premananda
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Posts posted by premananda
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If the "babaji" really performed those activities he wasn´t doing sadhan-bhajan. I hope we all agree on that.
Those guys are fringe groups.
The ones who are true Gaudiya Vaishnava babajis don´t perform any "rasa-lila" with females.
One of those true babas is Srila Ananta das Babaji of Sri Radhakunda. It is probably him they are referring to in the text. Because he is the most famous in Vraja, and he has published many books, with commentaries. If your tridanda Swami refers to Srila Babaji Maharaj with his dramatic description of sahajiya activities among Gaudiya babajis he is being very offensive. This is how I interpreted his little speech.
This again proves my thesis that many of the GM gurus like to slander and gossip. It is so tragic and pathetic.
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Originally posted by amanpeter:
For your info:
Is It Ok for Us To Read The Books Of _______ das Babaji Maharaj From Radha Kunda?
Dear , I do not want to give any criticism and make an offence to any Vaisnava. But, you are asking, so I am replying. All Vaisnavas please forgive me if there is any offense.
Our guru varga tells us that those who are sahajiya, sakhi, bekhi, smarta, jata goswami, atti vari, chudadhari, gauranga nagari, owlbaul krtha bhaja, nira, sai, etc. We should never associate with them.
In Radha Kunda there are many babajis. Many persons there are doing bhajana sadhana with a pure mood. But many more persons there have an impure mood. This is like introducing a slow poison into a culture, and all it's bad activities. They are writing about and translating all the
Goswamis books with nice quotations and with sweet words. But, we do not know if there is
some activity they are performing which is a weakness on their part.
I have been to many places, and know them, having spoken to them. They think that sex enjoyment is part of our sadhana-bhajana. They say we should take sex enjoyment and simultaneously remember Radha-Govinda lila!
Their books, their writings and their disciples are based upon illicit “parakiya” relationships. If they obtain a “parakiya” lady friend they give diksa mantras to her and then think they are asting parakiya rasa. So, there was one disciple of a Radha Kunda babaji, who was rich, and was given the order to do bhajana in parakiya rasa, to find some lady friend to have this parakiya relationship with. So, when he went back to his home in _____ he called his young niece to come to his house and stay with him while he was doing his sadhana bhajan. While she was there he would make her engage in illicit activities. He called her everyday. Finally she complained to her husband not understanding why her uncle was doing this. Her husband came to this disciples home with a group of hoodlums who beat him severly sending him to hospital. The husband told him to do his sadhan-bhajan in the hospital. There are many things like this going on in Vrndavan, Navadwipa, Calcutta, everywhere. There are many apasampradayas doing only
bad, bhogus activites and sex enjoyment.
They are giving guru pranali, manjari bhava, sakhi bhav, but not having any good behaviour. So they do not know what is the difference between body and soul. They are absorbed in material existence. The Srimad
Bhagavatam tells us: yasyapma buddhi kucpi tridatuke swadi calatradisu vomaijadi yatitha budhi salila swayu soukora
He is an ass among cows. So, offences, anarthas, are not leaving the heart
by performing such bad activities. But they are thinking siddha dasa varamdasa; giving to new people, who are completely unqualified, this secret esoteric knowledge.
What is The Remedy For Chronic Nama-Aparadha?
When an ecstatic mood comes in our chanting of Hari-nama then all offences will be finished. So we should always serve, be fully engaged, Guru and Vaisnavas, doing bhajana-sadhana. Then offences will not come.
By the mercy of Guru and Vaisnavas a pure mood will come into our hearts when our lives
are fully dedicated to them only.
Jaya Sri Radhe!
Your servant,
Tridandi Swami Bhaktivedanta Tirtha Maharaja
send questions to gourgovinda@hotmail.com
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There must be some divine involvement
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There must be some divine involvement
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Originally posted by jndas:
Could you give some examples? Thanks.
