Posts posted by Raguraman
the concept here is if we can worship narayana in an image of stone by offering flowers fruits and prayers...the same naraayana can be worshipped in a much more tangible way by offering service , love , food and clothing to the lesser privileged.
I do not deny this at all. Lord Narayana is antaryami and service to them is great. There is a difference between seeing GOD in human beings(Jivas), human bodies and stones is different from calling all this as GOD itself.
funnily it was swamiji who gave the most famous answer regarding the worship of stone images to the raja who ridiculed the practice. he asked the dewan to spit on the raja's image. when the dewan got scared and refused , swamiji explained how the image represented the raja himself to the dewan...much like how the stone images mean krishna and ram to us.
a kid can understand this concept...if anticheater , raghuraman etc cant...then either they want to prolong the conversation or are too stubborn or most probably anticheater is hating the logical and sensible way his queries are being answered and finds no way out but abuse to get his thoughts across.
All great. But it still does not explain the term used. As for image worship, seeing GOD in Jiva's etc. is alright. The question here is not about this. What anti-cheater is really asking is how can you tell people that humans are GOD.
Sticking to ones stand is not logic.
This may be more applicable to you guys. Tell me how can GOD become human.
And Narayana is not daridra. Read carefully. Serving the needy pleses the god. Thats what it means. Feeding the poor, educating the poor are all direct services to god. Thats what the concept of daridra narayana means. If some one cannot understand even this basic concept, I donno how logical it is. The concept if service occupies a high space in hindu dharma. That includes Anna Dhana, Siksh Dhana and all that.
There is a tamil saying " ezayin sirripinil iraivanik kaanbom" which means we can see god in the smiles of the poor.
This is not a question on service and every branch of Vaishnavism emphasises service.
The question is about calling and telling human beings that we are all GOD. That is the point here.
I have not seen so much conviction and stability of mind as you even though you are younger than people abusing you. You stuck to your logic.
I did not find any logical answer from people here on two issues. Only abuses on a young and intelligent person.
The very word Naarayana means the resting place of all humans. This is none but Lord.
1. So how can Narayana be daridra ? Is it not a good question. If you are not able to give a convincing answer to a kid atleast have the decency to accept your ignorance on this matter. May be you should ask your guru what Sri Ramakrishna really meant instead of abusing a kid.
2. How can GOD become a Jiva or vice-versa ?
This 2nd problem is even addressed by all Vaishnava AchAryas.
Why ignore this?
iv. 5. 9.
p Homage to you, sparkling hearts of the gods
Namo vah kirikebhyo devanam hrudayebhyo
Salutations to those(the forms of Rudra) who shower prosperity on the devotees and to those who possess the hearts of the celestials(or to those who are very dear to the celestials).
I think the above translation is closer to the truth.
As for the Maitrayana Brahmana Upanishad, some do not accept it as authentic, some take it as authentic. So I cannot comment on that which I do not trust as authemtic.
The mahamruntyunjaya Mantra is a part of Rudram, which is right in the center of Yajur Veda.
Dont run you imagination wild.
Infact you are talking like the nameologist of Raj TV, Vijay TV Sun TV etc.
Perhaps, people like you, when their false beliefs are adequately exposed, they start to accuse other people of imagination.
This is what happens when a person not even trying to find out what mantra is part of what Sloka try to make a completely baseless point.
First, the sloka is added along with Rudram and is not a part of Rudram.
Second, this verse is found in Rig Veda Samhita and not in Yajur Veda Samhita.
Third, there is not a single evidence that this points to Lors Shiva only. I have proovided reference in Narasimha Tapaniya Upanishad where Lord Narasimha is said to be three eyed and master, Lord of Rudra.
Four, I have provided reference to Rig Veda Samhita 7:40:5 which shows that Lord Rudra gained all HIS powers from Lord Visnu. Why reject this verse. Considering this, Lord Rudra grants HIS mercy and mukti only through Lord Visnu's permission and not otherwise.
It seems that your stand is totally demolished. so all this useless accusations of me being imaginative when you do not know which mantra is where.
Shall we say Krishna also refers to Lord Siva based on your Sardarji logic?
This indeed will be a sardarji logic, for only people like you can make.
So my question remains. Since none of these things exist except Brahman, then Vedas are illusion too, for there is not the other to teach in the first place. Mukti is also illusion. Then what is that advaita preaches. NOTHING...
