suchandra

Room Conversation during lunchtime July 8, 1977, Vṛndāvana Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: So there was a newspaper clipping about Māyāpura published in the Hindustan Times. This newspaper clipping… Prabhupāda: Hindustan Times? Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes, Prabhupāda. Prabhupāda: Delhi. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Ah. The heading is “Eleven Krishna Devotees Held for Firing.” “Five Indian and six foreign Vaiṣṇava devotees were arrested from Māyāpura maṭha of ISKCON, the International Society for Krishna Consciousness, in Nabadwip last night when shots fired from inside the celebrated temple injured fifteen persons, most of them milkmen. A double-barreled gun was seized from the maṭha, it is reported. Police pickets have been posted since there is considerable tension in the nearby villages. Among those arrested is Swami Bhavānanda, an American in charge of the maṭha. Some time ago he was forced to leave the country after the expiry of his visa, but he returned later. The incident occurred at about 5 p.m. on Friday. Some boys were grazing their cattle on the fields outside the maṭha when some cows strayed into its compound. The cattle were beaten up by the inmates and driven out.” It doesn’t sound like our devotees. Beat up cows? “Angry milkmen from a nearby village crowded outside the maṭha. Shots were then fired from inside the maṭha, it is reported, injuring fifteen persons, two of them seriously. The police arrived on the scene within an hour. Among the six foreigners arrested are a Romanian, an Italian, and some Americans. The founder of the maṭha, Prabhupāda A. C. Bhaktivedanta, was not present.” This is called slanted reporting. I mean, first of all, our devotees don’t beat up the cows. We worship the cow. We don’t beat cows. I can’t take this as very factual account. So many statements here say, “It was reported,” “It was reported.” This is from a… It was published in Delhi, but it’s datelined Calcutta, and the event happened in Māyāpura. So by the time it got to Delhi it seems to have taken a strange shape. I thought you’d want to… Prabhupāda: These goyālas are very aggressive. Śatadhanya: Milkmen means goyālas. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Bālāi goyālas. Prabhupāda: It is not the Muhammadans. Śatadhanya: Not according to this. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: This is still not conclusive. Prabhupāda: No. Police inquiry must be there. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Should I save this? Prabhupāda: No. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Śatadhanya Mahārāja is going to be leaving to go to Māyāpura. Śatadhanya: Myself and Prabhāsa, we’re going to be leaving now for Delhi, then to Māyāpura. Prabhupāda: So what is the actual position, that they should… Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Send a letter from there. Prabhupāda: But why in the morning the cows will come? Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: It says here, “At 5 p.m. on Friday.” Prabhupāda: P.M. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes, in the evening. Prabhupāda: Evening? Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Five o’clock in the evening. Prabhupāda: But they say it was attacked at night. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yeah. Well, that’s what Gopāla Kṛṣṇa said over the telephone. I mean it’s hard to… We don’t know if this is correct or we don’t know… After all, Gopāla was speaking to Māyāpura over the telephone, so he only may have gotten some mistaken information. Prabhupāda: They say it was, they attacked at night, and they say five? Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Five o’clock. Prabhupāda: There is some mist… Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Oh, yes, surely. I mean Bhavānanda Mahārāja doesn’t fire a gun unless there’s some very, very heavy provocation. It wasn’t that some people were standing outside the building going like this. (gesticulates) They were attacking the building. They got into the building. They must have. Upendra: Before the festival they came with knives, and he never used a gun. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: We don’t fire guns into crowds… Devotee (1): They must have injured someone. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Something must have happened. Anyway, the police will be investigating thoroughly. I don’t know if I should keep… If I find out any more, should I keep talking to you about it, Śrīla…? It seems like it’s a depressing subject. Is it right to come to you with this news? Prabhupāda: Oh, yes. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: It’s all right. Should I give you some good news? Prabhupāda: What is that? Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Book distribution news. The latest saṅkīrtana newsletter came. Would you like to hear it now? Prabhupāda: Yes. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That will counteract the bad news. [break] Prabhupāda: Keeping alive. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: What, Śrīla Prabhupāda? Prabhupāda: Keeping alive this movement. All our temples are always crowded. In Los Angeles, in the morning class, it is very crowded. That colony has become very nice, Los Angeles. Ṭhik. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Oh, yes. Upendra: The colony. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That’s what it is. Now you can walk there, and you don’t even know you’re in America. All you see are devotees, devotees’ homes. And it’s always growing. It’s ever-increasing. Prabhupāda: “Transcendental meditation.” What meditation? Fifteen minutes—finished. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: They say it helps you sleep better. They claim that Transcendental Meditation helps you sleep more soundly. Prabhupāda: Ācchā. And life is meant for sleeping? Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: To the Western karmīs, sleep is a luxury, ’cause they have no peace of mind. So anything that can give them sleep, they like ’cause they can’t get to sleep. They try pills, so many things. Of course, we don’t sleep much either, but that is by choice. I tried one of those balls of bread. In America we call them “cannonballs.” Prabhupāda: Which ball? Upendra: Lakta. Prabhupāda: Oh. How do you like? Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Very tasteful. In America sometimes they put either butter or honey on them also to give it a little sweet taste. Upendra: But they cook them in the oven, and these are cooked on cow dung. These are cooked on the cow dung, khandi, khandi.(?) Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: :I was wondering how you were able to chew them. Prabhupāda: No, I could not. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: They’re pretty hard. These are very good on the long saṅkīrtana days. If someone has to go out for many hours, he takes some of these and puts them in his pocket. Then every hour he can eat one, and it gives him strength. Just like the villagers in India, they put in a little napkin. They put some… What is that? Ḍāl. Chickpeas. Prabhupāda: The villagers, these grain soaked in water, they… Not cooked. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Sometimes I have seen they sell on the streets some spicy ḍāl? Hard? I think that’s fried. Prabhupāda: Last year in Washington I was there. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: July Fourth. Oh, yes, you were there. They had a fireworks demonstration, and you saw a parade, I think. Upendra: Bicentennial? Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yeah, that was a big one, two-hundredth anniversary of the independence. The karmīs are very happy about these holidays like this July Fourth, but they are not as happy as devotees. We are even happier, because we know that all the karmīs will buy even more books on these days. Prabhupāda: (Bengali) Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Everything he’s preparing is very nectarine. I think this year, Christmastime, if we again put on our Santa Claus suits, eventually people will only give to our Santa Clauses. At first there was a reaction, last year. And this year there may be again a reaction, but after a few years no one will want to give to the other Santa Clauses. We will completely take over the Santa Claus costume. I don’t think we should give it up. Prabhupāda: Why? It is our choice. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Right. Prabhupāda: If I dress myself in a particular way, who can check it? They cannot check. I like this dress. That’s all. That is not violation of law. Upendra: Do they wear tilaka? Santa Claus? No. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: They can’t do that. They say, “You’re misrepresenting yourselves because…” Prabhupāda: I’m not misrepresenting. I like this dress. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: They say this dress indicates a Christian… Prabhupāda: Whatever indication, I like this. You cannot check my liking. Just like an Indian dresses like a European, or a European dresses like Indian. Does it mean that he has become Indian or he’s American? He likes it. That’s all. Can you object if a girl dresses like Indian with ladies’ sari? Can you object? It is something like that. “Oh, why you have become Indian-like? Why you are imitating?” Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: They say, “Well, no, you can wear your Santa Claus suit, but you’ll have to wear a Hare Kṛṣṇa button.” Prabhupāda: That we can do. Never mind. But that is not under your dictation. If I like. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: They actually made us in New York, the court. Prabhupāda: No, then there is no objection. But you cannot dictate… Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: What dress. Prabhupāda: Yes. I may dress myself to your liking; I may not. Rather, you like the Santa Claus dress. You are Christian. I am pleasing you by dressing myself like this. Why you are not pleased? I am trying to please you. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: They say, “Well, actually you’re concealing your identity.” Prabhupāda: That is my liking. You cannot dictate. I’m not pickpocketing you. What is the objection? Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: They say, “Well, why don’t you tell people who you actually are? Why don’t you say you’re a Hare Kṛṣṇa?” Prabhupāda: No, that is my desire. You cannot dictate. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Well, you’re asking me for your money. Prabhupāda: But unless you know that I’m Hare Kṛṣṇa people, how you are dictating me? Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: You’re asking me for my money, though. Prabhupāda: Huh? No, I am asking everyone. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: But you’re going to use it for Hare Kṛṣṇa. Prabhupāda: Yes. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: But we didn’t know you were Hare Kṛṣṇa. We thought you were Santa Claus. Prabhupāda: Whatever it may be, I am asking money from everyone. It is your liking. You give or not give. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: See, for many years there were these other Santa Clauses from the Salvation Army. So now they made a complaint that now no one knows who is a real Santa Claus because we are… The difference is they stand next to a big… Prabhupāda: But is there any law that nobody can dress like that? Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No. We’re only… Prabhupāda: Then? Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: There was a lot of publicity. Upendra: You once gave that Bengali saying, “When you eat, you eat for yourself, but when you dress, you dress for others.” Prabhupāda: Yes. Apake khana para…(?) Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No, I’m not so much speaking from the point of view of law. I’m just wondering whether it was… From the point of view of publicity for our society. Prabhupāda: Publicity, if we find that this dress will attract more, why not? We shall do. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: The Salvation Army Santa Clauses, they became very upset, because their routine is that they stand next to a big chimney, because Santa Claus is supposed to come down a chimney in the myth. So they stand next to the chimney, and they shake their bell. People put money into this chimney. But our Santa Clauses, they go down the street very, you know, moving around, dancing, and they go up to the people all over the place. They don’t wait for people to come over to the chimney. So we were taking away a lot of the donations that they would have given to the chimney Santa Clauses. So they were very… Prabhupāda: That is business, competition. You are doing your business; I am doing my business. That competition is there in every business. When there is business, you cannot dictate me in your favor: “While you are doing this, my business is being hampered.” Who will hear you? Hm? If you say it is competition, that “Why you are doing like this? It is hampering my business,” I’ll say, “Yes, I want that your business may be hampered; my business may prosper.” That’s it. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Cut-throat. Prabhupāda: We want that. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Everybody admits that no one can beat us in our book distribution. Other groups, they tried to duplicate what we are doing, but they failed. Prabhupāda: No, what they have got, books? Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No, that’s another thing. The other Santa Claus, they don’t give anything. We give books. They give nothing except they pat the guy on the head. They pat the child. That’s all. What will that help the child, patting him on the head? And another thing is that all the other Salvation Army Santa Claus, they’re all drunkards. Prabhupāda: They must be drunkards. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: You know the Salvation Army is very… They take all the drunkards. They give them Santa suits. Prabhupāda: If you take money without any aim, you must be drunkard. Upendra: Without any? Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Aim. Upendra: Aim. Prabhupāda: You must be drunkard, you must be woman-hunter, and you must be intoxicated. And that is not… A meat-eater. That is the whole world, going on. Not only in this planet, in upper planets. I have discussed this point in Bhāgavata. The modern economics, earning money very cheaply, has forced men to become drunkard, woman-hunters and meat-eater. But what he’ll do with the money? He has no higher idea. You must utilize the money which you have got so cheaply. And in the Western countries, if you have a little business plan, you can sell any damn nonsense things and get money. Is it not? Huh? Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes Upendra: They sell… Prabhupāda: No, I know that, that… What is that? Spectacle cleaner. It is ordinary tissue paper, and they advertise in such a way, getting money. Make any soda bicarb and advertise it as very good tonic. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yeah, they sell everything. Prabhupāda: And they know the art. Upendra: Many years ago they sold one plastic ring like this as a toy, and it became a craze all over America. Everyone bought little ones and big ones, called hoop, Hula-hoop, and they played with it, one ring, plastic ring. Prabhupāda: There are so many things. I saw. You have to know how to make people fool. This art you have to know. Then you can have money. “Moon walk.” Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: The government is the most expert at making people fool. Prabhupāda: Government is doing that, giving a piece of paper, “one thousand dollars.” American Express Company, giving paper only and collecting millions of dollars daily. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Just for giving paper you have to pay one percent of the value of paper. When you give your money, they give you paper. You pay one percent. Prabhupāda: But they have created such a credit, and people are confident as soon as present it… [break] Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That means that our goal is not to do business. It’s to enlighten people. (pause) So Vrindavan Chandra got off nicely. The train was on time, and he was very glad to receive all the prasādam. And they gave him a garland. He said he would remember everyone, such a nice visit he had. He actually enjoyed himself. I gave him the Nectar of Instruction to read. He read it. Prabhupāda: Hindi. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No. I gave him the English edition. And he said he would write as soon as he got back. He got quite a nice send-off, four or five people. Bhagatjī, Guṇārṇava, Tamāla Nārāyaṇa, the temple commander. It’s a little (indistinct). And they sat him down in the seat and made sure everything was all right. Everyone gives him a lot of respect. They know that he is your son, so when he walks out everybody was offering their namaskāras. (pause) Śrīla Prabhupāda? I was thinking I wanted to take a little rest. Is it all right? At three o’clock I go up to Bhakti-prema’s to try and understand how the universe is going on. So this is a good news, I think. Los Angeles is a good news. Prabhupāda: Very good. Jaya. (end)