Sri Caitanya Mangala, Madhya 1:
When the devotees perceived the form of Shyamsundar within the body of Gauranga, Gadadhar then assumed the form of Radharani. At that time Narahari manifested his previous form of Madhumati Sakhi. Seeing all this take place all of the devoteees began to call out "Hari bol! Hari bol!". Vrindavan then became manifest at Srivasangan as the cows, cowherd boys and gopis all began to mix with Sacinandan. In order to taste the flavor of the rasa everyone assumed their previous forms of either gopas or gopis. In their previous Braja svarupas everyone began to dance encircling Gouranga Deva. Seeing this wondrous display, the associates of all other avataras of the Lord cry, as the moon of Braja (Sri Krishna) rises in the sky of Navadvipa. In this way with Gadadhar, Gour lila continues on. And then, at other times, simultaneously Shyama lila takes place with Radharani, in the pleasure of the mellow of Rasa lila. Seeing these astonishing pastimes, all of the devotees would loudly cry, "Hari bol! Haribol!", and "Jaya! Jaya!"
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Originally posted by jijaji:
shvu..
I am sorry to say , but I have noticed somewhat of a double standard here. You are constantly BLASTING Gaudiya Vaishnavism as you consider it to be unauthentic and without foundation. Rather your postings generally support advaita..no problem to me. But you seem to be upset with those of us who have serious issues of Siddhanta with Gaudiya Math and it's branches. It does not suprise me in the least that other schools of Vedanta disagree with each other. It does not bother me that Tattvavadis are not acceptant of Sri Chaitanyas divinity. It does not bother me that followers of Goraknath do not accept Sri Chaitanyas divinity. But keep in mind that certainly Ramakrisha did.....as did many many others!
So you can argue until the cows come home...and call of us names who disagree with the Siddhanta being presented by these missionaries. BUT....you are doing the very same thing, walking around on the forums like YOU RULE..give me a break.
IS YOUR WORD FINAL HERE OR SOMETHING?
EXCUSE ME DUDE!
GET OFF YOUR HIGH HORSE!
Well written Sriman Jijaji, you figured this guy out!
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Originally posted by shvu:
There, the humble devotee goes off into a fit of anger once more !
I don't disucss atheism on this forum. If the administrator felt so, he would have cut me off, ages back. Simple?
You must learn the meaning of your name and try to live up to it. Donning the garb of a devotee and being empty and angry inside, doesn't cut it. I call that as hypocrisy. In my usless opinion, you are no better than me. You have a far, far way to go. In fact, by such an attitude, you are only blackening the image of Chaitanya and other devotees.
Cheers
You cannot possibly know if I was angry when I wrote the previous posting. By the way, I wasn´t.
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Originally posted by shvu:
I notice that you did not use the word arrogant this time. That is a step in the right direction.
According to you spiritual = accepting chaitanya as divine. You see, there are several other people who are spiritual, but do not accept Chaitanya as divine. Someday hopefully, you wil realize that and also drop the word materialistic. The exact english words for that would be tolerance and humility. You will eventually get around to that. Good luck.
Cheers
Why don´t you just disappear from this forum? Your opinion is totally useless.
I thought this was a forum for spiritually minded persons! Isn´t there some atheist/agnostic forum where you will fit in nicely?
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Originally posted by shvu:
If that is what one wishes to do.
Cheers
As I said, I don´t care what materialistic persons like yourself think about Sri Gauranga.
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"Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu is Sri Krsna Himself and has two types of lila. Vraja lila and
Navadwipa lila. When He is playing with all the Vraja Gopis, He is tasting all rasa in His all
attractive Syamasundara form. When He is in Navadwipa lila He is tasting Sri Radhika's great
merciful rasa."
Sometimes He is also overcome by the mood of being Sri Krishna in Gaura-lila. Then his associates adopt the Vrindavan mood.
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"If some people are arguing; "But, I don't accept them." We can say; "But who will accept you?" Our necessity is to understand all sastras, guru, and vaisnavas. What they are saying we accept, in this line.
Any comment on this thesis?"
Jaya Radhe!
Because we have sraddha in sadhu, guru and sastra we can see that Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu is the original Godhead.
Human beings naturally perceive things in an imperfect way. But sadhu, guru and sastra give the most essential of all knowledge, spiritual knowledge, which has its origin in Sri Krishna.
Therefore I don´t care what materialistic or arrogant persons say about the divinity of Sri Gauranga.
