Guest guest Report post Posted October 31, 2005 Poor Mary Anne. I often feel sorry for you at times because it seems as if you really don't understand why I and others often answer you the way we do. We are not trying to hurt your feelings but feel compelled to correct what we view as erroneous thinking. This is not meant to hurt or offend you, but nevertheless, I think (or hope) you are learning some valuable lessons here about cultural presumptiousness. I often look at your post and think twice before answering them and try to think exactly how to answer them. Nevertheless, Bsubramaniam has summed up my position and tone in everything that I normally answer to you. Western etiquette does not have to be embraced when you are dealing with the cultural milieu of Hinduism or any other indigenous culture. And that is the consternation I often have with your post when I make a rebuttal. I know this is probably a hard and humbling lesson for you to learn coming from your cultural and racial persuasion, and coming from a culture (American) wherein people question everything. But, it is so often in the history of the world that Western man so often assumes that everything should be geared his way and does not even realize the condescension that he is displaying. Or to put it more aptly, he often tries to superimpose western psychology, understanding, values, mores, and such, on indigenous cultures without even recognizing it. He very often assumes that any & everything should be geared towards his or her liking, and so often wants to either totally co-opt another culture without giving proper due, or pick, choose or reject parts of a culture that fits his or her liking. For instance, you mentioned about the beauty of Ammachi's teachings suiting Westerners and such. I don't think you realized that by saying such, you were actually negating the religion itself on the sly. It was as if to say that Ammachi's teachings are now somehow worthy of western attention because of a lesser dose of Hinduness involved; or better still because of a lesser dose of Hinduism involved that is only how westerners come to Ammachi. I don't believe you thought about it this way, or meant it this way either The sad thing is that many don't even recognize and don't realize that most Non-European culture people such as myself can detect it and sniff it out in a heart beat. Whether it is something that people say in seemingly small insignificant comments, snide remarks, or jokes, we can normally read between the lines when others can't. The funny thing is, this attitude can very often be seen in the so-called liberal types who actually pride themselves on being very open minded, but are actually carrying the "white man's burden" (or more politically correct, the "Western Man's Burden"), and are not even aware of it. Therefore, Mary Anne, that's where I think you and I are. You asked me a few weeks back what was my ethnicity, and I never answered you back. Why do you want to know? Will my being Indian or Non-Indian somehow qualify or disqualify me from writing rebuttals to your posts on this board? I mean really! I really don't like dissension, as it makes me uncomfortable. But, when you write something that conflicts with the predominant worldview of this SS Board, I have to strike. READ: This is a HINDU board, therefore HINDU people very often may very often look askance at somethings you may say. Please take a hard look at yourself and maybe you can realize how your attitude is eliciting these kind of responses from people. My 2 cents. JANARDANA DAS bsubramaniam wrote: This was not to offend you. After reading your original email, the following come to mind. Getting a mantra initiation from a Guru is not like a purchasing transaction. You did not like the product & therefore exchanged it. Guru gives a mantra for a person as he/she perceives appropriate at that time. This is not like poor customer service that you complained about. One does not question the reason for Guru giving a particular mantra(period). Many do not get the mantra they are seeking. The Guru may sometime give them a different mantra either for preparing them eventually to receive the mantra they are seeking or may consider a different mantra appropriate for the disciple. Without Siva there is no Sakti and without Sakti there is no Siva. The Mahaswamigal of Kanchi Mutt has eloquently described this in his commentary on Saundarya Lahari. Quoting “Even according to the Sakta system, it is not possible to separate Sakti from Siva and make the former an outward entity. The two are like the lamp and its flame, like the flower and its fragrance, like milk and its whiteness, like honey and its sweetness, like the word and its meaning. Are not these pairs inseparably bound together? …The mutual bond between Siva and Sakti must always be felt by us in the innermost recesses of our hearts.” If you pray to Sakti you are praying to Siva & vice versa whether the mantra is for Ardanarishwara or not. Sanskrit pronunciation differs considerably from Kashmir to Tamil Nadu in India. A mantra like "Om Sivasaktyaikya Rupinyai Namah" even though very clear as far as pronunciation in sanskrit will be pronounced with varying accent across various parts of India. The judgment that I take objection to is the fact that you judged swami as having spa out the word rupinyai in your mantra. You did not