxicated/drunk

with

> > > > power/self-grandeur (pride/ego).

> > > >

> > > > Mother is known as "Vidya and avidya swaroopini" and correct

> > > > appreciation of Mother includes understanding of both

facets. As

> > > > Shakti, She respresents raw power which can be routed

towards

> > good

> > > > deeds as well as bad deeds. Are both ends the same? The

wisdom,

> > > > required to put this immense shakti to good use, is

represented

> > by

> > > > Shiva, hence the union of Shiva and Parvati, wisdom and

power, is

> > > > said to be auspicious because it ensures the

correct/judicious

> > end

> > > > use of shakti. Hence the orientation of Shakti is very very

> > > > important.

> > > >

> > > > I always said that Soorya is both sattwik and krura. I also

> > always

> > > > said all planets, including Jupiter, can give malefic

results, if

> > > > they are functionally empowered to do so. You can refer to

all my

> > > > previous mails to confirm this.

> > > >

> > > > Sir, Truth is much more important than winning or losing an

> > > > argument. All discussions must proceed as an exploration and

> > > > celebration of Truth. When this is not the case, I see no

> > purpose in

> > > > continuing these discussions.

> > > >

> > > > Thanks & Regards,

> > > > Lakshmi

> > > >

> > > >

> > <%40>

> > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > >

> > > > > Having Icchamrityu and dying at an early age are

operating at

> > > > different

> > > > > levels. Bhishma had Iccha Mrityu but did not die young. So

> > please

> > > > do not

> > > > > try to mix the issues. If you have read Swamiji's

biography you

> > > > will

> > > > > find that he fell sick many times despite of apparent

robust

> > > > physique.

> > > > >

> > > > > Commenting on Shani in 4th for Rama's chart confirms with

his

> > > > being

> > > > > capable of giving Vipareeta results. I did not know I was

> > expected

> > > > to

> > > > > analyze the entire chart. By the way if there is a Kuja

dosha

> > how

> > > > does

> > > > > that by itself give a Divine wife? Please do not bring our

> > > > devotion to

> > > > > Lord Rama (and we both have that) into astrological

analysis of

> > > > his chart.

> > > > >

> > > > > Bringing in the dashas when the discussions are on the

effects

> > of

> > > > grahas

> > > > > will only lead the discussion to no where. The two have

to be

> > seen

> > > > > separately as we are not trying to time an event but only

> > trying

> > > > to find

> > > > > what are the effects on bhavas occupied.

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear Lakshmi in Ramana Maharshi's chart you have perhaps

> > forgotten

> > > > the

> > > > > saying Kuja vat Ketu. look at the Ketu deha in that

perspective

> > > > and let

> > > > > me know your views. And if by the way you read my mail, I

did

> > not

> > > > say

> > > > > anything about mars being killer for him, only that it

gave him

> > > > Sarcoma

> > > > > being 3rd lord.

> > > > >

> > > > > Also could you explain why Sun being Atma and always

> > beneficent as

> > > > you

> > > > > have claimed all along in the thread on the topic, did its

> > > > Mahadasha

> > > > > prove to be Killer to Ramana Maharshi?

> > > > >

> > > > > Take care,

> > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > > For example, remember that in Swami Vivekananda's

chart

> > Surya

> > > > is

> > > > > > lord of

> > > > > > > the 9th occupying the lagna and causing a powerful Raj

> > yoga. At

> > > > > > the same

> > > > > > > time if you thin how long the Swamiji lived, you may

have

> > to

> > > > think

> > > > > > again

> > > > > > > about saying that it did not act as Mahakrura. Think

about

> > > > what it

> > > > > > did

> > > > > > > to the 7th bhava of Swamiji, also, before declaring

that it

> > > > became

> > > > > > > shubha or less malefic.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Lakshmi: I think Swamiji had an icchamrityu and looking

at

> > the

> > > > dass

> > > > > > operating on 4th July 1902, I observe that he passed

away in

> > Jup-

> > > > Ven-

> > > > > > Jup-Ket-Sat-Sat.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Jup MD: 1893-02-09 (1:35:30 pm) - 1909-02-10 (3:59:13

pm)

> > > > > > Ven AD: 1900-12-25 (10:03:30 am) - 1903-08-27 (4:48:54

pm)

> > > > > > Jup PD: 1902-05-02 (1:42:07 pm) - 1902-09-12 (10:43:55

pm)

> > > > > > Ket SD: 1902-06-29 (9:11:48 am) - 1902-07-07 (5:06:28

am)

> > > > > > Sat PAD: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-06 (2:29:24

am)

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Sat: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-05 (1:27:03 am)

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Jupiter is in 2nd house from Moon, Venus is the 2nd

lord from

> > > > Moon

> > > > > > and is posited in 2nd from lagna, Ketu is in the house

of

> > Venus

> > > > and

> > > > > > gives the results of Venus and Saturn is the 2nd lord

from

> > > > > > lagna....all are marakas. the maraka significations are

> > stronger

> > > > > > from Moon, and it's the cause of his early death.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I fail to see where Sun comes into all this.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > However, I agree that Sun, as AK aspecting 7th house,

can

> > give

> > > > > > parivraja tendencies. But can you ignore the influence

of

> > Saturn

> > > > on

> > > > > > Moon and 4th house, occuring in the 10th house? I am

sure

> > even

> > > > weak

> > > > > > Sun would have given him parivraja yoga:--))but without

the

> > raja

> > > > > > yoga and the strong soul-level impact he created

wherever he

> > > > went.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Or if you like look at what happened to the 7th

> > > > > > > Bhava of Lord Rama with exalted Mars in the 7th bhava.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Mars in 7th gives kuja dosha, and I think the strong

Mars in

> > 7th

> > > > > > gave him an exalted wife like Sita. You have not

commented

> > on the

> > > > > > exalted Saturn in 4th house.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > In each of the

> > > > > > > example provided by you look at the bhava that the

planets

> > > > occupy

> > > > > > > (barring Saturn, for reasons already stated in

previous

> > mail),

> > > > > > without

> > > > > > > looking at the charts as belonging to great people,

and

> > then

> > > > make

> > > > > > up

> > > > > > > your mind as to the truth or otherwise of what I

said. Did

> > you

> > > > > > know

> > > > > > > Ramana Maharshi died following a malignant sarcoma of

left

> > hand

> > > > > > and Mars

> > > > > > > is karaka for the 3rd bhava in 8th in his chart, in

> > > > exaltation. Do

> > > > > > you

> > > > > > > think Mars gave him benevolent results?

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I also request you to examine the

following

> > dasa

> > > > > > sequences with an open mind. Sun is the 3rd lord from

Moon

> > (AK) &

> > > > > > 12th lord from lagna in Sri Ramana's chart, rahu is

with Sun

> > and

> > > > > > gives Sun'/Saturn's/Jupiter's effects...all of which

point to

> > > > > > dusthanas, Saturn is a maraka in 7th house and ketu can

give

> > the

> > > > > > effects of Moon/Mercury/mars. Mar's effect, if at all,

was

> > only

> > > > > > indirect, and he was not the killer.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Sun MD: 1949-02-03 (1:02:22 am) - 1955-02-03 (2:05:32

pm)

> > > > > > Rah AD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1951-02-21 (8:49:14

am)

> > > > > > Rah PD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1950-05-18 (12:04:47

am)

> > > > > > Sat SD: 1950-04-12 (3:37:16 am) - 1950-04-20 (12:18:02

am)

> > > > > > Ket PAD: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14

(11:08:26 pm)

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Ket: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14 (12:47:04 pm)

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I think what stands out is the fact that the dasa of the

> > graha

> > > > > > conjoined Moon brought about death. I think their mind

> > willed the

> > > > > > death.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Can a planet give results in a dasa totally

> > > > unrelated/unassociated

> > > > > > with itself? I request you to consider the above

objectively.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I will talk about the other charts/issues in my next

mail.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > >

> > > > > > In Paramhans Ramkrishna's chart,

> > > > > > > I do not know where you find Mars strong as a planet

in

> > > > > > debilitation in

> > > > > > > Navamsha gives results of debility even when in

exaltation

> > in

> > > > rasi

> > > > > > > chart. In case of Saturn Viparitam shane smritam has

> > already

> > > > been

> > > > > > > mentioned by me, in earlier mail.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I myself have not considered Mars/Venus in

> > Thakur's

> > > > > > chart because they are debilitated. Please go through my

> > message

> > > > > > again. I was talking about Saturn and Rahu.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > About Shri Aurobindo, I trust you are

> > > > > > > aware of his revolutionary background and that he was

> > editor

> > > > of a

> > > > > > paper

> > > > > > > "Vande Mataram" not much known for its soft language.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > > Same is the case with strong Malefics giving P.M.

Yogas.

> > Every

> > > > > > graha is

> > > > > > > capable of 12 variations of a P.M. Yoga attributed to

it,

> > at

> > > > the

> > > > > > very

> > > > > > > least. It would only be naive to imagine they would

all

> > give

> > > > > > identical

> > > > > > > results as indicated by Parashara or all with Pancha

> > > > Mahapurusha

> > > > > > Yoga

> > > > > > > would only rule over different parts of India (barring

> > Saturn),

> > > > > > just

> > > > > > > because the sage said so. The sages gave us

principles and

> > > > > > expected us

> > > > > > > to apply them to real life horoscope using Viveka.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I would gladly give you the shloka giving the

reference to

> > > > > > > "Viparita---Shane..." it is from an old classic

respected

> > > > amongst

> > > > > > > astrologers, but as you do not seem to accept

anything that

> > > > does

> > > > > > not fit

> > > > > > > in with what, you think. is said by Dr. Raman, it

would be

> > an

> > > > > > exercise

> > > > > > > in futility. should you yet want the shloka I would of

> > course

> > > > be

> > > > > > glad to

> > > > > > > give it to you.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Om Gurave namah

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > You seem to be disagreeing with Shri B.V. Raman that

> > strong

> > > > > > planets,

> > > > > > > > whether malefic or benefics give good results,

while weak

> > > > planets

> > > > > > > > give bad results. Perhaps you also disagree about

strong

> > > > malefics

> > > > > > > > giving mahapurusha yogas. Isn't it contrary to what

all

> > the

> > > > > > jyotish

> > > > > > > > texts teach?

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Then, here are a few examples, where I find that

strong

> > > > malefics

> > > > > > > > have neither made the natives krura nor that their

> > > > significations

> > > > > > > > suffered.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Swami Vivekananda: strong sun in lagna and mars in

5th

> > house

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Sri Aurobindo: Strong Sun in 2nd house.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Maharshi Mahesh yogi: exalted Mars in lagna.

> > > > > > > > Ramana Maharshi: strong Mars in 8th house

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Sri Ramakrishna Paramahamsa: Exalted Saturn(9H) and

Rahu

> > > > (4H).

> > > > > > Mars

> > > > > > > > and Venus are also exalted in rasi, while

debilitated in

> > > > navamsa.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Sir, can you give me the reference for "vipareetam

shaneH

> > > > > > sritam"?

> > > > > > > > Does it, by any chance, refer to Saturn's placement

in

> > the

> > > > 8th

> > > > > > house

> > > > > > > > being beneficial?

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > I am happy that you agree strong Saturn gives good

> > results.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Can you tell me from where the saying is because i

would

> > > > like to

> > > > > > > > read it up myself and understand.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > --- Chandrashekhar <chandrashekhar46@

> > > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk>>

> > > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > About Krura planets the saying is, that with

> > > > > > > > > > > strength the Krura grahas

> > > > > > > > > > > become more Krura (Maha-krura) and the shubha

> > grahas

> > > > > > > > > > > become more shubha.

> > > > > > > > > > > Only Shani is more krura when weak and

beneficial

> > or

> > > > > > > > > > > less krura when

> > > > > > > > > > > strong "Viparitama shaneH smritam".

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > My sun dasa started when I was 9 years old,

and

> > > > > > > > > > > ended when I was 15

> > > > > > > > > > > > years old. How come you didn't notice the

second

> > > > > > > > > > > part? I was old

> > > > > > > > > > > > enough to understand the difference between

> > > > > > > > > > > success and failure, I

> > > > > > > > > > > > guess!

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Anyway, if you agree that Rahu is giving

Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > > results, and those

> > > > > > > > > > > > results are exceptionally good, then it

> > > > > > > > > > > automatically follows that

> > > > > > > > > > > > Sun is strong in my chart because according

to

> > > > > > > > > > > Shri B.V Raman, evil

> > > > > > > > > > > > planets, especially when weak, give bad

results

> > > > > > > > > > > (vide "a catechism

> > > > > > > > > > > > of astrology"), while strong planets, even

if

> > > > > > > > > > > evil, give good

> > > > > > > > > > > > results. If my Sun were weak, he wouldn't be

> > > > > > > > > > > giving such good

> > > > > > > > > > > > results:--))

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Since Mercury is hopelessly combust and

inferior

> > > > > > > > > > > in shadbala

> > > > > > > > > > > > strength, the major results of Dharma

> > > > > > > > > > > karmadhipathi yoga are also

> > > > > > > > > > > > given by Sun, because according to "300

> > > > > > > > > > > combinations" of Sri

> > > > > > > > > > > > Raman, a planet with higher shadbala is more

> > > > > > > > > > > likely to give the

> > > > > > > > > > > > results of a yoga.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Regarding Karna, I request you to read the

Karna

> > > > > > > > > > > Parva of

> > > > > > > > > > > > Mahabharata again. When he died, the nature

bowed

> > > > > > > > > > > in grief, because

> > > > > > > > > > > > he's one of the noblest persons in

Mahabharata.

> > > > > > > > > > > Even the episode you

> > > > > > > > > > > > quoted happened because Parashurama would

teach

> > > > > > > > > > > only Brahmins and

> > > > > > > > > > > > Karna desperately wanted to learn

dhanurvidya

> > from

> > > > > > > > > > > Parashurama so

> > > > > > > > > > > > that he can support Duryodhana. Deceit is

> > > > > > > > > > > certainly punishable and

> > > > > > > > > > > > Karna did pay dearly. But it's to be borne

in

> > mind

> > > > > > > > > > > that whatever

> > > > > > > > > > > > Karna did was only to please Duryodhana, his

> > > > > > > > > > > dearest friend. Karna

> > > > > > > > > > > > did not gain anything personally.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the 3rd house from 8th house

(I

> > > > > > > > > > > think there was a typo

> > > > > > > > > > > > at your end). In the natural zodiac, the 10

th

> > > > > > > > > > > sign, being the

> > > > > > > > > > > > cardinal earth sign, represents

south /dakshina

> > > > > > > > > > > disha. South is the

> > > > > > > > > > > > direction ruled by Yama, the lord of death,

hence

> > > > > > > > > > > 10th house

> > > > > > > > > > > > represents burial grounds. So, the Rudras

> > (Saturn,

> > > > > > > > > > > Sun and Mars) are

> > > > > > > > > > > > strong in south. Also, Sun resides in south

and

> > > > > > > > > > > starts his

> > > > > > > > > > > > northern voyage from here. So he has

digbala in

> > > > > > > > > > > 10th house.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > I did clarify that when I referred to Surya

as

> > > > > > > > > > > Karma saakshi, it's

> > > > > > > > > > > > only to his status as antaraatma and not as

a

> > > > > > > > > > > deity. Perhaps this

> > > > > > > > > > > > escaped your attention.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > This is my last post on the subject.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > <%40>

> > > > <%40>

> > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > > > <%40>,

> > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar

> > > > > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > You were too young for the results of the

dasha

> > > > > > > > > > > to manifest,

> > > > > > > > > > > > though it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > is good news that your father had

promotions

> > and

> > > > > > > > > > > you received

> > > > > > > > > > > > > prizes/accolades during that time. It is

> > > > > > > > > > > interesting to know you

> > > > > > > > > > > > got

> > > > > > > > > > > > > these results at a young age of 9 or so

as that

> > > > > > > > > > > is when Sun dasha

> > > > > > > > > > > > was

> > > > > > > > > > > > > operative. I am relieved you did not have

any

> > > > > > > > > > > health problems in

> > > > > > > > > > > > > March-August 1970 period.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > But we are talking about Rahu and Rahu

would

> > > > > > > > > > > give results of Sun

> > > > > > > > > > > > more

> > > > > > > > > > > > > prominently, by conjunction, as you

guessed but

> > > > > > > > > > > also that of

> > > > > > > > > > > > Mercury

> > > > > > > > > > > > > (You have a Dharmakarmaadhipati yoga

after all)

> > > > > > > > > > > and that is why I

> > > > > > > > > > > > said

> > > > > > > > > > > > > for understanding Sun its dasha instead

of Rahu

> > > > > > > > > > > dasha needs to be

> > > > > > > > > > > > analyzed.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Mercury is malefic not because I say so

but

> > > > > > > > > > > because Jyotish says

> > > > > > > > > > > > that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > mercury is malefic when conjunct a papa

graha

> > > > > > > > > > > and he is conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > > two,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun and Rahu.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the apex of Artha trikona

and

> > > > > > > > > > > directly involved with

> > > > > > > > > > > > > efforts to earn money. Though claimed to

be

> > > > > > > > > > > smashana/burial

> > > > > > > > > > > > ground, it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > is 4th from ayush sthana (8th) and its

home

> > that

> > > > > > > > > > > is why affliction

> > > > > > > > > > > > to it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > can give death. But 8th is more popularly

> > called

> > > > > > > > > > > mrityu sthana and

> > > > > > > > > > > > hence

> > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th is called Smashana. If it is really

> > > > > > > > > > > smashana why would it be

> > > > > > > > > > > > called

> > > > > > > > > > > > > karma sthana and why would Sun be at its

most

> > > > > > > > > > > brilliant there?

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > I did not say he can not represent water

bodies

> > > > > > > > > > > in temple, but not

> > > > > > > > > > > > only

> > > > > > > > > > > > > those.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > My Sun dasa was excellent too. My father

> > > > > > > > > > > received promotion(s),

> > > > > > > > > > > > my

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > school/college days were great and i

received

> > > > > > > > > > > wide acclaim/prizes

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > for my ability in creative writing,

Veena,

> > > > > > > > > > > quiz contests etc,

> > > > > > > > > > > > apart

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > from studies. So, for a student, I guess

> > > > > > > > > > > that's excellent!!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > How do you justify this, if Sun were

weak?

> > > > > > > > > > > Rahu is certainly

> > > > > > > > > > > > giving

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > the yogakaraka results, but being in

Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > > house and being

> > > > > > > > > > > > conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun, don't you think Rahu is also

giving the

> > > > > > > > > > > results of Sun? You

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > said that mercury is malefic and heavily

> > > > > > > > > > > combust too:--))

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1th house also represent burial

> > > > > > > > > > > ground/smashaana. Is that a place

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > for attachment?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandra represents all water bodies, so

why

> > > > > > > > > > > can't he represent

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > temple tank?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > === message truncated ===

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

 

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Tired of spam? Mail has the best spam

> > protection

> > > > > > around

> > > > > > > > > > <>

> > < <>>

> > > > < <>

> > < <>>>

> > > > > > < <>

> > < <>>

> > > > < <>

> > < <>>>>

> > > > > > > > < <>

> > < <>>

> > > > < <>

> > < <>>>

> > > > > > < <>

> > < <>>

> > > > < <>

> > < <>>>>>

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > ---------------

-----

> > ----

> > > > -

> > > > > > > > -------

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database:

268.11.7/435 -

> > Release

> > > > > > Date:

> > > > > > > > 8/31/2006

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

removed]

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > -------------------

-----

> > -

> > > > > > -------

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.12.2/441 -

Release

> > > > Date:

> > > > > > 9/7/2006

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

[Guest guest]

Om Gurave Namah

 

Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

 

Please tell me in the body divisions given according to kootas, is

the head/face part of Vagbhava koota or not? Let's get this straight

first, then we can discuss chakras and the rest. Please do not worry

about quotes, because I will not disappoint you, and can provide

them by the ton:--))

 

When one is said to be "beheaded" does it mean the portion upto neck

or the portion upto forehead?

 

Are you not splitting hairs here?

 

Regards,

Lakshmi

 

 

 

 

 

 

, Chandrashekhar

<chandrashekhar46 wrote:

>

> Dear Divine Lakshmi,

>

> If you think Sahasrara and Vishuddha Chakras at the same place,

and if

> Pankaja refers to head and not face, all your arguments are

acceptable.

> Unfortunately they are not.

>

> I see that you have not given anything in support of your argument

> barring conjectures and have not commented on the shloka I sent

you.

>

> Chandrashekhar.

>

> b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> >

> >

> > Om Gurave Namah

> >

> > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> >

> > Lalitha Sahasranaamam describes Mother thus...

> >

> > Srimadvaagbhavakootaika swaroopamukha pankajaa

> > kanthaadhakatiparyanta madhyakoota swaroopini

> > Shaktikootaikathaapanna katyadhobhaagadhaariNi.

> >

> > The three divisions are

> >

> > Vagbhava koota - the face/head

> > Madhya/kamaraaja koota - from neck to kati

> > Shakti koota - the portion after kati to feet

> >

> > Can you tell me in this division, where does the head come...in

the

> > vagbhava koota or in shakti koota? Is there any other koota

defined

> > for the head/rear portion of the face etc? Or do you imply that

> > Mother has only a face without the head!!!

> >

> > You know very well that we are not talking of astrology mappings

> > here. Yet why you choose to interpret even a simple principle in

> > this strange fashion is some thing beyond me, unless you are

> > confused yourself (can happen to all of us) or want to confuse

> > others (no comments).

> >

> > If either Bhagavan Hayagriva or Sage Agasthya intended that "bisa

> > tantu taneeyasi" should be understood wrt kundalini at Mooladhara

> > also they would have put it immediately after "mooladharaika

> > nilayaa.. and not after "shatchakropari samsthithaa".

> >

> > ofcourse, I do not mean that Kundalini is like a python at

> > mooladhara:--)), but definitely much grosser than at sahasraara.

> >

> > Btw, I am sure you know that kundalini is not agni tattwatmika at

> > mooladhara. The agnitattwa of "vidyullekha" happens only from

> > swadhisthana, because agni is oordhwa mukha and is ignited only

when

> > the Kundalini turns upwards.

> >

> > Regards,

> > Lakshmi

> >

> >

> > <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > >

> > > By the way Vag beeja kuta is not only head but a group of

> > Panchadhasha

> > > mantra and referred to as maa's face indicating the vacha.

> > > Raajrajeshwari Kavacha prays that the vagbija protect the

throat

> > and not

> > > the head as you imply. Certainly not head. And her principal

abode

> > is

> > > said to be Mulaadhara and not sahasrara. However if you want

to

> > distort

> > > this to mean she is inauspicious when dormant you are free to

do

> > so. I

> > > would however request you to think why the HrIm beeja is most

dear

> > to

> > > her and not the AiM beeja (Devi Patha, if you need the

reference).

> > It

> > > would perhaps be well to understand that Kundalini means of

the

> > coiled

> > > form and "Visa Tantu..." coming after that certainly does not

mean

> > what

> > > you want to think it does.

> > >

> > > In the meanwhile, please contemplate on this.

> > > Aaxare prdevta Éìjntax> k…{flI devta

> > > ädhäre paradevatä bhavrajanatädhaù kuëòalé devatä

> > > devanamixdevta iÇjgtamanNdpuÃiSwta,

> > > devänämadhidevatä trijagatämänandapuïjasthitä|

> > > mUlaxarinvaisnI iÇrm[i ya }ainnI mailnI

> > > mülädhäraniväsiné triramaëé yä jïäniné mäliné

> > > sa me mat&mnuiSwta k…lpwanNdEkbIjanna.32,21.

> > > sä me mätåmanusthitä kulapathänandaikabéjänanä||32|21||

> > >

> > > This is how Kundalini is described in Rudrayamala Tantra. Do

you

> > think

> > > it is wrong?

> > >

> > > Chandrashekhar.

> > >

> > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > >

> > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > >

> > > > "vagbhavabeejasya kundalineethi sangnyaa

thadroopa"...Kundalini

> > as

> > > > preceding "bisa tantu taneeyasee" is described as vagbhava

beeja

> > > > or "aim" (saraswati) beeja. As you have read the yamalas, i

am

> > sure

> > > > you know which part of body comprises of vagbhava

koota...it's

> > the

> > > > head!!

> > > >

> > > > Let me also explain the term preceding kundalini.

> > > > It's "mahaasakthiH" and not "MahashakthiH" and talks of the

> > > > eagerness of Mother to unite with Shiva....mahe utsave

tatratya

> > > > shivashaktisamaayogaroope aasakthiH tatparataa yasyaaH.

> > > >

> > > > Is this enough to show that "bisa tantu taneeyasee" is the

> > climactic

> > > > name of shakti in ascension?

> > > >

> > > > Regarding Devi worshippers wrt unawakened kundalini, let me

quote

> > > > this sentence.....hey Srividyopaasakaah. uttishtatha. maa

> > > > swaptha....meaning o srividyopaasaka! wake up( the

kundalini).

> > don't

> > > > let it sleep!!

> > > >

> > > > Many thanks for this extended discussion on Kundalini. It's

time

> > for

> > > > taking leave.

> > > >

> > > > Regards,

> > > > Lakshmi

> > > >

> > > >

> > <%40>

> > > > <%40>, "b_lakshmi_ramesh"

> > > > <b_lakshmi_ramesh@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > >

> > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > >

> > > > > The shadripus are kaama (lust), krodha (anger), lobha

(greed),

> > > > moha

> > > > > (attachment, delusion), mada (pride) and maatsarya

(jealousy)

> > > > > If "mada" means "lust" what does "kaama" imply among the

> > > > > shadripus? "Mada" signifies one who is intoxicated/drunk

with

> > > > > power/self-grandeur (pride/ego).

> > > > >

> > > > > Mother is known as "Vidya and avidya swaroopini" and

correct

> > > > > appreciation of Mother includes understanding of both

facets.

> > As

> > > > > Shakti, She respresents raw power which can be routed

towards

> > good

> > > > > deeds as well as bad deeds. Are both ends the same? The

wisdom,

> > > > > required to put this immense shakti to good use, is

> > represented by

> > > > > Shiva, hence the union of Shiva and Parvati, wisdom and

power,

> > is

> > > > > said to be auspicious because it ensures the

correct/judicious

> > end

> > > > > use of shakti. Hence the orientation of Shakti is very

very

> > > > > important.

> > > > >

> > > > > I always said that Soorya is both sattwik and krura. I

also

> > always

> > > > > said all planets, including Jupiter, can give malefic

results,

> > if

> > > > > they are functionally empowered to do so. You can refer

to all

> > my

> > > > > previous mails to confirm this.

> > > > >

> > > > > Sir, Truth is much more important than winning or losing

an

> > > > > argument. All discussions must proceed as an exploration

and

> > > > > celebration of Truth. When this is not the case, I see no

> > purpose

> > > > in

> > > > > continuing these discussions.

> > > > >

> > > > > Thanks & Regards,

> > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > <%40>

> > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Having Icchamrityu and dying at an early age are

operating at

> > > > > different

> > > > > > levels. Bhishma had Iccha Mrityu but did not die young.

So

> > > > please

> > > > > do not

> > > > > > try to mix the issues. If you have read Swamiji's

biography

> > you

> > > > > will

> > > > > > find that he fell sick many times despite of apparent

robust

> > > > > physique.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Commenting on Shani in 4th for Rama's chart confirms

with his

> > > > > being

> > > > > > capable of giving Vipareeta results. I did not know I

was

> > > > expected

> > > > > to

> > > > > > analyze the entire chart. By the way if there is a Kuja

dosha

> > > > how

> > > > > does

> > > > > > that by itself give a Divine wife? Please do not bring

our

> > > > > devotion to

> > > > > > Lord Rama (and we both have that) into astrological

analysis

> > of

> > > > > his chart.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Bringing in the dashas when the discussions are on the

> > effects

> > > > of

> > > > > grahas

> > > > > > will only lead the discussion to no where. The two have

to be

> > > > seen

> > > > > > separately as we are not trying to time an event but

only

> > trying

> > > > > to find

> > > > > > what are the effects on bhavas occupied.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Dear Lakshmi in Ramana Maharshi's chart you have perhaps

> > > > forgotten

> > > > > the

> > > > > > saying Kuja vat Ketu. look at the Ketu deha in that

> > perspective

> > > > > and let

> > > > > > me know your views. And if by the way you read my mail,

I did

> > > > not

> > > > > say

> > > > > > anything about mars being killer for him, only that it

gave

> > him

> > > > > Sarcoma

> > > > > > being 3rd lord.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Also could you explain why Sun being Atma and always

> > beneficent

> > > > as

> > > > > you

> > > > > > have claimed all along in the thread on the topic, did

its

> > > > > Mahadasha

> > > > > > prove to be Killer to Ramana Maharshi?

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Take care,

> > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > For example, remember that in Swami Vivekananda's

chart

> > > > Surya

> > > > > is

> > > > > > > lord of

> > > > > > > > the 9th occupying the lagna and causing a powerful

Raj

> > yoga.

> > > > At

> > > > > > > the same

> > > > > > > > time if you thin how long the Swamiji lived, you may

> > have to

> > > > > think

> > > > > > > again

> > > > > > > > about saying that it did not act as Mahakrura. Think

> > about

> > > > > what it

> > > > > > > did

> > > > > > > > to the 7th bhava of Swamiji, also, before declaring

that

> > it

> > > > > became

> > > > > > > > shubha or less malefic.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Lakshmi: I think Swamiji had an icchamrityu and

looking at

> > the

> > > > > dass

> > > > > > > operating on 4th July 1902, I observe that he passed

away

> > in

> > > > Jup-

> > > > > Ven-

> > > > > > > Jup-Ket-Sat-Sat.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Jup MD: 1893-02-09 (1:35:30 pm) - 1909-02-10 (3:59:13

pm)

> > > > > > > Ven AD: 1900-12-25 (10:03:30 am) - 1903-08-27

(4:48:54 pm)

> > > > > > > Jup PD: 1902-05-02 (1:42:07 pm) - 1902-09-12

(10:43:55 pm)

> > > > > > > Ket SD: 1902-06-29 (9:11:48 am) - 1902-07-07 (5:06:28

am)

> > > > > > > Sat PAD: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-06

(2:29:24 am)

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Sat: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-05 (1:27:03 am)

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Jupiter is in 2nd house from Moon, Venus is the 2nd

lord

> > from

> > > > > Moon

> > > > > > > and is posited in 2nd from lagna, Ketu is in the

house of

> > > > Venus

> > > > > and

> > > > > > > gives the results of Venus and Saturn is the 2nd lord

from

> > > > > > > lagna....all are marakas. the maraka significations

are

> > > > stronger

> > > > > > > from Moon, and it's the cause of his early death.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I fail to see where Sun comes into all this.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > However, I agree that Sun, as AK aspecting 7th house,

can

> > give

> > > > > > > parivraja tendencies. But can you ignore the

influence of

> > > > Saturn

> > > > > on

> > > > > > > Moon and 4th house, occuring in the 10th house? I am

sure

> > even

> > > > > weak

> > > > > > > Sun would have given him parivraja yoga:--))but

without the

> > > > raja

> > > > > > > yoga and the strong soul-level impact he created

wherever

> > he

> > > > > went.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Or if you like look at what happened to the 7th

> > > > > > > > Bhava of Lord Rama with exalted Mars in the 7th

bhava.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Mars in 7th gives kuja dosha, and I think the strong

Mars

> > in

> > > > 7th

> > > > > > > gave him an exalted wife like Sita. You have not

commented

> > on

> > > > the

> > > > > > > exalted Saturn in 4th house.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > In each of the

> > > > > > > > example provided by you look at the bhava that the

> > planets

> > > > > occupy

> > > > > > > > (barring Saturn, for reasons already stated in

previous

> > > > mail),

> > > > > > > without

> > > > > > > > looking at the charts as belonging to great people,

and

> > then

> > > > > make

> > > > > > > up

> > > > > > > > your mind as to the truth or otherwise of what I

said.

> > Did

> > > > you

> > > > > > > know

> > > > > > > > Ramana Maharshi died following a malignant sarcoma

of

> > left

> > > > hand

> > > > > > > and Mars

> > > > > > > > is karaka for the 3rd bhava in 8th in his chart, in

> > > > > exaltation. Do

> > > > > > > you

> > > > > > > > think Mars gave him benevolent results?

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I also request you to examine the

following

> > dasa

> > > > > > > sequences with an open mind. Sun is the 3rd lord from

Moon

> > (AK)

> > > > &

> > > > > > > 12th lord from lagna in Sri Ramana's chart, rahu is

with

> > Sun

> > > > and

> > > > > > > gives Sun'/Saturn's/Jupiter's effects...all of which

point

> > to

> > > > > > > dusthanas, Saturn is a maraka in 7th house and ketu

can

> > give

> > > > the

> > > > > > > effects of Moon/Mercury/mars. Mar's effect, if at

all, was

> > only

> > > > > > > indirect, and he was not the killer.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Sun MD: 1949-02-03 (1:02:22 am) - 1955-02-03 (2:05:32

pm)

> > > > > > > Rah AD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1951-02-21 (8:49:14

am)

> > > > > > > Rah PD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1950-05-18

(12:04:47 am)

> > > > > > > Sat SD: 1950-04-12 (3:37:16 am) - 1950-04-20

(12:18:02 am)

> > > > > > > Ket PAD: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14

(11:08:26

> > pm)

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Ket: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14 (12:47:04

pm)

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I think what stands out is the fact that the dasa of

the

> > graha

> > > > > > > conjoined Moon brought about death. I think their mind

> > willed

> > > > the

> > > > > > > death.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Can a planet give results in a dasa totally

> > > > > unrelated/unassociated

> > > > > > > with itself? I request you to consider the above

> > objectively.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I will talk about the other charts/issues in my next

mail.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > In Paramhans Ramkrishna's chart,

> > > > > > > > I do not know where you find Mars strong as a

planet in

> > > > > > > debilitation in

> > > > > > > > Navamsha gives results of debility even when in

> > exaltation

> > > > in

> > > > > rasi

> > > > > > > > chart. In case of Saturn Viparitam shane smritam has

> > already

> > > > > been

> > > > > > > > mentioned by me, in earlier mail.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I myself have not considered Mars/Venus

in

> > > > Thakur's

> > > > > > > chart because they are debilitated. Please go through

my

> > > > message

> > > > > > > again. I was talking about Saturn and Rahu.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > About Shri Aurobindo, I trust you are

> > > > > > > > aware of his revolutionary background and that he

was

> > editor

> > > > > of a

> > > > > > > paper

> > > > > > > > "Vande Mataram" not much known for its soft

language.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Same is the case with strong Malefics giving P.M.

Yogas.

> > > > Every

> > > > > > > graha is

> > > > > > > > capable of 12 variations of a P.M. Yoga attributed

to

> > it, at

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > very

> > > > > > > > least. It would only be naive to imagine they would

all

> > give

> > > > > > > identical

> > > > > > > > results as indicated by Parashara or all with Pancha

> > > > > Mahapurusha

> > > > > > > Yoga

> > > > > > > > would only rule over different parts of India

(barring

> > > > Saturn),

> > > > > > > just

> > > > > > > > because the sage said so. The sages gave us

principles

> > and

> > > > > > > expected us

> > > > > > > > to apply them to real life horoscope using Viveka.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > I would gladly give you the shloka giving the

reference

> > to

> > > > > > > > "Viparita---Shane..." it is from an old classic

respected

> > > > > amongst

> > > > > > > > astrologers, but as you do not seem to accept

anything

> > that

> > > > > does

> > > > > > > not fit

> > > > > > > > in with what, you think. is said by Dr. Raman, it

would

> > be an

> > > > > > > exercise

> > > > > > > > in futility. should you yet want the shloka I would

of

> > > > course

> > > > > be

> > > > > > > glad to

> > > > > > > > give it to you.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Om Gurave namah

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > You seem to be disagreeing with Shri B.V. Raman

that

> > strong

> > > > > > > planets,

> > > > > > > > > whether malefic or benefics give good results,

while

> > weak

> > > > > planets

> > > > > > > > > give bad results. Perhaps you also disagree about

> > strong

> > > > > malefics

> > > > > > > > > giving mahapurusha yogas. Isn't it contrary to

what

> > all the

> > > > > > > jyotish

> > > > > > > > > texts teach?

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Then, here are a few examples, where I find that

strong

> > > > > malefics

> > > > > > > > > have neither made the natives krura nor that their

> > > > > significations

> > > > > > > > > suffered.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Swami Vivekananda: strong sun in lagna and mars

in 5th

> > > > house

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Sri Aurobindo: Strong Sun in 2nd house.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Maharshi Mahesh yogi: exalted Mars in lagna.

> > > > > > > > > Ramana Maharshi: strong Mars in 8th house

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Sri Ramakrishna Paramahamsa: Exalted Saturn(9H)

and

> > Rahu

> > > > > (4H).

> > > > > > > Mars

> > > > > > > > > and Venus are also exalted in rasi, while

debilitated

> > in

> > > > > navamsa.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Sir, can you give me the reference for "vipareetam

> > shaneH

> > > > > > > sritam"?

> > > > > > > > > Does it, by any chance, refer to Saturn's

placement in

> > the

> > > > > 8th

> > > > > > > house

> > > > > > > > > being beneficial?

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > I am happy that you agree strong Saturn gives good

> > results.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Can you tell me from where the saying is because i

> > would

> > > > > like to

> > > > > > > > > read it up myself and understand.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > --- Chandrashekhar <chandrashekhar46@

> > > > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk>>

> > > > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > About Krura planets the saying is, that with

> > > > > > > > > > > > strength the Krura grahas

> > > > > > > > > > > > become more Krura (Maha-krura) and the

shubha

> > grahas

> > > > > > > > > > > > become more shubha.

> > > > > > > > > > > > Only Shani is more krura when weak and

> > beneficial or

> > > > > > > > > > > > less krura when

> > > > > > > > > > > > strong "Viparitama shaneH smritam".

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > My sun dasa started when I was 9 years

old, and

> > > > > > > > > > > > ended when I was 15

> > > > > > > > > > > > > years old. How come you didn't notice the

> > second

> > > > > > > > > > > > part? I was old

> > > > > > > > > > > > > enough to understand the difference

between

> > > > > > > > > > > > success and failure, I

> > > > > > > > > > > > > guess!

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Anyway, if you agree that Rahu is giving

Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > > > results, and those

> > > > > > > > > > > > > results are exceptionally good, then it

> > > > > > > > > > > > automatically follows that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun is strong in my chart because

according to

> > > > > > > > > > > > Shri B.V Raman, evil

> > > > > > > > > > > > > planets, especially when weak, give bad

results

> > > > > > > > > > > > (vide "a catechism

> > > > > > > > > > > > > of astrology"), while strong planets,

even if

> > > > > > > > > > > > evil, give good

> > > > > > > > > > > > > results. If my Sun were weak, he wouldn't

be

> > > > > > > > > > > > giving such good

> > > > > > > > > > > > > results:--))

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Since Mercury is hopelessly combust and

> > inferior

> > > > > > > > > > > > in shadbala

> > > > > > > > > > > > > strength, the major results of Dharma

> > > > > > > > > > > > karmadhipathi yoga are also

> > > > > > > > > > > > > given by Sun, because according to "300

> > > > > > > > > > > > combinations" of Sri

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Raman, a planet with higher shadbala is

more

> > > > > > > > > > > > likely to give the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > results of a yoga.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Regarding Karna, I request you to read the

> > Karna

> > > > > > > > > > > > Parva of

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Mahabharata again. When he died, the

nature

> > bowed

> > > > > > > > > > > > in grief, because

> > > > > > > > > > > > > he's one of the noblest persons in

Mahabharata.

> > > > > > > > > > > > Even the episode you

> > > > > > > > > > > > > quoted happened because Parashurama would

teach

> > > > > > > > > > > > only Brahmins and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Karna desperately wanted to learn

dhanurvidya

> > from

> > > > > > > > > > > > Parashurama so

> > > > > > > > > > > > > that he can support Duryodhana. Deceit is

> > > > > > > > > > > > certainly punishable and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Karna did pay dearly. But it's to be

borne in

> > mind

> > > > > > > > > > > > that whatever

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Karna did was only to please Duryodhana,

his

> > > > > > > > > > > > dearest friend. Karna

> > > > > > > > > > > > > did not gain anything personally.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the 3rd house from 8th

house (I

> > > > > > > > > > > > think there was a typo

> > > > > > > > > > > > > at your end). In the natural zodiac, the

10 th

> > > > > > > > > > > > sign, being the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > cardinal earth sign, represents

south /dakshina

> > > > > > > > > > > > disha. South is the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > direction ruled by Yama, the lord of

death,

> > hence

> > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house

> > > > > > > > > > > > > represents burial grounds. So, the Rudras

> > (Saturn,

> > > > > > > > > > > > Sun and Mars) are

> > > > > > > > > > > > > strong in south. Also, Sun resides in

south and

> > > > > > > > > > > > starts his

> > > > > > > > > > > > > northern voyage from here. So he has

digbala in

> > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > I did clarify that when I referred to

Surya as

> > > > > > > > > > > > Karma saakshi, it's

> > > > > > > > > > > > > only to his status as antaraatma and not

as a

> > > > > > > > > > > > deity. Perhaps this

> > > > > > > > > > > > > escaped your attention.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > This is my last post on the subject.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > <%40>

> > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40>,

> > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar

> > > > > > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > You were too young for the results of

the

> > dasha

> > > > > > > > > > > > to manifest,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > though it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > is good news that your father had

promotions

> > and

> > > > > > > > > > > > you received

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > prizes/accolades during that time. It is

> > > > > > > > > > > > interesting to know you

> > > > > > > > > > > > > got

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > these results at a young age of 9 or so

as

> > that

> > > > > > > > > > > > is when Sun dasha

> > > > > > > > > > > > > was

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > operative. I am relieved you did not

have any

> > > > > > > > > > > > health problems in

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > March-August 1970 period.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > But we are talking about Rahu and Rahu

would

> > > > > > > > > > > > give results of Sun

> > > > > > > > > > > > > more

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > prominently, by conjunction, as you

guessed

> > but

> > > > > > > > > > > > also that of

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Mercury

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > (You have a Dharmakarmaadhipati yoga

after

> > all)

> > > > > > > > > > > > and that is why I

> > > > > > > > > > > > > said

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > for understanding Sun its dasha instead

of

> > Rahu

> > > > > > > > > > > > dasha needs to be

> > > > > > > > > > > > > analyzed.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mercury is malefic not because I say so

but

> > > > > > > > > > > > because Jyotish says

> > > > > > > > > > > > > that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > mercury is malefic when conjunct a papa

graha

> > > > > > > > > > > > and he is conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > > > two,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun and Rahu.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the apex of Artha trikona

and

> > > > > > > > > > > > directly involved with

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > efforts to earn money. Though claimed

to be

> > > > > > > > > > > > smashana/burial

> > > > > > > > > > > > > ground, it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > is 4th from ayush sthana (8th) and its

home

> > that

> > > > > > > > > > > > is why affliction

> > > > > > > > > > > > > to it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > can give death. But 8th is more

popularly

> > called

> > > > > > > > > > > > mrityu sthana and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > hence

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th is called Smashana. If it is really

> > > > > > > > > > > > smashana why would it be

> > > > > > > > > > > > > called

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > karma sthana and why would Sun be at

its most

> > > > > > > > > > > > brilliant there?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > I did not say he can not represent water

> > bodies

> > > > > > > > > > > > in temple, but not

> > > > > > > > > > > > > only

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > those.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My Sun dasa was excellent too. My

father

> > > > > > > > > > > > received promotion(s),

> > > > > > > > > > > > > my

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > school/college days were great and i

> > received

> > > > > > > > > > > > wide acclaim/prizes

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > for my ability in creative writing,

Veena,

> > > > > > > > > > > > quiz contests etc,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > apart

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > from studies. So, for a student, I

guess

> > > > > > > > > > > > that's excellent!!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > How do you justify this, if Sun were

weak?

> > > > > > > > > > > > Rahu is certainly

> > > > > > > > > > > > > giving

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > the yogakaraka results, but being in

Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > > > house and being

> > > > > > > > > > > > > conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun, don't you think Rahu is also

giving

> > the

> > > > > > > > > > > > results of Sun? You

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > said that mercury is malefic and

heavily

> > > > > > > > > > > > combust too:--))

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1th house also represent burial

> > > > > > > > > > > > ground/smashaana. Is that a place

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > for attachment?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandra represents all water bodies,

so why

> > > > > > > > > > > > can't he represent

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > temple tank?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > === message truncated ===

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

 

> > > > > > > > > > >

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[Guest guest]

Om Gurave Namah

 

Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

 

Please translate the word "mada" also in all its nuances, and see

why they all can not be applied to Rahu. Why close your mind to

other meanings?

 

I also notice that you have not provided any pramana that says

that "mada" means only lust/intoxication and not pride/vanity/ego. I

am still waiting for it.

 

>From what Saravali says, I perceive "ego" to be the basic quality of

all those born. it perpetuates survival and rebirth. If you

disagree, can you provide a pramaana that says only a king can have

ego and others can not.

 

Regards,

Lakshmi

 

 

 

 

 

, Chandrashekhar

<chandrashekhar46 wrote:

>

> Dear Divine Lakshmi,

>

> I was trying to translate Abhimana and not pride. And Pride in a

King

> whom you have all along been trying to equate to a Divine being (I

think

> amsha of Lord Vishnu or some such thing you said, while arguing

why King

> is divine and by extension Surya; if memory serves me right), may

not be

> a divine virtue but would certainly be tantamount to Ego.

>

> So please do not try to read something that is not there in the

message.

> It is always difficult to translate Sanskrit words in English

language

> due to limitation of words with different flavors in English.

>

> Chandrashekhar.

>

> b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> >

> >

> > Om Gurave Namah

> >

> > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> >

> > It is interesting to see that you do not think that pride and ego

> > are not one and the same thing. Please refer to your own message

at

> >

> > /message/11735

> > </message/11735>

> >

> > where you mentioned the following:

> >

> > "we find that Bhava Manjari does

> > attribute Abhimana (pride/ego) to Surya and so does Bhuvan

Deepak."

> >

> > How come pride/ego are synonymous in the case of Sun and not so

in

> > the case of Rahu? Is this fair? And, is this necessary?

> >

> > Isn't "abhimaana" a much milder word than "mada"? The

> > word "abhimaana" might have positive connotations, but the

> > word "mada" has absolutely no positive connotations. Pradeep may

> > not understand this but I am sure you do.

> >

> > Fair arguments never hurt me, sir, but this sort of arguments,

> > especially coming from you, certainly confound me.

> >

> > Can you quote any pramaana that says "mada" means only lust and

not

> > pride/ego/vanity etc?

> >

> > Regarding vidyaa/avidyaa and auspicious/inauspicious nature of

> > Mother:

> >

> > Vidyaavidya swaroopini: 402nd name of Mother

> >

> > Vidyaamchaavidyaamchayasthadvedobhayam saH, avidyayaamritu

> > teerthva,vidyayaamritamasnutha, vidyaina charamavrittiroopam

> > jnaanam, avidyaa bhedabhraantiroopam jnaanam"

> >

> > Avidya results in mrityu while vidyaa results in immortality and

> > moiksha. Vidyaa gives charama vrittiroopa jnaanam, while avidya

> > gives bhedabhraanthiroopa jnaanam.

> >

> > So, which one is auspicious? The direction which gives

> > immortality/moksha or the direction which results in

> > differentiation, delusion and death?

> >

> > Further in the explanation of the name "BhadramoorthiH" it is

stated

> > in Soubhagyabhaskaram that "brahmam tanmangalam". The true

> > auspiciousness is that after which no other inauspiciousness

occurs.

> > In a state which is dominated by desires, delusions etc

> > (mooladhara), this is impossible. This state of " absoluteness

> > auspiciousness " is possible only at the state of Brahman

> > (sahasraara).

> >

> > "theshaamcha lokaapibahuvidhaaH parasivaabhinnamahaashaktistu

> > sarvalokaatheethaa mahaakailaasaaparaajithaadi padapratipaadye

> > sarvalokotthare tisthathi.anyaapaam sivashakteenaam kathipayaanam

> > saattwikshareeraanyapi sattwaadhikyagunaantharaalpatwa yukthaani

na

> > punaH shuddhasattwaani..

> >

> > "The form where Mother is one with shiva is the

highest/mahaashakti

> > form. All shiva+shakti roopas are sattwa roopas, but those lower

> > than this are a mixture of rajo and tamo gunas.

> >

> > I hope these suffice, or if you want, I can quote more.

> >

> > Regards,

> > Lakshmi

> >

> >

> > <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > >

> > > Pride is different from ego. Like it or not Mada does mean

> > intoxication

> > > or lust. The Kama that is referred to relates to kaamana which

> > means

> > > desires for things possessed by others. That is what Asteya,

one

> > of the

> > > Yamas of Hatha yogas refer to.

> > >

> > > We are talking about auspiciousness or other wise of the

dormant

> > or

> > > awakened Kundalini. As I said all scriptures can be

misinterpreted

> > if

> > > one wants to do that. But that does not serve any purpose. I

would

> > not

> > > go into what exactly is meant by Vidya and Avidya related to

Maa.

> > I have

> > > not yet seen any Pramana, in the form of a shloka, to support

your

> > > proposition that dormant Kundalini is inauspicious and the

> > awakened

> > > Kundalini is auspicious so far. I have already posted the way

my

> > > generation has been taught to accept an argument, so I shall

not

> > repeat

> > > it here.

> > >

> > > But I will not resort to conjectures and would like to quote

from

> > > Rudrayamala tantra about the swarUpa of dormant Kundalini.

Being

> > > graduate in sanskrit, I am sure I will not have to translate

it

> > for you.

> > > Aaxare prdevta Éìjntax> k…{flI devta

> > > ädhäre paradevatä bhavrajanatädhaù kuëòalé devatä

> > > devanamixdevta iÇjgtamanNdpuÃiSwta,

> > > devänämadhidevatä trijagatämänandapuïjasthitä|

> > > mUlaxarinvaisnI iÇrm[i ya }ainnI mailnI

> > > mülädhäraniväsiné triramaëé yä jïäniné mäliné

> > > sa me mat&mnuiSwta k…lpwanNdEkbIjanna.32,21.

> > > sä me mätåmanusthitä kulapathänandaikabéjänanä||32|21||

> > >

> > > I am sure you must have some quote to support your

contention. I

> > would

> > > like to see the shloka, as against conjectures, so that I can

> > improve

> > > upon my knowledge of the swarupaa of Kundalini.

> > >

> > > I can understand your reluctance to support your propositions

with

> > > suitable pramanas. I am sorry if I have hurt you by pointing

out

> > the

> > > inconsistency in the way you treated Surya and Rahu

combinations

> > in two

> > > different chart as stand out combinations only.

> > >

> > > I had no intention to cause any hurt to you and if I have

done so

> > > inadvertently I crave your pardon.

> > >

> > > Take care,

> > >

> > > Chandrashekhar

> > >

> > >

> > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > >

> > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > >

> > > > The shadripus are kaama (lust), krodha (anger), lobha

(greed),

> > moha

> > > > (attachment, delusion), mada (pride) and maatsarya

(jealousy)

> > > > If "mada" means "lust" what does "kaama" imply among the

> > > > shadripus? "Mada" signifies one who is intoxicated/drunk

with

> > > > power/self-grandeur (pride/ego).

> > > >

> > > > Mother is known as "Vidya and avidya swaroopini" and correct

> > > > appreciation of Mother includes understanding of both

facets. As

> > > > Shakti, She respresents raw power which can be routed

towards

> > good

> > > > deeds as well as bad deeds. Are both ends the same? The

wisdom,

> > > > required to put this immense shakti to good use, is

represented

> > by

> > > > Shiva, hence the union of Shiva and Parvati, wisdom and

power, is

> > > > said to be auspicious because it ensures the

correct/judicious

> > end

> > > > use of shakti. Hence the orientation of Shakti is very very

> > > > important.

> > > >

> > > > I always said that Soorya is both sattwik and krura. I also

> > always

> > > > said all planets, including Jupiter, can give malefic

results, if

> > > > they are functionally empowered to do so. You can refer to

all my

> > > > previous mails to confirm this.

> > > >

> > > > Sir, Truth is much more important than winning or losing an

> > > > argument. All discussions must proceed as an exploration and

> > > > celebration of Truth. When this is not the case, I see no

> > purpose in

> > > > continuing these discussions.

> > > >

> > > > Thanks & Regards,

> > > > Lakshmi

> > > >

> > > >

> > <%40>

> > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > >

> > > > > Having Icchamrityu and dying at an early age are

operating at

> > > > different

> > > > > levels. Bhishma had Iccha Mrityu but did not die young. So

> > please

> > > > do not

> > > > > try to mix the issues. If you have read Swamiji's

biography you

> > > > will

> > > > > find that he fell sick many times despite of apparent

robust

> > > > physique.

> > > > >

> > > > > Commenting on Shani in 4th for Rama's chart confirms with

his

> > > > being

> > > > > capable of giving Vipareeta results. I did not know I was

> > expected

> > > > to

> > > > > analyze the entire chart. By the way if there is a Kuja

dosha

> > how

> > > > does

> > > > > that by itself give a Divine wife? Please do not bring our

> > > > devotion to

> > > > > Lord Rama (and we both have that) into astrological

analysis of

> > > > his chart.

> > > > >

> > > > > Bringing in the dashas when the discussions are on the

effects

> > of

> > > > grahas

> > > > > will only lead the discussion to no where. The two have

to be

> > seen

> > > > > separately as we are not trying to time an event but only

> > trying

> > > > to find

> > > > > what are the effects on bhavas occupied.

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear Lakshmi in Ramana Maharshi's chart you have perhaps

> > forgotten

> > > > the

> > > > > saying Kuja vat Ketu. look at the Ketu deha in that

perspective

> > > > and let

> > > > > me know your views. And if by the way you read my mail, I

did

> > not

> > > > say

> > > > > anything about mars being killer for him, only that it

gave him

> > > > Sarcoma

> > > > > being 3rd lord.

> > > > >

> > > > > Also could you explain why Sun being Atma and always

> > beneficent as

> > > > you

> > > > > have claimed all along in the thread on the topic, did its

> > > > Mahadasha

> > > > > prove to be Killer to Ramana Maharshi?

> > > > >

> > > > > Take care,

> > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > > For example, remember that in Swami Vivekananda's

chart

> > Surya

> > > > is

> > > > > > lord of

> > > > > > > the 9th occupying the lagna and causing a powerful Raj

> > yoga. At

> > > > > > the same

> > > > > > > time if you thin how long the Swamiji lived, you may

have

> > to

> > > > think

> > > > > > again

> > > > > > > about saying that it did not act as Mahakrura. Think

about

> > > > what it

> > > > > > did

> > > > > > > to the 7th bhava of Swamiji, also, before declaring

that it

> > > > became

> > > > > > > shubha or less malefic.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Lakshmi: I think Swamiji had an icchamrityu and looking

at

> > the

> > > > dass

> > > > > > operating on 4th July 1902, I observe that he passed

away in

> > Jup-

> > > > Ven-

> > > > > > Jup-Ket-Sat-Sat.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Jup MD: 1893-02-09 (1:35:30 pm) - 1909-02-10 (3:59:13

pm)

> > > > > > Ven AD: 1900-12-25 (10:03:30 am) - 1903-08-27 (4:48:54

pm)

> > > > > > Jup PD: 1902-05-02 (1:42:07 pm) - 1902-09-12 (10:43:55

pm)

> > > > > > Ket SD: 1902-06-29 (9:11:48 am) - 1902-07-07 (5:06:28

am)

> > > > > > Sat PAD: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-06 (2:29:24

am)

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Sat: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-05 (1:27:03 am)

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Jupiter is in 2nd house from Moon, Venus is the 2nd

lord from

> > > > Moon

> > > > > > and is posited in 2nd from lagna, Ketu is in the house

of

> > Venus

> > > > and

> > > > > > gives the results of Venus and Saturn is the 2nd lord

from

> > > > > > lagna....all are marakas. the maraka significations are

> > stronger

> > > > > > from Moon, and it's the cause of his early death.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I fail to see where Sun comes into all this.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > However, I agree that Sun, as AK aspecting 7th house,

can

> > give

> > > > > > parivraja tendencies. But can you ignore the influence

of

> > Saturn

> > > > on

> > > > > > Moon and 4th house, occuring in the 10th house? I am

sure

> > even

> > > > weak

> > > > > > Sun would have given him parivraja yoga:--))but without

the

> > raja

> > > > > > yoga and the strong soul-level impact he created

wherever he

> > > > went.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Or if you like look at what happened to the 7th

> > > > > > > Bhava of Lord Rama with exalted Mars in the 7th bhava.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Mars in 7th gives kuja dosha, and I think the strong

Mars in

> > 7th

> > > > > > gave him an exalted wife like Sita. You have not

commented

> > on the

> > > > > > exalted Saturn in 4th house.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > In each of the

> > > > > > > example provided by you look at the bhava that the

planets

> > > > occupy

> > > > > > > (barring Saturn, for reasons already stated in

previous

> > mail),

> > > > > > without

> > > > > > > looking at the charts as belonging to great people,

and

> > then

> > > > make

> > > > > > up

> > > > > > > your mind as to the truth or otherwise of what I

said. Did

> > you

> > > > > > know

> > > > > > > Ramana Maharshi died following a malignant sarcoma of

left

> > hand

> > > > > > and Mars

> > > > > > > is karaka for the 3rd bhava in 8th in his chart, in

> > > > exaltation. Do

> > > > > > you

> > > > > > > think Mars gave him benevolent results?

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I also request you to examine the

following

> > dasa

> > > > > > sequences with an open mind. Sun is the 3rd lord from

Moon

> > (AK) &

> > > > > > 12th lord from lagna in Sri Ramana's chart, rahu is

with Sun

> > and

> > > > > > gives Sun'/Saturn's/Jupiter's effects...all of which

point to

> > > > > > dusthanas, Saturn is a maraka in 7th house and ketu can

give

> > the

> > > > > > effects of Moon/Mercury/mars. Mar's effect, if at all,

was

> > only

> > > > > > indirect, and he was not the killer.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Sun MD: 1949-02-03 (1:02:22 am) - 1955-02-03 (2:05:32

pm)

> > > > > > Rah AD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1951-02-21 (8:49:14

am)

> > > > > > Rah PD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1950-05-18 (12:04:47

am)

> > > > > > Sat SD: 1950-04-12 (3:37:16 am) - 1950-04-20 (12:18:02

am)

> > > > > > Ket PAD: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14

(11:08:26 pm)

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Ket: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14 (12:47:04 pm)

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I think what stands out is the fact that the dasa of the

> > graha

> > > > > > conjoined Moon brought about death. I think their mind

> > willed the

> > > > > > death.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Can a planet give results in a dasa totally

> > > > unrelated/unassociated

> > > > > > with itself? I request you to consider the above

objectively.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I will talk about the other charts/issues in my next

mail.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > >

> > > > > > In Paramhans Ramkrishna's chart,

> > > > > > > I do not know where you find Mars strong as a planet

in

> > > > > > debilitation in

> > > > > > > Navamsha gives results of debility even when in

exaltation

> > in

> > > > rasi

> > > > > > > chart. In case of Saturn Viparitam shane smritam has

> > already

> > > > been

> > > > > > > mentioned by me, in earlier mail.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I myself have not considered Mars/Venus in

> > Thakur's

> > > > > > chart because they are debilitated. Please go through my

> > message

> > > > > > again. I was talking about Saturn and Rahu.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > About Shri Aurobindo, I trust you are

> > > > > > > aware of his revolutionary background and that he was

> > editor

> > > > of a

> > > > > > paper

> > > > > > > "Vande Mataram" not much known for its soft language.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > > Same is the case with strong Malefics giving P.M.

