Dayal_Govinda

This is from www.nostradamous-repository.org Update Sept 13, 2001 It is hard to understand why some people are using such a tragic event to spread more fear using the name of Nostradamus but unfortunately that is the case. By the way, Nostradamus died in 1566 so anything with "Nostradamus 1654" should give you a clue. So, for your information, the following variations are also hoaxes attributed to Nostradamus: The one starting with "New century and 9 months", The one starting with "9 months and eleven days" or "On eleventh day of 9th month", The one which mentions "two steel birds", The one which mixes 2 completely unrelated quatrains of Nostradamus "From the sky will come a great King of Terror...The sky will burn at forty-five degrees" in order to fit the event. Also, don't forget that NY is not at 45 degrees but a little south of 41 degrees. More will be added as encountered... As for "City of God", see below: The following quatrain has been circulating the Internet after the WTC bombings. In the City of God there will be a great thunder, two brothers torn apart by chaos, while the fortress endures, the great leader will sucumb. The third big war will begin when the big city is burning. It is NOT by Nostradamus. This is a HOAX. (The link to a possible source of this hoax has been removed as that page is no longer accessible.)

This is from www.nostradamous-repository.org Update Sept 13, 2001 It is hard to understand why some people are using such a tragic event to spread more fear using the name of Nostradamus but unfortunately that is the case. By the way, Nostradamus died in 1566 so anything with "Nostradamus 1654" should give you a clue. So, for your information, the following variations are also hoaxes attributed to Nostradamus: The one starting with "New century and 9 months", The one starting with "9 months and eleven days" or "On eleventh day of 9th month", The one which mentions "two steel birds", The one which mixes 2 completely unrelated quatrains of Nostradamus "From the sky will come a great King of Terror...The sky will burn at forty-five degrees" in order to fit the event. Also, don't forget that NY is not at 45 degrees but a little south of 41 degrees. More will be added as encountered... As for "City of God", see below: The following quatrain has been circulating the Internet after the WTC bombings. In the City of God there will be a great thunder, two brothers torn apart by chaos, while the fortress endures, the great leader will sucumb. The third big war will begin when the big city is burning. It is NOT by Nostradamus. This is a HOAX. (The link to a possible source of this hoax has been removed as that page is no longer accessible.)

jndas, Are you going to do anything about this guy random?? Aren't you supposed to be moderating the forums? I thought we were having a philosophical discusion. If certain people can't speak without being offensive or lowering the tone then I suggest that you don't let them say a thing. Dayal Govinda dasa Random: No one appreciates your crass, low class comments. Keep them to yourself, don't polute all of us with your filth.

jndas, you clearly do not do your research. About 2 weeks before Bhaktisiddhanta's passing Prabhupada wrote to him and asked if there was any service he could do for the mission. Bhaktisiddhanta replied that "I think that it would be good for you to preach in English". This is what was said, and this is what Prabhupada took as his life and soul. Prabhupada's guru nistha was such that the suggestion of his guru, he took to be an order. By dedicating himself fully to this suggestion/order he was undeniably successful in his mission. This is the glory of Prabhupada. If he had simply followed an order then he would be a good disciple no doubt, one of many. But by following a suggestion as if it was an order he proved himself to be unique. I hope that people reading this can understand this simple point. Dayal Govinda dasa

Dear Maitraya, You should understand to whom and to what I am refering when I stated that the comment was homophobic paranoia. I know members of galva and they are not plotting to decieve the devotee community. The very idea that they are is laughable. I called this homophobic paranoia because many devotees on this forum seem to be threatened by the very existance of homosexuals, thus they equate them with many abominable things such as paedophilia, promiscuity and deception. Showing no compassion and understanding to other vaisnavas has nothing to do with following Prabhupada. It is true that he can be quoted to support many different opinions, take the womens issue for example. But what he said and how he acted were often different. We are to extract the essence of these instructions and apply them to the present situation rather than to fanatically hold on to every word that Prabhupada said as absolute for all time. Do you really believe that everything Prabhupada said will be relevant for the next 10000 years? Dayal Govinda