elucidate whether you asked him if he found the mantra given to you as a problem or any such query. Yet you passed judgment on the fact that he spat out the word. Did you find out if your mantra required pronunciation in a particular way? Also, when teaching mantra to people who do not know Sanskrit, each word/break is sometimes pronounced in such a way that it is clear, but may sound guttural or harsh when compared to a mantra that is chanted continuously. Without exploring these, it is wrong to pass judgment. It is common practice that people are not allowed to touch Sankaracharya at most times. It does not matter whether it is a male or female. There would be consternation if anyone tries to touch Sankaracharya. Even a person's head touching his feet is not allowed at most times. There are times when he allows people to wash his feet & fall at his feet. He may also touch their head as a sign of blessings. These however are not the norm, but on specific occasions & time. Therefore there does not have to be any ulterior feelings for the swami refusing to hug you. He does not have to embrace western etiquette. -------------- Original message -------------- In what way have I judged the swami? I exercised my own discernment regarding the mantra I had asked for, and the swami acted of his own accord in the scheme of all that. And he brougth me to Amma, who gave me the mantra I had requested. As I said before, I don't really know what the swami meant by his actions after I received the mantra I had requested. It isn't judging him to feel confused, and to feel, also, that if he had a valid point to make, I might have understood it better if he'd actually told me what the point was. However, maybe he didn't even know what he was getting at. Maybe he was annoyed. Or, perhaps, as suggested by other members, he was simply blinded by my human female beauty and cannot be held responsible for his own actions LOL , bsubramaniam@c... wrote: > > >Ammachi reaches so many people with such a >wonderful message > >of how a loving, compassionate heart is God, and >that we should not > >judge others, or speak ill of others. To do so is >to judge and speak > >ill of ourselves, and of the Self. > > > And yet you have judged the swami who initiated you with the mantra. How hypocritical Deepavali greeting Traditions Divine Visit your group "" on the web. FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 31, 2005 Janardana Dasa, I just want to say I really appreciated this post and think these views are right on. I am not talking in a personal way towards Mary Anne since I have not been following the thread that closely. You stated the matter very clearly. If only more westerners could see these simple facts. But it is near impossible for that to be the case unless they either spend significant time in India or significant time with people that can point out their "Western Discourse" as Foucault puts it. It is the conditioning that comes with being born and educated here in the West. Jai Maa! Surya PS I have been with Amma closely for 16 years, doing Her US Tours where I have been part of the official staff or volunteer staff (now that I have two kids to contend with). Her Swamis never hug any women. Amma would really rip them if they did, believe me! - Janardana Dasa Monday, October 31, 2005 1:08 AM Re: Re: Just want to share. Poor Mary Anne. I often feel sorry for you at times because it seems as if you really don't understand why I and others often answer you the way we do. We are not trying to hurt your feelings but feel compelled to correct what we view as erroneous thinking. This is not meant to hurt or offend you, but nevertheless, I think (or hope) you are learning some valuable lessons here about cultural presumptiousness. I often look at your post and think twice before answering them and try to think exactly how to answer them. Nevertheless, Bsubramaniam has summed up my position and tone in everything that I normally answer to you. Western etiquette does not have to be embraced when you are dealing with the cultural milieu of Hinduism or any other indigenous culture. And that is the consternation I often have with your post when I make a rebuttal. I know this is probably a hard and humbling lesson for you to learn coming from your cultural and racial persuasion, and coming from a culture (American) wherein people question everything. But, it is so often in the history of the world that Western man so often assumes that everything should be geared his way and does not even realize the condescension that he is displaying. Or to put it more aptly, he often tries to superimpose western psychology, understanding, values, mores, and such, on indigenous cultures without even recognizing it. He very often assumes that any & everything should be geared towards his or her liking, and so often wants to either totally co-opt another culture without giving proper due, or pick, choose or reject parts of a culture that fits his or her liking. For instance, you mentioned about the beauty of Ammachi's teachings suiting Westerners and such. I don't think you realized that by saying such, you were actually negating the religion itself on the sly. It was as if to say that Ammachi's teachings are now somehow worthy of western attention because of a lesser dose of Hinduness involved; or better still because of a lesser dose of Hinduism involved