srikanthdk71

what's next???

 

Dear Sri, after knowing that, I'll tag the title Mahatma to you also.

 

I'll give you a hint for this what's next....

 

Go first of all read the Gita, and then the Bhagvatam....

 

Everything is there for the mystery concerning what's next...

Mahajan, I am asking you to be Free and you ask me to get stuck again interpreting the book on which Thousands of people have interpreted. I am happy being with myself. Satyameva Jayate..your way or my way.. is it not?

that we all Vaishnavas know, that's why many devotees in the past refused entry to Vaikuntha also...

 

And also the only thing a vaishnava aspire for is Bhakti.

 

[Confirmed by Prahlada Maharaj Himself]

I am not talking of a Kailasa or a Vaikunta where the Shaivas or Vaishnavas are stuck. There is still something beyond it.

Bhakti purifies. It still stops with an experience of a Kailasa or a Vaikunta in a Saanidhya or Saamipya. But Mukti is impossible. Nobody can give you Mukti. You have to earn it yourself. It is simple. Where there is Two(Dvaita) there is no Mukti. If Mukti is a Myth, then.. All the Best.

And Alas, the founder himself couldnt fulfil it

Ravindranji, that was good try. Good Explanation of Free Will.

sri could you please explain a little more about this choiceless state of liberation....this state of being you talk about? and what does one do in that state of presence?

 

why I ask is this. firstly I do not have that emptiness, secondly if a person is at some level of conscious awareness will speaking of these satori states you have found, benefit him...or would a more pragmatic teaching benefit the seeker? (exercising our free will here:))

Somehow, I missed this question. Sorry for answering late.

Mahajan, firstly I would try to answer the first part of your concern. Choiceless state is where the mind stops. The general perception is, when mind stops. No experience. That is a myth. When mind stops, all your purity ie., love and compassion is experienced. I will give you an example. When you eat a choco, you are happy. When you give the same choco to your kids and when they eat it and feel happy, the happiness in your heart stays for more time. The first was the experience of the mind. The second is the experience of the heart(YOU). The core of those pure feelings can be tapped with Dhyana. You have also asked me, what does one do? It can only be experienced if nothing is done. The mind is like the wave of the sea. The calm bed of the sea can be experienced once the wave subsides within itself. It is natural and need no special practice.

Your second part about the Satvic states to benifit the seeker. Unless, there is a freeness of mind not to cling to any outer bondings, the inner cannot be experienced. Anything we do like a Satsang, a Bhajan or a Recitation of a Mantra is to gratify our mind, to get a special feel to our senses. The crying for the lord, etc is showing your love to the one outside you. Most of us are self bankrupt and try to look for answers outside which our peers, masters and parents taught us and being followed as a tradition. Unless we depend on our senses to get our own experience, the state of realization appears a myth. I have quoted a small example several times which I have no hesitation is quoting once again. If Krishna was to appear before you in a Temple, would you know he is Krishna or will you look up to your peers to confirm what you feel matches with his. Most of us belong to the second category. This is what I called Self Bankruptcy. Truth cannot be taught. It can only be experienced. All the states of Bhu, Bhuvah to Satyam can be experienced within yourself. Once you know the Satyam, you will always want to be there. This is the samadhi state where it is oblivion of all the Annamay, Pranamay... Koshas and loves to be within itself forever.

Keep Smiling:) Forever

If you can't beat them, join them.

Maharaj, Any organisation cannot preach TRUTH, once an organisation is formed, there is Kraya and Vikraya (Give and Take). It becomes a Vyaapaara(Business). An organisation can go to any extent to save its fabric, promote its belief. Even if Krishna decends one day in front of the devotees of an organisation, they will look up to their peers to give a green signal go ahead to believe the truth. That is called self bankruptcy. When you can yourself perceive the truth, why look up to somebody? Lets all realise the TRUTH ourselves in getting lost in beliefs or gloryfing the past.

You mean Sankaracharya became a Gaudiya Vaishnava?