"Hmmm...Prana(Lord Vayu) here refers to life force that drives everything in prakriti including great Deities like Lord Rudra."
Rig Veda Mandal VII Sukta 59 and Mantra 12
Maha Mrituyonjaya Mantra
We Worship Tryambaka (Rudra), Who spreads Fragrance and Increases nourishment , May He release me, like the cucumber from its stem, from Mortal life, But not From Immortality.
Man Shiva grants immortality. Shiva granted it to Markendeya.
Now even Sruti evidences are negated? You people are biased without any hope.
Trayambaka can refer to Lord Narasimha as well. Lord Narasimha has three eyes and is mentioned in Narasimha Tapaniya Upansihad. In the same Upansihad Lord Narasimha is also mentioned to be the Lord of Sankara(Rudra).
Now if one takes it that this word Trayambakam refers to Lord Narasimha or Lord Rudra, either way Lord Rudra cannot offer Mukti to any soul independent of Lord Visnu.
One has to again consider Rig Veda 7:40:5 where it is clearly said that Lord Rudra gained all HIS powers by worshipping Lord Visnu. One has to also consider Devi Sukta where DEVI claims she is the strength in Lord Rudra's weapons. So it is clear that Lord Rudra offers mukti through Lord Visnu's grace and not othewise. The vedic mantra is actually to Lord Visnu in Narasimha form.
There is also a puranic story where Lord Shiva asks Lord Visnu for a boon that anybody who dies in Kasi may attain mukti. In the event of death, Lord Shiva HIMSELF comes to the human and preaches Brahmataraka mantra to the departing.
pAramArthika view is for the Self realised and Gods. vyAvahArika for most of us.
Krishna can say that all is Him only. He can also say that there is no Karma for Him. He will also say that there is no creation but His Leela only. But can I say these? That is till I really realise that? What is the use of theoretical claims.
An objective TRUTH or Fact does not depend on a person and his perception. For example, if all the people in Earth were to believe that the Earth is flat or even correctly as spherical the Earth is still spherical. Similarly I am trying to state the objective fact as recognized in Advaita.
I am trying to state an objective FACT or TRUTH as recognized by advaita. This TRUTH is recognized in pAramArtika level and is the absolute FACT as per advaita.
So let us drop lower levels of understanding (as stated in Advaita) which is subjective and also subject to MAYA as per advaita.
It is true that Lord Krishna is not subject to Maya or Karma. It, however, does not imply non-existence or deny the vry existence of Karma or Maya(Avidya).
But, as per advaita, the absolute TRUTH or FACT is that there is one reality(Brahman) and the very existence of creation, Karma etc. is denied.
ie none of this we see as creation even exist in reality.
"In other words MAYA and consequently this whole creation both do not exist."
In this statement you yourself seem to be pre-stating that Maya and creation are synonumous.
Dear Raghuramji, I do not want to argue and earn ephitets like Asura, fanatic etc. But I will just point out a difference in the views. And both views are His.
I am getting very good responses from you sir. So to learn from you is very good for me as well. Since you have some anubhava in Advaita it is better for me atleast to gain knowledge of your perspectives.
As for Maya and creation, it is said, in advaita, that the whole creation is maya or illusion.
When you say that I am an eternal Dasa serving the Lord, then who is serving? Surely the Dasa is serving the Lord? But the Lord Himself has said that all work is done by Him alone. So how you feel that You as a Dasa are serving. How can you claim the doership?
For me this is contradictory. To feel that I am serving has a pride/sense of doership and this does not go well with Advaita. And this sense of doer ship is contradictory to Gita.
May be you have your own valid justification. I will not relish to contest those. But to learn from you i will gladly read what you write.
Advaita also believes that all paths are valid since all karma is done by Him and will not be in vain.
You must have heard of the Slokha used by madhvas.
Naham Karta Hari Karta.....
There is no doubt that Lord is the doer. But, unlike advaita, we recognize the existence of other entities except Brahman or Lord. The existence of these entities does depend on Brahman and is REAL. Even in Mukti we are his servants. Now it is true that all activities and free will are facilitated by Brahman so that it functions from moment to moment(depending on Brahman). But the FREE WILL itself comes from Svabhava of Jiva. Jiva, with its svabhava, has no begining or anihilation.
Free will, mind, intellect, body, existence of everything and whatever you think of is functioning because of Brahman. In other words Brahman makes possible that everything can function every moment aftre moment. That is why Lord is called as the real doer.