that is only how westerners come to Ammachi. I don't believe you thought about it this way, or meant it this way either The sad thing is that many don't even recognize and don't realize that most Non-European culture people such as myself can detect it and sniff it out in a heart beat. Whether it is something that people say in seemingly small insignificant comments, snide remarks, or jokes, we can normally read between the lines when others can't. The funny thing is, this attitude can very often be seen in the so-called liberal types who actually pride themselves on being very open minded, but are actually carrying the "white man's burden" (or more politically correct, the "Western Man's Burden"), and are not even aware of it. Therefore, Mary Anne, that's where I think you and I are. You asked me a few weeks back what was my ethnicity, and I never answered you back. Why do you want to know? Will my being Indian or Non-Indian somehow qualify or disqualify me from writing rebuttals to your posts on this board? I mean really! I really don't like dissension, as it makes me uncomfortable. But, when you write something that conflicts with the predominant worldview of this SS Board, I have to strike. READ: This is a HINDU board, therefore HINDU people very often may very often look askance at somethings you may say. Please take a hard look at yourself and maybe you can realize how your attitude is eliciting these kind of responses from people. My 2 cents. JANARDANA DAS bsubramaniam wrote: This was not to offend you. After reading your original email, the following come to mind. Getting a mantra initiation from a Guru is not like a purchasing transaction. You did not like the product & therefore exchanged it. Guru gives a mantra for a person as he/she perceives appropriate at that time. This is not like poor customer service that you complained about. One does not question the reason for Guru giving a particular mantra(period). Many do not get the mantra they are seeking. The Guru may sometime give them a different mantra either for preparing them eventually to receive the mantra they are seeking or may consider a different mantra appropriate for the disciple. Without Siva there is no Sakti and without Sakti there is no Siva. The Mahaswamigal of Kanchi Mutt has eloquently described this in his commentary on Saundarya Lahari. Quoting "Even according to the Sakta system, it is not possible to separate Sakti from Siva and make the former an outward entity. The two are like the lamp and its flame, like the flower and its fragrance, like milk and its whiteness, like honey and its sweetness, like the word and its meaning. Are not these pairs inseparably bound together? .The mutual bond between Siva and Sakti must always be felt by us in the innermost recesses of our hearts." If you pray to Sakti you are praying to Siva & vice versa whether the mantra is for Ardanarishwara or not. Sanskrit pronunciation differs considerably from Kashmir to Tamil Nadu in India. A mantra like "Om Sivasaktyaikya Rupinyai Namah" even though very clear as far as pronunciation in sanskrit will be pronounced with varying accent across various parts of India. The judgment that I take objection to is the fact that you judged swami as having spa out the word rupinyai in your mantra. You did not elucidate whether you asked him if he found the mantra given to you as a problem or any such query. Yet you passed judgment on the fact that he spat out the word. Did you find out if your mantra required pronunciation in a particular way? Also, when teaching mantra to people who do not know Sanskrit, each word/break is sometimes pronounced in such a way that it is clear, but may sound guttural or harsh when compared to a mantra that is chanted continuously. Without exploring these, it is wrong to pass judgment. It is common practice that people are not allowed to touch Sankaracharya at most times. It does not matter whether it is a male or female. There would be consternation if anyone tries to touch Sankaracharya. Even a person's head touching his feet is not allowed at most times. There are times when he allows people to wash his feet & fall at his feet. He may also touch their head as a sign of blessings. These however are not the norm, but on specific occasions & time. Therefore there does not have to be any ulterior feelings for the swami refusing to hug you. He does not have to embrace western etiquette. -------------- Original message -------------- In what way have I judged the swami? I exercised my own discernment regarding the mantra I had asked for, and the swami acted of his own accord in the scheme of all that. And he brougth me to Amma, who gave me the mantra I had requested. As I said before, I don't really know what the swami meant by his actions after I received the mantra I had requested. It isn't judging him to feel confused, and to feel, also, that if he had a valid point to make, I might have understood it better if he'd actually told me what the point was. However, maybe he didn't even know what he was getting at. Maybe he was annoyed. Or, perhaps, as suggested by other members, he was simply blinded by my human female beauty and cannot be held responsible for his own actions LOL , bsubramaniam@c... wrote: > > >Ammachi reaches so many people with such a >wonderful message > >of how a loving, compassionate heart is God, and >that we should not > >judge others, or speak ill of others. To do so is >to judge and speak > >ill of ourselves, and of the Self. > > > And yet you have judged the swami who initiated you with the mantra. How hypocritical Deepavali greeting Traditions Divine Visit your group "" on the web. Links FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. Deepavali greeting Traditions Divine a.. Visit your group "" on the web. b.. c.. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 31, 2005 I feel there is no apt response to this. We have reached an impasse. Let's leave it and maybe greater understanding can dawn beyond positions in the future. Namaste, Mary Ann , Janardana Dasa <lightdweller> wrote: > > Poor Mary Anne. I often feel sorry for you at times because it seems as if you really don't understand why I and others often answer you the way we do. We are not trying to hurt your feelings but feel compelled to correct what we view as erroneous thinking. This is not meant to hurt or offend you, but nevertheless, I think (or hope) you are learning some valuable lessons here about cultural presumptiousness. > > I often look at your post and think twice before answering them and try to think exactly how to answer them. Nevertheless, Bsubramaniam has summed up my position and tone in everything that I normally answer to you. Western etiquette does not have to be embraced when you are dealing with the cultural milieu of Hinduism or any other indigenous culture. And that is the consternation I often have with your post when I make a rebuttal. I know this is probably a hard and humbling lesson for you to learn coming from your cultural and racial persuasion, and coming from a culture (American) wherein people question everything. > > But, it is so often in the history of the world that Western man so often assumes that everything should be geared his way and does not even realize the condescension that he is displaying. Or to put it more aptly, he often tries to superimpose western psychology, understanding, values, mores, and such, on indigenous cultures without even recognizing it. He very often assumes that any & everything should be geared towards his or her liking, and so often wants to either totally co-opt another culture without giving proper due, or pick, choose or reject parts of a culture that fits his or her liking. For instance, you mentioned about the beauty of Ammachi's teachings suiting Westerners and such. I don't think you realized that by saying such, you were actually negating the religion itself on the sly. It was as if to say that Ammachi's teachings are now somehow worthy of western attention because of a lesser dose of Hinduness involved; or better still because of a lesser dose of > Hinduism involved that is only how westerners come to Ammachi. I don't believe you thought about it this way, or meant it this way either > > The sad thing is that many don't even recognize and don't realize that most Non-European culture people such as myself can detect it and sniff it out in a heart beat. Whether it is something that people say in seemingly small insignificant comments, snide remarks, or jokes, we can normally read between the lines when others can't. The funny thing is, this attitude can very often be seen in the so- called liberal types who actually pride themselves on being very open minded, but are actually carrying the "white man's burden" (or more politically correct, the "Western Man's Burden"), and are not even aware of it. > > Therefore, Mary Anne, that's where I think you and I are. You asked me a few weeks back what was my ethnicity, and I never answered you back. Why do you want to know? Will my being Indian or Non-Indian somehow qualify or disqualify me from writing rebuttals to your posts on this board? I mean really! I really don't like dissension, as it makes me uncomfortable. But, when you write something that conflicts with the predominant worldview of this SS Board, I have to strike. READ: This is a HINDU board, therefore HINDU people very often may very often look askance at somethings you may say. Please take a hard look at yourself and maybe you can realize how your attitude is eliciting these kind of responses from people. > > My 2 cents. > > JANARDANA DAS > > > bsubramaniam@c... wrote: > > This was not to offend you. After reading your original email, the following come to mind. > > Getting a mantra initiation from a Guru is not like a purchasing transaction. You did not like the product & therefore exchanged it. Guru gives a mantra for a person as he/she perceives appropriate at that time. This is not like poor customer service that you complained about. One does not question the reason for Guru giving a particular mantra(period). Many do not get the mantra they are seeking. The Guru may sometime give them a different mantra either for preparing them eventually to receive the mantra they are seeking or may consider a different mantra appropriate for the disciple. > > Without Siva there is no Sakti and without Sakti there is no Siva. The Mahaswamigal of Kanchi Mutt has eloquently described this in his commentary on Saundarya Lahari. Quoting "Even according to the Sakta system, it is not possible to separate Sakti from Siva and make the former an outward entity. The two are like the lamp and its flame, like the flower and its fragrance, like milk and its whiteness, like honey and its