 

No, those hymns are simply reflective of his devotion to Saguna Brahman. Everything is real, including duality at the Vyavaharika. Hence, Brahman with attributes and personal form exists at the illusory level.

 

In his Gita Bhashya, Sankaracharya translates 'Akshara' as Nirguna Brahman. Hence, according to him, meditating on Nirguna Brahman is a pretty tough ask, so, one can first devote himself to Isvara, Saguna Brahman. That is the basis of so many devotional hymns. He even advocates worship of archa avatara, the deity in temples, for this purpose.

 

He certainly did not change his mind, trust me. Advaita is a crazy philosophy.

 

 

 

Of course. I have great respect for Adi Sankaracharya, and certainly for his followers. Sri Krishna Premi is a great advaitin scholar and a Krishna bhakta who has become quite popular here.

 

However, In my opinion, it is a long stretch to call the philosophy of Vedanta as Advaitic. One look at the core scriptures can tell you that they don't talk of advaita at all. The Mahavakyas, as Advaitins call them, along with the concept of Avidya, are the supporting pillars of Advaita. And they can be easily refuted.

 

Advaita is an intellectual error.

Mahoday, Advaita is not an error at all. It is the ultimate and most scientific philosophy ever available. You say, the ultimate has a beautiful form of Pundarika. If there is a form, it is a limitation. So, obviously the unlimited is still there outside his form. Any form is not ultimate. It is a limited entity. The imperceivable is the truth or the Nirakara. Saguna Brahman is the Kriya aspect of Brahman and Nirguna is the constant regulation of the Saguna. Even in our human body, the Nirguna is regulating the Saguna aspect. Sri Shankara focused both on Saakara and Nirakara or else in the bid to save Dharma, he would have killed the fabric of Hindu beliefs and Buddhism would have killed everything. He did not preach strong Advaita philosophy and stuck to the sampradaaya of Shruti, Smriti and Puranas. It was for the others to grasp what he had to say. Some grasped it as Maayavaada where the constantly changing was refered to mind and told as Asat and the Nitya and satya was called Sat. The Asat was called Maaya and the Sat was the Atma. Please give me an answer as Dark Warrior-not affiliated to a sampradaaya, affiliated with oneself what you feel from deep within you and not quote from the books. I am asking for experiences of the present and not Pramaans of the past. Is it not YATHAA PINDE, TATHAA BRAHMAANDE? Is realization a Myth? If you think so? Think again.

A frustrated little boy or a frustrated Sanyassi sincerely surrendered to Hari is far much better than an exalted personalty devoid of the Bhagvata Doctrine.

Mahatma, the frustration never goes and the wanting is always there in the Pravritti Way where as in the Nivritti or Vyragya, the craving for the truth exists. When there is search for truth, it should be Absolute Truth and not partial Truth. Hari, Hara Brahmaadi are partial truths. They too are bound by Karmas. The absolute is unbound and infinite. The choice is yours. Yes, the surrender to Hari is easy. But what next? A true seeker will always be restless and in want of answers however he may pretend that he has no deviations in his belief. But when he finds the answer for himself, there is no other way is what he says. Ultimately, YOU are the experiencer.

 

SB 4.24.18

 

 

Lord Çiva, the most powerful demigod, second only to Lord Viñëu, is self-sufficient. Although he has nothing to aspire for in the material world, for the benefit of those in the material world he is always busily engaged everywhere and is accompanied by his dangerous energies like goddess Kälé and goddess Durgä.

 

 

 

PURPORT

 

 

Lord Çiva is known as the greatest devotee of the Supreme Personality of Godhead. He is known as the best of all types of Vaiñëavas (vaiñëavänäà yathä çambhuù).