Room Conversation about Māyāpura Attack Talk with Vrindavan De by His Divine Grace A. C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupāda July 8, 1977, Vṛndāvana 7 Prabhupāda: Broken. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Finished. I remember we were walking with you. So it was near the… You know, near Bury Place there’s a little park. Prabhupāda: That is very nice. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yeah. There was one building that they were constructing, and before finishing the building they were living in it, and you said, “This means this British Empire is finished. They cannot even afford to finish the building before living in it. This is a sign that they are not opulent at all.” I remember you said that. They’re not very opulent, the British. Prabhupāda: No. Their opulence finished. Actually they’re poor country. Simply by exploiting other countries they became rich. Otherwise they are… Naturally they are poor. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Peasants. Didn’t Hitler say something about that? Prabhupāda: Eh? Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I think Hitler said they’re… Prabhupāda: “Shopkeeper’s nation.” Yes. Naturally they are very poor. They cannot produce anything. It is so cold. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: They produce coal. Prabhupāda: I do not know what is they produce… What is called? Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Moss. Prabhupāda: Moss. When there is moss and waterpot. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Moss. Prabhupāda: Moss, moss. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: They produce that. Prabhupāda: (laughs) Everywhere you’ll find, even on the trees, because there is no sunshine, all rainfall. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Right. Prabhupāda: Very wretched place. I told some television reporter. “Here is hell.” Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: When you landed there you said that? Prabhupāda: No. There was television girl. “What is the description of hell?” “Now, here is, London.” Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Whew! That must not have been a very popular statement. Prabhupāda: No, he stopped immediately. Simply outwardly decorated, and it is hell. I told him. Actually that is, everywhere. No… Only cloud and that mist. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: They say that the sun never sets in the British Empire. Prabhupāda: But is always sets in London. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: It never rose. Prabhupāda: Setting of sunshine is monopolized by London. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: There’s a description in the Bhāgavatam about the setting of the sun. It’s described that when the day…, that the water is darker by day. The ocean water is darker by day than by night. And the reason given is that the daytime, the daylight goes into the ocean at night. The ocean absorbs the light of the day, and therefore when you look at the water at night, it’s lighter than it is during the day. That’s a fact. The Bhāgavatam explains why, that there’s some power within the ocean to attract the daytime. And in the daytime, the nighttime goes… Prabhupāda: It is absorbed. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: And the opposite is true, in the daytime the night goes into the water, so it appears a very dark color. This is… Every explanation is given in the Bhāgavatam, and it’s all in contradiction to the so-called scientists. They say that the reason we experience day and night is that the earth is rotating on its axis and at the same time circumambulating the sun. Prabhupāda: Double. Double motion. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. So they say, therefore, when you’re on this side and the sun is here, you won’t see, but when it turns around, then you’ll see the sun. But the Bhāgavatam does not agree with that description. The Bhāgavatam says that you don’t see the sun because it’s blocked by the Meru. The sun is moving, and Meru is blocking. And they never even heard of Meru. What is their knowledge? Such a big mountain and they don’t even know about it. That means they never left the earth’s sphere. They never went more than a few hundred miles in the air, Śrīla Prabhupāda. It’s all lies. Prabhupāda: All. That I am speaking from the very beginning. Now it is proved. They are also saying. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes, about the moon hoax. Prabhupāda: Yes. They could not answer this, “Why Sunday first, Monday?” Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I was with you when that reporter came in Los Angeles. Prabhupāda said, “Then answer to this one question, ‘Why all over the world, Sunday comes before Monday?’ ” Prabhupāda: They could not answer. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No, they thought that that was a childish… They thought that was very childish to say… Prabhupāda: Yes, first of all answer this child. Then become scientist. So there is no professor. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Actually, to them, some of our statements seem very childish and innocent. Prabhupāda: Hm? Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Some of the things that we say. Just like why is the water darker at daytime? Because the night has entered the water. They say, “Oh, that is…” Upendra: They say it’s mythology. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Mythology or childish. “Only a child would believe such a thing.” But it’s common sense. They have no faith, Śrīla Prabhupāda. Prabhupāda: Hm. Go and take rest. [break] Because I am very much fond of traveling, touring, they might have caused some danger. So Kṛṣṇa has detained me. What do you think? Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I think you’re right, Śrīla Prabhupāda. Yes. Actually the GBC, we all were thinking that it might be dangerous for you… Prabhupāda: Yes. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: …to travel. Prabhupāda: They would have been very glad that “Here is the old rascal who has spoiled our children.” They could charge, and drag me to the courts and give me trouble. Therefore a restriction on me. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: What, Prabhupāda? Prabhupāda: Restrict, that instead of myself, he has to restrict: “Do this way.” Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Including go to the court. This boy writes further. He says, “They claimed I was brainwashed by Śrīla Prabhupāda and the devotees, and they were here to get me to think for myself again. They kept me up for ten hours at a time for so-called deprogramming, just blaspheming Śrīla Prabhupāda and Kṛṣṇa and telling lie after lie. Finally they let me go to sleep, and in the morning it was time for more blaspheming and lies. But by Kṛṣṇa’s mercy I was able to escape out the front door of the house,” he says, “which was unguarded. I ran down my block barefoot and was able to get to my friend’s house. I told him the story. He gave me enough money to get to a nearby temple. There I served Rādhā and Kṛṣṇa and had the association of my Godbrothers, who are most dear to me. There I spent the happiest time of my life as a devotee with the association of the Brajabāsīs. Being a devotee of Lord Śrī Kṛṣṇa, there’s nothing like it—singing, dancing, taking prasādam, being happy and free from anxiety all the time. It is just a blissful life. All Kṛṣṇa wants is for us to be happy with Him. I called my parents and told them that I was doing fine and that I had even gained seven pounds in weight. They had the police looking for me all over the place in only a minute, and they finally showed up. Mahārāja felt it was best that I go back and clear things up with my parents and with their consent come back. But they refused to let me go, and instead put me through a one-month deprogramming session. This time I was unable to escape. But now Kṛṣṇa has pulled me through, even though I’m forced to live with my parents. They are nice people, but they just don’t understand about transcendental life. But they will come around sooner or later. I cannot keep any Vedic literature at home, so a friend lets me keep it at his house, and I read it during my school lunchtime. I am not able to keep japa beads to chant on, so I chant Hare Kṛṣṇa on rosary beads. I’m sixteen years old now and going to school, where I am taught little of any value. It is sometimes difficult to remain Kṛṣṇa conscious out in the material world, but I pray to Lord Caitanya and Lord Nityānanda to help me become strong and desire to serve Kṛṣṇa more and more every day. I will be able to join the Hare Kṛṣṇa movement in person in two years, which isn’t very long considering that I have waited to serve Kṛṣṇa for millions of lifetimes. If you have the opportunity to serve Kṛṣṇa, don’t waste it, because you may wind up in my shoes in your next life. Hare Kṛṣṇa.” This is… Prabhupāda: If one man is turned by this, the movement is successful. So there is good prospect, good hope. And you all combine together, try. Push this movement more and more. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: A lot of encouraging… I mean, everywhere there’s victory. Prabhupāda: Now I am assured. If I die or live, this movement will go on. Is it not? Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: This movement cannot die. Too many… Implanted in so many people’s hearts now. We cannot get it out anymore. Prabhupāda: Then? Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: A very nice magazine. Prabhupāda: Yes. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I can just show you some pictures. [break] Prabhupāda: There is no danger at Vṛndāvana-candra’s… Kaunteya pratijānīhi na me bhaktaḥ pra… So now they are printing, huh? Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yeah, this is on their own press, Śrīla Prabhupāda. Prabhupāda: Oh! Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Look how nicely they’ve done. It says, “Serving Kṛṣṇa in the Land of Transcendental Bliss.” Ox cart, cooking, Kulādri cooking in a big pot, cows, milking. Here they have all the people working on it. Prabhupāda: Very nice. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: “Light of the Bhāgavata.” It’s a lecture by you. These are original illustrations. Prabhupāda: Very good. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Oh, do you see what this says, Śrīla Prabhupāda, on this past page? It says… This is the verse. “The small rivulets, which were almost dried up during the months of May and June, now begin to overflow, transgressing the banks of the river, just as the upstarts addicted to uncontrolled sense enjoyment overflow the limits of expenditure all of a sudden.” And then they show a picture describing it. Sense enjoyment. They’re going verse by verse and drawing original illustrations to depict. Vedic recipe page: rasagullās. It says, “Agni-hotra on Lord Nṛsiṁhadeva’s Appearance Day.” Prabhupāda: Very good. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Sanskrit is given. It’s very nice. “Spiritual Psychology: Going Beyond the Sex Impulse.” Prabhupāda: They printed in their own press. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes, Prabhupāda. Prabhupāda: Very good advancement. What is this? Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: It says, “Āśrama Stems.” It’s describing the construction of your palace. And here’s a picture of the two śālagrāmas which they now worship. Look how elaborate! Prabhupāda: Very good. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Śrī Hiraṇyagarbha and Śrī Sudarśana in jeweled thrones. This is making the top of the domes. On your Palace there’s… The top domes have lotus petals coming under them. So over that will go the domes. This is very big. The devotees are making the whole thing themselves. This shows devotees. See, this is a form, and into this form they’ll pour concrete and other things and make shapes like these lotus petals. It’s all hand done. “The Hare Kṛṣṇa Movement.” This is pictures of saṅkīrtana in Pittsburgh and Wheeling, West Virginia. “Iṣṭagoṣṭhi: Questions and answers discussed between His Holiness Kīrtanānanda Swami and members and guests of New Vrindaban.” “Cow-Kathā.” (laughter) Like kṛṣṇa- kathā, cow-kathā. “Seeking Refuge from the Kali-yuga.” This is from your old Back to Godheads. I remember in the first printings in America this appeared—Nārada-Bhakti-Sūtra. This boy writes an article every week—“Deep in the Woods.” He’s the woodman there, wood cutter. He tells about different… He relates it to the śāstra. “Color photographs available of Rādhā-Vṛndāvana-candra.” They send it in the mail, “Non-profit organization, US Postage Paid.” So it goes in the mail just like this. Very nice. I think it’s time for your massage, Śrīla Prabhupāda. Prabhupāda: I’ll take. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Okay. I thought it was good to read all these things to you. Prabhupāda: Oh, yes. [break] …underneath a tree. Devotees: Yes. [break] Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: …telephone call from Gopāla Kṛṣṇa. He got a call from Māyāpura, and in our Māyāpura temple there was some difficulty there from dacoits. Prabhupāda: Hm? Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Three hundred dacoits attacked our temple, and there was fighting, and five of the devotees were in the hospital. Bhavānanda Mahārāja, he was arrested ’cause he fired a gun. He shot two of them and put them in the hospital, so they arrested him. And that’s all he told me. Three hundred dacoits attacked. He said Jayapatākā is now there. Jayapatākā wasn’t there. He was traveling and preaching. So he’s there now. He’s sending a report to you, a more detailed report. And they want… Jayapatākā Mahārāja wants Śatadhanya Mahārāja to go immediately there because Bhavānanda is in jail, arrested. And they want Prabhāsa to come, because the gun, the gun that Bhavānanda Mahārāja used is in the name of Prabhāsa. And Gopāla Kṛṣṇa is going there tomorrow. He’s also going there. Prabhupāda: So why attacked? Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Well, the only thing we could guess is that now the government is Communist. So it may be that these were Communist-inspired dacoits. I mean, three hundred, if there was actually… It must have been quite a huge number. That means they were organized. It’s not some ordinary village dacoits to have such a huge number of them. So the Communists, maybe they did this. It’s hard to understand until we get the report from Jayapatākā. He said he’s sending it. Prabhupāda: And police did not help? Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Well, it was in the middle of the night. So probably by the time they informed the police, you know, by the time the police came, whatever was done was done. I mean, Gopāla didn’t have the full information, and he’s going there. And, of course, we were only talking over telephone, so even if he knew… He told me as much as he could over the telephone. But I asked if anyone was killed. He said no. But five devotees were in the hospital. You know that teacher who was here? Hiraṇyagarbha? Remember the gurukula teacher? He was stabbed. I think that’s about the most serious that anyone was hurt. No one was killed or anything, but… The government now is very precarious there. It’s all Communist government. I mean, I remember when Bengal was with the Communists in 1971. It was horrible there. So many marches, and so many of our members were being attacked. So maybe it was the Communists who did this. I don’t think the Gauḍīya Maṭha could have organized such a thing. They would not do that. Prabhupāda: No. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: It sounds like… I don’t know if there’s any… Probably they won’t attack again immediately. Now there must be police all the time there. I remember, in Calcutta once we had some trouble. Immediately they put a police guard all the time. The question is, of course, how much the government will protect us if the government is Communist and these were Communists who attacked. That we’ll have to see. Prabhupāda: No. It has to be taken to the Central Government. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That’s what I thought also. I suspect that Gopāla wants to get the full information firsthand. Then he has to come to Vṛndāvana-Delhi anyway, so probably he’ll come from Calcutta to Delhi directly to deal with the Central government. At that time, we should take the help of Bhakti-caitanya Mahārāja’s friend, Mr. Gupta. This is the proper occasion. Prabhupāda: But if the dacoits attack, we used gun, what is wrong? Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Self-protection. The question is it may be that the gun may only be allowed to be used by the licensed holder of the gun. Prabhupāda: That does not… Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Sometimes, you know, when a person is arrested, it doesn’t mean he’s guilty, but they have to arrest him. Then, later on, it’s taken up in court whether or not he’s guilty. Prabhupāda: Gun is kept for protection. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Anyway, it will come up in court. That’s a formality, that when you shoot someone they arrest you. Whether you’re right or wrong, they have to take you to court. Probably the dacoits pressed some charge also. Who knows? Jayapatākā’s report will be coming with…, more fully… Actually I would have waited to tell you, but because Śatadhanya will have to… They want him to go, so… They want Prabhāsa there right away. It may be that they want to say that Prabhāsa was there. Prabhupāda: So both of them are going? Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Well, Gopāla… His point… He said Jayapatākā wants Śatadhanya Mahārāja and Prabhāsa to go. Prabhupāda: Then let them go. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That was his whole point in calling, because they cannot call from Māyāpura to Vṛndāvana. The telephone line will not do that. So Māyāpura called Bombay and Bombay called here. Prabhupāda: So some of the dacoits are arrested or not? Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He didn’t say. I’m certain that some of them must have been arrested. They couldn’t have all gotten away. I mean, some of them are in the hospital. The ones that Bhavānanda shot are in the hospital. Prabhupāda: So one is in the hospital. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Two. Prabhupāda: Two. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Bhavānanda shot down two of them. Prabhupāda: No, no. From their? Dacoits? Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yeah, two. Bhavānanda shot with a gun two dacoits, and they’re in the hospital. Prabhupāda: So then there is clue. Then others should be arrested. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Actually… I’m actually speculating… Gopāla said Bhavānanda shot two of them, and he’s in jail for shooting two of them. I’m saying that they’re in the hospital. Maybe they’re not. He’s arrested for shooting two of them. Prabhupāda: Unless they are in hospital… Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: How could he be arrested? Right. Prabhupāda: Bengal has become ruined. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: They’re the only place in all of India that elected a Communist government. Everyone else was so happy to elect the new party. But they elected Communists. Most amazing. Prabhupāda: Where is Vrindavan? Devotee: He’s resting. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: You know, what I’m thinking is that that Mr. Arora, he wanted to go to Jyoti Basu. Prabhupāda: He talks too much. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I don’t think it’s going to have much consequence. If they want to give us the land, they’ll give it. It’s not that… Prabhupāda: Hm? Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Regarding that land, if they want to give it, they’ll give it. It’s not that somebody’s going to come, like Mr. Arora, and by his coming suddenly they’re going to give us the land. It’s a big political matter. It’s not friendship. We just have to become very much prepared now for such occurrences. Those gurukula boys, as they grow up, they should be trained to protect Māyāpura. Prabhupāda: Therefore I say kṣatriya. Some of our men should be trained as kṣatriya. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: This is required. Prabhupāda: Cātur-varṇyaṁ mayā sṛṣṭam [Bg. 4.13]. There must be division—brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya, vaiśya—not that all one class. That is all wrong. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Some people are inclined in that way. Guṇa-karma. Prabhupāda: But everyone can be utilized if you organize it rightly. Three hundred dacoits there means government is very weak. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That’s just in one little area, Nadia District. Imagine how many dacoits are in all of Bengal now. It will get even worse than it was in 1971. I’m sure, as the Kali-yuga progresses, it will only get worse. And it was very bad. I remember when we were living in Bali Ganj. Every day there was march. People were marching, Communist slogans. Prabhupāda: (indistinct) Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. Bhakti-caru was saying that one of the reasons Bengali people are by nature… They’re intelligent. They’re always intelligent people, not so much physically hard working. So without so much physical work to do and without proper employment, this intelligence now has become misdirected. ’Cause nowhere else in India do the Communists have such a foothold as in Bengal. Prabhupāda: Intelligent and lazy. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Intelligent lazy. I looked on the medicine bottle of this cough medicine that you took. Prabhupāda: Hm? Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: This cough medicine that you took, that Expectrin? One fourth of it is chloroform, and it says that in some persons it will cause sleepiness, drowsiness, due to the chloroform. Upendra: He’s coming, Prabhupādajī. He’s just finishing breakfast. He said he’s coming. [break] Prabhupāda: …in the world, the most disturbing element. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: In Russia, it seems from Harikeśa’s letter, that they are admitting it is a failure. Prabhupāda: It is… It must be failure. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Now in Russia they seem to be tending more and more to give up all of this false philosophy. They’re allowing churches again. Prabhupāda: Lenin, Stalin, they were guṇḍās. Guṇḍā philosophy. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: What about Marx? Prabhupāda: He was a rascal. What is his philosophy? Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Economic philosophy. Prabhupāda: No, no, what is that, basic principle? Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Basic principle is that the… Prabhupāda: I do not care to read this nonsense, never. What I hear from you, that’s all. I tell them, “Mūḍhas, narādhamas.” That’s all. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: You don’t spend any time studying their philosophy. Prabhupāda: Why shall I waste my time? I never read all these. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Sometimes devotees say, in order to defeat… This is their philosophy. Prabhupāda: They are defeated, already dead. Few days they can quack. That’s all. Who asks for Marx now? Gandhi, Marx, Tolstoy, who cares for them? Vivekananda? Now Kṛṣṇa’s Bhagavad-gītā is taken. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Even in the law court it’s quoted. Prabhupāda: So what is the Marx philosophy? Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He says that the people are suffering at the hands of the capitalists. One or two people… Prabhupāda: That’s a fact. That we admit, but not to adjust in that way. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He said everything should be taken out of the hands of the few and given to the many. Prabhupāda: Yes. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: By violent revolution. Prabhupāda: Why violent revolution? Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He says the few will not give up without forcefully taking it from them. Prabhupāda: But you’ll also not give up. You want to take it by force. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He says… Prabhupāda: So if you have got right to take by force, others have got the right to take by force. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He says, “We represent everyone except the few. And we want to make the few part of us, but they should not be special.” Prabhupāda: But if you are so able, then why you are few? You must be many. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No. His revolution is the revolution of the masses against the few. Just like in Russia they overthrew the Czars. Prabhupāda: Not the masses. The guṇḍās. Russia was never joined by the masses. It is wrong. That I have studied. Guṇḍās, some guṇḍās… Just like three hundred guṇḍās came. That does not mean that the mass of… The guṇḍās’ party, Lenin guṇḍās… He had some few men. They attacked. They killed. That’s all, not the mass. It was not a mass movement. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: In China it was the masses. Prabhupāda: No. The same, the same few. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Well, they said that the few represented the masses. Prabhupāda: How? Who elected you? Who asked you? Gaya mane napni mora:(?) “Nobody cares for me, and I have become beautiful.” There are many Bengali… Danle tarale nija ram salda.(?) (chuckles) Mass people never joined. That I have studied. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Well, they say that they represent the… Prabhupāda: You can say, but who made you representative? You can say all nonsense. That is your business. [break]… who will give something standard, they’ll be established. That standard is in this varṇāśrama. Here is the standard, that leg must be there, the hand must be there, the head must be there, the belly must be… One who has got the qualities to work like hand, he must work as hand. That is natural. These rascals have no education actually. Therefore I always say, “rascals.” They manufacture. They are imperfect, and they manufacture. [break] “Probably,” “maybe,” like that. No standard logic. So, (Bengali) Vrindavan De: Nandagrāma, Varṣāṇā, Rādhā-kuṇḍa, Śyāma-kuṇḍa. (Bengali) Prabhupāda: Govardhana Hill? Vrindavan De: Govardhana. (Bengali) Prabhupāda: (Bengali) So do you know anything about Bengal situation? Vrindavan De: I think it’s okay now. Prabhupāda: What is the Communist view? Vrindavan De: Communist view? Prabhupāda: They don’t want religion? What is this leader? Ajit Bose? Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Jyoti Bose. Vrindavan De: No, he’s not the man of that sort. He’s very serious type of man. Prabhupāda: But Bengal is now full of rogues and rascals and dacoits, everywhere. Practically whole Bengal is full of these elements. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: More than other places. Vrindavan De: The Congress Minister is very much serious person. Prabhupāda: Anywhere you are going, anywhere, you can be attacked. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Any train, anywhere. Prabhupāda: Anywhere. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Any street. Prabhupāda: Nowhere is safe. Some boys may come and attack you and take… Nobody will… Is it not like that? Neither at home, neither on the road… You are not safe. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Imagine, in Māyāpura we have 250 devotees, and still they attacked. Prabhupāda: Hm? Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: In Māyāpura we have 250 people. What family has 250 people? If 250 people and there’s danger, then what to speak of a family man with only a few people in the family? That means they’re ready to attack any number of people. There are so many dacoits. Prabhupāda: No, therefore they came in number, three hundred. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: And it was very organized, they said. At night they came. Vrindavan De: They can refer the matter to the Home Department. He’s the Home Minister, I think, that Jyoti Bose. He is Chief and Home. He’s controlling the police powers and force. (Bengali) Take action. Prabhupāda: They must be doing something. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Oh, there’s no doubt. With Jayapatākā Mahārāja there… Prabhupāda: (Bengali) Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes, there was shooting. Bhavānanda Mahārāja was shooting. There was shooting. I don’t know if they were also shooting, the dacoits, but we had, our boys… This has happened before in small scale, so Jayapatākā knows. We’ve been attacked enough times so that they know that we’re going to make full reports and complaints and get action. The main thing immediately is to get protection of the police so that this doesn’t reoccur. Vrindavan De: You can forward a copy to (indistinct). Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Then we should go… It should be taken to the Central Government. Vrindavan De: The Chief Secretary. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Another help you can get is from the embassies. American Embassy has to give protection to its citizens. All foreign embassies have to give full protection. Actually that’s a very good road to take, because if the foreign embassies put in complaints, then it becomes international thing. Then the Central Government will get very upset and direct the West Bengal Government to stop this from reoccuring “Because we are getting complaints from foreign governments now that we can’t give protection to foreigners who are here in this country.” Prabhupāda: So give them the instruction. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: They should complain to the Consulate, American Consulate, and Consulate will complain to the Embassy. Once we get the full information then we can take action here in Delhi also. At this point we don’t have enough information. This is a very good road to take. Go to the American Embassy in Delhi and say, “We want protection. We are American citizens. We want protection. We’re being attacked in Bengal. You must put pressure on the government to give us protection.” And they’ll do that surely. Plus they have to start an investigation to expose who has done this. That has to also be brought up. I’m sure Jayapatākā is… Śrīla Prabhupāda, should we go and take our breakfast? Prabhupāda: Hm. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: You want Vrindavan to stay for a while? Prabhupāda: No, he (indistinct). (Bengali conversation about going around Vṛndāvana) I shall give you car. (Bengali). So if you do business, I’ll give you car. Not for luxury. (conversation continues in Bengali) (end)