sweetness, like the word and its meaning. Are not these pairs inseparably bound together? …The mutual bond between Siva and Sakti must always be felt by us in the innermost recesses of our hearts." If you pray to Sakti you are praying to Siva & vice versa whether the mantra is for Ardanarishwara or not. > > Sanskrit pronunciation differs considerably from Kashmir to Tamil Nadu in India. A mantra like "Om Sivasaktyaikya Rupinyai Namah" even though very clear as far as pronunciation in sanskrit will be pronounced with varying accent across various parts of India. The judgment that I take objection to is the fact that you judged swami as having spa out the word rupinyai in your mantra. You did not elucidate whether you asked him if he found the mantra given to you as a problem or any such query. Yet you passed judgment on the fact that he spat out the word. Did you find out if your mantra required pronunciation in a particular way? Also, when teaching mantra to people who do not know Sanskrit, each word/break is sometimes pronounced in such a way that it is clear, but may sound guttural or harsh when compared to a mantra that is chanted continuously. Without exploring these, it is wrong to pass judgment. > > It is common practice that people are not allowed to touch Sankaracharya at most times. It does not matter whether it is a male or female. There would be consternation if anyone tries to touch Sankaracharya. Even a person's head touching his feet is not allowed at most times. There are times when he allows people to wash his feet & fall at his feet. He may also touch their head as a sign of blessings. These however are not the norm, but on specific occasions & time. Therefore there does not have to be any ulterior feelings for the swami refusing to hug you. He does not have to embrace western etiquette. > > -------------- Original message -------------- > In what way have I judged the swami? I exercised my own discernment > regarding the mantra I had asked for, and the swami acted of his own > accord in the scheme of all that. And he brougth me to Amma, who > gave me the mantra I had requested. > > As I said before, I don't really know what the swami meant by his > actions after I received the mantra I had requested. It isn't > judging him to feel confused, and to feel, also, that if he had a > valid point to make, I might have understood it better if he'd > actually told me what the point was. However, maybe he didn't even > know what he was getting at. Maybe he was annoyed. Or, perhaps, as > suggested by other members, he was simply blinded by my human female > beauty and cannot be held responsible for his own actions LOL > > > > > , bsubramaniam@c... wrote: > > > > >Ammachi reaches so many people with such a >wonderful message > > >of how a loving, compassionate heart is God, and >that we should > not > > >judge others, or speak ill of others. To do so is >to judge and > speak > > >ill of ourselves, and of the Self. > > > > > > And yet you have judged the swami who initiated you with the > mantra. How hypocritical > > > > > > > Deepavali greeting Traditions Divine > > > > > > > > > Visit your group "" on the web. > > > > > Terms of Service. > > > Links > > > FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. > > > Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 31, 2005 Namaste. Respectfully, I agree. I didn't want to hurt your feelings and hope I haven't done so. Let's leave it here. Sincerely, Janardana Das Mary Ann <buttercookie61 wrote: I feel there is no apt response to this. We have reached an impasse. Let's leave it and maybe greater understanding can dawn beyond positions in the future. Namaste, Mary Ann , Janardana Dasa <lightdweller> wrote: > > Poor Mary Anne. I often feel sorry for you at times because it seems as if you really don't understand why I and others often answer you the way we do. We are not trying to hurt your feelings but feel compelled to correct what we view as erroneous thinking. This is not meant to hurt or offend you, but nevertheless, I think (or hope) you are learning some valuable lessons here about cultural presumptiousness. > > I often look at your post and think twice before answering them and try to think exactly how to answer them. Nevertheless, Bsubramaniam has summed up my position and tone in everything that I normally answer to you. Western etiquette does not have to be embraced when you are dealing with the cultural milieu of Hinduism or any other indigenous culture. And that is the consternation I often have with your post when I make a rebuttal. I know this is probably a hard and humbling lesson for you to learn coming from your cultural and racial persuasion, and coming from a culture (American) wherein people question everything. > > But, it is so often in the history of the world that Western man so often assumes that everything should be geared his way and does not even realize the condescension that he is displaying. Or to put it more aptly, he often tries to superimpose western psychology, understanding, values, mores, and such, on indigenous cultures without even recognizing it. He very often assumes that any & everything should be geared towards his or her liking, and so often wants to either totally co-opt another culture without giving proper due, or pick, choose or reject parts of a culture that fits his or her liking. For instance, you mentioned