quote: by jndas "They are doing something worse. They are misrepresenting the Vedic teachings and claiming homosexuality is sanctioned in the scriptures and in Vedic culture." Not sanctioned, just that it existed. quote:by jndas "Srila Prabhupada, the real guru," The real guru? Are you insinuating that Prabhupada is the only guru, all others are false? The only one to take instruction from? This is a ritvik idea, something that has been dealt with time and time again. If you do not mean this then you must accept that other guru's (bone fide of course) may do things differently. quote:by jndas "Any so-called guru, claiming to follow Srila Prabhupada, who makes such distortions in the teachings is bogus. It only makes me doubt whether or not such a personality may himself be homosexual." Distortions? did prabhupada distort the teachings when he allowed men and women to dance together in kirtan and live in the same temple? No he adjusted that which is non-essential to bhakti to engage everyone according to their propensity. I also assume you therefore think that I am gay just because I wrote in support of them? quote:by jndas "Srila Prabhupada never compromised on spiritual principles. He told his disciples that they must strictly follow four regulative principles - no meat eating, non intoxication, no illicit sex and no gambling. What if someone was serious about devotional life but couldn't give up meat eating? Prabhupada would not initiate them. The fact is, if they aren't willing to change their life style to suit the gurus instructions then they are not serious about devotion." If you will kindly re-read my post you will see that I never said that Prabhupada compromised on devotional principles, just that he adjusted the non-essential aspects of devotional life. You must aknowledge that Prabhupada did this. As I said before he allowed men and women to live in the same building and that was unheard of previously.He saw the way the society worked and adjusted accordingly. quote:by jndas "guru sanctioned non-celibate homosexual marriages, and "Prabhupada said it was alright". Where did I say non-celibate? I said that some may not be suited to celibate brahmacari life not that they should enter into a relationship based on sex. I also never said "Prabhupada said it was alright". quote:by jndas "The problem is sinful activities fo not create a conducive atmosphere for Krishna consciousness:" No they don't, but why imply that they are inherently sinful because they are gay? How many grhasta couples do not engage in any form of sexual activity? very few, that is why they are grhastas. Bhaktisiddhanta taught his disciples that sex is for marriage, only prahupdada stressed the regulation of sex life within marriage. The idea that because they are gay there are therefore breaking the 'illicit sex' regulation is absurd. refer to my above point. quote:by jndas "I also find it a shame that such people will try to mislead the devotee public through a well-organized program of dis-information [such as occured on chakra]." This is homophobic paranoia DGd

Dear all, I am very surprised to see the reactions of the devotees on this forum to the issue raised by Brahma das. I am behind Brahma 100 percent. The points raised by those devotees in GALVA are important to note, they are not trying to force their homosexuality upon us as has been insinuated by many of the responses herein. They merely require recognition that they can be Gaudiya Vaisnavas too. I for one think it sad that they felt they had to put together such an organization instead of feeling comfortable in the association of all devotees. However, the responses on this forum have proved why this article was written. We are supposed to be cultivating love for Sri Caitanya mahaprabhu, if we cannot even act in a civilized and compassionate way towards each other whom we call our godbrothers and godsisters then how are we to develop any feelings towards Mahaprabhu? The issue of a 'guru sanctioned gay relationship' is an interesting one. The guru sees all as equal and tries to engage people according to their propensity and situation. If someone is serious about devotional life and happens to be gay, and if they are not be suited to celibate brahmacari life, what does one suggest? Surely one should situate themselves such that they can practice spiritual life with the least amount of mental anguish. If they are happy in their relationship and it creates a conducive atmosphere for practicing Krsna consciousness then where is the problem? Many heterosexual devotee relationships are dysfunctional and hardly conducive to spiritual life. Are they better just because they are man and wife? I find it a shame that many of the devotees here have shown so much ignorance in dealing with this issue. From equating homosexuality with promiscuity on one side, to the extreme of equating it with pedophilia. It is this kind of prejudice that forces societies such as Galva to form, they are trying to show the devotee community that homosexuality has always been in existence and is a part of their present psychosocial make-up, something that must be dealt with. Regarding Prabhupada's attitude to homosexual relationships, he had to be so accommodating and flexible to fit in with the western society that it would be easy to take it for granted. He was heavily criticized by some of his godbrothers for even allowing men and women to dance together in Kirtan let alone live in the same temple. Such was his vision that he saw the way the western world worked and adjusted the non-essential aspects of devotional life accordingly. There are some people on this forum whom I would be ashamed to be associated with, I will mention no names but by my response you should know whom I am addressing. We are all part of Mahaprabhu's family, let us try and act that way. Some of my close godbrothers are gay, and I feel far more comfortable around them then I would do around most of these forum members. They are devotees first and foremost, judge by the spirituality of a person not by their sexual preference. Lets try and be progressive in our thinking, and strive to unite the devotee community rather than drive more rifts between us all. In service Dayal Govinda dasa.

The general principle is that prior to initiation one should chant on neem beads or count on ones fingers. At the time of initiation the guru gives a tulasi mala that he has chanted on and instructs the disciple in the specifics of chanting , how many rounds etc. So from this point of view, after (and hopefully prior to) initiation one will have given up eating meat. Although I have never heard it said like this before. As jndas said, substance is more important than form, but, if we have feeling then we will want to perfrom everything correctly as well.