Consequently, Lord Çiva has a Vaiñëava sampradäya, the disciplic succession known as the Rudra-sampradäya. Just as there is a Brahma-sampradäya coming directly from Lord Brahmä, the Rudra-sampradäya comes directly from Lord Çiva. Lord Çiva is one of the twelve great personalities, as stated in Çrémad-Bhägavatam (6.3.20):

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

svayambhür näradaù çambhuù

 

kumäraù kapilo manuù

prahlädo janako bhéñmo

balir vaiyäsakir vayam

 

 

 

 

 

These are twelve great authorities in preaching God consciousness. The name Çambhu means Lord Çiva. His disciplic succession is also known as the Viñëusvämi-sampradäya, and the current Viñëusvämi-sampradäya is also known as the Vallabha-sampradäya.

The current Brahma-sampradäya is known as the Madhva-Gauòéya-sampradäya. Even though Lord Çiva appeared to preach Mäyäväda philosophy, at the end of his pastime in the form of Çaìkaräcärya, he preached the Vaiñëava philosophy: bhaja govindaà bhaja govindaà bhaja govindaà müòha-mate.

He stressed worshiping Lord Kåñëa, or Govinda, three times in this verse and especially warned his followers that they could not possibly achieve deliverance, or mukti, simply by word jugglery and grammatical puzzles. If one is actually serious to attain mukti, he must worship Lord Kåñëa. That is Çrépäda Çaìkaräcärya’s last instruction.

Herein it is mentioned that Lord Çiva is always accompanied by his material energy (çaktyä ghorayä). Material energy—goddess Durgä, or goddess Kälé—is always under his control. Goddess Kälé and Durgä serve him by killing all the asuras, or demons.

Sometimes Kälé becomes so infuriated that she indiscriminately kills all kinds of asuras. There is a popular picture of goddess Kälé in which she wears a garland composed of the heads of the asuras and holds in her left hand a captured head and in her right hand a great khaòga, or chopper, for killing asuras. Great wars are symbolic representations of Kälé’s devastation of the asuras and are actually conducted by the goddess Kälé.

 

 

 

såñöi-sthiti-pralaya-sädhana-çaktir ekä (Brahma-saàhitä 5.44)

 

 

Asuras try to pacify the goddess Kälé, or Durgä, by worshiping her in material opulence, but when the asuras become too intolerable, goddess Kälé does not discriminate in killing them wholesale.

Asuras do not know the secret of the energy of Lord Çiva, and they prefer to worship goddess Kälé or Durgä or Lord Çiva for material benefit. Due to their demoniac character, they are reluctant to surrender to Lord Kåñëa, as indicated by Bhagavad-gétä (7.15):

 

 

 

na mäà duñkåtino müòhäù

 

 

 

 

prapadyante narädhamäù

 

mäyayäpahåta-jïänä

äsuraà bhävam äçritäù

 

 

 

 

 

Lord Çiva’s duty is very dangerous because he has to employ the energy of goddess Kälé (or Durgä). In another popular picture the goddess Kälé is sometimes seen standing on the prostrate body of Lord Çiva, which indicates that sometimes Lord Çiva has to fall down flat in order to stop goddess Kälé from killing the asuras.

Since Lord Çiva controls the great material energy (goddess Durgä), worshipers of Lord Çiva attain very opulent positions within this material world. Under Lord Çiva’s direction, a worshiper of Lord Çiva gets all kinds of material facilities.

In contrast, a Vaiñëava, or worshiper of Lord Viñëu, gradually becomes poorer in material possessions because Lord Viñëu does not trick His devotees into becoming materially entangled by possessions. Lord Viñëu gives His devotees intelligence from within, as stated in Bhagavad-gétä (10.10):

 

 

 

teñäà satata-yuktänäà

 

 

 

 

bhajatäà préti-pürvakam

 

dadämi buddhi-yogaà taà

yena mäm upayänti te

 

 

 

 

 

“To those who are constantly devoted and worship Me with love, I give the understanding by which they can come to Me.”

Thus Lord Viñëu gives intelligence to His devotee so that the devotee can make progress on the path back home, back to Godhead. Since a devotee has nothing to do with any kind of material possession, he does not come under the control of goddess Kälé, or the goddess Durgä.