about the beauty of Ammachi's teachings suiting Westerners and such. I don't think you realized that by saying such, you were actually negating the religion itself on the sly. It was as if to say that Ammachi's teachings are now somehow worthy of western attention because of a lesser dose of Hinduness involved; or better still because of a lesser dose of > Hinduism involved that is only how westerners come to Ammachi. I don't believe you thought about it this way, or meant it this way either > > The sad thing is that many don't even recognize and don't realize that most Non-European culture people such as myself can detect it and sniff it out in a heart beat. Whether it is something that people say in seemingly small insignificant comments, snide remarks, or jokes, we can normally read between the lines when others can't. The funny thing is, this attitude can very often be seen in the so- called liberal types who actually pride themselves on being very open minded, but are actually carrying the "white man's burden" (or more politically correct, the "Western Man's Burden"), and are not even aware of it. > > Therefore, Mary Anne, that's where I think you and I are. You asked me a few weeks back what was my ethnicity, and I never answered you back. Why do you want to know? Will my being Indian or Non-Indian somehow qualify or disqualify me from writing rebuttals to your posts on this board? I mean really! I really don't like dissension, as it makes me uncomfortable. But, when you write something that conflicts with the predominant worldview of this SS Board, I have to strike. READ: This is a HINDU board, therefore HINDU people very often may very often look askance at somethings you may say. Please take a hard look at yourself and maybe you can realize how your attitude is eliciting these kind of responses from people. > > My 2 cents. > > JANARDANA DAS > > > bsubramaniam@c... wrote: > > This was not to offend you. After reading your original email, the following come to mind. > > Getting a mantra initiation from a Guru is not like a purchasing transaction. You did not like the product & therefore exchanged it. Guru gives a mantra for a person as he/she perceives appropriate at that time. This is not like poor customer service that you complained about. One does not question the reason for Guru giving a particular mantra(period). Many do not get the mantra they are seeking. The Guru may sometime give them a different mantra either for preparing them eventually to receive the mantra they are seeking or may consider a different mantra appropriate for the disciple. > > Without Siva there is no Sakti and without Sakti there is no Siva. The Mahaswamigal of Kanchi Mutt has eloquently described this in his commentary on Saundarya Lahari. Quoting "Even according to the Sakta system, it is not possible to separate Sakti from Siva and make the former an outward entity. The two are like the lamp and its flame, like the flower and its fragrance, like milk and its whiteness, like honey and its sweetness, like the word and its meaning. Are not these pairs inseparably bound together? …The mutual bond between Siva and Sakti must always be felt by us in the innermost recesses of our hearts." If you pray to Sakti you are praying to Siva & vice versa whether the mantra is for Ardanarishwara or not. > > Sanskrit pronunciation differs considerably from Kashmir to Tamil Nadu in India. A mantra like "Om Sivasaktyaikya Rupinyai Namah" even though very clear as far as pronunciation in sanskrit will be pronounced with varying accent across various parts of India. The judgment that I take objection to is the fact that you judged swami as having spa out the word rupinyai in your mantra. You did not elucidate whether you asked him if he found the mantra given to you as a problem or any such query. Yet you passed judgment on the fact that he spat out the word. Did you find out if your mantra required pronunciation in a particular way? Also, when teaching mantra to people who do not know Sanskrit, each word/break is sometimes pronounced in such a way that it is clear, but may sound guttural or harsh when compared to a mantra that is chanted continuously. Without exploring these, it is wrong to pass judgment. > > It is common practice that people are not allowed to touch Sankaracharya at most times. It does not matter whether it is a male or female. There would be consternation if anyone tries to touch Sankaracharya. Even a person's head touching his feet is not allowed at most times. There are times when he allows people to wash his feet & fall at his feet. He may also touch their head as a sign of blessings. These however are not the norm, but on specific occasions & time. Therefore there does not have to be any ulterior feelings for the swami refusing to hug you. He does not have to embrace western etiquette. > > -------------- Original message -------------- > In what way have I judged the swami? I exercised my own discernment > regarding the mantra I had asked for, and the swami acted of his own > accord in the scheme of all that. And he brougth me to Amma, who > gave me the mantra I had requested. > > As I said before, I don't really know what the swami meant by his > actions after I received the mantra I had requested. It isn't > judging him to feel confused, and to feel, also, that if he had a > valid point to make, I might have understood it