What persons who disregard or ignore Sri Gauranga also lack is the ability to perceive the spiritual nature of His lilas. Persons like that don´t have a higher goal in life, they simply dive into material life, and in the end become very unhappy and suffer.
What a waste of time to simply try to satisfy one´s senses. We may die any moment, who really knows?
The beauty of Sri Gauranga even dissipates the desire to escape material life and attain moksha. Liberation becomes totally insignificant.
Sri Sri Radha-Krishna´s names, forms, qualities and pastimes drowns the devotee in pure nectar. There is no other choice except to surrender oneself to that amazing world, where Sri Sri Radha-Krishna are in the centre.
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Transcendental Encounters
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BY PREMANANDA DAS
In October 1995 I came to Navadvip Dham to perform some seva and to meet with devotee friends, Bengali and Western. During the time I stayed in Navadvip (from October ´95 to April ´96) I had the great fortune to meet living Gaudiya Vaishnava sadhus and receive knowledge and inspiration from them. In the mornings and evenings I would go visit different temples in Navadvip Dham, to attend Arati, take prasadam, and meet the Radha-Krishna bhaktas.
Srila Jiva Gosvami, Mahanta of Srivasangan in Navadvip Dham
One such temple was the Srivasangan. The Mahanta there is Srila Jiva Gosvami, who is about 65 years old and a son of Srila Nimai-canda Gosvami, who previously was the mayor of Navadvip Dham and Mahanta of the Srivasangan. Their Guru-pranali descends from Srila Viracandra Gosvami, the son of Srila Nityananda Prabhu. Srila Jiva Gosvami is called 'Bulbul' Gosvami, because he sings very beautifully (Bulbul is the name of a sweet singing bird). Sri Jiva Prabhu chants one lakha of Harinama in the morning and forenoon, and then studies Shastra, receives guests, and performs his other services in the temple. I once asked him about the birthplace of Sri Chaitanya Mahaprabhu, but he simply replied, 'Radhe-Shyam, Radhe-Shyam', as if to say that it is not so important - what really matters is Radhe-Shyam. (There are different opinions about the location of the Janmasthan among Gaudiya Vaishnavas) The geographical birthplace of Sriman Mahaprabhu, some say, has been washed away by the Ganga a long time ago. So why bother to argue about it, what is more important is to engage in sravanam, kirtanam, smaranam, pada-sevanam, arcanam, vandanam, dasyam, sakhyam, and atmanivedanam. Srila Jiva Gosvami is a close friend of my Gurudeva, and they visit each others temples and attend each others festivals. The first time I visited Jiva Prabhu I mentioned that I am a follower of Srila Gadadhar-pran Prabhu, upon which he became very happy and invited me to his private room.
Many times I attended the evening Sri Chaitanya Bhagavat-path and sandhya-arati. After the reading Sri Jiva Prabhu would sing melodiously various kirtanas and everyone would become very blissful. Sometimes they sing the kirttan "Jaya Sri Krishna Chaitanya Prabhu Nityananda, Hare Krishna Hare Rama Sri Radhe-Govinda"
A retired Vaishnava Couple
In the house where I stayed, there was an elderly couple who were deeply spiritual persons, both were initiated into the line coming from Madhavacharyya, an eternal associate of Sriman Chaitanya Mahaprabhu. Every morning and evening they would sit together and read from Sri Chaitanya-caritamrita, and other Scriptures. Both had a transcendental radiance and they seemed to experience spiritual joy all of the time. One evening I was standing on the verandah, listening to the Sankirttan going on in a nearby temple. Beside me the elderly Vaishnavi was standing and listening. Suddenly I felt very blissful, the hairs on my body stood on end, and my eyes filled with tears. I became perplexed because this was quite unusual. I looked at the Vaishnavi standing beside me, and she looked so peaceful and blissful, I felt that she was experiencing spiritual joy and that her spiritual emotions somehow influenced me. Divine Love is contagious.
Once I asked the old Vaishnava gentleman if Siddha-pranali is given in his parampara. He replied that it is given, after the sadhaka has become quite detached from sense enjoyment and attracted to Sri Sri Radha-Krishna-lila. Not until then. He also said that it is important to deeply study the Gosvamis´ Scriptures, otherwise we will remain on a lower level of devotion.