Yogas.

> > Every

> > > > > > graha is

> > > > > > > capable of 12 variations of a P.M. Yoga attributed to

it,

> > at

> > > > the

> > > > > > very

> > > > > > > least. It would only be naive to imagine they would

all

> > give

> > > > > > identical

> > > > > > > results as indicated by Parashara or all with Pancha

> > > > Mahapurusha

> > > > > > Yoga

> > > > > > > would only rule over different parts of India (barring

> > Saturn),

> > > > > > just

> > > > > > > because the sage said so. The sages gave us

principles and

> > > > > > expected us

> > > > > > > to apply them to real life horoscope using Viveka.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I would gladly give you the shloka giving the

reference to

> > > > > > > "Viparita---Shane..." it is from an old classic

respected

> > > > amongst

> > > > > > > astrologers, but as you do not seem to accept

anything that

> > > > does

> > > > > > not fit

> > > > > > > in with what, you think. is said by Dr. Raman, it

would be

> > an

> > > > > > exercise

> > > > > > > in futility. should you yet want the shloka I would of

> > course

> > > > be

> > > > > > glad to

> > > > > > > give it to you.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Om Gurave namah

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > You seem to be disagreeing with Shri B.V. Raman that

> > strong

> > > > > > planets,

> > > > > > > > whether malefic or benefics give good results,

while weak

> > > > planets

> > > > > > > > give bad results. Perhaps you also disagree about

strong

> > > > malefics

> > > > > > > > giving mahapurusha yogas. Isn't it contrary to what

all

> > the

> > > > > > jyotish

> > > > > > > > texts teach?

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Then, here are a few examples, where I find that

strong

> > > > malefics

> > > > > > > > have neither made the natives krura nor that their

> > > > significations

> > > > > > > > suffered.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Swami Vivekananda: strong sun in lagna and mars in

5th

> > house

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Sri Aurobindo: Strong Sun in 2nd house.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Maharshi Mahesh yogi: exalted Mars in lagna.

> > > > > > > > Ramana Maharshi: strong Mars in 8th house

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Sri Ramakrishna Paramahamsa: Exalted Saturn(9H) and

Rahu

> > > > (4H).

> > > > > > Mars

> > > > > > > > and Venus are also exalted in rasi, while

debilitated in

> > > > navamsa.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Sir, can you give me the reference for "vipareetam

shaneH

> > > > > > sritam"?

> > > > > > > > Does it, by any chance, refer to Saturn's placement

in

> > the

> > > > 8th

> > > > > > house

> > > > > > > > being beneficial?

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > I am happy that you agree strong Saturn gives good

> > results.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Can you tell me from where the saying is because i

would

> > > > like to

> > > > > > > > read it up myself and understand.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > --- Chandrashekhar <chandrashekhar46@

> > > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk>>

> > > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > About Krura planets the saying is, that with

> > > > > > > > > > > strength the Krura grahas

> > > > > > > > > > > become more Krura (Maha-krura) and the shubha

> > grahas

> > > > > > > > > > > become more shubha.

> > > > > > > > > > > Only Shani is more krura when weak and

beneficial

> > or

> > > > > > > > > > > less krura when

> > > > > > > > > > > strong "Viparitama shaneH smritam".

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > My sun dasa started when I was 9 years old,

and

> > > > > > > > > > > ended when I was 15

> > > > > > > > > > > > years old. How come you didn't notice the

second

> > > > > > > > > > > part? I was old

> > > > > > > > > > > > enough to understand the difference between

> > > > > > > > > > > success and failure, I

> > > > > > > > > > > > guess!

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Anyway, if you agree that Rahu is giving

Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > > results, and those

> > > > > > > > > > > > results are exceptionally good, then it

> > > > > > > > > > > automatically follows that

> > > > > > > > > > > > Sun is strong in my chart because according

to

> > > > > > > > > > > Shri B.V Raman, evil

> > > > > > > > > > > > planets, especially when weak, give bad

results

> > > > > > > > > > > (vide "a catechism

> > > > > > > > > > > > of astrology"), while strong planets, even

if

> > > > > > > > > > > evil, give good

> > > > > > > > > > > > results. If my Sun were weak, he wouldn't be

> > > > > > > > > > > giving such good

> > > > > > > > > > > > results:--))

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Since Mercury is hopelessly combust and

inferior

> > > > > > > > > > > in shadbala

> > > > > > > > > > > > strength, the major results of Dharma

> > > > > > > > > > > karmadhipathi yoga are also

> > > > > > > > > > > > given by Sun, because according to "300

> > > > > > > > > > > combinations" of Sri

> > > > > > > > > > > > Raman, a planet with higher shadbala is more

> > > > > > > > > > > likely to give the

> > > > > > > > > > > > results of a yoga.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Regarding Karna, I request you to read the

Karna

> > > > > > > > > > > Parva of

> > > > > > > > > > > > Mahabharata again. When he died, the nature

bowed

> > > > > > > > > > > in grief, because

> > > > > > > > > > > > he's one of the noblest persons in

Mahabharata.

> > > > > > > > > > > Even the episode you

> > > > > > > > > > > > quoted happened because Parashurama would

teach

> > > > > > > > > > > only Brahmins and

> > > > > > > > > > > > Karna desperately wanted to learn

dhanurvidya

> > from

> > > > > > > > > > > Parashurama so

> > > > > > > > > > > > that he can support Duryodhana. Deceit is

> > > > > > > > > > > certainly punishable and

> > > > > > > > > > > > Karna did pay dearly. But it's to be borne

in

> > mind

> > > > > > > > > > > that whatever

> > > > > > > > > > > > Karna did was only to please Duryodhana, his

> > > > > > > > > > > dearest friend. Karna

> > > > > > > > > > > > did not gain anything personally.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the 3rd house from 8th house

(I

> > > > > > > > > > > think there was a typo

> > > > > > > > > > > > at your end). In the natural zodiac, the 10

th

> > > > > > > > > > > sign, being the

> > > > > > > > > > > > cardinal earth sign, represents

south /dakshina

> > > > > > > > > > > disha. South is the

> > > > > > > > > > > > direction ruled by Yama, the lord of death,

hence

> > > > > > > > > > > 10th house

> > > > > > > > > > > > represents burial grounds. So, the Rudras

> > (Saturn,

> > > > > > > > > > > Sun and Mars) are

> > > > > > > > > > > > strong in south. Also, Sun resides in south

and

> > > > > > > > > > > starts his

> > > > > > > > > > > > northern voyage from here. So he has

digbala in

> > > > > > > > > > > 10th house.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > I did clarify that when I referred to Surya

as

> > > > > > > > > > > Karma saakshi, it's

> > > > > > > > > > > > only to his status as antaraatma and not as

a

> > > > > > > > > > > deity. Perhaps this

> > > > > > > > > > > > escaped your attention.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > This is my last post on the subject.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > <%40>

> > > > <%40>

> > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > > > <%40>,

> > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar

> > > > > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > You were too young for the results of the

dasha

> > > > > > > > > > > to manifest,

> > > > > > > > > > > > though it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > is good news that your father had

promotions

> > and

> > > > > > > > > > > you received

> > > > > > > > > > > > > prizes/accolades during that time. It is

> > > > > > > > > > > interesting to know you

> > > > > > > > > > > > got

> > > > > > > > > > > > > these results at a young age of 9 or so

as that

> > > > > > > > > > > is when Sun dasha

> > > > > > > > > > > > was

> > > > > > > > > > > > > operative. I am relieved you did not have

any

> > > > > > > > > > > health problems in

> > > > > > > > > > > > > March-August 1970 period.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > But we are talking about Rahu and Rahu

would

> > > > > > > > > > > give results of Sun

> > > > > > > > > > > > more

> > > > > > > > > > > > > prominently, by conjunction, as you

guessed but

> > > > > > > > > > > also that of

> > > > > > > > > > > > Mercury

> > > > > > > > > > > > > (You have a Dharmakarmaadhipati yoga

after all)

> > > > > > > > > > > and that is why I

> > > > > > > > > > > > said

> > > > > > > > > > > > > for understanding Sun its dasha instead

of Rahu

> > > > > > > > > > > dasha needs to be

> > > > > > > > > > > > analyzed.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Mercury is malefic not because I say so

but

> > > > > > > > > > > because Jyotish says

> > > > > > > > > > > > that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > mercury is malefic when conjunct a papa

graha

> > > > > > > > > > > and he is conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > > two,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun and Rahu.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the apex of Artha trikona

and

> > > > > > > > > > > directly involved with

> > > > > > > > > > > > > efforts to earn money. Though claimed to

be

> > > > > > > > > > > smashana/burial

> > > > > > > > > > > > ground, it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > is 4th from ayush sthana (8th) and its

home

> > that

> > > > > > > > > > > is why affliction

> > > > > > > > > > > > to it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > can give death. But 8th is more popularly

> > called

> > > > > > > > > > > mrityu sthana and

> > > > > > > > > > > > hence

> > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th is called Smashana. If it is really

> > > > > > > > > > > smashana why would it be

> > > > > > > > > > > > called

> > > > > > > > > > > > > karma sthana and why would Sun be at its

most

> > > > > > > > > > > brilliant there?

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > I did not say he can not represent water

bodies

> > > > > > > > > > > in temple, but not

> > > > > > > > > > > > only

> > > > > > > > > > > > > those.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > My Sun dasa was excellent too. My father

> > > > > > > > > > > received promotion(s),

> > > > > > > > > > > > my

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > school/college days were great and i

received

> > > > > > > > > > > wide acclaim/prizes

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > for my ability in creative writing,

Veena,

> > > > > > > > > > > quiz contests etc,

> > > > > > > > > > > > apart

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > from studies. So, for a student, I guess

> > > > > > > > > > > that's excellent!!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > How do you justify this, if Sun were

weak?

> > > > > > > > > > > Rahu is certainly

> > > > > > > > > > > > giving

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > the yogakaraka results, but being in

Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > > house and being

> > > > > > > > > > > > conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun, don't you think Rahu is also

giving the

> > > > > > > > > > > results of Sun? You

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > said that mercury is malefic and heavily

> > > > > > > > > > > combust too:--))

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1th house also represent burial

> > > > > > > > > > > ground/smashaana. Is that a place

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > for attachment?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandra represents all water bodies, so

why

> > > > > > > > > > > can't he represent

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > temple tank?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > === message truncated ===

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

 

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Tired of spam? Mail has the best spam

> > protection

> > > > > > around

> > > > > > > > > > <>

> > < <>>

> > > > < <>

> > < <>>>

> > > > > > < <>

> > < <>>

> > > > < <>

> > < <>>>>

> > > > > > > > < <>

> > < <>>

> > > > < <>

> > < <>>>

> > > > > > < <>

> > < <>>

> > > > < <>

> > < <>>>>>

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > ---------------

-----

> > ----

> > > > -

> > > > > > > > -------

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database:

268.11.7/435 -

> > Release

> > > > > > Date:

> > > > > > > > 8/31/2006

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

removed]

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > -------------------

-----

> > -

> > > > > > -------

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.12.2/441 -

Release

> > > > Date:

> > > > > > 9/7/2006

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

[Guest guest]

Om Gurave Namah

 

Namaste Pradeep,

 

Thinking in retrospect, as I have written in the mail to

Chandrasekhar ji, perhaps we are wrong in interpreting that "ego" is

found only in some people. If we interpret dispassionately, perhaps

Kalyan Varma has been RIGHTLY saying all along that ego ( necessary

for perpetuation of Creation) is present in every being, as much as

soul/mind or happiness/grief are present, yet I don't find us

fighting about them. we need to accept that I have ego, you have

ego, chandrasekhar ji has ego...all of us have it, perhaps in

different degrees.

 

How wrong was I to think that "ego" is peculiar only to some

people!! How wrong was i to think that we are exceptions! "Ego" is

part of the natural state of every individual...like the kundalini

residing in mooladhara of every one.

 

Only a blessed few succeed in reversing this ego, in dissolving this

separateness. They cross this Vishnu Maaya and reach a state of

Realization.

 

Thanks for helping me reach this humbling yet exhilerating

understanding. I have truly learnt something today.

 

Regards,

Lakshmi

 

 

 

 

 

, "b_lakshmi_ramesh"

<b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

>

> Om Gurave Namah

>

> Namaste Pradeep,

>

> Only Kalyan Varma is mentioning.Kalyan Varma included

> > the illusionary factor which can catalyse all of the above and

> result

> > in dukham.

>

> Lakshmi: I must remind you that The Kalyana Varma reference was

not

> chosen by me. It was chosen by Chandrasekhar ji and certified to

be

> impeccable.

>

> Can you tell me if any other astro-book says that Saturn gives

> contrary results (except in 8th house)? I do not recall

> Parashara/Varahamihira saying it. If you can find it, please let

me

> know.

>

> I must honestly say that Parashara/Varahamihira do not say

anything

> about Rahu representing "mada". But have they explicitly said any

> thing about Sun having "ego" either? Were we not drawing

convoluted

> conclusions then?

>

> Should we quote a book when it suits us and dump it when it

doesn't?

>

> Pradeep, please do not think that I am championing either Sun or

> Rahu. I am sure you have read the mail where I said that Rahu is

> also capable of giving great spirituality when involved in such

> yogas. Infact what I have been fighting for all these days is for

> fair treatment of all planets.

>

> > Thus we have to look for the meaning suiting the context.Why

Rahu

> is

> > just one among the shad ripus?Why not lust,kaama,moha,krodha?

Rahu

> is

> > not any of these.He makes us have all these.

>

> Lakshmi: You are very correct. Rahu is the generator of "I"- a

false

> feeling as a separate entity, which is the basis of ego (as

> defined/argued by you in the earlier mails). This feeling is also

> the basis of the shadripus which are based on one individual being

> different from other.

>

> Sun called as Atma karaka

> > is karaka for lagna in astrology.Am i wrong? Once he enters the

> body

> > he is trapped and just wanders wherever the mind is

taking ,until

> self

> > realization.Am i wrong?What is BHagavatham mentioning about

> individual

> > soul and its plight.

> >

> > Rahu does not enter on its own nor is it a feeling of ''I''.It

is

> just

> > our assumption.

>

> Lakshmi: Since we are talking about astrology, can you tell me

> why "kumbha" (pindanda)has been given the dual lordship by Saturn

> and Rahu? Why does birth take place? Because of karma (Saturn) and

> unsatisfied kaama (Rahu) or because of aatma? If birth takes place

> because of aatma, why should Aatma be unhappy or feel trapped in a

> body? I request you to reflect on these and answer.

>

> Why is Rahu called "Kaala sarpam" and represents Time? Does he

cause

> day/night? does he cause seasons? Then why? It's because he causes

> the interminable birth cycle.

>

> According to your own/Chandrasekhar ji's previous e-mails, "ego"

is

> a false feeling of differentiation. Now you yourself have said

> that " Rahu the intoxication or illusion surrounding us giving us

a

> smoky/obscurant idea".

>

> I agree with all that you say. Now putting all this together,

please

> tell me if Rahu does not give a illusiory/intoxicated/false idea

of

> oneself.

>

> Btw, I really appreciate the way you research and i understand the

> way you feel about Rahu. I again reiterate that I have nothing

> against Rahu...my own Rahu dasa is excellent and is bringing me

> immense spiritual benefits, like the present discussion:--))

>

> Regards,

> Lakshmi

>

>

>

>

>

>

> >

>

>

> > Thanks

> > Pradeep

> >

> > , "b_lakshmi_ramesh"

> > <b_lakshmi_ramesh@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Om Gurave Namah

> > >

> > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji & Pradeep ji,

> > >

> > > I recollect writing in my previous e-mails, that the shloka

from

> > > Saravali talks about the inner qualities of an

> > > individual/kalapurusha. Does the word "mada" imply

intoxication

> as

> > > an inner quality? Does the word "intoxication" belong in that

> > > context, in that group?

> > >

> > > I do not think either of you responded to that. perhaps you

> missed

> > > it out in the avalanche of e-mails:--))

> > >

> > > Can i have your response(s) please?

> > >

> > > Regards,

> > > Lakshmi

> > >

> > >

> > > , Chandrashekhar

> > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > >

> > > > Pride is different from ego. Like it or not Mada does mean

> > > intoxication

> > > > or lust. The Kama that is referred to relates to kaamana

which

> > > means

> > > > desires for things possessed by others. That is what Asteya,

> one

> > > of the

> > > > Yamas of Hatha yogas refer to.

> > > >

> > > > We are talking about auspiciousness or other wise of the

> dormant

> > > or

> > > > awakened Kundalini. As I said all scriptures can be

> misinterpreted

> > > if

> > > > one wants to do that. But that does not serve any purpose. I

> would

> > > not

> > > > go into what exactly is meant by Vidya and Avidya related to

> Maa.

> > > I have

> > > > not yet seen any Pramana, in the form of a shloka, to

support

> your

> > > > proposition that dormant Kundalini is inauspicious and the

> > > awakened

> > > > Kundalini is auspicious so far. I have already posted the

way

> my

> > > > generation has been taught to accept an argument, so I shall

> not

> > > repeat

> > > > it here.

> > > >

> > > > But I will not resort to conjectures and would like to quote

> from

> > > > Rudrayamala tantra about the swarUpa of dormant Kundalini.

> Being

> > > > graduate in sanskrit, I am sure I will not have to translate

> it

> > > for you.

> > > > Aaxare prdevta Éìjntax> k…{flI devta

> > > > ädhäre paradevatä bhavrajanatädhaù kuëòalé devatä

> > > > devanamixdevta iÇjgtamanNdpuÃiSwta,

> > > > devänämadhidevatä trijagatämänandapuïjasthitä|

> > > > mUlaxarinvaisnI iÇrm[i ya }ainnI mailnI

> > > > mülädhäraniväsiné triramaëé yä jïäniné mäliné

> > > > sa me mat&mnuiSwta k…lpwanNdEkbIjanna.32,21.

> > > > sä me mätåmanusthitä kulapathänandaikabéjänanä||32|21||

> > > >

> > > > I am sure you must have some quote to support your

contention.

> I

> > > would

> > > > like to see the shloka, as against conjectures, so that I

can

> > > improve

> > > > upon my knowledge of the swarupaa of Kundalini.

> > > >

> > > > I can understand your reluctance to support your

propositions

> with

> > > > suitable pramanas. I am sorry if I have hurt you by pointing

> out

> > > the

> > > > inconsistency in the way you treated Surya and Rahu

> combinations

> > > in two

> > > > different chart as stand out combinations only.

> > > >

> > > > I had no intention to cause any hurt to you and if I have

done

> so

> > > > inadvertently I crave your pardon.

> > > >

> > > > Take care,

> > > >

> > > > Chandrashekhar

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > >

> > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > >

> > > > > The shadripus are kaama (lust), krodha (anger), lobha

> (greed),

> > > moha

> > > > > (attachment, delusion), mada (pride) and maatsarya

(jealousy)

> > > > > If "mada" means "lust" what does "kaama" imply among the

> > > > > shadripus? "Mada" signifies one who is intoxicated/drunk

with

> > > > > power/self-grandeur (pride/ego).

> > > > >

> > > > > Mother is known as "Vidya and avidya swaroopini" and

correct

> > > > > appreciation of Mother includes understanding of both

> facets. As

> > > > > Shakti, She respresents raw power which can be routed

> towards

> > > good

> > > > > deeds as well as bad deeds. Are both ends the same? The

> wisdom,

> > > > > required to put this immense shakti to good use, is

> represented

> > > by

> > > > > Shiva, hence the union of Shiva and Parvati, wisdom and

> power, is

> > > > > said to be auspicious because it ensures the

> correct/judicious

> > > end

> > > > > use of shakti. Hence the orientation of Shakti is very very

> > > > > important.

> > > > >

> > > > > I always said that Soorya is both sattwik and krura. I

also

> > > always

> > > > > said all planets, including Jupiter, can give malefic

> results, if

> > > > > they are functionally empowered to do so. You can refer to

> all my

> > > > > previous mails to confirm this.

> > > > >

> > > > > Sir, Truth is much more important than winning or losing an

> > > > > argument. All discussions must proceed as an exploration

and

> > > > > celebration of Truth. When this is not the case, I see no

> > > purpose in

> > > > > continuing these discussions.

> > > > >

> > > > > Thanks & Regards,

> > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Having Icchamrityu and dying at an early age are

operating

> at

> > > > > different

> > > > > > levels. Bhishma had Iccha Mrityu but did not die young.

So

> > > please

> > > > > do not

> > > > > > try to mix the issues. If you have read Swamiji's

> biography you

> > > > > will

> > > > > > find that he fell sick many times despite of apparent

> robust

> > > > > physique.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Commenting on Shani in 4th for Rama's chart confirms

with

> his

> > > > > being

> > > > > > capable of giving Vipareeta results. I did not know I

was

> > > expected

> > > > > to

> > > > > > analyze the entire chart. By the way if there is a Kuja

> dosha

> > > how

> > > > > does

> > > > > > that by itself give a Divine wife? Please do not bring

our

> > > > > devotion to

> > > > > > Lord Rama (and we both have that) into astrological

> analysis of

> > > > > his chart.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Bringing in the dashas when the discussions are on the

> effects

> > > of

> > > > > grahas

> > > > > > will only lead the discussion to no where. The two have

to

> be

> > > seen

> > > > > > separately as we are not trying to time an event but

only

> > > trying

> > > > > to find

> > > > > > what are the effects on bhavas occupied.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Dear Lakshmi in Ramana Maharshi's chart you have perhaps

> > > forgotten

> > > > > the

> > > > > > saying Kuja vat Ketu. look at the Ketu deha in that

> perspective

> > > > > and let

> > > > > > me know your views. And if by the way you read my mail,

I

> did

> > > not

> > > > > say

> > > > > > anything about mars being killer for him, only that it

> gave him

> > > > > Sarcoma

> > > > > > being 3rd lord.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Also could you explain why Sun being Atma and always

> > > beneficent as

> > > > > you

> > > > > > have claimed all along in the thread on the topic, did

its

> > > > > Mahadasha

> > > > > > prove to be Killer to Ramana Maharshi?

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Take care,

> > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > For example, remember that in Swami Vivekananda's

> chart

> > > Surya

> > > > > is

> > > > > > > lord of

> > > > > > > > the 9th occupying the lagna and causing a powerful

Raj

> > > yoga. At

> > > > > > > the same

> > > > > > > > time if you thin how long the Swamiji lived, you may

> have

> > > to

> > > > > think

> > > > > > > again

> > > > > > > > about saying that it did not act as Mahakrura. Think

> about

> > > > > what it

> > > > > > > did

> > > > > > > > to the 7th bhava of Swamiji, also, before declaring

> that it

> > > > > became

> > > > > > > > shubha or less malefic.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Lakshmi: I think Swamiji had an icchamrityu and

looking

> at

> > > the

> > > > > dass

> > > > > > > operating on 4th July 1902, I observe that he passed

> away in

> > > Jup-

> > > > > Ven-

> > > > > > > Jup-Ket-Sat-Sat.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Jup MD: 1893-02-09 (1:35:30 pm) - 1909-02-10 (3:59:13

pm)

> > > > > > > Ven AD: 1900-12-25 (10:03:30 am) - 1903-08-27 (4:48:54

> pm)

> > > > > > > Jup PD: 1902-05-02 (1:42:07 pm) - 1902-09-12 (10:43:55

> pm)

> > > > > > > Ket SD: 1902-06-29 (9:11:48 am) - 1902-07-07 (5:06:28

am)

> > > > > > > Sat PAD: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-06 (2:29:24

> am)

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Sat: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-05 (1:27:03 am)

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Jupiter is in 2nd house from Moon, Venus is the 2nd

lord

> from

> > > > > Moon

> > > > > > > and is posited in 2nd from lagna, Ketu is in the house

> of

> > > Venus

> > > > > and

> > > > > > > gives the results of Venus and Saturn is the 2nd lord

> from

> > > > > > > lagna....all are marakas. the maraka significations

are

> > > stronger

> > > > > > > from Moon, and it's the cause of his early death.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I fail to see where Sun comes into all this.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > However, I agree that Sun, as AK aspecting 7th house,

> can

> > > give

> > > > > > > parivraja tendencies. But can you ignore the influence

> of

> > > Saturn

> > > > > on

> > > > > > > Moon and 4th house, occuring in the 10th house? I am

> sure

> > > even

> > > > > weak

> > > > > > > Sun would have given him parivraja yoga:--))but

without

> the

> > > raja

> > > > > > > yoga and the strong soul-level impact he created

> wherever he

> > > > > went.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Or if you like look at what happened to the 7th

> > > > > > > > Bhava of Lord Rama with exalted Mars in the 7th

bhava.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Mars in 7th gives kuja dosha, and I think the strong

> Mars in

> > > 7th

> > > > > > > gave him an exalted wife like Sita. You have not

> commented

> > > on the

> > > > > > > exalted Saturn in 4th house.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > In each of the

> > > > > > > > example provided by you look at the bhava that the

> planets

> > > > > occupy

> > > > > > > > (barring Saturn, for reasons already stated in

> previous

> > > mail),

> > > > > > > without

> > > > > > > > looking at the charts as belonging to great people,

> and

> > > then

> > > > > make

> > > > > > > up

> > > > > > > > your mind as to the truth or otherwise of what I

said.

> Did

> > > you

> > > > > > > know

> > > > > > > > Ramana Maharshi died following a malignant sarcoma

of

> left

> > > hand

> > > > > > > and Mars

> > > > > > > > is karaka for the 3rd bhava in 8th in his chart, in

> > > > > exaltation. Do

> > > > > > > you

> > > > > > > > think Mars gave him benevolent results?

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I also request you to examine the

> following

> > > dasa

> > > > > > > sequences with an open mind. Sun is the 3rd lord from

> Moon

> > > (AK) &

> > > > > > > 12th lord from lagna in Sri Ramana's chart, rahu is

with

> Sun

> > > and

> > > > > > > gives Sun'/Saturn's/Jupiter's effects...all of which

> point to

> > > > > > > dusthanas, Saturn is a maraka in 7th house and ketu

can

> give

> > > the

> > > > > > > effects of Moon/Mercury/mars. Mar's effect, if at all,

> was

> > > only

> > > > > > > indirect, and he was not the killer.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Sun MD: 1949-02-03 (1:02:22 am) - 1955-02-03 (2:05:32

pm)

> > > > > > > Rah AD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1951-02-21 (8:49:14

am)

> > > > > > > Rah PD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1950-05-18 (12:04:47

> am)

> > > > > > > Sat SD: 1950-04-12 (3:37:16 am) - 1950-04-20 (12:18:02

> am)

> > > > > > > Ket PAD: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14

(11:08:26

> pm)

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Ket: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14 (12:47:04

pm)

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I think what stands out is the fact that the dasa of

the

> > > graha

> > > > > > > conjoined Moon brought about death. I think their mind

> > > willed the

> > > > > > > death.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Can a planet give results in a dasa totally

> > > > > unrelated/unassociated

> > > > > > > with itself? I request you to consider the above

> objectively.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I will talk about the other charts/issues in my next

> mail.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > In Paramhans Ramkrishna's chart,

> > > > > > > > I do not know where you find Mars strong as a planet

in

> > > > > > > debilitation in

> > > > > > > > Navamsha gives results of debility even when in

> exaltation

> > > in

> > > > > rasi

> > > > > > > > chart. In case of Saturn Viparitam shane smritam has

> > > already

> > > > > been

> > > > > > > > mentioned by me, in earlier mail.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I myself have not considered Mars/Venus

in

> > > Thakur's

> > > > > > > chart because they are debilitated. Please go through

my

> > > message

> > > > > > > again. I was talking about Saturn and Rahu.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > About Shri Aurobindo, I trust you are

> > > > > > > > aware of his revolutionary background and that he

was

> > > editor

> > > > > of a

> > > > > > > paper

> > > > > > > > "Vande Mataram" not much known for its soft language.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Same is the case with strong Malefics giving P.M.

> Yogas.

> > > Every

> > > > > > > graha is

> > > > > > > > capable of 12 variations of a P.M. Yoga attributed

to

> it,

> > > at

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > very

> > > > > > > > least. It would only be naive to imagine they would

> all

> > > give

> > > > > > > identical

> > > > > > > > results as indicated by Parashara or all with Pancha

> > > > > Mahapurusha

> > > > > > > Yoga

> > > > > > > > would only rule over different parts of India

(barring

> > > Saturn),

> > > > > > > just

> > > > > > > > because the sage said so. The sages gave us

principles

> and

> > > > > > > expected us

> > > > > > > > to apply them to real life horoscope using Viveka.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > I would gladly give you the shloka giving the

> reference to

> > > > > > > > "Viparita---Shane..." it is from an old classic

> respected

> > > > > amongst

> > > > > > > > astrologers, but as you do not seem to accept

anything

> that

> > > > > does

> > > > > > > not fit

> > > > > > > > in with what, you think. is said by Dr. Raman, it

> would be

> > > an

> > > > > > > exercise

> > > > > > > > in futility. should you yet want the shloka I would

of

> > > course

> > > > > be

> > > > > > > glad to

> > > > > > > > give it to you.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Om Gurave namah

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > You seem to be disagreeing with Shri B.V. Raman

that

> > > strong

> > > > > > > planets,

> > > > > > > > > whether malefic or benefics give good results,

while

> weak

> > > > > planets

> > > > > > > > > give bad results. Perhaps you also disagree about

> strong

> > > > > malefics

> > > > > > > > > giving mahapurusha yogas. Isn't it contrary to

what

> all

> > > the

> > > > > > > jyotish

> > > > > > > > > texts teach?

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Then, here are a few examples, where I find that

> strong

> > > > > malefics

> > > > > > > > > have neither made the natives krura nor that their

> > > > > significations

> > > > > > > > > suffered.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Swami Vivekananda: strong sun in lagna and mars in

> 5th

> > > house

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Sri Aurobindo: Strong Sun in 2nd house.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Maharshi Mahesh yogi: exalted Mars in lagna.

> > > > > > > > > Ramana Maharshi: strong Mars in 8th house

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Sri Ramakrishna Paramahamsa: Exalted Saturn(9H)

and

> Rahu

> > > > > (4H).

> > > > > > > Mars

> > > > > > > > > and Venus are also exalted in rasi, while

> debilitated in

> > > > > navamsa.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Sir, can you give me the reference for "vipareetam

> shaneH

> > > > > > > sritam"?

> > > > > > > > > Does it, by any chance, refer to Saturn's

placement

> in

> > > the

> > > > > 8th

> > > > > > > house

> > > > > > > > > being beneficial?

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > I am happy that you agree strong Saturn gives good

> > > results.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Can you tell me from where the saying is because i

> would

> > > > > like to

> > > > > > > > > read it up myself and understand.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > --- Chandrashekhar <chandrashekhar46@

> > > > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk>>

> > > > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > About Krura planets the saying is, that with

> > > > > > > > > > > > strength the Krura grahas

> > > > > > > > > > > > become more Krura (Maha-krura) and the

shubha

> > > grahas

> > > > > > > > > > > > become more shubha.

> > > > > > > > > > > > Only Shani is more krura when weak and

> beneficial

> > > or

> > > > > > > > > > > > less krura when

> > > > > > > > > > > > strong "Viparitama shaneH smritam".

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > My sun dasa started when I was 9 years

old,

> and

> > > > > > > > > > > > ended when I was 15

> > > > > > > > > > > > > years old. How come you didn't notice the

> second

> > > > > > > > > > > > part? I was old

> > > > > > > > > > > > > enough to understand the difference between

> > > > > > > > > > > > success and failure, I

> > > > > > > > > > > > > guess!

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Anyway, if you agree that Rahu is giving

> Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > > > results, and those

> > > > > > > > > > > > > results are exceptionally good, then it

> > > > > > > > > > > > automatically follows that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun is strong in my chart because

according

> to

> > > > > > > > > > > > Shri B.V Raman, evil

> > > > > > > > > > > > > planets, especially when weak, give bad

> results

> > > > > > > > > > > > (vide "a catechism

> > > > > > > > > > > > > of astrology"), while strong planets, even

if

> > > > > > > > > > > > evil, give good

> > > > > > > > > > > > > results. If my Sun were weak, he wouldn't

be

> > > > > > > > > > > > giving such good

> > > > > > > > > > > > > results:--))

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Since Mercury is hopelessly combust and

> inferior

> > > > > > > > > > > > in shadbala

> > > > > > > > > > > > > strength, the major results of Dharma

> > > > > > > > > > > > karmadhipathi yoga are also

> > > > > > > > > > > > > given by Sun, because according to "300

> > > > > > > > > > > > combinations" of Sri

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Raman, a planet with higher shadbala is

more

> > > > > > > > > > > > likely to give the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > results of a yoga.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Regarding Karna, I request you to read the

> Karna

> > > > > > > > > > > > Parva of

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Mahabharata again. When he died, the

nature

> bowed

> > > > > > > > > > > > in grief, because

> > > > > > > > > > > > > he's one of the noblest persons in

> Mahabharata.

> > > > > > > > > > > > Even the episode you

> > > > > > > > > > > > > quoted happened because Parashurama would

> teach

> > > > > > > > > > > > only Brahmins and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Karna desperately wanted to learn

> dhanurvidya

> > > from

> > > > > > > > > > > > Parashurama so

> > > > > > > > > > > > > that he can support Duryodhana. Deceit is

> > > > > > > > > > > > certainly punishable and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Karna did pay dearly. But it's to be borne

> in

> > > mind

> > > > > > > > > > > > that whatever

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Karna did was only to please Duryodhana,

his

> > > > > > > > > > > > dearest friend. Karna

> > > > > > > > > > > > > did not gain anything personally.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the 3rd house from 8th house

(I

> > > > > > > > > > > > think there was a typo

> > > > > > > > > > > > > at your end). In the natural zodiac, the

10

> th

> > > > > > > > > > > > sign, being the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > cardinal earth sign, represents

> south /dakshina

> > > > > > > > > > > > disha. South is the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > direction ruled by Yama, the lord of

death,

> hence

> > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house

> > > > > > > > > > > > > represents burial grounds. So, the Rudras

> > > (Saturn,

> > > > > > > > > > > > Sun and Mars) are

> > > > > > > > > > > > > strong in south. Also, Sun resides in

south

> and

> > > > > > > > > > > > starts his

> > > > > > > > > > > > > northern voyage from here. So he has

digbala

> in

> > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > I did clarify that when I referred to

Surya

> as

> > > > > > > > > > > > Karma saakshi, it's

> > > > > > > > > > > > > only to his status as antaraatma and not

as a

> > > > > > > > > > > > deity. Perhaps this

> > > > > > > > > > > > > escaped your attention.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > This is my last post on the subject.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40>,

> > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar

> > > > > > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > You were too young for the results of

the

> dasha

> > > > > > > > > > > > to manifest,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > though it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > is good news that your father had

> promotions

> > > and

> > > > > > > > > > > > you received

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > prizes/accolades during that time. It is

> > > > > > > > > > > > interesting to know you

> > > > > > > > > > > > > got

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > these results at a young age of 9 or so

as

> that

> > > > > > > > > > > > is when Sun dasha

> > > > > > > > > > > > > was

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > operative. I am relieved you did not

have

> any

> > > > > > > > > > > > health problems in

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > March-August 1970 period.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > But we are talking about Rahu and Rahu

> would

> > > > > > > > > > > > give results of Sun

> > > > > > > > > > > > > more

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > prominently, by conjunction, as you

> guessed but

> > > > > > > > > > > > also that of

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Mercury

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > (You have a Dharmakarmaadhipati yoga

after

> all)

> > > > > > > > > > > > and that is why I

> > > > > > > > > > > > > said

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > for understanding Sun its dasha instead

of

> Rahu

> > > > > > > > > > > > dasha needs to be

> > > > > > > > > > > > > analyzed.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mercury is malefic not because I say so

but

> > > > > > > > > > > > because Jyotish says

> > > > > > > > > > > > > that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > mercury is malefic when conjunct a papa

> graha

> > > > > > > > > > > > and he is conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > > > two,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun and Rahu.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the apex of Artha trikona

and

> > > > > > > > > > > > directly involved with

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > efforts to earn money. Though claimed to

be

> > > > > > > > > > > > smashana/burial

> > > > > > > > > > > > > ground, it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > is 4th from ayush sthana (8th) and its

> home

> > > that

> > > > > > > > > > > > is why affliction

> > > > > > > > > > > > > to it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > can give death. But 8th is more

popularly

> > > called

> > > > > > > > > > > > mrityu sthana and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > hence

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th is called Smashana. If it is really

> > > > > > > > > > > > smashana why would it be

> > > > > > > > > > > > > called

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > karma sthana and why would Sun be at its

> most

> > > > > > > > > > > > brilliant there?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > I did not say he can not represent water

> bodies

> > > > > > > > > > > > in temple, but not

> > > > > > > > > > > > > only

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > those.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My Sun dasa was excellent too. My

father

> > > > > > > > > > > > received promotion(s),

> > > > > > > > > > > > > my

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > school/college days were great and i

> received

> > > > > > > > > > > > wide acclaim/prizes

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > for my ability in creative writing,

> Veena,

> > > > > > > > > > > > quiz contests etc,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > apart

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > from studies. So, for a student, I

guess

> > > > > > > > > > > > that's excellent!!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > How do you justify this, if Sun were

> weak?

> > > > > > > > > > > > Rahu is certainly

> > > > > > > > > > > > > giving

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > the yogakaraka results, but being in

> Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > > > house and being

> > > > > > > > > > > > > conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun, don't you think Rahu is also

giving

> the

> > > > > > > > > > > > results of Sun? You

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > said that mercury is malefic and

heavily

> > > > > > > > > > > > combust too:--))

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1th house also represent burial

> > > > > > > > > > > > ground/smashaana. Is that a place

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > for attachment?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandra represents all water bodies,

so

> why

> > > > > > > > > > > > can't he represent

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > temple tank?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > === message truncated ===

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

>

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Tired of spam? Mail has the best spam

> > > protection

> > > > > > > around

> > > > > > > > > > > <>

> > > > > < <>>

> > > > > > > < <>

> > > > > < <>>>

> > > > > > > > > < <>

> > > > > < <>>

> > > > > > > < <>

> > > > > < <>>>>

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > --------------

--

> ----

> > > ----

> > > > > -

> > > > > > > > > -------

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database:

268.11.7/435 -

>

> > > Release

> > > > > > > Date:

> > > > > > > > > 8/31/2006

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> removed]

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > ------------------

--

> ----

> > > -

> > > > > > > -------

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.12.2/441 -

> Release

> > > > > Date:

> > > > > > > 9/7/2006

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

[Guest guest]

Om Gurave Namah

 

Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

 

Thanks for sharing the nice shloka with us. I am sorry that I had

indeed overlooked responding to it. In this regard, I have already

given my explanation of what's auspicious and what's not, based on

Soubhagya Bhaskaram.

 

Can you please explain to me how you understand the

phrase "kulapathänandaikabéjänanä".

 

Regards,

Lakshmi

 

 

 

 

, Chandrashekhar

<chandrashekhar46 wrote:

>

> Dear Divine Lakshmi,

>

> If you think Sahasrara and Vishuddha Chakras at the same place,

and if

> Pankaja refers to head and not face, all your arguments are

acceptable.

> Unfortunately they are not.

>

> I see that you have not given anything in support of your argument

> barring conjectures and have not commented on the shloka I sent

you.

>

> Chandrashekhar.

>

> b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> >

> >

> > Om Gurave Namah

> >

> > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> >

> > Lalitha Sahasranaamam describes Mother thus...

> >

> > Srimadvaagbhavakootaika swaroopamukha pankajaa

> > kanthaadhakatiparyanta madhyakoota swaroopini

> > Shaktikootaikathaapanna katyadhobhaagadhaariNi.

> >

> > The three divisions are

> >

> > Vagbhava koota - the face/head

> > Madhya/kamaraaja koota - from neck to kati

> > Shakti koota - the portion after kati to feet

> >

> > Can you tell me in this division, where does the head come...in

the

> > vagbhava koota or in shakti koota? Is there any other koota

defined

> > for the head/rear portion of the face etc? Or do you imply that

> > Mother has only a face without the head!!!

> >

> > You know very well that we are not talking of astrology mappings

> > here. Yet why you choose to interpret even a simple principle in

> > this strange fashion is some thing beyond me, unless you are

> > confused yourself (can happen to all of us) or want to confuse

> > others (no comments).

> >

> > If either Bhagavan Hayagriva or Sage Agasthya intended that "bisa

> > tantu taneeyasi" should be understood wrt kundalini at Mooladhara

> > also they would have put it immediately after "mooladharaika

> > nilayaa.. and not after "shatchakropari samsthithaa".

> >

> > ofcourse, I do not mean that Kundalini is like a python at

> > mooladhara:--)), but definitely much grosser than at sahasraara.

> >

> > Btw, I am sure you know that kundalini is not agni tattwatmika at

> > mooladhara. The agnitattwa of "vidyullekha" happens only from

> > swadhisthana, because agni is oordhwa mukha and is ignited only

when

> > the Kundalini turns upwards.

> >

> > Regards,

> > Lakshmi

> >

> >

> > <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > >

> > > By the way Vag beeja kuta is not only head but a group of

> > Panchadhasha

> > > mantra and referred to as maa's face indicating the vacha.

> > > Raajrajeshwari Kavacha prays that the vagbija protect the

throat

> > and not

> > > the head as you imply. Certainly not head. And her principal

abode

> > is

> > > said to be Mulaadhara and not sahasrara. However if you want

to

> > distort

> > > this to mean she is inauspicious when dormant you are free to

do

> > so. I

> > > would however request you to think why the HrIm beeja is most

dear

> > to

> > > her and not the AiM beeja (Devi Patha, if you need the

reference).

> > It

> > > would perhaps be well to understand that Kundalini means of

the

> > coiled

> > > form and "Visa Tantu..." coming after that certainly does not

mean

> > what

> > > you want to think it does.

> > >

> > > In the meanwhile, please contemplate on this.

> > > Aaxare prdevta Éìjntax> k…{flI devta

> > > ädhäre paradevatä bhavrajanatädhaù kuëòalé devatä

> > > devanamixdevta iÇjgtamanNdpuÃiSwta,

> > > devänämadhidevatä trijagatämänandapuïjasthitä|

> > > mUlaxarinvaisnI iÇrm[i ya }ainnI mailnI

> > > mülädhäraniväsiné triramaëé yä jïäniné mäliné

> > > sa me mat&mnuiSwta k…lpwanNdEkbIjanna.32,21.

> > > sä me mätåmanusthitä kulapathänandaikabéjänanä||32|21||

> > >

> > > This is how Kundalini is described in Rudrayamala Tantra. Do

you

> > think

> > > it is wrong?

> > >

> > > Chandrashekhar.

> > >

> > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > >

> > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > >

> > > > "vagbhavabeejasya kundalineethi sangnyaa

thadroopa"...Kundalini

> > as

> > > > preceding "bisa tantu taneeyasee" is described as vagbhava

beeja

> > > > or "aim" (saraswati) beeja. As you have read the yamalas, i

am

> > sure

> > > > you know which part of body comprises of vagbhava

koota...it's

> > the

> > > > head!!

> > > >

> > > > Let me also explain the term preceding kundalini.

> > > > It's "mahaasakthiH" and not "MahashakthiH" and talks of the

> > > > eagerness of Mother to unite with Shiva....mahe utsave

tatratya

> > > > shivashaktisamaayogaroope aasakthiH tatparataa yasyaaH.

> > > >

> > > > Is this enough to show that "bisa tantu taneeyasee" is the

> > climactic

> > > > name of shakti in ascension?

> > > >

> > > > Regarding Devi worshippers wrt unawakened kundalini, let me

quote

> > > > this sentence.....hey Srividyopaasakaah. uttishtatha. maa

> > > > swaptha....meaning o srividyopaasaka! wake up( the

kundalini).

> > don't

> > > > let it sleep!!

> > > >

> > > > Many thanks for this extended discussion on Kundalini. It's

time

> > for

> > > > taking leave.

> > > >

> > > > Regards,

> > > > Lakshmi

> > > >

> > > >

> > <%40>

> > > > <%40>, "b_lakshmi_ramesh"

> > > > <b_lakshmi_ramesh@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > >

> > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > >

> > > > > The shadripus are kaama (lust), krodha (anger), lobha

(greed),

> > > > moha

> > > > > (attachment, delusion), mada (pride) and maatsarya

(jealousy)

> > > > > If "mada" means "lust" what does "kaama" imply among the

> > > > > shadripus? "Mada" signifies one who is intoxicated/drunk

with

> > > > > power/self-grandeur (pride/ego).

> > > > >

> > > > > Mother is known as "Vidya and avidya swaroopini" and

correct

> > > > > appreciation of Mother includes understanding of both

facets.

> > As

> > > > > Shakti, She respresents raw power which can be routed

towards

> > good

> > > > > deeds as well as bad deeds. Are both ends the same? The

wisdom,

> > > > > required to put this immense shakti to good use, is

> > represented by

> > > > > Shiva, hence the union of Shiva and Parvati, wisdom and

power,

> > is

> > > > > said to be auspicious because it ensures the

correct/judicious

> > end

> > > > > use of shakti. Hence the orientation of Shakti is very

very

> > > > > important.

> > > > >

> > > > > I always said that Soorya is both sattwik and krura. I

also

> > always

> > > > > said all planets, including Jupiter, can give malefic

results,

> > if

> > > > > they are functionally empowered to do so. You can refer

to all

> > my

> > > > > previous mails to confirm this.

> > > > >

> > > > > Sir, Truth is much more important than winning or losing

an

> > > > > argument. All discussions must proceed as an exploration

and

> > > > > celebration of Truth. When this is not the case, I see no

> > purpose

> > > > in

> > > > > continuing these discussions.

> > > > >

> > > > > Thanks & Regards,

> > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > <%40>

> > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Having Icchamrityu and dying at an early age are

operating at

> > > > > different

> > > > > > levels. Bhishma had Iccha Mrityu but did not die young.

So

> > > > please

> > > > > do not

> > > > > > try to mix the issues. If you have read Swamiji's

biography

> > you

> > > > > will

> > > > > > find that he fell sick many times despite of apparent

robust

> > > > > physique.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Commenting on Shani in 4th for Rama's chart confirms

with his

> > > > > being

> > > > > > capable of giving Vipareeta results. I did not know I

was

> > > > expected

> > > > > to

> > > > > > analyze the entire chart. By the way if there is a Kuja

dosha

> > > > how

> > > > > does

> > > > > > that by itself give a Divine wife? Please do not bring

our

> > > > > devotion to

> > > > > > Lord Rama (and we both have that) into astrological

analysis

> > of

> > > > > his chart.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Bringing in the dashas when the discussions are on the

> > effects

> > > > of

> > > > > grahas

> > > > > > will only lead the discussion to no where. The two have

to be

> > > > seen

> > > > > > separately as we are not trying to time an event but

only

> > trying

> > > > > to find

> > > > > > what are the effects on bhavas occupied.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Dear Lakshmi in Ramana Maharshi's chart you have perhaps

> > > > forgotten

> > > > > the

> > > > > > saying Kuja vat Ketu. look at the Ketu deha in that

> > perspective

> > > > > and let

> > > > > > me know your views. And if by the way you read my mail,

I did

> > > > not

> > > > > say

> > > > > > anything about mars being killer for him, only that it

gave

> > him

> > > > > Sarcoma

> > > > > > being 3rd lord.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Also could you explain why Sun being Atma and always

> > beneficent

> > > > as

> > > > > you

> > > > > > have claimed all along in the thread on the topic, did

its

> > > > > Mahadasha

> > > > > > prove to be Killer to Ramana Maharshi?

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Take care,

> > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > For example, remember that in Swami Vivekananda's

chart

> > > > Surya

> > > > > is

> > > > > > > lord of

> > > > > > > > the 9th occupying the lagna and causing a powerful

Raj

> > yoga.

> > > > At

> > > > > > > the same

> > > > > > > > time if you thin how long the Swamiji lived, you may

> > have to

> > > > > think

> > > > > > > again

> > > > > > > > about saying that it did not act as Mahakrura. Think

> > about

> > > > > what it

> > > > > > > did

> > > > > > > > to the 7th bhava of Swamiji, also, before declaring

that

> > it

> > > > > became

> > > > > > > > shubha or less malefic.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Lakshmi: I think Swamiji had an icchamrityu and

looking at

> > the

> > > > > dass

> > > > > > > operating on 4th July 1902, I observe that he passed

away

> > in

> > > > Jup-

> > > > > Ven-

> > > > > > > Jup-Ket-Sat-Sat.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Jup MD: 1893-02-09 (1:35:30 pm) - 1909-02-10 (3:59:13

pm)

> > > > > > > Ven AD: 1900-12-25 (10:03:30 am) - 1903-08-27

(4:48:54 pm)

> > > > > > > Jup PD: 1902-05-02 (1:42:07 pm) - 1902-09-12

(10:43:55 pm)

> > > > > > > Ket SD: 1902-06-29 (9:11:48 am) - 1902-07-07 (5:06:28

am)

> > > > > > > Sat PAD: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-06

(2:29:24 am)

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Sat: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-05 (1:27:03 am)

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Jupiter is in 2nd house from Moon, Venus is the 2nd

lord

> > from

> > > > > Moon

> > > > > > > and is posited in 2nd from lagna, Ketu is in the

house of

> > > > Venus

> > > > > and

> > > > > > > gives the results of Venus and Saturn is the 2nd lord

from

> > > > > > > lagna....all are marakas. the maraka significations

are

> > > > stronger

> > > > > > > from Moon, and it's the cause of his early death.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I fail to see where Sun comes into all this.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > However, I agree that Sun, as AK aspecting 7th house,

can

> > give

> > > > > > > parivraja tendencies. But can you ignore the

influence of

> > > > Saturn

> > > > > on

> > > > > > > Moon and 4th house, occuring in the 10th house? I am

sure

> > even

> > > > > weak

> > > > > > > Sun would have given him parivraja yoga:--))but

without the

> > > > raja

> > > > > > > yoga and the strong soul-level impact he created

wherever

> > he

> > > > > went.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Or if you like look at what happened to the 7th

> > > > > > > > Bhava of Lord Rama with exalted Mars in the 7th

bhava.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Mars in 7th gives kuja dosha, and I think the strong

Mars

> > in

> > > > 7th

> > > > > > > gave him an exalted wife like Sita. You have not

commented

> > on

> > > > the

> > > > > > > exalted Saturn in 4th house.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > In each of the

> > > > > > > > example provided by you look at the bhava that the

> > planets

> > > > > occupy

> > > > > > > > (barring Saturn, for reasons already stated in

previous

> > > > mail),

> > > > > > > without

> > > > > > > > looking at the charts as belonging to great people,

and

> > then

> > > > > make

> > > > > > > up

> > > > > > > > your mind as to the truth or otherwise of what I

said.

> > Did

> > > > you

> > > > > > > know

> > > > > > > > Ramana Maharshi died following a malignant sarcoma

of

> > left

> > > > hand

> > > > > > > and Mars

> > > > > > > > is karaka for the 3rd bhava in 8th in his chart, in

> > > > > exaltation. Do

> > > > > > > you

> > > > > > > > think Mars gave him benevolent results?

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I also request you to examine the

following

> > dasa

> > > > > > > sequences with an open mind. Sun is the 3rd lord from

Moon

> > (AK)

> > > > &

> > > > > > > 12th lord from lagna in Sri Ramana's chart, rahu is

with

> > Sun

> > > > and

> > > > > > > gives Sun'/Saturn's/Jupiter's effects...all of which

point

> > to

> > > > > > > dusthanas, Saturn is a maraka in 7th house and ketu

can

> > give

> > > > the

> > > > > > > effects of Moon/Mercury/mars. Mar's effect, if at

all, was

> > only

> > > > > > > indirect, and he was not the killer.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Sun MD: 1949-02-03 (1:02:22 am) - 1955-02-03 (2:05:32

pm)

> > > > > > > Rah AD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1951-02-21 (8:49:14

am)

> > > > > > > Rah PD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1950-05-18

(12:04:47 am)

> > > > > > > Sat SD: 1950-04-12 (3:37:16 am) - 1950-04-20

(12:18:02 am)

> > > > > > > Ket PAD: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14

(11:08:26

> > pm)

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Ket: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14 (12:47:04

pm)

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I think what stands out is the fact that the dasa of

the

> > graha

> > > > > > > conjoined Moon brought about death. I think their mind

> > willed

> > > > the

> > > > > > > death.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Can a planet give results in a dasa totally

> > > > > unrelated/unassociated

> > > > > > > with itself? I request you to consider the above

> > objectively.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I will talk about the other charts/issues in my next

mail.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > In Paramhans Ramkrishna's chart,

> > > > > > > > I do not know where you find Mars strong as a

planet in

> > > > > > > debilitation in

> > > > > > > > Navamsha gives results of debility even when in

> > exaltation

> > > > in

> > > > > rasi

> > > > > > > > chart. In case of Saturn Viparitam shane smritam has

> > already

> > > > > been

> > > > > > > > mentioned by me, in earlier mail.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I myself have not considered Mars/Venus

in

> > > > Thakur's

> > > > > > > chart because they are debilitated. Please go through

my

> > > > message

> > > > > > > again. I was talking about Saturn and Rahu.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > About Shri Aurobindo, I trust you are

> > > > > > > > aware of his revolutionary background and that he

was

> > editor

> > > > > of a

> > > > > > > paper

> > > > > > > > "Vande Mataram" not much known for its soft

language.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Same is the case with strong Malefics giving P.M.

Yogas.

> > > > Every

> > > > > > > graha is

> > > > > > > > capable of 12 variations of a P.M. Yoga attributed

to

> > it, at

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > very

> > > > > > > > least. It would only be naive to imagine they would

all

> > give

> > > > > > > identical

> > > > > > > > results as indicated by Parashara or all with Pancha

> > > > > Mahapurusha

> > > > > > > Yoga

> > > > > > > > would only rule over different parts of India

(barring

> > > > Saturn),

> > > > > > > just

> > > > > > > > because the sage said so. The sages gave us

principles

> > and

> > > > > > > expected us

> > > > > > > > to apply them to real life horoscope using Viveka.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > I would gladly give you the shloka giving the

reference

> > to

> > > > > > > > "Viparita---Shane..." it is from an old classic

respected

> > > > > amongst

> > > > > > > > astrologers, but as you do not seem to accept

anything

> > that

> > > > > does

> > > > > > > not fit

> > > > > > > > in with what, you think. is said by Dr. Raman, it

would

> > be an

> > > > > > > exercise

> > > > > > > > in futility. should you yet want the shloka I would

of

> > > > course

> > > > > be

> > > > > > > glad to

> > > > > > > > give it to you.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Om Gurave namah

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > You seem to be disagreeing with Shri B.V. Raman

that

> > strong

> > > > > > > planets,

> > > > > > > > > whether malefic or benefics give good results,

while

> > weak

> > > > > planets

> > > > > > > > > give bad results. Perhaps you also disagree about

> > strong

> > > > > malefics

> > > > > > > > > giving mahapurusha yogas. Isn't it contrary to

what

> > all the

> > > > > > > jyotish

> > > > > > > > > texts teach?

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Then, here are a few examples, where I find that

strong

> > > > > malefics

> > > > > > > > > have neither made the natives krura nor that their

> > > > > significations

> > > > > > > > > suffered.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Swami Vivekananda: strong sun in lagna and mars

in 5th

> > > > house

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Sri Aurobindo: Strong Sun in 2nd house.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Maharshi Mahesh yogi: exalted Mars in lagna.

> > > > > > > > > Ramana Maharshi: strong Mars in 8th house

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Sri Ramakrishna Paramahamsa: Exalted Saturn(9H)

and

> > Rahu

> > > > > (4H).

> > > > > > > Mars

> > > > > > > > > and Venus are also exalted in rasi, while

debilitated

> > in

> > > > > navamsa.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Sir, can you give me the reference for "vipareetam

> > shaneH

> > > > > > > sritam"?

> > > > > > > > > Does it, by any chance, refer to Saturn's

placement in

> > the

> > > > > 8th

> > > > > > > house

> > > > > > > > > being beneficial?

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > I am happy that you agree strong Saturn gives good

> > results.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Can you tell me from where the saying is because i

> > would

> > > > > like to

> > > > > > > > > read it up myself and understand.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > --- Chandrashekhar <chandrashekhar46@

> > > > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk>>

> > > > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > About Krura planets the saying is, that with

> > > > > > > > > > > > strength the Krura grahas

> > > > > > > > > > > > become more Krura (Maha-krura) and the

shubha

> > grahas

> > > > > > > > > > > > become more shubha.

> > > > > > > > > > > > Only Shani is more krura when weak and

> > beneficial or

> > > > > > > > > > > > less krura when

> > > > > > > > > > > > strong "Viparitama shaneH smritam".

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > My sun dasa started when I was 9 years

old, and

> > > > > > > > > > > > ended when I was 15

> > > > > > > > > > > > > years old. How come you didn't notice the

> > second

> > > > > > > > > > > > part? I was old

> > > > > > > > > > > > > enough to understand the difference

between

> > > > > > > > > > > > success and failure, I

> > > > > > > > > > > > > guess!

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Anyway, if you agree that Rahu is giving

Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > > > results, and those

> > > > > > > > > > > > > results are exceptionally good, then it

> > > > > > > > > > > > automatically follows that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun is strong in my chart because

according to

> > > > > > > > > > > > Shri B.V Raman, evil

> > > > > > > > > > > > > planets, especially when weak, give bad

results

> > > > > > > > > > > > (vide "a catechism

> > > > > > > > > > > > > of astrology"), while strong planets,

even if

> > > > > > > > > > > > evil, give good

> > > > > > > > > > > > > results. If my Sun were weak, he wouldn't

be

> > > > > > > > > > > > giving such good

> > > > > > > > > > > > > results:--))

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Since Mercury is hopelessly combust and

> > inferior

> > > > > > > > > > > > in shadbala

> > > > > > > > > > > > > strength, the major results of Dharma

> > > > > > > > > > > > karmadhipathi yoga are also

> > > > > > > > > > > > > given by Sun, because according to "300

> > > > > > > > > > > > combinations" of Sri

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Raman, a planet with higher shadbala is

more

> > > > > > > > > > > > likely to give the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > results of a yoga.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Regarding Karna, I request you to read the

> > Karna

> > > > > > > > > > > > Parva of

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Mahabharata again. When he died, the

nature

> > bowed

> > > > > > > > > > > > in grief, because

> > > > > > > > > > > > > he's one of the noblest persons in

Mahabharata.

