Redsox

Redsox to merge with Krsna

Business week has reported that Redsox Inc. has attempted a hostile merger with Krsna. The report says that Redsox offered 1,0000000008 Gazillion dollars in the proposed buyout. Part of the proposal is that Krsna would stay on as the CEO of Goloka Vrndavana indefinitely.

The lady who wanted to make new costumes for the deities, how can we judge her for her desire to please krishna in that way when that desire has been placed there by krishna Himself? Also, if you try to listen and hear , listen and hear , and not think about or ask questions about krishna so that you can be an Uttama Bhaktha then are you doing this for krishna's pleasure or your pleasure to be an Uttama Bhakta? Or is this the wrong question to ask?

Bhaktivedanta VedaBase: Śrī Caitanya Caritāmṛta Madhya 19.167

From the PURPORT

The criterion is that a devotee must know what Kṛṣṇa wants him to do. This understanding can be achieved through the medium of a spiritual master who is a bona fide representative of Kṛṣṇa. Śrīla Rūpa Gosvāmī advises, ādau gurv-āśrayam. One who is serious in wanting to render pure devotional service to the Lord must take shelter of a spiritual master who comes in the disciplic succession from Kṛṣṇa. Evaḿ paramparā-prāptam imaḿ rājarṣayo viduḥ [Bg. 4.2]. Without accepting a bona fide spiritual master coming in the disciplic succession, one cannot find out the real purpose of devotional service. Therefore one has to accept the shelter of a bona fide spiritual master and agree to be directed by him. The first business of a pure devotee is to satisfy his spiritual master, whose only business is to spread Kṛṣṇa consciousness. And if one can satisfy the spiritual master, Kṛṣṇa is automatically satisfied — yasya prasādād bhagavat-prasādaḥ **. This is the success of devotional service. This is the meaning of the word ānukūlyena — that is, favorable devotional service to the Lord. A pure devotee has no plans other than those for the Lord's service. He is not interested in attaining success in mundane activities. He simply wants success in the progress of devotional service. For a devotee, there cannot be worship of others or demigod worship. A pure devotee does not engage himself in such pseudo devotional service. He is interested only in satisfying Kṛṣṇa. If one lives only for the satisfaction of Kṛṣṇa, it does not matter whether he belongs to this order of life or that order of life. One's only business should be to satisfy Kṛṣṇa. This process is completely manifest in the activities of the Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement. It has been actually proved that the entire world can accept devotional service without failure. One simply has to follow the instructions of the representative of Kṛṣṇa.

This begs another question, isn't krishna already self-satisfied? Are we then only satisfying ourselves by going after krishna?

Wow, this indeed has been a good discussion. Thank you

Perspective?

Is this prabhupada meant then? Do what you are supposed to do in life. If you are a teacher, teach... if you are a doctor then heal with the best of your ability etc, but do it in the mindset that you are acting for the Lord, hence quickly rise to the spiritual world because of that mindset?

all krishnaleela my friend:-)

 

Krishna is never deluded and ever-aware of His play (or the play of prakrithi) ... but so long as we cannot spot Him, we will talk of offense and punishment for we have identified atma (or is that Krishna?) with the material-modes. Krishna can never be offended (ps. i don't really know Krishna:-) but if you play the part of Hiranyakasipu you know what happens next !! Call it punishment or Grace or just the fruits of actions.

Yea, thats what I think too. You said "play the part of Hiranyakasipu", which makes me wonder whether possibly everyone is just a devotee in this material creation , and is only playing a role to ultimately please krishna.

Dear Beggar,

The quotations you provided basically put me under more confusion, where I cannot understand how Krishna who controls every aspect of living entity's modes of actions can ever get offended by it.

Anyway, I understand it as how bhaktajan says it, basically that Krishna acts only to reciprocate the pure devotee's desires. In that sense too then even when you consider it a lila, and if krishna is sincerely only pleasing his devotee by acting "angry" , then too the pure devotee according to Bhagavad Gita cannot think badly about anyone... then krishna also doesn't get offended because his devotee doesn't get offended.

So my question is how krishna can get offended (EDIT: with our without) any intent of offense from the living entity that is solely in His control. Unless ofcourse, that living entity is bhisma and its the soul's desire to see lord in an "angry" form.

No object is good or bad in this world. Everything is a manifestation of the Lord's energy.

3) When someone is completely pure and free from lust, anger and greed, Krishna may give them oppulence or take away their oppulence. Both situations are equal for a liberated devotee and mean nothing.