Srila Vishnudas Babaji, Mahanta of Samaj-bari
When I visited the Srivasangan I passed by a quite large temple located on the other side of the Srivasangan Road. My wife´s relatives told me that it is called 'Samaj-bari'. The founder of this temple was the great siddha-mahapurusha Srila Radharaman-caran das Babaji Maharaj, who was initiated by a saint called Sankararanya Puri who was in the line of Srila Nityananda Prabhu. One afternoon I visited Samaj-bari and talked to a devotee there, a young Bengali man. He spoke good English and I asked him many questions about their parampara and mantras etc. He told me that the first mantra given to them is 'bhaja Nitai Gaura Radhe Shyama, japa Hare Krishna Hare Rama'. I became a little turned off by this first (because I had heard some negative statements about this mantra), but after hearing an explanation of the mantra I became more positive. The meaning is that by the grace of Nitai one attains Gaura, who is non-different from Radhe-Shyam. It has been interpreted to mean that Nitai Gaura are non-different from Radhe-Shyama, in another words that Nitai is the same as Radha in Vrindavan. But this is not correct. The devotee told me that Sri Nityananda´s identity in madhura-rasa is Srimati Ananga Manjari, so through the parampara they are serving under her and Srimati Rupa Manjari´s guidance. The devotee said that by performing Raganuga-sadhana in Gopi-bhava one can attain a manjari siddha-deha in Goloka Vrindavana.
Another day I went back, being fascinated by what the devotee had told me. I went to see Srila Vishnudas Babaji, the Mahanta of the temple. He just came out from his little room and I bowed down to him. He said that I have come there due to the mercy of Sri Gauranga Mahaprabhu, and asked me to come into his room and have a seat. He sat down on his bed, chanting all the time on his japa-mala quietly. His eyes were closed and he seemed to be lost in another world, another reality, immersed in deep contemplation. After some time I asked him about lila-smaranam, and he said that while chanting japa one should meditate on Radha-Krishna-lila according to the asta-kala, the eightfold time periods of the day in Goloka Vrindavan. Although, one should first focus on Gaura-lila. Then through Gaura-lila Vraja-lila will appear. The elderly Babaji´s eyes were filled with tears and he told me that at that very time period Yugala-milana of Gadadhara-Radha/ Gaura-Krishna was taking place.
Srila Gadadhara-prana Prabhu, my mantra-diksha guru and disciple of Srila Lalitaprasad Thakur
The first time I met my Gurudeva was in Mayapur Dham in 1994. At this time I stayed at the Sri Chaitanya Sarasvat Math in Navadvip Dham. It was there I met Gopal Gosvami, my present brother-in-law. Once he asked me if I wanted to visit a Western devotee who lives in Mayapur permanently. I became interested and we went to see this devotee who turned out to be Srila Gadadhar-pran Prabhu. When we came the Midday Bhoga-arati was taking place, the Thakuras, Sri Sri Gaura-Gadadhara were placed just outside the temple room and one of his disciples was fanning Them. We offered our dandavat pranamas and left after a few minutes. My brother-in-law said that Srila Gadadhar-pran was a disciple of Srila Lalitaprasad Thakur. The name seemed familiar somehow.
Nex time I went to India, in 1995 I had been thinking about Gadadhar-pran Prabhu and had become very curious about his Guru and their parampara. One afternoon when I came from the ISKCON Mayapura temple I decided to visit him.
Gadadhar-pran Prabhu was lying down in his small kutir and when he noticed me he sat up and we offered dandavats to each other. He asked who I was and why I had come to visit him. Then I explained that I was very interested to hear about his Gurudeva and the parampara teachings etc. He laid down on his bed again (he had fever and a cold at the time) and explained about Guru-parampara, Raganuga-sadhana and many other things. As he was talking I could understand that he was a very advanced soul. Everything he said was realized knowledge, not theoretical knowledge. He was transcendentally situated in his eternal identity which seemed to shine through. Due to his influence I became eager to hear more about Raganuga-sadhana and Radha-Krishna-lila. I returned many times during my six months in Navadvip and learned many things about Asta-kala-lila and Lila-smaranam etc. We would regularly read from his translation of Sri Govinda-lilamrita after taking prasadam. I would read out loud and he would comment on the verses.