> > > > > > > > > > > > Even the episode you

> > > > > > > > > > > > > quoted happened because Parashurama would

teach

> > > > > > > > > > > > only Brahmins and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Karna desperately wanted to learn

dhanurvidya

> > from

> > > > > > > > > > > > Parashurama so

> > > > > > > > > > > > > that he can support Duryodhana. Deceit is

> > > > > > > > > > > > certainly punishable and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Karna did pay dearly. But it's to be

borne in

> > mind

> > > > > > > > > > > > that whatever

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Karna did was only to please Duryodhana,

his

> > > > > > > > > > > > dearest friend. Karna

> > > > > > > > > > > > > did not gain anything personally.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the 3rd house from 8th

house (I

> > > > > > > > > > > > think there was a typo

> > > > > > > > > > > > > at your end). In the natural zodiac, the

10 th

> > > > > > > > > > > > sign, being the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > cardinal earth sign, represents

south /dakshina

> > > > > > > > > > > > disha. South is the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > direction ruled by Yama, the lord of

death,

> > hence

> > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house

> > > > > > > > > > > > > represents burial grounds. So, the Rudras

> > (Saturn,

> > > > > > > > > > > > Sun and Mars) are

> > > > > > > > > > > > > strong in south. Also, Sun resides in

south and

> > > > > > > > > > > > starts his

> > > > > > > > > > > > > northern voyage from here. So he has

digbala in

> > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > I did clarify that when I referred to

Surya as

> > > > > > > > > > > > Karma saakshi, it's

> > > > > > > > > > > > > only to his status as antaraatma and not

as a

> > > > > > > > > > > > deity. Perhaps this

> > > > > > > > > > > > > escaped your attention.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > This is my last post on the subject.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > <%40>

> > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40>,

> > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar

> > > > > > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > You were too young for the results of

the

> > dasha

> > > > > > > > > > > > to manifest,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > though it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > is good news that your father had

promotions

> > and

> > > > > > > > > > > > you received

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > prizes/accolades during that time. It is

> > > > > > > > > > > > interesting to know you

> > > > > > > > > > > > > got

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > these results at a young age of 9 or so

as

> > that

> > > > > > > > > > > > is when Sun dasha

> > > > > > > > > > > > > was

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > operative. I am relieved you did not

have any

> > > > > > > > > > > > health problems in

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > March-August 1970 period.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > But we are talking about Rahu and Rahu

would

> > > > > > > > > > > > give results of Sun

> > > > > > > > > > > > > more

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > prominently, by conjunction, as you

guessed

> > but

> > > > > > > > > > > > also that of

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Mercury

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > (You have a Dharmakarmaadhipati yoga

after

> > all)

> > > > > > > > > > > > and that is why I

> > > > > > > > > > > > > said

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > for understanding Sun its dasha instead

of

> > Rahu

> > > > > > > > > > > > dasha needs to be

> > > > > > > > > > > > > analyzed.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mercury is malefic not because I say so

but

> > > > > > > > > > > > because Jyotish says

> > > > > > > > > > > > > that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > mercury is malefic when conjunct a papa

graha

> > > > > > > > > > > > and he is conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > > > two,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun and Rahu.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the apex of Artha trikona

and

> > > > > > > > > > > > directly involved with

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > efforts to earn money. Though claimed

to be

> > > > > > > > > > > > smashana/burial

> > > > > > > > > > > > > ground, it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > is 4th from ayush sthana (8th) and its

home

> > that

> > > > > > > > > > > > is why affliction

> > > > > > > > > > > > > to it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > can give death. But 8th is more

popularly

> > called

> > > > > > > > > > > > mrityu sthana and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > hence

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th is called Smashana. If it is really

> > > > > > > > > > > > smashana why would it be

> > > > > > > > > > > > > called

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > karma sthana and why would Sun be at

its most

> > > > > > > > > > > > brilliant there?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > I did not say he can not represent water

> > bodies

> > > > > > > > > > > > in temple, but not

> > > > > > > > > > > > > only

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > those.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My Sun dasa was excellent too. My

father

> > > > > > > > > > > > received promotion(s),

> > > > > > > > > > > > > my

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > school/college days were great and i

> > received

> > > > > > > > > > > > wide acclaim/prizes

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > for my ability in creative writing,

Veena,

> > > > > > > > > > > > quiz contests etc,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > apart

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > from studies. So, for a student, I

guess

> > > > > > > > > > > > that's excellent!!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > How do you justify this, if Sun were

weak?

> > > > > > > > > > > > Rahu is certainly

> > > > > > > > > > > > > giving

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > the yogakaraka results, but being in

Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > > > house and being

> > > > > > > > > > > > > conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun, don't you think Rahu is also

giving

> > the

> > > > > > > > > > > > results of Sun? You

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > said that mercury is malefic and

heavily

> > > > > > > > > > > > combust too:--))

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1th house also represent burial

> > > > > > > > > > > > ground/smashaana. Is that a place

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > for attachment?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandra represents all water bodies,

so why

> > > > > > > > > > > > can't he represent

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > temple tank?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > === message truncated ===

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

 

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Tired of spam? Mail has the best spam

> > protection

> > > > > > > around

> > > > > > > > > > > <>

> > < <>>

> > > > < <>

> > < <>>>

> > > > > > > < <>

> > < <>>

> > > > < <>

> > < <>>>>

> > > > > > > > > < <>

> > < <>>

> > > > < <>

> > < <>>>

> > > > > > > < <>

> > < <>>

> > > > < <>

> > < <>>>>>

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > -------------

-----

> > ----

> > > > --

> > > > > -

> > > > > > > > > -------

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database:

268.11.7/435 -

> > > > Release

> > > > > > > Date:

> > > > > > > > > 8/31/2006

> > > > > > > > > > >

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> > > > > > > > > >

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Release

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[Guest guest]

Dear Chandrashekhar Ji namste

 

>Most of the

> speeches that you quote, if read with due detachment and ignoring

the

> personalities making them, would sound most egoist speeches to all

and

> sundry. I know saying this would raise

> tempers on the list but truth must prevail.

 

 

Exactly. Truth must prevail. Why a passionate speech by a vedic king

should be treated as expression of Ego? If this is ego then every

thing by a king towards his subjects will be ego.

Ofcourse, I am nobody to object your views about that but it would be

interesting to find out what excatly you considered as egoist in

those speeches.

 

 

> But one can go on arguing on this aspect to no end and bringing in

the

> ideal king as an example of King and conjecturing the Parashara

meant

> that King, while good for argument's sake may not be the right way

to

> look at astrological principles.

 

 

I wanted to say that in a Vedic context, King means who takes pride

in the welfare of the subjects and will not have absolute power like

in western philosophy. Such vedic king may be ideal or may not be

ideal but what vedic scriptures say must be kept in mind. If we

believe that Parashara is vedic Jyotish Pravartak then there is no

question about what he had in mind when he said about Surya being

King. Terms which are Vedic should be treated on the Vedic context.

It does not matter as to how many kings were cruel towards subjects

in Vedic times what matters is that how scriptures describe the

king.What are his duties and what should be his authority and how he

should excercise it? That is why it essential to get in to what Vedas

and Manu says about king's duties. If you feel that I am

unnecessarily getting this point, I respectfully request you to

please think on this.

 

> Do you think Mada does not mean intoxication or state of

intoxication in

> Sanskrit?

 

Mada does mean Intoxication but point is that it as well means Pride!

Why to forget this? If Kalyan Verma says that Rahu is associated with

Mada then all meanings of Mada will be associated with Rahu. That

will include being intoxicated and as well being into state of Pride.

Since rahu as well is understood as 'limitless' so naturally pride

will be limitless and hence will be Ego.

 

 

There is no doubt that Rahu gives the results like Shani or the lord

of the house occupied by him but this possibly we apply more, when we

are into timing of events. Otherwise why Parashara has said few

things only related to Rahu? Like he says that 5th house Rahu when

aspected by Mars or in the houses of Mars then the native will have

problems in the progeny. He could have simply said in one line that

Rahu should be Always treated as lord of the house occupied by him or

like Shani and that would have ended the references of Rahu. But

parashara clearly gives the independent references of Rahu.

 

 

Thanks a lot for your Time and Sapce.

 

Prabodh Vekhande

Jai Jai Shankar

Har Har Shankar

 

 

 

 

, Chandrashekhar

<chandrashekhar46 wrote:

>

> Dear Prabodh,

>

> You are not wrong when you say that "So in a Vedic Jyotish way the

Sun

> in strength will have PRIDE in being ideal king' for his subjects

(other

> Grahas)." But if the King is doing what is only his duty as per the

> Vedic Dharma, then pride in such context will be Ego. Most of the

> speeches that you quote, if read with due detachment and ignoring

the

> personalities making them, would sound most egoist speeches to all

and

> sundry. I know saying this would raise

> tempers on the list but truth must prevail.

>

> But one can go on arguing on this aspect to no end and bringing in

the

> ideal king as an example of King and conjecturing the Parashara

meant

> that King, while good for argument's sake may not be the right way

to

> look at astrological principles. The first pitfall would be that

though

> it is fashionable these days to say that all Kings of Vedic times

acted

> as they should the fact remains that Puranas and Vedas are replete

with

> stories of Kings who were very cruel t their subjects and harassed

those

> performing vedic Rituals. When this is pointed out tempers flare

which

> is a sure beginning of a rational discussion on the principles of

> astrology going awry.

>

> That is why it is better to steer clear of the scriptures when

> discussing astrology, specially on a public list, as the scriptures

are

> subject to different interpretations.

>

> Do you think Mada does not mean intoxication or state of

intoxication in

> Sanskrit? I am sure that Unmaada is one of the five arrows of

Madana.

> And that is Mada represented by Rahu. That is what flows through

the

> temporal glands of a bull elephant and then the bull elephant

becomes

> uncontrollable like being intoxicated.

>

> Again if you happen to refer to kosha you will find synonyms for

the

> five types of pride to be Garva, Abhimaana, Ahankara, Maana etc.

While

> in English language Pride has certain connotation, to find exact

> synonyms to Sanskrit words is always difficult.

>

> Letting apart these discussions which will more often mislead than

solve

> anything, let us at least agree that the sage does say that Rahu

and

> Ketu behave as the lords of the house occupied by them or the lord

of a

> house that they conjoin.

>

> If we are agreed on this then think why should Rahu, or Ketu for

that

> matter, who can not deliver own results but has to depend on other

> planets to express itself would, by itself and devoid of other

graha

> combination; be endowed with the quality of Ego by the writer. More

so

> why when Rahu when alone is said to give results of Shani (Manda

Sama

> Rahu..) as Shani is certainly not connected with ego by any stretch

of

> imagination.

>

> Take care,

> Chandrashekhar.

>

>

> Prabodh Vekhande wrote:

> >

> >

> > Dear Chandrashekhar ji Namste

> >

> > It was indeed a great plesure to read your mails regarding

> > interpretations of the astrological text and more specially how

> > Sanskrit language words can mislead at times. Now I have some

doubts.

> >

> > I think Pride means Self-respect and Ego means Inflated or False

> > Pride. Parashara has attributed the Sun to being Raja or King. In

the

> > vedic philosophy we see that Raja was suppose to take care of the

> > welfare of his subjects. In the Chandogya Upanishad the king

> > Ashvapati describes his kingdom and his subjects as: "In my

kingdom

> > there is no thief,no coward,nor amiser,no drunked,nor is there one

> > who has not taken the vow of worship of the'Fire', no idots, nor

men

> > of loose character.Where could therefore be here women without

> > morals?"(Chandogya 5-11). We as well see similar references in

> > Ramayana regarding RamaRajya. Rama says: I will forsake

everything,

> > affection,compassion,happiness,even my beloved wife Janaki, for

the

> > sake of the welfare of my subjects. I will not mind any

affliction in

> > abondoning my wife for the good of my subjects". We find many such

> > references in RigVeda and Atherva veda as well. The great epic of

> > VedaVyasa as well gives similar attributes to King.Such was the

> > concept of the ideal of the institution of kingship, which every

> > Vedic king took PRIDE in realising.

> >

> > In the pasasge of Time there came the western counterpart for

Vedic

> > Kings. In the west the mediaeval thinkers invested divine

inheritance

> > on the king who was considered to be the representative of God.

The

> > king having received his authority to rule by divine right was not

> > answerable to the people and therefore was an absolute in his own

> > right.The people had no right to rebel against the king or demand

his

> > dethronement. The predominant thought behind that concept was to

> > bestow sovereign and absolute powers on the king. This naturally

made

> > Kings to have 'inflated pride' or EGO. This western mediaeval

concept

> > of king had great influence in Mediaeval indian kings as well.

> >

> > In Bharat, however, political thinkers never advocated or offered

any

> > abolute power and authority to the king. Kingship was always

regared

> > as subservient to the will and dependent upon the sanction of the

> > people and was alwyas answerable to them. So there was no concept

> > of 'Inflated or False Pride' in the Vedic King. The king being

fully

> > aware that all his authority and power were derived from his

> > subjects would try to look to their welfare.

> >

> > So in a Vedic Jyotish way the Sun in strength will have PRIDE in

> > being ideal 'king' for his subjects(other Grahas). Same, if seen

in

> > Western way can mean the Sun will have EGO.

> >

> > Moreover, we see that Western(foreign) cocept of Absolute power

with

> > the King is exactly opposite that of Vedic concept of King. So in

a

> > vedic way of thinking what is wrong in attributting Rahu to

foreign

> > concept of inflated & false Pride or EGO.?

> >

> > Finally, Mada does mean Pride in sanskrit. When attributed to

Rahu,

> > will naturally have the element of falsehood/deceit associated

with

> > pride and hence may lead to EGO. Am I wrong?

> >

> > Thanks a lot for your Time and Sapce.

> >

> > Prabodh Vekhande

> > Jai Jai Shankar

> > Har Har Shankar

> >

> >

> > <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > >

> > > Pride is different from ego. Like it or not Mada does mean

> > intoxication

> > > or lust. The Kama that is referred to relates to kaamana which

> > means

> > > desires for things possessed by others. That is what Asteya,

one of

> > the

> > > Yamas of Hatha yogas refer to.

> > >

> > > We are talking about auspiciousness or other wise of the

dormant or

> > > awakened Kundalini. As I said all scriptures can be

misinterpreted

> > if

> > > one wants to do that. But that does not serve any purpose. I

would

> > not

> > > go into what exactly is meant by Vidya and Avidya related to

Maa. I

> > have

> > > not yet seen any Pramana, in the form of a shloka, to support

your

> > > proposition that dormant Kundalini is inauspicious and the

awakened

> > > Kundalini is auspicious so far. I have already posted the way

my

> > > generation has been taught to accept an argument, so I shall

not

> > repeat

> > > it here.

> > >

> > > But I will not resort to conjectures and would like to quote

from

> > > Rudrayamala tantra about the swarUpa of dormant Kundalini.

Being

> > > graduate in sanskrit, I am sure I will not have to translate

it for

> > you.

> > > Aaxare prdevta Éìjntax> k…{flI devta

> > > ädhäre paradevatä bhavrajanatädhaù kuëòalé devatä

> > > devanamixdevta iÇjgtamanNdpuÃiSwta,

> > > devänämadhidevatä trijagatämänandapuïjasthitä|

> > > mUlaxarinvaisnI iÇrm[i ya }ainnI mailnI

> > > mülädhäraniväsiné triramaëé yä jïäniné mäliné

> > > sa me mat&mnuiSwta k…lpwanNdEkbIjanna.32,21.

> > > sä me mätåmanusthitä kulapathänandaikabéjänanä||32|21||

> > >

> > > I am sure you must have some quote to support your contention.

I

> > would

> > > like to see the shloka, as against conjectures, so that I can

> > improve

> > > upon my knowledge of the swarupaa of Kundalini.

> > >

> > > I can understand your reluctance to support your propositions

with

> > > suitable pramanas. I am sorry if I have hurt you by pointing

out

> > the

> > > inconsistency in the way you treated Surya and Rahu

combinations in

> > two

> > > different chart as stand out combinations only.

> > >

> > > I had no intention to cause any hurt to you and if I have done

so

> > > inadvertently I crave your pardon.

> > >

> > > Take care,

> > >

> > > Chandrashekhar

> > >

> > >

> > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > >

> > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > >

> > > > The shadripus are kaama (lust), krodha (anger), lobha

(greed),

> > moha

> > > > (attachment, delusion), mada (pride) and maatsarya (jealousy)

> > > > If "mada" means "lust" what does "kaama" imply among the

> > > > shadripus? "Mada" signifies one who is intoxicated/drunk with

> > > > power/self-grandeur (pride/ego).

> > > >

> > > > Mother is known as "Vidya and avidya swaroopini" and correct

> > > > appreciation of Mother includes understanding of both

facets. As

> > > > Shakti, She respresents raw power which can be routed

towards good

> > > > deeds as well as bad deeds. Are both ends the same? The

wisdom,

> > > > required to put this immense shakti to good use, is

represented by

> > > > Shiva, hence the union of Shiva and Parvati, wisdom and

power, is

> > > > said to be auspicious because it ensures the

correct/judicious end

> > > > use of shakti. Hence the orientation of Shakti is very very

> > > > important.

> > > >

> > > > I always said that Soorya is both sattwik and krura. I also

always

> > > > said all planets, including Jupiter, can give malefic

results, if

> > > > they are functionally empowered to do so. You can refer to

all my

> > > > previous mails to confirm this.

> > > >

> > > > Sir, Truth is much more important than winning or losing an

> > > > argument. All discussions must proceed as an exploration and

> > > > celebration of Truth. When this is not the case, I see no

purpose

> > in

> > > > continuing these discussions.

> > > >

> > > > Thanks & Regards,

> > > > Lakshmi

> > > >

> > > >

> > <%40>

> > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > >

> > > > > Having Icchamrityu and dying at an early age are operating

at

> > > > different

> > > > > levels. Bhishma had Iccha Mrityu but did not die young. So

> > please

> > > > do not

> > > > > try to mix the issues. If you have read Swamiji's

biography you

> > > > will

> > > > > find that he fell sick many times despite of apparent

robust

> > > > physique.

> > > > >

> > > > > Commenting on Shani in 4th for Rama's chart confirms with

his

> > > > being

> > > > > capable of giving Vipareeta results. I did not know I was

> > expected

> > > > to

> > > > > analyze the entire chart. By the way if there is a Kuja

dosha

> > how

> > > > does

> > > > > that by itself give a Divine wife? Please do not bring our

> > > > devotion to

> > > > > Lord Rama (and we both have that) into astrological

analysis of

> > > > his chart.

> > > > >

> > > > > Bringing in the dashas when the discussions are on the

effects

> > of

> > > > grahas

> > > > > will only lead the discussion to no where. The two have to

be

> > seen

> > > > > separately as we are not trying to time an event but only

trying

> > > > to find

> > > > > what are the effects on bhavas occupied.

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear Lakshmi in Ramana Maharshi's chart you have perhaps

> > forgotten

> > > > the

> > > > > saying Kuja vat Ketu. look at the Ketu deha in that

perspective

> > > > and let

> > > > > me know your views. And if by the way you read my mail, I

did

> > not

> > > > say

> > > > > anything about mars being killer for him, only that it

gave him

> > > > Sarcoma

> > > > > being 3rd lord.

> > > > >

> > > > > Also could you explain why Sun being Atma and always

beneficent

> > as

> > > > you

> > > > > have claimed all along in the thread on the topic, did its

> > > > Mahadasha

> > > > > prove to be Killer to Ramana Maharshi?

> > > > >

> > > > > Take care,

> > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > > For example, remember that in Swami Vivekananda's chart

> > Surya

> > > > is

> > > > > > lord of

> > > > > > > the 9th occupying the lagna and causing a powerful Raj

> > yoga. At

> > > > > > the same

> > > > > > > time if you thin how long the Swamiji lived, you may

have to

> > > > think

> > > > > > again

> > > > > > > about saying that it did not act as Mahakrura. Think

about

> > > > what it

> > > > > > did

> > > > > > > to the 7th bhava of Swamiji, also, before declaring

that it

> > > > became

> > > > > > > shubha or less malefic.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Lakshmi: I think Swamiji had an icchamrityu and looking

at the

> > > > dass

> > > > > > operating on 4th July 1902, I observe that he passed

away in

> > Jup-

> > > > Ven-

> > > > > > Jup-Ket-Sat-Sat.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Jup MD: 1893-02-09 (1:35:30 pm) - 1909-02-10 (3:59:13 pm)

> > > > > > Ven AD: 1900-12-25 (10:03:30 am) - 1903-08-27 (4:48:54

pm)

> > > > > > Jup PD: 1902-05-02 (1:42:07 pm) - 1902-09-12 (10:43:55

pm)

> > > > > > Ket SD: 1902-06-29 (9:11:48 am) - 1902-07-07 (5:06:28 am)

> > > > > > Sat PAD: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-06 (2:29:24

am)

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Sat: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-05 (1:27:03 am)

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Jupiter is in 2nd house from Moon, Venus is the 2nd lord

from

> > > > Moon

> > > > > > and is posited in 2nd from lagna, Ketu is in the house of

> > Venus

> > > > and

> > > > > > gives the results of Venus and Saturn is the 2nd lord

from

> > > > > > lagna....all are marakas. the maraka significations are

> > stronger

> > > > > > from Moon, and it's the cause of his early death.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I fail to see where Sun comes into all this.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > However, I agree that Sun, as AK aspecting 7th house,

can give

> > > > > > parivraja tendencies. But can you ignore the influence of

> > Saturn

> > > > on

> > > > > > Moon and 4th house, occuring in the 10th house? I am

sure even

> > > > weak

> > > > > > Sun would have given him parivraja yoga:--))but without

the

> > raja

> > > > > > yoga and the strong soul-level impact he created

wherever he

> > > > went.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Or if you like look at what happened to the 7th

> > > > > > > Bhava of Lord Rama with exalted Mars in the 7th bhava.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Mars in 7th gives kuja dosha, and I think the strong

Mars in

> > 7th

> > > > > > gave him an exalted wife like Sita. You have not

commented on

> > the

> > > > > > exalted Saturn in 4th house.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > In each of the

> > > > > > > example provided by you look at the bhava that the

planets

> > > > occupy

> > > > > > > (barring Saturn, for reasons already stated in previous

> > mail),

> > > > > > without

> > > > > > > looking at the charts as belonging to great people,

and then

> > > > make

> > > > > > up

> > > > > > > your mind as to the truth or otherwise of what I said.

Did

> > you

> > > > > > know

> > > > > > > Ramana Maharshi died following a malignant sarcoma of

left

> > hand

> > > > > > and Mars

> > > > > > > is karaka for the 3rd bhava in 8th in his chart, in

> > > > exaltation. Do

> > > > > > you

> > > > > > > think Mars gave him benevolent results?

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I also request you to examine the

following dasa

> > > > > > sequences with an open mind. Sun is the 3rd lord from

Moon

> > (AK) &

> > > > > > 12th lord from lagna in Sri Ramana's chart, rahu is with

Sun

> > and

> > > > > > gives Sun'/Saturn's/Jupiter's effects...all of which

point to

> > > > > > dusthanas, Saturn is a maraka in 7th house and ketu can

give

> > the

> > > > > > effects of Moon/Mercury/mars. Mar's effect, if at all,

was

> > only

> > > > > > indirect, and he was not the killer.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Sun MD: 1949-02-03 (1:02:22 am) - 1955-02-03 (2:05:32 pm)

> > > > > > Rah AD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1951-02-21 (8:49:14 am)

> > > > > > Rah PD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1950-05-18 (12:04:47

am)

> > > > > > Sat SD: 1950-04-12 (3:37:16 am) - 1950-04-20 (12:18:02

am)

> > > > > > Ket PAD: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14 (11:08:26

pm)

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Ket: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14 (12:47:04 pm)

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I think what stands out is the fact that the dasa of the

graha

> > > > > > conjoined Moon brought about death. I think their mind

willed

> > the

> > > > > > death.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Can a planet give results in a dasa totally

> > > > unrelated/unassociated

> > > > > > with itself? I request you to consider the above

objectively.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I will talk about the other charts/issues in my next

mail.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > >

> > > > > > In Paramhans Ramkrishna's chart,

> > > > > > > I do not know where you find Mars strong as a planet in

> > > > > > debilitation in

> > > > > > > Navamsha gives results of debility even when in

exaltation

> > in

> > > > rasi

> > > > > > > chart. In case of Saturn Viparitam shane smritam has

already

> > > > been

> > > > > > > mentioned by me, in earlier mail.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I myself have not considered Mars/Venus in

> > Thakur's

> > > > > > chart because they are debilitated. Please go through my

> > message

> > > > > > again. I was talking about Saturn and Rahu.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > About Shri Aurobindo, I trust you are

> > > > > > > aware of his revolutionary background and that he was

editor

> > > > of a

> > > > > > paper

> > > > > > > "Vande Mataram" not much known for its soft language.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > > Same is the case with strong Malefics giving P.M.

Yogas.

> > Every

> > > > > > graha is

> > > > > > > capable of 12 variations of a P.M. Yoga attributed to

it, at

> > > > the

> > > > > > very

> > > > > > > least. It would only be naive to imagine they would

all give

> > > > > > identical

> > > > > > > results as indicated by Parashara or all with Pancha

> > > > Mahapurusha

> > > > > > Yoga

> > > > > > > would only rule over different parts of India (barring

> > Saturn),

> > > > > > just

> > > > > > > because the sage said so. The sages gave us principles

and

> > > > > > expected us

> > > > > > > to apply them to real life horoscope using Viveka.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I would gladly give you the shloka giving the

reference to

> > > > > > > "Viparita---Shane..." it is from an old classic

respected

> > > > amongst

> > > > > > > astrologers, but as you do not seem to accept anything

that

> > > > does

> > > > > > not fit

> > > > > > > in with what, you think. is said by Dr. Raman, it

would be

> > an

> > > > > > exercise

> > > > > > > in futility. should you yet want the shloka I would of

> > course

> > > > be

> > > > > > glad to

> > > > > > > give it to you.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Om Gurave namah

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > You seem to be disagreeing with Shri B.V. Raman that

> > strong

> > > > > > planets,

> > > > > > > > whether malefic or benefics give good results, while

weak

> > > > planets

> > > > > > > > give bad results. Perhaps you also disagree about

strong

> > > > malefics

> > > > > > > > giving mahapurusha yogas. Isn't it contrary to what

all

> > the

> > > > > > jyotish

> > > > > > > > texts teach?

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Then, here are a few examples, where I find that

strong

> > > > malefics

> > > > > > > > have neither made the natives krura nor that their

> > > > significations

> > > > > > > > suffered.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Swami Vivekananda: strong sun in lagna and mars in

5th

> > house

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Sri Aurobindo: Strong Sun in 2nd house.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Maharshi Mahesh yogi: exalted Mars in lagna.

> > > > > > > > Ramana Maharshi: strong Mars in 8th house

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Sri Ramakrishna Paramahamsa: Exalted Saturn(9H) and

Rahu

> > > > (4H).

> > > > > > Mars

> > > > > > > > and Venus are also exalted in rasi, while

debilitated in

> > > > navamsa.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Sir, can you give me the reference for "vipareetam

shaneH

> > > > > > sritam"?

> > > > > > > > Does it, by any chance, refer to Saturn's placement

in the

> > > > 8th

> > > > > > house

> > > > > > > > being beneficial?

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > I am happy that you agree strong Saturn gives good

> > results.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Can you tell me from where the saying is because i

would

> > > > like to

> > > > > > > > read it up myself and understand.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > --- Chandrashekhar <chandrashekhar46@

> > > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk>>

> > > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > About Krura planets the saying is, that with

> > > > > > > > > > > strength the Krura grahas

> > > > > > > > > > > become more Krura (Maha-krura) and the shubha

grahas

> > > > > > > > > > > become more shubha.

> > > > > > > > > > > Only Shani is more krura when weak and

beneficial or

> > > > > > > > > > > less krura when

> > > > > > > > > > > strong "Viparitama shaneH smritam".

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > My sun dasa started when I was 9 years old,

and

> > > > > > > > > > > ended when I was 15

> > > > > > > > > > > > years old. How come you didn't notice the

second

> > > > > > > > > > > part? I was old

> > > > > > > > > > > > enough to understand the difference between

> > > > > > > > > > > success and failure, I

> > > > > > > > > > > > guess!

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Anyway, if you agree that Rahu is giving

Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > > results, and those

> > > > > > > > > > > > results are exceptionally good, then it

> > > > > > > > > > > automatically follows that

> > > > > > > > > > > > Sun is strong in my chart because according

to

> > > > > > > > > > > Shri B.V Raman, evil

> > > > > > > > > > > > planets, especially when weak, give bad

results

> > > > > > > > > > > (vide "a catechism

> > > > > > > > > > > > of astrology"), while strong planets, even if

> > > > > > > > > > > evil, give good

> > > > > > > > > > > > results. If my Sun were weak, he wouldn't be

> > > > > > > > > > > giving such good

> > > > > > > > > > > > results:--))

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Since Mercury is hopelessly combust and

inferior

> > > > > > > > > > > in shadbala

> > > > > > > > > > > > strength, the major results of Dharma

> > > > > > > > > > > karmadhipathi yoga are also

> > > > > > > > > > > > given by Sun, because according to "300

> > > > > > > > > > > combinations" of Sri

> > > > > > > > > > > > Raman, a planet with higher shadbala is more

> > > > > > > > > > > likely to give the

> > > > > > > > > > > > results of a yoga.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Regarding Karna, I request you to read the

Karna

> > > > > > > > > > > Parva of

> > > > > > > > > > > > Mahabharata again. When he died, the nature

bowed

> > > > > > > > > > > in grief, because

> > > > > > > > > > > > he's one of the noblest persons in

Mahabharata.

> > > > > > > > > > > Even the episode you

> > > > > > > > > > > > quoted happened because Parashurama would

teach

> > > > > > > > > > > only Brahmins and

> > > > > > > > > > > > Karna desperately wanted to learn

dhanurvidya from

> > > > > > > > > > > Parashurama so

> > > > > > > > > > > > that he can support Duryodhana. Deceit is

> > > > > > > > > > > certainly punishable and

> > > > > > > > > > > > Karna did pay dearly. But it's to be borne

in mind

> > > > > > > > > > > that whatever

> > > > > > > > > > > > Karna did was only to please Duryodhana, his

> > > > > > > > > > > dearest friend. Karna

> > > > > > > > > > > > did not gain anything personally.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the 3rd house from 8th house (I

> > > > > > > > > > > think there was a typo

> > > > > > > > > > > > at your end). In the natural zodiac, the 10

th

> > > > > > > > > > > sign, being the

> > > > > > > > > > > > cardinal earth sign, represents

south /dakshina

> > > > > > > > > > > disha. South is the

> > > > > > > > > > > > direction ruled by Yama, the lord of death,

hence

> > > > > > > > > > > 10th house

> > > > > > > > > > > > represents burial grounds. So, the Rudras

(Saturn,

> > > > > > > > > > > Sun and Mars) are

> > > > > > > > > > > > strong in south. Also, Sun resides in south

and

> > > > > > > > > > > starts his

> > > > > > > > > > > > northern voyage from here. So he has digbala

in

> > > > > > > > > > > 10th house.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > I did clarify that when I referred to Surya

as

> > > > > > > > > > > Karma saakshi, it's

> > > > > > > > > > > > only to his status as antaraatma and not as a

> > > > > > > > > > > deity. Perhaps this

> > > > > > > > > > > > escaped your attention.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > This is my last post on the subject.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > <%40>

> > > > <%40>

> > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > > > <%40>,

> > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar

> > > > > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > You were too young for the results of the

dasha

> > > > > > > > > > > to manifest,

> > > > > > > > > > > > though it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > is good news that your father had

promotions and

> > > > > > > > > > > you received

> > > > > > > > > > > > > prizes/accolades during that time. It is

> > > > > > > > > > > interesting to know you

> > > > > > > > > > > > got

> > > > > > > > > > > > > these results at a young age of 9 or so as

that

> > > > > > > > > > > is when Sun dasha

> > > > > > > > > > > > was

> > > > > > > > > > > > > operative. I am relieved you did not have

any

> > > > > > > > > > > health problems in

> > > > > > > > > > > > > March-August 1970 period.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > But we are talking about Rahu and Rahu

would

> > > > > > > > > > > give results of Sun

> > > > > > > > > > > > more

> > > > > > > > > > > > > prominently, by conjunction, as you

guessed but

> > > > > > > > > > > also that of

> > > > > > > > > > > > Mercury

> > > > > > > > > > > > > (You have a Dharmakarmaadhipati yoga after

all)

> > > > > > > > > > > and that is why I

> > > > > > > > > > > > said

> > > > > > > > > > > > > for understanding Sun its dasha instead of

Rahu

> > > > > > > > > > > dasha needs to be

> > > > > > > > > > > > analyzed.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Mercury is malefic not because I say so but

> > > > > > > > > > > because Jyotish says

> > > > > > > > > > > > that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > mercury is malefic when conjunct a papa

graha

> > > > > > > > > > > and he is conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > > two,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun and Rahu.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the apex of Artha trikona and

> > > > > > > > > > > directly involved with

> > > > > > > > > > > > > efforts to earn money. Though claimed to be

> > > > > > > > > > > smashana/burial

> > > > > > > > > > > > ground, it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > is 4th from ayush sthana (8th) and its

home that

> > > > > > > > > > > is why affliction

> > > > > > > > > > > > to it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > can give death. But 8th is more popularly

called

> > > > > > > > > > > mrityu sthana and

> > > > > > > > > > > > hence

> > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th is called Smashana. If it is really

> > > > > > > > > > > smashana why would it be

> > > > > > > > > > > > called

> > > > > > > > > > > > > karma sthana and why would Sun be at its

most

> > > > > > > > > > > brilliant there?

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > I did not say he can not represent water

bodies

> > > > > > > > > > > in temple, but not

> > > > > > > > > > > > only

> > > > > > > > > > > > > those.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > My Sun dasa was excellent too. My father

> > > > > > > > > > > received promotion(s),

> > > > > > > > > > > > my

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > school/college days were great and i

received

> > > > > > > > > > > wide acclaim/prizes

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > for my ability in creative writing,

Veena,

> > > > > > > > > > > quiz contests etc,

> > > > > > > > > > > > apart

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > from studies. So, for a student, I guess

> > > > > > > > > > > that's excellent!!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > How do you justify this, if Sun were

weak?

> > > > > > > > > > > Rahu is certainly

> > > > > > > > > > > > giving

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > the yogakaraka results, but being in

Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > > house and being

> > > > > > > > > > > > conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun, don't you think Rahu is also giving

the

> > > > > > > > > > > results of Sun? You

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > said that mercury is malefic and heavily

> > > > > > > > > > > combust too:--))

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1th house also represent burial

> > > > > > > > > > > ground/smashaana. Is that a place

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > for attachment?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandra represents all water bodies, so

why

> > > > > > > > > > > can't he represent

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > temple tank?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > === message truncated ===

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

 

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Tired of spam? Mail has the best spam

> > protection

> > > > > > around

> > > > > > > > > > <>

> > < <>>

> > > > < <>

> > < <>>>

> > > > > > < <>

> > < <>>

> > > > < <>

> > < <>>>>

> > > > > > > > < <>

> > < <>>

> > > > < <>

> > < <>>>

> > > > > > < <>

> > < <>>

> > > > < <>

> > < <>>>>>

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > ----------------

-----

> > ---

> > > > -

> > > > > > > > -------

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.11.7/435 -

> > Release

> > > > > > Date:

> > > > > > > > 8/31/2006

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

removed]

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > --------------------

-----

> > > > > > -------

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.12.2/441 -

Release

> > > > Date:

> > > > > > 9/7/2006

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

[Guest guest]

Dear Divine Lakshmi,

 

Have you not heard about unmaada in even 3 year old children? Please

think about this before declaring that it is not possible in 5 years

old. And congenital conditions where impure blood flows t heart causing

comatose conditions that can be equated to intoxication?

 

I do not think I have said that a Bull elephant is in a permanent state

of intoxication. I have only used its example to indicate what is Mada.

 

If the test of what is inner quality is being in that state permanently

then even your definition of ego suffers from not being so in very young

children. Nor is lust in existence from young age. Ask any medical

practitioner and he will tell that I am not wrong. Not that I think the

parameter is right.

 

 

Chandrashekhar.

 

b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

>

> Om Gurave Namah

>

> Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

>

> What i meant by "inner" quality is an "inherent/natural " quality of

> human being. Please refer to my original mail in this respect.

>

> Now, all of us have soul, mind, strength, speech, knowledge,

> happiness, ego (sense of being different from others) and grief.

> Even a 5 year old kid has all these qualities, as appropriate to

> his/her age, unless handicapped. Are we intoxicated? Is the 5 year

> old intoxicated? Is "intoxication" a natural or unnatural quality?

> Is the bull elephant in a permanent state of intoxication?

>

> Regards,

> Lakshmi

>

>

> <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> <chandrashekhar46 wrote:

> >

> > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> >

> > At least AI did not answer as I did not want to split hairs over

> whether

> > all that is mentioned in the referred shloka is inner quality

> since I do

> > not find Kalyan Varman mentioning or implying so. However as you

> want an

> > reply, let me ask as to why if speech, attributed to Budha in the

> > shloka, can be internal quality according to you then why should

> > intoxication not be?

> >

> > Chandrashekhar.

> >

> >

> > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > >

> > >

> > > Om Gurave Namah

> > >

> > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji & Pradeep ji,

> > >

> > > I recollect writing in my previous e-mails, that the shloka from

> > > Saravali talks about the inner qualities of an

> > > individual/kalapurusha. Does the word "mada" imply intoxication

> as

> > > an inner quality? Does the word "intoxication" belong in that

> > > context, in that group?

> > >

> > > I do not think either of you responded to that. perhaps you

> missed

> > > it out in the avalanche of e-mails:--))

> > >

> > > Can i have your response(s) please?

> > >

> > > Regards,

> > > Lakshmi

> > >

> > >

> <%40>

> > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > >

> > > > Pride is different from ego. Like it or not Mada does mean

> > > intoxication

> > > > or lust. The Kama that is referred to relates to kaamana which

> > > means

> > > > desires for things possessed by others. That is what Asteya,

> one

> > > of the

> > > > Yamas of Hatha yogas refer to.

> > > >

> > > > We are talking about auspiciousness or other wise of the

> dormant

> > > or

> > > > awakened Kundalini. As I said all scriptures can be

> misinterpreted

> > > if

> > > > one wants to do that. But that does not serve any purpose. I

> would

> > > not

> > > > go into what exactly is meant by Vidya and Avidya related to

> Maa.

> > > I have

> > > > not yet seen any Pramana, in the form of a shloka, to support

> your

> > > > proposition that dormant Kundalini is inauspicious and the

> > > awakened

> > > > Kundalini is auspicious so far. I have already posted the way

> my

> > > > generation has been taught to accept an argument, so I shall

> not

> > > repeat

> > > > it here.

> > > >

> > > > But I will not resort to conjectures and would like to quote

> from

> > > > Rudrayamala tantra about the swarUpa of dormant Kundalini.

> Being

> > > > graduate in sanskrit, I am sure I will not have to translate

> it

> > > for you.

> > > > Aaxare prdevta Éìjntax> k…{flI devta

> > > > ädhäre paradevatä bhavrajanatädhaù kuëòalé devatä

> > > > devanamixdevta iÇjgtamanNdpuÃiSwta,

> > > > devänämadhidevatä trijagatämänandapuïjasthitä|

> > > > mUlaxarinvaisnI iÇrm[i ya }ainnI mailnI

> > > > mülädhäraniväsiné triramaëé yä jïäniné mäliné

> > > > sa me mat&mnuiSwta k…lpwanNdEkbIjanna.32,21.

> > > > sä me mätåmanusthitä kulapathänandaikabéjänanä||32|21||

> > > >

> > > > I am sure you must have some quote to support your

> contention. I

> > > would

> > > > like to see the shloka, as against conjectures, so that I can

> > > improve

> > > > upon my knowledge of the swarupaa of Kundalini.

> > > >

> > > > I can understand your reluctance to support your propositions

> with

> > > > suitable pramanas. I am sorry if I have hurt you by pointing

> out

> > > the

> > > > inconsistency in the way you treated Surya and Rahu

> combinations

> > > in two

> > > > different chart as stand out combinations only.

> > > >

> > > > I had no intention to cause any hurt to you and if I have

> done so

> > > > inadvertently I crave your pardon.

> > > >

> > > > Take care,

> > > >

> > > > Chandrashekhar

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > >

> > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > >

> > > > > The shadripus are kaama (lust), krodha (anger), lobha

> (greed),

> > > moha

> > > > > (attachment, delusion), mada (pride) and maatsarya

> (jealousy)

> > > > > If "mada" means "lust" what does "kaama" imply among the

> > > > > shadripus? "Mada" signifies one who is intoxicated/drunk

> with

> > > > > power/self-grandeur (pride/ego).

> > > > >

> > > > > Mother is known as "Vidya and avidya swaroopini" and correct

> > > > > appreciation of Mother includes understanding of both

> facets. As

> > > > > Shakti, She respresents raw power which can be routed

> towards

> > > good

> > > > > deeds as well as bad deeds. Are both ends the same? The

> wisdom,

> > > > > required to put this immense shakti to good use, is

> represented

> > > by

> > > > > Shiva, hence the union of Shiva and Parvati, wisdom and

> power, is

> > > > > said to be auspicious because it ensures the

> correct/judicious

> > > end

> > > > > use of shakti. Hence the orientation of Shakti is very very

> > > > > important.

> > > > >

> > > > > I always said that Soorya is both sattwik and krura. I also

> > > always

> > > > > said all planets, including Jupiter, can give malefic

> results, if

> > > > > they are functionally empowered to do so. You can refer to

> all my

> > > > > previous mails to confirm this.

> > > > >

> > > > > Sir, Truth is much more important than winning or losing an

> > > > > argument. All discussions must proceed as an exploration and

> > > > > celebration of Truth. When this is not the case, I see no

> > > purpose in

> > > > > continuing these discussions.

> > > > >

> > > > > Thanks & Regards,

> > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > >

> > > > >

> <%40>

> > > <%40>

> > > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Having Icchamrityu and dying at an early age are

> operating at

> > > > > different

> > > > > > levels. Bhishma had Iccha Mrityu but did not die young. So

> > > please

> > > > > do not

> > > > > > try to mix the issues. If you have read Swamiji's

> biography you

> > > > > will

> > > > > > find that he fell sick many times despite of apparent

> robust

> > > > > physique.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Commenting on Shani in 4th for Rama's chart confirms with

> his

> > > > > being

> > > > > > capable of giving Vipareeta results. I did not know I was

> > > expected

> > > > > to

> > > > > > analyze the entire chart. By the way if there is a Kuja

> dosha

> > > how

> > > > > does

> > > > > > that by itself give a Divine wife? Please do not bring our

> > > > > devotion to

> > > > > > Lord Rama (and we both have that) into astrological

> analysis of

> > > > > his chart.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Bringing in the dashas when the discussions are on the

> effects

> > > of

> > > > > grahas

> > > > > > will only lead the discussion to no where. The two have

> to be

> > > seen

> > > > > > separately as we are not trying to time an event but only

> > > trying

> > > > > to find

> > > > > > what are the effects on bhavas occupied.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Dear Lakshmi in Ramana Maharshi's chart you have perhaps

> > > forgotten

> > > > > the

> > > > > > saying Kuja vat Ketu. look at the Ketu deha in that

> perspective

> > > > > and let

> > > > > > me know your views. And if by the way you read my mail, I

> did

> > > not

> > > > > say

> > > > > > anything about mars being killer for him, only that it

> gave him

> > > > > Sarcoma

> > > > > > being 3rd lord.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Also could you explain why Sun being Atma and always

> > > beneficent as

> > > > > you

> > > > > > have claimed all along in the thread on the topic, did its

> > > > > Mahadasha

> > > > > > prove to be Killer to Ramana Maharshi?

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Take care,

> > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > For example, remember that in Swami Vivekananda's

> chart

> > > Surya

> > > > > is

> > > > > > > lord of

> > > > > > > > the 9th occupying the lagna and causing a powerful Raj

> > > yoga. At

> > > > > > > the same

> > > > > > > > time if you thin how long the Swamiji lived, you may

> have

> > > to

> > > > > think

> > > > > > > again

> > > > > > > > about saying that it did not act as Mahakrura. Think

> about

> > > > > what it

> > > > > > > did

> > > > > > > > to the 7th bhava of Swamiji, also, before declaring

> that it

> > > > > became

> > > > > > > > shubha or less malefic.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Lakshmi: I think Swamiji had an icchamrityu and looking

> at

> > > the

> > > > > dass

> > > > > > > operating on 4th July 1902, I observe that he passed

> away in

> > > Jup-

> > > > > Ven-

> > > > > > > Jup-Ket-Sat-Sat.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Jup MD: 1893-02-09 (1:35:30 pm) - 1909-02-10 (3:59:13

> pm)

> > > > > > > Ven AD: 1900-12-25 (10:03:30 am) - 1903-08-27 (4:48:54

> pm)

> > > > > > > Jup PD: 1902-05-02 (1:42:07 pm) - 1902-09-12 (10:43:55

> pm)

> > > > > > > Ket SD: 1902-06-29 (9:11:48 am) - 1902-07-07 (5:06:28

> am)

> > > > > > > Sat PAD: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-06 (2:29:24

> am)

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Sat: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-05 (1:27:03 am)

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Jupiter is in 2nd house from Moon, Venus is the 2nd

> lord from

> > > > > Moon

> > > > > > > and is posited in 2nd from lagna, Ketu is in the house

> of

> > > Venus

> > > > > and

> > > > > > > gives the results of Venus and Saturn is the 2nd lord

> from

> > > > > > > lagna....all are marakas. the maraka significations are

> > > stronger

> > > > > > > from Moon, and it's the cause of his early death.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I fail to see where Sun comes into all this.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > However, I agree that Sun, as AK aspecting 7th house,

> can

> > > give

> > > > > > > parivraja tendencies. But can you ignore the influence

> of

> > > Saturn

> > > > > on

> > > > > > > Moon and 4th house, occuring in the 10th house? I am

> sure

> > > even

> > > > > weak

> > > > > > > Sun would have given him parivraja yoga:--))but without

> the

> > > raja

> > > > > > > yoga and the strong soul-level impact he created

> wherever he

> > > > > went.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Or if you like look at what happened to the 7th

> > > > > > > > Bhava of Lord Rama with exalted Mars in the 7th bhava.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Mars in 7th gives kuja dosha, and I think the strong

> Mars in

> > > 7th

> > > > > > > gave him an exalted wife like Sita. You have not

> commented

> > > on the

> > > > > > > exalted Saturn in 4th house.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > In each of the

> > > > > > > > example provided by you look at the bhava that the

> planets

> > > > > occupy

> > > > > > > > (barring Saturn, for reasons already stated in

> previous

> > > mail),

> > > > > > > without

> > > > > > > > looking at the charts as belonging to great people,

> and

> > > then

> > > > > make

> > > > > > > up

> > > > > > > > your mind as to the truth or otherwise of what I

> said. Did

> > > you

> > > > > > > know

> > > > > > > > Ramana Maharshi died following a malignant sarcoma of

> left

> > > hand

> > > > > > > and Mars

> > > > > > > > is karaka for the 3rd bhava in 8th in his chart, in

> > > > > exaltation. Do

> > > > > > > you

> > > > > > > > think Mars gave him benevolent results?

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I also request you to examine the

> following

> > > dasa

> > > > > > > sequences with an open mind. Sun is the 3rd lord from

> Moon

> > > (AK) &

> > > > > > > 12th lord from lagna in Sri Ramana's chart, rahu is

> with Sun

> > > and

> > > > > > > gives Sun'/Saturn's/Jupiter's effects...all of which

> point to

> > > > > > > dusthanas, Saturn is a maraka in 7th house and ketu can

> give

> > > the

> > > > > > > effects of Moon/Mercury/mars. Mar's effect, if at all,

> was

> > > only

> > > > > > > indirect, and he was not the killer.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Sun MD: 1949-02-03 (1:02:22 am) - 1955-02-03 (2:05:32

> pm)

> > > > > > > Rah AD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1951-02-21 (8:49:14

> am)

> > > > > > > Rah PD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1950-05-18 (12:04:47

> am)

> > > > > > > Sat SD: 1950-04-12 (3:37:16 am) - 1950-04-20 (12:18:02

> am)

> > > > > > > Ket PAD: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14

> (11:08:26 pm)

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Ket: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14 (12:47:04 pm)

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I think what stands out is the fact that the dasa of the

> > > graha

> > > > > > > conjoined Moon brought about death. I think their mind

> > > willed the

> > > > > > > death.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Can a planet give results in a dasa totally

> > > > > unrelated/unassociated

> > > > > > > with itself? I request you to consider the above

> objectively.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I will talk about the other charts/issues in my next

> mail.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > In Paramhans Ramkrishna's chart,

> > > > > > > > I do not know where you find Mars strong as a planet

> in

> > > > > > > debilitation in

> > > > > > > > Navamsha gives results of debility even when in

> exaltation

> > > in

> > > > > rasi

> > > > > > > > chart. In case of Saturn Viparitam shane smritam has

> > > already

> > > > > been

> > > > > > > > mentioned by me, in earlier mail.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I myself have not considered Mars/Venus in

> > > Thakur's

> > > > > > > chart because they are debilitated. Please go through my

> > > message

> > > > > > > again. I was talking about Saturn and Rahu.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > About Shri Aurobindo, I trust you are

> > > > > > > > aware of his revolutionary background and that he was

> > > editor

> > > > > of a

> > > > > > > paper

> > > > > > > > "Vande Mataram" not much known for its soft language.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Same is the case with strong Malefics giving P.M.

> Yogas.

> > > Every

> > > > > > > graha is

> > > > > > > > capable of 12 variations of a P.M. Yoga attributed to

> it,

> > > at

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > very

> > > > > > > > least. It would only be naive to imagine they would

> all

> > > give

> > > > > > > identical

> > > > > > > > results as indicated by Parashara or all with Pancha

> > > > > Mahapurusha

> > > > > > > Yoga

> > > > > > > > would only rule over different parts of India (barring

> > > Saturn),

> > > > > > > just

> > > > > > > > because the sage said so. The sages gave us

> principles and

> > > > > > > expected us

> > > > > > > > to apply them to real life horoscope using Viveka.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > I would gladly give you the shloka giving the

> reference to

> > > > > > > > "Viparita---Shane..." it is from an old classic

> respected

> > > > > amongst

> > > > > > > > astrologers, but as you do not seem to accept

> anything that

> > > > > does

> > > > > > > not fit

> > > > > > > > in with what, you think. is said by Dr. Raman, it

> would be

> > > an

> > > > > > > exercise

> > > > > > > > in futility. should you yet want the shloka I would of

> > > course

> > > > > be

> > > > > > > glad to

> > > > > > > > give it to you.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Om Gurave namah

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > You seem to be disagreeing with Shri B.V. Raman that

> > > strong

> > > > > > > planets,

> > > > > > > > > whether malefic or benefics give good results,

> while weak

> > > > > planets

> > > > > > > > > give bad results. Perhaps you also disagree about

> strong

> > > > > malefics

> > > > > > > > > giving mahapurusha yogas. Isn't it contrary to what

> all

> > > the

> > > > > > > jyotish

> > > > > > > > > texts teach?

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Then, here are a few examples, where I find that

> strong

> > > > > malefics

> > > > > > > > > have neither made the natives krura nor that their

> > > > > significations

> > > > > > > > > suffered.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Swami Vivekananda: strong sun in lagna and mars in

> 5th

> > > house

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Sri Aurobindo: Strong Sun in 2nd house.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Maharshi Mahesh yogi: exalted Mars in lagna.

> > > > > > > > > Ramana Maharshi: strong Mars in 8th house

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Sri Ramakrishna Paramahamsa: Exalted Saturn(9H) and

> Rahu

> > > > > (4H).

> > > > > > > Mars

> > > > > > > > > and Venus are also exalted in rasi, while

> debilitated in

> > > > > navamsa.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Sir, can you give me the reference for "vipareetam

> shaneH

> > > > > > > sritam"?

> > > > > > > > > Does it, by any chance, refer to Saturn's placement

> in

> > > the

> > > > > 8th

> > > > > > > house

> > > > > > > > > being beneficial?

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > I am happy that you agree strong Saturn gives good

> > > results.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Can you tell me from where the saying is because i

> would

> > > > > like to

> > > > > > > > > read it up myself and understand.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > --- Chandrashekhar <chandrashekhar46@

> > > > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk>>

> > > > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > About Krura planets the saying is, that with

> > > > > > > > > > > > strength the Krura grahas

> > > > > > > > > > > > become more Krura (Maha-krura) and the shubha

> > > grahas

> > > > > > > > > > > > become more shubha.

> > > > > > > > > > > > Only Shani is more krura when weak and

> beneficial

> > > or

> > > > > > > > > > > > less krura when

> > > > > > > > > > > > strong "Viparitama shaneH smritam".

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > My sun dasa started when I was 9 years old,

> and

> > > > > > > > > > > > ended when I was 15

> > > > > > > > > > > > > years old. How come you didn't notice the

> second

> > > > > > > > > > > > part? I was old

> > > > > > > > > > > > > enough to understand the difference between

> > > > > > > > > > > > success and failure, I

> > > > > > > > > > > > > guess!

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Anyway, if you agree that Rahu is giving

> Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > > > results, and those

> > > > > > > > > > > > > results are exceptionally good, then it

> > > > > > > > > > > > automatically follows that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun is strong in my chart because according

> to

> > > > > > > > > > > > Shri B.V Raman, evil

> > > > > > > > > > > > > planets, especially when weak, give bad

> results

> > > > > > > > > > > > (vide "a catechism

> > > > > > > > > > > > > of astrology"), while strong planets, even

> if

> > > > > > > > > > > > evil, give good

> > > > > > > > > > > > > results. If my Sun were weak, he wouldn't be

> > > > > > > > > > > > giving such good

> > > > > > > > > > > > > results:--))

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Since Mercury is hopelessly combust and

> inferior

> > > > > > > > > > > > in shadbala

> > > > > > > > > > > > > strength, the major results of Dharma

> > > > > > > > > > > > karmadhipathi yoga are also

> > > > > > > > > > > > > given by Sun, because according to "300

> > > > > > > > > > > > combinations" of Sri

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Raman, a planet with higher shadbala is more

> > > > > > > > > > > > likely to give the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > results of a yoga.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Regarding Karna, I request you to read the

> Karna

> > > > > > > > > > > > Parva of

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Mahabharata again. When he died, the nature

> bowed

> > > > > > > > > > > > in grief, because

> > > > > > > > > > > > > he's one of the noblest persons in

> Mahabharata.

> > > > > > > > > > > > Even the episode you

> > > > > > > > > > > > > quoted happened because Parashurama would

> teach

> > > > > > > > > > > > only Brahmins and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Karna desperately wanted to learn

> dhanurvidya

> > > from

> > > > > > > > > > > > Parashurama so

> > > > > > > > > > > > > that he can support Duryodhana. Deceit is

> > > > > > > > > > > > certainly punishable and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Karna did pay dearly. But it's to be borne

> in

> > > mind

> > > > > > > > > > > > that whatever

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Karna did was only to please Duryodhana, his

> > > > > > > > > > > > dearest friend. Karna

> > > > > > > > > > > > > did not gain anything personally.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the 3rd house from 8th house

> (I

> > > > > > > > > > > > think there was a typo

> > > > > > > > > > > > > at your end). In the natural zodiac, the 10

> th

> > > > > > > > > > > > sign, being the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > cardinal earth sign, represents

> south /dakshina

> > > > > > > > > > > > disha. South is the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > direction ruled by Yama, the lord of death,

> hence

> > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house

> > > > > > > > > > > > > represents burial grounds. So, the Rudras

> > > (Saturn,

> > > > > > > > > > > > Sun and Mars) are

> > > > > > > > > > > > > strong in south. Also, Sun resides in south

> and

> > > > > > > > > > > > starts his

> > > > > > > > > > > > > northern voyage from here. So he has

> digbala in

> > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > I did clarify that when I referred to Surya

> as

> > > > > > > > > > > > Karma saakshi, it's

> > > > > > > > > > > > > only to his status as antaraatma and not as

> a

> > > > > > > > > > > > deity. Perhaps this

> > > > > > > > > > > > > escaped your attention.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > This is my last post on the subject.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> <%40>

> > > <%40>

> > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40>,

> > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar

> > > > > > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > You were too young for the results of the

> dasha

> > > > > > > > > > > > to manifest,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > though it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > is good news that your father had

> promotions

> > > and

> > > > > > > > > > > > you received

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > prizes/accolades during that time. It is

> > > > > > > > > > > > interesting to know you

> > > > > > > > > > > > > got

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > these results at a young age of 9 or so

> as that

> > > > > > > > > > > > is when Sun dasha

> > > > > > > > > > > > > was

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > operative. I am relieved you did not have

> any

> > > > > > > > > > > > health problems in

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > March-August 1970 period.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > But we are talking about Rahu and Rahu

> would

> > > > > > > > > > > > give results of Sun

> > > > > > > > > > > > > more

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > prominently, by conjunction, as you

> guessed but

> > > > > > > > > > > > also that of

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Mercury

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > (You have a Dharmakarmaadhipati yoga

> after all)

> > > > > > > > > > > > and that is why I

> > > > > > > > > > > > > said

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > for understanding Sun its dasha instead

> of Rahu

> > > > > > > > > > > > dasha needs to be

> > > > > > > > > > > > > analyzed.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mercury is malefic not because I say so

> but

> > > > > > > > > > > > because Jyotish says

> > > > > > > > > > > > > that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > mercury is malefic when conjunct a papa

> graha

> > > > > > > > > > > > and he is conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > > > two,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun and Rahu.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the apex of Artha trikona

> and

> > > > > > > > > > > > directly involved with

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > efforts to earn money. Though claimed to

> be

> > > > > > > > > > > > smashana/burial

> > > > > > > > > > > > > ground, it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > is 4th from ayush sthana (8th) and its

> home

> > > that

> > > > > > > > > > > > is why affliction

> > > > > > > > > > > > > to it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > can give death. But 8th is more popularly

> > > called

> > > > > > > > > > > > mrityu sthana and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > hence

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th is called Smashana. If it is really

> > > > > > > > > > > > smashana why would it be

> > > > > > > > > > > > > called

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > karma sthana and why would Sun be at its

> most

> > > > > > > > > > > > brilliant there?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > I did not say he can not represent water

> bodies

> > > > > > > > > > > > in temple, but not

> > > > > > > > > > > > > only

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > those.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My Sun dasa was excellent too. My father

> > > > > > > > > > > > received promotion(s),

> > > > > > > > > > > > > my

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > school/college days were great and i

> received

> > > > > > > > > > > > wide acclaim/prizes

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > for my ability in creative writing,

> Veena,

> > > > > > > > > > > > quiz contests etc,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > apart

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > from studies. So, for a student, I guess

> > > > > > > > > > > > that's excellent!!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > How do you justify this, if Sun were

> weak?