Indeed, they are also missing here, http://causelessmercy.com/t/?i=1977

I dont know if this is the complete conversation, it stops quite abruptly..(end) Room Conversations by His Divine Grace A. C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupāda July 7, 1977, Vṛndāvana Prabhupāda: Just see. For cutting the throat of cow, he’s going thousands of miles. This is the civilization. He’s an expert butcher, and he has got service in Australia, and he’ll go. This is livelihood, personal duty. What a nonsense business, and he’s going to… Mā jīva vā māra. A butcher is advised, “Don’t die; don’t live. If you live, it is a horrible business, and if you die, you’ll go to hell. So don’t die; don’t live.” Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He has a question to ask. He says, “Is it permitted to use shells for making jewelry, crowns, etc., for Deities? Or is it to be considered as the bone of an animal?” Prabhupāda: No, you can do it. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: ’Cause they’re very beautiful. Prabhupāda: The bone of animal is the conchshell, and that is used in Deity room. It is… The conchshell is nothing but bone of an animal. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Right. He says that he has a plan. “We want to inlay the thrones for the new temple with beautiful shells if it is permitted.” Prabhupāda: Oh, yes. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He’s says he’s trying to increase the book distribution by arranging a big door-to-door program. Prabhupāda: That is my earnest desire. Fulfill it. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That’s all he has to say. That was all the mail that came. Prabhupāda: You can send him some old newsletter with a note that “How your other Godbrothers are doing. Compete with them in this line.” Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Okay. Prabhupāda: Hm. Simply fighting, what gift? Fighting between brother and brother, that is going on perpetually, but do something for the father. By right I’ll take. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yeah. Satsvarūpa’s… Rāmeśvara sent an article. One of Siddha’s papers, they published an article which was against the devotees. Prabhupāda: Who? Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Siddha-svarūpa’s. Prabhupāda: Oh. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: It was against the devotees’ book distribution tactics. So… Prabhupāda: So you can send them: “This is not good.” Let him know. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: So Satsvarūpa wrote a letter to the editor of the newspaper—it’s a newspaper which is put out by Siddha’s people— saying that “This is not at all proper. You should not…” He gave so many shastric references why it is not good. Prabhupāda: It will be corrected. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yeah, I mean the main… It’s not so serious. The main point is, as you said, they’re chanting and all these other activities. Prabhupāda: Yes. So we shall go now? Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. It’s getting late. Prabhupāda: Where is Jao Prasad? [break] Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Everything was “probably” in their books. Prabhupāda: “Probably,” “maybe.” Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Those are their favorite words. Śrīla Prabhupāda? We’re receiving a number of letters now, and these are people who want to get initiated. So up until now, since your becoming ill, we asked them to wait. Prabhupāda: The local, mean, senior sannyāsīs can do that. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That’s what we were doing… I mean, formerly we were… The local GBC, sannyāsīs, were chanting on their beads, and they were writing to Your Divine Grace, and you were giving a spiritual name. So should that process be resumed, or should we…? I mean one thing is that it’s said that the spiritual master takes on the… You know, he takes on the… He has to cleanse the disciple by… So we don’t want that you should have to… Your health is not so good, so that should not be… That’s why we’ve been asking everybody to wait. I just want to know if we should continue to wait some more time. Prabhupāda: No, the senior sannyāsīs… Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: So they should continue to… Prabhupāda: You can give me a list of sannyāsīs. I will mark who will… Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Okay. Prabhupāda: You can do. Kīrtanānanda can do. And our Satsvarūpa can do. So these three, you can give, begin. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: So supposing someone is in America, should they simply write directly to Kīrtanānanda or Satsvarūpa? Prabhupāda: Nearby. Jayatīrtha can give. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Jayatīrtha. Prabhupāda: Bhavānan…, er, Bhagavān. And he can do also. Harikeśa. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Harikeśa Mahārāja. Prabhupāda: And… Five, six men, you divide who is nearest. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Who is nearest. So persons wouldn’t have to write to Your Divine Grace. They could write directly to that person? Prabhupāda: Hm. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Actually they are initiating the person on Your Divine Grace’s behalf. Those persons who are initiated are still your… Prabhupāda: Second initiation we shall think over, second initiation. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: This is for first initiation, okay. And for second initiation, for the time being they should… Prabhupāda: No, they have to wait. Second initiation, that should be given… Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Should… Some devotees are writing you now for second initiation, and I’m writing them to wait a while because you’re not well. So can I continue to tell them that? Prabhupāda: They can do second initiation. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: By writing you. Prabhupāda: No. These men. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: These men, they can also do second initiation. So there’s no need for devotees to write to you for first and second initiation. They can write to the man nearest them. But all these persons are still your disciples. Anybody who gives initiation is doing so on your behalf. Prabhupāda: Yes. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: You know that book I’m maintaining of all of your disciples’ names? Should I continue that? Prabhupāda: Hm. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: So if someone gives initiation, like Harikeśa Mahārāja, he should send the person’s name to us here and I’ll enter it in the book. Okay. Is there someone else in India that you want to do this? Prabhupāda: India, I am here. We shall see. In India, Jayapatākā. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Jayapatākā Mahārāja. Prabhupāda: You are also in India. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. Prabhupāda: You can note down these names. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes, I have them. Prabhupāda: Who are they? Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Kīrtanānanda Mahārāja, Satsvarūpa Mahārāja, Jayatīrtha Prabhu, Bhagavān Prabhu, Harikeśa Mahārāja, Jayapatākā Mahārāja and Tamāla Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja. Prabhupāda: That’s nice. Now you distribute. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Seven. There’s seven names. Prabhupāda: For the time being, seven names, sufficient. You can make Rāmeśvara. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Rāmeśvara Mahārāja. Prabhupāda: And Hṛdayānanda. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Oh, yeah. South America. Prabhupāda: So without waiting for me, wherever you consider it is right… That will depend on discretion. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: On discretion. Prabhupāda: Yes. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That’s for first and second initiations. Prabhupāda: Hm. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Okay. Shall I send a kīrtana party, Śrīla Prabhupāda? [break] Prabhupāda: And his wife takes four bottles of Nax Pomica.(?) If we said that “Dr. Bannerji prescribes Nax Pomica(?) and different (indistinct) to every person,” therefore we finished the Nax Pomica(?) bottle very quickly. He was the biggest customer for Nax Pomica, Tincture Nax Pomica.(?) So he… And he was very famous doctor. And Abhinas Chandra Bannerji, he went to Allahabad very poor condition. Then, by medical practice, he became very rich man. I think simply by the mercy of Nax Pomica.(?) So one must know the right way. (coughs) Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: How’s your cold, Śrīla Prabhupāda? Prabhupāda: There is nothing. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Is it changing the condition at all? We should think how to get rid of it. Prabhupāda: How to rid? Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I remember one thing you were taking to loosen the phlegm in Māyāpura when you had a cough. You were taking a little hot lemon juice in the mornings. Prabhupāda: You can give me. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I remember that. It seemed to have good effects. It also helped for digestion. Prabhupāda: So any other? Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No. Actually I’m right in the middle of doing these accounts, so I probably should… Prabhupāda: (coughing) So this bank manager came. It means they are little serious. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Oh, this is a real good sign. The last request of the head office is a very good sign. The head office is requesting, “Now please take the letter for him to sign…” It means that they’re planning how to get the branch open. And I told this man that “If you get this opened, then surely we will open your branch in our Māyāpura center as well in all other centers.” Prabhupāda: That’s nice. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: They are a good bank. There’s no doubt. Prabhupāda: That Mr. Neta came? Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: His name is Mr. Pattak, isn’t it? Prabhupāda: Oh, Pattak, Pattak, yes. That’s all right. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: After massage I can come and see you and give some… (end)