One devotee from ISKCON came once and asked some questions, because he had read his book 'Why did Chaitanya Mahaprabhu Come?'. Srila Gadadhar-pran asked him what he thought about the book, did he agree with its contents and conclusions? The devotee replied that he didn´t agree with everything, only a few things he found to be true. Then Gadadhar-pran asked what it was that he didn´t agree with, and pointed out that everything he has written is based on Shastra, Guru and Sadhu, and there are many quotes from these in the book. The devotee was dumbstruck, he couldn´t mention a single example of apa-siddhanta in the book.
Another time some devotees from a Gaudiya Math came over and talked. Gurudeva asked them what the goal of Gaudiya Vaishnavism is. They answered 'Guru-seva', 'Vaisnava-seva' and other things. Then Gadadhar-pran said that it is not wrong, but the Caitanya-caritamrita teaches: 'ataeva gopi-bhava kari angikar ratri dine cinte radha-krishnera vihara', 'therefore adopt gopi-bhava and meditate day and night on the pastimes of Radha-Krishna'. And he quoted another verse which says that through sakhi-bhava one will attain the lotus feet of Radha-Krishna. He also pointed out that actually our goal is not to become Krishna-dasas, rather should we become Radha-dasis.
The next time I went to India, in 1997, I received Mantra-Diksha from Srila Gadadhar-pran Prabhu into the line of Srimati Jahnava Devi (Srimati Ananga Manjari).
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Originally posted by jndas:
Perhaps there will be some more general topics we can all agree on. This is one reason I prefer to avoid getting into spiritual details. The finer we go, the more chances there are for disagreement.
Of course there are other things we agree on. It was not meant as an absolute statement. "We will always disagree on everything", was not what I meant.
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jndas,
We will always disagree.
P D
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This translation, made by a god-brother of mine, is a first copy of the book that never was completed. So there might be some mistakes in the translation. Please correct, if you have the interest.
PD
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Sri Rupa Goswami´s
Sri Upadesamrta
with commentary by
Srila Bhaktivinoda Thakura.
vaco vegam manasah krodha-vegam
jivha-vegam udaropastha-vegam
etan vegan yo visaheta dhirah
sarvam apinam prthivim sa sisyat
A wise and sober person who can endure the impulses of speech, the mind, anger, the tongue, the belly and the genitals is verily the most worthy to command the whole world.
Rendering in Bengali verse-
guru krpabale labhi sambandha-vijnana
krti-jiva hayena bhajane yatnavan
By the strenght of guru krpa one is endowed with subjective realization of sambandha jnana. Such a fortunate jiva shall then perform bhajan with great zeal and earnestness.
sei jive sri-rupa goswami mahodaya
"upadesamrta" dhanya karena niscaya
For his benefit, Sri Rupa Goswami has composed this unequivocal and blessed "Upadesamrta", the ambrosial precepts.
grhi grha tyagi bhede dviprakara jane
upadesa-bheda vicaribe vijna-gane
The wise will discern the appropriate lesson, having duly considered the two kinds of aspirants; householders and those have abandoned household life.
grhi prati ei saba upadesa haya
grha tyagi prati iha parakasthamaya
All these teachings are cerainly meant for the householders, and the renounced will aslo find herein the highest transcendental enlightenment.
vakya-vega, mano-vega, krodha-vega ara
jivha-vega udara-vega, upastha-vega chara
The impulses of speech, the mind, anger, the tongue, the belly and the genitals can be most disconcerting.
ei chaya vega sahi ´krsna namasraya
jagat sasite pare parajiya bhaye
One can subdue these impulses by taking regue in the divine nama of Krsna, and one who does so conquers fear and is fit to rule the whole world.
kevala saranagati krsna-bhakti-maya
bhakti pratikula tyaga ta´ra anga haya
Devotion to Krsna is embued with exclusive surrender, an aspect of which is the abandonment of those things (and persons) detrimental thereto.
caya vega sahi ´yukta vairagya asraye
name aparadhe-sunya haibe nirbhaye
By resorting to yukta and vairagya one may endure the six impulses, and become fearless by cultivating the divine name avoiding with care the ten offenses.