Thank you for that, this makes alot of sense when put in this way.

Look at this paragraph. " the wholesale satisfaction of every atom of every constituent part of our spiritual body: priti anga lage kale, priti anga mora – "Every part of my every limb, cries for union with the corresponding part of every limb of the other side." In this type of merging we maintain a spiritual body which is distinct and seperate from the Lord, who also has a spiritual body. It is said, "as is above, so is below", so the material bodies that we have here are a perverted reflection of our eternal spiritual bodies or forms. This means that we are eternally individuals.

 

Hmm, I thought we already established that we eternally exist as individuals.

I am talking about the merging with krishna. The emphasis on the union with krishna, where krishna is felt at every limb of the body.... that the spiritual body feels krishna in every part of it at the pinnacle of its realization of Him, but isn't this a merger then with krishna?

Also are you saying that no merger with krishna is possible without madhurya bhava? How about Ramanuja? How about people like him who gained moksha? what do you think happened to Ramanuja?

Then he can see that what was (initially realised as) 'brahma'; then Paramatma, or Vasudeva; then Lakshmi-Narayana, that has gradually come to him as Krishna consciousness, not Narayana consciousness. Superceding Narayana consciousness he comes in contact with Krishna consciousness of the Reality. He is awakened – he finds himself awakened in a plane where he sees the all-connecting, all-harmonising principle is no longer Narayana, but Krishna – He is showing Himself as Krishna. Then he is fully awakened, and at the same time he sees that the environment, and the object of his search, is also fully equipped. This is full-fledged theism.

loosely translated, I thought krishna meant "the all attractive one".

loosely translated , I thought Narayana meant "The lord of all beings", some say it means "the abode of beings" .

So are you saying the perspective of the bhakta changes when the soul no longer sees God as the supporter of beings, but looks upon Him as the all attractive one? Or are you stating that the bhakta leaves the ritualistic worship of Narayana?

I have another question, why would the bhakta have any need for any ritual when Sriman Narayana is in front of the soul in Vaikunta?

And finally, there we will attain the fullest satisfaction of all the inner parts of our system, the wholesale satisfaction of every atom of every constituent part of our spiritual body: priti anga lage kale, priti anga mora – "Every part of my every limb, cries for union with the corresponding part of every limb of the other side." Sambandha – relationship with the environment – may come to such a stage, that every atom consistuting my spiritual body and mind, will aspire after union with every corresponding part of the environment.

In sum, don't merge.

 

so feeling krishna in every single atom of the spiritual body is not merging with krishna? What are you doing in that instance if you are not merging, your spiritual body into krishna? If you say that you are hoping for union with krishna , so doesn't that make the merging into krishna the result of that relationship?

Maybe someone has already mentioned this here, but an offense to a vaisnava is an offense to Sri Krsna.

 

Like it's just bad karma, dude.

Well, thanks for your answer, but krishna states in Bhagavad Gita that a living entity does not do anything and all is done by the interactions between the three modes of material nature. Also, He further says that He is the one who controls the material nature. Then, how is it so that He is offended by some interaction between the three modes when He is not under the control of it (He is the one who controls it, right?)? Can you please tell me how krishna can be offended?

Thank you for that. , I will read it over and I will ask if I have any questions.

I always thought merging with krishna is an ultimate form of union with Him, because you are completely one with Him then, you never leave Him and He never leaves you at that point. I thought these relationships (servant, friendship/brother, mother/father, husband/lover) with krishna are a way to find our union with Him, but some say this is spiritual death...can anyone explain this more to me? thanks in advance.

Thanks

I am wondering about how reducing it to "just karma" lines up with the fact that Krsna is a person, who has personal love towards His devotee and the fact that everything His devotee does is a love offering to Him.

I don't know , when I read gita, it seemed like Krishna is a non-judging supreme person who is all full of love, compassion, , mercy and above "offense", and it just seemed like he saves us from our wrongs than judge and punish us because of them.

Thank you for that Bhaktajan, that makes lot of sense. I guess what is really bad is the desire for wealth rather than wealth itself. So krishna protects us from the psychological dependence on wealth, I guess He doesn't necessarily make us poor as if it was a law to get close to Him, because how can wealth be bad? - wealth is another aspect of His power, what is bad is our desire for something impermanent instead of being free to love krishna. I guess this is why kings like Janaka gained krishna's association and friendship while still remaining extremely rich materially , it was because they weren't attached to that wealth , they were attached to krishna.