<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width=550 border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=middle>"Nice" comment by H.Kissinger - wonder what his next life will look like? DoD LIES, but VA Admits 153,000 Disability Claims </TD></TR><TR><TD> November 1, 2006 Finally some reliable figures are coming out from the Veterans Affairs department concerning the Global War on Terrorism (GWOT). or more simply the latest ill-advised US military adventure in Iraq, started in March 2003... Instead of the 30,000 casualties reported by the DoD, the latest VA report shows that 153,000 US soldiers - out of a total deployed of 567,000 - were injured enough to claim for disability. The accepted ratio of Wounded to Dead in the latest Iraq War is 7.5 to 1, according to the Washington Post, which extrapolates to around 20,400 US soldiers DEAD up to June 2006 "The number of wounded in Iraq through March 31, 2006, was 7.5 times the number of dead" Progression: in a six months period claims have increased from 115,500 to 153,000, or an increase of some 32%. It therefore seems reasonable to assume that the ANNUALIZED increase in casualty claims is of the order of 60% from year to year!.... It took 15 years for the claims relating to the much shorter Gulf War, where 580,000 US troops were deployed to reach the incredible number of 518,000, or nearly 90% of deployment. Because of the extensive use of Depleted Uranium this time around (2000 tons against 350 tons) one could reasonably expect that 90% of all soldiers deployed will claim disability within 10 years of the beginning of the War, the other 10% being DEAD... As Kissinger said: "Military men are just dumb stupid animals to be used as pawns in foreign policy." Now he could very well say: "Military men are just dumb stupid Walking Zombies waiting to dies of DU poisoning" VA Link: www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/news/20061010/index.htm </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

Why buy in kali-yuga controlled London? Link below is the place in Jaipur where the most beautiful Deities are made!http://www.moortikalakendra.com/products_God.htm#God Mobile :91-9314870321/9829787682

Well, what I heard quite often is that the cremation has to take place before the next sunrise - even when death occured in the evening. May be we might have difficulties to apply vedic culture concerning death rituals that easily into this advanced age of Kali. When it comes to know that someone might leave this world soon there should be harinam sankirtan to help the departing soul to think of Krishna and attain the eternal kingdom of God. 1. As Death Approaches Traditionally, a Hindu dies at home. Nowadays the dying are increasingly kept in hospitals, even when recovery is clearly not possible. Knowing the merits of dying at home among loved ones, Hindus bring the ill home. When death is imminent, kindred are notified. The person is placed in his room or in the entryway of the house, with the head facing east. A lamp is lit near his head and he is urged to concentrate on his mantra. Kindred keep vigil until the great departure, singing hymns, praying and reading scripture. If he cannot come home, this happens at the hospital, regardless of institutional objections. 2. The Moment of Death If the dying person is unconscious at departure, a family member chants the mantra softly in the right ear. If none is known, "Aum Namo Narayana" or "Aum Nama Krishnaya" is intoned. (This is also done for sudden-death victims, such as on a battlefield or in a car accident.) Holy ash or sandal paste is applied to the forehead, Vedic verses are chanted, and a few drops of milk, Ganga or other holy water are trickled into the mouth. After death, the body is laid in the home's entryway, with the head facing south, on a cot or the ground--reflecting a return to the lap of Mother Earth. The lamp is kept lit near the head and incense burned. A cloth is tied under the chin and over the top of the head. The thumbs are tied together, as are the big toes. In a hospital, the family has the death certificate signed immediately and transports the body home. Under no circumstances should the body be embalmed or organs removed for use by others. Religious pictures are turned to the wall, and in some traditions mirrors are covered. Relatives are beckoned to bid farewell and sing sacred songs at the side of the body. 3. The Homa Fire Ritual If available, a special funeral priest is called. In a shelter built by the family, a fire ritual (homa) is performed to bless nine brass kumbhas (water pots) and one clay pot. Lacking the shelter, an appropriate fire is made in the home. The "chief mourner" leads the rites. He is the eldest son in the case of the father's death and the youngest son in the case of the mother's. In some traditions, the eldest son serves for both, or the wife, son-in-law or nearest male relative. 4. Preparing the Body The chief mourner now performs arati, passing an oil lamp over the remains, then offering flowers. The male (or female, depending on the gender of the deceased) relatives carry the body to the back porch, remove the clothes and drape it with a white cloth. (If there is no porch, the body can be sponge bathed and prepared where it is.) Each applies sesame oil to the head, and the body is bathed with water from the nine kumbhas, dressed, placed in a coffin (or on a palanquin) and carried to the homa shelter. The young children, holding small lighted sticks, encircle the body, singing hymns. The women then walk around the body and offer puffed rice into the mouth to nourish the deceased for the journey ahead. A widow will place her tali (wedding pendant) around her husband's neck, signifying her enduring tie to him. The coffin is then closed. If unable to bring the body home, the family arranges to clean and dress it at the mortuary rather than leave these duties to strangers. The ritual homa fire can be made at home or kindled at the crematorium. 5. Cremation Only men go to the cremation site, led by the chief mourner. Two pots are carried: the clay kumbha and another containing burning embers from the homa. The body is carried three times counterclockwise around the pyre, then placed upon it. All circumambulating, and some arati, in the rites is counterclockwise. If a coffin is used, the cover is now removed. The men offer puffed rice as the women did earlier, cover the body with wood and offer incense and ghee. With the clay pot on his left shoulder, the chief mourner circles the pyre while holding a fire brand behind his back. At each turn around the pyre, a relative knocks a hole in the pot with a knife, letting water out, signifying life's leaving its vessel. At the end of three turns, the chief mourner drops the pot. Then, without turning to face the body, he lights the pyre and leaves the cremation grounds. The others follow. At a gas-fueled crematorium, sacred wood and ghee are placed inside the coffin with the body. Where permitted, the body is carried around the chamber, and a small fire is lit in the coffin before it is consigned to the flames. The cremation switch then is engaged by the chief mourner. 6. Return Home; Ritual Impurity Returning home, all bathe and share in cleaning the house. A lamp and water pot are set where the body lay in state. The water is changed daily, and pictures remain turned to the wall. The shrine room is closed, with white cloth draping all icons. During these days of ritual impurity, family and close relatives do not visit others' homes, though neighbors and relatives bring daily meals to relieve the burdens during mourning. Neither do they attend festivals and temples, visit swamis, nor take part in marriage arrangements. Some observe this period up to one year. For the death of friends, teachers or students, observances are optional. While mourning is never suppressed or denied, scriptures admonish against excessive lamentation and encourage joyous release. The departed soul is acutely conscious of emotional forces directed at him. Prolonged grieving can hold him in earthly consciousness, inhibiting full transition to the heaven worlds. In Hindu Bali, it is shameful to cry for the dead. 7. Bone-Gathering Ceremony About 12 hours after cremation, family men return to collect the remains. Water is sprinkled on the ash; the remains are collected on a large tray. At crematoriums the family can arrange to personally gather the remains: ashes and small pieces of white bone called "flowers." In crematoriums these are ground to dust, and arrangements must be made to preserve them. Ashes are carried or sent to India for deposition in the Ganges or placed them in an auspicious river or the ocean, along with garlands and flowers. 8. First Memorial On the 3rd, 5th, 7th or 9th day, relatives gather for a meal of the deceased's favorite foods. A portion is offered before his photo and later ceremonially left at an abandoned place, along with some lit camphor. Customs for this period are varied. Some offer pinda (rice balls) daily for nine days. Others combine all these offerings with the following sapindikarana rituals for a few days or one day of ceremonies. 9. 31st-Day Memorial On the 31st day, a memorial service is held. In some traditions it is a repetition of the funeral rites. At home, all thoroughly clean the house. A priest purifies the home, and performs the sapindikarana, making one large pinda (representing the deceased) and three small, representing the father, grandfather and greatgrandfather. The large ball is cut in three pieces and joined with the small pindas to ritually unite the soul with the ancestors in the next world. The pindas are fed to the crows, to a cow or thrown in a river for the fish. Some perform this rite on the 11th day after cremation. Others perform it twice: on the 31st day or (11th, 15th, etc.) and after one year. Once the first sapindikarana is completed, the ritual impurity ends. Monthly repetition is also common for one year. 10. One-Year Memorial At the yearly anniversary of the death (according to the moon calendar), a priest conducts the shraddha rites in the home, offering pinda to the ancestors. This ceremony is done yearly as long as the sons of the deceased are alive (or for a specified period). It is now common in India to observe shraddha for ancestors just prior to the yearly Navaratri festival. This time is also appropriate for cases where the day of death is unknown. Hindu funeral rites can be simple or exceedingly complex. These ten steps, devotedly completed according to the customs, means, and ability of the family, will properly conclude one earthly sojourn of any Hindu soul. Recommended Resources: Funeral and Other Sacraments After Death, Jnana Prabodhini, 510 Sadashiv Petha, Pune 411 030, India. Grihya Sutras, Sacred Books of the East Series, Motilal Banarsidass, Bungalow Road, Jawaharnagar, New Delhi 7, India. Hindu Samskaras, Dr. Raj Bali Pandy, Motilal Banarsidass. Life After Life, Raymond A. Moody, Bantam Books, 1540 Broadway, New York, New York 10036. Meditation and the Art of Dying, Pandit Usharbudh Arya, Himalayan Institute, Honesdale, Pennsylvania 18431. The Transition Called Death, Charles Hampton, Theosophical Publishing House, 306 West Geneva Rd, Wheaton, Illinois 60187. Dilemmas of Life and Death, S. Cromwell Crowley, SUNY Press, Albany, New York 12246.

This mantra from Sri Isopanisad you can chant without being worried and at the same time it greatly helps you to focus your mind without going to hell or feeling guilty. om purnam adah purnam idam purnat purnam udacyate purnasya purnam adaya purnam evavasisyate

I think you posted this under the wrong place - this is rather a spiritual topic and not a medical. Celibacy is ultimately NO such thing as oppression but replacing material pleasure with spiritual pleasure. When experiencing actual spiritual pleasure from within you automatically are no more interested in material pleasure, which isnt indeed no pleasure at all, but just a temporary short relieve. http://www.audarya-fellowship.com/forums/1005699-post19.html