> > > > > > > > > > > > Rahu is certainly

> > > > > > > > > > > > > giving

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > the yogakaraka results, but being in

> Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > > > house and being

> > > > > > > > > > > > > conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun, don't you think Rahu is also

> giving the

> > > > > > > > > > > > results of Sun? You

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > said that mercury is malefic and heavily

> > > > > > > > > > > > combust too:--))

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1th house also represent burial

> > > > > > > > > > > > ground/smashaana. Is that a place

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > for attachment?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandra represents all water bodies, so

> why

> > > > > > > > > > > > can't he represent

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > temple tank?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > === message truncated ===

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

>

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Tired of spam? Mail has the best spam

> > > protection

> > > > > > > around

> > > > > > > > > > > <>

> < <>>

> > > < <>

> < <>>>

> > > > > < <>

> < <>>

> > > < <>

> < <>>>>

> > > > > > > < <>

> < <>>

> > > < <>

> < <>>>

> > > > > < <>

> < <>>

> > > < <>

> < <>>>>>

> > > > > > > > > < <>

> < <>>

> > > < <>

> < <>>>

> > > > > < <>

> < <>>

> > > < <>

> < <>>>>

> > > > > > > < <>

> < <>>

> > > < <>

> < <>>>

> > > > > < <>

> < <>>

> > > < <>

> < <>>>>>>

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > ---------------

> -----

> > > ----

> > > > > -

> > > > > > > > > -------

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database:

> 268.11.7/435 -

> > > Release

> > > > > > > Date:

> > > > > > > > > 8/31/2006

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> removed]

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > -------------------

> -----

> > > -

> > > > > > > -------

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.12.2/441 -

> Release

> > > > > Date:

> > > > > > > 9/7/2006

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

[Guest guest]

Dear Divine Lakshmi,

 

Please let me have one of the dozens of quotes from scriptures that you

have that state that dormant Kundalini is inauspicious. That will help

enlighten me. Then we will take up the Vag beeja and other Kootas.

 

Chandrashekhar.

 

b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

>

>

> Om Gurave Namah

>

> Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

>

> Please tell me in the body divisions given according to kootas, is

> the head/face part of Vagbhava koota or not? Let's get this straight

> first, then we can discuss chakras and the rest. Please do not worry

> about quotes, because I will not disappoint you, and can provide

> them by the ton:--))

>

> When one is said to be "beheaded" does it mean the portion upto neck

> or the portion upto forehead?

>

> Are you not splitting hairs here?

>

> Regards,

> Lakshmi

>

>

> <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> <chandrashekhar46 wrote:

> >

> > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> >

> > If you think Sahasrara and Vishuddha Chakras at the same place,

> and if

> > Pankaja refers to head and not face, all your arguments are

> acceptable.

> > Unfortunately they are not.

> >

> > I see that you have not given anything in support of your argument

> > barring conjectures and have not commented on the shloka I sent

> you.

> >

> > Chandrashekhar.

> >

> > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > >

> > >

> > > Om Gurave Namah

> > >

> > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > >

> > > Lalitha Sahasranaamam describes Mother thus...

> > >

> > > Srimadvaagbhavakootaika swaroopamukha pankajaa

> > > kanthaadhakatiparyanta madhyakoota swaroopini

> > > Shaktikootaikathaapanna katyadhobhaagadhaariNi.

> > >

> > > The three divisions are

> > >

> > > Vagbhava koota - the face/head

> > > Madhya/kamaraaja koota - from neck to kati

> > > Shakti koota - the portion after kati to feet

> > >

> > > Can you tell me in this division, where does the head come...in

> the

> > > vagbhava koota or in shakti koota? Is there any other koota

> defined

> > > for the head/rear portion of the face etc? Or do you imply that

> > > Mother has only a face without the head!!!

> > >

> > > You know very well that we are not talking of astrology mappings

> > > here. Yet why you choose to interpret even a simple principle in

> > > this strange fashion is some thing beyond me, unless you are

> > > confused yourself (can happen to all of us) or want to confuse

> > > others (no comments).

> > >

> > > If either Bhagavan Hayagriva or Sage Agasthya intended that "bisa

> > > tantu taneeyasi" should be understood wrt kundalini at Mooladhara

> > > also they would have put it immediately after "mooladharaika

> > > nilayaa.. and not after "shatchakropari samsthithaa".

> > >

> > > ofcourse, I do not mean that Kundalini is like a python at

> > > mooladhara:--)), but definitely much grosser than at sahasraara.

> > >

> > > Btw, I am sure you know that kundalini is not agni tattwatmika at

> > > mooladhara. The agnitattwa of "vidyullekha" happens only from

> > > swadhisthana, because agni is oordhwa mukha and is ignited only

> when

> > > the Kundalini turns upwards.

> > >

> > > Regards,

> > > Lakshmi

> > >

> > >

> <%40>

> > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > >

> > > > By the way Vag beeja kuta is not only head but a group of

> > > Panchadhasha

> > > > mantra and referred to as maa's face indicating the vacha.

> > > > Raajrajeshwari Kavacha prays that the vagbija protect the

> throat

> > > and not

> > > > the head as you imply. Certainly not head. And her principal

> abode

> > > is

> > > > said to be Mulaadhara and not sahasrara. However if you want

> to

> > > distort

> > > > this to mean she is inauspicious when dormant you are free to

> do

> > > so. I

> > > > would however request you to think why the HrIm beeja is most

> dear

> > > to

> > > > her and not the AiM beeja (Devi Patha, if you need the

> reference).

> > > It

> > > > would perhaps be well to understand that Kundalini means of

> the

> > > coiled

> > > > form and "Visa Tantu..." coming after that certainly does not

> mean

> > > what

> > > > you want to think it does.

> > > >

> > > > In the meanwhile, please contemplate on this.

> > > > Aaxare prdevta Éìjntax> k…{flI devta

> > > > ädhäre paradevatä bhavrajanatädhaù kuëòalé devatä

> > > > devanamixdevta iÇjgtamanNdpuÃiSwta,

> > > > devänämadhidevatä trijagatämänandapuïjasthitä|

> > > > mUlaxarinvaisnI iÇrm[i ya }ainnI mailnI

> > > > mülädhäraniväsiné triramaëé yä jïäniné mäliné

> > > > sa me mat&mnuiSwta k…lpwanNdEkbIjanna.32,21.

> > > > sä me mätåmanusthitä kulapathänandaikabéjänanä||32|21||

> > > >

> > > > This is how Kundalini is described in Rudrayamala Tantra. Do

> you

> > > think

> > > > it is wrong?

> > > >

> > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > >

> > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > >

> > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > >

> > > > > "vagbhavabeejasya kundalineethi sangnyaa

> thadroopa"...Kundalini

> > > as

> > > > > preceding "bisa tantu taneeyasee" is described as vagbhava

> beeja

> > > > > or "aim" (saraswati) beeja. As you have read the yamalas, i

> am

> > > sure

> > > > > you know which part of body comprises of vagbhava

> koota...it's

> > > the

> > > > > head!!

> > > > >

> > > > > Let me also explain the term preceding kundalini.

> > > > > It's "mahaasakthiH" and not "MahashakthiH" and talks of the

> > > > > eagerness of Mother to unite with Shiva....mahe utsave

> tatratya

> > > > > shivashaktisamaayogaroope aasakthiH tatparataa yasyaaH.

> > > > >

> > > > > Is this enough to show that "bisa tantu taneeyasee" is the

> > > climactic

> > > > > name of shakti in ascension?

> > > > >

> > > > > Regarding Devi worshippers wrt unawakened kundalini, let me

> quote

> > > > > this sentence.....hey Srividyopaasakaah. uttishtatha. maa

> > > > > swaptha....meaning o srividyopaasaka! wake up( the

> kundalini).

> > > don't

> > > > > let it sleep!!

> > > > >

> > > > > Many thanks for this extended discussion on Kundalini. It's

> time

> > > for

> > > > > taking leave.

> > > > >

> > > > > Regards,

> > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > >

> > > > >

> <%40>

> > > <%40>

> > > > > <%40>, "b_lakshmi_ramesh"

> > > > > <b_lakshmi_ramesh@> wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > The shadripus are kaama (lust), krodha (anger), lobha

> (greed),

> > > > > moha

> > > > > > (attachment, delusion), mada (pride) and maatsarya

> (jealousy)

> > > > > > If "mada" means "lust" what does "kaama" imply among the

> > > > > > shadripus? "Mada" signifies one who is intoxicated/drunk

> with

> > > > > > power/self-grandeur (pride/ego).

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Mother is known as "Vidya and avidya swaroopini" and

> correct

> > > > > > appreciation of Mother includes understanding of both

> facets.

> > > As

> > > > > > Shakti, She respresents raw power which can be routed

> towards

> > > good

> > > > > > deeds as well as bad deeds. Are both ends the same? The

> wisdom,

> > > > > > required to put this immense shakti to good use, is

> > > represented by

> > > > > > Shiva, hence the union of Shiva and Parvati, wisdom and

> power,

> > > is

> > > > > > said to be auspicious because it ensures the

> correct/judicious

> > > end

> > > > > > use of shakti. Hence the orientation of Shakti is very

> very

> > > > > > important.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I always said that Soorya is both sattwik and krura. I

> also

> > > always

> > > > > > said all planets, including Jupiter, can give malefic

> results,

> > > if

> > > > > > they are functionally empowered to do so. You can refer

> to all

> > > my

> > > > > > previous mails to confirm this.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Sir, Truth is much more important than winning or losing

> an

> > > > > > argument. All discussions must proceed as an exploration

> and

> > > > > > celebration of Truth. When this is not the case, I see no

> > > purpose

> > > > > in

> > > > > > continuing these discussions.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Thanks & Regards,

> > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> <%40>

> > > <%40>

> > > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Having Icchamrityu and dying at an early age are

> operating at

> > > > > > different

> > > > > > > levels. Bhishma had Iccha Mrityu but did not die young.

> So

> > > > > please

> > > > > > do not

> > > > > > > try to mix the issues. If you have read Swamiji's

> biography

> > > you

> > > > > > will

> > > > > > > find that he fell sick many times despite of apparent

> robust

> > > > > > physique.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Commenting on Shani in 4th for Rama's chart confirms

> with his

> > > > > > being

> > > > > > > capable of giving Vipareeta results. I did not know I

> was

> > > > > expected

> > > > > > to

> > > > > > > analyze the entire chart. By the way if there is a Kuja

> dosha

> > > > > how

> > > > > > does

> > > > > > > that by itself give a Divine wife? Please do not bring

> our

> > > > > > devotion to

> > > > > > > Lord Rama (and we both have that) into astrological

> analysis

> > > of

> > > > > > his chart.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Bringing in the dashas when the discussions are on the

> > > effects

> > > > > of

> > > > > > grahas

> > > > > > > will only lead the discussion to no where. The two have

> to be

> > > > > seen

> > > > > > > separately as we are not trying to time an event but

> only

> > > trying

> > > > > > to find

> > > > > > > what are the effects on bhavas occupied.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Dear Lakshmi in Ramana Maharshi's chart you have perhaps

> > > > > forgotten

> > > > > > the

> > > > > > > saying Kuja vat Ketu. look at the Ketu deha in that

> > > perspective

> > > > > > and let

> > > > > > > me know your views. And if by the way you read my mail,

> I did

> > > > > not

> > > > > > say

> > > > > > > anything about mars being killer for him, only that it

> gave

> > > him

> > > > > > Sarcoma

> > > > > > > being 3rd lord.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Also could you explain why Sun being Atma and always

> > > beneficent

> > > > > as

> > > > > > you

> > > > > > > have claimed all along in the thread on the topic, did

> its

> > > > > > Mahadasha

> > > > > > > prove to be Killer to Ramana Maharshi?

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Take care,

> > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > For example, remember that in Swami Vivekananda's

> chart

> > > > > Surya

> > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > lord of

> > > > > > > > > the 9th occupying the lagna and causing a powerful

> Raj

> > > yoga.

> > > > > At

> > > > > > > > the same

> > > > > > > > > time if you thin how long the Swamiji lived, you may

> > > have to

> > > > > > think

> > > > > > > > again

> > > > > > > > > about saying that it did not act as Mahakrura. Think

> > > about

> > > > > > what it

> > > > > > > > did

> > > > > > > > > to the 7th bhava of Swamiji, also, before declaring

> that

> > > it

> > > > > > became

> > > > > > > > > shubha or less malefic.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Lakshmi: I think Swamiji had an icchamrityu and

> looking at

> > > the

> > > > > > dass

> > > > > > > > operating on 4th July 1902, I observe that he passed

> away

> > > in

> > > > > Jup-

> > > > > > Ven-

> > > > > > > > Jup-Ket-Sat-Sat.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Jup MD: 1893-02-09 (1:35:30 pm) - 1909-02-10 (3:59:13

> pm)

> > > > > > > > Ven AD: 1900-12-25 (10:03:30 am) - 1903-08-27

> (4:48:54 pm)

> > > > > > > > Jup PD: 1902-05-02 (1:42:07 pm) - 1902-09-12

> (10:43:55 pm)

> > > > > > > > Ket SD: 1902-06-29 (9:11:48 am) - 1902-07-07 (5:06:28

> am)

> > > > > > > > Sat PAD: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-06

> (2:29:24 am)

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Sat: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-05 (1:27:03 am)

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Jupiter is in 2nd house from Moon, Venus is the 2nd

> lord

> > > from

> > > > > > Moon

> > > > > > > > and is posited in 2nd from lagna, Ketu is in the

> house of

> > > > > Venus

> > > > > > and

> > > > > > > > gives the results of Venus and Saturn is the 2nd lord

> from

> > > > > > > > lagna....all are marakas. the maraka significations

> are

> > > > > stronger

> > > > > > > > from Moon, and it's the cause of his early death.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > I fail to see where Sun comes into all this.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > However, I agree that Sun, as AK aspecting 7th house,

> can

> > > give

> > > > > > > > parivraja tendencies. But can you ignore the

> influence of

> > > > > Saturn

> > > > > > on

> > > > > > > > Moon and 4th house, occuring in the 10th house? I am

> sure

> > > even

> > > > > > weak

> > > > > > > > Sun would have given him parivraja yoga:--))but

> without the

> > > > > raja

> > > > > > > > yoga and the strong soul-level impact he created

> wherever

> > > he

> > > > > > went.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Or if you like look at what happened to the 7th

> > > > > > > > > Bhava of Lord Rama with exalted Mars in the 7th

> bhava.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Mars in 7th gives kuja dosha, and I think the strong

> Mars

> > > in

> > > > > 7th

> > > > > > > > gave him an exalted wife like Sita. You have not

> commented

> > > on

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > > exalted Saturn in 4th house.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > In each of the

> > > > > > > > > example provided by you look at the bhava that the

> > > planets

> > > > > > occupy

> > > > > > > > > (barring Saturn, for reasons already stated in

> previous

> > > > > mail),

> > > > > > > > without

> > > > > > > > > looking at the charts as belonging to great people,

> and

> > > then

> > > > > > make

> > > > > > > > up

> > > > > > > > > your mind as to the truth or otherwise of what I

> said.

> > > Did

> > > > > you

> > > > > > > > know

> > > > > > > > > Ramana Maharshi died following a malignant sarcoma

> of

> > > left

> > > > > hand

> > > > > > > > and Mars

> > > > > > > > > is karaka for the 3rd bhava in 8th in his chart, in

> > > > > > exaltation. Do

> > > > > > > > you

> > > > > > > > > think Mars gave him benevolent results?

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I also request you to examine the

> following

> > > dasa

> > > > > > > > sequences with an open mind. Sun is the 3rd lord from

> Moon

> > > (AK)

> > > > > &

> > > > > > > > 12th lord from lagna in Sri Ramana's chart, rahu is

> with

> > > Sun

> > > > > and

> > > > > > > > gives Sun'/Saturn's/Jupiter's effects...all of which

> point

> > > to

> > > > > > > > dusthanas, Saturn is a maraka in 7th house and ketu

> can

> > > give

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > > effects of Moon/Mercury/mars. Mar's effect, if at

> all, was

> > > only

> > > > > > > > indirect, and he was not the killer.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Sun MD: 1949-02-03 (1:02:22 am) - 1955-02-03 (2:05:32

> pm)

> > > > > > > > Rah AD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1951-02-21 (8:49:14

> am)

> > > > > > > > Rah PD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1950-05-18

> (12:04:47 am)

> > > > > > > > Sat SD: 1950-04-12 (3:37:16 am) - 1950-04-20

> (12:18:02 am)

> > > > > > > > Ket PAD: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14

> (11:08:26

> > > pm)

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Ket: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14 (12:47:04

> pm)

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > I think what stands out is the fact that the dasa of

> the

> > > graha

> > > > > > > > conjoined Moon brought about death. I think their mind

> > > willed

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > > death.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Can a planet give results in a dasa totally

> > > > > > unrelated/unassociated

> > > > > > > > with itself? I request you to consider the above

> > > objectively.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > I will talk about the other charts/issues in my next

> mail.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > In Paramhans Ramkrishna's chart,

> > > > > > > > > I do not know where you find Mars strong as a

> planet in

> > > > > > > > debilitation in

> > > > > > > > > Navamsha gives results of debility even when in

> > > exaltation

> > > > > in

> > > > > > rasi

> > > > > > > > > chart. In case of Saturn Viparitam shane smritam has

> > > already

> > > > > > been

> > > > > > > > > mentioned by me, in earlier mail.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I myself have not considered Mars/Venus

> in

> > > > > Thakur's

> > > > > > > > chart because they are debilitated. Please go through

> my

> > > > > message

> > > > > > > > again. I was talking about Saturn and Rahu.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > About Shri Aurobindo, I trust you are

> > > > > > > > > aware of his revolutionary background and that he

> was

> > > editor

> > > > > > of a

> > > > > > > > paper

> > > > > > > > > "Vande Mataram" not much known for its soft

> language.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Same is the case with strong Malefics giving P.M.

> Yogas.

> > > > > Every

> > > > > > > > graha is

> > > > > > > > > capable of 12 variations of a P.M. Yoga attributed

> to

> > > it, at

> > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > very

> > > > > > > > > least. It would only be naive to imagine they would

> all

> > > give

> > > > > > > > identical

> > > > > > > > > results as indicated by Parashara or all with Pancha

> > > > > > Mahapurusha

> > > > > > > > Yoga

> > > > > > > > > would only rule over different parts of India

> (barring

> > > > > Saturn),

> > > > > > > > just

> > > > > > > > > because the sage said so. The sages gave us

> principles

> > > and

> > > > > > > > expected us

> > > > > > > > > to apply them to real life horoscope using Viveka.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > I would gladly give you the shloka giving the

> reference

> > > to

> > > > > > > > > "Viparita---Shane..." it is from an old classic

> respected

> > > > > > amongst

> > > > > > > > > astrologers, but as you do not seem to accept

> anything

> > > that

> > > > > > does

> > > > > > > > not fit

> > > > > > > > > in with what, you think. is said by Dr. Raman, it

> would

> > > be an

> > > > > > > > exercise

> > > > > > > > > in futility. should you yet want the shloka I would

> of

> > > > > course

> > > > > > be

> > > > > > > > glad to

> > > > > > > > > give it to you.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave namah

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > You seem to be disagreeing with Shri B.V. Raman

> that

> > > strong

> > > > > > > > planets,

> > > > > > > > > > whether malefic or benefics give good results,

> while

> > > weak

> > > > > > planets

> > > > > > > > > > give bad results. Perhaps you also disagree about

> > > strong

> > > > > > malefics

> > > > > > > > > > giving mahapurusha yogas. Isn't it contrary to

> what

> > > all the

> > > > > > > > jyotish

> > > > > > > > > > texts teach?

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Then, here are a few examples, where I find that

> strong

> > > > > > malefics

> > > > > > > > > > have neither made the natives krura nor that their

> > > > > > significations

> > > > > > > > > > suffered.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Swami Vivekananda: strong sun in lagna and mars

> in 5th

> > > > > house

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Sri Aurobindo: Strong Sun in 2nd house.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Maharshi Mahesh yogi: exalted Mars in lagna.

> > > > > > > > > > Ramana Maharshi: strong Mars in 8th house

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Sri Ramakrishna Paramahamsa: Exalted Saturn(9H)

> and

> > > Rahu

> > > > > > (4H).

> > > > > > > > Mars

> > > > > > > > > > and Venus are also exalted in rasi, while

> debilitated

> > > in

> > > > > > navamsa.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Sir, can you give me the reference for "vipareetam

> > > shaneH

> > > > > > > > sritam"?

> > > > > > > > > > Does it, by any chance, refer to Saturn's

> placement in

> > > the

> > > > > > 8th

> > > > > > > > house

> > > > > > > > > > being beneficial?

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > I am happy that you agree strong Saturn gives good

> > > results.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Can you tell me from where the saying is because i

> > > would

> > > > > > like to

> > > > > > > > > > read it up myself and understand.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > --- Chandrashekhar <chandrashekhar46@

> > > > > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk>>

> > > > > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > About Krura planets the saying is, that with

> > > > > > > > > > > > > strength the Krura grahas

> > > > > > > > > > > > > become more Krura (Maha-krura) and the

> shubha

> > > grahas

> > > > > > > > > > > > > become more shubha.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Only Shani is more krura when weak and

> > > beneficial or

> > > > > > > > > > > > > less krura when

> > > > > > > > > > > > > strong "Viparitama shaneH smritam".

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > My sun dasa started when I was 9 years

> old, and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > ended when I was 15

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > years old. How come you didn't notice the

> > > second

> > > > > > > > > > > > > part? I was old

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > enough to understand the difference

> between

> > > > > > > > > > > > > success and failure, I

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > guess!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Anyway, if you agree that Rahu is giving

> Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > > > > results, and those

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > results are exceptionally good, then it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > automatically follows that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun is strong in my chart because

> according to

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Shri B.V Raman, evil

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > planets, especially when weak, give bad

> results

> > > > > > > > > > > > > (vide "a catechism

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > of astrology"), while strong planets,

> even if

> > > > > > > > > > > > > evil, give good

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > results. If my Sun were weak, he wouldn't

> be

> > > > > > > > > > > > > giving such good

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > results:--))

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Since Mercury is hopelessly combust and

> > > inferior

> > > > > > > > > > > > > in shadbala

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > strength, the major results of Dharma

> > > > > > > > > > > > > karmadhipathi yoga are also

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > given by Sun, because according to "300

> > > > > > > > > > > > > combinations" of Sri

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Raman, a planet with higher shadbala is

> more

> > > > > > > > > > > > > likely to give the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > results of a yoga.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regarding Karna, I request you to read the

> > > Karna

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Parva of

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mahabharata again. When he died, the

> nature

> > > bowed

> > > > > > > > > > > > > in grief, because

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > he's one of the noblest persons in

> Mahabharata.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Even the episode you

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > quoted happened because Parashurama would

> teach

> > > > > > > > > > > > > only Brahmins and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Karna desperately wanted to learn

> dhanurvidya

> > > from

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Parashurama so

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > that he can support Duryodhana. Deceit is

> > > > > > > > > > > > > certainly punishable and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Karna did pay dearly. But it's to be

> borne in

> > > mind

> > > > > > > > > > > > > that whatever

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Karna did was only to please Duryodhana,

> his

> > > > > > > > > > > > > dearest friend. Karna

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > did not gain anything personally.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the 3rd house from 8th

> house (I

> > > > > > > > > > > > > think there was a typo

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > at your end). In the natural zodiac, the

> 10 th

> > > > > > > > > > > > > sign, being the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > cardinal earth sign, represents

> south /dakshina

> > > > > > > > > > > > > disha. South is the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > direction ruled by Yama, the lord of

> death,

> > > hence

> > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > represents burial grounds. So, the Rudras

> > > (Saturn,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun and Mars) are

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > strong in south. Also, Sun resides in

> south and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > starts his

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > northern voyage from here. So he has

> digbala in

> > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > I did clarify that when I referred to

> Surya as

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Karma saakshi, it's

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > only to his status as antaraatma and not

> as a

> > > > > > > > > > > > > deity. Perhaps this

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > escaped your attention.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > This is my last post on the subject.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> <%40>

> > > <%40>

> > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40>,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You were too young for the results of

> the

> > > dasha

> > > > > > > > > > > > > to manifest,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > though it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is good news that your father had

> promotions

> > > and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > you received

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > prizes/accolades during that time. It is

> > > > > > > > > > > > > interesting to know you

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > got

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > these results at a young age of 9 or so

> as

> > > that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > is when Sun dasha

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > was

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > operative. I am relieved you did not

> have any

> > > > > > > > > > > > > health problems in

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > March-August 1970 period.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But we are talking about Rahu and Rahu

> would

> > > > > > > > > > > > > give results of Sun

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > more

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > prominently, by conjunction, as you

> guessed

> > > but

> > > > > > > > > > > > > also that of

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mercury

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (You have a Dharmakarmaadhipati yoga

> after

> > > all)

> > > > > > > > > > > > > and that is why I

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > said

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > for understanding Sun its dasha instead

> of

> > > Rahu

> > > > > > > > > > > > > dasha needs to be

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > analyzed.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mercury is malefic not because I say so

> but

> > > > > > > > > > > > > because Jyotish says

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > mercury is malefic when conjunct a papa

> graha

> > > > > > > > > > > > > and he is conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > two,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun and Rahu.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the apex of Artha trikona

> and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > directly involved with

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > efforts to earn money. Though claimed

> to be

> > > > > > > > > > > > > smashana/burial

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > ground, it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is 4th from ayush sthana (8th) and its

> home

> > > that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > is why affliction

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > to it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > can give death. But 8th is more

> popularly

> > > called

> > > > > > > > > > > > > mrityu sthana and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > hence

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th is called Smashana. If it is really

> > > > > > > > > > > > > smashana why would it be

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > called

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > karma sthana and why would Sun be at

> its most

> > > > > > > > > > > > > brilliant there?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I did not say he can not represent water

> > > bodies

> > > > > > > > > > > > > in temple, but not

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > only

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > those.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My Sun dasa was excellent too. My

> father

> > > > > > > > > > > > > received promotion(s),

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > my

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > school/college days were great and i

> > > received

> > > > > > > > > > > > > wide acclaim/prizes

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > for my ability in creative writing,

> Veena,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > quiz contests etc,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > apart

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > from studies. So, for a student, I

> guess

> > > > > > > > > > > > > that's excellent!!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > How do you justify this, if Sun were

> weak?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Rahu is certainly

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > giving

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > the yogakaraka results, but being in

> Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > > > > house and being

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun, don't you think Rahu is also

> giving

> > > the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > results of Sun? You

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > said that mercury is malefic and

> heavily

> > > > > > > > > > > > > combust too:--))

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1th house also represent burial

> > > > > > > > > > > > > ground/smashaana. Is that a place

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > for attachment?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandra represents all water bodies,

> so why

> > > > > > > > > > > > > can't he represent

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > temple tank?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > === message truncated ===

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

>

> > > > > > > > > > > >

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> > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

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> > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

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[Guest guest]

Dear Divine Lakshmi,

 

The pramana to ancient text is indeed difficult to give, as there are no

Sanskrit to English dictionaries that were written by the ancient sages.

 

You may, however, like to refer to Monier William dictionary that

translates Sanskrit words to English as we are talking about English

words. I would, personally, refer to Sanskrit Kosha of Apte in hard

copy. Higher Sanskrit Grammar of M.R. Kale is another good source. The

meaning of Mada is made very clear there.

 

Chandrashekhar.

 

b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

>

>

> Om Gurave Namah

>

> Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

>

> Please translate the word "mada" also in all its nuances, and see

> why they all can not be applied to Rahu. Why close your mind to

> other meanings?

>

> I also notice that you have not provided any pramana that says

> that "mada" means only lust/intoxication and not pride/vanity/ego. I

> am still waiting for it.

>

> >From what Saravali says, I perceive "ego" to be the basic quality of

> all those born. it perpetuates survival and rebirth. If you

> disagree, can you provide a pramaana that says only a king can have

> ego and others can not.

>

> Regards,

> Lakshmi

>

>

> <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> <chandrashekhar46 wrote:

> >

> > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> >

> > I was trying to translate Abhimana and not pride. And Pride in a

> King

> > whom you have all along been trying to equate to a Divine being (I

> think

> > amsha of Lord Vishnu or some such thing you said, while arguing

> why King

> > is divine and by extension Surya; if memory serves me right), may

> not be

> > a divine virtue but would certainly be tantamount to Ego.

> >

> > So please do not try to read something that is not there in the

> message.

> > It is always difficult to translate Sanskrit words in English

> language

> > due to limitation of words with different flavors in English.

> >

> > Chandrashekhar.

> >

> > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > >

> > >

> > > Om Gurave Namah

> > >

> > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > >

> > > It is interesting to see that you do not think that pride and ego

> > > are not one and the same thing. Please refer to your own message

> at

> > >

> > > /message/11735

> </message/11735>

> > > </message/11735

> </message/11735>>

> > >

> > > where you mentioned the following:

> > >

> > > "we find that Bhava Manjari does

> > > attribute Abhimana (pride/ego) to Surya and so does Bhuvan

> Deepak."

> > >

> > > How come pride/ego are synonymous in the case of Sun and not so

> in

> > > the case of Rahu? Is this fair? And, is this necessary?

> > >

> > > Isn't "abhimaana" a much milder word than "mada"? The

> > > word "abhimaana" might have positive connotations, but the

> > > word "mada" has absolutely no positive connotations. Pradeep may

> > > not understand this but I am sure you do.

> > >

> > > Fair arguments never hurt me, sir, but this sort of arguments,

> > > especially coming from you, certainly confound me.

> > >

> > > Can you quote any pramaana that says "mada" means only lust and

> not

> > > pride/ego/vanity etc?

> > >

> > > Regarding vidyaa/avidyaa and auspicious/inauspicious nature of

> > > Mother:

> > >

> > > Vidyaavidya swaroopini: 402nd name of Mother

> > >

> > > Vidyaamchaavidyaamchayasthadvedobhayam saH, avidyayaamritu

> > > teerthva,vidyayaamritamasnutha, vidyaina charamavrittiroopam

> > > jnaanam, avidyaa bhedabhraantiroopam jnaanam"

> > >

> > > Avidya results in mrityu while vidyaa results in immortality and

> > > moiksha. Vidyaa gives charama vrittiroopa jnaanam, while avidya

> > > gives bhedabhraanthiroopa jnaanam.

> > >

> > > So, which one is auspicious? The direction which gives

> > > immortality/moksha or the direction which results in

> > > differentiation, delusion and death?

> > >

> > > Further in the explanation of the name "BhadramoorthiH" it is

> stated

> > > in Soubhagyabhaskaram that "brahmam tanmangalam". The true

> > > auspiciousness is that after which no other inauspiciousness

> occurs.

> > > In a state which is dominated by desires, delusions etc

> > > (mooladhara), this is impossible. This state of " absoluteness

> > > auspiciousness " is possible only at the state of Brahman

> > > (sahasraara).

> > >

> > > "theshaamcha lokaapibahuvidhaaH parasivaabhinnamahaashaktistu

> > > sarvalokaatheethaa mahaakailaasaaparaajithaadi padapratipaadye

> > > sarvalokotthare tisthathi.anyaapaam sivashakteenaam kathipayaanam

> > > saattwikshareeraanyapi sattwaadhikyagunaantharaalpatwa yukthaani

> na

> > > punaH shuddhasattwaani..

> > >

> > > "The form where Mother is one with shiva is the

> highest/mahaashakti

> > > form. All shiva+shakti roopas are sattwa roopas, but those lower

> > > than this are a mixture of rajo and tamo gunas.

> > >

> > > I hope these suffice, or if you want, I can quote more.

> > >

> > > Regards,

> > > Lakshmi

> > >

> > >

> <%40>

> > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > >

> > > > Pride is different from ego. Like it or not Mada does mean

> > > intoxication

> > > > or lust. The Kama that is referred to relates to kaamana which

> > > means

> > > > desires for things possessed by others. That is what Asteya,

> one

> > > of the

> > > > Yamas of Hatha yogas refer to.

> > > >

> > > > We are talking about auspiciousness or other wise of the

> dormant

> > > or

> > > > awakened Kundalini. As I said all scriptures can be

> misinterpreted

> > > if

> > > > one wants to do that. But that does not serve any purpose. I

> would

> > > not

> > > > go into what exactly is meant by Vidya and Avidya related to

> Maa.

> > > I have

> > > > not yet seen any Pramana, in the form of a shloka, to support

> your

> > > > proposition that dormant Kundalini is inauspicious and the

> > > awakened

> > > > Kundalini is auspicious so far. I have already posted the way

> my

> > > > generation has been taught to accept an argument, so I shall

> not

> > > repeat

> > > > it here.

> > > >

> > > > But I will not resort to conjectures and would like to quote

> from

> > > > Rudrayamala tantra about the swarUpa of dormant Kundalini.

> Being

> > > > graduate in sanskrit, I am sure I will not have to translate

> it

> > > for you.

> > > > Aaxare prdevta Éìjntax> k…{flI devta

> > > > ädhäre paradevatä bhavrajanatädhaù kuëòalé devatä

> > > > devanamixdevta iÇjgtamanNdpuÃiSwta,

> > > > devänämadhidevatä trijagatämänandapuïjasthitä|

> > > > mUlaxarinvaisnI iÇrm[i ya }ainnI mailnI

> > > > mülädhäraniväsiné triramaëé yä jïäniné mäliné

> > > > sa me mat&mnuiSwta k…lpwanNdEkbIjanna.32,21.

> > > > sä me mätåmanusthitä kulapathänandaikabéjänanä||32|21||

> > > >

> > > > I am sure you must have some quote to support your

> contention. I

> > > would

> > > > like to see the shloka, as against conjectures, so that I can

> > > improve

> > > > upon my knowledge of the swarupaa of Kundalini.

> > > >

> > > > I can understand your reluctance to support your propositions

> with

> > > > suitable pramanas. I am sorry if I have hurt you by pointing

> out

> > > the

> > > > inconsistency in the way you treated Surya and Rahu

> combinations

> > > in two

> > > > different chart as stand out combinations only.

> > > >

> > > > I had no intention to cause any hurt to you and if I have

> done so

> > > > inadvertently I crave your pardon.

> > > >

> > > > Take care,

> > > >

> > > > Chandrashekhar

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > >

> > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > >

> > > > > The shadripus are kaama (lust), krodha (anger), lobha

> (greed),

> > > moha

> > > > > (attachment, delusion), mada (pride) and maatsarya

> (jealousy)

> > > > > If "mada" means "lust" what does "kaama" imply among the

> > > > > shadripus? "Mada" signifies one who is intoxicated/drunk

> with

> > > > > power/self-grandeur (pride/ego).

> > > > >

> > > > > Mother is known as "Vidya and avidya swaroopini" and correct

> > > > > appreciation of Mother includes understanding of both

> facets. As

> > > > > Shakti, She respresents raw power which can be routed

> towards

> > > good

> > > > > deeds as well as bad deeds. Are both ends the same? The

> wisdom,

> > > > > required to put this immense shakti to good use, is

> represented

> > > by

> > > > > Shiva, hence the union of Shiva and Parvati, wisdom and

> power, is

> > > > > said to be auspicious because it ensures the

> correct/judicious

> > > end

> > > > > use of shakti. Hence the orientation of Shakti is very very

> > > > > important.

> > > > >

> > > > > I always said that Soorya is both sattwik and krura. I also

> > > always

> > > > > said all planets, including Jupiter, can give malefic

> results, if

> > > > > they are functionally empowered to do so. You can refer to

> all my

> > > > > previous mails to confirm this.

> > > > >

> > > > > Sir, Truth is much more important than winning or losing an

> > > > > argument. All discussions must proceed as an exploration and

> > > > > celebration of Truth. When this is not the case, I see no

> > > purpose in

> > > > > continuing these discussions.

> > > > >

> > > > > Thanks & Regards,

> > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > >

> > > > >

> <%40>

> > > <%40>

> > > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Having Icchamrityu and dying at an early age are

> operating at

> > > > > different

> > > > > > levels. Bhishma had Iccha Mrityu but did not die young. So

> > > please

> > > > > do not

> > > > > > try to mix the issues. If you have read Swamiji's

> biography you

> > > > > will

> > > > > > find that he fell sick many times despite of apparent

> robust

> > > > > physique.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Commenting on Shani in 4th for Rama's chart confirms with

> his

> > > > > being

> > > > > > capable of giving Vipareeta results. I did not know I was

> > > expected

> > > > > to

> > > > > > analyze the entire chart. By the way if there is a Kuja

> dosha

> > > how

> > > > > does

> > > > > > that by itself give a Divine wife? Please do not bring our

> > > > > devotion to

> > > > > > Lord Rama (and we both have that) into astrological

> analysis of

> > > > > his chart.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Bringing in the dashas when the discussions are on the

> effects

> > > of

> > > > > grahas

> > > > > > will only lead the discussion to no where. The two have

> to be

> > > seen

> > > > > > separately as we are not trying to time an event but only

> > > trying

> > > > > to find

> > > > > > what are the effects on bhavas occupied.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Dear Lakshmi in Ramana Maharshi's chart you have perhaps

> > > forgotten

> > > > > the

> > > > > > saying Kuja vat Ketu. look at the Ketu deha in that

> perspective

> > > > > and let

> > > > > > me know your views. And if by the way you read my mail, I

> did

> > > not

> > > > > say

> > > > > > anything about mars being killer for him, only that it

> gave him

> > > > > Sarcoma

> > > > > > being 3rd lord.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Also could you explain why Sun being Atma and always

> > > beneficent as

> > > > > you

> > > > > > have claimed all along in the thread on the topic, did its

> > > > > Mahadasha

> > > > > > prove to be Killer to Ramana Maharshi?

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Take care,

> > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > For example, remember that in Swami Vivekananda's

> chart

> > > Surya

> > > > > is

> > > > > > > lord of

> > > > > > > > the 9th occupying the lagna and causing a powerful Raj

> > > yoga. At

> > > > > > > the same

> > > > > > > > time if you thin how long the Swamiji lived, you may

> have

> > > to

> > > > > think

> > > > > > > again

> > > > > > > > about saying that it did not act as Mahakrura. Think

> about

> > > > > what it

> > > > > > > did

> > > > > > > > to the 7th bhava of Swamiji, also, before declaring

> that it

> > > > > became

> > > > > > > > shubha or less malefic.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Lakshmi: I think Swamiji had an icchamrityu and looking

> at

> > > the

> > > > > dass

> > > > > > > operating on 4th July 1902, I observe that he passed

> away in

> > > Jup-

> > > > > Ven-

> > > > > > > Jup-Ket-Sat-Sat.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Jup MD: 1893-02-09 (1:35:30 pm) - 1909-02-10 (3:59:13

> pm)

> > > > > > > Ven AD: 1900-12-25 (10:03:30 am) - 1903-08-27 (4:48:54

> pm)

> > > > > > > Jup PD: 1902-05-02 (1:42:07 pm) - 1902-09-12 (10:43:55

> pm)

> > > > > > > Ket SD: 1902-06-29 (9:11:48 am) - 1902-07-07 (5:06:28

> am)

> > > > > > > Sat PAD: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-06 (2:29:24

> am)

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Sat: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-05 (1:27:03 am)

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Jupiter is in 2nd house from Moon, Venus is the 2nd

> lord from

> > > > > Moon

> > > > > > > and is posited in 2nd from lagna, Ketu is in the house

> of

> > > Venus

> > > > > and

> > > > > > > gives the results of Venus and Saturn is the 2nd lord

> from

> > > > > > > lagna....all are marakas. the maraka significations are

> > > stronger

> > > > > > > from Moon, and it's the cause of his early death.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I fail to see where Sun comes into all this.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > However, I agree that Sun, as AK aspecting 7th house,

> can

> > > give

> > > > > > > parivraja tendencies. But can you ignore the influence

> of

> > > Saturn

> > > > > on

> > > > > > > Moon and 4th house, occuring in the 10th house? I am

> sure

> > > even

> > > > > weak

> > > > > > > Sun would have given him parivraja yoga:--))but without

> the

> > > raja

> > > > > > > yoga and the strong soul-level impact he created

> wherever he

> > > > > went.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Or if you like look at what happened to the 7th

> > > > > > > > Bhava of Lord Rama with exalted Mars in the 7th bhava.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Mars in 7th gives kuja dosha, and I think the strong

> Mars in

> > > 7th

> > > > > > > gave him an exalted wife like Sita. You have not

> commented

> > > on the

> > > > > > > exalted Saturn in 4th house.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > In each of the

> > > > > > > > example provided by you look at the bhava that the

> planets

> > > > > occupy

> > > > > > > > (barring Saturn, for reasons already stated in

> previous

> > > mail),

> > > > > > > without

> > > > > > > > looking at the charts as belonging to great people,

> and

> > > then

> > > > > make

> > > > > > > up

> > > > > > > > your mind as to the truth or otherwise of what I

> said. Did

> > > you

> > > > > > > know

> > > > > > > > Ramana Maharshi died following a malignant sarcoma of

> left

> > > hand

> > > > > > > and Mars

> > > > > > > > is karaka for the 3rd bhava in 8th in his chart, in

> > > > > exaltation. Do

> > > > > > > you

> > > > > > > > think Mars gave him benevolent results?

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I also request you to examine the

> following

> > > dasa

> > > > > > > sequences with an open mind. Sun is the 3rd lord from

> Moon

> > > (AK) &

> > > > > > > 12th lord from lagna in Sri Ramana's chart, rahu is

> with Sun

> > > and

> > > > > > > gives Sun'/Saturn's/Jupiter's effects...all of which

> point to

> > > > > > > dusthanas, Saturn is a maraka in 7th house and ketu can

> give

> > > the

> > > > > > > effects of Moon/Mercury/mars. Mar's effect, if at all,

> was

> > > only

> > > > > > > indirect, and he was not the killer.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Sun MD: 1949-02-03 (1:02:22 am) - 1955-02-03 (2:05:32

> pm)

> > > > > > > Rah AD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1951-02-21 (8:49:14

> am)

> > > > > > > Rah PD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1950-05-18 (12:04:47

> am)

> > > > > > > Sat SD: 1950-04-12 (3:37:16 am) - 1950-04-20 (12:18:02

> am)

> > > > > > > Ket PAD: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14

> (11:08:26 pm)

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Ket: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14 (12:47:04 pm)

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I think what stands out is the fact that the dasa of the

> > > graha

> > > > > > > conjoined Moon brought about death. I think their mind

> > > willed the

> > > > > > > death.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Can a planet give results in a dasa totally

> > > > > unrelated/unassociated

> > > > > > > with itself? I request you to consider the above

> objectively.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I will talk about the other charts/issues in my next

> mail.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > In Paramhans Ramkrishna's chart,

> > > > > > > > I do not know where you find Mars strong as a planet

> in

> > > > > > > debilitation in

> > > > > > > > Navamsha gives results of debility even when in

> exaltation

> > > in

> > > > > rasi

> > > > > > > > chart. In case of Saturn Viparitam shane smritam has

> > > already

> > > > > been

> > > > > > > > mentioned by me, in earlier mail.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I myself have not considered Mars/Venus in

> > > Thakur's

> > > > > > > chart because they are debilitated. Please go through my

> > > message

> > > > > > > again. I was talking about Saturn and Rahu.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > About Shri Aurobindo, I trust you are

> > > > > > > > aware of his revolutionary background and that he was

> > > editor

> > > > > of a

> > > > > > > paper

> > > > > > > > "Vande Mataram" not much known for its soft language.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Same is the case with strong Malefics giving P.M.

> Yogas.

> > > Every

> > > > > > > graha is

> > > > > > > > capable of 12 variations of a P.M. Yoga attributed to

> it,

> > > at

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > very

> > > > > > > > least. It would only be naive to imagine they would

> all

> > > give

> > > > > > > identical

> > > > > > > > results as indicated by Parashara or all with Pancha

> > > > > Mahapurusha

> > > > > > > Yoga

> > > > > > > > would only rule over different parts of India (barring

> > > Saturn),

> > > > > > > just

> > > > > > > > because the sage said so. The sages gave us

> principles and

> > > > > > > expected us

> > > > > > > > to apply them to real life horoscope using Viveka.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > I would gladly give you the shloka giving the

> reference to

> > > > > > > > "Viparita---Shane..." it is from an old classic

> respected

> > > > > amongst

> > > > > > > > astrologers, but as you do not seem to accept

> anything that

> > > > > does

> > > > > > > not fit

> > > > > > > > in with what, you think. is said by Dr. Raman, it

> would be

> > > an

> > > > > > > exercise

> > > > > > > > in futility. should you yet want the shloka I would of

> > > course

> > > > > be

> > > > > > > glad to

> > > > > > > > give it to you.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Om Gurave namah

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > You seem to be disagreeing with Shri B.V. Raman that

> > > strong

> > > > > > > planets,

> > > > > > > > > whether malefic or benefics give good results,

> while weak

> > > > > planets

> > > > > > > > > give bad results. Perhaps you also disagree about

> strong

> > > > > malefics

> > > > > > > > > giving mahapurusha yogas. Isn't it contrary to what

> all

> > > the

> > > > > > > jyotish

> > > > > > > > > texts teach?

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Then, here are a few examples, where I find that

> strong

> > > > > malefics

> > > > > > > > > have neither made the natives krura nor that their

> > > > > significations

> > > > > > > > > suffered.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Swami Vivekananda: strong sun in lagna and mars in

> 5th

> > > house

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Sri Aurobindo: Strong Sun in 2nd house.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Maharshi Mahesh yogi: exalted Mars in lagna.

> > > > > > > > > Ramana Maharshi: strong Mars in 8th house

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Sri Ramakrishna Paramahamsa: Exalted Saturn(9H) and

> Rahu

> > > > > (4H).

> > > > > > > Mars

> > > > > > > > > and Venus are also exalted in rasi, while

> debilitated in

> > > > > navamsa.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Sir, can you give me the reference for "vipareetam

> shaneH

> > > > > > > sritam"?

> > > > > > > > > Does it, by any chance, refer to Saturn's placement

> in

> > > the

> > > > > 8th

> > > > > > > house

> > > > > > > > > being beneficial?

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > I am happy that you agree strong Saturn gives good

> > > results.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Can you tell me from where the saying is because i

> would

> > > > > like to

> > > > > > > > > read it up myself and understand.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > --- Chandrashekhar <chandrashekhar46@

> > > > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk>>

> > > > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > About Krura planets the saying is, that with

> > > > > > > > > > > > strength the Krura grahas

> > > > > > > > > > > > become more Krura (Maha-krura) and the shubha

> > > grahas

> > > > > > > > > > > > become more shubha.

> > > > > > > > > > > > Only Shani is more krura when weak and

> beneficial

> > > or

> > > > > > > > > > > > less krura when

> > > > > > > > > > > > strong "Viparitama shaneH smritam".

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > My sun dasa started when I was 9 years old,

> and

> > > > > > > > > > > > ended when I was 15

> > > > > > > > > > > > > years old. How come you didn't notice the

> second

> > > > > > > > > > > > part? I was old

> > > > > > > > > > > > > enough to understand the difference between

> > > > > > > > > > > > success and failure, I

> > > > > > > > > > > > > guess!

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Anyway, if you agree that Rahu is giving

> Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > > > results, and those

> > > > > > > > > > > > > results are exceptionally good, then it

> > > > > > > > > > > > automatically follows that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun is strong in my chart because according

> to

> > > > > > > > > > > > Shri B.V Raman, evil

> > > > > > > > > > > > > planets, especially when weak, give bad

> results

> > > > > > > > > > > > (vide "a catechism

> > > > > > > > > > > > > of astrology"), while strong planets, even

> if

> > > > > > > > > > > > evil, give good

> > > > > > > > > > > > > results. If my Sun were weak, he wouldn't be

> > > > > > > > > > > > giving such good

> > > > > > > > > > > > > results:--))

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Since Mercury is hopelessly combust and

> inferior

> > > > > > > > > > > > in shadbala

> > > > > > > > > > > > > strength, the major results of Dharma

> > > > > > > > > > > > karmadhipathi yoga are also

> > > > > > > > > > > > > given by Sun, because according to "300

> > > > > > > > > > > > combinations" of Sri

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Raman, a planet with higher shadbala is more

> > > > > > > > > > > > likely to give the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > results of a yoga.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Regarding Karna, I request you to read the

> Karna

> > > > > > > > > > > > Parva of

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Mahabharata again. When he died, the nature

> bowed

> > > > > > > > > > > > in grief, because

> > > > > > > > > > > > > he's one of the noblest persons in

> Mahabharata.

> > > > > > > > > > > > Even the episode you

> > > > > > > > > > > > > quoted happened because Parashurama would

> teach

> > > > > > > > > > > > only Brahmins and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Karna desperately wanted to learn

> dhanurvidya

> > > from

> > > > > > > > > > > > Parashurama so

> > > > > > > > > > > > > that he can support Duryodhana. Deceit is

> > > > > > > > > > > > certainly punishable and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Karna did pay dearly. But it's to be borne

> in

> > > mind

> > > > > > > > > > > > that whatever

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Karna did was only to please Duryodhana, his

> > > > > > > > > > > > dearest friend. Karna

> > > > > > > > > > > > > did not gain anything personally.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the 3rd house from 8th house

> (I

> > > > > > > > > > > > think there was a typo

> > > > > > > > > > > > > at your end). In the natural zodiac, the 10

> th

> > > > > > > > > > > > sign, being the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > cardinal earth sign, represents

> south /dakshina

> > > > > > > > > > > > disha. South is the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > direction ruled by Yama, the lord of death,

> hence

> > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house

> > > > > > > > > > > > > represents burial grounds. So, the Rudras

> > > (Saturn,

> > > > > > > > > > > > Sun and Mars) are

> > > > > > > > > > > > > strong in south. Also, Sun resides in south

> and

> > > > > > > > > > > > starts his

> > > > > > > > > > > > > northern voyage from here. So he has

> digbala in

> > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > I did clarify that when I referred to Surya

> as

> > > > > > > > > > > > Karma saakshi, it's

> > > > > > > > > > > > > only to his status as antaraatma and not as

> a

> > > > > > > > > > > > deity. Perhaps this

> > > > > > > > > > > > > escaped your attention.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > This is my last post on the subject.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> <%40>

> > > <%40>

> > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40>,

> > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar

> > > > > > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > You were too young for the results of the

> dasha

> > > > > > > > > > > > to manifest,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > though it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > is good news that your father had

> promotions

> > > and

> > > > > > > > > > > > you received

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > prizes/accolades during that time. It is

> > > > > > > > > > > > interesting to know you

> > > > > > > > > > > > > got

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > these results at a young age of 9 or so

> as that

> > > > > > > > > > > > is when Sun dasha

> > > > > > > > > > > > > was

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > operative. I am relieved you did not have

> any

> > > > > > > > > > > > health problems in

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > March-August 1970 period.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > But we are talking about Rahu and Rahu

> would

> > > > > > > > > > > > give results of Sun

> > > > > > > > > > > > > more

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > prominently, by conjunction, as you

> guessed but

> > > > > > > > > > > > also that of

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Mercury

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > (You have a Dharmakarmaadhipati yoga

> after all)

> > > > > > > > > > > > and that is why I

> > > > > > > > > > > > > said

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > for understanding Sun its dasha instead

> of Rahu

> > > > > > > > > > > > dasha needs to be

> > > > > > > > > > > > > analyzed.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mercury is malefic not because I say so

> but

> > > > > > > > > > > > because Jyotish says

> > > > > > > > > > > > > that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > mercury is malefic when conjunct a papa

> graha

> > > > > > > > > > > > and he is conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > > > two,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun and Rahu.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the apex of Artha trikona

> and

> > > > > > > > > > > > directly involved with

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > efforts to earn money. Though claimed to

> be

> > > > > > > > > > > > smashana/burial

> > > > > > > > > > > > > ground, it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > is 4th from ayush sthana (8th) and its

> home

> > > that

> > > > > > > > > > > > is why affliction

> > > > > > > > > > > > > to it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > can give death. But 8th is more popularly

> > > called

> > > > > > > > > > > > mrityu sthana and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > hence

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th is called Smashana. If it is really

> > > > > > > > > > > > smashana why would it be

> > > > > > > > > > > > > called

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > karma sthana and why would Sun be at its

> most

> > > > > > > > > > > > brilliant there?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > I did not say he can not represent water

> bodies

> > > > > > > > > > > > in temple, but not

> > > > > > > > > > > > > only

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > those.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My Sun dasa was excellent too. My father

> > > > > > > > > > > > received promotion(s),

> > > > > > > > > > > > > my

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > school/college days were great and i

> received

> > > > > > > > > > > > wide acclaim/prizes

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > for my ability in creative writing,

> Veena,

> > > > > > > > > > > > quiz contests etc,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > apart

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > from studies. So, for a student, I guess

> > > > > > > > > > > > that's excellent!!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > How do you justify this, if Sun were

> weak?

> > > > > > > > > > > > Rahu is certainly

> > > > > > > > > > > > > giving

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > the yogakaraka results, but being in

> Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > > > house and being

> > > > > > > > > > > > > conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun, don't you think Rahu is also

> giving the

> > > > > > > > > > > > results of Sun? You

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > said that mercury is malefic and heavily

> > > > > > > > > > > > combust too:--))

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1th house also represent burial

> > > > > > > > > > > > ground/smashaana. Is that a place

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > for attachment?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandra represents all water bodies, so

> why

> > > > > > > > > > > > can't he represent

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > temple tank?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > === message truncated ===

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

>

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Tired of spam? Mail has the best spam

> > > protection

> > > > > > > around

> > > > > > > > > > > <>

> < <>>

> > > < <>

> < <>>>

> > > > > < <>

> < <>>

> > > < <>

> < <>>>>

> > > > > > > < <>

> < <>>

> > > < <>

> < <>>>

> > > > > < <>

> < <>>

> > > < <>

> < <>>>>>

> > > > > > > > > < <>

> < <>>

> > > < <>

> < <>>>

> > > > > < <>

> < <>>

> > > < <>

> < <>>>>

> > > > > > > < <>

> < <>>

> > > < <>

> < <>>>

> > > > > < <>

> < <>>

> > > < <>

> < <>>>>>>

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > ---------------

> -----

> > > ----

> > > > > -

> > > > > > > > > -------

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database:

> 268.11.7/435 -

> > > Release

> > > > > > > Date:

> > > > > > > > > 8/31/2006

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> removed]

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > -------------------

> -----

> > > -

> > > > > > > -------

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.12.2/441 -

> Release

> > > > > Date:

> > > > > > > 9/7/2006

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

[Guest guest]

Dear Divine Lakshmi,

I hope you do not want me to translate Aanana as head? I do not see you

disputing Kundalini in Mulaadhara being called Triramani, GYaanini etc.

though you think she is inauspicious there. May I know why? I hope you

do not dispute Lord Krishna's opinion on GYana.

Chandrashekhar.

 

b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

>

>

> Om Gurave Namah

>

> Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

>

> Thanks for sharing the nice shloka with us. I am sorry that I had

> indeed overlooked responding to it. In this regard, I have already

> given my explanation of what's auspicious and what's not, based on

> Soubhagya Bhaskaram.

>

> Can you please explain to me how you understand the

> phrase "kulapathänandaikabéjänanä".

>

> Regards,

> Lakshmi

>

>

>

> <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> <chandrashekhar46 wrote:

> >

> > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> >

> > If you think Sahasrara and Vishuddha Chakras at the same place,

> and if

> > Pankaja refers to head and not face, all your arguments are

> acceptable.

> > Unfortunately they are not.

> >

> > I see that you have not given anything in support of your argument

> > barring conjectures and have not commented on the shloka I sent

> you.

> >

> > Chandrashekhar.

> >

> > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > >

> > >

> > > Om Gurave Namah

> > >

> > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > >

> > > Lalitha Sahasranaamam describes Mother thus...

> > >

> > > Srimadvaagbhavakootaika swaroopamukha pankajaa

> > > kanthaadhakatiparyanta madhyakoota swaroopini

> > > Shaktikootaikathaapanna katyadhobhaagadhaariNi.

> > >

> > > The three divisions are

> > >

> > > Vagbhava koota - the face/head

> > > Madhya/kamaraaja koota - from neck to kati

> > > Shakti koota - the portion after kati to feet

> > >

> > > Can you tell me in this division, where does the head come...in

> the

> > > vagbhava koota or in shakti koota? Is there any other koota

> defined

> > > for the head/rear portion of the face etc? Or do you imply that

> > > Mother has only a face without the head!!!

> > >

> > > You know very well that we are not talking of astrology mappings

> > > here. Yet why you choose to interpret even a simple principle in

> > > this strange fashion is some thing beyond me, unless you are

> > > confused yourself (can happen to all of us) or want to confuse

> > > others (no comments).

> > >

> > > If either Bhagavan Hayagriva or Sage Agasthya intended that "bisa

> > > tantu taneeyasi" should be understood wrt kundalini at Mooladhara

> > > also they would have put it immediately after "mooladharaika

> > > nilayaa.. and not after "shatchakropari samsthithaa".

> > >

> > > ofcourse, I do not mean that Kundalini is like a python at

> > > mooladhara:--)), but definitely much grosser than at sahasraara.

> > >

> > > Btw, I am sure you know that kundalini is not agni tattwatmika at

> > > mooladhara. The agnitattwa of "vidyullekha" happens only from

> > > swadhisthana, because agni is oordhwa mukha and is ignited only

> when

> > > the Kundalini turns upwards.

> > >

> > > Regards,

> > > Lakshmi

> > >

> > >

> <%40>

> > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > >

> > > > By the way Vag beeja kuta is not only head but a group of

> > > Panchadhasha

> > > > mantra and referred to as maa's face indicating the vacha.