I think I am clear here and would explain more if needed.
Most do not know advaita.
I am surprised that such a knowledgeable person thinks wrt advaita as below:
"It is said that Jiva(reflection of Brahman) is unreal. Brahman is the only reality."
Can you show me anywhere that Jiva is said to be unreal in Advaita. It is what original Buddhists said.
Truly sir, I am not knowledgeable at all, but thank you for acknowledging the fact that such a thought is Buddhism period.
To this Shankara said "If nothing exists outside the conciousness then how the perception of that nothing arises?".
Shankara says that Jiva is real, only its perception through the sense organs is not perfect. He gave an example that a real rope is percieved as a snake in darkness. But for the perception of the snake a rope has to be there.
People have not read or understood Shankara at all.
I am talking from pAramArthika view. This is the comlete and perfect TRUTH and knowledge according to advaita. So in this sense. Other views in vyAvahArika sense are lower level of realization, but not the perfect knowledge. This is what I was talking as different states of knowledge in the first post. One, according to advaita, after reaching higher stages from vyAvahArika level, goes to pAramArthika level. This level is referred to as ajAti VAda.
In this stage, according to advaita, one realizes through jnana that maya has no reality at all. In other words MAYA and consequently this whole creation both do not exist. Brahman becomes identical to ATMAN and this state is referred as Turiya(See my first post). ATMAN as per advaita is Brahman(I will not differ here as it is the TRUTH and ATMAN is a term that refers to the same object ie Brahman).
But the observer(Jiva) is referred to as AnAtman in advaita too as in Buddhism. This Jiva is unreal in the ultimate realization and so JIVA does not exist in the paramartika sense.
So my question remains as to what undergoes Karma and reincarnation. But suddddenly, just now I realize that in pAramArtika sense there is no creation at all and so Karma also does not exist as per advaita.
So one can conclude this way that awareness exists but no perception in mukti. But what gets mukti when there is no Jiva or creation or karma. So one might think Brahman gets mukti. Wait but when there is no creation or karma or maya then there is no mukti too. So there is no Veda too. Only the undifferentiated element called Brahman exists with pure awareness and having no perception(of different objects). Well objects or nothing else exist, except BRAHMAN.
This is what Buddhism teaches. Well this is Buddhism.
By attacking my inadequacy on vedas you are doing a fine jog of presenting your own intelegence, read my post you will see i clearly mention i am not well versed in vedas.
You are agreeing to lack of knowledge. Then what is the point in arguing with me. First you need to learn. I am not attacking you, but it is pointless on your part to prove your point when you do not know what Vedas say.
Are you able to answer did Sri Vyasdev not know sruti?
This is ridiculous question. Veda Vyasa(Krishna Dwaipanya) is Lord Visnu's avatar.
leave the sruti to you, but i do not need your permision to discuss.
i have no doubt when Krishna says those who worship Devas go to them, it would be foolish to think otherwise.
Point was; Arjun is quite clearly asking Lord Krishna, in what various forms are you to be remembered? And Sri Bhagvan is responding to this question. thats all realy.
Jai Shree Krishna
Then please read Gita fully. What is said here is that HE, the LORD, is the support(antaryami) of everything.
I am the origin or seed of all beings, O Arjuna. There is nothing, animate or inanimate, that can exist without Me. (See also 7.10 and 9.18) (10.39)
Read the verses below. Particularly 15 and 17. Lord Shiva and Lord Brahma are said to be seen within Lord Krishn'a transcendental body in verse 15, but in verse 17 Lord Krishna HIMESELF is seen as holding Discuss, Gadha etc. This form is seacial to Lord Visnu only.
Arjuna said: O Lord, I see in Your body all the gods and multitude of beings, all sages, celestial serpents, Lord Shiva as well as Lord Brahmaa seated on the lotus. (11.15)
O Lord of the universe, I see You everywhere with infinite form, with many arms, stomachs, faces, and eyes. Neither do I see the beginning nor the middle nor the end of Your Universal Form. (11.16)
I see You with Your crown, club, discus; and a mass of radiance, difficult to behold, shining all around with immeasurable brilliance of the sun and the blazing fire. (11.17)
There is no end of My divine manifestations, O Arjuna. This is only a brief description by Me of the extent of My divine manifestations. (10.40)
Whatever is endowed with glory, brilliance, and power; know that to be a manifestation of a fraction of My splendor. (10.41)
What is the need for this detailed knowledge, O Arjuna? I continually support the entire universe by a small fraction of My energy. (10.42)
Actually, I think he means to say that great people like Shankara, Ramana, etc do not require an approval from Srila Prabhupada, who mainly wrote his version of gita, and spread a version of hinduism more close to christianity and did nothing for the religion and country. I think you shud answer that first.