Sri Piyusa Varsini Vrtti
Sri Gauracandraya namah - Obeisance to Sri Gauracandra.
yat krpa sagarodbhutam upadesamrtam bhuvi
sri rupena samanitam gaura-candram bhajami tam
natva grantha-pranetaram tikakaram pranamya ca
maya viracyate vrttih piyusa parivesini
I worship Gauracandra, whose dear associate Sri Rupa has churned this nectar of instruction from the ocean of astonishment.
With salutation to the author and the various commentators, I hereby commence my own commentary entitled "Piyusa Varsini" or "A Rain Shower of Ambrosia".
to be continued...
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Originally posted by Satyaraja dasa:
>>Have you ever considered that GM is a fountain of gossip and slander? I have
associated plenty with those persons, I know what I am talking about. GM is not
nice!<<
Dear Premananda:
It is said that birds of the same plumage fly together. Therefore you got an association suitable for you. You are now following a very ancient apa-sampradaya called Gaura-nagari. Now you known that Gaura is Krsna and He is relishing so many gopis
including yourself. You got a nice gurudeva, who has long blonde hairs but he tinges them
black to give him a gopi's aspect. As a gopi he also plays rasa-lila with some boyfriends,
just to enter in the mood of parakya-rasa; that's to say, Gaura is his paramour but he also should have some husbands. These perversions are not permitted in GM, and therefore you had opted to find a place suitable to live according your own tendencies. That's fine, and now as your heart is paining due remorse, you believe that is better to justify your sins with some non-sense arguments.
Nice sex religion. Drugs are welcome! 3rd class of people, 3rd class of behavior, 3rd class of instructions!
I bet you wish that was true so you have something to dream about.
Fortunately what you wrote about "perversions" is just a fabrication of your twisted imagination.
It is true that my Guru dyes his hair black. There is no prohibition against it. And the hair style and color has nothing to do with his form as a manjari. You don´t have a clue.
Your comments show that you are seeing things in a very superficial way. This includes your conception of guru-parampara.
P D
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Originally posted by jndas:
I visited the site, but I must admit I felt odd. I mean, being surrounded by babaji katha without all of your insults flying left and right. It was just a strange feeling - almost paranormal.
I haven´t insulted anybody, only pointed out some flaws in your conception of what a guru-parampara is. There is some hidden criticism of the GM on the website, but nobody is mentioned by name.
Personally I feel very inspired after reading the articles on the site.
PD
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Originally posted by jndas:
I visited the site, but I must admit I felt odd. I mean, being surrounded by babaji katha without all of your insults flying left and right. It was just a strange feeling - almost paranormal.
I haven´t insulted anybody, only pointed out some flaws in your conception of what a guru-parampara is. There is some hidden criticism of the GM on the website, but nobody is mentioned by name.
Personally I feel very inspired after reading the articles on the site.
PD
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Originally posted by Satyaraja dasa:
cyber-babajis' syndicate & CO
You are missing something great if you don´t read the articles on this site.
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Originally posted by Satyaraja dasa:
cyber-babajis' syndicate & CO
You are missing something great if you don´t read the articles on this site.
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Originally posted by Satyaraja dasa:
cyber-babajis' syndicate & CO
You are missing something great if you don´t read the articles on this site.
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Originally posted by Satyaraja dasa:
cyber-babajis' syndicate & CO
You are missing something great if you don´t read the articles on this site.
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Everyone, check out this Babaji site!
in Spiritual Discussions
Posted · Report reply
If the "babaji" really performed those activities he wasn´t doing sadhan-bhajan. I hope we all agree on that.
Those guys are fringe groups.
The ones who are true Gaudiya Vaishnava babajis don´t perform any "rasa-lila" with females.
One of those true babas is Srila Ananta das Babaji of Sri Radhakunda. It is probably him they are referring to in the text. Because he is the most famous in Vraja, and he has published many books, with commentaries. If your tridanda Swami refers to Srila Babaji Maharaj with his dramatic description of sahajiya activities among Gaudiya babajis he is being very offensive. This is how I interpreted his little speech.
This again proves my thesis that many of the GM gurus like to slander and gossip. It is so tragic and pathetic.
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