> > > > Raajrajeshwari Kavacha prays that the vagbija protect the

> throat

> > > and not

> > > > the head as you imply. Certainly not head. And her principal

> abode

> > > is

> > > > said to be Mulaadhara and not sahasrara. However if you want

> to

> > > distort

> > > > this to mean she is inauspicious when dormant you are free to

> do

> > > so. I

> > > > would however request you to think why the HrIm beeja is most

> dear

> > > to

> > > > her and not the AiM beeja (Devi Patha, if you need the

> reference).

> > > It

> > > > would perhaps be well to understand that Kundalini means of

> the

> > > coiled

> > > > form and "Visa Tantu..." coming after that certainly does not

> mean

> > > what

> > > > you want to think it does.

> > > >

> > > > In the meanwhile, please contemplate on this.

> > > > Aaxare prdevta Éìjntax> k…{flI devta

> > > > ädhäre paradevatä bhavrajanatädhaù kuëòalé devatä

> > > > devanamixdevta iÇjgtamanNdpuÃiSwta,

> > > > devänämadhidevatä trijagatämänandapuïjasthitä|

> > > > mUlaxarinvaisnI iÇrm[i ya }ainnI mailnI

> > > > mülädhäraniväsiné triramaëé yä jïäniné mäliné

> > > > sa me mat&mnuiSwta k…lpwanNdEkbIjanna.32,21.

> > > > sä me mätåmanusthitä kulapathänandaikabéjänanä||32|21||

> > > >

> > > > This is how Kundalini is described in Rudrayamala Tantra. Do

> you

> > > think

> > > > it is wrong?

> > > >

> > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > >

> > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > >

> > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > >

> > > > > "vagbhavabeejasya kundalineethi sangnyaa

> thadroopa"...Kundalini

> > > as

> > > > > preceding "bisa tantu taneeyasee" is described as vagbhava

> beeja

> > > > > or "aim" (saraswati) beeja. As you have read the yamalas, i

> am

> > > sure

> > > > > you know which part of body comprises of vagbhava

> koota...it's

> > > the

> > > > > head!!

> > > > >

> > > > > Let me also explain the term preceding kundalini.

> > > > > It's "mahaasakthiH" and not "MahashakthiH" and talks of the

> > > > > eagerness of Mother to unite with Shiva....mahe utsave

> tatratya

> > > > > shivashaktisamaayogaroope aasakthiH tatparataa yasyaaH.

> > > > >

> > > > > Is this enough to show that "bisa tantu taneeyasee" is the

> > > climactic

> > > > > name of shakti in ascension?

> > > > >

> > > > > Regarding Devi worshippers wrt unawakened kundalini, let me

> quote

> > > > > this sentence.....hey Srividyopaasakaah. uttishtatha. maa

> > > > > swaptha....meaning o srividyopaasaka! wake up( the

> kundalini).

> > > don't

> > > > > let it sleep!!

> > > > >

> > > > > Many thanks for this extended discussion on Kundalini. It's

> time

> > > for

> > > > > taking leave.

> > > > >

> > > > > Regards,

> > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > >

> > > > >

> <%40>

> > > <%40>

> > > > > <%40>, "b_lakshmi_ramesh"

> > > > > <b_lakshmi_ramesh@> wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > The shadripus are kaama (lust), krodha (anger), lobha

> (greed),

> > > > > moha

> > > > > > (attachment, delusion), mada (pride) and maatsarya

> (jealousy)

> > > > > > If "mada" means "lust" what does "kaama" imply among the

> > > > > > shadripus? "Mada" signifies one who is intoxicated/drunk

> with

> > > > > > power/self-grandeur (pride/ego).

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Mother is known as "Vidya and avidya swaroopini" and

> correct

> > > > > > appreciation of Mother includes understanding of both

> facets.

> > > As

> > > > > > Shakti, She respresents raw power which can be routed

> towards

> > > good

> > > > > > deeds as well as bad deeds. Are both ends the same? The

> wisdom,

> > > > > > required to put this immense shakti to good use, is

> > > represented by

> > > > > > Shiva, hence the union of Shiva and Parvati, wisdom and

> power,

> > > is

> > > > > > said to be auspicious because it ensures the

> correct/judicious

> > > end

> > > > > > use of shakti. Hence the orientation of Shakti is very

> very

> > > > > > important.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I always said that Soorya is both sattwik and krura. I

> also

> > > always

> > > > > > said all planets, including Jupiter, can give malefic

> results,

> > > if

> > > > > > they are functionally empowered to do so. You can refer

> to all

> > > my

> > > > > > previous mails to confirm this.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Sir, Truth is much more important than winning or losing

> an

> > > > > > argument. All discussions must proceed as an exploration

> and

> > > > > > celebration of Truth. When this is not the case, I see no

> > > purpose

> > > > > in

> > > > > > continuing these discussions.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Thanks & Regards,

> > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> <%40>

> > > <%40>

> > > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Having Icchamrityu and dying at an early age are

> operating at

> > > > > > different

> > > > > > > levels. Bhishma had Iccha Mrityu but did not die young.

> So

> > > > > please

> > > > > > do not

> > > > > > > try to mix the issues. If you have read Swamiji's

> biography

> > > you

> > > > > > will

> > > > > > > find that he fell sick many times despite of apparent

> robust

> > > > > > physique.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Commenting on Shani in 4th for Rama's chart confirms

> with his

> > > > > > being

> > > > > > > capable of giving Vipareeta results. I did not know I

> was

> > > > > expected

> > > > > > to

> > > > > > > analyze the entire chart. By the way if there is a Kuja

> dosha

> > > > > how

> > > > > > does

> > > > > > > that by itself give a Divine wife? Please do not bring

> our

> > > > > > devotion to

> > > > > > > Lord Rama (and we both have that) into astrological

> analysis

> > > of

> > > > > > his chart.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Bringing in the dashas when the discussions are on the

> > > effects

> > > > > of

> > > > > > grahas

> > > > > > > will only lead the discussion to no where. The two have

> to be

> > > > > seen

> > > > > > > separately as we are not trying to time an event but

> only

> > > trying

> > > > > > to find

> > > > > > > what are the effects on bhavas occupied.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Dear Lakshmi in Ramana Maharshi's chart you have perhaps

> > > > > forgotten

> > > > > > the

> > > > > > > saying Kuja vat Ketu. look at the Ketu deha in that

> > > perspective

> > > > > > and let

> > > > > > > me know your views. And if by the way you read my mail,

> I did

> > > > > not

> > > > > > say

> > > > > > > anything about mars being killer for him, only that it

> gave

> > > him

> > > > > > Sarcoma

> > > > > > > being 3rd lord.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Also could you explain why Sun being Atma and always

> > > beneficent

> > > > > as

> > > > > > you

> > > > > > > have claimed all along in the thread on the topic, did

> its

> > > > > > Mahadasha

> > > > > > > prove to be Killer to Ramana Maharshi?

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Take care,

> > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > For example, remember that in Swami Vivekananda's

> chart

> > > > > Surya

> > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > lord of

> > > > > > > > > the 9th occupying the lagna and causing a powerful

> Raj

> > > yoga.

> > > > > At

> > > > > > > > the same

> > > > > > > > > time if you thin how long the Swamiji lived, you may

> > > have to

> > > > > > think

> > > > > > > > again

> > > > > > > > > about saying that it did not act as Mahakrura. Think

> > > about

> > > > > > what it

> > > > > > > > did

> > > > > > > > > to the 7th bhava of Swamiji, also, before declaring

> that

> > > it

> > > > > > became

> > > > > > > > > shubha or less malefic.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Lakshmi: I think Swamiji had an icchamrityu and

> looking at

> > > the

> > > > > > dass

> > > > > > > > operating on 4th July 1902, I observe that he passed

> away

> > > in

> > > > > Jup-

> > > > > > Ven-

> > > > > > > > Jup-Ket-Sat-Sat.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Jup MD: 1893-02-09 (1:35:30 pm) - 1909-02-10 (3:59:13

> pm)

> > > > > > > > Ven AD: 1900-12-25 (10:03:30 am) - 1903-08-27

> (4:48:54 pm)

> > > > > > > > Jup PD: 1902-05-02 (1:42:07 pm) - 1902-09-12

> (10:43:55 pm)

> > > > > > > > Ket SD: 1902-06-29 (9:11:48 am) - 1902-07-07 (5:06:28

> am)

> > > > > > > > Sat PAD: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-06

> (2:29:24 am)

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Sat: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-05 (1:27:03 am)

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Jupiter is in 2nd house from Moon, Venus is the 2nd

> lord

> > > from

> > > > > > Moon

> > > > > > > > and is posited in 2nd from lagna, Ketu is in the

> house of

> > > > > Venus

> > > > > > and

> > > > > > > > gives the results of Venus and Saturn is the 2nd lord

> from

> > > > > > > > lagna....all are marakas. the maraka significations

> are

> > > > > stronger

> > > > > > > > from Moon, and it's the cause of his early death.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > I fail to see where Sun comes into all this.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > However, I agree that Sun, as AK aspecting 7th house,

> can

> > > give

> > > > > > > > parivraja tendencies. But can you ignore the

> influence of

> > > > > Saturn

> > > > > > on

> > > > > > > > Moon and 4th house, occuring in the 10th house? I am

> sure

> > > even

> > > > > > weak

> > > > > > > > Sun would have given him parivraja yoga:--))but

> without the

> > > > > raja

> > > > > > > > yoga and the strong soul-level impact he created

> wherever

> > > he

> > > > > > went.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Or if you like look at what happened to the 7th

> > > > > > > > > Bhava of Lord Rama with exalted Mars in the 7th

> bhava.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Mars in 7th gives kuja dosha, and I think the strong

> Mars

> > > in

> > > > > 7th

> > > > > > > > gave him an exalted wife like Sita. You have not

> commented

> > > on

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > > exalted Saturn in 4th house.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > In each of the

> > > > > > > > > example provided by you look at the bhava that the

> > > planets

> > > > > > occupy

> > > > > > > > > (barring Saturn, for reasons already stated in

> previous

> > > > > mail),

> > > > > > > > without

> > > > > > > > > looking at the charts as belonging to great people,

> and

> > > then

> > > > > > make

> > > > > > > > up

> > > > > > > > > your mind as to the truth or otherwise of what I

> said.

> > > Did

> > > > > you

> > > > > > > > know

> > > > > > > > > Ramana Maharshi died following a malignant sarcoma

> of

> > > left

> > > > > hand

> > > > > > > > and Mars

> > > > > > > > > is karaka for the 3rd bhava in 8th in his chart, in

> > > > > > exaltation. Do

> > > > > > > > you

> > > > > > > > > think Mars gave him benevolent results?

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I also request you to examine the

> following

> > > dasa

> > > > > > > > sequences with an open mind. Sun is the 3rd lord from

> Moon

> > > (AK)

> > > > > &

> > > > > > > > 12th lord from lagna in Sri Ramana's chart, rahu is

> with

> > > Sun

> > > > > and

> > > > > > > > gives Sun'/Saturn's/Jupiter's effects...all of which

> point

> > > to

> > > > > > > > dusthanas, Saturn is a maraka in 7th house and ketu

> can

> > > give

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > > effects of Moon/Mercury/mars. Mar's effect, if at

> all, was

> > > only

> > > > > > > > indirect, and he was not the killer.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Sun MD: 1949-02-03 (1:02:22 am) - 1955-02-03 (2:05:32

> pm)

> > > > > > > > Rah AD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1951-02-21 (8:49:14

> am)

> > > > > > > > Rah PD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1950-05-18

> (12:04:47 am)

> > > > > > > > Sat SD: 1950-04-12 (3:37:16 am) - 1950-04-20

> (12:18:02 am)

> > > > > > > > Ket PAD: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14

> (11:08:26

> > > pm)

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Ket: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14 (12:47:04

> pm)

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > I think what stands out is the fact that the dasa of

> the

> > > graha

> > > > > > > > conjoined Moon brought about death. I think their mind

> > > willed

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > > death.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Can a planet give results in a dasa totally

> > > > > > unrelated/unassociated

> > > > > > > > with itself? I request you to consider the above

> > > objectively.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > I will talk about the other charts/issues in my next

> mail.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > In Paramhans Ramkrishna's chart,

> > > > > > > > > I do not know where you find Mars strong as a

> planet in

> > > > > > > > debilitation in

> > > > > > > > > Navamsha gives results of debility even when in

> > > exaltation

> > > > > in

> > > > > > rasi

> > > > > > > > > chart. In case of Saturn Viparitam shane smritam has

> > > already

> > > > > > been

> > > > > > > > > mentioned by me, in earlier mail.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I myself have not considered Mars/Venus

> in

> > > > > Thakur's

> > > > > > > > chart because they are debilitated. Please go through

> my

> > > > > message

> > > > > > > > again. I was talking about Saturn and Rahu.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > About Shri Aurobindo, I trust you are

> > > > > > > > > aware of his revolutionary background and that he

> was

> > > editor

> > > > > > of a

> > > > > > > > paper

> > > > > > > > > "Vande Mataram" not much known for its soft

> language.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Same is the case with strong Malefics giving P.M.

> Yogas.

> > > > > Every

> > > > > > > > graha is

> > > > > > > > > capable of 12 variations of a P.M. Yoga attributed

> to

> > > it, at

> > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > very

> > > > > > > > > least. It would only be naive to imagine they would

> all

> > > give

> > > > > > > > identical

> > > > > > > > > results as indicated by Parashara or all with Pancha

> > > > > > Mahapurusha

> > > > > > > > Yoga

> > > > > > > > > would only rule over different parts of India

> (barring

> > > > > Saturn),

> > > > > > > > just

> > > > > > > > > because the sage said so. The sages gave us

> principles

> > > and

> > > > > > > > expected us

> > > > > > > > > to apply them to real life horoscope using Viveka.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > I would gladly give you the shloka giving the

> reference

> > > to

> > > > > > > > > "Viparita---Shane..." it is from an old classic

> respected

> > > > > > amongst

> > > > > > > > > astrologers, but as you do not seem to accept

> anything

> > > that

> > > > > > does

> > > > > > > > not fit

> > > > > > > > > in with what, you think. is said by Dr. Raman, it

> would

> > > be an

> > > > > > > > exercise

> > > > > > > > > in futility. should you yet want the shloka I would

> of

> > > > > course

> > > > > > be

> > > > > > > > glad to

> > > > > > > > > give it to you.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave namah

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > You seem to be disagreeing with Shri B.V. Raman

> that

> > > strong

> > > > > > > > planets,

> > > > > > > > > > whether malefic or benefics give good results,

> while

> > > weak

> > > > > > planets

> > > > > > > > > > give bad results. Perhaps you also disagree about

> > > strong

> > > > > > malefics

> > > > > > > > > > giving mahapurusha yogas. Isn't it contrary to

> what

> > > all the

> > > > > > > > jyotish

> > > > > > > > > > texts teach?

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Then, here are a few examples, where I find that

> strong

> > > > > > malefics

> > > > > > > > > > have neither made the natives krura nor that their

> > > > > > significations

> > > > > > > > > > suffered.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Swami Vivekananda: strong sun in lagna and mars

> in 5th

> > > > > house

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Sri Aurobindo: Strong Sun in 2nd house.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Maharshi Mahesh yogi: exalted Mars in lagna.

> > > > > > > > > > Ramana Maharshi: strong Mars in 8th house

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Sri Ramakrishna Paramahamsa: Exalted Saturn(9H)

> and

> > > Rahu

> > > > > > (4H).

> > > > > > > > Mars

> > > > > > > > > > and Venus are also exalted in rasi, while

> debilitated

> > > in

> > > > > > navamsa.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Sir, can you give me the reference for "vipareetam

> > > shaneH

> > > > > > > > sritam"?

> > > > > > > > > > Does it, by any chance, refer to Saturn's

> placement in

> > > the

> > > > > > 8th

> > > > > > > > house

> > > > > > > > > > being beneficial?

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > I am happy that you agree strong Saturn gives good

> > > results.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Can you tell me from where the saying is because i

> > > would

> > > > > > like to

> > > > > > > > > > read it up myself and understand.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > --- Chandrashekhar <chandrashekhar46@

> > > > > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk>>

> > > > > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > About Krura planets the saying is, that with

> > > > > > > > > > > > > strength the Krura grahas

> > > > > > > > > > > > > become more Krura (Maha-krura) and the

> shubha

> > > grahas

> > > > > > > > > > > > > become more shubha.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Only Shani is more krura when weak and

> > > beneficial or

> > > > > > > > > > > > > less krura when

> > > > > > > > > > > > > strong "Viparitama shaneH smritam".

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > My sun dasa started when I was 9 years

> old, and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > ended when I was 15

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > years old. How come you didn't notice the

> > > second

> > > > > > > > > > > > > part? I was old

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > enough to understand the difference

> between

> > > > > > > > > > > > > success and failure, I

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > guess!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Anyway, if you agree that Rahu is giving

> Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > > > > results, and those

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > results are exceptionally good, then it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > automatically follows that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun is strong in my chart because

> according to

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Shri B.V Raman, evil

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > planets, especially when weak, give bad

> results

> > > > > > > > > > > > > (vide "a catechism

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > of astrology"), while strong planets,

> even if

> > > > > > > > > > > > > evil, give good

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > results. If my Sun were weak, he wouldn't

> be

> > > > > > > > > > > > > giving such good

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > results:--))

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Since Mercury is hopelessly combust and

> > > inferior

> > > > > > > > > > > > > in shadbala

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > strength, the major results of Dharma

> > > > > > > > > > > > > karmadhipathi yoga are also

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > given by Sun, because according to "300

> > > > > > > > > > > > > combinations" of Sri

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Raman, a planet with higher shadbala is

> more

> > > > > > > > > > > > > likely to give the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > results of a yoga.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regarding Karna, I request you to read the

> > > Karna

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Parva of

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mahabharata again. When he died, the

> nature

> > > bowed

> > > > > > > > > > > > > in grief, because

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > he's one of the noblest persons in

> Mahabharata.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Even the episode you

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > quoted happened because Parashurama would

> teach

> > > > > > > > > > > > > only Brahmins and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Karna desperately wanted to learn

> dhanurvidya

> > > from

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Parashurama so

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > that he can support Duryodhana. Deceit is

> > > > > > > > > > > > > certainly punishable and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Karna did pay dearly. But it's to be

> borne in

> > > mind

> > > > > > > > > > > > > that whatever

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Karna did was only to please Duryodhana,

> his

> > > > > > > > > > > > > dearest friend. Karna

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > did not gain anything personally.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the 3rd house from 8th

> house (I

> > > > > > > > > > > > > think there was a typo

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > at your end). In the natural zodiac, the

> 10 th

> > > > > > > > > > > > > sign, being the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > cardinal earth sign, represents

> south /dakshina

> > > > > > > > > > > > > disha. South is the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > direction ruled by Yama, the lord of

> death,

> > > hence

> > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > represents burial grounds. So, the Rudras

> > > (Saturn,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun and Mars) are

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > strong in south. Also, Sun resides in

> south and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > starts his

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > northern voyage from here. So he has

> digbala in

> > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > I did clarify that when I referred to

> Surya as

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Karma saakshi, it's

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > only to his status as antaraatma and not

> as a

> > > > > > > > > > > > > deity. Perhaps this

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > escaped your attention.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > This is my last post on the subject.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> <%40>

> > > <%40>

> > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40>,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You were too young for the results of

> the

> > > dasha

> > > > > > > > > > > > > to manifest,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > though it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is good news that your father had

> promotions

> > > and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > you received

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > prizes/accolades during that time. It is

> > > > > > > > > > > > > interesting to know you

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > got

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > these results at a young age of 9 or so

> as

> > > that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > is when Sun dasha

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > was

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > operative. I am relieved you did not

> have any

> > > > > > > > > > > > > health problems in

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > March-August 1970 period.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But we are talking about Rahu and Rahu

> would

> > > > > > > > > > > > > give results of Sun

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > more

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > prominently, by conjunction, as you

> guessed

> > > but

> > > > > > > > > > > > > also that of

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mercury

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (You have a Dharmakarmaadhipati yoga

> after

> > > all)

> > > > > > > > > > > > > and that is why I

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > said

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > for understanding Sun its dasha instead

> of

> > > Rahu

> > > > > > > > > > > > > dasha needs to be

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > analyzed.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mercury is malefic not because I say so

> but

> > > > > > > > > > > > > because Jyotish says

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > mercury is malefic when conjunct a papa

> graha

> > > > > > > > > > > > > and he is conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > two,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun and Rahu.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the apex of Artha trikona

> and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > directly involved with

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > efforts to earn money. Though claimed

> to be

> > > > > > > > > > > > > smashana/burial

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > ground, it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is 4th from ayush sthana (8th) and its

> home

> > > that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > is why affliction

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > to it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > can give death. But 8th is more

> popularly

> > > called

> > > > > > > > > > > > > mrityu sthana and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > hence

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th is called Smashana. If it is really

> > > > > > > > > > > > > smashana why would it be

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > called

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > karma sthana and why would Sun be at

> its most

> > > > > > > > > > > > > brilliant there?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I did not say he can not represent water

> > > bodies

> > > > > > > > > > > > > in temple, but not

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > only

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > those.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My Sun dasa was excellent too. My

> father

> > > > > > > > > > > > > received promotion(s),

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > my

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > school/college days were great and i

> > > received

> > > > > > > > > > > > > wide acclaim/prizes

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > for my ability in creative writing,

> Veena,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > quiz contests etc,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > apart

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > from studies. So, for a student, I

> guess

> > > > > > > > > > > > > that's excellent!!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > How do you justify this, if Sun were

> weak?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Rahu is certainly

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > giving

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > the yogakaraka results, but being in

> Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > > > > house and being

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun, don't you think Rahu is also

> giving

> > > the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > results of Sun? You

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > said that mercury is malefic and

> heavily

> > > > > > > > > > > > > combust too:--))

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1th house also represent burial

> > > > > > > > > > > > > ground/smashaana. Is that a place

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > for attachment?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandra represents all water bodies,

> so why

> > > > > > > > > > > > > can't he represent

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > temple tank?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > === message truncated ===

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

>

> > > > > > > > > > > >

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> > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

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[Guest guest]

Dear Prabodh,

 

I can understand why you find it difficult to see ego in the speeches

that you quoted. That precisely is why I said that it is better not to

bring personalities in discussions on astrology, especially those whom

one may revere. It is not easy to be dispassionate about their actions

or speech.

 

If a King proclaiming his virtues himself is not ego then pray what is?

It is an accepted practice that one does not broadcast one's virtue

oneself. I think you will understand the source of the following.

@tavan! @v pué;ae yt! £ jaya£ATma àja£#it h, ivàa> àa÷s! twa c£@tdœ yae

-taR sa Sm&t£A¼na. 9£45

9.45. He only is a perfect man who consists (of three persons united),

his wife, himself, and his offspring; thus (says the Veda), and

(learned) Brahmanas propound this (maxim) likewise, 'The husband is

declared to be one with the wife.'

 

And though as you have quoted Lord Rama saying " I will not mind any

affliction in abandoning my wife for the good of my subjects". and

called it Vedic Dharma. Let me quote Manusmriti on when a King should

give up his wife.

"Aapdw¡ xn< r]edœ daran! r]edœ xnErœ Aip, AaTman< stt< r]edœ darErœ Aip

xnErœ Aip." 7£213

7.213.

For times of need let him preserve his wealth; at the expense of his

wealth let him preserve his wife; let him at all events preserve himself

even by (giving up) his wife and his wealth.

 

So do you think that what was said was more of a boast or otherwise?

 

About the conduct of Kings Manusmriti says:

sMmanadœ äaü[ae inTym! %iÖjet iv;adœ #v, Am&tSy£#v c£Aka'œ]edœ AvmanSy

svRda. 2£162

 

venae ivnòae Aivnyat! £ n÷;z! c£@v paiwRv>, suda> pEjvnz! c£@v sumuoae

inimrœ @v c. 7£41

7.41.

Through a want of humility Vena perished, likewise king Nahusha, Sudas,

the son of Pigavana, Sumukha, and Nemi.

 

I am sure you recognize names of many Vedic Kings there. Do you think

Parashara was unaware of this and so he must have meant what you imply?

 

Think again. It is easy to swear by one sage and think his words meant

what we want them to mean and it may be entirely different what he in

fact meant to convey.

 

Endless debate on what is Mada is possible but Koshas, Higher Sanskrit

Grammar by M.R. Bhat and other sources do indicate that Mada is

primarily intoxication state, the reasons being variable. I think it is

well to remember that rahu delivers results based on the graha conjunct

or the lord of the Bhava occupied or 7th from itself and even those of

planets aspecting it ( by extension). No wonder that rahu occupying

house of Mars in 5th can cause problems in begetting progeny.

 

If as you think Rahu who is Mada and that it means Pride then why Rahu

in 5th should create problems in the house of progeny. It should give

more progeny and with ease as the indications will be that of the jataka

having pride on account of multiple progeny. Though for the life of me I

do not understand why the combination given by you indicates that rahu

is Pride. And that, that is the reason for the person not having Progeny

or having difficulty in getting progeny.

 

I do not find again, that Parashara is referring to Rahu only being in

the 5th or as you say Rahu alone in the example given by you. He on the

other hand does say that rahu has to be in a) 5th house and B) in the

rasi of Mars or aspected by Mars, for problems in begetting progeny. Or

have I not been able to understand what you are diriving at when you say

Parashara giving independent indications of rahu in the example given?

 

Chandrashekhar.

 

 

 

Prabodh Vekhande wrote:

>

>

> Dear Chandrashekhar Ji namste

>

> >Most of the

> > speeches that you quote, if read with due detachment and ignoring

> the

> > personalities making them, would sound most egoist speeches to all

> and

> > sundry. I know saying this would raise

> > tempers on the list but truth must prevail.

>

> Exactly. Truth must prevail. Why a passionate speech by a vedic king

> should be treated as expression of Ego? If this is ego then every

> thing by a king towards his subjects will be ego.

> Ofcourse, I am nobody to object your views about that but it would be

> interesting to find out what excatly you considered as egoist in

> those speeches.

>

> > But one can go on arguing on this aspect to no end and bringing in

> the

> > ideal king as an example of King and conjecturing the Parashara

> meant

> > that King, while good for argument's sake may not be the right way

> to

> > look at astrological principles.

>

> I wanted to say that in a Vedic context, King means who takes pride

> in the welfare of the subjects and will not have absolute power like

> in western philosophy. Such vedic king may be ideal or may not be

> ideal but what vedic scriptures say must be kept in mind. If we

> believe that Parashara is vedic Jyotish Pravartak then there is no

> question about what he had in mind when he said about Surya being

> King. Terms which are Vedic should be treated on the Vedic context.

> It does not matter as to how many kings were cruel towards subjects

> in Vedic times what matters is that how scriptures describe the

> king.What are his duties and what should be his authority and how he

> should excercise it? That is why it essential to get in to what Vedas

> and Manu says about king's duties. If you feel that I am

> unnecessarily getting this point, I respectfully request you to

> please think on this.

>

> > Do you think Mada does not mean intoxication or state of

> intoxication in

> > Sanskrit?

>

> Mada does mean Intoxication but point is that it as well means Pride!

> Why to forget this? If Kalyan Verma says that Rahu is associated with

> Mada then all meanings of Mada will be associated with Rahu. That

> will include being intoxicated and as well being into state of Pride.

> Since rahu as well is understood as 'limitless' so naturally pride

> will be limitless and hence will be Ego.

>

> There is no doubt that Rahu gives the results like Shani or the lord

> of the house occupied by him but this possibly we apply more, when we

> are into timing of events. Otherwise why Parashara has said few

> things only related to Rahu? Like he says that 5th house Rahu when

> aspected by Mars or in the houses of Mars then the native will have

> problems in the progeny. He could have simply said in one line that

> Rahu should be Always treated as lord of the house occupied by him or

> like Shani and that would have ended the references of Rahu. But

> parashara clearly gives the independent references of Rahu.

>

> Thanks a lot for your Time and Sapce.

>

> Prabodh Vekhande

> Jai Jai Shankar

> Har Har Shankar

>

>

> <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> <chandrashekhar46 wrote:

> >

> > Dear Prabodh,

> >

> > You are not wrong when you say that "So in a Vedic Jyotish way the

> Sun

> > in strength will have PRIDE in being ideal king' for his subjects

> (other

> > Grahas)." But if the King is doing what is only his duty as per the

> > Vedic Dharma, then pride in such context will be Ego. Most of the

> > speeches that you quote, if read with due detachment and ignoring

> the

> > personalities making them, would sound most egoist speeches to all

> and

> > sundry. I know saying this would raise

> > tempers on the list but truth must prevail.

> >

> > But one can go on arguing on this aspect to no end and bringing in

> the

> > ideal king as an example of King and conjecturing the Parashara

> meant

> > that King, while good for argument's sake may not be the right way

> to

> > look at astrological principles. The first pitfall would be that

> though

> > it is fashionable these days to say that all Kings of Vedic times

> acted

> > as they should the fact remains that Puranas and Vedas are replete

> with

> > stories of Kings who were very cruel t their subjects and harassed

> those

> > performing vedic Rituals. When this is pointed out tempers flare

> which

> > is a sure beginning of a rational discussion on the principles of

> > astrology going awry.

> >

> > That is why it is better to steer clear of the scriptures when

> > discussing astrology, specially on a public list, as the scriptures

> are

> > subject to different interpretations.

> >

> > Do you think Mada does not mean intoxication or state of

> intoxication in

> > Sanskrit? I am sure that Unmaada is one of the five arrows of

> Madana.

> > And that is Mada represented by Rahu. That is what flows through

> the

> > temporal glands of a bull elephant and then the bull elephant

> becomes

> > uncontrollable like being intoxicated.

> >

> > Again if you happen to refer to kosha you will find synonyms for

> the

> > five types of pride to be Garva, Abhimaana, Ahankara, Maana etc.

> While

> > in English language Pride has certain connotation, to find exact

> > synonyms to Sanskrit words is always difficult.

> >

> > Letting apart these discussions which will more often mislead than

> solve

> > anything, let us at least agree that the sage does say that Rahu

> and

> > Ketu behave as the lords of the house occupied by them or the lord

> of a

> > house that they conjoin.

> >

> > If we are agreed on this then think why should Rahu, or Ketu for

> that

> > matter, who can not deliver own results but has to depend on other

> > planets to express itself would, by itself and devoid of other

> graha

> > combination; be endowed with the quality of Ego by the writer. More

> so

> > why when Rahu when alone is said to give results of Shani (Manda

> Sama

> > Rahu..) as Shani is certainly not connected with ego by any stretch

> of

> > imagination.

> >

> > Take care,

> > Chandrashekhar.

> >

> >

> > Prabodh Vekhande wrote:

> > >

> > >

> > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji Namste

> > >

> > > It was indeed a great plesure to read your mails regarding

> > > interpretations of the astrological text and more specially how

> > > Sanskrit language words can mislead at times. Now I have some

> doubts.

> > >

> > > I think Pride means Self-respect and Ego means Inflated or False

> > > Pride. Parashara has attributed the Sun to being Raja or King. In

> the

> > > vedic philosophy we see that Raja was suppose to take care of the

> > > welfare of his subjects. In the Chandogya Upanishad the king

> > > Ashvapati describes his kingdom and his subjects as: "In my

> kingdom

> > > there is no thief,no coward,nor amiser,no drunked,nor is there one

> > > who has not taken the vow of worship of the'Fire', no idots, nor

> men

> > > of loose character.Where could therefore be here women without

> > > morals?"(Chandogya 5-11). We as well see similar references in

> > > Ramayana regarding RamaRajya. Rama says: I will forsake

> everything,

> > > affection,compassion,happiness,even my beloved wife Janaki, for

> the

> > > sake of the welfare of my subjects. I will not mind any

> affliction in

> > > abondoning my wife for the good of my subjects". We find many such

> > > references in RigVeda and Atherva veda as well. The great epic of

> > > VedaVyasa as well gives similar attributes to King.Such was the

> > > concept of the ideal of the institution of kingship, which every

> > > Vedic king took PRIDE in realising.

> > >

> > > In the pasasge of Time there came the western counterpart for

> Vedic

> > > Kings. In the west the mediaeval thinkers invested divine

> inheritance

> > > on the king who was considered to be the representative of God.

> The

> > > king having received his authority to rule by divine right was not

> > > answerable to the people and therefore was an absolute in his own

> > > right.The people had no right to rebel against the king or demand

> his

> > > dethronement. The predominant thought behind that concept was to

> > > bestow sovereign and absolute powers on the king. This naturally

> made

> > > Kings to have 'inflated pride' or EGO. This western mediaeval

> concept

> > > of king had great influence in Mediaeval indian kings as well.

> > >

> > > In Bharat, however, political thinkers never advocated or offered

> any

> > > abolute power and authority to the king. Kingship was always

> regared

> > > as subservient to the will and dependent upon the sanction of the

> > > people and was alwyas answerable to them. So there was no concept

> > > of 'Inflated or False Pride' in the Vedic King. The king being

> fully

> > > aware that all his authority and power were derived from his

> > > subjects would try to look to their welfare.

> > >

> > > So in a Vedic Jyotish way the Sun in strength will have PRIDE in

> > > being ideal 'king' for his subjects(other Grahas). Same, if seen

> in

> > > Western way can mean the Sun will have EGO.

> > >

> > > Moreover, we see that Western(foreign) cocept of Absolute power

> with

> > > the King is exactly opposite that of Vedic concept of King. So in

> a

> > > vedic way of thinking what is wrong in attributting Rahu to

> foreign

> > > concept of inflated & false Pride or EGO.?

> > >

> > > Finally, Mada does mean Pride in sanskrit. When attributed to

> Rahu,

> > > will naturally have the element of falsehood/deceit associated

> with

> > > pride and hence may lead to EGO. Am I wrong?

> > >

> > > Thanks a lot for your Time and Sapce.

> > >

> > > Prabodh Vekhande

> > > Jai Jai Shankar

> > > Har Har Shankar

> > >

> > >

> <%40>

> > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > >

> > > > Pride is different from ego. Like it or not Mada does mean

> > > intoxication

> > > > or lust. The Kama that is referred to relates to kaamana which

> > > means

> > > > desires for things possessed by others. That is what Asteya,

> one of

> > > the

> > > > Yamas of Hatha yogas refer to.

> > > >

> > > > We are talking about auspiciousness or other wise of the

> dormant or

> > > > awakened Kundalini. As I said all scriptures can be

> misinterpreted

> > > if

> > > > one wants to do that. But that does not serve any purpose. I

> would

> > > not

> > > > go into what exactly is meant by Vidya and Avidya related to

> Maa. I

> > > have

> > > > not yet seen any Pramana, in the form of a shloka, to support

> your

> > > > proposition that dormant Kundalini is inauspicious and the

> awakened

> > > > Kundalini is auspicious so far. I have already posted the way

> my

> > > > generation has been taught to accept an argument, so I shall

> not

> > > repeat

> > > > it here.

> > > >

> > > > But I will not resort to conjectures and would like to quote

> from

> > > > Rudrayamala tantra about the swarUpa of dormant Kundalini.

> Being

> > > > graduate in sanskrit, I am sure I will not have to translate

> it for

> > > you.

> > > > Aaxare prdevta Éìjntax> k…{flI devta

> > > > ädhäre paradevatä bhavrajanatädhaù kuëòalé devatä

> > > > devanamixdevta iÇjgtamanNdpuÃiSwta,

> > > > devänämadhidevatä trijagatämänandapuïjasthitä|

> > > > mUlaxarinvaisnI iÇrm[i ya }ainnI mailnI

> > > > mülädhäraniväsiné triramaëé yä jïäniné mäliné

> > > > sa me mat&mnuiSwta k…lpwanNdEkbIjanna.32,21.

> > > > sä me mätåmanusthitä kulapathänandaikabéjänanä||32|21||

> > > >

> > > > I am sure you must have some quote to support your contention.

> I

> > > would

> > > > like to see the shloka, as against conjectures, so that I can

> > > improve

> > > > upon my knowledge of the swarupaa of Kundalini.

> > > >

> > > > I can understand your reluctance to support your propositions

> with

> > > > suitable pramanas. I am sorry if I have hurt you by pointing

> out

> > > the

> > > > inconsistency in the way you treated Surya and Rahu

> combinations in

> > > two

> > > > different chart as stand out combinations only.

> > > >

> > > > I had no intention to cause any hurt to you and if I have done

> so

> > > > inadvertently I crave your pardon.

> > > >

> > > > Take care,

> > > >

> > > > Chandrashekhar

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > >

> > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > >

> > > > > The shadripus are kaama (lust), krodha (anger), lobha

> (greed),

> > > moha

> > > > > (attachment, delusion), mada (pride) and maatsarya (jealousy)

> > > > > If "mada" means "lust" what does "kaama" imply among the

> > > > > shadripus? "Mada" signifies one who is intoxicated/drunk with

> > > > > power/self-grandeur (pride/ego).

> > > > >

> > > > > Mother is known as "Vidya and avidya swaroopini" and correct

> > > > > appreciation of Mother includes understanding of both

> facets. As

> > > > > Shakti, She respresents raw power which can be routed

> towards good

> > > > > deeds as well as bad deeds. Are both ends the same? The

> wisdom,

> > > > > required to put this immense shakti to good use, is

> represented by

> > > > > Shiva, hence the union of Shiva and Parvati, wisdom and

> power, is

> > > > > said to be auspicious because it ensures the

> correct/judicious end

> > > > > use of shakti. Hence the orientation of Shakti is very very

> > > > > important.

> > > > >

> > > > > I always said that Soorya is both sattwik and krura. I also

> always

> > > > > said all planets, including Jupiter, can give malefic

> results, if

> > > > > they are functionally empowered to do so. You can refer to

> all my

> > > > > previous mails to confirm this.

> > > > >

> > > > > Sir, Truth is much more important than winning or losing an

> > > > > argument. All discussions must proceed as an exploration and

> > > > > celebration of Truth. When this is not the case, I see no

> purpose

> > > in

> > > > > continuing these discussions.

> > > > >

> > > > > Thanks & Regards,

> > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > >

> > > > >

> <%40>

> > > <%40>

> > > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Having Icchamrityu and dying at an early age are operating

> at

> > > > > different

> > > > > > levels. Bhishma had Iccha Mrityu but did not die young. So

> > > please

> > > > > do not

> > > > > > try to mix the issues. If you have read Swamiji's

> biography you

> > > > > will

> > > > > > find that he fell sick many times despite of apparent

> robust

> > > > > physique.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Commenting on Shani in 4th for Rama's chart confirms with

> his

> > > > > being

> > > > > > capable of giving Vipareeta results. I did not know I was

> > > expected

> > > > > to

> > > > > > analyze the entire chart. By the way if there is a Kuja

> dosha

> > > how

> > > > > does

> > > > > > that by itself give a Divine wife? Please do not bring our

> > > > > devotion to

> > > > > > Lord Rama (and we both have that) into astrological

> analysis of

> > > > > his chart.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Bringing in the dashas when the discussions are on the

> effects

> > > of

> > > > > grahas

> > > > > > will only lead the discussion to no where. The two have to

> be

> > > seen

> > > > > > separately as we are not trying to time an event but only

> trying

> > > > > to find

> > > > > > what are the effects on bhavas occupied.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Dear Lakshmi in Ramana Maharshi's chart you have perhaps

> > > forgotten

> > > > > the

> > > > > > saying Kuja vat Ketu. look at the Ketu deha in that

> perspective

> > > > > and let

> > > > > > me know your views. And if by the way you read my mail, I

> did

> > > not

> > > > > say

> > > > > > anything about mars being killer for him, only that it

> gave him

> > > > > Sarcoma

> > > > > > being 3rd lord.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Also could you explain why Sun being Atma and always

> beneficent

> > > as

> > > > > you

> > > > > > have claimed all along in the thread on the topic, did its

> > > > > Mahadasha

> > > > > > prove to be Killer to Ramana Maharshi?

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Take care,

> > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > For example, remember that in Swami Vivekananda's chart

> > > Surya

> > > > > is

> > > > > > > lord of

> > > > > > > > the 9th occupying the lagna and causing a powerful Raj

> > > yoga. At

> > > > > > > the same

> > > > > > > > time if you thin how long the Swamiji lived, you may

> have to

> > > > > think

> > > > > > > again

> > > > > > > > about saying that it did not act as Mahakrura. Think

> about

> > > > > what it

> > > > > > > did

> > > > > > > > to the 7th bhava of Swamiji, also, before declaring

> that it

> > > > > became

> > > > > > > > shubha or less malefic.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Lakshmi: I think Swamiji had an icchamrityu and looking

> at the

> > > > > dass

> > > > > > > operating on 4th July 1902, I observe that he passed

> away in

> > > Jup-

> > > > > Ven-

> > > > > > > Jup-Ket-Sat-Sat.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Jup MD: 1893-02-09 (1:35:30 pm) - 1909-02-10 (3:59:13 pm)

> > > > > > > Ven AD: 1900-12-25 (10:03:30 am) - 1903-08-27 (4:48:54

> pm)

> > > > > > > Jup PD: 1902-05-02 (1:42:07 pm) - 1902-09-12 (10:43:55

> pm)

> > > > > > > Ket SD: 1902-06-29 (9:11:48 am) - 1902-07-07 (5:06:28 am)

> > > > > > > Sat PAD: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-06 (2:29:24

> am)

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Sat: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-05 (1:27:03 am)

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Jupiter is in 2nd house from Moon, Venus is the 2nd lord

> from

> > > > > Moon

> > > > > > > and is posited in 2nd from lagna, Ketu is in the house of

> > > Venus

> > > > > and

> > > > > > > gives the results of Venus and Saturn is the 2nd lord

> from

> > > > > > > lagna....all are marakas. the maraka significations are

> > > stronger

> > > > > > > from Moon, and it's the cause of his early death.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I fail to see where Sun comes into all this.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > However, I agree that Sun, as AK aspecting 7th house,

> can give

> > > > > > > parivraja tendencies. But can you ignore the influence of

> > > Saturn

> > > > > on

> > > > > > > Moon and 4th house, occuring in the 10th house? I am

> sure even

> > > > > weak

> > > > > > > Sun would have given him parivraja yoga:--))but without

> the

> > > raja

> > > > > > > yoga and the strong soul-level impact he created

> wherever he

> > > > > went.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Or if you like look at what happened to the 7th

> > > > > > > > Bhava of Lord Rama with exalted Mars in the 7th bhava.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Mars in 7th gives kuja dosha, and I think the strong

> Mars in

> > > 7th

> > > > > > > gave him an exalted wife like Sita. You have not

> commented on

> > > the

> > > > > > > exalted Saturn in 4th house.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > In each of the

> > > > > > > > example provided by you look at the bhava that the

> planets

> > > > > occupy

> > > > > > > > (barring Saturn, for reasons already stated in previous

> > > mail),

> > > > > > > without

> > > > > > > > looking at the charts as belonging to great people,

> and then

> > > > > make

> > > > > > > up

> > > > > > > > your mind as to the truth or otherwise of what I said.

> Did

> > > you

> > > > > > > know

> > > > > > > > Ramana Maharshi died following a malignant sarcoma of

> left

> > > hand

> > > > > > > and Mars

> > > > > > > > is karaka for the 3rd bhava in 8th in his chart, in

> > > > > exaltation. Do

> > > > > > > you

> > > > > > > > think Mars gave him benevolent results?

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I also request you to examine the

> following dasa

> > > > > > > sequences with an open mind. Sun is the 3rd lord from

> Moon

> > > (AK) &

> > > > > > > 12th lord from lagna in Sri Ramana's chart, rahu is with

> Sun

> > > and

> > > > > > > gives Sun'/Saturn's/Jupiter's effects...all of which

> point to

> > > > > > > dusthanas, Saturn is a maraka in 7th house and ketu can

> give

> > > the

> > > > > > > effects of Moon/Mercury/mars. Mar's effect, if at all,

> was

> > > only

> > > > > > > indirect, and he was not the killer.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Sun MD: 1949-02-03 (1:02:22 am) - 1955-02-03 (2:05:32 pm)

> > > > > > > Rah AD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1951-02-21 (8:49:14 am)

> > > > > > > Rah PD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1950-05-18 (12:04:47

> am)

> > > > > > > Sat SD: 1950-04-12 (3:37:16 am) - 1950-04-20 (12:18:02

> am)

> > > > > > > Ket PAD: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14 (11:08:26

> pm)

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Ket: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14 (12:47:04 pm)

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I think what stands out is the fact that the dasa of the

> graha

> > > > > > > conjoined Moon brought about death. I think their mind

> willed

> > > the

> > > > > > > death.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Can a planet give results in a dasa totally

> > > > > unrelated/unassociated

> > > > > > > with itself? I request you to consider the above

> objectively.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I will talk about the other charts/issues in my next

> mail.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > In Paramhans Ramkrishna's chart,

> > > > > > > > I do not know where you find Mars strong as a planet in

> > > > > > > debilitation in

> > > > > > > > Navamsha gives results of debility even when in

> exaltation

> > > in

> > > > > rasi

> > > > > > > > chart. In case of Saturn Viparitam shane smritam has

> already

> > > > > been

> > > > > > > > mentioned by me, in earlier mail.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I myself have not considered Mars/Venus in

> > > Thakur's

> > > > > > > chart because they are debilitated. Please go through my

> > > message

> > > > > > > again. I was talking about Saturn and Rahu.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > About Shri Aurobindo, I trust you are

> > > > > > > > aware of his revolutionary background and that he was

> editor

> > > > > of a

> > > > > > > paper

> > > > > > > > "Vande Mataram" not much known for its soft language.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Same is the case with strong Malefics giving P.M.

> Yogas.

> > > Every

> > > > > > > graha is

> > > > > > > > capable of 12 variations of a P.M. Yoga attributed to

> it, at

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > very

> > > > > > > > least. It would only be naive to imagine they would

> all give

> > > > > > > identical

> > > > > > > > results as indicated by Parashara or all with Pancha

> > > > > Mahapurusha

> > > > > > > Yoga

> > > > > > > > would only rule over different parts of India (barring

> > > Saturn),

> > > > > > > just

> > > > > > > > because the sage said so. The sages gave us principles

> and

> > > > > > > expected us

> > > > > > > > to apply them to real life horoscope using Viveka.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > I would gladly give you the shloka giving the

> reference to

> > > > > > > > "Viparita---Shane..." it is from an old classic

> respected

> > > > > amongst

> > > > > > > > astrologers, but as you do not seem to accept anything

> that

> > > > > does

> > > > > > > not fit

> > > > > > > > in with what, you think. is said by Dr. Raman, it

> would be

> > > an

> > > > > > > exercise

> > > > > > > > in futility. should you yet want the shloka I would of

> > > course

> > > > > be

> > > > > > > glad to

> > > > > > > > give it to you.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Om Gurave namah

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > You seem to be disagreeing with Shri B.V. Raman that

> > > strong

> > > > > > > planets,

> > > > > > > > > whether malefic or benefics give good results, while

> weak

> > > > > planets

> > > > > > > > > give bad results. Perhaps you also disagree about

> strong

> > > > > malefics

> > > > > > > > > giving mahapurusha yogas. Isn't it contrary to what

> all

> > > the

> > > > > > > jyotish

> > > > > > > > > texts teach?

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Then, here are a few examples, where I find that

> strong

> > > > > malefics

> > > > > > > > > have neither made the natives krura nor that their

> > > > > significations

> > > > > > > > > suffered.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Swami Vivekananda: strong sun in lagna and mars in

> 5th

> > > house

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Sri Aurobindo: Strong Sun in 2nd house.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Maharshi Mahesh yogi: exalted Mars in lagna.

> > > > > > > > > Ramana Maharshi: strong Mars in 8th house

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Sri Ramakrishna Paramahamsa: Exalted Saturn(9H) and

> Rahu

> > > > > (4H).

> > > > > > > Mars

> > > > > > > > > and Venus are also exalted in rasi, while

> debilitated in

> > > > > navamsa.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Sir, can you give me the reference for "vipareetam

> shaneH

> > > > > > > sritam"?

> > > > > > > > > Does it, by any chance, refer to Saturn's placement

> in the

> > > > > 8th

> > > > > > > house

> > > > > > > > > being beneficial?

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > I am happy that you agree strong Saturn gives good

> > > results.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Can you tell me from where the saying is because i

> would

> > > > > like to

> > > > > > > > > read it up myself and understand.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > --- Chandrashekhar <chandrashekhar46@

> > > > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk>>

> > > > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > About Krura planets the saying is, that with

> > > > > > > > > > > > strength the Krura grahas

> > > > > > > > > > > > become more Krura (Maha-krura) and the shubha

> grahas

> > > > > > > > > > > > become more shubha.

> > > > > > > > > > > > Only Shani is more krura when weak and

> beneficial or

> > > > > > > > > > > > less krura when

> > > > > > > > > > > > strong "Viparitama shaneH smritam".

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > My sun dasa started when I was 9 years old,

> and

> > > > > > > > > > > > ended when I was 15

> > > > > > > > > > > > > years old. How come you didn't notice the

> second

> > > > > > > > > > > > part? I was old

> > > > > > > > > > > > > enough to understand the difference between

> > > > > > > > > > > > success and failure, I

> > > > > > > > > > > > > guess!

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Anyway, if you agree that Rahu is giving

> Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > > > results, and those

> > > > > > > > > > > > > results are exceptionally good, then it

> > > > > > > > > > > > automatically follows that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun is strong in my chart because according

> to

> > > > > > > > > > > > Shri B.V Raman, evil

> > > > > > > > > > > > > planets, especially when weak, give bad

> results

> > > > > > > > > > > > (vide "a catechism

> > > > > > > > > > > > > of astrology"), while strong planets, even if

> > > > > > > > > > > > evil, give good

> > > > > > > > > > > > > results. If my Sun were weak, he wouldn't be

> > > > > > > > > > > > giving such good

> > > > > > > > > > > > > results:--))

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Since Mercury is hopelessly combust and

> inferior

> > > > > > > > > > > > in shadbala

> > > > > > > > > > > > > strength, the major results of Dharma

> > > > > > > > > > > > karmadhipathi yoga are also

> > > > > > > > > > > > > given by Sun, because according to "300

> > > > > > > > > > > > combinations" of Sri

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Raman, a planet with higher shadbala is more

> > > > > > > > > > > > likely to give the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > results of a yoga.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Regarding Karna, I request you to read the

> Karna

> > > > > > > > > > > > Parva of

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Mahabharata again. When he died, the nature

> bowed

> > > > > > > > > > > > in grief, because

> > > > > > > > > > > > > he's one of the noblest persons in

> Mahabharata.

> > > > > > > > > > > > Even the episode you

> > > > > > > > > > > > > quoted happened because Parashurama would

> teach

> > > > > > > > > > > > only Brahmins and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Karna desperately wanted to learn

> dhanurvidya from

> > > > > > > > > > > > Parashurama so

> > > > > > > > > > > > > that he can support Duryodhana. Deceit is

> > > > > > > > > > > > certainly punishable and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Karna did pay dearly. But it's to be borne

> in mind

> > > > > > > > > > > > that whatever

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Karna did was only to please Duryodhana, his

> > > > > > > > > > > > dearest friend. Karna

> > > > > > > > > > > > > did not gain anything personally.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the 3rd house from 8th house (I

> > > > > > > > > > > > think there was a typo

> > > > > > > > > > > > > at your end). In the natural zodiac, the 10

> th

> > > > > > > > > > > > sign, being the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > cardinal earth sign, represents

> south /dakshina

> > > > > > > > > > > > disha. South is the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > direction ruled by Yama, the lord of death,

> hence

> > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house

> > > > > > > > > > > > > represents burial grounds. So, the Rudras

> (Saturn,

> > > > > > > > > > > > Sun and Mars) are

> > > > > > > > > > > > > strong in south. Also, Sun resides in south

> and

> > > > > > > > > > > > starts his

> > > > > > > > > > > > > northern voyage from here. So he has digbala

> in

> > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > I did clarify that when I referred to Surya

> as

> > > > > > > > > > > > Karma saakshi, it's

> > > > > > > > > > > > > only to his status as antaraatma and not as a

> > > > > > > > > > > > deity. Perhaps this

> > > > > > > > > > > > > escaped your attention.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > This is my last post on the subject.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> <%40>

> > > <%40>

> > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40>,

> > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar

> > > > > > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > You were too young for the results of the

> dasha

> > > > > > > > > > > > to manifest,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > though it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > is good news that your father had

> promotions and

> > > > > > > > > > > > you received

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > prizes/accolades during that time. It is

> > > > > > > > > > > > interesting to know you

> > > > > > > > > > > > > got

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > these results at a young age of 9 or so as

> that

> > > > > > > > > > > > is when Sun dasha

> > > > > > > > > > > > > was

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > operative. I am relieved you did not have

> any

> > > > > > > > > > > > health problems in

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > March-August 1970 period.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > But we are talking about Rahu and Rahu

> would

> > > > > > > > > > > > give results of Sun

> > > > > > > > > > > > > more

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > prominently, by conjunction, as you

> guessed but

> > > > > > > > > > > > also that of

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Mercury

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > (You have a Dharmakarmaadhipati yoga after

> all)

> > > > > > > > > > > > and that is why I

> > > > > > > > > > > > > said

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > for understanding Sun its dasha instead of

> Rahu

> > > > > > > > > > > > dasha needs to be

> > > > > > > > > > > > > analyzed.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mercury is malefic not because I say so but

> > > > > > > > > > > > because Jyotish says

> > > > > > > > > > > > > that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > mercury is malefic when conjunct a papa

> graha

> > > > > > > > > > > > and he is conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > > > two,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun and Rahu.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the apex of Artha trikona and

> > > > > > > > > > > > directly involved with

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > efforts to earn money. Though claimed to be

> > > > > > > > > > > > smashana/burial

> > > > > > > > > > > > > ground, it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > is 4th from ayush sthana (8th) and its

> home that

> > > > > > > > > > > > is why affliction

> > > > > > > > > > > > > to it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > can give death. But 8th is more popularly

> called

> > > > > > > > > > > > mrityu sthana and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > hence

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th is called Smashana. If it is really

> > > > > > > > > > > > smashana why would it be

> > > > > > > > > > > > > called

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > karma sthana and why would Sun be at its

> most

> > > > > > > > > > > > brilliant there?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > I did not say he can not represent water

> bodies

> > > > > > > > > > > > in temple, but not

> > > > > > > > > > > > > only

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > those.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My Sun dasa was excellent too. My father

> > > > > > > > > > > > received promotion(s),

> > > > > > > > > > > > > my

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > school/college days were great and i

> received

> > > > > > > > > > > > wide acclaim/prizes

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > for my ability in creative writing,

> Veena,

> > > > > > > > > > > > quiz contests etc,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > apart

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > from studies. So, for a student, I guess

> > > > > > > > > > > > that's excellent!!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > How do you justify this, if Sun were

> weak?

> > > > > > > > > > > > Rahu is certainly

> > > > > > > > > > > > > giving

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > the yogakaraka results, but being in

> Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > > > house and being

> > > > > > > > > > > > > conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun, don't you think Rahu is also giving

> the

> > > > > > > > > > > > results of Sun? You

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > said that mercury is malefic and heavily

> > > > > > > > > > > > combust too:--))

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1th house also represent burial

> > > > > > > > > > > > ground/smashaana. Is that a place

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > for attachment?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandra represents all water bodies, so

> why

> > > > > > > > > > > > can't he represent

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > temple tank?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > === message truncated ===

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

>

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Tired of spam? Mail has the best spam

> > > protection

> > > > > > > around

> > > > > > > > > > > <>

> < <>>

> > > < <>

> < <>>>

> > > > > < <>

> < <>>

> > > < <>

> < <>>>>

> > > > > > > < <>

> < <>>

> > > < <>

> < <>>>

> > > > > < <>

> < <>>

> > > < <>

> < <>>>>>

> > > > > > > > > < <>

> < <>>

> > > < <>

> < <>>>

> > > > > < <>

> < <>>

> > > < <>

> < <>>>>

> > > > > > > < <>

> < <>>

> > > < <>

> < <>>>

> > > > > < <>

> < <>>

> > > < <>

> < <>>>>>>

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > ----------------

> -----

> > > ---

> > > > > -

> > > > > > > > > -------

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.11.7/435 -

> > > Release

> > > > > > > Date:

> > > > > > > > > 8/31/2006

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> removed]

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > --------------------

> -----

> > > > > > > -------

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.12.2/441 -

> Release

> > > > > Date:

> > > > > > > 9/7/2006

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

[Guest guest]

Om Gurave Namah

 

Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

 

"agnim swaadhistaanagataagnitejomayeem kundalineemichhdhwam.

icchaadandenaahatyothapayadhwam....athaeva rodanaavasthasaahityaat.

kulakundaadutthaapanasyotpatti roopatwaaccha sadya utpannaa

kumaareetyuchyathe. yoshittaruNee kaarunyalakshaNaa

sooryeNaahtaaduparibhaage saahityaatpativrataa. patim

brahmarandhrastham kaameshwaram vratayati bhunkte payovratam

braahmaNasyethi prayogaaccha evam koumaarataaruNya

sambhogairarishtam shubham peeyusha varshaNaroopam anyadapi

yatkinchitsaakriyathe karoti tatsarvam agnisswaadhisthaanagatho

anuvedhati saadhayathi. agnijwalanenaiva chandramandalam dravateethi

bhavaH"

 

I am sure you can translate this and understand that Kundalini has

the ability to do "shubham" only when it matures (utpatti avastha)

and unites with Shiva causing the amrita varsham, through the medium

of agni.

 

Regards,

Lakshmi

 

 

 

, Chandrashekhar

<chandrashekhar46 wrote:

>

> Dear Divine Lakshmi,

>

> Please let me have one of the dozens of quotes from scriptures

that you

> have that state that dormant Kundalini is inauspicious. That will

help

> enlighten me. Then we will take up the Vag beeja and other Kootas.

>

> Chandrashekhar.

>

> b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> >

> >

> > Om Gurave Namah

> >

> > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> >

> > Please tell me in the body divisions given according to kootas,

is

> > the head/face part of Vagbhava koota or not? Let's get this

straight

> > first, then we can discuss chakras and the rest. Please do not

worry

> > about quotes, because I will not disappoint you, and can provide

> > them by the ton:--))

> >

> > When one is said to be "beheaded" does it mean the portion upto

neck

> > or the portion upto forehead?

> >

> > Are you not splitting hairs here?

> >

> > Regards,

> > Lakshmi

> >

> >

> > <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > >

> > > If you think Sahasrara and Vishuddha Chakras at the same

place,

> > and if

> > > Pankaja refers to head and not face, all your arguments are

> > acceptable.

> > > Unfortunately they are not.

> > >

> > > I see that you have not given anything in support of your

argument

> > > barring conjectures and have not commented on the shloka I

sent

> > you.

> > >

> > > Chandrashekhar.

> > >

> > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > >

> > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > >

> > > > Lalitha Sahasranaamam describes Mother thus...