His version of Gita is exactly as per Vaishnava schools like Sri Sampradaya and Dvaita. Do you know all Vaishnava acaryas teach pure monotheism.
Shankara, Ramana etc. advaitis are not the only people who wrote commentaries on Gita. Besides Advaita is full of fallacy.
Anyway, I can see that you are alone defending your faith inspite of all the attacks. But I like your technique.
My boss used to say " If you know, clarify. If you dont know, confuse." I think you are a living example.
Would you care to explain more. I am not confused about anything here. May be it is you people who are very much confused. May be your philosophy dos not stand on stable ground.
It is heart breaking to see some advaitists and Shivites like Barney belittling Srila Prabhupada. Their knowledge of this great man's achievement seems to be nill. So I have started this thread. After reading his life story one can clearly see that Srila Prabhupada's achievement is too great compared to some other gurus like gurudeva.
All glories to Srila Prabhupada.
"We think that we have met Your Goodness by the will of providence, just so that we may accept you as captain of the ship for those who desire to cross the difficult ocean of Kali, which deteriorates all the good qualities of a human being." (Srimad-Bhagavatam 1.1.22)
On the order of his spiritual master, His Divine Grace A. C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada began writing on and translating Vedic texts in the English language to bring the message of Lord Krsna to the Western countries. After decades of struggle in India, he came to the West and started the International Society for Krishna Consciousness. Later on he created the Bhaktivedanta Book Trust, to publish his writings and recordings of his lectures, conversations, etc. The VedaBase has been created so that this great treasurehouse of knowledge may be preserved and propagated and so that all may take advantage of the wisdom and association of the pure devotee of Lord Krishna.
His Divine Grace A. C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada appeared in this world in 1896 in Calcutta, India. He first met his spiritual master, Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Gosvami, in Calcutta in 1922. Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati, a prominent religious scholar and the founder of sixty-four Gaudiya Mathas (Vedic institutes), liked this educated young man and convinced him to dedicate his life to teaching Vedic knowledge. Srila Prabhupada became his student, and eleven years later (1933) at Allahabad he became his formally initiated disciple.
At their first meeting, in 1922, Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura requested Srila Prabhupada to broadcast the Vedic knowledge through the English language. In the years that followed, Srila Prabhupada wrote a commentary on the Bhagavad-gita, assisted the Gaudiya Matha in its work, and in 1944 started Back to Godhead, an English fortnightly magazine. Maintaining the publication was a struggle. Single-handedly, Srila Prabhupada edited it, typed the manuscripts, checked the galley proofs, and even distributed the individual copies. Once begun, the magazine never stopped; it is now being continued by his disciples in the West and is published in over thirty languages.
Recognizing Srila Prabhupada's philosophical learning and devotion, the Gaudiya Vaisnava Society honored him in 1947 with the title Bhaktivedanta. In 1950, at the age of fifty-four, Srila Prabhupada retired from married life, adopting the vanaprastha (retired) order to devote more time to his studies and writing. Srila Prabhupada traveled to the holy city of Vrndavana, where he lived in humble circumstances in the historic temple of Radha-Damodara. There he engaged himself for several years in deep study and writing. He accepted the renounced order of life (sannyasa) in 1959. At Radha-Damodara, Srila Prabhupada began work on his life's masterpiece: a multivolume annotated translation of the eighteen-thousand-verse Srimad-Bhagavatam (Bhagavata Purana). He also wrote Easy Journey to Other Planets during this time.
After publishing three volumes of the Bhagavatam, Srila Prabhupada came to the United States of America, in September 1965, to fulfill the mission of his spiritual master. Subsequently, His Divine Grace wrote more than sixty volumes of authoritative annotated translations and summary studies of the philosophical and religious classics of India.
When he first arrived by freighter in New York City, Srila Prabhupada was practically penniless. Only after almost a year of great difficulty did he establish the International Society for Krishna Consciousness, in July of 1966. Until his passing away on November 14, 1977, he guided the Society and saw it grow to a worldwide confederation of more than one hundred asramas, schools, temples, institutes and farm communities.