Shocking result by the BMJ, vaccination against influenza has no use! British Medical Journal Analysis and comment Public health Influenza vaccination: policy versus evidence </NOBR>Tom Jefferson, coordinator</STRONG><SUP>1</SUP></NOBR> <SUP>1</SUP> Cochrane Vaccines Field, Anguillara Sabazia, Roma 00061, Italy jefferson.tom@gmail.com........ type=text/javascript><!-- var u = "jefferson.tom", d = "gmail.com"; document.getElementById("em0").innerHTML = '<a href="' + u + '@' + d + '">' + u + '@' + d + '<\/a>'//-->.........> Each year enormous effort goes into producing influenza vaccines<SUP> </SUP>for that specific year and delivering them to appropriate sections<SUP> </SUP>of the population. Is this effort justified?<SUP> </SUP> Viral infections of the respiratory tract impose a high burden<SUP> </SUP>on society. In the last half of the 20th century, efforts to<SUP> </SUP>prevent or minimise their impact centred on the use of influenza<SUP> </SUP>vaccines. Each year enormous effort goes into producing that<SUP> </SUP>year's vaccine and delivering it to appropriate sections of<SUP> </SUP>the population. Here, I will discuss policies on the use of<SUP> </SUP>inactivated vaccines for seasonal influenza; the evidence for<SUP> </SUP>their efficacy, effectiveness, and safety ("effects"); and possible<SUP> </SUP>reasons for the gap between policy and evidence.<SUP> </SUP> Policies Every vaccination campaign has stated aims against which its<SUP> </SUP>effects must be measured. The US Advisory Committee on Immunisation<SUP> </SUP>Practices produces a regularly updated rationale for vaccination<SUP> </SUP>against influenza.<SUP>1</SUP> The current version identifies 11 categories<SUP> </SUP>of patients at high risk of complications from influenza (box).<SUP> </SUP> The rationale rests on the heavy burden that influenza imposes<SUP> </SUP>on the population and the benefits of vaccination. For example,<SUP> </SUP>reductions in cases, admissions to hospital, mortality of elderly<SUP> </SUP>people in families with children, contacts with healthcare professionals,<SUP> </SUP>antibiotic prescriptions, and absenteeism for children and household<SUP> </SUP>contacts are the main arguments for extending vaccination to<SUP> </SUP>healthy children aged 6-23 months in the United States.<SUP>2</SUP> Canada<SUP> </SUP>introduced a similar policy in 2004.<SUP>3</SUP> Less comprehensive policies<SUP> </SUP>recommending vaccination for all people aged 60 or 65 and over<SUP> </SUP>are in place in 40 of 51 developed or rapidly developing countries.<SUP>4</SUP><SUP> </SUP>On the basis of single studies, the World Health Organization<SUP> </SUP>estimates that "vaccination of the elderly reduces the risk<SUP> </SUP>of serious complications or of death by 70-85%."<SUP>5</SUP> Given the<SUP> </SUP>global nature of these recommendations, what type of evidence<SUP> </SUP>should we expect to support them and what does available evidence<SUP> </SUP>tell us?<SUP>4</SUP><SUP> </SUP> Which evidence? When considering the best evidence for vaccination we must take<SUP> </SUP>into account the unique epidemiological features of influenza<SUP> </SUP>viruses and the rationale for immunisation. The incidence and<SUP> </SUP>circulation of seasonal influenza and other respiratory viruses<SUP> </SUP>vary greatly each year, each season, and even in each setting.<SUP> </SUP>A systematic review of the incidence of influenza in people<SUP> </SUP>up to 19 years' old reported a seasonal variability of 0-46%;<SUP> </SUP>during a five year period the average incidence was 4.6% in<SUP> </SUP>this age group. During a period of 25 years the incidence was<SUP> </SUP>9.5% in children under 5.<SUP>6</SUP> Because of this variability and lack<SUP> </SUP>of carryover protection from one year's vaccine to the next,<SUP>7</SUP><SUP> </SUP>especially if the virus changes its antigenic configuration,<SUP> </SUP>single studies reporting data from one or two seasons are difficult<SUP> </SUP>to interpret. Single studies are also not reliable sources for<SUP> </SUP>generalising and forecasting the effects of vaccines, especially<SUP> </SUP>when numbers are small. They introduce further instability into<SUP> </SUP>already problematic forecasting. Additional limitations to our<SUP> </SUP>forecasting ability are imposed by our use (and misuse) of studies<SUP> </SUP>assessing the effects of influenza vaccines. Although the effect<SUP> </SUP>assessed depends on the aims of the particular campaign, most<SUP> </SUP>concentrate on serious effects (such as pneumonia or death)<SUP> </SUP>and person to person transmission (table 1). Field efficacy<SUP> </SUP>studies are only relevant when viral circulation is high, but<SUP> </SUP>no one can forecast with precision the impact on next year's<SUP> </SUP>influenza.<SUP> </SUP> Studies of the effects on influenza-like illness and its complications<SUP> </SUP>most closely replicate real life conditions because no one knows<SUP> </SUP>what agent (if any) causes this disease. Influenza-like illness<SUP> </SUP>is an acute respiratory disease caused by many different viruses<SUP> </SUP>(including influenza A and B), which presents with symptoms<SUP> </SUP>and signs that cannot be distinguished from those of influenza.<SUP> </SUP>Influenza-like illness does not have documented laboratory isolation<SUP> </SUP>of the causative agent and is the syndrome that most commonly<SUP> </SUP>presents to doctors ("the flu").<SUP> </SUP> In general the most powerful and reliable studies are those<SUP> </SUP>that "average" out several years and perform subanalyses by<SUP> </SUP>setting, population, viral circulation, and viral-vaccine antigenic<SUP> </SUP>match—variables that affect interpretation of the effects<SUP> </SUP>of a vaccine. Systematic reviews are the best way to perform<SUP> </SUP>such analyses, and provide powerful evidence weighted by the<SUP> </SUP>methodological quality of the studies involved. Large datasets<SUP> </SUP>containing several decades of observations help us to assess<SUP> </SUP>the performance of vaccines more accurately.<SUP> </SUP> <CENTER><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width="95%" border=1><TBODY><TR bgColor=#e1e1e1><TD><TABLE cellSpacing=2 cellPadding=2 width="100%"><TBODY><TR bgColor=#e1e1e1><TD vAlign=top align=left bgColor=#ffffff>People for whom vaccination is recommended in the United States<SUP>1</SUP> People<SUP> </SUP>aged 65 or more Patients in institutions who have chronic medical<SUP> </SUP>conditions Adults and children with chronic disorders of the<SUP> </SUP>cardiovascular and respiratory systems (including asthma but<SUP> </SUP>excluding hypertension) Adults and children who have been treated<SUP> </SUP>in hospital in the preceding 12 months for a range of conditions<SUP> </SUP>(for example, diabetes or haemoglobinopathy) Adults and children<SUP> </SUP>with conditions that compromise respiratory function or handling<SUP> </SUP>of infected secretions Children aged 6 months to 18 years being<SUP> </SUP>treated with aspirin Women who are pregnant during the influenza<SUP> </SUP>"season" Children aged 6-59 months Adults aged 50-64 years Carers<SUP> </SUP>and household contacts (including children) of those in the<SUP> </SUP>above risk categories and of children aged 0-59 months Healthcare<SUP> </SUP>workers </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></CENTER> <SUP></SUP> The evidence I searched for relevant systematic reviews when updating and<SUP> </SUP>expanding the Clinical Evidence chapter on influenza (see bmj.com)—evidence<SUP> </SUP>was plentiful. The examples in table 2 show the strength of<SUP> </SUP>the evidence and the contradictions in relation to the stated<SUP> </SUP>aims of the vaccination campaign. Whenever possible, I chose<SUP> </SUP>evidence gathered in the optimal circumstances (for inactivated<SUP> </SUP>vaccines)—high viral circulation and a good match between<SUP> </SUP>the viral antigen and the vaccine.<SUP> </SUP> <!-- null --> <CENTER><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width="95%"><TBODY><TR bgColor=#e1e1e1><TD><TABLE cellSpacing=2 cellPadding=2><TBODY><TR bgColor=#e1e1e1><TD vAlign=top align=middle bgColor=#ffffff>View this table: <NOBR>[in this window] [in a new window] </NOBR> </TD><TD vAlign=top align=left>Table 2 Examples of evidence from systematic reviews comparing inactivated influenza vaccines with placebo or no intervention </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></CENTER> <SUP></SUP> Three problems are immediately apparent. The first is heavy<SUP> </SUP>reliance on non-randomised studies (chiefly cohort studies),<SUP> </SUP>especially in the elderly. This makes assessment of methodological<SUP> </SUP>quality an important part of data interpretation. For example,<SUP> </SUP>of 40 datasets assessing the effects of influenza vaccines in<SUP> </SUP>elderly people in institutions, only 26 reported data on viral<SUP> </SUP>types in circulation and only 21 gave information on vaccine<SUP> </SUP>content. Insufficient data were available in 11 of 17 retrospective<SUP> </SUP>studies of elderly people in institutions to allow reviewers<SUP> </SUP>to assess the authors' claim of "high" or "epidemic" viral circulation.<SUP>11<SUP> </SUP>14</SUP> A metaanalysis of inactivated vaccines in elderly people<SUP> </SUP>showed a gradient from no effect against influenza or influenza-like<SUP> </SUP>illness to a large effect (up to 60%) in preventing all-cause<SUP> </SUP>mortality. These findings are both counterintuitive and implausible,<SUP> </SUP>as other causes of death are far more prevalent in elderly people<SUP> </SUP>even in the winter months.<SUP>15 16</SUP> It is impossible for a vaccine<SUP> </SUP>that does not prevent influenza to prevent its complications,<SUP> </SUP>including admission to hospital.<SUP> </SUP> A more likely explanation for such a finding is selection bias,<SUP> </SUP>where one half of the study population (hemi-cohort) systematically<SUP> </SUP>differs from the other in one or more key characteristics.<SUP>14-16</SUP><SUP> </SUP>In this case, the vaccinated hemi-cohort may have been more<SUP> </SUP>mobile, healthy, and wealthy than the control hemi-cohort, thus<SUP> </SUP>explaining the differences in all-cause mortality.<SUP>11 14</SUP> The<SUP> </SUP>same effect is seen in stronger study designs (such as cluster<SUP> </SUP>randomised trials) that are badly executed, which introduces<SUP> </SUP>bias.<SUP>10</SUP> Its presence seems to be a marker of confounders that<SUP> </SUP>persist even after adjusting for known ones, and it makes accurate<SUP> </SUP>interpretation of the data difficult. Caution in interpretation<SUP> </SUP>should thus be the rule, not the exception. This problem (in<SUP> </SUP>the opposite direction—with frailer people more likely<SUP> </SUP>to be vaccinated) has been identified before but not heeded.<SUP>17</SUP><SUP> </SUP>The only way that all known and unknown confounders can be adequately<SUP> </SUP>controlled for is by randomisation.<SUP> </SUP> The influence of poor study quality is also seen in the outcome<SUP> </SUP>of a review of evidence supporting the vaccination of all children<SUP> </SUP>to minimise transmission to family contacts.<SUP>18</SUP> Five randomised<SUP> </SUP>studies and five non-randomised studies were reviewed, but although<SUP> </SUP>data were suggestive of protection, its extent was impossible<SUP> </SUP>to measure because of the weak methods used in the primary studies.<SUP>18</SUP><SUP> </SUP> The second problem is either the absence of evidence or the<SUP> </SUP>absence of convincing evidence on most of the effects at the<SUP> </SUP>centre of campaign objectives (table 2). In children under 2<SUP> </SUP>years inactivated vaccines had the same field efficacy as placebo,<SUP>8</SUP><SUP> </SUP>and in healthy people under 65 vaccination did not affect hospital<SUP> </SUP>stay, time off work, or death from influenza and its complications.<SUP>9</SUP><SUP> </SUP>Reviews found no evidence of an effect in patients with asthma<SUP> </SUP>or cystic fibrosis, but inactivated vaccines reduced the incidence<SUP> </SUP>of exacerbations after three to four weeks by 39% in those with<SUP> </SUP>chronic obstructive pulmonary disease.<SUP>12 13 19</SUP> All reviewers<SUP> </SUP>reported small data sets (such as 180 people with chronic obstructive<SUP> </SUP>pulmonary disease<SUP>13</SUP>), which may explain the lack of demonstrable<SUP> </SUP>effect.<SUP> </SUP> The third problem is the small and heterogeneous dataset on<SUP> </SUP>the safety of inactivated vaccines, which is surprising given<SUP> </SUP>their longstanding and widespread use. A Cochrane Database Systematic<SUP> </SUP>Review found only one old trial with data from 35 participants<SUP> </SUP>aged 12-28 months.<SUP>8</SUP> In the general population of elderly people,<SUP> </SUP>despite a dataset of several million observations, safety was<SUP> </SUP>only reported in five randomised controlled trials (2963 observations<SUP> </SUP>in total) on local and systemic adverse events seen within a<SUP> </SUP>week of giving parenteral inactivated vaccine.<SUP>11</SUP> Although there<SUP> </SUP>appears to be no evidence that annual revaccination is harmful,<SUP> </SUP>such a lack of knowledge is surprising.<SUP> </SUP> Gap between policy and evidence The large gap between policy and what the data tell us (when<SUP> </SUP>rigorously assembled and evaluated) is surprising. The reasons<SUP> </SUP>for this situation are not clear and may be complex. The starting<SUP> </SUP>point is the potential confusion between influenza and influenza-like<SUP> </SUP>illness, when any case of illness resembling influenza is seen<SUP> </SUP>as real influenza, especially during peak periods of activity.<SUP> </SUP>Some surveillance systems report cases of influenza-like illness<SUP> </SUP>as influenza without further explanation. This confusion leads<SUP> </SUP>to a gross overestimation of the impact of influenza, unrealistic<SUP> </SUP>expectations of the performance of vaccines, and spurious certainty<SUP> </SUP>of our ability to predict viral circulation and impact. The<SUP> </SUP>consequences are seen in the impractical advice given by public<SUP> </SUP>bodies on thresholds of the incidence of influenza-like illness<SUP> </SUP>at which influenza specific interventions (antivirals) should<SUP> </SUP>be used.<SUP>20</SUP><SUP> </SUP> The confusion between influenza and influenza-like illness is<SUP> </SUP>compounded by the lack of accurate and fast surveillance systems<SUP> </SUP>that can tell what viruses are circulating in a setting or community<SUP> </SUP>within a short time frame, and after the "season" is finished<SUP> </SUP>give an accurate picture of what went on to enable better forecasting<SUP> </SUP>of future trends.<SUP>21</SUP> Accurate surveillance must be based on a<SUP> </SUP>properly worked out sampling system for cases of influenza-like<SUP> </SUP>illness that meet set criteria, with accurate and quick feedback<SUP> </SUP>of a presumptive microbiological diagnosis. Without this, we<SUP> </SUP>cannot generalise from random sampling.<SUP> </SUP> Another reason may be "availability creep." In their efforts<SUP> </SUP>to deal with, or be seen to deal with, policy makers favour<SUP> </SUP>intervention with what is available—registered influenza<SUP> </SUP>vaccines. A similar philosophy is the "we have to make decisions<SUP> </SUP>and cannot wait to have perfect data" approach. This attitude<SUP> </SUP>may have an altruistic basis but has two important consequences.<SUP> </SUP>Firstly, it uses up resources that could be invested in a proper<SUP> </SUP>evaluation of influenza vaccines or on other health interventions<SUP> </SUP>of proven effectiveness. Secondly, the inception of a vaccination<SUP> </SUP>campaign seems to preclude the assessment of a vaccine through<SUP> </SUP>placebo controlled randomised trials on ethical grounds. Far<SUP> </SUP>from being unethical, however, such trials are desperately needed<SUP> </SUP>and we should invest in them without delay. A further consequence<SUP> </SUP>is reliance on non-randomised studies once the campaign is under<SUP> </SUP>way. It is debatable whether these can contribute to our understanding<SUP> </SUP>of the effectiveness of vaccines. Ultimately non-randomised<SUP> </SUP>designs cannot answer questions on the effects of influenza<SUP> </SUP>vaccines.<SUP> </SUP> <CENTER><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width="95%" border=1><TBODY><TR bgColor=#e1e1e1><TD><TABLE cellSpacing=2 cellPadding=2 width="100%"><TBODY><TR bgColor=#e1e1e1><TD vAlign=top align=left bgColor=#ffffff>Summary points Public policy worldwide recommends the use of<SUP> </SUP>inactivated influenza vaccines to prevent seasonal outbreaks Because<SUP> </SUP>viral circulation and antigenic match vary each year and non-randomised<SUP> </SUP>studies predominate, systematic reviews of large datasets from<SUP> </SUP>several decades provide the best information on vaccine performance Evidence<SUP> </SUP>from systematic reviews shows that inactivated vaccines have<SUP> </SUP>little or no effect on the effects measured Most studies are<SUP> </SUP>of poor methodological quality and the impact of confounders<SUP> </SUP>is high Little comparative evidence exists on the safety of<SUP> </SUP>these vaccines Reasons for the current gap between policy and<SUP> </SUP>evidence are unclear, but given the huge resources involved,<SUP> </SUP>a re-evaluation should be urgently undertaken </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></CENTER> <SUP></SUP> The optimistic and confident tone of some predictions of viral<SUP> </SUP>circulation and of the impact of inactivated vaccines, which<SUP> </SUP>are at odds with the evidence, is striking. The reasons are<SUP> </SUP>probably complex and may involve "a messy blend of truth conflicts<SUP> </SUP>and conflicts of interest making it difficult to separate factual<SUP> </SUP>disputes from value disputes"<SUP>22</SUP> or a manifestation of optimism<SUP> </SUP>bias (an unwarranted belief in the efficacy of interventions).<SUP>23</SUP><SUP> </SUP> Whatever the reasons, it is a sobering thought that Archie Cochrane's<SUP> </SUP>1972 statement that we should use what has been tested and found<SUP> </SUP>to reach its objectives is as revolutionary now as it was then.<SUP> </SUP> <HR align=left width="30%" noShade SIZE=1> <!-- null --><SUP></SUP>Details of the search<SUP> </SUP>strategy are on bmj.com<SUP> </SUP> <!-- null -->Contributor: TJ designed and wrote the paper and is the sole<SUP> </SUP>contributor and guarantor.<SUP> </SUP> <!-- null -->Competing interests: TJ owned shares in Glaxo SmithKline and<SUP> </SUP>received consultancy fees from Sanofi-Synthelabo (2002) and<SUP> </SUP>Roche (1997-9).<SUP> </SUP> References <!-- null --><LI value=1><SUP></SUP>Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. Prevention and control of influenza: recommendations of the Advisory Committee on Immunization Practices (ACIP). Morbid Mortal Wkly Rep 2006;55: 1-41.<!-- HIGHWIRE ID="333:7574:912:1" --><!-- /HIGHWIRE --><SUP> </SUP><!-- null --><LI value=2><SUP></SUP>American Academy of Pediatrics Committee on Infectious Diseases. Recommendations for influenza immunization of children. Pediatrics 2004;113: 1441-7.<!-- HIGHWIRE ID="333:7574:912:2" --><NOBR>[Abstract/Free Full Text]</NOBR><!-- /HIGHWIRE --><SUP> </SUP><!-- null --><LI value=3><SUP></SUP>Orr P. An advisory committee statement (ACS). National Advisory Committee on Immunization (NACI). Statement on influenza vaccination for the 2004-2005 season. Can Commun Dis Rep 2004;30: 1-32.<!-- HIGHWIRE ID="333:7574:912:3" -->[Medline]<!-- /HIGHWIRE --><SUP> </SUP><!-- null --><LI value=4><SUP></SUP>Van Essen GA, Palache AM, Forleo E, Fedson DS. 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Arch Intern Med 1999;159: 182-8.<!-- HIGHWIRE ID="333:7574:912:7" --><NOBR>[Abstract/Free Full Text]</NOBR><!-- /HIGHWIRE --><SUP> </SUP><!-- null --><LI value=8><SUP></SUP>Smith S, Demicheli V, Di Pietrantonj C, Harnden AR, Jefferson T, Matheson NJ, et al. Vaccines for preventing influenza in healthy children. Cochrane Database Syst Rev 2006;(1):CD004879.<!-- HIGHWIRE ID="333:7574:912:8" --><!-- /HIGHWIRE --><SUP> </SUP><!-- null --><LI value=9><SUP></SUP>Demicheli V, Rivetti D, Deeks JJ, Jefferson TO. Vaccines for preventing influenza in healthy adults. Cochrane Database Syst Rev 2004;(3):CD001269.<!-- HIGHWIRE ID="333:7574:912:9" --><!-- /HIGHWIRE --><SUP> </SUP><!-- null --><LI value=10><SUP></SUP>Thomas RE, Jefferson T, Demicheli V, Rivetti D. Influenza vaccination for healthcare workers who work with the elderly. 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Cochrane Database Syst Rev 2006;(1):CD002733.<!-- HIGHWIRE ID="333:7574:912:13" --><!-- /HIGHWIRE --><SUP> </SUP><!-- null --><LI value=14><SUP></SUP>Jefferson T, Rivetti D, Rivetti A, Rudin M, Di Pietrantonj C, Demicheli V. Efficacy and effectiveness of influenza vaccines in elderly people: a systematic review. Lancet 2005;366: 1165-74.<!-- HIGHWIRE ID="333:7574:912:14" -->[CrossRef][iSI][Medline]<!-- /HIGHWIRE --><SUP> </SUP><!-- null --><LI value=15><SUP></SUP>Simonsen L, Reichert TA, Viboud C, Blackwelder WC, Taylor RJ, Miller MA. Impact of influenza vaccination on seasonal mortality in the US elderly population. Arch Intern Med 2005;165: 265-72.<!-- HIGHWIRE ID="333:7574:912:15" --><NOBR>[Abstract/Free Full Text]</NOBR><!-- /HIGHWIRE --><SUP> </SUP><!-- null --><LI value=16><SUP></SUP>Simonsen L, Viboud C, Taylor R. Influenza vaccination in elderly people. Lancet 2005;366: 2086.<!-- HIGHWIRE ID="333:7574:912:16" -->[iSI][Medline]<!-- /HIGHWIRE --><SUP> </SUP><!-- null --><LI value=17><SUP></SUP>Hak E, Verheij TJ, Grobbee DE, Nichol KL, Hoes AW. Confounding by indication in non-experimental evaluation of vaccine effectiveness: the example of prevention of influenza complications. J Epidemiol Community Health 2002;56: 951-5.<!-- HIGHWIRE ID="333:7574:912:17" --><NOBR>[Abstract/Free Full Text]</NOBR><!-- /HIGHWIRE --><SUP> </SUP><!-- null --><LI value=18><SUP></SUP>Jordan R, Connock M, Albon E, Fry-Smith A, Olowokure B, Hawker J, et al. Universal vaccination of children against influenza: are there indirect benefits to the community? A systematic review of the evidence. Vaccine 2006;24: 1047-62.<!-- HIGHWIRE ID="333:7574:912:18" -->[CrossRef][iSI][Medline]<!-- /HIGHWIRE --><SUP> </SUP><!-- null --><LI value=19><SUP></SUP>Bhalla P, Tan A, Smyth R. Vaccines for preventing influenza in people with cystic fibrosis. Cochrane Database Syst Rev 2000;(1):CD001753.<!-- HIGHWIRE ID="333:7574:912:19" --><!-- /HIGHWIRE --><SUP> </SUP><!-- null --><LI value=20><SUP></SUP>Harling R, Hayward A, Watson JM. Implications of the incidence of influenza-like illness in nursing homes for influenza chemoprophylaxis: descriptive study [see comments]. BMJ 2004;329: 663-4.<!-- HIGHWIRE ID="333:7574:912:20" --><NOBR>[Free Full Text]</NOBR><!-- /HIGHWIRE --><SUP> </SUP><!-- null --><LI value=21><SUP></SUP>Carman WF, Wallace LA, Walker J. Rapid virological surveillance of community influenza infection in general practice. BMJ 2000;321: 736-7.<!-- HIGHWIRE ID="333:7574:912:21" --><NOBR>[Free Full Text]</NOBR><!-- /HIGHWIRE --><SUP> </SUP><!-- null --><LI value=22><SUP></SUP>MacCoun RJ. Biases in the interpretation and use of research results. Annu Rev Psychol 1998;49: 259-87.<!-- HIGHWIRE ID="333:7574:912:22" -->[CrossRef][iSI][Medline]<!-- /HIGHWIRE --><SUP> </SUP><!-- null --> <SUP></SUP>Chalmers I, Matthews R. What are the implications of optimism bias in clinical research? Lancet 2006;367: 449-50.<!-- HIGHWIRE ID="333:7574:912:23" -->[CrossRef][iSI][Medline]<!-- /HIGHWIRE --><SUP> </SUP> (Accepted 21 September 2006) <!-- null --> Related Articles <DL><DT>Of measles and flu <DD>Fiona Godlee BMJ 2006 333: 0. <NOBR>[Full Text] </NOBR> </DD></DL><DL><DT>Implications of the incidence of influenza-like illness in nursing homes for influenza chemoprophylaxis: descriptive study <DD>Richard Harling, Andrew Hayward, and John M Watson BMJ 2004 329: 663-664. <NOBR>[Full Text] </NOBR> </DD></DL><DL><DT>Rapid virological surveillance of community influenza infection in general practice <DD>William F Carman, Lesley A Wallace, Jacqueline Walker, Sheena McIntyre, Ahilya Noone, Peter Christie, James Millar, and James D Douglas BMJ 2000 321: 736-737. <NOBR>[Full Text] </NOBR> </DD></DL> <!-- eletters -->Rapid Responses: Read all Rapid Responses <DL><DT>Emperor's clothes exposed <DD>Nick Hardwick <DD>bmj.com, 28 Oct 2006 [Full text] <DT>Vested interests will always trump evidence <DD>GH Hall <DD>bmj.com, 28 Oct 2006 [Full text] <DT>Policy versus evidence: policy in the lead <DD>Peter Doshi <DD>bmj.com, 29 Oct 2006 [Full text] <DT>Influenza vaccination: what evidence can we rely on? <DD>Stuart J cornell <DD>bmj.com, 29 Oct 2006 [Full text] </DD></DL><!-- null -->