Thank you very much for your time taken to answer my questions (In the simple way that you did). It takes me a while to dig through the quotations and such, but the answer hits me like a rock sometimes

Vaisnava aparadha can also take offense unknowingly on the part of the offender . I believe that there is a story about Srila Rupa Goswami inadvertently offending a Vaisnava. Srila Rupa Goswami could detect this because his smaranam or remembrance of the pastimes of Radha and Krsna became weakened. Once he begged forgiveness from the Vaisnava he unknowingly offended, his lila smaranam was fully restored.

Can you tell me how this happens? what is the story? Do you have a web-link to the story anywhere?

Sri Krishna is infinite, and any minute action that we do here (which is still assuming that *we* are acting (which is an illusion of sorts), and not Sri Krishna) can in no way negatively affect Him. On the relative plane, on which we live, if we "offend" the Vaishnava--that is, if we defame or harm the Vaishnava, some reaction--unpleasant, perhaps--will come to us.

 

I hope that helps.

Yes that helps alot. Thats what my friend said too and it makes sense. It is our own mind and intentions that matter. This is why we need to keep a close watch on the mind and purify it of evil intentions with the help of hari nama. That way, we don't judge or offend good people unecessarily and reap bad benefits because of it.

I am lost in your quotations. Why would wealth take one away from Krishna when wealth is also another aspect of Srimati Radharani? If you could, please explain in your own words , it would help simpletons like me. Any time spent is much appreciated.

I had a discussion with my friend and she gave me a good answer. She said that it is just karma. The devotee whom you supposedly "offend" is really not offended, neither is krishna who is beyond the offense, but the bad intentions within you that made you act in a bad way give you bad reactions. Ofcourse, we say that it comes from krishna because all results good or bad are really given to the individual by krishna. Ofcourse, if you do something without any negative intentions, then there is no offense, and if anyone gets offended when there are no such feelings from you, then its their own problem.

Thank you for your help

Okay, if you want me to wait, I will wait , re-read your posts, see if it makes sense, if it doesn't, I will post back. Thanks for your time and patience.

If you will pause for a few moments inbetween posts, it should make perfect sense. Please take a few moments to contemplate on these matters before replying. Devotees are offended when they see pure devotees criticized or blasphemed. The dust particles at the lotus feet of a pure devotee are pure. They are pure living entities. So if they see that the pure devotee is being blasphemed or unduly criticized (Vaishnava ninda), then they take offense. The devotee himself won't take offense, but the dust particles at his lotus feet will. Just as a devotee of Srila Prabhupada will take offense when he sees that Srila Prabhupada is being blasphemed.

 

It's not really all that difficult to understand. It's up to you if you want to understand or if you're simply searching for loopholes so that you can criticize at will, with supposed impunity.

Again, I am sorry if I offend you. The fact is, I am not really challenging your belief system, I am merely overwhelmed by the loopholes that I see exist.

For instance, you said the dust that exists at the lotus feet of the devotee are also pure living entities. Now according to how I read Bhagavad Gita, a pure devotee or a living entity is something that is dear to krishna. If that is so, then whatever is dear to krishna as said by krishna in Bhagavad Gita never gets offended. Then how can it be so that a devotee like Srila prabhupada or the dust at his lotus feet be offended when no such concept of offense exists within a pure devotee like Srila Prabhupada?

Is it that I am reading this wrong? Maybe Krishna doesn't mean that pure living entity never gets angry or offended , or is it so that those who see offense are not pure?

Again, I sincerely apologize, I am not trying to find loopholes, maybe I am just thinking too much into it.

You are getting way way ahead of yourself. The approach you are taking is like trying to eat a feast all at once instead of one bite at a time.

 

First understand the truth that is before you and then ask about how it ties in with other things. Do you see? One bite at a time.

But you didn't answer my question.

Are you saying I am not intelligent enough to understand why or how krishna gets offended?

I just told you. He is offended when you offend His devotee. A father will get angry when someone subjects his child to ridicule. It is like that.

 

Sorry I have no other answer for you.

But isn't it the three modes of material nature that cause the offense? Arent' they under Krishna's control? Do you get what I am saying?

Please know that I am not trying to challenge your belief system here. I am just trying to understand it. When I asked the same type of questions at a satsang, I got a very unsatisfactory answer just like this one, but if I am not satisfied with that specific answer and ask again, the swami gets offended and he thinks that I am challenging him and trying to prove him wrong or ignorant, when I was only trying to sincerely clear a doubt in my mind.