In 1968, Srila Prabhupada created New Vrindaban, an experimental Vedic community in the hills of West Virginia. Inspired by the success of New Vrindaban, which became a thriving farm community of more than two thousand acres, his students have since founded several similar communities in the United States and other countries.
In 1972, His Divine Grace introduced the Vedic system of primary and secondary education in the West by founding the Gurukula school in Dallas, Texas. Since then, under his supervision, his disciples have established children's schools throughout the United States and the rest of the world, with the principal educational center now located in Vrndavana, India.
Srila Prabhupada also inspired the construction of several large international cultural centers in India. The center at Sridhama Mayapur in West Bengal is the site for a planned spiritual city, an ambitious project for which construction will extend over many years to come. In Vrndavana, India, are the magnificent Krsna-Balarama Temple and International Guesthouse and the Srila Prabhupada Memorial and Museum. There is also a major cultural and educational center in Bombay. Other centers are planned in a dozen important locations on the Indian subcontinent.
Srila Prabhupada's most significant contribution, however, is his books. Highly respected by the academic community for their authority, depth, and clarity, they are used as standard textbooks in numerous college courses. His writings have been translated into over fifty languages. The Bhaktivedanta Book Trust, established in 1972 to publish the works of His Divine Grace, has thus become the world's largest publisher of books in the field of Indian religion and philosophy.
In just twelve years, in spite of his advanced age, Srila Prabhupada circled the globe fourteen times on lecture tours that took him to six continents. In spite of such a vigorous schedule, Srila Prabhupada continued to write prolifically. His writings constitute a veritable library of Vedic philosophy, religion, literature, and culture.
yasya prasadad bhagavat-prasado
yasyaprasadan na gatih kuto 'pi
dhyayan stuvams tasya yasas tri-sandhyam
vande guroh sri-caranaravindam
"By the mercy of the spiritual master one receives the benediction of Krsna. Without the grace of the spiritual master, one cannot make any advancement. Therefore, I should always remember and praise the spiritual master. At least three times a day I should offer my respectful obeisances unto the lotus feet of my spiritual master."
Soem of his works: Compare this to the miniscule amount of work done by other gurus mentioned in some post.
His Divine Grace A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada
Bhagavad-gita As It Is
Srimad-Bhagavatam, cantos 1-10, (29 vols.)
Sri Caitanya-caritamrta (17 vols.)
Teachings of Lord Caitanya
The Nectar of Devotion
Easy Journey to Other Planets
Krsna Consciousness: The Topmost Yoga System
Krsna, the Supreme Personality of Godhead (3 vols.)
Perfect Questions, Perfect Answers
Dialectical Spiritualism -- A Vedic View of Western Philosophy
Teachings of Lord Kapila, the Son of Devahuti
Transcendental Teachings of Prahlad Maharaja
Teachings of Queen Kunti
Krsna, the Reservoir of Pleasure
The Science of Self-Realization
The Path of Perfection
Life Comes From Life
The Perfection of Yoga
Beyond Birth and Death
On the Way to Krsna
Raja-vidya: The King of Knowledge
Elevation to Krsna Consciousness
Krsna Consciousness: The Matchless Gift
Back to Godhead magazine (founder)
It is not a wonder that no advaiti wants to confront the problem here. They do not have any answer, for the very postulaion of one reality in advaitam is FALLACY.
A great soul is one who sacrifice his life for the poor and meek. Tell me what Srila Prabhupada sacrificed for? I respect Srila Prabhupada for his [only] effort in preaching the Gita to the westerners. Besides that he has nothing great to be proud of.
Barney is clearly exposing his hatred for Vaishnava Acharyas. On the one hand he does not even undersstand that ISKCON is present in so many parts of the world. Today, ISKCONs presence is felt everywhere that first Gita book I read in a remote town in Tamil Nadu is that of Srila Prabhupada's translation.
While Barney being a Shivite praises Sivaya Subramanyaswamy(a Shivite Guru), he denigrates a Vaishnava Guru(Srila Prabhupada). He forgets that there are about 90,000 followers of ISKCON only in USA. One has to consider so many other countries from Europe, middle-east and Asia. What ISKCON has achieved is far more than what Saiva Siddhanta Church achieved. Not to mention Srila Prabhupada is not even alive. Considering what Srila Prabhupada achived in a short span of 10 years and at an age of 70 tells more of this great Guru. Surely his achievements over a span of 10 years are a lot better than most Saiva Gurus achievements over a span of 50 years.