While reading this the global elite of global industrialism are in very great worry about their industries pumping daily 500 billions tons of carbon into the atmosphere - and this since 150 years. So far their intelligence makes it to figure that by increasing global taxation the problem can be solved. Using Russia's President Wladimir Putin's vocabulary to comment on such criminal exploiters: "Should we catch them in a shithouse, we'll kill them in a shithouse!" Examination of sun-rays resulted that important constituent parts of sun-rays are being blocked to enter the earth's surface by present extreme polution of the atmosphere - constituent parts of sun-rays which are important for our vegetation - although the level of lightness is still normal. <TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width=629 border=0><TBODY><TR><TD colSpan=3>Report's stark warning on climate </TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top width=416><!-- S BO --><!-- S IBYL --><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width=416 border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=bottom>Analysis By Robert Peston Business Editor, BBC News </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE> <!-- E IBYL --> <!-- S IIMA --><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width=203 align=right border=0><TBODY><TR><TD> Power firms have to cut emissions by 60-70%, the report says </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><!-- E IIMA -->The Stern Review says that climate change represents the greatest and widest-ranging market failure ever seen. And on the basis of this intellectually rigorous and thorough report, it is hard to disagree. Sir Nicholas Stern, a distinguished development economist and former chief economist at the World Bank, is not a man given to hyperbole. Yet he says "our actions over the coming few decades could create risks of major disruption to economic and social activity, later in this century and in the next, on a scale similar to those associated with the great wars and the economic depression of the first half of the 20th century". His report gives prescriptions for how to minimise this economic and social disruption. His central argument is that spending large sums of money now on measures to reduce carbon emissions will bring dividends on a colossal scale. It would be wholly irrational, therefore, not to spend this money. However, he warns that we are too late to prevent any deleterious consequences from climate change. The prospects are worst for Africa and developing countries, so the richer nations must provide them with financial and technological help to prepare and adapt. Tough decisions He believes it is practical to aim for a stabilisation of greenhouse gas levels in the atmosphere of 500 to 550 parts per million of carbon dioxide equivalent by 2050 - which is double pre-industrial levels and compares with 430ppm today. But even stabilising at that level will probably mean significant climate change. <!-- S IBOX --><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width=208 align=right border=0><TBODY><TR><TD width=5></TD><TD class=sibtbg>For 150 years, we've pumped carbon into the atmosphere - whether through energy or transport - as if it had no price David Milliband, Environment Secretary <!-- S ILIN -->'High cost' of climate change <!-- E ILIN --> </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><!-- E IBOX --> Even to stabilise at that level, emissions per unit of gross domestic product (GDP) would need to be cut by an average of three quarters by 2050 - a frightening statistic. As well as decarbonising the power sector by 60%-70% there will also have to be an end to deforestation - emissions from deforestation are estimated at more than 18% of global emissions, more than transport. And there will have to be deep cuts in emissions from transport. The costs of these changes should be around 1% of global GDP by 2050 - in other words the world would be 1% poorer than we would otherwise have been, which would be significant but far from prohibitive. To be clear, this does not mean we would be 1% poorer than we are today, but that global growth will be slower. The way to look at this 1% is as an investment. Because the costs of not taking this action are mind-bogglingly large. Rising estimates Sir Nicholas Stern's start point is economic modelling carried out in other studies showing that a scenario of 2-3 degrees of warming would lead to a permanent loss of up to 3% in global world output, compared to what would have happened without climate change. But he says those estimates are too low. <!-- S IIMA --><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width=203 align=right border=0><TBODY><TR><TD>Sir Nicholas warns the world will face more floods and droughts </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><!-- E IIMA --> He believes 5-6 degrees of warming is a "real possibility" for the next century. Having fed the probabilities of the various different degrees of global warming into his economic model, he estimates that "business as usual" would lead to a permanent reduction in global per-capita consumption of at least 5%. But, that estimate does not include the financial cost of the direct impact on human health and the environment from global warming, or the disproportionate costs on poor regions of the world. It also ignores so-called "feedback mechanisms", which may mean that as the stock of greenhouse gases increases there is a disproportionate rise in warming with each new increment in emissions. Unfair burden Putting all these factors together, he comes up with the stark conclusion that if we do nothing to stem climate change, there could be a permanent reduction in consumption per head of 20%. In other words, everyone in the world would be a fifth poorer than they would otherwise have been. Even worse, these costs will not be shared evenly. There will be a disproportionate burden on the poorest countries. So here's the winning formula: Stern says spend 1% of world GDP to be 20% richer than we will otherwise be. It looks like a no-brainer. There is another way of presenting this analysis of benefits versus costs. Stern says that if you take the present value (the value in today's money) of the benefits over the coming years of taking action to stabilise greenhouse gases by 2050, then deduct the costs, you end up with a "profit" of $2.5 trillion (£1.32 trillion). Any way you look at it, the financial case for tackling climate change looks watertight. Hurdles That said, there are great impediments to harvesting this dividend. One is the obvious problem, which is that it requires collective, coordinated action by most of the world's governments - and securing the requisite consensus on the way forward will not be simple. <!-- S IBOX --><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width=208 align=right border=0><TBODY><TR><TD width=5></TD><TD class=sibtbg>We should prepare for a whole series of shocks from the effects of climate change that are already unavoidable Robert Peston, BBC Business Editor </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><!-- E IBOX --> In the interests of fairness, Stern argues that the richer countries should take responsibility for between 60% and 80% of reductions in emissions from 1990 levels by 2050. But assuming that consensus is reached, what is the best way to correct the grotesque market failure that is currently taking us on a path to poverty? How do we start to pay a price for carbon that reflects its true economic and social costs, or a price that includes the present value of future climate change? There are two main ways of achieving this. One is through taxation. The other is through rationing the amount of carbon emissions that any business - or any individual - can make, and then creating a proper global market. Such a move would allow any business or institution that wants to emit more than its entitlement to buy that right, and any business that emits less than its entitlement to sell the unused portion of its entitlement - effectively carbon trading. Another imperative for governments is to encourage research and development on low-carbon technologies. Governments must also encourage "behavioural change", through regulation - such as imposing tighter standards on the energy efficiency of buildings - as well as educating the public about the true costs of wasting energy. Trouble ahead That said, we should prepare for a whole series of shocks from the effects of climate change that are already unavoidable. <!-- S IIMA --><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width=203 align=right border=0><TBODY><TR><TD> Poor countries are expected to be hit hardest by global warming </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><!-- E IIMA --> There will probably be both more droughts and more floods. An increased incidence of devastating storms is expected. And there is an increased risk of famine in the poorest countries. So we must start to get better at monitoring of climate conditions - and adapt ourselves for the new world. That means reinforcing buildings and infrastructure to make them sturdier in the face of extreme weather conditions, investment in new dykes, and support for financial markets so that it is possible to purchase insurance against climate-related disaster. It will all be very expensive, disproportionately so for developing countries. So Stern argues, and it's hard to disagree, that there is a strong moral obligation on the richer countries to help the poorest ones protect themselves against the very worst that may transpire. <!-- E BO --> </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