> > > >

> > > > Srimadvaagbhavakootaika swaroopamukha pankajaa

> > > > kanthaadhakatiparyanta madhyakoota swaroopini

> > > > Shaktikootaikathaapanna katyadhobhaagadhaariNi.

> > > >

> > > > The three divisions are

> > > >

> > > > Vagbhava koota - the face/head

> > > > Madhya/kamaraaja koota - from neck to kati

> > > > Shakti koota - the portion after kati to feet

> > > >

> > > > Can you tell me in this division, where does the head

come...in

> > the

> > > > vagbhava koota or in shakti koota? Is there any other koota

> > defined

> > > > for the head/rear portion of the face etc? Or do you imply

that

> > > > Mother has only a face without the head!!!

> > > >

> > > > You know very well that we are not talking of astrology

mappings

> > > > here. Yet why you choose to interpret even a simple

principle in

> > > > this strange fashion is some thing beyond me, unless you are

> > > > confused yourself (can happen to all of us) or want to

confuse

> > > > others (no comments).

> > > >

> > > > If either Bhagavan Hayagriva or Sage Agasthya intended

that "bisa

> > > > tantu taneeyasi" should be understood wrt kundalini at

Mooladhara

> > > > also they would have put it immediately after "mooladharaika

> > > > nilayaa.. and not after "shatchakropari samsthithaa".

> > > >

> > > > ofcourse, I do not mean that Kundalini is like a python at

> > > > mooladhara:--)), but definitely much grosser than at

sahasraara.

> > > >

> > > > Btw, I am sure you know that kundalini is not agni

tattwatmika at

> > > > mooladhara. The agnitattwa of "vidyullekha" happens only

from

> > > > swadhisthana, because agni is oordhwa mukha and is ignited

only

> > when

> > > > the Kundalini turns upwards.

> > > >

> > > > Regards,

> > > > Lakshmi

> > > >

> > > >

> > <%40>

> > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > >

> > > > > By the way Vag beeja kuta is not only head but a group of

> > > > Panchadhasha

> > > > > mantra and referred to as maa's face indicating the vacha.

> > > > > Raajrajeshwari Kavacha prays that the vagbija protect the

> > throat

> > > > and not

> > > > > the head as you imply. Certainly not head. And her

principal

> > abode

> > > > is

> > > > > said to be Mulaadhara and not sahasrara. However if you

want

> > to

> > > > distort

> > > > > this to mean she is inauspicious when dormant you are

free to

> > do

> > > > so. I

> > > > > would however request you to think why the HrIm beeja is

most

> > dear

> > > > to

> > > > > her and not the AiM beeja (Devi Patha, if you need the

> > reference).

> > > > It

> > > > > would perhaps be well to understand that Kundalini means

of

> > the

> > > > coiled

> > > > > form and "Visa Tantu..." coming after that certainly does

not

> > mean

> > > > what

> > > > > you want to think it does.

> > > > >

> > > > > In the meanwhile, please contemplate on this.

> > > > > Aaxare prdevta Éìjntax> k…{flI devta

> > > > > ädhäre paradevatä bhavrajanatädhaù kuëòalé devatä

> > > > > devanamixdevta iÇjgtamanNdpuÃiSwta,

> > > > > devänämadhidevatä trijagatämänandapuïjasthitä|

> > > > > mUlaxarinvaisnI iÇrm[i ya }ainnI mailnI

> > > > > mülädhäraniväsiné triramaëé yä jïäniné mäliné

> > > > > sa me mat&mnuiSwta k…lpwanNdEkbIjanna.32,21.

> > > > > sä me mätåmanusthitä kulapathänandaikabéjänanä||32|21||

> > > > >

> > > > > This is how Kundalini is described in Rudrayamala Tantra.

Do

> > you

> > > > think

> > > > > it is wrong?

> > > > >

> > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > >

> > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > "vagbhavabeejasya kundalineethi sangnyaa

> > thadroopa"...Kundalini

> > > > as

> > > > > > preceding "bisa tantu taneeyasee" is described as

vagbhava

> > beeja

> > > > > > or "aim" (saraswati) beeja. As you have read the

yamalas, i

> > am

> > > > sure

> > > > > > you know which part of body comprises of vagbhava

> > koota...it's

> > > > the

> > > > > > head!!

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Let me also explain the term preceding kundalini.

> > > > > > It's "mahaasakthiH" and not "MahashakthiH" and talks of

the

> > > > > > eagerness of Mother to unite with Shiva....mahe utsave

> > tatratya

> > > > > > shivashaktisamaayogaroope aasakthiH tatparataa yasyaaH.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Is this enough to show that "bisa tantu taneeyasee" is

the

> > > > climactic

> > > > > > name of shakti in ascension?

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Regarding Devi worshippers wrt unawakened kundalini,

let me

> > quote

> > > > > > this sentence.....hey Srividyopaasakaah. uttishtatha.

maa

> > > > > > swaptha....meaning o srividyopaasaka! wake up( the

> > kundalini).

> > > > don't

> > > > > > let it sleep!!

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Many thanks for this extended discussion on Kundalini.

It's

> > time

> > > > for

> > > > > > taking leave.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > <%40>

> > > > <%40>

> > > > > > <%

40>, "b_lakshmi_ramesh"

> > > > > > <b_lakshmi_ramesh@> wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > The shadripus are kaama (lust), krodha (anger), lobha

> > (greed),

> > > > > > moha

> > > > > > > (attachment, delusion), mada (pride) and maatsarya

> > (jealousy)

> > > > > > > If "mada" means "lust" what does "kaama" imply among

the

> > > > > > > shadripus? "Mada" signifies one who is

intoxicated/drunk

> > with

> > > > > > > power/self-grandeur (pride/ego).

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Mother is known as "Vidya and avidya swaroopini" and

> > correct

> > > > > > > appreciation of Mother includes understanding of both

> > facets.

> > > > As

> > > > > > > Shakti, She respresents raw power which can be routed

> > towards

> > > > good

> > > > > > > deeds as well as bad deeds. Are both ends the same?

The

> > wisdom,

> > > > > > > required to put this immense shakti to good use, is

> > > > represented by

> > > > > > > Shiva, hence the union of Shiva and Parvati, wisdom

and

> > power,

> > > > is

> > > > > > > said to be auspicious because it ensures the

> > correct/judicious

> > > > end

> > > > > > > use of shakti. Hence the orientation of Shakti is very

> > very

> > > > > > > important.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I always said that Soorya is both sattwik and krura. I

> > also

> > > > always

> > > > > > > said all planets, including Jupiter, can give malefic

> > results,

> > > > if

> > > > > > > they are functionally empowered to do so. You can

refer

> > to all

> > > > my

> > > > > > > previous mails to confirm this.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Sir, Truth is much more important than winning or

losing

> > an

> > > > > > > argument. All discussions must proceed as an

exploration

> > and

> > > > > > > celebration of Truth. When this is not the case, I

see no

> > > > purpose

> > > > > > in

> > > > > > > continuing these discussions.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Thanks & Regards,

> > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > <%40>

> > > > <%40>

> > > > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Having Icchamrityu and dying at an early age are

> > operating at

> > > > > > > different

> > > > > > > > levels. Bhishma had Iccha Mrityu but did not die

young.

> > So

> > > > > > please

> > > > > > > do not

> > > > > > > > try to mix the issues. If you have read Swamiji's

> > biography

> > > > you

> > > > > > > will

> > > > > > > > find that he fell sick many times despite of

apparent

> > robust

> > > > > > > physique.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Commenting on Shani in 4th for Rama's chart confirms

> > with his

> > > > > > > being

> > > > > > > > capable of giving Vipareeta results. I did not know

I

> > was

> > > > > > expected

> > > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > analyze the entire chart. By the way if there is a

Kuja

> > dosha

> > > > > > how

> > > > > > > does

> > > > > > > > that by itself give a Divine wife? Please do not

bring

> > our

> > > > > > > devotion to

> > > > > > > > Lord Rama (and we both have that) into astrological

> > analysis

> > > > of

> > > > > > > his chart.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Bringing in the dashas when the discussions are on

the

> > > > effects

> > > > > > of

> > > > > > > grahas

> > > > > > > > will only lead the discussion to no where. The two

have

> > to be

> > > > > > seen

> > > > > > > > separately as we are not trying to time an event but

> > only

> > > > trying

> > > > > > > to find

> > > > > > > > what are the effects on bhavas occupied.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Dear Lakshmi in Ramana Maharshi's chart you have

perhaps

> > > > > > forgotten

> > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > saying Kuja vat Ketu. look at the Ketu deha in that

> > > > perspective

> > > > > > > and let

> > > > > > > > me know your views. And if by the way you read my

mail,

> > I did

> > > > > > not

> > > > > > > say

> > > > > > > > anything about mars being killer for him, only that

it

> > gave

> > > > him

> > > > > > > Sarcoma

> > > > > > > > being 3rd lord.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Also could you explain why Sun being Atma and always

> > > > beneficent

> > > > > > as

> > > > > > > you

> > > > > > > > have claimed all along in the thread on the topic,

did

> > its

> > > > > > > Mahadasha

> > > > > > > > prove to be Killer to Ramana Maharshi?

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Take care,

> > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > For example, remember that in Swami

Vivekananda's

> > chart

> > > > > > Surya

> > > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > > lord of

> > > > > > > > > > the 9th occupying the lagna and causing a

powerful

> > Raj

> > > > yoga.

> > > > > > At

> > > > > > > > > the same

> > > > > > > > > > time if you thin how long the Swamiji lived,

you may

> > > > have to

> > > > > > > think

> > > > > > > > > again

> > > > > > > > > > about saying that it did not act as Mahakrura.

Think

> > > > about

> > > > > > > what it

> > > > > > > > > did

> > > > > > > > > > to the 7th bhava of Swamiji, also, before

declaring

> > that

> > > > it

> > > > > > > became

> > > > > > > > > > shubha or less malefic.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Lakshmi: I think Swamiji had an icchamrityu and

> > looking at

> > > > the

> > > > > > > dass

> > > > > > > > > operating on 4th July 1902, I observe that he

passed

> > away

> > > > in

> > > > > > Jup-

> > > > > > > Ven-

> > > > > > > > > Jup-Ket-Sat-Sat.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Jup MD: 1893-02-09 (1:35:30 pm) - 1909-02-10

(3:59:13

> > pm)

> > > > > > > > > Ven AD: 1900-12-25 (10:03:30 am) - 1903-08-27

> > (4:48:54 pm)

> > > > > > > > > Jup PD: 1902-05-02 (1:42:07 pm) - 1902-09-12

> > (10:43:55 pm)

> > > > > > > > > Ket SD: 1902-06-29 (9:11:48 am) - 1902-07-07

(5:06:28

> > am)

> > > > > > > > > Sat PAD: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-06

> > (2:29:24 am)

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Sat: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-05

(1:27:03 am)

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Jupiter is in 2nd house from Moon, Venus is the

2nd

> > lord

> > > > from

> > > > > > > Moon

> > > > > > > > > and is posited in 2nd from lagna, Ketu is in the

> > house of

> > > > > > Venus

> > > > > > > and

> > > > > > > > > gives the results of Venus and Saturn is the 2nd

lord

> > from

> > > > > > > > > lagna....all are marakas. the maraka

significations

> > are

> > > > > > stronger

> > > > > > > > > from Moon, and it's the cause of his early death.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > I fail to see where Sun comes into all this.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > However, I agree that Sun, as AK aspecting 7th

house,

> > can

> > > > give

> > > > > > > > > parivraja tendencies. But can you ignore the

> > influence of

> > > > > > Saturn

> > > > > > > on

> > > > > > > > > Moon and 4th house, occuring in the 10th house? I

am

> > sure

> > > > even

> > > > > > > weak

> > > > > > > > > Sun would have given him parivraja yoga:--))but

> > without the

> > > > > > raja

> > > > > > > > > yoga and the strong soul-level impact he created

> > wherever

> > > > he

> > > > > > > went.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Or if you like look at what happened to the 7th

> > > > > > > > > > Bhava of Lord Rama with exalted Mars in the 7th

> > bhava.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Mars in 7th gives kuja dosha, and I think the

strong

> > Mars

> > > > in

> > > > > > 7th

> > > > > > > > > gave him an exalted wife like Sita. You have not

> > commented

> > > > on

> > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > exalted Saturn in 4th house.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > In each of the

> > > > > > > > > > example provided by you look at the bhava that

the

> > > > planets

> > > > > > > occupy

> > > > > > > > > > (barring Saturn, for reasons already stated in

> > previous

> > > > > > mail),

> > > > > > > > > without

> > > > > > > > > > looking at the charts as belonging to great

people,

> > and

> > > > then

> > > > > > > make

> > > > > > > > > up

> > > > > > > > > > your mind as to the truth or otherwise of what I

> > said.

> > > > Did

> > > > > > you

> > > > > > > > > know

> > > > > > > > > > Ramana Maharshi died following a malignant

sarcoma

> > of

> > > > left

> > > > > > hand

> > > > > > > > > and Mars

> > > > > > > > > > is karaka for the 3rd bhava in 8th in his

chart, in

> > > > > > > exaltation. Do

> > > > > > > > > you

> > > > > > > > > > think Mars gave him benevolent results?

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I also request you to examine the

> > following

> > > > dasa

> > > > > > > > > sequences with an open mind. Sun is the 3rd lord

from

> > Moon

> > > > (AK)

> > > > > > &

> > > > > > > > > 12th lord from lagna in Sri Ramana's chart, rahu

is

> > with

> > > > Sun

> > > > > > and

> > > > > > > > > gives Sun'/Saturn's/Jupiter's effects...all of

which

> > point

> > > > to

> > > > > > > > > dusthanas, Saturn is a maraka in 7th house and

ketu

> > can

> > > > give

> > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > effects of Moon/Mercury/mars. Mar's effect, if at

> > all, was

> > > > only

> > > > > > > > > indirect, and he was not the killer.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Sun MD: 1949-02-03 (1:02:22 am) - 1955-02-03

(2:05:32

> > pm)

> > > > > > > > > Rah AD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1951-02-21

(8:49:14

> > am)

> > > > > > > > > Rah PD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1950-05-18

> > (12:04:47 am)

> > > > > > > > > Sat SD: 1950-04-12 (3:37:16 am) - 1950-04-20

> > (12:18:02 am)

> > > > > > > > > Ket PAD: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14

> > (11:08:26

> > > > pm)

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Ket: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14

(12:47:04

> > pm)

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > I think what stands out is the fact that the dasa

of

> > the

> > > > graha

> > > > > > > > > conjoined Moon brought about death. I think their

mind

> > > > willed

> > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > death.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Can a planet give results in a dasa totally

> > > > > > > unrelated/unassociated

> > > > > > > > > with itself? I request you to consider the above

> > > > objectively.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > I will talk about the other charts/issues in my

next

> > mail.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > In Paramhans Ramkrishna's chart,

> > > > > > > > > > I do not know where you find Mars strong as a

> > planet in

> > > > > > > > > debilitation in

> > > > > > > > > > Navamsha gives results of debility even when in

> > > > exaltation

> > > > > > in

> > > > > > > rasi

> > > > > > > > > > chart. In case of Saturn Viparitam shane

smritam has

> > > > already

> > > > > > > been

> > > > > > > > > > mentioned by me, in earlier mail.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I myself have not considered

Mars/Venus

> > in

> > > > > > Thakur's

> > > > > > > > > chart because they are debilitated. Please go

through

> > my

> > > > > > message

> > > > > > > > > again. I was talking about Saturn and Rahu.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > About Shri Aurobindo, I trust you are

> > > > > > > > > > aware of his revolutionary background and that

he

> > was

> > > > editor

> > > > > > > of a

> > > > > > > > > paper

> > > > > > > > > > "Vande Mataram" not much known for its soft

> > language.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Same is the case with strong Malefics giving

P.M.

> > Yogas.

> > > > > > Every

> > > > > > > > > graha is

> > > > > > > > > > capable of 12 variations of a P.M. Yoga

attributed

> > to

> > > > it, at

> > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > very

> > > > > > > > > > least. It would only be naive to imagine they

would

> > all

> > > > give

> > > > > > > > > identical

> > > > > > > > > > results as indicated by Parashara or all with

Pancha

> > > > > > > Mahapurusha

> > > > > > > > > Yoga

> > > > > > > > > > would only rule over different parts of India

> > (barring

> > > > > > Saturn),

> > > > > > > > > just

> > > > > > > > > > because the sage said so. The sages gave us

> > principles

> > > > and

> > > > > > > > > expected us

> > > > > > > > > > to apply them to real life horoscope using

Viveka.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > I would gladly give you the shloka giving the

> > reference

> > > > to

> > > > > > > > > > "Viparita---Shane..." it is from an old classic

> > respected

> > > > > > > amongst

> > > > > > > > > > astrologers, but as you do not seem to accept

> > anything

> > > > that

> > > > > > > does

> > > > > > > > > not fit

> > > > > > > > > > in with what, you think. is said by Dr. Raman,

it

> > would

> > > > be an

> > > > > > > > > exercise

> > > > > > > > > > in futility. should you yet want the shloka I

would

> > of

> > > > > > course

> > > > > > > be

> > > > > > > > > glad to

> > > > > > > > > > give it to you.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave namah

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > You seem to be disagreeing with Shri B.V.

Raman

> > that

> > > > strong

> > > > > > > > > planets,

> > > > > > > > > > > whether malefic or benefics give good results,

> > while

> > > > weak

> > > > > > > planets

> > > > > > > > > > > give bad results. Perhaps you also disagree

about

> > > > strong

> > > > > > > malefics

> > > > > > > > > > > giving mahapurusha yogas. Isn't it contrary to

> > what

> > > > all the

> > > > > > > > > jyotish

> > > > > > > > > > > texts teach?

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Then, here are a few examples, where I find

that

> > strong

> > > > > > > malefics

> > > > > > > > > > > have neither made the natives krura nor that

their

> > > > > > > significations

> > > > > > > > > > > suffered.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Swami Vivekananda: strong sun in lagna and

mars

> > in 5th

> > > > > > house

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Sri Aurobindo: Strong Sun in 2nd house.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Maharshi Mahesh yogi: exalted Mars in lagna.

> > > > > > > > > > > Ramana Maharshi: strong Mars in 8th house

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Sri Ramakrishna Paramahamsa: Exalted Saturn

(9H)

> > and

> > > > Rahu

> > > > > > > (4H).

> > > > > > > > > Mars

> > > > > > > > > > > and Venus are also exalted in rasi, while

> > debilitated

> > > > in

> > > > > > > navamsa.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Sir, can you give me the reference

for "vipareetam

> > > > shaneH

> > > > > > > > > sritam"?

> > > > > > > > > > > Does it, by any chance, refer to Saturn's

> > placement in

> > > > the

> > > > > > > 8th

> > > > > > > > > house

> > > > > > > > > > > being beneficial?

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > I am happy that you agree strong Saturn gives

good

> > > > results.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Can you tell me from where the saying is

because i

> > > > would

> > > > > > > like to

> > > > > > > > > > > read it up myself and understand.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Chandrashekhar <chandrashekhar46@

> > > > > > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk>>

> > > > > > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > About Krura planets the saying is, that

with

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > strength the Krura grahas

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > become more Krura (Maha-krura) and the

> > shubha

> > > > grahas

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > become more shubha.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Only Shani is more krura when weak and

> > > > beneficial or

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > less krura when

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > strong "Viparitama shaneH smritam".

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My sun dasa started when I was 9 years

> > old, and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > ended when I was 15

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > years old. How come you didn't notice

the

> > > > second

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > part? I was old

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > enough to understand the difference

> > between

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > success and failure, I

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > guess!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Anyway, if you agree that Rahu is

giving

> > Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > results, and those

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > results are exceptionally good, then

it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > automatically follows that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun is strong in my chart because

> > according to

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Shri B.V Raman, evil

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > planets, especially when weak, give

bad

> > results

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > (vide "a catechism

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > of astrology"), while strong planets,

> > even if

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > evil, give good

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > results. If my Sun were weak, he

wouldn't

> > be

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > giving such good

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > results:--))

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Since Mercury is hopelessly combust

and

> > > > inferior

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > in shadbala

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > strength, the major results of Dharma

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > karmadhipathi yoga are also

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > given by Sun, because according

to "300

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > combinations" of Sri

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Raman, a planet with higher shadbala

is

> > more

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > likely to give the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > results of a yoga.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regarding Karna, I request you to

read the

> > > > Karna

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Parva of

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mahabharata again. When he died, the

> > nature

> > > > bowed

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > in grief, because

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > he's one of the noblest persons in

> > Mahabharata.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Even the episode you

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > quoted happened because Parashurama

would

> > teach

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > only Brahmins and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Karna desperately wanted to learn

> > dhanurvidya

> > > > from

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Parashurama so

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > that he can support Duryodhana.

Deceit is

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > certainly punishable and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Karna did pay dearly. But it's to be

> > borne in

> > > > mind

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > that whatever

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Karna did was only to please

Duryodhana,

> > his

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > dearest friend. Karna

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > did not gain anything personally.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the 3rd house from 8th

> > house (I

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > think there was a typo

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > at your end). In the natural zodiac,

the

> > 10 th

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > sign, being the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > cardinal earth sign, represents

> > south /dakshina

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > disha. South is the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > direction ruled by Yama, the lord of

> > death,

> > > > hence

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > represents burial grounds. So, the

Rudras

> > > > (Saturn,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun and Mars) are

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > strong in south. Also, Sun resides in

> > south and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > starts his

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > northern voyage from here. So he has

> > digbala in

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I did clarify that when I referred to

> > Surya as

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Karma saakshi, it's

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > only to his status as antaraatma and

not

> > as a

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > deity. Perhaps this

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > escaped your attention.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This is my last post on the subject.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > <%40>

> > > > <%40>

> > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <%

40>,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You were too young for the results

of

> > the

> > > > dasha

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > to manifest,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > though it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is good news that your father had

> > promotions

> > > > and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > you received

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > prizes/accolades during that time.

It is

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > interesting to know you

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > got

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > these results at a young age of 9

or so

> > as

> > > > that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > is when Sun dasha

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > was

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > operative. I am relieved you did not

> > have any

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > health problems in

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > March-August 1970 period.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But we are talking about Rahu and

Rahu

> > would

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > give results of Sun

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > more

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > prominently, by conjunction, as you

> > guessed

> > > > but

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > also that of

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mercury

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (You have a Dharmakarmaadhipati yoga

> > after

> > > > all)

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > and that is why I

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > said

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > for understanding Sun its dasha

instead

> > of

> > > > Rahu

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > dasha needs to be

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > analyzed.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mercury is malefic not because I

say so

> > but

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > because Jyotish says

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > mercury is malefic when conjunct a

papa

> > graha

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > and he is conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > two,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun and Rahu.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the apex of Artha

trikona

> > and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > directly involved with

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > efforts to earn money. Though

claimed

> > to be

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > smashana/burial

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ground, it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is 4th from ayush sthana (8th) and

its

> > home

> > > > that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > is why affliction

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > to it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > can give death. But 8th is more

> > popularly

> > > > called

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > mrityu sthana and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > hence

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th is called Smashana. If it is

really

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > smashana why would it be

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > called

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > karma sthana and why would Sun be at

> > its most

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > brilliant there?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I did not say he can not represent

water

> > > > bodies

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > in temple, but not

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > only

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > those.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My Sun dasa was excellent too. My

> > father

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > received promotion(s),

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > my

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > school/college days were great

and i

> > > > received

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > wide acclaim/prizes

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > for my ability in creative

writing,

> > Veena,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > quiz contests etc,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > apart

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > from studies. So, for a student, I

> > guess

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > that's excellent!!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > How do you justify this, if Sun

were

> > weak?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rahu is certainly

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > giving

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > the yogakaraka results, but being

in

> > Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > house and being

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun, don't you think Rahu is also

> > giving

> > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > results of Sun? You

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > said that mercury is malefic and

> > heavily

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > combust too:--))

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1th house also represent burial

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > ground/smashaana. Is that a place

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > for attachment?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandra represents all water

bodies,

> > so why

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > can't he represent

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > temple tank?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > === message truncated ===

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Tired of spam? Mail has the best

spam

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> > > > < <>

> > < <>>>>

> > > > > > > > > < <>

> > < <>>

> > > > < <>

> > < <>>>

> > > > > > < <>

> > < <>>

> > > > < <>

> > < <>>>>>

> > > > > > > > > > > <

<>

> > < <>>

> > > > < <>

> > < <>>>

> > > > > > < <>

> > < <>>

> > > > < <>

> > < <>>>>

> > > > > > > > > < <>

> > < <>>

> > > > < <>

> > < <>>>

> > > > > > < <>

> > < <>>

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> > < <>>>>>>

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> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > ---------

----

> > -----

> > > > ----

> > > > > > --

> > > > > > > -

> > > > > > > > > > > -------

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database:

> > 268.11.7/435 -

> > > > > > Release

> > > > > > > > > Date:

> > > > > > > > > > > 8/31/2006

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> > removed]

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > -------------

----

> > -----

> > > > ---

> > > > > > > > > -------

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database:

268.12.2/441 -

> > > > Release

> > > > > > > Date:

> > > > > > > > > 9/7/2006

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> > removed]

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > -----------------

----

> > ----

> > > > > > --

> > > > > > > -------

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.12.2/442 -

> > Release

> > > > > > Date:

> > > > > > > 9/8/2006

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

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> > <http://uk.docs./nowyoucan.html>>>

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > -----------------------

--

> > > > -------

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.12.2/442 -

Release

> > Date:

> > > > 9/8/2006

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > ________

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> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > -------------------------

> > -------

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.12.2/442 - Release

Date:

> > 9/8/2006

> > >

> > >

> > > ________

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[Guest guest]

Om Gurave Namah

 

Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

 

I agree with you. However, if it's no problem, I would be thankful

if you can give all the meanings of "mada" as given in monier-

williams, apte dictionaries etc?

 

Did you face similar problems when you translated the

word "abhimaana" as pride/ego?

 

regards,

Lakshmi

 

 

 

, Chandrashekhar

<chandrashekhar46 wrote:

>

> Dear Divine Lakshmi,

>

> The pramana to ancient text is indeed difficult to give, as there

are no

> Sanskrit to English dictionaries that were written by the ancient

sages.

>

> You may, however, like to refer to Monier William dictionary that

> translates Sanskrit words to English as we are talking about

English

> words. I would, personally, refer to Sanskrit Kosha of Apte in

hard

> copy. Higher Sanskrit Grammar of M.R. Kale is another good source.

The

> meaning of Mada is made very clear there.

>

> Chandrashekhar.

>

> b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> >

> >

> > Om Gurave Namah

> >

> > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> >

> > Please translate the word "mada" also in all its nuances, and see

> > why they all can not be applied to Rahu. Why close your mind to

> > other meanings?

> >

> > I also notice that you have not provided any pramana that says

> > that "mada" means only lust/intoxication and not

pride/vanity/ego. I

> > am still waiting for it.

> >

> > >From what Saravali says, I perceive "ego" to be the basic

quality of

> > all those born. it perpetuates survival and rebirth. If you

> > disagree, can you provide a pramaana that says only a king can

have

> > ego and others can not.

> >

> > Regards,

> > Lakshmi

> >

> >

> > <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > >

> > > I was trying to translate Abhimana and not pride. And Pride

in a

> > King

> > > whom you have all along been trying to equate to a Divine

being (I

> > think

> > > amsha of Lord Vishnu or some such thing you said, while

arguing

> > why King

> > > is divine and by extension Surya; if memory serves me right),

may

> > not be

> > > a divine virtue but would certainly be tantamount to Ego.

> > >

> > > So please do not try to read something that is not there in

the

> > message.

> > > It is always difficult to translate Sanskrit words in English

> > language

> > > due to limitation of words with different flavors in English.

> > >

> > > Chandrashekhar.

> > >

> > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > >

> > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > >

> > > > It is interesting to see that you do not think that pride

and ego

> > > > are not one and the same thing. Please refer to your own

message

> > at

> > > >

> > > > /message/11735

> > </message/11735>

> > > > </message/11735

> > </message/11735>>

> > > >

> > > > where you mentioned the following:

> > > >

> > > > "we find that Bhava Manjari does

> > > > attribute Abhimana (pride/ego) to Surya and so does Bhuvan

> > Deepak."

> > > >

> > > > How come pride/ego are synonymous in the case of Sun and

not so

> > in

> > > > the case of Rahu? Is this fair? And, is this necessary?

> > > >

> > > > Isn't "abhimaana" a much milder word than "mada"? The

> > > > word "abhimaana" might have positive connotations, but the

> > > > word "mada" has absolutely no positive connotations.

Pradeep may

> > > > not understand this but I am sure you do.

> > > >

> > > > Fair arguments never hurt me, sir, but this sort of

arguments,

> > > > especially coming from you, certainly confound me.

> > > >

> > > > Can you quote any pramaana that says "mada" means only lust

and

> > not

> > > > pride/ego/vanity etc?

> > > >

> > > > Regarding vidyaa/avidyaa and auspicious/inauspicious nature

of

> > > > Mother:

> > > >

> > > > Vidyaavidya swaroopini: 402nd name of Mother

> > > >

> > > > Vidyaamchaavidyaamchayasthadvedobhayam saH, avidyayaamritu

> > > > teerthva,vidyayaamritamasnutha, vidyaina charamavrittiroopam

> > > > jnaanam, avidyaa bhedabhraantiroopam jnaanam"

> > > >

> > > > Avidya results in mrityu while vidyaa results in

immortality and

> > > > moiksha. Vidyaa gives charama vrittiroopa jnaanam, while

avidya

> > > > gives bhedabhraanthiroopa jnaanam.

> > > >

> > > > So, which one is auspicious? The direction which gives

> > > > immortality/moksha or the direction which results in

> > > > differentiation, delusion and death?

> > > >

> > > > Further in the explanation of the name "BhadramoorthiH" it

is

> > stated

> > > > in Soubhagyabhaskaram that "brahmam tanmangalam". The true

> > > > auspiciousness is that after which no other inauspiciousness

> > occurs.

> > > > In a state which is dominated by desires, delusions etc

> > > > (mooladhara), this is impossible. This state of "

absoluteness

> > > > auspiciousness " is possible only at the state of Brahman

> > > > (sahasraara).

> > > >

> > > > "theshaamcha lokaapibahuvidhaaH

parasivaabhinnamahaashaktistu

> > > > sarvalokaatheethaa mahaakailaasaaparaajithaadi

padapratipaadye

> > > > sarvalokotthare tisthathi.anyaapaam sivashakteenaam

kathipayaanam

> > > > saattwikshareeraanyapi sattwaadhikyagunaantharaalpatwa

yukthaani

> > na

> > > > punaH shuddhasattwaani..

> > > >

> > > > "The form where Mother is one with shiva is the

> > highest/mahaashakti

> > > > form. All shiva+shakti roopas are sattwa roopas, but those

lower

> > > > than this are a mixture of rajo and tamo gunas.

> > > >

> > > > I hope these suffice, or if you want, I can quote more.

> > > >

> > > > Regards,

> > > > Lakshmi

> > > >

> > > >

> > <%40>

> > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > >

> > > > > Pride is different from ego. Like it or not Mada does mean

> > > > intoxication

> > > > > or lust. The Kama that is referred to relates to kaamana

which

> > > > means

> > > > > desires for things possessed by others. That is what

Asteya,

> > one

> > > > of the

> > > > > Yamas of Hatha yogas refer to.

> > > > >

> > > > > We are talking about auspiciousness or other wise of the

> > dormant

> > > > or

> > > > > awakened Kundalini. As I said all scriptures can be

> > misinterpreted

> > > > if

> > > > > one wants to do that. But that does not serve any

purpose. I

> > would

> > > > not

> > > > > go into what exactly is meant by Vidya and Avidya related

to

> > Maa.

> > > > I have

> > > > > not yet seen any Pramana, in the form of a shloka, to

support

> > your

> > > > > proposition that dormant Kundalini is inauspicious and the

> > > > awakened

> > > > > Kundalini is auspicious so far. I have already posted the

way

> > my

> > > > > generation has been taught to accept an argument, so I

shall

> > not

> > > > repeat

> > > > > it here.

> > > > >

> > > > > But I will not resort to conjectures and would like to

quote

> > from

> > > > > Rudrayamala tantra about the swarUpa of dormant Kundalini.

> > Being

> > > > > graduate in sanskrit, I am sure I will not have to

translate

> > it

> > > > for you.

> > > > > Aaxare prdevta Éìjntax> k…{flI devta

> > > > > ädhäre paradevatä bhavrajanatädhaù kuëòalé devatä

> > > > > devanamixdevta iÇjgtamanNdpuÃiSwta,

> > > > > devänämadhidevatä trijagatämänandapuïjasthitä|

> > > > > mUlaxarinvaisnI iÇrm[i ya }ainnI mailnI

> > > > > mülädhäraniväsiné triramaëé yä jïäniné mäliné

> > > > > sa me mat&mnuiSwta k…lpwanNdEkbIjanna.32,21.

> > > > > sä me mätåmanusthitä kulapathänandaikabéjänanä||32|21||

> > > > >

> > > > > I am sure you must have some quote to support your

> > contention. I

> > > > would

> > > > > like to see the shloka, as against conjectures, so that I

can

> > > > improve

> > > > > upon my knowledge of the swarupaa of Kundalini.

> > > > >

> > > > > I can understand your reluctance to support your

propositions

> > with

> > > > > suitable pramanas. I am sorry if I have hurt you by

pointing

> > out

> > > > the

> > > > > inconsistency in the way you treated Surya and Rahu

> > combinations

> > > > in two

> > > > > different chart as stand out combinations only.

> > > > >

> > > > > I had no intention to cause any hurt to you and if I have

> > done so

> > > > > inadvertently I crave your pardon.

> > > > >

> > > > > Take care,

> > > > >

> > > > > Chandrashekhar

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > The shadripus are kaama (lust), krodha (anger), lobha

> > (greed),

> > > > moha

> > > > > > (attachment, delusion), mada (pride) and maatsarya

> > (jealousy)

> > > > > > If "mada" means "lust" what does "kaama" imply among the

> > > > > > shadripus? "Mada" signifies one who is intoxicated/drunk

> > with

> > > > > > power/self-grandeur (pride/ego).

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Mother is known as "Vidya and avidya swaroopini" and

correct

> > > > > > appreciation of Mother includes understanding of both

> > facets. As

> > > > > > Shakti, She respresents raw power which can be routed

> > towards

> > > > good

> > > > > > deeds as well as bad deeds. Are both ends the same? The

> > wisdom,

> > > > > > required to put this immense shakti to good use, is

> > represented

> > > > by

> > > > > > Shiva, hence the union of Shiva and Parvati, wisdom and

> > power, is

> > > > > > said to be auspicious because it ensures the

> > correct/judicious

> > > > end

> > > > > > use of shakti. Hence the orientation of Shakti is very

very

> > > > > > important.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I always said that Soorya is both sattwik and krura. I

also

> > > > always

> > > > > > said all planets, including Jupiter, can give malefic

> > results, if

> > > > > > they are functionally empowered to do so. You can refer

to

> > all my

> > > > > > previous mails to confirm this.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Sir, Truth is much more important than winning or

losing an

> > > > > > argument. All discussions must proceed as an

exploration and

> > > > > > celebration of Truth. When this is not the case, I see

no

> > > > purpose in

> > > > > > continuing these discussions.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Thanks & Regards,

> > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > <%40>

> > > > <%40>

> > > > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Having Icchamrityu and dying at an early age are

> > operating at

> > > > > > different

> > > > > > > levels. Bhishma had Iccha Mrityu but did not die

young. So

> > > > please

> > > > > > do not

> > > > > > > try to mix the issues. If you have read Swamiji's

> > biography you

> > > > > > will

> > > > > > > find that he fell sick many times despite of apparent

> > robust

> > > > > > physique.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Commenting on Shani in 4th for Rama's chart confirms

with

> > his

> > > > > > being

> > > > > > > capable of giving Vipareeta results. I did not know I

was

> > > > expected

> > > > > > to

> > > > > > > analyze the entire chart. By the way if there is a

Kuja

> > dosha

> > > > how

> > > > > > does

> > > > > > > that by itself give a Divine wife? Please do not

bring our

> > > > > > devotion to

> > > > > > > Lord Rama (and we both have that) into astrological

> > analysis of

> > > > > > his chart.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Bringing in the dashas when the discussions are on the

> > effects

> > > > of

> > > > > > grahas

> > > > > > > will only lead the discussion to no where. The two

have

> > to be

> > > > seen

> > > > > > > separately as we are not trying to time an event but

only

> > > > trying

> > > > > > to find

> > > > > > > what are the effects on bhavas occupied.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Dear Lakshmi in Ramana Maharshi's chart you have

perhaps

> > > > forgotten

> > > > > > the

> > > > > > > saying Kuja vat Ketu. look at the Ketu deha in that

> > perspective

> > > > > > and let

> > > > > > > me know your views. And if by the way you read my

mail, I

> > did

> > > > not

> > > > > > say

> > > > > > > anything about mars being killer for him, only that it

> > gave him

> > > > > > Sarcoma

> > > > > > > being 3rd lord.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Also could you explain why Sun being Atma and always

> > > > beneficent as

> > > > > > you

> > > > > > > have claimed all along in the thread on the topic,

did its

> > > > > > Mahadasha

> > > > > > > prove to be Killer to Ramana Maharshi?

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Take care,

> > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > For example, remember that in Swami Vivekananda's

> > chart

> > > > Surya

> > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > lord of

> > > > > > > > > the 9th occupying the lagna and causing a

powerful Raj

> > > > yoga. At

> > > > > > > > the same

> > > > > > > > > time if you thin how long the Swamiji lived, you

may

> > have

> > > > to

> > > > > > think

> > > > > > > > again

> > > > > > > > > about saying that it did not act as Mahakrura.

Think

> > about

> > > > > > what it

> > > > > > > > did

> > > > > > > > > to the 7th bhava of Swamiji, also, before

declaring

> > that it

> > > > > > became

> > > > > > > > > shubha or less malefic.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Lakshmi: I think Swamiji had an icchamrityu and

looking

> > at

> > > > the

> > > > > > dass

> > > > > > > > operating on 4th July 1902, I observe that he passed

> > away in

> > > > Jup-

> > > > > > Ven-

> > > > > > > > Jup-Ket-Sat-Sat.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Jup MD: 1893-02-09 (1:35:30 pm) - 1909-02-10

(3:59:13

> > pm)

> > > > > > > > Ven AD: 1900-12-25 (10:03:30 am) - 1903-08-27

(4:48:54

> > pm)

> > > > > > > > Jup PD: 1902-05-02 (1:42:07 pm) - 1902-09-12

(10:43:55

> > pm)

> > > > > > > > Ket SD: 1902-06-29 (9:11:48 am) - 1902-07-07

(5:06:28

> > am)

> > > > > > > > Sat PAD: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-06

(2:29:24

> > am)

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Sat: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-05 (1:27:03

am)

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Jupiter is in 2nd house from Moon, Venus is the 2nd

> > lord from

> > > > > > Moon

> > > > > > > > and is posited in 2nd from lagna, Ketu is in the

house

> > of

> > > > Venus

> > > > > > and

> > > > > > > > gives the results of Venus and Saturn is the 2nd

lord

> > from

> > > > > > > > lagna....all are marakas. the maraka significations

are

> > > > stronger

> > > > > > > > from Moon, and it's the cause of his early death.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > I fail to see where Sun comes into all this.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > However, I agree that Sun, as AK aspecting 7th

house,

> > can

> > > > give

> > > > > > > > parivraja tendencies. But can you ignore the

influence

> > of

> > > > Saturn

> > > > > > on

> > > > > > > > Moon and 4th house, occuring in the 10th house? I am

> > sure

> > > > even

> > > > > > weak

> > > > > > > > Sun would have given him parivraja yoga:--))but

without

> > the

> > > > raja

> > > > > > > > yoga and the strong soul-level impact he created

> > wherever he

> > > > > > went.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Or if you like look at what happened to the 7th

> > > > > > > > > Bhava of Lord Rama with exalted Mars in the 7th

bhava.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Mars in 7th gives kuja dosha, and I think the strong

> > Mars in

> > > > 7th

> > > > > > > > gave him an exalted wife like Sita. You have not

> > commented

> > > > on the

> > > > > > > > exalted Saturn in 4th house.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > In each of the

> > > > > > > > > example provided by you look at the bhava that the

> > planets

> > > > > > occupy

> > > > > > > > > (barring Saturn, for reasons already stated in

> > previous

> > > > mail),

> > > > > > > > without

> > > > > > > > > looking at the charts as belonging to great

people,

> > and

> > > > then

> > > > > > make

> > > > > > > > up

> > > > > > > > > your mind as to the truth or otherwise of what I

> > said. Did

> > > > you

> > > > > > > > know

> > > > > > > > > Ramana Maharshi died following a malignant

sarcoma of

> > left

> > > > hand

> > > > > > > > and Mars

> > > > > > > > > is karaka for the 3rd bhava in 8th in his chart,

in

> > > > > > exaltation. Do

> > > > > > > > you

> > > > > > > > > think Mars gave him benevolent results?

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I also request you to examine the

> > following

> > > > dasa

> > > > > > > > sequences with an open mind. Sun is the 3rd lord

from

> > Moon

> > > > (AK) &

> > > > > > > > 12th lord from lagna in Sri Ramana's chart, rahu is

> > with Sun

> > > > and

> > > > > > > > gives Sun'/Saturn's/Jupiter's effects...all of which

> > point to

> > > > > > > > dusthanas, Saturn is a maraka in 7th house and ketu

can

> > give

> > > > the

> > > > > > > > effects of Moon/Mercury/mars. Mar's effect, if at

all,

> > was

> > > > only

> > > > > > > > indirect, and he was not the killer.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Sun MD: 1949-02-03 (1:02:22 am) - 1955-02-03

(2:05:32

> > pm)

> > > > > > > > Rah AD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1951-02-21

(8:49:14

> > am)

> > > > > > > > Rah PD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1950-05-18

(12:04:47

> > am)

> > > > > > > > Sat SD: 1950-04-12 (3:37:16 am) - 1950-04-20

(12:18:02

> > am)

> > > > > > > > Ket PAD: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14

> > (11:08:26 pm)

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Ket: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14

(12:47:04 pm)

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > I think what stands out is the fact that the dasa

of the

> > > > graha

> > > > > > > > conjoined Moon brought about death. I think their

mind

> > > > willed the

> > > > > > > > death.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Can a planet give results in a dasa totally

> > > > > > unrelated/unassociated

> > > > > > > > with itself? I request you to consider the above

> > objectively.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > I will talk about the other charts/issues in my next

> > mail.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > In Paramhans Ramkrishna's chart,

> > > > > > > > > I do not know where you find Mars strong as a

planet

> > in

> > > > > > > > debilitation in

> > > > > > > > > Navamsha gives results of debility even when in

> > exaltation

> > > > in

> > > > > > rasi

> > > > > > > > > chart. In case of Saturn Viparitam shane smritam

has

> > > > already

> > > > > > been

> > > > > > > > > mentioned by me, in earlier mail.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I myself have not considered

Mars/Venus in

> > > > Thakur's

> > > > > > > > chart because they are debilitated. Please go

through my

> > > > message

> > > > > > > > again. I was talking about Saturn and Rahu.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > About Shri Aurobindo, I trust you are

> > > > > > > > > aware of his revolutionary background and that he

was

> > > > editor

> > > > > > of a

> > > > > > > > paper

> > > > > > > > > "Vande Mataram" not much known for its soft

language.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Same is the case with strong Malefics giving P.M.

> > Yogas.

> > > > Every

> > > > > > > > graha is

> > > > > > > > > capable of 12 variations of a P.M. Yoga

attributed to

> > it,

> > > > at

> > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > very

> > > > > > > > > least. It would only be naive to imagine they

would

> > all

> > > > give

> > > > > > > > identical

> > > > > > > > > results as indicated by Parashara or all with

Pancha

> > > > > > Mahapurusha

> > > > > > > > Yoga

> > > > > > > > > would only rule over different parts of India

(barring

> > > > Saturn),

> > > > > > > > just

> > > > > > > > > because the sage said so. The sages gave us

> > principles and

> > > > > > > > expected us

> > > > > > > > > to apply them to real life horoscope using Viveka.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > I would gladly give you the shloka giving the

> > reference to

> > > > > > > > > "Viparita---Shane..." it is from an old classic

> > respected

> > > > > > amongst

> > > > > > > > > astrologers, but as you do not seem to accept

> > anything that

> > > > > > does

> > > > > > > > not fit

> > > > > > > > > in with what, you think. is said by Dr. Raman, it

> > would be

> > > > an

> > > > > > > > exercise

> > > > > > > > > in futility. should you yet want the shloka I

would of

> > > > course

> > > > > > be

> > > > > > > > glad to

> > > > > > > > > give it to you.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave namah

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > You seem to be disagreeing with Shri B.V. Raman

that

> > > > strong

> > > > > > > > planets,

> > > > > > > > > > whether malefic or benefics give good results,

> > while weak

> > > > > > planets

> > > > > > > > > > give bad results. Perhaps you also disagree

about

> > strong

> > > > > > malefics

> > > > > > > > > > giving mahapurusha yogas. Isn't it contrary to

what

> > all

> > > > the

> > > > > > > > jyotish

> > > > > > > > > > texts teach?

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Then, here are a few examples, where I find that

> > strong

> > > > > > malefics

> > > > > > > > > > have neither made the natives krura nor that

their

> > > > > > significations

> > > > > > > > > > suffered.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Swami Vivekananda: strong sun in lagna and mars

in

> > 5th

> > > > house

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Sri Aurobindo: Strong Sun in 2nd house.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Maharshi Mahesh yogi: exalted Mars in lagna.

> > > > > > > > > > Ramana Maharshi: strong Mars in 8th house

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Sri Ramakrishna Paramahamsa: Exalted Saturn(9H)

and

> > Rahu

> > > > > > (4H).

> > > > > > > > Mars

> > > > > > > > > > and Venus are also exalted in rasi, while

> > debilitated in

> > > > > > navamsa.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Sir, can you give me the reference

for "vipareetam

> > shaneH

> > > > > > > > sritam"?

> > > > > > > > > > Does it, by any chance, refer to Saturn's

placement

> > in

> > > > the

> > > > > > 8th

> > > > > > > > house

> > > > > > > > > > being beneficial?

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > I am happy that you agree strong Saturn gives

good

> > > > results.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Can you tell me from where the saying is

because i

> > would

> > > > > > like to

> > > > > > > > > > read it up myself and understand.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > --- Chandrashekhar <chandrashekhar46@

> > > > > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk>>

> > > > > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > About Krura planets the saying is, that

with

> > > > > > > > > > > > > strength the Krura grahas

> > > > > > > > > > > > > become more Krura (Maha-krura) and the

shubha

> > > > grahas

> > > > > > > > > > > > > become more shubha.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Only Shani is more krura when weak and

> > beneficial

> > > > or

> > > > > > > > > > > > > less krura when

> > > > > > > > > > > > > strong "Viparitama shaneH smritam".

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > My sun dasa started when I was 9 years

old,

> > and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > ended when I was 15

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > years old. How come you didn't notice

the

> > second

> > > > > > > > > > > > > part? I was old

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > enough to understand the difference

between

> > > > > > > > > > > > > success and failure, I

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > guess!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Anyway, if you agree that Rahu is giving

> > Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > > > > results, and those

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > results are exceptionally good, then it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > automatically follows that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun is strong in my chart because

according

> > to

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Shri B.V Raman, evil

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > planets, especially when weak, give bad

> > results

> > > > > > > > > > > > > (vide "a catechism

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > of astrology"), while strong planets,

even

> > if

> > > > > > > > > > > > > evil, give good

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > results. If my Sun were weak, he

wouldn't be

> > > > > > > > > > > > > giving such good

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > results:--))

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Since Mercury is hopelessly combust and

> > inferior

> > > > > > > > > > > > > in shadbala

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > strength, the major results of Dharma

> > > > > > > > > > > > > karmadhipathi yoga are also

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > given by Sun, because according to "300

> > > > > > > > > > > > > combinations" of Sri

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Raman, a planet with higher shadbala is

more

> > > > > > > > > > > > > likely to give the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > results of a yoga.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regarding Karna, I request you to read

the

> > Karna

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Parva of

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mahabharata again. When he died, the

nature

> > bowed

> > > > > > > > > > > > > in grief, because

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > he's one of the noblest persons in

> > Mahabharata.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Even the episode you

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > quoted happened because Parashurama

would

> > teach

> > > > > > > > > > > > > only Brahmins and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Karna desperately wanted to learn

> > dhanurvidya

> > > > from

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Parashurama so

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > that he can support Duryodhana. Deceit

is

> > > > > > > > > > > > > certainly punishable and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Karna did pay dearly. But it's to be

borne

> > in

> > > > mind

> > > > > > > > > > > > > that whatever

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Karna did was only to please

Duryodhana, his

> > > > > > > > > > > > > dearest friend. Karna

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > did not gain anything personally.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the 3rd house from 8th

house

> > (I

> > > > > > > > > > > > > think there was a typo

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > at your end). In the natural zodiac,

the 10

> > th

> > > > > > > > > > > > > sign, being the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > cardinal earth sign, represents

> > south /dakshina

> > > > > > > > > > > > > disha. South is the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > direction ruled by Yama, the lord of

death,

> > hence

> > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > represents burial grounds. So, the

Rudras

> > > > (Saturn,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun and Mars) are

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > strong in south. Also, Sun resides in

south

> > and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > starts his

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > northern voyage from here. So he has

> > digbala in

> > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > I did clarify that when I referred to

Surya

> > as

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Karma saakshi, it's

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > only to his status as antaraatma and

not as

> > a

> > > > > > > > > > > > > deity. Perhaps this

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > escaped your attention.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > This is my last post on the subject.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > <%40>

> > > > <%40>

> > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40>,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You were too young for the results of

the

> > dasha

> > > > > > > > > > > > > to manifest,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > though it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is good news that your father had

> > promotions

> > > > and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > you received

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > prizes/accolades during that time. It

is

> > > > > > > > > > > > > interesting to know you

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > got

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > these results at a young age of 9 or

so

> > as that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > is when Sun dasha

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > was

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > operative. I am relieved you did not

have

> > any

> > > > > > > > > > > > > health problems in

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > March-August 1970 period.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But we are talking about Rahu and Rahu

> > would

> > > > > > > > > > > > > give results of Sun

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > more

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > prominently, by conjunction, as you

> > guessed but

> > > > > > > > > > > > > also that of

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mercury

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (You have a Dharmakarmaadhipati yoga

> > after all)

> > > > > > > > > > > > > and that is why I

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > said

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > for understanding Sun its dasha

instead

> > of Rahu

> > > > > > > > > > > > > dasha needs to be

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > analyzed.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mercury is malefic not because I say

so

> > but

> > > > > > > > > > > > > because Jyotish says

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > mercury is malefic when conjunct a

papa

> > graha

> > > > > > > > > > > > > and he is conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > two,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun and Rahu.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the apex of Artha

trikona

> > and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > directly involved with

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > efforts to earn money. Though claimed

to

> > be

> > > > > > > > > > > > > smashana/burial

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > ground, it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is 4th from ayush sthana (8th) and its

> > home

> > > > that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > is why affliction

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > to it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > can give death. But 8th is more

popularly

> > > > called

> > > > > > > > > > > > > mrityu sthana and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > hence

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th is called Smashana. If it is

really

> > > > > > > > > > > > > smashana why would it be

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > called

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > karma sthana and why would Sun be at

its

> > most

> > > > > > > > > > > > > brilliant there?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I did not say he can not represent

water

> > bodies

> > > > > > > > > > > > > in temple, but not

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > only

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > those.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My Sun dasa was excellent too. My

father

> > > > > > > > > > > > > received promotion(s),

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > my

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > school/college days were great and i

> > received

> > > > > > > > > > > > > wide acclaim/prizes

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > for my ability in creative writing,

> > Veena,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > quiz contests etc,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > apart

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > from studies. So, for a student, I

guess

> > > > > > > > > > > > > that's excellent!!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > How do you justify this, if Sun were

> > weak?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Rahu is certainly

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > giving

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > the yogakaraka results, but being in

> > Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > > > > house and being

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun, don't you think Rahu is also

> > giving the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > results of Sun? You

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > said that mercury is malefic and

heavily

> > > > > > > > > > > > > combust too:--))

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1th house also represent burial

> > > > > > > > > > > > > ground/smashaana. Is that a place

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > for attachment?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandra represents all water

bodies, so

> > why

> > > > > > > > > > > > > can't he represent

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > temple tank?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > === message truncated ===

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Tired of spam? Mail has the best spam

> > > > protection

> > > > > > > > around

> > > > > > > > > > > >

<>

> > < <>>

> > > > < <>

> > < <>>>

> > > > > > < <>

> > < <>>

> > > > < <>

> > < <>>>>

> > > > > > > > < <>

> > < <>>

> > > > < <>

> > < <>>>

> > > > > > < <>

> > < <>>

> > > > < <>

> > < <>>>>>

> > > > > > > > > > < <>

> > < <>>

> > > > < <>

> > < <>>>

> > > > > > < <>

> > < <>>

> > > > < <>

> > < <>>>>

> > > > > > > > < <>

> > < <>>

> > > > < <>

> > < <>>>

> > > > > > < <>

> > < <>>

> > > > < <>

> > < <>>>>>>

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > -----------

----

> > -----

> > > > ----

> > > > > > -

> > > > > > > > > > -------

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database:

> > 268.11.7/435 -

> > > > Release

> > > > > > > > Date:

> > > > > > > > > > 8/31/2006

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> > removed]

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > ---------------

----

> > -----

> > > > -

> > > > > > > > -------

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database:

268.12.2/441 -

> > Release

> > > > > > Date:

> > > > > > > > 9/7/2006

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

removed]

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > -------------------

----

> > --

> > > > > > -------

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.12.2/442 -

> > Release

> > > > Date:

> > > > > > 9/8/2006

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

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> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > -----------------------

--

> > > > -------

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.12.2/442 -

Release

> > Date:

> > > > 9/8/2006

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

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> > > >

> > > > -------------------------

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> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.12.2/442 - Release

Date:

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> > >

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>

>

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[Guest guest]

Dear Chandrashekhar ji Namste

 

> If a King proclaiming his virtues himself is not ego then pray what

is?

> It is an accepted practice that one does not broadcast one's virtue

> oneself.

 

King proclaiming his virtues himself can not be an example of Ego

specially it the king is speaking truth. At most it can be treated as

expression of Pride but certainly not Ego. In this way even Krishna

will be clubed as Egoist as he has proclaim so many things about

himself in Geeta.

 

> I am sure you recognize names of many Vedic Kings there. Do you

think

> Parashara was unaware of this and so he must have meant what you

imply?

>

 

I do but the point is not that. As I said earlier that scriptures say

that King should take Pride in welfare of his subjects and should not

considered as absolute power. Some kings at vedic times have acted

otherwise but that is not the point. Moreover there is no point in

making conjuctures as what parashara thought and whether he was aware

of the Kings not following scriptures,before writting Jyotish

Grantha. In my humble opinion we can only comment on meanings of

Vedic terms like 'King' in vedic context. My example of rama was to

highlight the fact that there were kings who were ready to do

anything for the welfare of their subjects. King's dharma was that

only and Rama followed it.

 

WIll write about Rahu again once this is resoived!

 

Thanks a lot for your Time and Sapce.

 

Prabodh Vekhande

Jai Jai Shankar

Har Har Shankar

 

 

, Chandrashekhar

<chandrashekhar46 wrote:

>

> Dear Prabodh,

>

> I can understand why you find it difficult to see ego in the

speeches

> that you quoted. That precisely is why I said that it is better not

to

> bring personalities in discussions on astrology, especially those

whom

> one may revere. It is not easy to be dispassionate about their

actions

> or speech.

>

> If a King proclaiming his virtues himself is not ego then pray what

is?

> It is an accepted practice that one does not broadcast one's virtue

> oneself. I think you will understand the source of the following.

> @tavan! @v pué;ae yt! £ jaya£ATma àja£#it h, ivàa> àa÷s! twa c£@tdœ

yae

> -taR sa Sm&t£A¼na. 9£45

> 9.45. He only is a perfect man who consists (of three persons

united),

> his wife, himself, and his offspring; thus (says the Veda), and

> (learned) Brahmanas propound this (maxim) likewise, 'The husband is

> declared to be one with the wife.'

>

> And though as you have quoted Lord Rama saying " I will not mind

any

> affliction in abandoning my wife for the good of my subjects". and

> called it Vedic Dharma. Let me quote Manusmriti on when a King

should

> give up his wife.

> "Aapdw¡ xn< r]edœ daran! r]edœ xnErœ Aip, AaTman< stt< r]edœ darErœ

Aip

> xnErœ Aip." 7£213

> 7.213.

> For times of need let him preserve his wealth; at the expense of

his

> wealth let him preserve his wife; let him at all events preserve

himself

> even by (giving up) his wife and his wealth.

>

> So do you think that what was said was more of a boast or otherwise?

>

> About the conduct of Kings Manusmriti says:

> sMmanadœ äaü[ae inTym! %iÖjet iv;adœ #v, Am&tSy£#v c£Aka'œ]edœ

AvmanSy

> svRda. 2£162

>

> venae ivnòae Aivnyat! £ n÷;z! c£@v paiwRv>, suda> pEjvnz! c£@v

sumuoae

> inimrœ @v c. 7£41

> 7.41.

> Through a want of humility Vena perished, likewise king Nahusha,

Sudas,

> the son of Pigavana, Sumukha, and Nemi.

>

> I am sure you recognize names of many Vedic Kings there. Do you

think

> Parashara was unaware of this and so he must have meant what you

imply?

>

> Think again. It is easy to swear by one sage and think his words

meant

> what we want them to mean and it may be entirely different what he

in

> fact meant to convey.

>

> Endless debate on what is Mada is possible but Koshas, Higher

Sanskrit

> Grammar by M.R. Bhat and other sources do indicate that Mada is

> primarily intoxication state, the reasons being variable. I think

it is

> well to remember that rahu delivers results based on the graha

conjunct

> or the lord of the Bhava occupied or 7th from itself and even those

of

> planets aspecting it ( by extension). No wonder that rahu occupying

> house of Mars in 5th can cause problems in begetting progeny.

>

> If as you think Rahu who is Mada and that it means Pride then why

Rahu

> in 5th should create problems in the house of progeny. It should

give

> more progeny and with ease as the indications will be that of the

jataka

> having pride on account of multiple progeny. Though for the life of

me I

> do not understand why the combination given by you indicates that

rahu

> is Pride. And that, that is the reason for the person not having

Progeny

> or having difficulty in getting progeny.

>

> I do not find again, that Parashara is referring to Rahu only being

in

> the 5th or as you say Rahu alone in the example given by you. He

on the

> other hand does say that rahu has to be in a) 5th house and B) in

the

> rasi of Mars or aspected by Mars, for problems in begetting

progeny. Or

> have I not been able to understand what you are diriving at when

you say

> Parashara giving independent indications of rahu in the example

given?