Lord Çiva is also in charge of the tamo-guëa, or the mode of ignorance in this material world. His potency, the goddess Durgä, is described as keeping all living entities in the darkness of ignorance (yä devé sarva-bhüteñu nidra-rüpaà saàsthitä).

Both Lord Brahmä and Lord Çiva are incarnations of Lord Viñëu, but Lord Brahmä is in charge of the creation whereas Lord Çiva is in charge of the destruction, which he carries out with the help of his material energy, goddess Kälé, or goddess Durgä.

Thus in this verse Lord Çiva is described as being accompanied by dangerous potencies (çaktyä ghorayä), and that is the actual position of Lord Çiva.

Bhaiyya, The Absolute Truth can never be yours unless you are engraving quotations from the past. The past is dead. The future in unseen. Oh mere Dev, Be yourself. The truth is in the present and is present within you. Realise!!!

Surrender!

Surrender Now!

You must surrender to a senior Vaishnava or

you will surrender to a lesser authority.

Bhaktajan

Light your own lamp. Do not live in the light of others. They are like the car that can take you to your home. But once you reach home, you dont take your car inside. You park it out and it is YOU who walk into your home.

Surrender!

"Following your bliss" is a concept that requires the

"Absolute Truth" otherwise you will follow "Subjective Truth".

Such Subjective Truth(s) are only as good as the species of bodies you possess for some short (or long) life span.

Bhaktajan

Bliss Eternal is not a concept. It is an Experience which you also can experience unless you leave thinking too much.

Surrender!

Your priorities are evidently start and end with your pleasuring your senses--that is all you are preaching.

Having said that, I presume that you are unaware of higher pursuits other than sense-gratification, ie:, fame, adoration & distinction and especially first and definitely not least of all, Sex pleasures.

 

You don't know these things, Right?

 

Your suggestions are all about pursuing your dreams in a world of wars, famine, death, exploitation, querrel, hypocracy, lust and the repetition of birth after birth via blind faith in your petty sized insignificance.

 

May your pettiness end,

 

Bhaktajan

Who is preaching to pleasurise the senses? The yogis or the Bhogis(?). Who is trying to keep the seekers under their influence? If Krishna himself decends on this earth again, you will look up to your masters to confirm that he is Krishna? Will you not? Such is your dependancy. Just question yourself the way you are heading is towards the TRUTH or a limited set of Beliefs which is projected as the Absolute Truth by an Institution. Last but not the least, hope you would have understood by now the meaning of pettiness.

Take anything that is good. Anything can be expressed in any language. You have conveyed your message also in English. Finding fault outside you is easy but finding truth within is difficult.

 

Its quite mind boggling why he shud say that..shankaracharya's brahm is inert.It can neither bestow any 'krpa' nor can it purify any1's mind.Shankara himself states that

'oh my Brahm ! You are inert.' he has used the word 'udaseen' in this context...how wil his inert brahm bestow grace??

Hence,shuddhayati na antaraatma..krsna..bhaktimriteh.

This is the link...how many here,who are riding on the advaita bandwagon,know that shankaracharya CRIED in bhava,so that he could attain vision of lord krsna ? ?

 

1. Bhraman is in Equilibrium. Not inert. It is there in Jaagrit, Swapna and Sushupti.Your choice of words is incorrect.

2. It can neither bestow any Kripa nor can purify any ones mind. Yes. Absolutely right. Kripa to whom? It is already pure. Bestowing a kripa comes from the mind. Not the conciousness. Your own mind is not willing to accept that there is conciousnes within you which you are trying to find outside you.

3. Sanaatan means that was there, is there and will be there. Krishna was not there, was there and is no more there. So, what is there now within you? Questions about the past? Leave it. Hold that one that was there, is there and will be there. That is YOU. The experiencer. Realise yourself else you will get lost in glorifying the past. You would have forgotten your present and presence.

What has this got to do with a spiritual forum? If you start understanding the Gita in the gross form, there will be no difference between the you and the interpreters of Bible. What is your goal? Achieve it.