Still someone who hasn't understood the rule - even if Israel is wrong - they are right! Paradox? Think twice, you might find the answer, Kula!

Serving mother cow an excerpt from Go Seva Camatkara In our village my forefathers were always rich and my father also had a good life. He used to spend four to five hours in the service of the Lord and rest of the day in his seed selling business and in farming. He liked his work a lot. He had a lot of land and had an improved way of farming. He had a good influence on thevillagers and they were very happy with him. After my father passed away, the responsibility for the business and the farming fell on my shoulders. Unfortunately we began to lose our property and in a short time I had lost half of the property. The farming work stopped and the seed business dropped off. Eventually all income was stopped. The farm produced fewer grains and most of the land turned barren.In just a short time everything was destroyed. I began to worry day and night. Any work I had started ended in loss. It was as if my fortune had left me. I have two younger brothers and by their choice we divided the property into three parts. Four years passed and my condition worsened. I accumulated more debts and the villagers began to call me lazy. The situation became so bad that I had to beg grains from others. But I didn ’t lose patience as I had faith in Lord. One day I was laying on my bed worrying I fell asleep.In a dream I saw my cows and bulls chasing me saying, “You never care for us.You only care for your own eating and sleeping. You never come to the goshalla and check our condition. Have you checked if we are lying in dung and urine or in a clean place? You suffer for your sinful neglect.You can still wake up and change your attitude,otherwise eventually you will be ruined.” Hearing the cows and bulls chastise me, I suddenly awoke and felt guilt. I knew it was only a dream but I immediately picked up the lantern and went to the goshalla. There I saw all the cows tied to stakes and obviously very hungry. They didn ’t even have straw to eat and there were piles of garbage around the goshalla. I began to repent. I started cleaning the goshalla and kept on cleaning until ten o ’clock in the morning. Since that day,I milk the cows in the morning and evening and made sure they had good water and fresh grass. When the bulls and the cows went to graze, I cleaned the goshalla with my own hands.I threw away the garbage and piled up the dung, which soon turned into good compost.They began to live happily and became healthy and strong. Now there was plenty of milk and ghee and due to the improved health of the bulls, my farming increased and I began to produce five to six times more grain than before. My interest in farming increased and my distress disappeared.Most of my debts were paid off and my situation changed dramatically. Those who used to call me lazy now began to praise me. This is a true story. In my greediness I lost almost all my properties,but by the mercy of the supreme Lord and by the blessing of go-mata, I began to care for the cows with my own hands and my condition turned around. If any farmer who has cows has become a poor soul, then he should follow my path. I can guarantee that with faith in God and by serving mother cow, the worst of the worst condition will turn into a good condition. Amara Ujala Miraculous Cow Cures Disease Nom Pengh, Cambodia Nowadays huge crowds are flooding the village of Fung Trapiyang Chum in Cambodia to see and touch a miraculous cow which is said to have the power to uproot all dreadful diseases by its touch. Puch Peech, the farmer who owns the cow, claims that while his wife Cong Meech was suffering from an incurable disease,the cow attempted to lick her her hands and feet but he interferred and pulled her back.But the cow persisted and when she succeeded in licking the farmer ’s wife, she experienced a miraculous recovery and has since been living a normal life. Puch Peech said in wonder,“How could I have known that the cow ’s divine impulse would heal my wife?“ After the news hit the front page of the newspapers people from many different regions of Cambodia began to visit the village.Puch Peech declares that at least five hundred people arrive daily to see the cow and that within the last fifteen days perhaps ten thousand people have touched her. Even very heavy rains have not discouraged people from traveling to see the cow. Puch Peech now charges the visitors five hundred reals (about seventeen cents)which they happily give to touch the cow. He has become a rich man. Ross Sath, 68, said that he had been suffering from weakness but since the day he touched the cow,he has recovered his strength.“It was difficult for me to walk even two meters ” he said, “but now I can walk three or four hundred meters without stress,difficulty or exhaustion ”. To test the cow further, Puch Peech and his wife took her to visit a blind woman.They claim that after the cow licked her, the woman regained her vision. So thousands of people are crowding Fung Trapiyang Chum to visit the cow who can uproot all disease. Visitors feed all kinds of delicacies to this holy cow and have named her Priyaha,which is a name of God.

It is of course as such that we want to understand everything with our brain - after all why do we have such a phenomenous HDD with some 5 millions GB storage capacity? Well, as quoted above - actual knowledge is revealed and becomes an irrevocable fact, quote below. However, this probably only works perfectly when we are linked with a pure devotee of Lord. Any suggestions?

Thanks for your deep concern on this issue, but couldnt this also be said about any topic on this forum - go to Israel, go to Iskcon LA, go to Putin, go to JPS, go to Bush, etc., etc.? There is a growing sense of unease about the effectiveness of ISKCON's current preaching paradigms all over the world. The rising number of ads calling for pujaris, cooks, and preachers to reinforce existing ISKCON temples is a visible indicator that ISKCON's preaching performance has slowed down drastically and is in bad shape. I see SP's movement getting farther and farther away from what he wanted it to be. You just have to read whats going on to see that it's true! Whats happening now in the land of religion - India, is surelly not solved by material adjustment but by uplifting societies with the yuga-dharma, at least this has to be understood. ISKCON should stop its disuniting, splitting up in many fractions policy and see what happens when devotees stop to preach and instead try to gratify their own interests. Is this not a topic for a Vaishnava forum?

We surely would like to write and post only "nice" and "beautiful" news, however in this progressing aga of kali-yuga we also have to point out how society is being cheated by scrupelous government and next, what can be done to uplift society. Keeping silent means accepting - we're becoming involved in complicity.

Last night there was a quite shocking documentary on TV about Indian women who "want to spare their daughters from their own fate in live". Additionally many families cant pay for a dowry which is almost a law, especially, when they have more than one daughter. Out of despair they decide for terrible abortion - with the result that by now 10 million girls are missing and 10 million men cant have a family living. In some parts of India, one in every five girls is being eliminated at the fetal and of course how could it be otherwise, USA supplies all the "advanced" technologies like ultrasonic etc. in every small town, "the business to be worth $100 million to $200 million a year in India". (Wallstreet Journal) Another important pressure for this negative development is of course the fact that those who own and control the rupee currency also control the economic well being of India and this is not the Indian government but a handful globalization tycoons in NY who decide about the value of the rupee and the quality of live of India's middle class and lower middle class. Playing football with India's currency so to speak. Since India's government is nothing but a paid shadow cabinet of NY's super rich elite till today no doctors who perform abortions are being punished although in India abortion is illegal. In northern India we find regions with villages where only men live - and the Indian government seems to have an answer for this too: Bollywood. This world's biggest film industry supported by Hollywood is providing for these millions of unwanted single men pornographic content via satelite. Genocide of India's daughters Last updated at 08:49am on 14th October 2006 What will become of this nation of ever fewer women? Girl Shortage Causes Wife Buying In India Ten million female foetuses have been illegally aborted in India by mothers desperate to bear a son. What will become of this nation of ever fewer women? ANNE SEBBA investigates: May you be the mother of a hundred sons - this is the Sanskrit blessing given to a Hindu woman in India on her wedding day. And the minute she falls pregnant, there is the traditional chanting of mantras by the other women of the family, calling for the foetus, if female, to be transformed into a male. Increasingly, such age-old beliefs are becoming a curse in India, as, in this deeply patriarchal society, women have become obsessed with giving birth only to sons. ‘Asking me why I need a son, instead of a daughter, is like asking me why I have two eyes and not one,’ says one woman in the northern district of Haryana, who has just had an abortion after discovering that the baby she was carrying was female. This woman is by no means alone in taking such shocking and drastic measures to avoid giving birth to a girl. In fact, such is the widespread determination to produce only sons that, since ultrasound scans became widely available in the Eighties, the number of abortions carried out on female foetuses in India has risen at a terrifying pace. Even by the most conservative estimates, sex-selective abortion in India now accounts for the termination of some ten million female foetuses over the past 20 years. That means that each year a staggering half a million girls have been prevented from being born. ‘This is the world’s biggest genocide ever,’ says Chetan Sharma, founder of the Delhi-based organisation Datamation, which campaigns against female foeticide. According to India’s 2001 census, the number of nought to six-year-old girls per 1,000 boys was 927, a dramatic dip from 962 in 1981. ‘The future is frightening. Over the next five years we could see more than a million foetuses eliminated every year,’ says Dr Sabu George, who has charted the problem. ‘At this pace we’ll soon have no girls born in the country. We don’t know where it will stop.’ The female shortfall is not a new problem in India. Even during the days of the Raj, and the first census in 1881, the British made efforts to eradicate female infanticide. But the problem of female foeticide is a new phenomenon fuelled by advances in technology and the widespread liberal attitudes to abortion. In 1971 India was one of the first countries to legalise abortion, partly intended as a means of population control. ‘Today, anyone can walk into a government hospital and ask for an immediate abortion up to the 20th week of pregnancy, free, merely by saying there has been a failure of contraception,’ explains Kalpana Sharma, whose columns in The Hindu newspaper regularly rail against the dangers of undervaluing women. Women cannot admit that they knew the sex of their baby in advance of having an abortion because that is illegal in India. According to a law passed by the Indian government in 1994, hospitals, clinics and laboratories are not allowed to use prenatal diagnostic techniques — including ultrasound scans like those pregnant women in the UK routinely undergo at 12 and 20 weeks — for the purpose of determining the sex of the foetus. However, this law has been widely ignored — because local officials are reluctant to fight the will of the people. Women know that if they produce only daughters, they will be pitied by everyone around them — or, worse, abused. In many cases, it is even considered a betrayal of the family. ‘I want a son as we have a big business,’ says another woman who has undergone nine abortions of female foetuses. ‘I want what my husband has built from scratch to go to his own blood.’ But it is not just that in Indian families it is the son who will carry on the family name or business and take care of elderly parents. Daughters are an enormous financial burden because when they marry, a dowry must be found. Although it is illegal both to give and receive a dowry, the practice continues and the demands made by the groom’s family are increasingly nothing short of extortion, according to Kalpana Sharma. These days, they often include jewellery, clothes, furniture, white goods, cars and even a new home. Lavish weddings in exotic locations and with mammoth feasts are also expected, and the groom’s family often makes last-minute demands. ‘Raising a female child is like watering your neighbour’s plant,’ says one woman in Gujarat. For the boy’s family, it is gain, gain, gain. But for the girl’s parents, financing the dowry and wedding often involves selling off land and spiralling into debt that becomes impossible to pay off. Lifestyle choice Female foeticide isn’t common only among poor families. Aborting a female foetus is increasingly becoming a lifestyle choice among wealthy women. The states with the lowest ratios of girls to boys — 820 females to every 1,000 males — are also the most prosperous, like Punjab, Gujarat and Haryana. It is not simply that affluent women believe they will have a better standard of living if they have only sons. It means, too, that there is more money to spend on sport, leisure and consumer goods, as well as more time to pursue a career. There is also the issue of land inheritance. Daughters are now legally entitled to an equal share of land when their parents die and many families do not want to see their legacy divided up. The division of land has become a major factor in recent years because although sex-selective abortions are still largely an urban phenomenon, the easy availability of mobile scanning machines means doctors are now doing brisk business in rural areas. Getting a licence for the equipment is easy and many so-called ‘doctors’ offer women the service without being qualified or registered. There are 25,770 officially registered pre-natal units in India, but one doctor estimates there are as many as 70,000 ultrasound machines operating in the country. Nobody reports the unqualified technicians because it is not in their interest to do so. Even the qualified doctors in registered clinics have ways of circumventing the law against using ultrasound tests to determine the sex of the foetus. If the ultrasound test shows a male foetus in the womb the doctor simply tells the nurse: ‘I think this calls for sweets,’ a well-known code to mean ‘Good news, it’s a boy’. No paperwork is filled in, so there is no evidence of illegal practices. Anyone found guilty of organising an illegal abortion theoretically faces a prison sentence of between three and five years and a fine of 10,000 rupees (£118). But only two men have been convicted since the law was introduced 12 years ago. So why do such highly-trained doctors show such a disregard for the ethics of sex selection? Some doctors insist they are performing a valuable service by preventing divorces. Others claim that the doctors’ union has been over-zealous in protecting its own, and that the doctors and lawyers have formed a powerful nexus in the fight against official clampdowns — to their mutual financial benefit. Lucractive practice The practice is hugely lucrative for doctors. Private doctors charge a minimum of 5,000 rupees (£60) for an abortion and often much more, depending on how far into the pregnancy the woman is. Dr Puneet Bedi, a specialist in fetal medicine, says: ‘Everybody knows that this technological wonder [ultrasound] is being used at random, to diagnose and kill girls. Foeticide is performed by trained professionals with licences and registration numbers; it is a multi-billion rupee industry.’ Many social workers in India believe it is unfair to accuse women of being complicit in this genocide, a denial of the girl’s fundamental human right of being allowed to be born. A few believe they are acting out of kindness: ‘Why bring a girl into the world who will be subjected to a dreadful life of misery?’ one told me. There are many stories, even in relatively prosperous families, of young girls being undernourished while boys are well-fed, or girls being treated as maids while the sons lead a life of leisure. But more often than not, an abortion to terminate the development of a female foetus is an action forced on a woman by the twin pressures of a powerful mother-in-law and husband. A key reason for the woman’s compliance is the fear that they may be replaced by a younger, more fertile woman who will produce sons if they do not submit. Alarmingly, this fear has spread to Indian women in the UK who face the same patriarchal attitudes. An increasing number are travelling to India for an abortion, as far fewer questions are asked there than in Britain. ‘There is definitely an increase in abuse faced by Asian women in the UK who are mothers of girls,’ said Jasvinder Sanghera, who runs an advice centre in Derby. ‘We see women who are beaten or abused by their husband and especially their mother-in-law for producing daughters. They are not considered worthy or dutiful daughters-in-law.’ Tragically, there are already disturbing consequences of the falling ratio of females to males in India. In Gujarat, and some villages in Punjab, there are so few higher caste women that tribal women are being imported to service whole families of men — father, sons and brothers. The demand for sexual services is such that in some areas middlemen have started supplying girls for between 500 rupees (£6) and 60,000 rupees (£711) a month. The money goes to the husband or father who hires her out. Long-term worries are not simply the fear that such an imbalance will result in the rise of prostitution and sex trafficking. The danger to women’s emotional and physical health from repeated abortions is huge. Sex-selective abortions are often performed later in the pregnancy and are therefore more dangerous. Only 20 per cent of all abortions conform to the provisions of Indian law and those performed outside hospital often result in complications that lead to the deaths of thousands of woman. So how can this demographic catastrophe be averted? The Indian government is taking steps to impose regulations on the registered ultrasound clinics throughout the country, but Chetan Sharma, of Datamation, says that local officials are guilty of corruption and will simply continue to turn a blind eye. Feminists believe that until Indian society begins to value women, no amount of laws will help. ‘Until women take control of their own lives and refuse to give in to pressure, nothing will change,’ says Rasil Basu, who has made a film about the crisis called Vanishing Daughters. ‘Empowerment of women is the only answer.’ Kalpana Sharma, of The Hindu newspaper, believes the beginnings of change have been prompted by recent revelations that girls are consistently doing better than their male counterparts at school and college and are beginning to branch into traditionally male fields like engineering and medicine. ‘I know women who have been persuaded to have multiple abortions and who feel absolutely rotten, but they have no choice — either abortion or divorce,’ says Sharma. ‘But I sense things are changing with a younger generation of very well-educated women who are not prepared to put up with this. Women are starting to find their courage, even if it means leaving their marriage.’