>

> Chandrashekhar.

>

>

>

> Prabodh Vekhande wrote:

> >

> >

> > Dear Chandrashekhar Ji namste

> >

> > >Most of the

> > > speeches that you quote, if read with due detachment and

ignoring

> > the

> > > personalities making them, would sound most egoist speeches to

all

> > and

> > > sundry. I know saying this would raise

> > > tempers on the list but truth must prevail.

> >

> > Exactly. Truth must prevail. Why a passionate speech by a vedic

king

> > should be treated as expression of Ego? If this is ego then every

> > thing by a king towards his subjects will be ego.

> > Ofcourse, I am nobody to object your views about that but it

would be

> > interesting to find out what excatly you considered as egoist in

> > those speeches.

> >

> > > But one can go on arguing on this aspect to no end and

bringing in

> > the

> > > ideal king as an example of King and conjecturing the Parashara

> > meant

> > > that King, while good for argument's sake may not be the right

way

> > to

> > > look at astrological principles.

> >

> > I wanted to say that in a Vedic context, King means who takes

pride

> > in the welfare of the subjects and will not have absolute power

like

> > in western philosophy. Such vedic king may be ideal or may not be

> > ideal but what vedic scriptures say must be kept in mind. If we

> > believe that Parashara is vedic Jyotish Pravartak then there is no

> > question about what he had in mind when he said about Surya being

> > King. Terms which are Vedic should be treated on the Vedic

context.

> > It does not matter as to how many kings were cruel towards

subjects

> > in Vedic times what matters is that how scriptures describe the

> > king.What are his duties and what should be his authority and how

he

> > should excercise it? That is why it essential to get in to what

Vedas

> > and Manu says about king's duties. If you feel that I am

> > unnecessarily getting this point, I respectfully request you to

> > please think on this.

> >

> > > Do you think Mada does not mean intoxication or state of

> > intoxication in

> > > Sanskrit?

> >

> > Mada does mean Intoxication but point is that it as well means

Pride!

> > Why to forget this? If Kalyan Verma says that Rahu is associated

with

> > Mada then all meanings of Mada will be associated with Rahu. That

> > will include being intoxicated and as well being into state of

Pride.

> > Since rahu as well is understood as 'limitless' so naturally pride

> > will be limitless and hence will be Ego.

> >

> > There is no doubt that Rahu gives the results like Shani or the

lord

> > of the house occupied by him but this possibly we apply more,

when we

> > are into timing of events. Otherwise why Parashara has said few

> > things only related to Rahu? Like he says that 5th house Rahu when

> > aspected by Mars or in the houses of Mars then the native will

have

> > problems in the progeny. He could have simply said in one line

that

> > Rahu should be Always treated as lord of the house occupied by

him or

> > like Shani and that would have ended the references of Rahu. But

> > parashara clearly gives the independent references of Rahu.

> >

> > Thanks a lot for your Time and Sapce.

> >

> > Prabodh Vekhande

> > Jai Jai Shankar

> > Har Har Shankar

> >

> >

> > <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Prabodh,

> > >

> > > You are not wrong when you say that "So in a Vedic Jyotish way

the

> > Sun

> > > in strength will have PRIDE in being ideal king' for his

subjects

> > (other

> > > Grahas)." But if the King is doing what is only his duty as

per the

> > > Vedic Dharma, then pride in such context will be Ego. Most of

the

> > > speeches that you quote, if read with due detachment and

ignoring

> > the

> > > personalities making them, would sound most egoist speeches to

all

> > and

> > > sundry. I know saying this would raise

> > > tempers on the list but truth must prevail.

> > >

> > > But one can go on arguing on this aspect to no end and

bringing in

> > the

> > > ideal king as an example of King and conjecturing the Parashara

> > meant

> > > that King, while good for argument's sake may not be the right

way

> > to

> > > look at astrological principles. The first pitfall would be

that

> > though

> > > it is fashionable these days to say that all Kings of Vedic

times

> > acted

> > > as they should the fact remains that Puranas and Vedas are

replete

> > with

> > > stories of Kings who were very cruel t their subjects and

harassed

> > those

> > > performing vedic Rituals. When this is pointed out tempers

flare

> > which

> > > is a sure beginning of a rational discussion on the principles

of

> > > astrology going awry.

> > >

> > > That is why it is better to steer clear of the scriptures when

> > > discussing astrology, specially on a public list, as the

scriptures

> > are

> > > subject to different interpretations.

> > >

> > > Do you think Mada does not mean intoxication or state of

> > intoxication in

> > > Sanskrit? I am sure that Unmaada is one of the five arrows of

> > Madana.

> > > And that is Mada represented by Rahu. That is what flows

through

> > the

> > > temporal glands of a bull elephant and then the bull elephant

> > becomes

> > > uncontrollable like being intoxicated.

> > >

> > > Again if you happen to refer to kosha you will find synonyms

for

> > the

> > > five types of pride to be Garva, Abhimaana, Ahankara, Maana

etc.

> > While

> > > in English language Pride has certain connotation, to find

exact

> > > synonyms to Sanskrit words is always difficult.

> > >

> > > Letting apart these discussions which will more often mislead

than

> > solve

> > > anything, let us at least agree that the sage does say that

Rahu

> > and

> > > Ketu behave as the lords of the house occupied by them or the

lord

> > of a

> > > house that they conjoin.

> > >

> > > If we are agreed on this then think why should Rahu, or Ketu

for

> > that

> > > matter, who can not deliver own results but has to depend on

other

> > > planets to express itself would, by itself and devoid of other

> > graha

> > > combination; be endowed with the quality of Ego by the writer.

More

> > so

> > > why when Rahu when alone is said to give results of Shani

(Manda

> > Sama

> > > Rahu..) as Shani is certainly not connected with ego by any

stretch

> > of

> > > imagination.

> > >

> > > Take care,

> > > Chandrashekhar.

> > >

> > >

> > > Prabodh Vekhande wrote:

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji Namste

> > > >

> > > > It was indeed a great plesure to read your mails regarding

> > > > interpretations of the astrological text and more specially

how

> > > > Sanskrit language words can mislead at times. Now I have some

> > doubts.

> > > >

> > > > I think Pride means Self-respect and Ego means Inflated or

False

> > > > Pride. Parashara has attributed the Sun to being Raja or

King. In

> > the

> > > > vedic philosophy we see that Raja was suppose to take care

of the

> > > > welfare of his subjects. In the Chandogya Upanishad the king

> > > > Ashvapati describes his kingdom and his subjects as: "In my

> > kingdom

> > > > there is no thief,no coward,nor amiser,no drunked,nor is

there one

> > > > who has not taken the vow of worship of the'Fire', no idots,

nor

> > men

> > > > of loose character.Where could therefore be here women

without

> > > > morals?"(Chandogya 5-11). We as well see similar references

in

> > > > Ramayana regarding RamaRajya. Rama says: I will forsake

> > everything,

> > > > affection,compassion,happiness,even my beloved wife Janaki,

for

> > the

> > > > sake of the welfare of my subjects. I will not mind any

> > affliction in

> > > > abondoning my wife for the good of my subjects". We find

many such

> > > > references in RigVeda and Atherva veda as well. The great

epic of

> > > > VedaVyasa as well gives similar attributes to King.Such was

the

> > > > concept of the ideal of the institution of kingship, which

every

> > > > Vedic king took PRIDE in realising.

> > > >

> > > > In the pasasge of Time there came the western counterpart for

> > Vedic

> > > > Kings. In the west the mediaeval thinkers invested divine

> > inheritance

> > > > on the king who was considered to be the representative of

God.

> > The

> > > > king having received his authority to rule by divine right

was not

> > > > answerable to the people and therefore was an absolute in

his own

> > > > right.The people had no right to rebel against the king or

demand

> > his

> > > > dethronement. The predominant thought behind that concept

was to

> > > > bestow sovereign and absolute powers on the king. This

naturally

> > made

> > > > Kings to have 'inflated pride' or EGO. This western mediaeval

> > concept

> > > > of king had great influence in Mediaeval indian kings as

well.

> > > >

> > > > In Bharat, however, political thinkers never advocated or

offered

> > any

> > > > abolute power and authority to the king. Kingship was always

> > regared

> > > > as subservient to the will and dependent upon the sanction

of the

> > > > people and was alwyas answerable to them. So there was no

concept

> > > > of 'Inflated or False Pride' in the Vedic King. The king

being

> > fully

> > > > aware that all his authority and power were derived from his

> > > > subjects would try to look to their welfare.

> > > >

> > > > So in a Vedic Jyotish way the Sun in strength will have

PRIDE in

> > > > being ideal 'king' for his subjects(other Grahas). Same, if

seen

> > in

> > > > Western way can mean the Sun will have EGO.

> > > >

> > > > Moreover, we see that Western(foreign) cocept of Absolute

power

> > with

> > > > the King is exactly opposite that of Vedic concept of King.

So in

> > a

> > > > vedic way of thinking what is wrong in attributting Rahu to

> > foreign

> > > > concept of inflated & false Pride or EGO.?

> > > >

> > > > Finally, Mada does mean Pride in sanskrit. When attributed to

> > Rahu,

> > > > will naturally have the element of falsehood/deceit

associated

> > with

> > > > pride and hence may lead to EGO. Am I wrong?

> > > >

> > > > Thanks a lot for your Time and Sapce.

> > > >

> > > > Prabodh Vekhande

> > > > Jai Jai Shankar

> > > > Har Har Shankar

> > > >

> > > >

> > <%40>

> > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > >

> > > > > Pride is different from ego. Like it or not Mada does mean

> > > > intoxication

> > > > > or lust. The Kama that is referred to relates to kaamana

which

> > > > means

> > > > > desires for things possessed by others. That is what

Asteya,

> > one of

> > > > the

> > > > > Yamas of Hatha yogas refer to.

> > > > >

> > > > > We are talking about auspiciousness or other wise of the

> > dormant or

> > > > > awakened Kundalini. As I said all scriptures can be

> > misinterpreted

> > > > if

> > > > > one wants to do that. But that does not serve any purpose.

I

> > would

> > > > not

> > > > > go into what exactly is meant by Vidya and Avidya related

to

> > Maa. I

> > > > have

> > > > > not yet seen any Pramana, in the form of a shloka, to

support

> > your

> > > > > proposition that dormant Kundalini is inauspicious and the

> > awakened

> > > > > Kundalini is auspicious so far. I have already posted the

way

> > my

> > > > > generation has been taught to accept an argument, so I

shall

> > not

> > > > repeat

> > > > > it here.

> > > > >

> > > > > But I will not resort to conjectures and would like to

quote

> > from

> > > > > Rudrayamala tantra about the swarUpa of dormant Kundalini.

> > Being

> > > > > graduate in sanskrit, I am sure I will not have to

translate

> > it for

> > > > you.

> > > > > Aaxare prdevta Éìjntax> k…{flI devta

> > > > > ädhäre paradevatä bhavrajanatädhaù kuëòalé devatä

> > > > > devanamixdevta iÇjgtamanNdpuÃiSwta,

> > > > > devänämadhidevatä trijagatämänandapuïjasthitä|

> > > > > mUlaxarinvaisnI iÇrm[i ya }ainnI mailnI

> > > > > mülädhäraniväsiné triramaëé yä jïäniné mäliné

> > > > > sa me mat&mnuiSwta k…lpwanNdEkbIjanna.32,21.

> > > > > sä me mätåmanusthitä kulapathänandaikabéjänanä||32|21||

> > > > >

> > > > > I am sure you must have some quote to support your

contention.

> > I

> > > > would

> > > > > like to see the shloka, as against conjectures, so that I

can

> > > > improve

> > > > > upon my knowledge of the swarupaa of Kundalini.

> > > > >

> > > > > I can understand your reluctance to support your

propositions

> > with

> > > > > suitable pramanas. I am sorry if I have hurt you by

pointing

> > out

> > > > the

> > > > > inconsistency in the way you treated Surya and Rahu

> > combinations in

> > > > two

> > > > > different chart as stand out combinations only.

> > > > >

> > > > > I had no intention to cause any hurt to you and if I have

done

> > so

> > > > > inadvertently I crave your pardon.

> > > > >

> > > > > Take care,

> > > > >

> > > > > Chandrashekhar

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > The shadripus are kaama (lust), krodha (anger), lobha

> > (greed),

> > > > moha

> > > > > > (attachment, delusion), mada (pride) and maatsarya

(jealousy)

> > > > > > If "mada" means "lust" what does "kaama" imply among the

> > > > > > shadripus? "Mada" signifies one who is intoxicated/drunk

with

> > > > > > power/self-grandeur (pride/ego).

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Mother is known as "Vidya and avidya swaroopini" and

correct

> > > > > > appreciation of Mother includes understanding of both

> > facets. As

> > > > > > Shakti, She respresents raw power which can be routed

> > towards good

> > > > > > deeds as well as bad deeds. Are both ends the same? The

> > wisdom,

> > > > > > required to put this immense shakti to good use, is

> > represented by

> > > > > > Shiva, hence the union of Shiva and Parvati, wisdom and

> > power, is

> > > > > > said to be auspicious because it ensures the

> > correct/judicious end

> > > > > > use of shakti. Hence the orientation of Shakti is very

very

> > > > > > important.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I always said that Soorya is both sattwik and krura. I

also

> > always

> > > > > > said all planets, including Jupiter, can give malefic

> > results, if

> > > > > > they are functionally empowered to do so. You can refer

to

> > all my

> > > > > > previous mails to confirm this.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Sir, Truth is much more important than winning or losing

an

> > > > > > argument. All discussions must proceed as an exploration

and

> > > > > > celebration of Truth. When this is not the case, I see no

> > purpose

> > > > in

> > > > > > continuing these discussions.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Thanks & Regards,

> > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > <%40>

> > > > <%40>

> > > > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Having Icchamrityu and dying at an early age are

operating

> > at

> > > > > > different

> > > > > > > levels. Bhishma had Iccha Mrityu but did not die

young. So

> > > > please

> > > > > > do not

> > > > > > > try to mix the issues. If you have read Swamiji's

> > biography you

> > > > > > will

> > > > > > > find that he fell sick many times despite of apparent

> > robust

> > > > > > physique.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Commenting on Shani in 4th for Rama's chart confirms

with

> > his

> > > > > > being

> > > > > > > capable of giving Vipareeta results. I did not know I

was

> > > > expected

> > > > > > to

> > > > > > > analyze the entire chart. By the way if there is a Kuja

> > dosha

> > > > how

> > > > > > does

> > > > > > > that by itself give a Divine wife? Please do not bring

our

> > > > > > devotion to

> > > > > > > Lord Rama (and we both have that) into astrological

> > analysis of

> > > > > > his chart.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Bringing in the dashas when the discussions are on the

> > effects

> > > > of

> > > > > > grahas

> > > > > > > will only lead the discussion to no where. The two

have to

> > be

> > > > seen

> > > > > > > separately as we are not trying to time an event but

only

> > trying

> > > > > > to find

> > > > > > > what are the effects on bhavas occupied.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Dear Lakshmi in Ramana Maharshi's chart you have

perhaps

> > > > forgotten

> > > > > > the

> > > > > > > saying Kuja vat Ketu. look at the Ketu deha in that

> > perspective

> > > > > > and let

> > > > > > > me know your views. And if by the way you read my

mail, I

> > did

> > > > not

> > > > > > say

> > > > > > > anything about mars being killer for him, only that it

> > gave him

> > > > > > Sarcoma

> > > > > > > being 3rd lord.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Also could you explain why Sun being Atma and always

> > beneficent

> > > > as

> > > > > > you

> > > > > > > have claimed all along in the thread on the topic, did

its

> > > > > > Mahadasha

> > > > > > > prove to be Killer to Ramana Maharshi?

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Take care,

> > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > For example, remember that in Swami Vivekananda's

chart

> > > > Surya

> > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > lord of

> > > > > > > > > the 9th occupying the lagna and causing a powerful

Raj

> > > > yoga. At

> > > > > > > > the same

> > > > > > > > > time if you thin how long the Swamiji lived, you

may

> > have to

> > > > > > think

> > > > > > > > again

> > > > > > > > > about saying that it did not act as Mahakrura.

Think

> > about

> > > > > > what it

> > > > > > > > did

> > > > > > > > > to the 7th bhava of Swamiji, also, before declaring

> > that it

> > > > > > became

> > > > > > > > > shubha or less malefic.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Lakshmi: I think Swamiji had an icchamrityu and

looking

> > at the

> > > > > > dass

> > > > > > > > operating on 4th July 1902, I observe that he passed

> > away in

> > > > Jup-

> > > > > > Ven-

> > > > > > > > Jup-Ket-Sat-Sat.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Jup MD: 1893-02-09 (1:35:30 pm) - 1909-02-10

(3:59:13 pm)

> > > > > > > > Ven AD: 1900-12-25 (10:03:30 am) - 1903-08-27

(4:48:54

> > pm)

> > > > > > > > Jup PD: 1902-05-02 (1:42:07 pm) - 1902-09-12

(10:43:55

> > pm)

> > > > > > > > Ket SD: 1902-06-29 (9:11:48 am) - 1902-07-07

(5:06:28 am)

> > > > > > > > Sat PAD: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-06

(2:29:24

> > am)

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Sat: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-05 (1:27:03

am)

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Jupiter is in 2nd house from Moon, Venus is the 2nd

lord

> > from

> > > > > > Moon

> > > > > > > > and is posited in 2nd from lagna, Ketu is in the

house of

> > > > Venus

> > > > > > and

> > > > > > > > gives the results of Venus and Saturn is the 2nd lord

> > from

> > > > > > > > lagna....all are marakas. the maraka significations

are

> > > > stronger

> > > > > > > > from Moon, and it's the cause of his early death.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > I fail to see where Sun comes into all this.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > However, I agree that Sun, as AK aspecting 7th house,

> > can give

> > > > > > > > parivraja tendencies. But can you ignore the

influence of

> > > > Saturn

> > > > > > on

> > > > > > > > Moon and 4th house, occuring in the 10th house? I am

> > sure even

> > > > > > weak

> > > > > > > > Sun would have given him parivraja yoga:--))but

without

> > the

> > > > raja

> > > > > > > > yoga and the strong soul-level impact he created

> > wherever he

> > > > > > went.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Or if you like look at what happened to the 7th

> > > > > > > > > Bhava of Lord Rama with exalted Mars in the 7th

bhava.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Mars in 7th gives kuja dosha, and I think the strong

> > Mars in

> > > > 7th

> > > > > > > > gave him an exalted wife like Sita. You have not

> > commented on

> > > > the

> > > > > > > > exalted Saturn in 4th house.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > In each of the

> > > > > > > > > example provided by you look at the bhava that the

> > planets

> > > > > > occupy

> > > > > > > > > (barring Saturn, for reasons already stated in

previous

> > > > mail),

> > > > > > > > without

> > > > > > > > > looking at the charts as belonging to great people,

> > and then

> > > > > > make

> > > > > > > > up

> > > > > > > > > your mind as to the truth or otherwise of what I

said.

> > Did

> > > > you

> > > > > > > > know

> > > > > > > > > Ramana Maharshi died following a malignant sarcoma

of

> > left

> > > > hand

> > > > > > > > and Mars

> > > > > > > > > is karaka for the 3rd bhava in 8th in his chart, in

> > > > > > exaltation. Do

> > > > > > > > you

> > > > > > > > > think Mars gave him benevolent results?

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I also request you to examine the

> > following dasa

> > > > > > > > sequences with an open mind. Sun is the 3rd lord from

> > Moon

> > > > (AK) &

> > > > > > > > 12th lord from lagna in Sri Ramana's chart, rahu is

with

> > Sun

> > > > and

> > > > > > > > gives Sun'/Saturn's/Jupiter's effects...all of which

> > point to

> > > > > > > > dusthanas, Saturn is a maraka in 7th house and ketu

can

> > give

> > > > the

> > > > > > > > effects of Moon/Mercury/mars. Mar's effect, if at

all,

> > was

> > > > only

> > > > > > > > indirect, and he was not the killer.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Sun MD: 1949-02-03 (1:02:22 am) - 1955-02-03

(2:05:32 pm)

> > > > > > > > Rah AD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1951-02-21

(8:49:14 am)

> > > > > > > > Rah PD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1950-05-18

(12:04:47

> > am)

> > > > > > > > Sat SD: 1950-04-12 (3:37:16 am) - 1950-04-20

(12:18:02

> > am)

> > > > > > > > Ket PAD: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14

(11:08:26

> > pm)

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Ket: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14 (12:47:04

pm)

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > I think what stands out is the fact that the dasa of

the

> > graha

> > > > > > > > conjoined Moon brought about death. I think their

mind

> > willed

> > > > the

> > > > > > > > death.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Can a planet give results in a dasa totally

> > > > > > unrelated/unassociated

> > > > > > > > with itself? I request you to consider the above

> > objectively.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > I will talk about the other charts/issues in my next

> > mail.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > In Paramhans Ramkrishna's chart,

> > > > > > > > > I do not know where you find Mars strong as a

planet in

> > > > > > > > debilitation in

> > > > > > > > > Navamsha gives results of debility even when in

> > exaltation

> > > > in

> > > > > > rasi

> > > > > > > > > chart. In case of Saturn Viparitam shane smritam

has

> > already

> > > > > > been

> > > > > > > > > mentioned by me, in earlier mail.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I myself have not considered

Mars/Venus in

> > > > Thakur's

> > > > > > > > chart because they are debilitated. Please go

through my

> > > > message

> > > > > > > > again. I was talking about Saturn and Rahu.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > About Shri Aurobindo, I trust you are

> > > > > > > > > aware of his revolutionary background and that he

was

> > editor

> > > > > > of a

> > > > > > > > paper

> > > > > > > > > "Vande Mataram" not much known for its soft

language.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Same is the case with strong Malefics giving P.M.

> > Yogas.

> > > > Every

> > > > > > > > graha is

> > > > > > > > > capable of 12 variations of a P.M. Yoga attributed

to

> > it, at

> > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > very

> > > > > > > > > least. It would only be naive to imagine they would

> > all give

> > > > > > > > identical

> > > > > > > > > results as indicated by Parashara or all with

Pancha

> > > > > > Mahapurusha

> > > > > > > > Yoga

> > > > > > > > > would only rule over different parts of India

(barring

> > > > Saturn),

> > > > > > > > just

> > > > > > > > > because the sage said so. The sages gave us

principles

> > and

> > > > > > > > expected us

> > > > > > > > > to apply them to real life horoscope using Viveka.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > I would gladly give you the shloka giving the

> > reference to

> > > > > > > > > "Viparita---Shane..." it is from an old classic

> > respected

> > > > > > amongst

> > > > > > > > > astrologers, but as you do not seem to accept

anything

> > that

> > > > > > does

> > > > > > > > not fit

> > > > > > > > > in with what, you think. is said by Dr. Raman, it

> > would be

> > > > an

> > > > > > > > exercise

> > > > > > > > > in futility. should you yet want the shloka I

would of

> > > > course

> > > > > > be

> > > > > > > > glad to

> > > > > > > > > give it to you.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave namah

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > You seem to be disagreeing with Shri B.V. Raman

that

> > > > strong

> > > > > > > > planets,

> > > > > > > > > > whether malefic or benefics give good results,

while

> > weak

> > > > > > planets

> > > > > > > > > > give bad results. Perhaps you also disagree about

> > strong

> > > > > > malefics

> > > > > > > > > > giving mahapurusha yogas. Isn't it contrary to

what

> > all

> > > > the

> > > > > > > > jyotish

> > > > > > > > > > texts teach?

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Then, here are a few examples, where I find that

> > strong

> > > > > > malefics

> > > > > > > > > > have neither made the natives krura nor that

their

> > > > > > significations

> > > > > > > > > > suffered.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Swami Vivekananda: strong sun in lagna and mars

in

> > 5th

> > > > house

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Sri Aurobindo: Strong Sun in 2nd house.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Maharshi Mahesh yogi: exalted Mars in lagna.

> > > > > > > > > > Ramana Maharshi: strong Mars in 8th house

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Sri Ramakrishna Paramahamsa: Exalted Saturn(9H)

and

> > Rahu

> > > > > > (4H).

> > > > > > > > Mars

> > > > > > > > > > and Venus are also exalted in rasi, while

> > debilitated in

> > > > > > navamsa.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Sir, can you give me the reference

for "vipareetam

> > shaneH

> > > > > > > > sritam"?

> > > > > > > > > > Does it, by any chance, refer to Saturn's

placement

> > in the

> > > > > > 8th

> > > > > > > > house

> > > > > > > > > > being beneficial?

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > I am happy that you agree strong Saturn gives

good

> > > > results.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Can you tell me from where the saying is because

i

> > would

> > > > > > like to

> > > > > > > > > > read it up myself and understand.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > --- Chandrashekhar <chandrashekhar46@

> > > > > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk>>

> > > > > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > About Krura planets the saying is, that

with

> > > > > > > > > > > > > strength the Krura grahas

> > > > > > > > > > > > > become more Krura (Maha-krura) and the

shubha

> > grahas

> > > > > > > > > > > > > become more shubha.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Only Shani is more krura when weak and

> > beneficial or

> > > > > > > > > > > > > less krura when

> > > > > > > > > > > > > strong "Viparitama shaneH smritam".

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > My sun dasa started when I was 9 years

old,

> > and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > ended when I was 15

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > years old. How come you didn't notice the

> > second

> > > > > > > > > > > > > part? I was old

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > enough to understand the difference

between

> > > > > > > > > > > > > success and failure, I

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > guess!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Anyway, if you agree that Rahu is giving

> > Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > > > > results, and those

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > results are exceptionally good, then it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > automatically follows that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun is strong in my chart because

according

> > to

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Shri B.V Raman, evil

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > planets, especially when weak, give bad

> > results

> > > > > > > > > > > > > (vide "a catechism

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > of astrology"), while strong planets,

even if

> > > > > > > > > > > > > evil, give good

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > results. If my Sun were weak, he

wouldn't be

> > > > > > > > > > > > > giving such good

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > results:--))

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Since Mercury is hopelessly combust and

> > inferior

> > > > > > > > > > > > > in shadbala

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > strength, the major results of Dharma

> > > > > > > > > > > > > karmadhipathi yoga are also

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > given by Sun, because according to "300

> > > > > > > > > > > > > combinations" of Sri

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Raman, a planet with higher shadbala is

more

> > > > > > > > > > > > > likely to give the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > results of a yoga.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regarding Karna, I request you to read

the

> > Karna

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Parva of

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mahabharata again. When he died, the

nature

> > bowed

> > > > > > > > > > > > > in grief, because

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > he's one of the noblest persons in

> > Mahabharata.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Even the episode you

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > quoted happened because Parashurama would

> > teach

> > > > > > > > > > > > > only Brahmins and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Karna desperately wanted to learn

> > dhanurvidya from

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Parashurama so

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > that he can support Duryodhana. Deceit is

> > > > > > > > > > > > > certainly punishable and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Karna did pay dearly. But it's to be

borne

> > in mind

> > > > > > > > > > > > > that whatever

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Karna did was only to please Duryodhana,

his

> > > > > > > > > > > > > dearest friend. Karna

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > did not gain anything personally.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the 3rd house from 8th

house (I

> > > > > > > > > > > > > think there was a typo

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > at your end). In the natural zodiac, the

10

> > th

> > > > > > > > > > > > > sign, being the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > cardinal earth sign, represents

> > south /dakshina

> > > > > > > > > > > > > disha. South is the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > direction ruled by Yama, the lord of

death,

> > hence

> > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > represents burial grounds. So, the Rudras

> > (Saturn,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun and Mars) are

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > strong in south. Also, Sun resides in

south

> > and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > starts his

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > northern voyage from here. So he has

digbala

> > in

> > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > I did clarify that when I referred to

Surya

> > as

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Karma saakshi, it's

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > only to his status as antaraatma and not

as a

> > > > > > > > > > > > > deity. Perhaps this

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > escaped your attention.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > This is my last post on the subject.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > <%40>

> > > > <%40>

> > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40>,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You were too young for the results of

the

> > dasha

> > > > > > > > > > > > > to manifest,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > though it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is good news that your father had

> > promotions and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > you received

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > prizes/accolades during that time. It

is

> > > > > > > > > > > > > interesting to know you

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > got

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > these results at a young age of 9 or

so as

> > that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > is when Sun dasha

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > was

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > operative. I am relieved you did not

have

> > any

> > > > > > > > > > > > > health problems in

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > March-August 1970 period.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But we are talking about Rahu and Rahu

> > would

> > > > > > > > > > > > > give results of Sun

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > more

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > prominently, by conjunction, as you

> > guessed but

> > > > > > > > > > > > > also that of

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mercury

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (You have a Dharmakarmaadhipati yoga

after

> > all)

> > > > > > > > > > > > > and that is why I

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > said

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > for understanding Sun its dasha

instead of

> > Rahu

> > > > > > > > > > > > > dasha needs to be

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > analyzed.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mercury is malefic not because I say

so but

> > > > > > > > > > > > > because Jyotish says

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > mercury is malefic when conjunct a papa

> > graha

> > > > > > > > > > > > > and he is conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > two,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun and Rahu.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the apex of Artha

trikona and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > directly involved with

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > efforts to earn money. Though claimed

to be

> > > > > > > > > > > > > smashana/burial

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > ground, it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is 4th from ayush sthana (8th) and its

> > home that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > is why affliction

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > to it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > can give death. But 8th is more

popularly

> > called

> > > > > > > > > > > > > mrityu sthana and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > hence

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th is called Smashana. If it is

really

> > > > > > > > > > > > > smashana why would it be

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > called

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > karma sthana and why would Sun be at

its

> > most

> > > > > > > > > > > > > brilliant there?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I did not say he can not represent

water

> > bodies

> > > > > > > > > > > > > in temple, but not

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > only

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > those.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My Sun dasa was excellent too. My

father

> > > > > > > > > > > > > received promotion(s),

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > my

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > school/college days were great and i

> > received

> > > > > > > > > > > > > wide acclaim/prizes

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > for my ability in creative writing,

> > Veena,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > quiz contests etc,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > apart

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > from studies. So, for a student, I

guess

> > > > > > > > > > > > > that's excellent!!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > How do you justify this, if Sun were

> > weak?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Rahu is certainly

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > giving

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > the yogakaraka results, but being in

> > Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > > > > house and being

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun, don't you think Rahu is also

giving

> > the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > results of Sun? You

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > said that mercury is malefic and

heavily

> > > > > > > > > > > > > combust too:--))

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1th house also represent burial

> > > > > > > > > > > > > ground/smashaana. Is that a place

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > for attachment?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandra represents all water bodies,

so

> > why

> > > > > > > > > > > > > can't he represent

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > temple tank?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > === message truncated ===

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Tired of spam? Mail has the best spam

> > > > protection

> > > > > > > > around

> > > > > > > > > > > >

<>

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> > < <>>>>

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> > < <>>

> > > > < <>

> > < <>>>

> > > > > > < <>

> > < <>>

> > > > < <>

> > < <>>>>>

> > > > > > > > > > < <>

> > < <>>

> > > > < <>

> > < <>>>

> > > > > > < <>

> > < <>>

> > > > < <>

> > < <>>>>

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> > < <>>

> > > > < <>

> > < <>>>

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> > < <>>

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> > < <>>>>>>

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > ------------

----

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> > > > ---

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> > > > > > > > > > -------

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database:

268.11.7/435 -

> > > > Release

> > > > > > > > Date:

> > > > > > > > > > 8/31/2006

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> > removed]

> > > > > > > > > > >

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> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > ----------------

----

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> > > > > > > > -------

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.12.2/441 -

> > Release

> > > > > > Date:

> > > > > > > > 9/7/2006

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> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

removed]

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> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > --------------------

----

> > -

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> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.12.2/442 -

Release

> > > > Date:

> > > > > > 9/8/2006

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> > > > > > ------------------------

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> > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.12.2/442 - Release

> > Date:

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[Guest guest]

Om Gurave Namah

 

Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

 

When we refer to Ravana as "Dashaanana" does that mean he had only

10 faces and not 10 heads? What about other synonyms for Ravana like

dashakantha, dasagreeva etc? Or when we talk of "sahasra seersha

purushaH " are we talking only of heads without faces?

 

:--))

 

According to me, "triramani" suggests the Beautiful One who is

embodiment of /resides in/revels in....gunatraya, roopatraya,

avasthaatraya, maatritraya, bhoopuratraya, mandalatraya, konatraya,

rekhaatraya, mantratraya, kootatraya, triputi etc.

 

I hope you realize that here we are talking of one who has

sthoola/sookshma/karana sareeras as well as trigunas. Please

contrast this to "sphutashivashaktisamaagama beejankuraroopiNi

paraashaktiH aNutharasookshmaanuttaravimarshalipi

lakshyavigrahaabhaathi"-which means that union of shiva-shakti is

like beejankura. At this juncture Paraashakti is so subtle as not to

be perceived at all. She's like akasha and exists only as

akshara/mantra swaroopini. Vagbhava koota!

 

I refer you to the "oordhwamoolamadhaH shaakham ashwatham" example I

quoted earlier, in this respect. What's is seen at the lower level

is physical/gunamayi (sthoola/gross) manifestation, while at the

higher level it's the unseen roots/beeja (sookshma/subtle)

manifestation. Both belong to the same tree, but there is a

difference in manifestation.

 

Mother is definitely "gyaanini" at all times. But at Mooladhara the

gyaana is only inert/potential. Suppose you have a great life-

changing book (kundalini) in your house (body), shut up in a room

(mooladhara). You do have the book, the potential to actuate

yourself, but unless you open the room, read the book, allow that

great wisdom to touch you and transform you, do you reap any benefit

from its presence?

 

Now, can I please have your understanding

of "kulapathänandaikabéjänanä"?

 

Perhaps we are unfairly imposing on others' time.

 

Regards,

Lakshmi

 

, Chandrashekhar

<chandrashekhar46 wrote:

>

> Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> I hope you do not want me to translate Aanana as head? I do not

see you

> disputing Kundalini in Mulaadhara being called Triramani, GYaanini

etc.

> though you think she is inauspicious there. May I know why? I hope

you

> do not dispute Lord Krishna's opinion on GYana.

> Chandrashekhar.

>

> b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> >

> >

> > Om Gurave Namah

> >

> > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> >

> > Thanks for sharing the nice shloka with us. I am sorry that I had

> > indeed overlooked responding to it. In this regard, I have

already

> > given my explanation of what's auspicious and what's not, based

on

> > Soubhagya Bhaskaram.

> >

> > Can you please explain to me how you understand the

> > phrase "kulapathänandaikabéjänanä".

> >

> > Regards,

> > Lakshmi

> >

> >

> >

> > <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > >

> > > If you think Sahasrara and Vishuddha Chakras at the same

place,

> > and if

> > > Pankaja refers to head and not face, all your arguments are

> > acceptable.

> > > Unfortunately they are not.

> > >

> > > I see that you have not given anything in support of your

argument

> > > barring conjectures and have not commented on the shloka I

sent

> > you.

> > >

> > > Chandrashekhar.

> > >

> > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > >

> > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > >

> > > > Lalitha Sahasranaamam describes Mother thus...

> > > >

> > > > Srimadvaagbhavakootaika swaroopamukha pankajaa

> > > > kanthaadhakatiparyanta madhyakoota swaroopini

> > > > Shaktikootaikathaapanna katyadhobhaagadhaariNi.

> > > >

> > > > The three divisions are

> > > >

> > > > Vagbhava koota - the face/head

> > > > Madhya/kamaraaja koota - from neck to kati

> > > > Shakti koota - the portion after kati to feet

> > > >

> > > > Can you tell me in this division, where does the head

come...in

> > the

> > > > vagbhava koota or in shakti koota? Is there any other koota

> > defined

> > > > for the head/rear portion of the face etc? Or do you imply

that

> > > > Mother has only a face without the head!!!

> > > >

> > > > You know very well that we are not talking of astrology

mappings

> > > > here. Yet why you choose to interpret even a simple

principle in

> > > > this strange fashion is some thing beyond me, unless you are

> > > > confused yourself (can happen to all of us) or want to

confuse

> > > > others (no comments).

> > > >

> > > > If either Bhagavan Hayagriva or Sage Agasthya intended

that "bisa

> > > > tantu taneeyasi" should be understood wrt kundalini at

Mooladhara

> > > > also they would have put it immediately after "mooladharaika

> > > > nilayaa.. and not after "shatchakropari samsthithaa".

> > > >

> > > > ofcourse, I do not mean that Kundalini is like a python at

> > > > mooladhara:--)), but definitely much grosser than at

sahasraara.

> > > >

> > > > Btw, I am sure you know that kundalini is not agni

tattwatmika at

> > > > mooladhara. The agnitattwa of "vidyullekha" happens only

from

> > > > swadhisthana, because agni is oordhwa mukha and is ignited

only

> > when

> > > > the Kundalini turns upwards.

> > > >

> > > > Regards,

> > > > Lakshmi

> > > >

> > > >

> > <%40>

> > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > >

> > > > > By the way Vag beeja kuta is not only head but a group of

> > > > Panchadhasha

> > > > > mantra and referred to as maa's face indicating the vacha.

> > > > > Raajrajeshwari Kavacha prays that the vagbija protect the

> > throat

> > > > and not

> > > > > the head as you imply. Certainly not head. And her

principal

> > abode

> > > > is

> > > > > said to be Mulaadhara and not sahasrara. However if you

want

> > to

> > > > distort

> > > > > this to mean she is inauspicious when dormant you are

free to

> > do

> > > > so. I

> > > > > would however request you to think why the HrIm beeja is

most

> > dear

> > > > to

> > > > > her and not the AiM beeja (Devi Patha, if you need the

> > reference).

> > > > It

> > > > > would perhaps be well to understand that Kundalini means

of

> > the

> > > > coiled

> > > > > form and "Visa Tantu..." coming after that certainly does

not

> > mean

> > > > what

> > > > > you want to think it does.

> > > > >

> > > > > In the meanwhile, please contemplate on this.

> > > > > Aaxare prdevta Éìjntax> k…{flI devta

> > > > > ädhäre paradevatä bhavrajanatädhaù kuëòalé devatä

> > > > > devanamixdevta iÇjgtamanNdpuÃiSwta,

> > > > > devänämadhidevatä trijagatämänandapuïjasthitä|

> > > > > mUlaxarinvaisnI iÇrm[i ya }ainnI mailnI

> > > > > mülädhäraniväsiné triramaëé yä jïäniné mäliné

> > > > > sa me mat&mnuiSwta k…lpwanNdEkbIjanna.32,21.

> > > > > sä me mätåmanusthitä kulapathänandaikabéjänanä||32|21||

> > > > >

> > > > > This is how Kundalini is described in Rudrayamala Tantra.

Do

> > you

> > > > think

> > > > > it is wrong?

> > > > >

> > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > >

> > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > "vagbhavabeejasya kundalineethi sangnyaa

> > thadroopa"...Kundalini

> > > > as

> > > > > > preceding "bisa tantu taneeyasee" is described as

vagbhava

> > beeja

> > > > > > or "aim" (saraswati) beeja. As you have read the

yamalas, i

> > am

> > > > sure

> > > > > > you know which part of body comprises of vagbhava

> > koota...it's

> > > > the

> > > > > > head!!

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Let me also explain the term preceding kundalini.

> > > > > > It's "mahaasakthiH" and not "MahashakthiH" and talks of

the

> > > > > > eagerness of Mother to unite with Shiva....mahe utsave

> > tatratya

> > > > > > shivashaktisamaayogaroope aasakthiH tatparataa yasyaaH.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Is this enough to show that "bisa tantu taneeyasee" is

the

> > > > climactic

> > > > > > name of shakti in ascension?

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Regarding Devi worshippers wrt unawakened kundalini,

let me

> > quote

> > > > > > this sentence.....hey Srividyopaasakaah. uttishtatha.

maa

> > > > > > swaptha....meaning o srividyopaasaka! wake up( the

> > kundalini).

> > > > don't

> > > > > > let it sleep!!

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Many thanks for this extended discussion on Kundalini.

It's

> > time

> > > > for

> > > > > > taking leave.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > <%40>

> > > > <%40>

> > > > > > <%

40>, "b_lakshmi_ramesh"

> > > > > > <b_lakshmi_ramesh@> wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > The shadripus are kaama (lust), krodha (anger), lobha

> > (greed),

> > > > > > moha

> > > > > > > (attachment, delusion), mada (pride) and maatsarya

> > (jealousy)

> > > > > > > If "mada" means "lust" what does "kaama" imply among

the

> > > > > > > shadripus? "Mada" signifies one who is

intoxicated/drunk

> > with

> > > > > > > power/self-grandeur (pride/ego).

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Mother is known as "Vidya and avidya swaroopini" and

> > correct

> > > > > > > appreciation of Mother includes understanding of both

> > facets.

> > > > As

> > > > > > > Shakti, She respresents raw power which can be routed

> > towards

> > > > good

> > > > > > > deeds as well as bad deeds. Are both ends the same?

The

> > wisdom,

> > > > > > > required to put this immense shakti to good use, is

> > > > represented by

> > > > > > > Shiva, hence the union of Shiva and Parvati, wisdom

and

> > power,

> > > > is

> > > > > > > said to be auspicious because it ensures the

> > correct/judicious

> > > > end

> > > > > > > use of shakti. Hence the orientation of Shakti is very

> > very

> > > > > > > important.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I always said that Soorya is both sattwik and krura. I

> > also

> > > > always

> > > > > > > said all planets, including Jupiter, can give malefic

> > results,

> > > > if

> > > > > > > they are functionally empowered to do so. You can

refer

> > to all

> > > > my

> > > > > > > previous mails to confirm this.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Sir, Truth is much more important than winning or

losing

> > an

> > > > > > > argument. All discussions must proceed as an

exploration

> > and

> > > > > > > celebration of Truth. When this is not the case, I

see no

> > > > purpose

> > > > > > in

> > > > > > > continuing these discussions.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Thanks & Regards,

> > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > <%40>

> > > > <%40>

> > > > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Having Icchamrityu and dying at an early age are

> > operating at

> > > > > > > different

> > > > > > > > levels. Bhishma had Iccha Mrityu but did not die

young.

> > So

> > > > > > please

> > > > > > > do not

> > > > > > > > try to mix the issues. If you have read Swamiji's

> > biography

> > > > you

> > > > > > > will

> > > > > > > > find that he fell sick many times despite of

apparent

> > robust

> > > > > > > physique.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Commenting on Shani in 4th for Rama's chart confirms

> > with his

> > > > > > > being

> > > > > > > > capable of giving Vipareeta results. I did not know

I

> > was

> > > > > > expected

> > > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > analyze the entire chart. By the way if there is a

Kuja

> > dosha

> > > > > > how

> > > > > > > does

> > > > > > > > that by itself give a Divine wife? Please do not

bring

> > our

> > > > > > > devotion to

> > > > > > > > Lord Rama (and we both have that) into astrological

> > analysis

> > > > of

> > > > > > > his chart.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Bringing in the dashas when the discussions are on

the

> > > > effects

> > > > > > of

> > > > > > > grahas

> > > > > > > > will only lead the discussion to no where. The two

have

> > to be

> > > > > > seen

> > > > > > > > separately as we are not trying to time an event but

> > only

> > > > trying

> > > > > > > to find

> > > > > > > > what are the effects on bhavas occupied.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Dear Lakshmi in Ramana Maharshi's chart you have

perhaps

> > > > > > forgotten

> > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > saying Kuja vat Ketu. look at the Ketu deha in that

> > > > perspective

> > > > > > > and let

> > > > > > > > me know your views. And if by the way you read my

mail,

> > I did

> > > > > > not

> > > > > > > say

> > > > > > > > anything about mars being killer for him, only that

it

> > gave

> > > > him

> > > > > > > Sarcoma

> > > > > > > > being 3rd lord.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Also could you explain why Sun being Atma and always

> > > > beneficent

> > > > > > as

> > > > > > > you

> > > > > > > > have claimed all along in the thread on the topic,

did

> > its

> > > > > > > Mahadasha

> > > > > > > > prove to be Killer to Ramana Maharshi?

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Take care,

> > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > For example, remember that in Swami

Vivekananda's

> > chart

> > > > > > Surya

> > > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > > lord of

> > > > > > > > > > the 9th occupying the lagna and causing a

powerful

> > Raj

> > > > yoga.

> > > > > > At

> > > > > > > > > the same

> > > > > > > > > > time if you thin how long the Swamiji lived,

you may

> > > > have to

> > > > > > > think

> > > > > > > > > again

> > > > > > > > > > about saying that it did not act as Mahakrura.

Think

> > > > about

> > > > > > > what it

> > > > > > > > > did

> > > > > > > > > > to the 7th bhava of Swamiji, also, before

declaring

> > that

> > > > it

> > > > > > > became

> > > > > > > > > > shubha or less malefic.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Lakshmi: I think Swamiji had an icchamrityu and

> > looking at

> > > > the

> > > > > > > dass

> > > > > > > > > operating on 4th July 1902, I observe that he

passed

> > away

> > > > in

> > > > > > Jup-

> > > > > > > Ven-

> > > > > > > > > Jup-Ket-Sat-Sat.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Jup MD: 1893-02-09 (1:35:30 pm) - 1909-02-10

(3:59:13

> > pm)

> > > > > > > > > Ven AD: 1900-12-25 (10:03:30 am) - 1903-08-27

> > (4:48:54 pm)

> > > > > > > > > Jup PD: 1902-05-02 (1:42:07 pm) - 1902-09-12

> > (10:43:55 pm)

> > > > > > > > > Ket SD: 1902-06-29 (9:11:48 am) - 1902-07-07

(5:06:28

> > am)

> > > > > > > > > Sat PAD: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-06

> > (2:29:24 am)

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Sat: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-05

(1:27:03 am)

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Jupiter is in 2nd house from Moon, Venus is the

2nd

> > lord

> > > > from

> > > > > > > Moon

> > > > > > > > > and is posited in 2nd from lagna, Ketu is in the

> > house of

> > > > > > Venus

> > > > > > > and

> > > > > > > > > gives the results of Venus and Saturn is the 2nd

lord

> > from

> > > > > > > > > lagna....all are marakas. the maraka

significations

> > are

> > > > > > stronger

> > > > > > > > > from Moon, and it's the cause of his early death.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > I fail to see where Sun comes into all this.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > However, I agree that Sun, as AK aspecting 7th

house,

> > can

> > > > give

> > > > > > > > > parivraja tendencies. But can you ignore the

> > influence of

> > > > > > Saturn

> > > > > > > on

> > > > > > > > > Moon and 4th house, occuring in the 10th house? I

am

> > sure

> > > > even

> > > > > > > weak

> > > > > > > > > Sun would have given him parivraja yoga:--))but

> > without the

> > > > > > raja

> > > > > > > > > yoga and the strong soul-level impact he created

> > wherever

> > > > he

> > > > > > > went.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Or if you like look at what happened to the 7th

> > > > > > > > > > Bhava of Lord Rama with exalted Mars in the 7th

> > bhava.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Mars in 7th gives kuja dosha, and I think the

strong

> > Mars

> > > > in

> > > > > > 7th

> > > > > > > > > gave him an exalted wife like Sita. You have not

> > commented

> > > > on

> > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > exalted Saturn in 4th house.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > In each of the

> > > > > > > > > > example provided by you look at the bhava that

the

> > > > planets

> > > > > > > occupy

> > > > > > > > > > (barring Saturn, for reasons already stated in

> > previous

> > > > > > mail),

> > > > > > > > > without

> > > > > > > > > > looking at the charts as belonging to great

people,

> > and

> > > > then

> > > > > > > make

> > > > > > > > > up

> > > > > > > > > > your mind as to the truth or otherwise of what I

> > said.

> > > > Did

> > > > > > you

> > > > > > > > > know

> > > > > > > > > > Ramana Maharshi died following a malignant

sarcoma

> > of

> > > > left

> > > > > > hand

> > > > > > > > > and Mars

> > > > > > > > > > is karaka for the 3rd bhava in 8th in his

chart, in

> > > > > > > exaltation. Do

> > > > > > > > > you

> > > > > > > > > > think Mars gave him benevolent results?

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I also request you to examine the

> > following

> > > > dasa

> > > > > > > > > sequences with an open mind. Sun is the 3rd lord

from

> > Moon

> > > > (AK)

> > > > > > &

> > > > > > > > > 12th lord from lagna in Sri Ramana's chart, rahu

is

> > with

> > > > Sun

> > > > > > and

> > > > > > > > > gives Sun'/Saturn's/Jupiter's effects...all of

which

> > point

> > > > to

> > > > > > > > > dusthanas, Saturn is a maraka in 7th house and

ketu

> > can

> > > > give

> > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > effects of Moon/Mercury/mars. Mar's effect, if at

> > all, was

> > > > only

> > > > > > > > > indirect, and he was not the killer.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Sun MD: 1949-02-03 (1:02:22 am) - 1955-02-03

(2:05:32

> > pm)

> > > > > > > > > Rah AD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1951-02-21

(8:49:14

> > am)

> > > > > > > > > Rah PD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1950-05-18

> > (12:04:47 am)

> > > > > > > > > Sat SD: 1950-04-12 (3:37:16 am) - 1950-04-20

> > (12:18:02 am)

> > > > > > > > > Ket PAD: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14

> > (11:08:26

> > > > pm)

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Ket: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14

(12:47:04

> > pm)

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > I think what stands out is the fact that the dasa

of

> > the

> > > > graha

> > > > > > > > > conjoined Moon brought about death. I think their

mind

> > > > willed

> > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > death.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Can a planet give results in a dasa totally

> > > > > > > unrelated/unassociated

> > > > > > > > > with itself? I request you to consider the above

> > > > objectively.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > I will talk about the other charts/issues in my

next

> > mail.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > In Paramhans Ramkrishna's chart,

> > > > > > > > > > I do not know where you find Mars strong as a

> > planet in

> > > > > > > > > debilitation in

> > > > > > > > > > Navamsha gives results of debility even when in

> > > > exaltation

> > > > > > in

> > > > > > > rasi

> > > > > > > > > > chart. In case of Saturn Viparitam shane

smritam has

> > > > already

> > > > > > > been

> > > > > > > > > > mentioned by me, in earlier mail.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I myself have not considered

Mars/Venus

> > in

> > > > > > Thakur's

> > > > > > > > > chart because they are debilitated. Please go

through

> > my

> > > > > > message

> > > > > > > > > again. I was talking about Saturn and Rahu.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > About Shri Aurobindo, I trust you are

> > > > > > > > > > aware of his revolutionary background and that

he

> > was

> > > > editor

> > > > > > > of a

> > > > > > > > > paper

> > > > > > > > > > "Vande Mataram" not much known for its soft

> > language.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Same is the case with strong Malefics giving

P.M.

> > Yogas.

> > > > > > Every

> > > > > > > > > graha is

> > > > > > > > > > capable of 12 variations of a P.M. Yoga

attributed

> > to

> > > > it, at

> > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > very

> > > > > > > > > > least. It would only be naive to imagine they

would

> > all

> > > > give

> > > > > > > > > identical

> > > > > > > > > > results as indicated by Parashara or all with

Pancha

> > > > > > > Mahapurusha

> > > > > > > > > Yoga

> > > > > > > > > > would only rule over different parts of India

> > (barring

> > > > > > Saturn),

> > > > > > > > > just

> > > > > > > > > > because the sage said so. The sages gave us

> > principles

> > > > and

> > > > > > > > > expected us

> > > > > > > > > > to apply them to real life horoscope using

Viveka.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > I would gladly give you the shloka giving the

> > reference

> > > > to

> > > > > > > > > > "Viparita---Shane..." it is from an old classic

> > respected

> > > > > > > amongst

> > > > > > > > > > astrologers, but as you do not seem to accept

> > anything

> > > > that

> > > > > > > does

> > > > > > > > > not fit

> > > > > > > > > > in with what, you think. is said by Dr. Raman,

it

> > would

> > > > be an

> > > > > > > > > exercise

> > > > > > > > > > in futility. should you yet want the shloka I

would

> > of

> > > > > > course

> > > > > > > be

> > > > > > > > > glad to

> > > > > > > > > > give it to you.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave namah

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > You seem to be disagreeing with Shri B.V.

Raman

> > that

> > > > strong

> > > > > > > > > planets,

> > > > > > > > > > > whether malefic or benefics give good results,

> > while

> > > > weak

> > > > > > > planets

> > > > > > > > > > > give bad results. Perhaps you also disagree

about

> > > > strong

> > > > > > > malefics

> > > > > > > > > > > giving mahapurusha yogas. Isn't it contrary to

> > what

> > > > all the

> > > > > > > > > jyotish

> > > > > > > > > > > texts teach?

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Then, here are a few examples, where I find

that

> > strong

> > > > > > > malefics

> > > > > > > > > > > have neither made the natives krura nor that

their

> > > > > > > significations

> > > > > > > > > > > suffered.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Swami Vivekananda: strong sun in lagna and

mars

> > in 5th

> > > > > > house

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Sri Aurobindo: Strong Sun in 2nd house.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Maharshi Mahesh yogi: exalted Mars in lagna.

> > > > > > > > > > > Ramana Maharshi: strong Mars in 8th house

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Sri Ramakrishna Paramahamsa: Exalted Saturn

(9H)

> > and

> > > > Rahu

> > > > > > > (4H).

> > > > > > > > > Mars

> > > > > > > > > > > and Venus are also exalted in rasi, while

> > debilitated

> > > > in

> > > > > > > navamsa.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Sir, can you give me the reference

for "vipareetam

> > > > shaneH

> > > > > > > > > sritam"?

> > > > > > > > > > > Does it, by any chance, refer to Saturn's

> > placement in

> > > > the

> > > > > > > 8th

> > > > > > > > > house

> > > > > > > > > > > being beneficial?

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > I am happy that you agree strong Saturn gives

good

> > > > results.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Can you tell me from where the saying is

because i

> > > > would

> > > > > > > like to

> > > > > > > > > > > read it up myself and understand.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Chandrashekhar <chandrashekhar46@

> > > > > > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk>>

> > > > > > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > About Krura planets the saying is, that

with

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > strength the Krura grahas

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > become more Krura (Maha-krura) and the

> > shubha

> > > > grahas

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > become more shubha.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Only Shani is more krura when weak and

> > > > beneficial or

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > less krura when

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > strong "Viparitama shaneH smritam".

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My sun dasa started when I was 9 years

> > old, and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > ended when I was 15

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > years old. How come you didn't notice

the

> > > > second

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > part? I was old

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > enough to understand the difference

> > between

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > success and failure, I

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > guess!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Anyway, if you agree that Rahu is

giving

> > Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > results, and those

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > results are exceptionally good, then

it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > automatically follows that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun is strong in my chart because

> > according to

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Shri B.V Raman, evil

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > planets, especially when weak, give

bad

> > results

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > (vide "a catechism

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > of astrology"), while strong planets,

> > even if

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > evil, give good

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > results. If my Sun were weak, he

wouldn't

> > be

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > giving such good

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > results:--))

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Since Mercury is hopelessly combust

and

> > > > inferior

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > in shadbala

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > strength, the major results of Dharma

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > karmadhipathi yoga are also

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > given by Sun, because according

to "300

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > combinations" of Sri

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Raman, a planet with higher shadbala

is

> > more

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > likely to give the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > results of a yoga.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regarding Karna, I request you to

read the

> > > > Karna

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Parva of

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mahabharata again. When he died, the

> > nature

> > > > bowed

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > in grief, because

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > he's one of the noblest persons in

> > Mahabharata.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Even the episode you

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > quoted happened because Parashurama

would

> > teach

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > only Brahmins and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Karna desperately wanted to learn

> > dhanurvidya

> > > > from

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Parashurama so

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > that he can support Duryodhana.

Deceit is

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > certainly punishable and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Karna did pay dearly. But it's to be

> > borne in

> > > > mind

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > that whatever

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Karna did was only to please

Duryodhana,

> > his

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > dearest friend. Karna

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > did not gain anything personally.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the 3rd house from 8th

> > house (I

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > think there was a typo

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > at your end). In the natural zodiac,

the

> > 10 th

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > sign, being the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > cardinal earth sign, represents

> > south /dakshina

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > disha. South is the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > direction ruled by Yama, the lord of

> > death,

> > > > hence

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > represents burial grounds. So, the

Rudras

> > > > (Saturn,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun and Mars) are

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > strong in south. Also, Sun resides in

> > south and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > starts his

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > northern voyage from here. So he has

> > digbala in

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I did clarify that when I referred to

> > Surya as

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Karma saakshi, it's

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > only to his status as antaraatma and

not

> > as a

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > deity. Perhaps this

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > escaped your attention.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This is my last post on the subject.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > <%40>

> > > > <%40>

> > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <%

40>,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You were too young for the results

of

> > the

> > > > dasha

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > to manifest,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > though it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is good news that your father had

> > promotions

> > > > and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > you received

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > prizes/accolades during that time.