This is silly. When Krishna says He is seated in everyone's heart, He means that He is seated in everyone's soul. In the place where love and compassion come from. He doesn't mean, "There's a little incarnation of me with a little condo living inside of your heart which is located toward the left-side of your chest." Please

Mahajan,Accolades to you. You got it right. The heart of Maharashtra, Mumbai. The heart of India, New Delhi. Since science has told that heart is the place where the blood is supplied through auricles and ventricles we start searching concioueness in the heart. But conciousness is not in one place of the Body. It is within and without. The central focus of creation is the heart. The experiencer is the heart.

L.S.,

 

However, it is also stated in this book that Krishna sees the future (as well as the past and the present) of our (material) existence, which implies that we do not have a choice and that free will does not exist. Can someone explain this apparent contradiction?

 

Bart

Maharaj, if something called Sankalpa exists, it is nothing but Free Will. Sankalpa is the Thought arising from conciousness and you will carry it out under any adversity. In the same way, when the conciousness is focussed on Kaala (time), you can also perceive the past, present and future because your conciousness is Kaalateet (not bound by time). Many have demonstrated this in the past also and even in the present. A choice leads to dilemma. Be choiceless. Realise the conciousness within you. You can do miracles for yourself.

Sounds like some of that new age self help psychology or something. I tried that kind of stuff when I was younger and found it ultimately unsatisfying. It can work for awhile to help you achieve material goals or something but it doesn't give the complete picture of the universe and its functioning. Don't know for sure if Srimad Bhagavatam is true or not but at least it attempts to give you the complete picture. At the end of the day Srimad Bhagavatam is a very interesting explanation of things and the simple life of Krishna Consciousness seems like a nice way to live this life as compared to the constant stress of the materialistic civilization we have created.

Maharaj, if you try, nothing happens because you are trying. There is a thought. You should let it happen. I am talking about the thoughtless state. I know it helps in material goals. But these are not goals. These are hurdles. A siddhi is not a gain, it is a hurdle to make to stop from reaching the light. A lamp that is some distance away from you can just give you partial light. Some things start appearing to you. If you are satisfied, you stop there. But if you throw it and your only goal is the light, you get it. In the same way, A swarga, Kinnara loka, a Kailasa, a Vaikunta etc are hurdles in your way. But unless you are free from experiences, the TRUTH cannot be perceived. Yes, Krishna Conciousness can teach you to live in the light of Krishna, but what about your own lamp which is as bright as the devine itself? You can decorate the lord with all the stutis, aratis etc but only when you remove those ornaments, will you see HIM.

Dark Warrior Mahajan, I bow to your extreme knowledge of the books, its interpretation, kindly let me know how may quotes were done from Srimad Bhagavatam from Sri Adi Shankara or Sri Ramanujacharya. None. Why? It only has its existance felt from the time of Sri Madhvacharya. Was it written in between? If so from whom? Vyasa ? It is not written in Anushtup Chandas which all other forms of Vyasa works has been written. Why this speciality? Who was supreme before the Dwapara Yuga? Why did Rama worship Shiva? Why only Shiva and Shakti finds mention in the Sat Yuga? Kindly give Pramaans for the same so that it will be useful for all.

Dear Shrikant,

 

While what you are saying is true - heat and cold exists in the body too, there by making it an argument to dismiss the world outside and science is reducing to idealism ( or maya vada). In idealism the world does not exist except as an idea in a mind. (hence maya) Realism - which is the bacic assumption of science - assumes that the world is real and exists independant of our mind and its conception, and is governed its own objective and real processes independ of our subjective conceptions of it.

 

Your ideas of heat and cold bringing nabi and throat chakra in to picture seems to reduce the world process to individual phenominon - and hence subjective phenominon - that is idealism, a rejection of realism.