better if he'd > actually told me what the point was. However, maybe he didn't even > know what he was getting at. Maybe he was annoyed. Or, perhaps, as > suggested by other members, he was simply blinded by my human female > beauty and cannot be held responsible for his own actions LOL > > > > > , bsubramaniam@c... wrote: > > > > >Ammachi reaches so many people with such a >wonderful message > > >of how a loving, compassionate heart is God, and >that we should > not > > >judge others, or speak ill of others. To do so is >to judge and > speak > > >ill of ourselves, and of the Self. > > > > > > And yet you have judged the swami who initiated you with the > mantra. How hypocritical > > > > > > > Deepavali greeting Traditions Divine > > > > > > > > > Visit your group "" on the web. > > > > > Terms of Service. > > > Links > > > FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. > > > Deepavali greeting Traditions Divine Visit your group "" on the web. FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 31, 2005 All Mantras from Amma are equally good for those that receive them. - Mary Ann Sunday, October 30, 2005 10:59 PM Re: Just want to share. Thank you so much for taking the time to offer your thoughts on this topic. Amma gives the Ardhanarishwara mantra to anyone and everyone freely; she recommends it in Immortal Light, her book of advice to householders, as a starting place. I feel blessed to have come to that mantra on my own, through my exposure to the Ardhanarishwara/i her at Shakti Sadhana , through my hathayoga practice, and via all my other studies, practices, experiences, etc. before I read about this in Amma's book. Deepavali greeting Traditions Divine a.. Visit your group "" on the web. b.. c.. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 31, 2005 Thanks for sharing that Len. The last word was "kuru" Do you know what it means. Anyone know? I also know that it was different from what she whispered to my mother and my aunt. She whispered the same thing to both of them. Talking about sharing. My cousin in the US went to her year before last just for darshan and again it was for the first time and she said to him "your mother is very ill. Bring her to me" It is very true my aunt (different aunt from the one who came with me) is ill. Anyways my cousin took his mother to Amma and my aunt who is hard as nails when it comes to believing in Gurus or putting her trust in anyone came away unable to describe what she felt when Amma hugged her. She just said that she felt different and unfortunately she stopped taking all her medication saying that she now felt better. She had a massive bi-polar depressive episode, had to be hospitalised. She went to see Amma again last year and asked for mantra. Since then she takes all her meds, she has not had any further set backs health wise. Her doctors have taken her off anti depressants since last year. She continues to take her meds for her bi-polar condition. More importantly wereas for years she has not taken care of her health in any way what so ever, that has now changed and she looks after her self. , Len Rosenberg <kalipadma108> wrote: > > > > --- her_asha <her_asha> wrote: > > > I got Amma's darshan for the first time last week > > when she was here in > > the UK. When she hugged me, she whispered something > > in my ear. She > > repeated it several times. I had not asked her or > > her assistants for a > > mantra or anything. > > > > Was it a mantra? Do you only receive a mantra if you > > ask for it? > > Yes, you only receive a mantra if you ask for one. > Amma frequently whispers things in her devotees' ears. > It's a blessing. It can be in English, Sanskrit, or > a modern Indian language. > > Some devotees swear that Amma chanted "My daughter, my > daughter," to them. (Even sometimes to men!) Others > thought it was "maddotta, maddotta," and wondered what > the word meant. > > She often chants to me, "Ma ma ma ma ma ma ma ma ma!" > Nine "Ma's." ("Ma" means "mother" in many Indian > langages.) Nine is Durga's number. I always get a > vivid mind-picture of goddess Durga when she chants > this. > > On another occasion, Amma rubbed my chest and chanted > "rang... rang... rang... rang... rang!" Five "rang's" > -- "rang" is the Beeja mantra for Fire. (At first > hearing, I thought it was "Ram," that she was chanting > the name of the hero-king of the Ramayana.) Then I > had an image of five red triangles (red triangle is > the Tattva symbol for Fire), which circled around and > formed a pentacle! Since I'm also a Wiccan, I thought > that was significant! > > But others have pointed out that Swamis sometimes > meditate amidst five fires -- bonfires around them at > North, South, East, and West, and under the blazing > Sun. So perhaps Amma was suggesting I needed to > meditate more? > > > > The worst of it is...she said it soooo fast I > > desperately tried to > > remember it but I can't ( I only remember the last > > word!! > > > > What to do? > > Accept that you've been blessed. What was the last > word? > > -- Len > > > > > > Start your day with - Make it your home page! > http://www./r/hs > Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 31, 2005 --- her_asha <her_asha wrote: > > Thanks for sharing that Len. The last word was > "kuru" Do you know what > it means. Anyone know? "Kuru" is a Sanskrit word that means "make it so!" or "Do it!" The big