It is

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > interesting to know you

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > got

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > these results at a young age of 9

or so

> > as

> > > > that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > is when Sun dasha

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > was

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > operative. I am relieved you did not

> > have any

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > health problems in

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > March-August 1970 period.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But we are talking about Rahu and

Rahu

> > would

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > give results of Sun

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > more

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > prominently, by conjunction, as you

> > guessed

> > > > but

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > also that of

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mercury

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (You have a Dharmakarmaadhipati yoga

> > after

> > > > all)

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > and that is why I

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > said

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > for understanding Sun its dasha

instead

> > of

> > > > Rahu

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > dasha needs to be

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > analyzed.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mercury is malefic not because I

say so

> > but

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > because Jyotish says

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > mercury is malefic when conjunct a

papa

> > graha

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > and he is conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > two,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun and Rahu.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the apex of Artha

trikona

> > and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > directly involved with

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > efforts to earn money. Though

claimed

> > to be

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > smashana/burial

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ground, it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is 4th from ayush sthana (8th) and

its

> > home

> > > > that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > is why affliction

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > to it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > can give death. But 8th is more

> > popularly

> > > > called

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > mrityu sthana and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > hence

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th is called Smashana. If it is

really

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > smashana why would it be

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > called

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > karma sthana and why would Sun be at

> > its most

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > brilliant there?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I did not say he can not represent

water

> > > > bodies

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > in temple, but not

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > only

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > those.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My Sun dasa was excellent too. My

> > father

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > received promotion(s),

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > my

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > school/college days were great

and i

> > > > received

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > wide acclaim/prizes

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > for my ability in creative

writing,

> > Veena,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > quiz contests etc,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > apart

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > from studies. So, for a student, I

> > guess

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > that's excellent!!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > How do you justify this, if Sun

were

> > weak?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rahu is certainly

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > giving

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > the yogakaraka results, but being

in

> > Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > house and being

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun, don't you think Rahu is also

> > giving

> > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > results of Sun? You

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > said that mercury is malefic and

> > heavily

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > combust too:--))

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1th house also represent burial

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > ground/smashaana. Is that a place

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > for attachment?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandra represents all water

bodies,

> > so why

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > can't he represent

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > temple tank?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > === message truncated ===

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Tired of spam? Mail has the best

spam

> > > > protection

> > > > > > > > > around

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

<>

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> > > > < <>

> > < <>>>>

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> > < <>>

> > > > < <>

> > < <>>>

> > > > > > < <>

> > < <>>

> > > > < <>

> > < <>>>>>

> > > > > > > > > > > <

<>

> > < <>>

> > > > < <>

> > < <>>>

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> > < <>>

> > > > < <>

> > < <>>>>

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> > < <>>

> > > > < <>

> > < <>>>

> > > > > > < <>

> > < <>>

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> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > ---------

----

> > -----

> > > > ----

> > > > > > --

> > > > > > > -

> > > > > > > > > > > -------

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database:

> > 268.11.7/435 -

> > > > > > Release

> > > > > > > > > Date:

> > > > > > > > > > > 8/31/2006

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> > removed]

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > -------------

----

> > -----

> > > > ---

> > > > > > > > > -------

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database:

268.12.2/441 -

> > > > Release

> > > > > > > Date:

> > > > > > > > > 9/7/2006

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> > removed]

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > -----------------

----

> > ----

> > > > > > --

> > > > > > > -------

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.12.2/442 -

> > Release

> > > > > > Date:

> > > > > > > 9/8/2006

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > ________

> > > > > > > > Try the all-new Mail. "The New Version is

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> > > > > >

> > > > > > -----------------------

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> > > > -------

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> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.12.2/442 -

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[Guest guest]

Dear Divine Lakshmi,

 

Are you not deviating from the original thread? Where is the reference

to the dormant Kundalini being inauspicious? And may I know as to why

the shloka describing the state of Kundalini at Muladhara is excluded? I

am sure you know that Kundalini does not arise from Swadhishthana. Would

you bekind enough to quote the source sothat I could try to locate the

complete verse myself?

 

Chandrashekhar.

 

 

b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

>

>

> Om Gurave Namah

>

> Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

>

> "agnim swaadhistaanagataagnitejomayeem kundalineemichhdhwam.

> icchaadandenaahatyothapayadhwam....athaeva rodanaavasthasaahityaat.

> kulakundaadutthaapanasyotpatti roopatwaaccha sadya utpannaa

> kumaareetyuchyathe. yoshittaruNee kaarunyalakshaNaa

> sooryeNaahtaaduparibhaage saahityaatpativrataa. patim

> brahmarandhrastham kaameshwaram vratayati bhunkte payovratam

> braahmaNasyethi prayogaaccha evam koumaarataaruNya

> sambhogairarishtam shubham peeyusha varshaNaroopam anyadapi

> yatkinchitsaakriyathe karoti tatsarvam agnisswaadhisthaanagatho

> anuvedhati saadhayathi. agnijwalanenaiva chandramandalam dravateethi

> bhavaH"

>

> I am sure you can translate this and understand that Kundalini has

> the ability to do "shubham" only when it matures (utpatti avastha)

> and unites with Shiva causing the amrita varsham, through the medium

> of agni.

>

> Regards,

> Lakshmi

>

>

> <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> <chandrashekhar46 wrote:

> >

> > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> >

> > Please let me have one of the dozens of quotes from scriptures

> that you

> > have that state that dormant Kundalini is inauspicious. That will

> help

> > enlighten me. Then we will take up the Vag beeja and other Kootas.

> >

> > Chandrashekhar.

> >

> > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > >

> > >

> > > Om Gurave Namah

> > >

> > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > >

> > > Please tell me in the body divisions given according to kootas,

> is

> > > the head/face part of Vagbhava koota or not? Let's get this

> straight

> > > first, then we can discuss chakras and the rest. Please do not

> worry

> > > about quotes, because I will not disappoint you, and can provide

> > > them by the ton:--))

> > >

> > > When one is said to be "beheaded" does it mean the portion upto

> neck

> > > or the portion upto forehead?

> > >

> > > Are you not splitting hairs here?

> > >

> > > Regards,

> > > Lakshmi

> > >

> > >

> <%40>

> > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > >

> > > > If you think Sahasrara and Vishuddha Chakras at the same

> place,

> > > and if

> > > > Pankaja refers to head and not face, all your arguments are

> > > acceptable.

> > > > Unfortunately they are not.

> > > >

> > > > I see that you have not given anything in support of your

> argument

> > > > barring conjectures and have not commented on the shloka I

> sent

> > > you.

> > > >

> > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > >

> > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > >

> > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > >

> > > > > Lalitha Sahasranaamam describes Mother thus...

> > > > >

> > > > > Srimadvaagbhavakootaika swaroopamukha pankajaa

> > > > > kanthaadhakatiparyanta madhyakoota swaroopini

> > > > > Shaktikootaikathaapanna katyadhobhaagadhaariNi.

> > > > >

> > > > > The three divisions are

> > > > >

> > > > > Vagbhava koota - the face/head

> > > > > Madhya/kamaraaja koota - from neck to kati

> > > > > Shakti koota - the portion after kati to feet

> > > > >

> > > > > Can you tell me in this division, where does the head

> come...in

> > > the

> > > > > vagbhava koota or in shakti koota? Is there any other koota

> > > defined

> > > > > for the head/rear portion of the face etc? Or do you imply

> that

> > > > > Mother has only a face without the head!!!

> > > > >

> > > > > You know very well that we are not talking of astrology

> mappings

> > > > > here. Yet why you choose to interpret even a simple

> principle in

> > > > > this strange fashion is some thing beyond me, unless you are

> > > > > confused yourself (can happen to all of us) or want to

> confuse

> > > > > others (no comments).

> > > > >

> > > > > If either Bhagavan Hayagriva or Sage Agasthya intended

> that "bisa

> > > > > tantu taneeyasi" should be understood wrt kundalini at

> Mooladhara

> > > > > also they would have put it immediately after "mooladharaika

> > > > > nilayaa.. and not after "shatchakropari samsthithaa".

> > > > >

> > > > > ofcourse, I do not mean that Kundalini is like a python at

> > > > > mooladhara:--)), but definitely much grosser than at

> sahasraara.

> > > > >

> > > > > Btw, I am sure you know that kundalini is not agni

> tattwatmika at

> > > > > mooladhara. The agnitattwa of "vidyullekha" happens only

> from

> > > > > swadhisthana, because agni is oordhwa mukha and is ignited

> only

> > > when

> > > > > the Kundalini turns upwards.

> > > > >

> > > > > Regards,

> > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > >

> > > > >

> <%40>

> > > <%40>

> > > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > By the way Vag beeja kuta is not only head but a group of

> > > > > Panchadhasha

> > > > > > mantra and referred to as maa's face indicating the vacha.

> > > > > > Raajrajeshwari Kavacha prays that the vagbija protect the

> > > throat

> > > > > and not

> > > > > > the head as you imply. Certainly not head. And her

> principal

> > > abode

> > > > > is

> > > > > > said to be Mulaadhara and not sahasrara. However if you

> want

> > > to

> > > > > distort

> > > > > > this to mean she is inauspicious when dormant you are

> free to

> > > do

> > > > > so. I

> > > > > > would however request you to think why the HrIm beeja is

> most

> > > dear

> > > > > to

> > > > > > her and not the AiM beeja (Devi Patha, if you need the

> > > reference).

> > > > > It

> > > > > > would perhaps be well to understand that Kundalini means

> of

> > > the

> > > > > coiled

> > > > > > form and "Visa Tantu..." coming after that certainly does

> not

> > > mean

> > > > > what

> > > > > > you want to think it does.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > In the meanwhile, please contemplate on this.

> > > > > > Aaxare prdevta Éìjntax> k…{flI devta

> > > > > > ädhäre paradevatä bhavrajanatädhaù kuëòalé devatä

> > > > > > devanamixdevta iÇjgtamanNdpuÃiSwta,

> > > > > > devänämadhidevatä trijagatämänandapuïjasthitä|

> > > > > > mUlaxarinvaisnI iÇrm[i ya }ainnI mailnI

> > > > > > mülädhäraniväsiné triramaëé yä jïäniné mäliné

> > > > > > sa me mat&mnuiSwta k…lpwanNdEkbIjanna.32,21.

> > > > > > sä me mätåmanusthitä kulapathänandaikabéjänanä||32|21||

> > > > > >

> > > > > > This is how Kundalini is described in Rudrayamala Tantra.

> Do

> > > you

> > > > > think

> > > > > > it is wrong?

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > "vagbhavabeejasya kundalineethi sangnyaa

> > > thadroopa"...Kundalini

> > > > > as

> > > > > > > preceding "bisa tantu taneeyasee" is described as

> vagbhava

> > > beeja

> > > > > > > or "aim" (saraswati) beeja. As you have read the

> yamalas, i

> > > am

> > > > > sure

> > > > > > > you know which part of body comprises of vagbhava

> > > koota...it's

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > head!!

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Let me also explain the term preceding kundalini.

> > > > > > > It's "mahaasakthiH" and not "MahashakthiH" and talks of

> the

> > > > > > > eagerness of Mother to unite with Shiva....mahe utsave

> > > tatratya

> > > > > > > shivashaktisamaayogaroope aasakthiH tatparataa yasyaaH.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Is this enough to show that "bisa tantu taneeyasee" is

> the

> > > > > climactic

> > > > > > > name of shakti in ascension?

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Regarding Devi worshippers wrt unawakened kundalini,

> let me

> > > quote

> > > > > > > this sentence.....hey Srividyopaasakaah. uttishtatha.

> maa

> > > > > > > swaptha....meaning o srividyopaasaka! wake up( the

> > > kundalini).

> > > > > don't

> > > > > > > let it sleep!!

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Many thanks for this extended discussion on Kundalini.

> It's

> > > time

> > > > > for

> > > > > > > taking leave.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> <%40>

> > > <%40>

> > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > <%

> 40>, "b_lakshmi_ramesh"

> > > > > > > <b_lakshmi_ramesh@> wrote:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > The shadripus are kaama (lust), krodha (anger), lobha

> > > (greed),

> > > > > > > moha

> > > > > > > > (attachment, delusion), mada (pride) and maatsarya

> > > (jealousy)

> > > > > > > > If "mada" means "lust" what does "kaama" imply among

> the

> > > > > > > > shadripus? "Mada" signifies one who is

> intoxicated/drunk

> > > with

> > > > > > > > power/self-grandeur (pride/ego).

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Mother is known as "Vidya and avidya swaroopini" and

> > > correct

> > > > > > > > appreciation of Mother includes understanding of both

> > > facets.

> > > > > As

> > > > > > > > Shakti, She respresents raw power which can be routed

> > > towards

> > > > > good

> > > > > > > > deeds as well as bad deeds. Are both ends the same?

> The

> > > wisdom,

> > > > > > > > required to put this immense shakti to good use, is

> > > > > represented by

> > > > > > > > Shiva, hence the union of Shiva and Parvati, wisdom

> and

> > > power,

> > > > > is

> > > > > > > > said to be auspicious because it ensures the

> > > correct/judicious

> > > > > end

> > > > > > > > use of shakti. Hence the orientation of Shakti is very

> > > very

> > > > > > > > important.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > I always said that Soorya is both sattwik and krura. I

> > > also

> > > > > always

> > > > > > > > said all planets, including Jupiter, can give malefic

> > > results,

> > > > > if

> > > > > > > > they are functionally empowered to do so. You can

> refer

> > > to all

> > > > > my

> > > > > > > > previous mails to confirm this.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Sir, Truth is much more important than winning or

> losing

> > > an

> > > > > > > > argument. All discussions must proceed as an

> exploration

> > > and

> > > > > > > > celebration of Truth. When this is not the case, I

> see no

> > > > > purpose

> > > > > > > in

> > > > > > > > continuing these discussions.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Thanks & Regards,

> > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> <%40>

> > > <%40>

> > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Having Icchamrityu and dying at an early age are

> > > operating at

> > > > > > > > different

> > > > > > > > > levels. Bhishma had Iccha Mrityu but did not die

> young.

> > > So

> > > > > > > please

> > > > > > > > do not

> > > > > > > > > try to mix the issues. If you have read Swamiji's

> > > biography

> > > > > you

> > > > > > > > will

> > > > > > > > > find that he fell sick many times despite of

> apparent

> > > robust

> > > > > > > > physique.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Commenting on Shani in 4th for Rama's chart confirms

> > > with his

> > > > > > > > being

> > > > > > > > > capable of giving Vipareeta results. I did not know

> I

> > > was

> > > > > > > expected

> > > > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > > analyze the entire chart. By the way if there is a

> Kuja

> > > dosha

> > > > > > > how

> > > > > > > > does

> > > > > > > > > that by itself give a Divine wife? Please do not

> bring

> > > our

> > > > > > > > devotion to

> > > > > > > > > Lord Rama (and we both have that) into astrological

> > > analysis

> > > > > of

> > > > > > > > his chart.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Bringing in the dashas when the discussions are on

> the

> > > > > effects

> > > > > > > of

> > > > > > > > grahas

> > > > > > > > > will only lead the discussion to no where. The two

> have

> > > to be

> > > > > > > seen

> > > > > > > > > separately as we are not trying to time an event but

> > > only

> > > > > trying

> > > > > > > > to find

> > > > > > > > > what are the effects on bhavas occupied.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Dear Lakshmi in Ramana Maharshi's chart you have

> perhaps

> > > > > > > forgotten

> > > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > saying Kuja vat Ketu. look at the Ketu deha in that

> > > > > perspective

> > > > > > > > and let

> > > > > > > > > me know your views. And if by the way you read my

> mail,

> > > I did

> > > > > > > not

> > > > > > > > say

> > > > > > > > > anything about mars being killer for him, only that

> it

> > > gave

> > > > > him

> > > > > > > > Sarcoma

> > > > > > > > > being 3rd lord.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Also could you explain why Sun being Atma and always

> > > > > beneficent

> > > > > > > as

> > > > > > > > you

> > > > > > > > > have claimed all along in the thread on the topic,

> did

> > > its

> > > > > > > > Mahadasha

> > > > > > > > > prove to be Killer to Ramana Maharshi?

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Take care,

> > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > For example, remember that in Swami

> Vivekananda's

> > > chart

> > > > > > > Surya

> > > > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > > > lord of

> > > > > > > > > > > the 9th occupying the lagna and causing a

> powerful

> > > Raj

> > > > > yoga.

> > > > > > > At

> > > > > > > > > > the same

> > > > > > > > > > > time if you thin how long the Swamiji lived,

> you may

> > > > > have to

> > > > > > > > think

> > > > > > > > > > again

> > > > > > > > > > > about saying that it did not act as Mahakrura.

> Think

> > > > > about

> > > > > > > > what it

> > > > > > > > > > did

> > > > > > > > > > > to the 7th bhava of Swamiji, also, before

> declaring

> > > that

> > > > > it

> > > > > > > > became

> > > > > > > > > > > shubha or less malefic.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi: I think Swamiji had an icchamrityu and

> > > looking at

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > > dass

> > > > > > > > > > operating on 4th July 1902, I observe that he

> passed

> > > away

> > > > > in

> > > > > > > Jup-

> > > > > > > > Ven-

> > > > > > > > > > Jup-Ket-Sat-Sat.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Jup MD: 1893-02-09 (1:35:30 pm) - 1909-02-10

> (3:59:13

> > > pm)

> > > > > > > > > > Ven AD: 1900-12-25 (10:03:30 am) - 1903-08-27

> > > (4:48:54 pm)

> > > > > > > > > > Jup PD: 1902-05-02 (1:42:07 pm) - 1902-09-12

> > > (10:43:55 pm)

> > > > > > > > > > Ket SD: 1902-06-29 (9:11:48 am) - 1902-07-07

> (5:06:28

> > > am)

> > > > > > > > > > Sat PAD: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-06

> > > (2:29:24 am)

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Sat: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-05

> (1:27:03 am)

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Jupiter is in 2nd house from Moon, Venus is the

> 2nd

> > > lord

> > > > > from

> > > > > > > > Moon

> > > > > > > > > > and is posited in 2nd from lagna, Ketu is in the

> > > house of

> > > > > > > Venus

> > > > > > > > and

> > > > > > > > > > gives the results of Venus and Saturn is the 2nd

> lord

> > > from

> > > > > > > > > > lagna....all are marakas. the maraka

> significations

> > > are

> > > > > > > stronger

> > > > > > > > > > from Moon, and it's the cause of his early death.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > I fail to see where Sun comes into all this.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > However, I agree that Sun, as AK aspecting 7th

> house,

> > > can

> > > > > give

> > > > > > > > > > parivraja tendencies. But can you ignore the

> > > influence of

> > > > > > > Saturn

> > > > > > > > on

> > > > > > > > > > Moon and 4th house, occuring in the 10th house? I

> am

> > > sure

> > > > > even

> > > > > > > > weak

> > > > > > > > > > Sun would have given him parivraja yoga:--))but

> > > without the

> > > > > > > raja

> > > > > > > > > > yoga and the strong soul-level impact he created

> > > wherever

> > > > > he

> > > > > > > > went.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Or if you like look at what happened to the 7th

> > > > > > > > > > > Bhava of Lord Rama with exalted Mars in the 7th

> > > bhava.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Mars in 7th gives kuja dosha, and I think the

> strong

> > > Mars

> > > > > in

> > > > > > > 7th

> > > > > > > > > > gave him an exalted wife like Sita. You have not

> > > commented

> > > > > on

> > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > exalted Saturn in 4th house.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > In each of the

> > > > > > > > > > > example provided by you look at the bhava that

> the

> > > > > planets

> > > > > > > > occupy

> > > > > > > > > > > (barring Saturn, for reasons already stated in

> > > previous

> > > > > > > mail),

> > > > > > > > > > without

> > > > > > > > > > > looking at the charts as belonging to great

> people,

> > > and

> > > > > then

> > > > > > > > make

> > > > > > > > > > up

> > > > > > > > > > > your mind as to the truth or otherwise of what I

> > > said.

> > > > > Did

> > > > > > > you

> > > > > > > > > > know

> > > > > > > > > > > Ramana Maharshi died following a malignant

> sarcoma

> > > of

> > > > > left

> > > > > > > hand

> > > > > > > > > > and Mars

> > > > > > > > > > > is karaka for the 3rd bhava in 8th in his

> chart, in

> > > > > > > > exaltation. Do

> > > > > > > > > > you

> > > > > > > > > > > think Mars gave him benevolent results?

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I also request you to examine the

> > > following

> > > > > dasa

> > > > > > > > > > sequences with an open mind. Sun is the 3rd lord

> from

> > > Moon

> > > > > (AK)

> > > > > > > &

> > > > > > > > > > 12th lord from lagna in Sri Ramana's chart, rahu

> is

> > > with

> > > > > Sun

> > > > > > > and

> > > > > > > > > > gives Sun'/Saturn's/Jupiter's effects...all of

> which

> > > point

> > > > > to

> > > > > > > > > > dusthanas, Saturn is a maraka in 7th house and

> ketu

> > > can

> > > > > give

> > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > effects of Moon/Mercury/mars. Mar's effect, if at

> > > all, was

> > > > > only

> > > > > > > > > > indirect, and he was not the killer.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Sun MD: 1949-02-03 (1:02:22 am) - 1955-02-03

> (2:05:32

> > > pm)

> > > > > > > > > > Rah AD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1951-02-21

> (8:49:14

> > > am)

> > > > > > > > > > Rah PD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1950-05-18

> > > (12:04:47 am)

> > > > > > > > > > Sat SD: 1950-04-12 (3:37:16 am) - 1950-04-20

> > > (12:18:02 am)

> > > > > > > > > > Ket PAD: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14

> > > (11:08:26

> > > > > pm)

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Ket: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14

> (12:47:04

> > > pm)

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > I think what stands out is the fact that the dasa

> of

> > > the

> > > > > graha

> > > > > > > > > > conjoined Moon brought about death. I think their

> mind

> > > > > willed

> > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > death.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Can a planet give results in a dasa totally

> > > > > > > > unrelated/unassociated

> > > > > > > > > > with itself? I request you to consider the above

> > > > > objectively.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > I will talk about the other charts/issues in my

> next

> > > mail.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > In Paramhans Ramkrishna's chart,

> > > > > > > > > > > I do not know where you find Mars strong as a

> > > planet in

> > > > > > > > > > debilitation in

> > > > > > > > > > > Navamsha gives results of debility even when in

> > > > > exaltation

> > > > > > > in

> > > > > > > > rasi

> > > > > > > > > > > chart. In case of Saturn Viparitam shane

> smritam has

> > > > > already

> > > > > > > > been

> > > > > > > > > > > mentioned by me, in earlier mail.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I myself have not considered

> Mars/Venus

> > > in

> > > > > > > Thakur's

> > > > > > > > > > chart because they are debilitated. Please go

> through

> > > my

> > > > > > > message

> > > > > > > > > > again. I was talking about Saturn and Rahu.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > About Shri Aurobindo, I trust you are

> > > > > > > > > > > aware of his revolutionary background and that

> he

> > > was

> > > > > editor

> > > > > > > > of a

> > > > > > > > > > paper

> > > > > > > > > > > "Vande Mataram" not much known for its soft

> > > language.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Same is the case with strong Malefics giving

> P.M.

> > > Yogas.

> > > > > > > Every

> > > > > > > > > > graha is

> > > > > > > > > > > capable of 12 variations of a P.M. Yoga

> attributed

> > > to

> > > > > it, at

> > > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > very

> > > > > > > > > > > least. It would only be naive to imagine they

> would

> > > all

> > > > > give

> > > > > > > > > > identical

> > > > > > > > > > > results as indicated by Parashara or all with

> Pancha

> > > > > > > > Mahapurusha

> > > > > > > > > > Yoga

> > > > > > > > > > > would only rule over different parts of India

> > > (barring

> > > > > > > Saturn),

> > > > > > > > > > just

> > > > > > > > > > > because the sage said so. The sages gave us

> > > principles

> > > > > and

> > > > > > > > > > expected us

> > > > > > > > > > > to apply them to real life horoscope using

> Viveka.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > I would gladly give you the shloka giving the

> > > reference

> > > > > to

> > > > > > > > > > > "Viparita---Shane..." it is from an old classic

> > > respected

> > > > > > > > amongst

> > > > > > > > > > > astrologers, but as you do not seem to accept

> > > anything

> > > > > that

> > > > > > > > does

> > > > > > > > > > not fit

> > > > > > > > > > > in with what, you think. is said by Dr. Raman,

> it

> > > would

> > > > > be an

> > > > > > > > > > exercise

> > > > > > > > > > > in futility. should you yet want the shloka I

> would

> > > of

> > > > > > > course

> > > > > > > > be

> > > > > > > > > > glad to

> > > > > > > > > > > give it to you.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave namah

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > You seem to be disagreeing with Shri B.V.

> Raman

> > > that

> > > > > strong

> > > > > > > > > > planets,

> > > > > > > > > > > > whether malefic or benefics give good results,

> > > while

> > > > > weak

> > > > > > > > planets

> > > > > > > > > > > > give bad results. Perhaps you also disagree

> about

> > > > > strong

> > > > > > > > malefics

> > > > > > > > > > > > giving mahapurusha yogas. Isn't it contrary to

> > > what

> > > > > all the

> > > > > > > > > > jyotish

> > > > > > > > > > > > texts teach?

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Then, here are a few examples, where I find

> that

> > > strong

> > > > > > > > malefics

> > > > > > > > > > > > have neither made the natives krura nor that

> their

> > > > > > > > significations

> > > > > > > > > > > > suffered.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Swami Vivekananda: strong sun in lagna and

> mars

> > > in 5th

> > > > > > > house

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Sri Aurobindo: Strong Sun in 2nd house.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Maharshi Mahesh yogi: exalted Mars in lagna.

> > > > > > > > > > > > Ramana Maharshi: strong Mars in 8th house

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Sri Ramakrishna Paramahamsa: Exalted Saturn

> (9H)

> > > and

> > > > > Rahu

> > > > > > > > (4H).

> > > > > > > > > > Mars

> > > > > > > > > > > > and Venus are also exalted in rasi, while

> > > debilitated

> > > > > in

> > > > > > > > navamsa.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Sir, can you give me the reference

> for "vipareetam

> > > > > shaneH

> > > > > > > > > > sritam"?

> > > > > > > > > > > > Does it, by any chance, refer to Saturn's

> > > placement in

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > > 8th

> > > > > > > > > > house

> > > > > > > > > > > > being beneficial?

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > I am happy that you agree strong Saturn gives

> good

> > > > > results.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Can you tell me from where the saying is

> because i

> > > > > would

> > > > > > > > like to

> > > > > > > > > > > > read it up myself and understand.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Chandrashekhar <chandrashekhar46@

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk>>

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > About Krura planets the saying is, that

> with

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > strength the Krura grahas

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > become more Krura (Maha-krura) and the

> > > shubha

> > > > > grahas

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > become more shubha.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Only Shani is more krura when weak and

> > > > > beneficial or

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > less krura when

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > strong "Viparitama shaneH smritam".

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My sun dasa started when I was 9 years

> > > old, and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ended when I was 15

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > years old. How come you didn't notice

> the

> > > > > second

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > part? I was old

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > enough to understand the difference

> > > between

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > success and failure, I

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > guess!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Anyway, if you agree that Rahu is

> giving

> > > Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > results, and those

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > results are exceptionally good, then

> it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > automatically follows that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun is strong in my chart because

> > > according to

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Shri B.V Raman, evil

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > planets, especially when weak, give

> bad

> > > results

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (vide "a catechism

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > of astrology"), while strong planets,

> > > even if

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > evil, give good

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > results. If my Sun were weak, he

> wouldn't

> > > be

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > giving such good

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > results:--))

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Since Mercury is hopelessly combust

> and

> > > > > inferior

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > in shadbala

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > strength, the major results of Dharma

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > karmadhipathi yoga are also

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > given by Sun, because according

> to "300

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > combinations" of Sri

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Raman, a planet with higher shadbala

> is

> > > more

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > likely to give the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > results of a yoga.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regarding Karna, I request you to

> read the

> > > > > Karna

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Parva of

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mahabharata again. When he died, the

> > > nature

> > > > > bowed

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > in grief, because

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > he's one of the noblest persons in

> > > Mahabharata.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Even the episode you

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > quoted happened because Parashurama

> would

> > > teach

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > only Brahmins and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Karna desperately wanted to learn

> > > dhanurvidya

> > > > > from

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Parashurama so

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > that he can support Duryodhana.

> Deceit is

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > certainly punishable and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Karna did pay dearly. But it's to be

> > > borne in

> > > > > mind

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > that whatever

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Karna did was only to please

> Duryodhana,

> > > his

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > dearest friend. Karna

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > did not gain anything personally.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the 3rd house from 8th

> > > house (I

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > think there was a typo

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > at your end). In the natural zodiac,

> the

> > > 10 th

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > sign, being the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > cardinal earth sign, represents

> > > south /dakshina

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > disha. South is the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > direction ruled by Yama, the lord of

> > > death,

> > > > > hence

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > represents burial grounds. So, the

> Rudras

> > > > > (Saturn,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun and Mars) are

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > strong in south. Also, Sun resides in

> > > south and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > starts his

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > northern voyage from here. So he has

> > > digbala in

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I did clarify that when I referred to

> > > Surya as

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Karma saakshi, it's

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > only to his status as antaraatma and

> not

> > > as a

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > deity. Perhaps this

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > escaped your attention.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This is my last post on the subject.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> <%40>

> > > <%40>

> > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <%

> 40>,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You were too young for the results

> of

> > > the

> > > > > dasha

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > to manifest,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > though it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is good news that your father had

> > > promotions

> > > > > and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > you received

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > prizes/accolades during that time.

> It is

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > interesting to know you

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > got

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > these results at a young age of 9

> or so

> > > as

> > > > > that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is when Sun dasha

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > was

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > operative. I am relieved you did not

> > > have any

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > health problems in

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > March-August 1970 period.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But we are talking about Rahu and

> Rahu

> > > would

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > give results of Sun

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > more

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > prominently, by conjunction, as you

> > > guessed

> > > > > but

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > also that of

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mercury

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (You have a Dharmakarmaadhipati yoga

> > > after

> > > > > all)

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and that is why I

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > said

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > for understanding Sun its dasha

> instead

> > > of

> > > > > Rahu

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > dasha needs to be

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > analyzed.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mercury is malefic not because I

> say so

> > > but

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > because Jyotish says

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > mercury is malefic when conjunct a

> papa

> > > graha

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and he is conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > two,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun and Rahu.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the apex of Artha

> trikona

> > > and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > directly involved with

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > efforts to earn money. Though

> claimed

> > > to be

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > smashana/burial

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ground, it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is 4th from ayush sthana (8th) and

> its

> > > home

> > > > > that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is why affliction

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > to it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > can give death. But 8th is more

> > > popularly

> > > > > called

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > mrityu sthana and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > hence

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th is called Smashana. If it is

> really

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > smashana why would it be

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > called

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > karma sthana and why would Sun be at

> > > its most

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > brilliant there?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I did not say he can not represent

> water

> > > > > bodies

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > in temple, but not

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > only

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > those.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My Sun dasa was excellent too. My

> > > father

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > received promotion(s),

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > my

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > school/college days were great

> and i

> > > > > received

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > wide acclaim/prizes

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > for my ability in creative

> writing,

> > > Veena,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > quiz contests etc,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > apart

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > from studies. So, for a student, I

> > > guess

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > that's excellent!!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > How do you justify this, if Sun

> were

> > > weak?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rahu is certainly

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > giving

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > the yogakaraka results, but being

> in

> > > Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > house and being

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun, don't you think Rahu is also

> > > giving

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > results of Sun? You

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > said that mercury is malefic and

> > > heavily

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > combust too:--))

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1th house also represent burial

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ground/smashaana. Is that a place

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > for attachment?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandra represents all water

> bodies,

> > > so why

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > can't he represent

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > temple tank?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > === message truncated ===

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Tired of spam? Mail has the best

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> > > > > protection

> > > > > > > > > > around

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> > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---------

> ----

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> > > > > ----

> > > > > > > --

> > > > > > > > -

> > > > > > > > > > > > -------

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database:

> > > 268.11.7/435 -

> > > > > > > Release

> > > > > > > > > > Date:

> > > > > > > > > > > > 8/31/2006

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> > > removed]

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > -------------

> ----

> > > -----

> > > > > ---

> > > > > > > > > > -------

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database:

> 268.12.2/441 -

> > > > > Release

> > > > > > > > Date:

> > > > > > > > > > 9/7/2006

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> > > removed]

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > -----------------

> ----

> > > ----

> > > > > > > --

> > > > > > > > -------

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.12.2/442 -

> > > Release

> > > > > > > Date:

> > > > > > > > 9/8/2006

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > ________

> > > > > > > > > Try the all-new Mail. "The New Version is

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> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > -----------------------

> --

> > > > > -------

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.12.2/442 -

> Release

> > > Date:

> > > > > 9/8/2006

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

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> > > > > -------------------------

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> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.12.2/442 - Release

> Date:

> > > 9/8/2006

> > > >

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> Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.12.4/449 - Release 9/15/2006

 

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[Guest guest]

Dear Divine Lakshmi,

 

I did not say that. It was you who questioned whether a 5 year old can

be intoxicated? I have not said that a baby does not have a mind soul

etc. as far as I remember. I was only asking you about your premise of

what is inner qualities/inherent/natural qualities and what is not and

questioning the intoxication of a 5 year old child. I was pointing out

that intoxication when related to Mada is not necessarily though not

excluding that of intoxicating substance but also of mind.

 

I think ego, as being out of proportionate proud of one's actual or

perceived accomplishments and ego as the feeling of differentiation with

that of Parmatman is very different. This is the problem when one wants

to discuss Sanskrit or even Prakrit words in English. I think I have

already brought this to your notice earlier too.

 

I trust I have clarified my statements enough. And by the way when we

are discussing ego yes that is about anomalies brought about by certain

Grahas and who does that. Otherwise why would a graha, favorably

disposed, bring about bad qualities in a person?

 

Think about this. Would a weak Moon, afflicted and ill placed bring

about mental aberration or a strong Moon that is favorably placed? Would

weak Sun, unfavorably placed make one a King or a weak Sun unfavorably

placed? If we are talking about a graha giving all the attributes given

to it irrespective of its state of strength and type of placement, then

perhaps we have wasted everyone's time and space.

Chandrashekhar.

 

b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

>

>

> Om Gurave Namah

>

> Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

>

> God forbid that I should find "unmaada" a natural/normal occurrence

> in children. I am sure that you realize here that we are not

> discussing anomalies but regular qualities.

>

> "ego" as a separate "I" feeling occurs right from birth, as a

> survival instinct. It may not be apparent then, but then are soul,

> mind etc very apparent at that stage/age? Just because it's not

> actively manifested, can you say that a newborn baby has no soul,

> mind etc? similarly speech, sexuality are also latent in all, but

> will manifest only at the appropriate age.

>

> Please consider the above.

>

> Regards

> Lakshmi

>

>

> <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> <chandrashekhar46 wrote:

> >

> > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> >

> > Have you not heard about unmaada in even 3 year old children?

> Please

> > think about this before declaring that it is not possible in 5

> years

> > old. And congenital conditions where impure blood flows t heart

> causing

> > comatose conditions that can be equated to intoxication?

> >

> > I do not think I have said that a Bull elephant is in a permanent

> state

> > of intoxication. I have only used its example to indicate what is

> Mada.

> >

> > If the test of what is inner quality is being in that state

> permanently

> > then even your definition of ego suffers from not being so in very

> young

> > children. Nor is lust in existence from young age. Ask any medical

> > practitioner and he will tell that I am not wrong. Not that I

> think the

> > parameter is right.

> >

> >

> > Chandrashekhar.

> >

> > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > >

> > > Om Gurave Namah

> > >

> > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > >

> > > What i meant by "inner" quality is an "inherent/natural "

> quality of

> > > human being. Please refer to my original mail in this respect.

> > >

> > > Now, all of us have soul, mind, strength, speech, knowledge,

> > > happiness, ego (sense of being different from others) and grief.

> > > Even a 5 year old kid has all these qualities, as appropriate to

> > > his/her age, unless handicapped. Are we intoxicated? Is the 5

> year

> > > old intoxicated? Is "intoxication" a natural or unnatural

> quality?

> > > Is the bull elephant in a permanent state of intoxication?

> > >

> > > Regards,

> > > Lakshmi

> > >

> > >

> <%40>

> > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > >

> > > > At least AI did not answer as I did not want to split hairs

> over

> > > whether

> > > > all that is mentioned in the referred shloka is inner quality

> > > since I do

> > > > not find Kalyan Varman mentioning or implying so. However as

> you

> > > want an

> > > > reply, let me ask as to why if speech, attributed to Budha in

> the

> > > > shloka, can be internal quality according to you then why

> should

> > > > intoxication not be?

> > > >

> > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > >

> > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji & Pradeep ji,

> > > > >

> > > > > I recollect writing in my previous e-mails, that the shloka

> from

> > > > > Saravali talks about the inner qualities of an

> > > > > individual/kalapurusha. Does the word "mada" imply

> intoxication

> > > as

> > > > > an inner quality? Does the word "intoxication" belong in

> that

> > > > > context, in that group?

> > > > >

> > > > > I do not think either of you responded to that. perhaps you

> > > missed

> > > > > it out in the avalanche of e-mails:--))

> > > > >

> > > > > Can i have your response(s) please?

> > > > >

> > > > > Regards,

> > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > >

> > > > >

> <%40>

> > > <%40>

> > > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Pride is different from ego. Like it or not Mada does mean

> > > > > intoxication

> > > > > > or lust. The Kama that is referred to relates to kaamana

> which

> > > > > means

> > > > > > desires for things possessed by others. That is what

> Asteya,

> > > one

> > > > > of the

> > > > > > Yamas of Hatha yogas refer to.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > We are talking about auspiciousness or other wise of the

> > > dormant

> > > > > or

> > > > > > awakened Kundalini. As I said all scriptures can be

> > > misinterpreted

> > > > > if

> > > > > > one wants to do that. But that does not serve any

> purpose. I

> > > would

> > > > > not

> > > > > > go into what exactly is meant by Vidya and Avidya related

> to

> > > Maa.

> > > > > I have

> > > > > > not yet seen any Pramana, in the form of a shloka, to

> support

> > > your

> > > > > > proposition that dormant Kundalini is inauspicious and the

> > > > > awakened

> > > > > > Kundalini is auspicious so far. I have already posted the

> way

> > > my

> > > > > > generation has been taught to accept an argument, so I

> shall

> > > not

> > > > > repeat

> > > > > > it here.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > But I will not resort to conjectures and would like to

> quote

> > > from

> > > > > > Rudrayamala tantra about the swarUpa of dormant Kundalini.

> > > Being

> > > > > > graduate in sanskrit, I am sure I will not have to

> translate

> > > it

> > > > > for you.

> > > > > > Aaxare prdevta Éìjntax> k…{flI devta

> > > > > > ädhäre paradevatä bhavrajanatädhaù kuëòalé devatä

> > > > > > devanamixdevta iÇjgtamanNdpuÃiSwta,

> > > > > > devänämadhidevatä trijagatämänandapuïjasthitä|

> > > > > > mUlaxarinvaisnI iÇrm[i ya }ainnI mailnI

> > > > > > mülädhäraniväsiné triramaëé yä jïäniné mäliné

> > > > > > sa me mat&mnuiSwta k…lpwanNdEkbIjanna.32,21.

> > > > > > sä me mätåmanusthitä kulapathänandaikabéjänanä||32|21||

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I am sure you must have some quote to support your

> > > contention. I

> > > > > would

> > > > > > like to see the shloka, as against conjectures, so that I

> can

> > > > > improve

> > > > > > upon my knowledge of the swarupaa of Kundalini.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I can understand your reluctance to support your

> propositions

> > > with

> > > > > > suitable pramanas. I am sorry if I have hurt you by

> pointing

> > > out

> > > > > the

> > > > > > inconsistency in the way you treated Surya and Rahu

> > > combinations

> > > > > in two

> > > > > > different chart as stand out combinations only.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I had no intention to cause any hurt to you and if I have

> > > done so

> > > > > > inadvertently I crave your pardon.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Take care,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Chandrashekhar

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > The shadripus are kaama (lust), krodha (anger), lobha

> > > (greed),

> > > > > moha

> > > > > > > (attachment, delusion), mada (pride) and maatsarya

> > > (jealousy)

> > > > > > > If "mada" means "lust" what does "kaama" imply among the

> > > > > > > shadripus? "Mada" signifies one who is intoxicated/drunk

> > > with

> > > > > > > power/self-grandeur (pride/ego).

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Mother is known as "Vidya and avidya swaroopini" and

> correct

> > > > > > > appreciation of Mother includes understanding of both

> > > facets. As

> > > > > > > Shakti, She respresents raw power which can be routed

> > > towards

> > > > > good

> > > > > > > deeds as well as bad deeds. Are both ends the same? The

> > > wisdom,

> > > > > > > required to put this immense shakti to good use, is

> > > represented

> > > > > by

> > > > > > > Shiva, hence the union of Shiva and Parvati, wisdom and

> > > power, is

> > > > > > > said to be auspicious because it ensures the

> > > correct/judicious

> > > > > end

> > > > > > > use of shakti. Hence the orientation of Shakti is very

> very

> > > > > > > important.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I always said that Soorya is both sattwik and krura. I

> also

> > > > > always

> > > > > > > said all planets, including Jupiter, can give malefic

> > > results, if

> > > > > > > they are functionally empowered to do so. You can refer

> to

> > > all my

> > > > > > > previous mails to confirm this.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Sir, Truth is much more important than winning or

> losing an

> > > > > > > argument. All discussions must proceed as an

> exploration and

> > > > > > > celebration of Truth. When this is not the case, I see

> no

> > > > > purpose in

> > > > > > > continuing these discussions.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Thanks & Regards,

> > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> <%40>

> > > <%40>

> > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar

> > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Having Icchamrityu and dying at an early age are

> > > operating at

> > > > > > > different

> > > > > > > > levels. Bhishma had Iccha Mrityu but did not die

> young. So

> > > > > please

> > > > > > > do not

> > > > > > > > try to mix the issues. If you have read Swamiji's

> > > biography you

> > > > > > > will

> > > > > > > > find that he fell sick many times despite of apparent

> > > robust

> > > > > > > physique.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Commenting on Shani in 4th for Rama's chart confirms

> with

> > > his

> > > > > > > being

> > > > > > > > capable of giving Vipareeta results. I did not know I

> was

> > > > > expected

> > > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > analyze the entire chart. By the way if there is a

> Kuja

> > > dosha

> > > > > how

> > > > > > > does

> > > > > > > > that by itself give a Divine wife? Please do not

> bring our

> > > > > > > devotion to

> > > > > > > > Lord Rama (and we both have that) into astrological

> > > analysis of

> > > > > > > his chart.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Bringing in the dashas when the discussions are on the

> > > effects

> > > > > of

> > > > > > > grahas

> > > > > > > > will only lead the discussion to no where. The two

> have

> > > to be

> > > > > seen

> > > > > > > > separately as we are not trying to time an event but

> only

> > > > > trying

> > > > > > > to find

> > > > > > > > what are the effects on bhavas occupied.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Dear Lakshmi in Ramana Maharshi's chart you have

> perhaps

> > > > > forgotten

> > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > saying Kuja vat Ketu. look at the Ketu deha in that

> > > perspective

> > > > > > > and let

> > > > > > > > me know your views. And if by the way you read my

> mail, I

> > > did

> > > > > not

> > > > > > > say

> > > > > > > > anything about mars being killer for him, only that it

> > > gave him

> > > > > > > Sarcoma

> > > > > > > > being 3rd lord.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Also could you explain why Sun being Atma and always

> > > > > beneficent as

> > > > > > > you

> > > > > > > > have claimed all along in the thread on the topic,

> did its

> > > > > > > Mahadasha

> > > > > > > > prove to be Killer to Ramana Maharshi?

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Take care,

> > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > For example, remember that in Swami Vivekananda's

> > > chart

> > > > > Surya

> > > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > > lord of

> > > > > > > > > > the 9th occupying the lagna and causing a

> powerful Raj

> > > > > yoga. At

> > > > > > > > > the same

> > > > > > > > > > time if you thin how long the Swamiji lived, you

> may

> > > have

> > > > > to

> > > > > > > think

> > > > > > > > > again

> > > > > > > > > > about saying that it did not act as Mahakrura.

> Think

> > > about

> > > > > > > what it

> > > > > > > > > did

> > > > > > > > > > to the 7th bhava of Swamiji, also, before

> declaring

> > > that it

> > > > > > > became

> > > > > > > > > > shubha or less malefic.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Lakshmi: I think Swamiji had an icchamrityu and

> looking

> > > at

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > dass

> > > > > > > > > operating on 4th July 1902, I observe that he passed

> > > away in

> > > > > Jup-

> > > > > > > Ven-

> > > > > > > > > Jup-Ket-Sat-Sat.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Jup MD: 1893-02-09 (1:35:30 pm) - 1909-02-10

> (3:59:13

> > > pm)

> > > > > > > > > Ven AD: 1900-12-25 (10:03:30 am) - 1903-08-27

> (4:48:54

> > > pm)

> > > > > > > > > Jup PD: 1902-05-02 (1:42:07 pm) - 1902-09-12

> (10:43:55

> > > pm)

> > > > > > > > > Ket SD: 1902-06-29 (9:11:48 am) - 1902-07-07

> (5:06:28

> > > am)

> > > > > > > > > Sat PAD: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-06

> (2:29:24

> > > am)

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Sat: 1902-07-04 (8:44:27 pm) - 1902-07-05 (1:27:03

> am)

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Jupiter is in 2nd house from Moon, Venus is the 2nd

> > > lord from

> > > > > > > Moon

> > > > > > > > > and is posited in 2nd from lagna, Ketu is in the

> house

> > > of

> > > > > Venus

> > > > > > > and

> > > > > > > > > gives the results of Venus and Saturn is the 2nd

> lord

> > > from

> > > > > > > > > lagna....all are marakas. the maraka significations

> are

> > > > > stronger

> > > > > > > > > from Moon, and it's the cause of his early death.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > I fail to see where Sun comes into all this.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > However, I agree that Sun, as AK aspecting 7th

> house,

> > > can

> > > > > give

> > > > > > > > > parivraja tendencies. But can you ignore the

> influence

> > > of

> > > > > Saturn

> > > > > > > on

> > > > > > > > > Moon and 4th house, occuring in the 10th house? I am

> > > sure

> > > > > even

> > > > > > > weak

> > > > > > > > > Sun would have given him parivraja yoga:--))but

> without

> > > the

> > > > > raja

> > > > > > > > > yoga and the strong soul-level impact he created

> > > wherever he

> > > > > > > went.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Or if you like look at what happened to the 7th

> > > > > > > > > > Bhava of Lord Rama with exalted Mars in the 7th

> bhava.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Mars in 7th gives kuja dosha, and I think the strong

> > > Mars in

> > > > > 7th

> > > > > > > > > gave him an exalted wife like Sita. You have not

> > > commented

> > > > > on the

> > > > > > > > > exalted Saturn in 4th house.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > In each of the

> > > > > > > > > > example provided by you look at the bhava that the

> > > planets

> > > > > > > occupy

> > > > > > > > > > (barring Saturn, for reasons already stated in

> > > previous

> > > > > mail),

> > > > > > > > > without

> > > > > > > > > > looking at the charts as belonging to great

> people,

> > > and

> > > > > then

> > > > > > > make

> > > > > > > > > up

> > > > > > > > > > your mind as to the truth or otherwise of what I

> > > said. Did

> > > > > you

> > > > > > > > > know

> > > > > > > > > > Ramana Maharshi died following a malignant

> sarcoma of

> > > left

> > > > > hand

> > > > > > > > > and Mars

> > > > > > > > > > is karaka for the 3rd bhava in 8th in his chart,

> in

> > > > > > > exaltation. Do

> > > > > > > > > you

> > > > > > > > > > think Mars gave him benevolent results?

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I also request you to examine the

> > > following

> > > > > dasa

> > > > > > > > > sequences with an open mind. Sun is the 3rd lord

> from

> > > Moon

> > > > > (AK) &

> > > > > > > > > 12th lord from lagna in Sri Ramana's chart, rahu is

> > > with Sun

> > > > > and

> > > > > > > > > gives Sun'/Saturn's/Jupiter's effects...all of which

> > > point to

> > > > > > > > > dusthanas, Saturn is a maraka in 7th house and ketu

> can

> > > give

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > effects of Moon/Mercury/mars. Mar's effect, if at

> all,

> > > was

> > > > > only

> > > > > > > > > indirect, and he was not the killer.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (started from Moon):

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Sun MD: 1949-02-03 (1:02:22 am) - 1955-02-03

> (2:05:32

> > > pm)

> > > > > > > > > Rah AD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1951-02-21

> (8:49:14

> > > am)

> > > > > > > > > Rah PD: 1950-03-29 (3:54:04 am) - 1950-05-18

> (12:04:47

> > > am)

> > > > > > > > > Sat SD: 1950-04-12 (3:37:16 am) - 1950-04-20

> (12:18:02

> > > am)

> > > > > > > > > Ket PAD: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14

> > > (11:08:26 pm)

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Deha-antardasas in this PAD:

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Ket: 1950-04-14 (12:08:34 pm) - 1950-04-14

> (12:47:04 pm)

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > I think what stands out is the fact that the dasa

> of the

> > > > > graha

> > > > > > > > > conjoined Moon brought about death. I think their

> mind

> > > > > willed the

> > > > > > > > > death.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Can a planet give results in a dasa totally

> > > > > > > unrelated/unassociated

> > > > > > > > > with itself? I request you to consider the above

> > > objectively.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > I will talk about the other charts/issues in my next

> > > mail.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > In Paramhans Ramkrishna's chart,

> > > > > > > > > > I do not know where you find Mars strong as a

> planet

> > > in

> > > > > > > > > debilitation in

> > > > > > > > > > Navamsha gives results of debility even when in

> > > exaltation

> > > > > in

> > > > > > > rasi

> > > > > > > > > > chart. In case of Saturn Viparitam shane smritam

> has

> > > > > already

> > > > > > > been

> > > > > > > > > > mentioned by me, in earlier mail.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Lakshmi: Sir, I myself have not considered

> Mars/Venus in

> > > > > Thakur's

> > > > > > > > > chart because they are debilitated. Please go

> through my

> > > > > message

> > > > > > > > > again. I was talking about Saturn and Rahu.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > About Shri Aurobindo, I trust you are

> > > > > > > > > > aware of his revolutionary background and that he

> was

> > > > > editor

> > > > > > > of a

> > > > > > > > > paper

> > > > > > > > > > "Vande Mataram" not much known for its soft

> language.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Same is the case with strong Malefics giving P.M.

> > > Yogas.

> > > > > Every

> > > > > > > > > graha is

> > > > > > > > > > capable of 12 variations of a P.M. Yoga

> attributed to

> > > it,

> > > > > at

> > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > very

> > > > > > > > > > least. It would only be naive to imagine they

> would

> > > all

> > > > > give

> > > > > > > > > identical

> > > > > > > > > > results as indicated by Parashara or all with

> Pancha

> > > > > > > Mahapurusha

> > > > > > > > > Yoga

> > > > > > > > > > would only rule over different parts of India

> (barring

> > > > > Saturn),

> > > > > > > > > just

> > > > > > > > > > because the sage said so. The sages gave us

> > > principles and

> > > > > > > > > expected us

> > > > > > > > > > to apply them to real life horoscope using Viveka.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > I would gladly give you the shloka giving the

> > > reference to

> > > > > > > > > > "Viparita---Shane..." it is from an old classic

> > > respected

> > > > > > > amongst

> > > > > > > > > > astrologers, but as you do not seem to accept

> > > anything that

> > > > > > > does

> > > > > > > > > not fit

> > > > > > > > > > in with what, you think. is said by Dr. Raman, it

> > > would be

> > > > > an

> > > > > > > > > exercise

> > > > > > > > > > in futility. should you yet want the shloka I

> would of

> > > > > course

> > > > > > > be

> > > > > > > > > glad to

> > > > > > > > > > give it to you.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave namah

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > You seem to be disagreeing with Shri B.V. Raman

> that

> > > > > strong

> > > > > > > > > planets,

> > > > > > > > > > > whether malefic or benefics give good results,

> > > while weak

> > > > > > > planets

> > > > > > > > > > > give bad results. Perhaps you also disagree

> about

> > > strong

> > > > > > > malefics

> > > > > > > > > > > giving mahapurusha yogas. Isn't it contrary to

> what

> > > all

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > jyotish

> > > > > > > > > > > texts teach?

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Then, here are a few examples, where I find that

> > > strong

> > > > > > > malefics

> > > > > > > > > > > have neither made the natives krura nor that

> their

> > > > > > > significations

> > > > > > > > > > > suffered.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Swami Vivekananda: strong sun in lagna and mars

> in

> > > 5th

> > > > > house

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Sri Aurobindo: Strong Sun in 2nd house.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Maharshi Mahesh yogi: exalted Mars in lagna.

> > > > > > > > > > > Ramana Maharshi: strong Mars in 8th house

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Sri Ramakrishna Paramahamsa: Exalted Saturn(9H)

> and

> > > Rahu

> > > > > > > (4H).

> > > > > > > > > Mars

> > > > > > > > > > > and Venus are also exalted in rasi, while

> > > debilitated in

> > > > > > > navamsa.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Sir, can you give me the reference

> for "vipareetam

> > > shaneH

> > > > > > > > > sritam"?

> > > > > > > > > > > Does it, by any chance, refer to Saturn's

> placement

> > > in

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > 8th

> > > > > > > > > house

> > > > > > > > > > > being beneficial?

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > I am happy that you agree strong Saturn gives

> good

> > > > > results.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Can you tell me from where the saying is

> because i

> > > would

> > > > > > > like to

> > > > > > > > > > > read it up myself and understand.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Chandrashekhar <chandrashekhar46@

> > > > > > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk>>

> > > > > > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > About Krura planets the saying is, that

> with

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > strength the Krura grahas

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > become more Krura (Maha-krura) and the

> shubha

> > > > > grahas

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > become more shubha.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Only Shani is more krura when weak and

> > > beneficial

> > > > > or

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > less krura when

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > strong "Viparitama shaneH smritam".

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My sun dasa started when I was 9 years

> old,

> > > and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > ended when I was 15

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > years old. How come you didn't notice

> the

> > > second

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > part? I was old

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > enough to understand the difference

> between

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > success and failure, I

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > guess!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Anyway, if you agree that Rahu is giving

> > > Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > results, and those

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > results are exceptionally good, then it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > automatically follows that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun is strong in my chart because

> according

> > > to

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Shri B.V Raman, evil

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > planets, especially when weak, give bad

> > > results

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > (vide "a catechism

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > of astrology"), while strong planets,

> even

> > > if

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > evil, give good

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > results. If my Sun were weak, he

> wouldn't be

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > giving such good

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > results:--))

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Since Mercury is hopelessly combust and

> > > inferior

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > in shadbala

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > strength, the major results of Dharma

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > karmadhipathi yoga are also

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > given by Sun, because according to "300

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > combinations" of Sri

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Raman, a planet with higher shadbala is

> more

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > likely to give the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > results of a yoga.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regarding Karna, I request you to read

> the

> > > Karna

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Parva of

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mahabharata again. When he died, the

> nature

> > > bowed

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > in grief, because

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > he's one of the noblest persons in

> > > Mahabharata.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Even the episode you

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > quoted happened because Parashurama

> would

> > > teach

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > only Brahmins and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Karna desperately wanted to learn

> > > dhanurvidya

> > > > > from

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Parashurama so

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > that he can support Duryodhana. Deceit

> is

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > certainly punishable and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Karna did pay dearly. But it's to be

> borne

> > > in

> > > > > mind

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > that whatever

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Karna did was only to please

> Duryodhana, his

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > dearest friend. Karna

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > did not gain anything personally.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the 3rd house from 8th

> house

> > > (I

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > think there was a typo

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > at your end). In the natural zodiac,

> the 10

> > > th

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > sign, being the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > cardinal earth sign, represents

> > > south /dakshina

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > disha. South is the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > direction ruled by Yama, the lord of

> death,

> > > hence

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > represents burial grounds. So, the

> Rudras

> > > > > (Saturn,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun and Mars) are

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > strong in south. Also, Sun resides in

> south

> > > and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > starts his

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > northern voyage from here. So he has

> > > digbala in

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I did clarify that when I referred to

> Surya

> > > as

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Karma saakshi, it's

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > only to his status as antaraatma and

> not as

> > > a

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > deity. Perhaps this

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > escaped your attention.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This is my last post on the subject.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> <%40>

> > > <%40>

> > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40>

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40>,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine Lakshmi,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You were too young for the results of

> the

> > > dasha

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > to manifest,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > though it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is good news that your father had

> > > promotions

> > > > > and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > you received

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > prizes/accolades during that time. It

> is

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > interesting to know you

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > got

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > these results at a young age of 9 or

> so

> > > as that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > is when Sun dasha

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > was

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > operative. I am relieved you did not

> have

> > > any

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > health problems in

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > March-August 1970 period.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But we are talking about Rahu and Rahu

> > > would

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > give results of Sun

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > more

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > prominently, by conjunction, as you

> > > guessed but

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > also that of

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mercury

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (You have a Dharmakarmaadhipati yoga

> > > after all)

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > and that is why I

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > said

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > for understanding Sun its dasha

> instead

> > > of Rahu

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > dasha needs to be

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > analyzed.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mercury is malefic not because I say

> so

> > > but

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > because Jyotish says

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > mercury is malefic when conjunct a

> papa

> > > graha

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > and he is conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > two,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun and Rahu.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th house is the apex of Artha

> trikona

> > > and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > directly involved with

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > efforts to earn money. Though claimed

> to

> > > be

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > smashana/burial

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ground, it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is 4th from ayush sthana (8th) and its

> > > home

> > > > > that

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > is why affliction

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > to it

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > can give death. But 8th is more

> popularly

> > > > > called

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > mrityu sthana and

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > hence

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th is called Smashana. If it is

> really

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > smashana why would it be

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > called

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > karma sthana and why would Sun be at

> its

> > > most

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > brilliant there?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I did not say he can not represent

> water

> > > bodies

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > in temple, but not

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > only

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > those.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > b_lakshmi_ramesh wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Chandrasekhar ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My Sun dasa was excellent too. My

> father

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > received promotion(s),

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > my

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > school/college days were great and i

> > > received

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > wide acclaim/prizes

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > for my ability in creative writing,

> > > Veena,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > quiz contests etc,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > apart

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > from studies. So, for a student, I

> guess

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > that's excellent!!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > How do you justify this, if Sun were

> > > weak?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rahu is certainly

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > giving

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > the yogakaraka results, but being in

> > > Sun's

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > house and being

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > conjunct

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun, don't you think Rahu is also

> > > giving the

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > results of Sun? You

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > said that mercury is malefic and

> heavily

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > combust too:--))

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1th house also represent burial

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > ground/smashaana. Is that a place

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > for attachment?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandra represents all water

> bodies, so

> > > why

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > can't he represent

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > temple tank?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lakshmi

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > === message truncated ===

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Tired of spam? Mail has the best spam

> > > > > protection

> > > > > > > > > around

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> > > > > > > > > > > > > -----------

> ----

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> > > > > ----

> > > > > > > -

> > > > > > > > > > > -------

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database:

> > > 268.11.7/435 -

> > > > > Release

> > > > > > > > > Date:

> > > > > > > > > > > 8/31/2006

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> > > removed]

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > ---------------

> ----

> > > -----

> > > > > -

> > > > > > > > > -------

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database:

> 268.12.2/441 -

> > > Release

> > > > > > > Date:

> > > > > > > > > 9/7/2006

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> removed]

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > -------------------

> ----

> > > --

> > > > > > > -------

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.12.2/442 -

> > > Release

> > > > > Date:

> > > > > > > 9/8/2006

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

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> > > <http://uk.docs./nowyoucan.html

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> <http://uk.docs./nowyoucan.html>

> > > <http://uk.docs./nowyoucan.html

> <http://uk.docs./nowyoucan.html>>>>

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > -----------------------

> --

> > > > > -------

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.12.2/442 -

> Release

> > > Date:

> > > > > 9/8/2006

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

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> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > -------------------------

> > > -------

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.12.2/442 - Release

> Date:

> > > 9/8/2006

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > ________

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> > >

> > >

> > > -------------------------

> -------

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.12.4/449 - Release Date:

> 9/15/2006

> >

> >

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> Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.12.4/449 - Release 9/15/2006

 

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