 

The world exists. It is real, and is objective. You will have to accept this unless of course you are an idealist. ( that is if you think that there is no world outside you - it is just an illusion)

 

Regards,

K.Ravindran

YATHA PINDE, TATHAA BRAHMAANDE, Monism or Maayavaada is simple. Where is all your experiences from your time of Birth? Everything is within you. Within your mind. Is the mind true? No. Then What is True? YOU. Your existance is only the TRUTH. The rest was not bothered to give a thought and was called Maaya which is generated from the Tamasic Shakti. There is Brahma, Vishnu and Mahesh in just a Thought. It is born, given a shape and then goes to Laya or Perishes. The Atma which has a definition as

Shivam, Shaantam, Advaitam, Chaturthamanyante

Sa Aatma Sabigyeyah

is only considered to be the Truth. Nanakji also said, Jin Khoja Tin Paayian, Gehri Paani Pet, everything lies within you. Try and you will find it. Easy to dismiss.

I normally do not use quotations from the past where they lived their present. The past is not going to happen again. So let us live in the present and start from here. Or else, we would be lost in time by just digging the past without knowing where we are really heading to. Spirituality doesnt need a BASE to stand. It is just the TRUTH. Maybe different directions. But leading to the SAME.

He might understand it in an encrypted messages.

 

We are here talking about sprituality and he is quoting american popstars.

The child has stepped to a path and thinks that being Missionary is a Seva done to his seniors. He doesnt believe in uplifting himself to their or beyond their level. He believes that they should lend a helping hand to lift him which is next to impossible. The person who has lost belief from himself can only depend on the bookish quotes made in the past or he will experience and tell the world what he really is.

Thanks dude, you've defined it nicely.

Sajjan, Life can only be understood on the broader perspective. When we try and limit ourselves to smaller areas, the rest is lost.

This is how I show respect to my senior mentors. I can do this because I can see who is in what position,

Bhaktajan

I liked your name BHAKTAJAN. But I request you to kindly change it to Prabhupada Bhaktajan or Chaitanya Bhaktajan. You hate Lord Shiva, you hate the "Maayavaadi"s. You hate Adi Shankara, You hate Advaita philosophy, Your time starts only from the period when prabupada made his existance. You live in a limited boundry and try to say that all the world exists within those walls and not outside it. So broad is your perspective. Try and break the barriers that you have built for yourself in the form of your organisation that you are loyal to. Truth is something beyond a Chaitanya, prabupada and even for that matter Sri Adi Shankara. Realise yourself from the present and not waste time in glorifying the past. It is not going to happen again. So, what is going to happen is what you do. Be your own mentor NOW!!!

The thread is Irrelevent. Makes sense in a cooking class forum. Kindly try and maintiain the spirit of the Forum.

Ramakrishna and Vivikananda are Mayavadis, if you are a Vaishnava, Lord Caitanya forbid His disciples to hear Mayavadi nonsense trash

If Lord Caitanya made an organisation, he was not a realised soul. It even applies to Prabhupada. Sorry, but I have to say this. When man is in a boundry of beliefs and tries to preach that only he can lead you to the truth, he is fooling all and himself.

Guru is like a Bridge. He has to tell his disciples that, you can come though it and go through it but you are not allowed to build your abode on it.

But your Gurus seems to say, Come here. Build your house. I will lead you to the highest.

Alas, the Guru himself has not thought beyond his beliefs. God save such disciples who live on the bridge and did not have the independence to cross it.

Read the books of Madam Blavitsky and Aurobindo if you want to know about the research made about where the mind lies else start finding yourself where mind stops within you. Both will lead you to some starkling conclusions. I recommend the second. The best judge is YOU.

Dear Sajjans, I dont know how this Thread started so seriously about Global Warming and has lost its way. Scientific discoveries are pertaining to the world outside and difficult to prove whether there is a Global Warming or Freezing. There is a simple way to know this ourselves. The Agni Tattva lies in the Nabhi(belly button) and the Soma Tattva lies in the throat. This is what that brings equilibrium to the temperature of the human body. In meditation, if you know that your Nabhi is more receptive than your throat, then there is warming around you else if the throat is more receptive, there is freezing around you. As simple as it. Just try and you will not depend on the outside Science to prove Warming and Freezing to you.