Going for the root of this deviating development is of course those who provide knowledge - the brahmins. A goshala is the result of steps that have to be taken - one by one. You cant just open a goshala in the middle of a kali-yuga society without having fullfilled basic requirements first. Devotees join a temple and become fully trained as Vaishnavas, then they get married and leave the temple to start a household. Presently these fully trained up devotees are then left to their own resources, they live "outside". This is maya, rascaldom! This doesnt create a varnashram commune which supports the temple but the very opposite - grhastha couples struggle to maintain themselves, become useless for the temple, even dont associate with the temple anymore, easy divorce, saintly children victimized etc., and the temple brahmin-preachers are send out to collect for the temple expenditure/electricity/water. This is the most foolish thing ever, which never creates a strong varnashram commune - and only a varnashram commune is able to organize a goshala. In other words a real TP can only allow devotees to get married and live outside when the TP has setup temple owned workstations where those grhasthas can work in a temple owned business, always in association of other devotees. This is a genuine, bona fide TP and not a pseudo who sends fully trained devotee grhasthas (brahmin-initiated) to work in karmi jobs. If this is the law than there will be gradually a growing varnashram commune and only then a goshala can be maintained properly by a varnashrama commune with lets say 50-100 devotees without selling the bulls do get extra cash for surviving. Stop ISKCON's present kali-yuga mentality!

New ideas on origin of man Tuesday October 24 2006 00:00 IST <SMALL>COIMBATORE: Author and scientist Dr Michael A Cremo would be in the Textile City between November 4 and 7, as part of his tour in India to promote his ‘ground breaking ideas’ on alternative world view of origin of man and Darwin’s theory of evolution. During his sojourn here, Michael would be promoting his new book Human Devolution, besides making himself available for open discussions at the premises of the International Society for Krishna Consciousness (ISKCON) and other different colleges and institutions in the city. In Forbidden Archaeology(co-author Richard L Thompson), Michael had documented the evidence for extreme human antiquity. He claimed that in the past 150 years, archaeologists had found abundant evidence, showing that human beings did exist for hundreds of millions of years. This evidence, radically contradicted the picture of human origins that was presented to us by Darwin’s modern followers, who maintained that human beings evolved recently within the past 100,000 years or so, from some ape-like ancestors. </SMALL> <SMALL></SMALL> <SMALL> </SMALL> <SMALL></SMALL> <SMALL>Michael had also stated that the Vedas had lent a strong support to his case. Interestingly, the ancient Sanskrit writings profounded that humans had been present on earth for two billion years. In Human Devolution, he suggested that we had not evolved upward from the apes on this planet, as modern science made it, but devolved from an original spiritual position in higher levels of reality. An ISKCON release stated that when Michael was 27, he became a disciple of ISKCON’s founder Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada. He lives in Los Angeles and writes for Bhaktivedanta Book Trust (BBT), as part of the staff of ISKCON.</SMALL>

He means divorce, there're too many broken marriages in ISKCON, yes, it's sad, especially for the children. However, when Narayana Maharaja told how he joined GM, he said, "I left in the middle of the night, never to return, although my kids were only 2 and 3 years old."

A guy gets a flat tire in front of a mental hospital. As he's putting on the spare, the four nuts for securing the tire to the car accidentally fall down a storm grate. He's distraught because he doesn't know what to do. A mental patient watching the whole episode from behind a fence says: "Why don't you just take one nut off each of the other three tires and put the spare on with those? That should hold you until you get to a service station." The man is amazed. What a great idea! Then he says, "But you're a mental patient. How'd you think of something so clever?" The patient says, "I'm just crazy, not stupid."

Ozone Hole Biggest Yet Scientists worry about DNA damage to those in southern hemisphere By Phil Berardelli ScienceNOW Daily News 20 October 2006 The hole in Earth's ozone layer has grown to its biggest dimensions yet, according to scientists at NASA and the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration (NOAA). The gap--observed last month over Antarctica--was nearly three times the size of the continental United States and about 1% larger than the previous record. Widening gap? This satellite image, taken 24 September, shows the record-breaking Antarctic ozone hole. The blue and purple colors denote areas with the least ozone, while the greens and yellows indicate higher concentrations of the gas. Credit: NASA The ozone hole has appeared every Antarctic winter since scientists began taking measurements in 1985. It signals the continued action of ozone-destroying compounds, such as chlorofluorocarbons (CFCs), in the atmosphere, which are magnified by the effect of colder winter temperatures on the fragile gas. Because ozone blocks DNA-damaging rays from the sun, scientists are concerned that a weakening of this protective layer could lead to a higher incidence of cancer and infertility among people living in the southern hemisphere. In 1987, an international agreement known as the Montreal Protocol banned the release of CFCs (once common in refrigerators and air conditioners) into the atmosphere; however, their effect can persist for decades. At the current rate of recovery, scientists estimate it could take another 60 years for the planet's ozone layer to mend completely. The record-setting ozone hole was observed from 21 September to 30 September by NASA's polar-orbiting Aura satellite, as well as from instrument-laden balloons launched by polar research stations. Scientists calculated the gap at 27.4 million square kilometers, says Paul Newman, an atmospheric scientist at NASA's Goddard Space Flight Center in Greenbelt, Maryland, which manages Aura. The biggest previous gap was 27.1 million square kilometers, he says, seen in 2003. In addition, the readings showed nearly all of the ozone had been destroyed between eight and 13 miles above Earth's surface. "These numbers mean the ozone is virtually gone in this layer of the atmosphere," says David Hofmann, director of the Global Monitoring Division at NOAA's Earth System Research Laboratory in Boulder, Colorado. "It appears that the 2006 ozone hole will go down as a record-setter." A record-setter perhaps, but not necessarily meaningful, says atmospheric scientist Michael Newchurch at the University of Alabama, Huntsville. He notes that colder-than-normal temperatures over Antarctica this year accounted for the expansion--a trend that's not guaranteed to continue. On the other hand, Newchurch says, atmospheric levels of carbon dioxide are increasing, which could lead to a cooler stratosphere. So "we may not have seen the biggest ozone hole, but soon the effect of declining [CFCs] will overcome the cooling temperatures, and the size of the hole will diminish," he says.

"Today, we are learning the language in which God created life," US President Bill Clinton said on 26 June 2000. "The initial sequencing of the human genome is historically been completed." Today, 2006 science says, "Clinton's hurry ahead was childish - about 98.5% of the human genome which has been designated as "junk DNA", including most sequences within introns and most intergenic DNA - contains many hidden treasures. But we are still far from fully understanding the language of DNA." The existence of large amounts of this so called "junk DNA" (up to 98.5% in humans) in the genomes of eukaryotes has been used as an argument against intelligent design and the role of a Creator and as an argument for the random process of evolution. In sum, the scientist know very little - what they considered as "having discovered the language how God created life" was just 1.5% of the human DNA - but still they proclaim in schoolbooks, consciousness/identity is generated by the brain cells and originally everything developed by chance from dead chemicals - by automatic evolution. ................................................................................................ Srila Prabhupada. [casting Dr. Singh in the role of a materialistic scientist]. All right, scientist, why is life not coming from matter right now? You rascal. Why isn't life coming from matter today? Actually such scientists are rascals. They childishly say that life came from matter, although they are not at all able to prove it. Our Krsna consciousness movement should expose all these rascals. They are only bluffing. Why don't they create life immediately? In the past, they say, life arose from matter; and they say that this will happen again in the future. They even say that they will create life from matter. What kind of theory is this? They have already commented that life began from matter. This refers to the past--"began." Then why do they now speak of the future? Is it not contradictory? They are expecting the past to occur in the future. This is childish nonsense. Karandhara. They say that life arose from matter in the past and that they will create life this way in the future. Srila Prabhupada. What is this nonsense? If they cannot prove that life arises from matter in the present, how do they know life arose this way in the past? Dr. Singh. They are assuming... Srila Prabhupada. Everyone can assume, but this is not science. Everyone can assume something. You can assume something, I can assume something. But there must be proof. We can prove that life arises from life. For example, a father begets a child. The father is living, and the child is living. But where is their proof that a father can be a dead stone? Where is their proof? We can easily prove that life begins from life. And the original life is Krsna. That also can be proven. But what evidence exists that a child is born of stone? They cannot actually prove that life comes from matter. They are leaving that aside for the future.

July 1, 1991, was the day India went bankrupt. The RBI had to pull an embarrassing move that saved the entire country from certain doom and gloom. Then-Finance Minister Manmohan Singh pulled the trigger and shipped about $800 billion worth of gold to the Bank of England and obtained additionally a $400 billion loan to correct its balance of payments and finance its debts. In sum - no more gold in India - it sits right in the City of London, UK.

A peace bridge across NH 150! </B> Akoijam Sunita IMPHAL, Oct 19: Even though the SPF government has been missing datelines on the BT Road flyover time and again, the devotees and disciples of the late Swami Damodar of ISKCON are planning to build a Peace Bridge across NH 150, connecting the two complexes of ISKCON, by November 2007. "This was one of the last wishes of his holiness Bhakti Svarupa Damodara Swami Sripada. He personally told me about this on 1st October. He wanted to build this Peace Bridge in memory of the 6 innocent people who lost their lives on 16th August, on the Janmasthami day, due to the bomb blast," said Radhamohan Das, secretary URI (United Religion Initiative). It may be recalled that the religious leader died on 2nd October at Bhajankutir, Kolkata and was rested in samadhi at Radhakunda on 4th October. Recounting the personal grief Swami Damodar went through after the ISKCON bomb blast that left many injured and 6 dead, including a nine years old and an eleven years old, Radhamohan said, "Our Swami did not die of the bomb splinter but from shock. The shock of losing 6 innocent lives so abruptly and unreasonably was responsible for his disappearance from this world." Saying that the Swami wanted to build a Peace Bridge connecting the eastern and western complexes of ISKCON, across the NH 150, in memory of those 6 lives, Radhamohan said his disciples and devotees are seriously planning to carry out "what our Guruji desired". He said that the bridge will be in the form of a flyover. Earlier the state government during the chief ministership of W Nupamacha had plan of building a flyover at the same place but it never materialized said Radhamohan. "We have sought government help and we will request through the concerned department of the Manipur government to the central government to permit the smooth construction of the Peace Bridge. We will try to finish and inaugurate by November 2007," said Radhamohan to this writer. Stating that Swami Damodar, who was trained as a scientist and also known as Dr TD Singh, wanted to have a scientific and spiritual quest essay competition and students` conference on the need for a balanced growth of scientific temper and spiritual wisdom, Radhamohan said this wish of the Swami will be carried out soon at Puri and interested students and persons can submit their application at ISKCON before November 1.