battle in the Mahabharata takes place in Kurukshetra, or "the field where they did it." > I also know that it was different from what she > whispered to my mother > and my aunt. She whispered the same thing to both of > them. > > Talking about sharing. My cousin in the US went to > her year before > last just for darshan and again it was for the first > time and she said > to him "your mother is very ill. Bring her to me" <snip> > Her doctors have taken her off anti > depressants since last year. > She continues to take her meds for her bi-polar > condition. More > importantly wereas for years she has not taken care > of her health in > any way what so ever, that has now changed and she > looks after her self. This is great news! Tasmai shree gurave namaha. (To such a blessed Guru, I bow.) -- Len Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 31, 2005 If that is what the word means then indeed I am truely blessed and I thank you for telling me what it means. I know where it applies and what it applies to. For 3 years now I have been oh so desperately trying to "make it so". More accurately for the first 2 years I thought I had to do it and I thought it was me doing it to "make it so". In the last year I have realised it is Devi's grace that I have got as far as I have. I don't want to share the details here but yes, that is something I have to do, yes it is a battle and it takes every resource from me. , Len Rosenberg <kalipadma108> wrote: > > > > --- her_asha <her_asha> wrote: > > > > > Thanks for sharing that Len. The last word was > > "kuru" Do you know what > > it means. Anyone know? > > "Kuru" is a Sanskrit word that means "make it so!" or > "Do it!" The big battle in the Mahabharata takes > place in Kurukshetra, or "the field where they did > it." > > > > I also know that it was different from what she > > whispered to my mother > > and my aunt. She whispered the same thing to both of > > them. > > > > Talking about sharing. My cousin in the US went to > > her year before > > last just for darshan and again it was for the first > > time and she said > > to him "your mother is very ill. Bring her to me" > > <snip> > > > Her doctors have taken her off anti > > depressants since last year. > > She continues to take her meds for her bi-polar > > condition. More > > importantly wereas for years she has not taken care > > of her health in > > any way what so ever, that has now changed and she > > looks after her self. > > This is great news! > > Tasmai shree gurave namaha. > (To such a blessed Guru, I bow.) > > -- Len > > > > > > > Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 > > Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted November 1, 2005 I was referring to the present sringiri acharayal. He was junior at that time. It all happened in 1983., At that time, she was only 15yrs old. Things were going well for her. after meeting him she performed arrangatram, then went to states for studies. and so forth. Things changed after marriage. Now, she turned spiritual but not before. raji. > >Hi Rajeshwariji, > >Thanks for sharing this story. May I ask which Acharya you are >referring to - I think it is the former Sringeri Acharya who was a >great saint. > >Also I believe that even if there is a possibility of disasters >happening at a later time, these can be changed with our sincere >sadhana, thoughts and intentions. I see this sometimes when looking >at astrological charts, where at very bad times, everything goes on >smoothly. Again somewhere in the Bhagavatam, there is a saying (I am >not sure if this is by Narada or Akrura or someone else) "That after >travelling all over the world, I have observed that the good man who >is steadfastedly devoted to God never suffers". > >-yogaman > > >, "rajeshwari iyer" ><rajii31@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > > I want to share this particualr incidence with members. > > > > My sister was taking training in Bharatnatyam dancing and was very > > passionate about it. Infact, she wanted tobe a professional dancer. > > > > She met Sringeri acharayal(Like amma) and asked for blessing. but, >he turned > > his head and refused to bless her. She felt very humuliated and >wanted to > > know the reason. She spoke to his assistant, but, acharayal refused >to give > > any reason. > > > > She persued her dancing and gave some programmes while she went to >study in > > states. She could have even married and settled in States. >Instead, her > > passion for dancing was so intense, she decided to return and >continue her > > training. - She met her future parter via parents recommendation, >He was in > > art field and promised that he would give her all the >encouragement to > > continue. > > > > The fact is, after marriage his family objected and he refused to >give her > > permission. To cut short the whole story , this marriage was a >total > > disappointment . Now, neither she works nor persues dancing. >Infact, she has > > no interest in dancing. Dance remained a failed dream. > > > > Why I am narrating this incidence is that maybe acharayal could >forsee her > > future that is the reason he did not bless her. > > > > The difference between ordinary and truely spritually evolved >people is that > > they can forsee the future but we are trapped with present desire >or > > problems. > > > > > > Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