It is interesting to note that Barney statements on Srila Prabhupada. He states that Srila Prabhupada can be praised only for praching Gita to the west. ISKCON has temples in so many countries around the world. They have published numerous scriptures(all of them translated by the humble Guru Srila Prabhupada at age 70 or more). In the begining he used to type all his works and sell them and make money. This money was again used to create more copies. His life in USA began without any financial backing these Saiva Gurus had from their home country. From being a no one in USA, Srila Prabhupada has built a organization that exists in most parts of the world today. His translations and works are more comprehensive than what the Saiva Gurus achieved with financial backing from Hindus over a span of 50 years.
Now anyone can tell who is greater here. Gurudeva's achievements over 50 years dwarfs before Srila Prabhupada's achivement in 10 years.
Gandhiji is a greater soul than Srila Prabhupada.
--yes.. a materialist politician is better than a saint, your understanding of spirituality is very nice
What materialistic aspect did you find in gandhiji's notion for freedom. If he wanted material he could have become an excellent lawyer and made a lot of money.
Similarly Srila Prabhupada could have simply used all the money from ISKCON. He did not use a penny for himself. He sacrificed his entire life for spreading Vedas in west. Srila Prabhupada's mission is spiritual and greater than Gandhi's mission for political freedom.
Good joke ! Like somebody was saving shiva was the first vaishnava ,now you have twisted the indian history also .
It is clearly mentioned in Vedas that Lord Shiva gained his powers by worshipping Lord Visnu(Rig Veda 7:40:5). Anybody who worships Lord Visnu with the right knowledge is a Vaishnava. So Lord Shiva is a Vaishnava.
Even a small child in india would know who got us freedom. If your argument was true then netaji must have been called the father of the nation. With due respect to nethaji , his efforts on freedom were also immense.But gandhiji is the forerunner in the freedom struggle.
Krishna talks about karma yoga in gita. Good example of a karma yogi is gandhi. Dont abuse him,atleast for the sake of srila prabhupada.
One point is Gandhi's efforts for freedom struggle did unite people, but Britain was forced externally by other powers to grant freedom to India. This is the actual reason and Gandhi's influence in this is not that much. One needs to know the effects of second world war, American involvement and pressure on Britain for freedom of India etc.
Y didnt srila prabhupada preach in india. Since according to him the sanatana dharma was not followed properly he could have guided the millions of indians to the right path.Why did he have to choose westeners mostly ?. I dont find greater iskcon activity in india .Atleast in chennai upto my knowledge .
So as though you would have changed your mind if he had preached in Chennai. Srila Prabhupada's orders were from his Guru and prampara. It was Bhagavan's will that Srila Prabhuada spread Vaishnava theology to west.
Since you brought up tukaram,namdev and gnaneshwar. Has prabhupada mentioned anything about lord vittal @pandarpur.
This is a very ignorant question. Lord Vittala is the SELF-SAME BHAGAVAN Visnu and every Vaishnava(HKs included) knows that.
Why cant you tell then y prabhupada didnt say anything about sri rayaru. The problem is a lot of HK's approve only what prabhupada has said , since he has mentioned nothing about rayaru they are questioning the authenticity of rayaru.
Srila Prabhupada did not mention about Namdev, Jnanadev and so many other Vaishnavas. It does not mean he disrespects any Vaishnava. His teachings were more on Lord HIMSELF than on Vaishnavas.
Srila Prabhupada entered USA at 70 years of age with a few dollars in his hand. Within 10 years what he did was write books and spread Krishna Consciousness. He did not enjoy the money which his organization collected. All the money was spent for spreading Vaishnava philosophy. Only ognorant people think that he was enjoying grants from rich people. Most of his followers were not so rich. Ofcourse some rich followers were there. In this way he is no lesser than Gandhi. Barney, you seem to have extreme hatred for HKs. It is not good for your mental health.
Forgive YYY and people of that sort. There is one thread here about Raghavendra swamy and one guy asked y hasnt Prabhupadha has not mentioned about Raghavendra swamy. It is unfortunate that shree Raghavendra swamy needs a approval stamp from prabhupada for his service. Ellam time !!
As per the Upanishads and Vedas, MahAtmA and AtmA are terms exclusively used to denote BhagavAn and none else. To use this term for any human is detestable. As for Sri Rayaru, some western Vaishnavas are simply wondering why Srila Prabhupada did not mention such a great Swami. It is not a sign that one seeks approval from Srila Prabhupada.
Mariathaiya pesa kathuko. Avaru eluvathu vaisula satichathu satharana visayamala.
to accept anything you have to have faith, it is also very easy to pull few quotes, there are contradictions all over.
my question was since Sri Vyasdev wrote the vedas and puranas, did he not know Sruti?
I guess you do not understand what Sruti is ? Sruti refers to Veda Samhitas, Brahmanas, Aranyakas and Upanishads. There is no contradiction in Sritis. I think I am discussing with somebody who does not know even what Sruti is.
(Bhagavad Gita is explained as per the Srutis by Vaishnavas. When Lord Krishna says "I am Sankara, etc" He means that HE is the antaryami of all these demi-Gods. )
It is quite clear what Lord Krishna is saying if you are questioning that then there is something fundamentaly wrong.
Jai Shree Krishna
Lord Krishna also says there that one who worships Devas go to Devas, one who worships ghosts go to them, etc. and that one who worships HIM, attains HIM. Read fully before making any conclusions. You need to gain knowledge before you argue here. First know what Sruti refers to.
This is the fundamental problem of Advaita as I recognize it.
I am not claiming I know everything.
Advaita recognizes different states of perception of truth, but the ultimate truth is that there is only one TATVAM ie Brahman.
They interpret the Mandukya Upanishad teachings of ChaturVyuhas(Taijasa, Prajna etc.) of Bhagavan as states of Jivas and Turiya(fourth) form of Bhagavan as Brahman ie "Man minus EGO".
To explain more, the first three states(waking, dreaming, sleeping) as states where the unreal Jiva appears to exist and when the Jiva attains realization(Turiya) it becomes Brahman.
It is said that Jiva(reflection of Brahman) is unreal. Brahman is the only reality.
Then what is enveloped by maya. One cannot say that the unreal(non-existent) Jiva is enveloped by Maya, since that which does not exist cannot be bound.
Obviously Brahman cannot be bound by Karmas or Maya or EGO. I think advaitists agree to this.
So the question remains as to what undergoes effects of the Karmas.
I have quoted verses from Sruti that clearly show Lord Rudra is subordinate to Lord Visnu, Mahalakshmi and even Lord Vayu. If you cannot accept it then you are rejecting Vedas. Bhagavad Gita is explained as per the Srutis by Vaishnavas. When Lord Krishna says "I am Sankara, etc" He means that HE is the antaryami of all these demi-Gods.
"The ignorant ones, not knowing My supreme natures as the great Lord of all beings, disregard Me when I assume human form. "
Krishna is the human form of the lord according to this, then y are worshipping the human form. Actually you shld worship the real form of the lord if you what it is ?
The verse clearly says that Lord Krishna in that human form is Brahman. Simple. So if Brahman assumes a form it is ABSOLUTELY REAL. This is what Lord Krishna is saying, that deluded people(like advaitists) disregard HIM, when HE takes human form.
Ok if krishna did not die what happened to him at the end of the yuga ?
Your question is illegitimate. Lord Krishna is Brahman. So there is no begining or end for HIM. HE is IMMORTAL and omnipresent.
I thought you would be mature to understand what i was saying. The omni present is not contained only in the form that krishna took. He claims to be omni present in gita and you are saying he is contained to his form, which is totally opposite.
Your or my limitation to know that Lord Krishna is omnipresent is not Lord Krishna's limitation. The form of LORD Krishna is transcendental and beyond both of us. What you see as though Lord Krishna is limited is your fault or avidya.
Anything that does not satisfy your philosophy is tamasic and are added. Anything that satifies your points is correct. When you claim you are different from lord you are contradicting his own point of omni presence.
I provide Sruti verses, didn't I. I think you need to understand fully about Vaishnavism before you argue with me.
in The Hinduism Forum
Posted · Report reply
Stick to logical reasonong. No need to use word like cheat etc. It is not respectful towards a great saint. I don't think Swamy Ramakrishna is an ordinary man. One can be a strong Advaiti and a great saint at the same time. The good example is Sri Ramana Maharishi, Sri Ramakrishna himself etc.
These souls are greater than us in every way. Even Madhvacharya bowed down humbly and respected his advaita guru.